1 00:00:09,520 --> 00:00:14,440 A little nine -year -old girl had just learnt she could have her own new 2 00:00:14,440 --> 00:00:15,440 bicycle. 3 00:00:16,620 --> 00:00:17,320 The 4 00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:24,540 last 5 00:00:24,540 --> 00:00:30,840 sighting I would ever have of our little girl was the imprint of her hair 6 00:00:30,840 --> 00:00:35,600 sweeping around her face as she closed the door behind her. 7 00:00:42,000 --> 00:00:47,300 There was still some school holiday left, and I wanted Jennifer to be able 8 00:00:47,300 --> 00:00:50,040 enjoy travelling to her friends' houses. 9 00:00:50,780 --> 00:00:55,420 And Pat says, no, don't be buying a new bike. Keep it for Christmas present. And 10 00:00:55,420 --> 00:00:58,880 I says, no, the better that she has it for the holidays. 11 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:05,239 Pat didn't want me to buy that bike. 12 00:01:06,880 --> 00:01:10,220 And if I hadn't have bought it, she wouldn't have been out on that bike to 13 00:01:10,860 --> 00:01:11,860 Take him. 14 00:01:28,320 --> 00:01:33,000 Most people are good and kind, but there are some who want to hurt children. 15 00:01:33,300 --> 00:01:38,460 This man came up and said, would I like to see some puppies? And I said yes. 16 00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:43,060 I had warned her on lots of occasions about taking lifts in cars. 17 00:01:43,420 --> 00:01:46,820 So I know that if she did get in the car, she was forced into it. 18 00:01:47,380 --> 00:01:50,260 We were dealing with a travelling sexual predator. 19 00:01:55,000 --> 00:01:58,680 We would just give anything, everything we've got, just to have her back. 20 00:02:02,100 --> 00:02:05,580 When a child disappears, publicity is vital. 21 00:02:05,860 --> 00:02:07,460 Bring her back, whoever has her. 22 00:02:07,870 --> 00:02:09,690 This was now a serial killer. 23 00:02:13,610 --> 00:02:17,050 There was somebody lurking there, waiting to snatch a child. 24 00:02:17,590 --> 00:02:20,770 The young girl just walking down the street never came back again. 25 00:02:21,130 --> 00:02:23,710 There just cannot be anything other than evil. 26 00:02:27,390 --> 00:02:29,290 Because somebody else has a child next. 27 00:02:29,850 --> 00:02:31,390 They never stop at one. 28 00:02:32,570 --> 00:02:35,430 Abducted, taken south, murdered. 29 00:02:35,980 --> 00:02:40,980 an aggressive predatory paedophile, a heat -seeking missile, and once his 30 00:02:40,980 --> 00:02:43,440 was locked on, sadly, end of story. 31 00:02:43,760 --> 00:02:44,880 Will you catch him? 32 00:02:45,140 --> 00:02:46,140 I think so. 33 00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:20,280 A man was mowing his lawn when he looked up 34 00:03:20,280 --> 00:03:24,140 and saw a neighbour's girl walking past. 35 00:03:24,760 --> 00:03:28,560 She was actually on her way back to her house because her friend hadn't been 36 00:03:28,560 --> 00:03:29,840 where she thought she would be. 37 00:03:30,340 --> 00:03:32,480 He continued with what he was doing. 38 00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:34,440 He saw a van. 39 00:03:36,820 --> 00:03:38,960 And this man had stopped his van. 40 00:03:40,120 --> 00:03:41,860 She disappeared into thin air. 41 00:03:44,300 --> 00:03:46,640 The van disappeared. 42 00:03:49,200 --> 00:03:54,360 He felt that something was seriously wrong and raised the alarm. 43 00:03:55,600 --> 00:04:01,560 The police officer comes down straightaway to the road and is actually 44 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:08,360 to the informant when all of a sudden coming south in the same van. 45 00:04:12,330 --> 00:04:14,170 when the van came into view. 46 00:04:15,690 --> 00:04:22,350 The policeman he was talking to ran in front of the van and 47 00:04:22,350 --> 00:04:24,690 stopped it. 48 00:04:29,210 --> 00:04:31,130 The policeman opened the van. 49 00:04:33,490 --> 00:04:40,170 The van appeared to be empty except for what appeared to be 50 00:04:40,170 --> 00:04:41,450 a bundle of 51 00:04:44,729 --> 00:04:51,650 He thought he saw the bundle of rags moving and he realised 52 00:04:51,650 --> 00:04:55,650 that actually what was a bundle of rags was a child. 53 00:04:58,250 --> 00:05:04,410 Bound, gagged, wrists tied, elastoplast on her mouth, 54 00:05:04,850 --> 00:05:10,590 her cushion cover zipped up and tied over her head, very much longer. 55 00:05:11,020 --> 00:05:14,220 And she would have undoubtedly died of asphyxiation. 56 00:05:16,100 --> 00:05:18,720 He released the child. 57 00:05:21,400 --> 00:05:23,180 And it was his own daughter. 58 00:05:27,540 --> 00:05:34,520 How that police officer managed to maintain his professionalism is one of 59 00:05:34,520 --> 00:05:37,800 most extraordinary events I've ever covered as a reporter. 60 00:06:03,210 --> 00:06:08,110 Northern Ireland in the 1980s was a place that was very troubled, but in 61 00:06:08,110 --> 00:06:11,710 of Northern Ireland it was much more normal, and actually it was quiet, it 62 00:06:11,710 --> 00:06:13,270 rural, it was almost a yesterday. 63 00:06:14,210 --> 00:06:17,650 In this area it's all farmland, mostly. 64 00:06:18,570 --> 00:06:20,130 You get lost very easy. 65 00:06:21,030 --> 00:06:22,670 People coming to this house get lost. 66 00:06:25,530 --> 00:06:29,550 In 1981 our family was complete. 67 00:06:30,570 --> 00:06:32,770 Pat was 34 and I was 33. 68 00:06:33,490 --> 00:06:35,270 Mark was 14. 69 00:06:35,970 --> 00:06:37,470 Jennifer was 9. 70 00:06:37,850 --> 00:06:39,230 Philip was 6. 71 00:06:39,510 --> 00:06:42,490 Victoria was only 8 or 9 months old. 72 00:06:43,490 --> 00:06:49,430 I'll never forget going out. I think we were going up to Antrim to the lock for 73 00:06:49,430 --> 00:06:50,430 an afternoon. 74 00:06:50,770 --> 00:06:57,330 I'll never forget parking the car and every door opened and the boot opened 75 00:06:57,330 --> 00:06:59,390 children fell out. It was just lovely. 76 00:07:02,580 --> 00:07:04,160 Jennifer was a lovely child. 77 00:07:04,440 --> 00:07:08,320 She loved people, having her friends here and going to friends. 