1
00:00:46,698 --> 00:00:50,267
It's... I think it's...
It's whatever's here.
2
00:00:52,573 --> 00:00:55,054
Whatever is here is...
3
00:00:55,185 --> 00:00:56,447
Is it trying to harm you?
4
00:00:56,577 --> 00:00:57,709
Yes.
5
00:00:57,839 --> 00:01:01,539
It's like a black shadow
that forms a hood.
6
00:01:01,669 --> 00:01:03,584
Surrounded by pastoral charm
7
00:01:03,715 --> 00:01:05,499
in a quaint Long Island township
8
00:01:05,630 --> 00:01:07,110
stands a wooden frame house
9
00:01:07,240 --> 00:01:08,520
that some folk claim is haunted.
10
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George and Kathleen Lutz
11
00:01:28,435 --> 00:01:29,543
are with us this
morning to talk about
12
00:01:29,567 --> 00:01:31,308
what happened in Amityville.
13
00:01:31,438 --> 00:01:33,397
Within a week, Kathy's
hand had been touched
14
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by something that we discussed
and couldn't explain.
15
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It was just something unseen.
16
00:01:38,358 --> 00:01:40,578
We also had hordes of flies
17
00:01:40,708 --> 00:01:43,189
that would appear
within two rooms.
18
00:01:43,320 --> 00:01:44,625
You played George in the movie.
19
00:01:44,756 --> 00:01:47,280
Mm-hmm.
- And you did research this.
20
00:01:47,411 --> 00:01:49,456
I didn't realize what
I was getting into.
21
00:01:49,587 --> 00:01:52,764
The Amityville Horror is
an experience in terror
22
00:01:52,894 --> 00:01:55,549
you will never forget.
23
00:02:03,644 --> 00:02:06,299
I remember the tagline.
"For God's sakes, get out."
24
00:02:11,957 --> 00:02:13,567
Do you plan to show
the movie here?
25
00:02:13,698 --> 00:02:14,873
No, we don't.
26
00:02:15,003 --> 00:02:16,962
Our people put up quite a stink.
27
00:02:17,092 --> 00:02:21,532
And the distributor agreed
not to show it in Amityville.
28
00:02:21,662 --> 00:02:24,926
People forgot after seeing
The Amityville Horror
29
00:02:25,057 --> 00:02:28,278
the true tragedy of
really what happened.
30
00:02:33,761 --> 00:02:36,286
I lost a whole
family in one night.
31
00:02:38,636 --> 00:02:41,639
And I couldn't bring them back.
32
00:02:43,684 --> 00:02:45,773
A young man murdered,
in cold blood,
33
00:02:45,904 --> 00:02:48,776
his father, mother, four
brothers, and sisters
34
00:02:48,907 --> 00:02:52,258
because voices
told him to do it.
35
00:02:53,520 --> 00:02:54,869
Nobody was drugged.
36
00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:56,871
Nobody heard any shots.
37
00:02:57,002 --> 00:03:00,266
And to this day, all
the clever lawyers
38
00:03:00,397 --> 00:03:03,617
and all the police officers
have no answer to this.
39
00:03:03,748 --> 00:03:07,882
Because they just aren't
qualified to understand it.
40
00:04:22,653 --> 00:04:25,395
We also had hordes of flies
41
00:04:25,525 --> 00:04:27,919
that would appear
within two rooms.
42
00:04:28,049 --> 00:04:30,356
And no matter how many
times we would kill them,
43
00:04:30,487 --> 00:04:32,489
they'd reappeared.
44
00:04:32,619 --> 00:04:34,534
My name is
Christopher Quaratino.
45
00:04:34,665 --> 00:04:36,928
I'm formerly known
as Christopher Lutz,
46
00:04:37,058 --> 00:04:39,104
Kathy Lutz's son.
47
00:04:39,234 --> 00:04:42,455
The Amityville Horror
is called a true story.
48
00:04:42,586 --> 00:04:45,545
And what really happened is,
49
00:04:45,676 --> 00:04:49,984
to me, more traumatic.
50
00:04:50,115 --> 00:04:53,814
And it was something
that I would like to have
51
00:04:53,945 --> 00:04:56,034
just forgotten about.
52
00:04:59,516 --> 00:05:01,076
Unfortunately, I
wasn't able to do that.
53
00:05:01,126 --> 00:05:03,911
And now, it's time to
set that record straight.
54
00:05:19,927 --> 00:05:21,818
The first time I went to go
see the house in Amityville
55
00:05:21,842 --> 00:05:25,672
would've been when my parents
were serious about buying it.
56
00:05:25,803 --> 00:05:28,022
The real estate agent was there.
57
00:05:28,153 --> 00:05:29,850
I was just a kid.
58
00:05:29,981 --> 00:05:32,810
And I'm, like, checking out
this new, big sprawling place,
59
00:05:32,940 --> 00:05:34,377
a new playground.
60
00:05:36,988 --> 00:05:39,599
To me, it was like,
this place is huge.
61
00:05:39,730 --> 00:05:42,385
We'd never had a
house that large.
62
00:05:44,169 --> 00:05:47,390
George and Kathy asked
me to go out with them
63
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to look at the house
64
00:05:48,826 --> 00:05:50,654
that they were
interested in buying.
65
00:05:52,133 --> 00:05:54,005
It went right up to the sound.
66
00:05:54,135 --> 00:05:57,704
So the... the water was
right behind the house.
67
00:05:57,835 --> 00:05:59,402
There was a big stretch of land
68
00:05:59,532 --> 00:06:01,621
to get from the
house to the sound.
69
00:06:01,752 --> 00:06:03,536
And there was a whole boathouse.
70
00:06:06,844 --> 00:06:10,500
It was very pretty
neighborhood, very quiet.
71
00:06:18,595 --> 00:06:19,987
They gave me a camera
72
00:06:20,118 --> 00:06:23,469
and they asked me to take
pictures of the house.
73
00:06:26,254 --> 00:06:29,432
And we spent a good hour or
so walking around the house
74
00:06:29,562 --> 00:06:32,783
'cause it was a big house.
75
00:06:32,913 --> 00:06:35,568
We walked in and there
was this marble floor...
76
00:06:38,223 --> 00:06:41,661
a beautiful banister
going up three stories...
77
00:06:44,185 --> 00:06:47,058
and you could look from
the foyer and look up
78
00:06:47,188 --> 00:06:50,757
and you could see the balcony
on the third-floor landing.
79
00:06:50,888 --> 00:06:53,717
It was beautiful. The
house was gorgeous.
80
00:06:53,847 --> 00:06:55,849
You'll see what
a beauty this is.
81
00:07:01,638 --> 00:07:03,944
There's nothing like
it on the market,
82
00:07:04,075 --> 00:07:05,816
not at this price.
83
00:07:08,949 --> 00:07:11,517
Come in. Come on
in. Thank you.
84
00:07:11,648 --> 00:07:12,648
Impressive, isn't it?
85
00:07:12,736 --> 00:07:14,172
Mm-hmm.
86
00:07:14,302 --> 00:07:15,956
As soon as Kathy walked
in the front door,
87
00:07:16,087 --> 00:07:20,265
she just had this
smile like this was it.
88
00:07:20,395 --> 00:07:22,049
I describe the house as charming
89
00:07:22,180 --> 00:07:23,181
the first time I saw it
90
00:07:23,311 --> 00:07:24,835
because that's what
I thought of it.
91
00:07:34,235 --> 00:07:37,282
Before we left, George
and Kathy asked me
92
00:07:37,412 --> 00:07:40,807
if I felt anything in the house.
