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How do I do something
that makes the world better
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00:00:14,081 --> 00:00:16,217
beyond what I need today?
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00:00:16,250 --> 00:00:19,220
[uneasy music]
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00:00:19,253 --> 00:00:21,055
♪ ♪
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[Clyne] The three words
I would use to describe NXIVM
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are magnificence
times infinity.
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[India]
I went into NXIVM looking
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for a more purposeful life,
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00:00:30,765 --> 00:00:33,300
and I thought that these
people wanted that, too.
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00:00:33,334 --> 00:00:36,470
An EM is a stimulus-response
disconnection.
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[India] But then I went
through something
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that I don't wish
upon anybody.
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[woman 1] Keith Raniere,
NXIVM's founder,
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00:00:42,743 --> 00:00:44,779
created
a secret sex slave ring.
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[woman 2] Female members
of NXIVM were branded
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in their pelvic areas.
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[Lalich] NXIVM is one
of the worst,
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00:00:50,284 --> 00:00:53,354
most harmful cults
I've ever heard of.
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[India] How did we all end up
in the clutches of a monster?
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I'm still trying to figure
it out,
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and I need to go back
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so I can deconstruct the last
seven years of my life.
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[Keith] Do you understand
how you could rape a baby?
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I can make it a baby
that's very rapable.
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[India] It's taken me
over 50 hours
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of working with a therapist
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to even be able to say
something sexual did happen
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between Keith and I.
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[disquieting electronic music]
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[siren wailing in the distance]
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Confronting all
of these memories
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is just bringing up
a lot for me.
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[Bernstein]
Mm-hmm.
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Like, I feel robbed sometimes.
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[Bernstein]
You were.
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You were robbed
of a lot of things
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that if you had known
ahead of time,
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you would've run
for the hills, right?
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-My God.
-Right?
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[laughing]
Like, I can't even imagine
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what my- what my life
would've been like
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if someone was like,
"Hey, come to this course
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"where eventually
you're going to feel crazy
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"and you're going to
have to be somebody's slave
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and you're not gonna have
your own life."
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[sniffles]
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-How did that happen?
-[Bernstein] Yeah.
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You've been influenced
in so many ways
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because Keith created
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a very deliberate methodology
for indoctrination,
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and so the more you understand
about what happened to you,
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sort of the system
that you were put in,
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then I think the more you get
why it is that you did this
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so that you're not
beating yourself up.
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[spacey music]
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♪ ♪
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I've really been struggling
to figure out
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how NXIVM really worked.
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It's like, what the hell
happened to me?
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It's like the curriculum
totally changed my brain.
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How did I get indoctrinated
without even knowing it?
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[sedate rock music]
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♪ ♪
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NXIVM seemed so legitimate.
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They had centers
all over the world,
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but their headquarters
were in Albany.
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Albany-Rensselear is the final stop
for this train.
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Make sure you have all of your
personal belongings.
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Albany is where Keith
and a majority
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of the higher-ranking
members lived.
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♪ ♪
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It's not easy
to come back here.
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♪ ♪
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455 New Karner Road,
NXIVM headquarters.
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The 55 is gone.
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A lot of my life
was spent in this place.
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This is super weird.
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How are you different
than your indoctrination?
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How are you actually different
than you believe you are?
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[uneasy music]
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Oh, that's freaky.
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Still says
"Executive Success Programs."
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♪ ♪
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[Keith] A psychopath,
doesn't have any empathy,
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just sees something
that feels good--
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raping a person, raping a cat.
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♪ ♪
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You know, whatever it is.
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I feel like the blood
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is leaving my arms.
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Not totally dizzy, but just,
like, a li-little bit weird.
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Oh, that's so weird.
Even the lights are still on.
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It's like they just left.
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♪ ♪
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In this room,
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we would have
the higher-ranking members
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promote people.
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The only way to move up
in NXIVM
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was to recruit other people
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and to continue taking
more and more classes.
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♪ ♪
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The Stripe Path
was NXIVM's ranking system,
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00:04:50,391 --> 00:04:52,726
similar to
a martial arts studio,
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where you master one level
and then the next and the next
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until you're proficient enough
to teach.
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People worked really hard
to earn their next stripe
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or the next colored sash.
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[Kelly] There were
different goals
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00:05:07,941 --> 00:05:10,010
you had to meet,
and enrolling was part of it.
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I was enrolling clients
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and friends and acquaintances
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and family members
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because I believed
in this so much
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and because I had
a huge network of people.
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[India] When I was
first promoted to coach,
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it felt great because
I thought that I was rising
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through the ranks
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of this innovative
humanitarian organization.
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So welcome to the rank
of proctor,
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with all the rights,
privileges,
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and responsibilities
that come with the rank.
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[India] The only way that you
could make money in NXIVM
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is when you became a proctor,
which was an orange sash.
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That was the dream,
to have an actual career
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where you could help people.
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Senior proctors,
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wore the green sashes,
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like Sarah Edmondson
and Mark Vicente,
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were making a good living
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running the centers
and enrolling people.
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They were making commissions
off of anyone
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that they brought
into the organization,
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and they were making
commissions off of anyone
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who those people brought in.
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[Ross] This is the way
indoctrination works.
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In order to get so many people
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to go even deeper and deeper
into the course curriculum,
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Keith Raniere would hold out
a kind of carrot
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and say, "Look, you know,
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"this might be tough,
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but there's a pot of gold
at the end of this rainbow."
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Welcome to the rank of proctor.
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[India]
The first time I saw someone
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00:06:29,823 --> 00:06:32,493
be promoted to proctor,
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I felt a little jealous.
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I thought, "I want that.
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How do I even get there?"
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[Lalich] The illusion was,
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to be able to rise up
in the ranks.
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It was a merit-based system,
but, in fact,
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00:06:45,672 --> 00:06:47,007
Keith was really pulling
the strings
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from behind the scenes,
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and so it really had
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nothing to do with merit
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but to Keith's preferences.
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And as you might imagine,
it was the more beautiful,
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slender women who were chosen
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to rise up more quickly
in the ranks.
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And that's how Keith
eventually built up
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00:07:01,655 --> 00:07:03,190
the stable of sex slaves.
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Those were
well-earned promotions.
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With respect
to motivating mules,
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I just set up
the circumstances.
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Most of the time,
if they're motivated
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for the first time
in their life,
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they go too far,
which is fine.
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Yeah.
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-So anything else? Are we done?
-[man speaks indistinctly]
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-[clapboard snaps]
-[man] We're good.
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By 2013, I had been in NXIVM
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for about two years
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00:07:36,957 --> 00:07:40,060
and a coach in training
for about a year.
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I put in hundreds of hours
in teaching and coaching,
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00:07:43,931 --> 00:07:46,800
and I wasn't making
any money doing it,
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00:07:46,834 --> 00:07:50,003
but I believed that
I was working my way up.
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They said it was like
an unpaid internship.
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All coaches had to work
without pay.
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So, to make money,
I'd pick up any odd jobs
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and assistant work that
I could fit around coaching.
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Eventually my entire life
became NXIVM-related,
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including my friends.
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00:08:09,256 --> 00:08:12,593
And then I met a guy,
and I thought it could be
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00:08:12,626 --> 00:08:15,195
the beginning
of something really great.
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00:08:15,229 --> 00:08:17,764
His name
was Michel Chernitzky,
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00:08:17,798 --> 00:08:19,533
and he was also in NXIVM.
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Enrolling is like sex.
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It feels good, and if it doesn't,
you're not doing it correctly.
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[laughter]
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00:08:28,275 --> 00:08:30,777
[India]
When we first started dating,
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00:08:30,811 --> 00:08:33,180
Nancy Salzman
was super opposed,
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00:08:33,213 --> 00:08:35,549
because he was
a higher-ranking coach
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and I was not.
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00:08:37,584 --> 00:08:39,720
And so she kind of, like,
inserted herself
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in our relationship
195
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and put all these parameters
in place
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in order for him to date me.
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00:08:45,525 --> 00:08:48,862
So we had to split everything
50/50, for example,
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00:08:48,896 --> 00:08:51,531
to make sure that I wasn't
dependent on him.
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00:08:51,565 --> 00:08:54,801
Nancy told me that being
dependent on people
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00:08:54,835 --> 00:08:58,071
was a problem
that I needed to work on.
201
00:08:58,105 --> 00:08:59,573
[Lalich]
There was a great deal
202
00:08:59,606 --> 00:09:01,842
of what we call
the systems of control,
203
00:09:01,875 --> 00:09:03,310
telling people
who they could date
204
00:09:03,543 --> 00:09:06,046
and who they couldn't date,
how they should behave.
205
00:09:06,079 --> 00:09:08,916
Every little part of daily life
was controlled
206
00:09:08,949 --> 00:09:10,817
in some way or another
by the group.
207
00:09:10,851 --> 00:09:12,853
Over time, you begin to lose
208
00:09:12,886 --> 00:09:15,088
your critical-thinking
abilities.
209
00:09:15,122 --> 00:09:17,291
Through
this indoctrination process,
210
00:09:17,324 --> 00:09:19,593
you don't really know
who yourself is,
211
00:09:19,626 --> 00:09:22,562
and they're creating
a new self for you.
212
00:09:26,566 --> 00:09:29,069
[Catherine]
I-I do feel unbelievable guilt
213
00:09:29,102 --> 00:09:32,906
because I was the one who
introduced India to NXIVM,
214
00:09:32,940 --> 00:09:37,778
and it took me years to realize
how dangerous it was.
215
00:09:37,811 --> 00:09:39,680
After India became a coach,
216
00:09:39,713 --> 00:09:41,648
she started
to recruit everybody.
217
00:09:41,682 --> 00:09:43,951
She started to recruit
all my friends on Facebook.
218
00:09:43,984 --> 00:09:47,788
Her personality changed,
and it wasn't her.
219
00:09:47,821 --> 00:09:49,323
I didn't know
what I was up against,
220
00:09:49,356 --> 00:09:51,158
and I thought, "Okay,
221
00:09:51,191 --> 00:09:53,360
I don't want to fight
with her,"
222
00:09:53,593 --> 00:09:55,929
but I would try
and remind her that
223
00:09:55,963 --> 00:09:58,832
before she joined the group,
she had other interests,
224
00:09:58,865 --> 00:10:02,002
including
the entertainment business.
225
00:10:02,035 --> 00:10:03,337
So, when a friend of mine
told me
226
00:10:03,370 --> 00:10:06,106
that they were producing
a film with Pierce Brosnan
227
00:10:06,139 --> 00:10:08,875
and it was gonna be filming
in Belgrade, I thought,
228
00:10:08,909 --> 00:10:10,310
"What a great opportunity
for India,"
229
00:10:10,344 --> 00:10:12,145
because they were looking
for an assistant for Pierce.
230
00:10:12,179 --> 00:10:13,380
[gunshots]
231
00:10:13,613 --> 00:10:15,816
[India] When I decided to take
the job,
232
00:10:15,849 --> 00:10:17,985
Mark Vicente made
it impossible
233
00:10:18,018 --> 00:10:20,654
for me to feel good
about my decision.
234
00:10:20,687 --> 00:10:23,256
I remember him even crying
over the fact
235
00:10:23,290 --> 00:10:26,193
that I was bailing
on my ESP team.
236
00:10:26,226 --> 00:10:28,328
There was
so much guilt-tripping
237
00:10:28,362 --> 00:10:29,696
about doing anything
238
00:10:29,730 --> 00:10:33,166
that NXIVM
didn't want you to do.
239
00:10:33,200 --> 00:10:35,902
So, even when I was leaving
to do this job,
240
00:10:35,936 --> 00:10:37,771
they were chasing
after me, telling me,
241
00:10:37,804 --> 00:10:39,806
"Can't you see
how this is your issue?
242
00:10:39,840 --> 00:10:41,708
"You're giving up
on your ideology
243
00:10:41,742 --> 00:10:42,909
"'cause you want
to take this job
244
00:10:42,943 --> 00:10:44,845
and get
your parents' approval."
245
00:10:44,878 --> 00:10:47,714
[dramatic music]
246
00:10:47,748 --> 00:10:49,349
♪ ♪
247
00:10:49,383 --> 00:10:51,251
I even remember
being in Belgrade,
248
00:10:51,284 --> 00:10:53,320
and I was getting
constant feedback
249
00:10:53,353 --> 00:10:55,088
that I was a shitty coach
250
00:10:55,122 --> 00:10:57,858
because of my lack
of commitment.
251
00:10:57,891 --> 00:11:01,061
So then they ended up
giving me an ultimatum.
252
00:11:01,094 --> 00:11:03,764
They said I could continue
to placate my family
253
00:11:03,797 --> 00:11:07,868
or commit to NXIVM
and achieve my full potential.
254
00:11:07,901 --> 00:11:10,871
♪ ♪
255
00:11:10,904 --> 00:11:12,973
I did end up
finishing the job,
256
00:11:13,006 --> 00:11:14,408
but when I was done,
257
00:11:14,441 --> 00:11:16,743
they made me go
straight to Silver Bay
258
00:11:16,777 --> 00:11:19,212
so that I could go
to my second V-Week
259
00:11:19,246 --> 00:11:22,349
and then stay in Albany
another three weeks
260
00:11:22,382 --> 00:11:24,051
for back-to-back trainings.
