All language subtitles for Leaving.Neverland.2019.Part.2
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00:00:47,083 --> 00:00:48,834
I never told anyone
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about any of the sexual
stuff that went on.
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00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:55,875
I felt special.
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00:00:55,959 --> 00:01:00,208
I was this boy from the
other side of the world
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and Michael chose me.
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00:01:02,875 --> 00:01:06,208
Yeah, there's no question
I was like head over heels
8
00:01:06,291 --> 00:01:08,458
in love with Michael.
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And he said he loved me.
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- What's your name?
- My name's Wade.
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His name's Wade.
How old are you Wade?
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- Ten.
- Ten years old.
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A real momentum had started behind my career
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in the dance world,
starting to do music videos,
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commercials,
and acting in TV shows.
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Go on, Wade!
Show what else you can do!
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A lot of it became about impressing Michael.
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Hopefully make him happy
and make him impressed,
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and, you know,
get that stamp of approval.
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Yeah, Wade!
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Give Wade a hand!
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Yeah!
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00:02:19,834 --> 00:02:24,625
There was a kind of
mass sleepover at Neverland.
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I would've been about 11.
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And it was Jordy,
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Jordan Chandler,
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Macaulay Culkin,
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and myself.
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Jordy was the new kid,
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the new boy,
and the one who was
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super close with Michael.
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00:02:52,875 --> 00:02:56,417
Michael and Jordy
would disappear a lot.
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And I remember this
particular moment when...
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00:03:01,083 --> 00:03:03,834
all of us kids
and Michael were...
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00:03:03,917 --> 00:03:07,041
were hanging out in Michael's
bedroom in Neverland.
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All of a sudden,
Michael and Jordy were gone.
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They had gone in
one of his bathrooms,
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and the door was closed.
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You know, I used to be
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the boy who was in there
with Michael.
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00:03:25,834 --> 00:03:28,750
You know, I just knew
in my gut that...
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00:03:28,834 --> 00:03:31,083
that's what they were doing
when they were disappearing.
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They were doing all of
that same sexual stuff.
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Good morning, everyone.
Michael Jackson is at the center
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00:03:37,291 --> 00:03:39,625
of a criminal investigation
in Los Angeles.
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00:03:39,709 --> 00:03:42,083
One report talks
of child abuse charges.
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00:03:42,166 --> 00:03:44,542
Official reports obtained by NBC News
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00:03:44,625 --> 00:03:47,208
detail the allegations
against Jackson,
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made by a 13-year-old boy.
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He told a case worker that
a four-month-long relationship
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00:03:52,500 --> 00:03:55,375
with Jackson began with
the singer hugging him,
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and ended with
various sex acts.
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When pop star Michael Jackson
dropped out of sight two weeks ago,
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there was much speculation that he was trying
to duck child molestation allegations.
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00:04:05,834 --> 00:04:09,417
Jackson's people claim the
charges are part of an extortion plot.
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They claim that Michael is more
of a victim than a suspect.
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00:04:13,417 --> 00:04:16,917
He loved children.
He missed out on his childhood.
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He just enjoyed
being with children.
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I can hear him saying to me,
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"I would never hurt a child."
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He would cry.
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"I could never hurt a child,"
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and he would break into tears.
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Very convincing.
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00:04:32,250 --> 00:04:35,750
You know, I'd been told
that Wade was sleeping,
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doing sleepovers with Michael,
and sleeping in his bed.
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00:04:39,250 --> 00:04:42,250
And then you hear stories of,
you know,
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00:04:42,333 --> 00:04:45,792
someone accusing him
of molesting a child,
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00:04:45,875 --> 00:04:48,917
and I'm, like, holy crap, is...
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is that what's happening
with my brother?
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The next big thing I remember
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was two cops
showing up at my door.
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They said that Michael had been charged
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with child abuse.
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I said to Wade, you know,
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"You've done nothing wrong.
You can tell us.
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It's not your fault,
you've done nothing wrong."
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Wade was very stoic.
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But this was...
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you know, terrifying
right from the get.
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This is the first time that...
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00:05:27,709 --> 00:05:29,875
anyone ever...
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directly asked me, you know,
84
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did Michael Jackson
ever touch you sexually
85
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or anything like that?
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Without flinching,
87
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without batting an eyelash,
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you know, my answer was no.
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No way.
Absolutely not.
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You know, did this...
Did he ever touch you here?
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00:05:48,667 --> 00:05:51,208
Did this sort of thing
ever happen? Did he ever
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show you...
any pornography?
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All of those sorts of
questions, you know.
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Over and over again,
without flinching,
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my answer was no,
absolutely not. Never.
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00:06:04,041 --> 00:06:05,583
Obviously, as a mother,
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00:06:05,667 --> 00:06:08,417
when these allegations
were brought to us,
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the first thing when I get Wade
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00:06:10,417 --> 00:06:12,166
by himself,
I said to him, "Okay.
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00:06:12,250 --> 00:06:16,083
"So, as your mother,
I need to ask you,
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00:06:16,166 --> 00:06:19,750
has Michael ever done anything
inappropriate with you?"
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And he was so convincing.
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"Absolutely not.
104
00:06:23,959 --> 00:06:27,834
"He has never ever
done anything. Never."
105
00:06:27,917 --> 00:06:31,834
You know, as soon as the cop
started asking me these questions,
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the first thing that
came to mind for me was
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everything that Michael started
saying to me when I was seven.
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You know, if anyone
ever found out that...
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we were doing any of these sort
of things, these sexual things,
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that he and I would go to jail
for the rest of our lives.
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It was terrifying.
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Why is Michael Jackson,
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an adult,
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repeatedly
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sleeping in the same bed
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with a young boy?
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It is important to note
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that children everywhere
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are watching
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to see how this child,
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00:07:10,583 --> 00:07:13,583
who has been brave
enough to come forward,
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to make his allegations
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will be treated.
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They may be fearful
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about what will happen to them
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if they come forward
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to make a charge
against a celebrity,
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or against a powerful person.
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00:07:32,583 --> 00:07:36,250
There have been many disgusting statements
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made recently
concerning allegations
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of improper conduct on my part.
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These statements about
me are totally false.
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They served
a search warrant on me,
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which allowed them to view
and photograph my body,
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including my penis,
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my buttocks, my lower torso,
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00:07:53,875 --> 00:07:57,417
thighs, and any other area
that they wanted.
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It brings tears to my eyes
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when I see any
child who suffers.
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00:08:02,583 --> 00:08:05,291
I am not guilty
of these allegations,
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00:08:05,375 --> 00:08:08,625
but if I am guilty of anything,
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00:08:08,709 --> 00:08:11,041
it is of giving
all that I have...
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all that I have to give
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to help children
all over the world.
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It is of loving children
of all ages and races.
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00:08:18,667 --> 00:08:20,750
It is of gaining sheer joy
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00:08:20,834 --> 00:08:24,417
from seeing children with their
innocent and smiling faces.
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To my friends and fans,
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thank you very much
for all of your support.
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00:08:30,583 --> 00:08:34,333
Together, we will see this
through to the very end.
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00:08:34,417 --> 00:08:36,333
I love you very much,
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00:08:36,417 --> 00:08:38,750
and may God bless you all.
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I love you. Goodbye.
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He had been,
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I think, a little absent
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00:08:50,667 --> 00:08:52,792
from my life.
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And then, he's back in it
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'cause he needs
you for something.
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00:08:57,500 --> 00:08:59,000
He needs you to testify.
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00:08:59,083 --> 00:09:03,291
So honestly,
you're happy that he's back.
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00:09:03,375 --> 00:09:07,083
You're kind of just excited
that he's talking to you again.
162
00:09:08,458 --> 00:09:10,125
First heard it on the news.
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00:09:10,208 --> 00:09:12,959
Totally shocked.
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00:09:13,041 --> 00:09:16,583
I told my husband,
"We need to talk to Jimmy."
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00:09:16,667 --> 00:09:19,709
He said Michael
did not touch him.
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00:09:19,792 --> 00:09:22,667
"Are you all all right?
Did anything happen to you?"
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00:09:22,750 --> 00:09:24,083
"No, Mom."
168
00:09:24,166 --> 00:09:26,625
It was like,
"No, Mom," like that.
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It would go for months without talking,
or seeing each other.
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00:09:31,166 --> 00:09:33,875
Now all of a sudden, once...
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00:09:33,959 --> 00:09:36,792
this Jordy case kind of
exploded in the press...
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every day, he would call.
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Friday, 3:12 p.m.
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00:09:49,333 --> 00:09:51,792
Gabby!
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00:09:51,875 --> 00:09:55,875
It's Apple Head.
Um, I was wondering maybe...
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00:09:55,959 --> 00:09:59,000
sometime tomorrow night,
we could see a movie.
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It'd be really nice.
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00:10:00,834 --> 00:10:03,750
So, I'll call you tomorrow.
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00:10:03,834 --> 00:10:05,083
I'll sleep in tomorrow,
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00:10:05,166 --> 00:10:08,208
and then maybe we can
do something. Thank you!
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Goodbye.
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00:10:10,583 --> 00:10:13,709
Bye, Little One.
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After these phone calls had been
going on for a while, there were...
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I mean, you know,
really similar, each one,
185
00:10:19,917 --> 00:10:22,834
and just the same
sort of talk, and...
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00:10:22,917 --> 00:10:27,166
I mean, what I understand now
as coaching sessions, you know.
187
00:10:27,250 --> 00:10:30,542
I went in to meet his lawyers
for, like, a rehearsal.
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They gave me... They did,
like, a mock interview.
189
00:10:34,291 --> 00:10:37,125
You know, kind of role-playing
190
00:10:37,208 --> 00:10:39,166
a policeman or lawyer and...
191
00:10:39,250 --> 00:10:42,291
You know, "We know you guys
have done this. We have photos.
192
00:10:42,375 --> 00:10:45,792
So, just tell us...
Just tell us about it."
193
00:10:45,875 --> 00:10:48,667
That... That's like a ploy.
Like, they don't know,
194
00:10:48,750 --> 00:10:51,542
they don't have photos,
just tell them no.
195
00:10:51,625 --> 00:10:54,834
That's, like, the golden rule.
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00:10:55,500 --> 00:10:56,875
You know, just don't tell them,
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00:10:56,959 --> 00:11:00,583
and they don't actually know,
or they can't prove it.
198
00:11:00,667 --> 00:11:02,917
It was reported
in Vanity Fair that,
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00:11:03,000 --> 00:11:07,125
that Michael convinced
his 13-year-old mother...
200
00:11:07,208 --> 00:11:10,709
the mother of his 13-year-old
accuser to allow...
201
00:11:10,792 --> 00:11:12,500
to allow him to move in
202
00:11:12,583 --> 00:11:15,000
with them in the same house,
and that for three months,
203
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he slept in the same bed
with this 13-year-old boy.
204
00:11:18,750 --> 00:11:21,166
I mean, at best,
would you describe
205
00:11:21,250 --> 00:11:22,917
Michael Jackson's
behavior
206
00:11:23,000 --> 00:11:25,333
as just
extremely weird?
207
00:11:25,417 --> 00:11:28,709
Well, I wouldn't accept what
I read in Vanity Fair, Katie,
208
00:11:28,792 --> 00:11:31,083
and that's one of the things I'd
like to talk about at some point.
209
00:11:31,166 --> 00:11:33,542
But, let me say this. I think
when the facts come out,
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00:11:33,625 --> 00:11:36,458
that you'll find out
that Michael Jackson
211
00:11:36,542 --> 00:11:39,917
loves children, and he loves
them in a very, very proper way.
212
00:11:40,750 --> 00:11:42,542
You know, very much said...
213
00:11:42,625 --> 00:11:47,166
He used the...
"They want fame and money" card.
214
00:11:47,250 --> 00:11:52,750
Like, that was... So, kind of what he...
he pitched to everybody.
215
00:11:52,834 --> 00:11:57,291
Um, so, that's
what he told my parents,
216
00:11:57,375 --> 00:11:58,875
and they believed him.
217
00:12:03,041 --> 00:12:05,083
And I said to Michael,
218
00:12:05,166 --> 00:12:07,500
why is this boy
doing this to you?
219
00:12:07,583 --> 00:12:10,417
And he said, "Oh, it's
not him. It's his father.
220
00:12:10,500 --> 00:12:12,667
His father wants money."
221
00:12:13,792 --> 00:12:15,834
I asked if he was
angry with the boy.
222
00:12:15,917 --> 00:12:18,250
He said, "No,
I'm not angry with him."
223
00:12:18,834 --> 00:12:21,542
And I thought, what a good man.
224
00:12:21,625 --> 00:12:23,291
What a good man Michael is.
225
00:12:23,375 --> 00:12:26,208
He's not even mad at the child.
226
00:12:26,291 --> 00:12:30,041
Thank you.
227
00:12:30,125 --> 00:12:33,291
Jackson likes to surround
himself with young children,
228
00:12:33,375 --> 00:12:36,750
and some of them have been
speaking out on his behalf.
229
00:12:36,834 --> 00:12:39,417
Last night, this girl,
who says she and her brother
230
00:12:39,500 --> 00:12:41,583
have spent lots of time
with Jackson,
231
00:12:41,667 --> 00:12:44,583
talked to station
KNBC in Los Angeles,
232
00:12:44,667 --> 00:12:47,917
denouncing the allegations
of child molestation.
233
00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:49,583
I think it's sick, personally,
234
00:12:49,667 --> 00:12:51,917
because Michael
loves little kids.
235
00:12:52,000 --> 00:12:54,625
- You know, I've known Michael since I was 10.
Mm-hmm.
236
00:12:54,709 --> 00:12:56,000
He's never done anything to me.
237
00:12:56,083 --> 00:12:57,792
He's never done
anything to my brother.
238
00:12:57,875 --> 00:13:00,041
I loved this man.
I trusted him.
239
00:13:00,125 --> 00:13:02,417
I didn't think he would
ever do anything.
240
00:13:02,500 --> 00:13:05,709
You know that he's famous
and people could do this,
241
00:13:05,792 --> 00:13:08,250
and people could be after
money and stuff like that.
242
00:13:08,333 --> 00:13:09,667
So, that wasn't
hard to believe.
243
00:13:09,750 --> 00:13:11,709
Joy Robson said she did not believe
244
00:13:11,792 --> 00:13:13,375
Jackson would molest anyone.
245
00:13:13,458 --> 00:13:16,291
You just develop that trust
with him immediately.
246
00:13:16,375 --> 00:13:18,291
He's just a very
special person.
247
00:13:18,375 --> 00:13:22,166
Because we were so close
with Michael, obviously...
248
00:13:22,250 --> 00:13:24,750
I wanted to believe that.
249
00:13:24,834 --> 00:13:28,208
But more than anything,
I believed my son.
250
00:13:28,291 --> 00:13:30,750
I believed that
he would've told me
251
00:13:30,834 --> 00:13:33,667
had something happened.
252
00:13:33,750 --> 00:13:36,792
Sources tell CNN,
authorities may attempt to bring Wade
253
00:13:36,875 --> 00:13:38,542
before the grand juror.
254
00:13:38,625 --> 00:13:43,917
I was excited by the idea
of being able to defend him,
255
00:13:44,625 --> 00:13:47,625
and being able to save him.
256
00:13:47,709 --> 00:13:49,625
Yeah, you know,
there's been different times
257
00:13:49,709 --> 00:13:51,458
where it'd just
be me and Michael.
258
00:13:51,542 --> 00:13:52,583
Then there'd be other times
259
00:13:52,667 --> 00:13:54,250
where he has other
friends over, too.
260
00:13:54,333 --> 00:13:58,000
It's just... a slumber party.
We just have a lot of fun.
261
00:13:58,083 --> 00:14:02,083
I've been there when these kids
have been in Michael's room.
262
00:14:02,166 --> 00:14:05,166
I've been there with them.
It's just party time.
263
00:14:05,250 --> 00:14:08,208
They watch videos.
They eat junk food.
264
00:14:08,291 --> 00:14:11,250
They play video games.
265
00:14:11,333 --> 00:14:14,458
They play so hard,
they fall asleep.
266
00:14:14,542 --> 00:14:16,750
They're exhausted.
They fall asleep.
267
00:14:16,834 --> 00:14:18,417
There's nothing more
to it than that.
268
00:14:18,500 --> 00:14:20,959
From your standpoint,
does it seem unusual
269
00:14:21,041 --> 00:14:24,917
for a 34-year-old man
to have kids sleeping over?
270
00:14:25,000 --> 00:14:26,959
Not when you know
Michael's background.
271
00:14:27,041 --> 00:14:29,750
Under normal circumstances,
possibly, yes.
272
00:14:29,834 --> 00:14:33,166
But Michael, everybody knows
he didn't have a childhood.
273
00:14:33,250 --> 00:14:36,959
Soon, it will be Jackson's
turn himself to respond to questions.
274
00:14:37,041 --> 00:14:40,542
The teen said that when they traveled
together to Monaco last May, quote,
275
00:14:40,625 --> 00:14:43,875
"That's when the whole thing
really got out of hand.
276
00:14:43,959 --> 00:14:46,875
"He then masturbated me
to climax. After that,
277
00:14:46,959 --> 00:14:49,375
"Michael Jackson
masturbated me many times
278
00:14:49,458 --> 00:14:51,583
both with his hand
and with his mouth."
279
00:14:51,667 --> 00:14:54,125
Among the documents filed
with the court were excerpts
280
00:14:54,208 --> 00:14:57,125
of depositions by several
former Jackson employees,
281
00:14:57,208 --> 00:14:59,834
including Jackson's chauffeur,
who said he dropped
282
00:14:59,917 --> 00:15:01,709
the entertainer off
at the boy's house
283
00:15:01,792 --> 00:15:04,542
on overnight visits
30 days in a row.