93
00:07:40,938 --> 00:07:43,810
I don't know why, but
there was just something
94
00:07:43,941 --> 00:07:45,943
that made me feel strange.
95
00:07:48,815 --> 00:07:51,862
And that's when they
showed me the bullet holes.
96
00:08:16,713 --> 00:08:18,233
When George showed
me the bullet holes,
97
00:08:18,323 --> 00:08:21,500
he was actually laughing,
98
00:08:21,631 --> 00:08:23,807
not because of
what had happened,
99
00:08:23,937 --> 00:08:27,506
but for the fact that
he did not believe that
100
00:08:27,637 --> 00:08:29,856
there was anything in this house
101
00:08:29,987 --> 00:08:32,598
that would stop
him from buying it.
102
00:08:35,079 --> 00:08:40,040
The house was on the
market for $100,000.
103
00:08:40,171 --> 00:08:44,001
We made an offer of
$80,000. It was accepted.
104
00:08:44,131 --> 00:08:46,220
And we moved into this beautiful
105
00:08:46,351 --> 00:08:49,963
4,000 square foot home
106
00:08:50,094 --> 00:08:54,838
on the water with a heated
pool, full basement,
107
00:08:54,968 --> 00:08:56,753
boathouse, garage,
108
00:08:56,883 --> 00:08:59,625
and we thought we were home.
109
00:09:29,873 --> 00:09:31,657
My mom had divorced my real dad
110
00:09:31,788 --> 00:09:34,704
when I was about five.
111
00:09:34,834 --> 00:09:37,228
Mom was Irish.
Dad was Italian.
112
00:09:37,358 --> 00:09:40,579
♪ Started a business deal
113
00:09:40,710 --> 00:09:43,016
My mom was an angel.
114
00:09:43,147 --> 00:09:44,931
They had my older
brother Danny first.
115
00:09:45,062 --> 00:09:46,846
And then I was second.
116
00:09:46,977 --> 00:09:50,241
And then came my
younger sister Melissa.
117
00:09:50,371 --> 00:09:52,809
♪ Love was the last Thing
that crossed my mind ♪
118
00:09:52,939 --> 00:09:56,029
♪ But business
119
00:09:56,160 --> 00:09:58,031
After the divorce,
120
00:09:58,162 --> 00:10:01,948
Mom, she was working
as a waitress.
121
00:10:02,079 --> 00:10:05,212
George used to come
in to where she'd work
122
00:10:05,343 --> 00:10:09,129
and sit in her section,
and he was fond of her.
123
00:10:11,088 --> 00:10:13,307
One night, her car
wouldn't start.
124
00:10:13,438 --> 00:10:15,005
She began to walk home.
125
00:10:16,354 --> 00:10:18,704
George showed up as
a hero on his Harley,
126
00:10:18,835 --> 00:10:19,966
gave her a ride home.
127
00:10:20,097 --> 00:10:21,707
And pretty soon, Mom
had sold her house
128
00:10:21,838 --> 00:10:24,928
and we moved into
the Amityville house.
129
00:10:31,108 --> 00:10:32,718
My mom was excited about it.
130
00:10:32,849 --> 00:10:35,155
It was an exciting
time for all of us.
131
00:10:51,432 --> 00:10:54,174
On the cuff of my
jeans, all my jeans,
132
00:10:54,305 --> 00:10:57,438
I had angel wings with
Harley-Davidson in the middle.
133
00:10:57,569 --> 00:11:02,705
They were, like, three
inches wide, an inch tall.
134
00:11:02,835 --> 00:11:05,925
And this guy next to me is
looking at my cuff and says,
135
00:11:06,056 --> 00:11:09,015
"Hey, uh, you ride
a motorcycle?"
136
00:11:09,146 --> 00:11:11,017
I said, "Yeah, I have
a Harley-Davidson."
137
00:11:11,148 --> 00:11:15,935
He says, "Yeah, so do I.
My name is George Lutz."
138
00:11:16,066 --> 00:11:19,722
He said his grandfather
owned a surveying company,
139
00:11:19,852 --> 00:11:22,812
and he was now
running the business,
140
00:11:22,942 --> 00:11:25,379
which gave him time,
I think, to hang out
141
00:11:25,510 --> 00:11:26,859
on the Harley-Davidson.
142
00:11:40,220 --> 00:11:43,746
In those days, guys were
chopping their motorcycles,
143
00:11:43,876 --> 00:11:47,184
extended front ends,
lots of chrome,
144
00:11:47,314 --> 00:11:49,055
high handlebars.
145
00:11:49,186 --> 00:11:50,883
And I rode with a
bunch of guys that
146
00:11:51,014 --> 00:11:53,059
had bikes like that.
147
00:11:53,190 --> 00:11:57,237
And that's the group I
introduced George to.
148
00:11:57,368 --> 00:11:58,804
And we just took
him into the group
149
00:11:58,935 --> 00:12:01,894
like he was one of the guys.
150
00:12:05,071 --> 00:12:05,942
I think the first time
151
00:12:06,072 --> 00:12:07,204
I remember meeting George,
152
00:12:07,334 --> 00:12:10,033
he showed up on
that Harley trike.
153
00:12:10,163 --> 00:12:11,662
By then, I was riding
a two-wheel bike,
154
00:12:11,686 --> 00:12:13,558
but I still had my big wheel.
155
00:12:13,688 --> 00:12:15,888
And I saw that Harley trike
with the wheelie bars on it.
156
00:12:15,995 --> 00:12:19,085
And its loud engine was, like,
157
00:12:19,216 --> 00:12:22,262
you know, definitely
cooler than my big wheel.
158
00:12:22,393 --> 00:12:24,525
I remember he gave us
kids each a ride on it.
159
00:12:24,656 --> 00:12:28,007
And it was pretty impressive.
160
00:12:28,965 --> 00:12:30,357
He was into Harleys big time.
161
00:12:30,488 --> 00:12:34,492
He also had a
really big chopper.
162
00:12:34,622 --> 00:12:37,277
It was fun to be around.
163
00:12:37,408 --> 00:12:40,498
Early on, everything was
like, it's a new friend.
164
00:12:40,628 --> 00:12:41,934
He's got cool things.
165
00:12:42,065 --> 00:12:44,284
And he was a black
belt in jujitsu.
166
00:12:44,415 --> 00:12:47,418
He started getting us boys
involved in jujitsu classes
167
00:12:47,548 --> 00:12:49,855
and starting to learn to fight
and how to defend yourself.
168
00:12:49,986 --> 00:12:52,118
And so it was all new.
169
00:12:52,249 --> 00:12:55,078
It was somebody that was a
man figure that was there
170
00:12:55,208 --> 00:12:59,865
and kind to us, and...
And, uh, and Mom liked him,
171
00:12:59,996 --> 00:13:01,432
and that was that.
172
00:13:05,131 --> 00:13:07,177
After he married Kathy,
173
00:13:07,307 --> 00:13:11,094
the children looked like they
were very happy with George.
174
00:13:11,224 --> 00:13:13,139
They got along with him well.
175
00:13:13,270 --> 00:13:16,012
He seemed to be a
very good father,
176
00:13:16,142 --> 00:13:19,102
especially to the boys.
177
00:13:19,232 --> 00:13:21,887
I think Danny was nine,
178
00:13:22,018 --> 00:13:23,149
Christopher was seven,
179
00:13:23,280 --> 00:13:26,805
and Missy was five
and she was adorable.
180
00:13:26,936 --> 00:13:29,025
All the kids were really nice.
181
00:13:31,027 --> 00:13:34,247
Kathy was a very good mother.