78 00:07:09,460 --> 00:07:12,820 We had a lovely relationship, so we had a lovely relationship. 79 00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:25,460 When I got home, Pat was standing at the back door. 80 00:07:26,340 --> 00:07:29,460 I said, what's wrong? Pat says, Jennifer hasn't come home. 81 00:07:31,180 --> 00:07:35,620 She went off on her bike to see a friend, which is about two and a half 82 00:07:35,620 --> 00:07:36,620 down the road. 83 00:07:37,840 --> 00:07:43,240 We drove down to the house where Jennifer was supposed to go to and she 84 00:07:43,240 --> 00:07:44,240 had arrived. 85 00:07:47,020 --> 00:07:52,980 So we went round other houses and up lanes and eventually 86 00:07:52,980 --> 00:07:57,720 we went to the local police station and said, look, we can't find her. 87 00:07:58,030 --> 00:08:00,590 We knew we had a serious situation. 88 00:08:04,730 --> 00:08:09,490 When Jennifer went missing, my father happened to be the station sergeant in 89 00:08:09,490 --> 00:08:10,990 Hillsborough Police Station. 90 00:08:11,230 --> 00:08:16,990 My father knew Andy Carty. Jennifer was a carefree girl, enjoyed the country 91 00:08:16,990 --> 00:08:19,630 life. She was near my age. 92 00:08:30,510 --> 00:08:32,350 The house was filled with people. 93 00:08:32,870 --> 00:08:39,730 A friend of mine arrived with a pickup truck and he says, look, what 94 00:08:39,730 --> 00:08:41,409 direction did you go Andy? 95 00:08:42,169 --> 00:08:46,950 And just about a mile and a half down the road, the lights picked up the 96 00:08:46,950 --> 00:08:48,310 reflection on our bike. 97 00:08:53,030 --> 00:08:58,110 So when the bike was found, then we knew that we had a big problem. 98 00:08:59,240 --> 00:09:01,780 We knew that somebody had abducted her. 99 00:09:05,540 --> 00:09:12,500 I was difficult to sleep 100 00:09:12,500 --> 00:09:15,100 because of so much commotion and I was worried for my sister. 101 00:09:16,140 --> 00:09:23,080 I heard my mum scream and I got up and I came out and it 102 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:24,660 was because her bike had been found. 103 00:09:26,460 --> 00:09:27,640 It was only then. 104 00:09:28,410 --> 00:09:30,330 That it sort of hit me. My sister's missing. 105 00:09:30,650 --> 00:09:32,750 You know, what's going on? 106 00:09:33,270 --> 00:09:36,910 From that minute onwards, our child was in danger. 107 00:09:45,930 --> 00:09:47,390 I awoke. 108 00:09:47,950 --> 00:09:51,930 To the phone ringing very early on and it was another inspector. 109 00:09:52,190 --> 00:09:57,070 I was rather surprised because I knew that he had not been scheduled to work 110 00:09:57,070 --> 00:10:01,090 overnight and he apprised me then of the situation. 111 00:10:01,510 --> 00:10:06,470 Advised me somewhat bizarrely to make sure I brought Wellington boots because 112 00:10:06,470 --> 00:10:08,510 there was going to be a lot of searching to be done. 113 00:10:09,010 --> 00:10:12,630 Child disappearances at that time were few and far between. 114 00:10:13,770 --> 00:10:18,570 Very quickly, there was hundreds and hundreds of people, armed forces and 115 00:10:18,570 --> 00:10:19,950 officers looking for Jennifer. 116 00:10:20,570 --> 00:10:24,050 The word had travelled so fast. 117 00:10:24,530 --> 00:10:27,790 There wasn't a house, there wasn't somebody out searching. 118 00:10:28,330 --> 00:10:29,430 Everybody helped. 119 00:10:30,350 --> 00:10:32,630 A nine -year -old just doesn't disappear. 120 00:10:32,850 --> 00:10:37,930 Like this hand and heart, hello, I wouldn't have said so publicly. 121 00:10:38,210 --> 00:10:41,730 I was very concerned that something sinister had happened. 122 00:10:42,540 --> 00:10:46,180 You would expect that a nine -year -old would turn up within 12 hours. 123 00:10:51,960 --> 00:10:55,920 The search began last night. It's centred around a wide area of remote 124 00:10:55,920 --> 00:10:58,780 countryside and the difficult terrain is hampering the operation. 125 00:10:59,580 --> 00:11:03,340 Police blocked off roads and interviewed motorists, hoping that someone might 126 00:11:03,340 --> 00:11:04,600 have remembered seeing the girl. 127 00:11:04,840 --> 00:11:08,720 The first plan of action is to gather information, but we're talking about a 128 00:11:08,720 --> 00:11:11,140 nine -year -old child who left home. 129 00:11:11,680 --> 00:11:15,580 The previous afternoon, to go to a friend's house, and she never reached 130 00:11:15,580 --> 00:11:17,720 friend's house, and she didn't return home. 131 00:11:18,820 --> 00:11:23,600 We were searching in a concentric ring from the location of the bicycle. 132 00:11:24,240 --> 00:11:29,420 There was no leads, there were no clues, so it was a question just of carrying 133 00:11:29,420 --> 00:11:31,100 on, spreading out further. 134 00:11:31,540 --> 00:11:33,080 There'd be a group of citizens. 135 00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:37,300 with a police officer attached, giving a search area, and out they went to try 136 00:11:37,300 --> 00:11:40,820 and find Jennifer, to try and find items that might belong to Jennifer, to try 137 00:11:40,820 --> 00:11:42,480 and find anything else that might have been out of place. 138 00:11:43,240 --> 00:11:48,620 The search would have been stretched in a line across a field and moving across 139 00:11:48,620 --> 00:11:52,620 that field, but looking particularly at the hedgerows and looking particularly 140 00:11:52,620 --> 00:11:53,620 at outbuildings. 141 00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:58,420 The army are using helicopters to cover thousands of acres of field and teams of 142 00:11:58,420 --> 00:12:00,880 helpers are taking it in turn to look for the girl. 143 00:12:03,370 --> 00:12:06,910 I remember, even as a child, was the news changing. 144 00:12:07,710 --> 00:12:11,990 So yes, the troubles were going on. Yes, the hunger strikes were going on. Yes, 145 00:12:12,070 --> 00:12:15,530 there were shootings. And yes, there were bombings. But the emphasis of the 146 00:12:15,530 --> 00:12:17,950 changed to Jennifer's disappearance. 147 00:12:19,570 --> 00:12:23,970 Northern Ireland was a place where we did a lot of bad things to each other, 148 00:12:23,970 --> 00:12:25,170 we didn't do them to children. 