1
00:03:47,756 --> 00:03:49,876
Good afternoon, ladies and gentlemen.

2
00:03:51,756 --> 00:03:55,636
The demo which you're about to see,
and hopefully participate in...

3
00:03:55,716 --> 00:03:59,356
The original inventor of video games,
Ralph Baer.

4
00:04:00,236 --> 00:04:04,396
He was sitting there working for
a defence contractor in the United States

5
00:04:04,996 --> 00:04:07,676
in Manchester, New Hampshire, in 1968,

6
00:04:08,156 --> 00:04:12,636
and he was thinking that this technology
would let us bring stories home.

7
00:04:12,716 --> 00:04:16,076
And so he designed a box
called the Brown Box,

8
00:04:16,156 --> 00:04:17,516
which was all discrete.

9
00:04:17,596 --> 00:04:19,476
There were no microprocessors yet.

10
00:04:19,556 --> 00:04:22,636
And he didn't use
any integrated circuits at all,

11
00:04:22,716 --> 00:04:24,876
he just built discrete circuits

12
00:04:24,956 --> 00:04:28,116
that would create simple objects
on a TV screen

13
00:04:28,196 --> 00:04:30,636
and let a controller move them.

14
00:04:31,156 --> 00:04:36,196
And he sat there, he got it to work,
he got a lot of broad-ranging patents

15
00:04:36,276 --> 00:04:39,316
but his company was an aerospace company,

16
00:04:39,396 --> 00:04:42,236
they didn't know anything at all
about consumer electronics,

17
00:04:42,316 --> 00:04:45,556
so finally his company
hooked up with Magnavox,

18
00:04:45,636 --> 00:04:48,956
and they came out with
the Magnavox Odyssey.

19
00:04:51,116 --> 00:04:53,036
The electronic game of the future.

20
00:04:53,116 --> 00:04:56,756
Odyssey easily attaches to any brand TV,
black-and-white or colour,

21
00:04:56,836 --> 00:05:00,156
to create a closed-circuit
electronic playground.

22
00:05:00,236 --> 00:05:04,676
That was demonstrated in
the San Francisco Bay area in 1972,

23
00:05:05,076 --> 00:05:08,076
and Nolan Bushnell saw it.
And he was inspired.

24
00:05:08,636 --> 00:05:11,276
Now Bushnell had been thinking about

25
00:05:11,356 --> 00:05:14,676
bringing video games to the arcade world,

26
00:05:15,596 --> 00:05:18,916
and he'd been starting trying to figure out
how to take Computer Space,

27
00:05:18,996 --> 00:05:22,596
which was done with large computers
on vector monitors,

28
00:05:23,116 --> 00:05:24,756
and trying to come up
with something that did that.

29
00:05:24,836 --> 00:05:27,556
And that was all discrete logic too.

30
00:05:28,156 --> 00:05:31,796
But then he saw this easy, accessible game

31
00:05:32,796 --> 00:05:38,156
and he took the idea and he asked
Al Alcorn to build an implementation of it,

32
00:05:38,236 --> 00:05:40,236
and that became Atari Pong.

33
00:05:40,356 --> 00:05:42,476
That put Atari on the map.

34
00:05:42,556 --> 00:05:45,556
So that got Atari

35
00:05:45,636 --> 00:05:49,636
to be the leader in the arcade
video game business

36
00:05:49,716 --> 00:05:51,876
as opposed to
the home video game business,

37
00:05:51,956 --> 00:05:54,316
which Magnavox was the pioneer in.

38
00:05:54,396 --> 00:05:57,836
Then they started building
more complicated machines.

39
00:05:57,916 --> 00:05:59,876
They started with random logic,

40
00:05:59,956 --> 00:06:03,276
and then they started experimenting
with microprocessors.

41
00:06:03,356 --> 00:06:07,196
So then that set up a square
that was incomplete.

42
00:06:07,276 --> 00:06:09,876
There were home Pong-type games.

43
00:06:09,956 --> 00:06:12,757
There were arcade Pong-like games.

44
00:06:13,077 --> 00:06:16,277
There were more complicated
arcade video games

45
00:06:16,357 --> 00:06:18,957
and the place to complete was,

46
00:06:19,037 --> 00:06:24,677
"How can Atari, and their competitors,
bring the complicated games home?"

47
00:06:25,437 --> 00:06:29,557
That market problem was the one
that the Atari 2600,

48
00:06:30,237 --> 00:06:32,637
codenamed Stella, was intended to solve.

49
00:06:32,797 --> 00:06:34,877
Nolan bought a group of engineers

50
00:06:34,957 --> 00:06:37,077
called Cyan Engineering.

51
00:06:37,157 --> 00:06:38,597
They were up in Grass Valley.

52
00:06:38,677 --> 00:06:41,717
Steve Mayer, Larry Emmons, Ron Milner.

53
00:06:41,797 --> 00:06:45,037
They were the three engineers,
and Nolan tasked them with

54
00:06:45,157 --> 00:06:48,837
building a consumer version
of a coin-op game.

55
00:06:48,917 --> 00:06:50,757
They hired Joe Decuir,

56
00:06:50,837 --> 00:06:54,437
and the four of them
built a giant bread board.

57
00:06:54,517 --> 00:06:56,517
It was always gonna be a console,

58
00:06:56,597 --> 00:06:59,197
we knew it was gonna be programmable
in some fashion.

59
00:06:59,277 --> 00:07:01,477
But we were under a lot of pressure

60
00:07:01,557 --> 00:07:03,437
to keep the bill and materials down.

61
00:07:03,717 --> 00:07:06,077
To make it programmable would have meant

62
00:07:06,157 --> 00:07:08,797
to have some built-in ROM with a language.

63
00:07:08,877 --> 00:07:09,917
We would have needed some RAM

64
00:07:09,997 --> 00:07:12,717
to put the programs
that you were gonna create in.

65
00:07:12,797 --> 00:07:14,677
That would have made it more expensive.

66
00:07:14,757 --> 00:07:18,557
And we would've had to put in the cost
of some kind of keyboard controller.

67
00:07:18,637 --> 00:07:21,157
And we thought it was too big a jump

68
00:07:21,237 --> 00:07:23,797
to go all the way to a personal computer
the first time.

69
00:07:23,877 --> 00:07:27,077
Jay Miner and Harold Lee
were the main chip guys,

70
00:07:27,157 --> 00:07:28,837
and Jay Miner did the whole design.

71
00:07:28,917 --> 00:07:30,717
So he took that giant bread board,

72
00:07:30,797 --> 00:07:32,917
and he was gonna push it down
to a single chip.

73
00:07:33,117 --> 00:07:35,357
He basically produced the TIA chip,

74
00:07:35,437 --> 00:07:37,317
which was the
Television Interface Adaptor chip,

75
00:07:37,397 --> 00:07:40,277
which shrunk 150 chips on a circuit board
in an arcade machine

76
00:07:40,357 --> 00:07:41,797
into one little tiny chip.

77
00:07:41,997 --> 00:07:43,557
So he had to throw out a bunch of stuff

78
00:07:43,637 --> 00:07:46,237
that the Grass Valley guys had done,

79
00:07:46,317 --> 00:07:49,797
so we ended up having to do the software
and of course we complained bitterly.

80
00:07:49,877 --> 00:07:53,517
"Come on, Jay. I don't wanna write
horizontal syncs every line, just do it!"

81
00:07:54,437 --> 00:07:56,397
But the things that he threw out

82
00:07:56,477 --> 00:07:59,837
perfectly set up so that we could do
what we ended up doing.

83
00:08:00,077 --> 00:08:03,517
From the first crude Tank and Pong games,

84
00:08:03,597 --> 00:08:04,957
till Pitfall!

85
00:08:05,037 --> 00:08:08,997
We could have done a game
like Pitfall! graphics in 1976.

86
00:08:09,077 --> 00:08:10,717
We just didn't know how.

87
00:08:10,797 --> 00:08:13,917
The machine didn't change
over those six years,

88
00:08:13,997 --> 00:08:15,077
we did.

89
00:08:15,717 --> 00:08:17,677
And so, part of that, or most of that,

90
00:08:17,757 --> 00:08:20,317
was because Jay left off
a whole bunch of stuff.

91
00:08:20,677 --> 00:08:23,487
People got very creative
within the first two,

92
00:08:23,512 --> 00:08:26,141
three years of the
lifespan of the VCS.

93
00:08:26,197 --> 00:08:31,597
And people did absolutely amazing and
staggeringly inventive things with that.

94
00:09:10,397 --> 00:09:11,597
We were aware of Apple.

95
00:09:11,677 --> 00:09:15,397
We knew they were going after
the appliance computer market

96
00:09:15,477 --> 00:09:18,917
with much higher costs,
and much different market.

97
00:09:19,197 --> 00:09:23,157
You have the Apple II,
which was a really advanced computer.

98
00:09:23,237 --> 00:09:26,157
It had all kind of capacity for expansion

99
00:09:26,237 --> 00:09:30,397
that would help it do things for business
and science and office workers.

100
00:09:31,117 --> 00:09:36,957
Meanwhile, Apple had cultivated a really
strong image as a computer company.

101
00:09:37,037 --> 00:09:39,317
Then you have the first Atari,
which is very limited,

102
00:09:39,917 --> 00:09:43,277
and gave them a reputation
as a game company.

103
00:09:43,717 --> 00:09:45,597
And we went after the console market

104
00:09:45,677 --> 00:09:48,437
because we were
an entertainment games company.

105
00:09:49,477 --> 00:09:52,917
And it helped us a lot
that we were thinking in those terms,

106
00:09:52,997 --> 00:09:55,877
and not in terms of productivity software.

107
00:09:56,117 --> 00:09:59,357
We re-wrestled that problem later
with our next machine.

108
00:10:00,117 --> 00:10:02,397
Atari brings the computer age home.

109
00:10:02,477 --> 00:10:04,997
- Gotta run, gotta go!
- Late again, Dad?

110
00:10:05,077 --> 00:10:06,517
With an Atari home computer...

111
00:10:06,597 --> 00:10:07,797
Have a nice day at the office!

112
00:10:07,877 --> 00:10:10,277
...you can easily work at home

113
00:10:10,357 --> 00:10:13,277
or open your home
to a world of possibilities.

114
00:10:13,357 --> 00:10:16,706
In fact, the hardest part about
owning an Atari home computer

115
00:10:16,731 --> 00:10:18,501
isn't how to use it,

116
00:10:18,557 --> 00:10:20,397
but who gets to use it.

117
00:10:20,477 --> 00:10:23,837
Market's closed, Dad. Mind if I do my work?

118
00:10:23,917 --> 00:10:25,517
Hey, nope, no problem.

119
00:10:25,597 --> 00:10:28,237
Atari Home Computers.
We've brought the computer age home.

120
00:10:28,757 --> 00:10:31,757
Jay Miner had become, sort of,
head of the chip group.

121
00:10:31,837 --> 00:10:38,557
Jay was the heart and soul behind
the Atari 400 and the Atari 800.

122
00:10:38,637 --> 00:10:40,917
When I was programming the 800 in 1980,

123
00:10:40,997 --> 00:10:44,797
I was stunned by just how clever
the design was.

124
00:10:45,237 --> 00:10:48,197
The Atari 400 and 800
personal computer systems

125
00:10:48,277 --> 00:10:50,717
have outstanding graphics capabilities.

126
00:10:51,237 --> 00:10:53,077
These features are made possible

127
00:10:53,157 --> 00:10:56,837
by three unique,
large-scale integrated circuit chips.

128
00:10:56,917 --> 00:10:59,518
Jay had divided into three chips this time,

129
00:10:59,598 --> 00:11:01,638
cos he couldn't fit it all into one chip.

130
00:11:01,718 --> 00:11:03,718
So there was a new version of the TIA,

131
00:11:03,798 --> 00:11:05,918
which we called the Colleen TIA.

132
00:11:05,998 --> 00:11:08,158
It handled sprites, missiles, balls.

133
00:11:08,518 --> 00:11:10,998
The ANTIC was the stuff that overflowed,

134
00:11:11,078 --> 00:11:12,718
that did more of the playfield graphics.

135
00:11:13,318 --> 00:11:14,838
And the ANTIC had something
that we invented,

136
00:11:14,918 --> 00:11:16,838
called the display list.

137
00:11:16,918 --> 00:11:18,838
So you give it a list of instructions,

138
00:11:18,918 --> 00:11:21,998
very simple ones,
telling it what to do on each line,

139
00:11:22,078 --> 00:11:25,438
so we didn't have to write kernels
to load the register.

140
00:11:25,518 --> 00:11:29,158
So this display list would load
those registers for us every line.

141
00:11:29,318 --> 00:11:31,718
And it controlled the line by itself.

142
00:11:31,798 --> 00:11:33,358
And the third chip was the POKEY chip,

143
00:11:34,118 --> 00:11:38,198
which stands for
"Potentiometers and Keyboard."

144
00:11:38,318 --> 00:11:40,958
So it did the joysticks, the pots,

145
00:11:41,038 --> 00:11:42,838
the keyboard, and the other peripherals.

146
00:11:43,118 --> 00:11:47,878
I think the most important thing
about those early chipsets,

147
00:11:48,358 --> 00:11:50,918
were that they recognised that

148
00:11:50,998 --> 00:11:54,798
computers could be about
a lot more than just crunching numbers.

149
00:11:55,478 --> 00:11:57,158
That computers could be fun.

150
00:11:57,238 --> 00:12:01,398
Computers could be engaging,
exciting, creative.

151
00:12:01,918 --> 00:12:03,878
And that it required

152
00:12:04,598 --> 00:12:08,558
a degree of technical
ingenuity and creativity

153
00:12:08,838 --> 00:12:12,078
that people simply weren't putting into
computers at that point,

154
00:12:12,158 --> 00:12:14,238
certainly not into computing technology.

155
00:12:14,318 --> 00:12:16,358
I mean, you look at
something like the Apple II.

156
00:12:16,438 --> 00:12:17,558
It was a good computer.

157
00:12:17,638 --> 00:12:19,838
You know, it would run
spreadsheets and so on,

158
00:12:19,918 --> 00:12:21,638
and even some primitive games.

159
00:12:21,718 --> 00:12:24,158
But there was a lot missing.

160
00:12:24,238 --> 00:12:26,598
And a lot of the stuff that was missing

161
00:12:26,678 --> 00:12:28,718
was in the Atari 400 and 800 chipsets.

162
00:12:41,558 --> 00:12:44,598
At Atari,
Warner Communications bought them,

163
00:12:44,678 --> 00:12:46,598
they installed Ray Kassar as president.

164
00:12:46,718 --> 00:12:49,838
Best is yet to come, we have
terrific games coming out next year.

165
00:12:49,918 --> 00:12:53,758
We have E.T. for example,
a wonderful love story cartridge.

166
00:12:53,838 --> 00:12:55,718
I think there's great interest
in home computers,

167
00:12:55,798 --> 00:12:57,478
which Atari makes, and video games...

168
00:12:57,558 --> 00:13:01,918
They were essentially owned by
a entertainment media conglomerate,

169
00:13:01,998 --> 00:13:04,718
and Ray Kassar came from that culture.

170
00:13:04,798 --> 00:13:06,518
Now you have to realise

171
00:13:06,598 --> 00:13:10,318
that Nolan Bushnell
and Joe Keenan and Al Alcorn,

172
00:13:10,398 --> 00:13:12,598
they were basically goof-offs.

173
00:13:12,678 --> 00:13:15,878
Not quite hippies,
but you'd call them relaxed. Casual.

174
00:13:15,958 --> 00:13:17,238
They smoked dope.

175
00:13:17,318 --> 00:13:20,398
We went up to the Nolan suite
where we smoked a few joints.

176
00:13:20,478 --> 00:13:22,438
And so that was the Atari that we knew.

177
00:13:22,678 --> 00:13:25,638
Ray comes in with his,
you know, $3,000 suits.

178
00:13:25,718 --> 00:13:29,038
He had a chauffeured limousine
that drove him up to the city.

179
00:13:29,118 --> 00:13:31,758
Ray Kassar was not a technical guy.

180
00:13:31,838 --> 00:13:33,718
He came from the fabric business.

181
00:13:33,998 --> 00:13:38,838
And he was a vice-president
at something called Burlington Industries,

182
00:13:38,918 --> 00:13:41,318
that makes towels and socks.

183
00:13:41,678 --> 00:13:44,198
He thought that you sold computers

184
00:13:44,558 --> 00:13:46,558
to women in designer colours.

185
00:13:46,638 --> 00:13:49,958
He gave a lecture to us
in Atari Engineering

186
00:13:50,398 --> 00:13:54,718
in late January, early February of 1979.

187
00:13:54,798 --> 00:13:56,558
And he told us this.

188
00:13:57,238 --> 00:14:01,278
Most of the women who worked at Atari
in engineering left within a month.

189
00:14:01,358 --> 00:14:03,678
They really just did not understand

190
00:14:03,758 --> 00:14:06,398
how to treat developers
and how to do engineering.

191
00:14:06,718 --> 00:14:10,038
He said, you know, "I've worked
with towel designers at Burlington."

192
00:14:10,118 --> 00:14:13,558
And they make those designs on the
towels, the fancy patterns and stuff.

193
00:14:13,638 --> 00:14:16,678
And he said,
"They consider themselves artists.

194
00:14:16,758 --> 00:14:20,638
"They think it's their art on the towel
that sells the towel."

195
00:14:20,718 --> 00:14:22,398
And he said,

196
00:14:22,478 --> 00:14:25,598
"I had to tell them,
'You guys are a dime a dozen.

197
00:14:25,678 --> 00:14:28,638
"'I could hire any idiot to design towels.

198
00:14:28,718 --> 00:14:30,718
"'And I wouldn't have
to pay them anything.'"

199
00:14:30,798 --> 00:14:33,758
And so he basically said
we were a dime a dozen,

200
00:14:33,838 --> 00:14:37,358
he didn't need to pay us anything cos
he could hire anybody to do what we do.

201
00:14:37,438 --> 00:14:38,958
It was just like towel design.

202
00:14:39,558 --> 00:14:42,518
And Jay Miner said,
"I don't like where this is going."

203
00:14:42,598 --> 00:14:45,958
Jay Miner, he wanted to continue the
work he'd done on the Atari 800.

204
00:14:46,038 --> 00:14:48,343
So, it was clear that they
weren't gonna be able to make

205
00:14:48,368 --> 00:14:49,702
any new technology at Atari.

206
00:14:49,758 --> 00:14:54,998
So he just left, and actually went to work
for a company making pacemaker chips.

207
00:14:56,158 --> 00:14:58,518
Zymos was a chip company,
they made chips.

208
00:14:58,758 --> 00:15:01,238
In those days you do RAM chips,

209
00:15:01,318 --> 00:15:05,038
you do peripheral chips, any kind of chip
that the company can do.

210
00:15:09,838 --> 00:15:12,958
While I was at Activision,
after I finished Kaboom!,

211
00:15:13,038 --> 00:15:15,478
I really wanted to do a new game system.

212
00:15:15,598 --> 00:15:18,678
Atari still had not come out with the 5200,

213
00:15:18,838 --> 00:15:21,878
they were still selling 400s and 800s.

214
00:15:21,958 --> 00:15:24,998
And Doug Neubauer
had called me up one day,

215
00:15:25,318 --> 00:15:26,638
and we were talking about it.

216
00:15:26,718 --> 00:15:30,198
I said, "Look, I wanna leave Activision,
I really wanna do a new game system."

217
00:15:30,278 --> 00:15:33,198
We both knew Jay Miner, we talked about it.

218
00:15:33,518 --> 00:15:35,758
And he said, "Sure," he'd like to do it.

219
00:15:35,838 --> 00:15:38,878
Bert Braddock, the president of Zymos,
he liked the idea.

220
00:15:39,278 --> 00:15:42,198
So we put together, like,
a little business plan,

221
00:15:42,318 --> 00:15:44,718
and he presented it to his investor,

222
00:15:44,798 --> 00:15:47,439
who was a man named O.W. Rollins.

223
00:15:47,759 --> 00:15:50,279
He had put a lot of money into Zymos,

224
00:15:50,359 --> 00:15:52,679
so Rollins said he'll invest money.

225
00:15:53,119 --> 00:15:55,679
It was just purely a game machine
with joysticks,

226
00:15:55,759 --> 00:15:58,439
and a simple console, nothing else.

227
00:15:58,519 --> 00:15:59,999
I guess at the time,

228
00:16:00,079 --> 00:16:03,159
with Atari doing so well
and everybody was talking about games,

229
00:16:03,239 --> 00:16:05,319
they really wanted to invest
in a game console.

230
00:16:05,399 --> 00:16:08,119
It looked like it was gonna do very well
for them at that time.

231
00:16:08,199 --> 00:16:10,199
June of 1982,

232
00:16:10,279 --> 00:16:15,039
Rollins hired an executive search team
to find a president.

233
00:16:15,119 --> 00:16:17,079
And they found Dave Morse.

234
00:16:17,159 --> 00:16:18,679
Tonka Toys in Minnesota.

235
00:16:19,199 --> 00:16:22,439
And so Dave and I worked on
the business plan over the summer,

236
00:16:22,519 --> 00:16:24,879
and they basically
approved it in September.

237
00:16:24,959 --> 00:16:26,359
So, October of '82,

238
00:16:26,799 --> 00:16:29,839
Rollins agreed to spend $3 million

239
00:16:29,919 --> 00:16:32,199
to fund, at that time, Hi-Toro.

240
00:16:32,759 --> 00:16:34,639
This is, of course, the season to be jolly,

241
00:16:34,719 --> 00:16:36,919
but the folks at Mattel
and Warner Communications

242
00:16:36,999 --> 00:16:38,319
and a lot of other companies

243
00:16:38,399 --> 00:16:40,719
are having trouble
getting into the holiday spirit.

244
00:16:40,799 --> 00:16:43,959
Sales down dramatically
for home video game cartridges

245
00:16:44,039 --> 00:16:45,839
and investors are bailing out.

246
00:16:45,919 --> 00:16:47,279
Scott Barrett reports.

247
00:16:47,879 --> 00:16:50,759
Warner Communications down
one and a quarter points today,

248
00:16:50,839 --> 00:16:52,679
16 and three quarter points yesterday.

249
00:16:52,839 --> 00:16:55,599
Mattel down
seven and a quarter points today.

250
00:16:55,679 --> 00:16:59,039
Both companies have one important
Christmas season product in common:

251
00:16:59,719 --> 00:17:01,559
home video game cartridges.

252
00:17:01,639 --> 00:17:05,719
What happened with Atari was that
they got really big really quickly,

253
00:17:05,799 --> 00:17:08,548
and then they forgot that
technology was gonna keep going,

254
00:17:08,573 --> 00:17:10,063
it was going to get better.

255
00:17:10,319 --> 00:17:15,559
They started to think of their Atari
video computer system, the 2600,

256
00:17:15,959 --> 00:17:17,559
kind of like a television,

257
00:17:17,639 --> 00:17:20,479
thinking there's gonna be one of these in
every home, it's like an appliance.

258
00:17:21,039 --> 00:17:25,119
And Atari, nevertheless, felt like they
could ride that horse for years and years.

259
00:17:25,359 --> 00:17:28,439
Naturally, it was going to hit a wall
very, very quickly,

260
00:17:28,519 --> 00:17:31,799
and they overbuilt the company
around that assumption.

261
00:17:32,119 --> 00:17:35,679
And they didn't really plan that
effectively for a next generation.

262
00:17:35,759 --> 00:17:36,972
And so it went up really fast,

263
00:17:36,997 --> 00:17:39,463
and then it turned around and
it came down really fast.

264
00:17:39,519 --> 00:17:43,519
Just like the laws of physics,
what goes up must come down.

265
00:17:43,599 --> 00:17:48,559
And then they made a great big
implosion when they crashed,

266
00:17:48,639 --> 00:17:51,719
and they kind of sucked the entire
industry down with them for a while.

267
00:17:51,799 --> 00:17:54,046
All the game companies were losing money.

268
00:17:54,071 --> 00:17:56,103
Mattel, 20th Century Fox, Hasbro.

269
00:17:56,159 --> 00:17:58,879
All of those others companies,
Imagic, they all went broke.

270
00:17:59,599 --> 00:18:02,439
And retailers and distributors
refused to carry anything.

271
00:18:02,519 --> 00:18:05,359
We were telling our sales
people at Electronic Arts

272
00:18:05,439 --> 00:18:08,359
to go find all the guys
who are carrying Atari,

273
00:18:08,439 --> 00:18:10,039
and they came back and said,
"They're all gone.

274
00:18:10,119 --> 00:18:11,719
"They all went out of
business or shut down.

275
00:18:11,799 --> 00:18:14,199
"They don't want to do anything
with any more video games."

276
00:18:14,279 --> 00:18:18,799
It was very difficult in the early '80s
trying to rebuild all of that distribution.

277
00:18:18,879 --> 00:18:23,719
Nobody, no single American
toy store, distributor,

278
00:18:23,799 --> 00:18:25,999
nobody wanted to hear the word
"video game."

279
00:18:26,079 --> 00:18:29,239
They'd all lost their shirt,
and they would never touch them again.

280
00:18:29,319 --> 00:18:31,079
There is one encouraging note
for the industry,

281
00:18:31,159 --> 00:18:33,159
while software sales may be slumping,

282
00:18:33,239 --> 00:18:35,919
and of course "software" is a
computer buff term for that

283
00:18:35,999 --> 00:18:39,079
video cartridge that contains
the game program,

284
00:18:39,159 --> 00:18:41,359
hardware sales are still soaring.

285
00:18:41,439 --> 00:18:44,439
Most hardware can double
as a personal computer,

286
00:18:44,519 --> 00:18:47,479
leading most optimistic industry experts
to conclude

287
00:18:47,559 --> 00:18:50,279
that video game players
may be tired of playing

288
00:18:50,359 --> 00:18:53,439
and are now getting down to
the serious business of computing.

289
00:18:53,679 --> 00:18:57,639
And so, the only market available at
that time really was the computer.

290
00:18:57,759 --> 00:19:01,639
If you started in 1983 with an idea
for a new company,

291
00:19:01,719 --> 00:19:03,199
you could not do a video game.

292
00:19:03,279 --> 00:19:05,879
There was just absolutely no possibility,

293
00:19:05,959 --> 00:19:09,079
because there wasn't a distributor
or retailer that would talk to you.

294
00:19:09,159 --> 00:19:12,599
And the Consumer Electronic Shows,
they disappeared.

295
00:19:12,679 --> 00:19:15,079
If you went to the show
in, say, June of '83,

296
00:19:15,159 --> 00:19:17,439
there were almost no video games
there at all.

297
00:19:17,839 --> 00:19:21,879
Jay Miner had already begun a project

298
00:19:22,199 --> 00:19:25,839
to design a low-cost super computer

299
00:19:25,919 --> 00:19:28,639
based on the Motorola 68000 chip,

300
00:19:28,719 --> 00:19:33,479
which at that time, was only being used
in high-end workstations.

301
00:19:33,559 --> 00:19:35,279
Dave learned about it

302
00:19:35,439 --> 00:19:41,119
and the two of them decided
to go back to the original backer

303
00:19:41,199 --> 00:19:46,399
and propose that they make a
few changes to the strategy,

304
00:19:46,479 --> 00:19:50,519
but basically fund the continuation
of this project.

305
00:19:50,999 --> 00:19:56,679
The changes were not only to target
the low-end business market,

306
00:19:56,759 --> 00:19:58,679
which is what Jay had in mind,

307
00:19:58,959 --> 00:20:02,759
but also to target the
home computer market,

308
00:20:02,839 --> 00:20:05,719
including the ability to do
dazzling video games.

309
00:20:06,879 --> 00:20:09,679
So that was the element that Dave added.

310
00:20:09,759 --> 00:20:13,319
Dave Morse was what I consider to be
a marketing genius,

311
00:20:14,559 --> 00:20:18,999
well under-considered in terms of, I think,
an awful lot of people.

312
00:20:19,079 --> 00:20:20,559
Very creative.

313
00:20:20,639 --> 00:20:22,289
And his directive to us

314
00:20:22,314 --> 00:20:26,903
was he wanted to be able to
animate cartoons in real time.

315
00:20:26,959 --> 00:20:30,279
So we again listed,
"What do we need for a game?

316
00:20:30,359 --> 00:20:31,799
"What do we need for productivity?

317
00:20:31,879 --> 00:20:34,280
"Let's make sure we can cover
both of them in the same set."

318
00:20:34,360 --> 00:20:39,920
At that point, the only real game in town
in the low-end business market

319
00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:42,240
and also high-end home market

320
00:20:42,320 --> 00:20:43,760
was the Apple IIe.

321
00:20:43,840 --> 00:20:46,720
They had owned that market
for a long, long time,

322
00:20:46,800 --> 00:20:50,320
and Dave felt it wasn't a
terribly exciting computer.

323
00:20:50,400 --> 00:20:52,320
There was also all the
Commodore computers.

324
00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:53,840
And Commodore was very big at the time.

325
00:20:53,920 --> 00:20:57,400
They had sold millions and millions
of these small home computers.