182
00:13:34,378 --> 00:13:37,033
She was a very sweet, innocent,
183
00:13:37,163 --> 00:13:40,645
beautiful, beautiful person.
184
00:13:40,775 --> 00:13:43,430
George and Kathy
were young parents.
185
00:13:49,045 --> 00:13:50,394
We love this house.
186
00:13:50,524 --> 00:13:52,178
We were so happy
to get that house.
187
00:13:52,309 --> 00:13:55,399
We really wanted to live there.
188
00:13:55,529 --> 00:13:57,227
There was such a
desire on our part
189
00:13:57,357 --> 00:14:02,145
to move in and be
a family there.
190
00:14:02,275 --> 00:14:03,973
It was the time where
I was just a kid
191
00:14:04,103 --> 00:14:07,541
and running around
different places
192
00:14:07,672 --> 00:14:08,934
to explore and look around.
193
00:14:09,065 --> 00:14:12,329
And I was exploring my new room
194
00:14:12,459 --> 00:14:17,377
and looking out that
quarter round window.
195
00:14:17,508 --> 00:14:19,423
We'd only been in
two-story homes before,
196
00:14:19,553 --> 00:14:22,295
so a three-story
was, like, cool.
197
00:14:24,254 --> 00:14:27,039
I remember about
that bedroom that
198
00:14:27,170 --> 00:14:30,086
the weird and kind
of colorful and cool
199
00:14:30,216 --> 00:14:33,219
and interesting wallpaper.
200
00:14:33,350 --> 00:14:36,092
The one wall being
all, like, dots,
201
00:14:36,222 --> 00:14:38,094
but then the other side
where it had, like,
202
00:14:38,224 --> 00:14:40,357
all these
old-fashioned drawings.
203
00:14:40,487 --> 00:14:44,317
And I remember a lady
on there with a hat.
204
00:14:47,494 --> 00:14:51,107
In my closet, there was a hook.
205
00:14:51,237 --> 00:14:54,980
I had this bag that
had a drawstring,
206
00:14:55,111 --> 00:14:57,896
and I hooked it on there.
207
00:15:09,386 --> 00:15:12,128
The weight of it
caused the paneling...
208
00:15:12,258 --> 00:15:14,391
to tip forward.
209
00:15:17,263 --> 00:15:20,005
And that revealed, like, an area
210
00:15:20,136 --> 00:15:22,312
that was behind there.
211
00:15:43,855 --> 00:15:46,727
The Realtor told us after
we had toured the house,
212
00:15:46,858 --> 00:15:50,340
this is the house the
DeFeos were murdered in,
213
00:15:50,470 --> 00:15:55,214
the news stories that
had been a year earlier.
214
00:15:55,345 --> 00:15:58,304
We talked about it at
length as a family.
215
00:15:58,435 --> 00:16:00,263
We asked the kids,
"Look, you're gonna have
216
00:16:00,393 --> 00:16:02,395
the same bedrooms
that these kids had,
217
00:16:02,526 --> 00:16:03,546
and they were killed here."
218
00:16:03,570 --> 00:16:07,226
"Is that gonna be a problem?"
219
00:16:07,357 --> 00:16:10,403
And they were all fine with it.
220
00:16:10,534 --> 00:16:13,319
It wasn't a snap
decision by any means.
221
00:16:16,757 --> 00:16:19,151
George told me that
he bought the house.
222
00:16:19,282 --> 00:16:21,762
He paid 80,000 for it,
223
00:16:21,893 --> 00:16:23,503
had to furnish it,
224
00:16:23,634 --> 00:16:25,723
bought some of the furniture
that was in the house
225
00:16:25,853 --> 00:16:27,986
from the DeFeo estate.
226
00:16:39,780 --> 00:16:41,521
When he first saw the house,
227
00:16:41,652 --> 00:16:44,089
there was still some
blood in some of the rooms
228
00:16:44,220 --> 00:16:46,091
and on some of the furniture.
229
00:16:46,222 --> 00:16:47,440
It was kind of strange.
230
00:17:36,402 --> 00:17:38,274
On the second floor,
231
00:17:38,404 --> 00:17:40,232
in the sewing room,
232
00:17:40,363 --> 00:17:41,383
there was a lot of flies there,
233
00:17:41,407 --> 00:17:42,515
and that was the first place
234
00:17:42,539 --> 00:17:44,236
that I had seen them.
235
00:17:47,326 --> 00:17:50,416
There was times when
you'd feel a chill.
236
00:18:23,275 --> 00:18:26,104
And then, I remember
the awkward moment
237
00:18:26,235 --> 00:18:27,627
where I was in the basement
238
00:18:27,758 --> 00:18:33,198
and Mom and George
were down there.
239
00:18:33,329 --> 00:18:35,461
And I remember asking,
240
00:18:35,592 --> 00:18:39,944
"Is this where they
hid the bodies?"
241
00:18:40,074 --> 00:18:41,815
I remember Mom looking at George
242
00:18:41,946 --> 00:18:43,600
and George looking at Mom,
243
00:18:43,730 --> 00:18:45,167
and then they all looked at me.
244
00:18:45,297 --> 00:18:47,778
And nobody answered
the question.
245
00:19:02,358 --> 00:19:04,273
The Maharishi
Mahesh Yogis program
246
00:19:04,403 --> 00:19:06,231
of transcendental
meditation attracted
247
00:19:06,362 --> 00:19:08,407
thousands of followers.
248
00:19:10,670 --> 00:19:12,977
George was into this new thing
249
00:19:13,107 --> 00:19:14,457
that I didn't know
anything about.
250
00:19:14,587 --> 00:19:16,328
It was new to me, anyway.
251
00:19:16,459 --> 00:19:20,680
It was called
transcendental meditation.
252
00:19:20,811 --> 00:19:24,815
He would sit in this specific
position sitting on the floor,
253
00:19:24,945 --> 00:19:27,687
legs crossed, palms open,
254
00:19:27,818 --> 00:19:30,429
and holding his
fingers in a weird way,
255
00:19:30,560 --> 00:19:33,563
and say these sounds.
256
00:19:33,693 --> 00:19:35,434
Every single student
at the university
257
00:19:35,565 --> 00:19:39,221
is a regular practitioner of
transcendental meditation.
258
00:19:41,092 --> 00:19:43,268
It's nothing out of
the ordinary at all.
259
00:19:43,399 --> 00:19:44,530
At times, one...
260
00:19:44,661 --> 00:19:46,532
He got my mom into it.
261
00:19:46,663 --> 00:19:49,535
Of their vast organization.
262
00:19:49,666 --> 00:19:53,322
We were both into practicing
transcendental meditation.
263
00:19:55,976 --> 00:19:57,456
I don't think she
ever had anything
264
00:19:57,587 --> 00:20:01,373
to do with it prior to
them getting together.
265
00:20:16,606 --> 00:20:18,869
It was a pretty regular
thing that they did.
266
00:20:18,999 --> 00:20:20,827
And they would want time
to be able to do it.
267
00:20:20,958 --> 00:20:24,440
And we would be quiet,
268
00:20:24,570 --> 00:20:28,008
whether it was up in our
own rooms or outside.
269
00:20:28,139 --> 00:20:32,926
I recall them wanting a
long time to meditate, so...
270
00:20:40,020 --> 00:20:44,416
That was my introduction to
transcendental meditation.
271
00:20:47,593 --> 00:20:49,726
And he had me doing it with him.
272
00:20:56,820 --> 00:21:00,345
I was practicing
transcendental meditation.
