1 00:00:06,485 --> 00:00:09,805 A NETFLIX ORIGINAL DOCUMENTARY SERIES 2 00:00:14,085 --> 00:00:16,325 MOST OF THESE COURT IMAGES HAVE NEVER BEEN BROADCAST. 3 00:00:16,405 --> 00:00:18,805 Please sit down, both the officer and the defendant. 4 00:00:18,965 --> 00:00:24,085 I remember that I was in first grade when the trial started, 5 00:00:24,285 --> 00:00:27,805 so there was the need 6 00:00:28,405 --> 00:00:31,005 to figure out some details 7 00:00:31,085 --> 00:00:35,965 about who really was my biological father, because up until that moment, 8 00:00:36,805 --> 00:00:40,885 I didn't know it and I hadn't cared about it since I was very young. 9 00:00:43,325 --> 00:00:47,965 I remember that the media was at the door to the school. 10 00:00:48,285 --> 00:00:52,565 I left class before the usual end time. I got out through a different door 11 00:00:52,805 --> 00:00:53,765 and I was taken home. 12 00:00:57,605 --> 00:00:59,445 -This man, Miguel Ricart... -Miguel Ricart... 13 00:00:59,525 --> 00:01:00,405 Miguel Ricart... 14 00:01:00,485 --> 00:01:03,765 The first time I saw him, it was on TV, 15 00:01:04,645 --> 00:01:06,565 because every year, 16 00:01:06,645 --> 00:01:11,685 on the anniversary of the girls' death, pictures have always been shown. 17 00:01:15,445 --> 00:01:18,965 It's difficult to explain how I saw my father 18 00:01:19,045 --> 00:01:20,765 when I didn't really know him. 19 00:01:21,725 --> 00:01:27,005 He didn't get old, because I grew up with the same pictures, over and over. 20 00:01:27,925 --> 00:01:30,525 I knew that he was my family, 21 00:01:30,605 --> 00:01:33,325 but I don't feel like 22 00:01:33,405 --> 00:01:36,765 he's a relative, yet he's actually my father. 23 00:01:38,005 --> 00:01:40,605 There are always parallel trials 24 00:01:40,725 --> 00:01:42,885 with those more present in the media. 25 00:01:54,005 --> 00:01:56,325 MONDAY, MAY 12TH, 1997 FIRST SESSION OF MIGUEL RICART'S TRIAL 26 00:01:56,405 --> 00:01:58,685 You'll be now be questioned first by the prosecutor. 27 00:01:58,765 --> 00:02:00,605 POPULAR PROSECUTION CLARA CAMPOAMOR'S GROUP 28 00:02:00,685 --> 00:02:02,805 Then, the private prosecution. 29 00:02:02,885 --> 00:02:04,605 PRIVATE PROSECUTION PARENTS AND COUNSEL 30 00:02:04,685 --> 00:02:06,965 After that, the popular prosecution attorneys. 31 00:02:07,245 --> 00:02:10,525 Then, your defense attorney... 32 00:02:10,605 --> 00:02:11,485 DEFENSE 33 00:02:11,925 --> 00:02:17,685 And I must tell you that you have the constitutional right to remain silent. 34 00:02:18,845 --> 00:02:22,285 The trial is the most important moment of this process. 35 00:02:22,365 --> 00:02:25,205 And you can see there, and not read, or watch on TV... 36 00:02:25,285 --> 00:02:27,045 JOURNALISTS 37 00:02:27,125 --> 00:02:29,245 ...what a particular Civil Guard officer said. 38 00:02:29,325 --> 00:02:32,045 You actually see the Civil Guard before the court, 39 00:02:32,605 --> 00:02:35,805 and you can notice whether that person hesitates, 40 00:02:36,205 --> 00:02:38,285 whether they are telling a coherent narrative, 41 00:02:38,365 --> 00:02:41,725 how Ricart is behaving... The trial is the key to everything. 42 00:02:41,805 --> 00:02:45,005 Sit down at the front. 43 00:02:45,245 --> 00:02:46,805 Officer, help him. 44 00:02:49,245 --> 00:02:51,645 Two days before the trial started, 45 00:02:51,725 --> 00:02:53,845 Fernando García tried to get it canceled. 46 00:02:53,925 --> 00:02:55,285 EX-POLICE INSPECTOR 47 00:02:55,365 --> 00:02:57,405 And a demonstration was held. 48 00:02:57,485 --> 00:02:58,925 JUSTICE FOR TOÑI, MÍRIAM AND DESI 49 00:02:59,005 --> 00:03:00,525 Many people attended. 50 00:03:00,605 --> 00:03:03,205 He led the demonstration hugging people. 51 00:03:03,685 --> 00:03:07,165 That gesture of his that became so popular. 52 00:03:07,245 --> 00:03:08,605 We want justice! 53 00:03:08,685 --> 00:03:09,565 We want justice! 54 00:03:09,645 --> 00:03:12,165 And there was a banner he was very pleased with. 55 00:03:12,365 --> 00:03:13,965 It was repeated all over the place. 56 00:03:14,845 --> 00:03:17,805 "Fernando, you are the rule of law." 57 00:03:17,885 --> 00:03:19,005 FERNANDO IS THE RULE OF LAW 58 00:03:19,085 --> 00:03:20,485 That was terrible. 59 00:03:20,925 --> 00:03:24,405 Just before a trial was going to be held guaranteeing due process, 60 00:03:25,445 --> 00:03:27,925 where a defendant was sitting accused 61 00:03:28,845 --> 00:03:31,445 of kidnapping, raping, 62 00:03:31,965 --> 00:03:33,765 and murdering three girls, 63 00:03:34,525 --> 00:03:38,165 that wasn't democratic or the rule of law for many people. 64 00:03:38,245 --> 00:03:39,405 The rule of law 65 00:03:40,005 --> 00:03:43,125 was what that man alluded to or what the banner was saying 66 00:03:43,205 --> 00:03:44,285 on a show where, 67 00:03:44,805 --> 00:03:46,605 after discussing this topic 68 00:03:47,125 --> 00:03:48,125 there was a man 69 00:03:48,725 --> 00:03:50,885 who hung a bell from his penis 70 00:03:50,965 --> 00:03:52,365 and made it ring. 71 00:03:52,445 --> 00:03:54,485 And that was the great contradiction. 72 00:03:56,965 --> 00:03:58,365 We were so stupefied 73 00:03:59,565 --> 00:04:01,845 that we followed the guidelines given 74 00:04:02,765 --> 00:04:03,805 by these men. 75 00:04:05,525 --> 00:04:08,365 We suggested the cancellation of the trial 76 00:04:08,445 --> 00:04:11,445 because after analyzing the evidence, they show that there were 77 00:04:11,525 --> 00:04:14,285 at least eight persons involved. A white hair and seven hairs 78 00:04:14,645 --> 00:04:17,285 from seven different people. 79 00:04:17,645 --> 00:04:19,565 There's biological evidence 80 00:04:19,645 --> 00:04:22,925 that they were involved in the death of my daughter, Toñi and Desirée. 81 00:04:23,005 --> 00:04:23,845 However, 82 00:04:24,605 --> 00:04:27,885 there is none against Miguel Ricart and Antonio Anglés. 83 00:04:27,965 --> 00:04:30,925 The prosecutor had already submitted his report and conclusions. 84 00:04:31,005 --> 00:04:33,525 GARCIA DOESN'T THINK RICART WAS DIRECTLY INVOLVED IN THE CRIME 85 00:04:33,605 --> 00:04:35,005 And suddenly, something as forceful 86 00:04:35,085 --> 00:04:37,725 as Fernando García saying: 87 00:04:38,005 --> 00:04:40,205 "I doubt that Miguel Ricart was involved." 88 00:04:40,405 --> 00:04:43,445 He didn't even say there was more or less evidence. 89 00:04:43,885 --> 00:04:46,125 He began to doubt that Miguel Ricart was involved at all. 90 00:04:46,765 --> 00:04:47,605 Thanks to everyone. 91 00:04:47,685 --> 00:04:48,725 The sad thing about this 92 00:04:48,805 --> 00:04:51,365 is that I knew the result of the trial before it started. 93 00:04:51,445 --> 00:04:52,965 MÍRIAM'S FATHER 94 00:04:53,045 --> 00:04:56,205 I knew that Miguel Ricart was going to be given a long sentence. 95 00:04:56,285 --> 00:04:57,685 I knew that. 96 00:04:59,005 --> 00:05:01,285 Just as I knew that Ricart hadn't killed my daughter. 97 00:05:01,365 --> 00:05:04,285 I knew the result of the trial from the very first day. 98 00:05:04,845 --> 00:05:05,925 PROVINCIAL COURT 99 00:05:07,965 --> 00:05:11,325 At the first session, there was an attempt at a cancellation or a postponement. 100 00:05:11,885 --> 00:05:16,405 So there was the uncertainty of whether or not the trial would be held. 101 00:05:16,525 --> 00:05:17,565 The situation was 102 00:05:17,885 --> 00:05:21,165 that the expiration of the four years of Ricart's pre-trial detention was close. 103 00:05:21,245 --> 00:05:22,965 CLARA CAMPOAMOR LAWYER 104 00:05:23,045 --> 00:05:24,645 So he was about to be released. 105 00:05:26,485 --> 00:05:28,525 Number two, the trial didn't have to be suspended 106 00:05:28,605 --> 00:05:33,805 because the possibility of an investigation with new facts 107 00:05:33,965 --> 00:05:35,405 had always remained open. 108 00:05:35,485 --> 00:05:39,005 With regard to the cancellation request, the court will not grant it. 109 00:05:39,525 --> 00:05:43,445 The obsession of the parties to raise issues regarding the investigation 110 00:05:43,525 --> 00:05:45,325 is, in my view, totally out of the procedure. 111 00:05:45,405 --> 00:05:46,325 PRIVATE PROSECUTOR 112 00:05:46,405 --> 00:05:49,965 And this court has the obligation to defend the integrity of the procedure, 113 00:05:50,045 --> 00:05:51,605 otherwise, this will never end. 114 00:05:51,685 --> 00:05:55,445 So they did accept the analysis of a few hairs, 115 00:05:55,525 --> 00:05:58,125 but the court said, "This is enough." 116 00:05:58,205 --> 00:06:00,125 And so the trial of the Alcàsser case began. 117 00:06:00,205 --> 00:06:03,365 The defendant may sit at this desk. 118 00:06:04,205 --> 00:06:07,125 Please, officer, set up the microphone. 119 00:06:09,365 --> 00:06:10,725 May it please the court, 120 00:06:10,805 --> 00:06:12,045 the defense said, 121 00:06:12,245 --> 00:06:15,805 and I will just quote the statements... 122 00:06:15,885 --> 00:06:18,005 AFTER THE FIRST ATTEMPT AT CANCELING THE TRIAL, 123 00:06:18,085 --> 00:06:20,725 THE ALLEGED SELF-INCRIMINATION OF RICART PROMPTED A SECOND ONE. 124 00:06:20,805 --> 00:06:22,525 ...determine that these statements 125 00:06:22,605 --> 00:06:24,805 may be deemed totally or partially invalid. 126 00:06:24,885 --> 00:06:27,765 May it please the court, we'd like to support the request of the defense 127 00:06:27,845 --> 00:06:31,845 and weigh whether or not those statements should be deemed invalid. 128 00:06:32,565 --> 00:06:35,325 It was so bizarre that the defense requested 129 00:06:35,405 --> 00:06:37,885 the nullification of Ricart's statements 130 00:06:38,005 --> 00:06:41,085 and the private prosecution supported it. 131 00:06:41,165 --> 00:06:45,605 Both the prosecutor and the judge reacted immediately. 