326
00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:10,280
Ghostbusters!

327
00:21:10,800 --> 00:21:13,480
So the idea of taking that idea
and really extending it

328
00:21:13,560 --> 00:21:17,760
and giving those a lot more
graphic capability, a lot more power,

329
00:21:17,840 --> 00:21:20,720
you know, the multitasking
as well as really good sound,

330
00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:24,440
it was just the next step in the evolution
of personal computing.

331
00:21:24,880 --> 00:21:31,400
I have a notebook from Atari
which has a preview of the Amiga.

332
00:21:31,480 --> 00:21:35,440
I wrote that preview in June of 1979.

333
00:21:35,520 --> 00:21:39,720
And so when Jay called me up
in the fall of 1982 and said,

334
00:21:40,040 --> 00:21:43,480
"Let's come up with a new machine,"
I was ready to go.

335
00:21:43,560 --> 00:21:48,440
So I went and met Jay in October of 1982,
and we started planning out this system.

336
00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:51,960
So I worked as a consultant for Jay Miner.

337
00:21:52,040 --> 00:21:54,840
I was badge number three at
what was then called Hi-Toro.

338
00:21:54,920 --> 00:21:59,760
While I was working with Jay finishing
up the clock chip at Apple,

339
00:21:59,840 --> 00:22:02,440
and of course we'd go out for lunch
every now and then,

340
00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:05,600
I was in the Macintosh lab.

341
00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:08,800
And my lab bench was very near
Dan Kottke's,

342
00:22:08,880 --> 00:22:11,840
another early engineer
on the Macintosh project,

343
00:22:11,920 --> 00:22:16,280
and he was adding a test connector
to the Mac motherboard.

344
00:22:16,600 --> 00:22:20,760
And Steve Jobs comes over and says,
"What's that?"

345
00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:22,580
There are various stories
about Steve Jobs

346
00:22:22,605 --> 00:22:24,264
walking up to an
engineer and going,

347
00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:25,440
"What are you doing?"

348
00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:28,720
And Dan Kottke says,
"I'm putting in a test connector."

349
00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:31,560
And Steve goes, "What test connector?
What do you want to test?" And he says,

350
00:22:31,640 --> 00:22:36,360
"Well, various things, like an option,
for instance, for a colour adaptor."

351
00:22:36,440 --> 00:22:38,720
And then Steve goes on this rant about how

352
00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:42,640
the Mac is a black-and-white
high-resolution monochrome computer,

353
00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:45,320
"It'll never have colour,
I don't want you playing with colour.

354
00:22:45,400 --> 00:22:47,520
"Please remove that test connector."

355
00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:50,960
Right? And Steve rants about this
and goes tromping off.

356
00:22:51,040 --> 00:22:55,280
So I'm saying, "OK, Steve doesn't want
to do a colour Macintosh."

357
00:22:55,360 --> 00:22:58,960
At the next lunch I went
to with Jay, Jay says,

358
00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:02,476
"I've got some investors who
want to start a company

359
00:23:02,501 --> 00:23:04,704
to do a colour game machine."

360
00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:08,240
And I'm going, "Hey, I've always been
interested in colour,

361
00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:10,080
"and Steve says he's not interested in it."

362
00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:15,280
And so, I jumped at the opportunity
to do something new and creative.

363
00:23:15,360 --> 00:23:16,958
I worked in the early stages,

364
00:23:16,983 --> 00:23:20,344
so I worked with Jay and Ron
and very few other people.

365
00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:23,760
And we spent an awful lot of our time
on the whiteboard...

366
00:23:23,840 --> 00:23:26,320
Saying, "No, no. That's all wrong,"
and erasing it all.

367
00:23:26,400 --> 00:23:29,440
We went through several weeks there,

368
00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:33,160
of just throwing ideas around
of what we wanted to do.

369
00:23:33,240 --> 00:23:35,770
And then we would go to
the giant drawing table

370
00:23:35,795 --> 00:23:37,744
and start drawing all this stuff

371
00:23:37,800 --> 00:23:41,120
because we didn't have
good computer-aided design tools yet.

372
00:23:41,200 --> 00:23:45,120
We were still designing on vellums

373
00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:48,680
and we'd get these big tables
with fluorescent lights under them

374
00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:50,760
and do it manually by hand.

375
00:23:50,840 --> 00:23:55,280
It was just the three of
us for several months

376
00:23:55,840 --> 00:23:58,153
until we had all the design,

377
00:23:58,178 --> 00:24:02,224
except for maybe three
features, finalised.

378
00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:05,480
At that time Amiga was looking to expand.

379
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:08,120
I go down there,
I get out at the Sunnyvale train station,

380
00:24:08,200 --> 00:24:10,360
there's this big old guy with a beard,

381
00:24:10,440 --> 00:24:13,240
in a Lincoln,
and this little dog sitting at one window.

382
00:24:15,520 --> 00:24:17,480
And I thought, "This is
an interesting guy."

383
00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:20,880
And then I guessed correctly

384
00:24:20,960 --> 00:24:23,800
when he asked me the difference
between a flip-flop and a latch.

385
00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:26,920
And we hit it off.
So I said, "I gotta work for this guy."

386
00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:29,662
They invited me to
come out and interview

387
00:24:29,687 --> 00:24:32,664
and I blew off their invitation twice.

388
00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:34,400
Two times!

389
00:24:34,480 --> 00:24:36,520
I said, "OK, I'll think about it."

390
00:24:36,600 --> 00:24:40,280
And then I decided I wasn't going to do it
because it was just too wacky.

391
00:24:40,360 --> 00:24:43,040
It's a bunch of people out in California,

392
00:24:43,120 --> 00:24:45,440
they're going to go
and create a new computer,

393
00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:47,400
and, sure, this is a great idea.

394
00:24:47,480 --> 00:24:51,680
And my family, especially my mom, they
were warning me, "Out in California..."

395
00:24:51,760 --> 00:24:54,204
"California is the land
of fruit and nuts,"

396
00:24:54,229 --> 00:24:56,784
is what they all used
to say to me back then.

397
00:24:56,840 --> 00:24:59,000
And though I blew them off twice,
they kept calling.

398
00:24:59,080 --> 00:25:01,920
Thankfully, they called the third time. And
the third time, I accepted and went out.

399
00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:03,640
I actually missed my first interview.

400
00:25:04,400 --> 00:25:09,200
What I had heard about it was that there
was a small start-up company and so...

401
00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:11,640
Scheduled an interview,
and it was on a Friday night.

402
00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:16,360
And HP typically has these things called
beer busts, at that time, on Friday night.

403
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:19,880
And about 8:30,
after quite a bit of wine at the beer bust,

404
00:25:19,960 --> 00:25:21,680
I suddenly remembered I was supposed to

405
00:25:21,761 --> 00:25:24,881
go to an interview at Amiga
with Bob Pariseau.

406
00:25:24,961 --> 00:25:28,001
And so I called him up in a panic,

407
00:25:28,081 --> 00:25:31,081
and he said, "No, no problem.
Just come in next week."

408
00:25:31,161 --> 00:25:32,281
And so I went in,

409
00:25:32,441 --> 00:25:36,761
they had the whiteboard with the 68000
as one of the key elements,

410
00:25:36,841 --> 00:25:40,361
and then they showed the chips
and the basic architecture

411
00:25:40,441 --> 00:25:42,561
and fairly quickly made up my mind

412
00:25:42,641 --> 00:25:45,761
that I wanted to leave HP
and join this company.

413
00:25:45,841 --> 00:25:51,241
My wife got a call from a head-hunter
and then from Bob Pariseau,

414
00:25:51,321 --> 00:25:54,361
who was the head of software at Amiga.

415
00:25:55,001 --> 00:25:59,601
And it's funny because she felt he was
very rude on the telephone,

416
00:25:59,681 --> 00:26:01,841
and said, "Don't call this guy back.

417
00:26:01,921 --> 00:26:04,681
"You don't want to talk to this...
I don't want you working for..."

418
00:26:04,761 --> 00:26:07,681
"For this guy and his company."

419
00:26:08,441 --> 00:26:11,001
But I had a friend who
had interviewed there

420
00:26:11,081 --> 00:26:14,841
for the operating system job,
and he decided it wasn't for him,

421
00:26:14,921 --> 00:26:17,841
but he called me up and he said,
"You really should go talk to these guys

422
00:26:17,921 --> 00:26:21,521
"because they want to create
a whole new computer system,

423
00:26:21,601 --> 00:26:23,921
"and they want to do a whole
operating system from scratch

424
00:26:24,001 --> 00:26:26,361
"and I was thinking maybe you'd be
interested in that."

425
00:26:26,921 --> 00:26:29,881
So I went down to the interview
and interviewed with Bob Pariseau

426
00:26:30,001 --> 00:26:32,641
and met some of the other
guys there, Dave Morse.

427
00:26:32,961 --> 00:26:36,801
And then they made me an offer the same day

428
00:26:36,881 --> 00:26:38,361
and I couldn't refuse. I accepted it.

429
00:26:38,441 --> 00:26:44,521
I was talking to, what was at that time,
"a talent agent" for technology people.

430
00:26:44,601 --> 00:26:47,921
And he introduced me
to this company, Amiga,

431
00:26:48,001 --> 00:26:51,001
that was doing something interesting.

432
00:26:51,081 --> 00:26:54,441
I went down, I took a look.
I saw the whiteboard.

433
00:26:54,521 --> 00:26:58,401
I just knew, without question,
that this is what I wanted to work on.

434
00:26:58,481 --> 00:27:00,641
Of course,
I completely screwed up the interview.

435
00:27:00,721 --> 00:27:03,841
And Morse threw me out and said,
"Go away, don't bother me, little boy."

436
00:27:03,921 --> 00:27:08,321
But I was being massively,
totally arrogant. It was awful.

437
00:27:08,401 --> 00:27:10,161
The next morning, I call back.

438
00:27:10,241 --> 00:27:14,161
And I apologised and I tell Dave Morse
how sorry I am that I behaved that way,

439
00:27:14,241 --> 00:27:17,161
and I really, really want to just
work on that machine.

440
00:27:17,241 --> 00:27:18,841
And he says, "OK, fine. Come in."

441
00:27:18,921 --> 00:27:22,161
And I came in
and he handed me off to Tom Cahill

442
00:27:22,241 --> 00:27:24,321
who was running the lab at the time.

443
00:27:24,401 --> 00:27:28,401
And they put me to work
sweeping the place clean,

444
00:27:28,481 --> 00:27:32,001
picking up parts, putting them back
in the bins where they belong.

445
00:27:32,081 --> 00:27:35,161
And so I started at Amiga as a janitor.

446
00:27:35,241 --> 00:27:38,041
And loved it, and had to be there
and it was amazing.

447
00:27:47,641 --> 00:27:50,020
One of the things I saw
during my interview at Amiga

448
00:27:50,045 --> 00:27:51,345
was a little whiteboard.

449
00:27:51,401 --> 00:27:55,001
I think a lot of the guys talk about this
that were on the original Amiga team.

450
00:27:55,081 --> 00:27:57,881
And it was a whiteboard that had a
diagram of how the system worked

451
00:27:57,961 --> 00:28:00,081
in terms of its system architecture.

452
00:28:00,161 --> 00:28:04,561
And it was really quite elegant and it was
also a multiprocessing architecture,

453
00:28:04,641 --> 00:28:07,241
where multiple things can be happening
at the same time.

454
00:28:07,321 --> 00:28:08,961
And as soon as I looked at that, I knew

455
00:28:09,041 --> 00:28:12,041
that multitasking was going to be
required to make that work well.

456
00:28:12,121 --> 00:28:15,961
To be able to coordinate all the different
parts of the system at the same time.

457
00:28:16,721 --> 00:28:20,721
The magical, incredible drawing
on that whiteboard

458
00:28:20,801 --> 00:28:23,961
that showed an amazing architecture.

459
00:28:24,041 --> 00:28:25,921
Multiple buses,

460
00:28:26,001 --> 00:28:29,841
ways to get the graphics out of regular
memory and on to video

461
00:28:29,921 --> 00:28:32,441
without stopping the processor.

462
00:28:32,521 --> 00:28:34,841
Real audio? Holy cow.

463
00:28:35,121 --> 00:28:37,081
It had additional features

464
00:28:37,161 --> 00:28:40,121
that were already plotted out
on this whiteboard

465
00:28:40,201 --> 00:28:44,561
that made it clear, in advance,
that Jay Miner and company intended

466
00:28:44,801 --> 00:28:48,001
to create a real computer,
not just a game system.

467
00:28:48,081 --> 00:28:50,561
But they intended to create something
that could have a keyboard

468
00:28:50,641 --> 00:28:52,361
if you wanted it to have a keyboard.

469
00:28:52,801 --> 00:28:57,321
It could have external drive capability
if you wanted to expand it.

470
00:28:57,401 --> 00:29:00,041
Memory expansion
if you wanted to expand the system.

471
00:29:01,321 --> 00:29:05,561
So, the process of creating the Amiga
was one where

472
00:29:05,641 --> 00:29:07,761
we went back and forth between

473
00:29:07,841 --> 00:29:10,001
how much do we want to make it
a game machine,

474
00:29:10,081 --> 00:29:13,481
how much do we want to make it a tool
or a utility like a real computer,

475
00:29:13,561 --> 00:29:16,121
or like a IBM-PC type of thing.

476
00:29:16,561 --> 00:29:18,321
And we tried to balance that

477
00:29:18,401 --> 00:29:20,641
through the whole process
of making the computer.

478
00:29:20,721 --> 00:29:23,801
And it was a difficult balance
to make along the way.

479
00:29:23,881 --> 00:29:27,321
Because those are such different markets
and such different types of usages.

480
00:29:27,921 --> 00:29:32,241
We relied on a lot of the concepts
that had already been developed.

481
00:29:32,321 --> 00:29:36,481
Grand UNIX systems,
grand Sun Microsystems sorts of things,

482
00:29:36,561 --> 00:29:40,801
where they had tackled
giant operating systems

483
00:29:40,881 --> 00:29:42,801
and figured out the right way to do it.

484
00:29:43,241 --> 00:29:47,521
We wanted to do that, too.
We wanted to create that kind of power.

485
00:29:47,601 --> 00:29:50,641
But to pack it in a little box
that was easily accessible,

486
00:29:50,721 --> 00:29:54,321
that was easily affordable by every man.

487
00:29:54,401 --> 00:29:59,241
We wanted to have a machine that was
a magnificent game-playing system

488
00:29:59,321 --> 00:30:03,881
that would run circles around any
other game system that was out there,

489
00:30:03,961 --> 00:30:05,761
and yet cost less than all of them.

490
00:30:06,281 --> 00:30:10,282
We wanted a machine that had
the graphics capabilities

491
00:30:10,362 --> 00:30:13,562
that if you look at what was available
in the marketplace at that time,

492
00:30:13,642 --> 00:30:15,442
a Silicon Graphics machine
or something like that,

493
00:30:15,522 --> 00:30:17,962
you'd pay $20,000-$30,000

494
00:30:18,042 --> 00:30:21,122
for a machine that would have
the kinds of capabilities

495
00:30:21,202 --> 00:30:25,642
that we hoped to be able to launch
to the public at less than $1,000 price.

496
00:30:25,722 --> 00:30:27,442
That was our big dream.

497
00:30:27,522 --> 00:30:32,002
We were all in this together,
we all had kind of the same vision.

498
00:30:32,082 --> 00:30:35,042
It really was more like a mission from God,

499
00:30:35,122 --> 00:30:37,762
that we thought we needed to bring this out

500
00:30:37,842 --> 00:30:40,482
for everyone to be able
to experience and use.

501
00:30:40,682 --> 00:30:42,962
And it had a friendly name, Amiga, that...

502
00:30:43,042 --> 00:30:44,962
Who could not love such a name?

503
00:30:45,882 --> 00:30:49,842
When I joined Amiga,
and saw the diagram on the wall

504
00:30:49,922 --> 00:30:53,362
of the chip architecture
and the system architecture,

505
00:30:54,482 --> 00:30:57,362
one of the things about it is,
to implement that, normally,

506
00:30:57,442 --> 00:31:00,442
would require a lot of
different small chips.

507
00:31:00,522 --> 00:31:02,362
And it would be a very complex system,

508
00:31:02,442 --> 00:31:05,162
and take a lot of power and be very large.

509
00:31:05,762 --> 00:31:09,282
But what was happening at
that time in chip technology

510
00:31:09,362 --> 00:31:11,882
was very large-scale integration, VLSI.

511
00:31:11,962 --> 00:31:14,082
And making custom chips,

512
00:31:14,162 --> 00:31:19,002
and that's something that Jay Miner
had a lot of experience with at Atari,

513
00:31:19,082 --> 00:31:20,762
in creating the Atari products.

514
00:31:20,842 --> 00:31:25,242
So, seeing that architecture and knowing
that those chips were really a possibility,

515
00:31:25,322 --> 00:31:27,562
and that they could be made
at an affordable type of price

516
00:31:27,642 --> 00:31:29,482
that would work in a home computer

517
00:31:29,562 --> 00:31:31,522
was a huge breakthrough.

518
00:31:31,602 --> 00:31:35,602
The chips, Portia, Agnus and Daphne,

519
00:31:35,682 --> 00:31:37,362
which were their original names,

520
00:31:37,442 --> 00:31:39,722
Agnus was the main DMA engine.

521
00:31:39,802 --> 00:31:43,242
It was an address generator, AG,
so that's where we got Agnus.

522
00:31:43,322 --> 00:31:47,042
And it was really the DMA engine
for everything.

523
00:31:47,722 --> 00:31:50,722
Daphne was fed by Agnus,

524
00:31:50,802 --> 00:31:54,409
and was given all the display
stuff to generate the displays,

525
00:31:54,434 --> 00:31:55,946
generate the sprites,

526
00:31:56,002 --> 00:31:58,762
and do some of my stuff.

527
00:31:59,322 --> 00:32:04,322
Portia, the port chip and the audio chip,
was also fed by Agnus.

528
00:32:04,402 --> 00:32:07,882
So Agnus had all this huge amounts
of DMA pointers in it.

529
00:32:07,962 --> 00:32:11,042
And it basically pulled stuff out of memory

530
00:32:11,122 --> 00:32:13,882
and put stuff in memory
and then fed the other two chips

531
00:32:13,962 --> 00:32:18,882
to do other things like the audio,
the floppy disk IO, the display,

532
00:32:18,962 --> 00:32:22,162
and then Agnus also did, internally
though, it did the blitter operation.

533
00:32:22,242 --> 00:32:23,482
So it did the graphics.

534
00:32:23,562 --> 00:32:26,962
And based on that
and how well that was tightly integrated

535
00:32:27,042 --> 00:32:32,122
with the 68000 and Agnus basically
stealing cycles from the 68000...

536
00:32:32,202 --> 00:32:36,362
Cos the 68000 could only use memory
at half the speed of the RAM,

537
00:32:36,442 --> 00:32:38,642
we were able to do all these
things in the background

538
00:32:38,722 --> 00:32:41,522
without really affecting
the 68000's performance.

539
00:32:41,802 --> 00:32:45,722
The way those chips worked is they
all got their little moment in time

540
00:32:45,802 --> 00:32:48,562
to get on the memory bus
to talk to the main CPU

541
00:32:48,642 --> 00:32:51,442
or to talk to each other on that bus.

542
00:32:51,522 --> 00:32:56,042
And there were actually 25
different slices of time in that.

543
00:32:56,122 --> 00:32:58,122
We called it 25 DMA channels.

544
00:32:58,202 --> 00:33:02,162
So organising and orchestrating all
of that was a major accomplishment.

545
00:33:02,282 --> 00:33:05,322
You had audio bits being DMA-ed,

546
00:33:05,402 --> 00:33:07,642
and you had video
bits being DMA-ed,

547
00:33:07,722 --> 00:33:10,762
and you the blitter
moving graphics around,

548
00:33:10,842 --> 00:33:14,082
you had the floppy disk
DMA stuff going on.

549
00:33:14,162 --> 00:33:18,002
In order to effectively get all those
things moving around properly,

550
00:33:18,082 --> 00:33:21,122
all at the same time, you have to
have pre-emptive multitasking.

551
00:33:21,202 --> 00:33:25,002
Because you can't be pulling stuff
to wait for something to do.

552
00:33:25,082 --> 00:33:26,802
You have to be event-driven,

553
00:33:26,882 --> 00:33:29,282
so that when things
need to be restarted

554
00:33:29,362 --> 00:33:32,442
or things are done and you need
to start something else up,

555
00:33:32,522 --> 00:33:34,122
it all has to be pre-emptive.

556
00:33:34,202 --> 00:33:35,722
Yeah, so back then,

557
00:33:35,802 --> 00:33:39,722
most computers, micro-computers,
were single-tasking computers,

558
00:33:39,802 --> 00:33:42,202
you ran one application
at a time.

559
00:33:42,282 --> 00:33:44,882
You did what you wanted, you
shut down that application,

560
00:33:44,962 --> 00:33:46,482
and then you ran something else.

561
00:33:46,562 --> 00:33:48,842
So you could only run
one program at a time.

562
00:33:48,922 --> 00:33:50,842
The idea of a multi-tasking
operating system

563
00:33:50,922 --> 00:33:55,122
is to allow several different processes
to run in parallel at the same time,

564
00:33:55,202 --> 00:33:58,362
and to share the CPU between
the different processes,

565
00:33:58,442 --> 00:34:00,202
and to do that fast enough

566
00:34:00,282 --> 00:34:02,322
that you don't notice that
it's switching between them.

567
00:34:02,402 --> 00:34:07,522
The 68000 chip only had a
few of the features needed

568
00:34:07,602 --> 00:34:10,042
to properly do what a full

569
00:34:10,122 --> 00:34:13,242
multi-tasking operating
system does nowadays.

570
00:34:13,322 --> 00:34:17,122
And so we were only thinking
of doing the best we could

571
00:34:17,202 --> 00:34:20,094
to let the software team take
it beyond what the basic,

572
00:34:20,119 --> 00:34:21,666
simple hardware could do.

573
00:34:21,722 --> 00:34:25,002
Yeah, multi-tasking was
more difficult to implement

574
00:34:25,082 --> 00:34:26,642
on a machine like the Amiga.

575
00:34:26,722 --> 00:34:29,762
That was the early days
of microprocessors.

576
00:34:29,842 --> 00:34:35,642
And they didn't have the concept of
protecting different process spaces.

577
00:34:35,722 --> 00:34:40,042
So it was easy for one process to overrun
the memory into another process.

578
00:34:40,442 --> 00:34:43,202
So, the design of the multi-tasking
had to be very careful

579
00:34:43,282 --> 00:34:46,442
to try to avoid those types
of situations from happening.

580
00:34:46,522 --> 00:34:50,162
Well, when I came into the project,
I started in August of '83,

581
00:34:50,242 --> 00:34:54,442
there was no hardware, there wasn't
even a board with a 68000 on it.

582
00:34:54,522 --> 00:34:58,243
There was just... We had an
Atari 800 that we could use

583
00:34:58,323 --> 00:35:00,083
and we had a SAGE computer...

584
00:35:00,163 --> 00:35:03,723
That was a fancy
multi-user computer,

585
00:35:03,803 --> 00:35:07,843
designed to handle up to
four users at the same time.

586
00:35:07,923 --> 00:35:11,123
And we had 10 users jammed
on that tiny little box,

587
00:35:11,203 --> 00:35:14,963
all hammering at that one CPU,
trying to get it to do our work.

588
00:35:15,283 --> 00:35:20,563
Right around October, I think,
we had our first 68000 prototype

589
00:35:20,643 --> 00:35:24,803
which was just a 68000 with some
RAM on it, and a serial port.

590
00:35:25,363 --> 00:35:29,883
There was no fancy hardware at that
time, but it did allow us to...

591
00:35:29,963 --> 00:35:34,403
It allowed Carl to bring up his
pre-emptive multi-tasking kernel.

592
00:35:34,483 --> 00:35:37,523
It allowed me to get
graphics basically running

593
00:35:37,603 --> 00:35:40,723
with a little emulator for
some of the graphics.

594
00:35:40,803 --> 00:35:45,483
The architecture of the system
let the different developers

595
00:35:45,563 --> 00:35:48,043
develop their components,
their libraries,

596
00:35:48,123 --> 00:35:49,763
independent of each other,

597
00:35:49,843 --> 00:35:52,923
and actually load them into
the system independently,

598
00:35:53,003 --> 00:35:55,683
and allow them to test
without having to coordinate

599
00:35:55,763 --> 00:35:57,923
in a real serious way
with everyone else.

600
00:35:58,003 --> 00:36:00,163
I don't believe we
got real hardware,

601
00:36:00,243 --> 00:36:03,083
where they were plugging the
wire-wrapped bread boards in,

602
00:36:03,163 --> 00:36:06,283
until basically about
a month before CES.

603
00:36:06,643 --> 00:36:10,603
We had one bread board to
represent the computer,

604
00:36:10,683 --> 00:36:15,563
the 68000, the memory, and
it had some connectors on it

605
00:36:15,643 --> 00:36:18,403
to represent the sockets where
the three custom chips would go.

606
00:36:18,643 --> 00:36:24,083
Three 40-pin sockets to plug the umbilical
cords that went from the chip stacks,

607
00:36:24,163 --> 00:36:30,803
which were between five and seven
sets of boards with high-speed CMOS

608
00:36:30,923 --> 00:36:34,163
that emulated the functions
of the hardware.

609
00:36:34,243 --> 00:36:37,643
And each one of those would plug
into a different 40-pin socket

610
00:36:37,723 --> 00:36:39,603
on what we called then the
Lorraine motherboard.

611
00:36:39,683 --> 00:36:43,123
But it was a very
primitive way to mimic

612
00:36:43,203 --> 00:36:45,963
something that's going to be
turned into an integrated circuit.

613
00:36:46,043 --> 00:36:50,843
But there was no prototyping technology
at that time to quickly make a chip.

614
00:36:50,923 --> 00:36:56,043
You had to do this preliminary step and
work out all the details and the bugs.

615
00:36:56,123 --> 00:36:59,443
Then I finally was able to like...
Well, let me pull the emulator out,

616
00:36:59,523 --> 00:37:03,003
and plug in writing these
registers to the hardware

617
00:37:03,123 --> 00:37:04,683
and see if anything happened.

618
00:37:04,763 --> 00:37:07,923
And after three weeks to four
weeks of concentrated work,

619
00:37:08,003 --> 00:37:12,643
in the last week before CES, we
basically moved into the office.

620
00:37:12,723 --> 00:37:17,843
So it was quite an amazing time period
when we're all pushing each other

621
00:37:17,923 --> 00:37:19,603
to try to get more stuff done,

622
00:37:19,683 --> 00:37:22,563
and trying to help each other
to get that stuff done.

623
00:37:26,403 --> 00:37:30,403
The build-up to the CES shows
was actually insanity.

624
00:37:31,243 --> 00:37:34,723
It was not a nice smooth, kind of,
"OK, we're going to go to CES."

625
00:37:34,803 --> 00:37:36,603
It was like, "Oh, my God!

626
00:37:36,683 --> 00:37:39,403
"We've got to make
this work for CES."

627
00:37:39,483 --> 00:37:42,323
As we came up to that CES show,

628
00:37:42,403 --> 00:37:46,363
I was already part of the
higher-level discussions

629
00:37:46,443 --> 00:37:48,163
that were taking place
in the company.

630
00:37:50,043 --> 00:37:51,883
And so, unfortunately for me,

631
00:37:51,963 --> 00:37:54,923
I knew a lot more than other
people in the company knew,

632
00:37:55,003 --> 00:37:58,643
and I had a clear sense of
just how bad things were,

633
00:37:58,723 --> 00:38:00,723
how close we were to
the edge, financially.

634
00:38:01,123 --> 00:38:02,643
We were out of money.

635
00:38:02,723 --> 00:38:04,563
And it was difficult
to find money.

636
00:38:04,803 --> 00:38:07,283
Jay mortgaged his house.

637
00:38:07,363 --> 00:38:10,603
Dave sold at least one car. He
had some fancy, expensive cars.

638
00:38:10,683 --> 00:38:15,803
So, I was very aware of the
emptiness of the wallet.

639
00:38:15,883 --> 00:38:18,283
The CES show was kind of
a make-or-break thing.

640
00:38:18,363 --> 00:38:20,763
If we didn't make it to CES,

641
00:38:21,363 --> 00:38:23,083
it was gonna hurt.

642
00:38:23,163 --> 00:38:24,643
We had to show something.

643
00:38:24,723 --> 00:38:27,803
We had to show something
to people to impress them,

644
00:38:27,883 --> 00:38:33,003
to either get additional funding, or to
figure out a way to sell the product.

645
00:38:33,083 --> 00:38:35,243
We knew things were bad,

646
00:38:35,523 --> 00:38:39,083
but it didn't matter.

647
00:38:39,683 --> 00:38:42,323
We were gonna do what we
were gonna do anyway.

648
00:38:42,403 --> 00:38:44,883
The machine was always breaking
down, there were always problems

649
00:38:44,963 --> 00:38:46,683
where something would go
out and all of a sudden

650
00:38:46,763 --> 00:38:48,603
the blitter would stop working,
and those types of things.