284
00:15:04,625 --> 00:15:06,291
Also included was a deposition
285
00:15:06,375 --> 00:15:08,750
of former Jackson maid,
Blanca Francia,
286
00:15:08,834 --> 00:15:11,583
who claims that at
Jackson's Neverland Ranch,
287
00:15:11,667 --> 00:15:13,500
he has a closet within a closet
288
00:15:13,583 --> 00:15:16,625
in which he kept pictures
and videotapes of children.
289
00:15:16,709 --> 00:15:19,000
She also claims
to have seen Jackson naked
290
00:15:19,083 --> 00:15:21,375
with young boys
on several occasions.
291
00:15:21,458 --> 00:15:24,667
Jackson publicly denied
the allegations last week
292
00:15:24,750 --> 00:15:28,333
at the NAACP Image Awards
in Pasadena.
293
00:15:28,417 --> 00:15:31,375
Everyone is presumed to be
innocent, and totally innocent,
294
00:15:31,458 --> 00:15:33,959
until they are
charged with a crime,
295
00:15:34,041 --> 00:15:36,750
and then convicted
by a jury of their peers.
296
00:15:38,000 --> 00:15:40,458
He asked me to testify.
297
00:15:40,542 --> 00:15:43,667
There was like a pretrial,
so I went to court.
298
00:15:43,750 --> 00:15:46,792
I remember going
in there, and...
299
00:15:48,125 --> 00:15:52,000
being very... robotic.
300
00:15:52,083 --> 00:15:54,709
I mean, I had, like I said,
rehearsed it so much,
301
00:15:54,792 --> 00:15:57,250
that it was just going
through the motions.
302
00:15:57,333 --> 00:16:00,834
They asked, and, you know,
I said no, of course.
303
00:16:03,041 --> 00:16:06,208
Just like part of my job...
304
00:16:06,291 --> 00:16:08,625
to, you know,
to do that for Michael.
305
00:16:08,709 --> 00:16:12,667
He's a very, very nice,
kind person.
306
00:16:12,750 --> 00:16:15,166
He wouldn't hurt anybody.
307
00:16:15,250 --> 00:16:18,250
He doesn't have
a mean bone in his body.
308
00:16:18,875 --> 00:16:21,000
Like, I knew it was true...
309
00:16:22,917 --> 00:16:26,542
but I couldn't let
myself go there,
310
00:16:26,625 --> 00:16:29,208
and it was just like Jordy...
311
00:16:30,125 --> 00:16:32,917
was the enemy.
312
00:16:34,417 --> 00:16:38,542
Michael...
told me that I had to lie.
313
00:16:39,959 --> 00:16:42,834
And that's what I did.
314
00:16:42,917 --> 00:16:44,625
I lied.
315
00:16:44,709 --> 00:16:46,834
I know Michael very well.
316
00:16:46,917 --> 00:16:49,583
I know he wouldn't do
anything like that.
317
00:16:49,917 --> 00:16:53,417
Has he ever tried to do anything with you
318
00:16:53,500 --> 00:16:56,291
that would even be
considered questionable?
319
00:16:56,375 --> 00:16:58,250
No, nothing.
320
00:16:58,709 --> 00:17:00,417
Nothing at all.
Has never touched you?
321
00:17:00,500 --> 00:17:03,208
- Mm-mm.
- Have you ever seen Michael naked?
322
00:17:03,291 --> 00:17:04,583
No.
323
00:17:05,375 --> 00:17:07,917
There's a stunning development
in the Michael Jackson story.
324
00:17:08,000 --> 00:17:11,291
NBC News has confirmed
that lawyers for the entertainer
325
00:17:11,375 --> 00:17:15,083
accused of sexually molesting
a 14-year-old boy
326
00:17:15,166 --> 00:17:18,625
are now seeking an out-of-court
settlement in that case,
327
00:17:18,709 --> 00:17:20,667
and that lawyers
for both sides
328
00:17:20,750 --> 00:17:23,208
are actively
negotiating an agreement
329
00:17:23,291 --> 00:17:24,875
which could be announced
as soon as tomorrow.
330
00:17:24,959 --> 00:17:27,625
Jackson reportedly
is prepared to pay
331
00:17:27,709 --> 00:17:30,709
at least $10 million
to settle this case.
332
00:17:30,792 --> 00:17:33,583
I don't have any...
333
00:17:33,667 --> 00:17:38,208
guilt about... not being able
to tell the truth.
334
00:17:38,291 --> 00:17:44,458
I had no choice but to say what I did
in that deposition when I was 11.
335
00:17:49,500 --> 00:17:51,375
That was what I had to say.
336
00:17:51,458 --> 00:17:53,375
We wish to jointly announce
337
00:17:53,458 --> 00:17:56,458
a mutual resolution
of this lawsuit.
338
00:17:56,542 --> 00:17:59,083
The resolution of this case
339
00:17:59,166 --> 00:18:00,875
is in no way
340
00:18:00,959 --> 00:18:03,583
an admission of guilt
by Michael Jackson.
341
00:18:03,667 --> 00:18:05,834
Then, when they
settled out of court,
342
00:18:05,917 --> 00:18:08,000
I asked him why he did that,
343
00:18:08,083 --> 00:18:10,166
and he said,
"My attorney said
344
00:18:10,250 --> 00:18:13,792
"it would cost me more
money to fight it,
345
00:18:13,875 --> 00:18:16,417
so it was better
for me to settle it."
346
00:18:16,500 --> 00:18:19,458
The accuser settled the
civil lawsuit against Jackson,
347
00:18:19,542 --> 00:18:23,083
reportedly for between
five and 25 million dollars.
348
00:18:23,166 --> 00:18:25,166
Then they took that money.
349
00:18:26,291 --> 00:18:28,583
People said to me that
just proves he's guilty.
350
00:18:28,667 --> 00:18:30,166
And I would say no.
351
00:18:30,250 --> 00:18:35,250
That to me proves that all it
was about all along was money.
352
00:18:35,333 --> 00:18:38,792
How much money
would make it okay
353
00:18:38,875 --> 00:18:41,542
for your child to be abused?
Ten million? No.
354
00:18:41,625 --> 00:18:43,583
Twenty million? Oh, maybe.
355
00:18:43,667 --> 00:18:47,709
I said, "To me, no amount of
money would make that okay."
356
00:18:47,792 --> 00:18:50,667
If I thought
that he had touched my son,
357
00:18:50,750 --> 00:18:54,333
I would not stop
till he was behind bars.
358
00:18:58,750 --> 00:19:00,500
We wanted to buy another house,
359
00:19:00,583 --> 00:19:04,875
and Michael gave us a loan
at a very low percentage rate.
360
00:19:06,500 --> 00:19:09,500
My husband had already
had a deposition.
361
00:19:09,583 --> 00:19:11,583
We were on Michael's camp.
362
00:19:11,667 --> 00:19:15,500
My son also for Michael.
363
00:19:15,583 --> 00:19:17,959
And after that was
all said and done
364
00:19:18,041 --> 00:19:21,542
is when Michael
forgave the debt.
365
00:19:21,625 --> 00:19:24,834
Michael said, "No, I don't
want you to pay me anymore,"
366
00:19:24,917 --> 00:19:27,125
um, "It's a gift."
367
00:19:27,208 --> 00:19:29,166
So, he did buy us a house.
368
00:19:29,250 --> 00:19:33,375
It's just coincidental,
he wasn't buying us off,
369
00:19:33,458 --> 00:19:36,750
but the timing's right there.
370
00:19:36,834 --> 00:19:38,917
Just sounds bad.
371
00:19:40,291 --> 00:19:41,583
Yeah.
372
00:19:54,875 --> 00:19:58,333
My mom and I went to Neverland
373
00:19:58,417 --> 00:20:01,083
soon after that for a few days.
374
00:20:02,166 --> 00:20:05,417
You know, same sort of...
physical scenario happened,
375
00:20:05,500 --> 00:20:10,166
meaning Mom stayed in one of the
rooms upstairs at Neverland, and...
376
00:20:11,000 --> 00:20:14,792
and I went into Michael's room,
and into Michael's bed, and...
377
00:20:14,875 --> 00:20:20,041
and the same sexual stuff
all happened again.
378
00:20:20,125 --> 00:20:23,959
First hearing that, you know,
that he wanted to see me,
379
00:20:24,041 --> 00:20:26,959
that he wanted me
to come there felt so good.
380
00:20:27,792 --> 00:20:30,917
I'm back, like,
we're coming back together.
381
00:20:34,834 --> 00:20:39,875
Michael! Michael!
Michael!
382
00:20:45,709 --> 00:20:47,583
Michael!
383
00:20:47,667 --> 00:20:49,709
He would just call every once in a while.
384
00:20:49,792 --> 00:20:53,542
He gave me a car
when I turned 16.
385
00:20:54,583 --> 00:20:55,834
I was very much
into filmmaking,
386
00:20:55,917 --> 00:20:58,083
and I was doing
my filmmaking classes,
387
00:20:58,166 --> 00:21:02,083
and Michael tells you that,
"You don't need school.
388
00:21:02,166 --> 00:21:05,417
"Nobody who ever did
anything good goes to school."
389
00:21:05,500 --> 00:21:08,834
So, he'd say, "You don't need it.
All you need is me."
390
00:21:08,917 --> 00:21:15,041
He very much said, you know,
"You're gonna be like a little Spielberg."
391
00:21:16,667 --> 00:21:19,917
Michael would fund
these short films,
392
00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:23,333
and I made those
all throughout high school.
393
00:21:23,417 --> 00:21:27,667
And I made a 35mm
short film at Neverland.
394
00:21:29,750 --> 00:21:31,458
And he talked to my parents
395
00:21:31,542 --> 00:21:34,083
'cause I was in some
of the advanced classes,
396
00:21:34,166 --> 00:21:36,375
and he said,
"You don't need math."
397
00:21:36,458 --> 00:21:40,250
So, he convinced my parents
to pull me out of the classes,
398
00:21:40,333 --> 00:21:44,291
so that I can kind of don't
have to worry about studying,
399
00:21:44,375 --> 00:21:46,333
and just focus on filmmaking.
400
00:21:46,417 --> 00:21:50,375
And he would... he'd tell them,
"Don't worry. I'll be there."
401
00:21:50,458 --> 00:21:55,917
He very much is, like,
making you depend on him.
402
00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:58,250
Like, "Don't go get
an education.
403
00:21:58,333 --> 00:22:00,458
Just... I'll take care of it."
404
00:22:00,542 --> 00:22:03,500
And then when he went away,
it just kind of derailed,
405
00:22:03,583 --> 00:22:06,542
and I was pretty lost.
406
00:22:17,250 --> 00:22:19,041
Well, it was apparently
more than just a rumor.
407
00:22:19,125 --> 00:22:21,625
Press agents have now
confirmed that Michael Jackson
408
00:22:21,709 --> 00:22:25,667
and Lisa Marie Presley
are husband and wife.
409
00:22:25,750 --> 00:22:28,166
The two say they
denied their marriage for months
410
00:22:28,250 --> 00:22:31,208
in an attempt to avoid
the glare of the media.
411
00:22:31,291 --> 00:22:33,291
Mrs. Presley-Jackson
issues a statement
412
00:22:33,375 --> 00:22:35,583
saying she's very much
in love with Michael
413
00:22:35,667 --> 00:22:37,917
and looks forward
to raising a family.
414
00:22:39,625 --> 00:22:42,250
I remember Michael saying to me
415
00:22:42,333 --> 00:22:45,000
that he's gonna have to...
416
00:22:45,083 --> 00:22:48,750
have these public
relationships with women,
417
00:22:48,834 --> 00:22:51,458
so that people don't
think anything.
418
00:22:52,792 --> 00:22:55,417
He would always say
he's gonna get married.
419
00:22:55,500 --> 00:22:57,625
He said he'd have to go
get married at some point,
420
00:22:57,709 --> 00:23:00,333
but that it wouldn't
mean anything.
421
00:23:00,417 --> 00:23:03,875
So one day,
I got a phone call from Michael.
422
00:23:03,959 --> 00:23:06,041
He said, "Stephanie,
I'm not gonna be able
423
00:23:06,125 --> 00:23:08,000
to come over as often."
424
00:23:08,083 --> 00:23:09,792
It was a short phone call.
425
00:23:09,875 --> 00:23:13,750
Hung up, went to my husband and said,
"We've just been dumped."
426
00:23:13,834 --> 00:23:17,041
Yeah, it was an emptiness.
I loved him.
427
00:23:17,125 --> 00:23:19,542
He was one of my children,
so it was a...
428
00:23:19,625 --> 00:23:22,959
a child leaving the home.
429
00:23:23,041 --> 00:23:24,875
That's how it felt.
430
00:23:29,542 --> 00:23:33,125
Again,
I was seeing less of Michael.
431
00:23:34,083 --> 00:23:36,917
Still talking to him but less.
432
00:23:38,375 --> 00:23:40,542
Two to three times a year.
433
00:23:40,625 --> 00:23:44,583
Still, every time that
I was physically with him
434
00:23:44,667 --> 00:23:47,959
and stayed the night
with him anywhere,
435
00:23:48,041 --> 00:23:50,375
the same sexual stuff happened.
436
00:23:54,875 --> 00:23:57,375
My dance world was
kind of really building,
437
00:23:57,458 --> 00:24:00,208
and moving towards me
being a choreographer.
438
00:24:02,291 --> 00:24:05,083
The dance studio that I had
been going to for years,
439
00:24:05,166 --> 00:24:07,583
I came to them
and said I wanna teach.
440
00:24:07,667 --> 00:24:08,875
They gave me a shot,
441
00:24:08,959 --> 00:24:11,959
substituting for
other teachers.
442
00:24:12,041 --> 00:24:13,917
They gave me my own class
and really quickly,
443
00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:16,917
that class became
massive, packed.
444
00:24:18,792 --> 00:24:21,500
Michael was preparing
445
00:24:21,583 --> 00:24:25,291
for his HIStory world tour.
446
00:24:25,375 --> 00:24:30,625
I was...
brought by Michael's driver
447
00:24:30,709 --> 00:24:34,500
to the dance studio,
where Michael was rehearsing,
448
00:24:34,583 --> 00:24:37,291
for me to be able to watch rehearsal
a little bit and hang out.
449
00:24:41,375 --> 00:24:44,166
And that night,
he took me back,
450
00:24:44,250 --> 00:24:46,417
with Michael back to the hotel.
451
00:24:54,792 --> 00:24:57,125
And so, I'm 14
at this point, and...
452
00:24:57,208 --> 00:25:00,417
I've had a major growth spurt.
453
00:25:00,500 --> 00:25:02,125
I'm probably...
454
00:25:04,417 --> 00:25:05,667
five-eleven.
455
00:25:05,750 --> 00:25:11,834
So, the same
or taller than Michael.
456
00:25:11,917 --> 00:25:15,083
Just a whole different
physical vibe.
457
00:25:21,208 --> 00:25:23,500
And at some point
in the night,
458
00:25:23,583 --> 00:25:27,333
you know, we slip
back into the routine,
459
00:25:27,417 --> 00:25:31,166
the same sort of
sexual stuff.
460
00:25:31,250 --> 00:25:36,709
And I don't remember how
exactly it evolved to this,
461
00:25:36,792 --> 00:25:40,709
how it moved to this next stage,
462
00:25:42,959 --> 00:25:46,291
but what ended up
happening is...
463
00:25:49,375 --> 00:25:52,458
Michael, uh, tried to...
464
00:25:54,709 --> 00:25:59,333
penetrate me, um,
in my anus, with his penis.
465
00:26:04,458 --> 00:26:06,208
You know, trying for a while,
466
00:26:06,291 --> 00:26:09,542
and, I guess,
was able to a bit,
467
00:26:09,625 --> 00:26:12,000
but it was really painful.
468
00:26:12,083 --> 00:26:14,959
And too painful for me,
469
00:26:15,041 --> 00:26:17,583
so, so he stopped.
470
00:26:25,333 --> 00:26:27,250
Yeah, I don't
remember us, like,
471
00:26:27,333 --> 00:26:31,125
talking about it
or anything like that, or...
472
00:26:32,291 --> 00:26:34,250
acting like...
473
00:26:34,333 --> 00:26:39,041
anything particularly different
had happened.
474
00:26:39,875 --> 00:26:41,583
I think after that,
475
00:26:41,667 --> 00:26:45,542
after it wasn't working,
after it was too painful for me,
476
00:26:46,667 --> 00:26:51,542
we kind of went back
to our regular sexual routine.
477
00:26:58,625 --> 00:27:00,417
The next morning,
478
00:27:00,500 --> 00:27:04,667
Michael had like a recording
session to prepare for.
479
00:27:06,750 --> 00:27:09,291
He handed me
some new, like, camera
480
00:27:09,375 --> 00:27:12,291
that he had gotten,
that I could play with.
481
00:27:23,834 --> 00:27:27,792
I was dropped off
by his driver,
482
00:27:27,875 --> 00:27:33,041
um, back to my condo
in Hollywood.
483
00:27:33,875 --> 00:27:36,291
And then, that afternoon,
484
00:27:36,375 --> 00:27:39,625
my mother receives a phone call
485
00:27:39,709 --> 00:27:42,667
from Michael's
personal secretary
486
00:27:42,750 --> 00:27:44,583
that Michael...
487
00:27:44,667 --> 00:27:47,500
wants to see Wade right away.
488
00:27:53,375 --> 00:27:55,667
I think I was picked up
again by Michael's driver,
489
00:27:55,750 --> 00:27:57,125
and brought
to the dance studio
490
00:27:57,208 --> 00:27:59,417
where he was back
in rehearsals.
491
00:28:00,333 --> 00:28:02,000
Right away,
he just went right into it.
492
00:28:02,083 --> 00:28:05,458
He was kind of
super nervous and said,
493
00:28:05,542 --> 00:28:12,250
"What did you do with your
underwear from last night?"
494
00:28:14,417 --> 00:28:16,583
I said, "I don't know. I...