273
00:21:00,476 --> 00:21:02,565
And on one occasion,
274
00:21:02,695 --> 00:21:05,524
during the meditation,
275
00:21:05,655 --> 00:21:09,354
something reached out
and took hold of my hand.
276
00:21:13,532 --> 00:21:16,535
And my only
description for it was
277
00:21:16,666 --> 00:21:18,755
the touch of a woman,
278
00:21:18,885 --> 00:21:20,931
simply because you
could feel a softness.
279
00:21:21,061 --> 00:21:24,456
But yet, you know there was
an inner strength involved.
280
00:21:26,502 --> 00:21:27,677
I thought she was kidding
281
00:21:27,807 --> 00:21:31,376
and she, you know,
reiterated it again.
282
00:21:31,507 --> 00:21:34,031
And I believed her.
283
00:21:37,600 --> 00:21:41,647
She was concerned enough
to tell me about it.
284
00:21:41,778 --> 00:21:43,562
And we really put it down to
285
00:21:43,693 --> 00:21:47,479
just being overtired
and moving in.
286
00:21:47,610 --> 00:21:50,569
We moved in a week
before Christmas, 1975.
287
00:21:50,700 --> 00:21:53,659
So we were very anxious to
get set up for Christmas.
288
00:21:53,790 --> 00:21:57,576
We had a lot of company
coming the following week.
289
00:22:01,188 --> 00:22:03,843
And on a weekend, there
were a number of people
290
00:22:03,974 --> 00:22:05,802
who were going to
go and help them
291
00:22:05,932 --> 00:22:09,893
move their stuff into the house.
292
00:22:10,023 --> 00:22:11,416
What do you think?
293
00:22:11,547 --> 00:22:13,462
My ex-husband and I,
294
00:22:13,592 --> 00:22:15,899
both of us were
gonna go to the house
295
00:22:16,029 --> 00:22:17,770
and help him move in.
296
00:22:17,901 --> 00:22:21,513
When we got to the house, I
just became violently sick.
297
00:22:21,644 --> 00:22:24,995
I got very dizzy. I
felt very nauseous.
298
00:22:25,125 --> 00:22:27,867
And I told my husband, I
said, "I can't go in there."
299
00:22:27,998 --> 00:22:29,173
What's the matter?
300
00:22:29,303 --> 00:22:31,697
And I felt like I
was gonna pass out
301
00:22:31,828 --> 00:22:33,268
sitting in the car
outside the house.
302
00:22:33,307 --> 00:22:35,788
I don't want to go any closer.
303
00:22:35,919 --> 00:22:38,530
Carolyn, what are
you talking about?
304
00:22:38,661 --> 00:22:40,967
Get out.
305
00:22:41,098 --> 00:22:43,579
It gives me the creeps.
306
00:22:43,709 --> 00:22:45,711
George and Kathy
wanted to have, like,
307
00:22:45,842 --> 00:22:48,845
a housewarming holiday
party together.
308
00:22:48,975 --> 00:22:52,457
Again, the exact same thing
that happened to me in the car
309
00:22:52,588 --> 00:22:54,111
happened to me in the apartment.
310
00:22:54,241 --> 00:22:55,852
I got dizzy.
311
00:22:55,982 --> 00:22:57,549
I got sick.
312
00:22:57,680 --> 00:22:59,856
I felt like I was
gonna pass out.
313
00:22:59,986 --> 00:23:02,685
And I never made
it to the party.
314
00:23:02,815 --> 00:23:04,730
I never made it out the door.
315
00:23:04,861 --> 00:23:09,126
It was just a
unbelievable feeling.
316
00:23:23,619 --> 00:23:29,755
And after that, I
had other encounters
317
00:23:29,886 --> 00:23:33,455
with a presence
either in our bedroom,
318
00:23:33,585 --> 00:23:37,415
the kitchen, or the dining room.
319
00:23:37,546 --> 00:23:39,635
Missy came down on one occasion.
320
00:23:39,765 --> 00:23:44,640
And she said, "Mommy,
do angels talk?"
321
00:23:44,770 --> 00:23:48,121
And I asked her to
explain her question.
322
00:23:48,252 --> 00:23:52,517
And she said, "Well,
something talks to me,
323
00:23:52,648 --> 00:23:55,868
and I answer."
324
00:23:55,999 --> 00:24:00,612
And I shrugged it off, a
child's vivid imagination.
325
00:24:00,743 --> 00:24:03,180
On several occasions,
326
00:24:03,310 --> 00:24:06,096
I'd go and stand in front
of Missy's closed door,
327
00:24:06,226 --> 00:24:09,447
and I would hear her
carrying on a conversation.
328
00:24:09,578 --> 00:24:11,188
And I would hear the answer.
329
00:24:11,318 --> 00:24:12,581
And I opened the door.
330
00:24:12,711 --> 00:24:15,671
You could hear the
sounds of an answer.
331
00:24:15,801 --> 00:24:17,629
- Of another voice?
- I would open the door.
332
00:24:17,760 --> 00:24:19,085
And Missy would be
sitting on her bed.
333
00:24:19,109 --> 00:24:21,764
And she had a small
rocking chair in the room.
334
00:24:21,894 --> 00:24:23,132
And the chair would be rocking.
335
00:24:23,156 --> 00:24:25,768
You couldn't see
anything sitting in it.
336
00:24:25,898 --> 00:24:28,597
And Missy was talking in
the direction of the chair.
337
00:24:34,864 --> 00:24:37,606
And then Missy
told us about Jody.
338
00:24:41,610 --> 00:24:45,004
- You scared Jody.
- Jody?
339
00:24:45,135 --> 00:24:46,832
She tells me about
the little boy
340
00:24:46,963 --> 00:24:48,791
who used to live in my room.
341
00:24:48,921 --> 00:24:51,533
He got hurt and he died.
342
00:24:52,969 --> 00:24:57,190
Missy said that
there was this pig.
343
00:24:57,321 --> 00:24:59,236
We put it to her imagination
344
00:24:59,366 --> 00:25:02,282
until there were
345
00:25:02,413 --> 00:25:05,982
hoofprints out in the snow.
346
00:25:11,335 --> 00:25:13,555
Something walked from the house,
347
00:25:13,685 --> 00:25:15,600
through the snow,
out to the river,
348
00:25:15,731 --> 00:25:17,515
and right off into the water.
349
00:25:25,349 --> 00:25:27,177
Christmas came.
350
00:25:27,307 --> 00:25:30,876
Danny and I started
fighting more than ever.
351
00:25:31,007 --> 00:25:36,578
My brother is, you know,
kind of an instigator.
352
00:25:37,883 --> 00:25:40,103
The whole wall
along the playroom,
353
00:25:40,233 --> 00:25:43,062
it was closet area.
354
00:25:43,193 --> 00:25:47,893
And my brother convinced me to
go in there and get something.
355
00:25:48,024 --> 00:25:50,243
He shut the door.
356
00:25:50,374 --> 00:25:51,810
And I couldn't get out.
357
00:25:55,509 --> 00:25:59,905
Backing up, something
grabbed the back of my calf.
358
00:26:00,036 --> 00:26:01,733
And it scared the
hell out of me.
359
00:26:24,713 --> 00:26:26,671
So I met George in '73
360
00:26:26,802 --> 00:26:29,718
and we spent a lot
of time together.
361
00:26:29,848 --> 00:26:32,329
He was just getting
his marriage annulled
362
00:26:32,459 --> 00:26:34,766
from his first wife.
363
00:26:35,941 --> 00:26:37,397
Didn't know much
about his background,
364
00:26:37,421 --> 00:26:39,945
except he was an ex-Marine.