261
00:11:24,084 --> 00:11:25,952
[all cheering]
262
00:11:25,986 --> 00:11:30,257
I had really hoped that
this Pierce Brosnan project
263
00:11:30,290 --> 00:11:32,993
would inspire her to go
in another direction,
264
00:11:33,026 --> 00:11:35,429
but my plans backfired,
265
00:11:35,462 --> 00:11:38,165
because the minute she was done
with the project,
266
00:11:38,198 --> 00:11:41,401
her involvement
with NXIVM only deepened.
267
00:11:44,037 --> 00:11:47,074
Those two weeks are $20,000.
268
00:11:47,107 --> 00:11:51,278
There is a 20% discount
going on for V-Week.
269
00:11:51,311 --> 00:11:54,047
It is an investment
in your internal world,
270
00:11:54,081 --> 00:11:55,816
in your life.
271
00:11:55,849 --> 00:11:58,452
[Tabby] I didn't ever take
the $10,000 course,
272
00:11:58,485 --> 00:12:00,420
because that is just a big no,
273
00:12:00,454 --> 00:12:03,890
but I frequently took
the $5,000 to $6,000 courses.
274
00:12:03,924 --> 00:12:07,360
And so I got into debt
pretty easily,
275
00:12:07,394 --> 00:12:09,896
about $80,000 to $100,000.
276
00:12:09,930 --> 00:12:14,801
In order to pay off that debt,
I worked for NXIVM.
277
00:12:14,835 --> 00:12:16,436
Once I was ahead,
they would say,
278
00:12:16,470 --> 00:12:20,774
"Tabby, we just started
this brand-new intensive.
279
00:12:20,807 --> 00:12:22,476
"We think it's the next thing
that you need
280
00:12:22,509 --> 00:12:24,144
to get to your next stripe."
281
00:12:24,177 --> 00:12:26,913
[sighs]
Okay, okay, I can do this.
282
00:12:26,947 --> 00:12:28,281
[India] My grandfather
283
00:12:28,315 --> 00:12:32,419
had so generously left me
money for college,
284
00:12:32,452 --> 00:12:36,289
and I ended up spending it all
on NXIVM courses.
285
00:12:36,323 --> 00:12:37,457
They convinced me
286
00:12:37,491 --> 00:12:40,460
that their education
was better than college.
287
00:12:40,494 --> 00:12:43,797
They wanted me to enroll
in a series of courses
288
00:12:43,830 --> 00:12:46,133
called Jness Tracks.
289
00:12:46,166 --> 00:12:49,136
♪ ♪
290
00:12:49,169 --> 00:12:51,505
Jness had been around
for a while,
291
00:12:51,538 --> 00:12:53,373
but it was just for women.
292
00:12:53,406 --> 00:12:57,344
These new tracks
were like Jness on steroids.
293
00:12:57,377 --> 00:13:00,080
It took the curriculum
to a whole new level.
294
00:13:00,113 --> 00:13:03,116
Even though we had been
with Jness since 2006,
295
00:13:03,150 --> 00:13:06,820
we didn't understand, really,
the men's side of things,
296
00:13:06,853 --> 00:13:10,023
and having the men with us,
it was life-changing.
297
00:13:10,056 --> 00:13:12,526
[woman]
Three, two, one, clap.
298
00:13:12,559 --> 00:13:14,861
I feel like more of a man today
299
00:13:14,895 --> 00:13:16,263
than when I started
this intensive.
300
00:13:16,296 --> 00:13:19,499
[India] NXIVM said the purpose
of the Jness Tracks
301
00:13:19,533 --> 00:13:21,501
was to improve relationships
302
00:13:21,535 --> 00:13:24,070
and to understand
the gender roles.
303
00:13:24,104 --> 00:13:28,041
It's day one, and I felt
so exposed, I felt nauseous.
304
00:13:28,074 --> 00:13:29,176
But there's a potency
305
00:13:29,209 --> 00:13:30,544
to the way
that this is structured
306
00:13:30,577 --> 00:13:32,913
that's really,
really, really effective.
307
00:13:32,946 --> 00:13:35,182
I believe Jness Tracks
really helps understand
308
00:13:35,215 --> 00:13:39,352
some of the-the gender roles
that males experience
309
00:13:39,386 --> 00:13:41,121
with respect to sexuality.
310
00:13:41,154 --> 00:13:44,257
It was a lot about how men
311
00:13:44,291 --> 00:13:46,893
are not naturally monogamous,
312
00:13:46,927 --> 00:13:49,262
and it's normal for men
to want to sleep
313
00:13:49,296 --> 00:13:50,931
with many women
314
00:13:50,964 --> 00:13:54,534
and that women really shouldn't
question what their husbands,
315
00:13:54,568 --> 00:13:56,603
men, boyfriends,
partners are doing.
316
00:13:56,836 --> 00:13:58,238
He can be serious
with one woman
317
00:13:58,271 --> 00:14:00,240
and still do things
with other women,
318
00:14:00,273 --> 00:14:02,576
whereas he knows you can't.
319
00:14:02,609 --> 00:14:03,977
I remember having a problem
320
00:14:04,010 --> 00:14:06,379
with the
open-relationship idea,
321
00:14:06,413 --> 00:14:08,315
and when I said
anything about it,
322
00:14:08,348 --> 00:14:10,584
they would just tell me,
"Well, go get an EM
323
00:14:10,617 --> 00:14:12,919
so that you don't have
that reaction anymore."
324
00:14:12,953 --> 00:14:14,387
[Salzman]
Once you have an EM,
325
00:14:14,421 --> 00:14:17,624
the issue not only isn't
an issue anymore in your life,
326
00:14:17,857 --> 00:14:19,359
but after
a short period of time,
327
00:14:19,392 --> 00:14:21,895
you forget that it ever was.
328
00:14:21,928 --> 00:14:23,230
[India]
To be honest,
329
00:14:23,263 --> 00:14:25,565
my relationship got
worse and worse
330
00:14:25,599 --> 00:14:27,634
as I continued
with the Jness Tracks,
331
00:14:27,867 --> 00:14:30,904
although I wanted to tell
myself that it got better.
332
00:14:30,937 --> 00:14:33,873
I think what I gained
is a perspective
333
00:14:33,907 --> 00:14:36,643
that allows me to exercise
my free will
334
00:14:36,876 --> 00:14:41,414
in a very different way,
actually exercise my free will.
335
00:14:41,448 --> 00:14:45,919
[India] I believed Michel and I
had a monogamous relationship.
336
00:14:45,952 --> 00:14:49,122
I was only, like, 23 years old,
337
00:14:49,155 --> 00:14:51,157
and I-I hadn't had
338
00:14:51,191 --> 00:14:52,993
a lot of experience
with these things,
339
00:14:53,026 --> 00:14:54,961
and the majority
of these people were,
340
00:14:54,995 --> 00:14:57,297
you know, 30s and up.
341
00:14:57,330 --> 00:14:59,366
And what I started to learn
342
00:14:59,399 --> 00:15:03,436
was that many of the couples
within NXIVM and ESP
343
00:15:03,470 --> 00:15:06,039
were frequently swapping.
344
00:15:07,474 --> 00:15:10,477
All of these ideas
about sexuality
345
00:15:10,510 --> 00:15:11,978
and blurring boundaries
346
00:15:12,012 --> 00:15:14,481
were repeated constantly
in all of the classes.
347
00:15:15,915 --> 00:15:18,218
It was like a- you're
in a revolving door
348
00:15:18,251 --> 00:15:19,286
that never ends.
349
00:15:19,319 --> 00:15:21,354
It's like, we're going around
350
00:15:21,388 --> 00:15:24,391
in this, uh... in, uh,
some kind of merry-go-round,
351
00:15:24,424 --> 00:15:26,593
and it's just-it just gets
more enjoyable.
352
00:15:26,626 --> 00:15:28,595
[uneasy music]
353
00:15:28,628 --> 00:15:31,931
[Edmondson] When I got here,
I was a ball of stress.
354
00:15:31,965 --> 00:15:34,567
On day one,
I turned to my fiancé
355
00:15:34,601 --> 00:15:36,936
and said, "I just got
my money's worth."
356
00:15:36,970 --> 00:15:38,171
[cheers]
357
00:15:38,204 --> 00:15:39,339
It's my turn.
358
00:15:39,372 --> 00:15:41,341
Every woman needs this.
359
00:15:41,374 --> 00:15:44,044
This is true empowerment.
360
00:15:44,077 --> 00:15:46,479
Take the Jness Tracks.
[laughs]
361
00:15:46,513 --> 00:15:47,714
The Jness Tracks were
362
00:15:47,947 --> 00:15:49,582
incredibly lucrative
for the company,
363
00:15:49,616 --> 00:15:51,718
and I got a lot of pressure
from Mark Vicente
364
00:15:51,951 --> 00:15:54,254
at the time to continue
taking more tracks.
365
00:15:54,287 --> 00:15:55,522
He was making commissions
366
00:15:55,555 --> 00:15:57,557
off of any of the trainings
that I took.
367
00:15:57,590 --> 00:15:59,726
This training is, uh,
368
00:15:59,959 --> 00:16:03,697
a very, very, very safe
environment
369
00:16:03,730 --> 00:16:05,665
for men and women
to be together.
370
00:16:05,699 --> 00:16:07,233
[woman]
Um, you're hired.
371
00:16:07,267 --> 00:16:08,501
-[laughter]
-Yeah?
372
00:16:08,535 --> 00:16:10,337
[Keith]
Most people scream abuse,
373
00:16:10,370 --> 00:16:12,105
and they have no idea
of the morality
374
00:16:12,138 --> 00:16:13,373
that they're talking about,
375
00:16:13,406 --> 00:16:14,974
and a lot of times,
376
00:16:15,008 --> 00:16:17,577
the screaming of abuse
is abuse in itself.
377
00:16:17,610 --> 00:16:21,715
One of the Jness Tracks
was actually about rape,
378
00:16:21,748 --> 00:16:26,152
and Keith would blur the lines
between rape and consent.
379
00:16:26,186 --> 00:16:28,188
[Keith]
You physically could rape.
380
00:16:28,221 --> 00:16:32,258
Really, the issue is, why won't
you let yourself go there?
381
00:16:32,292 --> 00:16:35,061
[India] The idea that rape
wasn't rape
382
00:16:35,095 --> 00:16:37,764
if the victim didn't choose
to see it that way
383
00:16:37,997 --> 00:16:40,033
started to become normalized,
384
00:16:40,066 --> 00:16:43,503
and it wasn't like you just
heard those "lessons" once.
385
00:16:43,536 --> 00:16:46,473
You heard them over
and over and over again.
386
00:16:46,506 --> 00:16:48,641
So that just became normal.
387
00:16:48,675 --> 00:16:50,510
[Keith]
Molested, abused.
388
00:16:50,543 --> 00:16:52,512
The worst thing
that ever happened to you.
389
00:16:52,545 --> 00:16:54,614
You know how I know
it wasn't that bad?
390
00:16:54,647 --> 00:16:56,182
'Cause you're all sitting here.
391
00:16:56,216 --> 00:16:57,550
In Jness, one of the things
392
00:16:57,584 --> 00:16:59,419
I had to struggle with
393
00:16:59,452 --> 00:17:02,088
was how they spoke about rape.
394
00:17:04,090 --> 00:17:07,160
W-what happened to me
395
00:17:07,193 --> 00:17:10,230
should never have happened
to anyone.
396
00:17:12,432 --> 00:17:15,402
Growing up, my family was part
397
00:17:15,435 --> 00:17:19,305
of this religious cult
called the Children of God.
398
00:17:19,339 --> 00:17:22,075
At the time, when I was five,
I was living
399
00:17:22,108 --> 00:17:25,745
in the Philippines
at this commune.
400
00:17:25,779 --> 00:17:28,415
We were all separated by age,
401
00:17:28,448 --> 00:17:31,584
and we all had these...
402
00:17:31,618 --> 00:17:33,420
caretakers...
[sniffles]
403
00:17:33,453 --> 00:17:36,356
...these people
who enforced the rules
404
00:17:36,389 --> 00:17:38,625
and taught us.
405
00:17:38,658 --> 00:17:41,628
[uneasy music]
406
00:17:41,661 --> 00:17:44,097
♪ ♪
407
00:17:44,130 --> 00:17:48,401
This caretaker raped me...
408
00:17:48,435 --> 00:17:51,104
and took away my innocence...
409
00:17:51,137 --> 00:17:53,173
♪ ♪
410
00:17:53,206 --> 00:17:57,610
...and violated me
in the most inhumane way.
411
00:17:59,813 --> 00:18:03,283
So how NXIVM
talked about rape--
412
00:18:05,385 --> 00:18:08,121
now it was--
413
00:18:08,154 --> 00:18:10,723
just happened to my body.