495
00:28:17,208 --> 00:28:19,250
"I don't know. I took
them off and, you know,
496
00:28:19,333 --> 00:28:21,750
showered and put new ones on."
497
00:28:21,834 --> 00:28:26,125
He said, "You gotta go home
and find them.'
498
00:28:28,125 --> 00:28:31,291
"And I don't... you know...
499
00:28:32,458 --> 00:28:34,667
"I don't know
if there's any, um,
500
00:28:35,500 --> 00:28:38,583
"There might be
some blood on them.
501
00:28:41,417 --> 00:28:44,166
If there is, you gotta
get rid of them."
502
00:28:47,083 --> 00:28:49,959
How long does it take for you to get home?
503
00:28:52,291 --> 00:28:55,792
Got back in the car and he
drove me back to the condo, and...
504
00:28:57,291 --> 00:29:00,458
luckily, not luckily, you know,
I guess my mother hadn't...
505
00:29:00,542 --> 00:29:03,500
found them, hadn't tried to
clean them or anything yet.
506
00:29:06,709 --> 00:29:08,250
I found the underwear,
and there was
507
00:29:08,333 --> 00:29:11,000
some drops of blood
on the inside.
508
00:29:11,792 --> 00:29:14,000
Your blood?
- My blood.
509
00:29:17,834 --> 00:29:22,959
I... grabbed them,
sort of stuffed them in my pocket,
510
00:29:23,041 --> 00:29:25,291
down into the garage,
511
00:29:25,375 --> 00:29:28,000
and threw them in the bin.
512
00:29:29,625 --> 00:29:33,041
That was the last...
513
00:29:34,834 --> 00:29:40,125
sexual experience
that I remember with Michael.
514
00:29:45,125 --> 00:29:47,125
Excuse me!
515
00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:04,291
Wedding bells have
rung again for Michael Jackson.
516
00:30:04,375 --> 00:30:07,375
The superstar is on a working
honeymoon this morning,
517
00:30:07,458 --> 00:30:10,208
with his new bride in Australia.
518
00:30:10,291 --> 00:30:13,000
It's the first leg of his HIStory world tour,
519
00:30:13,083 --> 00:30:15,792
and Michael Jackson is
mixing music with marriage
520
00:30:15,875 --> 00:30:17,458
in Sydney, Australia.
521
00:30:17,542 --> 00:30:18,917
The Gloved One giving his hand
522
00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:21,125
to longtime friend,
Debbie Rowe,
523
00:30:21,208 --> 00:30:24,583
who also happens to be six
months pregnant with his baby.
524
00:30:29,458 --> 00:30:32,333
Somewhere in 2001 or 2002,
525
00:30:32,417 --> 00:30:34,792
I think some desire started
526
00:30:34,875 --> 00:30:37,250
building in me to, uh,
527
00:30:37,333 --> 00:30:40,959
want to try and connect
with Dad more.
528
00:30:42,583 --> 00:30:44,667
And we had a couple
of phone conversations
529
00:30:44,750 --> 00:30:47,166
when he was still in Australia.
530
00:30:47,250 --> 00:30:50,083
He told me some stories
of his life and...
531
00:30:50,166 --> 00:30:54,500
and, I don't know, it felt like
the beginning of something.
532
00:31:01,041 --> 00:31:03,750
I had moved from Brisbane to the Gold Coast.
533
00:31:04,709 --> 00:31:06,000
He was living down the coast,
534
00:31:06,083 --> 00:31:09,083
so I was seeing him
a little bit more often.
535
00:31:09,166 --> 00:31:10,917
We would meet
and, like, go to a pub
536
00:31:11,000 --> 00:31:14,625
and play some pool and talk.
537
00:31:14,709 --> 00:31:17,625
I don't know if he was
even working at that point.
538
00:31:17,709 --> 00:31:20,792
You know, he didn't really
have any much money.
539
00:31:21,500 --> 00:31:23,917
You know, I think he was
probably just living on,
540
00:31:24,000 --> 00:31:26,959
you know, like the government
kind of handout.
541
00:31:27,834 --> 00:31:30,250
He'd kind of gone downhill.
542
00:31:32,750 --> 00:31:36,125
I would see my dad usually about...
543
00:31:36,834 --> 00:31:38,542
maybe every two years.
544
00:31:38,625 --> 00:31:42,417
And his mental
and emotional state
545
00:31:42,500 --> 00:31:46,500
just really continued
to degrade over the years.
546
00:31:48,375 --> 00:31:53,125
He was diagnosed
with bipolar disorder.
547
00:31:54,583 --> 00:31:59,250
He was doing things like
disappearing in the night and,
548
00:31:59,333 --> 00:32:04,917
and going on walks
through the city, through LA.
549
00:32:05,000 --> 00:32:09,625
And catching buses,
and, and we'd have to find him.
550
00:32:10,834 --> 00:32:13,291
You know,
I think it kind of scared
551
00:32:13,375 --> 00:32:15,083
Wade a little bit, and...
552
00:32:15,166 --> 00:32:19,917
and Chantal, which didn't help
their relationship at all.
553
00:32:21,750 --> 00:32:24,041
I mean,
I think it terrified me,
554
00:32:24,125 --> 00:32:25,917
but my reaction to it
555
00:32:26,000 --> 00:32:28,959
was just to get angry.
556
00:32:29,041 --> 00:32:30,625
And like, I just
wanted him to go.
557
00:32:30,709 --> 00:32:33,500
Should we go on,
continue?
558
00:32:35,250 --> 00:32:38,000
Wade really pushed my dad away.
559
00:32:40,583 --> 00:32:42,500
He didn't understand
why he had to...
560
00:32:42,583 --> 00:32:45,291
to understand him 'cause
he didn't even know him really.
561
00:32:45,375 --> 00:32:49,542
You know, didn't feel that he
needed this person in his life.
562
00:32:51,250 --> 00:32:54,041
We talked a lot,
and at some point, he said to me,
563
00:32:54,125 --> 00:32:56,041
"Don't you ever let
anybody tell you
564
00:32:56,125 --> 00:32:58,458
that you did the wrong thing."
565
00:32:58,542 --> 00:33:02,125
He said, "You did
the right thing for Wade,
566
00:33:02,208 --> 00:33:03,917
and it was the right
thing for me."
567
00:33:04,000 --> 00:33:06,959
He said, "I learned to stand
on my own two feet.
568
00:33:07,041 --> 00:33:09,458
"I was so dependent on you,
569
00:33:09,542 --> 00:33:11,542
"and I had to learn
to live without you,
570
00:33:11,625 --> 00:33:14,375
and stand on my own
two feet." So, he did...
571
00:33:15,375 --> 00:33:18,500
he did rise above it
for a while.
572
00:33:18,583 --> 00:33:22,542
It's only when
Shane left that, um...
573
00:33:23,250 --> 00:33:25,667
he couldn't cope anymore.
574
00:33:30,709 --> 00:33:34,291
At that point,
I didn't know if I was leaving for good.
575
00:33:34,917 --> 00:33:36,834
I said,
"I'm taking six months off
576
00:33:36,917 --> 00:33:38,959
to go and hang out
with the family."
577
00:33:41,500 --> 00:33:43,125
The day that I left,
578
00:33:43,208 --> 00:33:47,333
my grandparents,
his mom and dad, and Dad,
579
00:33:47,417 --> 00:33:51,250
came over to say goodbye
before I headed to the airport.
580
00:33:53,250 --> 00:33:56,667
And I remember Dad
didn't say a word.
581
00:33:57,083 --> 00:33:59,917
Not... just, nothing at all.
He was just...
582
00:34:00,000 --> 00:34:01,333
kind of like a statue.
583
00:34:01,417 --> 00:34:05,291
Kind of just staring off
in the distance and, um...
584
00:34:06,333 --> 00:34:08,250
and then I remember, like,
585
00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:11,208
saying goodbye
and giving him a hug,
586
00:34:11,834 --> 00:34:15,458
and I don't... I don't
even think he hugged me.
587
00:34:15,542 --> 00:34:17,291
I think he just stood
there while I hugged him.
588
00:34:17,375 --> 00:34:20,583
He was just,
you know, like...
589
00:34:21,417 --> 00:34:24,041
you know, the lights were on,
but no one was home.
590
00:34:39,583 --> 00:34:43,834
I feel like I'd been
here for a day, maybe.
591
00:34:44,959 --> 00:34:48,083
Mom was driving
around in the car.
592
00:34:48,166 --> 00:34:51,417
I get a phone call,
and it was...
593
00:34:51,500 --> 00:34:54,583
like, my girlfriend
at the time,
594
00:34:54,667 --> 00:34:56,166
from Australia.
595
00:34:56,250 --> 00:34:59,000
And she was
a police officer as well.
596
00:34:59,834 --> 00:35:02,417
And she called me
and said, uh,
597
00:35:02,500 --> 00:35:07,417
You know, "Sorry, Shane,
but your dad's dead."
598
00:35:07,500 --> 00:35:12,667
The day that he left,
his father hung himself.
599
00:35:16,834 --> 00:35:20,375
I think my response was
just anger, at first.
600
00:35:21,333 --> 00:35:25,959
"You asshole." Basically,
I was kind of pissed off.
601
00:35:26,041 --> 00:35:29,375
He had hung himself...
in his apartment.
602
00:35:31,417 --> 00:35:33,583
His mom and dad found him.
603
00:35:38,083 --> 00:35:43,125
I was...
in a recording session.
604
00:35:43,208 --> 00:35:47,083
I was writing and producing
some music for a pop group.
605
00:35:47,166 --> 00:35:49,750
Got out of the recording
session, went to my car,
606
00:35:49,834 --> 00:35:55,709
and I had all these kind of
missed calls from my mother.
607
00:35:55,792 --> 00:35:57,834
She told me...
608
00:36:01,125 --> 00:36:03,208
"Your dad died."
609
00:36:03,291 --> 00:36:05,166
I brought all the children in...
610
00:36:05,250 --> 00:36:07,458
home for the night,
and we stayed up all night,
611
00:36:07,542 --> 00:36:10,959
and we laughed and we cried
and we laughed and we cried.
612
00:36:12,125 --> 00:36:14,959
But then, from...
613
00:36:15,041 --> 00:36:17,709
I think, the next day...
614
00:36:21,875 --> 00:36:24,000
I don't know, I felt like
I just started
615
00:36:24,083 --> 00:36:26,417
...stitching myself up
again already.
616
00:36:26,500 --> 00:36:28,625
One, two,
three, four.
617
00:36:39,041 --> 00:36:41,500
I mean, after the funeral was done,
and we went back
618
00:36:41,583 --> 00:36:44,000
to Los Angeles,
619
00:36:44,083 --> 00:36:46,667
I just went back to
the business of moving on,
620
00:36:46,750 --> 00:36:49,417
and getting back to work.
621
00:36:49,500 --> 00:36:53,625
And I see what's
really going on
622
00:36:53,709 --> 00:36:57,500
At 17, with 'NSYNC,
I directed what I think,
623
00:36:57,583 --> 00:37:00,208
at the time, was
considered the largest tour,
624
00:37:00,291 --> 00:37:03,333
I mean, just in scale, the size
that had ever happened.
625
00:37:06,208 --> 00:37:09,875
Baby, you're not
the only one
626
00:37:09,959 --> 00:37:13,000
You might not have heard of
Wade Robson, but right now,
627
00:37:13,083 --> 00:37:15,792
he's one of the biggest
names in world music.
628
00:37:15,875 --> 00:37:18,208
The Queensland-born
19-year-old
629
00:37:18,291 --> 00:37:19,875
has found fame and fortune
630
00:37:19,959 --> 00:37:22,583
as the most sought-after
hit-maker in America.
631
00:37:22,667 --> 00:37:25,875
The creative force behind
pop star Britney Spears
632
00:37:25,959 --> 00:37:27,500
and boy band 'NSYNC.
633
00:37:27,583 --> 00:37:31,709
At 16,
after the family had moved to LA,
634
00:37:31,792 --> 00:37:34,583
he started choreographing
Britney Spears.
635
00:37:34,667 --> 00:37:38,208
She was so impressed, she asked
him to take creative control
636
00:37:38,291 --> 00:37:40,625
of every facet of her worldwide
637
00:37:40,709 --> 00:37:43,125
Dream Within A Dream tour.
638
00:37:43,667 --> 00:37:45,250
She works real hard,
so that's important.
639
00:37:45,333 --> 00:37:49,083
And I'm a workaholic,
and a slave driver, you know.
640
00:37:49,166 --> 00:37:52,375
But she's willing to put in
the work, so that's always...
641
00:37:52,458 --> 00:37:54,083
that always helps. Um...
642
00:37:54,166 --> 00:37:56,625
You're probably every guy's hero,
you know that?
643
00:37:56,709 --> 00:37:58,166
I guess so.
644
00:37:58,250 --> 00:38:00,125
Thank you so much, Little Rock.
645
00:38:00,208 --> 00:38:03,208
You've been such
a wonderful audience!
646
00:38:03,291 --> 00:38:07,125
Michael had some sort
of obsession with Britney.
647
00:38:08,375 --> 00:38:12,125
And he would call me,
and he'd wanna know,
648
00:38:12,208 --> 00:38:15,083
um, you know, what it was
like working with her,
649
00:38:15,166 --> 00:38:17,542
and what she was like,
and, uh,
650
00:38:17,625 --> 00:38:19,792
"Isn't she sexy?
Isn't she beautiful?"
651
00:38:19,875 --> 00:38:21,500
One and two and three and...
652
00:38:21,583 --> 00:38:25,083
Wondering if I can set up,
like, a way for them to meet.
653
00:38:25,667 --> 00:38:29,208
And in those conversations,
as well, Michael was really...
654
00:38:30,291 --> 00:38:36,250
interested in my...
sexual life with girls.
655
00:38:39,250 --> 00:38:42,375
I remember that being
just really weird,
656
00:38:42,458 --> 00:38:47,750
considering Michael
and I's whole sexual history.
657
00:38:47,834 --> 00:38:50,792
It was a weird pull 'cause
while at the same time,
658
00:38:50,875 --> 00:38:55,166
I mean, I still...
loved him deeply.
659
00:38:57,083 --> 00:39:01,959
Maybe one day,
I was gonna be the friend
660
00:39:02,041 --> 00:39:06,250
for him that he could have
a real, honest,
661
00:39:06,333 --> 00:39:09,083
vulnerable conversation with.
662
00:39:09,166 --> 00:39:12,458
The one person that he could
really be real with.
663
00:39:27,125 --> 00:39:30,750
My name is Laura Primack,
and I am James's wife.
664
00:39:30,834 --> 00:39:33,709
I grew up in the suburbs
outside of Chicago.
665
00:39:33,792 --> 00:39:35,166
I went to college
on the East Coast.
666
00:39:35,250 --> 00:39:38,083
I went to an art school
in Rhode Island, and...
667
00:39:38,166 --> 00:39:40,834
afterwards, I thought,
before I settle back home,
668
00:39:40,917 --> 00:39:42,208
I should try the other coast.
669
00:39:45,542 --> 00:39:49,375
There was a dive bar very close
to my apartment in Hollywood.
670
00:39:51,250 --> 00:39:54,375
And I would go there on
almost a nightly basis.
671
00:40:00,750 --> 00:40:02,333
One night, a girlfriend
of mine said
672
00:40:02,417 --> 00:40:04,875
she wanted to go there
'cause she had a crush
673
00:40:04,959 --> 00:40:08,750
on a guy in the band,
which was actually James.
674
00:40:14,125 --> 00:40:16,166
He was in a band called Skylab.
675
00:40:16,250 --> 00:40:18,208
The singer was British,
676
00:40:18,291 --> 00:40:20,959
and the music was kind of
like Smashing Pumpkins
677
00:40:21,041 --> 00:40:22,834
or Radiohead and, um,
678
00:40:22,917 --> 00:40:24,083
they were really fun to watch.
679
00:40:24,166 --> 00:40:26,250
They were really
good performers.
680
00:40:31,834 --> 00:40:33,250
So, I went to the bar
to meet her,
681
00:40:33,333 --> 00:40:36,542
and she ended up
falling ill, didn't come.
682
00:40:36,625 --> 00:40:39,208
So, when James's band was up at the bar,
buying drinks,
683
00:40:39,291 --> 00:40:42,000
I decided to go up
and introduce myself.
684
00:40:43,834 --> 00:40:45,583
I mean, he looked the part.
He looked awesome,
685
00:40:45,667 --> 00:40:47,583
but the first thing he said
when I told him I was there
686
00:40:47,667 --> 00:40:49,709
to see him 'cause my friend
thought he was cute was,
687
00:40:49,792 --> 00:40:52,667
"I don't think you're
talking about me."
688
00:40:52,750 --> 00:40:55,750
He seemed so wholeheartedly
689
00:40:55,834 --> 00:40:58,792
modest and humble and...
It just caught me off guard
690
00:40:58,875 --> 00:41:02,792
'cause that's not what I had
experienced in Los Angeles so far.
691
00:41:12,250 --> 00:41:13,917
She was really sweet,
692
00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:16,375
and, um, she's very upbeat.
693
00:41:17,750 --> 00:41:20,041
She just turned out
to be a great person,
694
00:41:20,125 --> 00:41:21,834
so I got lucky.
695
00:41:21,917 --> 00:41:25,583
I think the first night
that I went to his house,
696
00:41:25,667 --> 00:41:27,959
um, it was late at night.
697
00:41:28,041 --> 00:41:30,834
He probably had a band practice,
so maybe I got there at 11:00,
698
00:41:30,917 --> 00:41:33,709
but he had candies
on the side of the bed,
699
00:41:33,792 --> 00:41:35,834
and an intention that we were
gonna watch Harry Potter.
700
00:41:35,917 --> 00:41:38,875
I mean, that was his, like,
"Come on over we'll have a date night thing."