365
00:26:40,076 --> 00:26:42,644
But he never talked about
the military service.
366
00:26:48,432 --> 00:26:51,130
George did say that
he served in Vietnam.
367
00:26:52,915 --> 00:26:55,744
There was something
368
00:26:55,874 --> 00:26:57,789
that he didn't
want to talk about
369
00:26:57,920 --> 00:26:59,835
when it came to his
service in Vietnam.
370
00:27:03,882 --> 00:27:06,232
And too many people, my friends,
371
00:27:06,363 --> 00:27:07,973
the ones that did come back,
372
00:27:08,104 --> 00:27:09,714
they were not the same.
373
00:27:12,543 --> 00:27:15,285
Over 1,000 Vietnam
vets came here to say
374
00:27:15,415 --> 00:27:19,158
the war was a horrible
mistake and should end.
375
00:27:19,289 --> 00:27:20,638
The protest was angry
376
00:27:20,769 --> 00:27:22,292
and more passionate than most
377
00:27:22,422 --> 00:27:24,250
because these vets
had borne witness.
378
00:27:24,381 --> 00:27:26,862
The men have a flair for drama,
379
00:27:26,992 --> 00:27:29,386
throwing back the medals
they had won in Vietnam.
380
00:27:29,516 --> 00:27:32,302
They were still unsatisfied.
381
00:27:35,131 --> 00:27:37,916
The Vietnam veteran
is a fascinating
382
00:27:38,047 --> 00:27:41,703
and tragic figure
in American history,
383
00:27:41,833 --> 00:27:44,836
particularly in the '70s.
384
00:27:44,967 --> 00:27:52,322
They carried the guilt of this
absurd and useless operation.
385
00:27:52,452 --> 00:27:55,455
And they don't return home
to any kind of homecoming,
386
00:27:55,586 --> 00:27:57,806
any kind of celebration.
387
00:28:06,466 --> 00:28:09,208
A lot of vets returning,
finding themselves alienated
388
00:28:09,339 --> 00:28:12,385
both from mainstream America
and from the counterculture,
389
00:28:12,516 --> 00:28:15,214
would find themselves
joining biker gangs
390
00:28:15,345 --> 00:28:17,956
because it's a way of
building up a kind of identity
391
00:28:18,087 --> 00:28:20,219
that is independent
392
00:28:20,350 --> 00:28:23,353
and as a way of dealing
with the dislocation
393
00:28:23,483 --> 00:28:26,182
and confusion of that era.
394
00:28:30,926 --> 00:28:35,017
The logic of a biker gang is
not dissimilar than a platoon.
395
00:28:35,147 --> 00:28:38,934
That sense of camaraderie
in a hostile universe,
396
00:28:39,064 --> 00:28:41,458
it carries over
into a biker gang,
397
00:28:41,588 --> 00:28:44,200
where you're really there
for your fellow bikers.
398
00:28:44,330 --> 00:28:47,029
And there's an
incredible tight bond.
399
00:28:49,205 --> 00:28:51,381
So in a way, they
represent the profound
400
00:28:51,511 --> 00:28:54,906
and painful
contradictions of the era.
401
00:28:56,952 --> 00:29:00,477
A couple of guys in our group
were veterans from Vietnam.
402
00:29:00,607 --> 00:29:02,522
But they never talked about it.
403
00:29:02,653 --> 00:29:04,481
They just enjoyed
the camaraderie
404
00:29:04,611 --> 00:29:06,222
and the motorcycles.
405
00:29:08,572 --> 00:29:12,141
George's gas tank was
shaped like a coffin.
406
00:29:13,969 --> 00:29:15,840
It was also painted all black.
407
00:29:15,971 --> 00:29:18,103
That says something.
408
00:29:18,234 --> 00:29:21,280
He made sure the
trike was his own.
409
00:29:21,411 --> 00:29:25,110
George had himself painted
in the prone position
410
00:29:25,241 --> 00:29:30,289
with George laying
on the coffin tank,
411
00:29:30,420 --> 00:29:31,987
like he was in a coffin.
412
00:29:41,257 --> 00:29:44,086
When we went to New
Hampshire Bike Week,
413
00:29:44,216 --> 00:29:47,306
I think this was in 1975.
414
00:29:49,439 --> 00:29:52,398
And one of the guys said
that his brother-in-law
415
00:29:52,529 --> 00:29:55,314
had moved to Weirs Beach.
416
00:29:55,445 --> 00:30:00,450
It was just a short ride
down the hill from our hotel.
417
00:30:00,580 --> 00:30:04,541
And his name was Ray Buckland.
418
00:30:04,671 --> 00:30:07,892
I am a follower of the
religion of witchcraft,
419
00:30:08,023 --> 00:30:10,939
the pre-Christian religion.
420
00:30:11,069 --> 00:30:13,158
He had a big name in the occult,
421
00:30:13,289 --> 00:30:16,161
wrote books on witchcraft.
422
00:30:16,292 --> 00:30:20,426
We got there and he gave us
a tour of the whole house.
423
00:30:20,557 --> 00:30:22,167
Witchcraft and Satanism are
424
00:30:22,298 --> 00:30:25,649
exploding in popularity,
especially among youth.
425
00:30:25,779 --> 00:30:28,478
This lecture is given
by Dr. Raymond Buckland,
426
00:30:28,608 --> 00:30:31,960
anthropologist and white witch
of Long Island, New York.
427
00:30:32,090 --> 00:30:34,571
If we can have the
house lights off,
428
00:30:34,701 --> 00:30:38,357
then we'll get into the slides.
429
00:30:38,488 --> 00:30:40,533
His slides show ceremonies
430
00:30:40,664 --> 00:30:42,231
held in his own basement,
431
00:30:42,361 --> 00:30:45,016
where he and his wife,
a high priestess,
432
00:30:45,147 --> 00:30:46,496
hold nude rituals
433
00:30:46,626 --> 00:30:49,934
to summon Neolithic gods
of the hunt and fertility.
434
00:30:53,503 --> 00:30:56,462
They say these ceremonies
can heal the sick,
435
00:30:56,593 --> 00:30:58,900
but they could be
used for evil purposes
436
00:30:59,030 --> 00:31:02,033
in the wrong hands.
437
00:31:04,514 --> 00:31:08,518
Ray Buckland originally
had a museum in Bayshore
438
00:31:08,648 --> 00:31:10,476
on Long Island.
439
00:31:11,782 --> 00:31:15,394
George also said that he had
been to the museum in Bayshore.
440
00:31:22,575 --> 00:31:25,100
And we headed outside,
441
00:31:25,230 --> 00:31:28,103
had a smoke before we
got ready to ride again,
442
00:31:28,233 --> 00:31:30,496
but George was
nowhere to be found.
443
00:31:30,627 --> 00:31:34,674
He was still in the
house talking to Ray.
444
00:31:34,805 --> 00:31:37,155
He finally came outside.
445
00:31:37,286 --> 00:31:39,027
We razzed him a little bit about
446
00:31:39,157 --> 00:31:40,637
what the heck he was doing.
447
00:31:40,767 --> 00:31:42,334
He never said anything about
448
00:31:42,465 --> 00:31:45,381
why he was talking to Ray at
any extended length of time.
449
00:31:45,511 --> 00:31:48,514
So we just got on
our bikes and rode.
450
00:31:48,645 --> 00:31:51,039
No further mention of it
for the rest of the week
451
00:31:51,169 --> 00:31:53,084
and the seven-hour ride home.
452
00:31:53,215 --> 00:31:55,086
Absolutely nothing.
