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This could have been any house in Kerala,

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but what unfolded within its confines
was something unheard of.

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Today in Koodathayi,
during the quiet hours of the morning,

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while most in town were still sleeping,

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Jolly Joseph, a respected local mother,

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was taken into custody in a case

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which has sent shockwaves
through all of India.

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Present at the time of her arrest
was her son, Remo.

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The arrest was made early in the morning.

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Only my brother and I were there
during the arrest.

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A team had quickly arrived…

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A police officer named Jeevan
and two lady officers had arrived.

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They were saying
that they were going to take her away.

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I was completely shocked.

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Being completely shocked,
I didn't know what to do.

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Until that day,
we believed that the deaths

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of our close family members were natural.

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I had doubts until the very end.

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I can never see that person
as my mother again.

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A shocking story is emerging
out of Koodathayi,

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a sleepy village
in Kozhikode district of north Kerala.

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Jolly Joseph has been arrested
for allegedly

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killing her mother-in-law, father-in-law,

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husband, and three others
over a period of 14 years

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without raising anyone's suspicions.

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In a first for Kerala police,

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the mortal remains of the six victims

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are being exhumed
from their graves on the same day.

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In the midst of it all, a woman
named Jolly stands as the mastermind.

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But who was Jolly?

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How did she manage to commit six murders

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without family or locals
raising any suspicion?

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Jolly, the primary accused in this case,

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was a faculty
at the National Institute of Technology.

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As far as I know, she also had
a good connection with the church.

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Many find it hard to believe

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that a woman,

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known to be family-oriented,

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well-respected, and liked,

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could be a cold-blooded killer.

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KARUNYA RESIDENCE ASSOCIATION
K.G. SIMON IPS, KAIYYALAKYAGATTU

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I am K.G. Simon, Indian Police Service.

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I've retired now.

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While I was working for 37 years,
my whole life and career

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was that of a police officer.

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In 2019, I was in Kollam
as a District Police Superintendent

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before being transferred

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to Kozhikode Rural District
as the Superintendent of Police.

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And while I was in my office,

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a report by the DYSP of Thamarassery
was brought before me.

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The report was about Roy's death
at the Ponnamattam house in 2011.

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Roy died in the year 2011.

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The Ponnamattam family
was prominent in Koodathayi.

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Roy Thomas was the eldest son.

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The complaint was filed
by Roy's sister, Renji,

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and Roy's brother.

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The report clearly stated

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that Roy died
due to consumption of cyanide.

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But where did he get the cyanide from,
or how he consumed it,

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or what difficulty
could have led Roy wanting to die,

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none of the facts were mentioned.

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That's when I decided

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to start the investigation of Roy's case.

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The first meeting with Jolly Joseph
was at the crime branch office.

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It was after her arrest

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that I started to question her
when we took her in custody.

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Initially, it was very difficult
for her to speak.

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Later, she opened up when I started
showing her the evidence collected.

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As a matter of fact, we have been
investigating this case for two months.

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We have interrogated about 200 people.
No one knew about it.

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Only over the course of this investigation

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were we able to narrow our focus down
to the woman named Jolly,

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who has since been arrested as a suspect.

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Is she cooperating with the police?

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Yes, she is cooperating.

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When a person gives a statement
while in police custody,

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we don't need to take it seriously.

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It can never be used against the accused,

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which is a true fact.

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Whether prosecution
brings the confession or not,

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this confession
does not have any validity.

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What happened in reality is not
what is written in the charge sheet.

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The most important thing Jolly told me,
right in our first interaction,

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was that she did not commit this crime.

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This story has absolutely exploded
across India.

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Kerala, a region known for its
high levels of education and employment,

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is now in the headlines
for this bizarre tragedy.

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Everything changed after the story broke.

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Koodathayi was thronged by a lot
of people, who were mere spectators.

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Almost every day for a month,

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reporters were camping outside
the Ponnamattam home.

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In fact, I am one such reporter, you know,

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who actually camped out.

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There were a lot of neighbors
who were very upset about Jolly.

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And there were contradicting takes
on who she was.

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Some would say that she was very good.

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Others would say that,

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"No, but she always had
this dark side to her."

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Jolly is a woman
who interacts well with everyone.

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She has a good rapport
with my family members.

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There is no difference in opinion
regarding Jolly amongst them.

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Jolly surely has a mental disability.

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Now, our sources suggest that she was,
in fact, connected to a sex racket.

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I heard people making catcalls
around that time

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saying, "Kattappana."

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And she is "high range."

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So I realized that

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because of the place
that she came from, Kattappanna.

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The fact that it was from the high ranges,
a hilly terrain,

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all these things were actually posed
as some sort of a bad thing against her.

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I felt like most reports
were trying to showcase

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the most salacious aspects of the story.

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No one seemed to be asking
the most important questions.

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Who was Jolly Joseph

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and what made her do
the things that she allegedly did?

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And I think that was one of the reasons

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why I felt that I should
do a story about Jolly Joseph.

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I'll go to Kattappana and see
where did Jolly grow up?

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And after speaking to Jolly's family
in Kattappana, I came to understand.

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Jolly's family is actually
a family of farmers.

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She was really not comfortable

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being in a house where people
were expected to do work for a living.

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She was flamboyant.

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She wanted to live a cool life.

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I think that was there when

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Jolly decided to get married to Roy

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because the Ponnamattam family is a very
established family in Koodathayi.

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This is a family which is settled in
a different part of the state altogether,

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a different culture and everything

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so getting married
into a family of employed people

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could mean a different
lifestyle altogether.

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Maybe she would have
the kind of luxury which she had wanted.

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As children,

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we grew up like it was
in any other normal family.

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I, my elder brother, and my sister.

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Rojo and I would play
with the neighborhood kids.

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But my eldest brother, Roy,
was an introvert at that time.

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He would not come to play much.

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Roy was six and a half years
older than me.

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So I had a lot of respect for him
and a little fear, for sure.

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My mother was a teacher
in a nearby school,

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so she has taught all the kids
of that town around that time.

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My father was in the education department,

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which is why he was so highly respected
and had a good reputation.

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Our family gave a lot of importance
to education.

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After a few years,
when Roy was pursuing pre-degree,

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Rojo came to me to tell me something.

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Rojo was a mischievous kid at that age

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and said he had found a letter
intended for Roy

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from someone named Jolly.

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So I opened the letter and read it,

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and I understood what it was.

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I found the addresser
as Jolly Joseph Kattappana.

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The first time I met Jolly was

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at my maternal Uncle Manchadiyil Mathew's
housewarming ceremony.

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So my Uncle Manchadiyil Mathew's
wife's brother's daughter, is Jolly.

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She was short
and wore high-heeled sandals.

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In those times, people didn't wear
high-heeled sandals, but Jolly did.

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At those times,
kids would meet and exchange letters.

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There was no other mode of communication.

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So through love letters,
they started liking each other.

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Roy admitted to his affair
and was serious about her.

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But my father was literally
not interested in this marriage.

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The main reason for his dislike
could be because they were related to us.

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But Jolly told everyone
that she was a qualified professional

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who passed MCom with 50% of marks.

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So I heard Mother saying,

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"It's okay,

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because once Jolly comes here,
she can pursue further studies or work.

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Since she has a master in commerce,
she will definitely get a good job."

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So that's why my mother
wanted to get them settled soon.

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It was raining throughout the wedding.

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Now, people look back
and say that was a bad omen.

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My father was upset.
Even during the wedding, he was upset.

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I remember he wouldn't talk much with her.

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In our house, it was the first wedding.

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So as usual, there was excitement.

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We never imagined that the marriage
would be a disaster like this.

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Seventeen years ago, Jolly Joseph
married Roy and moved here to Koodathayi

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and into the home
of Tom and Annamma Thomas.

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This well-respected family
welcomed her with open arms,

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which makes what Jolly did in this house
all the more shocking.

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The Ponnamattam house
is right in front of our house.

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I saw Jolly when she came here
after marriage.

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Wherever she went,
she spoke to everybody so well.

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She was close with the neighbors.
She was a star between them.

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She was like that.

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Since they were newlyweds,

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neighbors, relatives and family friends
would invite them for lunch.

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Soon, she carved out a space for herself
in our family and with relatives.

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Roy would leave in the morning for work.

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So Jolly was relatively free.

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She learned to cook food and all.

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She used to cook traditional food.

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We used to go to the hotel
to have food and go shopping.

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Jolly was very fond of shopping,
especially jewelry.

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Jolly just seemed so happy.

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But then Mother said,

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"There is no need to sit idle at home
after your studies. You can get a job.

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Go for a job, settle in life."

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"If both husband and wife start working,

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then both can share
life's burdens equally."

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I would tell Mother,
"Let her do what she likes."

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Jolly Joseph's mother-in-law

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had a very different culture.

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She was a mother-in-law
who believes that an educated girl

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should not be sitting idle at home
without working,

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which is a good perspective to have.

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But for Jolly,
that was tremendous pressure.

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Some girls do not wish to go for any job.
They like to stay at home.

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But at that time,
she became pregnant with Remo.

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So we dropped that plan then.

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00:16:01,000 --> 00:16:05,083
The Ponnamattam house in Koodathayi
is where I was born and grew up.

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00:16:05,166 --> 00:16:09,958
I definitely have
a very close attachment with that house.

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I am the first child of the family.

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00:16:13,083 --> 00:16:16,625
I got all the privileges provided
to a first child from everyone.

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Ours was a big family.

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A very happy family.

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After Remo was born, my mother would say,

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"Jolly can go to work,
I will look after the baby."

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00:16:36,708 --> 00:16:37,833
My mother told her,

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00:16:37,916 --> 00:16:39,875
"I will take care of him.
You don't worry, Jolly.

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Since you have a good qualification,
get a job.

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00:16:41,875 --> 00:16:44,791
Once you get a job, you will get settled."

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00:16:44,875 --> 00:16:46,500
Mother repeatedly said that.

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00:16:49,791 --> 00:16:52,083
From my investigation,
I had come to understand

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00:16:52,166 --> 00:16:55,000
that from the day Jolly Joseph married Roy
and came to Ponnamattam house,

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00:16:55,083 --> 00:16:57,958
Jolly used to tell people,
that she is an MCom graduate,

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00:16:58,750 --> 00:17:01,541
but what Jolly told me was,

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"This degree that I created

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00:17:05,041 --> 00:17:07,791
was the greatest mistake
that I have committed in life."

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00:17:10,166 --> 00:17:11,708
What Jolly said was,

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00:17:11,791 --> 00:17:13,708
Annamma Thomas was not aware

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00:17:13,791 --> 00:17:17,500
that Jolly Joseph
did not have such a qualification.

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00:17:18,583 --> 00:17:22,208
So Annamma used to tell Jolly,
though she had such a high qualification,

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00:17:22,291 --> 00:17:26,125
why is she not trying for a job?

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00:17:26,708 --> 00:17:30,291
So arguments like this were going on.

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00:17:30,375 --> 00:17:32,708
When this reached an intensified state,

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00:17:32,791 --> 00:17:34,875
Jolly's father, Joseph,
came to visit them.

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00:17:36,458 --> 00:17:38,750
Jolly was sure that Annamma Thomas
would speak to her father

241
00:17:38,833 --> 00:17:41,166
about sending her for a job.

242
00:17:42,166 --> 00:17:44,000
And when Annamma said so,

243
00:17:44,083 --> 00:17:48,083
Joseph would definitely say that
Jolly does not have such a qualification

244
00:17:48,166 --> 00:17:49,875
and Jolly was sure she would be caught.

245
00:18:13,958 --> 00:18:17,625
We were getting ready
to have our breakfast.

246
00:18:18,541 --> 00:18:21,375
Roy was playing music
at a high volume upstairs.

247
00:18:24,750 --> 00:18:28,500
The dining room was visible
from the kitchen.

248
00:18:32,458 --> 00:18:34,375
I was preparing chicken in the kitchen.

249
00:18:37,208 --> 00:18:40,416
I saw Mother taking water
and walking away.

250
00:18:41,625 --> 00:18:45,500
I still remember clearly,
after around 20 minutes, I got the feeling

251
00:18:45,583 --> 00:18:47,625
that I should check on Mother.

252
00:18:47,708 --> 00:18:49,500
That thought occurred to me.

253
00:18:53,000 --> 00:18:54,333
When I got there,

254
00:18:54,416 --> 00:18:57,250
I saw Mother sitting with her legs
outstretched on the bed,

255
00:18:57,333 --> 00:18:58,791
leaning against the window.

256
00:19:00,041 --> 00:19:03,625
She had tears in her eyes.
I asked her what happened.

257
00:19:03,708 --> 00:19:06,041
She said,
"I am going to die. Call everyone."

258
00:19:09,208 --> 00:19:12,208
I rushed out, shut off the electricity,
and screamed.

259
00:19:15,083 --> 00:19:17,541
When I ran downstairs
and reached her side,

260
00:19:18,250 --> 00:19:21,166
Mother was lying on the bed with fear.

261
00:19:21,250 --> 00:19:25,541
The blood was surging up
and there was a bloody hue all over.

262
00:19:25,625 --> 00:19:28,250
Mother said,
"I can't breathe, I am dying."

263
00:19:28,833 --> 00:19:32,041
So I asked my brother
to call the doctor quickly.

264
00:19:35,125 --> 00:19:39,458
Her legs were moving up
and her body started jerking.

265
00:19:39,958 --> 00:19:41,375
Finally, a doctor arrived.

266
00:19:41,458 --> 00:19:45,541
The doctor checked her pulse and said,
"Quickly, take her to the hospital!"