414
00:18:10,757 --> 00:18:14,861
Did not make once-
one ounce of sense to me.
415
00:18:15,094 --> 00:18:19,666
The person that's the victim,
self-victimizing, is abusing.
416
00:18:19,699 --> 00:18:22,702
The person
who is complaining is abusing.
417
00:18:22,735 --> 00:18:23,837
So the question...
418
00:18:23,870 --> 00:18:25,472
[Naomi]
I wanted to leave NXIVM,
419
00:18:25,505 --> 00:18:26,639
but I didn't.
420
00:18:26,673 --> 00:18:28,641
It was very confusing.
421
00:18:28,675 --> 00:18:30,310
When you're the only one
in the room
422
00:18:30,343 --> 00:18:32,312
who thinks something is wrong,
423
00:18:32,345 --> 00:18:33,680
are you the wrong one?
424
00:18:33,713 --> 00:18:36,316
Are you the right one?
425
00:18:36,349 --> 00:18:39,652
After what happened
to me as a child,
426
00:18:39,686 --> 00:18:43,223
it's hard to admit that
I was part of another cult,
427
00:18:43,256 --> 00:18:46,860
especially an organization
like NXIVM.
428
00:18:48,495 --> 00:18:51,164
Uh, yeah.
Why do I look green?
429
00:18:51,197 --> 00:18:54,334
[Naomi] Looking back, I see
how they were slowly creating
430
00:18:54,367 --> 00:18:55,802
this environment for Keith
431
00:18:55,835 --> 00:18:58,505
to achieve
his horrible, barbaric goals
432
00:18:58,538 --> 00:19:00,507
by completely manipulating
433
00:19:00,540 --> 00:19:02,709
the minds of women and men.
434
00:19:04,177 --> 00:19:07,714
[man speaking foreign language]
435
00:19:12,886 --> 00:19:15,355
[men groaning]
436
00:19:15,388 --> 00:19:17,490
[cheers and applause]
437
00:19:17,524 --> 00:19:19,392
[Ashley]
Probably one
438
00:19:19,425 --> 00:19:22,629
of the most horrifying
programs of NXIVM
439
00:19:22,662 --> 00:19:24,864
was something called SOP,
440
00:19:24,898 --> 00:19:28,368
because it was really militant.
441
00:19:28,401 --> 00:19:31,204
[disquieting music]
442
00:19:31,237 --> 00:19:32,372
[Ames]
Throughout history,
443
00:19:32,405 --> 00:19:34,707
most movements
have been led by men.
444
00:19:34,741 --> 00:19:37,710
They go grab their pitchforks,
or they grab their muskets,
445
00:19:37,744 --> 00:19:39,479
or they grab something.
446
00:19:39,512 --> 00:19:42,815
Imagine knowing that
you have thousands of men,
447
00:19:42,849 --> 00:19:44,617
maybe even millions of men,
448
00:19:44,651 --> 00:19:47,520
that will fortify the
principles that we stand for.
449
00:19:47,554 --> 00:19:49,889
[applause]
450
00:19:49,923 --> 00:19:51,524
[cheering]
451
00:19:51,558 --> 00:19:54,861
SOP stands
for "Society of Protectors."
452
00:19:54,894 --> 00:19:58,898
It started off as
the male counterpart to Jness.
453
00:19:58,932 --> 00:20:00,600
[Keith]
Primitive parts of us
454
00:20:00,633 --> 00:20:02,869
are hungry fucking beasties.
455
00:20:02,902 --> 00:20:04,370
I mean, that's what
we want to do,
456
00:20:04,404 --> 00:20:08,308
is fucking, fucking,
fuck, fuck, fuck.
457
00:20:08,341 --> 00:20:10,343
Feel like fucking
something today.
458
00:20:10,376 --> 00:20:11,778
"God, I'm pissed!
I want to fuck something!"
459
00:20:11,811 --> 00:20:12,779
You know?
460
00:20:12,812 --> 00:20:14,247
If we conquer a woman,
461
00:20:14,280 --> 00:20:16,249
if we grab the thing
we want to fuck,
462
00:20:16,282 --> 00:20:18,918
whatever it is, and fuck it,
they enjoy it.
463
00:20:18,952 --> 00:20:21,220
[cheers and applause]
464
00:20:21,254 --> 00:20:24,991
No one has ever taught us
how to relate to women
465
00:20:25,224 --> 00:20:28,795
nowhere in all the education
my whole life...
466
00:20:28,828 --> 00:20:31,331
and this is, in my opinion,
467
00:20:31,364 --> 00:20:33,366
the Harvard of trying to relate
to women.
468
00:20:33,399 --> 00:20:34,834
You have to come.
469
00:20:34,867 --> 00:20:36,936
Cult indoctrination is actually
470
00:20:36,970 --> 00:20:39,372
a mind-control regime
471
00:20:39,405 --> 00:20:43,776
to reprogram your beliefs
and to foster obedience.
472
00:20:43,810 --> 00:20:47,981
What you see in NXIVM
is the same indoctrination
473
00:20:48,014 --> 00:20:50,249
and coercive
persuasion process
474
00:20:50,283 --> 00:20:52,585
used by
terrorist organizations
475
00:20:52,619 --> 00:20:54,454
like ISIS and al-Qaeda.
476
00:20:54,487 --> 00:20:57,490
[in Arabic] We were beating each other
because it would make us tougher,
477
00:20:57,523 --> 00:21:00,259
and they said it wouldn't hurt next time.
478
00:21:02,362 --> 00:21:05,665
[Ross, in English] Where was Keith Raniere
really going with all this?
479
00:21:05,698 --> 00:21:08,534
Because it appears that
he was going to weaponize
480
00:21:08,568 --> 00:21:10,603
his most devoted followers.
481
00:21:10,637 --> 00:21:12,939
People bond through pain.
482
00:21:12,972 --> 00:21:15,742
They don't bond
through "ha ha" happy.
483
00:21:15,775 --> 00:21:20,480
[India] Next, Keith developed
the SOP Complete program,
484
00:21:20,513 --> 00:21:22,348
and he invited women
485
00:21:22,382 --> 00:21:24,550
to take this curriculum
with men.
486
00:21:24,584 --> 00:21:26,819
[Ashley]
SOP Complete was an intensive
487
00:21:26,853 --> 00:21:28,688
that was six days long
488
00:21:28,721 --> 00:21:31,290
for women to understand
what it was like
489
00:21:31,324 --> 00:21:33,326
to be treated like little boys.
490
00:21:33,359 --> 00:21:36,295
Because we weren't raised
the way little boys were,
491
00:21:36,329 --> 00:21:38,431
we had to learn
how to be disciplined.
492
00:21:38,464 --> 00:21:42,335
I actually sat right there
when I took SOP.
493
00:21:42,368 --> 00:21:43,670
That was probably
494
00:21:43,703 --> 00:21:46,673
one of the more
disturbing programs.
495
00:21:46,706 --> 00:21:48,374
[Ashley] Every day
we were just supposed to wear
496
00:21:48,408 --> 00:21:50,009
the biggest, baggiest clothes.
497
00:21:50,043 --> 00:21:52,879
It was all about not drawing
attention to your body.
498
00:21:52,912 --> 00:21:54,914
[India] There were a series
of physical challenges,
499
00:21:54,947 --> 00:21:57,083
like planks and push-ups,
500
00:21:57,316 --> 00:21:59,852
and we weren't allowed to eat
or drink or pee
501
00:21:59,886 --> 00:22:01,854
unless we asked permission.
502
00:22:01,888 --> 00:22:03,856
We were told that as women,
503
00:22:03,890 --> 00:22:06,526
we couldn't just
get away with things
504
00:22:06,559 --> 00:22:08,695
to achieve success in life.
505
00:22:08,728 --> 00:22:13,366
We had to agree to accept
100% feedback
506
00:22:13,399 --> 00:22:15,868
when you signed up
for one of these courses,
507
00:22:15,902 --> 00:22:19,906
and I remember,
in one of the courses,
508
00:22:19,939 --> 00:22:22,942
I was wearing
these pink Converse,
509
00:22:22,975 --> 00:22:25,411
and the man
who was running my group
510
00:22:25,445 --> 00:22:26,713
made a comment to me.
511
00:22:26,746 --> 00:22:31,350
He said, "Every time you wear
those pink Converse,
512
00:22:31,384 --> 00:22:34,387
all I can think about
is fucking you."
513
00:22:34,420 --> 00:22:38,725
And I felt totally humiliated
and embarrassed,
514
00:22:38,758 --> 00:22:41,060
like I had done
something wrong,
515
00:22:41,094 --> 00:22:44,397
like the fact that I was a girl
516
00:22:44,430 --> 00:22:46,432
wearing pink shoes
517
00:22:46,466 --> 00:22:48,968
was taunting him
and torturing him as a man,
518
00:22:49,001 --> 00:22:51,370
but I bought that,
and I believed that.
519
00:22:51,404 --> 00:22:54,974
I believed that my action
was hurting him.
520
00:22:55,007 --> 00:22:57,643
-[insects chirping]
-Ah.
521
00:22:57,677 --> 00:23:00,580
[Lalich] Using that kind
of misogyny was a way
522
00:23:00,613 --> 00:23:02,381
to get the women
523
00:23:02,415 --> 00:23:03,750
to hate themselves, in a way,
524
00:23:03,783 --> 00:23:06,152
and-and behave
in a subservient way,
525
00:23:06,385 --> 00:23:09,589
which is what Keith Raniere
was promoting.
526
00:23:09,622 --> 00:23:12,558
[Ashley] They made fun of you,
demean you.
527
00:23:12,592 --> 00:23:15,628
If you talked back, you had
to wear a crown or a mask.
528
00:23:15,661 --> 00:23:17,563
[India] They even made
Clare Bronfman
529
00:23:17,597 --> 00:23:19,499
wear a jockstrap.
530
00:23:19,532 --> 00:23:21,768
They gave us nicknames
and mantras.
531
00:23:21,801 --> 00:23:26,472
Mine was "I am nothing,
and I have no real emotions."
532
00:23:26,506 --> 00:23:29,842
In order to speak,
you had to repeat that mantra
533
00:23:29,876 --> 00:23:31,077
over and over again,
534
00:23:31,110 --> 00:23:33,746
sometimes yelling
across the room.
535
00:23:33,780 --> 00:23:35,181
♪ ♪
536
00:23:35,414 --> 00:23:38,451
I basically just fell
into a pattern of compliance
537
00:23:38,484 --> 00:23:41,454
because that was
the safest thing I could do
538
00:23:41,487 --> 00:23:44,757
to not be pointed out
and humiliated.
539
00:23:44,791 --> 00:23:48,895
SOP was
a very abusive curriculum.
540
00:23:49,996 --> 00:23:52,565
[India] The freakiest part
for me about that training
541
00:23:52,598 --> 00:23:54,066
is that at the end of it,
542
00:23:54,100 --> 00:23:56,969
you love your male mentors,
543
00:23:57,003 --> 00:23:58,471
and you feel like,
544
00:23:58,504 --> 00:24:00,973
"This is the best thing
that's ever happened to me."
545
00:24:01,007 --> 00:24:02,975
I still don't understand it.
546
00:24:03,009 --> 00:24:05,044
How did they make us
feel grateful
547
00:24:05,077 --> 00:24:07,013
for that kind of abuse?
548
00:24:11,117 --> 00:24:13,152
[Ashley]
At the end of SOP Complete,
549
00:24:13,186 --> 00:24:15,988
they want you to sign up
for $50 a month
550
00:24:16,022 --> 00:24:17,990
to be part of a team.
551
00:24:18,024 --> 00:24:21,093
You practice something
called "readiness drills."
552
00:24:21,127 --> 00:24:23,963
Every day somebody
in the chain of command
553
00:24:23,996 --> 00:24:26,532
would send in the word "ready"
554
00:24:26,566 --> 00:24:28,501
to team members
all over the world.
555
00:24:30,203 --> 00:24:32,972
And then everyone on the team
would have to respond
556
00:24:33,005 --> 00:24:35,842
with the word ready
within 60 seconds.
557
00:24:35,875 --> 00:24:38,511
I was in a group of six women
that included India.
558
00:24:38,544 --> 00:24:39,879
[chiming]
559
00:24:39,912 --> 00:24:42,849
If one of the team members
missed the drill,
560
00:24:42,882 --> 00:24:44,517
you would have a fail.
561
00:24:44,550 --> 00:24:46,786
When our group failed
the readiness drill,
562
00:24:46,819 --> 00:24:50,122
we would get what they called
a penance, like a punishment.
563
00:24:50,156 --> 00:24:52,124
[synth music]
564
00:24:52,158 --> 00:24:54,126
[Ashley] Sometimes you're
taking cold showers
565
00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:56,829
or you get up at, like,
4:00 in the morning,
566
00:24:56,863 --> 00:24:59,198
stand for half an hour.