701
00:41:38,959 --> 00:41:42,250
And I thought the fact that he had
just bought me candies was adorable.
702
00:41:42,333 --> 00:41:44,083
So, I think we moved
in together about
703
00:41:44,166 --> 00:41:46,166
six months after
we'd started dating.
704
00:41:46,250 --> 00:41:47,792
I think right around
that time, too,
705
00:41:47,875 --> 00:41:51,834
James had been taking art
classes at a local art school
706
00:41:51,917 --> 00:41:54,333
and doing his homework
in our office.
707
00:41:54,417 --> 00:41:57,542
And at that point, we were growing,
we needed more help,
708
00:41:57,625 --> 00:42:00,709
and our owner said, "Why don't
come in and work with us?"
709
00:42:00,792 --> 00:42:02,834
So, we went from dating,
to living together,
710
00:42:02,917 --> 00:42:04,667
to living together
and working together,
711
00:42:04,750 --> 00:42:07,458
so it got very
intense very quick
712
00:42:07,542 --> 00:42:10,000
when you combine
all those things.
713
00:42:10,083 --> 00:42:12,000
It was a pretty
traditional start.
714
00:42:12,083 --> 00:42:14,375
That's not to say that, um,
715
00:42:14,458 --> 00:42:16,625
there weren't ups and downs,
but from my perspective,
716
00:42:16,709 --> 00:42:20,000
they were the kinds of ups and
downs that most relationships had.
717
00:42:26,750 --> 00:42:29,917
Secrets will eat you up.
718
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:33,291
It sucks life out of you,
719
00:42:33,375 --> 00:42:36,750
just deteriorates
you from the inside.
720
00:42:36,834 --> 00:42:40,041
Like a part of you is dead.
721
00:42:40,125 --> 00:42:42,208
It kind of took everything I had
722
00:42:42,291 --> 00:42:45,375
to function during the day,
723
00:42:45,458 --> 00:42:48,917
to let other people see me
as a functioning person.
724
00:42:50,500 --> 00:42:53,250
So, it took a lot
of effort to...
725
00:42:55,333 --> 00:42:57,750
to keep it together.
726
00:42:59,000 --> 00:43:02,625
And then, I would go home
and... and be a wreck.
727
00:43:02,709 --> 00:43:06,166
And it was hard... I'm sure
it was hard on my wife.
728
00:43:12,417 --> 00:43:16,625
You know, James had a lot of...
personality quirks.
729
00:43:16,709 --> 00:43:18,291
You know, he'd go through
730
00:43:18,375 --> 00:43:20,875
bouts where he just wanted
to stay in bed all weekend
731
00:43:20,959 --> 00:43:23,917
and watch TV, or, um...
732
00:43:24,000 --> 00:43:25,834
you know, be a little bit
more antisocial.
733
00:43:25,917 --> 00:43:30,166
But, for me, especially
'cause I know that I am a people person, I...
734
00:43:30,250 --> 00:43:32,625
a lot of these things,
I just assumed were what it's like
735
00:43:32,709 --> 00:43:34,083
when you're not
a people person.
736
00:43:34,166 --> 00:43:37,000
I loved it. I mean,
from my perspective,
737
00:43:37,083 --> 00:43:39,250
"Oh, let's stay in
and cuddle and watch movies,
738
00:43:39,333 --> 00:43:41,417
and be in the dark and never
leave the house."
739
00:43:41,500 --> 00:43:43,917
And then, you know,
maybe after the first year, I was like,
740
00:43:44,000 --> 00:43:47,583
"Well, should we just go to Target
and get groceries, or do something?"
741
00:43:47,667 --> 00:43:52,000
Later on, as it didn't
really go away, it...
742
00:43:52,083 --> 00:43:55,458
you know, it could get a little
bit more boring or confusing.
743
00:43:57,041 --> 00:43:59,542
I couldn't sleep, and...
744
00:43:59,625 --> 00:44:02,917
I would have just
panic attacks about
745
00:44:03,000 --> 00:44:06,166
things that shouldn't give
me panic attacks, and...
746
00:44:06,250 --> 00:44:09,959
One of the weird things is not
liking yourself and not knowing why.
747
00:44:10,041 --> 00:44:14,542
Like, I didn't know why
I had these problems
748
00:44:14,625 --> 00:44:16,583
or felt these ways.
749
00:44:16,667 --> 00:44:19,417
Constant anxiety and...
750
00:44:19,500 --> 00:44:21,667
and then depression and...
751
00:44:23,583 --> 00:44:26,458
not knowing why
you're like that.
752
00:44:28,875 --> 00:44:32,458
When I was in my early 20s,
I did a lot of...
753
00:44:32,542 --> 00:44:37,792
substances to help
deal with it.
754
00:44:37,875 --> 00:44:41,208
At the time, I didn't know
that that's what I was doing.
755
00:44:41,917 --> 00:44:45,750
But then, when I got
off the substances,
756
00:44:45,834 --> 00:44:48,166
and there was
nothing to mask it,
757
00:44:48,250 --> 00:44:50,250
was when I was...
758
00:44:51,917 --> 00:44:57,709
really noticed
that I was anxious all the time.
759
00:45:02,458 --> 00:45:05,792
How the hell did you get up there?
760
00:45:05,875 --> 00:45:07,959
Oh, baby.
761
00:45:08,750 --> 00:45:10,458
It's pretty.
762
00:45:11,875 --> 00:45:15,917
My name is Amanda Robson,
and I am Wade's wife.
763
00:45:16,750 --> 00:45:20,375
Wade and I met at a nightclub,
764
00:45:20,458 --> 00:45:23,542
and I was working
as a promoter there.
765
00:45:23,625 --> 00:45:26,375
My girlfriend and I
were just like totally
766
00:45:26,458 --> 00:45:28,041
playing around
on the dance floor,
767
00:45:28,125 --> 00:45:30,041
dancing very goofy.
768
00:45:30,125 --> 00:45:33,000
And Wade and his friends,
769
00:45:33,083 --> 00:45:35,750
kind of like, jokingly
770
00:45:35,834 --> 00:45:38,583
called us out to do
like a little battle,
771
00:45:38,667 --> 00:45:41,625
which I didn't know
who Wade was at the time.
772
00:45:43,166 --> 00:45:45,375
This huge crowd
773
00:45:45,458 --> 00:45:48,208
began to form around us,
774
00:45:48,291 --> 00:45:51,417
and then Wade and his
friends went into this
775
00:45:51,500 --> 00:45:53,834
full-on choreographed routine
776
00:45:53,917 --> 00:45:57,709
and made us look
really ridiculous.
777
00:46:02,875 --> 00:46:05,834
My girlfriend that
I was at the club with
778
00:46:05,917 --> 00:46:08,375
was like, "Do you know
who that is? That's
779
00:46:08,458 --> 00:46:11,792
Wade Robson,
'NSYNC's choreographer,"
780
00:46:11,875 --> 00:46:16,166
and, you know,
thought it was very cool.
781
00:46:17,083 --> 00:46:19,333
And I thought he was
a total asshole.
782
00:46:19,417 --> 00:46:21,917
He was 19,
783
00:46:22,000 --> 00:46:24,125
and I was 22.
784
00:46:24,208 --> 00:46:26,000
On our first date,
785
00:46:26,083 --> 00:46:28,083
I remember him, um,
786
00:46:28,166 --> 00:46:30,542
you know, mentioning
Michael Jackson was
787
00:46:30,625 --> 00:46:35,792
a huge part of why
they came over from Australia,
788
00:46:35,875 --> 00:46:38,291
and that Michael was his
789
00:46:38,375 --> 00:46:41,667
teacher and role model.
790
00:46:41,750 --> 00:46:44,667
It was like, wow,
that sounds really intense.
791
00:46:44,750 --> 00:46:46,458
That's what it
sounded like to me.
792
00:46:51,166 --> 00:46:56,291
I had really started a whole new aspect
793
00:46:56,375 --> 00:46:59,917
of my adult life with Amanda.
794
00:47:06,250 --> 00:47:09,917
She'd, you know, been
this incredible breath
795
00:47:10,000 --> 00:47:12,333
of fresh air to me.
796
00:47:16,625 --> 00:47:20,333
And her perspective on life,
797
00:47:20,417 --> 00:47:24,375
what life meant to her,
what relationships meant to her
798
00:47:24,458 --> 00:47:26,959
was just so clear.
799
00:47:41,625 --> 00:47:43,000
Good afternoon.
I'm Ken Shemwell,
800
00:47:43,083 --> 00:47:45,291
undersheriff,
Santa Barbara County.
801
00:47:46,583 --> 00:47:48,083
In June of 2003,
802
00:47:48,166 --> 00:47:50,500
the Santa Barbara County
Sheriff's Department
803
00:47:50,583 --> 00:47:52,875
received information
that a 13-year-old boy
804
00:47:52,959 --> 00:47:55,917
was a possible
victim of lewd acts.
805
00:47:56,000 --> 00:47:59,375
The allegation claimed that
entertainer Michael Jackson
806
00:47:59,458 --> 00:48:02,750
had engaged in these
activities with the victim
807
00:48:02,834 --> 00:48:05,083
while a guest
at the Neverland Ranch.
808
00:48:05,166 --> 00:48:07,333
Is the manager here?
809
00:48:07,417 --> 00:48:09,041
- Manager?
- Manager.
810
00:48:09,125 --> 00:48:12,041
I'm gonna get a uniform for you.
Man 2: Okay.
811
00:48:12,125 --> 00:48:14,375
We got, uh...
812
00:48:14,458 --> 00:48:16,125
This morning, investigators
813
00:48:16,208 --> 00:48:18,083
effected the service
of a search warrant
814
00:48:18,166 --> 00:48:19,875
as a part of an investigation.
815
00:48:22,792 --> 00:48:26,709
An arrest warrant for
Mr. Jackson has been issued
816
00:48:26,792 --> 00:48:29,333
on multiple counts
of child molestation.
817
00:48:30,041 --> 00:48:34,375
Boom, there's these
new allegations.
818
00:48:36,333 --> 00:48:39,375
And all of this
craziness unfolds,
819
00:48:39,458 --> 00:48:41,792
I mean, that I see
via the news.
820
00:48:46,917 --> 00:48:49,250
Good day, everyone.
Pop star Michael Jackson
821
00:48:49,333 --> 00:48:51,959
is now under arrest, and,
at this hour, is in the custody
822
00:48:52,041 --> 00:48:54,834
of a Santa Barbara, California
Sheriff's department.
823
00:48:55,667 --> 00:49:00,750
Michael in handcuffs was,
uh, painful to see.
824
00:49:00,834 --> 00:49:03,208
When Michael Jackson was arrested,
825
00:49:03,291 --> 00:49:05,583
his mugshot was taken,
he was fingerprinted,
826
00:49:05,667 --> 00:49:07,083
he gave up his passport,
827
00:49:07,166 --> 00:49:09,250
and he was released
on $3 million bond.
828
00:49:09,333 --> 00:49:15,625
His lawyer called the charges that could send
Jackson away to prison for years a big lie.
829
00:49:15,709 --> 00:49:16,959
If anybody doesn't think,
830
00:49:17,041 --> 00:49:19,166
based upon what's
happened so far,
831
00:49:19,250 --> 00:49:20,834
that the true motivation
832
00:49:20,917 --> 00:49:23,125
of these charges
and these allegations
833
00:49:23,208 --> 00:49:26,291
is anything but money,
and the seeking of money,
834
00:49:26,375 --> 00:49:28,333
then they're living
in their own Neverland.
835
00:49:28,417 --> 00:49:31,083
Jackson faces nine charges total,
836
00:49:31,166 --> 00:49:34,333
seven for committing a lewd
act on a child under 14,
837
00:49:34,417 --> 00:49:36,250
and two for giving the child
838
00:49:36,333 --> 00:49:39,959
an intoxicating agent
for the purpose of molestation.
839
00:49:40,041 --> 00:49:44,166
We will land on you
like a ton of bricks.
840
00:49:44,250 --> 00:49:46,875
We will land on you
like a hammer.
841
00:49:46,959 --> 00:49:48,792
If you do anything
842
00:49:48,875 --> 00:49:51,625
to besmirch
this man's reputation,
843
00:49:51,709 --> 00:49:55,500
we will unleash a legal torrent
like you've never seen.
844
00:49:55,583 --> 00:49:56,834
We will demand...
845
00:49:56,917 --> 00:49:58,792
Michael called,
846
00:49:58,875 --> 00:50:02,333
and I hadn't talked to him
in a really long time.
847
00:50:03,625 --> 00:50:07,125
And I had known
of the trial, so...
848
00:50:08,709 --> 00:50:12,959
I kind of saw the pattern
from before happen again.
849
00:50:15,417 --> 00:50:17,667
He called my parents,
850
00:50:17,750 --> 00:50:21,417
and tried to convince
them to...
851
00:50:21,500 --> 00:50:24,750
testify for him
and get involved.
852
00:50:25,792 --> 00:50:28,959
And my dad was very much
853
00:50:29,041 --> 00:50:31,750
like, back to,
"Let's protect Michael."
854
00:50:32,750 --> 00:50:36,834
Michael could do no wrong
in my husband's eyes.
855
00:50:36,917 --> 00:50:41,166
He felt what Michael did for the
world made the world happy...
856
00:50:41,250 --> 00:50:45,667
all his songs about peace
and love in the world.
857
00:50:45,750 --> 00:50:50,291
That's how my husband saw
Michael... the songs he sang.
858
00:50:51,625 --> 00:50:55,000
And he truly believed it.
859
00:51:01,500 --> 00:51:06,375
Make a better place
for you and for me
860
00:51:06,458 --> 00:51:09,625
I absolutely didn't believe the first time.
861
00:51:09,709 --> 00:51:13,208
It was wrong.
It was the father's greed.
862
00:51:13,291 --> 00:51:15,542
And then the second time,
863
00:51:15,625 --> 00:51:17,792
I started to question it
in my head.
864
00:51:17,875 --> 00:51:20,750
The accuser is reportedly a 12-year-old boy,
865
00:51:20,834 --> 00:51:22,375
befriended by Jackson.
866
00:51:22,458 --> 00:51:24,333
The child is
described in reports
867
00:51:24,417 --> 00:51:26,542
as having met Jackson
through a charity
868
00:51:26,625 --> 00:51:29,083
that grants wishes
for ill children.
869
00:51:31,667 --> 00:51:33,333
We didn't know this boy at all.
870
00:51:33,417 --> 00:51:37,875
This was during a period where we really
didn't have much to do with Michael.
871
00:51:37,959 --> 00:51:39,875
Once again, I thought,
you know, this is a kid
872
00:51:39,959 --> 00:51:43,083
who was suffering from
cancer, and I thought,
873
00:51:43,166 --> 00:51:45,500
defending Michael,
this was just another case
874
00:51:45,583 --> 00:51:49,208
where Michael's probably paying
for all his medical bills,
875
00:51:49,291 --> 00:51:52,500
and these people are
taking advantage of it.
876
00:51:53,583 --> 00:51:55,792
That information
about Gavin's mother,
877
00:51:55,875 --> 00:51:57,834
she had been arrested
for shoplifting,
878
00:51:57,917 --> 00:51:59,875
and she had blamed
the security people.
879
00:51:59,959 --> 00:52:02,166
There was a big
thing about that.
880
00:52:02,250 --> 00:52:06,000
They spin information
against the parents.
881
00:52:06,834 --> 00:52:08,458
I believed it all.
882
00:52:08,542 --> 00:52:12,291
He said that he wanted
to show me how to masturbate.
883
00:52:12,375 --> 00:52:14,875
He wanted to show you how to masturbate?
884
00:52:15,542 --> 00:52:18,083
Okay.
Yeah, and then I said no.
885
00:52:20,291 --> 00:52:22,417
And then he said
he could do it for me.
886
00:52:22,500 --> 00:52:23,834
Okay.
887
00:52:25,709 --> 00:52:27,709
And did he do
it for you?
888
00:52:35,709 --> 00:52:37,875
Go ahead, Gavin.
It's fine.
889
00:52:39,750 --> 00:52:41,291
He put his hand
in my pants.
890
00:52:41,375 --> 00:52:43,458
Did he put it
on the outside?
891
00:52:43,542 --> 00:52:45,208
- Inside.
- Inside?
892
00:52:45,291 --> 00:52:47,083
What did
he do next?
893
00:52:47,166 --> 00:52:49,709
He started...
masturbating me.
894
00:52:50,458 --> 00:52:52,166
Okay.
895
00:52:52,250 --> 00:52:53,542
Yeah.
896
00:52:54,917 --> 00:52:57,709
I told him
I didn't want to do that.
897
00:52:57,792 --> 00:53:00,333
- Did he stop?
- I told him not to.
898
00:53:00,417 --> 00:53:02,667
He kept on doing it.
899
00:53:02,750 --> 00:53:05,417
In the time
that I was with Wade...
900
00:53:07,583 --> 00:53:10,917
you know, he didn't hear
from Michael a whole lot.
901
00:53:11,000 --> 00:53:15,583
Michael all of a sudden
started to, um,
902
00:53:16,417 --> 00:53:19,792
was starting to communicate with Wade
a whole bunch and reaching out to him.
903
00:53:19,875 --> 00:53:22,709
But it was like, everyday.
904
00:53:22,792 --> 00:53:25,041
The first conversation
905
00:53:25,125 --> 00:53:29,083
after he was arrested
was like...
906
00:53:31,417 --> 00:53:34,083
a continuation, like
picking right back up
907
00:53:34,166 --> 00:53:38,375
from the phone conversations
when I was 11,
908
00:53:38,458 --> 00:53:42,375
and the Jordy Chandler
investigation was going on.
909
00:53:42,458 --> 00:53:45,750
"Here they are again,
trying to take me down.
910
00:53:47,041 --> 00:53:49,208
These evil people."
