1 00:00:03,020 --> 00:00:05,380 Previously, on the disappearance of Maura Murray. 2 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:07,520 Fred, why are you upset with the police? 3 00:00:08,220 --> 00:00:09,740 I think they're hiding something. 4 00:00:10,260 --> 00:00:14,060 I've been looking into the theory that the police covered up Maura's 5 00:00:14,060 --> 00:00:16,920 disappearance. What would you ask him if you had one question? 6 00:00:17,340 --> 00:00:18,740 What did you do with Maura Murray? 7 00:00:19,540 --> 00:00:24,980 And interviewed an eyewitness, known as Witness A, who concealed her identity 8 00:00:24,980 --> 00:00:25,959 for years. 9 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:28,760 Do you wish you had gone back and asked if you could help? 10 00:00:29,160 --> 00:00:32,740 Sometimes I think that I may have disappeared, too, if I did. 11 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:40,960 Her accusations hinge on police SUV 001, a vehicle people assert was only 12 00:00:40,960 --> 00:00:43,000 driven by the chief, Jeff Williams. 13 00:00:43,380 --> 00:00:45,900 But the police claim otherwise. 14 00:00:46,240 --> 00:00:52,480 What vehicle were you in? The Explorer 4x4. With unprecedented access to law 15 00:00:52,480 --> 00:00:54,800 enforcement, I'm picking this theory apart. 16 00:00:55,650 --> 00:00:58,530 People have said that you guys know where she is. We don't know where she 17 00:00:58,550 --> 00:00:59,650 and we don't know what happened to her. 18 00:01:00,370 --> 00:01:04,129 And so far, I'm not convinced police were involved. 19 00:01:05,330 --> 00:01:07,490 But something else caught my attention. 20 00:01:09,470 --> 00:01:11,510 Fred said, well, she's all depressed. 21 00:01:12,170 --> 00:01:14,810 Go out in the woods, you step off the trail, and you die. 22 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:40,620 Have you heard the theory that there was another officer on the scene before 23 00:01:40,620 --> 00:01:42,680 you, that this is a report by Witness A? 24 00:01:43,500 --> 00:01:48,300 I've heard of that, but there was no one there when I got on scene. 25 00:01:48,560 --> 00:01:53,240 I'm interviewing Sergeant Cecil Smith, the responding officer to Maura Murray's 26 00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:54,240 car crash. 27 00:01:54,380 --> 00:02:01,360 If Sergeant Smith was driving SUV 001, as he claims, then there really is 28 00:02:01,360 --> 00:02:03,440 no mystery to Witness A's sightings. 29 00:02:04,330 --> 00:02:09,289 But why would law enforcement seem so curious about her account after she 30 00:02:09,289 --> 00:02:10,289 reported it? 31 00:02:10,490 --> 00:02:12,390 I got a call back from the police department. 32 00:02:12,730 --> 00:02:14,950 They didn't say, like, are you sure you didn't see anybody? 33 00:02:15,550 --> 00:02:17,130 They were like, are you sure it was 01? 34 00:02:17,430 --> 00:02:18,430 I said, yeah. 35 00:02:18,570 --> 00:02:20,290 I don't know the answer to that question. 36 00:02:20,950 --> 00:02:24,770 Maybe that's just following up with people on that incident. 37 00:02:25,470 --> 00:02:26,910 It does seem strange. 38 00:02:27,570 --> 00:02:30,790 This is why it's important that we speak to Jeff Williams himself. 39 00:02:31,770 --> 00:02:33,130 We've put in many requests. 40 00:02:34,200 --> 00:02:35,260 But we're still waiting. 41 00:02:36,120 --> 00:02:39,020 Did you ever talk to the family, any of the family members? I did. 42 00:02:39,380 --> 00:02:44,960 Fred, I explained it to him, and he said, well, you know, she had an 43 00:02:44,960 --> 00:02:45,960 couple days ago. 44 00:02:46,080 --> 00:02:47,080 She's all depressed. 45 00:02:47,420 --> 00:02:49,500 You know, she might have done the old squaw. 46 00:02:51,540 --> 00:02:52,540 What's that? 47 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:56,340 Well, you know, you're depressed, and we talked about it before on our hikes. 48 00:02:56,380 --> 00:03:01,180 You know, you go out in the woods, you step off the trail, and you die. 49 00:03:04,020 --> 00:03:08,960 Hello. What did you make of that? That Fred knew something I didn't know about 50 00:03:08,960 --> 00:03:15,880 Maura and her mental state. And when I talked to her sister 51 00:03:15,880 --> 00:03:20,340 Kathleen the same day, she told me pretty much the same thing. 52 00:03:20,700 --> 00:03:24,980 Maura had had an accident with her father's car while she'd been drinking 53 00:03:24,980 --> 00:03:26,320 weekend before. 54 00:03:27,900 --> 00:03:32,140 She got mad at Fred, got in another car and took off, left Massachusetts. 55 00:03:33,200 --> 00:03:38,300 And we think she went in the woods and hid and took a bunch of sleeping pills, 56 00:03:38,360 --> 00:03:39,440 and we both think she's dead. 57 00:03:41,200 --> 00:03:44,780 Now I have the sister and the father both telling me that she might be dead. 58 00:03:44,880 --> 00:03:47,020 That's when it got serious. 59 00:03:50,700 --> 00:03:56,340 If Fred warns the police about suicide, it's in stark contrast to anything he's 60 00:03:56,340 --> 00:03:57,059 told me. 61 00:03:57,060 --> 00:04:00,720 Guy grabbed her walking down the road and killed her. 62 00:04:02,160 --> 00:04:03,180 Probably that night. 63 00:04:03,940 --> 00:04:08,400 And Kathleen was also clear that she doesn't feel that way now. 64 00:04:08,900 --> 00:04:10,220 Suicide? No. 65 00:04:10,980 --> 00:04:11,980 No. 66 00:04:12,780 --> 00:04:17,640 Why would they tell me something in our interviews that is completely at odds 67 00:04:17,640 --> 00:04:21,120 with what they told the police in the days after Maura's disappearance? 68 00:04:22,120 --> 00:04:27,520 I need to sit back down with Fred and explore Maura's possible suicide in more 69 00:04:27,520 --> 00:04:28,520 depth. 70 00:04:29,540 --> 00:04:30,940 In the meantime... 71 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:35,760 Our noteworthy interviews with Cecil Smith and John Monahan seem to have had 72 00:04:35,760 --> 00:04:36,760 effect. 73 00:04:37,280 --> 00:04:41,900 Assistant Attorney General Strelzin has just informed me he's making Jeff 74 00:04:41,900 --> 00:04:43,880 Williams available for an interview. 75 00:04:44,920 --> 00:04:51,120 Fred, family investigator John Smith, podcasters Tim and Lance, everyone has 76 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:55,160 wanted to speak with the chief, but no one has ever been allowed. 77 00:04:56,200 --> 00:04:57,240 Maggie, nice to meet you. 78 00:04:57,560 --> 00:04:59,580 All right, good to see you, Jeff. Come on in. Sure. 79 00:05:00,140 --> 00:05:05,240 You know, we know you probably have a lot to say about accusations, rumors out 80 00:05:05,240 --> 00:05:06,219 there about yourself. 81 00:05:06,220 --> 00:05:07,620 You know, I'm sure you've heard some of those. 82 00:05:07,900 --> 00:05:09,400 You know, actually very limited. 83 00:05:09,620 --> 00:05:12,040 I'm not a big social media guy. 84 00:05:12,320 --> 00:05:15,920 What has been going around the Internet is that a woman who has been called 85 00:05:15,920 --> 00:05:22,620 Witness A drove by the scene earlier than 746 when Cecil responded and says 86 00:05:22,620 --> 00:05:28,640 saw SUV 001 at the scene. So the idea out there is that SUV 001 was your 87 00:05:28,640 --> 00:05:31,960 vehicle. that you possibly had something to do with Morris disappearing? 