132 00:06:46,085 --> 00:06:49,045 Let's see, if the self-incriminating statements are declared void, 133 00:06:49,125 --> 00:06:51,725 Miguel Ricart can't be questioned at all. 134 00:06:51,805 --> 00:06:53,485 What kind of prosecution are you doing? 135 00:06:53,805 --> 00:06:56,645 May it please the court, I don't know if I've understood this correctly. 136 00:06:56,725 --> 00:06:57,605 CHIEF PROSECUTOR 137 00:06:57,685 --> 00:06:59,485 Is the private prosecution 138 00:06:59,565 --> 00:07:02,045 supporting the request of the defense 139 00:07:02,405 --> 00:07:06,605 to try to declare invalid the statements on the record, 140 00:07:07,005 --> 00:07:09,605 so that only the statements produced here are valid, 141 00:07:09,885 --> 00:07:13,245 considering that Miguel Ricart has initially denied his involvement? 142 00:07:13,485 --> 00:07:17,045 If this is the case, the prosecution does not understand their position. 143 00:07:18,005 --> 00:07:20,005 I would like to make this clear to me. 144 00:07:20,605 --> 00:07:21,725 I find it absurd 145 00:07:22,245 --> 00:07:24,805 that there is a prosecution that is not prosecuting. 146 00:07:25,365 --> 00:07:27,525 The private prosecution was formed... 147 00:07:27,605 --> 00:07:29,285 CHIEF PROSECUTOR 148 00:07:29,365 --> 00:07:31,525 ...by an attorney with a solicitor, 149 00:07:31,605 --> 00:07:34,085 on behalf of Fernando García Mediano. 150 00:07:34,885 --> 00:07:38,205 Someone has informed Fernando García about our way of doing things. 151 00:07:38,445 --> 00:07:40,805 He wanted us to represent the case. 152 00:07:41,525 --> 00:07:44,045 I told him that I wasn't an expert in criminal law, 153 00:07:44,125 --> 00:07:46,245 that I appreciated his trust, 154 00:07:46,325 --> 00:07:49,725 but I could forward him to many of my colleagues. 155 00:07:49,805 --> 00:07:51,165 PRIVATE PROSECUTOR 156 00:07:51,245 --> 00:07:52,885 They insisted that I had to take the case. 157 00:07:52,965 --> 00:07:56,525 Weren't you surprised or puzzled that they wanted you as their attorney? 158 00:07:56,605 --> 00:07:58,365 -It's true that... -No, I mean... 159 00:07:58,445 --> 00:08:02,445 It's remarkable that in probably the case with the biggest media impact in Spain, 160 00:08:02,525 --> 00:08:06,085 one of the attorneys was inexperienced and not a criminal law expert. 161 00:08:06,525 --> 00:08:07,365 Actually, 162 00:08:08,285 --> 00:08:10,965 there was some kind of "psychological blackmail." 163 00:08:11,525 --> 00:08:14,845 My wife was just pregnant with my first child, and I told him 164 00:08:15,085 --> 00:08:17,685 that there were better prepared attorneys to take it. 165 00:08:17,765 --> 00:08:21,365 But he said, "I don't think they're better than you, I think you'll be capable." 166 00:08:21,605 --> 00:08:25,045 And tapping into the emotion of the fact that we were going to be parents, 167 00:08:25,125 --> 00:08:26,125 we were told that, 168 00:08:26,405 --> 00:08:30,285 in that respect, if I were him, 169 00:08:30,605 --> 00:08:33,525 I'd love to take this case myself. 170 00:08:33,605 --> 00:08:35,925 And I think that was what persuaded me. 171 00:08:37,445 --> 00:08:40,285 And this man belonged to the private prosecution, 172 00:08:40,525 --> 00:08:42,885 but his whole procedure acted 173 00:08:43,365 --> 00:08:46,405 in defense of Miguel Ricart. 174 00:08:47,245 --> 00:08:50,805 To him, Miguel Ricart was no more than a servant, 175 00:08:52,285 --> 00:08:53,405 albeit non-uniformed, 176 00:08:53,925 --> 00:08:55,845 of highly prominent 177 00:08:56,285 --> 00:08:58,765 and wealthy figures in Spain. 178 00:08:58,845 --> 00:09:02,405 In my 37 years as a prosecutor, I've never seen anything like this. 179 00:09:02,485 --> 00:09:04,685 HIGH COURT OF JUSTICE VALENCIA 2018 180 00:09:06,165 --> 00:09:08,805 VALENCIA PROVINCIAL COURT 1997 181 00:09:08,885 --> 00:09:12,525 In that session, we found a lot of people who wanted to go in, 182 00:09:13,085 --> 00:09:16,205 people who had slept there to get into the courtroom, 183 00:09:16,285 --> 00:09:20,565 because the courtroom had a limited capacity of around 100 people. 184 00:09:21,125 --> 00:09:22,645 You'll enter in groups of ten. 185 00:09:22,725 --> 00:09:24,245 We are with Fernando! 186 00:09:24,325 --> 00:09:25,605 We are with Fernando! 187 00:09:25,685 --> 00:09:27,405 That was one of the key moments. 188 00:09:27,685 --> 00:09:33,005 I saw a lot of people at the door who wanted to be in the courtroom. 189 00:09:33,885 --> 00:09:35,485 Don't ever give up. 190 00:09:35,565 --> 00:09:38,325 All parents and grandparents are with you. 191 00:09:38,405 --> 00:09:41,045 Don't ever give up until the murderers are found. 192 00:09:41,565 --> 00:09:42,645 That's what we'll do. 193 00:09:42,965 --> 00:09:44,405 I hope it will be canceled. 194 00:09:44,885 --> 00:09:47,325 I followed you since the beginning. I'm with you. 195 00:09:47,405 --> 00:09:49,805 They think that these palaces are theirs. 196 00:09:49,965 --> 00:09:51,605 There were a lot of people 197 00:09:51,685 --> 00:09:54,045 who expected to be there. 198 00:09:54,125 --> 00:09:57,565 They were just waiting for the trial to end 199 00:09:57,645 --> 00:09:59,405 to shake my hand or give me a hug. 200 00:09:59,485 --> 00:10:00,805 You have our full support. 201 00:10:00,885 --> 00:10:02,365 For anything you need. 202 00:10:02,445 --> 00:10:03,285 Cheer up! 203 00:10:03,365 --> 00:10:04,205 Be strong! 204 00:10:04,285 --> 00:10:05,205 Thank you. 205 00:10:06,285 --> 00:10:07,125 Goodbye. 206 00:10:13,525 --> 00:10:16,045 Please, sit down, both the officer and the defendant. 207 00:10:16,125 --> 00:10:17,205 Public hearing. 208 00:10:18,525 --> 00:10:20,005 The defendant is reminded... 209 00:10:20,085 --> 00:10:21,325 MAY 13, 1997 SECOND COURT SESSION 210 00:10:21,405 --> 00:10:25,245 ...of his constitutional right to remain silent if he sees fit. 211 00:10:25,605 --> 00:10:27,805 The prosecutor will begin his interrogation. 212 00:10:28,125 --> 00:10:29,525 May it please the court. 213 00:10:29,605 --> 00:10:33,165 You said that on November 13, 1992, 214 00:10:33,605 --> 00:10:36,405 after having dinner at the Anglés' house, 215 00:10:37,285 --> 00:10:39,605 you went to a club, 216 00:10:39,685 --> 00:10:43,205 found three hitchhiking girls, you invited them in... 217 00:10:43,805 --> 00:10:46,125 That's what the Civil Guard told me, but... 218 00:10:46,605 --> 00:10:49,325 -That's what they told you to say? -Yes. 219 00:10:49,965 --> 00:10:52,005 -And did you or didn't you say it? -What? 220 00:10:52,365 --> 00:10:53,765 -That? -Yes. 221 00:10:54,525 --> 00:10:56,405 If it's written there, I guess I did. 222 00:10:56,485 --> 00:10:59,525 So you said it because the Civil Guard told you to say it. 223 00:11:00,885 --> 00:11:05,005 Because I was threatened and they tortured me. 224 00:11:05,085 --> 00:11:06,245 In front of your lawyer? 225 00:11:06,645 --> 00:11:08,645 No, they didn't beat me in front of her. 226 00:11:08,725 --> 00:11:11,405 But as soon as she left, they beat the shit out of me. 227 00:11:11,485 --> 00:11:14,285 But when your lawyer left, you had already made your statement. 228 00:11:14,365 --> 00:11:15,205 Yes, sure. 229 00:11:15,925 --> 00:11:18,445 So if they beat you after your lawyer left... 230 00:11:18,805 --> 00:11:20,365 At first, before, in the middle... 231 00:11:20,925 --> 00:11:23,005 Okay, at first, before, and in the middle. 232 00:11:23,085 --> 00:11:24,645 Well, not in the middle of it. 233 00:11:24,725 --> 00:11:26,365 Not when my lawyer was present. 234 00:11:27,205 --> 00:11:29,885 The statements by the Civil Guard 235 00:11:31,005 --> 00:11:33,565 are repetitive. It's the same story. 236 00:11:33,645 --> 00:11:35,605 So out of the three statements, 237 00:11:35,765 --> 00:11:39,005 you reject the first two and accept the last one. 238 00:11:40,645 --> 00:11:41,485 Did I say that? 239 00:11:43,205 --> 00:11:45,205 -I don't remember. -Why did you do that 240 00:11:45,485 --> 00:11:47,285 and didn't tell Your Honor and me 241 00:11:48,005 --> 00:11:49,685 that you rejected the three of them, 242 00:11:50,525 --> 00:11:53,005 because you had been tortured during the three of them? 243 00:11:53,085 --> 00:11:55,085 Out of fear that they would hurt my daughter. 244 00:11:56,005 --> 00:11:58,685 Did they tell you that, if you recanted, 245 00:11:59,245 --> 00:12:01,085 something could happen to your daughter? 246 00:12:01,165 --> 00:12:03,045 No, they told me 247 00:12:03,325 --> 00:12:04,885 to do what they said 248 00:12:04,965 --> 00:12:08,125 or my daughter could suffer the same fate as the Alcàsser girls. 249 00:12:08,365 --> 00:12:11,325 -That's exactly what they told me. -The Civil Guard told you that? 250 00:12:11,405 --> 00:12:12,325 Yes, sir. 251 00:12:12,405 --> 00:12:14,205 They gave me the following information: 252 00:12:14,645 --> 00:12:16,405 That there was a bullet in the pit. 253 00:12:16,925 --> 00:12:18,085 I don't believe that. 254 00:12:20,085 --> 00:12:22,525 That the girls were raped in the hut 255 00:12:23,045 --> 00:12:25,805 at Llombai or at La Romana. I don't believe that either. 256 00:12:29,605 --> 00:12:31,685 That the girls were murdered there. 257 00:12:33,005 --> 00:12:34,405 I don't believe that either. 258 00:12:35,165 --> 00:12:38,885 Oh, and they also told me that the girls had marks on their ankles. 259 00:12:41,045 --> 00:12:41,885 That... 260 00:12:42,365 --> 00:12:45,605 and no sticks had been put up the asses, 261 00:12:45,685 --> 00:12:47,365 but they had been fucked in the ass. 262 00:12:47,445 --> 00:12:49,045 That's what you were supposed to say? 263 00:12:49,125 --> 00:12:51,765 -Yes, I was told that in prison. -However... 