651
00:38:48,963 --> 00:38:51,243
So, it was difficult
because it was a very...

652
00:38:51,323 --> 00:38:54,203
These were these separate boards
that were very complicated,

653
00:38:54,283 --> 00:38:57,043
with lots of wires on them, lots
of things that could go wrong.

654
00:38:57,443 --> 00:39:02,363
The hardware guys are doing their best to
make sure this hardware stays working.

655
00:39:02,443 --> 00:39:04,483
Things would die,
wires would break.

656
00:39:04,883 --> 00:39:08,123
It was a giant set of wire-wrapped
boards, it was fragile.

657
00:39:08,203 --> 00:39:09,843
We were very nervous about it.

658
00:39:10,243 --> 00:39:14,443
And in addition, we were trying to add
new features up to the last minute

659
00:39:14,523 --> 00:39:18,523
to make the CES demos just
blow everyone's socks off,

660
00:39:18,603 --> 00:39:21,883
we used to say, and that was
kind of the terminology we used.

661
00:39:21,963 --> 00:39:23,523
We blew everyone's socks off.

662
00:39:23,603 --> 00:39:26,683
But how to do that always
was up to the last minute.

663
00:39:26,763 --> 00:39:29,963
So many of us ended
up staying nights,

664
00:39:30,043 --> 00:39:34,883
and working weekends to try to get as
much done as we could before the show.

665
00:39:35,403 --> 00:39:40,283
It was frightening.
It was exhilarating.

666
00:39:40,883 --> 00:39:44,724
And then, a software
guy comes in

667
00:39:44,804 --> 00:39:48,284
and wants me to make a major
change to the hardware,

668
00:39:48,364 --> 00:39:50,644
a few weeks before CES,

669
00:39:50,724 --> 00:39:53,244
to put in a feature
for the graphics.

670
00:39:53,324 --> 00:39:54,884
And I'm flabbergasted.

671
00:39:54,964 --> 00:39:57,964
It is just, "No way.
Are you kidding?

672
00:39:58,044 --> 00:39:59,907
"We're not gonna make
that kind of change.

673
00:39:59,932 --> 00:40:01,188
We can't take that risk.

674
00:40:01,244 --> 00:40:03,444
"This is the whole company.

675
00:40:03,524 --> 00:40:07,724
"We mess this up and we have no
hardware, we are in big trouble."

676
00:40:07,924 --> 00:40:10,284
The hardware feature that
he wanted was line draw.

677
00:40:10,364 --> 00:40:12,304
Other, more expensive graphics computers,

678
00:40:12,329 --> 00:40:14,268
already had kind of a hardware line draw,

679
00:40:14,324 --> 00:40:17,684
but this was the first
time that a blitter

680
00:40:17,764 --> 00:40:20,524
was basically perverted into
being able to draw lines.

681
00:40:20,804 --> 00:40:24,604
It was a great idea,
but there was no time.

682
00:40:24,684 --> 00:40:26,524
And there was no schedule.

683
00:40:26,604 --> 00:40:29,884
And I wasn't going to allow it.
No way, no how.

684
00:40:29,964 --> 00:40:32,364
Bob Pariseau, the guy
in charge of software,

685
00:40:32,444 --> 00:40:36,164
is trying to convince me to do
this, because it's very important.

686
00:40:36,244 --> 00:40:38,524
And I absolutely will not do it.

687
00:40:38,604 --> 00:40:43,364
He grabs my arm, and in a joking
way, starts twisting my arm.

688
00:40:43,444 --> 00:40:45,444
"I'm twisting your arm,
you're gonna do this."

689
00:40:45,964 --> 00:40:48,924
The dog, Mitchie, Jay's dog,

690
00:40:49,324 --> 00:40:52,244
leaps to my defence,
and I can't help it.

691
00:40:52,324 --> 00:40:54,524
The dog jumped to my defence.

692
00:40:54,604 --> 00:40:55,884
Of course I'll put it in.

693
00:40:56,364 --> 00:40:59,284
And we took the risk, and we
took apart the wire wraps,

694
00:40:59,364 --> 00:41:03,084
and we made the changes, and we
made it to CES with line draw,

695
00:41:03,564 --> 00:41:07,564
one of the most astonishing things
to see in a machine of that time.

696
00:41:07,644 --> 00:41:08,764
Thank you, dog.

697
00:41:08,844 --> 00:41:13,484
When it was finally time to pack up the
office and take everything to the show,

698
00:41:13,564 --> 00:41:17,204
some of us were still working on
our code, and they had to, like,

699
00:41:17,284 --> 00:41:20,604
you know, have our computers plugged
into extension cords so we could

700
00:41:20,684 --> 00:41:23,644
walk out to the parking lot with
the computer and keep working

701
00:41:23,724 --> 00:41:26,524
right until they had to unplug
it and put it in the van.

702
00:41:26,604 --> 00:41:28,484
Because it was like that.

703
00:41:28,564 --> 00:41:30,444
The changes were happening
all the way up to

704
00:41:30,924 --> 00:41:34,884
when those boards were being taken and
put into aeroplane seats on aeroplanes

705
00:41:34,964 --> 00:41:36,444
and flown down to Las Vegas.

706
00:41:36,524 --> 00:41:40,044
It was chaos. There was nothing
smooth about that whole process.

707
00:41:48,604 --> 00:41:52,764
Everyone's hopes and
dreams were pinned to

708
00:41:52,844 --> 00:41:56,604
that moment when the
CES show opened,

709
00:41:57,484 --> 00:42:00,244
and the first people would
start to see our baby,

710
00:42:00,324 --> 00:42:02,204
and what kind of
response would it get.

711
00:42:02,284 --> 00:42:05,964
They had a booth there, all this Amiga
stuff that had been done before,

712
00:42:06,044 --> 00:42:09,444
like the Amiga joysticks, the Power
Sticks, some of the Amiga games

713
00:42:09,524 --> 00:42:13,924
that were actually designed to establish
the company as a real company.

714
00:42:14,004 --> 00:42:17,724
When the people finally got
a chance to see our baby,

715
00:42:17,804 --> 00:42:20,124
the response was overwhelming.

716
00:42:20,204 --> 00:42:22,244
It was astonishing.

717
00:42:22,324 --> 00:42:24,604
Every party that came in there,

718
00:42:24,684 --> 00:42:28,404
every major corporation that got
a chance to see the device,

719
00:42:28,484 --> 00:42:33,124
they were astonished at the magnificence
of the thing they had just seen.

720
00:42:33,204 --> 00:42:37,244
That was the great endorsement
that we were on the right track.

721
00:42:37,324 --> 00:42:39,684
We were knocking people's
socks off with this thing.

722
00:42:39,964 --> 00:42:46,084
And that night, then, the Amiga
executives said to the rest of staff

723
00:42:46,164 --> 00:42:47,844
they were so pleased
with everything.

724
00:42:47,924 --> 00:42:51,324
They took us out to dinner. We
had this awesome Italian dinner.

725
00:42:51,404 --> 00:42:52,684
Drank a lot of Chianti.

726
00:42:53,404 --> 00:42:56,804
And all through the meal, Dale and
RJ are over here at the side,

727
00:42:56,884 --> 00:42:59,844
and they're conversing between
themselves, and they're laughing,

728
00:42:59,924 --> 00:43:02,804
and they're having the
best possible time.

729
00:43:02,884 --> 00:43:05,924
And so we get done and he's saying,
"OK, we're gonna take the van,

730
00:43:06,004 --> 00:43:07,524
"and we're gonna go
back over to the show."

731
00:43:07,604 --> 00:43:09,044
And I said, "You're not
gonna be able to get in."

732
00:43:09,124 --> 00:43:10,924
I said, "They lock that
place up tight as a drum."

733
00:43:11,004 --> 00:43:12,364
They said, "Don't worry."

734
00:43:12,724 --> 00:43:16,604
Dale and I and that one
six-pack of warm beer.

735
00:43:18,084 --> 00:43:20,004
We went back to the trade show,

736
00:43:20,084 --> 00:43:22,804
and worked until we passed out.

737
00:43:23,124 --> 00:43:26,884
Because the demo
already existed,

738
00:43:26,964 --> 00:43:28,324
we made it better.

739
00:43:28,404 --> 00:43:33,524
The demo started as a yellow
and blue spinning ball

740
00:43:33,604 --> 00:43:38,004
that Sam Dicker wrote, that filled
the screen, and it was a great demo,

741
00:43:38,084 --> 00:43:41,964
and that was one of the canned demos
that we had for the show at CES.

742
00:43:42,044 --> 00:43:46,204
Prior to that, I had started working
on a modification of that demo,

743
00:43:46,284 --> 00:43:50,404
which was to basically shrink
it down to a small ball,

744
00:43:50,484 --> 00:43:51,644
which I called a Quickie.

745
00:43:51,724 --> 00:43:55,084
Using a play field, I could
make it bounce up and down.

746
00:43:55,164 --> 00:43:59,324
Having a background in physics,
I knew the simple algorithms

747
00:43:59,404 --> 00:44:02,084
to make something look like
it's bouncing up and down.

748
00:44:02,164 --> 00:44:06,724
And also knowing exactly how the play
field worked with a colour palette,

749
00:44:06,804 --> 00:44:11,084
I knew that I could put a trick in there
to make it look like there was a shadow,

750
00:44:11,164 --> 00:44:13,924
and that the ball would
actually cast a shadow.

751
00:44:14,484 --> 00:44:17,164
So I programmed that in there,

752
00:44:19,044 --> 00:44:22,684
and it was just a basic,
simple bouncing ball

753
00:44:22,764 --> 00:44:26,604
casting a shadow on a
simple grid in the back.

754
00:44:27,284 --> 00:44:31,564
What happened was that we
managed to fall asleep.

755
00:44:31,644 --> 00:44:34,325
I think I fell asleep first
and Dale went second.

756
00:44:34,405 --> 00:44:39,045
But the last thing that he did
was he had created a build,

757
00:44:39,125 --> 00:44:41,005
run it on the hardware,

758
00:44:41,085 --> 00:44:45,925
and then worked on the software a little
bit more to make one more change,

759
00:44:46,005 --> 00:44:49,845
and then while he was waiting for
that one more change to compile,

760
00:44:49,925 --> 00:44:51,525
he fell asleep.

761
00:44:51,605 --> 00:44:55,645
But what happened was then that the
two of us were in that room sleeping

762
00:44:55,725 --> 00:44:58,045
when our co-workers showed
up the next morning

763
00:44:58,125 --> 00:45:01,685
to clean up the booth and get ready
for the next day of the show.

764
00:45:01,765 --> 00:45:06,285
Both RJ and I are sleeping on the floor
cos we were there all night long,

765
00:45:07,325 --> 00:45:12,805
and I had left the bouncing ball that
we had just created that last night

766
00:45:12,885 --> 00:45:14,525
bouncing on the screen.

767
00:45:14,605 --> 00:45:17,965
The next morning we came in, and we
all looked at each other and said,

768
00:45:18,045 --> 00:45:20,205
"What the hell did those
two guys do last night?"

769
00:45:20,285 --> 00:45:24,365
When they came in, they clearly
recognised what was different,

770
00:45:24,445 --> 00:45:26,605
but no one knew that we were
in the next room sleeping,

771
00:45:26,685 --> 00:45:30,525
because we were in a room separate
from the main computer hardware room.

772
00:45:30,605 --> 00:45:34,725
We had to be in this little side
room where we had passed out.

773
00:45:34,805 --> 00:45:37,085
And so they didn't even know we were
in there for about half an hour,

774
00:45:37,165 --> 00:45:38,325
until someone stumbled upon us

775
00:45:38,350 --> 00:45:40,629
cos they were looking for a
place to put their coats.

776
00:45:40,685 --> 00:45:44,685
And they find the two
of us asleep in there.

777
00:45:46,325 --> 00:45:49,325
The show was only gonna
go on for one more day.

778
00:45:49,405 --> 00:45:53,765
Gary McCoy and Don Reisinger, they'd
already brought a lot of people by

779
00:45:53,845 --> 00:45:57,125
to show off the capabilities
of the Amiga computer.

780
00:45:57,205 --> 00:46:01,125
This was all behind curtains. It wasn't
open to anybody to just walk in.

781
00:46:01,205 --> 00:46:02,445
You had to be invited in.

782
00:46:02,525 --> 00:46:06,645
So it was like Sears and all these
other companies that were invited in.

783
00:46:06,725 --> 00:46:11,045
They had already seen this stuff, and
they all immediately went out and got,

784
00:46:11,125 --> 00:46:13,805
I think, just about every person
that they had already brought in,

785
00:46:13,885 --> 00:46:16,645
they brought them back
to see that demo.

786
00:46:22,445 --> 00:46:27,005
You could not believe the number of
people that wanted to get in to see

787
00:46:27,085 --> 00:46:29,725
what the hell was going
on inside that compound.

788
00:46:30,125 --> 00:46:31,605
I thought it was incredible.

789
00:46:32,405 --> 00:46:35,125
That was the most amazing thing.

790
00:46:35,405 --> 00:46:40,365
Yeah, real-time graphics was
amazing to do in those days.

791
00:46:41,045 --> 00:46:45,005
Now, of course, it's very commonplace,
but that was something special.

792
00:46:45,125 --> 00:46:47,965
It reminded me of the statement
from Samuel F.B. Morse,

793
00:46:48,045 --> 00:46:49,965
when he did the first telegraph.

794
00:46:50,045 --> 00:46:51,565
"What hath God wrought?"

795
00:46:51,645 --> 00:46:53,245
That's the first thing
that came to mind, is,

796
00:46:53,325 --> 00:46:55,485
"What in the hell have we
done here to this industry?"

797
00:47:04,365 --> 00:47:07,085
There was a lot of buzz
in the marketplace,

798
00:47:07,165 --> 00:47:09,469
and even Steve Jobs had heard the buzz

799
00:47:09,494 --> 00:47:12,269
and came over a couple of different times.

800
00:47:12,525 --> 00:47:18,165
After he visited, we were convinced
it was strictly a fishing expedition,

801
00:47:18,245 --> 00:47:21,165
to see what it was he
might be up against.

802
00:47:21,245 --> 00:47:25,165
We were constantly giving demos to
potential investors, or partners,

803
00:47:25,245 --> 00:47:27,565
or someone that could
bring in some cash.

804
00:47:27,645 --> 00:47:31,245
We had a number of the most
prominent venture capital people

805
00:47:31,325 --> 00:47:33,685
in the tech business
come and visit.

806
00:47:33,765 --> 00:47:36,205
They loved what we had,

807
00:47:36,285 --> 00:47:38,885
but in the final analysis,

808
00:47:38,965 --> 00:47:43,205
they figured it was gonna take a whole lot
of money to get this thing to the market,

809
00:47:43,285 --> 00:47:46,525
and they weren't willing to
go up against IBM and Apple.

810
00:47:46,965 --> 00:47:50,925
We were pretty nervous that if we
didn't get an influx of cash soon,

811
00:47:51,005 --> 00:47:54,685
or if the company
wasn't purchased soon,

812
00:47:54,765 --> 00:47:58,205
that we'd all be out of a job and that
dream would have just fallen apart.

813
00:47:58,285 --> 00:48:00,518
When Amiga started running out of money,

814
00:48:00,543 --> 00:48:02,829
Dave Morse had to start looking for some.

815
00:48:03,445 --> 00:48:05,587
And he ended up going back to Atari,

816
00:48:05,612 --> 00:48:08,389
where Jay Miner actually had some contacts.

817
00:48:08,885 --> 00:48:14,245
So, they made a deal that Atari would
lend them $500,000 to keep going.

818
00:48:14,325 --> 00:48:17,365
They would use that money
to actually make chips

819
00:48:17,445 --> 00:48:20,125
of the prototype chips that
they had previously made.

820
00:48:20,205 --> 00:48:25,045
If they didn't pay back that
loan by June 30th, 1984,

821
00:48:25,125 --> 00:48:28,045
it meant that Atari would get
that technology for nothing.

822
00:48:28,365 --> 00:48:32,005
The deal was made, and it was a
bit of a deal with the devil.

823
00:48:32,085 --> 00:48:36,445
There was that point in time when we
were going to have to produce or,

824
00:48:36,565 --> 00:48:40,485
you know, we were gonna end up being
part of Atari one way or the other.

825
00:48:40,605 --> 00:48:44,765
They didn't think it was a smart deal.
Jay Miner knew it wasn't a smart deal.

826
00:48:44,845 --> 00:48:46,478
But they really had no
options at that time,

827
00:48:46,503 --> 00:48:47,989
cos they were just
running out of money.

828
00:48:48,205 --> 00:48:49,485
But that deal was made
with Warner Brothers,

829
00:48:52,045 --> 00:48:55,845
and between that time and the time
that Commodore came into the picture,

830
00:48:55,925 --> 00:48:58,605
Warner Brothers sold the
whole thing to the Tramiels.

831
00:48:59,125 --> 00:49:01,725
Warner Communications' sale
of its Atari home computers

832
00:49:01,805 --> 00:49:04,605
may eliminate a big financial
headache for that company,

833
00:49:04,685 --> 00:49:08,325
but the sale, for $240 million
in notes to Jack Tramiel,

834
00:49:08,405 --> 00:49:10,125
who once headed
Commodore computers,

835
00:49:10,205 --> 00:49:12,325
could cause headaches for
a lot of other companies.

836
00:49:12,405 --> 00:49:15,645
Here's our clear-headed business
reporter, Barron's Editor Alan Abelson.

837
00:49:15,725 --> 00:49:16,965
- Good morning, Alan.
- Good morning.

838
00:49:17,045 --> 00:49:20,046
Well, you know, that kind of deal,
Bob, was a Henny Youngman deal.

839
00:49:20,126 --> 00:49:21,166
What does that mean?

840
00:49:21,246 --> 00:49:24,486
Well, that means that Warner said to
them, "Here, take my company, please."

841
00:49:24,566 --> 00:49:27,086
The fact is that Tramiel
almost got it for nothing.

842
00:49:27,206 --> 00:49:29,966
The terms were
extraordinarily easy.

843
00:49:30,046 --> 00:49:32,726
And, you know, Tramiel's a
guy who takes no prisoners.

844
00:49:32,806 --> 00:49:34,646
So this ought to
be quite a fight.

845
00:49:34,726 --> 00:49:37,646
A real grudge battle between
Commodore and Atari.

846
00:49:37,726 --> 00:49:41,406
So Jack Tramiel, when I knew him,
he was president of Commodore.

847
00:49:41,486 --> 00:49:45,086
He had a reputation.
His history was that

848
00:49:45,166 --> 00:49:49,366
he was in a concentration camp
in Germany in World War II.

849
00:49:49,446 --> 00:49:52,726
And he came out of that with
kind of a certain attitude.

850
00:49:52,806 --> 00:49:55,766
His attitude is
"business is hell."

851
00:49:55,846 --> 00:49:59,006
And if you get in his way,
he will send you there.

852
00:49:59,086 --> 00:50:02,366
You don't want to be in a
negotiation with a man

853
00:50:02,446 --> 00:50:05,886
who firmly believes
that business is war,

854
00:50:05,966 --> 00:50:08,526
and all he has to do is figure
out how to bring you down.

855
00:50:08,606 --> 00:50:10,726
He would be the guy you
want on your side.

856
00:50:11,606 --> 00:50:14,046
But you still wouldn't
necessarily trust him.

857
00:50:14,566 --> 00:50:17,886
Sometimes in a really intense meeting if
he wanted to show you how fierce he was

858
00:50:17,966 --> 00:50:21,286
and how strong he was, and how
much of a survivor he was,

859
00:50:21,366 --> 00:50:23,406
he would pull up his
shirt and show you

860
00:50:23,486 --> 00:50:27,046
the serial number that
had been tattooed on him

861
00:50:27,286 --> 00:50:29,446
when he was in a
concentration camp.

862
00:50:29,566 --> 00:50:31,648
The man was an extremely intense man

863
00:50:31,673 --> 00:50:34,430
and his family picked
up on that whole vibe.

864
00:50:34,486 --> 00:50:37,166
Are you prepared to tell
us why you left Commodore?

865
00:50:37,246 --> 00:50:39,206
The chairman of the
company, and myself,

866
00:50:39,286 --> 00:50:42,526
have disagreed on the
basic principles

867
00:50:42,606 --> 00:50:44,606
of how to run the company.

868
00:50:45,686 --> 00:50:49,526
And I felt if I cannot go
into my office smiling

869
00:50:50,206 --> 00:50:51,886
and being happy, I better quit.

870
00:50:51,966 --> 00:50:54,006
Commodore was a huge
business at the time.

871
00:50:54,486 --> 00:50:57,246
Irving Gould and Jack
Tramiel built that company

872
00:50:57,326 --> 00:51:00,406
to being a powerhouse in
home personal computing.

873
00:51:01,326 --> 00:51:04,046
When Jack went to Atari, it
was a good move for him.

874
00:51:04,126 --> 00:51:07,646
He was going to try to duplicate
the Commodore business model.

875
00:51:07,726 --> 00:51:10,006
He was going to try to
turn everything around.

876
00:51:10,086 --> 00:51:11,806
He knew what he had to do.

877
00:51:11,886 --> 00:51:15,766
And Irving Gould, who was
chairman of Commodore,

878
00:51:15,846 --> 00:51:19,606
was uncertain as to how powerful
and how successful Jack could be.

879
00:51:19,846 --> 00:51:22,646
As they started to approach
the June 30th deadline,

880
00:51:22,726 --> 00:51:26,326
they didn't want to just give
up that technology to Atari

881
00:51:26,406 --> 00:51:29,926
and they needed to be able
to pay back that loan

882
00:51:30,006 --> 00:51:31,566
in order to get that
off their back.

883
00:51:31,886 --> 00:51:34,046
That half-million dollars
that came in from Atari

884
00:51:34,126 --> 00:51:38,766
really did kind of get us a breath
of air for a short period of time.

885
00:51:38,846 --> 00:51:42,966
But Jack Tramiel from
Commodore had moved to Atari

886
00:51:43,046 --> 00:51:47,206
and then this was the idea of
going to work for Jack Tramiel,

887
00:51:47,286 --> 00:51:51,526
which all of us were quite nervous
about and didn't like that idea.

888
00:51:51,766 --> 00:51:55,606
It felt to us that as the
negotiations were progressing,

889
00:51:55,686 --> 00:51:58,206
they wanted more and more.

890
00:51:58,286 --> 00:51:59,661
And if it got to the point

891
00:51:59,686 --> 00:52:03,070
where we were putting them in
business to compete with us,

892
00:52:03,126 --> 00:52:05,406
that wouldn't have
made any sense to us.

893
00:52:05,486 --> 00:52:09,126
And we kept telling them that,
but we couldn't budge them.

894
00:52:09,206 --> 00:52:11,966
The Atari guys knew that we were
getting more and more desperate,

895
00:52:12,046 --> 00:52:14,846
that we're almost out of money,
that time was almost up,

896
00:52:14,926 --> 00:52:17,846
and they knew they
had us over a barrel

897
00:52:17,926 --> 00:52:19,686
and they believed
that it was too late,

898
00:52:19,766 --> 00:52:23,606
that we couldn't find
another partner to go with

899
00:52:23,686 --> 00:52:26,806
and that Atari acquisition
was the only hope for Amiga.

900
00:52:27,406 --> 00:52:29,246
Part of the deal that
we made with Atari

901
00:52:29,326 --> 00:52:32,606
was they would get the
detailed silicon drawings

902
00:52:32,686 --> 00:52:35,046
of how to make the
three custom chips.

903
00:52:35,126 --> 00:52:39,126
There was some things that we did
to protect ourselves against Atari.

904
00:52:39,606 --> 00:52:42,926
The set of drawings we
gave them were modified.

905
00:52:43,006 --> 00:52:44,486
They wouldn't work.

906
00:52:44,886 --> 00:52:49,446
There was only one set
of correct drawings,

907
00:52:49,526 --> 00:52:53,726
and they were saved in a dusty old
attaché case here in this house.

908
00:52:53,806 --> 00:52:57,086
They only wanted the hardware, and
they weren't interested in the people.

909
00:52:57,166 --> 00:53:01,166
The just wanted the tool as a
weapon to point at Commodore

910
00:53:01,246 --> 00:53:03,526
and try to sink the
ship of Commodore.

911
00:53:08,966 --> 00:53:11,846
Somehow Dave got in
contact with Commodore.

912
00:53:11,926 --> 00:53:15,926
Dave and I had agreed to some
parameters of what was acceptable

913
00:53:16,006 --> 00:53:21,686
in terms of a price for the company,
and Dave went ahead and did a deal.

914
00:53:21,766 --> 00:53:24,366
Dave was very, very
pragmatic about this.

915
00:53:24,606 --> 00:53:26,686
And I think for him
the thing was,

916
00:53:27,046 --> 00:53:29,486
even though we can finish this,

917
00:53:29,726 --> 00:53:33,766
we don't know if we're going to have
the marketing horsepower to market it

918
00:53:33,926 --> 00:53:37,006
and that Commodore is
a better bet for that

919
00:53:37,086 --> 00:53:39,366
because they do have the
marketing horsepower.

920
00:53:39,446 --> 00:53:42,286
They've got the distribution system,
they've got the manufacturing.

921
00:53:42,366 --> 00:53:46,366
There was a lot of animosity between
Jack Tramiel and Irving Gould.

922
00:53:46,446 --> 00:53:51,286
And Irving Gould knew that if they
bought that technology outright,

923
00:53:51,366 --> 00:53:53,606
Jack Tramiel would not be
able to use that at Atari.

924
00:53:53,806 --> 00:53:57,166
So, what he ended up doing,
instead of just buying the chips

925
00:53:57,246 --> 00:54:00,646
was he bought the whole Amiga company
for about $30 million dollars.

926
00:54:00,726 --> 00:54:05,486
And I was with Dave the day
we drove over to Atari

927
00:54:05,566 --> 00:54:10,287
and presented the guy with
a cheque for $500,000,

928
00:54:10,367 --> 00:54:13,007
which he was not
at all expecting.

929
00:54:13,087 --> 00:54:14,847
And he almost fell
off his chair.

930
00:54:14,927 --> 00:54:19,167
He had to excuse himself from the
meeting to call Jack Tramiel,

931
00:54:19,247 --> 00:54:23,247
who was in the process
of buying Atari.

932
00:54:23,327 --> 00:54:27,527
And apparently, Tramiel, not
knowing anything about this deal,

933
00:54:27,607 --> 00:54:32,607
said "When somebody gives
you a cheque for $500,000,

934
00:54:32,687 --> 00:54:33,927
"you take it."

935
00:54:34,327 --> 00:54:37,807
And so we left. He took
the cheque and we left.

936
00:54:37,887 --> 00:54:42,087
Months later, Leonard Tramiel was
looking through some documents

937
00:54:42,167 --> 00:54:45,567
and he happened to see that
there was this deal with Amiga

938
00:54:45,647 --> 00:54:47,807
that perhaps wasn't
fully honoured.

939
00:54:47,887 --> 00:54:49,207
And that's when
the lawsuit came.

940
00:54:49,567 --> 00:54:52,967
Tramiel being Tramiel sued
Commodore and sued all of us.

941
00:55:02,447 --> 00:55:05,847
The computer business is not
dead, it's alive and kicking.

942
00:55:12,927 --> 00:55:15,727
When the lawsuit from
Jack Tramiel came along

943
00:55:15,807 --> 00:55:19,407
and Atari started suing Amiga,
and Jay Miner personally,

944
00:55:19,487 --> 00:55:23,287
the judge ordered that they had to stop
work on it until things were sorted out.

945
00:55:23,367 --> 00:55:26,567
The basis of the lawsuit
seems to be that

946
00:55:26,647 --> 00:55:30,327
the only way Atari was not
to get the chip technology

947
00:55:30,407 --> 00:55:33,407
was if the chips weren't
in a working state.

948
00:55:33,487 --> 00:55:38,607
When Dave Morse came over to Atari and
paid back the $500,000 on June 30th,

949
00:55:38,967 --> 00:55:41,967
he told them that the chips
weren't working yet.

950
00:55:42,047 --> 00:55:46,687
That got Amiga off the hook about
having to deliver the chips to Atari.

951
00:55:47,047 --> 00:55:49,727
However, when Leonard
Tramiel looked at it,

952
00:55:49,807 --> 00:55:51,647
he thought it was really
suspicious because

953
00:55:51,727 --> 00:55:54,487
they actually did have the
working prototypes of the chips.

954
00:55:54,567 --> 00:55:56,647
They were demo-ing the computer

955
00:55:56,727 --> 00:55:58,610
and they subsequently
successfully

956
00:55:58,635 --> 00:56:01,271
made the chips in silicon
that were working.

957
00:56:01,327 --> 00:56:03,367
So, he thought there was
something fishy about that.

958
00:56:06,287 --> 00:56:07,687
Yes, I am very happy.

959
00:56:09,687 --> 00:56:11,567
When Jack Tramiel bought Atari,

960
00:56:12,327 --> 00:56:15,967
he started pulling in all kinds
of engineers from Commodore.