911
00:53:54,083 --> 00:53:57,750
I would like to thank
the fans around the world...
912
00:53:57,834 --> 00:53:59,208
Can you speak up,
please?
913
00:53:59,291 --> 00:54:02,125
I would like to thank
the fans around the world
914
00:54:02,792 --> 00:54:05,792
for your love and your support,
from every corner of the Earth.
915
00:54:05,875 --> 00:54:07,667
My family,
who's been very supportive.
916
00:54:07,750 --> 00:54:10,375
My brother Randy,
who's been incredible.
917
00:54:10,458 --> 00:54:13,208
I wanna thank the community
of Santa Maria.
918
00:54:13,291 --> 00:54:15,583
I want you to know that I...
919
00:54:15,667 --> 00:54:18,542
I love the community
of Santa Maria very much.
920
00:54:19,375 --> 00:54:22,375
It's my community.
I love the people.
921
00:54:22,458 --> 00:54:24,500
I will always love the people.
My children were born
922
00:54:24,583 --> 00:54:27,208
in this community.
My home is in this community.
923
00:54:27,291 --> 00:54:28,667
I will always love
this community
924
00:54:28,750 --> 00:54:30,166
from the bottom of my heart.
925
00:54:30,250 --> 00:54:32,792
That's why I moved here.
Thank you very much.
926
00:54:34,834 --> 00:54:39,000
So,
I was 21 or 22 at this point,
927
00:54:39,083 --> 00:54:42,417
and I really did not wanna
go through this again.
928
00:54:42,500 --> 00:54:44,834
I did not wanna testify.
929
00:54:44,917 --> 00:54:48,500
So, at some point,
I worked up the courage
930
00:54:48,583 --> 00:54:52,792
to tell Michael
that I don't wanna testify.
931
00:54:53,375 --> 00:54:57,208
I remember silence
on the phone for a while.
932
00:55:00,250 --> 00:55:01,959
He said, "You know, I...
933
00:55:02,041 --> 00:55:06,583
"You know, I understand.
I understand it's really hard and it's...
934
00:55:06,667 --> 00:55:10,375
"it's tough to go through this with
all of the media and everything.
935
00:55:13,208 --> 00:55:17,333
"Yeah, but, you know,
we can't let them do this to us.
936
00:55:19,166 --> 00:55:21,375
We can't let them take us down."
937
00:55:22,834 --> 00:55:25,500
Us, us, us, you know?
938
00:55:27,250 --> 00:55:30,000
I was kind of breaking, like,
939
00:55:30,083 --> 00:55:32,250
having a nervous breakdown.
940
00:55:33,250 --> 00:55:34,875
And I didn't wanna be involved.
941
00:55:34,959 --> 00:55:37,125
And so I told my mom...
942
00:55:38,125 --> 00:55:41,875
then that he wasn't
a good person.
943
00:55:44,208 --> 00:55:45,792
And that, um...
944
00:55:46,667 --> 00:55:48,375
I don't want them involved.
945
00:55:50,583 --> 00:55:52,583
So, that was tough.
946
00:55:55,625 --> 00:55:58,333
Jimmy was over,
and he said to me,
947
00:55:58,417 --> 00:56:01,041
"Michael's an evil man."
948
00:56:01,125 --> 00:56:03,709
And I just said okay.
949
00:56:03,792 --> 00:56:08,500
And... I stood up
and I hugged him.
950
00:56:08,583 --> 00:56:11,166
And, "Do you wanna go to...
Do you wanna go get help?"
951
00:56:11,250 --> 00:56:14,208
"Oh, no, no, Mom!
And you can't tell anybody!
952
00:56:14,291 --> 00:56:16,583
You can't..." He was so afraid
953
00:56:16,667 --> 00:56:19,333
that I would tell somebody.
954
00:56:19,417 --> 00:56:22,000
Super scared, like...
955
00:56:22,083 --> 00:56:23,750
like a nervous-breakdown scared.
956
00:56:23,834 --> 00:56:27,625
It was a begging sort of,
"You can't tell anybody!"
957
00:56:27,709 --> 00:56:30,542
"I promise that. I promise
I won't tell anybody."
958
00:56:30,625 --> 00:56:34,625
And I felt that I had fucked up
so much the first time,
959
00:56:34,709 --> 00:56:38,834
that I wasn't the mother that
I should've been, guarding him,
960
00:56:38,917 --> 00:56:41,500
that he's come to me
with this truth
961
00:56:41,583 --> 00:56:44,709
that's killing him right now,
962
00:56:44,792 --> 00:56:47,208
I wasn't gonna tell anybody.
963
00:56:47,291 --> 00:56:49,917
I could be there for him now.
964
00:56:50,000 --> 00:56:53,583
I didn't talk with her
really about it.
965
00:56:53,667 --> 00:56:55,709
I couldn't talk about it.
966
00:56:55,792 --> 00:57:00,291
I just said enough
to, like, not get them involved.
967
00:57:01,834 --> 00:57:04,709
And she never... pushed.
968
00:57:07,000 --> 00:57:08,750
For once in his life,
Michael Jackson
969
00:57:08,834 --> 00:57:10,625
was not the center
of attention,
970
00:57:10,709 --> 00:57:14,291
even though this has been
a crucial day in his trial.
971
00:57:14,375 --> 00:57:16,375
The focus instead
was on the defense's
972
00:57:16,458 --> 00:57:19,291
first celebrity witness,
the actor Macaulay Culkin.
973
00:57:19,375 --> 00:57:22,041
The prosecution had suggested
974
00:57:22,125 --> 00:57:25,917
that in the early 1990s, he was
one of a number of young boys
975
00:57:26,000 --> 00:57:28,959
who'd been sexually
abused by Jackson.
976
00:57:30,166 --> 00:57:33,750
Actually, Wade had asked me not to testify,
that's how it started.
977
00:57:33,834 --> 00:57:36,000
He came to me and said,
978
00:57:36,083 --> 00:57:38,083
"I do not want you
to testify this time.
979
00:57:38,166 --> 00:57:40,417
I'm not going to either."
980
00:57:40,500 --> 00:57:42,792
And he said, "Just...
You know, I don't wanna
981
00:57:42,875 --> 00:57:44,750
go through all that again.
I've had enough."
982
00:57:44,834 --> 00:57:47,667
I said, "Well, okay, I'm gonna
ask you as an adult now."
983
00:57:47,750 --> 00:57:50,417
He was 21 at this point. I said,
"I haven't asked you this
984
00:57:50,500 --> 00:57:52,625
"for many, many years,
since you were a child.
985
00:57:52,709 --> 00:57:55,000
"But I'm gonna ask you one
more time, as an adult.
986
00:57:55,083 --> 00:57:58,959
Did Michael ever do anything
inappropriate with you?"
987
00:57:59,041 --> 00:58:02,458
And he, once again, looked
me in the eye and said, "No.
988
00:58:02,542 --> 00:58:04,458
He never did."
989
00:58:04,542 --> 00:58:05,875
I said, "So..."
990
00:58:05,959 --> 00:58:08,000
I said, "I think
you need to testify.
991
00:58:08,083 --> 00:58:09,291
This is your friend."
992
00:58:09,375 --> 00:58:11,542
And I said,
"I think at this point,
993
00:58:11,625 --> 00:58:13,083
"you and Macaulay Culkin
are probably
994
00:58:13,166 --> 00:58:16,375
"the only two people in
the world who can save him.
995
00:58:16,458 --> 00:58:17,834
"And if Michael goes
to prison,
996
00:58:17,917 --> 00:58:20,125
he won't survive prison,
you know that."
997
00:58:20,208 --> 00:58:22,792
Like, I would have dreams and...
998
00:58:22,875 --> 00:58:25,333
of Michael being in jail
999
00:58:25,417 --> 00:58:27,625
and being killed in jail,
1000
00:58:27,709 --> 00:58:30,834
or dying in jail.
I mean, just like...
1001
00:58:30,917 --> 00:58:34,291
Those two things,
Michael Jackson and jail,
1002
00:58:34,375 --> 00:58:37,041
just did not go together for me.
1003
00:58:37,125 --> 00:58:42,458
I mean, I still...
loved him deeply, you know?
1004
00:58:42,542 --> 00:58:45,166
Macaulay Culkin almost single-handedly
1005
00:58:45,250 --> 00:58:47,417
devastated and shook
the foundation
1006
00:58:47,500 --> 00:58:51,500
of the prosecution's pattern
evidence against Michael Jackson.
1007
00:58:51,583 --> 00:58:53,667
Newsman 2: Certainly,
if the jury believes Culkin,
1008
00:58:53,750 --> 00:58:56,542
it will be a significant
boost for the defense.
1009
00:59:01,417 --> 00:59:04,083
And he asked me to testify,
1010
00:59:04,166 --> 00:59:06,583
and, um, I said no.
1011
00:59:06,667 --> 00:59:09,542
And he got really angry at me,
1012
00:59:09,625 --> 00:59:12,291
and, um, he threatened me.
1013
00:59:13,792 --> 00:59:15,375
I had never seen him
this angry.
1014
00:59:15,458 --> 00:59:18,709
It was like, more like,
"Okay, you're enemy now."
1015
00:59:18,792 --> 00:59:21,041
He threatened me
with his lawyers,
1016
00:59:21,125 --> 00:59:24,000
and said that I had perjured
myself years ago,
1017
00:59:24,083 --> 00:59:27,750
and that he has the best
lawyers in the world and...
1018
00:59:27,834 --> 00:59:29,834
that they were gonna get me.
1019
00:59:31,291 --> 00:59:33,000
And I just said,
1020
00:59:33,083 --> 00:59:37,125
"I don't want any part of it.
You'll hear nothing from me.
1021
00:59:37,208 --> 00:59:38,458
You know, don't worry."
1022
00:59:38,542 --> 00:59:40,709
I was just trying
to calm him down
1023
00:59:40,792 --> 00:59:43,333
to get him off the phone.
1024
00:59:52,291 --> 00:59:56,000
The last time I talked to him
was near the end of the trial.
1025
00:59:58,166 --> 01:00:00,625
And he tried again to...
1026
01:00:00,709 --> 01:00:03,291
he wanted me to testify.
1027
01:00:04,166 --> 01:00:08,750
And he, like,
went into a spiel about...
1028
01:00:08,834 --> 01:00:11,083
"I'm sorry I haven't
been there for you,
1029
01:00:11,166 --> 01:00:13,083
"like, for directing
and all that stuff.
1030
01:00:13,166 --> 01:00:15,333
"Let's do something.
1031
01:00:16,583 --> 01:00:18,625
I know I haven't been there."
1032
01:00:19,417 --> 01:00:21,875
And, uh, I cut
the conversation short.
1033
01:00:21,959 --> 01:00:24,333
I just said, you know,
1034
01:00:25,083 --> 01:00:27,834
"Just don't call again,"
and I hung up.
1035
01:00:28,792 --> 01:00:31,500
And that was the last time
I spoke to him.
1036
01:00:35,667 --> 01:00:38,917
Michael,
he had been reminding Wade,
1037
01:00:39,000 --> 01:00:40,959
you know, how Wade
could support him
1038
01:00:41,041 --> 01:00:43,333
and how much he loved him.
1039
01:00:43,417 --> 01:00:45,583
He wanted to talk to me, saying,
1040
01:00:45,667 --> 01:00:47,959
you know, how much
he cared about me
1041
01:00:48,041 --> 01:00:50,750
and how happy I was
in Wade's life, and...
1042
01:00:50,834 --> 01:00:53,834
Suddenly having a lot of, uh...
1043
01:00:55,041 --> 01:00:57,959
interest in Wade's life,
and how he was doing,
1044
01:00:58,041 --> 01:01:00,333
and that felt
really good to Wade.
1045
01:01:00,417 --> 01:01:02,375
And then within...
1046
01:01:03,333 --> 01:01:05,834
a week or so after that,
1047
01:01:05,917 --> 01:01:10,041
I received a subpoena
to testify.
1048
01:01:21,500 --> 01:01:23,959
Reportedly,
the grand jury will hear testimony
1049
01:01:24,041 --> 01:01:26,875
from Jackson's now
14-year-old accuser.
1050
01:01:26,959 --> 01:01:29,625
But it's also been reported
that testimony will be heard
1051
01:01:29,709 --> 01:01:32,792
from Jackson's 1993
molestation case,
1052
01:01:32,875 --> 01:01:35,333
which was settled out of court.
1053
01:01:35,417 --> 01:01:37,375
I remember asking Wade,
1054
01:01:37,458 --> 01:01:40,834
"Nothing happened to you,
right? Like, you were never...
1055
01:01:40,917 --> 01:01:42,792
Like, he never did
anything to you, did he?"
1056
01:01:42,875 --> 01:01:46,250
I just needed to...
just put it out there.
1057
01:01:46,333 --> 01:01:48,458
And he assured me,
1058
01:01:48,542 --> 01:01:51,625
"No. No. Never."
1059
01:01:52,500 --> 01:01:54,458
And I believed him.
1060
01:01:56,500 --> 01:01:59,667
The idea of this truth
1061
01:01:59,750 --> 01:02:03,166
coming out, and Amanda
knowing about it,
1062
01:02:03,250 --> 01:02:05,375
and my family knowing about it,
1063
01:02:05,458 --> 01:02:08,375
and everybody in
the entertainment business,
1064
01:02:08,458 --> 01:02:11,542
in my career knowing about it,
1065
01:02:11,625 --> 01:02:15,166
I mean, was just
a ridiculous idea
1066
01:02:15,250 --> 01:02:17,709
that was never going to happen,
in my mind,
1067
01:02:17,792 --> 01:02:21,583
because, in my mind,
my whole life would be over.
1068
01:02:22,750 --> 01:02:27,250
If I questioned Michael's...
1069
01:02:27,333 --> 01:02:30,625
perspective, that he was
telling me about Gavin,
1070
01:02:31,750 --> 01:02:35,542
that I felt like I would,
you know, I would break,
1071
01:02:35,625 --> 01:02:38,875
like, I couldn't be
as strong as I needed to be.
1072
01:02:46,667 --> 01:02:48,208
He was worried.
1073
01:02:48,291 --> 01:02:52,250
We had had dinner the night
before at Neverland,
1074
01:02:52,333 --> 01:02:55,208
and he was definitely subdued.
1075
01:03:00,667 --> 01:03:04,166
So,
we were at the ranch with all his family.
1076
01:03:04,250 --> 01:03:06,375
Michael didn't look well.
1077
01:03:06,458 --> 01:03:07,917
He looked very sick.
1078
01:03:08,000 --> 01:03:11,709
His kids were there,
everybody was there.
1079
01:03:11,792 --> 01:03:15,875
Like,
his mind was just in a whole nother place.
1080
01:03:16,000 --> 01:03:20,208
I remember...
all of us sitting at dinner.
1081
01:03:21,041 --> 01:03:25,709
And... Paris, his daughter,
1082
01:03:27,458 --> 01:03:30,542
just wanting to-to...
1083
01:03:30,625 --> 01:03:32,458
wanting her dad's attention.
1084
01:03:32,542 --> 01:03:35,834
Kind of like, pulling on his arm,
and pulling on his fingers,
1085
01:03:35,917 --> 01:03:37,959
and "Daddy, Daddy, Daddy!"
1086
01:03:38,041 --> 01:03:41,792
And he was, I mean,
he just, he wasn't there.
1087
01:03:41,875 --> 01:03:44,834
I remember that,
just feeling really sad.
1088
01:03:44,917 --> 01:03:47,500
What if he loses?
What if he goes to jail?
1089
01:03:47,583 --> 01:03:49,458
You know, and these are
the last couple of times
1090
01:03:49,542 --> 01:03:52,375
that they see
their daddy, you know?
1091
01:03:53,166 --> 01:03:57,000
Which built my conviction
even that much more
1092
01:03:58,250 --> 01:04:00,834
to, uh, to save him.
1093
01:04:01,417 --> 01:04:06,417
I think that definitely
helped Wade to go into the...
1094
01:04:06,500 --> 01:04:08,792
you know, court room feeling,
1095
01:04:08,875 --> 01:04:11,375
you know, that he wanted
to support Michael,
1096
01:04:11,458 --> 01:04:13,333
and feeling good about that.
1097
01:04:17,792 --> 01:04:20,417
To me, it was like
here was his, you know,
1098
01:04:20,500 --> 01:04:24,041
lifelong friend that
just really needed him.
1099
01:04:24,750 --> 01:04:26,917
Looking back,
1100
01:04:27,000 --> 01:04:29,834
I mean, it's horrifying
to think about,
1101
01:04:29,917 --> 01:04:32,458
you know, the...
1102
01:04:33,542 --> 01:04:37,583
what that experience
really represented for Wade.
1103
01:04:38,291 --> 01:04:39,959
Love is so powerful.
1104
01:04:45,917 --> 01:04:48,125
And I remember how...
1105
01:04:49,291 --> 01:04:51,208
white he looked,
1106
01:04:51,291 --> 01:04:55,458
and his face was
really thin, drawn out.
1107
01:04:55,542 --> 01:04:57,625
Innocent! Innocent! Innocent!
1108
01:04:57,709 --> 01:04:59,750
He looked like a statue.
1109
01:05:01,458 --> 01:05:03,125
Lifeless.
1110
01:05:09,709 --> 01:05:14,041
I testified, which was hard.
1111
01:05:14,125 --> 01:05:18,041
I mean, I think for anybody,
being on the stand
1112
01:05:18,125 --> 01:05:21,458
is just a scary scenario.
1113
01:05:22,208 --> 01:05:25,417
Because you feel like lawyers
and different are attacking you,
1114
01:05:25,500 --> 01:05:27,500
and they're saying
different things, and...
1115
01:05:27,583 --> 01:05:30,750
you know, you have
this feeling of, like...
1116
01:05:30,834 --> 01:05:33,625
did I just put
my friend in jail?