264 00:12:51,845 --> 00:12:54,165 However, in your statement, you did say 265 00:12:54,605 --> 00:12:56,325 that sticks were inserted. 266 00:12:57,045 --> 00:12:57,885 Why? 267 00:12:58,365 --> 00:13:02,925 Mr. Prosecutor, you are talking about the statement before the judge in Alzira. 268 00:13:03,005 --> 00:13:05,525 -The second one in Alzira. -The second one. 269 00:13:05,605 --> 00:13:08,805 They told me there that nothing had been inserted up their ass. 270 00:13:09,325 --> 00:13:12,205 That's what the Civil Guard told you that you had to say? 271 00:13:12,685 --> 00:13:13,525 Yes. 272 00:13:13,605 --> 00:13:15,085 Yet, you didn't say that. 273 00:13:15,405 --> 00:13:17,205 You said that sticks were inserted. 274 00:13:17,485 --> 00:13:20,005 Well, maybe I was wrong. 275 00:13:20,085 --> 00:13:21,445 -Maybe you were wrong. -Yes. 276 00:13:22,245 --> 00:13:23,085 Okay. 277 00:13:23,165 --> 00:13:24,325 Listen, Mr. Prosecutor, 278 00:13:24,405 --> 00:13:26,805 if I receive death threats, what do you want me to do? 279 00:13:27,485 --> 00:13:29,645 Let's get right down to it. 280 00:13:30,205 --> 00:13:31,965 I don't care what's written there. 281 00:13:32,045 --> 00:13:35,445 What I'm trying to say, Mr. Enrique, is that they put in jail, 282 00:13:36,045 --> 00:13:37,045 whoever did this, 283 00:13:37,245 --> 00:13:39,685 and I don't want them to use me as a scapegoat. 284 00:13:40,045 --> 00:13:41,885 Don't use me as a scapegoat. 285 00:13:41,965 --> 00:13:44,605 But I'm not saying that justice is using me as a scapegoat, 286 00:13:44,685 --> 00:13:47,645 but some senior members of the Civil Guard before justice. 287 00:13:47,725 --> 00:13:49,205 But it looks like you 288 00:13:49,405 --> 00:13:51,525 are only scared at some moments. 289 00:13:51,605 --> 00:13:52,765 So you're saying 290 00:13:52,845 --> 00:13:54,965 that something should happen to my daughter 291 00:13:55,045 --> 00:13:56,645 -for it to be true? -No, God forbid. 292 00:13:56,725 --> 00:13:59,285 -Thank you very much. -I'm not saying nor thinking that. 293 00:13:59,405 --> 00:14:01,165 -Thank you very much. -What I am saying 294 00:14:01,245 --> 00:14:04,525 is that you have moments of fear of what may happen to your daughter... 295 00:14:04,605 --> 00:14:07,325 So you want to me to take the rap? 296 00:14:07,405 --> 00:14:08,685 I'm not saying this. 297 00:14:08,765 --> 00:14:10,045 What I'm saying is that, 298 00:14:10,485 --> 00:14:12,605 if you are in constant fear, 299 00:14:12,885 --> 00:14:16,605 I wonder why there are statements where you say, "I didn't do anything." 300 00:14:17,085 --> 00:14:20,285 Did your fear just vanish when you deny it? 301 00:14:20,365 --> 00:14:22,125 -Not at all. -For example, right now. 302 00:14:22,205 --> 00:14:23,485 Aren't you afraid now? 303 00:14:23,925 --> 00:14:25,805 No, of course I am. 304 00:14:26,365 --> 00:14:28,045 Okay, you answered my question. 305 00:14:28,125 --> 00:14:32,605 Finally, in this statement you say that Antonio Anglés 306 00:14:32,685 --> 00:14:35,565 had told you on many occasions that he wanted 307 00:14:35,805 --> 00:14:37,685 to get some girls 308 00:14:37,925 --> 00:14:41,245 and do with them whatever he wanted, meaning atrocities. 309 00:14:41,685 --> 00:14:46,805 Is it true that Antonio Anglés told you he wanted to commit atrocities with girls? 310 00:14:47,245 --> 00:14:49,285 -Yes, and... -It is true. 311 00:14:49,725 --> 00:14:53,325 And Mauricio was present, too. I told him I didn't want to do such things. 312 00:14:53,405 --> 00:14:54,565 Very well. 313 00:14:54,645 --> 00:14:56,765 Mauricio said that I was a pussy. 314 00:14:57,325 --> 00:14:58,725 -A...? -Pussy. 315 00:14:59,685 --> 00:15:01,045 -A coward. -Okay, okay. 316 00:15:02,325 --> 00:15:04,405 After the people saw Ricart's statement, 317 00:15:04,805 --> 00:15:05,725 when we left, 318 00:15:07,045 --> 00:15:12,005 some of them came to us, journalists who had come from Seville, Barcelona, 319 00:15:12,525 --> 00:15:14,445 and they said, "Gosh, you're right." 320 00:15:14,525 --> 00:15:16,205 And as soon as they said-- 321 00:15:16,285 --> 00:15:18,445 I'm getting goosebumps right now. 322 00:15:18,765 --> 00:15:19,965 As soon as they said that, 323 00:15:20,365 --> 00:15:23,125 and all that pressure we had built up 324 00:15:23,525 --> 00:15:27,205 after hours of TV stuff, the phone calls, 325 00:15:27,285 --> 00:15:31,005 all the people around you saying, "How are you saying that?" 326 00:15:31,085 --> 00:15:34,805 They looked at you in a weird way as if we were involved in the case, too. 327 00:15:34,885 --> 00:15:38,725 Then everything came out and I started to cry foolishly, 328 00:15:39,125 --> 00:15:41,725 because it had been very hard for us. 329 00:15:41,805 --> 00:15:43,965 From that moment on, the media started to... 330 00:15:44,045 --> 00:15:47,485 El Periódico de Catalunya created the "counter-trial," 331 00:15:47,565 --> 00:15:51,525 a section where they contrasted how the same witnesses 332 00:15:51,605 --> 00:15:53,725 said different things on TV and in court. 333 00:15:53,805 --> 00:15:56,125 RICART CRACKED IN FRONT OF THE FORENSIC DOCTORS 334 00:15:56,205 --> 00:15:57,805 So everything started to change. 335 00:15:58,485 --> 00:16:02,125 The Alcàsser trial had an unprecedented TV following in Spain. 336 00:16:02,205 --> 00:16:06,605 Over the 48 sessions, two TV shows followed it in the afternoon and evening. 337 00:16:06,685 --> 00:16:08,725 10:00 A.M. - ORAL HEARING 338 00:16:08,805 --> 00:16:11,165 6:00 P.M. - THE ALCÀSSER CASE 339 00:16:11,245 --> 00:16:14,725 10:00 P.M. TONIGHT WE CROSS THE MISSISSIPPI 340 00:16:19,845 --> 00:16:22,765 Both shows shared content and people with the public hearings. 341 00:16:22,845 --> 00:16:28,605 This was the first real trial by media in Spanish history. 342 00:16:35,085 --> 00:16:37,525 On the fourth day of the trial of the Alcàsser crime, 343 00:16:37,605 --> 00:16:39,925 many questions around the case are still unanswered. 344 00:16:40,005 --> 00:16:41,805 MAY 15, 1997 TRIAL'S FOURTH SESSION 345 00:16:41,885 --> 00:16:44,605 Up next, you'll be questioned 346 00:16:44,965 --> 00:16:48,445 by the attorney for the popular prosecution. 347 00:16:48,525 --> 00:16:50,205 May it please the court. 348 00:16:51,325 --> 00:16:52,485 In your... 349 00:16:52,885 --> 00:16:54,365 Your Honor. 350 00:16:54,445 --> 00:16:58,205 I will not answer the questions of the popular prosecution's attorney. 351 00:16:58,285 --> 00:17:00,285 You don't want to answer his questions? 352 00:17:00,365 --> 00:17:01,845 I won't answer, Your Honor. 353 00:17:01,925 --> 00:17:06,205 Ricart replied to all the parties but us, 354 00:17:06,885 --> 00:17:08,085 the popular prosecution. 355 00:17:08,685 --> 00:17:11,525 I wanted to put on record all the questions 356 00:17:11,605 --> 00:17:12,965 I would have asked 357 00:17:13,045 --> 00:17:15,485 in case he had wanted to answer them. 358 00:17:16,045 --> 00:17:20,845 Virgilio, in a very monotonous but forceful tone, 359 00:17:20,925 --> 00:17:23,365 began to read those questions. 360 00:17:23,845 --> 00:17:26,325 "Is it true that...?" And Miguel Ricart 361 00:17:26,525 --> 00:17:29,765 was getting angrier by the moment, because he listened to each atrocity, 362 00:17:29,845 --> 00:17:30,885 but he didn't answer. 363 00:17:30,965 --> 00:17:33,405 You said that you made this statement 364 00:17:33,485 --> 00:17:36,485 after having received a visit from the Civil Guard, 365 00:17:36,565 --> 00:17:39,605 when you were informed of the facts that you had to tell. 366 00:17:39,685 --> 00:17:40,685 I ask you: 367 00:17:40,765 --> 00:17:43,645 Did they tell you that when you stopped your car, 368 00:17:44,285 --> 00:17:46,525 the five of you walked in a single line? 369 00:17:56,005 --> 00:17:57,365 Did they also tell you that, 370 00:17:57,725 --> 00:18:00,925 when the girls protested and wanted to leave, 371 00:18:01,005 --> 00:18:04,245 Antonio began to beat Míriam and Desirée furiously 372 00:18:04,965 --> 00:18:06,045 with a stick 373 00:18:06,845 --> 00:18:09,245 while they were tied to a post? 374 00:18:10,925 --> 00:18:13,125 Did they also tell you that you had to say 375 00:18:13,285 --> 00:18:19,005 that when Antonio inserted his penis into Antonia's vagina, 376 00:18:19,685 --> 00:18:22,725 she showed signs of pain caused by the penetration? 377 00:18:25,565 --> 00:18:28,205 Did they also tell you or did they suggest 378 00:18:28,605 --> 00:18:30,565 or threaten you so that you said 379 00:18:30,645 --> 00:18:33,085 that this event took ten minutes? 380 00:18:39,005 --> 00:18:40,885 Did the Civil Guard tell you to say 381 00:18:40,965 --> 00:18:44,605 that you held the girls by their ankles 382 00:18:44,685 --> 00:18:47,165 while Antonio raped them? 383 00:18:47,365 --> 00:18:51,805 Do you know that this was known only after Dr. Frontela's autopsy? 384 00:18:52,405 --> 00:18:56,405 And do you know that an autopsy was performed in August 1994, 385 00:18:56,605 --> 00:18:59,405 a year after your statement? 386 00:18:59,485 --> 00:19:02,685 How could you know that if you hadn't been involved 387 00:19:03,645 --> 00:19:05,925 precisely by grabbing the girls 388 00:19:06,565 --> 00:19:07,605 by their ankles 389 00:19:08,245 --> 00:19:11,085 while Antonio Anglés raped them? 390 00:19:17,325 --> 00:19:21,285 And how is it possible that the Civil Guard let you know all this, 391 00:19:21,845 --> 00:19:23,765 and yet the most noticeable fact 392 00:19:24,245 --> 00:19:27,325 and the easiest to detect, 393 00:19:27,405 --> 00:19:29,245 which was the ripping off of the nipple, 394 00:19:30,485 --> 00:19:31,845 you said that you ignored 395 00:19:33,165 --> 00:19:35,725 anything related to that event? 