267
00:19:47,958 --> 00:19:50,125
A jeep arrived immediately

268
00:19:50,208 --> 00:19:53,500
and it was speeding towards
Omassery Hospital, with headlights on.

269
00:19:54,541 --> 00:19:56,916
Without even waiting
to switch off the engine,

270
00:19:57,000 --> 00:19:59,916
I had put the vehicle on gear
and ran to the casualty.

271
00:20:01,041 --> 00:20:03,375
I told the doctor to do
whatever checkup is required.

272
00:20:04,208 --> 00:20:06,750
She was taken inside.

273
00:20:10,958 --> 00:20:13,666
After five minutes,
the doctor said that she died.

274
00:20:21,291 --> 00:20:23,333
Koodathayi really wept.

275
00:20:24,250 --> 00:20:25,416
We were all devastated.

276
00:20:28,208 --> 00:20:33,083
My mother's death devoured me
mentally and physically.

277
00:20:35,416 --> 00:20:37,583
My mind kept telling me
that my mother would come back.

278
00:20:38,875 --> 00:20:41,125
But my mother did not come back.

279
00:20:50,541 --> 00:20:53,833
We didn't have any suspicion
about our mother's death.

280
00:20:55,583 --> 00:20:57,125
We thought the stroke was hereditary.

281
00:20:58,416 --> 00:21:01,041
Circumstances didn't lead to any doubt.

282
00:21:04,541 --> 00:21:09,125
The first victim was Annamma,
who died in 2002.

283
00:21:09,208 --> 00:21:13,083
Because she was a little old and she was
suffering from a lot of illnesses,

284
00:21:13,166 --> 00:21:16,500
the family did not really insist
on a postmortem.

285
00:21:18,875 --> 00:21:21,000
A case that happened in 2002

286
00:21:21,083 --> 00:21:24,666
was disclosed by the police
after a span of 18 years.

287
00:21:26,125 --> 00:21:29,875
So what evidential value has it got?

288
00:21:29,958 --> 00:21:33,583
It is true that Annamma died.

289
00:21:33,666 --> 00:21:39,916
But is it a murder, a heart attack,
or a suicide?

290
00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:42,958
These things have to be proved
by the prosecution.

291
00:21:43,041 --> 00:21:49,500
Therefore, in Annamma's case,
the evidence is very weak.

292
00:21:54,333 --> 00:21:57,833
After the burial, what I noticed was,

293
00:21:58,666 --> 00:22:04,583
the Jolly I saw after Mother's death
had a completely different personality.

294
00:22:05,875 --> 00:22:09,166
Jolly was doing
all the work systematically.

295
00:22:09,250 --> 00:22:13,291
Be it household or outdoor related,
whatever Mother used to take care of.

296
00:22:13,875 --> 00:22:18,708
So in such matters, Jolly became
the prime person in the family.

297
00:22:20,416 --> 00:22:22,291
My mother had written in her diary

298
00:22:22,375 --> 00:22:25,375
that she had deposited
some money in my name.

299
00:22:25,458 --> 00:22:28,458
And she had left some gold jewelry for me.
I had no idea.

300
00:22:29,125 --> 00:22:31,125
And for some reason, Jolly told me,

301
00:22:31,208 --> 00:22:34,333
"Mother had written in her diary
that certain things are for you, right?

302
00:22:34,416 --> 00:22:38,708
Apart from that, you are not getting
anything else from the property here."

303
00:22:39,541 --> 00:22:41,041
But this behavior was only towards me.

304
00:22:41,750 --> 00:22:45,125
This was not how
she would behave with outsiders

305
00:22:45,208 --> 00:22:47,166
or with Father.

306
00:22:47,250 --> 00:22:51,875
So I used to always wonder
why is she indifferent to me.

307
00:22:51,958 --> 00:22:53,291
Like one morning,

308
00:22:53,375 --> 00:22:57,125
I had given something to someone
and Jolly gave me a warning.

309
00:22:57,208 --> 00:22:58,458
"From now on,

310
00:22:58,541 --> 00:23:03,416
you must ask me before giving anything
to anyone from this house."

311
00:23:03,500 --> 00:23:07,875
She said,
"Don't do anything without asking me."

312
00:23:07,958 --> 00:23:10,375
I wasn't able to say anything
to my father.

313
00:23:10,458 --> 00:23:15,125
I wasn't able to tell my father
that Jolly was torturing me mentally

314
00:23:15,208 --> 00:23:17,500
as he was already going through a lot
in his life.

315
00:23:19,250 --> 00:23:22,875
Then two or three days later,
Jolly told me,

316
00:23:22,958 --> 00:23:25,291
"I am not going to work."

317
00:23:25,958 --> 00:23:27,791
"Shouldn't there be someone here?"
She asked me.

318
00:23:27,875 --> 00:23:29,291
"I have to take care of my father-in-law,

319
00:23:29,375 --> 00:23:32,541
so I am not going to leave the family,"
she said.

320
00:23:32,625 --> 00:23:38,375
Once my mother died,
she could take full charge.

321
00:23:38,458 --> 00:23:39,750
That's what had happened.

322
00:23:42,166 --> 00:23:47,791
When the mother-in-law passed away,
Jolly became the next homemaker.

323
00:23:47,875 --> 00:23:51,000
When Jolly got overall control
of the Ponnamattam family,

324
00:23:51,083 --> 00:23:57,958
she must have found it entertaining
to receive increased recognition.

325
00:23:58,041 --> 00:23:59,625
She must have desired it.

326
00:24:00,875 --> 00:24:05,375
Jolly Joseph felt
she would be regarded and respected well

327
00:24:05,458 --> 00:24:10,041
by her family, her relatives,
and by society.

328
00:24:12,333 --> 00:24:16,125
But later,
Jolly understood that being a teacher,

329
00:24:16,208 --> 00:24:19,458
Mother earned a good reputation,
love, and respect from people.

330
00:24:19,541 --> 00:24:24,500
So if Jolly has a job like that too,
she can gain everything too.

331
00:24:31,375 --> 00:24:33,916
One day, when I called Father,

332
00:24:34,583 --> 00:24:36,166
he told me

333
00:24:36,750 --> 00:24:41,541
that Jolly got a job
as a guest lecturer at NIT.

334
00:24:45,333 --> 00:24:48,375
Father said that it is good
because it's close to our house.

335
00:24:49,208 --> 00:24:51,541
Even though
it is a post of guest lecturer,

336
00:24:51,625 --> 00:24:54,458
in the future,
the job would become permanent.

337
00:24:54,541 --> 00:24:56,125
I asked him
how much salary she is getting.

338
00:24:56,666 --> 00:24:59,291
Father replied that Jolly said that
she would get 40,000 rupees as salary.

339
00:25:01,416 --> 00:25:04,666
I was too young
when she got the job at NIT.

340
00:25:04,750 --> 00:25:08,125
It was a huge institution.

341
00:25:08,791 --> 00:25:13,791
There's a canteen at NIT and we would
have food there and then return.

342
00:25:18,166 --> 00:25:22,708
She gained immense respect
in our Koodathayi area.

343
00:25:22,791 --> 00:25:27,708
She always has a preference over others,
being a lecturer at NIT.

344
00:25:28,833 --> 00:25:33,458
The community was in awe at the fact
that despite her being an NIT lecturer,

345
00:25:33,541 --> 00:25:38,000
she was humble and pleasant enough
to mingle easily with everyone.

346
00:25:39,166 --> 00:25:41,375
NATIONAL INSTITUTE OF TECHNOLOGY,
CALICUT

347
00:25:41,458 --> 00:25:44,666
When you say
that you are a professor at NIT,

348
00:25:44,750 --> 00:25:48,166
people tend to have a "wow" reaction.

349
00:25:48,250 --> 00:25:51,583
We know that the family
in which Jolly was born and raised

350
00:25:51,666 --> 00:25:52,958
was an agricultural family.

351
00:25:54,541 --> 00:25:55,958
It was a big thing for a girl

352
00:25:56,041 --> 00:25:59,000
to reach that level
from an agricultural family.

353
00:26:01,833 --> 00:26:05,958
That's when Jolly finally got respect
from both sides of our family,

354
00:26:06,041 --> 00:26:08,583
Mother and Father's side.

355
00:26:11,958 --> 00:26:13,666
When relatives came home,

356
00:26:13,750 --> 00:26:15,750
Jolly showed a lot of interest
in welcoming them,

357
00:26:15,833 --> 00:26:19,666
making the food they like and such.

358
00:26:21,458 --> 00:26:24,750
I remember this happening many times
whenever there were guests…

359
00:26:24,833 --> 00:26:26,458
Jolly would take Father's shirts.

360
00:26:26,541 --> 00:26:29,125
The ironing table was next to the stairs.

361
00:26:29,208 --> 00:26:32,208
So everyone could see
Jolly ironing the shirts.

362
00:26:33,791 --> 00:26:36,833
I got married in 2005

363
00:26:36,916 --> 00:26:39,416
and then I moved to Colombo
with my husband.

364
00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:43,458
In April 2007, I brought my father over
for a one-month visit.

365
00:26:43,958 --> 00:26:47,750
And again, I brought him over
for a one-month visit in 2008.

366
00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:52,166
At that time, Father had health issues
and became lean.

367
00:26:52,250 --> 00:26:53,833
He was not as he used to be at all.

368
00:26:53,916 --> 00:26:58,208
I wondered if he was down mentally.

369
00:27:00,291 --> 00:27:05,583
There was a dispute
between Tom Thomas and Jolly Joseph.

370
00:27:05,666 --> 00:27:07,333
M.S. Mathew was a regular visitor
at their home.

371
00:27:10,458 --> 00:27:13,916
M.S. Mathew
is Annamma's elder brother's son.

372
00:27:15,333 --> 00:27:19,916
Mathew is working
as a salesman in a jewelry shop.

373
00:27:20,458 --> 00:27:22,333
Mathew became her best friend.

374
00:27:23,708 --> 00:27:27,375
Tom Thomas knew about this

375
00:27:27,458 --> 00:27:29,916
and he asked Jolly Joseph

376
00:27:30,541 --> 00:27:35,291
as to why he came there so often
and what his purpose was

377
00:27:35,375 --> 00:27:38,833
to which she gave him some justifications.

378
00:27:39,791 --> 00:27:42,250
It was then that my father
began discussing things with me.

379
00:27:42,333 --> 00:27:47,583
"Jolly says one thing,
but I see her doing the other.

380
00:27:47,666 --> 00:27:50,625
If I ask her questions,
she beats around the bush.

381
00:27:50,708 --> 00:27:53,750
Then she is always in a corner
with her phone

382
00:27:53,833 --> 00:27:55,958
or she goes to the field
and speaks on the phone."

383
00:27:57,416 --> 00:27:59,208
Father was mentally upset about things.

384
00:27:59,291 --> 00:28:01,208
He did not know what was happening.

385
00:28:16,250 --> 00:28:21,791
One evening after his coffee,
as usual, he had a capsule.

386
00:28:23,041 --> 00:28:25,500
And these capsules are mushroom capsules.

387
00:28:28,083 --> 00:28:32,500
She went ahead and gave Thomas
the mushroom tablet.

388
00:28:33,333 --> 00:28:38,250
Thomas took the medicine,
and instantly, he felt some discomfort.

389
00:28:42,291 --> 00:28:46,958
He fell down unconsciously
near the washbasin.

390
00:28:48,416 --> 00:28:53,916
She didn't even attempt to help the man.

391
00:28:57,500 --> 00:28:59,083
She called someone who lived nearby,

392
00:28:59,166 --> 00:29:02,458
who took him to a hospital in a rickshaw.

393
00:29:06,541 --> 00:29:09,500
Tom Thomas died
on his way to the hospital.

394
00:29:13,666 --> 00:29:16,791
They took a lot of time
to take my father to the hospital.

395
00:29:16,875 --> 00:29:18,625
I asked, "Why did it take so long?"

396
00:29:20,291 --> 00:29:23,625
She said, "I couldn't find the car keys,
so it took time."

397
00:29:27,541 --> 00:29:31,791
The father was believed
to have died of a heart attack.

398
00:29:32,458 --> 00:29:35,666
Jolly somehow prevented them
from performing the autopsy.

399
00:29:35,750 --> 00:29:37,666
She convinced the doctors
that it was a heart attack

400
00:29:37,750 --> 00:29:39,166
and brought the body back to the house.

401
00:29:42,541 --> 00:29:44,083
He was buried in Mother's grave.

402
00:29:45,666 --> 00:29:47,208
When my father's dead body
was laid to rest,

403
00:29:47,833 --> 00:29:52,625
Jolly and M.S. Mathew were seen talking
at a distance from everyone else.

404
00:29:54,250 --> 00:29:55,958
So I asked my brother

405
00:29:56,708 --> 00:29:58,458
what was the relation between them

406
00:29:58,541 --> 00:30:01,083
and why are they speaking in a low voice,
standing away from others.

407
00:30:02,125 --> 00:30:03,750
So my brother, Roy, said

408
00:30:03,833 --> 00:30:07,458
they have cash dealings
and they must be discussing it.

409
00:30:13,500 --> 00:30:16,208
When I went through
the second case in detail,

410
00:30:16,291 --> 00:30:19,041
the proofs about the case were very weak.

411
00:30:19,750 --> 00:30:25,500
"She told everyone that it was
a heart attack and they believed it."

412
00:30:25,583 --> 00:30:27,375
That may be true.

413
00:30:27,458 --> 00:30:29,708
But how can a doctor believe it?

414
00:30:29,791 --> 00:30:33,250
Why did the doctor himself not realize

415
00:30:34,166 --> 00:30:38,958
that this was not a heart attack?