1117
01:05:33,709 --> 01:05:35,250
I was up there
for a couple hours.
1118
01:05:35,333 --> 01:05:37,208
The whole scenario was intense.
1119
01:05:37,291 --> 01:05:40,834
Wade was up
for a long time.
1120
01:05:40,917 --> 01:05:43,125
You know,
if this didn't go well for Michael,
1121
01:05:43,208 --> 01:05:45,917
he was gonna go to jail
for the rest of his life.
1122
01:05:46,000 --> 01:05:49,417
I was going to my grave
with that truth,
1123
01:05:49,500 --> 01:05:52,458
of the sexual stuff that
happened between Michael and I.
1124
01:05:52,542 --> 01:05:54,333
There was no way in hell
1125
01:05:54,417 --> 01:05:57,667
I was ever telling
anybody in the universe.
1126
01:05:59,083 --> 01:06:00,709
And that was... period.
1127
01:06:01,500 --> 01:06:03,000
Choreographer Wade Robson
1128
01:06:03,083 --> 01:06:05,166
acknowledged sharing
a bed with the singer
1129
01:06:05,250 --> 01:06:07,125
many times when he was a child,
1130
01:06:07,208 --> 01:06:09,458
but he denied
ever being molested.
1131
01:06:09,542 --> 01:06:12,291
"Did Mr. Jackson
ever molest you at any time,"
1132
01:06:12,375 --> 01:06:13,792
the defense lawyer asked.
1133
01:06:13,875 --> 01:06:16,542
"No, never,"
Wade Robson replied.
1134
01:06:16,625 --> 01:06:20,041
That contradicts testimony from
a former Michael Jackson maid,
1135
01:06:20,125 --> 01:06:23,291
who'd said she'd seen the
singer showering with the boy.
1136
01:06:23,375 --> 01:06:25,458
We've seen a parade
of witnesses saying
1137
01:06:25,542 --> 01:06:28,125
Michael Jackson's not a good guy,
this is what I saw him do.
1138
01:06:28,208 --> 01:06:31,458
If you can get one or two
or three people on that stand
1139
01:06:31,542 --> 01:06:34,250
who say,
"They were talking about me.
1140
01:06:34,333 --> 01:06:37,375
It never happened,"
very powerful.
1141
01:06:37,458 --> 01:06:40,333
Innocent! Innocent! Innocent!
1142
01:06:40,417 --> 01:06:43,125
We the jury in the above entitled case
1143
01:06:43,208 --> 01:06:47,709
find the defendant not guilty of
a lewd act upon a minor child.
1144
01:06:47,792 --> 01:06:49,834
not guilty.
1145
01:06:49,917 --> 01:06:52,750
not guilty.
1146
01:06:55,583 --> 01:06:57,667
And there it is, all 10 counts.
1147
01:06:57,750 --> 01:07:00,000
Not guilty on all 10 counts.
1148
01:07:00,083 --> 01:07:03,834
Michael Jackson will be
walking out of this courtroom
1149
01:07:03,917 --> 01:07:05,375
a free man.
1150
01:07:05,458 --> 01:07:09,458
Michael's innocent!
Michael's innocent!
1151
01:07:09,542 --> 01:07:13,083
A jury of 12 decided
the outcome of this trial.
1152
01:07:13,166 --> 01:07:14,959
Using the standard
of reasonable doubt,
1153
01:07:15,041 --> 01:07:17,583
they rendered a verdict
that was based on the facts
1154
01:07:17,667 --> 01:07:20,458
and evidence and within
the guidelines of the law.
1155
01:07:20,542 --> 01:07:23,000
We expected probably
better evidence,
1156
01:07:23,083 --> 01:07:24,458
you know,
something that was
1157
01:07:24,542 --> 01:07:26,166
a little more
convincing.
1158
01:07:26,250 --> 01:07:30,041
We just couldn't abide
the story of the mother for one.
1159
01:07:30,125 --> 01:07:34,291
I disliked it intensely when
she snapped her fingers at us.
1160
01:07:35,166 --> 01:07:39,125
That's when I thought,
"Don't snap your fingers at me, lady."
1161
01:07:42,291 --> 01:07:47,041
I feel that, uh,
Michael Jackson
1162
01:07:47,125 --> 01:07:49,208
probably has molested boys.
1163
01:07:49,291 --> 01:07:53,000
After some of the testimony
was offered,
1164
01:07:53,083 --> 01:07:55,083
I can't believe that,
1165
01:07:55,166 --> 01:07:59,125
that this man could sleep
in the same
1166
01:07:59,208 --> 01:08:03,166
bedroom for 365 straight days,
1167
01:08:03,250 --> 01:08:06,417
uh, and not do something more
1168
01:08:06,500 --> 01:08:09,375
than just watch television
and eat popcorn.
1169
01:08:11,291 --> 01:08:14,875
Yeah, like,
I can't imagine if I was Gavin,
1170
01:08:14,959 --> 01:08:18,208
or if I was Jordy at that time.
1171
01:08:18,291 --> 01:08:21,500
You know, no-no justice...
being served,
1172
01:08:21,583 --> 01:08:25,333
and not being believed
by so many people.
1173
01:08:27,542 --> 01:08:29,709
For Gavin, I wish I...
1174
01:08:30,583 --> 01:08:32,917
was at a place where
1175
01:08:33,000 --> 01:08:35,417
I could tell the truth and...
1176
01:08:35,500 --> 01:08:39,041
be a comrade with him.
1177
01:08:40,417 --> 01:08:43,000
You know, stopping
Michael and stopping
1178
01:08:43,083 --> 01:08:47,291
a lot of other kids
from being abused.
1179
01:08:48,375 --> 01:08:50,834
I just wasn't ready.
1180
01:08:50,917 --> 01:08:53,208
I wasn't able, when I was 11,
1181
01:08:53,291 --> 01:08:55,417
and when I was 22.
1182
01:08:56,542 --> 01:08:59,959
And I remember feeling
happy, for sure,
1183
01:09:00,041 --> 01:09:04,417
that he was acquitted,
that he wasn't going to jail.
1184
01:09:05,333 --> 01:09:09,458
I didn't believe or understand
1185
01:09:09,542 --> 01:09:11,291
that the sexual stuff
that happened
1186
01:09:11,375 --> 01:09:13,875
between Michael
and I was abuse.
1187
01:09:15,250 --> 01:09:19,500
I didn't feel like
I was hurt by it.
1188
01:09:19,583 --> 01:09:23,583
That it was anything bad
that happened to me.
1189
01:09:23,667 --> 01:09:25,917
At that point, it was...
1190
01:09:28,709 --> 01:09:31,709
I loved Michael.
Michael loved me.
1191
01:09:31,792 --> 01:09:35,458
This was something that happened between us,
that's it.
1192
01:09:35,542 --> 01:09:40,083
But I still had absolutely no
understanding that I was affected.
1193
01:09:40,166 --> 01:09:43,166
Or any feeling that
I was affected negatively.
1194
01:10:02,583 --> 01:10:04,834
In other news, could
Michael Jackson be planning
1195
01:10:04,917 --> 01:10:07,125
a comeback right
here in Las Vegas?
1196
01:10:07,208 --> 01:10:10,125
Lately, he has been
hiding out overseas,
1197
01:10:10,208 --> 01:10:13,083
making no public
appearances at all,
1198
01:10:13,166 --> 01:10:15,208
until, that is, Christmas Eve,
1199
01:10:15,291 --> 01:10:18,208
when he suddenly showed up
here at Caesar's Palace,
1200
01:10:18,291 --> 01:10:19,417
out of the blue,
1201
01:10:19,500 --> 01:10:22,875
and began doing holiday
shopping with his kids.
1202
01:10:29,917 --> 01:10:33,917
I was in Vegas for...
1203
01:10:34,000 --> 01:10:36,041
maybe about six months,
and I was choreographing
1204
01:10:36,125 --> 01:10:39,041
a Cirque Du Soleil show.
1205
01:10:39,125 --> 01:10:42,291
And at that point, Michael was
living in Vegas with his kids.
1206
01:10:45,458 --> 01:10:47,208
I wanted him to come see
the show,
1207
01:10:47,291 --> 01:10:49,917
and I asked him to write
some words
1208
01:10:50,000 --> 01:10:55,333
for the dancers in the show, some words of
inspiration before opening night and...
1209
01:10:56,834 --> 01:10:59,500
And one of the things he kept...
1210
01:11:00,625 --> 01:11:05,583
asking as we were
planning getting together was,
1211
01:11:05,667 --> 01:11:08,417
"You know, make sure... you're
gonna bring some wine? Yeah?"
1212
01:11:08,500 --> 01:11:12,750
So, this was a new dynamic,
which I liked as well 'cause I,
1213
01:11:12,834 --> 01:11:16,750
you know, me trying to have this
kind of normal experience with him.
1214
01:11:16,834 --> 01:11:19,333
Like, wow, cool. I'll be able
to sit there with Michael
1215
01:11:19,417 --> 01:11:21,250
and have a glass
of wine and...
1216
01:11:21,333 --> 01:11:24,041
talk about real
stuff and, you know.
1217
01:11:32,458 --> 01:11:35,250
Amanda and I go
to the grocery store and get
1218
01:11:35,333 --> 01:11:37,041
hot dogs and all
that kind of stuff,
1219
01:11:37,125 --> 01:11:39,750
and couple bottle
of wines and...
1220
01:11:39,834 --> 01:11:41,834
and go to the house.
1221
01:11:42,917 --> 01:11:45,583
And so, it's Michael
and the three kids.
1222
01:11:46,417 --> 01:11:47,792
You know, once we got in,
1223
01:11:47,875 --> 01:11:50,417
one of the first
things he asked was,
1224
01:11:50,500 --> 01:11:52,125
"Did you bring the wine?"
1225
01:11:52,208 --> 01:11:53,834
We had some, um,
1226
01:11:53,917 --> 01:11:56,333
those sort of larger
red plastic cups
1227
01:11:56,417 --> 01:11:58,917
and he grabbed one
of those and just
1228
01:11:59,000 --> 01:12:02,458
filled one up to the brim,
you know, with white wine,
1229
01:12:02,542 --> 01:12:05,208
and just chugged it down,
1230
01:12:05,291 --> 01:12:08,875
and then he kept going back
and was filling it up and...
1231
01:12:09,333 --> 01:12:11,250
So, I mean, this was
my first experience
1232
01:12:11,333 --> 01:12:14,750
of ever seeing him drink at all.
1233
01:12:14,834 --> 01:12:17,041
It was nice, and we would
crack some jokes.
1234
01:12:17,125 --> 01:12:19,083
There was still that feeling
of kind of reminiscing
1235
01:12:19,166 --> 01:12:21,750
about our relationship
from the past.
1236
01:12:21,834 --> 01:12:25,458
We watched a movie
with the kids.
1237
01:12:25,542 --> 01:12:28,625
You know, he just kept...
kept drinking.
1238
01:12:30,917 --> 01:12:32,500
And then at some point,
1239
01:12:32,583 --> 01:12:36,667
we're getting kind
of into the evening,
1240
01:12:36,750 --> 01:12:40,875
Michael says, "I'm gonna
go upstairs for a second."
1241
01:12:42,333 --> 01:12:44,333
Thirty minutes goes by,
1242
01:12:44,417 --> 01:12:46,750
an hour goes by, um,
1243
01:12:46,834 --> 01:12:49,291
you know, nothing from Michael,
he never comes back down.
1244
01:12:49,375 --> 01:12:51,417
Probably an hour,
hour and a half,
1245
01:12:51,500 --> 01:12:53,709
and we're just there with the kids,
and it's getting late now.
1246
01:12:53,792 --> 01:12:56,583
It's like 10,
or something like that.
1247
01:12:57,125 --> 01:13:00,542
So, Amanda and I are like,
"What do we...?"
1248
01:13:00,625 --> 01:13:02,792
You know, "What do we do?"
1249
01:13:02,875 --> 01:13:05,959
And I remember
asking the kids, like,
1250
01:13:06,041 --> 01:13:07,709
"Do you wanna go check on...
1251
01:13:07,792 --> 01:13:09,875
on your dad, if he's okay?"
1252
01:13:09,959 --> 01:13:12,166
And they were just
sort of like, "Nah.
1253
01:13:13,041 --> 01:13:14,750
He's fine."
1254
01:13:14,834 --> 01:13:16,500
Like it was, I mean,
it was noth...
1255
01:13:16,583 --> 01:13:19,792
it seemed like it was nothing
out of the ordinary for them.
1256
01:13:20,959 --> 01:13:24,291
And that was
the last time I saw him.
1257
01:13:37,709 --> 01:13:39,291
We're getting some
breaking news coming into
1258
01:13:39,375 --> 01:13:40,875
the Situation Room right now.
1259
01:13:40,959 --> 01:13:43,750
- What are we picking up?
- Apparently, Michael Jackson
1260
01:13:43,834 --> 01:13:46,083
suffered cardiac
arrest this afternoon.
1261
01:13:46,166 --> 01:13:49,250
He was rushed
to UCLA Medical Center.
1262
01:13:49,333 --> 01:13:51,667
CNN sources are now saying,
1263
01:13:51,750 --> 01:13:54,583
multiple sources,
that Michael Jackson
1264
01:13:54,667 --> 01:13:56,250
is in a coma.
1265
01:13:56,333 --> 01:13:57,792
You see the number of people
1266
01:13:57,875 --> 01:14:00,208
that have already gathered
outside the hospital.
1267
01:14:00,291 --> 01:14:02,750
If that isn't testament
to the star power
1268
01:14:02,834 --> 01:14:05,709
of Michael Jackson,
I don't know what is.
1269
01:14:14,125 --> 01:14:17,875
I was in my house.
1270
01:14:17,959 --> 01:14:21,667
I was working on some
choreography for a show.
1271
01:14:22,208 --> 01:14:24,792
Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.
1272
01:14:24,875 --> 01:14:28,834
And I believe it
was a friend of mine
1273
01:14:28,917 --> 01:14:32,000
who texted me and said,
"Turn on the news.
1274
01:14:33,041 --> 01:14:34,000
Now."
1275
01:14:35,709 --> 01:14:38,417
I think the first image I saw
1276
01:14:38,500 --> 01:14:42,542
was the paramedics
1277
01:14:42,625 --> 01:14:47,583
that were carrying Michael
to the hospital.
1278
01:14:48,417 --> 01:14:51,250
You know, that Michael had had
some sort of cardiac arrest
1279
01:14:51,333 --> 01:14:52,750
or something like that.
1280
01:14:52,834 --> 01:14:55,667
And we're just getting this in right now,
1281
01:14:55,750 --> 01:14:58,375
and it's very, very sad news,
1282
01:14:58,458 --> 01:15:00,792
Jim Moret
and to all of our viewers.
1283
01:15:00,875 --> 01:15:02,959
Both the Los Angeles Times
1284
01:15:03,041 --> 01:15:06,291
and CBS News are
both now reporting
1285
01:15:06,375 --> 01:15:08,750
that Michael Jackson has died.
1286
01:15:08,834 --> 01:15:12,083
CNN can now confirm
from the LA Coroner
1287
01:15:12,166 --> 01:15:13,875
that Michael Jackson
is dead.
1288
01:15:13,959 --> 01:15:17,417
Jackson appeared to
have suffered from cardiac arrest.
1289
01:15:17,500 --> 01:15:18,834
He was 50 years old.
1290
01:15:18,917 --> 01:15:22,083
Michael! Michael! Michael...
1291
01:15:23,542 --> 01:15:25,834
It's not like I just got a call
1292
01:15:25,917 --> 01:15:29,542
from my friend's mother
to tell me that my friend died.
1293
01:15:29,625 --> 01:15:32,750
You know, you're watching it,
like, on a newscast.
1294
01:15:32,834 --> 01:15:35,125
You know, just a whole
different way of finding out
1295
01:15:35,208 --> 01:15:38,458
that somebody you know died,
and I'm a mess.
1296
01:15:39,458 --> 01:15:43,333
- Are you serious?
Yeah, no, he died of a heart attack tonight in LA.
1297
01:15:43,417 --> 01:15:46,208
A heart attack!?
1298
01:15:49,125 --> 01:15:51,667
So much of my story,
so much of my life,
1299
01:15:51,750 --> 01:15:54,834
has been him,
you know, I came to America.
1300
01:15:54,917 --> 01:15:58,291
Like, everything, and he's been
such a big part of our life...
1301
01:15:58,375 --> 01:16:02,041
then all of sudden, just gone.
1302
01:16:02,125 --> 01:16:04,750
I guess you'd call it being in shock.
1303
01:16:04,834 --> 01:16:06,834
I mean, just being...
1304
01:16:07,625 --> 01:16:11,125
numb and not believing.
1305
01:16:16,208 --> 01:16:20,041
I was at work,
and I think a friend of mine texted.
1306
01:16:20,125 --> 01:16:23,875
Said, "I'm sorry,"
and I was like, for what?
1307
01:16:23,959 --> 01:16:26,750
And then I looked on
the news and saw it and...
1308
01:16:27,875 --> 01:16:29,417
I was sad.
1309
01:16:29,500 --> 01:16:33,417
My first reaction
was being really sad.
1310
01:16:33,500 --> 01:16:36,208
It's like we would
never be friends again.
1311
01:16:36,291 --> 01:16:38,208
I'd never know him again.
1312
01:16:38,291 --> 01:16:40,291
I danced when
I heard that he died.
1313
01:16:40,375 --> 01:16:42,667
I was laying in bed.
The news came on.
1314
01:16:42,750 --> 01:16:44,417
I got out of bed and I was,
1315
01:16:44,500 --> 01:16:48,667
"Oh, thank God. He can't
hurt anymore children."
1316
01:16:48,750 --> 01:16:51,417
Those were my thoughts,
and I danced.
1317
01:16:51,500 --> 01:16:54,166
He can't hurt anymore children!