149 00:12:25,610 --> 00:12:26,850 And suddenly this was different. 150 00:12:32,140 --> 00:12:36,440 In 1981, I was sent to Northern Ireland to report on their troubles. 151 00:12:37,980 --> 00:12:40,720 During the course of that, a child disappeared. 152 00:12:41,540 --> 00:12:43,440 I spoke to her father. 153 00:12:43,960 --> 00:12:49,640 It's a moment a reporter dreads to knock on the door of a 154 00:12:49,640 --> 00:12:52,580 family where a child has gone missing. 155 00:12:53,860 --> 00:13:00,780 He was a committed Christian who hoped that whoever it might have been... 156 00:13:00,890 --> 00:13:04,130 who had taken her. He would find it in his heart to return his daughter. 157 00:13:05,630 --> 00:13:08,210 Jennifer, she was very, very pleasant. 158 00:13:08,770 --> 00:13:13,590 I had warned her on lots of occasions about taking lifts in cars, and she told 159 00:13:13,590 --> 00:13:14,850 me, don't you be silly. 160 00:13:15,490 --> 00:13:20,070 There's no way that I would get into a car, you know? So I know that if she did 161 00:13:20,070 --> 00:13:21,650 get into a car, she was forced into it. 162 00:13:22,130 --> 00:13:23,850 It was all about hope. 163 00:13:24,410 --> 00:13:27,190 It was all about hope that we would see her again. 164 00:13:28,400 --> 00:13:34,840 To walk into this room and her Wendy house was here and toys were all here 165 00:13:34,840 --> 00:13:36,380 all of a sudden she's not there. 166 00:13:37,020 --> 00:13:41,020 It was just so dreadful. You just wanted to go away. 167 00:13:51,180 --> 00:13:56,100 I had not really left this house over them days. 168 00:13:57,320 --> 00:14:01,740 So we went down to the headquarters and we met the senior policeman. 169 00:14:02,100 --> 00:14:06,320 And all of a sudden, he was called away. 170 00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:13,100 We were asked to leave. And within the hour, there was a lovely girl called 171 00:14:13,100 --> 00:14:16,680 Yvonne. She called to tell us that her body had been found. 172 00:14:26,060 --> 00:14:30,160 Two guys are out at a location which then becomes quite infamous, McKees Dam, 173 00:14:30,400 --> 00:14:34,100 and they see something on the water, and they think it's a coat. 174 00:14:35,740 --> 00:14:38,800 They go straight to a local police station, and the police officer they 175 00:14:38,800 --> 00:14:39,779 is my father. 176 00:14:39,780 --> 00:14:43,360 He took one of the constables, they got in the car and accompanied the two back 177 00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:44,360 to McKees Dam. 178 00:14:45,400 --> 00:14:52,380 We walked in and could see the distinctive red, and sadly it turned out 179 00:14:52,380 --> 00:14:53,500 Jennifer. 180 00:14:58,350 --> 00:15:01,150 The perpetrator intended that she would be found. 181 00:15:03,750 --> 00:15:07,890 If they didn't want her to be found, they could have taken her around to the 182 00:15:07,890 --> 00:15:11,010 other side of the dam, could have taken her away from the path. 183 00:15:11,330 --> 00:15:15,370 You couldn't walk in there and not see the red clothing. 184 00:15:17,590 --> 00:15:24,210 Yvonne called and told me I would have to go to identify Jennifer's body. 185 00:15:24,490 --> 00:15:26,850 I can remember they opened the body bag. 186 00:15:31,050 --> 00:15:36,630 And Yvonne had to hold me up because I would have collapsed. 187 00:15:38,370 --> 00:15:45,070 And because she'd been in the water for so many days, 188 00:15:45,210 --> 00:15:51,490 I couldn't 189 00:15:51,490 --> 00:15:53,610 really identify her. 190 00:16:04,780 --> 00:16:11,760 I asked, would they unzip the bag further down? 191 00:16:12,440 --> 00:16:14,240 I wanted to see her shoes. 192 00:16:17,220 --> 00:16:19,380 And then I knew it was her, so I did. 193 00:16:25,220 --> 00:16:29,240 A massive hunt for the missing girl was called off this afternoon after her body 194 00:16:29,240 --> 00:16:30,240 was found in the lake. 195 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:34,500 A full -scale murder hunt has got underway and volunteers who helped 196 00:16:34,500 --> 00:16:38,540 remote countryside stood down. It's not yet known how she died. 197 00:16:39,300 --> 00:16:44,660 The puzzle for police really at that stage was that this was a nine -year 198 00:16:44,660 --> 00:16:50,260 girl in this rural area and she's found in a dam 15 miles away. 199 00:16:50,820 --> 00:16:53,780 So you're thinking, what's the connection? 200 00:16:55,040 --> 00:16:59,800 How did her body get miles away from where her bike was? 201 00:17:00,330 --> 00:17:03,770 Who had taken her? Why did they take her? 202 00:17:04,030 --> 00:17:09,290 For what reasoning did someone have a vendetta against my dad and do this on 203 00:17:09,290 --> 00:17:12,290 purpose? There's lots of things going through my head. 204 00:17:13,109 --> 00:17:19,670 I have to admit, right, and I don't often tell this, but I have to admit 205 00:17:19,670 --> 00:17:26,050 that revenge was a big part of my life then. 206 00:17:27,010 --> 00:17:28,610 If I had of... 207 00:17:28,920 --> 00:17:35,820 found out who had done what they did to Jennifer, I would have 208 00:17:35,820 --> 00:17:36,820 killed them. 209 00:17:36,920 --> 00:17:39,420 I mean that, I would have killed them. 210 00:17:44,220 --> 00:17:49,620 It was very important that he was caught. He could obviously do the same 211 00:17:49,620 --> 00:17:50,620 another girl. 212 00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:57,040 I'm looking at an account of the disappearance of Jennifer Cardie. 213 00:17:58,090 --> 00:18:01,890 We called her Little Red Riding Hood to get the attention of the reader. 214 00:18:04,810 --> 00:18:10,550 Extraordinary though the murder of Jennifer was, I could not have imagined 215 00:18:10,550 --> 00:18:17,350 over the next months and years I'd be reporting on yet more murders of young 216 00:18:17,350 --> 00:18:18,350 girls. 217 00:18:18,990 --> 00:18:24,370 I didn't think Jennifer's murder could have been that of a serial killer. 