453
00:31:55,217 --> 00:31:56,497
And, you know, we
knew each other
454
00:31:56,566 --> 00:31:58,089
pretty well by that time,
455
00:31:58,220 --> 00:32:00,024
'cause I had already been
best man at his wedding.
456
00:32:00,048 --> 00:32:02,398
So it was kind of strange.
457
00:32:03,355 --> 00:32:04,966
And he was into meditation.
458
00:32:05,096 --> 00:32:06,595
So every once in a
while on the ride home,
459
00:32:06,619 --> 00:32:09,666
he would stop and then meditate.
460
00:32:09,796 --> 00:32:12,930
He's, "I'm gonna meditate,
so don't disturb me."
461
00:32:19,371 --> 00:32:21,547
Understanding the human
as something that has
462
00:32:21,678 --> 00:32:23,549
these greater potentials
463
00:32:23,680 --> 00:32:26,683
is a super important
part of that whole
464
00:32:26,813 --> 00:32:29,642
'70s spiritual mind frame.
465
00:32:29,773 --> 00:32:33,298
There are psychic powers.
Telepathy is possible.
466
00:32:33,429 --> 00:32:35,518
So there was a sense that
there was an opportunity
467
00:32:35,648 --> 00:32:38,173
to change the self,
to explore the self.
468
00:32:38,303 --> 00:32:40,175
What can we actually do
469
00:32:40,305 --> 00:32:42,742
to enhance our own
inherent powers?
470
00:32:42,873 --> 00:32:44,440
The occult and the paranormal
471
00:32:44,570 --> 00:32:47,138
and radical
psychological techniques,
472
00:32:47,269 --> 00:32:50,011
they were all part of
this, as well as drugs.
473
00:32:53,536 --> 00:32:54,580
Did you ever think
474
00:32:54,711 --> 00:32:56,321
maybe you're conjuring
this up yourself,
475
00:32:56,452 --> 00:32:57,733
or it could be your own
mental powers working on it?
476
00:32:57,757 --> 00:33:00,021
Have you tried anything
in that area or...
477
00:33:00,151 --> 00:33:02,153
None of us really had any...
478
00:33:02,284 --> 00:33:05,504
Neither of us had any
knowledge of the occult
479
00:33:05,635 --> 00:33:07,506
prior to moving into
the home. Nothing?
480
00:33:07,637 --> 00:33:09,397
You hold yourself up for
ridicule, for one thing,
481
00:33:09,421 --> 00:33:11,684
to just stand up and say,
"This really happened."
482
00:33:11,815 --> 00:33:13,227
I'll tell you what.
I wouldn't be afraid
483
00:33:13,251 --> 00:33:14,576
to tell anybody if
it happened to me.
484
00:33:14,600 --> 00:33:15,751
Come to think of it,
again, on second thought,
485
00:33:15,775 --> 00:33:17,057
I'd run around and
tell them all, maybe.
486
00:33:17,081 --> 00:33:20,215
Charge admission to the house.
487
00:33:20,345 --> 00:33:22,260
We'd watch the furniture
fly or do something.
488
00:33:30,790 --> 00:33:32,705
One of these alternative
spiritual practices
489
00:33:32,836 --> 00:33:35,534
was transcendental meditation.
490
00:33:35,665 --> 00:33:38,233
Some of The Beach
Boys practiced TM,
491
00:33:38,363 --> 00:33:41,845
and it was kind of
a clever practice
492
00:33:41,975 --> 00:33:44,500
because it was
relatively simple.
493
00:33:44,630 --> 00:33:48,547
It would fit into
an ordinary day.
494
00:33:48,678 --> 00:33:50,593
And yet there was a
little bit of magic in it.
495
00:33:50,723 --> 00:33:52,029
You had the secret mantra.
496
00:33:57,817 --> 00:34:00,516
People thought it started to
open up magical powers even.
497
00:34:00,646 --> 00:34:02,518
So like a lot of
these practices,
498
00:34:02,648 --> 00:34:05,564
they provide immediate rewards,
499
00:34:05,695 --> 00:34:07,392
but then they also open the door
500
00:34:07,523 --> 00:34:09,786
towards the possibility
of more mystical
501
00:34:09,916 --> 00:34:11,701
or spiritual kinds of states.
502
00:34:14,704 --> 00:34:19,361
So a mantra is a series
of sacred syllables.
503
00:34:19,491 --> 00:34:20,666
And it might mean something,
504
00:34:20,797 --> 00:34:22,668
but the point is to
keep repeating it,
505
00:34:22,799 --> 00:34:24,670
not unlike saying a rosary.
506
00:34:24,801 --> 00:34:26,890
And you're repeating
the name of a god,
507
00:34:27,020 --> 00:34:29,066
or you're repeating
a certain phrase
508
00:34:29,197 --> 00:34:32,156
that you would get
from your guru,
509
00:34:32,287 --> 00:34:33,853
a series of sacred syllables
510
00:34:33,984 --> 00:34:37,335
that have some
extra power to them.
511
00:34:43,341 --> 00:34:44,429
The word that you repeat
512
00:34:44,560 --> 00:34:46,214
over and over and over again
513
00:34:46,344 --> 00:34:48,303
is actually the
name of a spirit.
514
00:34:48,433 --> 00:34:49,565
And what you're doing is,
515
00:34:49,695 --> 00:34:52,916
you're calling that
spirit into you.
516
00:34:53,046 --> 00:34:55,310
What George doesn't
talk about is
517
00:34:55,440 --> 00:34:57,573
the other thing that
he was mixing it with.
518
00:35:02,317 --> 00:35:05,276
What I found out is
that the list of spirits
519
00:35:05,407 --> 00:35:07,278
that are recommended from
520
00:35:07,409 --> 00:35:09,802
transcendental
meditation practitioners,
521
00:35:09,933 --> 00:35:12,762
they tell you what the word
is that you're gonna say.
522
00:35:15,068 --> 00:35:16,592
The things that
he was calling on
523
00:35:16,722 --> 00:35:18,724
are not on that
recommended list.
524
00:35:24,295 --> 00:35:26,645
It's not a good thing.
525
00:35:26,776 --> 00:35:29,300
And by calling that
spirit into himself,
526
00:35:29,431 --> 00:35:32,347
he availed himself
to possession.
527
00:35:32,477 --> 00:35:35,350
Because you're...
You're giving it...
528
00:35:35,480 --> 00:35:37,613
You're giving it entry.
529
00:35:37,743 --> 00:35:39,658
What George was
doing in that house
530
00:35:39,789 --> 00:35:42,879
would have caused a
haunting in any home.
531
00:36:02,638 --> 00:36:04,379
We were at home in Babylon,
532
00:36:04,509 --> 00:36:06,163
and there's a knock on the door,
533
00:36:06,294 --> 00:36:09,253
and it's George and Kathy.
534
00:36:09,384 --> 00:36:11,777
They were frightened.
535
00:36:11,908 --> 00:36:13,518
I had never seen them
like that before.
536
00:36:13,649 --> 00:36:15,303
They were truly frightened
537
00:36:15,433 --> 00:36:16,869
of what was happening
in the house.
538
00:36:18,523 --> 00:36:20,743
The temperature
extremes in the house,
539
00:36:20,873 --> 00:36:22,919
the way George
explained it was like
540
00:36:23,049 --> 00:36:24,790
a runaway locomotive.
541
00:36:24,921 --> 00:36:26,923
It got hot or it got cold.
542
00:36:31,319 --> 00:36:33,408
He was up every night
at three o'clock
543
00:36:33,538 --> 00:36:34,800
wandering the house,
544
00:36:34,931 --> 00:36:38,674
visiting the boathouse
for no apparent reason.