1318
01:16:54,250 --> 01:16:57,667
I was so happy he died.
1319
01:16:59,333 --> 01:17:02,917
I had a jacket that
Michael had given me.
1320
01:17:03,000 --> 01:17:06,291
I curled up in bed
with the jacket for a week.
1321
01:17:06,875 --> 01:17:09,667
I could not believe it.
1322
01:17:10,875 --> 01:17:14,041
It was like, it was losing
a family member.
1323
01:17:14,125 --> 01:17:15,792
We had loved him
for a long time.
1324
01:17:15,875 --> 01:17:19,500
We'd been friends
with him for over 20 years.
1325
01:17:20,041 --> 01:17:22,458
It was hard to accept.
1326
01:17:25,875 --> 01:17:28,291
You know,
you drive in the car,
1327
01:17:28,375 --> 01:17:31,500
and you hear
their music and you cry.
1328
01:17:31,583 --> 01:17:33,583
It's all around
you all the time,
1329
01:17:33,667 --> 01:17:36,417
so you grieve for multiple
days, you know, and you have
1330
01:17:36,500 --> 01:17:39,250
beautiful moments where you
remember beautiful memories
1331
01:17:39,333 --> 01:17:41,583
of being at the ranch
and all these great things
1332
01:17:41,667 --> 01:17:44,291
and remembering him
as a beautiful person,
1333
01:17:44,375 --> 01:17:47,125
but then also being...
feeling really sad.
1334
01:18:00,041 --> 01:18:01,667
I didn't know how to feel.
1335
01:18:01,750 --> 01:18:05,834
I just kind of started going for
walks around the neighborhood.
1336
01:18:05,917 --> 01:18:08,291
And, you know, people are
trying to call me like crazy,
1337
01:18:08,375 --> 01:18:11,333
and get in contact with me, and
I didn't wanna talk to anybody.
1338
01:18:11,417 --> 01:18:12,834
I didn't wanna talk
to my mother,
1339
01:18:12,917 --> 01:18:14,500
I didn't wanna talk
to anyone.
1340
01:18:17,750 --> 01:18:19,500
I remember him just sitting on curbs
1341
01:18:19,583 --> 01:18:23,125
and just being really
incredibly emotional.
1342
01:18:23,208 --> 01:18:25,500
A lot of...
1343
01:18:25,583 --> 01:18:29,125
yeah, a lot of, like,
curling up and crying.
1344
01:18:29,208 --> 01:18:33,125
And the press inquiries were
coming through my agents and...
1345
01:18:33,208 --> 01:18:35,250
and it got to the point
where they finally said to me,
1346
01:18:35,333 --> 01:18:37,834
"Listen, you gotta
do a statement."
1347
01:18:37,917 --> 01:18:40,834
So, I remember going to...
1348
01:18:40,917 --> 01:18:44,959
a sort of park in Santa Monica
to sit down and try and...
1349
01:18:46,000 --> 01:18:49,291
figure out what I wanted to say.
1350
01:18:51,333 --> 01:18:56,750
It was extremely
loving and grateful
1351
01:18:56,834 --> 01:18:58,834
for Michael in my life,
1352
01:18:58,917 --> 01:19:01,542
and talking about
he's the reason I dance,
1353
01:19:01,625 --> 01:19:04,667
the reason I make music,
1354
01:19:04,750 --> 01:19:08,625
and ending with, you know,
"I'll never stop missing him, but..."
1355
01:19:09,709 --> 01:19:11,375
You know, "Now, he's..."
1356
01:19:11,458 --> 01:19:14,583
Something along the lines of,
"Now, he's," uh...
1357
01:19:14,667 --> 01:19:18,625
"blessing the heavens
with a melody and a moonwalk."
1358
01:19:18,709 --> 01:19:21,291
Something like that.
1359
01:19:21,375 --> 01:19:24,500
He tried his hard to please everybody.
1360
01:19:24,583 --> 01:19:28,417
The sick, he donates
so much money to the sick.
1361
01:19:28,500 --> 01:19:30,667
He helped the blind.
He helped...
1362
01:19:30,750 --> 01:19:33,208
everybody that needed help,
1363
01:19:33,291 --> 01:19:34,333
and he was glad to do it.
1364
01:19:34,417 --> 01:19:37,500
I've seen Michael
help so many people,
1365
01:19:37,583 --> 01:19:39,750
and sometimes,
he would go and cry about it
1366
01:19:39,834 --> 01:19:43,417
because he felt sorry for
the people that he was helping.
1367
01:19:48,583 --> 01:19:51,917
Michael had a lot of great attributes,
1368
01:19:52,000 --> 01:19:54,625
and he was great
in a lot of ways,
1369
01:19:54,709 --> 01:19:57,250
and you loved him
in a lot of ways.
1370
01:19:59,083 --> 01:20:00,333
And then...
1371
01:20:00,417 --> 01:20:03,709
you know, Michael does
these things to you
1372
01:20:05,000 --> 01:20:07,750
that are not healthy,
1373
01:20:07,834 --> 01:20:10,000
but you still have...
1374
01:20:10,834 --> 01:20:13,583
um, you still have love for him.
1375
01:20:13,667 --> 01:20:16,458
So, it's really hard to...
1376
01:20:16,542 --> 01:20:20,125
have those two feelings
together.
1377
01:20:20,208 --> 01:20:22,500
I still today...
1378
01:20:22,583 --> 01:20:24,959
am grappling with that.
1379
01:20:32,333 --> 01:20:35,375
It is estimated that before it's over,
1380
01:20:35,458 --> 01:20:37,792
this will be viewed by between
1381
01:20:37,875 --> 01:20:40,000
750 million
1382
01:20:40,083 --> 01:20:43,583
to a billion people
around the world.
1383
01:20:45,166 --> 01:20:48,875
We were contacted to come to the funeral.
1384
01:20:48,959 --> 01:20:53,250
You know, we went to the big
funeral at the Staples Center.
1385
01:20:53,333 --> 01:20:56,500
We are the world
1386
01:20:56,583 --> 01:20:59,750
We are the children
1387
01:20:59,834 --> 01:21:02,917
We are the ones who make
the brighter place
1388
01:21:03,000 --> 01:21:05,166
So let's start giving
1389
01:21:05,250 --> 01:21:07,250
Let's start giving
1390
01:21:07,333 --> 01:21:09,875
I mean,
that was a surreal experience.
1391
01:21:09,959 --> 01:21:11,959
I mean, not your average
1392
01:21:12,041 --> 01:21:13,917
memorial or funeral.
1393
01:21:14,000 --> 01:21:15,333
It's true,
we make a better...
1394
01:21:15,417 --> 01:21:19,375
You know, musical performances
and...
1395
01:21:19,458 --> 01:21:24,625
Michael's image
up on the massive screen.
1396
01:21:24,709 --> 01:21:27,792
You know, at first it felt like,
oh, this is a big hoopla.
1397
01:21:27,875 --> 01:21:29,542
But it actually was
1398
01:21:29,625 --> 01:21:31,667
really nice,
respectful, you know.
1399
01:21:31,750 --> 01:21:33,667
The fans, everybody,
were quiet.
1400
01:21:33,750 --> 01:21:36,041
It actually felt like
a ceremony and...
1401
01:21:36,125 --> 01:21:39,125
it was very emotional for
all of us that were there.
1402
01:21:39,208 --> 01:21:42,291
Wade sobbed at the memorial service
1403
01:21:42,375 --> 01:21:44,875
like I've never heard him sob.
1404
01:21:44,959 --> 01:21:47,375
He put his head in his hands,
1405
01:21:47,458 --> 01:21:49,333
and actually sobbed and sobbed.
1406
01:21:49,417 --> 01:21:51,625
He didn't do that
when his father died.
1407
01:21:56,083 --> 01:21:58,583
That's the last time I remember
1408
01:21:58,667 --> 01:22:02,625
crying about him
being dead.
1409
01:22:07,333 --> 01:22:10,291
And then, I went back to work.
1410
01:22:11,083 --> 01:22:12,667
I mean...
1411
01:22:15,291 --> 01:22:16,500
Yeah.
1412
01:22:16,583 --> 01:22:18,834
I went back to work, full pelt.
1413
01:22:19,667 --> 01:22:22,333
Left right,
left right, left right...
1414
01:22:25,000 --> 01:22:26,792
Step! Step!
1415
01:22:26,875 --> 01:22:28,750
You know, it was
a new phase in my career in,
1416
01:22:28,834 --> 01:22:30,959
kind of, choreography
and stage directing.
1417
01:22:33,667 --> 01:22:34,834
Clap! Clap!
1418
01:22:34,917 --> 01:22:36,500
Amanda and I were married now.
1419
01:22:36,583 --> 01:22:40,500
We were starting to work together a bit,
creatively.
1420
01:22:40,583 --> 01:22:43,875
The phones are ringing! Like, say yes, yes!
You know, work begets work.
1421
01:22:44,000 --> 01:22:47,583
Like this is time to explode.
This is what you've been working for.
1422
01:22:47,667 --> 01:22:51,291
But he'd be in the adrenaline
of a job,
1423
01:22:51,375 --> 01:22:56,875
and it was always followed
by lulls of depression.
1424
01:22:56,959 --> 01:22:58,959
You know,
I'm just a perfectionist, and...
1425
01:22:59,041 --> 01:23:04,375
I just was never really
able to enjoy my work.
1426
01:23:05,375 --> 01:23:07,041
It wasn't fun,
1427
01:23:07,125 --> 01:23:09,667
and the more success I gained,
1428
01:23:09,750 --> 01:23:11,375
the less fun it became.
1429
01:23:11,458 --> 01:23:13,291
It was just more about pressure.
1430
01:23:19,041 --> 01:23:21,709
And he went through this really
1431
01:23:21,792 --> 01:23:24,375
dark, sort of sad,
1432
01:23:24,458 --> 01:23:27,458
lonely... a depression,
in a way.
1433
01:23:30,417 --> 01:23:33,959
I don't know what's going on. I think I'm
gonna have a heart attack or something.
1434
01:23:34,041 --> 01:23:36,166
He was freaking out.
1435
01:23:36,250 --> 01:23:38,667
He was so afraid that
whatever decision he made
1436
01:23:38,750 --> 01:23:40,500
was gonna be the wrong one.
1437
01:23:40,583 --> 01:23:44,000
"I've gotta stop, like...
I can't go through this
1438
01:23:44,083 --> 01:23:46,333
and not figure
out what's wrong."
1439
01:23:54,458 --> 01:23:56,625
So, we were all struggling,
trying to find out
1440
01:23:56,709 --> 01:23:58,750
what all this was about.
1441
01:24:02,208 --> 01:24:06,875
Amanda is so clear about
how she felt about everything,
1442
01:24:07,000 --> 01:24:10,792
and could communicate it,
and I just couldn't.
1443
01:24:11,458 --> 01:24:15,625
I would be sad,
I would get angry, and I just...
1444
01:24:15,709 --> 01:24:17,709
and she would ask me
what's wrong,
1445
01:24:17,792 --> 01:24:19,959
and I would just say
I don't know.
1446
01:24:27,667 --> 01:24:29,875
We had been working a ton,
1447
01:24:29,959 --> 01:24:34,125
traveling a lot, doing lots
of exciting work, and...
1448
01:24:34,208 --> 01:24:36,375
I remember telling
myself, you know,
1449
01:24:36,458 --> 01:24:38,375
when I can't
think of anything
1450
01:24:38,458 --> 01:24:41,583
but becoming a mom,
that will be the time that,
1451
01:24:41,667 --> 01:24:44,333
you know, we think
about starting a family.
1452
01:24:45,792 --> 01:24:50,041
And Koa arrived on this Earth,
1453
01:24:50,125 --> 01:24:52,542
November 10th, 2010.
1454
01:24:55,417 --> 01:24:58,667
I just entered this
1455
01:24:58,750 --> 01:25:02,667
state of absolute euphoria,
1456
01:25:03,333 --> 01:25:09,500
thinking, like, this is
the most important job
1457
01:25:10,250 --> 01:25:13,667
I've ever had,
being a father.
1458
01:25:13,750 --> 01:25:16,458
Koa's birth was, um,
1459
01:25:16,542 --> 01:25:21,792
directly aligned
with, uh, Wade receiving,
1460
01:25:21,875 --> 01:25:25,417
um, his dream job opportunity.
1461
01:25:25,500 --> 01:25:28,083
You know, Michael had
always prophesied to Wade
1462
01:25:28,166 --> 01:25:30,083
that he would be
a film director,
1463
01:25:30,166 --> 01:25:32,959
like Steven Spielberg
film director,
1464
01:25:33,041 --> 01:25:35,333
that that's what
he was working towards.
1465
01:25:35,417 --> 01:25:38,291
You know, so these are
kind of two really, uh,
1466
01:25:38,375 --> 01:25:42,875
intense life happenings
at the same time.
1467
01:25:42,959 --> 01:25:46,792
Becoming a father
and getting my first gig
1468
01:25:46,875 --> 01:25:50,125
as a feature film director.
1469
01:25:50,208 --> 01:25:53,125
The demands of the film
1470
01:25:53,208 --> 01:25:55,291
started to become
more apparent.
1471
01:25:55,375 --> 01:25:57,125
It was a big budget film,
1472
01:25:57,208 --> 01:26:02,458
and there's a lot of people
looking for answers from him,
1473
01:26:02,542 --> 01:26:07,000
in reference to story,
in reference to, you know, production.
1474
01:26:07,083 --> 01:26:11,041
And fatherhood was
also on his plate.
1475
01:26:11,125 --> 01:26:15,959
I stopped being able
to sleep at all.
1476
01:26:16,667 --> 01:26:21,542
Lying in bed
for eight, nine hours,
1477
01:26:21,625 --> 01:26:23,959
staring at the walls.
1478
01:26:25,125 --> 01:26:28,625
Stressed and anxiety
and fears beyond belief.
1479
01:26:28,709 --> 01:26:31,959
It gets to the point
where I'm barely operating.
1480
01:26:32,041 --> 01:26:35,041
I remove myself from the film.
I remove myself from any work.
1481
01:26:35,125 --> 01:26:38,500
I disappeared from the world.
1482
01:26:38,583 --> 01:26:41,250
You know, agents, managers,
"Don't call me."
1483
01:26:42,291 --> 01:26:45,709
I was barely talking
to my family.
1484
01:26:45,792 --> 01:26:48,166
Whatever was going on inside of him,
1485
01:26:48,250 --> 01:26:50,041
I mean, it was relentless.
1486
01:27:01,792 --> 01:27:04,417
They say time heals all wounds,
but that...
1487
01:27:04,500 --> 01:27:06,709
I don't think
time heals this one.
1488
01:27:06,792 --> 01:27:08,959
It just gets worse.
1489
01:27:12,208 --> 01:27:15,458
You can't talk to anybody
about it. You don't...
1490
01:27:16,458 --> 01:27:19,709
You don't get advice
or a perspective.
1491
01:27:19,792 --> 01:27:22,041
You're stuck...
1492
01:27:22,125 --> 01:27:24,291
keeping a secret, and then...
1493
01:27:26,750 --> 01:27:28,417
So, you don't ever...
1494
01:27:28,500 --> 01:27:32,625
You don't ever figure it out.
You're just stuck.
1495
01:27:32,709 --> 01:27:35,375
I could see he was
having a rough time,
1496
01:27:35,458 --> 01:27:39,417
just with his body
language, and I...
1497
01:27:39,500 --> 01:27:41,667
"Do you... Honey, do you
want to go to a psychiatrist?"
1498
01:27:41,750 --> 01:27:44,792
"No!" That was an absolute no.
1499
01:27:44,875 --> 01:27:46,500
Um...
1500
01:27:47,959 --> 01:27:49,750
He just wouldn't talk.
He wouldn't open up.
1501
01:27:49,834 --> 01:27:52,959
Jimmy wouldn't, was...
He was different.
1502
01:27:53,041 --> 01:27:54,709
It's fine for brief moments,
1503
01:27:54,792 --> 01:27:57,000
but when you spend years
like that,
1504
01:27:58,208 --> 01:28:00,208
and you don't sleep well...
1505
01:28:01,458 --> 01:28:03,625
you kind of go crazy.
1506
01:28:05,375 --> 01:28:06,583
When Cillian was born,
1507
01:28:06,667 --> 01:28:08,917
he had a little bit
of a breakdown.
1508
01:28:09,000 --> 01:28:11,041
And again,
me being me, I thought,
1509
01:28:11,125 --> 01:28:13,792
"Well, this must happen to dads
when they have their first kid.
1510
01:28:13,875 --> 01:28:17,917
It just makes people feel scared,"
and I understood, and...
1511
01:28:18,000 --> 01:28:20,792
I-I know I'm probably
sounding incredibly naive,
1512
01:28:20,875 --> 01:28:22,875
but some of the things
he did and didn't do,
1513
01:28:22,959 --> 01:28:25,834
I just attributed to...
this is our life.
1514
01:28:25,917 --> 01:28:28,834
This is, you know,
he sleeps an awful lot,
1515
01:28:28,917 --> 01:28:31,291
and so I'll stay up
and I'll take care of the kids,
1516
01:28:31,375 --> 01:28:33,667
or, you know,
he can't be around
1517
01:28:33,750 --> 01:28:36,583
the friends and the schools
the way I am, so I'll do that.
1518
01:28:36,667 --> 01:28:39,875
It was sort of survival mode,
I guess, is a good way to put it.
1519
01:28:39,959 --> 01:28:42,375
It was like, this is our scenario,
and we love each other,
1520
01:28:42,458 --> 01:28:44,583
so we're gonna work around
whatever this is.
1521
01:28:44,667 --> 01:28:46,583
I think the...
1522
01:28:47,959 --> 01:28:52,625
abuse symptoms intensify
when you have kids.
1523
01:28:52,709 --> 01:28:54,959
Like, it ramps up even more.