416
00:30:39,041 --> 00:30:45,750
How can our medical science
believe the words of a mere witness?

417
00:30:47,416 --> 00:30:49,833
The next victim in the case was Tom Thomas

418
00:30:49,916 --> 00:30:51,750
who died in 2008.

419
00:30:51,833 --> 00:30:53,750
There was a difference of six years

420
00:30:53,833 --> 00:30:57,250
between the first two deaths in this case.

421
00:30:57,333 --> 00:30:59,916
But because there was a huge gap
between the first

422
00:31:00,000 --> 00:31:02,416
and the second deaths
or murders in this case,

423
00:31:02,500 --> 00:31:05,291
it was very difficult
for the family members

424
00:31:05,375 --> 00:31:07,458
to assume something suspicious in this

425
00:31:07,541 --> 00:31:10,041
because there was nothing unusual
about it.

426
00:31:10,125 --> 00:31:13,916
Because of the way this poison was used,
there wasn't any visible injury

427
00:31:14,000 --> 00:31:16,958
or anything that would suggest
that this was a murder.

428
00:31:20,250 --> 00:31:21,666
At the time of the burial,

429
00:31:21,750 --> 00:31:24,708
Jolly was crying a lot towards the end.

430
00:31:24,791 --> 00:31:27,000
Especially when the coffin
was being lowered into the ground,

431
00:31:27,083 --> 00:31:28,500
she was crying a lot.

432
00:31:28,583 --> 00:31:33,750
But when we got back home,
I saw the same Jolly yet again.

433
00:31:33,833 --> 00:31:35,583
I told you what happened
after Mother died, right?

434
00:31:35,666 --> 00:31:38,416
She started managing things immediately.

435
00:31:40,708 --> 00:31:45,791
After Mother died, we already felt
like we had no space in that house.

436
00:31:45,875 --> 00:31:48,875
After Father left too,
that became a complete zero.

437
00:32:03,416 --> 00:32:07,083
I was not that close to Jolly at all.

438
00:32:08,958 --> 00:32:10,666
During the time of death,

439
00:32:10,750 --> 00:32:13,583
she called me one day,
standing near this teak tree

440
00:32:13,666 --> 00:32:15,208
and said she wanted to share a few things.

441
00:32:15,291 --> 00:32:17,041
I asked her, "What is it?"

442
00:32:17,125 --> 00:32:19,541
She said, "Three deaths
will take place in this house."

443
00:32:20,291 --> 00:32:26,333
She said that the well and the house
are not built in the right place.

444
00:32:27,083 --> 00:32:29,416
A wall should be made around the well

445
00:32:29,500 --> 00:32:32,125
and the tree in front should be cut down.

446
00:32:36,208 --> 00:32:39,000
If all of this is done,
then the deaths will not take place.

447
00:32:40,541 --> 00:32:42,666
When I asked her how she knew about this,

448
00:32:43,458 --> 00:32:47,250
she said that our priests
and their pastors had told her to do so.

449
00:32:48,791 --> 00:32:50,125
Then I stayed away.

450
00:32:50,208 --> 00:32:56,666
After that,
I completely stopped talking to her.

451
00:32:56,750 --> 00:33:00,000
Actually, I was so close to them.
I was like their own family.

452
00:33:00,083 --> 00:33:02,541
But then I completely
kept her away from me.

453
00:33:04,333 --> 00:33:07,416
After Tom and Annamma,
the next death in the Ponnamattam family

454
00:33:07,500 --> 00:33:09,208
wouldn't occur for another two years

455
00:33:09,291 --> 00:33:13,375
which allowed Jolly the opportunity
to quell any suspicions about the deaths

456
00:33:13,458 --> 00:33:17,333
and rebuild trust with her neighbors
and people in the town.

457
00:33:19,291 --> 00:33:21,916
After that,
our family became even smaller.

458
00:33:22,666 --> 00:33:25,958
But I was four or five years old,
maybe studying in LKG or UKG,

459
00:33:26,041 --> 00:33:27,458
when my mother was pregnant

460
00:33:27,958 --> 00:33:29,250
and my brother was born.

461
00:33:31,875 --> 00:33:37,875
When my younger brother was born,
I was very excited and happy,

462
00:33:37,958 --> 00:33:40,375
and that excitement continued.

463
00:33:44,125 --> 00:33:46,333
There were a lot of good moments

464
00:33:46,416 --> 00:33:48,583
and we led a very happy life
for quite a long time.

465
00:33:48,666 --> 00:33:51,583
But gradually, as I grew up to age,

466
00:33:51,666 --> 00:33:58,125
I could understand and see
the issues happening in the house.

467
00:33:58,208 --> 00:34:01,916
Until that age, we were not seriously
concerned about these things.

468
00:34:02,583 --> 00:34:08,041
As time progressed, a gap began to form
in the connection we had with Mother.

469
00:34:08,125 --> 00:34:10,666
There arose a disconnection
between Mother and Father too.

470
00:34:14,666 --> 00:34:16,250
It was like everyone just split up

471
00:34:16,333 --> 00:34:20,833
from each other and moved
to four corners of the house.

472
00:34:21,708 --> 00:34:28,250
Mother would always be busy saying
she had college work or paper evaluations.

473
00:34:29,791 --> 00:34:33,208
We felt that we were not given
any preference in her life.

474
00:34:35,250 --> 00:34:41,208
Later, Roy's business did not flourish
as he expected.

475
00:34:41,291 --> 00:34:43,583
So they became short of funds.

476
00:34:43,666 --> 00:34:45,958
Roy did not have any means of livelihood

477
00:34:46,041 --> 00:34:48,041
and towards the end,
it became problematic.

478
00:34:49,875 --> 00:34:51,916
A few days before the incident,
Rojo called me and said

479
00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:53,833
that Jolly had called him and said that

480
00:34:53,916 --> 00:34:55,916
she was thinking of a divorce.

481
00:34:56,583 --> 00:35:00,333
Roy was not taking care of things
and there were other problems as well.

482
00:35:02,500 --> 00:35:04,666
After that, in the evening,

483
00:35:04,750 --> 00:35:07,708
while Rojo and I
were sitting in Father's room,

484
00:35:08,250 --> 00:35:09,791
Roy came in.

485
00:35:09,875 --> 00:35:16,541
He came in and showed us a Xerox copy
of Father's will and said,

486
00:35:17,250 --> 00:35:18,791
"Father has mentioned in his will

487
00:35:18,875 --> 00:35:23,000
that the ownership of this house and land
will be transferred to Jolly and me."

488
00:35:24,958 --> 00:35:27,458
Renji immediately took it from him
and asked,

489
00:35:27,541 --> 00:35:29,291
"Is this the will?"

490
00:35:30,208 --> 00:35:32,125
This is not on a stamp paper

491
00:35:32,208 --> 00:35:33,833
and it doesn't bear
the signatures of witnesses.

492
00:35:35,750 --> 00:35:37,875
Suddenly, there was a pin-drop silence
in the room.

493
00:35:37,958 --> 00:35:40,375
And then both of them left the room.

494
00:35:40,458 --> 00:35:43,666
I just told Rojo to keep it with him.

495
00:35:45,791 --> 00:35:49,000
I do think that
there was some sort of give and take

496
00:35:49,083 --> 00:35:52,458
between Jolly and Roy as far as lies go.

497
00:35:52,541 --> 00:35:55,791
Roy definitely knew some of her lies

498
00:35:55,875 --> 00:35:58,875
because he himself was part of those lies.

499
00:35:59,750 --> 00:36:01,541
I think they had a fallout.

500
00:36:02,333 --> 00:36:05,458
Perhaps that is when the lies
started coming out.

501
00:36:05,541 --> 00:36:08,916
And Jolly must have thought
that something has to be done about it.

502
00:36:11,166 --> 00:36:13,625
Roy was also aware
of Jolly's illicit affair with Mathew.

503
00:36:13,708 --> 00:36:15,708
There were discussions about this
between Roy and Jolly.

504
00:36:16,291 --> 00:36:19,041
He started asking about her relationship
with Mathew, quite viciously,

505
00:36:19,125 --> 00:36:22,250
and why she still continues it.

506
00:36:23,458 --> 00:36:26,916
Jolly had the feeling that it's useless

507
00:36:27,666 --> 00:36:29,083
to continue her life with Roy.

508
00:36:37,208 --> 00:36:39,833
On September 30th, 2011,

509
00:36:42,333 --> 00:36:44,583
Jolly fed the children early

510
00:36:44,666 --> 00:36:47,875
and put them to sleep
in the room upstairs.

511
00:36:49,541 --> 00:36:51,750
At around 8:00 p.m.,

512
00:36:51,833 --> 00:36:53,208
she came down

513
00:36:53,875 --> 00:36:57,666
and prepared rice and chickpeas curry
for Roy's dinner.

514
00:37:00,875 --> 00:37:03,500
After Roy came home, he went upstairs
to where his children were sleeping

515
00:37:03,583 --> 00:37:05,583
and asked them whether
they were pretending to be asleep.

516
00:37:05,666 --> 00:37:07,833
Then he went downstairs in a happy mood.

517
00:37:08,958 --> 00:37:13,208
Then he had dinner
and all of a sudden, he became restless.

518
00:37:14,291 --> 00:37:16,333
He went to the bathroom.

519
00:37:22,958 --> 00:37:25,958
She told me that Roy had come home
at around 3:00 p.m.

520
00:37:26,041 --> 00:37:27,916
and had rice and Bengal gram curry.

521
00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:30,625
"Then at night, he didn't have dinner.

522
00:37:30,708 --> 00:37:33,458
I went to the kitchen to fry eggs
and that's when Roy went to the bathroom.

523
00:37:35,041 --> 00:37:38,208
When I was done and I came out,
he didn't open the bathroom," she said.

524
00:37:41,375 --> 00:37:44,375
She called me on the day Roy died.

525
00:37:44,458 --> 00:37:48,333
She said, "Roy wasn't opening the door,"
and asked me to come and help.

526
00:37:48,958 --> 00:37:50,250
I ran into their house.

527
00:37:50,333 --> 00:37:52,625
Roy was lying on the floor
with foam coming out of his mouth.

528
00:37:53,708 --> 00:37:56,583
Roy's uncle, Mathew,
came along with us at that time.

529
00:37:58,916 --> 00:38:04,500
We took him to the hospital immediately.
They said he was brought dead.

530
00:38:10,916 --> 00:38:12,708
I received a call at 11 o'clock…

531
00:38:15,708 --> 00:38:17,791
that Roy had passed away.

532
00:38:22,250 --> 00:38:25,166
We woke up seeing the lights on
in the house.

533
00:38:26,125 --> 00:38:30,125
One of our relatives, an aunt,
was sitting on my bed beside us.

534
00:38:32,708 --> 00:38:36,041
When I woke up, she told me that my father

535
00:38:36,125 --> 00:38:39,333
slipped and fell in the bathroom
and has now been taken to the hospital.

536
00:38:40,166 --> 00:38:42,208
I then went down to the ground floor.

537
00:38:42,291 --> 00:38:45,750
On the ground floor,
they had kept Father's framed photo.

538
00:38:45,833 --> 00:38:47,916
It was on the table

539
00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:52,208
with some candles and flowers beside it.

540
00:38:53,166 --> 00:38:56,791
We were gradually understanding
that Father was no more.

541
00:38:59,458 --> 00:39:03,625
Mathew knew something was fishy
about Roy's death.

542
00:39:03,708 --> 00:39:07,291
He insisted that a postmortem
should be conducted.

543
00:39:07,375 --> 00:39:09,166
Then Jolly said that the person had died.

544
00:39:09,250 --> 00:39:10,583
What is the use of doing a postmortem?

545
00:39:10,666 --> 00:39:13,916
Even though that was Jolly's view,
she had to listen to Manchadiyil Mathew,

546
00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:17,750
and the case was taken up,
and postmortem was done at that time.

547
00:39:20,333 --> 00:39:23,958
The doctor who had conducted
Roy's postmortem

548
00:39:24,541 --> 00:39:26,500
had mentioned very clearly
in the postmortem report

549
00:39:26,583 --> 00:39:29,041
that death was due to cyanide consumption.

550
00:39:32,291 --> 00:39:35,208
Jolly said they had debts
amounting to lakhs.

551
00:39:35,291 --> 00:39:36,958
That's why he committed suicide.

552
00:39:37,041 --> 00:39:39,458
That was Jolly's justification.

553
00:39:41,125 --> 00:39:43,125
I blamed my brother

554
00:39:45,375 --> 00:39:48,625
for creating debts and committing suicide.

555
00:39:53,750 --> 00:39:55,625
We felt anger and hatred towards him.

556
00:39:55,708 --> 00:39:58,625
And I was telling Renji,
"There is such a huge amount of debt.

557
00:39:58,708 --> 00:40:01,416
How are we going to repay it?"

558
00:40:03,625 --> 00:40:05,291
But no one came asking for it.

559
00:40:06,666 --> 00:40:11,708
No one ever called me or Renji
to say that Roy had borrowed

560
00:40:11,791 --> 00:40:15,166
even one rupee from them.

561
00:40:18,083 --> 00:40:21,291
His own wife, Jolly, said
no inquiry was required.

562
00:40:22,791 --> 00:40:24,208
So how can we push it?

563
00:40:25,875 --> 00:40:27,291
So at that time, we signed the statement

564
00:40:27,375 --> 00:40:28,958
saying that we don't need
any further investigation.

565
00:40:32,208 --> 00:40:34,666
After Roy's death,
three members of the same family

566
00:40:34,750 --> 00:40:36,833
had died in eerily similar ways.