88 00:05:33,260 --> 00:05:37,680 I wasn't at the scene the night of February 9, 2004. 89 00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:40,400 I wasn't on duty at the time of the accident. 90 00:05:41,060 --> 00:05:42,940 Was SUV 001 your vehicle? 91 00:05:43,440 --> 00:05:48,000 No. For patrol? No, the town never provided the chief of police a cruiser. 92 00:05:48,220 --> 00:05:50,240 No. Do you know who was driving it? 93 00:05:50,840 --> 00:05:54,000 Sergeant Smith was, yeah. So you didn't go by the scene? 94 00:05:54,360 --> 00:05:56,960 No. No, I did not go to the scene that night. 95 00:05:57,560 --> 00:06:02,500 We need to look at this through the lens of what was going on with that car. We 96 00:06:02,500 --> 00:06:06,780 weren't responding to the largest missing person case in state of New 97 00:06:06,780 --> 00:06:07,780 Hampshire's history. 98 00:06:07,800 --> 00:06:10,240 We were responding to a simple car accident. 99 00:06:10,600 --> 00:06:12,100 What do you think happened tomorrow? 100 00:06:12,800 --> 00:06:17,440 You know, I've spent sleepless nights since being recontacted about this 101 00:06:17,440 --> 00:06:21,200 then you start thinking about it and you start playing, Jeff, what could you 102 00:06:21,200 --> 00:06:22,740 have done? What did we miss? 103 00:06:23,020 --> 00:06:26,360 How did this happen? How could this happen? How could this happen? 104 00:06:27,530 --> 00:06:32,550 I wish I had answered for you. I mean, I wish, I wish, God, I wish we had 105 00:06:32,550 --> 00:06:33,550 answers. 106 00:06:35,250 --> 00:06:37,830 I've done three interviews with the police. 107 00:06:38,270 --> 00:06:43,410 Three men who haven't spoken to the media about this case since it made 108 00:06:43,410 --> 00:06:44,410 news. 109 00:06:44,710 --> 00:06:46,590 And all three stories match. 110 00:06:47,650 --> 00:06:52,730 I feel confident law enforcement had nothing to do with Maura's 111 00:06:53,630 --> 00:06:56,110 Which leads me back to Fred's statement. 112 00:06:56,540 --> 00:07:01,580 about the squaw walk, I now understand why police felt suicide was an option. 113 00:07:01,940 --> 00:07:07,060 Could something in Maura's life have triggered a suicidal response in a 114 00:07:07,060 --> 00:07:09,160 who might have become unstable? 115 00:07:09,780 --> 00:07:11,220 What were Maura's troubles? 116 00:07:11,500 --> 00:07:14,140 She stole from Fort Knox. 117 00:07:15,140 --> 00:07:20,760 She got caught using stolen credit card numbers to order food. 118 00:07:23,300 --> 00:07:25,660 I'm meeting with podcasters Tim and Lance. 119 00:07:26,380 --> 00:07:30,440 I want to know, were there any other clues pointing to suicide? 120 00:07:31,020 --> 00:07:34,720 A lot of people have speculated that, you know, there was a lot of problems in 121 00:07:34,720 --> 00:07:38,260 her life and she wasn't this all -American good girl. 122 00:07:38,780 --> 00:07:43,960 Is it possible that the family was hiding that she was depressed or 123 00:07:43,960 --> 00:07:45,580 with thoughts of suicide before? 124 00:07:45,980 --> 00:07:49,300 I think absolutely there's a chance she could have been suicidal and that could 125 00:07:49,300 --> 00:07:50,300 have been why she went. 126 00:07:50,600 --> 00:07:55,240 I've dug into patterns associated with suicide and discovered some interesting 127 00:07:55,240 --> 00:08:00,630 things. There is a pattern of people going to places that they feel connected 128 00:08:00,630 --> 00:08:02,490 or that are peaceful to commit suicide. 129 00:08:02,970 --> 00:08:07,270 The White Mountains she was really close to, she basically grew up there. Is 130 00:08:07,270 --> 00:08:10,470 that a possibility, that she was going there to commit suicide? 131 00:08:10,830 --> 00:08:15,110 Going to a peaceful area to commit suicide might have been one of her 132 00:08:15,110 --> 00:08:16,110 intentions. 133 00:08:16,410 --> 00:08:21,950 Inside Maura's abandoned car, law enforcement found five packs of sleeping 134 00:08:21,950 --> 00:08:25,350 and, more importantly, one empty box. 135 00:08:26,250 --> 00:08:29,970 Was she trying to overdose on sleeping pills and then was drinking a cocktail 136 00:08:29,970 --> 00:08:30,749 with it? 137 00:08:30,750 --> 00:08:32,850 Absolutely. There's a good chance that's a possibility. 138 00:08:33,650 --> 00:08:38,169 So when Maura crashed Fred's car at UMass, how much damage was done to the 139 00:08:38,710 --> 00:08:40,289 It's like $9 ,000 worth. 140 00:08:40,590 --> 00:08:41,630 It was a pretty bad accident. 141 00:08:42,110 --> 00:08:46,490 I would say there's a good chance he was angry at her. Maybe he even yelled at 142 00:08:46,490 --> 00:08:51,130 her, you know, and maybe that was part of what added on to her stress to leave. 143 00:08:54,410 --> 00:08:57,290 What was Fred's response to Maura crashing his car? 144 00:08:58,150 --> 00:09:02,750 Could this have set her off in some way, knowing it was a huge financial burden 145 00:09:02,750 --> 00:09:05,150 on Fred and the rest of her brothers and sisters? 146 00:09:05,790 --> 00:09:08,470 Could the family know that Maura killed herself? 147 00:09:11,750 --> 00:09:14,570 Let's talk about the weekend before Maura went missing. 148 00:09:15,190 --> 00:09:19,150 You were in Amherst. Maura's on campus at a party near her dorm. 149 00:09:19,390 --> 00:09:23,030 So Maura left the party with your car, and then she got in an accident. 150 00:09:23,600 --> 00:09:25,120 How badly damaged was your car? 151 00:09:26,080 --> 00:09:29,780 Oh, when I first saw it, it looked like a total wreck. 152 00:09:30,520 --> 00:09:34,800 So how did Maura break the news to you that she got into this accident in 153 00:09:34,800 --> 00:09:35,800 Hadley? 154 00:09:36,260 --> 00:09:37,260 Dad, 155 00:09:37,360 --> 00:09:38,660 I've got to tell you something. 156 00:09:39,080 --> 00:09:40,860 Was she upset? Oh, yeah. 157 00:09:41,720 --> 00:09:45,380 She wasn't bawling right then. She had to tell me. 158 00:09:45,820 --> 00:09:49,100 And it was difficult for her to get it out. I mean, she could imagine. 159 00:09:50,140 --> 00:09:52,380 She didn't want to disappoint me, you know. 160 00:09:53,210 --> 00:09:55,170 What was your reaction? Were you upset? 161 00:09:55,430 --> 00:09:56,430 Yes. 162 00:09:56,510 --> 00:09:57,550 Did you yell at her? 163 00:09:59,070 --> 00:10:04,530 No, not yelling, but I don't have to yell for her to know that I was upset. 164 00:10:04,850 --> 00:10:06,490 That was the last time you saw her. 165 00:10:06,930 --> 00:10:12,510 Do you feel guilty about the last interaction that you had with her was 166 00:10:12,510 --> 00:10:13,510 upset at her? 167 00:10:16,190 --> 00:10:17,190 Yeah. 168 00:10:17,910 --> 00:10:21,090 She walked into the dorm, and I told her, 169 00:10:22,510 --> 00:10:27,270 Something like, it's going to be all right. 170 00:10:28,150 --> 00:10:32,770 It's not the worst thing in the world, but she wasn't hearing that, and she was 171 00:10:32,770 --> 00:10:39,150 kind of sobbing without tears, you know, stifling and stuff. She was very upset, 172 00:10:39,290 --> 00:10:42,010 walked back into the dorm. She was very upset. 