567
00:24:59,232 --> 00:25:01,834
So, if you're traveling,
if you're sleeping,
568
00:25:01,868 --> 00:25:04,203
if you're driving, like,
you're always on edge,
569
00:25:04,237 --> 00:25:06,105
you're always thinking,
you're always going,
570
00:25:06,138 --> 00:25:09,709
"Is it going to go off?
What's next?"
571
00:25:09,742 --> 00:25:12,879
That was what we did
to build character.
572
00:25:12,912 --> 00:25:14,046
[Vicente]
And at the highest levels
573
00:25:14,080 --> 00:25:15,715
of current readiness testing,
574
00:25:15,748 --> 00:25:19,785
629 members in 96 teams
are ready for action.
575
00:25:19,819 --> 00:25:21,787
They are tested at random
576
00:25:21,821 --> 00:25:25,224
at any time day or night.
577
00:25:25,258 --> 00:25:27,059
[Bernstein]
You're not saying, "Okay."
578
00:25:27,093 --> 00:25:28,261
You're not saying, "Here."
579
00:25:28,294 --> 00:25:29,729
You're saying, "Ready,"
580
00:25:29,762 --> 00:25:31,530
which is like giving
your consent.
581
00:25:31,564 --> 00:25:32,865
"I'm ready for this.
582
00:25:32,899 --> 00:25:34,934
"I'm ready for whatever
is about to happen to me.
583
00:25:34,967 --> 00:25:36,802
"I don't know what's
gonna happen to me,
584
00:25:36,836 --> 00:25:38,170
but I need to be ready."
585
00:25:38,204 --> 00:25:40,673
To this day, if I hear
an iPhone go off
586
00:25:40,706 --> 00:25:42,208
with a certain ringer,
587
00:25:42,241 --> 00:25:43,910
like, my whole body goes
588
00:25:43,943 --> 00:25:47,013
into, like,
fight-or-flight mode.
589
00:25:47,046 --> 00:25:49,081
It was about, "Don't think.
590
00:25:49,115 --> 00:25:50,783
Just react."
591
00:25:50,816 --> 00:25:51,984
[Keith]
We can be ready.
592
00:25:52,018 --> 00:25:53,252
[Ross]
There is a parallel
593
00:25:53,286 --> 00:25:55,721
between Jim Jones
and Keith Raniere,
594
00:25:55,755 --> 00:25:58,958
where they wanted people
to obey and obey immediately.
595
00:25:58,991 --> 00:26:01,560
[Keith] There are
no other organizations
596
00:26:01,594 --> 00:26:04,964
that practice readiness
other than the military.
597
00:26:04,997 --> 00:26:08,734
[Ross] He wanted
his followers weaponized
598
00:26:08,768 --> 00:26:11,170
to take on his enemies.
599
00:26:12,805 --> 00:26:15,741
[Yusko] In 2003,
a remarkable story
600
00:26:15,775 --> 00:26:17,810
was published in Forbes,
601
00:26:17,843 --> 00:26:18,945
which should have opened
602
00:26:18,978 --> 00:26:20,713
a lot of people's eyes.
603
00:26:20,746 --> 00:26:22,048
[Cangro] The head
of Seagram's Liquor,
604
00:26:22,081 --> 00:26:24,283
multibillionaire
Edgar Bronfman,
605
00:26:24,317 --> 00:26:26,118
whose daughters,
Clare and Sara,
606
00:26:26,152 --> 00:26:28,821
were deeply involved in NXIVM,
607
00:26:28,854 --> 00:26:30,256
He came out in that article
608
00:26:30,289 --> 00:26:33,092
and said that he thinks
this group is a cult.
609
00:26:33,125 --> 00:26:36,062
Keith then turned the sisters
against their father,
610
00:26:36,095 --> 00:26:37,363
allegedly making Clare
611
00:26:37,596 --> 00:26:40,800
install spyware
on their father's computer.
612
00:26:40,833 --> 00:26:42,802
But even after that article
was published,
613
00:26:42,835 --> 00:26:43,836
nothing happened.
614
00:26:43,869 --> 00:26:45,638
NXIVM kept going.
615
00:26:45,671 --> 00:26:49,675
Whatever shit goes on with us,
we do what's necessary.
616
00:26:49,709 --> 00:26:53,813
[Cangro] Keith had created
the support network around him
617
00:26:53,846 --> 00:26:55,648
that would always stick by him.
618
00:26:55,681 --> 00:26:57,984
[Lalich] His followers did
internal damage control,
619
00:26:58,017 --> 00:26:59,318
where they would say
to people,
620
00:26:59,352 --> 00:27:01,220
"You might see something
by so-and-so.
621
00:27:01,253 --> 00:27:02,822
"Well, so-and-so's
a declared enemy
622
00:27:02,855 --> 00:27:04,256
"because they're really
just jealous
623
00:27:04,290 --> 00:27:06,692
and they don't want
to see us succeed."
624
00:27:06,726 --> 00:27:08,627
[Ross]
Over a period of years,
625
00:27:08,661 --> 00:27:10,930
the Bronfman sisters
have spent
626
00:27:10,963 --> 00:27:12,064
huge amounts of money
627
00:27:12,098 --> 00:27:14,633
on damage control
to defend NXIVM.
628
00:27:14,667 --> 00:27:18,671
I know, because there
was information about Raniere
629
00:27:18,704 --> 00:27:20,873
that I published
on culteducation.com
630
00:27:20,906 --> 00:27:22,341
and was sued over.
631
00:27:22,375 --> 00:27:25,878
[Yusko] NXIVM filed
a $10 million lawsuit
632
00:27:25,911 --> 00:27:27,213
against Rick Ross.
633
00:27:27,246 --> 00:27:30,850
It was shocking, the extent
in which NXIVM would go
634
00:27:30,883 --> 00:27:33,319
to silence their critics.
635
00:27:33,352 --> 00:27:35,254
[Ross] They had me
under surveillance.
636
00:27:35,287 --> 00:27:38,024
They actually went
through my garbage.
637
00:27:38,057 --> 00:27:40,192
They set up a phony client
638
00:27:40,226 --> 00:27:42,695
to retain me
for an intervention
639
00:27:42,728 --> 00:27:46,032
in an effort to get me
out on a- on a cruise ship
640
00:27:46,065 --> 00:27:47,199
in the middle of the ocean.
641
00:27:47,233 --> 00:27:49,702
What their intention
was regarding that,
642
00:27:49,735 --> 00:27:51,370
I-I'll never know.
643
00:27:51,404 --> 00:27:54,040
[India] A lot of people
were labeled the enemy,
644
00:27:54,073 --> 00:27:58,077
so anyone who left NXIVM
or disagreed with them
645
00:27:58,110 --> 00:28:00,012
would be put
into that category.
646
00:28:00,046 --> 00:28:04,884
I remember Nancy specifically
singling out Rick Ross
647
00:28:04,917 --> 00:28:06,085
as a suppressive.
648
00:28:06,118 --> 00:28:08,387
[Nancy]
A full suppressive is
649
00:28:08,421 --> 00:28:11,223
the worst possible thing
that can occur,
650
00:28:11,257 --> 00:28:13,325
because these people
look like you
651
00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:18,230
and they seem to act like you,
but they're nothing like you.
652
00:28:19,698 --> 00:28:20,900
[lock clicks]
653
00:28:20,933 --> 00:28:22,134
[India] Why didn't
I even question it?
654
00:28:22,168 --> 00:28:23,135
-Hi.
-Hi, there.
655
00:28:23,169 --> 00:28:24,336
It's nice to meet you.
656
00:28:24,370 --> 00:28:27,440
Keith and Nancy told us
to think of you
657
00:28:27,473 --> 00:28:31,143
as a devil, like Lucifer,
658
00:28:31,177 --> 00:28:36,115
and I'm embarrassed
that I- I believed that.
659
00:28:36,148 --> 00:28:38,451
I don't think that's anything
to be embarrassed about.
660
00:28:38,484 --> 00:28:40,252
There are many groups
that teach
661
00:28:40,286 --> 00:28:43,189
that whoever opposes them
is evil,
662
00:28:43,222 --> 00:28:45,858
they're Satanic,
they're possessed by demons.
663
00:28:45,891 --> 00:28:47,293
And it wasn't about you.
664
00:28:47,326 --> 00:28:48,761
-It was about Keith.
-Mm-hmm.
665
00:28:48,794 --> 00:28:51,197
It was about what he wanted
everyone to believe.
666
00:28:51,230 --> 00:28:53,065
- What he was a genius at...
- Mm-hmm.
667
00:28:53,099 --> 00:28:56,135
...was tweaking
and working this curriculum
668
00:28:56,168 --> 00:28:58,804
with the deliberate intent
of breaking people down.
669
00:28:58,838 --> 00:29:01,874
After I took one
of the SOP trainings,
670
00:29:01,907 --> 00:29:06,745
I remember telling Mark Vicente
that I just felt very dark,
671
00:29:06,779 --> 00:29:10,449
like I felt like I had gone
into a depressed state,
672
00:29:10,483 --> 00:29:12,318
and I thought,
"Is this normal?"
673
00:29:12,351 --> 00:29:14,086
And he was like, "Yeah."
674
00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:16,455
They used to record
people's brainwaves
675
00:29:16,489 --> 00:29:18,124
and emotional reactions.
676
00:29:18,157 --> 00:29:21,794
It was a cap that they would
put on their heads
677
00:29:21,827 --> 00:29:24,763
and then track what
was going on with their brains
678
00:29:24,797 --> 00:29:26,765
while they were either
getting EMs
679
00:29:26,799 --> 00:29:30,002
or while they were exploring
in certain intensives.
680
00:29:31,170 --> 00:29:36,108
I think it could help create,
like, a new form of science.
681
00:29:36,142 --> 00:29:38,344
[Cangro] Dr. Brandon Porter
joined NXIVM
682
00:29:38,377 --> 00:29:40,179
in the early 2000s,
683
00:29:40,212 --> 00:29:41,814
originally to do tests
684
00:29:41,847 --> 00:29:42,982
on how well
685
00:29:43,015 --> 00:29:44,917
the curriculum was working.
686
00:29:44,950 --> 00:29:47,419
Nancy Salzman and Keith
had made a bunch of different claims
687
00:29:47,453 --> 00:29:49,321
that their teachings
would be able
688
00:29:49,355 --> 00:29:52,124
to cure things
like Tourette's and OCD.
689
00:29:52,158 --> 00:29:56,228
It was Dr. Porter's job to see,
do these things actually work?
690
00:29:56,262 --> 00:29:58,964
[Porter] Every time
we're putting the hat on,
691
00:29:58,998 --> 00:30:00,266
it's like fishing.
692
00:30:00,299 --> 00:30:02,368
I'm throwing something out
693
00:30:02,401 --> 00:30:04,870
and then, like, seeing
if I catch anything.
694
00:30:04,904 --> 00:30:06,505
So keep wearing those hats.
695
00:30:06,539 --> 00:30:07,873
Yeah.
696
00:30:09,375 --> 00:30:11,544
[India] At the time, I didn't
think it was all that strange
697
00:30:11,577 --> 00:30:14,280
because they were saying that
they were a scientific program
698
00:30:14,313 --> 00:30:16,448
that was trying
to track everything.
699
00:30:16,482 --> 00:30:20,119
The cap with the electrodes
is kind of like pseudoscience,
700
00:30:20,152 --> 00:30:23,322
and it just kept getting
more and more extreme.
701
00:30:24,523 --> 00:30:28,460
Dr. Brandon Porter was doing
these, like crazy experiments,
702
00:30:28,494 --> 00:30:30,196
where he was exposing women
703
00:30:30,229 --> 00:30:32,531
to these horrific scenes
of violence.
704
00:30:34,066 --> 00:30:36,869
He sat women in a chair.
705
00:30:36,902 --> 00:30:39,872
He showed them
horrifying images of people
706
00:30:39,905 --> 00:30:42,541
being slaughtered
and mutilated,
707
00:30:42,575 --> 00:30:45,544
and then he filmed
their facial expression.
708
00:30:45,578 --> 00:30:49,081
[Glazer] If they expressed
horror and wanted to stop,
709
00:30:49,114 --> 00:30:50,316
it was suggested
710
00:30:50,349 --> 00:30:52,051
that that wouldn't be good
for the experiment.
711
00:30:52,084 --> 00:30:53,219
They needed to continue.
712
00:30:53,252 --> 00:30:54,587
And the very last scene
713
00:30:54,620 --> 00:30:56,188
that the subjects
were exposed to
714
00:30:56,222 --> 00:30:58,023
was actual footage
715
00:30:58,057 --> 00:31:01,026
of some drug cartel members
716
00:31:01,060 --> 00:31:05,197
hacking up and dismembering
five live Mexican women.
717
00:31:05,231 --> 00:31:08,467
[in Spanish]
They held the heads of the women and said,
718
00:31:08,500 --> 00:31:11,337
"Look at what we did to your whores."
719
00:31:11,370 --> 00:31:14,006
They showed their heads and their bodies.
720
00:31:14,540 --> 00:31:16,242
It was traumatic.