567
00:40:37,583 --> 00:40:41,625
One has to wonder why the remaining
family members were not more alarmed,

568
00:40:42,250 --> 00:40:45,500
why so many red flags
were missed at the time,

569
00:40:45,583 --> 00:40:48,041
and why more could not have been done

570
00:40:48,125 --> 00:40:52,208
to prevent the most shocking
and horrific deaths yet to come.

571
00:41:06,500 --> 00:41:09,166
I am the chief of Poison Control Center

572
00:41:09,250 --> 00:41:12,166
at Amrita Institute of Medical Sciences
in Kerala.

573
00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:16,750
There is a toxicological dictum.

574
00:41:17,333 --> 00:41:21,416
When you come across cyanide
in a case of death,

575
00:41:22,500 --> 00:41:26,166
first suspected murder,
regardless of what anybody may say…

576
00:41:26,708 --> 00:41:29,833
Relatives or the others all may say
this is accidental, this is suicide…

577
00:41:29,916 --> 00:41:32,375
But first, rule out murder.

578
00:41:32,958 --> 00:41:34,791
Then you can latch on to suicide.

579
00:41:34,875 --> 00:41:38,708
I'm surprised that
it did not strike the police.

580
00:41:41,041 --> 00:41:44,625
In 2011, even after knowing about cyanide
in the postmortem report.

581
00:41:45,333 --> 00:41:50,833
Why didn't Manchadiyil Mathew insist
on further investigation?

582
00:41:50,916 --> 00:41:52,833
Even Roy's brother and sister
did not insist.

583
00:41:52,916 --> 00:41:58,333
Why didn't the police find
where the poison came from?

584
00:41:58,416 --> 00:42:02,541
Instead of inquiring more about this case,

585
00:42:03,583 --> 00:42:07,041
police are simply insisting
that Jolly has committed the murders.

586
00:42:10,166 --> 00:42:14,291
More than failure,
the fact of the matter is that

587
00:42:14,375 --> 00:42:16,541
they did not take things seriously.

588
00:42:17,375 --> 00:42:22,291
When they went to their house,
Jolly Joseph may have said,

589
00:42:22,375 --> 00:42:25,416
"Don't bother us, it's a suicide."

590
00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:28,583
A typical officer who thinks rationally

591
00:42:28,666 --> 00:42:33,541
wouldn't expect his own wife to do this.

592
00:42:34,750 --> 00:42:36,083
Especially in such a family.

593
00:42:36,666 --> 00:42:40,666
That turned out to be helpful for Jolly.

594
00:42:45,208 --> 00:42:48,041
Cyanide is very hazardous,
everybody knows.

595
00:42:48,125 --> 00:42:52,166
When cyanide attacks,
even if oxygen is present in the body,

596
00:42:52,250 --> 00:42:55,125
it cannot be utilized by tissues,
that's how the person dies.

597
00:42:55,875 --> 00:42:57,375
Generally speaking,

598
00:42:57,458 --> 00:42:59,916
cyanide poisoning
can mimic a heart attack.

599
00:43:00,000 --> 00:43:03,375
If a large quantity
has been administered or ingested

600
00:43:03,458 --> 00:43:06,625
or that is swallowed,
it will cause the same kind of collapse.

601
00:43:07,208 --> 00:43:13,583
However, cyanide is almost impossible
to get by legitimate means in Kerala.

602
00:43:13,666 --> 00:43:16,791
So anybody who wants cyanide

603
00:43:16,875 --> 00:43:18,791
will have to get the license first.

604
00:43:19,500 --> 00:43:25,166
For instance, goldsmiths use
salts of cyanide for polishing the metal.

605
00:43:25,250 --> 00:43:27,833
Now, a person
who wants to kill may not have,

606
00:43:27,916 --> 00:43:30,583
you know, the patience to go hunting
and get hold of cyanide.

607
00:43:31,291 --> 00:43:35,666
As I said, it would be extremely difficult
for Jolly to acquire the cyanide.

608
00:43:35,750 --> 00:43:38,375
So if she did,
how did she possibly get it?

609
00:43:38,458 --> 00:43:40,166
Or who helped her get it?

610
00:43:51,416 --> 00:43:57,583
Losing my father
was the biggest trauma of my life.

611
00:43:59,666 --> 00:44:02,791
When we were with our friends, of course,
we were at that age…

612
00:44:02,875 --> 00:44:06,333
It was difficult for us to openly say
that we had lost our father.

613
00:44:06,416 --> 00:44:10,250
It was really difficult
to be without my father.

614
00:44:11,625 --> 00:44:13,333
We were losing everyone.

615
00:44:13,416 --> 00:44:17,291
Grandmother left us, then Grandfather,
and now our father left us.

616
00:44:17,375 --> 00:44:19,625
It was a time of loss.

617
00:44:21,000 --> 00:44:25,041
And then gradually, we reached a point
in life where it was just the three of us.

618
00:44:26,250 --> 00:44:29,416
When we reached that stage in life,

619
00:44:29,500 --> 00:44:33,791
it was then
that our real struggles actually started.

620
00:44:47,166 --> 00:44:50,916
I went to the panchayat office
to pay the land tax,

621
00:44:51,916 --> 00:44:55,166
the first step of transferring the house
and property to Jolly's name

622
00:44:55,250 --> 00:44:56,291
was in process.

623
00:44:58,416 --> 00:45:00,750
Rojo immediately called me
on hearing this.

624
00:45:02,166 --> 00:45:05,291
I was shocked,
wondering what had happened.

625
00:45:05,375 --> 00:45:06,708
How did she transfer the ownership?

626
00:45:06,791 --> 00:45:11,708
I asked him to inquire about the documents
she produced to transfer the ownership?

627
00:45:12,583 --> 00:45:14,291
She had made a fake will.

628
00:45:17,166 --> 00:45:19,083
The will that she produced that day

629
00:45:19,166 --> 00:45:21,916
now had all the things
I had said were missing then.

630
00:45:23,625 --> 00:45:26,291
Ownership in the name of Tom Thomas

631
00:45:26,375 --> 00:45:28,375
was transferred to the name of Roy Thomas,

632
00:45:28,458 --> 00:45:30,791
then that was transferred to Jolly Thomas.

633
00:45:31,375 --> 00:45:33,666
The notary's signature was there

634
00:45:33,750 --> 00:45:34,833
and stamps were affixed.

635
00:45:36,000 --> 00:45:38,666
Long back, I had told Rojo
to lock and keep the will safely.

636
00:45:38,750 --> 00:45:40,916
It's still in Rojo's cupboard.

637
00:45:42,125 --> 00:45:44,458
I told Rojo that this
single document is enough

638
00:45:44,541 --> 00:45:46,833
to prove that all of this is fake.

639
00:45:48,083 --> 00:45:50,625
Then Rojo said we have to cancel this

640
00:45:50,708 --> 00:45:54,125
and get back all the property
in Father's name,

641
00:45:54,208 --> 00:45:58,625
not in Jolly's name, as she is claiming.

642
00:45:58,708 --> 00:46:01,000
The entire property
has to be transferred back.

643
00:46:02,416 --> 00:46:04,166
We called all the elders of the family.

644
00:46:04,250 --> 00:46:05,541
I told them everything.

645
00:46:06,416 --> 00:46:08,458
I showed them the original will.

646
00:46:09,541 --> 00:46:13,916
I told all of them that this is the will
shown to us when Father died.

647
00:46:14,791 --> 00:46:17,875
When the new document came in,
it contained everything that wasn't in it.

648
00:46:17,958 --> 00:46:20,000
I asked, "Did Father come back
and write it down?"

649
00:46:20,083 --> 00:46:21,166
I only asked this single question.

650
00:46:23,833 --> 00:46:25,583
I went back
to the panchayat office several times

651
00:46:25,666 --> 00:46:29,125
and transferred everything back
to Father's name before I returned.

652
00:46:31,125 --> 00:46:33,333
We did not file a case
for the sake of the children.

653
00:46:33,916 --> 00:46:35,625
It had been only a year
since our brother died.

654
00:46:35,708 --> 00:46:37,583
If she went to jail,
what would the children do?

655
00:46:38,666 --> 00:46:41,166
For the sake of the children,
we forgave her

656
00:46:41,250 --> 00:46:43,583
and let her live in that house
without any problems.

657
00:46:47,625 --> 00:46:51,291
During that time, Uncle Manchadiyil Mathew
would call us often

658
00:46:51,375 --> 00:46:52,958
and discuss what was going on.

659
00:46:53,541 --> 00:46:59,416
And Jolly understood that he and I

660
00:46:59,500 --> 00:47:05,958
had a close rapport
and we shared our thoughts.

661
00:47:07,083 --> 00:47:10,541
He had a lot of suspicions about Jolly.

662
00:47:11,958 --> 00:47:14,375
On the day when Roy died,

663
00:47:15,041 --> 00:47:18,041
it was Manchadiyil Mathew who insisted

664
00:47:18,125 --> 00:47:20,416
that Roy's body should be sent
for postmortem.

665
00:47:21,000 --> 00:47:25,000
Thereafter, Manchadiyil Mathew
used to tell several people

666
00:47:25,083 --> 00:47:30,291
that he had doubts
as to why Roy died suddenly.

667
00:47:33,500 --> 00:47:39,666
He was a frequent visitor
to Jolly Joseph's house.

668
00:47:42,958 --> 00:47:47,500
As such, he came to know
of Jolly's affair with M.S. Mathew

669
00:47:47,583 --> 00:47:49,833
and he warned Jolly Joseph

670
00:47:49,916 --> 00:47:52,666
she should not be continuing her affair
with M.S. Mathew as it was not right.

671
00:47:53,208 --> 00:47:54,625
Jolly Joseph did not like this advice.

672
00:48:09,708 --> 00:48:15,166
One day, between 5:30 and 6:00 p.m.,
I got a call from Jolly.

673
00:48:17,083 --> 00:48:19,625
"Kunjumon Ichayan" is what
we called Uncle Manchadiyil.

674
00:48:19,708 --> 00:48:21,500
She said, "Kunjumon Ichayan passed away."

675
00:48:22,416 --> 00:48:24,416
I was shocked and said,
"Uncle passed away?"

676
00:48:24,500 --> 00:48:26,791
I said, "We just spoke this afternoon,
just two hours ago!"

677
00:48:27,708 --> 00:48:32,166
So she said, "Yes, he passed away,
I took him to the hospital, Renji."

678
00:48:34,458 --> 00:48:38,250
In 2014 was when Mathew had died

679
00:48:38,333 --> 00:48:41,666
under very similar circumstances as that

680
00:48:41,750 --> 00:48:44,583
of the three people who died initially.

681
00:48:44,666 --> 00:48:46,250
According to the police,

682
00:48:46,333 --> 00:48:49,666
Mathew started becoming a threat to Jolly

683
00:48:49,750 --> 00:48:54,708
and that is when Jolly decided
that Mathew should also be dead.

684
00:48:57,666 --> 00:49:03,750
There is no evidence anywhere that Jolly

685
00:49:03,833 --> 00:49:07,208
has given poison to Manchadiyil Mathew.

686
00:49:07,291 --> 00:49:10,791
Unfortunately, no postmortem
was conducted.

687
00:49:10,875 --> 00:49:12,166
I understand

688
00:49:13,458 --> 00:49:19,458
that Manchadiyil Mathew
had problems with Jolly since 2011.

689
00:49:19,541 --> 00:49:26,208
If that was the issue,
he could have avoided contacting Jolly.

690
00:49:26,291 --> 00:49:30,291
Instead, he was very close to her.

691
00:49:39,625 --> 00:49:43,041
When we look at all these murders,

692
00:49:43,958 --> 00:49:50,666
we can see multiple timespans
over a long period of 10 to 17 years,

693
00:49:52,375 --> 00:49:56,208
starting from Annamma Thomas
to the final one,

694
00:49:56,291 --> 00:49:59,666
we would notice that the duration
between the murders is decreasing.

695
00:49:59,750 --> 00:50:02,416
At first, there was a six-year gap,
which reduced gradually,

696
00:50:02,500 --> 00:50:05,916
and finally, there was only two-year gap,
one in 2014 and the next in 2016.

697
00:50:08,250 --> 00:50:11,500
That she took so many years
in between each murder

698
00:50:11,583 --> 00:50:14,625
could have helped her
obfuscate her crimes.

699
00:50:14,708 --> 00:50:17,541
The lady alleged
to have committed the crimes.

700
00:50:18,125 --> 00:50:19,583
I think she did a lot of studies

701
00:50:19,666 --> 00:50:21,791
over a period of time
and became more and more perfect

702
00:50:21,875 --> 00:50:24,166
as the time went by,
how to use the poison,

703
00:50:24,250 --> 00:50:26,666
how much to use it,
what situation to use it in.

704
00:50:27,666 --> 00:50:31,583
But even though in this particular case,
the alleged perpetrator

705
00:50:31,666 --> 00:50:34,375
did kill a number of people
over a period of time,

706
00:50:34,875 --> 00:50:37,500
she is not the classical serial killer

707
00:50:37,583 --> 00:50:43,125
because the motives
were completely different.

708
00:50:45,000 --> 00:50:49,083
Serial killers are anyone
who commits more than two murders

709
00:50:49,166 --> 00:50:54,291
and they commit it
in between having cooling periods.

710
00:50:54,833 --> 00:51:01,166
Serial murders also have a specific kind
of signature or pattern that is followed.

711
00:51:03,125 --> 00:51:05,666
As far as Jolly is concerned,

712
00:51:05,750 --> 00:51:10,250
she tried her best to maintain
two versions of herself for so long,

713
00:51:10,333 --> 00:51:12,916
doing what society expects out of her.