173 00:10:45,750 --> 00:10:47,230 Can't do anything about it now. 174 00:10:49,480 --> 00:10:53,140 Why did you tell the police Maura might have gone on a squaw walk? 175 00:10:53,480 --> 00:10:59,680 It was just a way of expressing myself. I should have never used that example or 176 00:10:59,680 --> 00:11:02,000 something. I don't believe her for a minute. 177 00:11:02,520 --> 00:11:05,760 She's way stronger than that, way smarter than that. 178 00:11:06,100 --> 00:11:07,540 I know the kid. 179 00:11:08,120 --> 00:11:09,440 I brought the kid up. 180 00:11:10,320 --> 00:11:11,500 Who would know better? 181 00:11:12,540 --> 00:11:16,740 She wouldn't want anyone to think that she was that weak mentally. 182 00:11:17,770 --> 00:11:20,870 and that unable to handle it, that she just gave up. 183 00:11:21,110 --> 00:11:24,690 And that is the reason I know she didn't commit suicide. 184 00:11:33,550 --> 00:11:38,890 I know she didn't commit suicide. 185 00:11:39,390 --> 00:11:40,850 I know the kid. 186 00:11:41,410 --> 00:11:42,690 I brought the kid up. 187 00:11:43,570 --> 00:11:44,770 Who would know better? 188 00:12:00,180 --> 00:12:05,440 Fred may think Maura didn't commit suicide, but there's more to explore 189 00:12:05,440 --> 00:12:10,420 theory that Maura could have died in the woods, either by her own hand or by 190 00:12:10,420 --> 00:12:15,180 accident. I went and talked to Mr. Atwood. He said she slurred her speech 191 00:12:15,180 --> 00:12:18,040 she had to lean on something while she was standing there. 192 00:12:18,260 --> 00:12:21,640 It's certainly possible she was right there nearby watching everything and 193 00:12:21,640 --> 00:12:22,640 waited until everybody left. 194 00:12:25,600 --> 00:12:31,680 If Maura was so intoxicated she became disoriented in the woods and died, is it 195 00:12:31,680 --> 00:12:34,080 possible the multiple search parties missed her? 196 00:12:39,020 --> 00:12:40,020 Hi, Dad. 197 00:12:40,320 --> 00:12:44,380 Hi. Maggie, nice to meet you. Art and I are meeting with Todd Bogardas at the 198 00:12:44,380 --> 00:12:45,920 crash site to find out. 199 00:12:46,380 --> 00:12:51,320 A 24 -year veteran with New Hampshire Fish and Game, he was the supervisor in 200 00:12:51,320 --> 00:12:56,160 charge of the official search for Maura, which commenced a day and a half after 201 00:12:56,160 --> 00:12:57,139 she vanished. 202 00:12:57,140 --> 00:13:01,020 We also had ground teams out checking trails, roadways. 203 00:13:01,840 --> 00:13:04,500 How many search and rescue missions have you done? 204 00:13:04,800 --> 00:13:08,880 I'd say I've been participating and managing in the hundreds. 205 00:13:09,140 --> 00:13:12,220 Wow. And how many of those are still outstanding missing people? 206 00:13:12,620 --> 00:13:14,880 There are still two that are unfounded. 207 00:13:15,120 --> 00:13:16,320 And Maura is one of them? 208 00:13:16,820 --> 00:13:17,820 She is. 209 00:13:18,500 --> 00:13:22,780 Some have been critical of the search for Maura. What is your opinion of the 210 00:13:22,780 --> 00:13:25,000 search back in the day by law enforcement? 211 00:13:25,920 --> 00:13:32,800 When it finally started, they waited too long, and then they had suboptimal 212 00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:36,720 conditions. What was your initial involvement in the search? 213 00:13:36,940 --> 00:13:38,680 Law enforcement, they had done... 214 00:13:39,610 --> 00:13:44,130 Most of the cursory searching that evening as well as the next day. 215 00:13:45,510 --> 00:13:51,790 Todd's team was brought in 36 hours after the crash on a clear, cold 216 00:13:51,790 --> 00:13:53,630 had about a foot and a half, two feet of snow. 217 00:13:54,210 --> 00:13:58,090 There was a very thin crust on the top, but if you or I were to walk off this 218 00:13:58,090 --> 00:14:00,390 road into the snow, we would very easily leave a footprint. 219 00:14:01,090 --> 00:14:05,990 Because the temperature remained steady and it didn't snow again, the snow on 220 00:14:05,990 --> 00:14:08,150 the ground hadn't changed since the crash. 221 00:14:08,830 --> 00:14:10,990 The search party used this to their advantage. 222 00:14:12,350 --> 00:14:14,930 Did you have any helicopters? 223 00:14:15,750 --> 00:14:19,830 Yeah, we did. We searched the immediate area and then we had them cone out and 224 00:14:19,830 --> 00:14:24,270 go several miles away from the area. That helicopter is also equipped with a 225 00:14:24,270 --> 00:14:26,250 FLIR unit, which is forward -looking infrared. 226 00:14:27,450 --> 00:14:31,370 So had she been out there and giving off any heat signal, they would have been 227 00:14:31,370 --> 00:14:32,370 able to pick that up. 228 00:14:32,790 --> 00:14:33,850 After covering... 229 00:14:34,490 --> 00:14:39,070 The significant area, at least 112 and outlying roads over probably 10 miles 230 00:14:39,070 --> 00:14:43,930 distance. The end result was we had no human foot tracks going into the 231 00:14:43,930 --> 00:14:48,630 woodlands off of the roadways that were not either cleared or accounted for. 232 00:14:49,010 --> 00:14:52,770 At the end of that day, the consensus was she did not leave the roadway. 233 00:14:53,990 --> 00:14:58,070 Ten miles of roadway checked just on that first official third. 234 00:14:58,970 --> 00:15:01,930 And not a single footprint that could have been more of. 235 00:15:02,860 --> 00:15:07,060 Today, police brought out search dogs for a second time. They scoured the area 236 00:15:07,060 --> 00:15:09,740 near where 21 -year -old Maura Murray was last seen. 237 00:15:11,180 --> 00:15:16,640 In case they missed something, a second search was organized, ten days after the 238 00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:22,280 crash, to inspect the woods, this time with three cadaver dogs who were trained 239 00:15:22,280 --> 00:15:24,600 specifically to find human remains. 240 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:28,720 So at that point, you could have been looking for a deceased person. 241 00:15:29,060 --> 00:15:34,120 Yes. Those dog teams went into the woodland and searched in different 242 00:15:34,120 --> 00:15:38,220 on both sides of Route 112 within the half -mile radius. 243 00:15:39,140 --> 00:15:43,540 Anytime we're searching, we're looking for people, yes, but more importantly, 244 00:15:43,620 --> 00:15:44,620 we're looking for clues. 245 00:15:44,800 --> 00:15:50,740 And clues, you mean like clothing or a backpack or a cell phone or something? 246 00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:52,980 Anything. Any human object. 247 00:15:53,600 --> 00:15:54,600 Did you ever find any? 248 00:15:55,080 --> 00:15:59,160 No clues to my knowledge that were directly related to Maura. 249 00:16:00,680 --> 00:16:06,260 Todd's team went on to conduct three more searches, one with seven dog teams. 250 00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:13,340 In the end, they searched 12 miles of roadway, one to two miles into the woods 251 00:16:13,340 --> 00:16:19,340 with dogs, and even places up to 50 miles away that they knew Maura loved to 252 00:16:19,340 --> 00:16:20,340 visit. 