396 00:19:39,805 --> 00:19:42,045 Did you rip off Desirée's nipple? 397 00:19:44,685 --> 00:19:45,925 And I'm asking you this, 398 00:19:46,485 --> 00:19:48,605 because in all your statements, 399 00:19:48,845 --> 00:19:53,805 you only acknowledge that you had contact with Desirée. 400 00:19:54,525 --> 00:19:56,005 Why with Desirée? I insist. 401 00:19:56,445 --> 00:20:00,125 Did you rip off her nipple 402 00:20:00,565 --> 00:20:01,805 with a pair of pliers? 403 00:20:05,045 --> 00:20:07,645 A big part of the list of questions, 404 00:20:07,725 --> 00:20:10,645 I don't know if there were 100, 150, 80... 405 00:20:10,725 --> 00:20:13,885 They were all intended to highlight 406 00:20:15,645 --> 00:20:17,645 how his argument 407 00:20:18,005 --> 00:20:22,485 that his statement had been coerced through torture or threats 408 00:20:22,765 --> 00:20:25,445 was inconsistent. 409 00:20:26,285 --> 00:20:29,885 HIGH COURT OF JUSTICE VALENCIA 2018 410 00:20:29,965 --> 00:20:32,125 FORENSIC CLINIC 411 00:20:32,205 --> 00:20:36,525 VALENCIA PROVINCIAL COURT 1997 412 00:20:40,845 --> 00:20:45,645 MAY 30, 1997 14TH SESSION OF THE TRIAL 413 00:20:45,725 --> 00:20:48,085 Manuel Fenollosa González, forensic doctor. 414 00:20:48,565 --> 00:20:51,805 Francisco Ros Plaza, forensic doctor. 415 00:20:51,885 --> 00:20:55,285 Please explain the physical examination of the defendant that you performed. 416 00:20:55,365 --> 00:20:57,285 It was a common chemical examination. 417 00:20:57,645 --> 00:21:01,805 Were you able to notice any kind of sign 418 00:21:02,165 --> 00:21:04,245 on the defendant's body 419 00:21:04,325 --> 00:21:05,885 that could make you think... 420 00:21:07,005 --> 00:21:08,165 of any... 421 00:21:09,405 --> 00:21:12,445 of any non-accidental injuries? 422 00:21:13,085 --> 00:21:13,925 Not at all. 423 00:21:14,845 --> 00:21:17,765 -Did he have any marks on his body? -Not at all. 424 00:21:18,325 --> 00:21:20,085 -Of any kind? -Of any kind. 425 00:21:21,165 --> 00:21:23,885 Can you guarantee that the defendant 426 00:21:24,365 --> 00:21:27,445 didn't have any mark, particularly on his forehead? 427 00:21:27,525 --> 00:21:31,445 In the examination I performed on January 31, 1993, 428 00:21:31,845 --> 00:21:32,845 not at all. 429 00:21:33,365 --> 00:21:34,405 He didn't have any. 430 00:21:38,925 --> 00:21:41,805 The impression that he gave at the trial was 431 00:21:41,925 --> 00:21:44,245 that he was staging everything 432 00:21:44,325 --> 00:21:45,965 because he already knew the results 433 00:21:46,045 --> 00:21:47,965 of that examination by the forensic experts 434 00:21:48,045 --> 00:21:49,925 and he knew what they'd say. 435 00:21:50,205 --> 00:21:56,605 So, as is common, he was displaying gestures of disapproval 436 00:21:56,885 --> 00:21:57,885 as a way to reject 437 00:21:58,645 --> 00:22:00,925 what the experts are saying, 438 00:22:01,005 --> 00:22:02,365 or to call them into question. 439 00:22:02,965 --> 00:22:05,565 If you're hearing something that isn't true, 440 00:22:06,125 --> 00:22:07,725 according to what you believe is true... 441 00:22:07,805 --> 00:22:08,725 RICART'S DEFENSE LAWYER 442 00:22:08,805 --> 00:22:11,765 ...and you can't reply, would you be desperate or happy? 443 00:22:12,245 --> 00:22:15,405 -Why did you get emotional, Miguel? -I wasn't emotional. I was pissed. 444 00:22:16,405 --> 00:22:21,125 In the examination I performed on January 31, 1993, not at all. 445 00:22:21,205 --> 00:22:25,405 This completely refutes Miguel Ricart's only remaining argument, 446 00:22:25,485 --> 00:22:28,605 because it categorically and officially refutes 447 00:22:28,925 --> 00:22:31,245 the claim that he had any signs of violence. 448 00:22:31,325 --> 00:22:35,885 I was there today. I saw these two forensic experts. 449 00:22:36,885 --> 00:22:38,965 And I thought they were pathetic. 450 00:22:39,045 --> 00:22:43,245 Even my family asks me why I seem to be interested in exonerating Ricart, 451 00:22:43,605 --> 00:22:47,605 and my only explanation is that Ricart didn't kill my daughter. 452 00:22:48,445 --> 00:22:50,285 Ricart is not my daughter's murderer 453 00:22:50,365 --> 00:22:52,365 and it's being proven. 454 00:22:52,605 --> 00:22:56,005 But there are people like Jerónimo, who makes evidence out of a silly thing. 455 00:22:56,085 --> 00:22:57,925 I'm respecting you, Fernando, 456 00:22:58,365 --> 00:23:00,165 but I see it's not being reciprocated. 457 00:23:00,245 --> 00:23:04,165 I'm not saying silly things and I ask you not to talk to me like that. 458 00:23:04,245 --> 00:23:06,645 -No, you say a lot of them. -Well, I think... 459 00:23:06,725 --> 00:23:08,645 And every time you say one, I'll tell you. 460 00:23:08,725 --> 00:23:12,365 Fernando, defending personal insults 461 00:23:13,085 --> 00:23:15,045 is something I'm not interested in at all. 462 00:23:15,245 --> 00:23:17,605 -That's your problem. -I have my own way of behaving. 463 00:23:17,685 --> 00:23:19,725 That's your problem. Anytime someone attacks me, 464 00:23:19,805 --> 00:23:21,885 -I'll reply with words. -I'm not attacking you. 465 00:23:21,965 --> 00:23:24,085 You can say whatever you think is right. 466 00:23:24,405 --> 00:23:27,365 But I'm just commenting on what an expert in this area said. 467 00:23:27,445 --> 00:23:28,965 EX-POLICE AND JOURNALIST 468 00:23:29,045 --> 00:23:30,645 Confronting Fernando back then 469 00:23:30,725 --> 00:23:33,685 brought with it immediate consequences. 470 00:23:35,565 --> 00:23:36,845 I walked down the street, 471 00:23:37,205 --> 00:23:39,405 and there was some deranged person 472 00:23:40,045 --> 00:23:42,485 who would just insult me. 473 00:23:42,565 --> 00:23:44,565 When I got out of the car 474 00:23:44,645 --> 00:23:46,725 to go to the court 475 00:23:47,045 --> 00:23:49,685 to see the trial, 476 00:23:49,765 --> 00:23:53,085 there were 40 or 50 deranged people calling me a murderer. 477 00:23:53,685 --> 00:23:55,205 Fernando, you're great! 478 00:23:55,285 --> 00:23:58,805 If I contradicted their beloved leader, I was called a murderer. 479 00:23:58,885 --> 00:24:00,765 Fernando, Fernando! 480 00:24:00,845 --> 00:24:02,125 Fernando, Fernando! 481 00:24:02,205 --> 00:24:04,005 Fernando, Fernando! 482 00:24:04,085 --> 00:24:06,805 Fernando, Fernando! 483 00:24:06,885 --> 00:24:10,605 We're giving you a lot of strength so that God gives you light. 484 00:24:11,805 --> 00:24:15,405 This is an injustice, and the real murderers will come out. 485 00:24:15,485 --> 00:24:19,125 There were people who said, "You must be well paid to cover this up, 486 00:24:19,205 --> 00:24:22,405 to cover up these murderers." I was frozen. 487 00:24:22,485 --> 00:24:23,925 10:00 ORAL HEARING 488 00:24:24,005 --> 00:24:27,045 They came from El Mississippi, they made a speech 489 00:24:28,325 --> 00:24:31,645 that was brutal, saying it was all fixed. 490 00:24:31,725 --> 00:24:32,805 Everything was a setup. 491 00:24:32,885 --> 00:24:33,805 They're hiding things. 492 00:24:33,885 --> 00:24:35,925 I think it is extremely abhorrent. 493 00:24:36,005 --> 00:24:37,245 And no one answered to that. 494 00:24:37,765 --> 00:24:39,805 But then, when they came here, 495 00:24:40,565 --> 00:24:42,325 and we began to argue, 496 00:24:42,405 --> 00:24:43,805 and we said, "Well, no, this... 497 00:24:43,885 --> 00:24:44,725 EL JUI'S SET 498 00:24:44,805 --> 00:24:47,245 ...Juan Ignacio, there are two possibilities. 499 00:24:47,325 --> 00:24:49,485 Either you're wrong or you're right. 500 00:24:50,165 --> 00:24:53,645 And since you have that paper there that I saw, you're lying." 501 00:24:53,725 --> 00:24:56,325 The warrant to search the Anglés' house 502 00:24:56,965 --> 00:25:00,085 is dated 1991. 503 00:25:00,165 --> 00:25:02,085 That's the first point, it's not dated. 504 00:25:02,165 --> 00:25:03,645 It wasn't signed by the judge 505 00:25:03,725 --> 00:25:06,445 and it is recorded like this in the case file, the warrant is here. 506 00:25:06,525 --> 00:25:09,965 No, no, Juan Ignacio, I'm asking you to explain this correctly. 507 00:25:10,125 --> 00:25:14,005 -No, I'm explaining it very well. -The warrant to search his house. 508 00:25:14,485 --> 00:25:15,725 -1991. -Excuse me, 509 00:25:15,805 --> 00:25:18,165 and then, with a pen, 510 00:25:18,285 --> 00:25:20,725 the number was written on top. Come on, show it. 511 00:25:20,885 --> 00:25:22,525 Show it to the camera. 512 00:25:22,605 --> 00:25:25,685 And about the judge's signature, there's no doubt about it. 513 00:25:25,765 --> 00:25:26,765 This is the warrant. 514 00:25:27,525 --> 00:25:31,245 I'd like to show it to the camera to check if it's there or not. 515 00:25:31,325 --> 00:25:33,805 No, sorry, but show the second page. 516 00:25:33,885 --> 00:25:37,645 -There are no more pages. Page six. -Show the second page. 517 00:25:37,725 --> 00:25:39,485 Show it, that's just the first page! 518 00:25:40,005 --> 00:25:41,245 That's the sixth page. 519 00:25:42,045 --> 00:25:45,525 This is the next page, so you can see it clearly. 520 00:25:45,765 --> 00:25:49,285 It is recorded. There wasn't a second page on the warrant to search the house. 521 00:25:49,365 --> 00:25:51,725 The judge didn't sign and it isn't dated. 522 00:25:51,925 --> 00:25:54,125 That's true and it's been proven. 523 00:25:54,205 --> 00:25:56,725 On the last show, we had a small argument 524 00:25:56,805 --> 00:25:59,165 about the warrant. Particularly Juan Ignacio. 525 00:25:59,245 --> 00:26:00,405 THREE DAYS LATER 526 00:26:00,485 --> 00:26:04,325 He questioned the legal validity of the warrant, 527 00:26:04,965 --> 00:26:07,205 one of Juan Ignacio Blanco's usual tactics. 