721
00:31:16,909 --> 00:31:20,346
[in English] One person seems to be alive
for, like, 60 seconds.
722
00:31:20,379 --> 00:31:23,115
So there's- there's having
that done to you,
723
00:31:23,148 --> 00:31:26,085
and then what is it like
being the executioner?
724
00:31:26,118 --> 00:31:27,653
[Meier] It was something
out of, like,
725
00:31:27,886 --> 00:31:29,655
a Goebbels experiment.
726
00:31:29,888 --> 00:31:31,457
[Lalich]
Makes one immediately think
727
00:31:31,490 --> 00:31:33,292
about what the Nazis
were doing,
728
00:31:33,325 --> 00:31:35,394
where they carried out
horrific experiments
729
00:31:35,427 --> 00:31:38,597
under the guise
of "great medical experiments."
730
00:31:38,631 --> 00:31:41,267
This completely
unconscionable,
731
00:31:41,300 --> 00:31:42,668
illegal activity,
732
00:31:42,901 --> 00:31:46,105
even if this were
in a medical institution,
733
00:31:46,138 --> 00:31:47,373
and of course, it wasn't.
734
00:31:47,406 --> 00:31:48,907
In my opinion,
735
00:31:48,941 --> 00:31:50,943
one of the most horrific things
I've ever heard of,
736
00:31:50,976 --> 00:31:53,012
and I've been studying cults
for 30 years.
737
00:31:53,045 --> 00:31:56,148
There's a part of me that
is so scared to do this.
738
00:31:56,181 --> 00:31:58,917
-[Keith] Good.
-[light laughter]
739
00:31:58,951 --> 00:32:01,153
[Ross] There were no boundaries
as to what the group
740
00:32:01,186 --> 00:32:03,122
might subject you to.
741
00:32:03,155 --> 00:32:05,257
You could have a meltdown.
742
00:32:05,291 --> 00:32:07,626
You could have
a psychotic break.
743
00:32:07,660 --> 00:32:10,629
You could fold, and people did.
744
00:32:10,663 --> 00:32:13,632
[India] I had seen people
have complete meltdowns
745
00:32:13,666 --> 00:32:15,434
in intensives,
746
00:32:15,467 --> 00:32:19,471
They were quickly escorted out.
It was very hushed.
747
00:32:19,505 --> 00:32:21,507
But I had never heard
748
00:32:21,540 --> 00:32:24,343
of anything
like Ana Cecilia's story.
749
00:32:24,376 --> 00:32:26,312
My name is Ana Cecilia,
750
00:32:26,345 --> 00:32:28,180
and I was in ESP
751
00:32:28,213 --> 00:32:31,083
for six months in 2002.
752
00:32:31,116 --> 00:32:33,419
This is the first time
I talk publicly about this.
753
00:32:33,452 --> 00:32:38,324
I had a psychotic event in one
of the advanced trainings.
754
00:32:38,357 --> 00:32:40,959
This was 2002,
so, like, 18 years ago.
755
00:32:40,993 --> 00:32:42,127
-Wow.
-Yeah.
756
00:32:42,161 --> 00:32:43,996
Oh, my gosh,
this is, like, 10 years
757
00:32:44,029 --> 00:32:45,731
before I even got involved.
758
00:32:45,964 --> 00:32:47,733
[Ana] Yeah, wow.
759
00:32:47,966 --> 00:32:50,002
My family and I were invited
760
00:32:50,035 --> 00:32:53,005
by Alex Betancourt
in Mexico City.
761
00:32:53,038 --> 00:32:54,506
I was with my mom,
762
00:32:54,540 --> 00:32:55,641
and I said joking, like,
763
00:32:55,674 --> 00:32:57,676
"I feel like
we're being hypnotized,"
764
00:32:57,710 --> 00:33:00,145
And she said, "Nah,"
like, "Yeah"...
765
00:33:00,179 --> 00:33:02,181
And that was it.
766
00:33:02,214 --> 00:33:03,716
And six months later,
767
00:33:03,749 --> 00:33:06,752
I'm, like, having
a total mental breakdown.
768
00:33:06,985 --> 00:33:09,321
[melancholy music]
769
00:33:09,355 --> 00:33:11,056
♪ ♪
770
00:33:11,090 --> 00:33:13,225
I was six months
into the program,
771
00:33:13,258 --> 00:33:15,060
and I was in Albany
772
00:33:15,094 --> 00:33:16,595
in the level two intensive.
773
00:33:16,628 --> 00:33:20,099
Usually Nancy spoke in class.
774
00:33:20,132 --> 00:33:22,101
I'd like you to think
775
00:33:22,134 --> 00:33:25,104
of the saddest thing
you can think of.
776
00:33:25,137 --> 00:33:27,039
Be aware,
777
00:33:27,072 --> 00:33:31,043
you're experiencing
the sadness...
778
00:33:31,076 --> 00:33:35,547
yet at the same time,
you're separate from it.
779
00:33:35,581 --> 00:33:38,584
[Ana] I was feeling
her tone of voice
780
00:33:38,617 --> 00:33:41,520
changing and saying one thing,
781
00:33:41,553 --> 00:33:43,322
but kind of meaning another.
782
00:33:43,355 --> 00:33:46,725
Go deeper and deeper
783
00:33:46,759 --> 00:33:48,594
into the emotion.
784
00:33:48,627 --> 00:33:50,763
Something in my heart
told me this is not good.
785
00:33:50,796 --> 00:33:54,733
And I just said, "I'm done,
I quit," and I left.
786
00:33:54,767 --> 00:33:57,269
Nancy came after me,
and I said,
787
00:33:57,302 --> 00:34:00,339
"If I really dedicate my life
to Keith and his mission,
788
00:34:00,372 --> 00:34:02,408
"I feel like I'm gonna lose
everything that I love,
789
00:34:02,441 --> 00:34:04,376
"everything in my life,
my family,
790
00:34:04,410 --> 00:34:08,347
my friends, my relationship,
my future, in a sense."
791
00:34:08,380 --> 00:34:10,082
And she said, "Oh, don't worry.
792
00:34:10,115 --> 00:34:13,118
You know, you're gonna see them
on the other side."
793
00:34:13,152 --> 00:34:15,654
In that state,
I took it as I would meet them
794
00:34:15,687 --> 00:34:17,823
in the next life
or in the afterlife.
795
00:34:18,056 --> 00:34:20,259
That's the last thing
I remember she said.
796
00:34:20,292 --> 00:34:22,761
My mind went blank,
and that's when I...
797
00:34:22,795 --> 00:34:25,464
I think that's when
the psychosis really kicked in,
798
00:34:25,497 --> 00:34:27,599
because then I- I lost clarity
799
00:34:27,633 --> 00:34:29,301
of what was real
and what wasn't.
800
00:34:29,334 --> 00:34:31,270
[Salzman]
Do you agree to take feedback?
801
00:34:31,303 --> 00:34:33,238
[Hassan] If you're
a psychiatrist whose-
802
00:34:33,272 --> 00:34:35,507
whose oath is do no harm,
803
00:34:35,541 --> 00:34:36,542
you would never mess
804
00:34:36,575 --> 00:34:37,543
with people's minds,
805
00:34:37,576 --> 00:34:39,711
but people like Nancy Salzman
806
00:34:39,745 --> 00:34:42,481
and Keith Raniere
used hypnosis
807
00:34:42,514 --> 00:34:46,151
and neurolinguistic programing
to manipulate people.
808
00:34:46,185 --> 00:34:49,288
If someone is very effective
as a hypnotist,
809
00:34:49,321 --> 00:34:52,424
they can get
very intelligent people
810
00:34:52,458 --> 00:34:55,394
to turn against themselves
and their true self,
811
00:34:55,427 --> 00:34:57,396
as well as their family
and friends.
812
00:34:59,331 --> 00:35:01,500
[Ana] I was sent back
to the hotel to sleep,
813
00:35:01,533 --> 00:35:05,471
but I couldn't sleep, and
my hallucinations got worse.
814
00:35:05,504 --> 00:35:07,439
I heard my boyfriend
talking on the phone.
815
00:35:07,473 --> 00:35:10,142
They told him to bring me
back to the center.
816
00:35:10,175 --> 00:35:11,743
That's when I just ran.
817
00:35:11,777 --> 00:35:13,612
[disquieting music]
818
00:35:13,645 --> 00:35:17,249
Like, I literally ran out
of the hotel room half naked,
819
00:35:17,282 --> 00:35:20,619
and, like, did
a whole horrible scene.
820
00:35:22,354 --> 00:35:24,156
And as I was leaving
in the ambulance,
821
00:35:24,189 --> 00:35:27,226
I saw Alex
and Karen and Raniere
822
00:35:27,259 --> 00:35:29,328
just watching me.
823
00:35:29,361 --> 00:35:31,263
And I knew that
I was in trouble
824
00:35:31,296 --> 00:35:33,131
and that I better shut up.
825
00:35:33,699 --> 00:35:35,534
For fear of?
826
00:35:36,768 --> 00:35:39,505
[Ana] Fear of them
coming after me,
827
00:35:39,538 --> 00:35:43,308
fear of them retaliating
against my family legally.
828
00:35:43,342 --> 00:35:45,277
So I kept silent.
829
00:35:47,212 --> 00:35:49,548
I spoke to Rick Ross,
and he said
830
00:35:49,581 --> 00:35:52,184
that I wasn't the only person
to come from NXIVM
831
00:35:52,217 --> 00:35:53,785
having had a psychotic break.
832
00:35:53,819 --> 00:35:56,522
[Yusko] I was the first person
to report
833
00:35:56,555 --> 00:35:59,391
on NXIVM and ESP,
834
00:35:59,424 --> 00:36:01,727
starting in 2003.
835
00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:04,196
People were saying
that the courses
836
00:36:04,229 --> 00:36:06,899
involved sleep deprivation,
837
00:36:06,932 --> 00:36:09,167
mind-control techniques,
838
00:36:09,201 --> 00:36:12,404
and a lot of the people
that were calling me
839
00:36:12,437 --> 00:36:14,373
and were telling me
840
00:36:14,406 --> 00:36:16,408
they were experiencing this
were women.
841
00:36:18,410 --> 00:36:19,811
In 2003,
842
00:36:19,845 --> 00:36:23,549
Kristin Snyder was taking
a NXIVM course in Alaska,
843
00:36:23,582 --> 00:36:26,485
and she started falling apart
really psychologically.
844
00:36:26,518 --> 00:36:28,887
No one ever saw her after that.
845
00:36:28,921 --> 00:36:30,889
According to police,
she took a kayak
846
00:36:30,923 --> 00:36:32,891
into Alaska Bay,
turned it over,
847
00:36:32,925 --> 00:36:34,259
and killed herself.
848
00:36:35,427 --> 00:36:38,597
State police found
a devastating suicide note
849
00:36:38,630 --> 00:36:39,665
in her truck.
850
00:36:50,309 --> 00:36:52,511
[Ross]
Before she was in NXIVM,
851
00:36:52,544 --> 00:36:54,746
Kristin Snyder was happy.
852
00:36:54,780 --> 00:36:56,248
She had a master's degree.
853
00:36:56,281 --> 00:36:58,550
She had her whole life
ahead of her,
854
00:36:58,584 --> 00:37:00,719
but when she got caught up
855
00:37:00,752 --> 00:37:02,754
in their endless maze
of courses,
856
00:37:02,788 --> 00:37:03,855
she had a meltdown.
857
00:37:06,258 --> 00:37:08,961
Even though it appears
that she killed herself,
858
00:37:08,994 --> 00:37:11,330
they could not recover
the body.
859
00:37:12,798 --> 00:37:14,499
[Yusko] You would think that
that would be enough
860
00:37:14,533 --> 00:37:16,768
to get some investigation
into the group
861
00:37:16,802 --> 00:37:19,304
that allegedly caused this,
862
00:37:19,338 --> 00:37:20,906
but we still have no answers.
863
00:37:21,974 --> 00:37:23,942
I know that NXIVM had a lot
of money
864
00:37:23,976 --> 00:37:25,277
from the Bronfman sisters,
865
00:37:25,310 --> 00:37:26,845
and public officials
866
00:37:26,878 --> 00:37:29,448
didn't want to get
on their wrong side.
867
00:37:29,481 --> 00:37:32,918
Keith Raniere said
the whole thing was a hoax.
868
00:37:32,951 --> 00:37:36,455
Keith told his followers
that Kristin Snyder was alive
869
00:37:36,488 --> 00:37:38,890
and living in Mexico.
870
00:37:41,326 --> 00:37:45,797
[India] By 2015, I had been
in NXIVM for four years,
871
00:37:45,831 --> 00:37:48,934
and I moved into an apartment
in Santa Monica
872
00:37:48,967 --> 00:37:52,437
near the NXIVM center
with my boyfriend, Michel.
873
00:37:52,471 --> 00:37:54,339
I had been a coach a while,
874
00:37:54,373 --> 00:37:56,575
and getting
to the next rank of proctor
875
00:37:56,608 --> 00:37:58,577
felt totally out of my reach.