253 00:16:21,710 --> 00:16:25,170 They never found a single thing related to Maura. 254 00:16:26,270 --> 00:16:31,010 With her missing for six months, the official search was called off. 255 00:16:32,140 --> 00:16:36,460 We've heard from people we've interviewed that it's hard to find a 256 00:16:36,460 --> 00:16:39,320 woods. They're so thick. Do you agree with that? 257 00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:43,140 I do agree it's hard, but I can tell you I'm not a big believer in people 258 00:16:43,140 --> 00:16:47,460 levitating and going long distances. So she had to have left the track for us if 259 00:16:47,460 --> 00:16:50,980 she went into the woodlands. I'm fairly confident to say she did not go into the 260 00:16:50,980 --> 00:16:52,300 woods and she left the area. 261 00:16:52,920 --> 00:16:54,280 Where do you believe she went? 262 00:16:54,750 --> 00:16:58,210 There's a New Hampshire State Police bloodhound that was brought in on our 263 00:16:58,210 --> 00:17:02,550 day of searching. That dog did run a track off the crash site. He actually 264 00:17:02,550 --> 00:17:03,349 it twice. 265 00:17:03,350 --> 00:17:07,130 And each time he ran a track from the crash site, it ended at the intersection 266 00:17:07,130 --> 00:17:12,270 of Bradley Hill Road, which is just within sight of the crash site. 267 00:17:13,910 --> 00:17:17,130 It's possible she may have been picked up by a vehicle there. 268 00:17:18,369 --> 00:17:23,270 Though the search and rescue effort sounds exhaustive, some believe... The 269 00:17:23,270 --> 00:17:27,770 bloodhound who tracked Maura from the crash site was actually not trailing 270 00:17:27,770 --> 00:17:32,510 anything, and the cadaver dog could have missed her body in freezing conditions. 271 00:17:37,170 --> 00:17:42,550 To test this out, we've invited Deb Ash and Heather Schaefer, along with their 272 00:17:42,550 --> 00:17:44,150 scent dog, to the cabin. 273 00:17:44,450 --> 00:17:48,030 The women run a company called Canine Alert Search Team. 274 00:17:48,560 --> 00:17:53,320 which provides trained dogs to New Hampshire's police and fire departments 275 00:17:53,320 --> 00:17:55,220 the state's search and rescue operations. 276 00:17:56,200 --> 00:17:57,960 So can you just explain what your dogs do? 277 00:17:58,200 --> 00:18:04,680 Yeah. So my dog is a wilderness air scent dog and looks for people that have 278 00:18:04,680 --> 00:18:05,760 passed away. 279 00:18:06,080 --> 00:18:09,200 And while my guy's looking for the live people, mostly. 280 00:18:09,680 --> 00:18:13,120 So let's meet the dogs. Can I pet them? Yes, you may. 281 00:18:18,090 --> 00:18:19,150 Hi, you're Angus. 282 00:18:20,470 --> 00:18:24,750 Angus will track a live scent, meaning using something that belonged to Maura, 283 00:18:24,830 --> 00:18:27,350 or in this case, something of mine. 284 00:18:27,950 --> 00:18:30,430 How old is he? He is six and a half. Oh, wow. 285 00:18:30,630 --> 00:18:33,250 Yeah. Hi, hi, hi. So this is Eisen. 286 00:18:33,490 --> 00:18:34,630 He's the cadaver dog. 287 00:18:34,950 --> 00:18:39,250 Deb's dog, Eisen, will demonstrate how dogs track dead bodies. 288 00:18:39,750 --> 00:18:45,480 Both dogs have thousands of hours of training and have assisted police, fire, 289 00:18:45,580 --> 00:18:49,460 and fish and game in finding missing or deceased individuals. 290 00:18:49,840 --> 00:18:51,860 How does finding a scent work? 291 00:18:52,300 --> 00:18:56,340 For human remains, within the first three months, you're probably going to 292 00:18:56,340 --> 00:18:58,360 lot of odor, so it's going to be a big scent. 293 00:18:58,740 --> 00:19:00,180 How about beyond three months? 294 00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:05,960 There have been dogs that have found buried remains from centuries ago. 295 00:19:06,540 --> 00:19:12,360 Yeah, they can smell fractions of a part per billion of concentration of scent. 296 00:19:12,540 --> 00:19:13,540 Wow. 297 00:19:13,630 --> 00:19:19,530 Scientists believe a dog's sense of smell is 10 ,000 to 100 ,000 times more 298 00:19:19,530 --> 00:19:20,650 acute than our own. 299 00:19:21,150 --> 00:19:26,550 Some researchers liken this to finding a single rotten apple in 2 million 300 00:19:26,550 --> 00:19:27,650 barrels of apples. 301 00:19:28,410 --> 00:19:32,590 And are they trained to only find human remains, or could they find, like, 302 00:19:32,590 --> 00:19:36,550 squirrels or something like that? No. Our dogs are proofed off of those sorts 303 00:19:36,550 --> 00:19:39,410 things. All we're interested in finding is the human. 304 00:19:39,980 --> 00:19:42,960 I was going to ask you about the weather today. I mean, it's obviously very 305 00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:44,080 windy here and cold. 306 00:19:44,980 --> 00:19:47,840 Does that have an effect on the dogs working? 307 00:19:48,060 --> 00:19:51,160 The cold, not so much. The wind, it does. Very much so. 308 00:19:51,700 --> 00:19:53,540 Scent is no different than smoke. 309 00:19:54,040 --> 00:19:57,800 So the wind's going to take the smoke, and it's going to move it. 310 00:19:59,680 --> 00:20:05,180 On the day Maura went missing, wind speed near the accident site was 311 00:20:05,180 --> 00:20:07,460 between 2 and 4 miles per hour. 312 00:20:08,060 --> 00:20:14,580 The wind speed today is 23 miles per hour, making our testing even more 313 00:20:14,580 --> 00:20:18,380 because the scent trail will be moved around by the whipping wind. 314 00:20:20,260 --> 00:20:23,340 Deb has brought along a frozen human placenta for the test. 315 00:20:24,380 --> 00:20:28,960 If Eisen can find it, it'll demonstrate how a cadaver dog can find a corpse, 316 00:20:29,100 --> 00:20:31,300 even if only a small part remained. 317 00:20:31,900 --> 00:20:33,240 You want to do it right here? Yeah. 318 00:20:34,180 --> 00:20:37,100 We can use some of these branches to cover it. 319 00:20:37,590 --> 00:20:42,510 We're going to hide the placenta, so Aizen has to rely completely on his 320 00:20:43,990 --> 00:20:44,990 Perfect. 321 00:20:46,050 --> 00:20:47,050 That's good. 322 00:20:47,790 --> 00:20:49,090 It's a quarter mile away. 323 00:20:51,010 --> 00:20:52,590 Let's see if Aizen can track it. 324 00:20:53,150 --> 00:20:54,490 Aizen, come here. 325 00:20:54,770 --> 00:20:55,770 Finish. 326 00:20:56,190 --> 00:20:57,670 You ready? You ready? 327 00:20:58,070 --> 00:20:59,070 Okay, 328 00:21:01,650 --> 00:21:03,850 so you can see a little bit of change in behavior. 329 00:21:04,070 --> 00:21:05,510 His tail starts to wag. 330 00:21:13,610 --> 00:21:14,249 Come here. 331 00:21:14,250 --> 00:21:15,250 Finish. 332 00:21:15,750 --> 00:21:17,230 You ready? You ready? 333 00:21:17,490 --> 00:21:18,490 Switch. 334 00:21:19,750 --> 00:21:24,890 If the cadaver dog, Eisen, can find the small, frozen body part we've hidden in 335 00:21:24,890 --> 00:21:29,230 the snow, it'll illustrate how the dogs used in Morris' search could have found 336 00:21:29,230 --> 00:21:34,450 her remains, even during the coldest months of winter and ten days after the 337 00:21:34,450 --> 00:21:35,750 crash when they started. 