961
00:56:16,087 --> 00:56:17,716
And a lot of those engineers

962
00:56:17,741 --> 00:56:21,231
were taking Commodore
intellectual property with them.

963
00:56:21,287 --> 00:56:25,327
Irving Gould really just wanted to
slow down Jack as much as he could,

964
00:56:25,407 --> 00:56:27,927
so he did a lawsuit
against Atari first.

965
00:56:28,607 --> 00:56:33,487
Jack attacking Commodore back
is probably somewhat warranted

966
00:56:33,567 --> 00:56:35,047
the way things were going.

967
00:56:35,127 --> 00:56:37,847
So, there was a lot of
animosity between those two

968
00:56:37,927 --> 00:56:39,247
and it really showed up.

969
00:56:40,207 --> 00:56:42,687
Oh, God. There is more to
this story but, I mean,

970
00:56:42,767 --> 00:56:46,527
we spent hours
with our attorneys

971
00:56:47,047 --> 00:56:50,127
preparing for a trial.

972
00:56:50,927 --> 00:56:54,807
And I was dressed and ready
to go down to testify,

973
00:56:55,647 --> 00:56:58,767
when we were told that
Commodore had settled.

974
00:57:08,287 --> 00:57:10,847
We had been watching
Atari, and of course

975
00:57:10,927 --> 00:57:13,927
Atari had thought that they
were going to get the Amiga.

976
00:57:14,047 --> 00:57:17,567
And when they didn't get the Amiga,
it was time to find a substitute

977
00:57:17,647 --> 00:57:19,087
that could compete
with the Amiga.

978
00:57:19,167 --> 00:57:20,767
They wanted to drive the Amiga

979
00:57:20,847 --> 00:57:23,207
and drive Commodore out of business
with what they were doing.

980
00:57:23,447 --> 00:57:25,847
The Tramiel family was
nothing if not resourceful.

981
00:57:26,287 --> 00:57:29,527
So once they took over Atari and
they were trying to revive it,

982
00:57:29,607 --> 00:57:34,047
they needed a new product and it was
time to move into 16-bit technology.

983
00:57:34,127 --> 00:57:38,167
Shiraz Shivji was the
designer of the Atari STE.

984
00:57:38,247 --> 00:57:39,527
He came right from Commodore.

985
00:57:39,607 --> 00:57:41,367
They knew of our
specs pretty well,

986
00:57:41,447 --> 00:57:44,007
and so they tried to copy
that as much as they could,

987
00:57:44,087 --> 00:57:49,047
and throw together a machine
that would look as good on paper

988
00:57:49,127 --> 00:57:50,487
and try to compete with us.

989
00:57:51,367 --> 00:57:54,007
And what's the quickest thing
they could put together?

990
00:57:54,087 --> 00:57:56,527
The 68000, a lot of RAM,

991
00:57:57,327 --> 00:57:58,407
and a MIDI port.

992
00:58:01,407 --> 00:58:05,767
The Atari 520 STE has twice the
power of many business models.

993
00:58:07,327 --> 00:58:09,367
I didn't dislike the STE at all.

994
00:58:09,447 --> 00:58:10,927
I thought it was OK.

995
00:58:11,007 --> 00:58:15,527
It just didn't have anything inside
it that was exciting, really.

996
00:58:15,887 --> 00:58:20,007
Atari ST was a little bit
more purist, I suppose.

997
00:58:21,287 --> 00:58:23,407
By "purist" you can read "shit."

998
00:58:23,687 --> 00:58:29,687
The Atari ST hardware and software-wise,
was far more evolutionary.

999
00:58:30,967 --> 00:58:33,127
Kind of what you would expect
somebody to have done.

1000
00:58:33,207 --> 00:58:37,167
The ST had the same processor,
but it was slightly faster.

1001
00:58:37,647 --> 00:58:41,007
It was 8 megahertz, instead
of just over 7 megahertz.

1002
00:58:41,087 --> 00:58:45,887
The ST didn't have a blitter, so it
wasn't able to shift as many pixels.

1003
00:58:46,687 --> 00:58:51,327
The ST didn't have a Copper, but you
could kind of fake display lists,

1004
00:58:52,047 --> 00:58:54,207
of a sort. Not really.

1005
00:58:54,407 --> 00:58:55,888
It didn't have sprite hardware.

1006
00:59:00,008 --> 00:59:01,448
It can paint pictures.

1007
00:59:02,048 --> 00:59:03,368
And make them move.

1008
00:59:04,328 --> 00:59:07,768
The ST palette was rubbish.
I think it had 512 colours,

1009
00:59:08,248 --> 00:59:13,168
and they weren't
even nice colours.

1010
00:59:14,728 --> 00:59:16,048
It didn't have sprite hardware.

1011
00:59:16,728 --> 00:59:18,288
The audio hardware was rubbish.

1012
00:59:18,368 --> 00:59:20,008
Scroll and the
music will scroll.

1013
00:59:24,488 --> 00:59:26,888
OK, we're just using the Atari
right now, nothing else?

1014
00:59:26,968 --> 00:59:29,168
That's correct. The sound chip in
the Atari is playing all the music.

1015
00:59:29,248 --> 00:59:30,528
OK, we can stop
that for a second.

1016
00:59:30,608 --> 00:59:33,888
The ST didn't have the
capabilities of the Amiga,

1017
00:59:33,968 --> 00:59:36,288
and the operating system

1018
00:59:36,448 --> 00:59:39,688
because they were under
such time constraints,

1019
00:59:39,768 --> 00:59:42,848
wasn't as mature as the operating
system and the user interface

1020
00:59:42,928 --> 00:59:44,328
that the Amiga had
when it was launched.

1021
00:59:44,528 --> 00:59:46,848
Its operating system was TOS.

1022
00:59:47,728 --> 00:59:49,688
Well, that said it all to me.

1023
00:59:50,608 --> 00:59:52,688
That it was the Tramiel
Operating System.

1024
00:59:52,768 --> 00:59:55,568
When it first came out everyone
called it the "Jackintosh"

1025
00:59:55,648 --> 00:59:57,962
because it had a nice black and white mode

1026
00:59:57,987 --> 01:00:00,032
so it could do what the Macintosh did

1027
01:00:00,088 --> 01:00:01,608
plus a little bit of colour.

1028
01:00:01,688 --> 01:00:04,128
And it did it OK.

1029
01:00:04,208 --> 01:00:07,728
You know, it didn't multi-task,
it ran GEM-DOS or TOS,

1030
01:00:07,808 --> 01:00:10,168
which was really just
repackaged GEM-DOS

1031
01:00:10,248 --> 01:00:12,448
that made it a little
more MS-DOS-like

1032
01:00:12,528 --> 01:00:15,568
so it was easy for people to write
programs for it if they knew MS-DOS.

1033
01:00:15,648 --> 01:00:19,008
But MS-DOS was the past.

1034
01:00:19,088 --> 01:00:20,248
It wasn't moving forward.

1035
01:00:20,568 --> 01:00:22,648
The ST had two things over
the Amiga, in my opinion.

1036
01:00:22,728 --> 01:00:25,438
The first was that beautiful
little monochrome display

1037
01:00:25,463 --> 01:00:26,792
that made it look like

1038
01:00:26,848 --> 01:00:29,848
the 'Jackintosh' that it is
referred to as affectionately.

1039
01:00:30,528 --> 01:00:32,208
And the other thing that
it had over the Amiga,

1040
01:00:32,288 --> 01:00:33,808
which for me was a
stroke of genius,

1041
01:00:33,888 --> 01:00:37,728
which is what defined the ST,
were a pair of MIDI ports.

1042
01:00:37,808 --> 01:00:39,808
And as a musician
myself at the time,

1043
01:00:39,888 --> 01:00:42,488
I had an ST because
it ran Creator,

1044
01:00:43,168 --> 01:00:46,088
which of course, now is
Logic Pro on the Mac.

1045
01:00:46,368 --> 01:00:49,808
They also had a buffered MIDI port, which
is what you really needed in those days

1046
01:00:50,288 --> 01:00:53,528
and unfortunately the Amiga didn't
really have a buffered serial port so

1047
01:00:53,608 --> 01:00:56,448
our MIDI could conceivably
break down faster.

1048
01:00:56,528 --> 01:01:01,208
On the other hand, once people got
better at writing multitasking code

1049
01:01:01,288 --> 01:01:03,042
music software worked
a whole lot better

1050
01:01:03,067 --> 01:01:04,992
than it ever did when
it was single tasking.

1051
01:01:05,088 --> 01:01:09,688
The Tramiels were good at
pushing less expensive hardware

1052
01:01:09,768 --> 01:01:12,008
and the ST kind of wormed
its way into the picture.

1053
01:01:12,608 --> 01:01:15,848
My idea is always to try to
bring the best technology

1054
01:01:15,928 --> 01:01:19,048
at the lowest price
to the masses.

1055
01:01:19,128 --> 01:01:22,528
We are a company which we like to sell
to the masses, not to the classes.

1056
01:01:22,608 --> 01:01:27,768
I think the ST was a
really good example

1057
01:01:27,848 --> 01:01:30,048
of what a Commodore-like
product was.

1058
01:01:30,128 --> 01:01:34,568
It was very simple mechanically. There
was a lot of integration everywhere.

1059
01:01:34,648 --> 01:01:38,008
You can put a chip to reduce
the number of parts on it.

1060
01:01:38,088 --> 01:01:40,328
They had done a very
good job at that.

1061
01:01:40,408 --> 01:01:42,328
And it was simple
to manufacture.

1062
01:01:42,408 --> 01:01:45,568
I have to give them credit because
for the amount of time they had,

1063
01:01:45,648 --> 01:01:48,168
the few months they had to
pull the Atari ST together,

1064
01:01:48,248 --> 01:01:49,688
it actually worked pretty well.

1065
01:01:49,768 --> 01:01:52,168
It wasn't an Amiga in terms of the
total capability of the system

1066
01:01:52,248 --> 01:01:53,568
and what it was capable of,

1067
01:01:53,648 --> 01:01:56,048
but it was something that
could definitely sell

1068
01:01:56,128 --> 01:01:59,888
as an increment above the Apple
II, or above the Commodore 64.

1069
01:01:59,968 --> 01:02:02,307
We were concerned that the
Atari would take away

1070
01:02:02,332 --> 01:02:04,432
a lot of the thunder
that the Amiga had

1071
01:02:04,488 --> 01:02:07,528
and in fact, it did, because
they did beat us to market

1072
01:02:07,608 --> 01:02:09,648
and it did have a lot
of good capabilities.

1073
01:02:09,728 --> 01:02:12,208
Certainly when the
Atari hit the ground

1074
01:02:12,288 --> 01:02:16,288
it did better at some things in the
first year or two than the Amiga did

1075
01:02:16,368 --> 01:02:18,008
because of all the
stuff that was there.

1076
01:02:18,088 --> 01:02:19,648
The Amiga had a steeper
learning curve.

1077
01:02:19,728 --> 01:02:24,128
We have introduced the ST in
the United States on July 8th.

1078
01:02:24,488 --> 01:02:26,688
We are selling
everything we make.

1079
01:02:26,768 --> 01:02:29,928
It was the best launch I had in the
history of the computer business.

1080
01:02:30,008 --> 01:02:33,008
Jack Tramiel, of course, was the
boss of Commodore Computers.

1081
01:02:33,088 --> 01:02:35,248
Since his sudden and rather
startling departure,

1082
01:02:35,328 --> 01:02:37,247
Commodore, like many another big name,

1083
01:02:37,272 --> 01:02:39,632
has been beset by major
financial problems.

1084
01:02:39,688 --> 01:02:40,768
But now they are fighting back.

1085
01:02:40,848 --> 01:02:44,728
And Frank Leonardi is Vice-President
of Marketing Business Systems,

1086
01:02:44,808 --> 01:02:47,168
Commodore Business
Machines, Incorporated.

1087
01:02:47,248 --> 01:02:48,968
I was hired by Commodore

1088
01:02:49,048 --> 01:02:53,728
and they wanted to
duplicate the market-entry

1089
01:02:54,128 --> 01:02:56,688
of the new Amiga technology

1090
01:02:57,488 --> 01:03:00,608
just as the Macintosh
was done by Apple.

1091
01:03:00,688 --> 01:03:05,368
So, they brought me in to duplicate
the channel penetration,

1092
01:03:05,448 --> 01:03:08,208
the concept, the marketing,
put the team together

1093
01:03:08,288 --> 01:03:12,368
and try to see if they could go ahead
and get the Amiga out on the market.

1094
01:03:12,568 --> 01:03:15,128
When they look at the speed and
the architecture of the Amiga

1095
01:03:15,208 --> 01:03:17,316
compared to the speed and the
architecture of the Macintosh,

1096
01:03:17,341 --> 01:03:18,272
there's no comparison.

1097
01:03:18,488 --> 01:03:19,808
When they launched the Amiga,

1098
01:03:19,888 --> 01:03:23,768
Commodore marketing did a big,
splashy launch in New York.

1099
01:03:24,368 --> 01:03:27,888
They had celebrities there,
they had all kinds of press,

1100
01:03:27,968 --> 01:03:31,528
the computer press, but
also just mainstream press.

1101
01:03:32,608 --> 01:03:34,688
Good evening, ladies
and gentlemen.

1102
01:03:35,368 --> 01:03:38,128
Commodore welcomes you
to Lincoln Center.

1103
01:03:38,808 --> 01:03:42,289
My name is Bob Truckenbrod, Vice
President of Marketing for Commodore,

1104
01:03:43,369 --> 01:03:44,849
and I will be your host

1105
01:03:44,929 --> 01:03:47,689
for what promises to be a
very exciting exhibition.

1106
01:03:49,569 --> 01:03:54,009
For tonight is the world
premiere of Amiga.

1107
01:03:54,129 --> 01:03:58,569
The launch of the Amiga in New
York was a wonderful experience.

1108
01:03:58,649 --> 01:04:02,809
We were so impressed that
Commodore could pull that off.

1109
01:04:02,889 --> 01:04:06,689
You know, right there at Lincoln Center,
to announce the Amiga to the world.

1110
01:04:06,769 --> 01:04:09,249
And to have all of us in tuxedos

1111
01:04:09,329 --> 01:04:12,489
and the women in beautiful
dresses and that kind of thing.

1112
01:04:12,569 --> 01:04:13,689
It really was fun.

1113
01:04:13,769 --> 01:04:17,849
I mean, to see all these dudes
dressed in black-tie, man,

1114
01:04:17,929 --> 01:04:22,329
it was just too much. Too much.

1115
01:04:22,569 --> 01:04:24,849
We did a satellite
uplink on this.

1116
01:04:25,089 --> 01:04:27,249
So this thing actually
kinda went world-wide.

1117
01:04:27,609 --> 01:04:31,449
The same time we showed that
launch from Lincoln Center

1118
01:04:31,529 --> 01:04:33,529
and anybody that
could sign on to it

1119
01:04:33,609 --> 01:04:36,809
was able to sign on and see the
launch exactly as it occurred.

1120
01:04:36,889 --> 01:04:40,049
Commodore really, you know,
they treated us very well.

1121
01:04:40,129 --> 01:04:43,249
I mean, they set all
that stuff out for us

1122
01:04:43,369 --> 01:04:45,729
and in some ways I felt like

1123
01:04:45,809 --> 01:04:49,529
some of the complaints about
Commodore were overblown

1124
01:04:49,609 --> 01:04:52,849
because they really did take the
thing and they really ran with it.

1125
01:04:52,929 --> 01:04:54,649
The sales team and
the marketing team

1126
01:04:54,729 --> 01:04:58,689
was involved only to the point of
trying to address the end use.

1127
01:04:58,769 --> 01:05:00,609
How were we going to
address the Amiga?

1128
01:05:00,689 --> 01:05:02,769
What was its main use?

1129
01:05:02,849 --> 01:05:05,609
And at that time there was
a guy named Bob Pariseau

1130
01:05:05,689 --> 01:05:07,129
who gave the presentation.

1131
01:05:07,609 --> 01:05:11,169
He was one of the engineers involved
from the original Amiga days.

1132
01:05:11,249 --> 01:05:12,649
The Amiga computer.

1133
01:05:14,169 --> 01:05:17,729
We've lived our dream, and
seen it come to life.

1134
01:05:18,729 --> 01:05:20,089
Now it's your turn.

1135
01:05:20,689 --> 01:05:23,769
What will you do with
the Amiga computer?

1136
01:05:24,049 --> 01:05:26,569
Bob basically was,
kind of the overseer

1137
01:05:26,889 --> 01:05:29,649
of a lot of the technical stuff,
particularly the software side.

1138
01:05:30,449 --> 01:05:34,809
And he did have the ability to
translate the techno side of things

1139
01:05:34,889 --> 01:05:37,609
into terms that I think most
people could really understand.

1140
01:05:37,689 --> 01:05:39,649
So when we needed a
spokesman who could,

1141
01:05:40,289 --> 01:05:42,449
if he got cornered on
a technical question,

1142
01:05:42,529 --> 01:05:46,209
could respond with a
technology-based answer

1143
01:05:46,289 --> 01:05:48,569
but he also could
make that translation

1144
01:05:48,649 --> 01:05:50,849
into terms that would be
more consumer-friendly.

1145
01:05:51,449 --> 01:05:52,809
Good evening.

1146
01:05:53,129 --> 01:05:55,249
What you are about to witness

1147
01:05:55,649 --> 01:05:59,569
is the result of an effort
of research and engineering

1148
01:05:59,849 --> 01:06:02,009
that began in 1982

1149
01:06:03,009 --> 01:06:04,569
and which, to date,

1150
01:06:04,649 --> 01:06:09,129
has consumed over 100 man-years
of engineering talent.

1151
01:06:10,169 --> 01:06:11,489
The Amiga computer.

1152
01:06:12,569 --> 01:06:14,849
What we demonstrated
at the launch

1153
01:06:15,249 --> 01:06:17,769
was just mind-blowing
for these guys.

1154
01:06:17,849 --> 01:06:21,369
When we went after that launch

1155
01:06:21,449 --> 01:06:24,209
it was to show audio, music,

1156
01:06:24,289 --> 01:06:26,569
graphics and speed.

1157
01:06:26,649 --> 01:06:27,849
And in doing that,

1158
01:06:27,929 --> 01:06:30,529
with the technology difference
of having the three chips

1159
01:06:30,649 --> 01:06:34,449
we tried to convince the world
that we had a better, faster

1160
01:06:34,529 --> 01:06:35,969
more colourful machine

1161
01:06:36,049 --> 01:06:38,449
and a distribution setup

1162
01:06:38,609 --> 01:06:40,489
that could easily
be transitioned to.

1163
01:06:40,569 --> 01:06:44,049
To show off the graphics
capabilities they got Andy Warhol

1164
01:06:44,129 --> 01:06:46,489
and Deborah Harry, who is
the singer in Blondie.

1165
01:06:46,569 --> 01:06:50,009
Andy Warhol was famous for
doing images of stars.

1166
01:06:50,089 --> 01:06:54,129
He would do a portrait of them with
very primary colour backgrounds.

1167
01:06:54,649 --> 01:06:57,009
And so they got him to do one
of those type of images,

1168
01:06:57,089 --> 01:07:00,529
where he would scan a picture
of her in and then colour it.

1169
01:07:00,609 --> 01:07:04,649
I was there for the rehearsals that
were going on with Andy Warhol.

1170
01:07:04,729 --> 01:07:08,689
And it was dicey, because the computer
was still not quite reliable.

1171
01:07:08,769 --> 01:07:13,329
And we were very concerned that it might
crash or just totally catch on fire,

1172
01:07:13,409 --> 01:07:16,649
burn up or something in the
middle of this big show

1173
01:07:16,729 --> 01:07:19,649
where we had all of this
press from New York.

1174
01:07:19,769 --> 01:07:22,729
We had this artist at
Amiga called Jack Haeger.

1175
01:07:22,809 --> 01:07:24,209
He was just a brilliant artist.

1176
01:07:24,289 --> 01:07:27,969
A lot of the early stuff that
was just awesome was Jack.

1177
01:07:28,049 --> 01:07:30,609
And Jack was also smooth
and a good talker.

1178
01:07:30,689 --> 01:07:34,289
And so, we decided he'd get
up on stage with Andy Warhol.

1179
01:07:34,849 --> 01:07:37,769
You found it to be very
spontaneous, didn't you?

1180
01:07:37,849 --> 01:07:40,889
Yeah, it's great. It's
such a great thing.

1181
01:07:44,929 --> 01:07:46,769
What more can you say?

1182
01:07:46,889 --> 01:07:48,049
Well...

1183
01:07:48,489 --> 01:07:53,089
Andy Warhol is using my
Graphicraft paint program

1184
01:07:53,209 --> 01:07:58,209
to modify a digitised image of
Deborah Harry that he just got

1185
01:07:58,289 --> 01:08:00,489
into the Amiga computer.

1186
01:08:00,889 --> 01:08:05,649
And we had rehearsed with Andy
Warhol, who was an artist.

1187
01:08:05,729 --> 01:08:08,369
He's not an engineer and
he's not a logical guy.

1188
01:08:08,449 --> 01:08:11,169
And so you can give him
logical instructions.

1189
01:08:11,289 --> 01:08:14,569
But he was an artist,
he wasn't an engineer.

1190
01:08:14,649 --> 01:08:16,769
And so we told him, "You can
do this, but don't do that.

1191
01:08:16,849 --> 01:08:18,089
"And do this and don't do that."

1192
01:08:18,169 --> 01:08:20,289
And he said, "Yeah, yeah.
I got it, I got it."

1193
01:08:20,369 --> 01:08:22,969
But he wasn't getting it.
And then, he was...

1194
01:08:23,049 --> 01:08:24,769
And he gets up on stage

1195
01:08:24,849 --> 01:08:29,770
and he starts playing with
Graphicraft like some crazy monkey,

1196
01:08:29,850 --> 01:08:32,530
when we know that the
thing is so fragile,

1197
01:08:32,610 --> 01:08:35,890
and the hardware's just
barely holding it together.

1198
01:08:35,970 --> 01:08:39,530
And the one thing that was
a disaster was flood fill.

1199
01:08:39,610 --> 01:08:43,530
That the flood fill wasn't working
correctly in the hardware. It would leak.

1200
01:08:43,610 --> 01:08:47,010
And if you clicked in the wrong place
and made it flood fill the wrong way,

1201
01:08:47,090 --> 01:08:50,330
it would leak and fill the entire
thing, and wipe out your entire image.

1202
01:08:50,410 --> 01:08:53,930
And so we told him, "Whatever you
do, don't touch the flood fill."

1203
01:08:54,010 --> 01:08:56,570
So the first thing the guy
reaches for is the flood fill.

1204
01:08:56,690 --> 01:08:59,050
And he's all, like...

1205
01:09:03,250 --> 01:09:05,370
And you gotta see,
Jack's face is...

1206
01:09:05,450 --> 01:09:08,650
Oh, God, it's just so awesome!
He's filled with this horror.

1207
01:09:08,730 --> 01:09:12,010
It's going down!
It's going down.

1208
01:09:12,090 --> 01:09:13,890
And he clicked on it and
he created the flood fill.

1209
01:09:13,970 --> 01:09:16,770
And I think all of us that
were on the engineering team,

1210
01:09:16,850 --> 01:09:18,210
sitting in the
audience, were like,

1211
01:09:18,290 --> 01:09:20,850
"No! What's gonna happen now?"

1212
01:09:20,930 --> 01:09:22,850
And we saw that flood fill
and it kind of filled in.

1213
01:09:22,930 --> 01:09:24,090
You know, you watched
it progress,

1214
01:09:24,170 --> 01:09:26,970
and you thought it'd get to the end and
then there'd be a guru meditation.

1215
01:09:27,050 --> 01:09:28,970
You know, the machine
would've crashed.

1216
01:09:29,050 --> 01:09:32,490
But, no, it didn't. It made
it through and it was all...

1217
01:09:32,570 --> 01:09:35,250
And we were relieved by that.

1218
01:09:35,330 --> 01:09:38,050
The immediate reaction after
the launch was phenomenal.

1219
01:09:38,130 --> 01:09:40,290
The kinds of words that,
you know, you just...

1220
01:09:40,370 --> 01:09:42,650
You'd write for yourself if
you wanted to write them

1221
01:09:42,730 --> 01:09:44,050
to describe something
phenomenal.

1222
01:09:44,170 --> 01:09:46,490
They responded very much like
people do to video games.

1223
01:09:46,570 --> 01:09:49,170
"Why have the graphics gotten better?
Why has the sound has gotten better?"

1224
01:09:49,250 --> 01:09:52,050
Because you respond to it with
your ears, with your eyes.

1225
01:09:52,370 --> 01:09:55,570
The tactofeel we now have in game
controllers and things as well,

1226
01:09:55,650 --> 01:09:57,570
and with feedback,
that's all a part of it.

1227
01:09:57,650 --> 01:10:00,650
Because as human beings,
that's what we respond to.

1228
01:10:00,730 --> 01:10:04,770
And we knocked their socks off,
absolutely knocked their socks off.

1229
01:10:10,290 --> 01:10:14,650
Re-experience the
mind unbounded.

1230
01:10:18,890 --> 01:10:23,370
Amiga, the first personal computer
that gives you a creative edge.

1231
01:10:23,450 --> 01:10:27,010
There used to be this massive,
massive disparity between the games

1232
01:10:27,090 --> 01:10:29,370
that we could play at home
and the kind of technology,

1233
01:10:29,450 --> 01:10:32,410
and the quality experience you
could get in the arcades.

1234
01:10:32,490 --> 01:10:34,010
And that was always
really evident

1235
01:10:34,090 --> 01:10:38,490
when you would see, like, the Spectrum
or the Commodore 64 adaptations,

1236
01:10:38,570 --> 01:10:40,290
the conversions of
those coin-op games.

1237
01:10:40,370 --> 01:10:42,130
I think Operation Wolf
was one that I remember.

1238
01:10:42,210 --> 01:10:44,490
It had the gun. The graphics
were actually really cool.

1239
01:10:44,570 --> 01:10:46,890
Then you would come home and play
on your 64 or your Spectrum,

1240
01:10:46,970 --> 01:10:48,210
and it was just nothing like it.

1241
01:10:48,290 --> 01:10:51,730
I mean, it wasn't anything like
Operation Wolf in anything but name.

1242
01:10:51,810 --> 01:10:53,370
And that was always
kind of depressing.

1243
01:10:53,450 --> 01:10:56,130
What I think is actually really interesting
about the Amiga generation is,

1244
01:10:56,210 --> 01:10:59,290
I think that was the first time that
we really started to close that gap.

1245
01:10:59,370 --> 01:11:01,050
By the time the Amiga came out,

1246
01:11:01,130 --> 01:11:04,570
there were already
coin-operated arcade machines

1247
01:11:04,650 --> 01:11:08,010
also using the Motorola MC68000.

1248
01:11:08,090 --> 01:11:10,370
And you could see in the
arcades what you could do

1249
01:11:10,450 --> 01:11:12,930
when you spent $5,000
or $10,000 on hardware

1250
01:11:13,010 --> 01:11:15,250
and built out a
really fabulous game.

1251
01:11:15,330 --> 01:11:17,930
And I'm thinking about games at
that time like Marble Madness.

1252
01:11:18,010 --> 01:11:21,610
Of course, we later licensed Marble
Madness and brought it to the Amiga.

1253
01:11:21,690 --> 01:11:23,530
That's the kind of thing
that became possible.

1254
01:11:23,610 --> 01:11:27,970
Suddenly, you could do things at
home that were pretty mind-boggling.

1255
01:11:28,050 --> 01:11:31,570
When I saw Marble Madness for
the first time on the Amiga,

1256
01:11:31,650 --> 01:11:34,530
it was shocking. And it
was shocking because,

1257
01:11:35,330 --> 01:11:37,090
as far as I can recall,

1258
01:11:37,170 --> 01:11:41,970
it was the first time that a
video game on a home computer,

1259
01:11:43,130 --> 01:11:44,890
pixel for pixel,

1260
01:11:44,970 --> 01:11:46,930
replicated an arcade game.

1261
01:11:47,010 --> 01:11:49,730
It was the arcade version.
There is no difference.

1262
01:11:49,810 --> 01:11:52,170
There might be very
slight differences,

1263
01:11:52,250 --> 01:11:56,690
but the quality of that Amiga version
was so fantastic at the time.

1264
01:11:56,770 --> 01:11:58,170
It looked like an arcade game.

1265
01:11:58,250 --> 01:12:00,530
And that was the big excitement.
You wanted that.

1266
01:12:00,610 --> 01:12:03,010
I just loved its clean clarity.

1267
01:12:03,090 --> 01:12:05,690
Marble Madness was
well-suited to the Amiga,

1268
01:12:05,770 --> 01:12:08,530
because it scrolled
these playfields.

1269
01:12:08,610 --> 01:12:11,542
The background as the marble was rolling

1270
01:12:11,567 --> 01:12:14,354
was a perfect operation for the chips.