528 00:26:07,285 --> 00:26:11,245 He only showed the first page on that lectern, and he said 529 00:26:11,645 --> 00:26:14,245 that the warrant was irregular. 530 00:26:14,805 --> 00:26:17,005 I must publicly say 531 00:26:17,085 --> 00:26:21,405 that this wasn't a mistake, but a lie by Juan Ignacio Blanco, 532 00:26:22,405 --> 00:26:23,525 who the other day showed 533 00:26:25,045 --> 00:26:25,885 this warrant... 534 00:26:26,325 --> 00:26:29,285 -It's not dated. -...but avoided, as I requested of him, 535 00:26:30,205 --> 00:26:32,725 to show the following page, where it says: 536 00:26:32,965 --> 00:26:36,005 "Catarroja, January 27, 1993." 537 00:26:36,605 --> 00:26:39,085 Signed by the judge and the secretary. 538 00:26:39,165 --> 00:26:43,525 This matter is serious, in my opinion, because it isn't just any manipulation 539 00:26:43,605 --> 00:26:46,405 we're used to seeing, but it's an outright lie, 540 00:26:47,405 --> 00:26:50,325 and quite an obvious one. 541 00:26:50,405 --> 00:26:53,325 But I insist that I asked you repeatedly to show this page. 542 00:26:53,645 --> 00:26:56,405 You said that it didn't exist. I think this is immoral. 543 00:26:56,485 --> 00:26:59,525 -If it had been dated in 1991... -I think you haven't read it. 544 00:26:59,605 --> 00:27:01,645 -I've read everything. -Or maybe you forgot. 545 00:27:01,725 --> 00:27:06,005 Here, it says, "Catarroja, January 27, 1993." 546 00:27:06,085 --> 00:27:08,325 -Yes, but that's at the end. -Here. Here. 547 00:27:08,405 --> 00:27:12,085 And hadn't that document been previously dated on 1991? 548 00:27:12,165 --> 00:27:15,285 Let's work with some honesty here. 549 00:27:15,365 --> 00:27:18,405 -I've been demanding that for four years. -Let's put some order here. 550 00:27:18,485 --> 00:27:20,285 -Let's do it together. -It's what I demand. 551 00:27:20,365 --> 00:27:21,765 -Let's do it. -Let's remember... 552 00:27:24,165 --> 00:27:26,805 Ricart said in one of his statements, 553 00:27:26,885 --> 00:27:30,925 that after taking the girls to the hut in La Romana 554 00:27:31,365 --> 00:27:35,205 and raping two of them, that Antonio was hungry 555 00:27:35,285 --> 00:27:38,405 and decided to go to a bar to grab some sandwiches. 556 00:27:43,805 --> 00:27:47,125 The first populated place with a bar is the crossroads at Catadau. 557 00:27:47,205 --> 00:27:49,725 According to the owners of this bar, 558 00:27:49,805 --> 00:27:54,605 Antonio Anglés and Miguel Ricart bought three sandwiches and two drinks. 559 00:27:56,085 --> 00:27:57,645 Do you know who these persons are? 560 00:27:58,045 --> 00:28:00,045 Yes, Miguel Ricart and Antonio Anglés. 561 00:28:00,125 --> 00:28:00,965 Are you sure? 562 00:28:01,045 --> 00:28:03,205 Yes, yes. They came to grab some sandwiches. 563 00:28:03,285 --> 00:28:04,845 Miguel Ricart entered the bar. 564 00:28:04,925 --> 00:28:08,285 -Miguel Ricart and Antonio Anglés? -No, Antonio Anglés didn't enter. 565 00:28:08,365 --> 00:28:10,005 So the only one who entered was Ricart. 566 00:28:10,085 --> 00:28:11,085 10TH SESSION MAY 26, 1997 567 00:28:11,165 --> 00:28:14,125 -Did you see any people outside? -No. I couldn't say who they were. 568 00:28:14,205 --> 00:28:17,085 -Do you know if they were in a car? -Yes, they were in a car outside. 569 00:28:17,285 --> 00:28:20,725 Arturo, you said that the person in question stayed in the car 570 00:28:20,805 --> 00:28:24,485 and you, Ana, said that this person was standing by a palm tree. 571 00:28:24,845 --> 00:28:26,445 Yes, he was two meters away. 572 00:28:26,525 --> 00:28:27,965 Was Antonio Anglés that person? 573 00:28:28,045 --> 00:28:29,005 No. 574 00:28:29,085 --> 00:28:30,365 He wasn't Antonio Anglés. 575 00:28:30,445 --> 00:28:33,925 No, because Antonio was very tall and that boy was a bit shorter. 576 00:28:34,005 --> 00:28:37,005 You said at the trial today that he resembled Mauri a lot. 577 00:28:37,685 --> 00:28:41,525 Yes, but I'm not certain whether that was Mauri or some other boy. 578 00:28:42,165 --> 00:28:44,405 What is particularly strong, 579 00:28:44,485 --> 00:28:47,685 and this is one of the questions Miguel Ricart was asked at the trial, 580 00:28:47,845 --> 00:28:49,805 is who that third sandwich was for. 581 00:28:49,885 --> 00:28:53,045 In your statement, you said two. 582 00:28:53,405 --> 00:28:56,925 The day of your statement before the prosecutor, you said three. 583 00:28:57,005 --> 00:28:59,765 Do you know that the bar owners 584 00:28:59,925 --> 00:29:02,685 said that it was three sandwiches and not two? 585 00:29:02,765 --> 00:29:04,085 And if there were three, 586 00:29:04,805 --> 00:29:06,125 who was the third one for? 587 00:29:12,845 --> 00:29:15,925 -Mauricio, do you have anything to say? -Not now. I will talk later. 588 00:29:16,005 --> 00:29:17,765 MAY 21, 1997 EIGHTH SESSION OF THE TRIAL 589 00:29:17,845 --> 00:29:19,725 Mauricio Anglés Martins. 590 00:29:26,165 --> 00:29:27,445 You said earlier 591 00:29:27,525 --> 00:29:30,205 that Miguel and Antonio used to take girls 592 00:29:30,285 --> 00:29:31,125 to the hut. 593 00:29:31,205 --> 00:29:32,845 Did you ever hear 594 00:29:32,925 --> 00:29:35,565 Miguel or your brother make any comments like this: 595 00:29:36,005 --> 00:29:39,285 "Why don't we go and take some girls, 596 00:29:40,325 --> 00:29:43,005 have a blast and then kill them?" 597 00:29:43,085 --> 00:29:45,925 My brother Antonio did say such a thing. 598 00:29:46,045 --> 00:29:48,485 -And what did he say in that comment? -He said that... 599 00:29:49,805 --> 00:29:50,885 some girls and stuff... 600 00:29:50,965 --> 00:29:52,805 I don't know, his remark was very... 601 00:29:53,925 --> 00:29:57,325 -disgusting. -Say it to us, because it's of interest. 602 00:29:57,405 --> 00:30:00,605 "Let's take three girls and it would be cool..." 603 00:30:00,885 --> 00:30:02,005 A comment like that. 604 00:30:02,245 --> 00:30:05,965 Miguel from Llíria... And I told him that that was crazy. 605 00:30:06,405 --> 00:30:10,565 No way. Because we just had passed 606 00:30:10,845 --> 00:30:14,005 by three girls on our way 607 00:30:14,325 --> 00:30:16,325 who were hitchhiking, I remember. 608 00:30:16,965 --> 00:30:19,365 And my brother made a comment like... 609 00:30:20,405 --> 00:30:23,805 And Miguel from Llíria, and I told him... 610 00:30:24,165 --> 00:30:28,285 Have you ever been to the huts with girls? 611 00:30:29,085 --> 00:30:30,165 -No. -Never? 612 00:30:30,245 --> 00:30:31,085 Never. 613 00:30:31,405 --> 00:30:33,405 I want to ask you one last question. 614 00:30:34,125 --> 00:30:35,245 In the deaths 615 00:30:36,005 --> 00:30:37,925 of the three Alcàsser girls, 616 00:30:38,125 --> 00:30:40,285 in their previous kidnapping, 617 00:30:40,365 --> 00:30:42,525 and in any actions against 618 00:30:42,605 --> 00:30:45,605 their sexual liberty that may have taken place, 619 00:30:45,885 --> 00:30:48,085 were you involved in any way? 620 00:30:48,165 --> 00:30:49,005 No. 621 00:30:49,245 --> 00:30:51,765 I'm tired of saying it. No, no and no. 622 00:30:51,845 --> 00:30:53,205 No more questions, Your Honor. 623 00:30:53,285 --> 00:30:56,085 If Mauricio Anglés was the third person, 624 00:30:56,165 --> 00:30:58,845 this would be a national scandal, 625 00:30:58,925 --> 00:31:05,205 because if they couldn't determine Mauricio's involvement after four years, 626 00:31:06,085 --> 00:31:09,685 I think this is a little bit embarrassing. 627 00:31:10,365 --> 00:31:12,965 Mauricio Anglés and Fernando García in each other's arms. 628 00:31:13,045 --> 00:31:17,205 An unpredictable image that could be seen in front of the court doors. 629 00:31:17,285 --> 00:31:18,325 See you later. 630 00:31:20,645 --> 00:31:22,165 -Help him. -I know. 631 00:31:24,445 --> 00:31:28,005 There you go, Mauricio, why did you make that movement right after that? 632 00:31:28,405 --> 00:31:29,325 Why that gesture? 633 00:31:29,405 --> 00:31:33,325 Because I saw that Fernando was touched, 634 00:31:33,845 --> 00:31:35,485 and I got emotional, too. 635 00:31:37,365 --> 00:31:40,845 Fernando, what did you and Mauricio talk about? 636 00:31:41,405 --> 00:31:43,845 We barely talked, he just said hello. 637 00:31:45,485 --> 00:31:49,885 I think he's also a person, so why shouldn't I shake hands with him? 638 00:31:50,765 --> 00:31:53,805 I think he said something like "I couldn't do anything else." 639 00:31:54,325 --> 00:31:55,805 That it wasn't in our hands. 640 00:31:55,925 --> 00:31:56,925 Something like that. 641 00:31:57,005 --> 00:31:59,925 If it had been in our hands, nothing would've ever happened. 642 00:32:00,485 --> 00:32:03,005 MAY 20, 1997 SEVENTH SESSION OF THE TRIAL 643 00:32:03,085 --> 00:32:04,405 Kelly, Kelly! 644 00:32:04,485 --> 00:32:07,365 What do you think about Ricart's statement, Kelly? 645 00:32:15,765 --> 00:32:17,005 Kelly, it's me, Rubén. 646 00:32:17,085 --> 00:32:20,485 Tell the Blond to go where the chain ring is. 647 00:32:20,565 --> 00:32:22,365 Tell him to bring the two sleeping bags, 648 00:32:22,445 --> 00:32:24,965 and the cereal and milk that are on top of the fridge. 649 00:32:25,045 --> 00:32:26,325 As soon as possible. 650 00:32:29,165 --> 00:32:30,605 Do you recognize that voice? 651 00:32:31,205 --> 00:32:32,685 Don't you recognize it today? 652 00:32:33,245 --> 00:32:35,085 I couldn't say for sure that's Antonio. 653 00:32:35,165 --> 00:32:37,365 You can't say for sure that is Antonio. 654 00:32:37,445 --> 00:32:38,285 No. 655 00:32:38,805 --> 00:32:41,365 Can you confirm that the recording you just heard 656 00:32:41,685 --> 00:32:43,965 is the same the police made you listen to? 657 00:32:44,405 --> 00:32:45,725 I can't confirm that. 658 00:32:45,805 --> 00:32:47,445 The two sleeping bags, 659 00:32:47,525 --> 00:32:50,805 and the cereal and milk that are on top of the fridge. 