338 00:21:36,350 --> 00:21:40,270 I mean, he looks like he's going back and forth and then he circles back. 339 00:21:40,570 --> 00:21:42,730 Right. They do do that. 340 00:21:43,200 --> 00:21:46,180 Great. Okay, so you can see a little bit of change in behavior. 341 00:21:47,080 --> 00:21:48,080 Watch. 342 00:21:48,540 --> 00:21:51,140 He's in odor. Do you see his tail start to wag? 343 00:21:51,420 --> 00:21:54,540 Yeah. All right. See how he's bracketing back and forth? Yeah. 344 00:21:55,460 --> 00:21:56,460 Oh, my God. 345 00:21:56,880 --> 00:21:58,460 Wow. Wow. Amazing. 346 00:22:00,780 --> 00:22:02,760 Yeah, good boy. Very good. 347 00:22:03,300 --> 00:22:07,180 So what did he do? He downed. Just a matter of like five minutes. 348 00:22:07,400 --> 00:22:08,940 Five or six minutes. Very cold today. 349 00:22:09,610 --> 00:22:13,410 and if she had been out here, there would be so much scent, of course the 350 00:22:13,410 --> 00:22:14,410 would find her. 351 00:22:14,430 --> 00:22:18,230 So would you say that, you know, the grid area that was searched, would you 352 00:22:18,230 --> 00:22:19,230 she's not there? 353 00:22:19,470 --> 00:22:21,950 I would say she's very likely not there. Okay. 354 00:22:23,970 --> 00:22:27,930 Now it's time to test the skills of Angus, Heather's tracking dog. 355 00:22:28,690 --> 00:22:33,530 Unlike a cadaver dog who is looking for a dead body, a tracking dog will follow 356 00:22:33,530 --> 00:22:36,990 the scent of a living person using an article of their clothing. 357 00:22:37,560 --> 00:22:42,500 or something from the person the dog is tracking, which is exactly what happened 358 00:22:42,500 --> 00:22:43,500 after Maura's crash. 359 00:22:44,460 --> 00:22:49,500 That dog did run a track off the crash site. He actually did it twice, and each 360 00:22:49,500 --> 00:22:51,900 time it ended within sight of the crash site. 361 00:22:54,660 --> 00:23:00,420 Okay, so I'm going to walk down the street to where the tracking dog lost 362 00:23:00,420 --> 00:23:01,399 Maura's scent. 363 00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:05,160 Right, and I'll pick you up at the other end, and then we'll go up and give her 364 00:23:05,160 --> 00:23:06,160 the gloves. 365 00:23:07,200 --> 00:23:07,959 See what happens. 366 00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:09,080 Okay. All right, go ahead. 367 00:23:13,160 --> 00:23:18,200 According to the police account, I'm walking the exact path Maura took away 368 00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:22,800 the crash site, and I'm going to get picked up in exactly the same spot the 369 00:23:22,800 --> 00:23:27,980 police tracking dog stopped when he lost Maura's scent, right in front of this 370 00:23:27,980 --> 00:23:28,980 cabin. 371 00:23:31,720 --> 00:23:33,720 Okay. Good job. 372 00:23:34,180 --> 00:23:35,180 Here we go. 373 00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:40,760 Hey, guys. 374 00:23:41,020 --> 00:23:42,460 You have your scent articles? 375 00:23:42,680 --> 00:23:43,680 My gloves. 376 00:23:43,980 --> 00:23:45,340 Put them in right there. 377 00:23:46,840 --> 00:23:51,040 According to Fred, Maura had new gloves at the time of her accident. 378 00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:55,300 I'm putting the gloves I wore at the crash site into a plastic bag. 379 00:23:56,600 --> 00:23:58,360 This will give Angus his scent. 380 00:23:59,060 --> 00:24:00,480 Okay. Check. 381 00:24:01,040 --> 00:24:02,040 Very nice. 382 00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:04,000 Search. 383 00:24:05,900 --> 00:24:10,680 So now I feel how hard he's pulling. Right, he's pulling hard. Yeah, I can 384 00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:11,860 it. So he's on to it. 385 00:24:12,300 --> 00:24:13,300 He is. 386 00:24:18,360 --> 00:24:19,760 He's looking around. Yeah. 387 00:24:24,060 --> 00:24:26,200 He just totally stopped. 388 00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:30,540 This look was what, you know, where'd the scent go? 389 00:24:31,500 --> 00:24:35,280 Well, Angus did a great job because this is where Maggie stopped. 390 00:24:36,580 --> 00:24:39,280 This is very similar to what happened with Maura. 391 00:24:41,120 --> 00:24:44,100 And how long would this scent last here, do you think? 392 00:24:45,180 --> 00:24:50,840 Anywhere from a couple hours after to a couple of days. 393 00:24:51,040 --> 00:24:52,460 A couple of days? Okay. 394 00:24:54,520 --> 00:24:55,540 This is important. 395 00:24:56,460 --> 00:25:00,800 A bloodhound was put on Maura's trail a day and a half after she disappeared, 396 00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:04,000 well within the window to track a strong scent. 397 00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:10,700 And, unlike today, winds were calm, meaning Maura's scent trail would likely 398 00:25:10,700 --> 00:25:12,380 have remained undisturbed. 399 00:25:12,940 --> 00:25:19,020 Could she have walked or gone up into one of these houses anywhere around 400 00:25:19,420 --> 00:25:25,740 I doubt it. If they had definite indicators that the dog was in the odor, 401 00:25:25,740 --> 00:25:31,420 track, they will follow it. So because the scent was lost right here, more than 402 00:25:31,420 --> 00:25:32,500 likely she got in the vehicle? 403 00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:33,840 More than likely. 404 00:25:40,140 --> 00:25:43,660 In the three months Art and I have been investigating Morris' disappearance, 405 00:25:44,020 --> 00:25:48,320 we've talked to dozens of people, combed through hundreds of documents, 406 00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:52,240 and untangled a web of theories about what happened to her. 407 00:25:53,300 --> 00:25:58,080 Now, with forensic testing completed, we want to take stock and decide which 408 00:25:58,080 --> 00:26:02,380 theory is most probable and determine what our next step should be. 409 00:26:03,140 --> 00:26:04,400 There's five main theories. 410 00:26:04,620 --> 00:26:10,620 She ran away, she died in a police cover -up, she committed suicide, she died in 411 00:26:10,620 --> 00:26:12,220 the woods, or she was murdered. 412 00:26:12,750 --> 00:26:16,510 You know, for running away, I think there were a lot of things going on in 413 00:26:16,510 --> 00:26:20,730 life. Absolutely, yeah. When you hear Maura had gotten in trouble for identity 414 00:26:20,730 --> 00:26:25,750 theft and credit card fraud, then it makes a lot of sense that she 415 00:26:25,990 --> 00:26:30,590 To me, it just doesn't seem like it would be enough to make somebody run 416 00:26:30,850 --> 00:26:34,970 especially for 13 years. Right, and she was pretty tight with the family, so 417 00:26:34,970 --> 00:26:38,890 even if she wanted to, let's just say, get away from the father, I think she 418 00:26:38,890 --> 00:26:41,990 would have stayed in touch with either Julie or Kathleen. Right. 419 00:26:42,270 --> 00:26:44,230 Do you think she would run away for all this time? 420 00:26:44,430 --> 00:26:50,730 No. She loved her family. If she was able to reach out and contact us, she 421 00:26:50,730 --> 00:26:51,730 definitely would have. 422 00:26:52,070 --> 00:26:53,170 But that didn't happen. 