876
00:37:58,610 --> 00:38:00,746
Michel really pressured me
877
00:38:00,779 --> 00:38:02,481
into taking
the ethicist course
878
00:38:02,514 --> 00:38:04,282
that Keith was teaching.
879
00:38:08,020 --> 00:38:10,856
He said it was
a very exclusive opportunity
880
00:38:10,889 --> 00:38:13,492
to be taught
by Keith directly,
881
00:38:13,525 --> 00:38:16,561
that this was
a very special thing
882
00:38:16,595 --> 00:38:17,929
that I was getting to do.
883
00:38:19,865 --> 00:38:22,934
Keith became obsessed with
having us watch these movies
884
00:38:22,968 --> 00:38:25,671
that were all about people
sacrificing themselves
885
00:38:25,704 --> 00:38:26,972
for a greater cause.
886
00:38:27,005 --> 00:38:30,776
In this cause, I, too,
am prepared to die.
887
00:38:30,809 --> 00:38:32,344
[Keith] You know,
in some cultures,
888
00:38:32,377 --> 00:38:33,578
people fought to die.
889
00:38:33,612 --> 00:38:36,014
The Mayan culture
where they had that that game
890
00:38:36,048 --> 00:38:37,716
and the people
who won the tournament
891
00:38:37,749 --> 00:38:39,317
were all sacrificed
to the sun god,
892
00:38:39,351 --> 00:38:40,686
they fought for that.
893
00:38:40,719 --> 00:38:43,388
They go, "I want that
to happen to me someday.
894
00:38:43,422 --> 00:38:45,557
"I want to get thrown
over an altar
895
00:38:45,590 --> 00:38:48,927
"and have my-myself slit
from my throat to my guts.
896
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:51,630
"I want to drive a plane
into the World Trade Center,
897
00:38:51,663 --> 00:38:53,699
'cause then there's glory."
898
00:38:53,732 --> 00:38:54,833
[India]
I remember sitting
899
00:38:54,866 --> 00:38:57,002
in this breakout group
in ethicist,
900
00:38:57,035 --> 00:38:59,004
and all of a sudden,
901
00:38:59,037 --> 00:39:02,507
I felt like I'm--
will die for Keith.
902
00:39:02,541 --> 00:39:05,377
-Yes.
-Like I would sacrifice myself.
903
00:39:05,410 --> 00:39:08,513
And I saw him sort of
in this godly position.
904
00:39:08,547 --> 00:39:11,516
[uneasy music]
905
00:39:11,550 --> 00:39:13,719
[Ross]
In a destructive cult,
906
00:39:13,752 --> 00:39:16,421
there is an absolute
authoritarian leader
907
00:39:16,455 --> 00:39:18,657
who becomes an object
of worship.
908
00:39:18,690 --> 00:39:21,059
Everything
in the group became,
909
00:39:21,093 --> 00:39:25,030
"How much are you willing
to do for Keith Raniere?"
910
00:39:25,063 --> 00:39:28,066
And Keith Raniere
was teaching a philosophy
911
00:39:28,100 --> 00:39:30,535
that the ends justify
the means.
912
00:39:30,569 --> 00:39:31,903
If we lie, but our goal
913
00:39:31,937 --> 00:39:33,572
is to save the world,
914
00:39:33,605 --> 00:39:35,540
isn't that justified?
915
00:39:35,574 --> 00:39:39,911
You can understand killing
when you feel it is necessary.
916
00:39:39,945 --> 00:39:42,614
So here you have these women,
917
00:39:42,647 --> 00:39:45,117
and let's suppose these women
are representative to you
918
00:39:45,150 --> 00:39:47,652
of a gang
that's killing your family,
919
00:39:47,686 --> 00:39:50,622
and that you feel
that if you don't do this,
920
00:39:50,655 --> 00:39:52,157
your family's gonna die,
921
00:39:52,390 --> 00:39:54,760
or people you know
are gonna die.
922
00:39:54,793 --> 00:39:56,461
So you feel they must die.
923
00:39:56,495 --> 00:39:58,396
[Ross]
Whatever I ask you to do,
924
00:39:58,430 --> 00:40:00,665
don't worry
about whether it's illegal,
925
00:40:00,699 --> 00:40:02,934
it's criminal, it's unethical,
926
00:40:02,968 --> 00:40:06,938
because our goal
is to improve the world,
927
00:40:06,972 --> 00:40:09,074
and as long
as that's our stated goal,
928
00:40:09,107 --> 00:40:12,611
whatever I asked you to do
is justified.
929
00:40:12,644 --> 00:40:15,747
Historically,
the most terrible example
930
00:40:15,781 --> 00:40:19,117
would be Waco or Jonestown,
931
00:40:19,151 --> 00:40:21,486
where you have people
willing to die
932
00:40:21,520 --> 00:40:23,755
and let their children die
933
00:40:23,789 --> 00:40:27,492
because the leader says,
"This is what we must do."
934
00:40:27,526 --> 00:40:29,961
♪ ♪
935
00:40:29,995 --> 00:40:34,065
It's very scary to think
where Keith Raniere
936
00:40:34,099 --> 00:40:35,901
was really leading this group,
937
00:40:35,934 --> 00:40:39,137
because year after year,
it escalated.
938
00:40:39,171 --> 00:40:42,774
[Junco] Vanguard, it is
with great honor that today,
939
00:40:42,808 --> 00:40:46,444
August 26 of 2015,
940
00:40:46,478 --> 00:40:49,648
I get to present you
with a gift,
941
00:40:49,681 --> 00:40:53,485
and it is a commitment
from myself
942
00:40:53,518 --> 00:40:56,588
and from the whole
of the NXIVM community
943
00:40:56,621 --> 00:40:58,623
that before this year ends,
944
00:40:58,657 --> 00:41:00,659
we will have started
the construction
945
00:41:00,692 --> 00:41:04,129
of your $20 million
dream science lab,
946
00:41:04,162 --> 00:41:06,998
a stem cell lab
and a brain lab
947
00:41:07,032 --> 00:41:10,202
with the MRIs and all
the progressive technology.
948
00:41:10,235 --> 00:41:14,139
Mr. Raniere is,
for those who don't know,
949
00:41:14,172 --> 00:41:17,709
RPI's first triple major.
950
00:41:17,742 --> 00:41:21,680
He has degrees in mathematics
and biology in physics.
951
00:41:21,713 --> 00:41:23,248
[Lalich]
One thing Keith always did
952
00:41:23,481 --> 00:41:25,183
was exaggerate
his intelligence,
953
00:41:25,217 --> 00:41:28,854
and they always touted that
he had three graduate degrees.
954
00:41:28,887 --> 00:41:30,021
We later came to see
955
00:41:30,055 --> 00:41:32,657
his actual
college transcripts,
956
00:41:32,691 --> 00:41:35,126
where he was on probation
several times,
957
00:41:35,160 --> 00:41:39,998
and his final GPA was 2.26,
which is barely a C.
958
00:41:40,031 --> 00:41:42,734
Keith was honored in 1989
959
00:41:42,767 --> 00:41:44,870
by the "Genius" Book
of World Records
960
00:41:44,903 --> 00:41:49,641
in the category-category
of highest IQ in human history.
961
00:41:49,674 --> 00:41:53,879
I found this on eBay.
962
00:41:53,912 --> 00:41:55,247
The highest score
963
00:41:55,280 --> 00:41:59,217
in the admission test
devised by Ronald K. Hoeflin...
964
00:41:59,251 --> 00:42:01,519
It names a number of people,
965
00:42:01,553 --> 00:42:04,055
with "Keith Raniere
of New York,
966
00:42:04,089 --> 00:42:06,291
"one of the only three members
967
00:42:06,524 --> 00:42:08,627
who have scored
higher than 45."
968
00:42:08,660 --> 00:42:11,596
I'd love to know
what the Hoeflin Test is.
969
00:42:11,630 --> 00:42:13,231
I've never heard of it.
970
00:42:13,265 --> 00:42:16,001
I'm sure that the
Guinness Book of World Records
971
00:42:16,034 --> 00:42:17,836
realized that it wasn't
a thing.
972
00:42:17,869 --> 00:42:19,738
This is the only edition
973
00:42:19,771 --> 00:42:21,172
that he appears in,
974
00:42:21,206 --> 00:42:23,775
and he's literally only
975
00:42:23,808 --> 00:42:27,245
in the Australian version
of this book.
976
00:42:27,279 --> 00:42:29,080
Keith was born in Brooklyn,
977
00:42:29,114 --> 00:42:30,315
and his parents divorced
978
00:42:30,548 --> 00:42:32,183
when he was around
eight years old.
979
00:42:32,217 --> 00:42:35,253
He then became his mother's
primary caregiver.
980
00:42:35,287 --> 00:42:37,589
She passed away
when he was 18.
981
00:42:37,622 --> 00:42:39,691
His father was actually
in advertising,
982
00:42:39,724 --> 00:42:41,726
and Keith followed
in those footsteps
983
00:42:41,760 --> 00:42:43,295
when he went into sales.
984
00:42:43,328 --> 00:42:45,597
Keith had been diagnosed
as gifted,
985
00:42:45,630 --> 00:42:47,933
and his childhood friends
have said that he developed
986
00:42:47,966 --> 00:42:51,202
a superiority complex
because of it.
987
00:42:51,236 --> 00:42:54,105
What do you think one
common misconception is
988
00:42:54,139 --> 00:42:56,007
that people might have
about you?
989
00:42:58,009 --> 00:43:02,113
I think because my life
is sufficiently different
990
00:43:02,147 --> 00:43:05,116
than a normal life,
it's hard to read,
991
00:43:05,150 --> 00:43:09,955
and if it's hard to read,
people will read as they will
992
00:43:09,988 --> 00:43:12,290
and think
all the strangest things.
993
00:43:17,162 --> 00:43:20,632
[Catherine] In September
of 2015, I had invited India
994
00:43:20,665 --> 00:43:24,302
to join my mother and I
in Tulum for my birthday,
995
00:43:24,336 --> 00:43:27,806
My husband, Casper,
and I had been separated,
996
00:43:27,839 --> 00:43:31,142
and during that trip,
he filed for divorce.
997
00:43:31,176 --> 00:43:33,211
So I was
definitely distracted,
998
00:43:33,244 --> 00:43:36,014
and I only wish in retrospect
999
00:43:36,047 --> 00:43:38,783
that I had been
more present with India
1000
00:43:38,817 --> 00:43:43,655
and that I had maybe noticed
what was going on with her.
1001
00:43:43,688 --> 00:43:46,725
[India] There was not
a lot of time off with NXIVM.
1002
00:43:46,758 --> 00:43:48,193
Even on a family trip,
1003
00:43:48,226 --> 00:43:49,794
I was bombarded
with activities,
1004
00:43:49,828 --> 00:43:51,296
like my SOP group,
1005
00:43:51,329 --> 00:43:54,899
readiness check-ins, calls,
admin work, you name it.
1006
00:43:54,933 --> 00:43:57,369
We were always kept very busy.
1007
00:43:57,402 --> 00:44:00,338
I was trying so hard to do well
1008
00:44:00,372 --> 00:44:04,009
'cause I just really wanted
to be promoted.
1009
00:44:04,042 --> 00:44:06,111
[Elizabeth] I remember going
for walks with India
1010
00:44:06,144 --> 00:44:07,846
and trying to talk to her,
just chat away,
1011
00:44:07,879 --> 00:44:09,381
and I would say,
"But what's it like?
1012
00:44:09,414 --> 00:44:10,882
What are you doing
up in there?"
1013
00:44:10,915 --> 00:44:11,950
"Oh, well, we do this,
1014
00:44:11,983 --> 00:44:13,151
and we do that."
1015
00:44:13,184 --> 00:44:14,686
But I could never get
1016
00:44:14,719 --> 00:44:16,254
a-a total feedback.
1017
00:44:16,287 --> 00:44:21,026
She was faintly absent-minded.
She didn't completely focus.
1018
00:44:21,059 --> 00:44:22,894
She seemed stuck.
1019
00:44:24,829 --> 00:44:27,032
It was right then
1020
00:44:27,065 --> 00:44:28,867
that Keith Raniere
1021
00:44:28,900 --> 00:44:32,404
took a very dark turn that...
1022
00:44:34,072 --> 00:44:37,942
...affected, impacted
my daughter's life profoundly.
1023
00:44:37,976 --> 00:44:39,711
I wish I had known.
1024
00:44:39,744 --> 00:44:44,049
I wish I had known to be able
to inter-intervene
1025
00:44:44,082 --> 00:44:46,084
in that moment.
1026
00:44:48,253 --> 00:44:50,455
[India]
By the end of 2015,
1027
00:44:50,688 --> 00:44:52,357
I was going
to Albany constantly
1028
00:44:52,390 --> 00:44:54,059
to take more classes.
1029
00:44:54,092 --> 00:44:56,728
I used to stay with Mark
and his wife, Bonnie,
1030
00:44:56,761 --> 00:45:00,398
and sometimes Allison Mack
would be there, too.