218 00:18:24,990 --> 00:18:26,430 It turns out it was. 219 00:18:40,510 --> 00:18:41,510 Mrs. 220 00:18:45,550 --> 00:18:49,450 Maxwell said that that day had been the first time Susan had been allowed to 221 00:18:49,450 --> 00:18:50,450 walk home alone. 222 00:18:56,470 --> 00:19:00,830 When she didn't turn up, Mrs. Maxwell drove to the town tennis club to try and 223 00:19:00,830 --> 00:19:02,810 find her, but there was no sign of her. 224 00:19:04,330 --> 00:19:08,850 She then began ringing around friends and relatives, but no one had seen 225 00:19:09,930 --> 00:19:14,950 Susan had gone missing while walking home from a game of tennis with a 226 00:19:15,270 --> 00:19:18,930 Sadly, she disappeared on her way back home. 227 00:19:30,280 --> 00:19:36,260 I am Roger Orr. I retired in 2008 as the Detective Chief Superintendent, Head of 228 00:19:36,260 --> 00:19:37,900 CID, in Lothian and Borders Police. 229 00:19:39,760 --> 00:19:41,620 Susan was 11 at that time. 230 00:19:41,880 --> 00:19:46,200 She had quite dark, shoulder -length hair, and would have been quite 231 00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:50,980 distinctive, even at that time, on a busy route, which was a main trunk road 232 00:19:50,980 --> 00:19:52,700 from south to north. 233 00:19:54,340 --> 00:19:56,520 A very responsible young girl. 234 00:19:56,970 --> 00:20:01,850 who does what she's told, follows regular routines, who has suddenly and 235 00:20:01,850 --> 00:20:04,770 inexplicably gone missing for the first time. 236 00:20:06,930 --> 00:20:09,190 I was an inspector in the serious crime squad. 237 00:20:09,410 --> 00:20:12,510 Right from the start, they thought it was a serious matter. 238 00:20:12,990 --> 00:20:18,510 We very, very quickly traced witnesses who had seen her on the road and then a 239 00:20:18,510 --> 00:20:21,510 car had come along a few minutes later and she'd been gone. 240 00:20:22,350 --> 00:20:24,990 So we were very, very quickly of the view. 241 00:20:25,630 --> 00:20:30,550 that she'd been snatched, Susie had been dragged into a vehicle and away. 242 00:20:32,890 --> 00:20:36,490 When a child disappears, publicity is vital. 243 00:20:37,110 --> 00:20:41,350 We would just give anything, everything we've got, just to have her back. Please 244 00:20:41,350 --> 00:20:42,950 let us have her back. 245 00:20:44,250 --> 00:20:50,290 Susan's parents, Liz and Fordyce, were both journalists, so they understood 246 00:20:50,290 --> 00:20:53,830 why we were there and the value of publicity. 247 00:20:54,590 --> 00:20:56,250 in the hunt for their missing daughter. 248 00:20:56,830 --> 00:21:00,990 Nobody knew where she was. She could have been anywhere. 249 00:21:01,910 --> 00:21:03,410 Trace, interview, eliminate. 250 00:21:03,670 --> 00:21:05,690 Now, the tracing and interviewing is the easy part. 251 00:21:06,130 --> 00:21:11,310 The eliminating is harder because sometimes people don't have an alibi. 252 00:21:12,230 --> 00:21:16,150 Who could possibly have snatched Susie from outside Coldstream? 253 00:21:16,850 --> 00:21:21,270 One of the main groups that used that road were delivery van drivers. 254 00:21:22,700 --> 00:21:29,680 We started to build up a picture of what we knew was travelling on that road at 255 00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:35,360 that time as best we could. And of course, after 24 to 48 hours, you're 256 00:21:35,360 --> 00:21:37,260 for the best, but you're fearing for the worst. 257 00:21:38,030 --> 00:21:42,370 This afternoon, 12 -year -old Susan Jackson played the part of the missing 258 00:21:42,370 --> 00:21:45,490 Maxwell in this reconstruction of last Friday's walk. 259 00:21:45,790 --> 00:21:49,430 Susan, wearing an identical outfit and carrying a tennis racket and ball, 260 00:21:49,610 --> 00:21:54,010 crossed the bridge over the river Tweed at Coldstream and continued 50 yards to 261 00:21:54,010 --> 00:21:55,570 the spot where she was last seen. 262 00:21:57,930 --> 00:22:02,830 This case brought huge publicity. As the word went out and as more and more 263 00:22:02,830 --> 00:22:06,150 people became involved and more and more people became interested in the case, 264 00:22:06,230 --> 00:22:08,170 so more and more of these phone calls came in. 265 00:22:08,640 --> 00:22:14,020 We were pretty well set up in the 1980s. There was one problem, one weakness, 266 00:22:14,260 --> 00:22:19,060 and that was we were still working with the old card index system. And that 267 00:22:19,060 --> 00:22:23,040 really hadn't changed in 100 years. I mean, if you went back and looked at the 268 00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:27,660 Whitechapel Ripper murders of 1888, the famous Jack the Ripper murders, you 269 00:22:27,660 --> 00:22:32,600 would recognise the admin system they used were the admin system we were using 270 00:22:32,600 --> 00:22:33,920 100 years later. 271 00:22:34,440 --> 00:22:37,940 The problem with card index systems is not where you start, but where you 272 00:22:37,940 --> 00:22:44,260 finish. You have massive incident rooms with tens of thousands of cards, which 273 00:22:44,260 --> 00:22:48,300 are impossible for any human being to actually get their head round or 274 00:22:49,880 --> 00:22:54,980 Every morning I feel this is going to be the day. We're going to get that phone 275 00:22:54,980 --> 00:22:58,180 call today to say she's going to be all right. 276 00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:09,660 Liz appeared on the radio to further the appeal. 277 00:23:10,680 --> 00:23:16,220 Very sadly, as that broadcast was going out, Susan's body was found. 278 00:23:17,980 --> 00:23:23,640 Susan's body was found nearly 250 miles from where she had been abducted, in a 279 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:29,080 lay -by off a minor road near the village of Utopseter in Staffordshire. 280 00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:34,700 She had been placed in a copse of trees adjacent to the lay -by. 281 00:23:35,230 --> 00:23:39,250 Her shoes had been removed, although she was still wearing the white socks that 282 00:23:39,250 --> 00:23:40,250 she had had on. 283 00:23:40,550 --> 00:23:46,910 The circumstances clearly indicated a forcible abduction with a very strong 284 00:23:46,910 --> 00:23:53,670 belief of a high degree of sexual motivation in the abduction and in her 285 00:23:53,670 --> 00:23:54,670 murder. 