660 00:32:50,885 --> 00:32:52,525 As soon as possible. 661 00:32:53,885 --> 00:32:55,045 Is that voice familiar? 662 00:32:55,125 --> 00:32:57,165 -Sorry? -Isn't that Antonio saying that? 663 00:32:58,245 --> 00:33:00,045 -I don't think so. -No. 664 00:33:00,125 --> 00:33:03,085 But you would know Antonio's voice and you can recognize it, 665 00:33:03,165 --> 00:33:04,845 -because you're his mother. -I think so. 666 00:33:04,925 --> 00:33:05,925 It isn't his, right? 667 00:33:06,925 --> 00:33:08,285 Is that your son's voice? 668 00:33:08,365 --> 00:33:09,205 No. 669 00:33:10,885 --> 00:33:13,245 -Are you sure it isn't his? -Of course it isn't! 670 00:33:14,085 --> 00:33:15,405 One can tell... 671 00:33:16,325 --> 00:33:17,805 Even if I'm deaf, 672 00:33:18,405 --> 00:33:20,045 and I never pick up the phone, 673 00:33:20,445 --> 00:33:23,045 but he has a different way of... More... 674 00:33:23,125 --> 00:33:23,965 Of talking. 675 00:33:24,045 --> 00:33:25,285 That isn't his voice! 676 00:33:26,205 --> 00:33:27,765 Is that your brother's voice? 677 00:33:27,845 --> 00:33:30,565 I couldn't be sure, because... 678 00:33:30,645 --> 00:33:33,485 -Can we hear it again? -I don't know that voice. 679 00:33:33,685 --> 00:33:35,685 -I don't know... -How come you don't know it? 680 00:33:35,765 --> 00:33:38,485 -I don't know. -But you remember your brother's voice. 681 00:33:38,685 --> 00:33:41,205 -Yes. -And you can't say that was his voice? 682 00:33:42,485 --> 00:33:44,165 Maybe it was, I don't know. 683 00:33:44,245 --> 00:33:46,005 Is it similar to your brother's voice? 684 00:33:46,565 --> 00:33:49,965 -When you hear that voice... -I couldn't be sure. I couldn't be sure. 685 00:33:54,805 --> 00:34:01,245 MAY 20, 1997 SEVENTH SESSION OF THE TRIAL 686 00:34:02,005 --> 00:34:03,965 Enrique Anglés Martins, 687 00:34:04,045 --> 00:34:05,765 do you swear to tell the truth? 688 00:34:05,845 --> 00:34:06,685 Do I swear...? 689 00:34:06,765 --> 00:34:09,685 Do you swear to tell the truth? Will you answer truthfully? 690 00:34:09,765 --> 00:34:12,205 I don't believe in God. 691 00:34:12,285 --> 00:34:13,445 I don't believe in God. 692 00:34:13,525 --> 00:34:14,685 Then do you promise? 693 00:34:16,085 --> 00:34:16,925 I do. 694 00:34:17,805 --> 00:34:20,045 Sit on that chair. 695 00:34:20,125 --> 00:34:22,885 UNAUTHORIZED SIGNAL BY COURT - ROOM 2 696 00:34:22,965 --> 00:34:24,925 Your brother wasn't normally violent. 697 00:34:25,285 --> 00:34:26,405 He wasn't violent. No. 698 00:34:26,485 --> 00:34:30,965 But when he wanted something and couldn't have it, did he become violent? 699 00:34:31,205 --> 00:34:32,285 -No. -Not then either? 700 00:34:32,365 --> 00:34:33,365 He didn't then either. 701 00:34:33,445 --> 00:34:35,285 That's what you said on TV last night. 702 00:34:35,685 --> 00:34:37,365 But we are on trial, not on TV. 703 00:34:38,645 --> 00:34:41,085 Here is where you should be, and not there. Anyway... 704 00:34:41,165 --> 00:34:42,125 At that moment, 705 00:34:42,205 --> 00:34:46,605 Enrique Anglés defined not the trial, but the Alcàsser case. 706 00:34:47,725 --> 00:34:50,725 The Alcàsser case isn't the lawsuit over the girls' triple murder. 707 00:34:50,805 --> 00:34:52,205 -They're different to me. -Yes. 708 00:34:52,685 --> 00:34:54,645 The lawsuit over the girls' triple murder 709 00:34:55,565 --> 00:34:58,485 is one thing, and the Alcàsser case is something fabricated 710 00:34:59,165 --> 00:35:00,765 following certain interests... 711 00:35:01,925 --> 00:35:03,845 -Artificially fabricated. -And that's what, 712 00:35:03,925 --> 00:35:05,565 over time, 713 00:35:06,605 --> 00:35:09,205 has been perpetuated and it still lingers online. 714 00:35:09,685 --> 00:35:12,805 You still don't know whose voice that was on the phone? 715 00:35:13,165 --> 00:35:16,085 I think, but I can't say for sure... 716 00:35:16,165 --> 00:35:17,445 ANTONIO ANGLÉS' BROTHER 717 00:35:17,525 --> 00:35:19,925 ...I think I made that call. 718 00:35:23,125 --> 00:35:25,845 And I did it with no purpose at all. 719 00:35:25,925 --> 00:35:28,605 I just did it to spread doubt. 720 00:35:28,685 --> 00:35:31,485 So you can't be sure, but you think it was you. 721 00:35:31,565 --> 00:35:33,405 -Yes, exactly. -And can you explain that? 722 00:35:33,485 --> 00:35:35,805 Well, maybe I went to a phone booth, 723 00:35:36,005 --> 00:35:40,005 a man came to me, he gave me 500 pesetas and a message, 724 00:35:40,685 --> 00:35:43,445 and I went there and made that call. 725 00:35:44,045 --> 00:35:45,085 You know? 726 00:35:45,845 --> 00:35:47,405 Come on, Enrique. 727 00:35:47,485 --> 00:35:51,445 Well, I'm telling what it can or can't be, because if it's not my brother's... 728 00:35:51,645 --> 00:35:54,005 Let's hear if it's your voice. 729 00:35:54,365 --> 00:35:56,725 Okay. Look, the audience is laughing. 730 00:35:56,805 --> 00:35:59,685 ...and the cereal and milk that are on top of the fridge. 731 00:36:00,125 --> 00:36:02,885 You know? As soon as possible. 732 00:36:04,125 --> 00:36:04,965 It's my voice. 733 00:36:05,285 --> 00:36:06,125 No way. 734 00:36:08,245 --> 00:36:10,925 -Why didn't you say that during the trial? -I wasn't asked. 735 00:36:11,005 --> 00:36:13,885 That was a trial and this is a TV set. 736 00:36:15,485 --> 00:36:16,645 So, you made that call. 737 00:36:16,725 --> 00:36:17,565 Yes. 738 00:36:17,685 --> 00:36:19,085 So, it could have been you, 739 00:36:19,165 --> 00:36:21,805 someone gave you a paper and 500 pesetas, you called, 740 00:36:21,885 --> 00:36:23,085 and that was the story. 741 00:36:23,165 --> 00:36:25,405 Yes, and it could have been different. 742 00:36:26,205 --> 00:36:30,485 I have another version in which I was very pissed off with my family, 743 00:36:30,565 --> 00:36:33,205 so I pretended to be Antonio to scare them. 744 00:36:33,645 --> 00:36:34,965 Well, not to scare them, 745 00:36:35,325 --> 00:36:37,765 but to make a joke and have a laugh. 746 00:36:38,325 --> 00:36:40,645 I ran for a while before making the call, 747 00:36:41,045 --> 00:36:43,525 and when I got there, I faked my voice. 748 00:36:43,965 --> 00:36:45,805 I'm an expert at faking voices. 749 00:36:47,085 --> 00:36:49,045 -Do you understand? -Okay, fake your voice. 750 00:36:49,125 --> 00:36:50,405 Let's focus. 751 00:36:50,805 --> 00:36:52,485 You said that you made that call... 752 00:36:52,565 --> 00:36:53,925 -Yes. -...just to make a joke. 753 00:36:54,005 --> 00:36:56,725 -Just to... -And why didn't you say that in the trial? 754 00:36:57,805 --> 00:37:01,285 Because maybe I didn't remember that it was my voice. 755 00:37:07,805 --> 00:37:09,045 Today we finally have with us... 756 00:37:09,125 --> 00:37:10,005 JUNE 4, 1997 6:30 P.M. 757 00:37:10,085 --> 00:37:11,925 ...the most eagerly awaited expert. 758 00:37:12,005 --> 00:37:14,805 To some, he is a prominent figure in his area of expertise, 759 00:37:14,885 --> 00:37:19,445 while, to others, he is a professional who likes controversy and popularity. 760 00:37:20,005 --> 00:37:21,805 I'm not trying to provide surprises 761 00:37:22,085 --> 00:37:23,605 or anything spectacular. 762 00:37:23,685 --> 00:37:25,925 I'll just answer the questions they ask me. 763 00:37:26,205 --> 00:37:30,485 His mere presence has been enough to cause much anticipation 764 00:37:30,565 --> 00:37:33,845 at the courtroom door, in the corridors of the Palace of Justice, 765 00:37:34,325 --> 00:37:38,405 and, obviously, during his statement before the judge of room number 2. 766 00:37:41,925 --> 00:37:46,045 Frontela Carreras, professor of legal medicine at the University of Seville. 767 00:37:46,125 --> 00:37:49,445 Professor, can you guarantee, according to your report, 768 00:37:49,525 --> 00:37:53,045 that there was pubic hair from several different people? 769 00:37:53,125 --> 00:37:55,205 We have asked you about the hairs before. 770 00:37:55,525 --> 00:37:58,925 I'm asking you now, was there pubic hair from several different people? 771 00:37:59,045 --> 00:38:02,405 I understand that there was hair belonging to several people. 772 00:38:03,365 --> 00:38:05,405 I should check it again to tell you how many. 773 00:38:05,965 --> 00:38:10,245 According to the report, and my calculations, there were seven, 774 00:38:10,445 --> 00:38:12,365 but you can confirm that was the case. 775 00:38:12,445 --> 00:38:14,085 I went straight to Frontela 776 00:38:14,285 --> 00:38:16,405 and told him, "Mr. Frontela, I need help, 777 00:38:16,725 --> 00:38:19,485 because I'm feeling defenseless. 778 00:38:19,565 --> 00:38:21,685 What's going on here? I don't believe this." 779 00:38:21,765 --> 00:38:24,445 And then Professor Frontela said, "I did the analysis, 780 00:38:25,485 --> 00:38:28,685 I've been investigating this and there are more people 781 00:38:28,765 --> 00:38:31,205 involved in the murder of Míriam, Toñi and Desirée." 782 00:38:31,285 --> 00:38:32,805 I never talked to them, 783 00:38:32,885 --> 00:38:35,325 and they never gave me a chance to talk to them. 784 00:38:35,685 --> 00:38:37,405 They didn't ask my opinion either. 785 00:38:39,205 --> 00:38:42,405 And didn't you feel that they were misinterpreting your analysis? 786 00:38:42,885 --> 00:38:46,325 -That they were taking advantage of it? -Using it to back up their theories? 787 00:38:46,405 --> 00:38:48,685 I don't care, I do what I have to do, 788 00:38:49,125 --> 00:38:51,285 and the rest can think whatever they want. 789 00:38:51,365 --> 00:38:52,205 I don't know. 790 00:38:52,725 --> 00:38:55,445 Frontela is a man of few words. 