1271
01:12:14,490 --> 01:12:17,730
So I think what the Amiga
really did as a computer was

1272
01:12:17,810 --> 01:12:20,530
it sort of took the blinders
off game developers

1273
01:12:21,130 --> 01:12:23,970
and it allowed us to start creating
more immersive experiences

1274
01:12:24,050 --> 01:12:26,330
with better graphics
and better sounds.

1275
01:12:26,410 --> 01:12:30,050
And it opened up the potential audience
to a much larger group of people

1276
01:12:30,130 --> 01:12:33,170
that were looking for something,
you know, a bit more entertaining

1277
01:12:33,250 --> 01:12:36,210
than what they were getting
from the 8-bit computers.

1278
01:12:44,370 --> 01:12:46,450
The first time I saw
Defender of the Crown,

1279
01:12:46,770 --> 01:12:48,530
I had to ask the guy behind the counter

1280
01:12:48,555 --> 01:12:50,754
to show me that it was
actually running code.

1281
01:12:50,810 --> 01:12:53,290
He said, "Have a go." "OK."

1282
01:12:55,290 --> 01:12:57,650
"Oh, my God."

1283
01:12:57,770 --> 01:13:00,610
I still remember playing the jousting.
The jousting was great.

1284
01:13:00,690 --> 01:13:04,130
It was like you were...
You were in a movie.

1285
01:13:05,010 --> 01:13:07,210
And yes, a pixelated
movie, but still.

1286
01:13:07,290 --> 01:13:08,949
Compared to the games you'd been playing

1287
01:13:08,974 --> 01:13:10,834
only maybe a year or two before that,

1288
01:13:10,890 --> 01:13:13,090
the graphical fidelity
was astonishing.

1289
01:13:13,170 --> 01:13:16,570
Bob Jacob at Cinemaware
absolutely loved movies,

1290
01:13:16,650 --> 01:13:18,691
and that's why he
started the company.

1291
01:13:18,771 --> 01:13:23,451
He had a real passion for storytelling
and for creating immersive environments,

1292
01:13:23,531 --> 01:13:26,011
and the Amiga allowed
him to do that.

1293
01:13:26,091 --> 01:13:31,971
It gave you this cinema experience
where you just didn't play a game,

1294
01:13:32,051 --> 01:13:33,691
but between the levels,

1295
01:13:33,771 --> 01:13:38,411
you'd see cutscenes where you, the hero,
was getting together with a woman,

1296
01:13:38,491 --> 01:13:42,171
or you, the hero, was demanding
justice from the bad guys.

1297
01:13:42,251 --> 01:13:45,971
We were able to do cutscenes
that had actual animation.

1298
01:13:47,131 --> 01:13:51,051
So when you rescue the princess and
you have the sword fighting scene,

1299
01:13:51,131 --> 01:13:56,251
you can have a cutscene at the end
where you have shadows on the wall,

1300
01:13:56,331 --> 01:13:59,211
and the hero embraces
the princess,

1301
01:13:59,291 --> 01:14:02,011
and we could let your
imagination run wild with that.

1302
01:14:02,091 --> 01:14:04,377
And it was a game that brought you in,

1303
01:14:04,402 --> 01:14:07,275
in a way that no other
game had done before.

1304
01:14:07,491 --> 01:14:09,931
And the game design
itself was good.

1305
01:14:10,011 --> 01:14:14,771
But there was this artist, Jim Sachs,
who was the art lead on that project,

1306
01:14:14,851 --> 01:14:17,291
and it was his magic

1307
01:14:17,371 --> 01:14:21,011
that turned that game from
a commonplace experience

1308
01:14:21,091 --> 01:14:23,331
into something like no one
had ever seen before.

1309
01:14:23,411 --> 01:14:27,491
Jim Sachs, I can say without
any hesitation, was a genius.

1310
01:14:27,571 --> 01:14:30,491
And Defender of the Crown
would not have been a success

1311
01:14:30,571 --> 01:14:32,331
if it hadn't been for Jim Sachs.

1312
01:14:32,411 --> 01:14:34,851
When I started doing the graphics
for Defender of the Crown,

1313
01:14:34,931 --> 01:14:37,131
the tools were
extremely primitive.

1314
01:14:37,211 --> 01:14:40,011
It was still Graphicraft
and Aegis Images.

1315
01:14:40,091 --> 01:14:42,931
So I was drawing castles
one dot at a time.

1316
01:14:43,011 --> 01:14:48,611
I'd do a sketch on paper, or I'd see
magazine articles about castles.

1317
01:14:48,691 --> 01:14:50,251
And I'd have that picture

1318
01:14:50,331 --> 01:14:52,571
and then do something
like that on the screen,

1319
01:14:52,651 --> 01:14:54,011
literally one dot at a time.

1320
01:14:54,091 --> 01:14:59,971
And put about five or six dots together
and that forms a block of stone.

1321
01:15:00,051 --> 01:15:04,051
And then, at that point, you
could clip out groups of pixels

1322
01:15:04,131 --> 01:15:06,611
and stamp them in as brushes.

1323
01:15:06,691 --> 01:15:09,171
So I was doing that. Stone
after stone after stone.

1324
01:15:09,251 --> 01:15:11,011
Finally, you have one tower,

1325
01:15:11,091 --> 01:15:14,611
and then draw the grass and
everything growing up to that.

1326
01:15:14,691 --> 01:15:16,131
Very time-consuming.

1327
01:15:16,211 --> 01:15:19,011
And after about
probably two weeks,

1328
01:15:19,091 --> 01:15:22,131
I had drawn the first castle
on a hill and turned that in.

1329
01:15:22,211 --> 01:15:23,811
And it just blew them
away, of course.

1330
01:15:23,931 --> 01:15:27,691
You know, it was just so much different
than anything else that they had seen.

1331
01:15:27,891 --> 01:15:31,451
So then, they could get an idea of what
the whole game was gonna look like,

1332
01:15:31,531 --> 01:15:33,651
and started to get really
excited about the whole thing.

1333
01:15:33,731 --> 01:15:37,371
The design itself reached for

1334
01:15:37,451 --> 01:15:42,731
the kind of softer entertainment
experience that is commonplace today.

1335
01:15:42,811 --> 01:15:44,974
Everyone's comfortable
with the fact

1336
01:15:44,999 --> 01:15:48,155
that software does that
movie thing that it does.

1337
01:15:48,211 --> 01:15:51,211
But Defender of the Crown,
the Cinemaware title,

1338
01:15:51,291 --> 01:15:54,691
was one of the first
that made that a reality

1339
01:15:54,771 --> 01:15:57,691
where you were no longer
just playing a game.

1340
01:15:57,771 --> 01:15:59,611
Because it demonstrated
not just graphically,

1341
01:15:59,691 --> 01:16:03,531
visually, this was a quantum leap
beyond anything we had seen in 8-bit.

1342
01:16:03,611 --> 01:16:05,051
It was certainly that.

1343
01:16:05,131 --> 01:16:08,251
But it was the kind of game
that just wasn't even possible.

1344
01:16:08,331 --> 01:16:11,971
There was nothing quite like Defender
of the Crown before it came out.

1345
01:16:12,051 --> 01:16:15,571
And it was definitely a signal
for where video games could go.

1346
01:16:15,651 --> 01:16:18,571
I didn't think all video
games would take that route,

1347
01:16:18,651 --> 01:16:22,571
but in terms of production values
and the ability to draw in people

1348
01:16:22,651 --> 01:16:26,491
who otherwise haven't been
interested in video games before.

1349
01:16:26,571 --> 01:16:29,459
The idea that a video game could
be a mass market activity

1350
01:16:29,484 --> 01:16:30,755
and not just a niche,

1351
01:16:30,811 --> 01:16:33,291
I think Defender of the Crown
was, if not the first,

1352
01:16:33,371 --> 01:16:35,251
then one of the very
first to signal that.

1353
01:16:48,931 --> 01:16:52,291
When the Amiga 1000 came off
the manufacturing line,

1354
01:16:52,811 --> 01:16:56,971
most of us were... "Amazed"
is the wrong word.

1355
01:16:57,051 --> 01:16:59,331
"Distressed" was a better word,

1356
01:16:59,451 --> 01:17:03,491
at what appeared to be
wholly inadequate marketing

1357
01:17:03,571 --> 01:17:05,011
on the part of Commodore.

1358
01:17:05,091 --> 01:17:08,971
They didn't really have a good focus, and
I think part of that was the fact that

1359
01:17:09,051 --> 01:17:12,171
the Amiga computer was so capable
of doing almost anything.

1360
01:17:12,251 --> 01:17:13,521
Unfortunately,

1361
01:17:13,546 --> 01:17:17,355
with the loss of the leadership of
Jack Tramiel that very same year,

1362
01:17:17,411 --> 01:17:21,051
Commodore was a little bit lost
as to what direction to take.

1363
01:17:21,131 --> 01:17:24,771
Their actions basically said, "We
don't understand what we got here."

1364
01:17:24,851 --> 01:17:28,491
They were shipping
containerloads of Commodore 64s.

1365
01:17:28,571 --> 01:17:31,731
They were shipping high volume
to these mass merchants.

1366
01:17:31,811 --> 01:17:33,388
And then all of a sudden,

1367
01:17:33,413 --> 01:17:37,195
along comes a good buy in
buying the Amiga technology,

1368
01:17:37,251 --> 01:17:40,931
because somebody had the vision to
go after the Macintosh business

1369
01:17:41,011 --> 01:17:44,371
and the business side
of the channels,

1370
01:17:44,451 --> 01:17:48,171
but nobody in the company
really had the experience.

1371
01:17:48,251 --> 01:17:51,931
They just didn't know how to market
any longer a computer like this

1372
01:17:52,011 --> 01:17:54,171
to that computer-based trait.

1373
01:17:54,251 --> 01:17:57,051
They really only understood
a no-mass market.

1374
01:17:57,131 --> 01:18:01,251
And the other part of it is that they
yanked the development, a support,

1375
01:18:01,331 --> 01:18:03,131
that had to be out there
in order to get software,

1376
01:18:03,211 --> 01:18:04,812
a meaningful software,
done in this thing.

1377
01:18:05,092 --> 01:18:07,652
They were so used to
the software community

1378
01:18:07,732 --> 01:18:13,172
going and fulfilling the Commodore
64 gaming and productivity software,

1379
01:18:13,252 --> 01:18:16,212
that they never really programmed
them for the conformity

1380
01:18:16,292 --> 01:18:18,492
of dealing with the
Amiga technology.

1381
01:18:18,572 --> 01:18:21,012
Commodore 64 software was
a grass-roots effort.

1382
01:18:22,012 --> 01:18:25,292
Software developers out in the field
went and did what they wanted to do.

1383
01:18:25,372 --> 01:18:27,412
Sometimes without the
help of Commodore.

1384
01:18:27,492 --> 01:18:29,092
Wasn't that easy to
do on the Amiga.

1385
01:18:29,172 --> 01:18:31,052
You needed the books. You
needed some training.

1386
01:18:31,132 --> 01:18:33,652
You needed some support
back from the company.

1387
01:18:33,732 --> 01:18:35,572
And Commodore didn't provide it.

1388
01:18:35,652 --> 01:18:39,972
Almost all the first-line software
that came out of that machine

1389
01:18:40,492 --> 01:18:45,172
was written by internal Amiga guys who
just basically sat down and wrote it.

1390
01:18:45,852 --> 01:18:48,132
Because they understood we had
to have these applications,

1391
01:18:48,212 --> 01:18:50,972
otherwise we had a nice
demo, but that was it.

1392
01:18:51,052 --> 01:18:54,132
We travelled around to 30
cities, launching the Amiga.

1393
01:18:54,212 --> 01:18:56,612
And we had everybody
ready for it.

1394
01:18:56,692 --> 01:18:57,852
But then, when we went home,

1395
01:18:57,932 --> 01:19:01,612
we found out they had already
had a conversation with Kmart

1396
01:19:01,892 --> 01:19:03,633
and Wal-Mart, and some
of these other guys

1397
01:19:03,658 --> 01:19:05,236
who were just used to selling numbers,

1398
01:19:05,292 --> 01:19:08,301
and they could care less
about support for the people

1399
01:19:08,326 --> 01:19:10,276
who wanted to do productivity.

1400
01:19:10,332 --> 01:19:12,772
They just wanted to
sell tons of games.

1401
01:19:13,212 --> 01:19:15,372
But again, that's all they knew.

1402
01:19:15,452 --> 01:19:18,012
Their experience had said,
"Hey, we'll get started,

1403
01:19:18,092 --> 01:19:19,852
"and then we'll take
it to the mass market,

1404
01:19:19,932 --> 01:19:22,372
"and we'll have another
Commodore 64 on our hands."

1405
01:19:23,252 --> 01:19:25,212
It wasn't a Commodore 64.

1406
01:19:25,292 --> 01:19:29,732
So, you know, to market it like that, I
mean, you just flunked Marketing 101.

1407
01:19:30,252 --> 01:19:32,892
And that's where we got lost.

1408
01:19:32,972 --> 01:19:35,292
We had no way to
sell that product.

1409
01:19:35,372 --> 01:19:39,372
All we had to do was give
it to the mass merchant,

1410
01:19:39,452 --> 01:19:42,332
and the mass merchant would end
up sending back the product

1411
01:19:42,412 --> 01:19:43,953
when the customer returned it to them,

1412
01:19:43,978 --> 01:19:45,716
because they didn't
know how to boot it up.

1413
01:19:45,972 --> 01:19:49,332
The ethos of Commodore,
it never had a plan,

1414
01:19:49,412 --> 01:19:52,412
so therefore, it never
questioned what was happening.

1415
01:19:52,492 --> 01:19:55,612
They stumbled from crisis
to crisis to crisis,

1416
01:19:55,692 --> 01:19:58,492
and just firefighting more time
than they were in planning.

1417
01:19:58,572 --> 01:20:01,372
After the west coast
guys left Commodore,

1418
01:20:01,452 --> 01:20:03,652
Commodore had to turn to
their own internal engineers

1419
01:20:03,732 --> 01:20:06,372
to continue development
of the Amiga system.

1420
01:20:06,452 --> 01:20:10,012
And so, what they said was,
"We're gonna go both ways.

1421
01:20:10,092 --> 01:20:14,492
"We're gonna have an Amiga computer
that's really aimed for business.

1422
01:20:14,572 --> 01:20:18,852
"It's gonna be very high-end, even
higher-end than the Amiga 1000 was.

1423
01:20:18,932 --> 01:20:21,812
"And we're also gonna
do a lower-end Amiga

1424
01:20:21,892 --> 01:20:24,332
"that's gonna be a
Commodore 64 replacement."

1425
01:20:24,892 --> 01:20:28,892
And so that's how the Amiga 500
came about and the Amiga 2000.

1426
01:20:29,612 --> 01:20:32,825
You are about to step into a
brave new world of power,

1427
01:20:32,850 --> 01:20:34,836
performance and productivity,

1428
01:20:34,892 --> 01:20:38,732
made possible by the new Commodore
Amiga 500 home computer.

1429
01:20:38,812 --> 01:20:41,932
Sit back and get set for
the ride of your life.

1430
01:20:44,492 --> 01:20:47,372
I am the Commodore Amiga 500.

1431
01:20:47,452 --> 01:20:48,612
Why do the A500?

1432
01:20:48,692 --> 01:20:50,892
I think the big idea there

1433
01:20:50,972 --> 01:20:54,132
was to make something that
Commodore understood better.

1434
01:20:54,212 --> 01:20:57,332
You know, Commodore was never that
good at selling higher-end systems.

1435
01:20:57,412 --> 01:21:00,452
And the A500 sort of hit

1436
01:21:00,532 --> 01:21:05,052
the same exact market
spot that the C128 had.

1437
01:21:05,132 --> 01:21:08,572
It was... You know, it was something
that a Commodore fan would recognise.

1438
01:21:08,652 --> 01:21:12,572
It was kind of what people thought about
home computers, at least in the '80s.

1439
01:21:12,692 --> 01:21:17,052
So, my recollection of the
origin of the A500 was

1440
01:21:17,132 --> 01:21:21,852
Gerard Bucas asked Jeff
Porter, George Robbins and I

1441
01:21:21,932 --> 01:21:26,692
to look at the A1000 and see
if we could cost reduce it.

1442
01:21:26,852 --> 01:21:30,132
So we had the schematics
that Dave Needle had done,

1443
01:21:30,212 --> 01:21:34,772
and we just decided the things that
were gonna reduce the cost were

1444
01:21:34,852 --> 01:21:40,172
getting rid of the writable control store
and putting it into a singular case,

1445
01:21:40,252 --> 01:21:41,892
and having a brick power supply.

1446
01:21:42,172 --> 01:21:44,652
And we looked at the Agnus
chip in particular,

1447
01:21:44,732 --> 01:21:47,412
which ended up getting
some stuff rolled into it.

1448
01:21:47,812 --> 01:21:52,452
And it was a big cost reduction. I mean,
the A1000 case was very expensive.

1449
01:21:52,532 --> 01:21:54,252
The lack of integration,
a lot of those...

1450
01:21:54,332 --> 01:21:58,212
All those separate chips that got
dramatically reduced with the Fat Agnus

1451
01:21:58,292 --> 01:21:59,612
reduced the cost of it.

1452
01:21:59,692 --> 01:22:03,812
It was really just, "Let's deliver
the same level of technology,

1453
01:22:03,892 --> 01:22:06,879
"but, you know, mechanically,
electronically,

1454
01:22:06,904 --> 01:22:08,916
whatever we can, cut the cost,

1455
01:22:08,972 --> 01:22:10,772
"so that we can make something

1456
01:22:10,797 --> 01:22:13,796
that Commodore people
know what to do with."

1457
01:22:14,132 --> 01:22:18,412
Jeff and I took that proposal
to a meeting with Jay Miner,

1458
01:22:18,492 --> 01:22:20,932
and we showed the factoring
that we wanted to do.

1459
01:22:21,012 --> 01:22:23,732
There was some debate as to whether
the clock stuff was gonna work,

1460
01:22:23,812 --> 01:22:26,412
but Jay Miner was like, "No.
That should work," you know.

1461
01:22:26,492 --> 01:22:29,492
And that was... It was cool meeting him.
I had never met him before.

1462
01:22:29,572 --> 01:22:33,292
He was very much
professional about

1463
01:22:33,372 --> 01:22:39,292
assessing whether what we were proposing
made sense technically speaking.

1464
01:22:39,372 --> 01:22:43,412
I'd been advised that they
were producing an A500,

1465
01:22:43,492 --> 01:22:46,212
that it was going to be aimed
at the consumer market.

1466
01:22:46,292 --> 01:22:48,092
And as soon as it arrived,

1467
01:22:48,117 --> 01:22:52,757
it definitely lived up to all
of our expectations and beyond.

1468
01:22:52,813 --> 01:22:56,293
Because the capabilities of
it were equally as good as

1469
01:22:56,373 --> 01:22:58,613
the majority of things
you could do on the 1000

1470
01:22:58,693 --> 01:23:01,813
at probably 25% of the
1000 price at that time.

1471
01:23:01,893 --> 01:23:05,053
I'm actually very proud of that
machine, cos I think it...

1472
01:23:05,133 --> 01:23:08,733
I thought it preserved
the spirit of the Amiga

1473
01:23:09,133 --> 01:23:13,893
while making it much more
available, in terms of price.

1474
01:23:13,973 --> 01:23:17,773
We were a consumer company
selling game computers,

1475
01:23:17,853 --> 01:23:21,773
and it doesn't mean that should be the
only thing Commodore was, but that...

1476
01:23:21,853 --> 01:23:23,693
Everyone knew that's
what our strength was.

1477
01:23:23,773 --> 01:23:29,013
The thing about the 500 was that
it was very clearly a realisation

1478
01:23:29,093 --> 01:23:30,773
that there is a games market,

1479
01:23:30,853 --> 01:23:33,643
and we need to put something out
that people can play games on,

1480
01:23:33,668 --> 01:23:34,597
and that was it.

1481
01:23:35,053 --> 01:23:36,933
So it served as a
great games machine,

1482
01:23:37,013 --> 01:23:38,533
and as a really good
development machine as well.

1483
01:23:38,613 --> 01:23:41,613
But I think that was a case
of Commodore realising

1484
01:23:41,693 --> 01:23:45,253
they had to directly address
the market that they created.

1485
01:24:13,773 --> 01:24:15,933
Using the Amiga for the first
time was a revelation.

1486
01:24:16,013 --> 01:24:17,933
It was like a veil
had been lifted.

1487
01:24:18,013 --> 01:24:22,453
It not only allowed us to dream,
it allowed us to dream big.

1488
01:24:34,013 --> 01:24:37,573
People who do game development
and some application development

1489
01:24:37,653 --> 01:24:39,853
can look at a PC or other machines

1490
01:24:39,933 --> 01:24:41,819
and see how much work it takes

1491
01:24:41,844 --> 01:24:45,237
to get the machine to do
what you want it to do,

1492
01:24:45,293 --> 01:24:49,893
and how easy it is to get the Amiga
to do what you want it to do.

1493
01:24:49,973 --> 01:24:51,933
So your energy and your time

1494
01:24:52,013 --> 01:24:55,933
are not spent on tricking the machine
to produce a piece of graphics.

1495
01:24:56,013 --> 01:25:01,213
They're spent on your invention
and your art and your creativity.

1496
01:25:01,293 --> 01:25:02,653
The goal that Jay and I had

1497
01:25:02,733 --> 01:25:07,133
was to advance the state of the art
10 times beyond the competition.

1498
01:25:07,213 --> 01:25:10,653
And when you advance the state
of the art sufficiently,

1499
01:25:11,133 --> 01:25:13,564
you get into the realm where
you're doing something

1500
01:25:13,589 --> 01:25:15,317
that people find completely new.

1501
01:25:15,373 --> 01:25:19,333
It expands their capability to
do things you can't do before

1502
01:25:19,413 --> 01:25:22,733
with 10 times more horsepower.
In some cases, even more.

1503
01:25:22,813 --> 01:25:24,163
Game developers now,

1504
01:25:24,188 --> 01:25:28,237
who typically might have just
been writing assembly code

1505
01:25:28,293 --> 01:25:32,453
or were doing as much as they can
just to get the hardware to do stuff,

1506
01:25:32,533 --> 01:25:34,693
all of a sudden,
they had a computer

1507
01:25:34,773 --> 01:25:37,693
that basically would do
most of the work for them.

1508
01:25:37,773 --> 01:25:39,573
There was the graphics chips

1509
01:25:39,653 --> 01:25:42,533
that were doing the blitting and
the moving of the graphics.

1510
01:25:42,613 --> 01:25:45,893
There were sprites that would just
appear where you wanted them to appear.

1511
01:25:45,973 --> 01:25:47,093
Multi-colour sprites.

1512
01:25:47,173 --> 01:25:51,373
You could do the play field animation.
You could do play field scrolling.

1513
01:25:51,453 --> 01:25:55,773
You could do simulated 3D perspective
stuff by using differential scrolling.

1514
01:25:55,853 --> 01:26:01,693
More colours using the run-length
compression in the Hold-and-Modify.

1515
01:26:01,773 --> 01:26:05,453
A multi-channel sampled audio
instead of beeps and boops.

1516
01:26:05,533 --> 01:26:09,173
So if you're a game developer,
and you saw the opportunity

1517
01:26:09,253 --> 01:26:11,282
to do what you could
with the Amiga

1518
01:26:11,307 --> 01:26:14,237
to advance the state of
your gaming creativity,

1519
01:26:14,293 --> 01:26:16,853
all of a sudden, this
gave you a new tool.

1520
01:26:32,173 --> 01:26:36,333
So it really appealed
to the creative edge.

1521
01:26:36,413 --> 01:26:38,453
That was what the
Amiga was about.

1522
01:26:38,533 --> 01:26:41,213
That was actually the slogan, was
that it gave you the creative edge.

1523
01:26:41,293 --> 01:26:43,893
And it really did. And
it took all the people

1524
01:26:43,973 --> 01:26:48,213
that were not just bland PCers that
just want to do PC-types of stuff,

1525
01:26:48,293 --> 01:26:50,533
but it just opened up
this whole new world.

1526
01:26:50,613 --> 01:26:52,973
The first time I saw it,
I was just blown away.

1527
01:26:53,053 --> 01:26:57,013
It was difficult to believe
just what a huge leap it was.

1528
01:26:57,093 --> 01:27:02,693
It just felt like you were just touching
science fiction, it was so advanced.

1529
01:27:02,773 --> 01:27:06,653
When it comes to the Amiga, the
world was really your oyster.

1530
01:27:06,733 --> 01:27:08,053
It really was...

1531
01:27:08,133 --> 01:27:09,033
It widened my world.

1532
01:27:09,058 --> 01:27:11,757
Cos I thought, "Well, we can
do anything we want to do."

1533
01:27:14,053 --> 01:27:15,093
So my mind just exploded.

1534
01:27:15,173 --> 01:27:17,613
Amiga was so smooth,
you know what I mean?

1535
01:27:17,693 --> 01:27:18,853
It was like a Porsche.

1536
01:27:20,973 --> 01:27:25,413
It had Copper. It had
this amazing sound chip.

1537
01:27:25,493 --> 01:27:26,893
Beautiful colours.

1538
01:27:26,973 --> 01:27:31,053
It was very fast. It was a
better machine all round.

1539
01:27:31,693 --> 01:27:35,413
And you could tell from the
games that were coming out.

1540
01:27:35,493 --> 01:27:37,493
To me, machines are machines,

1541
01:27:37,573 --> 01:27:39,934
and all I talk about with machines
is what's wrong with them.

1542
01:27:40,494 --> 01:27:42,974
I just only ever see
problems in machines.

1543
01:27:43,054 --> 01:27:45,755
Things that they're stopping me
from doing more efficiently,

1544
01:27:45,780 --> 01:27:46,798
that I want to do.

1545
01:27:47,214 --> 01:27:50,334
But the Amiga, actually, of all
of the machines I've worked on,

1546
01:27:50,414 --> 01:27:52,249
was the one which gave me the most

1547
01:27:52,274 --> 01:27:55,158
of what you wanted to deliver
the most painlessly.

1548
01:27:55,214 --> 01:27:57,174
From a designer's point of view,
it was a brilliant machine.

1549
01:27:57,254 --> 01:27:59,374
It was very accessible.

1550
01:27:59,454 --> 01:28:01,534
The programmers learned to get
very, very skilful at it.

1551
01:28:01,614 --> 01:28:04,174
But they didn't struggle too
much to get up and running.

1552
01:28:04,454 --> 01:28:06,454
So, still, in those days,

1553
01:28:07,014 --> 01:28:12,094
you could spend 75% of making the game
development time on making the game,

1554
01:28:12,174 --> 01:28:17,134
and 25% on doing the structure and
stuff, the routines to make it work.

1555
01:28:17,214 --> 01:28:19,614
What the Amiga did is
it inspired people

1556
01:28:19,694 --> 01:28:22,134
to explore the boundaries of
what the machine could do.

1557
01:28:22,214 --> 01:28:24,894
There was so much hardware in there,
compared to the other machines,

1558
01:28:24,974 --> 01:28:26,075
that you could play around with,

1559
01:28:26,100 --> 01:28:27,958
and there was so much
sneaky stuff you could do.

1560
01:28:28,014 --> 01:28:29,734
There was the
Hold-and-Modify mode,

1561
01:28:29,814 --> 01:28:32,894
and there was the weird modes where
it only had a 32-colour palette,

1562
01:28:32,974 --> 01:28:36,654
but you could get
32 more colours

1563
01:28:36,734 --> 01:28:38,574
that were basically half as
bright versions of that.

1564
01:28:38,654 --> 01:28:41,494
And so, it does inspire
people to get into the idea

1565
01:28:41,519 --> 01:28:44,278
that they're gonna have to explore
the different corners of stuff.

1566
01:28:44,574 --> 01:28:45,654
In the beginning,

1567
01:28:45,734 --> 01:28:51,054
if you wanted to put bitmapped
graphics onto a screen,

1568
01:28:51,134 --> 01:28:53,054
you'd have to create them,

1569
01:28:53,134 --> 01:28:56,894
you'd have to use the
computer, the computer's CPU,

1570
01:28:56,974 --> 01:29:00,134
to actually draw those
pixels onto the screen.

1571
01:29:00,214 --> 01:29:01,494
And that would take time,

1572
01:29:01,574 --> 01:29:05,054
and while the computer was doing that,
it couldn't be doing anything else.

1573
01:29:05,134 --> 01:29:08,654
And very often, in the early games, Jet
Set Willy is a good example of that,

1574
01:29:08,734 --> 01:29:11,774
nearly all of the time that
the computer was spending

1575
01:29:11,854 --> 01:29:14,494
was spent drawing
pixels onto the screen

1576
01:29:14,574 --> 01:29:17,414
and that left very little
time left for anything else.

1577
01:29:17,494 --> 01:29:19,454
What a blitter does,

1578
01:29:19,534 --> 01:29:22,934
is it says, "Hey, I'm really good at this.
I'm really fast.