286 00:23:56,250 --> 00:24:02,190 It seemed inevitable, but it was nonetheless terrible. 287 00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:06,480 Fifty officers are scouring the area looking for clues. 288 00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:11,640 In particular, they still want to find the tennis racket Susan had with her 289 00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:12,640 she disappeared. 290 00:24:14,460 --> 00:24:19,700 Keeping the story going, as we say in the business, became increasingly 291 00:24:19,700 --> 00:24:22,540 difficult because there was no more to write about. 292 00:24:24,220 --> 00:24:26,380 Susan was dead. 293 00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:30,760 She'd been murdered. The story now was a hunt for the killer. 294 00:24:36,940 --> 00:24:40,800 Police from Staffordshire and Northumbria are now manning an incident 295 00:24:40,800 --> 00:24:45,000 around the clock. They're hoping that someone may have noticed the 296 00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:48,280 vivid clothing as they drove past the spot where she was found. 297 00:24:49,160 --> 00:24:53,920 We now had a very, very complicated investigation on our hands. We had 298 00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:56,680 and Borders, we had Northumbria and we had Staffordshire. 299 00:24:57,240 --> 00:25:02,000 You've got vast distances, you've got very, very little in the way of forensic 300 00:25:02,000 --> 00:25:04,660 evidence and you've got three police forces. 301 00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:09,620 trying to work together using an antiquated system of administration. 302 00:25:10,060 --> 00:25:11,720 It doesn't get any harder than that. 303 00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:14,400 There's also a prospect that you're in for the long haul. 304 00:25:27,020 --> 00:25:33,940 In July of the following year, 1983, Caroline Hogg, aged five, goes 305 00:25:33,940 --> 00:25:34,940 missing. 306 00:25:44,910 --> 00:25:49,810 She has been allowed to go out to play for just a little longer at the end of a 307 00:25:49,810 --> 00:25:51,070 long, hot summer's day. 308 00:25:52,010 --> 00:25:57,230 And she's dressed very prettily in a little dress with training shoes, white 309 00:25:57,230 --> 00:26:00,230 socks, and her hair is blonde, tied up with punches. 310 00:26:03,330 --> 00:26:07,410 Caroline was allowed out to play for just five minutes at seven o 'clock in 311 00:26:07,410 --> 00:26:11,810 evening. Inexplicably, she wandered further than ever before from her 312 00:26:11,810 --> 00:26:16,950 home. At the end of the road, just 100 yards away, the Fun City Fairground was 313 00:26:16,950 --> 00:26:19,190 in full swing, and that's where she went. 314 00:26:20,010 --> 00:26:24,290 She's seen by several people on the promenade at that time, and one in 315 00:26:24,290 --> 00:26:29,030 particular is also able to describe someone on his own watching the children 316 00:26:29,030 --> 00:26:30,030 playing. 317 00:26:32,290 --> 00:26:35,730 Over subsequent days, evidence emerges... 318 00:26:35,980 --> 00:26:38,180 about Caroline being in the company of a man. 319 00:26:38,680 --> 00:26:41,920 And a picture is built up about her potential movements. 320 00:26:42,560 --> 00:26:47,460 There was a description of a girl like Caroline on the promenade, hand in hand 321 00:26:47,460 --> 00:26:49,080 with this scruffy -looking man. 322 00:26:49,360 --> 00:26:53,800 There was a description of Caroline and this scruffy -looking man in the 323 00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:54,800 funfair. 324 00:26:56,160 --> 00:27:00,820 The scruffy man pays for her to go on a ride in the amusement arcade. 325 00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:04,180 And then these sightings stop. 326 00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:08,140 One minute she's there, the next minute she's disappeared. 327 00:27:09,740 --> 00:27:14,220 It's a strange phenomenon, because there were so many people on that promenade 328 00:27:14,220 --> 00:27:18,920 that night who felt they should have seen something significant, all of which 329 00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:22,660 may have been true, and none of which may have been true. 330 00:27:23,940 --> 00:27:27,540 Marion Beck, the four -year -old daughter of one of the policemen hunting 331 00:27:27,540 --> 00:27:29,740 Caroline, retraced the girl's footsteps. 332 00:27:30,460 --> 00:27:34,220 She was dressed identically in an effort to jog the memory of anyone who might 333 00:27:34,220 --> 00:27:36,300 have seen Caroline the night she disappeared. 334 00:27:37,020 --> 00:27:41,220 Police are still appealing to anyone who was at the fair on July the 8th to come 335 00:27:41,220 --> 00:27:45,600 forward. The sightings of the scruffy man were obviously of importance. 336 00:27:46,140 --> 00:27:49,600 Whilst they had a degree of variation between them, there was sufficient 337 00:27:49,600 --> 00:27:53,700 commonality that justified us in putting out one artist's impression. 338 00:28:00,610 --> 00:28:04,530 Enquiries revealed that there was a significant number of people who would 339 00:28:04,530 --> 00:28:08,190 potentially be of interest to us who were present on that day. A surprisingly 340 00:28:08,190 --> 00:28:13,650 large number of people who had convictions for interfering with 341 00:28:13,650 --> 00:28:18,470 indecency offences. What was emerging there was quite a rapidly growing list 342 00:28:18,470 --> 00:28:19,770 potential suspects. 343 00:28:21,830 --> 00:28:25,390 All these people were of incredible interest to us. 344 00:28:25,930 --> 00:28:29,190 The thing is, none of them had transport. They had no mechanism for 345 00:28:29,190 --> 00:28:30,190 Caroline away. 346 00:28:30,550 --> 00:28:34,990 All police leave in Edinburgh has been cancelled and extra men drafted in. Her 347 00:28:34,990 --> 00:28:39,750 disappearance has so shocked the area that 600 volunteers came forward to help 348 00:28:39,750 --> 00:28:40,990 search for the little girl. 349 00:28:41,390 --> 00:28:43,030 Bring her back, whoever has her. 350 00:28:43,810 --> 00:28:48,930 If anybody knows anything at all, just to let the police know. 351 00:28:50,070 --> 00:28:54,650 In 1983, my daughter was four. 352 00:28:55,910 --> 00:29:00,410 It actually alters the way you see things. 