1031
00:45:00,432 --> 00:45:04,002
Allison was very expressive.
She was really outgoing.
1032
00:45:04,035 --> 00:45:05,403
She seemed fearless.
1033
00:45:05,437 --> 00:45:06,805
[speaking indistinctly]
1034
00:45:06,838 --> 00:45:08,440
All these characteristics
1035
00:45:08,473 --> 00:45:10,875
that I felt kind of weak in...
1036
00:45:12,077 --> 00:45:13,278
[Allison]
Principles.
1037
00:45:13,311 --> 00:45:15,814
If you have principles
that you won't violate...
1038
00:45:15,847 --> 00:45:17,849
[India] Allison taught a series
of advanced courses,
1039
00:45:17,882 --> 00:45:19,250
which I took.
1040
00:45:19,284 --> 00:45:22,754
It's always easier to satiate
than build character.
1041
00:45:22,787 --> 00:45:25,423
She was progressing up
the Stripe Path really fast,
1042
00:45:25,457 --> 00:45:28,059
and all of a sudden,
she was promoted to proctor.
1043
00:45:28,093 --> 00:45:29,461
I think it's perfect.
1044
00:45:29,494 --> 00:45:31,262
[India] I looked up to her
because of that.
1045
00:45:31,296 --> 00:45:32,931
I mean, what I did, I-I...
1046
00:45:32,964 --> 00:45:35,033
And I wanted that.
1047
00:45:35,066 --> 00:45:36,935
So, when she approached me,
1048
00:45:36,968 --> 00:45:39,037
I felt like the popular girl
at school
1049
00:45:39,070 --> 00:45:41,106
was coming to talk to me.
1050
00:45:41,139 --> 00:45:44,342
Allison asked me,
"How are you doing?"
1051
00:45:44,375 --> 00:45:46,277
So I just kind of answered
her honestly,
1052
00:45:46,311 --> 00:45:48,279
which was "Not good."
1053
00:45:48,313 --> 00:45:50,348
I just felt
like I was at a loss.
1054
00:45:50,381 --> 00:45:53,184
It had been a long time
since I had been promoted,
1055
00:45:53,218 --> 00:45:55,286
but I was taking tons
of classes.
1056
00:45:55,320 --> 00:45:57,222
I was teaching
tons of classes.
1057
00:45:57,255 --> 00:46:00,325
I was doing everything,
everything that I could.
1058
00:46:00,358 --> 00:46:02,961
I was exhausted,
and I wasn't making any money,
1059
00:46:02,994 --> 00:46:04,229
and I was scared.
1060
00:46:04,262 --> 00:46:07,432
I was investing all this time
and energy
1061
00:46:07,465 --> 00:46:09,467
into something that...
1062
00:46:09,501 --> 00:46:11,069
I couldn't make it work.
1063
00:46:11,102 --> 00:46:13,471
I just couldn't succeed.
1064
00:46:13,505 --> 00:46:18,109
My whole life was NXIVM,
and I wasn't getting anywhere.
1065
00:46:18,143 --> 00:46:20,512
I felt completely desperate.
1066
00:46:22,180 --> 00:46:23,815
[man] Don't mess
with perfection.
1067
00:46:23,848 --> 00:46:25,416
[laughs]
1068
00:46:25,450 --> 00:46:27,318
[India]
And that's when she said,
1069
00:46:27,352 --> 00:46:30,021
"I have something that
could be really great for you.
1070
00:46:30,054 --> 00:46:32,924
I think it could really help."
1071
00:46:32,957 --> 00:46:36,127
She really made it sound
like she had the answer,
1072
00:46:36,161 --> 00:46:39,197
like she had exactly
what I needed.
1073
00:46:40,365 --> 00:46:42,300
[Bernstein]
The cult sets up a system
1074
00:46:42,333 --> 00:46:44,903
where people can have a little
success at the beginning,
1075
00:46:44,936 --> 00:46:47,338
and then it stalls.
1076
00:46:47,372 --> 00:46:49,240
The cult will want you to feel
1077
00:46:49,274 --> 00:46:52,010
it's because of you
that it stalled.
1078
00:46:52,043 --> 00:46:56,014
What you don't realize
is that the group caused this.
1079
00:46:56,047 --> 00:46:58,516
It's like they knocked you
down to the ground,
1080
00:46:58,550 --> 00:47:00,885
and here they're putting
their hand out to you
1081
00:47:00,919 --> 00:47:02,053
to help pick you back up,
1082
00:47:02,086 --> 00:47:03,221
and you're so grateful
1083
00:47:03,254 --> 00:47:05,323
they're helping you
off the ground.
1084
00:47:07,458 --> 00:47:09,093
[India] Allison said,
"I really want to be able
1085
00:47:09,127 --> 00:47:10,461
"to tell you more
about this thing,
1086
00:47:10,495 --> 00:47:12,997
"but I-I need
something from you.
1087
00:47:13,031 --> 00:47:15,200
"I need collateral.
1088
00:47:15,233 --> 00:47:18,369
"I need something
that's really important to you,
1089
00:47:18,403 --> 00:47:21,539
"so I know that
when I tell you this secret,
1090
00:47:21,573 --> 00:47:24,075
you won't share it
with anybody else."
1091
00:47:24,108 --> 00:47:27,045
[ominous synth music]
1092
00:47:27,078 --> 00:47:28,580
[Lalich]
In the advanced courses,
1093
00:47:28,613 --> 00:47:30,882
they introduce the concept
of collateral,
1094
00:47:30,915 --> 00:47:32,550
which was, if you didn't stick
1095
00:47:32,584 --> 00:47:34,552
to some commitment
you had made,
1096
00:47:34,586 --> 00:47:37,222
you had to pay
some price for that.
1097
00:47:37,255 --> 00:47:38,890
Say you had a gym buddy,
1098
00:47:38,923 --> 00:47:41,192
and if you didn't turn up
every morning at 8:00,
1099
00:47:41,226 --> 00:47:43,127
then you would pay $100.
1100
00:47:43,161 --> 00:47:46,297
That was the deal you made.
1101
00:47:46,331 --> 00:47:48,466
That was turned
into something far more severe,
1102
00:47:48,499 --> 00:47:51,102
things like the deed
to your house,
1103
00:47:51,135 --> 00:47:52,604
compromising photos,
1104
00:47:52,637 --> 00:47:56,174
some kind of stories
about your family.
1105
00:47:56,207 --> 00:47:57,308
Turning this over
1106
00:47:57,342 --> 00:48:00,144
was showing
your ethical commitment.
1107
00:48:00,178 --> 00:48:02,180
It's always couched
in this language
1108
00:48:02,213 --> 00:48:03,481
to get you to accept it,
1109
00:48:03,514 --> 00:48:06,084
when, in fact, it was just
straight-out blackmail.
1110
00:48:06,117 --> 00:48:08,519
[India] The collateral
I was going to give to Allison
1111
00:48:08,553 --> 00:48:10,421
was information
about my family
1112
00:48:10,455 --> 00:48:13,424
that was very personal
and damaging.
1113
00:48:13,458 --> 00:48:15,360
She asked me to have it
in a letter format
1114
00:48:15,393 --> 00:48:16,594
addressed to the media,
1115
00:48:16,628 --> 00:48:19,197
like a New York Times or a CNN,
1116
00:48:19,230 --> 00:48:21,599
and then get it notarized.
1117
00:48:21,633 --> 00:48:25,370
These family secrets would be
immediately sent to the press
1118
00:48:25,403 --> 00:48:29,073
if I ever said anything about
what she was gonna tell me.
1119
00:48:29,107 --> 00:48:30,942
I just thought,
"I believe Allison."
1120
00:48:30,975 --> 00:48:33,177
I wanted to do well
in this program,
1121
00:48:33,211 --> 00:48:35,346
and I wanted to be promoted.
1122
00:48:35,380 --> 00:48:37,615
And I was never gonna share
the secret.
1123
00:48:37,649 --> 00:48:39,651
♪ ♪
1124
00:48:39,684 --> 00:48:42,120
We were
at this coach summit event.
1125
00:48:42,153 --> 00:48:43,955
Allison and I
were, like, hiding
1126
00:48:43,988 --> 00:48:46,991
behind this little
coffee table on a break.
1127
00:48:47,025 --> 00:48:49,027
I give her this collateral,
1128
00:48:49,060 --> 00:48:52,597
and she starts telling me
about this thing called DOS,
1129
00:48:52,630 --> 00:48:55,300
this secret society of women
1130
00:48:55,333 --> 00:48:59,470
that is unlike anything else
in NXIVM.
1131
00:48:59,504 --> 00:49:02,674
She believed that
the other NXIVM programs
1132
00:49:02,707 --> 00:49:05,310
couldn't push me
to become truly empowered
1133
00:49:05,343 --> 00:49:07,145
like DOS could.
1134
00:49:07,178 --> 00:49:10,481
Allison told me that Keith
had no involvement in this.
1135
00:49:10,515 --> 00:49:13,484
She said it was women
mentoring women
1136
00:49:13,518 --> 00:49:17,488
in a very specialized,
deep way...
1137
00:49:19,023 --> 00:49:22,360
...and that it would be able
to push me past the areas
1138
00:49:22,393 --> 00:49:25,096
that I hadn't been able
to push myself to grow.
1139
00:49:25,129 --> 00:49:28,499
It felt heavy.
It felt like a secret.
1140
00:49:28,533 --> 00:49:29,967
It felt like something
1141
00:49:30,001 --> 00:49:33,504
that I was getting
the privilege to learn about.
1142
00:49:33,538 --> 00:49:36,507
This was the first step
in the initiation process,
1143
00:49:36,541 --> 00:49:38,609
but there was
much more to come.
1144
00:49:38,643 --> 00:49:41,746
♪ ♪
1145
00:49:41,979 --> 00:49:43,648
I went back to LA,
1146
00:49:43,681 --> 00:49:45,350
and Allison started
calling me,
1147
00:49:45,383 --> 00:49:47,352
and we would have
these long conversations,
1148
00:49:47,385 --> 00:49:51,189
where she would tell me
more and more about DOS.
1149
00:49:51,222 --> 00:49:54,525
She wanted me to make
a lifetime commitment,
1150
00:49:54,559 --> 00:49:58,763
which included
ultimate obedience to her.
1151
00:49:58,996 --> 00:50:02,400
I asked Allison, "What does
'ultimate obedience' even mean?
1152
00:50:02,433 --> 00:50:05,436
"Like, does it mean that I have
to ask you permission
1153
00:50:05,470 --> 00:50:08,573
to have a boyfriend
or to travel?"
1154
00:50:08,606 --> 00:50:10,241
And she would say,
1155
00:50:10,274 --> 00:50:14,345
"You need to ask me permission
to do anything in your life."
1156
00:50:14,379 --> 00:50:16,481
And then Allison
explained to me
1157
00:50:16,514 --> 00:50:21,319
that the setup of DOS
was a master-slave dynamic.
1158
00:50:21,352 --> 00:50:25,223
I had a physical reaction
to those words.
1159
00:50:25,256 --> 00:50:28,393
She told me
that was perfectly normal.
1160
00:50:28,426 --> 00:50:30,061
That was part of the program,
1161
00:50:30,094 --> 00:50:33,264
to feel uncomfortable
and to do it anyways.
1162
00:50:33,297 --> 00:50:35,400
She told me to look at it more
1163
00:50:35,433 --> 00:50:38,569
as a mentor-student
relationship
1164
00:50:38,603 --> 00:50:41,439
and that she would always
be there for me.
1165
00:50:41,472 --> 00:50:45,410
I would constantly be taking
these phone calls outside
1166
00:50:45,443 --> 00:50:48,446
so that Michel, my boyfriend,
wouldn't hear.
1167
00:50:48,479 --> 00:50:51,482
So I was pacing
up and down my street
1168
00:50:51,516 --> 00:50:53,518
in front of my apartment.
1169
00:50:53,551 --> 00:50:55,553
I got on the phone
with Allison, and I said,
1170
00:50:55,586 --> 00:50:57,188
"I'm really embarrassed
to tell you this,
1171
00:50:57,221 --> 00:50:58,423
"but before I say yes,
1172
00:50:58,456 --> 00:51:00,425
"I just need to confess
something to you,
1173
00:51:00,458 --> 00:51:04,162
"which is I'm afraid that
you're gonna try to hurt me.
1174
00:51:04,195 --> 00:51:06,164
"I'm afraid
that you're gonna use...
1175
00:51:06,197 --> 00:51:08,266
[voice breaking] ...this stuff
that I've given you."
1176
00:51:08,299 --> 00:51:10,268
Sorry.
[sniffles]
1177
00:51:10,301 --> 00:51:13,171
[sighs softly]
1178
00:51:13,204 --> 00:51:16,207
It just really disturbs me.
[scoffs]
1179
00:51:18,476 --> 00:51:21,112
[sniffles]
1180
00:51:21,145 --> 00:51:23,614
It's really hard to, like...
1181
00:51:23,648 --> 00:51:27,118
just think about her lying
to me so much.