1579
01:29:23,014 --> 01:29:27,294
"I can take a bunch of pixels, which
correspond to an image from one place,

1580
01:29:27,374 --> 01:29:30,334
"combine them in fancy ways
with another bunch of pixels,

1581
01:29:30,414 --> 01:29:35,614
"like a mask or a stencil from another
place, and put them onto the screen,

1582
01:29:35,694 --> 01:29:39,214
"in whatever way you want in
any number of combinations,

1583
01:29:39,294 --> 01:29:40,654
"to form a final image,

1584
01:29:40,734 --> 01:29:44,454
"and I can do this 10 times
faster, 20 times faster,

1585
01:29:44,534 --> 01:29:45,854
"than the processor can do it."

1586
01:29:45,934 --> 01:29:50,374
So what that meant was, the processor
was free to do lots of other things,

1587
01:29:50,454 --> 01:29:52,694
like AI for example,
like collisions,

1588
01:29:52,774 --> 01:29:57,934
and the blitter allowed you to create an
immense amount of detail in the display

1589
01:29:58,214 --> 01:30:00,374
in a fraction of the time
that it used to take.

1590
01:30:00,454 --> 01:30:04,014
And the Copper lists allowed
us to change colours,

1591
01:30:04,094 --> 01:30:08,614
and shift things left and right slightly,
and do all these crazy things.

1592
01:30:08,934 --> 01:30:11,894
And we built a lot of the
games around these effects.

1593
01:30:12,054 --> 01:30:15,934
It's like, we could scroll
things and move them

1594
01:30:16,014 --> 01:30:18,414
without even really having
to put any effort in.

1595
01:30:18,494 --> 01:30:21,734
A lot of the hardware in there
is very specifically aimed

1596
01:30:21,814 --> 01:30:26,614
at the kind of things that we as game
designers and game producers require,

1597
01:30:26,694 --> 01:30:28,374
or certainly did back in the day.

1598
01:30:28,454 --> 01:30:32,574
To try and replicate the effects that
you get in arcade machines of the day,

1599
01:30:32,654 --> 01:30:35,094
you needed very powerful
hardware scrolling.

1600
01:30:35,174 --> 01:30:36,638
You needed sprite systems,

1601
01:30:36,663 --> 01:30:39,758
ways of moving objects in
front of other objects,

1602
01:30:39,814 --> 01:30:41,047
and obscuring backgrounds

1603
01:30:41,072 --> 01:30:43,438
and restoring backgrounds
quickly, easily,

1604
01:30:43,494 --> 01:30:44,560
and freeing up the processor

1605
01:30:44,585 --> 01:30:46,678
to do the main game loop, as it were.

1606
01:30:46,734 --> 01:30:51,494
So there was a lot of hardware in there
that you could see precious little use

1607
01:30:51,574 --> 01:30:54,414
for anything else other than games
or graphics demos, to be honest.

1608
01:30:54,494 --> 01:30:56,374
So it was a dream
machine, really,

1609
01:30:56,454 --> 01:30:59,494
because it really felt like it
had been created specifically

1610
01:30:59,574 --> 01:31:04,254
to produce the kind of games
that you saw in the arcades

1611
01:31:04,334 --> 01:31:06,134
and the kind of effects that
you saw in the arcades.

1612
01:31:06,214 --> 01:31:08,779
I think the thing that impressed
me the most about the Amiga,

1613
01:31:08,804 --> 01:31:09,878
besides the graphics,

1614
01:31:09,934 --> 01:31:12,414
was there was an actual
operating system on it.

1615
01:31:12,494 --> 01:31:14,614
Coming from the Commodore 64,

1616
01:31:14,694 --> 01:31:17,974
where you got a little prompt and you
could type in some BASIC commands,

1617
01:31:18,054 --> 01:31:19,734
the Amiga had a real OS.

1618
01:31:19,814 --> 01:31:23,894
There were files, and you could do a
shell and all that kind of stuff.

1619
01:31:23,974 --> 01:31:26,254
To me, that was very
interesting about the Amiga.

1620
01:31:26,334 --> 01:31:28,694
I think the biggest thing of all

1621
01:31:28,774 --> 01:31:31,894
was that the Amiga had a mouse.

1622
01:31:32,814 --> 01:31:36,094
So as soon as a mouse came
along, you had the freedom

1623
01:31:36,174 --> 01:31:38,316
to make the player be able to move

1624
01:31:38,341 --> 01:31:41,278
wherever they wanted
on screen immediately,

1625
01:31:41,334 --> 01:31:42,694
and that was a huge thing.

1626
01:31:42,774 --> 01:31:45,654
And that you had these two buttons,

1627
01:31:45,734 --> 01:31:48,894
fire, hold for scroll around.

1628
01:31:48,974 --> 01:31:52,494
And they had up, down, up,
down, so that's four inputs,

1629
01:31:52,574 --> 01:31:55,414
where we were only used to
one and the four directions.

1630
01:31:55,574 --> 01:31:57,454
That was incredibly important.

1631
01:31:57,534 --> 01:31:59,334
And it's even small things
to do with the mouse.

1632
01:31:59,414 --> 01:32:03,014
I remember the PC version of
Lemmings versus the Amiga one,

1633
01:32:03,094 --> 01:32:06,134
and for me, the Amiga one always
played much, much, much better.

1634
01:32:06,214 --> 01:32:08,254
And the real reason for that

1635
01:32:08,334 --> 01:32:11,774
was, actually, the Amiga
had a hardware cursor.

1636
01:32:11,854 --> 01:32:17,254
So no matter what speed your game ran
at, which was 30 frames per second,

1637
01:32:17,334 --> 01:32:19,934
the mouse moved at 60
frames per second.

1638
01:32:20,094 --> 01:32:21,774
And on the Amiga,
that was really nice.

1639
01:32:21,854 --> 01:32:25,694
You felt like you had really fine control
for when you were clicking as well.

1640
01:32:25,774 --> 01:32:28,575
Cos it could read the
click 60 times a second.

1641
01:32:28,695 --> 01:32:32,135
The PC only had
software mouse control.

1642
01:32:32,215 --> 01:32:35,015
So it was only moving the mouse
at 30 frames per second.

1643
01:32:35,095 --> 01:32:38,015
I could only register a click
30 frames per second as well.

1644
01:32:38,095 --> 01:32:40,455
For me, those two differences
are really subtle,

1645
01:32:40,535 --> 01:32:43,243
but the fact that you could run
the game at 30 frames per second

1646
01:32:43,268 --> 01:32:44,559
but move your input at 60,

1647
01:32:44,615 --> 01:32:48,455
once again, just showed how
advanced the Amiga was.

1648
01:32:48,535 --> 01:32:50,495
And just smart things
about doing things like,

1649
01:32:50,575 --> 01:32:53,095
"We're gonna make it so we
have a hardware mouse cursor,"

1650
01:32:53,535 --> 01:32:56,535
to me, it's the small things which
just show the genius of the team.

1651
01:32:56,615 --> 01:32:59,735
There were suddenly all kinds of
games that were made possible

1652
01:32:59,815 --> 01:33:04,175
by not being restricted by just the eight
cardinal directions on a joystick.

1653
01:33:04,255 --> 01:33:06,895
The ability just to navigate
a mouse around the screen

1654
01:33:06,975 --> 01:33:09,135
just opened up all kinds
of new possibilities.

1655
01:33:25,615 --> 01:33:28,615
Up until that point, I think the
transition from 8 to 16-bit

1656
01:33:28,695 --> 01:33:32,015
was the last generational
leap that we saw

1657
01:33:32,095 --> 01:33:35,375
that really allowed new
types of games to emerge.

1658
01:33:35,455 --> 01:33:38,175
Populous would not have been
possible on the Commodore 64.

1659
01:33:38,295 --> 01:33:39,895
I don't think
The Secret of Monkey Island

1660
01:33:39,975 --> 01:33:41,695
would have been possible
on the Commodore 64.

1661
01:33:41,895 --> 01:33:45,735
It revolutionised the way that
graphics looked in computer games

1662
01:33:45,815 --> 01:33:46,855
overnight, literally.

1663
01:33:48,015 --> 01:33:51,975
And it gave us so many
options and so many new ways

1664
01:33:52,055 --> 01:33:56,655
to look at how you could
realise a scene in a game.

1665
01:33:56,815 --> 01:33:59,975
It opened up all
kinds of avenues

1666
01:34:00,055 --> 01:34:03,015
to cinematic storytelling
and cutscenes

1667
01:34:03,095 --> 01:34:05,529
and all kinds of things
that we could do in a game,

1668
01:34:05,554 --> 01:34:07,239
that you could never do before.

1669
01:34:36,255 --> 01:34:39,455
It pushed game development,

1670
01:34:39,535 --> 01:34:41,975
it give it a rocket booster,

1671
01:34:42,055 --> 01:34:45,175
it give a nitro booster, and
pushed game development.

1672
01:34:45,255 --> 01:34:48,975
It accelerated ideas, people
wanting to get to work on games,

1673
01:34:49,055 --> 01:34:50,615
what you could actually do.

1674
01:34:50,695 --> 01:34:52,375
You could actually do a
lot more with a game.

1675
01:34:52,455 --> 01:34:55,815
It was such a leap
in technology,

1676
01:34:55,895 --> 01:35:01,495
even today, I find anyone who slags
off the Amiga needs a head test.

1677
01:35:01,575 --> 01:35:05,255
Because it was such a great machine.
It really was.

1678
01:35:50,735 --> 01:35:54,215
It wasn't hardship. I did
have a lot of passion for it,

1679
01:35:54,335 --> 01:35:57,375
but you weren't surviving
on passion and coffee.

1680
01:35:57,455 --> 01:35:59,855
You could actually come in
at the start of the day,

1681
01:35:59,935 --> 01:36:03,215
have some ideas in your head and you
could realise it without being stressed.

1682
01:36:03,295 --> 01:36:04,935
And that frees up...

1683
01:36:06,055 --> 01:36:09,255
Or that sort of freedom, rather,
enables you to be more creative,

1684
01:36:09,335 --> 01:36:13,975
and to push beyond just fighting against
tools and fighting against hardware.

1685
01:36:14,055 --> 01:36:16,775
You can get to where you
expected to be pretty quickly,

1686
01:36:16,855 --> 01:36:18,295
and then you can go beyond that.

1687
01:36:18,375 --> 01:36:22,255
On an Amiga, you had your mouse,
keyboard, you'd be drawing, fantastic.

1688
01:36:23,255 --> 01:36:27,495
So you've got this bigger resolution,
more colours and a palette.

1689
01:36:27,575 --> 01:36:30,735
On the 64, you had 16
colours, that was it.

1690
01:36:30,815 --> 01:36:33,335
On an Amiga, 4,096 colours.

1691
01:36:33,735 --> 01:36:36,895
Fantastic. "What colours do I need?
I'm spoilt for choice."

1692
01:36:36,975 --> 01:36:40,215
I wanted to make as many games
for the Amiga as possible.

1693
01:36:40,735 --> 01:36:43,895
And of course, we had a lot
of our own ideas for games.

1694
01:36:43,975 --> 01:36:46,895
We even went back to
our development tools,

1695
01:36:47,375 --> 01:36:51,055
and our development tools
were, at that time, PC-based.

1696
01:36:51,135 --> 01:36:54,059
And we had a really
nice Paintbox program

1697
01:36:54,084 --> 01:36:56,519
that our developers used on the PC

1698
01:36:56,575 --> 01:36:59,615
to do the graphic art
that went into the games.

1699
01:36:59,695 --> 01:37:02,855
And Tim Mott, who's a
really brilliant guy

1700
01:37:02,935 --> 01:37:06,575
that ran the technology side of
Electronic Arts for nine years,

1701
01:37:06,655 --> 01:37:09,671
it was his idea that we
take that Paintbox product

1702
01:37:09,696 --> 01:37:12,119
and turn it into a
consumer product,

1703
01:37:12,175 --> 01:37:13,775
Deluxe Paint,

1704
01:37:13,855 --> 01:37:18,056
which was easily the most
popular painting app

1705
01:37:18,136 --> 01:37:21,016
in the mid-1980s on any machine.

1706
01:37:21,256 --> 01:37:22,816
And it was very
commercially successful

1707
01:37:22,896 --> 01:37:24,696
because it was just so much
fun to screw around with it,

1708
01:37:24,776 --> 01:37:28,136
even if you weren't an artist or had
no professional reason to be using it.

1709
01:37:28,736 --> 01:37:33,296
Deluxe Paint came out for the Amiga and
it absolutely changed our industry.

1710
01:37:33,576 --> 01:37:35,096
We'd never seen
anything like it.

1711
01:37:35,176 --> 01:37:37,814
The idea that you could
grab an area of the screen

1712
01:37:37,839 --> 01:37:39,960
and pick it up and use it as a brush

1713
01:37:40,096 --> 01:37:41,856
was, frankly, astounding.

1714
01:37:42,016 --> 01:37:45,056
Nothing close to that, technically,
had ever been achieved.

1715
01:37:45,136 --> 01:37:48,136
You were watching it, not
actually believing your eyes

1716
01:37:48,216 --> 01:37:51,136
that you were able to
paint with a real bitmap.

1717
01:37:51,216 --> 01:37:52,696
It was just stunning.

1718
01:37:52,776 --> 01:37:56,056
It knew that I wanted to be able to
select things, cut and paste things,

1719
01:37:56,136 --> 01:37:58,856
move them around, change
colours once I put them down.

1720
01:37:58,936 --> 01:38:01,656
DPaint and the Amiga
was a real change.

1721
01:38:01,736 --> 01:38:05,576
I'm using this magical device
called a mouse. Brilliant.

1722
01:38:05,656 --> 01:38:07,056
You'd move it around the
screen and it's great.

1723
01:38:07,136 --> 01:38:08,736
You'd just click and
put your colour down.

1724
01:38:08,816 --> 01:38:14,096
Yeah, so first thing I did at Bitmaps
was Amiga, DPaint, Speedball 2.

1725
01:38:14,216 --> 01:38:15,256
Deluxe Paint came out

1726
01:38:15,336 --> 01:38:18,216
about halfway through my development
time on Defender of the Crown,

1727
01:38:18,296 --> 01:38:22,576
and it was a tremendous boon being
able to do things with brushes,

1728
01:38:22,656 --> 01:38:24,776
with sweeping brushes
and things like that,

1729
01:38:24,856 --> 01:38:28,416
that you couldn't do with
Graphicraft or Aegis Images.

1730
01:38:28,896 --> 01:38:34,336
You could do arcs and circles and
all kinds of interesting things.

1731
01:38:34,416 --> 01:38:38,376
You could tint, all kinds of effects
that you couldn't do before.

1732
01:38:38,456 --> 01:38:42,976
So that really speeded things
up during the development

1733
01:38:43,056 --> 01:38:44,536
and made things a lot easier.

1734
01:38:44,616 --> 01:38:46,056
And one of the great things
about Deluxe Paint was,

1735
01:38:46,136 --> 01:38:48,776
it was one of the first-ever packages
that had built-in animation.

1736
01:38:48,856 --> 01:38:52,536
You could set on
just a few frames,

1737
01:38:52,616 --> 01:38:54,856
make this little
character animate,

1738
01:38:54,936 --> 01:38:58,616
pick it up as a brush and then just
play the animation and play the brush.

1739
01:38:58,696 --> 01:39:01,056
So that it just put down
reams of these sprites.

1740
01:39:01,136 --> 01:39:04,576
And then, cos I was bored, I drew a
gun at the other end shooting them.

1741
01:39:04,656 --> 01:39:07,856
And that's where you start going, "Well,
that's funny, there's a game in that."

1742
01:39:07,936 --> 01:39:10,096
They give you DPaint,
you can export files,

1743
01:39:10,176 --> 01:39:13,016
you can incorporate those
into programs you're coding.

1744
01:39:13,096 --> 01:39:16,216
And it accelerates the rate of
development and productivity

1745
01:39:16,296 --> 01:39:19,016
of people who want to get into the
machine to use it for something.

1746
01:39:19,136 --> 01:39:24,896
It allowed me, who couldn't
draw to save his life,

1747
01:39:24,976 --> 01:39:27,856
allowed me to do
things on the screen,

1748
01:39:27,936 --> 01:39:31,576
and do them immediately, and
see the results immediately.

1749
01:39:31,696 --> 01:39:33,976
What Deluxe Paint allowed

1750
01:39:34,056 --> 01:39:37,976
was non-experts,
non-computer-experts,

1751
01:39:38,056 --> 01:39:41,616
people whose primary focus
was art and not technology,

1752
01:39:41,696 --> 01:39:44,136
to enter the domain of
video games creation.

1753
01:39:44,336 --> 01:39:45,976
It was a huge jump

1754
01:39:46,056 --> 01:39:49,456
moving from graphics on the
Commodore 64 to graphics on the Amiga.

1755
01:39:49,536 --> 01:39:52,491
It was like we'd missed
out one generation

1756
01:39:52,516 --> 01:39:54,920
and jumped to the next generation.

1757
01:39:55,016 --> 01:39:56,776
And it was fantastic.

1758
01:39:57,016 --> 01:39:59,296
It was a very powerful
piece of software,

1759
01:39:59,376 --> 01:40:01,767
and a lot of the effects you
see in modern-day software,

1760
01:40:01,792 --> 01:40:02,840
Photoshop and so on,

1761
01:40:02,896 --> 01:40:07,296
some of those effects appeared
first on Deluxe Paint.

1762
01:40:07,376 --> 01:40:11,176
So that just became the
ubiquitous piece of software

1763
01:40:11,256 --> 01:40:13,656
that we all used for
creating our sprites.

1764
01:40:13,816 --> 01:40:15,576
I loved the graphics
of the Amiga

1765
01:40:15,656 --> 01:40:18,296
for the games, for everything,
for the graphical tools,

1766
01:40:18,376 --> 01:40:23,576
but I got very caught up in the sound.
I absolutely loved the sound.

1767
01:40:55,816 --> 01:40:58,216
At the most basic level,
you had sampling.

1768
01:40:58,296 --> 01:41:02,256
Before that, it had all been synthesis,
albeit quite good synthesis,

1769
01:41:02,336 --> 01:41:04,056
on, say, the Commodore 64.

1770
01:41:04,136 --> 01:41:05,256
So, the Amiga was sampling.

1771
01:41:05,336 --> 01:41:10,856
And the Amiga had four sampling
voices, with 8-bit resolution,

1772
01:41:10,936 --> 01:41:13,136
and a lot more
memory, obviously.

1773
01:41:13,216 --> 01:41:16,856
So it opened up a new whole
way of creative freedom.

1774
01:41:16,936 --> 01:41:20,056
The only other alternative to
audio engineer on the Amiga

1775
01:41:20,136 --> 01:41:24,616
would be something like the
Akai S900 or S950 samplers,

1776
01:41:24,696 --> 01:41:26,376
or, of course, you
had the Fairlight.

1777
01:41:26,456 --> 01:41:29,496
Both of them cost thousands
of pounds at the time.

1778
01:41:29,576 --> 01:41:33,296
So, to buy an Amiga, you were
not only saving a lot of money,

1779
01:41:33,376 --> 01:41:38,216
it was enabling you to do things you
couldn't otherwise even dream of.

1780
01:41:38,416 --> 01:41:41,347
It was really bringing
professional sampling technology

1781
01:41:41,372 --> 01:41:43,360
into the hands of
everyday users.

1782
01:41:49,336 --> 01:41:53,016
Whenever I bought a new CD, I would
always sample it from beginning to end.

1783
01:41:53,096 --> 01:41:55,616
Whenever there was one
instrument exposed...

1784
01:41:55,696 --> 01:41:59,776
"The snare drum right there is exposed.
Shit, let's sample it."

1785
01:41:59,856 --> 01:42:04,217
So I would use AudioMaster to sample it,
and then I would put it in Soundtracker.

1786
01:42:04,817 --> 01:42:06,937
And I would be able to
use that snare drum.

1787
01:42:07,217 --> 01:42:10,177
Just like DJs use samplers
and all this kind of stuff.

1788
01:42:24,057 --> 01:42:26,657
We would put drums in
one of the channels,

1789
01:42:26,737 --> 01:42:29,977
the bass in another channel,
the melody in the third channel,

1790
01:42:30,057 --> 01:42:33,401
and even then, you'd have a
fourth channel for sprinkles

1791
01:42:33,426 --> 01:42:35,361
to enrich your arrangements.

1792
01:42:41,457 --> 01:42:44,457
You could not only sample drum sounds

1793
01:42:44,537 --> 01:42:47,617
and, essentially, any instrument
that you can think of,

1794
01:42:48,057 --> 01:42:49,857
but you could also sample chords.

1795
01:42:50,337 --> 01:42:54,897
So you could enhance the four channels
into more, because you would just...

1796
01:42:54,977 --> 01:42:59,297
Major chord, minor chord, and then
play that over different keys,

1797
01:42:59,377 --> 01:43:04,497
and you already have something with
one voice that sounds a lot bigger.

1798
01:43:13,617 --> 01:43:16,417
The Amiga sound chip was
solely sample-based.

1799
01:43:16,817 --> 01:43:21,097
However, you can also
sample small waveforms.

1800
01:43:21,177 --> 01:43:24,377
So, for instance, composers like
David Whittaker would do this a lot.

1801
01:43:24,737 --> 01:43:29,177
They would sample a series of square
waveforms with different widths to them

1802
01:43:29,257 --> 01:43:30,577
and then sequence them together.

1803
01:43:30,657 --> 01:43:33,577
And they could create quite rich
synthesised sounds like that.

1804
01:43:44,497 --> 01:43:48,297
What it facilitated was not
just people like Rob Hubbard,

1805
01:43:48,377 --> 01:43:50,697
who was a musician first
and a programmer second,

1806
01:43:50,777 --> 01:43:52,257
and not just people like me,

1807
01:43:52,337 --> 01:43:54,777
who is a programmer first
and a musician second.

1808
01:43:54,857 --> 01:43:56,817
But it allowed people who
weren't programmers at all,

1809
01:43:56,897 --> 01:43:58,697
had no programming ability,

1810
01:43:58,777 --> 01:44:03,377
to use an application like a tracker
to create amazing original works.

1811
01:44:03,457 --> 01:44:06,097
Soundtracker and ProTracker
and NoiseTracker,

1812
01:44:06,177 --> 01:44:07,937
that series of
programs, came out.

1813
01:44:08,017 --> 01:44:11,457
It enabled people who weren't
really educated musicians,

1814
01:44:11,537 --> 01:44:13,977
they couldn't read notes,
couldn't read sheet music,

1815
01:44:14,057 --> 01:44:15,817
enabled them to write music.

1816
01:44:16,017 --> 01:44:18,977
Because all they had to do was
put the notes in patterns,

1817
01:44:19,057 --> 01:44:22,857
which they could understand so
much easier than sheet music.

1818
01:44:22,937 --> 01:44:26,977
So it lowered the threshold for new
people to come in and create music.

1819
01:44:27,057 --> 01:44:29,737
The Soundtracker program
from Karsten Obarski

1820
01:44:29,817 --> 01:44:31,937
was a revolutionary
program for me.

1821
01:44:32,257 --> 01:44:35,097
You could actually control
the sound channels proper.

1822
01:44:35,177 --> 01:44:37,070
And do some tricks and hacks

1823
01:44:37,095 --> 01:44:40,881
just to make it sound bigger
than it actually was.

1824
01:44:40,937 --> 01:44:45,657
Because you had frame-by-frame
control of the sounds,

1825
01:44:45,737 --> 01:44:48,577
which was pretty
cool in those days.

1826
01:44:52,017 --> 01:44:56,137
With Rocket Ranger, the fist fight against
the Nazi guard was not a lot of fun.

1827
01:44:56,217 --> 01:45:00,097
But we had a sound guy, and
he stayed up late one night

1828
01:45:00,177 --> 01:45:03,097
and recorded sounds from
an old John Wayne movie,

1829
01:45:03,177 --> 01:45:05,497
digitised them and put
them into the game.

1830
01:45:05,577 --> 01:45:08,097
And all of a sudden, you'd
hit that Nazi guard

1831
01:45:08,177 --> 01:45:11,337
and you would hear something that
sounded like a John Wayne movie.

1832
01:45:11,417 --> 01:45:12,857
And it felt like you
were in the movie.

1833
01:45:12,937 --> 01:45:17,017
The sound effect made that whole
sequence so much more fun to play.

1834
01:45:21,617 --> 01:45:25,337
I think this was probably
one of the key moments

1835
01:45:25,417 --> 01:45:30,417
when the music started to really lean
in as a part of the valuable content.

1836
01:45:30,497 --> 01:45:33,897
Now, music in previous games, I'm not,
by any means, saying wasn't good.

1837
01:45:33,977 --> 01:45:36,817
I used to love a lot
of Commodore 64 music.

1838
01:45:36,897 --> 01:45:40,897
But what I'm saying is, on the hardware
level, it just became a point where,

1839
01:45:40,977 --> 01:45:44,617
"We've got to really put a lot of
attention on the music as well."

1840
01:45:44,697 --> 01:45:45,937
I remember Starglider.

1841
01:45:46,017 --> 01:45:47,257
Starglider

1842
01:45:47,337 --> 01:45:48,777
Yeah, we're singing
now, aren't we?

1843
01:45:48,977 --> 01:45:52,897
Starglider

1844
01:45:54,657 --> 01:45:57,017
I remember Starglider
having that sample,

1845
01:45:57,137 --> 01:46:00,497
which actually used a huge amount of
memory, but just for that one thing.

1846
01:46:00,577 --> 01:46:02,977
But it was very cool, very
impactful at the time.

1847
01:46:03,057 --> 01:46:05,817
By Rainbird

1848
01:46:05,897 --> 01:46:09,977
Here's just another example of the extra
memory and the faster processing power,

1849
01:46:10,057 --> 01:46:14,417
just allows you to make quite a leap up
in the quality of what you're doing.

1850
01:46:14,497 --> 01:46:20,017
It was amazing. To us, it
sounded full, powerful, varied.

1851
01:46:20,097 --> 01:46:22,417
You could do all
sorts of sounds.

1852
01:46:22,497 --> 01:46:25,857
From the techno music,
blippity-blop stuff,

1853
01:46:25,937 --> 01:46:29,377
to full arrangements, sampled
guitars, everything.

1854
01:46:29,457 --> 01:46:30,777
It was amazing.

1855
01:46:30,857 --> 01:46:35,417
And so, it was an introduction
into the world of sampling.

1856
01:46:35,497 --> 01:46:40,257
And I think that's really something that
Amiga can take a lot of credit for.

1857
01:46:40,337 --> 01:46:45,577
The sampling phenomenon really, for
me at least, started with the Amiga.

1858
01:46:45,657 --> 01:46:50,258
For me, it was the dream
of realising my music

1859
01:46:50,338 --> 01:46:53,138
in the way I had it in my head.

1860
01:46:53,698 --> 01:46:57,178
That was possible finally
with the Commodore Amiga.

1861
01:47:12,978 --> 01:47:17,338
One of the interesting developments
from launching the Amiga

1862
01:47:17,418 --> 01:47:22,098
and all the marketing activities that we
did was the growth in the pirate market.

1863
01:47:22,178 --> 01:47:24,258
Well, piracy, of course,
was a major problem,

1864
01:47:24,338 --> 01:47:26,658
and it's what drove me out
of the Commodore 64 market

1865
01:47:26,738 --> 01:47:28,978
and into the Amiga, initially.

1866
01:47:29,338 --> 01:47:32,258
And then became very
widespread on the Amiga.

1867
01:47:32,338 --> 01:47:36,098
In Germany, software piracy,

1868
01:47:36,178 --> 01:47:38,578
was rampant, absolutely rampant.

1869
01:47:38,658 --> 01:47:41,298
And I don't know why, but
it's quite the phenomenon

1870
01:47:41,378 --> 01:47:43,341
that Germans and, I believe,

1871
01:47:43,366 --> 01:47:47,082
Scandinavians tend to not
want to buy software.

1872
01:47:47,498 --> 01:47:49,498
And I never understood why.

1873
01:47:49,898 --> 01:47:54,738
So that means I got into pirated
games, pretty big time.

1874
01:47:54,818 --> 01:47:59,618
The people who were a bit more
clever, not only pirated games,

1875
01:47:59,698 --> 01:48:04,498
but they also programmed delicious
graphical and sound intros.

1876
01:48:04,578 --> 01:48:09,098
The cracktros, originally, were
this rebellious way of proving

1877
01:48:09,178 --> 01:48:10,498
how good you were at programming

1878
01:48:10,578 --> 01:48:13,018
and how good you were
at making cool effects.

1879
01:48:13,098 --> 01:48:17,218
Which you then put right in front
of your newest pirated game.

1880
01:48:18,218 --> 01:48:21,338
So, that's how pretty much
everybody in Europe started out.

1881
01:48:24,658 --> 01:48:28,018
This is going to be a
very, very big hit.

1882
01:48:28,098 --> 01:48:30,778
I think they did it mostly
just because they could,

1883
01:48:30,858 --> 01:48:33,978
as a challenge to themselves
and to the other hackers that,

1884
01:48:34,058 --> 01:48:35,938
"Who can do this first?
And who can do it right?"