545
00:36:38,804 --> 00:36:40,415
I had never seen them
like that before.
546
00:36:40,545 --> 00:36:42,243
They were truly frightened
547
00:36:42,373 --> 00:36:43,853
of what was happening
in the house.
548
00:36:47,422 --> 00:36:50,773
George had a change
in his demeanor
549
00:36:50,903 --> 00:36:53,602
where he no longer
went into work,
550
00:36:53,732 --> 00:36:57,475
became obsessed with just
sitting around the fire
551
00:36:57,606 --> 00:37:00,304
and obsessed with his
boats and his boathouse.
552
00:37:03,742 --> 00:37:06,441
And George's
temperament was, like,
553
00:37:06,571 --> 00:37:09,966
quick to get pissed
off and express that.
554
00:37:10,096 --> 00:37:12,708
That became scary.
555
00:37:14,187 --> 00:37:17,452
Confusion, anger, misplaced
556
00:37:17,582 --> 00:37:20,716
because I would direct it
at Kathy for no reason.
557
00:37:26,722 --> 00:37:29,725
Noises would go off
downstairs every night,
558
00:37:29,855 --> 00:37:31,466
slamming doors.
559
00:37:31,596 --> 00:37:33,095
The kids would come down
from the third floor
560
00:37:33,119 --> 00:37:35,600
to see what was going on.
561
00:37:37,733 --> 00:37:39,778
When we called Father
Ray the next day,
562
00:37:39,909 --> 00:37:41,650
he asked what we were
still doing there.
563
00:37:41,780 --> 00:37:43,889
He was surprised that we
were still even in the house.
564
00:37:43,913 --> 00:37:46,742
And it hadn't even occurred
to us to... even at that point
565
00:37:46,872 --> 00:37:49,658
to just up and
abandon everything.
566
00:37:49,788 --> 00:37:54,576
Father Ray wasn't just
your average parish priest.
567
00:37:54,706 --> 00:37:57,840
He was trained in the Vatican.
568
00:37:57,970 --> 00:37:59,624
The only priest I
knew was a priest
569
00:37:59,755 --> 00:38:01,974
by the name of Father
Ralph Pecoraro.
570
00:38:02,105 --> 00:38:04,977
I had met him when
my previous marriage,
571
00:38:05,108 --> 00:38:08,981
which had lasted about six
months, had been annulled.
572
00:38:09,112 --> 00:38:12,463
He went room to room,
said prayers in each room.
573
00:38:12,594 --> 00:38:15,553
I was blessing the sewing room.
574
00:38:15,684 --> 00:38:17,816
It was cold. It was
really cold in there.
575
00:38:17,947 --> 00:38:20,950
And I thought, "Gee,
that's... This is peculiar."
576
00:38:21,080 --> 00:38:24,649
I also... sprinkling holy water.
577
00:38:24,780 --> 00:38:26,825
Get out.
578
00:38:26,956 --> 00:38:30,960
And I heard a rather
deep voice behind me
579
00:38:31,090 --> 00:38:34,485
say, "Get out."
580
00:38:34,616 --> 00:38:35,878
He stopped and just asked us
581
00:38:36,008 --> 00:38:38,576
what we were going to
use one bedroom for.
582
00:38:38,707 --> 00:38:40,056
There was something
about the room
583
00:38:40,186 --> 00:38:43,146
that made him uncomfortable
and he wanted to leave.
584
00:38:43,276 --> 00:38:44,756
That was evidently the bedroom
585
00:38:44,887 --> 00:38:47,063
where the two boys
had been murdered.
586
00:38:57,203 --> 00:39:01,556
We had asked him to come back
and bless the house again,
587
00:39:01,686 --> 00:39:03,732
which he refused to do.
588
00:39:05,516 --> 00:39:08,476
And we were really
shattered by that.
589
00:39:08,606 --> 00:39:11,000
We didn't know why he
wouldn't come back.
590
00:39:11,130 --> 00:39:12,697
We couldn't understand that.
591
00:39:18,181 --> 00:39:19,835
Pretty soon, New Year's came.
592
00:39:19,965 --> 00:39:23,708
I remember coming back
from school one day.
593
00:39:23,839 --> 00:39:26,581
I was laying on my bed,
594
00:39:26,711 --> 00:39:29,671
looking out into the hallway.
595
00:39:31,324 --> 00:39:34,980
Right in front of the door,
there was this figure.
596
00:39:37,679 --> 00:39:39,420
It looked like a shadow,
597
00:39:39,550 --> 00:39:41,857
doesn't have legs
that touch the ground.
598
00:39:47,079 --> 00:39:48,690
And as I'm looking
at this thing,
599
00:39:48,820 --> 00:39:50,996
it's coming towards me.
600
00:39:58,134 --> 00:39:59,918
And I was petrified.
601
00:40:02,138 --> 00:40:03,792
Get out!
602
00:40:03,922 --> 00:40:06,490
Our Father which art in heaven,
603
00:40:06,621 --> 00:40:08,405
hallowed be thy name.
604
00:40:10,146 --> 00:40:12,888
The last week we were
there was the worst.
605
00:40:13,018 --> 00:40:14,542
Thy will be done.
606
00:40:14,672 --> 00:40:16,761
At a suggestion of a
friend, we went around
607
00:40:16,892 --> 00:40:20,461
and we blessed the
rooms in the house.
608
00:40:20,591 --> 00:40:23,942
There was quite a
deal of screaming.
609
00:40:24,073 --> 00:40:28,120
We heard a chorus of
voices scream out,
610
00:40:28,251 --> 00:40:30,601
"Will you please stop?"
611
00:40:33,299 --> 00:40:34,736
I remember them
having us go around
612
00:40:34,866 --> 00:40:37,608
and open all the windows.
613
00:40:37,739 --> 00:40:39,194
What they were trying
to do was, like,
614
00:40:39,218 --> 00:40:42,091
basically their own
exorcism of the house.
615
00:40:44,093 --> 00:40:47,575
And here they were walking
around saying these prayers.
616
00:40:49,925 --> 00:40:52,231
It was afterwards that they
had us closing the windows,
617
00:40:52,362 --> 00:40:55,626
and that was when the incident
with Danny's hand happened.
618
00:40:58,673 --> 00:41:01,676
My mom trying to get
the window off his hand
619
00:41:01,806 --> 00:41:03,166
took more time than
it should have.
620
00:41:04,809 --> 00:41:06,811
Let me push it up.
621
00:41:06,942 --> 00:41:08,770
And Danny was, like,
screaming in pain.
622
00:41:20,651 --> 00:41:23,698
I was half dressed.
623
00:41:23,828 --> 00:41:26,091
Then I looked down
at Kathy, and...
624
00:41:29,791 --> 00:41:31,706
the lines started
to form in her face.
625
00:41:31,836 --> 00:41:34,143
And she saw herself
and started screaming.
626
00:41:34,273 --> 00:41:37,233
What did you look like?
627
00:41:37,363 --> 00:41:38,843
Like an old crag.
628
00:41:38,974 --> 00:41:41,846
You tell me.
629
00:41:41,977 --> 00:41:43,215
What did you... what was your...
630
00:41:43,239 --> 00:41:44,869
Tell me what you saw
and what you thought.
631
00:41:44,893 --> 00:41:45,957
What did you think when
you look in the mirror
632
00:41:45,981 --> 00:41:47,341
and you see yourself
age like that?
633
00:41:47,373 --> 00:41:49,854
Well, it was really repulsive.