423 00:26:53,730 --> 00:26:56,510 Maura's mother was really sick with cancer when Maura disappeared. 424 00:26:56,830 --> 00:26:59,710 How hard would it have been not to come back for her mother's funeral? 425 00:26:59,930 --> 00:27:04,870 That seems really impossible to not come back home for mom. 426 00:27:05,670 --> 00:27:09,330 And the so -called sightings of Maura that we followed up on just haven't. 427 00:27:19,780 --> 00:27:22,500 So I think we can cross that one out. 428 00:27:22,980 --> 00:27:28,880 One theory that a lot of people gravitate to is a police cover -up of 429 00:27:29,870 --> 00:27:34,090 Police cover up, you know, whether it was the mysterious SUV there, the 001 430 00:27:34,090 --> 00:27:38,550 issue, the state police were trying to cover anything up. Everything that we 431 00:27:38,550 --> 00:27:42,490 came across had a fairly logical explanation to it. Could they have done 432 00:27:42,490 --> 00:27:43,389 better job? 433 00:27:43,390 --> 00:27:48,030 Yes. Yeah. And I mean, they even admit we probably could have done a better 434 00:27:48,090 --> 00:27:50,730 I think they feel as bad as everybody else does. 435 00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:59,040 From the beginning, suicide was a big one. 436 00:27:59,260 --> 00:28:02,140 But as we've looked into that, I mean, where's the body? 437 00:28:02,620 --> 00:28:07,040 Right. Usually with suicide, there's a note, there's a body. She had stuff to 438 00:28:07,040 --> 00:28:10,720 come back to. And right before she had left, she had done her homework 439 00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:14,740 assignment. Like, it was like the night before she had sent it. If it were me, 440 00:28:14,940 --> 00:28:16,880 that would be the last thing I would waste my time doing. 441 00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:18,760 We were talking about spring break. 442 00:28:19,020 --> 00:28:20,680 Did she seem excited about it? Yeah. 443 00:28:21,050 --> 00:28:22,750 We were going to go to Myrtle Beach. 444 00:28:23,030 --> 00:28:27,030 She was excited about future plans. It doesn't sound like somebody who was 445 00:28:27,030 --> 00:28:31,670 planning to end their life. Okay. And then even when we talked to the police, 446 00:28:31,710 --> 00:28:36,050 they said it's possible she just wandered off in the woods and died of 447 00:28:36,050 --> 00:28:37,050 natural element. 448 00:28:37,090 --> 00:28:39,590 I always thought that this was a possibility. 449 00:28:40,110 --> 00:28:43,810 How many times have you ever seen a dead animal in the woods? So could you miss 450 00:28:43,810 --> 00:28:44,810 a human being in the woods? 451 00:28:45,370 --> 00:28:46,730 Absolutely. But... 452 00:28:46,970 --> 00:28:51,170 I mean, with the five searches that they did, they had GPS on those dogs. We saw 453 00:28:51,170 --> 00:28:53,270 the map. They did a very thorough search. 454 00:28:53,550 --> 00:28:54,690 Could humans have missed this? 455 00:28:55,210 --> 00:28:56,189 It's possible. 456 00:28:56,190 --> 00:28:57,410 But could the dogs have? 457 00:28:57,950 --> 00:29:01,810 Not from what we saw. No, I don't think they definitely would have found her. 458 00:29:06,710 --> 00:29:10,450 Which means the most likely scenario is that... She would have gotten in a car 459 00:29:10,450 --> 00:29:12,910 where the dogs lost the sense. 460 00:29:13,170 --> 00:29:14,830 Would she accept help from a stranger? 461 00:29:15,450 --> 00:29:18,450 I think she would have, especially up there. 462 00:29:18,710 --> 00:29:21,130 Everyone's so nice, and we were never really on guard. 463 00:29:21,530 --> 00:29:25,490 Which means that she got into a car with somebody and was met with foul play. 464 00:29:28,890 --> 00:29:29,890 She was muted. 465 00:29:38,290 --> 00:29:41,970 The most likely scenario is that... She would have gotten in a car. 466 00:29:42,510 --> 00:29:44,430 Would she accept help from a stranger? 467 00:29:45,050 --> 00:29:48,030 I think she would have, especially up there. 468 00:29:48,230 --> 00:29:50,730 Everyone's so nice, and we were never really on guard. 469 00:29:52,130 --> 00:29:54,410 Which means that... She was murdered. 470 00:30:00,310 --> 00:30:04,550 The little hamlet town of Haywood, New Hampshire, ain't as pretty as everybody 471 00:30:04,550 --> 00:30:05,590 wants to paint it to be. 472 00:30:06,030 --> 00:30:11,170 If Maura was abducted and met with foul play, there is one person who has 473 00:30:11,170 --> 00:30:14,190 developed leads on suspects since day one. 474 00:30:14,700 --> 00:30:15,700 John Smith. 475 00:30:15,940 --> 00:30:20,560 He's a former New Hampshire police officer who has helped the family for 476 00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:21,560 decade. 477 00:30:21,900 --> 00:30:26,860 So while investigating Morris' disappearance, you think she did fall 478 00:30:26,860 --> 00:30:27,639 foul play? 479 00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:32,880 Well, I mean, that is 99 % my theory, that she fell victim to foul play. 480 00:30:34,220 --> 00:30:38,000 Can you tell me a little bit about the community up here? Like, what's it like 481 00:30:38,000 --> 00:30:39,280 to live in the North Country? 482 00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:43,340 It is friendly, and it's calm, it's peaceful. 483 00:30:44,620 --> 00:30:50,420 But as with any place, there's other parts of it that aren't as pretty. 484 00:30:51,700 --> 00:30:54,720 You've got people that are like hermits, you know, that don't come out of their 485 00:30:54,720 --> 00:30:57,140 house for months. They don't want to talk to anyone. 486 00:30:57,660 --> 00:31:01,020 There's a lot of crazy people around here that do some weird stuff. 487 00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:08,340 And you've come across a lot of this while investigating Maura's 488 00:31:08,740 --> 00:31:09,519 Yes, I have. 489 00:31:09,520 --> 00:31:12,340 Do you think somebody in this community knows something? 490 00:31:12,560 --> 00:31:13,560 I guarantee it. 491 00:31:15,350 --> 00:31:20,750 One of the local rumors is that Maura was supposedly picked up at the vehicle 492 00:31:20,750 --> 00:31:23,390 two or three guys. They were headed to the mountain resort. 493 00:31:23,630 --> 00:31:27,610 And they grabbed her from the scene, told her that they could get her out of 494 00:31:27,610 --> 00:31:32,070 there. And they ended up at this party. And during the party, Maura ended up 495 00:31:32,070 --> 00:31:34,950 ODing. And they didn't know what to do. 496 00:31:37,130 --> 00:31:41,450 This isn't the first time I'm hearing about young men associated with the ski 497 00:31:41,450 --> 00:31:44,510 resort just 20 miles from where Maura vanished. 498 00:31:45,310 --> 00:31:52,030 There was the story about some young men who worked at the 499 00:31:52,030 --> 00:31:58,710 ski area over in Loon that lived and would have driven by that site on the 500 00:31:58,710 --> 00:32:00,870 to work that didn't show up for work that night. 501 00:32:01,170 --> 00:32:05,730 Do you think any of these party rumor stories are credible? 