791 00:38:56,125 --> 00:39:00,285 When he sees you, even if he knows you, he pretends as if he doesn't. 792 00:39:00,365 --> 00:39:04,405 You can't make him answer one single question 793 00:39:04,965 --> 00:39:07,685 honestly and clearly. 794 00:39:08,565 --> 00:39:10,965 He messes everything up, he complicates things 795 00:39:11,245 --> 00:39:12,805 and then he says he can't talk. 796 00:39:13,005 --> 00:39:17,205 If he talks, he says things that don't represent reality. 797 00:39:17,285 --> 00:39:19,925 JUNE 2, 1997 15TH SESSION 798 00:39:22,005 --> 00:39:25,565 Ángel Carracedo, director of the Forensic Medicine Institute of Santiago. 799 00:39:25,645 --> 00:39:26,965 TOXICOLOGY EXPERT 800 00:39:27,045 --> 00:39:30,325 There are certainly hairs from five different people, 801 00:39:30,805 --> 00:39:31,845 and maybe seven. 802 00:39:31,925 --> 00:39:33,765 That's exactly as you just said. 803 00:39:33,845 --> 00:39:35,165 Exactly as I just said. 804 00:39:35,245 --> 00:39:38,765 -Five different persons are certain. -Yes, five different persons are certain. 805 00:39:38,845 --> 00:39:41,045 At least from five different persons, 806 00:39:41,125 --> 00:39:42,205 and maybe from seven. 807 00:39:42,445 --> 00:39:45,245 And none of them belongs to Miguel Ricart Tárrega. 808 00:39:45,325 --> 00:39:47,325 -With total certainty. -With total certainty. 809 00:39:47,405 --> 00:39:49,325 Can I say with certainty 810 00:39:49,405 --> 00:39:51,725 that this hair belongs to one of their killers? 811 00:39:51,885 --> 00:39:53,605 Obviously not, you can't say that. 812 00:39:53,685 --> 00:39:54,565 I can't say that. 813 00:39:54,645 --> 00:39:56,925 -It may belong to a different person. -Obviously. 814 00:39:57,005 --> 00:40:01,845 It may be be reasonable that, if the bodies were wrapped in a rug, 815 00:40:01,925 --> 00:40:05,645 there may have been other hairs on that rug 816 00:40:05,725 --> 00:40:08,805 from other people in different places and in different situations, 817 00:40:08,885 --> 00:40:10,925 but who may have been in contact with the rug. 818 00:40:11,285 --> 00:40:14,885 Obviously, the rug came into physical contact with the bodies 819 00:40:15,205 --> 00:40:17,045 and the hairs could have been detached. 820 00:40:17,125 --> 00:40:19,565 So we're in a vicious circle here. 821 00:40:19,645 --> 00:40:21,845 The hairs that could have been on the rug 822 00:40:21,925 --> 00:40:25,685 wouldn't get inside their clothes and wouldn't be found on the girls' underwear. 823 00:40:26,045 --> 00:40:30,405 And then there's the rug to analyze, and this hasn't been done either. 824 00:40:30,485 --> 00:40:32,325 Even assuming the hypothesis 825 00:40:32,725 --> 00:40:35,525 that the girls were raped on the rug, 826 00:40:35,605 --> 00:40:37,965 -which is another possible hypothesis... -Perfect. 827 00:40:38,045 --> 00:40:41,805 ...the hairs could have been found on their clothes when they put them on, 828 00:40:42,045 --> 00:40:45,125 and the girls could have the hairs attached to their bodies. 829 00:40:45,205 --> 00:40:47,365 -That could be. -That's a possible hypothesis. 830 00:40:47,445 --> 00:40:49,565 The professor found the hairs, 831 00:40:49,645 --> 00:40:52,525 but he classified them 832 00:40:52,605 --> 00:40:55,805 and then a morphological analysis was carried out. 833 00:40:56,445 --> 00:41:00,045 This hair is the same as this one I took from you. 834 00:41:00,485 --> 00:41:01,925 Okay? But... 835 00:41:03,245 --> 00:41:06,365 no other analysis had been legally carried out. 836 00:41:06,925 --> 00:41:11,085 When we saw the chance of carrying out that new analysis, 837 00:41:11,605 --> 00:41:15,805 that was when we began to know what DNA was. 838 00:41:16,165 --> 00:41:19,805 "What were they saying about some evidence from some biological remains?" 839 00:41:20,565 --> 00:41:21,885 There was no DNA database. 840 00:41:22,045 --> 00:41:24,725 That was the first one in Spain. 841 00:41:24,885 --> 00:41:28,245 We could only compare it 842 00:41:28,325 --> 00:41:31,485 with the individual we had in the case, 843 00:41:31,565 --> 00:41:33,365 and we weren't allowed to perform 844 00:41:33,805 --> 00:41:36,605 any other tests apart from that one. 845 00:41:36,765 --> 00:41:39,125 So do those hairs belong to Miguel Ricart? No. 846 00:41:39,845 --> 00:41:40,805 Excluded, that's it. 847 00:41:40,885 --> 00:41:43,565 Professor Luis Frontela's report was Fernando García's basis 848 00:41:43,645 --> 00:41:46,085 to prove that the investigation wasn't fully finished. 849 00:41:46,685 --> 00:41:48,885 But Frontela didn't bring anything really new. 850 00:41:50,045 --> 00:41:54,525 JUNE 5, 1997 18TH SESSION 851 00:41:54,645 --> 00:41:56,205 The room was fully closed. 852 00:41:56,525 --> 00:42:00,925 This morning, the video of the girls' autopsies was shown. 853 00:42:09,205 --> 00:42:12,405 Was it useful to Fernando García or to the other parties 854 00:42:12,485 --> 00:42:14,165 to see these pictures again? 855 00:42:14,245 --> 00:42:17,485 Well, they forced me to do it. They're forcing me to do all this. 856 00:42:17,565 --> 00:42:20,325 It's not pleasant, or something I have chosen. 857 00:42:20,405 --> 00:42:22,885 Obviously, I can't make any assessment. 858 00:42:22,965 --> 00:42:25,485 That will be done before the court. 859 00:42:25,565 --> 00:42:29,005 Is your opinion of the Valencian forensics any different now? 860 00:42:29,205 --> 00:42:32,245 Is it any different? I haven't said anything about them yet. 861 00:42:32,405 --> 00:42:34,605 I'll comment on it when I'm asked about it. 862 00:42:35,565 --> 00:42:37,925 Watching the autopsy video in court 863 00:42:38,005 --> 00:42:42,325 spurred Dr. Frontela to bring up new conclusions about the case. 864 00:42:46,525 --> 00:42:48,925 Frontela caused a commotion this morning 865 00:42:49,005 --> 00:42:52,165 when he introduced some elements that were not present in his reports. 866 00:42:52,245 --> 00:42:56,325 When confronted with some pictures of the autopsy with insect larvae, 867 00:42:56,485 --> 00:43:01,205 he suggested the girls could have died one month before their bodies were found, 868 00:43:01,485 --> 00:43:05,165 and that they could have been buried in a different place from La Romana. 869 00:43:05,245 --> 00:43:08,045 If the heads of some of the bodies 870 00:43:08,285 --> 00:43:11,605 were a few centimeters away from the bodies, 871 00:43:11,925 --> 00:43:17,485 plus the fact that the larvae had a size that didn't correspond 872 00:43:17,565 --> 00:43:21,765 to the time of death, it's not too risky to say 873 00:43:21,845 --> 00:43:25,685 that it's likely that the bodies had been in two places. 874 00:43:25,965 --> 00:43:29,845 Either a double burial or a double movement of the bodies. 875 00:43:29,965 --> 00:43:32,085 Frontela's view is not shared 876 00:43:32,165 --> 00:43:35,125 by the forensic doctors who performed the first autopsy. 877 00:43:35,205 --> 00:43:36,645 VALENCIAN FORENSIC EXPERTS SPOKESMAN 878 00:43:36,725 --> 00:43:39,365 Where there isn't anything to see, one can't see anything, obviously. 879 00:43:39,445 --> 00:43:43,565 But the sad truth is that our job is to look. 880 00:43:44,085 --> 00:43:46,685 The term autopsy, as it's well known, means "I see." 881 00:43:47,245 --> 00:43:51,165 And it is totally at odds with "I imagine." 882 00:43:51,245 --> 00:43:54,045 Professor Frontela, who also performed the autopsy of the girls, 883 00:43:54,125 --> 00:43:57,685 didn't collect any insects present on the bodies 884 00:43:57,965 --> 00:44:00,605 at the moment of the autopsy that he performed. 885 00:44:00,885 --> 00:44:04,405 I want to clarify something to make it totally clear. 886 00:44:06,965 --> 00:44:11,165 We didn't take any larvae because there were none left. 887 00:44:11,245 --> 00:44:13,605 Not because we didn't want to study them. 888 00:44:14,005 --> 00:44:16,125 Because they were so totally... 889 00:44:16,605 --> 00:44:19,925 And I admit that it's something that must be done after an autopsy. 890 00:44:20,005 --> 00:44:21,805 After an autopsy, any autopsy... 891 00:44:22,445 --> 00:44:26,805 After it, not before it, the bodies are washed, of course. 892 00:44:27,005 --> 00:44:31,365 But they washed them so carefully that not a single larva was left. 893 00:44:31,445 --> 00:44:34,805 Before performing the autopsy, 894 00:44:35,085 --> 00:44:40,445 did you wash the girls' clothes and bodies indiscriminately 895 00:44:40,725 --> 00:44:43,405 once their clothes had been removed from their bodies? 896 00:44:43,485 --> 00:44:48,405 Not at all. We washed certain areas of their bodies 897 00:44:48,485 --> 00:44:51,685 because that was the only way that allowed us to see 898 00:44:51,765 --> 00:44:53,325 whether there were any injuries 899 00:44:53,405 --> 00:44:56,205 underneath that dirt attached to the body. 900 00:44:56,285 --> 00:44:58,085 Regarding their clothes, 901 00:44:58,165 --> 00:45:00,405 it is true that, once they were analyzed, 902 00:45:00,605 --> 00:45:03,085 some of them, I couldn't say now which ones, 903 00:45:03,285 --> 00:45:07,605 were cleaned so that they were shown to the families 904 00:45:07,885 --> 00:45:09,605 in order to be identified. 905 00:45:09,845 --> 00:45:13,045 In three bags, soaked in water, 906 00:45:13,125 --> 00:45:15,125 with a few centimeters of water, what's that? 907 00:45:15,205 --> 00:45:16,045 NEXT DAY 908 00:45:16,125 --> 00:45:18,285 And not a single drop of mud, what's that? 909 00:45:18,365 --> 00:45:20,925 Maybe God's work? It was washed. 