353 00:29:00,790 --> 00:29:07,310 Caroline was everybody's child and everybody was hugely concerned about 354 00:29:07,310 --> 00:29:08,310 happened to Caroline. 355 00:29:23,470 --> 00:29:29,330 Caroline's body was found almost 300 miles south of where she had gone 356 00:29:29,430 --> 00:29:34,650 again in a lay -by adjacent to a busy road near the village of Twycross in 357 00:29:34,650 --> 00:29:38,550 Leicestershire. The sad discovery of the body in Leicestershire yesterday 358 00:29:38,550 --> 00:29:43,330 occurred only 30 miles from the Staffordshire lay -by in which 11 -year 359 00:29:43,330 --> 00:29:45,790 Susan Maxwell's body was found last August. 360 00:29:46,070 --> 00:29:49,030 She too had disappeared many miles to the north. 361 00:29:49,630 --> 00:29:52,410 When the body of Caroline was found in Leicestershire, 362 00:29:53,870 --> 00:30:00,050 We knew then this was the same man who had snatched Susie. 363 00:30:01,650 --> 00:30:08,290 Abducted, taken south, deposited in very, very similar places, 364 00:30:08,430 --> 00:30:10,670 just off Main A Road. 365 00:30:11,950 --> 00:30:12,950 Both murdered. 366 00:30:14,350 --> 00:30:19,470 We knew then that we were not only dealing with a travelling sexual 367 00:30:19,710 --> 00:30:22,890 but we were talking about a repeat offender as well. 368 00:30:26,670 --> 00:30:30,910 Now one of Britain's biggest manhunts is on for the man who walked hand in hand 369 00:30:30,910 --> 00:30:35,690 with Caroline Hogg from Portobello in Edinburgh, the same stranger who may 370 00:30:35,690 --> 00:30:40,210 been responsible for the death a year ago of 11 -year -old Susan Maxwell from 371 00:30:40,210 --> 00:30:41,210 North Northumberland. 372 00:30:41,830 --> 00:30:47,130 It was clear from the outset that the best way forward for everybody was for 373 00:30:47,130 --> 00:30:50,950 these two cases to be linked together in terms of a single directed 374 00:30:50,950 --> 00:30:56,050 investigation. The officer who was then appointed to lead the two linked 375 00:30:56,050 --> 00:30:58,090 investigations was Hector Clark. 376 00:30:59,090 --> 00:31:02,950 Hector Clark was the man with an impressive record of solving murders. 377 00:31:03,310 --> 00:31:06,030 He was one that was challenging him. 378 00:31:06,310 --> 00:31:11,410 We would urge people who think they may have some information which will lead us 379 00:31:11,410 --> 00:31:12,710 to this chap to come forward. 380 00:31:13,170 --> 00:31:14,330 Will you catch him? 381 00:31:14,950 --> 00:31:15,950 I think so. 382 00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:24,780 What we knew about this person was that he was a predatory paedophile who 383 00:31:24,780 --> 00:31:26,340 targeted young girls. 384 00:31:27,580 --> 00:31:33,500 He had access to a vehicle. Best chance was a covered vehicle. 385 00:31:33,920 --> 00:31:38,300 They had to have somewhere where he took the child and very quickly hid her from 386 00:31:38,300 --> 00:31:39,300 view. 387 00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:45,220 We were struggling. Fortunately for us, the ghost of the Yorkshire Ripper came 388 00:31:45,220 --> 00:31:46,420 to our assistance because... 389 00:31:46,840 --> 00:31:50,860 The Yorkshire Ripper had been such a catastrophe for policing in the UK. 390 00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:55,120 It was a classic case of very good people but poor systems. 391 00:31:55,500 --> 00:32:00,040 Hector Clarke, as a young detective, had worked on the Yorkshire Ripper cases 392 00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:01,980 and he had the bruises. 393 00:32:03,180 --> 00:32:08,540 He went to see the Chief Constable of Lothian and Borders Police and we had 394 00:32:08,540 --> 00:32:14,580 got a computer system for crime recording and Hector used that computer. 395 00:32:15,290 --> 00:32:19,730 to build the very first major incident index system on it. 396 00:32:20,050 --> 00:32:24,150 Police hunting the killer or killers of Caroline Hogg and Susan Maxwell say they 397 00:32:24,150 --> 00:32:26,110 can avoid the mistake for the Ripper investigation. 398 00:32:26,650 --> 00:32:31,350 I think it's the first time that it's been used in an inquiry involving a 399 00:32:31,350 --> 00:32:32,350 of police forces. 400 00:32:32,610 --> 00:32:36,370 The equipment will enable indexing and cross -referencing to be done 401 00:32:36,370 --> 00:32:38,810 immediately, avoiding mountains of paperwork. 402 00:32:39,270 --> 00:32:43,570 Well, the computer's giving us a technical assistance in a way that we've 403 00:32:43,570 --> 00:32:44,570 had before. 404 00:32:51,340 --> 00:32:55,800 We have forensic examinations being carried out all over the country. We 405 00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:58,940 locations being forensically examined. We've been interviewing people. We've 406 00:32:58,940 --> 00:33:01,080 been tracing suspects. We've been eliminating suspects. 407 00:33:01,340 --> 00:33:05,880 We've been doing pretty much everything that we can between, at that stage, four 408 00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:06,880 forces. 409 00:33:07,300 --> 00:33:11,860 And despite all this effort and the collation of all this information, there 410 00:33:11,860 --> 00:33:16,720 no single strong, viable, sustainable suspect emerging from that. 411 00:33:17,740 --> 00:33:19,580 There was a sense of unease. 412 00:33:20,110 --> 00:33:23,090 that this man was still out there somewhere. 413 00:33:23,390 --> 00:33:24,410 Where was he? 414 00:33:26,450 --> 00:33:32,970 And, of course, unspoken was the fact that he's done this twice, at least. 415 00:33:34,090 --> 00:33:35,190 He'll come back again. 416 00:33:43,370 --> 00:33:47,150 On the 26th of March, 1996... 