634
00:41:49,985 --> 00:41:53,641
My mouth was very
tight, severe lines,
635
00:41:53,771 --> 00:41:57,035
lines throughout the
cheeks, crow's feet,
636
00:41:57,166 --> 00:42:00,212
and the change in
the hair color.
637
00:42:00,343 --> 00:42:01,518
Did you feel...
638
00:42:01,649 --> 00:42:04,042
Physically, I felt
without energy.
639
00:42:04,173 --> 00:42:05,609
Huh.
640
00:42:05,740 --> 00:42:07,698
Uh, looking in the mirror,
641
00:42:07,829 --> 00:42:11,006
it was like looking
through a Halloween mask,
642
00:42:11,136 --> 00:42:13,922
knowing how you are,
what you look like.
643
00:42:14,052 --> 00:42:17,621
And yet what you see
isn't what you know.
644
00:42:34,769 --> 00:42:35,813
Something's going on
645
00:42:35,944 --> 00:42:37,008
that you don't
really understand.
646
00:42:37,032 --> 00:42:38,686
And we really did not want
647
00:42:38,816 --> 00:42:41,602
to just give up on living there.
648
00:42:43,038 --> 00:42:46,041
We wanted to get
the house fixed.
649
00:42:48,217 --> 00:42:52,221
George wanted to do some
research on the house.
650
00:42:52,351 --> 00:42:56,791
He got involved in looking
up what the land was
651
00:42:56,921 --> 00:42:58,967
and all the history of the house
652
00:42:59,097 --> 00:43:03,232
to see if there was any sort
of connection in the past
653
00:43:03,362 --> 00:43:07,976
to things that had happened
on the property, to the house.
654
00:43:24,775 --> 00:43:25,950
George and Kathy felt that
655
00:43:26,081 --> 00:43:28,910
something was let
loose in the house.
656
00:43:32,522 --> 00:43:36,700
I do believe in the paranormal,
657
00:43:36,831 --> 00:43:38,920
that people can
have experiences.
658
00:43:39,050 --> 00:43:41,313
So maybe there were children
ghosts in the house.
659
00:43:41,444 --> 00:43:44,273
And maybe that's what
Missy was talking to.
660
00:43:47,102 --> 00:43:48,320
We learned after we spoke
661
00:43:48,451 --> 00:43:49,757
with the local police there
662
00:43:49,887 --> 00:43:51,715
that we had the same
odor in the house
663
00:43:51,846 --> 00:43:53,064
that would come and go
664
00:43:53,195 --> 00:43:55,284
that was there when they
arrived on the scene.
665
00:43:59,114 --> 00:44:00,942
We could tell the
police about the murders
666
00:44:01,072 --> 00:44:03,684
things that were never
released to the public.
667
00:44:06,338 --> 00:44:09,211
We knew who was shot,
668
00:44:09,341 --> 00:44:11,430
where they were shot,
669
00:44:11,561 --> 00:44:12,997
what position they were in.
670
00:44:13,128 --> 00:44:14,433
The first week in the house,
671
00:44:14,564 --> 00:44:17,393
the children and Kathy all
slept on their stomachs.
672
00:44:17,523 --> 00:44:21,005
And we knew from that
that the murders had...
673
00:44:21,136 --> 00:44:23,138
Everyone in the
family had been shot,
674
00:44:23,268 --> 00:44:25,270
they were facedown
on their stomachs.
675
00:44:28,186 --> 00:44:31,407
I found myself waking
up at 3:15 every morning
676
00:44:31,537 --> 00:44:33,801
and for no reason at all.
677
00:44:33,931 --> 00:44:35,803
When we found out
later from the police
678
00:44:35,933 --> 00:44:37,345
something that had
never been released was
679
00:44:37,369 --> 00:44:41,460
that was when the
murders took place.
680
00:44:41,591 --> 00:44:45,203
George and Kathy told me
the story about the DeFeos.
681
00:44:45,334 --> 00:44:48,903
They were a family
from Brooklyn.
682
00:44:49,033 --> 00:44:52,428
And what happened, supposedly,
683
00:44:52,558 --> 00:44:55,213
Ronald DeFeo, the son,
684
00:44:55,344 --> 00:44:57,738
murdered his entire
family in the house.
685
00:45:09,053 --> 00:45:10,272
Sometimes, he'd remind me
686
00:45:10,402 --> 00:45:13,318
of Charles Manson.
687
00:45:13,449 --> 00:45:15,364
Maybe they thought
he'd get away with it,
688
00:45:15,494 --> 00:45:20,108
that it wasn't him, it
was a ghost that did it.
689
00:45:20,238 --> 00:45:24,068
I said, if anyone could
haunt a house, it's him.
690
00:45:35,471 --> 00:45:36,777
This is really the first time
691
00:45:36,907 --> 00:45:39,040
I'm even talking about it.
692
00:45:40,476 --> 00:45:42,043
I don't want to be
associated with it,
693
00:45:42,173 --> 00:45:43,566
to be honest with you.
694
00:45:43,696 --> 00:45:46,525
But something tells
me I should...
695
00:45:46,656 --> 00:45:48,440
I have a couple things to say.
696
00:45:48,571 --> 00:45:51,226
And I'd like to let people know
697
00:45:51,356 --> 00:45:54,055
some things that
they don't know.
698
00:45:57,493 --> 00:46:01,279
November 13, 1974.
699
00:46:01,410 --> 00:46:03,412
It was the last time I saw him.
700
00:46:06,632 --> 00:46:09,331
George told me that he...
701
00:46:09,461 --> 00:46:12,377
He had learned that
the house was built
702
00:46:12,508 --> 00:46:15,816
on an Indian burial ground.
703
00:46:15,946 --> 00:46:19,341
He went to the
society in Amityville,
704
00:46:19,471 --> 00:46:22,953
and they had old maps.
705
00:46:25,434 --> 00:46:29,133
And that it was possible
spirits in the land
706
00:46:29,264 --> 00:46:31,092
had something to
do with the evil
707
00:46:31,222 --> 00:46:33,268
that was in the house.
708
00:46:42,016 --> 00:46:42,886
What happened the night
709
00:46:43,017 --> 00:46:44,177
that made you flee the house?
710
00:46:44,279 --> 00:46:46,934
The boys' bedroom
was above ours,
711
00:46:47,064 --> 00:46:50,328
and they each had their own bed.
712
00:46:50,459 --> 00:46:54,289
And we could hear the beds
slamming down onto the floor.
713
00:46:56,378 --> 00:46:59,511
Something tremendous would
pick it up and slam it down.
714
00:46:59,642 --> 00:47:02,123
Their bedroom door
would open and close.
715
00:47:02,253 --> 00:47:04,081
Their closet doors
would open and close.
716
00:47:04,212 --> 00:47:07,215
And the boys were in
fear watching this.
717
00:47:08,738 --> 00:47:10,131
Go! Run!
718
00:47:48,082 --> 00:47:50,301
♪ Try
719
00:47:50,432 --> 00:47:55,045
♪ To understand what I say
720
00:47:55,176 --> 00:47:58,657
♪ We are not leaving today
721
00:47:58,788 --> 00:48:00,442
♪ It's true
722
00:48:00,572 --> 00:48:06,491
♪ Oh, we're just
Passing through ♪
723
00:48:21,202 --> 00:48:27,686
♪ You may hide
away For a while ♪
724
00:48:27,817 --> 00:48:31,690
♪ When you come back
There's a smile ♪
725
00:48:31,821 --> 00:48:35,912
♪ On the face of your clock
726
00:48:36,043 --> 00:48:41,004
♪ As the time passes by