502 00:32:05,930 --> 00:32:12,210 They sure seem fantastical and more of the urban legend, but I definitely feel 503 00:32:12,210 --> 00:32:13,350 that she was abducted. 504 00:32:13,690 --> 00:32:16,330 She's a beautiful girl. They were like, oh, let's get you out of here. You've 505 00:32:16,330 --> 00:32:17,009 been drinking. 506 00:32:17,010 --> 00:32:19,490 And she probably said, yeah, okay, let's go. 507 00:32:19,790 --> 00:32:21,330 What do people up here think happened? 508 00:32:21,670 --> 00:32:26,390 A lot of locals that know what their area is like believe that she was taken 509 00:32:26,390 --> 00:32:28,450 she was abducted and more than likely killed. 510 00:32:30,410 --> 00:32:35,410 But how possible is it someone would drive by at just the right time and kill 511 00:32:35,410 --> 00:32:36,410 Maura? 512 00:32:36,670 --> 00:32:38,970 Some believe it's more likely than we might think. 513 00:32:40,490 --> 00:32:43,730 Here's a criminal investigator from the Missing Maura Murray podcast. 514 00:32:45,350 --> 00:32:51,430 People keep saying that the probability of somebody getting in a car accident 515 00:32:51,430 --> 00:32:55,650 and then just by chance that you happen upon a serial killer, that is so 516 00:32:55,650 --> 00:33:00,070 unlikely. It just didn't happen when there are studies that show that two of 517 00:33:00,070 --> 00:33:03,390 major factors that contribute to crime are temptation and opportunity. 518 00:33:04,090 --> 00:33:08,970 There's no question that her being alone at night by herself poses the perfect 519 00:33:08,970 --> 00:33:09,970 opportunity. 520 00:33:11,270 --> 00:33:14,410 One serial killer looked for such opportunities. 521 00:33:16,090 --> 00:33:20,750 Israel Keyes was known to prey on people who were lost and called New Hampshire 522 00:33:20,750 --> 00:33:22,090 his stomping grounds. 523 00:33:23,290 --> 00:33:27,570 He planted murder kits with zip ties and weapons in the region so he could be 524 00:33:27,570 --> 00:33:28,950 prepared for his next victim. 525 00:33:30,890 --> 00:33:32,610 He was captured in 2012. 526 00:33:33,310 --> 00:33:38,030 And it's speculated he killed a dozen people, including two in Vermont. 527 00:33:40,870 --> 00:33:44,810 Though some members of the Murray family thought Keyes was a possible suspect, 528 00:33:45,370 --> 00:33:48,230 no connection has been drawn by law enforcement. 529 00:33:49,310 --> 00:33:52,570 And he committed suicide in prison in 2012. 530 00:33:55,110 --> 00:33:59,870 If Israel Keyes didn't kill Maura, could there be a different serial killer on 531 00:33:59,870 --> 00:34:00,870 the loose? 532 00:34:01,870 --> 00:34:04,750 There are others in the region who have mysteriously vanished. 533 00:34:07,810 --> 00:34:13,330 In 1993, 10 -year -old Holly Peranian was abducted while walking with her 534 00:34:13,330 --> 00:34:15,570 younger brother in Sturbridge, Massachusetts. 535 00:34:16,050 --> 00:34:18,530 Her body wasn't found for three months. 536 00:34:20,909 --> 00:34:26,489 Seven years later, and just 10 miles away, 16 -year -old Molly Bish vanished 537 00:34:26,489 --> 00:34:28,650 working as a lifeguard at a local pond. 538 00:34:30,670 --> 00:34:33,810 Her bones were found scattered in the woods three years later. 539 00:34:35,590 --> 00:34:39,969 Some suspect the two girls were murdered by the same man, and more than one has 540 00:34:39,969 --> 00:34:42,469 been investigated, though none have been charged. 541 00:34:44,610 --> 00:34:48,670 John Smith has traced dozens of murdered and missing women to New Hampshire 542 00:34:48,670 --> 00:34:53,770 alone, all within about 100 miles from where Maura vanished. 543 00:34:55,409 --> 00:34:59,110 He hasn't yet found a clear connection between Maura and these cases. 544 00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:02,500 But one case stands out. 545 00:35:05,920 --> 00:35:07,880 17 -year -old Breonna Maitland. 546 00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:22,820 Breonna Maitland went missing on March 19, 2004, approximately five weeks after 547 00:35:22,820 --> 00:35:27,020 Maura did, so I started becoming very interested in Breonna's case as well. 548 00:35:28,600 --> 00:35:32,540 Brianna Maitland vanished just 90 miles from where Maura disappeared. 549 00:35:34,640 --> 00:35:38,940 We're with John Smith on our way to where her abandoned vehicle was found. 550 00:35:39,280 --> 00:35:42,160 What were the circumstances surrounding Brianna's disappearance? 551 00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:43,879 Kind of bizarre. 552 00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:48,360 She'd just gotten out of work, and she drove not more than a few miles down the 553 00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:52,960 road, and her vehicle was found backed into an old farmhouse. 554 00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:56,880 The door was wide open and paychecks on the seat. 555 00:35:57,440 --> 00:35:58,680 She was nowhere to be seen. 556 00:36:02,620 --> 00:36:05,280 Should be up over this rise and on the right -hand side. 557 00:36:06,500 --> 00:36:09,960 Unfortunately, it has been burned down since I was up here the last time. 558 00:36:18,280 --> 00:36:24,100 This is the site of the old Dutchburn house, which is where Brianna Maitland's 559 00:36:24,100 --> 00:36:25,100 car was found. 560 00:36:25,120 --> 00:36:29,970 I came here to put... posters for more murray up i was looking into this case 561 00:36:29,970 --> 00:36:33,310 and i was trying to make some connections because the similarities of 562 00:36:33,310 --> 00:36:39,670 vehicles just being deserted and the vehicle actually backed into the house 563 00:36:39,670 --> 00:36:43,630 and hard enough to put a hole into the side of the house and the vehicle was 564 00:36:43,630 --> 00:36:50,510 left there so i was very interested in the whole possibility that there was 565 00:36:50,510 --> 00:36:52,150 a serial killer connection 566 00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:58,080 They've got a lot more information on Breanna Maitland than we have on Maura 567 00:36:58,080 --> 00:37:01,820 Murray. Once they had done a bunch of investigation and they found out that 568 00:37:01,820 --> 00:37:07,000 was possibly connected to the drug scene, so I think that more than likely 569 00:37:07,000 --> 00:37:09,060 was definitely involved with some bad characters. 570 00:37:09,260 --> 00:37:13,200 But Maura's doesn't have that. We don't have that much stuff to work with. 571 00:37:13,600 --> 00:37:15,860 It's basically all dead ends in Maura's case. 572 00:37:16,180 --> 00:37:19,700 But the Maitlands have denied their daughter's involvement in the drug 573 00:37:19,860 --> 00:37:25,250 and some believe a connection between the cases... and one killer is still 574 00:37:25,250 --> 00:37:26,250 possible. 575 00:37:26,970 --> 00:37:31,650 If you think about it, both of them had minor accidents, both very young and 576 00:37:31,650 --> 00:37:35,110 very nice -looking, and they both disappeared without a trace. 577 00:37:35,670 --> 00:37:38,870 People around here are really upset. They want this solved. 