417 00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:50,500 I received word across the force area that a child had gone missing. 418 00:33:52,460 --> 00:33:54,240 Sarah Jane Harper, she was 10. 419 00:34:08,340 --> 00:34:11,560 She'd gone to the corner shop, which she'd probably done numerous times. 420 00:34:12,120 --> 00:34:15,980 Apart from going for a loaf, she took two empty bottles of pop with her to get 421 00:34:15,980 --> 00:34:19,260 the refund on the bottles, which she'd spend then on sweets. 422 00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:22,880 It's about 100 metres from her home. 423 00:34:23,580 --> 00:34:26,380 She'd go to the corner shop, but she never returns. 424 00:34:27,820 --> 00:34:29,480 So the balloon goes up, as they say. 425 00:34:30,340 --> 00:34:32,880 We've got a young girl missing. Where the hell is she? 426 00:34:36,260 --> 00:34:40,719 I was a police officer at the time that Sarah went missing back in 1986. 427 00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:43,260 Female officers were very much in the minority. 428 00:34:45,420 --> 00:34:51,460 I received a call to say that Sarah had gone missing and that the investigating 429 00:34:51,460 --> 00:34:55,719 officer would like a female police officer from the unit that I was working 430 00:34:55,719 --> 00:34:58,760 to go and work with the family on that inquiry. 431 00:34:59,420 --> 00:35:05,580 And my role was to be a liaison between the family and the investigation team. 432 00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:10,620 Nowadays it's... always the case that a family layers an officer is appointed 433 00:35:10,620 --> 00:35:15,700 whenever anything like that happens but it was probably one of the first times 434 00:35:15,700 --> 00:35:21,640 an officer had worked in that way all i can do really is to be there in case 435 00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:27,860 there is anything that um that she needs sarah's mum was jackie harper It was 436 00:35:27,860 --> 00:35:32,720 very difficult for the family. Jackie was under a great deal of media 437 00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:36,620 which she obviously wasn't used to, police attention, which she wasn't used 438 00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:40,580 This was just an ordinary family living in an ordinary suburb of Leeds and 439 00:35:40,580 --> 00:35:45,320 suddenly thrust into the limelight. The volunteer search parties crowded into a 440 00:35:45,320 --> 00:35:49,560 school playground as the hunts for missing Sarah intensified. They began 441 00:35:49,560 --> 00:35:54,160 in teams under police supervision, concerned for the girls' safety growing 442 00:35:54,160 --> 00:35:55,160 the hour. 443 00:35:58,000 --> 00:36:02,460 I worked at Putsy CID and I was a detective constable in that office. 444 00:36:03,240 --> 00:36:08,460 The local community were devastated, terribly upset, you know, that a young 445 00:36:08,460 --> 00:36:10,680 just walking down the streets had never come back again. 446 00:36:10,900 --> 00:36:15,840 It was just horrendous and lots of people, you know, were helping in the 447 00:36:18,740 --> 00:36:20,800 It was like an invasion. 448 00:36:21,260 --> 00:36:22,680 Officers down every street. 449 00:36:23,260 --> 00:36:25,980 Every grate was lifted, every shed was checked. 450 00:36:26,860 --> 00:36:33,400 We searched 3 ,000 properties, took 1 ,400 witness statements. 451 00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:36,960 That's massive, and it's time -consuming. 452 00:36:38,840 --> 00:36:43,500 Whilst I was inside the house with Jackie and the family, I could sense the 453 00:36:43,500 --> 00:36:44,500 tension outside. 454 00:36:45,280 --> 00:36:48,120 And Jackie could sense that as well. 455 00:36:48,540 --> 00:36:52,140 The only person that can help is the person that's taken her. 456 00:36:52,700 --> 00:36:55,020 Bring her back, let us know where she is. 457 00:37:00,350 --> 00:37:04,650 Every home and every garden will be checked before the operation moves on. 458 00:37:04,950 --> 00:37:06,930 We've turned this place upside down. 459 00:37:07,150 --> 00:37:10,730 We're still doing that, of course, with a lot of houses still to search. 460 00:37:11,370 --> 00:37:12,870 There's not a sighting at all. 461 00:37:16,910 --> 00:37:17,910 Everybody's a suspect. 462 00:37:19,030 --> 00:37:23,610 The main one is the shopkeeper, because that's the last person that saw her. 463 00:37:24,840 --> 00:37:28,840 And we've got to check. And you check the shop, you check the sellers, you 464 00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:30,340 his vehicle, you check everything. 465 00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:32,220 But he's a good witness. 466 00:37:34,260 --> 00:37:38,220 What the shopkeeper could tell us was a man came in behind her. 467 00:37:40,140 --> 00:37:42,320 But he went back out. He didn't buy anything. 468 00:37:42,580 --> 00:37:43,900 A bald -headed man with a beard. 469 00:37:44,540 --> 00:37:47,200 Does anybody know him? Can anybody identify him? 470 00:37:49,220 --> 00:37:50,220 And nobody could. 471 00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:55,940 The murder bureaus were up and running, so you knew about Caroline Org and Susan 472 00:37:55,940 --> 00:37:57,560 Maxwell. Was it connected? 473 00:37:58,000 --> 00:38:02,320 At this moment in time, it'd be very easy to say yes, but the answer was, 474 00:38:02,320 --> 00:38:03,620 dealing with this independently. 475 00:38:03,840 --> 00:38:07,120 You don't assume anything, and you clear the ground beneath your feet. 476 00:38:11,580 --> 00:38:13,340 Sarah should have been safe. 477 00:38:14,520 --> 00:38:18,820 And 99 times out of 100, she would have been. 478 00:38:19,440 --> 00:38:20,920 But on that day... 479 00:38:21,190 --> 00:38:24,290 There was somebody lurking there, waiting to snatch a child. 480 00:38:28,590 --> 00:38:31,870 Sarah was alone, and she got snatched. 481 00:38:40,030 --> 00:38:43,890 Police searchers started near the spot where Sarah was found and worked their 482 00:38:43,890 --> 00:38:47,550 way upstream along the banks of the River Trent. Her body was only partly 483 00:38:47,550 --> 00:38:51,560 closed. They're looking for the shoes, blue anorak and pink corduroy skirt she 484 00:38:51,560 --> 00:38:53,020 was wearing when she was abducted. 