714
00:51:13,000 --> 00:51:14,333
But on the other hand,

715
00:51:14,416 --> 00:51:17,833
she is allegedly planning murders
and committing these acts.

716
00:51:18,750 --> 00:51:22,291
Whether we want to call her
serial killer or not,

717
00:51:22,375 --> 00:51:27,416
the only consistent thing
is the use of cyanide as poison,

718
00:51:27,500 --> 00:51:32,500
but she also seemed to have
a legitimate motive,

719
00:51:32,583 --> 00:51:33,708
which is financial gain.

720
00:51:35,291 --> 00:51:37,958
She must have wished to possess
her husband's property

721
00:51:38,041 --> 00:51:40,750
and her own family's property.

722
00:51:42,375 --> 00:51:48,666
She desired
a good financial status and wealth

723
00:51:48,750 --> 00:51:51,500
to make her life better and secure.

724
00:51:51,583 --> 00:51:54,291
But to acquire it,
she begins committing crimes.

725
00:51:54,375 --> 00:51:57,708
That is where she lost track of reality

726
00:51:57,791 --> 00:52:03,791
and went into a world of fantasy.

727
00:52:05,708 --> 00:52:11,666
So now, I can see Jolly as someone
who has created a world of her own,

728
00:52:11,750 --> 00:52:16,666
something kind of unreal,
and does everything she wants within it.

729
00:52:20,083 --> 00:52:24,458
Jolly's relentless pursuit of the life
she desired was unquenchable.

730
00:52:24,541 --> 00:52:27,083
And with her options
more limited than before,

731
00:52:27,166 --> 00:52:29,000
she began searching for a way forward.

732
00:52:35,291 --> 00:52:38,791
Jolly had a desire to marry Shaju.

733
00:52:40,583 --> 00:52:43,375
She even told many people
if she had a husband like Shaju,

734
00:52:44,041 --> 00:52:45,875
she would be really happy.

735
00:52:48,625 --> 00:52:51,416
Shaju Zacharias is Roy's first cousin.

736
00:52:52,083 --> 00:52:55,333
Jolly was sure that Shaju
would take care of all her needs

737
00:52:55,416 --> 00:52:58,291
because Shaju had a good job,
he was a teacher

738
00:52:58,375 --> 00:52:59,833
and was fairly rich

739
00:52:59,916 --> 00:53:02,958
and she desired
not to have any obligations.

740
00:53:05,541 --> 00:53:08,291
I remember Jolly always used to tell me.

741
00:53:08,375 --> 00:53:12,000
Sili is so lucky. Shaju has a job.

742
00:53:12,083 --> 00:53:15,708
There is not much work at home.
She used to say this always.

743
00:53:16,958 --> 00:53:19,041
Shaju Zacharias had two children.

744
00:53:19,125 --> 00:53:22,458
The elder one is Abel
and the younger one is Alphine.

745
00:53:22,541 --> 00:53:24,625
And only if their mother, Sili,
is murdered

746
00:53:24,708 --> 00:53:26,666
would Jolly be able
to marry Shaju Zacharias.

747
00:53:27,958 --> 00:53:29,375
She had killed her husband,

748
00:53:29,458 --> 00:53:33,333
Roy's father and mother,
and later, his uncle.

749
00:53:33,416 --> 00:53:34,791
And she was not caught yet…

750
00:53:35,916 --> 00:53:37,541
so she started planning the next one.

751
00:53:40,041 --> 00:53:42,166
On May 1st, 2014,

752
00:53:42,791 --> 00:53:45,333
it was Abel's first Holy Communion.

753
00:53:45,916 --> 00:53:49,625
All the invitees were gathered
at Shaju's residence for a meal.

754
00:53:49,708 --> 00:53:52,625
Jolly and her children
came for the function.

755
00:53:55,333 --> 00:53:59,958
We were invited to their home to celebrate
the first Holy Communion in great style.

756
00:54:00,041 --> 00:54:05,583
So we asked Sili to join us to have food.

757
00:54:05,666 --> 00:54:10,250
All of us sat at a table
and we were having food.

758
00:54:12,916 --> 00:54:18,000
Alphine's aunt was holding her
to feed her.

759
00:54:19,958 --> 00:54:22,416
Suddenly, Alphine started jumping

760
00:54:22,440 --> 00:55:12,476
GOPIHD

761
00:54:22,500 --> 00:54:27,958
in the aunt's arms
and she started to fall backward.

762
00:54:28,041 --> 00:54:30,000
And I could see very clearly

763
00:54:30,083 --> 00:54:33,458
that her eyeballs were moving upwards…

764
00:54:33,541 --> 00:54:36,375
Her eyeballs were rolling upwards.

765
00:54:38,416 --> 00:54:40,791
All the people in the house
came running towards the child.

766
00:54:40,875 --> 00:54:44,000
No one knew what had happened.

767
00:54:44,083 --> 00:54:48,791
When the child became unconscious,
Sili became upset and shocked.

768
00:54:49,875 --> 00:54:51,958
The child was taken to Omassery Hospital.

769
00:54:53,291 --> 00:54:56,666
It was reported
that the child's condition was critical

770
00:54:56,750 --> 00:54:58,750
and was put on a ventilator.

771
00:55:06,083 --> 00:55:08,666
At the time, the family believed
Alphine had choked

772
00:55:08,750 --> 00:55:10,666
on the food her aunt was feeding her.

773
00:55:10,750 --> 00:55:14,958
But to learn that a two-year-old child
had been poisoned was just horrific.

774
00:55:15,041 --> 00:55:17,416
Jolly was not just a woman, but a mother.

775
00:55:17,500 --> 00:55:19,291
How could someone with her background

776
00:55:19,375 --> 00:55:22,041
callously murder a baby
and feel no remorse?

777
00:55:23,333 --> 00:55:24,708
She was a two-year-old child.

778
00:55:24,791 --> 00:55:27,041
That brings to question

779
00:55:27,125 --> 00:55:30,208
the basic humanity of the person
who committed this.

780
00:55:30,791 --> 00:55:36,083
Women are looked up to
as mothers, nurturers, and caregivers.

781
00:55:36,166 --> 00:55:40,958
And the fact that a woman
is capable of killing an innocent child

782
00:55:41,041 --> 00:55:44,500
shatters that belief system to the core.

783
00:55:46,125 --> 00:55:49,250
All are wondering about the Alphine case

784
00:55:49,333 --> 00:55:53,875
as to why did Jolly
kill an innocent child,

785
00:55:53,958 --> 00:55:55,541
what was her intention?

786
00:55:56,125 --> 00:56:01,958
While I asked her again and again
why would she kill the child,

787
00:56:02,541 --> 00:56:04,166
Jolly asked,

788
00:56:04,250 --> 00:56:10,583
"What benefits do I get
by killing this small child?

789
00:56:11,916 --> 00:56:15,000
The child is a minor, she will not be
an obstacle to my marriage."

790
00:56:16,291 --> 00:56:18,458
After killing the mother,
she could have gotten married,

791
00:56:18,541 --> 00:56:20,875
claiming that she wanted
to take care of the child.

792
00:56:20,958 --> 00:56:23,916
Without any purpose,
why would she kill the child?

793
00:56:24,000 --> 00:56:28,500
So I strongly believe
the truth is something else.

794
00:56:37,833 --> 00:56:40,791
After Alphine's death in 2014,

795
00:56:40,875 --> 00:56:46,208
Sili was mentally depressed.

796
00:56:48,125 --> 00:56:53,416
It was during this time that
Jolly developed a friendship with Sili.

797
00:56:54,708 --> 00:56:56,875
It was Jolly who took the initiative.

798
00:56:57,541 --> 00:57:00,166
Sili used to tell Jolly

799
00:57:00,750 --> 00:57:05,166
that she needed one more child and so on.

800
00:57:05,250 --> 00:57:08,166
Sili used to say
that they wanted another girl.

801
00:57:09,041 --> 00:57:10,833
Then Jolly told her

802
00:57:11,541 --> 00:57:14,208
about the tablet
which her father-in-law was having.

803
00:57:16,500 --> 00:57:22,833
Jolly said that mushroom capsules are good
for health and relieving depression

804
00:57:22,916 --> 00:57:27,791
and Jolly persuaded Sili
to buy the mushroom tablets.

805
00:57:32,083 --> 00:57:35,958
The last in this case was Sili,
who was Shaju's wife.

806
00:57:36,041 --> 00:57:40,708
Shaju's wife actually died
while she was waiting at the reception

807
00:57:40,791 --> 00:57:44,833
of a dental hospital or dental clinic
in Thamarassery.

808
00:57:44,916 --> 00:57:48,916
Shaju was there,
Sili was there, and Jolly was also there.

809
00:57:49,000 --> 00:57:51,000
Sili and Jolly were sitting outside,

810
00:57:51,083 --> 00:57:55,375
in the visitor's room or rather the hall.

811
00:57:56,166 --> 00:57:57,166
They were sitting there.

812
00:57:57,916 --> 00:58:02,166
Jolly had previously filled
mushroom capsules with cyanide.

813
00:58:02,250 --> 00:58:06,500
Jolly handed it to Sili and said,
"This is a mushroom tablet. Have it."

814
00:58:06,583 --> 00:58:08,625
Sili trusted Jolly
and had the mushroom tablet.

815
00:58:09,916 --> 00:58:15,375
Immediately, Sili fell backward.

816
00:58:20,083 --> 00:58:21,750
After Sili passed away,

817
00:58:21,833 --> 00:58:24,625
the doctors at the hospital
where Sili was admitted

818
00:58:24,708 --> 00:58:28,041
told me that they had insisted
on a postmortem.

819
00:58:29,375 --> 00:58:34,041
So at that time,
Shaju outrightly refused a postmortem.

820
00:58:34,125 --> 00:58:36,291
He said that postmortem is not required

821
00:58:37,166 --> 00:58:40,666
and he said that postmortems
are not common in our families.

822
00:58:42,875 --> 00:58:49,166
As a lawyer, I wonder whether
it was actually Shaju's plan

823
00:58:50,208 --> 00:58:56,041
to murder Sili and Alphine
to fulfill his own aim.

824
00:58:56,708 --> 00:59:01,958
Shaju definitely could have
committed this murder to get Jolly.

825
00:59:02,041 --> 00:59:06,625
This is what I'm wondering
as the case progresses,

826
00:59:06,708 --> 00:59:09,666
while investigating other evidence.

827
00:59:17,208 --> 00:59:19,458
When I heard about Sili's death,

828
00:59:20,083 --> 00:59:21,458
I made it there purposefully.

829
00:59:21,541 --> 00:59:25,000
I felt that since I couldn't attend
the child's funeral before that,

830
00:59:25,083 --> 00:59:27,458
I must go there this time, definitely.

831
00:59:28,666 --> 00:59:31,083
After seeing me,
Jolly came out of the house

832
00:59:31,166 --> 00:59:33,625
and said to me,
"Come in, Sili's body is inside."

833
00:59:33,708 --> 00:59:36,375
That's when I saw her body.

834
00:59:38,291 --> 00:59:41,083
I told Jolly
she looked like she was sleeping.

835
00:59:42,416 --> 00:59:46,500
And then Jolly said,
"Yes, Renji. What can be done?

836
00:59:47,833 --> 00:59:51,958
Now I am going to get the body ready
for the next ritual."

837
00:59:52,041 --> 00:59:54,000
To which I told her to carry on.

838
00:59:55,625 --> 00:59:58,541
Jolly was taking care of Sili's body.

839
00:59:58,625 --> 01:00:02,541
So I watched Jolly
attending the body in the coffin.

840
01:00:03,125 --> 01:00:04,708
Sili's brother was there.

841
01:00:04,791 --> 01:00:09,416
She coordinated with him
to get flowers and get things ready.

842
01:00:09,500 --> 01:00:11,416
Jolly was managing everything.

843
01:00:12,458 --> 01:00:18,166
I stood looking at all this
and still remember how disturbed I felt.

844
01:00:19,500 --> 01:00:22,541
I wasn't concentrating on the dead body,

845
01:00:22,625 --> 01:00:27,416
I was looking at Jolly moving around,
bringing things from the other room,

846
01:00:27,500 --> 01:00:29,208
doing all the things there.

847
01:00:29,291 --> 01:00:33,416
I just saw her face for a moment

848
01:00:34,500 --> 01:00:36,833
and felt strange.

849
01:00:37,541 --> 01:00:42,625
I mean, I felt
she actually has an internal happiness.

850
01:00:44,458 --> 01:00:50,250
Somewhere, it reflected on Jolly's face.
I felt it.

851
01:00:56,291 --> 01:00:58,125
I just stood there.

852
01:01:00,125 --> 01:01:02,208
And a spark struck my mind.

853
01:01:03,750 --> 01:01:08,875
"Sili had died, for what?
To get the man, Shaju?

854
01:01:08,958 --> 01:01:12,666
For Jolly? Did Sili die for Jolly?"

855
01:01:12,750 --> 01:01:16,083
That thought
started to disturb me immensely.

856
01:01:16,666 --> 01:01:19,625
I wondered if perhaps
the baby might have been a hindrance.

857
01:01:19,708 --> 01:01:23,041
Even if Sili alone dies,

858
01:01:23,125 --> 01:01:25,833
an obligation to the child
would undoubtedly hold Jolly back.

859
01:01:29,541 --> 01:01:32,416
I knew something was not right.