910 00:45:21,445 --> 00:45:23,125 And I'm not lying, okay? 911 00:45:23,605 --> 00:45:26,125 And one more thing, if the clothes had mud on them, 912 00:45:26,205 --> 00:45:29,285 why on earth did you remove the mud? Who are you to remove the mud? 913 00:45:29,365 --> 00:45:32,925 How come you didn't know that there may be some important hairs in the mud? 914 00:45:33,005 --> 00:45:35,125 And if you washed the mud, where is it? 915 00:45:35,205 --> 00:45:37,125 Was it analyzed or sent to toxicology? 916 00:45:37,205 --> 00:45:38,325 Did that mud disappear? 917 00:45:38,405 --> 00:45:40,285 Did you examine it under the microscope? 918 00:45:40,365 --> 00:45:43,925 How can you know there isn't any element relevant to the crime? Be responsible! 919 00:45:45,085 --> 00:45:47,205 That was Luis Frontela's statement. 920 00:45:47,285 --> 00:45:48,365 4 DAYS LATER 921 00:45:48,445 --> 00:45:50,045 He was here a few days ago, live. 922 00:45:50,125 --> 00:45:54,005 It's odd how many times that man has to repeat "I'm not lying." 923 00:45:54,805 --> 00:45:56,205 It's been repeatedly said that... 924 00:45:56,285 --> 00:45:57,405 VALENCIAN FORENSICS SPOKESMAN 925 00:45:57,485 --> 00:45:59,525 ...the clothes were collected and classified. 926 00:45:59,605 --> 00:46:00,965 They were never washed. 927 00:46:01,045 --> 00:46:04,245 I don't like to question what you say, but there's something clear. 928 00:46:04,325 --> 00:46:06,965 -You don't have to question what I say. -In this case, I do. 929 00:46:07,045 --> 00:46:10,325 The washing of the bodies is never performed 930 00:46:10,405 --> 00:46:12,605 as it was communicated to the audience. 931 00:46:12,685 --> 00:46:15,205 -Fernando García was there. -The work is done properly. 932 00:46:15,285 --> 00:46:19,805 The fact that Fernando García... And don't use him in this matter. 933 00:46:19,885 --> 00:46:21,405 -I didn't see it. -I repeat... 934 00:46:21,485 --> 00:46:25,285 -that Mr. García doesn't have to know... -Mr. Verdugo, no one uses me. 935 00:46:25,365 --> 00:46:28,925 -...how an autopsy is performed. -Is there any dirt sample from the bodies? 936 00:46:29,005 --> 00:46:31,125 They were collected together with the clothes 937 00:46:31,205 --> 00:46:34,125 -and sent to the toxicology institute. -No. 938 00:46:34,365 --> 00:46:37,605 If you say now that because the clothes were wet, 939 00:46:37,885 --> 00:46:40,325 which is how the clothes were, because they were wet, 940 00:46:40,845 --> 00:46:42,405 after decomposing for two months, 941 00:46:42,485 --> 00:46:44,645 that can affect the results of the analysis, 942 00:46:44,725 --> 00:46:46,285 it's scientific nonsense. 943 00:46:46,365 --> 00:46:48,565 He said seven times that the clothes were washed. 944 00:46:48,645 --> 00:46:52,245 I repeat that is something that only Professor Frontela said. 945 00:46:52,325 --> 00:46:54,325 The clothes were never washed. 946 00:46:54,405 --> 00:46:58,005 That criticism towards the investigating judge is odd... 947 00:46:58,085 --> 00:46:59,365 OLEGARI GONZALO CANAL 9 JOURNALIST 948 00:46:59,445 --> 00:47:00,725 ...when the right moment 949 00:47:01,525 --> 00:47:05,085 was after the second autopsy was performed by Professor Frontela. 950 00:47:05,165 --> 00:47:07,845 The first one had been performed by the Valencian examiners. 951 00:47:07,925 --> 00:47:10,445 And there's a public appearance by Professor Frontela, 952 00:47:10,525 --> 00:47:12,565 the video which we have seen many times 953 00:47:12,645 --> 00:47:14,805 with Professor Font de Mora, 954 00:47:15,165 --> 00:47:18,885 director of the Valencia Forensics Institute at the time. 955 00:47:18,965 --> 00:47:21,365 Our findings allow 956 00:47:21,445 --> 00:47:24,525 for a precise enough reconstruction... 957 00:47:24,605 --> 00:47:27,445 The press conference was... 958 00:47:27,525 --> 00:47:29,885 let's say, laudatory towards themselves, right? 959 00:47:29,965 --> 00:47:32,805 -Yes, but you were there. -Why did you participate? 960 00:47:33,005 --> 00:47:34,405 The autopsy was carried out. 961 00:47:35,005 --> 00:47:36,405 The autopsy was carried out. 962 00:47:36,885 --> 00:47:40,685 What's the first thing that has to be done with the bodies afterwards? 963 00:47:40,765 --> 00:47:43,925 Bury them. Well, it's not the first thing, but the bodies must be buried. 964 00:47:44,005 --> 00:47:45,885 Then, a preliminary report is needed. 965 00:47:46,645 --> 00:47:50,285 This preliminary report addresses mainly the cause of death. 966 00:47:52,125 --> 00:47:53,845 And I agreed with that, of course. 967 00:47:53,925 --> 00:47:57,085 I agreed the cause of death was a shot in the head to each of them. 968 00:47:57,165 --> 00:47:59,525 I agreed with the cause of death. 969 00:48:00,085 --> 00:48:01,325 The rest... 970 00:48:01,405 --> 00:48:05,525 I don't think the essential part will change, 971 00:48:05,605 --> 00:48:11,285 and the autopsies performed by both teams will barely change a thing. 972 00:48:11,365 --> 00:48:13,245 Today is the 20th session 973 00:48:13,325 --> 00:48:16,485 of the Alcàsser trial and the controversy over the evidence continues. 974 00:48:16,565 --> 00:48:20,805 After watching the autopsies, Frontela's and the other examiners' conclusions 975 00:48:20,965 --> 00:48:22,405 are radically different. 976 00:48:22,485 --> 00:48:25,045 Frontela suggested the hypothesis of a double burial 977 00:48:25,125 --> 00:48:27,765 after the type or amount of larvae found in the bodies... 978 00:48:27,845 --> 00:48:32,485 We never thought of the possibility of a double burial. 979 00:48:32,565 --> 00:48:34,405 That's your opinion, maybe not mine. 980 00:48:34,485 --> 00:48:37,365 We think it's highly unlikely, not to say impossible. 981 00:48:37,445 --> 00:48:38,885 VALENCIAN FORENSICS AGAINST FRONTELA 982 00:48:38,965 --> 00:48:41,485 Asked by the private prosecution, you mentioned one hair 983 00:48:41,565 --> 00:48:44,685 -and the cancellation was requested. -The hairs you considered of interest... 984 00:48:44,765 --> 00:48:47,645 Asked by the private prosecution, you mentioned the double burial. 985 00:48:47,725 --> 00:48:51,285 Could it be ascertained whether or not there was a double burial? 986 00:48:51,365 --> 00:48:55,285 -The requested cancellation. -Why wasn't this in the file 987 00:48:55,365 --> 00:48:58,085 and why did you keep these issues undisclosed 988 00:48:58,245 --> 00:49:01,685 when you first came into contact with the private prosecution? 989 00:49:01,845 --> 00:49:06,205 A good part of the conspiracy theories come from some questions 990 00:49:06,285 --> 00:49:10,725 raised by Professor Frontela during the investigation. 991 00:49:10,805 --> 00:49:14,085 He had been questioning the whole work, 992 00:49:14,165 --> 00:49:17,085 from the removal of the bodies, the autopsy... 993 00:49:17,165 --> 00:49:18,325 REAL AUTOPSY VIDEO 994 00:49:18,405 --> 00:49:22,165 ...and some results and difficulties he had during the investigation. 995 00:49:22,245 --> 00:49:26,925 If I have all the resources I need and nothing is kept hidden from me... 996 00:49:27,005 --> 00:49:29,005 Then the private prosecution lived off this. 997 00:49:29,085 --> 00:49:31,925 Professor Frontela, I need help. 998 00:49:32,005 --> 00:49:34,245 The media lived off this. 999 00:49:34,325 --> 00:49:36,125 Why on earth did you remove the mud? 1000 00:49:36,205 --> 00:49:39,285 It's like there was an official version and a B-side 1001 00:49:39,365 --> 00:49:43,045 that no one wants to know and no one wants to investigate. 1002 00:49:43,125 --> 00:49:44,885 And Frontela's position is there. 1003 00:49:44,965 --> 00:49:47,285 Why did you keep these issues undisclosed 1004 00:49:47,525 --> 00:49:49,285 when you first came into contact 1005 00:49:49,525 --> 00:49:51,005 with the private prosecution? 1006 00:49:51,085 --> 00:49:54,885 You forget an important thing I said, that I didn't want any controversy. 1007 00:49:55,085 --> 00:49:59,045 I could say many things about the removal of the bodies and the first autopsy 1008 00:49:59,125 --> 00:50:03,045 and I didn't say a thing out of respect and because I didn't want to hurt anyone. 1009 00:50:03,125 --> 00:50:04,645 Be quiet! 1010 00:50:04,725 --> 00:50:06,685 Be quiet or I'll empty the courtroom! 1011 00:50:12,885 --> 00:50:16,645 The next time I hear any applause or other expressions, I'll empty the room. 1012 00:50:16,725 --> 00:50:18,405 We've been very respectful... 1013 00:50:18,485 --> 00:50:19,805 FRANCISCO ROS PLAZA FORENSIC DOCTOR 1014 00:50:19,885 --> 00:50:21,925 ...towards Dr. Frontela in every way. 1015 00:50:22,085 --> 00:50:25,005 However, he hasn't behaved the same way towards us. 1016 00:50:25,085 --> 00:50:26,845 What a dirty trick you're doing. 1017 00:50:26,925 --> 00:50:31,005 You know that what the media is saying doesn't match with what's going on there. 1018 00:50:31,405 --> 00:50:32,685 -If you'd been there... -Yes. 1019 00:50:34,365 --> 00:50:37,365 Be much more objective and impartial. 1020 00:50:37,445 --> 00:50:39,605 Watch the videos, watch what's going on. 1021 00:50:39,685 --> 00:50:42,765 The forensic experts are tearing me apart, they're... 1022 00:50:42,845 --> 00:50:45,405 And you know that's not the case, it's the opposite. 1023 00:50:45,605 --> 00:50:50,885 You know what's coming to light is the lousy job they did from the beginning. 1024 00:50:50,965 --> 00:50:51,885 So, what happens? 1025 00:50:51,965 --> 00:50:55,685 Should we eliminate whoever is brave, enterprising 1026 00:50:56,285 --> 00:50:58,165 and thinks otherwise? 1027 00:50:58,245 --> 00:51:00,085 Or should we shut up and be hypocrites? 1028 00:51:09,325 --> 00:51:15,805 These people have declined our invitation to take part in this series: 1029 00:51:16,125 --> 00:51:20,965 Bambu or Netflix can't be held responsible for any statement by any interviewee. 1030 00:52:24,765 --> 00:52:27,245 Subtitle translation by Carolina Daza