1885
01:48:36,018 --> 01:48:38,978
They used the Amiga a lot more

1886
01:48:39,058 --> 01:48:43,138
and much more interestingly than
the games that then followed

1887
01:48:43,218 --> 01:48:47,018
after you clicked the left mouse
button and the actual game loaded.

1888
01:48:47,098 --> 01:48:51,378
And eventually it developed into this
competitive, creative demo scene,

1889
01:48:51,458 --> 01:48:54,298
where people were actually
just saying "Screw the games.

1890
01:48:54,378 --> 01:48:57,058
"We just want to make cool
effects and cool visuals."

1891
01:49:31,418 --> 01:49:33,338
Talking away

1892
01:49:34,218 --> 01:49:36,618
I don't know what I'm to say

1893
01:49:36,698 --> 01:49:39,378
I'll say it anyway

1894
01:49:39,658 --> 01:49:43,018
Today's another day to find you

1895
01:49:43,098 --> 01:49:45,818
Shying away

1896
01:49:45,898 --> 01:49:48,458
I'll be coming for
your love, OK?

1897
01:49:48,538 --> 01:49:52,658
Take on me

1898
01:49:52,738 --> 01:49:54,138
Take on me

1899
01:49:54,218 --> 01:49:58,378
Take me on

1900
01:49:58,458 --> 01:49:59,698
Take on me

1901
01:49:59,778 --> 01:50:04,058
I'll be gone

1902
01:50:04,138 --> 01:50:06,898
In a day or two

1903
01:50:06,978 --> 01:50:09,778
They just did amazing
things with the technology.

1904
01:50:09,858 --> 01:50:11,298
Some of the demos,

1905
01:50:11,378 --> 01:50:15,658
where you'd have spinning 3D objects
and incredible artwork in them,

1906
01:50:15,738 --> 01:50:19,498
is just an excellent creation that
these programmers were making.

1907
01:50:22,778 --> 01:50:27,698
The roots of the demo scene was in
hundreds of thousands of bedrooms

1908
01:50:28,018 --> 01:50:31,658
and the guys sitting on their
computers, making stuff.

1909
01:50:31,738 --> 01:50:34,458
And it was a wonderful thing unlike
the later video games consoles

1910
01:50:34,538 --> 01:50:37,098
that you could program
them yourself at home.

1911
01:50:37,178 --> 01:50:38,538
So it really
encouraged creativity.

1912
01:50:38,618 --> 01:50:40,818
Now, whether you were inspired

1913
01:50:40,898 --> 01:50:44,218
to try and make a demo that was a
bit like another demo you'd seen,

1914
01:50:44,298 --> 01:50:46,618
or make a game that was a
bit like a game you'd seen,

1915
01:50:46,698 --> 01:50:48,338
it didn't really make
a lot of difference.

1916
01:50:48,418 --> 01:50:51,458
It was the fact that it was
possible for you to do it yourself

1917
01:50:51,538 --> 01:50:53,818
and you had this source of
inspiration all around.

1918
01:50:53,898 --> 01:50:56,738
These guys out in Finland and Norway
and these guys in Scandinavia

1919
01:50:56,818 --> 01:51:00,538
are doing these insane demos that I think
were really, really pushing the envelope

1920
01:51:00,618 --> 01:51:02,658
of what the Amiga
was capable of.

1921
01:51:02,738 --> 01:51:06,538
I quite often saw the
Fred Fish disks.

1922
01:51:06,618 --> 01:51:07,924
They weren't so much demos,

1923
01:51:07,949 --> 01:51:11,042
they were more utilities and
tools and all the rest of it,

1924
01:51:11,098 --> 01:51:13,418
which he used to build
things and they were great.

1925
01:51:13,498 --> 01:51:17,018
They were fantastic for learning
more about the Amiga and coding

1926
01:51:17,098 --> 01:51:18,898
and other things
that you could do

1927
01:51:18,978 --> 01:51:22,698
and other aspects to the
actual computer itself.

1928
01:51:22,778 --> 01:51:25,834
Whereas, I think in Europe
there was more of a clamour

1929
01:51:25,859 --> 01:51:27,802
for the demos and the graphics

1930
01:51:27,858 --> 01:51:29,978
and the audio, really, and the
entertainment side of it.

1931
01:51:30,418 --> 01:51:33,098
We had public domain software.

1932
01:51:33,178 --> 01:51:34,618
That was just
distributed by disk.

1933
01:51:34,698 --> 01:51:37,539
We didn't have the World Wide Web. We
didn't have any of that sort of thing.

1934
01:51:37,619 --> 01:51:41,939
So, it was literally people just buying
it via mail order and getting them home.

1935
01:51:42,179 --> 01:51:46,139
The first time you ever see a picture
that you've done and submitted it,

1936
01:51:46,219 --> 01:51:48,619
and seeing it in a
gallery, in a magazine,

1937
01:51:48,699 --> 01:51:51,539
that was just my proudest day.

1938
01:51:51,619 --> 01:51:52,819
So I just kept on doing it.

1939
01:51:52,899 --> 01:51:54,739
I couldn't get it
out there enough.

1940
01:51:55,739 --> 01:52:00,179
I guess that just got noticed and
started getting people asking

1941
01:52:00,259 --> 01:52:03,379
if I could do pictures
for their whatever.

1942
01:52:03,459 --> 01:52:04,241
And, in all frankness,

1943
01:52:04,266 --> 01:52:06,363
I didn't even know what the
demo scene was back then.

1944
01:52:06,619 --> 01:52:08,939
The demo scene was a
place to be creative.

1945
01:52:09,139 --> 01:52:11,259
There was just that.

1946
01:52:11,339 --> 01:52:13,499
Creativity, that's
what it was all about.

1947
01:52:13,579 --> 01:52:16,299
There's was no, "But we
have to finish this game,"

1948
01:52:16,379 --> 01:52:20,779
or, "This music has to fit
this scene in a movie,"

1949
01:52:20,859 --> 01:52:23,539
or, "It has to fit that
scene in a TV show,"

1950
01:52:23,619 --> 01:52:25,499
or, "It has to fit
this scene in a game."

1951
01:52:26,059 --> 01:52:27,739
It was whatever we
wanted it to be.

1952
01:52:27,819 --> 01:52:32,299
The first demo, I was very much
just proving myself as a programmer

1953
01:52:32,379 --> 01:52:37,099
and trying to make a first demo
that was really well constructed.

1954
01:52:37,179 --> 01:52:39,824
I suppose one way to look at it
is it's much like graffiti art,

1955
01:52:39,849 --> 01:52:40,923
quality graffiti art.

1956
01:52:40,979 --> 01:52:43,419
That, to me, is what it is
for the games industry.

1957
01:52:43,499 --> 01:52:46,659
That is like the graffiti
artists, but they're using demos.

1958
01:52:46,739 --> 01:52:48,979
It was absolutely stunning.
It was breathtaking,

1959
01:52:49,059 --> 01:52:50,739
some of the stuff they
would come out with.

1960
01:52:50,819 --> 01:52:53,102
And yet, a lot of them
weren't that bothered

1961
01:52:53,127 --> 01:52:55,003
about being commercially
successful.

1962
01:52:55,059 --> 01:52:57,499
They wouldn't want to
turn it into a game.

1963
01:52:58,059 --> 01:53:02,459
They just wanted to be known by a funny
name with an avatar or something

1964
01:53:02,539 --> 01:53:04,459
and be famous for
doing that demo.

1965
01:53:04,859 --> 01:53:06,859
We called ourselves IFF,

1966
01:53:06,939 --> 01:53:10,499
which was supposed to be short for
International Fart Federation.

1967
01:53:11,619 --> 01:53:14,659
We dropped that name
after maybe half a year

1968
01:53:14,739 --> 01:53:18,539
and decided to call us Crusaders
instead, after a bit of a vote.

1969
01:53:18,619 --> 01:53:22,459
One of the big things about the
demo scene versus games is that

1970
01:53:22,539 --> 01:53:27,379
creating a demo certainly didn't have
the complexities and difficulties

1971
01:53:27,459 --> 01:53:29,446
of actually building a game
that had to stand there

1972
01:53:29,471 --> 01:53:30,883
and not crash and anything else.

1973
01:53:31,339 --> 01:53:33,219
Most demos don't have AI,

1974
01:53:33,299 --> 01:53:36,619
they don't have considerations
about frameworks for the player

1975
01:53:36,699 --> 01:53:38,139
and everything else.

1976
01:53:38,219 --> 01:53:40,631
So, it's a completely different
thing that you're building

1977
01:53:40,656 --> 01:53:41,963
when you're building a demo

1978
01:53:42,019 --> 01:53:44,019
and you're building a game.

1979
01:53:44,099 --> 01:53:46,099
And, you know, you have the
luxury of irresponsibility.

1980
01:53:46,179 --> 01:53:48,299
They were all great sales
pieces for the Amiga.

1981
01:53:48,379 --> 01:53:51,459
If you had friends come over,
they wanted to see your Amiga,

1982
01:53:51,539 --> 01:53:52,819
you would often not
show them the games,

1983
01:53:52,899 --> 01:53:54,659
or not as much as you would
show them the demos.

1984
01:53:55,019 --> 01:53:57,459
Because they are of course completely
unencumbered by having to build

1985
01:53:57,539 --> 01:53:59,979
any kind of game or gameplay,

1986
01:54:00,059 --> 01:54:05,419
they could just go crazy with ray tracing
graphics and raster-based graphics

1987
01:54:05,499 --> 01:54:06,659
that they were able to create.

1988
01:54:06,979 --> 01:54:09,259
I remember the famous scrolling messages

1989
01:54:09,284 --> 01:54:11,563
that were constant shout outs to

1990
01:54:11,619 --> 01:54:15,179
various other cracking crews
around Scandinavia and Europe.

1991
01:54:15,259 --> 01:54:17,699
It was, "Hey, we
send our regards

1992
01:54:17,779 --> 01:54:21,739
"to these guys, these crews,
or these groups that we like."

1993
01:54:22,219 --> 01:54:24,259
Because we exchange stuff with
them or get demos with them.

1994
01:54:24,339 --> 01:54:28,739
And we said hey to these guys, which
made no sense at the time, really,

1995
01:54:28,819 --> 01:54:30,139
or now, when you look at it.

1996
01:54:30,339 --> 01:54:36,499
People would poke fun at each other,
but it was never anything serious.

1997
01:54:36,619 --> 01:54:42,619
It was all done in the spirit of the
demo scene, is how I like to put it.

1998
01:54:42,699 --> 01:54:47,299
The first demo I remember is, at
no surprise, is the Sodan demo,

1999
01:54:48,059 --> 01:54:50,506
which kind of showed a
lot of Amiga features

2000
01:54:50,531 --> 01:54:52,923
like dual-playfield and
everything that was

2001
01:54:52,979 --> 01:54:55,819
going on in that demo and
drawing lines, 3D graphics,

2002
01:54:55,899 --> 01:54:57,899
and it kind of blew me away
that they could do it,

2003
01:54:57,979 --> 01:55:00,219
because I hadn't got
that far at that point,

2004
01:55:00,299 --> 01:55:03,939
and it just got me even more interested
and wanted to learn more about

2005
01:55:04,019 --> 01:55:06,779
the Amiga chipset, so I could
do those things as well.

2006
01:55:07,139 --> 01:55:12,259
Kefrens and the Rebels, that made
some demos that inspired me.

2007
01:55:12,739 --> 01:55:16,539
Later on it would be Scoopex
and it would be Red Sector

2008
01:55:16,619 --> 01:55:20,179
and also, especially,
Phenomena from Sweden.

2009
01:55:20,699 --> 01:55:25,099
They had some amazing programmers
and especially musicians.

2010
01:55:25,419 --> 01:55:30,859
The guys from Crionics, working
with The Silents, Denmark,

2011
01:55:31,099 --> 01:55:35,379
on Hardwired, which was also one of
those demos that once it got put up

2012
01:55:35,459 --> 01:55:41,019
kind of moved the bar to a whole
different level for what people

2013
01:55:41,099 --> 01:55:43,219
now expected a demo to be.

2014
01:55:44,099 --> 01:55:48,459
The Budbrain Megademos, they were
great because they were very funny.

2015
01:55:48,819 --> 01:55:51,539
And there was a little bit
of a story to it as well.

2016
01:56:01,739 --> 01:56:02,739
Yo, check this out.

2017
01:56:11,139 --> 01:56:15,019
You know, my favourite demo of all
time is Mental Hangover by Scoopex.

2018
01:56:17,259 --> 01:56:21,699
You know, it was talking all about
drinking and being hungover,

2019
01:56:21,779 --> 01:56:24,459
and it had so much
attitude, you know?

2020
01:56:24,539 --> 01:56:28,460
We were kids, and we
expressed what we felt.

2021
01:56:28,540 --> 01:56:30,540
And that's what we were
feeling at the time.

2022
01:56:30,620 --> 01:56:32,820
We weren't feeling, "Let's
go make some money."

2023
01:56:32,900 --> 01:56:38,220
It was more about party or trying
to out-program each other.

2024
01:56:38,580 --> 01:56:43,740
The demos gave me freedom to actually
explore any side of myself, in composing.

2025
01:56:43,820 --> 01:56:47,820
Because you didn't have any
strict guidelines to hold on to.

2026
01:56:47,900 --> 01:56:52,460
It was actually a great time to learn,
you know, and explore yourself.

2027
01:56:58,020 --> 01:57:00,245
I was really excited about doing music

2028
01:57:00,270 --> 01:57:02,724
that somebody wanted
to use for something.

2029
01:57:02,780 --> 01:57:06,820
One this is to make a
cool-sounding music track,

2030
01:57:06,900 --> 01:57:11,140
but then to have that music track
put to some visual effects,

2031
01:57:11,220 --> 01:57:13,500
it makes the music sound
a lot cooler as well.

2032
01:57:13,980 --> 01:57:16,020
And it makes the visual
effects look better

2033
01:57:16,045 --> 01:57:18,084
when you add some cool
music to go with it.

2034
01:57:18,140 --> 01:57:20,860
So it's like they
enrich each other.

2035
01:57:26,020 --> 01:57:28,780
You could say that
there is a music style

2036
01:57:28,860 --> 01:57:31,380
that kind of is a
demo-scene music style.

2037
01:57:31,580 --> 01:57:34,420
I have not really
explored that scene much.

2038
01:57:34,500 --> 01:57:39,580
I was more interested in trying
to see how far I could push music

2039
01:57:39,660 --> 01:57:42,420
and mood, and to what
extremes I could push it.

2040
01:57:42,500 --> 01:57:49,420
And I think that's what I take
out and take with me to this day

2041
01:57:49,500 --> 01:57:54,340
try to create something you haven't
necessarily heard or try to innovate.

2042
01:57:54,420 --> 01:57:56,500
And do it as best I can.

2043
01:57:58,100 --> 01:57:59,820
Take four red capsules.

2044
01:57:59,900 --> 01:58:01,820
In 10 minutes, take two more.

2045
01:58:03,340 --> 01:58:06,820
The next step for me was
something called the demo party.

2046
01:58:07,300 --> 01:58:10,100
It was also called
the copy party,

2047
01:58:10,180 --> 01:58:13,260
because people went there to share
demos and share stuff that they had,

2048
01:58:13,340 --> 01:58:16,300
and also, let's be honest,

2049
01:58:16,380 --> 01:58:17,540
they went to copy games.

2050
01:58:17,620 --> 01:58:20,900
You basically rented a classroom
or two in schools to...

2051
01:58:20,980 --> 01:58:24,300
And it evolved from there, really,
it got bigger and bigger, obviously,

2052
01:58:24,740 --> 01:58:25,940
but at that time, that was it,

2053
01:58:25,965 --> 01:58:27,964
and it was just Commodore
Amigas everywhere.

2054
01:58:28,660 --> 01:58:34,420
The smell, the pungent smell,
almost like a mist in there.

2055
01:58:34,900 --> 01:58:39,380
It was like sweat and agony, and it's
just rows of computers everywhere.

2056
01:58:39,460 --> 01:58:41,064
We'd bring our sleeping bags

2057
01:58:41,089 --> 01:58:44,524
and stay over maybe something
like Saturday to Sunday.

2058
01:58:44,780 --> 01:58:46,580
There would be hundreds
of people there.

2059
01:58:46,660 --> 01:58:49,700
All swapping disks, copying
each other's stuff.

2060
01:58:49,860 --> 01:58:54,180
This was a way for people
that have been sending disks

2061
01:58:54,340 --> 01:58:56,900
and stuff like that to
actually meet in person.

2062
01:58:57,260 --> 01:58:59,940
And hang out, create
stuff together.

2063
01:59:00,260 --> 01:59:03,540
I remember the very first
demo party that we went to.

2064
01:59:03,620 --> 01:59:05,220
We called it a copy
party at the time.

2065
01:59:05,300 --> 01:59:09,940
There were, I don't know, 300,
400, 500 youths in a school.

2066
01:59:10,980 --> 01:59:14,580
And police showed up and
there was total panic,

2067
01:59:14,660 --> 01:59:16,220
there were people
jumping out windows.

2068
01:59:16,700 --> 01:59:18,140
Throwing disks out windows.

2069
01:59:18,780 --> 01:59:21,180
Crashing floppy disks
with their feet.

2070
01:59:21,260 --> 01:59:23,820
Trying to destroy evidence
of copying and stuff.

2071
01:59:23,940 --> 01:59:28,140
We were at one of my parties. Suddenly
the cops... Two cops show up.

2072
01:59:28,780 --> 01:59:33,140
And they say, "We hear you guys
have cracked games here and stuff".

2073
01:59:33,300 --> 01:59:35,820
And you know, the latest
games and stuff like that.

2074
01:59:35,900 --> 01:59:37,980
We're like, "It
might be possible."

2075
01:59:38,500 --> 01:59:42,460
They said, "So if I give you five disks,
can you put some of the latest games

2076
01:59:42,540 --> 01:59:44,220
"on there for me?"

2077
01:59:44,300 --> 01:59:46,740
I go, "I don't know, sure."

2078
01:59:46,900 --> 01:59:50,260
So the cop hands
me a pack of disks

2079
01:59:50,420 --> 01:59:52,100
and says, "I'll be
back in two hours.

2080
01:59:52,180 --> 01:59:55,140
"I would be grateful if you had some of
the latest games for my son on them."

2081
01:59:55,940 --> 01:59:58,180
Police still came and closed
down a lot of these parties.

2082
01:59:58,260 --> 02:00:00,900
What can you do, you know?

2083
02:00:01,020 --> 02:00:06,180
But that was the nature of it,
there was something a little bit

2084
02:00:06,540 --> 02:00:09,180
crazy about it, and we
weren't supposed to do it,

2085
02:00:09,340 --> 02:00:12,540
and we were often told that
these things could be shut down

2086
02:00:12,620 --> 02:00:15,820
by the police, and you know, don't
worry, just if it happens, it happens.

2087
02:00:16,060 --> 02:00:19,660
Somebody took a dump in some
other guy's sleeping bag.

2088
02:00:19,740 --> 02:00:22,100
He got scrubbed down.
Oh, my God.

2089
02:00:29,300 --> 02:00:32,580
There was definitely a big competitive
aspect to the demo scene.

2090
02:00:32,660 --> 02:00:36,340
I mean, the demo parties always had a
demo competition at the very end of it.

2091
02:00:36,780 --> 02:00:39,540
Where people showed off the latest
stuff that they'd been working on

2092
02:00:39,620 --> 02:00:40,620
for months.

2093
02:00:40,700 --> 02:00:44,860
Being number one, being most revered
was very much sought after.

2094
02:00:44,940 --> 02:00:47,500
Every group wanted
to be number one.

2095
02:00:47,660 --> 02:00:50,940
People would fill in a voting
form, send it to an address,

2096
02:00:51,020 --> 02:00:53,540
all of the information
was collated.

2097
02:00:53,620 --> 02:00:56,460
And the results were published
in the form of a demo

2098
02:00:56,780 --> 02:01:00,700
every month or two months, and this
was called the Crusaders Eurochart.

2099
02:01:01,100 --> 02:01:02,620
This was the spirit
of the demo scene.

2100
02:01:02,700 --> 02:01:05,500
Always trying to outdo each
other, always trying to innovate.

2101
02:01:05,700 --> 02:01:06,700
Always trying to
push things forward.

2102
02:01:06,900 --> 02:01:09,820
The technical achievements
these guys could accomplish

2103
02:01:09,900 --> 02:01:11,980
were like,
"How do they do that?"

2104
02:01:12,060 --> 02:01:13,591
Because we're developers,

2105
02:01:13,616 --> 02:01:17,165
and how do we incorporate
those effects into a game?

2106
02:01:17,261 --> 02:01:18,781
Can we use those
effects in a game?

2107
02:01:18,861 --> 02:01:21,221
So I think there was an
element of experimentation

2108
02:01:21,341 --> 02:01:23,501
that these guys did
to push the hardware.

2109
02:01:23,861 --> 02:01:25,781
To show other people
what you could do.

2110
02:01:27,141 --> 02:01:31,101
I think the games industry was
improved by the demo scene

2111
02:01:31,181 --> 02:01:33,901
for the simple reason that you
did see a lot of effects,

2112
02:01:33,981 --> 02:01:36,181
and you see a lot of techniques

2113
02:01:36,261 --> 02:01:40,461
that you probably wouldn't have come
up with unless you got inspired

2114
02:01:40,541 --> 02:01:41,541
from someone else doing it.

2115
02:01:42,061 --> 02:01:47,461
It's an interesting point to go
back and think about that era

2116
02:01:47,541 --> 02:01:49,581
in gaming history,
that Amiga era.

2117
02:01:49,661 --> 02:01:52,341
In that it did feel
very, very provincial.

2118
02:01:52,821 --> 02:01:56,381
And there was a very big difference
between what was happening in the UK

2119
02:01:56,461 --> 02:02:00,061
and in Europe, and what was
happening over in the USA.

2120
02:02:00,141 --> 02:02:02,901
And by the time we had
transitioned on to the Amiga,

2121
02:02:02,981 --> 02:02:05,701
America had really become
much more interested

2122
02:02:05,781 --> 02:02:07,421
in the Super Nintendo,

2123
02:02:07,501 --> 02:02:09,661
and the Sega Mega Drive.

2124
02:02:09,741 --> 02:02:11,261
Talk to an American
and ask them,

2125
02:02:11,341 --> 02:02:13,501
"What do you remember
about the 16-bit era?"

2126
02:02:13,781 --> 02:02:15,661
And they will say, "I
remember the Sega Genesis,"

2127
02:02:15,741 --> 02:02:17,301
"I remember the Super Nintendo."

2128
02:02:17,381 --> 02:02:20,581
If you ask a Brit what they
remember of the 16-bit era,

2129
02:02:20,661 --> 02:02:24,101
they will talk to you about the
Commodore Amiga, and the Atari ST.

2130
02:02:24,181 --> 02:02:28,101
So we had these two completely
different versions of the 16-bit era

2131
02:02:28,181 --> 02:02:29,581
on either side of the Atlantic.

2132
02:02:29,701 --> 02:02:33,621
And that's part of why, I think so many
of us, especially in Europe and in the UK

2133
02:02:33,701 --> 02:02:36,141
romanticise the
Amiga generation.

2134
02:02:36,261 --> 02:02:40,061
It's because it was the last time
that the games and the community

2135
02:02:40,141 --> 02:02:42,181
felt unique to us.

2136
02:02:42,261 --> 02:02:45,261
Before the global explosion
of gaming popularity

2137
02:02:45,341 --> 02:02:46,701
kind of brought
everyone into the mix.

2138
02:03:14,061 --> 02:03:16,181
When the Amiga 1000 came out...

2139
02:03:17,541 --> 02:03:19,421
Let me put it this way,

2140
02:03:20,861 --> 02:03:26,061
that's about the biggest surprise I
have every had in my entire career

2141
02:03:26,421 --> 02:03:28,101
in one single system.

2142
02:03:28,181 --> 02:03:30,621
It changed so many
things all at once.

2143
02:03:30,701 --> 02:03:34,061
I mean, and you ask somebody else,
they give you the same answer,

2144
02:03:34,141 --> 02:03:36,901
and give you five other
different examples.

2145
02:03:51,781 --> 02:03:54,743
I think it's quite simple
why people remember

2146
02:03:54,768 --> 02:03:57,085
the Amiga so fondly even today.

2147
02:03:57,141 --> 02:03:58,621
It's because it was
revolutionary.

2148
02:03:59,181 --> 02:04:02,061
When it came out, there
was nothing like it.

2149
02:04:02,181 --> 02:04:05,781
It wasn't a small step for
the computer generation,

2150
02:04:05,861 --> 02:04:07,421
it was a massive step.

2151
02:04:07,541 --> 02:04:08,901
This was the last machine

2152
02:04:10,381 --> 02:04:13,021
which had complicated hardware,
but it was understandable.

2153
02:04:13,101 --> 02:04:14,848
And it was documented to a level

2154
02:04:14,873 --> 02:04:17,765
where you could get down
to the individual bits

2155
02:04:17,821 --> 02:04:19,901
of hardware, you could
know everything about

2156
02:04:19,981 --> 02:04:21,781
that machine.

2157
02:04:21,861 --> 02:04:24,461
And it trained a whole
generation of people,

2158
02:04:24,541 --> 02:04:27,901
I mean, I don't think the entire
computer industry would have evolved

2159
02:04:27,981 --> 02:04:29,941
in quite the way, because
people who grew up with that

2160
02:04:30,021 --> 02:04:32,181
went on to do all the stuff
that is being done now.

2161
02:04:32,261 --> 02:04:34,101
The Amiga was the last...

2162
02:04:34,181 --> 02:04:38,101
The last time that you could just
really experiment and play around.

2163
02:04:38,181 --> 02:04:39,341
There were no real barriers.

2164
02:04:39,421 --> 02:04:44,581
And also the hardware itself, as I've
already spoken quite lovingly of,

2165
02:04:44,941 --> 02:04:48,581
was so flexible that it
allowed real experimentation,

2166
02:04:48,661 --> 02:04:52,381
and experimentation, actually, that I'm not
even sure the designers of the machine

2167
02:04:52,461 --> 02:04:53,461
had planned.

2168
02:04:53,861 --> 02:04:56,661
So you have the feeling
of empowerment.

2169
02:04:57,101 --> 02:05:02,301
To be able to do great things with
just that computer in front of you.

2170
02:05:02,381 --> 02:05:07,501
The first platform that allowed
people that were creative to get out

2171
02:05:07,581 --> 02:05:10,061
into the masses, and I just
enjoyed being a part of that.

2172
02:05:10,381 --> 02:05:12,781
The first time I saw
Jim Sachs' work,

2173
02:05:12,901 --> 02:05:16,621
I understood, immediately,
what the leap was.

2174
02:05:16,701 --> 02:05:20,301
The Amiga enabled that
entire revolution.

2175
02:05:20,421 --> 02:05:24,621
Not just graphically, but in the way
you could effectively tell a story,

2176
02:05:24,701 --> 02:05:26,821
and change the
gaming experience.

2177
02:05:26,941 --> 02:05:30,821
From one of just arcade quality, to
something a little more substantial.

2178
02:05:30,901 --> 02:05:34,061
Some of those early games, and
some of the immersive storytelling

2179
02:05:34,141 --> 02:05:35,421
that we were able to do

2180
02:05:35,501 --> 02:05:38,821
in some of those early games, I
think the repercussions of that,

2181
02:05:38,901 --> 02:05:42,501
the echoes of that are still
being heard, and felt today

2182
02:05:42,581 --> 02:05:44,301
in games that are
coming out now.

2183
02:05:44,421 --> 02:05:47,061
When people ask me why I am
still working in games...

2184
02:05:49,021 --> 02:05:52,261
It's that collaborative development
environment that you get

2185
02:05:52,341 --> 02:05:55,501
where you're working with artists,
coders, musicians, designers.

2186
02:05:55,581 --> 02:05:59,341
All in the same kind of framework, and
you're creating something together

2187
02:05:59,421 --> 02:06:02,382
that none of you as
individuals could create.

2188
02:06:02,462 --> 02:06:05,142
And it's probably the
Amiga that was the first

2189
02:06:05,222 --> 02:06:07,542
moment that happened
in my experience.

2190
02:06:07,942 --> 02:06:10,822
But once you got to the Amiga,
you could start to sell a game

2191
02:06:10,902 --> 02:06:12,502
on, "Look at these graphics."

2192
02:06:12,582 --> 02:06:17,142
And actually, the games industry
has spent the last 20 plus years

2193
02:06:17,222 --> 02:06:20,022
selling games in the
same sort of way.

2194
02:06:20,462 --> 02:06:23,822
The Amiga opened doors...

2195
02:06:25,622 --> 02:06:28,622
...for professionals

2196
02:06:29,862 --> 02:06:33,822
and professions in a way that I
don't think any other machine

2197
02:06:33,902 --> 02:06:35,902
has been able to emulate.

2198
02:06:36,662 --> 02:06:41,342
First it allowed the progression from
assembly language to C programming.

2199
02:06:41,422 --> 02:06:44,422
So programmers could afford
to be more high level,

2200
02:06:44,782 --> 02:06:48,662
and therefore, not nearly so
skilled on low level assembler.