860
01:01:37,208 --> 01:01:42,208
After Sili's death

861
01:01:42,791 --> 01:01:47,458
and after her first death anniversary,

862
01:01:47,541 --> 01:01:52,083
one day, Mother called me personally
and told me that

863
01:01:53,125 --> 01:01:54,708
a proposal had come for her,

864
01:01:57,833 --> 01:02:00,333
"Kariyachan Pappan is talking about

865
01:02:00,416 --> 01:02:07,208
a marriage proposal with Shaju."

866
01:02:08,416 --> 01:02:12,083
And she asked me what she should do.

867
01:02:12,875 --> 01:02:16,166
But that was just a formal way of

868
01:02:16,250 --> 01:02:19,875
asking for my acceptance
for their marriage.

869
01:02:22,041 --> 01:02:25,291
If they both
are interested in this marriage,

870
01:02:25,375 --> 01:02:27,458
I should not be an obstacle in their way.

871
01:02:27,541 --> 01:02:31,083
That was my intention.

872
01:02:37,875 --> 01:02:42,625
Jolly had a clear motive
behind getting married to Shaju.

873
01:02:44,041 --> 01:02:46,208
After the wedding took place,

874
01:02:47,041 --> 01:02:49,333
it was definite for me,
that she had achieved that goal.

875
01:02:54,041 --> 01:02:58,291
I used to always tell Rojo
about a verse in the bible.

876
01:02:59,000 --> 01:03:02,500
"Whatever is done in the dark
will be proclaimed on the rooftop,

877
01:03:02,583 --> 01:03:05,041
whatever is being hidden,

878
01:03:05,125 --> 01:03:11,375
all of this will come out into the light,"
is what I used to always tell Rojo.

879
01:03:12,416 --> 01:03:14,791
We've always said

880
01:03:14,875 --> 01:03:19,625
that a big criminal,
no matter how brilliant,

881
01:03:19,708 --> 01:03:25,166
God will leave something out there.

882
01:03:27,375 --> 01:03:32,166
So that's when, in my mind,
I made a clear decision.

883
01:03:32,250 --> 01:03:36,000
I just said to Rojo that I wanted a copy
of Roy's postmortem report.

884
01:03:37,875 --> 01:03:40,083
I immediately looked
at the death certificate.

885
01:03:40,166 --> 01:03:46,083
I saw that Roy's time of death
was 11:20 p.m. at night.

886
01:03:46,916 --> 01:03:52,375
We know that cyanide causes
an immediate halt in respiration.

887
01:03:53,083 --> 01:03:59,583
I noticed that the Bengal gram and rice
he consumed were undigested.

888
01:04:00,291 --> 01:04:03,583
This substance entered his body
through that food.

889
01:04:04,958 --> 01:04:09,291
A conversation came back to my mind.

890
01:04:09,375 --> 01:04:12,416
When I was at home after Roy's death,

891
01:04:12,500 --> 01:04:16,375
that next day,
I casually spoke with Jolly.

892
01:04:16,458 --> 01:04:20,791
I asked her, "What was the last thing
Roy ate yesterday?"

893
01:04:21,375 --> 01:04:24,375
So she said,
"He ate rice and Bengal gram curry,

894
01:04:24,458 --> 01:04:27,625
which is his favorite dish."

895
01:04:27,708 --> 01:04:29,166
I asked, "When did he eat it?"

896
01:04:29,250 --> 01:04:32,541
She said, "He ate around
2:30 to 3:00 p.m. in the afternoon.

897
01:04:33,500 --> 01:04:35,583
Then at night, he didn't have dinner."

898
01:04:36,875 --> 01:04:41,125
But while I was reading
the postmortem report,

899
01:04:41,708 --> 01:04:47,041
I could vividly recall her words
echoing in my mind.

900
01:04:47,125 --> 01:04:49,333
It was repeatedly coming to my mind.

901
01:04:50,958 --> 01:04:53,375
"At night, he didn't have dinner."

902
01:04:54,750 --> 01:04:59,833
It sent shivers down my spine

903
01:04:59,916 --> 01:05:02,000
and as I revisited the report,

904
01:05:03,291 --> 01:05:04,625
My God, this is…

905
01:05:04,708 --> 01:05:08,083
This is not the same
as what she said actually.

906
01:05:08,166 --> 01:05:09,875
I immediately realized.

907
01:05:10,666 --> 01:05:12,750
This food was not eaten at lunch.

908
01:05:13,875 --> 01:05:20,250
Because there was no time
for the food to digest.

909
01:05:22,041 --> 01:05:23,625
Roy had the dinner.

910
01:05:24,750 --> 01:05:26,916
That's when I knew,

911
01:05:27,000 --> 01:05:29,333
Jolly was the person behind all of this.

912
01:05:36,583 --> 01:05:39,875
I went to meet Mr. K.G. Simon
in Thodupuzha at his house.

913
01:05:40,625 --> 01:05:44,458
For almost three hours,
I sat there and told him all about this.

914
01:05:44,541 --> 01:05:47,083
Sequentially, I spoke about the deaths

915
01:05:47,166 --> 01:05:51,833
and all my doubts
about what I saw in the postmortem.

916
01:05:51,916 --> 01:05:54,250
He said, "Renji, whatever it is,
we will investigate.

917
01:05:54,333 --> 01:05:56,333
It requires some effort,
but we will investigate it."

918
01:05:58,416 --> 01:06:02,083
After that, we transferred the case
to the crime branch.

919
01:06:02,166 --> 01:06:06,166
We gathered ten people and proceeded
as a team for the investigation.

920
01:06:06,916 --> 01:06:12,875
She's endorsing herself as a teacher,
as an NIT teacher.

921
01:06:13,708 --> 01:06:14,916
That's how she introduced herself.

922
01:06:16,958 --> 01:06:21,416
Because of that, the investigation at NIT
was very important.

923
01:06:21,500 --> 01:06:24,583
The investigation agency
came here on August 20th.

924
01:06:24,666 --> 01:06:27,750
They told us to investigate if this lady

925
01:06:27,833 --> 01:06:30,291
worked here on a permanent
or temporary basis.

926
01:06:30,916 --> 01:06:34,375
We checked all the records from 2000.

927
01:06:34,458 --> 01:06:37,083
We mentioned in writing
to the investigating agency

928
01:06:37,166 --> 01:06:39,708
that there was no such lady working here.

929
01:06:42,458 --> 01:06:44,458
He said, "There was no such person here."

930
01:06:44,541 --> 01:06:49,333
Neither on temporary
nor on daily wage did she work here."

931
01:06:51,041 --> 01:06:53,416
Jolly did have an ID card.

932
01:06:53,500 --> 01:06:54,791
We have a photo of it.

933
01:06:55,458 --> 01:06:58,250
That was a source of confusion
for everyone.

934
01:06:58,875 --> 01:07:00,416
But Jolly had destroyed that ID card.

935
01:07:02,333 --> 01:07:03,666
Even though she was not a professor,

936
01:07:04,250 --> 01:07:07,375
I expected her to have a comparatively
high educational qualification.

937
01:07:07,458 --> 01:07:08,458
She didn't have that either.

938
01:07:09,416 --> 01:07:14,958
Jolly has certificates showing
she passed BCom and MCom

939
01:07:15,041 --> 01:07:17,375
and other professional certificates.

940
01:07:18,708 --> 01:07:21,500
On the basis of the certificate,
we went in search of its source and found

941
01:07:22,000 --> 01:07:24,625
it's not Jolly Joseph.

942
01:07:24,708 --> 01:07:26,333
It's a different individual.

943
01:07:28,291 --> 01:07:30,041
So then what was the source for that?

944
01:07:32,125 --> 01:07:36,916
Tom Thomas was an Administrative Assistant
of the educational department

945
01:07:37,000 --> 01:07:42,375
and after his retirement, he established
an Educational Consultancy.

946
01:07:43,041 --> 01:07:45,291
Photocopies of certificates
of many students

947
01:07:45,375 --> 01:07:47,958
used to come to his consultancy firm.

948
01:07:48,750 --> 01:07:50,416
Jolly was aware of this.

949
01:07:50,500 --> 01:07:53,708
She took a few certificates from there,

950
01:07:54,333 --> 01:07:57,041
and after erasing the name
and marks on a certificate,

951
01:07:57,125 --> 01:08:01,000
she entered her name "Jolly Joseph"
and also changed the marks obtained

952
01:08:01,083 --> 01:08:03,583
and took a photocopy of it
and kept it safely.

953
01:08:03,666 --> 01:08:05,791
Everything that Jolly said was lies.

954
01:08:07,458 --> 01:08:09,958
In my investigation, it was found

955
01:08:10,041 --> 01:08:13,416
that Jolly Joseph had studied
only up to pre-degree,

956
01:08:13,500 --> 01:08:14,750
as per the information received.

957
01:08:14,833 --> 01:08:16,166
That is an important fact.

958
01:08:25,166 --> 01:08:28,833
I was moving to Shimla to enroll
in a college and pursue my degree.

959
01:08:29,875 --> 01:08:33,541
Since it was a long journey,
I couldn't go home often.

960
01:08:33,625 --> 01:08:38,958
So my mother called me, saying that
a legal document had been delivered.

961
01:08:40,166 --> 01:08:45,041
Thamarassery Police Station stated
that there is suspicion in the six deaths

962
01:08:45,958 --> 01:08:48,916
that had occurred in Ponnamattam house

963
01:08:49,000 --> 01:08:53,708
and it has to be reinvestigated.

964
01:08:53,791 --> 01:08:59,333
The main suspect in the investigation
was Jolly, according to the petition.

965
01:09:00,541 --> 01:09:05,916
It was informed to Mother
from the Thamarassery Police Station

966
01:09:06,000 --> 01:09:12,000
that the petition was given
by my aunt and uncle.

967
01:09:12,750 --> 01:09:19,500
Around this time, Jolly would tell me,
"We must get rid of this case.

968
01:09:19,583 --> 01:09:22,500
You should ask them
to withdraw this case."

969
01:09:23,125 --> 01:09:26,875
It was unbelievable for me
to think that she had committed

970
01:09:26,958 --> 01:09:30,750
so many murders because I had seen
such things only in the movies,

971
01:09:30,833 --> 01:09:33,000
but never in real life.

972
01:09:33,791 --> 01:09:35,916
So I believed what she said.

973
01:09:37,541 --> 01:09:41,625
So I called Aunt Renji and told her,

974
01:09:41,708 --> 01:09:46,875
"If there is nothing solid in this case,
then we should close it

975
01:09:46,958 --> 01:09:51,000
because I am facing
a lot of mental disturbances due to this."

976
01:09:52,250 --> 01:09:54,000
"My mother says that
when each of those people died,

977
01:09:54,083 --> 01:09:56,958
it wasn't just my mother,
but everyone else was also present there."

978
01:09:57,625 --> 01:10:04,291
So tell Uncle that Mother is going to file
a defamation case against Uncle."

979
01:10:04,916 --> 01:10:06,916
Then Aunt Renji replied very emotionally,

980
01:10:07,000 --> 01:10:08,875
"Remo, there are a lot of unknown facts.

981
01:10:08,958 --> 01:10:13,083
There is suspicion in all the deaths"

982
01:10:14,208 --> 01:10:16,541
I told him,
no matter who all he asks to convince me…

983
01:10:17,041 --> 01:10:20,750
I think I was very stern

984
01:10:20,833 --> 01:10:22,291
when I said this to him,

985
01:10:22,375 --> 01:10:26,333
"There is no way
this complaint will be withdrawn.

986
01:10:26,416 --> 01:10:29,375
There should be somebody
to speak for the dead."

987
01:10:45,625 --> 01:10:49,041
So one day, a small piece of news
appears in the newspaper.

988
01:10:50,208 --> 01:10:56,750
One of my friends took a photo
of the news and sent it to me.

989
01:10:56,833 --> 01:10:58,791
Regarding the mysterious death
of six people

990
01:10:58,875 --> 01:10:59,875
in Koodathayi, Kozhikode,

991
01:10:59,958 --> 01:11:03,041
on Friday, the crime branch will open
the grave and conduct a forensic analysis.

992
01:11:03,125 --> 01:11:05,833
For this, the police requested permission
from the district administration.

993
01:11:05,916 --> 01:11:08,458
A shocking story
is emerging out of Koodathayi.

994
01:11:09,041 --> 01:11:12,333
Six members of a family named Ponnamattam

995
01:11:12,416 --> 01:11:13,916
are suspected to have been murdered

996
01:11:14,000 --> 01:11:15,708
between 2002 and 2016.

997
01:11:15,791 --> 01:11:18,291
It appeared as breaking news on channels.

998
01:11:18,375 --> 01:11:20,375
Serial murders in Koodathayi.

999
01:11:21,041 --> 01:11:22,083
The police are investigating.

1000
01:11:22,166 --> 01:11:25,458
Fourteen years, six mysterious deaths.

1001
01:11:26,708 --> 01:11:29,250
At that time,
our house and property were shown

1002
01:11:29,333 --> 01:11:31,875
reporting about six deaths
which are under suspicion.

1003
01:11:31,958 --> 01:11:35,916
I had no idea what was happening around,
even many of my friends were calling me

1004
01:11:36,000 --> 01:11:38,750
and asking, "What was happening?"
I told them, "I didn't know anything."

1005
01:11:40,291 --> 01:11:44,375
So I started from Shimla to Delhi.

1006
01:11:44,458 --> 01:11:48,500
From Delhi, I took a flight to Kerala.

1007
01:11:48,583 --> 01:11:54,208
I was continuously listening to the news
and what was happening.

1008
01:11:54,291 --> 01:11:56,916
The police are investigating the murders
that took place in Koodathayi.

1009
01:11:57,000 --> 01:11:58,708
If foul play is involved,

1010
01:11:58,791 --> 01:12:01,000
we need to find out what happened.