1182
00:51:27,151 --> 00:51:30,621
[sniffles]
But I told her.
1183
00:51:30,655 --> 00:51:33,324
I said, "I'm giving you
this stuff,
1184
00:51:33,357 --> 00:51:34,692
"but I'm afraid
that you're gonna try
1185
00:51:34,725 --> 00:51:37,261
"to hurt me with it,
and I don't know you very well.
1186
00:51:37,295 --> 00:51:40,465
"And I'm trusting you
that what I'm sharing with you,
1187
00:51:40,498 --> 00:51:42,600
you're gonna keep private."
1188
00:51:44,335 --> 00:51:47,505
And she said, "How can you
think of me like that?
1189
00:51:47,538 --> 00:51:49,106
"You know me.
1190
00:51:49,140 --> 00:51:50,675
"You know the things
that I stand for.
1191
00:51:50,708 --> 00:51:52,343
"You've taken intensives
with me.
1192
00:51:52,376 --> 00:51:54,645
"You've stayed in my house.
1193
00:51:54,679 --> 00:51:58,149
"How could you ever think
that I would try to hurt you
1194
00:51:58,182 --> 00:52:01,152
or exploit you or do
something violent against you?"
1195
00:52:01,185 --> 00:52:03,754
[sniffles] And I thought,
"How stupid am I?
1196
00:52:03,788 --> 00:52:06,724
Like, how stupid
am I to think that of her?"
1197
00:52:06,757 --> 00:52:09,160
And I actually, like, felt
really bad
1198
00:52:09,193 --> 00:52:10,695
that I even had that thought,
1199
00:52:10,728 --> 00:52:14,465
and right after that,
I told her that I was in
1200
00:52:14,499 --> 00:52:18,636
and that I wanted to be in DOS
and that I committed.
1201
00:52:18,669 --> 00:52:22,707
That moment
is, like, so significant for me
1202
00:52:22,740 --> 00:52:26,310
and where I felt like
I really didn't trust myself.
1203
00:52:26,344 --> 00:52:29,380
Like, I really--
I had an instinct.
1204
00:52:29,413 --> 00:52:31,682
I had a feeling
that told me that...
1205
00:52:31,716 --> 00:52:34,685
maybe this wasn't good,
and I...
1206
00:52:34,719 --> 00:52:38,356
I denied it,
but she also lied to me.
1207
00:52:38,389 --> 00:52:39,557
Like...
1208
00:52:41,392 --> 00:52:45,196
[sighs] Like,
I actually convinced myself
1209
00:52:45,229 --> 00:52:46,364
to trust her.
1210
00:52:46,397 --> 00:52:47,532
[sniffles]
1211
00:52:47,565 --> 00:52:50,535
[foreboding music]
1212
00:52:50,568 --> 00:52:51,936
♪ ♪
1213
00:52:52,169 --> 00:52:54,272
[Ross] The women
who were recruited
1214
00:52:54,305 --> 00:52:55,940
were literally worn out
1215
00:52:56,173 --> 00:52:58,743
by the training
and all of the coursework
1216
00:52:58,776 --> 00:53:00,311
and the intensives
1217
00:53:00,344 --> 00:53:02,580
and everything that these women
were subjected to,
1218
00:53:02,613 --> 00:53:04,815
so that when they came
to that point
1219
00:53:04,849 --> 00:53:07,251
of making a commitment to DOS,
1220
00:53:07,285 --> 00:53:09,387
their critical-thinking
faculties
1221
00:53:09,420 --> 00:53:12,557
and their ability
to judge that ask
1222
00:53:12,590 --> 00:53:14,325
was not in place.
1223
00:53:14,358 --> 00:53:16,961
They were not the same people
that they were
1224
00:53:17,194 --> 00:53:19,363
when they came through
initially
1225
00:53:19,397 --> 00:53:21,899
into the coursework at NXIVM.
1226
00:53:21,933 --> 00:53:24,936
♪ ♪
1227
00:53:34,779 --> 00:53:37,481
I was giving my all to NXIVM.
1228
00:53:37,515 --> 00:53:38,583
I was doing everything
1229
00:53:38,616 --> 00:53:40,751
that I thought I could do
to progress,
1230
00:53:40,785 --> 00:53:42,687
and I was not moving,
1231
00:53:42,720 --> 00:53:44,755
My master just looked at me
and said,
1232
00:53:44,789 --> 00:53:46,924
"There's another way."
1233
00:53:46,958 --> 00:53:49,260
She told me DOS
was not a part of NXIVM,
1234
00:53:49,293 --> 00:53:52,396
but that it would help me
achieve my goals in the group.
1235
00:53:52,430 --> 00:53:54,865
She said, "Well,
you're already a slave,"
1236
00:53:54,899 --> 00:53:58,603
like, "You're a slave
to your fears and attachments.
1237
00:53:58,636 --> 00:54:01,505
"Wouldn't you rather be a slave
to something that's more noble
1238
00:54:01,539 --> 00:54:04,008
"and to your actual values?
1239
00:54:04,241 --> 00:54:07,778
This is the training program
to teach you how to do that."
1240
00:54:07,812 --> 00:54:09,614
The term DOS wasn't told to me
1241
00:54:09,647 --> 00:54:11,782
until after I joined
the sorority.
1242
00:54:11,816 --> 00:54:13,751
My master said
"It's called DOS."
1243
00:54:13,784 --> 00:54:16,621
It stands for
Dominus Obsequious Sororium,
1244
00:54:16,654 --> 00:54:19,323
which kind of translates
from Latin, um,
1245
00:54:19,357 --> 00:54:21,392
to "master-slave sorority."
1246
00:54:21,425 --> 00:54:23,961
And I was like, "Well, that--
yeah, that makes sense.
1247
00:54:23,995 --> 00:54:26,497
It describes exactly
what we're doing."
1248
00:54:26,530 --> 00:54:28,366
-[man] And to come...
-[woman] Oh, good idea.
1249
00:54:28,399 --> 00:54:29,533
Is that good?
1250
00:54:29,567 --> 00:54:30,868
[woman]
It's, like, right here.
1251
00:54:30,901 --> 00:54:34,739
[India] Allison started me
on little activities
1252
00:54:34,772 --> 00:54:37,375
that began to make DOS
more and more real.
1253
00:54:37,408 --> 00:54:40,544
You have an experience
of what it feels like
1254
00:54:40,578 --> 00:54:43,648
to be committed to something
beyond what's convenient
1255
00:54:43,681 --> 00:54:44,982
and what's comfortable
1256
00:54:45,016 --> 00:54:48,319
and all of the benefits
that come from that.
1257
00:54:48,352 --> 00:54:52,056
My role was the student
who had to humble myself
1258
00:54:52,289 --> 00:54:54,458
in order to learn and to grow.
1259
00:54:54,492 --> 00:54:57,294
Allison would send me articles
that Keith had written,
1260
00:54:57,328 --> 00:54:58,496
and I had to journal
1261
00:54:58,529 --> 00:55:01,599
about how they
all impacted me.
1262
00:55:01,632 --> 00:55:03,634
She required me
to share something with her
1263
00:55:03,668 --> 00:55:06,470
that I felt vulnerable about
every day.
1264
00:55:06,504 --> 00:55:09,440
[uneasy music]
1265
00:55:09,473 --> 00:55:11,876
She was especially interested
in the things
1266
00:55:11,909 --> 00:55:13,811
that I felt uncomfortable with
1267
00:55:13,844 --> 00:55:17,682
that were sexual
or that felt intimate.
1268
00:55:17,715 --> 00:55:20,017
She referred to us as bonding.
1269
00:55:20,051 --> 00:55:22,853
♪ ♪
1270
00:55:22,887 --> 00:55:25,623
Allison told me
that I needed to lose weight
1271
00:55:25,656 --> 00:55:28,359
because it was a practice
in building character
1272
00:55:28,392 --> 00:55:30,094
and self-restraint.
1273
00:55:30,327 --> 00:55:32,763
If I couldn't meet
the weight requirement,
1274
00:55:32,797 --> 00:55:35,599
I would have to spend
30 days in Albany,
1275
00:55:35,633 --> 00:55:38,069
and that happened.
1276
00:55:38,102 --> 00:55:40,337
I had to make up
a bunch of excuses
1277
00:55:40,371 --> 00:55:42,540
to why I wasn't coming
back home.
1278
00:55:42,573 --> 00:55:46,043
but Allison told me that
my relationships to my family
1279
00:55:46,077 --> 00:55:49,413
were just examples
of where I was dependent,
1280
00:55:49,447 --> 00:55:52,550
and I needed to separate
myself from them,
1281
00:55:52,583 --> 00:55:54,051
is what I was being told.
1282
00:55:54,085 --> 00:55:56,887
What you learn
is the art of life
1283
00:55:56,921 --> 00:55:59,724
and how to be
a true student of that
1284
00:55:59,757 --> 00:56:01,625
and practice that every day.
1285
00:56:01,659 --> 00:56:03,728
♪ ♪
1286
00:56:03,761 --> 00:56:05,096
[man speaks indistinctly]
1287
00:56:05,129 --> 00:56:07,398
[India] Allison ordered me
to start texting her,
1288
00:56:07,431 --> 00:56:09,533
"Good night, master,"
and, "Good morning, master,"
1289
00:56:09,567 --> 00:56:11,368
every day.
1290
00:56:11,402 --> 00:56:14,138
It felt very uncomfortable
for me to do that,
1291
00:56:14,371 --> 00:56:18,075
and I started
to abbreviate it to an M
1292
00:56:18,109 --> 00:56:19,577
so that I could feel
1293
00:56:19,610 --> 00:56:22,747
a little bit more normal
about it,
1294
00:56:22,780 --> 00:56:25,783
but we knew what it meant.
1295
00:56:25,816 --> 00:56:27,752
It wasn't
like I was gonna sit there
1296
00:56:27,785 --> 00:56:30,521
and object to Allison.
1297
00:56:30,554 --> 00:56:31,922
At the time,
1298
00:56:31,956 --> 00:56:34,759
I was still living
with my boyfriend, Michel,
1299
00:56:34,792 --> 00:56:38,596
and Allison told me
that my relationship
1300
00:56:38,629 --> 00:56:40,498
was one of the things
that was keeping me
1301
00:56:40,531 --> 00:56:42,633
from getting stronger
and more empowered
1302
00:56:42,666 --> 00:56:46,604
and encouraged me
to end that relationship.
1303
00:56:46,637 --> 00:56:49,140
So I did.
1304
00:56:49,173 --> 00:56:51,942
It was implied
that you would be celibate
1305
00:56:51,976 --> 00:56:54,812
as a way to practice
self-restraint and discipline.
1306
00:56:54,845 --> 00:56:58,015
It seemed to be
a major focus for her.
1307
00:56:58,048 --> 00:56:59,583
[cell phone vibrates]
1308
00:56:59,617 --> 00:57:02,186
She would tell me,
"Everything I do,
1309
00:57:02,419 --> 00:57:04,622
I do for your own benefit."
1310
00:57:06,524 --> 00:57:09,727
"Everything I have you do
is for your own good."
1311
00:57:12,096 --> 00:57:13,631
[Keith]
Look, Mark.
1312
00:57:13,664 --> 00:57:16,000
Did you notice one of the women
wasn't wearing panties?
1313
00:57:16,033 --> 00:57:18,702
[Mark chuckles] How do you
notice those things?
1314
00:57:18,736 --> 00:57:21,972
[Keith] And all these weddings
that say it's official.
1315
00:57:22,006 --> 00:57:25,209
You know, you can say
a woman's official to...
1316
00:57:25,442 --> 00:57:28,946
to tease a woman
about her odor,
1317
00:57:28,979 --> 00:57:30,981
saying that she's...
1318
00:57:31,015 --> 00:57:33,951
About fish.
She's "a fish hole."
1319
00:57:33,984 --> 00:57:35,786
[Mark]
Mm-hmm.
1320
00:57:35,820 --> 00:57:37,154
[both]
Official.
1321
00:57:37,188 --> 00:57:38,989
[laughter]
1322
00:57:39,023 --> 00:57:40,524
[Keith]
She's official.
1323
00:57:40,558 --> 00:57:43,828
[Mark] Yeah, I like the way
you led me there.
1324
00:57:43,861 --> 00:57:47,064
[India] I was sitting
on Allison's bed with her,
1325
00:57:47,097 --> 00:57:51,168
and she told me, "I have
a new assignment for you.
1326
00:57:51,202 --> 00:57:55,506
It's about leaning
into fear and discomfort."
1327
00:57:55,539 --> 00:57:57,107
She made it sound different
1328
00:57:57,141 --> 00:57:59,710
than anything
I had ever done before,
1329
00:57:59,743 --> 00:58:02,046
but I knew
that whatever it was,
1330
00:58:02,079 --> 00:58:04,081
I would have to do it.
1331
00:58:04,114 --> 00:58:06,917
She told me, "Your assignment
1332
00:58:06,951 --> 00:58:09,019
is to seduce Keith."
1333
00:58:09,053 --> 00:58:11,655
[electronic music]