578 00:37:39,090 --> 00:37:42,890 She's not gone of her own free will, and neither is Maura. 579 00:37:43,630 --> 00:37:47,130 Several people of interest have been investigated in the Breonna Maitland 580 00:37:47,370 --> 00:37:49,430 but no suspects have been named. 581 00:37:50,710 --> 00:37:53,820 Breonna's case, like Maura's, has gone cold. 582 00:37:57,540 --> 00:38:02,340 John Smith hasn't completely ruled out a serial killer, and he has continued to 583 00:38:02,340 --> 00:38:07,240 pursue leads on suspects, namely a few locals that have caught his attention. 584 00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:11,840 Is there anyone else connected to this case that you have looked into or 585 00:38:11,840 --> 00:38:12,840 anything else? 586 00:38:13,140 --> 00:38:17,800 There's this really strange story about these two brothers who, one of them 587 00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:21,060 lived in an A -frame, which is only about a mile from the accident scene. 588 00:38:24,140 --> 00:38:29,660 There was rumors out there that Maura was taken and brought to this A -frame, 589 00:38:29,800 --> 00:38:32,920 and then she was actually killed in the A -frame. 590 00:38:34,500 --> 00:38:38,940 It's rumored that one of these brothers was involved in the local drug scene and 591 00:38:38,940 --> 00:38:39,980 had a criminal past. 592 00:38:40,880 --> 00:38:44,160 Could he have picked Maura up and then murdered her? 593 00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:50,420 Only a mile from where she crashed. 594 00:38:54,830 --> 00:39:00,210 One of them came forward, this is months after Moore disappeared, and said that 595 00:39:00,210 --> 00:39:03,870 he believed that his brother could have something to do with the case. 596 00:39:04,450 --> 00:39:05,970 And he called Mr. 597 00:39:06,170 --> 00:39:11,090 Murray and said, I found a knife in the glove compartment that had blood on it. 598 00:39:14,770 --> 00:39:18,690 They ended up getting this knife to Mr. Murray, and Mr. Murray tried to give 599 00:39:18,690 --> 00:39:21,290 that knife to the New Hampshire State Police, and they refused it. 600 00:39:21,660 --> 00:39:24,680 He sent it back again, and they accepted it the second time. 601 00:39:24,880 --> 00:39:27,280 And do you know whatever came of the knife after that? We do not know. 602 00:39:28,900 --> 00:39:30,580 Have you done any forensic testing? 603 00:39:31,020 --> 00:39:32,300 Nothing that I can share publicly. 604 00:39:36,360 --> 00:39:43,300 The place was vacant in 2006, so the owner of the property actually came to 605 00:39:43,300 --> 00:39:45,680 and said that if we wanted to go in there, we could. 606 00:39:46,380 --> 00:39:51,400 So we went in with the dogs. The dogs got a big hit on this upstairs closet 607 00:39:51,400 --> 00:39:54,640 for human remains. 608 00:39:54,940 --> 00:39:58,520 And carpet samples were given to the New Hampshire State Police. 609 00:39:58,880 --> 00:40:03,080 And we, of course, again, don't know what happened to that sample or what the 610 00:40:03,080 --> 00:40:04,200 test proved. 611 00:40:04,540 --> 00:40:08,800 So could we test other carpet samples or anything in the house? 612 00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:13,480 No, there's no carpet left in the house because the new owners had taken it all 613 00:40:13,480 --> 00:40:14,480 out. 614 00:40:14,560 --> 00:40:18,600 There may not have been carpet left, but there was something else. 615 00:40:19,620 --> 00:40:23,740 We ended up going there in 2016 with Tim and Lance. 616 00:40:24,400 --> 00:40:25,400 Can I keep going? 617 00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:27,840 We can go up to the house up here. 618 00:40:30,420 --> 00:40:31,980 We went through the whole house. 619 00:40:33,000 --> 00:40:34,000 Do you think that's blood? 620 00:40:34,320 --> 00:40:37,340 I mean, more than likely, it's human blood if it's up here in this room. The 621 00:40:37,340 --> 00:40:38,340 claw is it. 622 00:40:38,440 --> 00:40:40,900 You know, there's not going to be a bloody deer in the claw room. 623 00:40:41,840 --> 00:40:47,040 We actually took wood chips from that closet, and I have those in my 624 00:40:47,820 --> 00:40:51,160 If it's really blood they saw, could it be Maura's? 625 00:40:51,860 --> 00:40:53,320 Have you tested the wood chips? 626 00:40:53,560 --> 00:40:54,980 I haven't tested them yet, no. 627 00:40:56,520 --> 00:41:00,700 Would you be open to sharing the chips with us and we could have them tested? 628 00:41:01,060 --> 00:41:02,940 Yeah, I'd love to have them tested. Let's do it. 629 00:41:08,280 --> 00:41:10,820 Hi, how are you? Good. Come on in. 630 00:41:14,940 --> 00:41:19,860 Maggie, Art and I are meeting with Dr. Max Nuridine, a molecular geneticist and 631 00:41:19,860 --> 00:41:21,920 recognized forensic DNA expert. 632 00:41:22,660 --> 00:41:25,320 He'll tell us if these wood chips have blood on them at all. 633 00:41:26,280 --> 00:41:30,200 If they do, it could mean Maura was murdered in the A -frame house. 634 00:41:31,340 --> 00:41:35,520 And if a mix of DNA is found, it could also ID a killer. 635 00:41:47,280 --> 00:41:48,280 Hi, how are you? 636 00:41:48,480 --> 00:41:50,180 Max Noradine. Nice to meet you. 637 00:41:50,840 --> 00:41:56,060 Art and I are with Dr. Max Noradine, a geneticist who will tell us if blood is 638 00:41:56,060 --> 00:42:00,780 present on wood samples taken from a house it's rumored Maura was murdered 639 00:42:02,540 --> 00:42:06,780 If it is, it could solve her disappearance and ID her killer. 640 00:42:09,140 --> 00:42:12,940 Well, we have some wood chips from a house. 641 00:42:13,710 --> 00:42:19,570 that was searched by canines, and they were getting a particular hit in this 642 00:42:19,570 --> 00:42:24,290 closet. The walls look like they might have been paneled, and that's what these 643 00:42:24,290 --> 00:42:26,610 chips look like, actually, wood paneling. 644 00:42:32,190 --> 00:42:37,350 Dr. Neridian is using phenothaline, which will tell us if blood is present 645 00:42:37,350 --> 00:42:40,750 all and if the chips are viable for DNA testing. 646 00:42:41,360 --> 00:42:47,020 The phenolphthalein test is a color -based test, so you'll be able to see a 647 00:42:47,020 --> 00:42:51,260 really bright pink color develop if blood is present. 648 00:42:57,640 --> 00:43:03,300 And this is huge. This is all that is left of the house, and this could really 649 00:43:03,300 --> 00:43:08,860 put to rest some theories that are out there or confirm some things as well. 650 00:43:10,090 --> 00:43:15,710 Because of renovations, this critical evidence is the last to ever come out of 651 00:43:15,710 --> 00:43:20,310 the A -frame house, and possibly the last remnant of Maura. 652 00:43:22,530 --> 00:43:26,810 If this comes up positive for blood... You send this off to DNA right away. 653 00:43:27,810 --> 00:43:28,810 Okay. 654 00:43:39,370 --> 00:43:41,550 I'm going to start out with a drop of alcohol. 655 00:43:47,590 --> 00:43:48,810 Phenolphthalein reagent. 656 00:43:53,150 --> 00:43:56,610 I do see some paint color showing up. 657 00:43:56,970 --> 00:43:57,970 Really? 658 00:44:02,230 --> 00:44:05,330 For more on this case, visit Oxygen .com.