1011
01:12:01,083 --> 01:12:03,333
We have our methods to investigate.

1012
01:12:08,875 --> 01:12:11,041
It is the first time in the history
of Kerala Police

1013
01:12:11,125 --> 01:12:14,625
that six bodies were exhumed
at the same time.

1014
01:12:14,708 --> 01:12:17,750
Only those who are required
to be present should enter.

1015
01:12:20,750 --> 01:12:23,125
We cannot be certain we'll find cyanide

1016
01:12:23,208 --> 01:12:28,166
from a dead body buried over six years,
with the process of exhumation…

1017
01:12:28,250 --> 01:12:30,291
We may find it. That's all.

1018
01:12:33,166 --> 01:12:35,875
The problem in this series of cases

1019
01:12:35,958 --> 01:12:39,125
is no doubt going to be
the chemical analysis.

1020
01:12:39,708 --> 01:12:46,000
Only in one case, the autopsy was done on
time, maybe within a few hours or a day,

1021
01:12:46,083 --> 01:12:48,833
chemical analysis was done
and cyanide was detected.

1022
01:12:49,958 --> 01:12:52,666
Now we have a series of five dead bodies,

1023
01:12:53,333 --> 01:12:55,625
where we have to prove
the presence of cyanide,

1024
01:12:55,708 --> 01:12:59,791
and some of these were buried
for more than a decade.

1025
01:13:01,125 --> 01:13:04,791
I think it is virtually like
hunting for a needle in a haystack,

1026
01:13:04,875 --> 01:13:05,791
trying to find

1027
01:13:05,875 --> 01:13:09,416
cyanide in a decomposing
or decomposed body.

1028
01:13:11,791 --> 01:13:16,208
When people heard about the exhumation,
they were all angry at us.

1029
01:13:16,291 --> 01:13:20,916
There was pressure from both sides,
Mother's family and Father's family.

1030
01:13:21,000 --> 01:13:23,000
They even decided to call a meeting.

1031
01:13:23,083 --> 01:13:25,125
I heard from someone
that they had discussed

1032
01:13:25,208 --> 01:13:28,291
about calling Rojo back home
to break his legs.

1033
01:13:35,958 --> 01:13:39,833
So some people were there.

1034
01:13:39,916 --> 01:13:42,166
But since they didn't know the reason,

1035
01:13:42,250 --> 01:13:47,250
they were angry with me and Rojo
wondering why are we doing all this.

1036
01:13:48,708 --> 01:13:51,708
I looked at the crowd that had gathered.

1037
01:13:51,791 --> 01:13:55,000
Some people were saying,
"Even after death, Mr. Thomas

1038
01:13:55,083 --> 01:13:57,833
is not destined to sleep in peace."

1039
01:13:58,500 --> 01:14:00,958
I know what I am doing
is absolutely wrong.

1040
01:14:01,041 --> 01:14:03,500
I know everybody will say

1041
01:14:03,583 --> 01:14:06,041
this is the most foolish thing.

1042
01:14:06,125 --> 01:14:07,916
But I told them.

1043
01:14:08,000 --> 01:14:10,708
"I know my parents are with me,"
I told them.

1044
01:14:11,791 --> 01:14:13,083
I have a mission.

1045
01:14:18,666 --> 01:14:20,916
That's why I didn't bother
about the surrounding crowd

1046
01:14:21,000 --> 01:14:23,000
or their comments.

1047
01:14:33,041 --> 01:14:36,458
When I reached home,
I found that the house was empty,

1048
01:14:36,541 --> 01:14:38,291
except for my brother.

1049
01:14:39,875 --> 01:14:41,458
She came home.

1050
01:14:41,541 --> 01:14:45,875
When the woman called Jolly
returned home, I observed

1051
01:14:45,958 --> 01:14:47,625
that she looked very tired,

1052
01:14:47,708 --> 01:14:52,708
panic-stricken,
and her inner mind was full of fear.

1053
01:14:52,791 --> 01:14:57,750
I said that I need to speak to Jolly alone
and I went with her to a room.

1054
01:14:59,500 --> 01:15:04,166
After entering the room,
I asked her, "What's going on?"

1055
01:15:04,250 --> 01:15:07,416
I told her, "The news channels are all

1056
01:15:07,500 --> 01:15:11,291
pointing their fingers in your direction.

1057
01:15:12,083 --> 01:15:14,000
Have there been any mistakes on your part?

1058
01:15:14,083 --> 01:15:17,541
I'm asking you strongly,
are you involved in these murders?"

1059
01:15:17,625 --> 01:15:22,333
She cried and replied in a panicked voice

1060
01:15:22,416 --> 01:15:26,375
that she did not do anything wrong
and that she was not involved at all.

1061
01:15:26,458 --> 01:15:32,125
I said, "I want to know the truth,
tell me what happened!

1062
01:15:32,208 --> 01:15:35,791
You have definitely done something
and you must tell me everything."

1063
01:15:35,875 --> 01:15:37,541
By that time,

1064
01:15:38,500 --> 01:15:44,083
in a very feeble voice, she admitted
she had committed some mistakes.

1065
01:15:44,166 --> 01:15:46,916
So I asked her again,
"Did you commit these murders?

1066
01:15:47,000 --> 01:15:49,500
Tell me everything!"

1067
01:15:54,375 --> 01:15:58,416
I was at a relative's place in Kozhikode
when Remo had called.

1068
01:16:00,166 --> 01:16:03,083
I asked, "What happened, son?
What happened there?"

1069
01:16:05,000 --> 01:16:06,708
"This lady

1070
01:16:09,625 --> 01:16:11,125
killed everyone," he said.

1071
01:16:12,500 --> 01:16:14,333
Then I asked, "How do you know?

1072
01:16:15,333 --> 01:16:16,833
Who told you this?"

1073
01:16:17,833 --> 01:16:19,208
He said, "She told me.

1074
01:16:21,375 --> 01:16:22,708
Aunt, as soon as possible,

1075
01:16:23,416 --> 01:16:25,875
you should call the police
and get her arrested."

1076
01:16:28,375 --> 01:16:30,041
I quickly realized

1077
01:16:30,125 --> 01:16:31,916
that the rest of the cyanide
is still in that house.

1078
01:16:32,000 --> 01:16:34,041
And a small bit is enough
for two children.

1079
01:16:34,916 --> 01:16:38,000
I told him to grab a piece of cloth
or bed sheet and stuff it in his mouth

1080
01:16:38,083 --> 01:16:39,875
to avoid falling asleep.

1081
01:16:39,958 --> 01:16:41,916
"Don't eat anything.

1082
01:16:42,000 --> 01:16:43,916
Don't drink water or anything from there."

1083
01:16:44,000 --> 01:16:45,625
I kept repeating all this to him.

1084
01:16:46,458 --> 01:16:48,958
Then suddenly,
I could hear the door knocking.

1085
01:16:52,000 --> 01:16:55,583
Remo opened the door
and I could hear him talking.

1086
01:16:56,708 --> 01:16:59,833
I could hear him asking, "Why are you
standing here? What do you want to hear?"

1087
01:17:02,125 --> 01:17:05,208
On the other side of the phone, I realized

1088
01:17:05,291 --> 01:17:09,416
that Jolly was standing
in front of Remo's door.

1089
01:17:11,375 --> 01:17:15,458
I immediately said I would call him later
and I disconnected the call.

1090
01:17:17,208 --> 01:17:18,708
I was waiting for the sun to rise

1091
01:17:18,791 --> 01:17:21,541
so that I could get the kids out of there.

1092
01:17:21,625 --> 01:17:24,625
And in the morning, I called the SP.

1093
01:17:38,333 --> 01:17:42,375
This morning, Jolly Joseph was arrested
and taken to police custody

1094
01:17:42,458 --> 01:17:44,250
at her home in Koodathayi.

1095
01:17:44,333 --> 01:17:47,666
She will be formally charged
with killing her husband, Roy.

1096
01:17:47,750 --> 01:17:51,708
But she is under suspicion for the five
other deaths in question as well.

1097
01:17:54,708 --> 01:17:56,791
I was watching all these news clippings,

1098
01:17:58,375 --> 01:18:00,916
as Jolly is led out of the house
and into a police jeep.

1099
01:18:01,000 --> 01:18:03,833
Remo was standing on the porch.

1100
01:18:03,916 --> 01:18:05,250
But I didn't see my younger nephew.

1101
01:18:06,250 --> 01:18:11,541
So I was searching for any sign of him
in the news clippings.

1102
01:18:13,000 --> 01:18:14,250
As soon as we arrived,

1103
01:18:14,333 --> 01:18:16,708
I went and searched for the younger one.

1104
01:18:16,791 --> 01:18:19,041
He was still sleeping.

1105
01:18:19,125 --> 01:18:22,916
The vibe of the house seemed disturbed
from a few days back.

1106
01:18:23,000 --> 01:18:25,625
Many dishes were lying
in the washbasin unwashed.

1107
01:18:25,708 --> 01:18:30,208
There was leftover food
from the past two or three days.

1108
01:18:31,500 --> 01:18:33,916
I just closed the door and went outside.

1109
01:18:34,000 --> 01:18:35,625
By then, there were
a lot of neighbors at home.

1110
01:18:38,958 --> 01:18:40,166
Some of them tried to speak to me.

1111
01:18:40,250 --> 01:18:44,500
A bunch of the media people had packed in
right in front of the gate.

1112
01:18:44,583 --> 01:18:46,291
I realized
that I wouldn't be able to get out.

1113
01:18:49,833 --> 01:18:53,166
But that day, there was surprisingly

1114
01:18:53,833 --> 01:18:58,291
heavy rain and thunderstorm
around 3:30 to 4:00 p.m.

1115
01:18:58,375 --> 01:19:01,000
The rainfall was so heavy that
all the media people had to move away.

1116
01:19:01,083 --> 01:19:02,791
They couldn't stand there.

1117
01:19:03,750 --> 01:19:06,000
I decided to take the kids and go.

1118
01:19:06,916 --> 01:19:09,208
I told them,
"Go and get whatever you can take

1119
01:19:09,291 --> 01:19:13,375
and whatever is important to you."

1120
01:19:14,250 --> 01:19:17,166
Then I locked the house and we left.

1121
01:19:18,791 --> 01:19:25,416
That night, on our way,
Remo was showing me news clippings.

1122
01:19:25,500 --> 01:19:28,041
Shaju was defending Jolly.

1123
01:19:28,125 --> 01:19:31,750
They started responding
to various news channels saying,

1124
01:19:31,833 --> 01:19:35,916
"It's just a property case."
I was listening to all of this.

1125
01:19:37,541 --> 01:19:40,958
I told Remo,
"Don't bother about the comments.

1126
01:19:41,041 --> 01:19:42,791
Don't pay attention to it."

1127
01:19:47,250 --> 01:19:50,041
We reached Vyttila at 5:00 p.m.

1128
01:19:52,791 --> 01:19:55,708
We got out of the taxi
and opened the gate.

1129
01:20:00,083 --> 01:20:02,625
As soon as we crossed the gate…

1130
01:20:03,541 --> 01:20:10,458
I just looked up and told
my parents and my elder brother,

1131
01:20:11,166 --> 01:20:12,833
"I did what I could do."

1132
01:20:14,125 --> 01:20:17,208
Because these souls were with me.

1133
01:20:17,291 --> 01:20:18,916
Definitely, that's what I believe.

1134
01:20:19,583 --> 01:20:21,833
They must have wanted me
to accomplish this mission

1135
01:20:21,916 --> 01:20:23,291
and that's why it worked.

1136
01:20:23,375 --> 01:20:24,583
That's what I think.

1137
01:20:34,833 --> 01:20:37,208
For power, she killed her mother-in-law.

1138
01:20:37,291 --> 01:20:39,333
For property,
she killed her father-in-law.

1139
01:20:39,416 --> 01:20:41,458
For questioning her friendships,
she killed her husband.

1140
01:20:41,541 --> 01:20:44,750
For raising suspicions,
she killed her uncle, Mathew.

1141
01:20:44,833 --> 01:20:48,041
For having Shaju as her husband,
she killed his wife, Sili,

1142
01:20:48,125 --> 01:20:50,500
and their child, Alphine.

1143
01:20:50,583 --> 01:20:53,041
Was Jolly the only mastermind
behind all these murders?

1144
01:20:54,833 --> 01:20:58,125
The court has remanded Jolly
in police custody for six days,

1145
01:20:58,208 --> 01:21:00,458
until the 16th of this month.

1146
01:21:01,333 --> 01:21:03,791
During that time,
they will be questioning her,

1147
01:21:03,875 --> 01:21:06,333
and perhaps the biggest
unanswered question is,

1148
01:21:07,041 --> 01:21:09,166
"Did Jolly act alone?"

1149
01:21:12,541 --> 01:21:14,291
Jolly said that

1150
01:21:15,208 --> 01:21:21,208
she had read in the newspaper
that cyanide is very poisonous.

1151
01:21:21,291 --> 01:21:23,666
This poison, known as cyanide,

1152
01:21:23,750 --> 01:21:26,416
was easily accessible to those
who worked as goldsmiths.

1153
01:21:27,916 --> 01:21:31,291
M.S. Mathew was working

1154
01:21:31,375 --> 01:21:35,625
as a salesman in a jewelry shop.

1155
01:21:35,708 --> 01:21:38,791
For this very reason,
she had a friendship with Mathew.

1156
01:21:38,875 --> 01:21:41,666
Jolly asked him for some cyanide,

1157
01:21:41,750 --> 01:21:44,916
lying that she wanted
to kill a stray dog that came there.