485 00:38:53,920 --> 00:38:57,660 After the body of Sarah Harper was found, I was absolutely shocked. 486 00:38:58,520 --> 00:39:03,740 I remember going to the bathroom after we'd had that sort of briefing and 487 00:39:03,740 --> 00:39:08,080 crying. It was just so, so upsetting. And I know quite a lot of my colleagues, 488 00:39:08,300 --> 00:39:12,140 you always put a poker face on for the public, but it was really hard. 489 00:39:14,730 --> 00:39:20,750 She was a very streetwise young girl, Sarah. She was a real little local 490 00:39:20,770 --> 00:39:22,270 She could stand up for herself. 491 00:39:22,850 --> 00:39:26,390 She, quite clearly, had put up a considerable struggle. 492 00:39:27,190 --> 00:39:31,670 When her body was subsequently discovered floating in the River Trent 493 00:39:31,670 --> 00:39:35,770 Nottinghamshire, she too had been forcibly abducted. 494 00:39:36,110 --> 00:39:41,850 She had been restrained. She had been subject to manual strangulation. 495 00:39:44,750 --> 00:39:48,270 We weren't sure where she'd been put in the river, but we knew where she was 496 00:39:48,270 --> 00:39:53,290 found. And where she was found was in fairly close proximity to the other 497 00:39:53,290 --> 00:39:54,290 deposition sites. 498 00:39:54,830 --> 00:39:57,750 Where her body was found was in this triangle. 499 00:39:58,170 --> 00:40:01,130 And we journalists called it the murder triangle. 500 00:40:02,470 --> 00:40:09,190 The next big moment in the story was when Hector Clarke announced that they 501 00:40:09,190 --> 00:40:10,830 linking the three murders. 502 00:40:12,250 --> 00:40:13,310 This was now. 503 00:40:13,740 --> 00:40:14,740 A serial killer. 504 00:40:15,060 --> 00:40:17,080 He's not going to stop at Sarah, is he? 505 00:40:18,880 --> 00:40:20,780 He could be somebody else's child next. 506 00:40:22,700 --> 00:40:24,260 I don't know if he can live with himself. 507 00:40:24,900 --> 00:40:27,800 If he could just see what he was doing to people, he'd not be able to live with 508 00:40:27,800 --> 00:40:28,800 himself. 509 00:40:34,800 --> 00:40:40,640 These combined investigations represented the single biggest serial 510 00:40:40,640 --> 00:40:46,410 investigation. Since the arrest of Peter Sutcliffe, 187 ,000 people being spoken 511 00:40:46,410 --> 00:40:52,570 to, over a quarter of a million vehicle records, 60 ,000 plus formal written 512 00:40:52,570 --> 00:40:56,590 statements from people, which amounted at the end of the day to over 20 tonnes 513 00:40:56,590 --> 00:40:59,030 of material, huge volumes of stuff. 514 00:41:05,110 --> 00:41:10,170 Somewhere in the back of a very twisted mind, he may have wondered that... 515 00:41:11,500 --> 00:41:12,980 events would catch up with him. 516 00:41:15,120 --> 00:41:19,400 I'm sure the killer would have known he'd been hunted. He'd have seen the 517 00:41:19,400 --> 00:41:25,100 reports in the press, on the TV, the description of the person, and I'm sure 518 00:41:25,100 --> 00:41:26,880 he'd look to see if he'd made any mistakes. 519 00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:31,000 And we're waiting for him to make that mistake. 520 00:41:46,510 --> 00:41:49,290 Word came to us that there had been a significant arrest. 521 00:41:50,950 --> 00:41:57,270 Then the extraordinary circumstances of how the man was arrested 522 00:41:57,270 --> 00:41:58,910 were given to us. 523 00:41:59,350 --> 00:42:03,610 In July 1990, he drove his transit van through a village on the Scottish 524 00:42:03,610 --> 00:42:08,150 borders. Here, he abducted a schoolgirl that was spotted and stopped by the 525 00:42:08,150 --> 00:42:09,150 local police. 526 00:42:09,530 --> 00:42:13,890 And this is a child walking down towards the van and then disappearing at sight. 527 00:42:14,650 --> 00:42:18,090 You have this man who is an ordinary member of the public. 528 00:42:18,730 --> 00:42:19,970 He's got his eyes open. 529 00:42:20,170 --> 00:42:23,270 I run into the car and got a pen and paper and looked at the registration. 530 00:42:23,830 --> 00:42:25,390 It's almost stranger than fiction. 531 00:42:25,630 --> 00:42:31,810 The local police officer who is on duty that day steps out and stops the van, 532 00:42:31,970 --> 00:42:33,050 opens it up. 533 00:42:34,730 --> 00:42:40,230 They find what looks like a purpose -built sleeping bag and in that is his 534 00:42:40,230 --> 00:42:41,230 daughter. 535 00:42:42,670 --> 00:42:46,930 A man had been placed into custody and was being taken to a local police 536 00:42:46,930 --> 00:42:47,930 station. 537 00:42:48,910 --> 00:42:55,010 The man arrested was a disgusting pervert with a fixation on young girls. 538 00:42:57,310 --> 00:42:58,430 Robert Black. 539 00:43:07,210 --> 00:43:08,310 I remember 540 00:43:09,100 --> 00:43:15,140 being told by the police the story of how he was arrested and when they found 541 00:43:15,140 --> 00:43:20,260 the little girl in the back of the van how he had treated her. 542 00:43:22,160 --> 00:43:28,300 Almost immediately the police told us that. We were 100 % sure it was Black 543 00:43:28,300 --> 00:43:29,300 murdered Jennifer. 544 00:43:29,940 --> 00:43:36,240 What happened after? 545 00:43:36,860 --> 00:43:41,060 The arrest of Robert Black was even more remarkable than what happened before. 546 00:43:41,320 --> 00:43:47,180 We still have three unsolved significant major child murder inquiries on our 547 00:43:47,180 --> 00:43:48,180 hands. 548 00:43:48,340 --> 00:43:54,060 This could be the most viable suspect that we'd yet seen to date after all 549 00:43:54,060 --> 00:43:55,060 years of investigation. 550 00:43:56,140 --> 00:43:59,180 He wasn't talking. He was admitting nothing. 551 00:43:59,560 --> 00:44:04,220 So how to prove all those years later that he was the man? 552 00:44:04,760 --> 00:44:06,400 who had killed these girls. 553 00:44:08,100 --> 00:44:10,760 This interview has been tape recorded. Robert, could you give me your full 554 00:44:10,780 --> 00:44:11,880 please? Robert Black.