2201
02:06:49,782 --> 02:06:54,022
The second thing it facilitated
was the entry of artists.

2202
02:06:54,102 --> 02:06:58,342
Whose primary focus was art and
not the creation of pixels.

2203
02:06:58,422 --> 02:07:02,302
And the third stream of
people it brought in

2204
02:07:02,382 --> 02:07:04,422
was musicians and composers.

2205
02:07:04,502 --> 02:07:07,873
People who could now
create music on a machine

2206
02:07:07,898 --> 02:07:10,766
that would more faithfully than not

2207
02:07:10,822 --> 02:07:13,622
allow them to realise
their efforts.

2208
02:07:13,862 --> 02:07:17,302
And we moved from a
hobbyist industry

2209
02:07:17,382 --> 02:07:20,502
to very much an industry
capable of professionalism.

2210
02:07:20,742 --> 02:07:24,022
I think that everybody of my
generation who was from Europe

2211
02:07:24,102 --> 02:07:26,622
and who is in the games
industry nowadays,

2212
02:07:26,702 --> 02:07:29,542
I would bet that they
came in via the Amiga.

2213
02:07:29,622 --> 02:07:33,622
Maybe initially, shortly,
briefly, the C64,

2214
02:07:33,782 --> 02:07:34,902
and the Atari ST,

2215
02:07:35,022 --> 02:07:37,542
but all of us moved on to
the Amiga very quickly,

2216
02:07:37,622 --> 02:07:39,062
and that's where
everybody flourished.

2217
02:07:39,142 --> 02:07:42,822
So it's absolutely crucial, and
you can ask all around the world.

2218
02:07:43,222 --> 02:07:45,502
In Japan, people would have
come via the consoles,

2219
02:07:45,582 --> 02:07:47,542
a little bit also
here in the US,

2220
02:07:47,622 --> 02:07:50,822
and the PC of course got
strong very quickly in the US.

2221
02:07:50,942 --> 02:07:54,902
But all of Europe, the game
industry veterans of today

2222
02:07:54,982 --> 02:07:56,702
have to thank the
Amiga tremendously.

2223
02:07:57,182 --> 02:08:00,382
I think it was a fundamental building
block for the modern games industry.

2224
02:08:00,502 --> 02:08:04,502
I think it was a point at which
everybody realised games could be

2225
02:08:04,582 --> 02:08:08,582
the massive business that they are
now, worth countless billions.

2226
02:08:08,662 --> 02:08:13,222
And I think it was wonderful to be
involved at the very early stages.

2227
02:08:13,302 --> 02:08:18,182
We had no clue whatsoever that the
industry would get as big as it is now.

2228
02:08:18,262 --> 02:08:20,222
It was more than
a games machine.

2229
02:08:20,302 --> 02:08:24,382
It was more than a computer, it
was many things for many people.

2230
02:08:24,462 --> 02:08:27,942
That's what made it special, I think.
You know?

2231
02:08:28,022 --> 02:08:33,102
So, it was special for us because we
could really show off our talents.

2232
02:08:33,182 --> 02:08:36,702
And, like I said, it
was special for people

2233
02:08:36,782 --> 02:08:39,502
because they could do amazing
things with it, you know,

2234
02:08:39,582 --> 02:08:42,982
in terms of music,
visuals, video editing.

2235
02:08:44,342 --> 02:08:47,342
That's the main
reason, I reckon.

2236
02:08:47,422 --> 02:08:53,022
It touched many different people
from many walks of lives.

2237
02:08:53,102 --> 02:08:54,902
We knew it was a great
graphics machine.

2238
02:08:54,982 --> 02:08:58,622
But we never saw the entire
desktop revolution coming.

2239
02:08:58,702 --> 02:09:03,262
We didn't realise that the Amiga
was going to be the device

2240
02:09:03,342 --> 02:09:07,302
that was powerful enough to
create this new industry.

2241
02:09:07,382 --> 02:09:13,062
These days, no one thinks twice about
editing video on their home computer,

2242
02:09:13,142 --> 02:09:14,582
but it was radical then,

2243
02:09:14,662 --> 02:09:17,342
it was the first machine that
allowed that kind of capability.

2244
02:09:17,422 --> 02:09:21,902
And the Amiga was designed so they
put out very good video quality

2245
02:09:21,982 --> 02:09:24,782
compared to all the other computers
that were in the market in terms of

2246
02:09:24,902 --> 02:09:28,502
the NTSC television signal
that came out of the Amiga

2247
02:09:28,582 --> 02:09:31,902
was very close to being
right on the spec.

2248
02:09:31,982 --> 02:09:35,622
So it allowed you to then
record that onto videotape

2249
02:09:35,702 --> 02:09:37,462
or to put it out over the air,

2250
02:09:37,542 --> 02:09:38,902
whatever you wanted
to do with it.

2251
02:09:38,982 --> 02:09:42,222
And that was right out of the Amiga
without any special equipment.

2252
02:09:42,302 --> 02:09:45,382
A lot of people use that
even without Video Toaster.

2253
02:09:45,462 --> 02:09:49,222
They used their Amigas for
creating video and creating audio.

2254
02:09:49,462 --> 02:09:51,822
As we speak,

2255
02:09:51,902 --> 02:09:57,102
a paradigm shift of equal magnitude
has grabbed the world of video.

2256
02:09:57,182 --> 02:09:59,142
A paradigm shift.

2257
02:09:59,222 --> 02:10:02,302
And the force behind the shift,

2258
02:10:02,382 --> 02:10:06,182
we at NewTek call
the Video Toaster.

2259
02:10:06,262 --> 02:10:07,462
Hey, that's a hot name.

2260
02:10:07,542 --> 02:10:10,662
We discovered that by
using the Amiga's video,

2261
02:10:10,742 --> 02:10:15,102
we could take advantage of all of the
Amiga's graphic scope processing.

2262
02:10:15,782 --> 02:10:17,622
The Copper and the blitter.

2263
02:10:17,702 --> 02:10:20,062
All these things, we weren't
making pictures with them,

2264
02:10:20,142 --> 02:10:22,382
we were making these
bizarre little barcodes

2265
02:10:22,462 --> 02:10:25,222
that would then control
the Video Toaster card.

2266
02:10:25,302 --> 02:10:28,102
And then there was a huge
phenomenon with 3D animation.

2267
02:10:28,182 --> 02:10:31,862
Because LightWave 3D
was just one of the,

2268
02:10:31,942 --> 02:10:34,262
what we call croutons,
in the Video Toaster,

2269
02:10:34,342 --> 02:10:36,262
these little squares
you click on.

2270
02:10:36,342 --> 02:10:38,182
It's a toast analogy.

2271
02:10:38,262 --> 02:10:40,302
Croutons, little
pieces of bread.

2272
02:10:40,382 --> 02:10:42,022
It's just my "rye"
sense of humour.

2273
02:10:42,102 --> 02:10:46,142
One of the croutons
was LightWave.

2274
02:10:46,222 --> 02:10:49,543
So you click on that,
and the screen opens up

2275
02:10:49,623 --> 02:10:51,703
into front, top, and side view,

2276
02:10:51,783 --> 02:10:53,583
and now you can make models,
you can light them,

2277
02:10:53,663 --> 02:10:56,263
and you can do 3D animation.

2278
02:10:56,343 --> 02:11:02,783
And a lot of people started to buy the
Video Toaster just for that reason.

2279
02:11:02,863 --> 02:11:06,703
And so Babylon 5,

2280
02:11:06,783 --> 02:11:10,823
SeaQuest DSV, a Spielberg show.

2281
02:11:12,303 --> 02:11:18,463
Examples of people taking LightWave,
building a big crew of animators,

2282
02:11:18,543 --> 02:11:22,383
and doing CGI on television,
which, up to that point,

2283
02:11:22,463 --> 02:11:23,863
was absolutely unthinkable.

2284
02:11:23,943 --> 02:11:25,383
The market moved up.

2285
02:11:27,663 --> 02:11:32,023
And around the time that the Amiga
500 was really, really flying,

2286
02:11:32,103 --> 02:11:34,343
was also the beginning
of the PC market.

2287
02:11:34,423 --> 02:11:36,903
PCs, they were business machines
and they were very expensive.

2288
02:11:36,983 --> 02:11:39,583
So, actually, for most people,
they couldn't even...

2289
02:11:39,663 --> 02:11:41,183
They couldn't aspire
to buying one.

2290
02:11:41,263 --> 02:11:43,183
You're talking
about £1,000 plus.

2291
02:11:43,263 --> 02:11:45,423
Cos you know they're expensive,

2292
02:11:45,503 --> 02:11:48,423
and well made because
they had metal cases.

2293
02:11:48,503 --> 02:11:52,503
Whereas, of course, the home
PCs, they were made of plastic.

2294
02:11:52,583 --> 02:11:54,263
- So they weren't very serious things.
- And on occasions,

2295
02:11:54,343 --> 02:11:55,383
woodgrain plastic as well.

2296
02:11:55,463 --> 02:11:56,623
- Yes.
- Which was wonderful.

2297
02:11:56,703 --> 02:11:59,823
- I never quite understood that.
- The Atari VCS is beautiful.

2298
02:11:59,903 --> 02:12:02,423
Give the consumer confidence,
give them a plastic computer,

2299
02:12:02,503 --> 02:12:06,623
high-tech, but make sure it looks
like your grandad's gramophone.

2300
02:12:06,703 --> 02:12:09,063
And they weren't as popular
because, let's be honest about it,

2301
02:12:09,143 --> 02:12:13,223
the PCs could not deliver
what the Amiga could deliver.

2302
02:12:13,303 --> 02:12:15,303
In terms of graphics and sound,

2303
02:12:15,383 --> 02:12:17,343
and all those wonderful
things that we already know.

2304
02:12:17,423 --> 02:12:20,823
The PC was way behind
in technology terms.

2305
02:12:20,903 --> 02:12:24,703
I think it was difficult to make
games in the early days for PC.

2306
02:12:24,783 --> 02:12:27,223
- Yeah.
- Because the colour palettes

2307
02:12:27,303 --> 02:12:29,263
were just so incredibly awful.

2308
02:12:29,343 --> 02:12:30,543
There weren't really
colours, were there?

2309
02:12:30,623 --> 02:12:32,743
They were designed for
spreadsheet annotation.

2310
02:12:32,823 --> 02:12:35,423
Basically, the graphics cards
weren't graphics cards.

2311
02:12:35,503 --> 02:12:37,661
They were designed to
make spreadsheets,

2312
02:12:37,686 --> 02:12:39,527
and word processes easier to read.

2313
02:12:39,743 --> 02:12:42,503
You could have yellow letters
or you could have blue letters

2314
02:12:42,583 --> 02:12:43,663
- or green letters.
- Yeah.

2315
02:12:43,743 --> 02:12:44,743
I mean, that was
what it was for.

2316
02:12:44,823 --> 02:12:48,743
And then we were trying to, sort
of, hack that to make monsters,

2317
02:12:48,823 --> 02:12:50,623
and warriors, and all
that kind of stuff.

2318
02:12:50,703 --> 02:12:53,863
It was really about
the PC era of games.

2319
02:12:53,943 --> 02:12:56,703
Which coincides a lot
with the rise of Amiga.

2320
02:12:56,783 --> 02:13:02,223
And I think it was more getting out
of these specialised little machines,

2321
02:13:02,303 --> 02:13:05,543
like the Atari 800,
and the Commodore 64,

2322
02:13:05,623 --> 02:13:08,743
where things were moving
into actual real computers.

2323
02:13:08,823 --> 02:13:10,783
And the Amiga was
a real computer,

2324
02:13:10,863 --> 02:13:13,383
and the PC was a real computer,

2325
02:13:13,463 --> 02:13:17,223
and these things were making
their way into people's homes

2326
02:13:17,303 --> 02:13:19,543
for reasons other than gaming.

2327
02:13:19,623 --> 02:13:23,863
So, it's like we were getting into
people's homes in this stealth way.

2328
02:13:23,943 --> 02:13:26,583
They would buy their PC,
they would buy their Amiga

2329
02:13:26,663 --> 02:13:28,623
for some "serious" reason.

2330
02:13:28,703 --> 02:13:30,703
But they'd spend all their
time playing games on it.

2331
02:13:30,783 --> 02:13:34,063
So I do think it was actually a
very, very influential time,

2332
02:13:34,143 --> 02:13:35,343
just because of that.

2333
02:13:35,423 --> 02:13:39,823
Because a lot of these things were
moving into normal people's homes

2334
02:13:39,903 --> 02:13:42,743
for other reasons, and they
were being exposed to gaming.

2335
02:13:43,583 --> 02:13:47,223
Henry Rubin, who is the
vice-president of engineering,

2336
02:13:47,303 --> 02:13:51,463
really wanted Amigas to be able
to do some kind of PC emulation.

2337
02:13:51,903 --> 02:13:54,783
That's why we had that
PC emulation program

2338
02:13:54,863 --> 02:13:57,783
when the Amiga launched, even
though it was really, really slow

2339
02:13:57,863 --> 02:13:59,423
and not very useful.

2340
02:13:59,503 --> 02:14:00,863
The emulator.

2341
02:14:00,943 --> 02:14:05,623
Which turns your Amiga computer
into an IBM personal computer.

2342
02:14:09,743 --> 02:14:13,503
They wanted to be able to
sell Amigas into businesses.

2343
02:14:13,583 --> 02:14:16,863
And there was this
checkmark that said,

2344
02:14:16,943 --> 02:14:20,143
"Is it PC compatible to be able
to sell something in businesses?"

2345
02:14:20,223 --> 02:14:22,903
So, if I said I wanted
Amiga on my desk,

2346
02:14:22,983 --> 02:14:25,063
somebody's gonna
come along and say,

2347
02:14:25,143 --> 02:14:27,943
"You know, company requires you
to do all your documentation

2348
02:14:28,023 --> 02:14:31,663
"in Microsoft Word. So you
can't have that Amiga."

2349
02:14:31,743 --> 02:14:33,227
It was interesting because, obviously,

2350
02:14:33,252 --> 02:14:34,887
people were aware that
there was a market,

2351
02:14:34,943 --> 02:14:38,263
this machine was a market, but an
alternate way of it working...

2352
02:14:38,343 --> 02:14:40,983
There was that PC emulation
card, wasn't there?

2353
02:14:41,063 --> 02:14:44,263
The KCS Power Board,
I think it was.

2354
02:14:44,343 --> 02:14:45,783
Yeah, and that was
for the Amiga.

2355
02:14:45,863 --> 02:14:49,103
There was an interesting sort of hybrid.
You've got yourself an Amiga.

2356
02:14:49,183 --> 02:14:50,823
You actually want a PC.

2357
02:14:50,903 --> 02:14:53,063
So here's a board to plug
in to get yourself a PC.

2358
02:14:53,143 --> 02:14:55,983
PC emulator plugs into the
A500's RAM expansion.

2359
02:14:56,063 --> 02:14:58,303
Then, all of a sudden, I
have my Microsoft Word.

2360
02:14:58,383 --> 02:15:02,583
Here was a solution that allowed you
to get that Amiga into that business.

2361
02:15:02,663 --> 02:15:07,863
Which seems a bit counter-intuitive
now, but it led to great things.

2362
02:15:07,943 --> 02:15:12,423
And was the beginning of one
machine needing to work on another

2363
02:15:12,503 --> 02:15:13,623
and vice versa.

2364
02:15:13,703 --> 02:15:16,423
So it's the beginning of blurring
of the edges of PC technology,

2365
02:15:16,448 --> 02:15:17,367
Amiga technology,

2366
02:15:17,423 --> 02:15:18,623
and that kind of thing.

2367
02:15:18,703 --> 02:15:22,223
It's very hard to get across

2368
02:15:22,303 --> 02:15:25,343
the extent of the impact
the Amiga had on my life.

2369
02:15:28,823 --> 02:15:34,383
I think, had it not been for the Amiga,
I wouldn't be in the industry today.

2370
02:15:35,183 --> 02:15:37,824
I think, had it not
been for the Amiga,

2371
02:15:37,904 --> 02:15:41,264
I would not have started to
learn high-level languages.

2372
02:15:41,344 --> 02:15:45,944
I would not have started to get into
graphics and audio the way that I did.

2373
02:15:46,984 --> 02:15:49,544
I think, in a lot of ways,
because of the excitement,

2374
02:15:49,624 --> 02:15:53,624
because of that
profound step change

2375
02:15:53,704 --> 02:15:55,824
in what a machine could do,

2376
02:15:57,784 --> 02:16:04,224
it opened up life in a way that I
couldn't possibly imagine before.

2377
02:16:04,304 --> 02:16:06,384
It made me an optimist.

2378
02:16:06,464 --> 02:16:10,824
It made me realise that human beings
were capable of astounding leaps.

2379
02:16:11,944 --> 02:16:16,744
And it's very hard to get that
across without sounding ridiculous.

2380
02:16:17,584 --> 02:16:22,504
But it really was... People
wait for jetpacks, right?

2381
02:16:22,584 --> 02:16:26,264
People talk about flying cars.
The Amiga was that to me.

2382
02:16:26,344 --> 02:16:30,304
There are so many people just
starting to work on the Amiga again,

2383
02:16:30,384 --> 02:16:34,104
that there are lots of games,
new games, coming out right now

2384
02:16:34,184 --> 02:16:35,664
and the quality is so amazing,

2385
02:16:35,744 --> 02:16:39,264
it's even more amazing than
commercial games in the '80s.

2386
02:16:39,344 --> 02:16:43,784
The games industry on the
mobile phones is so destroyed,

2387
02:16:43,864 --> 02:16:46,657
that I actually think that
you can make more money

2388
02:16:46,682 --> 02:16:48,488
with an Amiga game right now

2389
02:16:48,544 --> 02:16:50,344
than you can do with
an iPhone game.

2390
02:16:50,424 --> 02:16:53,944
It was an incredible
culture at Amiga.

2391
02:16:54,024 --> 02:16:57,344
These guys... They were
firing on all cylinders.

2392
02:16:57,424 --> 02:16:59,864
You know, they were all friends.

2393
02:16:59,944 --> 02:17:02,464
The hardware guys worked
with the software guys.

2394
02:17:02,544 --> 02:17:06,944
It was kind of a small,
tightly knit team.

2395
02:17:07,424 --> 02:17:10,464
And you could just tell that
there was magic happening.

2396
02:17:10,544 --> 02:17:13,824
It was the thing that I loved
the most about the Amiga was,

2397
02:17:13,904 --> 02:17:18,624
it was this wild, galloping
horse the entire time.

2398
02:17:18,704 --> 02:17:22,944
And the best you could do
was ride that baby bareback

2399
02:17:23,024 --> 02:17:24,717
and hang on to the mane and hope

2400
02:17:24,742 --> 02:17:27,968
that we're all heading in the
right direction together.

2401
02:17:28,984 --> 02:17:34,224
It was insane. It was
passion, and love

2402
02:17:34,304 --> 02:17:37,264
and belief in things that
couldn't possibly come true,

2403
02:17:37,344 --> 02:17:40,064
and yet they were coming
true, month after month.

2404
02:17:40,144 --> 02:17:42,344
Things were working the
way that we hoped.

2405
02:17:42,424 --> 02:17:45,424
It was this crazy, crazy dream

2406
02:17:45,504 --> 02:17:50,544
that a bunch of us had and that we
actually managed to turn into reality.

2407
02:17:51,344 --> 02:17:54,664
For me, it was the
opportunity to create,

2408
02:17:54,744 --> 02:17:59,104
not just multi-tasking, but also
the architecture of the Amiga

2409
02:17:59,184 --> 02:18:02,624
with dynamically loadable
libraries and device drivers,

2410
02:18:02,704 --> 02:18:05,544
and the interrupt handlers,
and all of that architecture

2411
02:18:05,624 --> 02:18:08,864
that I created during that time

2412
02:18:08,944 --> 02:18:11,224
went on to be used by
so many other people.

2413
02:18:11,304 --> 02:18:14,424
It was like the basis
of design from then on.

2414
02:18:14,504 --> 02:18:19,304
It sort of established a
platform or a way of developing

2415
02:18:19,384 --> 02:18:20,824
all of the systems that
came in the future.

2416
02:18:20,904 --> 02:18:23,304
So it was one of the first
microcomputer systems

2417
02:18:23,384 --> 02:18:25,144
to really have that
kind of architecture.

2418
02:18:25,224 --> 02:18:26,744
All the stuff that
people have done

2419
02:18:26,824 --> 02:18:29,584
with the audio and the
graphics and the video,

2420
02:18:29,664 --> 02:18:33,184
I just really feel
that I'm lucky

2421
02:18:33,264 --> 02:18:35,704
to have been at the right place
and time to be a part of that.

2422
02:18:35,784 --> 02:18:37,424
So, that's very big.

2423
02:18:37,504 --> 02:18:38,864
And the friends I've made,

2424
02:18:38,944 --> 02:18:43,024
and I'm still in contact
with a lot of the people

2425
02:18:43,104 --> 02:18:45,384
that I worked with
during that time.

2426
02:18:45,464 --> 02:18:47,424
And that's been amazing, too.

2427
02:18:47,504 --> 02:18:52,904
I look back on my contribution to
the Amiga in several ways, I think.

2428
02:18:52,984 --> 02:18:56,224
The graphics, the bouncing ball,

2429
02:18:56,304 --> 02:19:00,144
the multi-tasking layer library.

2430
02:19:00,224 --> 02:19:03,384
But also, to a certain degree,

2431
02:19:03,464 --> 02:19:07,264
trying to instil in other
developers and other users

2432
02:19:07,344 --> 02:19:13,424
the magic that could be done if you're on
a mission from God with the right family.

2433
02:19:14,944 --> 02:19:20,224
And it was incredible working with
the people that I knew there.

2434
02:19:20,304 --> 02:19:23,944
And most... All of them are
still close friends of mine.

2435
02:19:24,024 --> 02:19:27,664
My Amiga family is gonna
be my family for life.

2436
02:19:27,744 --> 02:19:30,384
There have been questions
about what we believed

2437
02:19:30,464 --> 02:19:32,784
at the time when we
were doing the machine.

2438
02:19:32,864 --> 02:19:34,664
Did we think it was
gonna come true?

2439
02:19:34,744 --> 02:19:38,624
Did we feel a force to
push ourselves forward?

2440
02:19:38,704 --> 02:19:42,864
And the answer to that
is overpoweringly yes.

2441
02:19:42,944 --> 02:19:47,784
David Morse, president of the
company, was an amazing man.

2442
02:19:47,864 --> 02:19:52,984
Jay Miner, architect of the
basic system, an amazing man.

2443
02:19:53,064 --> 02:19:55,024
Dave Morse, our fearless leader,

2444
02:19:55,104 --> 02:19:58,984
he led us through all the
trials and tribulations.

2445
02:19:59,064 --> 02:20:01,344
He kept that flame alive.

2446
02:20:01,424 --> 02:20:07,104
There was some amazing power
behind those two guys

2447
02:20:07,184 --> 02:20:12,504
that pushed us forward
through no sleep, no money,

2448
02:20:12,584 --> 02:20:15,704
no time, no parts,

2449
02:20:15,784 --> 02:20:19,264
competition that would show
up from time to time...

2450
02:20:19,864 --> 02:20:24,505
All sorts of things that would get
in our way, parts that would break.

2451
02:20:24,585 --> 02:20:30,105
And we pushed forward because
we felt in our insides

2452
02:20:30,185 --> 02:20:33,985
how amazing this whole
machine was going to be.

2453
02:20:34,065 --> 02:20:38,265
And whatever spirit Dave and
Jay had inside of them fed us,

2454
02:20:38,345 --> 02:20:39,905
and pushed us forward.

2455
02:20:39,985 --> 02:20:41,465
It was amazing.

2456
02:20:41,545 --> 02:20:45,625
An Amiga serial
number 1 still works.

2457
02:20:45,705 --> 02:20:47,425
It still runs.

2458
02:20:48,665 --> 02:20:49,945
Magic.

2459
02:20:50,945 --> 02:20:55,185
You don't get an opportunity, very
often, to be at the very threshold,

2460
02:20:55,265 --> 02:20:59,305
the very beginning of a
billion-dollar-plus product line.

2461
02:20:59,385 --> 02:21:02,705
So I can look back and
say, "Hey, I was there.

2462
02:21:02,785 --> 02:21:05,625
"I was there when...
I walked in the door

2463
02:21:05,705 --> 02:21:10,465
"and we had two chairs, a card
table, and a coffeepot, and a dog."

2464
02:21:10,905 --> 02:21:14,185
Jay Miner had a dog.

2465
02:21:14,265 --> 02:21:16,505
Jay's dog was named Mitchy.

2466
02:21:16,585 --> 02:21:20,785
And Mitchy was the
mascot of the office.

2467
02:21:20,865 --> 02:21:26,265
And in the beginning days of the Amiga,
they designed the initial hardware

2468
02:21:26,345 --> 02:21:30,665
using pencils and
erasers and paper.

2469
02:21:30,745 --> 02:21:35,385
They would draw gates on the paper and
erase those gates and draw new ones,

2470
02:21:35,465 --> 02:21:37,665
and connect the lines together.

2471
02:21:37,745 --> 02:21:40,865
And this was state-of-the-art
of that day,

2472
02:21:40,945 --> 02:21:44,985
that you would design hardware
on paper with pencils.

2473
02:21:45,065 --> 02:21:48,625
And I would sit and watch Jay
Miner designing hardware.

2474
02:21:48,705 --> 02:21:52,585
And people say that it wasn't really
Jay that was the father of the Amiga,

2475
02:21:52,665 --> 02:21:53,945
that it was actually
Mitchy, his dog.

2476
02:21:54,025 --> 02:21:56,185
And I'm here to tell
you it's a true story.

2477
02:21:56,265 --> 02:21:57,305
I would watch.

2478
02:21:57,385 --> 02:22:00,585
Jay would sit there, and he'd
draw a gate on a sheet of paper,

2479
02:22:00,665 --> 02:22:03,505
and he'd look over at
Mitchy and Mitchy'd go...

2480
02:22:03,905 --> 02:22:06,905
And so he'd erase that and he'd draw it
upside down and with different lines,

2481
02:22:06,985 --> 02:22:08,105
and Mitchy'd go...

2482
02:22:08,825 --> 02:22:10,585
And so it was, "OK!" You know...

2483
02:22:13,705 --> 02:22:16,705
Amiga computer,
designed by a dog.

2484
02:23:48,145 --> 02:23:49,585
Where am I?

2485
02:25:08,785 --> 02:25:11,906
It is the best machine that is
around anywhere in the world.

2486
02:25:11,986 --> 02:25:13,426
The professional
machine of the future.

2487
02:25:23,466 --> 02:25:25,626
- How would I describe it?
- I think it's fantastic.

2488
02:25:25,706 --> 02:25:27,546
- Awesome.
- It's gonna skyrocket.

2489
02:25:27,626 --> 02:25:29,186
Only Amiga makes it possible.

2490
02:25:55,826 --> 02:26:00,626
Amiga's got the guts to do things
that you can't do on other hardware.

2491
02:26:00,706 --> 02:26:02,546
- And it does all the work for you.
- Wow.

2492
02:26:02,626 --> 02:26:05,266
State-of-the-art technology at a
price that everybody can afford.

2493
02:26:06,426 --> 02:26:10,386
The Amiga is the best
graphics machine available

2494
02:26:11,106 --> 02:26:12,346
in the world today.

2495
02:26:14,426 --> 02:26:15,466
Only Amiga.

2496
02:26:21,226 --> 02:26:22,266
Only Amiga.

2497
02:26:23,706 --> 02:26:24,706
Only Amiga.

2498
02:26:27,466 --> 02:26:28,466
Makes it possible.

2499
02:26:30,786 --> 02:26:32,506
Only Amiga makes it possible.

2500
02:26:36,386 --> 02:26:37,386
Outrageous.

2501
02:26:39,426 --> 02:26:40,426
Fabulous.

2502
02:26:47,146 --> 02:26:48,706
Only Amiga...

2503
02:26:48,786 --> 02:26:51,026
- This is it.
- ...makes it possible!

2504
02:26:59,746 --> 02:27:01,786
Well, it was in 1982,

2505
02:27:01,866 --> 02:27:05,346
a friend of mine that I
used to work with at Atari

2506
02:27:05,426 --> 02:27:06,626
came to me and said,

2507
02:27:06,706 --> 02:27:09,466
"Hey, Jay, let's start a new company.
I'm tired of this one."

2508
02:27:11,106 --> 02:27:14,866
And I said, "Well, fine." I said,
"I'll do the chips for it.

2509
02:27:14,946 --> 02:27:18,986
"And I'll be the vice president
if I can do the chips my way."

2510
02:27:19,546 --> 02:27:23,346
My original vision of the
machine was as a low-cost entry

2511
02:27:23,426 --> 02:27:28,746
into the computer field
via the video game area.

2512
02:27:28,826 --> 02:27:31,226
Video games, at that
time, were really hot,

2513
02:27:31,306 --> 02:27:34,026
and all our investors
wanted was a video game.

2514
02:27:34,106 --> 02:27:37,466
But I wanted something that could
be expanded into a real computer.