1158
01:21:45,708 --> 01:21:51,750
Praji Kumar is a goldsmith
who worked with M.S. Mathew,

1159
01:21:51,833 --> 01:21:54,458
and they were close friends.

1160
01:21:54,541 --> 01:21:57,375
And it was Praji Kumar
who gave him the cyanide.

1161
01:21:58,500 --> 01:21:59,833
Were you aware of what she was doing?

1162
01:21:59,916 --> 01:22:01,708
How many times did you
give cyanide to her?

1163
01:22:01,791 --> 01:22:03,875
Mathew, are you trapped
in this case by someone?

1164
01:22:05,291 --> 01:22:09,625
Mathew had the opportunity to explain
his side of the story to the court.

1165
01:22:10,125 --> 01:22:12,708
I mean, Mathew had the chance
to inform the court that he is innocent,

1166
01:22:12,791 --> 01:22:13,791
that the case is bogus,

1167
01:22:14,375 --> 01:22:16,750
and that he had nothing to do
with the six murders.

1168
01:22:17,333 --> 01:22:19,541
And when asked what he wanted to say,

1169
01:22:19,625 --> 01:22:21,416
Mathew didn't deny anything.

1170
01:22:23,541 --> 01:22:26,333
With Jolly and her accomplices
in the police custody,

1171
01:22:26,416 --> 01:22:30,833
K.G. Simon's case is complicated
by the lack of physical evidence.

1172
01:22:30,916 --> 01:22:35,875
No doubt finding the cyanide used
in these murders would make that case

1173
01:22:35,958 --> 01:22:37,458
much stronger.

1174
01:22:42,166 --> 01:22:46,041
The evidence-gathering process
was challenging.

1175
01:22:46,125 --> 01:22:52,250
Wherever Jolly was taken,
there was a lot of commotion.

1176
01:22:59,541 --> 01:23:02,083
Haven't you seen
enough photos of me already?

1177
01:23:02,166 --> 01:23:04,416
Yes, we have seen you a lot already.

1178
01:23:05,000 --> 01:23:08,083
Then we took Jolly Joseph
to the Ponnamattam house.

1179
01:23:08,166 --> 01:23:12,000
We felt as though the evidence
fell right into our hands.

1180
01:23:12,083 --> 01:23:15,083
In connection with the Koodathayi
serial murder case evidence hunting,

1181
01:23:15,166 --> 01:23:18,500
the police found powder suspected
to be cyanide from Ponnamattam house.

1182
01:23:18,583 --> 01:23:21,708
The investigating team claims
that Jolly herself handed it over to them.

1183
01:23:25,625 --> 01:23:32,083
With much respect to the honorable court
and with respect to the prosecution,

1184
01:23:32,166 --> 01:23:35,541
as a defense lawyer, after so many years,

1185
01:23:35,625 --> 01:23:42,250
even saying that they found this substance
in that house is beyond my imagination.

1186
01:23:43,208 --> 01:23:49,083
To prove the allegations against Jolly,

1187
01:23:49,166 --> 01:23:53,208
prosecution itself fabricated
the potassium cyanide,

1188
01:23:53,833 --> 01:23:58,375
the bottle that contained it,
the place where it was hidden,

1189
01:23:59,666 --> 01:24:05,833
I believe all these were framed
for the purpose of this case.

1190
01:24:07,291 --> 01:24:09,500
Whenever I spoke to police officers,

1191
01:24:09,583 --> 01:24:12,208
they did not give me clear-cut answers,

1192
01:24:12,291 --> 01:24:13,541
which made me feel

1193
01:24:13,625 --> 01:24:16,541
that the police investigation
was not complete.

1194
01:24:16,625 --> 01:24:19,708
There could have been holes
in the police narrative,

1195
01:24:19,791 --> 01:24:22,250
which was never questioned.

1196
01:24:22,791 --> 01:24:25,083
These questions would actually
stare back at you,

1197
01:24:25,166 --> 01:24:26,958
the loopholes in the case.

1198
01:24:32,583 --> 01:24:38,916
There are six cases against Jolly
with 263 witnesses.

1199
01:24:41,125 --> 01:24:46,250
If we conduct a trial
on each of these cases as they should be,

1200
01:24:46,833 --> 01:24:51,541
each trial will take a year.

1201
01:24:51,625 --> 01:24:54,541
So for six cases to be concluded,
it will take six years.

1202
01:24:56,125 --> 01:25:01,541
With all the available legal provisions,

1203
01:25:01,625 --> 01:25:04,666
I will prove her innocence.

1204
01:25:05,666 --> 01:25:09,625
I have 100% faith that Jolly will succeed.

1205
01:25:09,708 --> 01:25:13,125
She will not be convicted
in any point of time.

1206
01:25:27,500 --> 01:25:31,375
The case is now in the honorable court.

1207
01:25:33,583 --> 01:25:36,875
After retirement, many people
requested that I take up other jobs,

1208
01:25:37,541 --> 01:25:38,916
but I am refraining from them because

1209
01:25:39,000 --> 01:25:42,625
I need to look after my family
and be with them.

1210
01:25:42,708 --> 01:25:45,208
I'm investigating this case
just out of my desire.

1211
01:25:52,791 --> 01:25:55,375
When she was arrested
and a case was brought against her…

1212
01:25:56,333 --> 01:26:01,666
Some people couldn't speak to me.
Others did call me to apologize.

1213
01:26:04,041 --> 01:26:07,250
Most of the other relatives
were just dumbstruck.

1214
01:26:10,916 --> 01:26:12,333
When I look back…

1215
01:26:12,416 --> 01:26:14,625
It's fate. What else could it be?

1216
01:26:15,708 --> 01:26:17,625
Our bad fate.

1217
01:26:20,250 --> 01:26:23,000
We intend to renovate
the Ponnamattam house,

1218
01:26:24,000 --> 01:26:26,666
make it once again our ancestral home,

1219
01:26:27,416 --> 01:26:29,625
and continue to live there.
That's our desire.

1220
01:26:30,833 --> 01:26:35,791
By doing so, let the souls
of my mother and father get some solace.

1221
01:26:37,250 --> 01:26:39,541
Because that house
was their greatest desire.

1222
01:26:43,041 --> 01:26:46,041
Do you think your mother alone is guilty?

1223
01:26:46,125 --> 01:26:51,541
I can't say anything about that.
We'll know about the ultimate truth soon.

1224
01:26:51,625 --> 01:26:53,916
We believe in that ultimate truth.

1225
01:26:54,000 --> 01:26:58,250
I should be strong now
because I have a younger brother.

1226
01:26:58,333 --> 01:27:00,000
I have to take care of him.

1227
01:27:00,083 --> 01:27:03,625
So I will move on
and I will overcome this. That's all.

1228
01:27:03,708 --> 01:27:05,583
We should always keep this in mind.

1229
01:27:05,666 --> 01:27:09,750
Whether it takes 17 or 25 years,
truth will triumph.

1230
01:27:12,291 --> 01:27:14,625
Many people have asked this question.

1231
01:27:16,250 --> 01:27:21,291
"You all are such educated people.
How could you not find out about Jolly?"

1232
01:27:21,375 --> 01:27:23,833
Or, "Why didn't you find out
about Jolly's educational qualifications?"

1233
01:27:24,666 --> 01:27:29,500
And to those who asked me,
I asked them in return,

1234
01:27:30,125 --> 01:27:32,791
"When your children got married,
how many of you

1235
01:27:32,875 --> 01:27:38,958
have seen your daughter-in-law's
education certificates or portfolios?"

1236
01:27:40,375 --> 01:27:43,458
We trusted. Family means trust.

1237
01:27:45,916 --> 01:27:49,083
She knew no one would doubt her.

1238
01:27:51,416 --> 01:27:54,541
There is a phrase I keep hearing.

1239
01:27:54,625 --> 01:27:56,541
"A wolf in sheep's clothing."

1240
01:28:00,333 --> 01:28:05,333
If a wolf disguises himself as a sheep,
no one will know it's a wolf.

1241
01:28:05,875 --> 01:28:08,208
Maybe that's the reason why,
in Jolly's case,

1242
01:28:08,291 --> 01:28:10,833
nobody was able to see her true colors.

1243
01:28:14,083 --> 01:28:15,541
In retrospect…

1244
01:28:17,625 --> 01:28:20,083
What was Jolly trying to gain
through all this?

1245
01:28:22,541 --> 01:28:25,916
Money? Power? Property?

1246
01:28:26,958 --> 01:28:30,541
I wanted to hear the answers
from Jolly herself.

1247
01:28:38,791 --> 01:28:40,166
So I was waiting upstairs.

1248
01:28:40,916 --> 01:28:44,791
The police officers came back
along with Jolly.

1249
01:28:46,125 --> 01:28:50,583
When she saw me, there wasn't
any change in her facial expressions.

1250
01:28:52,250 --> 01:28:56,500
To be frank, I didn't have
any particular feeling for this woman.

1251
01:28:58,333 --> 01:29:00,291
I told her, "Look, I have come here

1252
01:29:00,375 --> 01:29:02,958
to talk about your frequent calls to Remo.

1253
01:29:03,041 --> 01:29:07,291
But he was very upset and I overheard him
speaking in a very aggressive manner.

1254
01:29:08,833 --> 01:29:11,916
You called him up and said,
'Let me see how they punish me.

1255
01:29:12,000 --> 01:29:13,791
Or wait and watch,
I am going to get out of here.

1256
01:29:13,875 --> 01:29:15,291
You come and show me the proof.'

1257
01:29:15,375 --> 01:29:17,125
If you say these to him,

1258
01:29:17,208 --> 01:29:19,000
it will enrage him.

1259
01:29:19,833 --> 01:29:21,875
So never do this."

1260
01:29:23,125 --> 01:29:25,375
I told her, "Remo's biggest dilemma
is that you still haven't shown

1261
01:29:25,458 --> 01:29:27,833
any remorse for what you have done.

1262
01:29:28,500 --> 01:29:34,625
You still haven't realized the seriousness
or depth of what you have done.

1263
01:29:35,375 --> 01:29:38,875
The children haven't gotten
what they wanted from their mother,

1264
01:29:38,958 --> 01:29:41,958
but they are going through
so much right now.

1265
01:29:42,041 --> 01:29:46,416
I don't want them
to go through this anymore

1266
01:29:46,500 --> 01:29:47,958
and that's why I am here.

1267
01:29:49,791 --> 01:29:52,291
I accept the fact that you are the one

1268
01:29:52,375 --> 01:29:55,583
who gave birth to them. I won't deny that.

1269
01:29:55,666 --> 01:29:58,958
I accept you as their mother,
but in this present situation,

1270
01:29:59,041 --> 01:30:00,458
they have suffered a lot.

1271
01:30:00,541 --> 01:30:02,375
I won't let them suffer anymore."

1272
01:30:02,458 --> 01:30:05,166
That's exactly how I said it,
"As long as I am alive, I won't allow it.

1273
01:30:07,541 --> 01:30:09,041
Now, they are my children.

1274
01:30:09,916 --> 01:30:12,666
I am going to raise them as my children."

1275
01:30:20,791 --> 01:30:26,083
What my aunt has done can't be explained
in just one word or sentence.

1276
01:30:28,875 --> 01:30:33,708
Because she cares for us
beyond our imagination.

1277
01:30:37,625 --> 01:30:40,416
Now, we really have a family.

1278
01:30:42,125 --> 01:30:45,125
This is not a new family.

1279
01:30:45,208 --> 01:30:47,416
We are all of the same blood.

1280
01:30:49,541 --> 01:30:52,250
Today, many people
who were closest to us aren't alive.

1281
01:30:52,333 --> 01:30:55,625
But still,
all of their blessings are with us.

1282
01:30:55,708 --> 01:30:58,541
Their souls are present amongst us.

1283
01:31:01,000 --> 01:31:04,500
So we don't think of the past
and have regrets.

1284
01:31:04,583 --> 01:31:07,500
We move on. We move on with strength.

1285
01:31:17,708 --> 01:31:20,708
This person who enjoyed
a great position in our house,

1286
01:31:21,208 --> 01:31:27,583
someone who had a lot of servants,
who lived a life with utmost pride,

1287
01:31:28,208 --> 01:31:31,041
came in surrounded
by a team of ten police officers.

1288
01:31:31,125 --> 01:31:34,166
When I saw her coming with them, I felt…

1289
01:31:34,791 --> 01:31:41,583
I felt very bad witnessing the situation
that Jolly had landed herself into.

1290
01:31:45,666 --> 01:31:49,125
I asked, "How do you feel
about what you have done?"

1291
01:31:51,500 --> 01:31:52,583
"It just happened."

1292
01:31:53,375 --> 01:31:55,208
That's the way she said it,
"It just happened."

1293
01:31:57,958 --> 01:32:01,375
I said, "You purposely killed six people.

1294
01:32:01,458 --> 01:32:03,666
You didn't even spare a little child.

1295
01:32:03,750 --> 01:32:05,666
And you said, this just happened?"

1296
01:32:08,250 --> 01:32:12,666
"That's because I have a criminal mind,
I can hide things."

1297
01:32:13,666 --> 01:32:14,958
That's what she replied.

1298
01:32:20,333 --> 01:32:24,541
After all that finished, she said to me,

1299
01:32:25,791 --> 01:32:27,333
"It is said in the Bible,

1300
01:32:27,416 --> 01:32:31,083
no matter how many sins we commit,
God will forgive us.

1301
01:32:31,708 --> 01:32:32,875
He will forgive me as well."

1302
01:32:36,833 --> 01:32:41,833
I said, "Yes, God may forgive.
May God forgive everyone!"