1524
01:28:56,458 --> 01:29:00,208
And then you see
how, like, innocent kids are.
1525
01:29:00,959 --> 01:29:03,667
I think having kids...
1526
01:29:03,750 --> 01:29:06,208
kind of shoves
that in your face.
1527
01:29:07,542 --> 01:29:11,333
He's getting closer to the age
I was when I was abused.
1528
01:29:14,291 --> 01:29:19,834
So, that is difficult
to deal with and see...
1529
01:29:19,917 --> 01:29:23,917
watch him kind of
become you at that age.
1530
01:29:30,000 --> 01:29:32,000
Found a therapist.
1531
01:29:32,083 --> 01:29:33,458
Trying to figure out
1532
01:29:33,542 --> 01:29:35,625
what the hell was
wrong with me.
1533
01:29:35,709 --> 01:29:38,041
I went through
the story of my life,
1534
01:29:38,125 --> 01:29:40,917
and I went through the...
1535
01:29:42,750 --> 01:29:45,417
story of my life with Michael,
1536
01:29:45,500 --> 01:29:49,542
but just... the good parts,
1537
01:29:49,625 --> 01:29:51,917
just the creative inspiration,
and the work,
1538
01:29:52,000 --> 01:29:54,667
and friendship,
and all of that stuff.
1539
01:29:54,750 --> 01:29:59,166
And I was saying things
at this point, like, to Amanda,
1540
01:29:59,250 --> 01:30:02,709
"I don't know...
I don't know who I am.
1541
01:30:02,792 --> 01:30:04,709
"Like, I don't
know what I want.
1542
01:30:04,792 --> 01:30:07,000
"I don't know left from right.
1543
01:30:07,083 --> 01:30:09,125
"All I know is you and Koa.
1544
01:30:09,208 --> 01:30:13,000
Like, that's all that makes
any sense to me."
1545
01:30:16,917 --> 01:30:19,333
It was so incredibly
frightening,
1546
01:30:19,417 --> 01:30:23,750
'cause for him to just sit still...
he was just terr...
1547
01:30:23,834 --> 01:30:27,208
There was just terror
in his eyes, all the time.
1548
01:30:28,583 --> 01:30:30,583
I would tell myself,
like, on our porch,
1549
01:30:30,667 --> 01:30:32,875
like, "Just keep it together,"
1550
01:30:32,959 --> 01:30:35,750
like, "It's gonna be okay.
1551
01:30:35,834 --> 01:30:39,875
We're gonna... He's gonna be okay.
We're gonna figure this out."
1552
01:30:41,792 --> 01:30:47,166
So, at this point, Koa is about...
a year and a half.
1553
01:30:48,917 --> 01:30:52,667
I start to...
1554
01:30:52,750 --> 01:30:56,375
have these images of...
1555
01:30:57,417 --> 01:31:00,458
the kind of sexual stuff
that happened
1556
01:31:00,542 --> 01:31:03,125
between Michael and I
1557
01:31:03,208 --> 01:31:05,041
happening to Koa.
1558
01:31:06,166 --> 01:31:07,875
And seeing...
1559
01:31:09,166 --> 01:31:12,625
Michael doing it to Koa,
1560
01:31:12,709 --> 01:31:14,834
what he did to me.
1561
01:31:15,834 --> 01:31:19,625
And my immediate...
1562
01:31:21,208 --> 01:31:26,750
...emotional, uh, reaction
to-to having those images
1563
01:31:26,834 --> 01:31:31,458
is just this, uh, rage and...
1564
01:31:31,542 --> 01:31:35,834
disgust and...
you know, violent feeling.
1565
01:31:35,917 --> 01:31:41,375
Like, I would kill anyone who
did anything like that to Koa.
1566
01:31:42,458 --> 01:31:45,250
What I started thinking was...
1567
01:31:47,125 --> 01:31:50,375
you know, how...
how can I have such...
1568
01:31:51,583 --> 01:31:53,917
clear feelings,
1569
01:31:54,000 --> 01:31:57,500
negative, horrible
feelings about the idea
1570
01:31:57,583 --> 01:32:01,291
of that sexual stuff
happening to Koa,
1571
01:32:01,375 --> 01:32:04,667
but when I think
about Michael and I,
1572
01:32:04,750 --> 01:32:07,875
and all of that sexual stuff
going on...
1573
01:32:07,959 --> 01:32:10,667
I don't...
I don't feel anything.
1574
01:32:12,500 --> 01:32:14,750
That's probably kind of weird.
1575
01:32:16,458 --> 01:32:20,083
And I start thinking, you know,
if I'm gonna go into therapy
1576
01:32:20,166 --> 01:32:22,458
and try and really
get to the bottom
1577
01:32:22,542 --> 01:32:25,291
of whatever the hell is
going on with me,
1578
01:32:25,375 --> 01:32:30,333
I probably have to talk about
the sexual stuff that went on.
1579
01:32:38,083 --> 01:32:41,792
I go in for a session
with Dr. Shaw.
1580
01:32:41,875 --> 01:32:44,625
"You know,
all the stuff about, um...
1581
01:32:45,959 --> 01:32:49,583
"all the allegations,
and, like, Michael Jackson...
1582
01:32:49,667 --> 01:32:53,166
"molesting kids
and all that stuff, um...
1583
01:32:55,792 --> 01:32:57,333
"It was, uh...
1584
01:32:57,417 --> 01:33:00,125
It was true. It happened to me."
1585
01:33:09,333 --> 01:33:13,250
There were little things that we
would try and do and look forward to.
1586
01:33:13,333 --> 01:33:17,166
Dinners or something, you know,
to try and put on a happy face,
1587
01:33:17,250 --> 01:33:18,917
and to, like, look forward
to something,
1588
01:33:19,000 --> 01:33:21,500
instead of, like,
the dread and fear of...
1589
01:33:22,375 --> 01:33:23,792
our reality.
1590
01:33:25,250 --> 01:33:27,709
Wade and Amanda were living in Santa Monica,
1591
01:33:27,792 --> 01:33:31,834
and food trucks were, like,
the big thing in LA at the time.
1592
01:33:32,875 --> 01:33:35,625
And I spoke with Erica,
my wife,
1593
01:33:35,709 --> 01:33:38,583
on the phone
as I'm driving there.
1594
01:33:38,667 --> 01:33:42,542
And she, uh, she says, uh...
1595
01:33:42,625 --> 01:33:46,709
"I gotta tell you about a crazy,
crazy dream I had last night."
1596
01:33:46,792 --> 01:33:48,250
Uh...
1597
01:33:48,333 --> 01:33:51,542
Wade had told her
1598
01:33:51,625 --> 01:33:54,375
that Michael Jackson
had abused him.
1599
01:33:55,375 --> 01:33:57,959
Uh, she said it was so real,
1600
01:33:58,041 --> 01:34:01,208
she woke up from the dream
actually crying about it.
1601
01:34:02,000 --> 01:34:04,834
My brother and Amanda
1602
01:34:04,917 --> 01:34:06,417
go and walk towards
the food trucks,
1603
01:34:06,500 --> 01:34:09,500
and we're waiting for some food,
and we're just chatting,
1604
01:34:09,583 --> 01:34:11,625
and my brother...
1605
01:34:11,709 --> 01:34:14,667
comes out of nowhere
and says, uh,
1606
01:34:15,333 --> 01:34:18,917
"You know, my wife had
this crazy dream."
1607
01:34:19,000 --> 01:34:24,542
Like, my first instinct
when he said that was to...
1608
01:34:26,834 --> 01:34:29,041
crack a joke.
1609
01:34:29,125 --> 01:34:33,709
And a joke that had sort of
become kind of standard for me,
1610
01:34:33,792 --> 01:34:36,333
which was, you know,
1611
01:34:36,417 --> 01:34:39,667
"Yeah, man. I don't know.
I mean, if it... was true,
1612
01:34:39,750 --> 01:34:42,917
"I don't know why
I wasn't sexy enough.
1613
01:34:43,000 --> 01:34:45,542
Like, what was wrong with me?"
1614
01:34:45,625 --> 01:34:48,792
And that was my instinct,
to kind of go right to that joke.
1615
01:34:49,750 --> 01:34:52,500
But I just couldn't,
I couldn't this time.
1616
01:34:52,583 --> 01:34:56,125
I mean, this was, like,
just an hour and a half ago
1617
01:34:56,208 --> 01:34:59,125
that I had told Dr. Shaw
for the first time.
1618
01:35:00,125 --> 01:35:02,291
So, my head just dropped.
1619
01:35:06,250 --> 01:35:09,667
And then I just kind of,
I just looked up and said,
1620
01:35:09,750 --> 01:35:11,917
"It is true."
1621
01:35:14,208 --> 01:35:17,333
And, um,
and I'm looking at him,
1622
01:35:18,083 --> 01:35:21,417
and I'm like, is he telling me
a joke or something right now?
1623
01:35:22,375 --> 01:35:25,625
And I'm like,
"What do you mean?"
1624
01:35:25,709 --> 01:35:27,834
And all sorts of things
are going through my head,
1625
01:35:27,917 --> 01:35:31,041
like the amount of years that,
1626
01:35:31,125 --> 01:35:33,709
you know,
he's defended this guy.
1627
01:35:35,291 --> 01:35:37,792
I remember, uh, Amanda...
1628
01:35:41,959 --> 01:35:44,583
...was, uh, was on my left,
1629
01:35:44,667 --> 01:35:47,458
and I remember,
physically, she just, um...
1630
01:35:49,792 --> 01:35:51,667
she just caved in,
1631
01:35:51,750 --> 01:35:54,458
like someone punched
her in the chest.
1632
01:35:59,583 --> 01:36:02,625
And my brother sort of had
the opposite physical reaction.
1633
01:36:02,709 --> 01:36:04,834
Like, his chest
kind of puffed out.
1634
01:36:04,917 --> 01:36:07,083
He got... angry.
1635
01:36:07,166 --> 01:36:09,166
I think his
first word was, "What?"
1636
01:36:10,834 --> 01:36:14,333
There was a real kind
of anger in his eyes.
1637
01:36:19,375 --> 01:36:23,083
The... It's like the world was,
kind of like spinning,
1638
01:36:23,166 --> 01:36:26,667
and all I could see was
Chantal was holding Koa.
1639
01:36:27,291 --> 01:36:29,667
So, it's like a blur,
1640
01:36:29,750 --> 01:36:34,000
and I just honed in on Koa,
and I needed to hold him.
1641
01:36:34,083 --> 01:36:35,917
And then they come over to me,
1642
01:36:36,000 --> 01:36:38,458
and as soon as
they come to the table,
1643
01:36:38,542 --> 01:36:43,208
Shane turns to me,
and he says,
1644
01:36:43,959 --> 01:36:47,166
"Wade, tell Chantal
what you just told us."
1645
01:36:47,250 --> 01:36:52,375
My sister's always been the one in
my life who's... more emotional,
1646
01:36:52,458 --> 01:36:56,959
like much more readily available,
wears her heart on her sleeve.
1647
01:36:57,041 --> 01:37:00,667
And I remember the look
in her eyes and just, um...
1648
01:37:01,709 --> 01:37:05,542
her just staring at me,
and just tears, you know.
1649
01:37:06,792 --> 01:37:10,291
I was hurt and angry for Wade.
1650
01:37:10,375 --> 01:37:14,291
I was upset for myself
and my relationship that I had,
1651
01:37:14,375 --> 01:37:16,917
and then I was really
scared for my mom.
1652
01:37:21,250 --> 01:37:24,375
I was afraid that my mom
would commit suicide.
1653
01:37:26,709 --> 01:37:29,917
'Cause it's not like
it was uncommon for me.
1654
01:37:33,417 --> 01:37:37,250
But I was afraid that my mom
would do something to herself,
1655
01:37:39,291 --> 01:37:43,083
because of the shame of,
you know, her not knowing or...
1656
01:37:44,750 --> 01:37:47,417
you know.
1657
01:37:48,125 --> 01:37:49,917
It's like this was the...
1658
01:37:51,083 --> 01:37:55,041
The story that I had been
telling all these years...
1659
01:37:57,208 --> 01:38:00,208
...the lies that I had
been telling about,
1660
01:38:00,291 --> 01:38:03,625
you know, that none of this
sexual stuff ever happened,
1661
01:38:03,709 --> 01:38:07,375
like, that was... that story...
1662
01:38:07,458 --> 01:38:09,959
that version of
the story was the...
1663
01:38:10,041 --> 01:38:12,959
the whole foundation of my life,
1664
01:38:13,041 --> 01:38:16,041
and my sister's,
and my brother's life.
1665
01:38:16,125 --> 01:38:17,500
I mean, like,
1666
01:38:17,583 --> 01:38:20,667
my whole life with
Michael is the reason...
1667
01:38:21,625 --> 01:38:25,125
my family split apart,
and we moved to America,
1668
01:38:25,208 --> 01:38:28,625
and, you know, like,
it's all wrapped up in that.
1669
01:38:31,750 --> 01:38:34,333
And now it's like this whole...
1670
01:38:34,417 --> 01:38:38,250
the whole foundation of this
story was bullshit, you know?
1671
01:38:45,208 --> 01:38:48,583
But there's a child.
1672
01:38:48,667 --> 01:38:50,250
The fact that I needed
to take care of him,
1673
01:38:50,333 --> 01:38:54,083
whatever he needed next,
got us home.
1674
01:38:54,166 --> 01:38:57,750
And now it's my and Wade's
first time alone.
1675
01:39:02,333 --> 01:39:05,834
And he's like, "Do you
wanna ask me anything?"
1676
01:39:05,917 --> 01:39:10,250
And I... And I said,
"Are you confused?
1677
01:39:10,333 --> 01:39:14,041
Like is there any confusion
as to like how...
1678
01:39:14,125 --> 01:39:19,834
what is like appropriate
to how you love Koa?"
1679
01:39:20,500 --> 01:39:23,125
And Wade was like,
"Absolutely not."
1680
01:39:25,375 --> 01:39:28,250
I had no knowledge
of child sexual abuse,
1681
01:39:28,333 --> 01:39:30,291
or the, um,
1682
01:39:30,375 --> 01:39:34,291
psychological way
it plays out into adulthood.
1683
01:39:34,375 --> 01:39:37,041
You know, I was incredibly naive
on the subject.
1684
01:39:37,125 --> 01:39:41,333
So, to me, you know,
the fact that he had...
1685
01:39:41,417 --> 01:39:43,500
had lied about it to me,
1686
01:39:43,583 --> 01:39:48,709
I thought the repercussions must
be something that... affected...
1687
01:39:48,792 --> 01:39:53,166
that he was scared of in relation to me,
or to us, or his...
1688
01:39:53,875 --> 01:39:55,375
I don't know.
1689
01:39:56,000 --> 01:40:00,041
It's like I... I used to be
the person that said...
1690
01:40:00,875 --> 01:40:04,291
you know,
"Oh, that person's after money,
1691
01:40:04,375 --> 01:40:07,625
or they're trying to bring
Michael down, and he's famous."
1692
01:40:07,709 --> 01:40:10,208
And I was the person
that said all that.
1693
01:40:11,125 --> 01:40:14,083
You know, and then now being
on the other side of it...
1694
01:40:14,750 --> 01:40:17,333
you know, now I understand why
people are saying that to me,
1695
01:40:17,417 --> 01:40:19,583
but at the same time,
it's like...
1696
01:40:21,083 --> 01:40:22,709
you know, I'm awake now.
1697
01:40:22,792 --> 01:40:27,291
It's like I see the reality,
and I see the truth,
1698
01:40:27,375 --> 01:40:30,500
and I, you know,
the pattern of what happened,
1699
01:40:30,583 --> 01:40:33,375
and-and that it happened
to my brother.
1700
01:40:33,458 --> 01:40:36,834
But I feel so bad
for every little boy
1701
01:40:36,917 --> 01:40:39,750
prior that tried to talk,
1702
01:40:39,834 --> 01:40:42,917
and got shut up really fast.
1703
01:40:43,834 --> 01:40:45,166
It's so hard to believe
1704
01:40:45,250 --> 01:40:47,917
that he would do that
to a little boy,
1705
01:40:48,041 --> 01:40:53,458
someone as beautiful
and talented as Wade was.
1706
01:40:54,792 --> 01:40:57,500
It's just overwhelming
to think that.
1707
01:41:00,208 --> 01:41:03,208
He's ruined, here,
a lot of lives,
1708
01:41:03,291 --> 01:41:05,291
a lot of lives.
1709
01:41:07,417 --> 01:41:12,834
What began to happen
was just this...
1710
01:41:14,208 --> 01:41:19,125
...emotional, like,
upheaval that was just...
1711
01:41:20,000 --> 01:41:25,333
all of these...
anger and sadness and...
1712
01:41:26,458 --> 01:41:29,917
you know, back and forth,
all over the place, unpredictable.
1713
01:41:30,041 --> 01:41:33,166
I mean, just coming out
of me constantly.
1714
01:41:37,792 --> 01:41:43,291
After about...
two weeks after I first told Dr. Shaw,
1715
01:41:44,792 --> 01:41:47,083
I, uh, I told Mom I wanted her
1716
01:41:47,166 --> 01:41:51,125
to come into a therapy
session with me.
1717
01:41:51,208 --> 01:41:52,834
I didn't tell her why.
1718
01:41:52,917 --> 01:41:55,917
I spent 30 minutes
with the therapist first,
1719
01:41:56,000 --> 01:41:58,625
just to have a chat,
talk about things.
1720
01:41:58,709 --> 01:42:01,083
So then...
1721
01:42:01,166 --> 01:42:04,250
after 30 minutes,
Wade joined us,
1722
01:42:04,333 --> 01:42:07,834
and we sat together
on the couch, and...
1723
01:42:09,834 --> 01:42:12,041
he turned to me and said...
1724
01:42:15,875 --> 01:42:19,500
that Michael Jackson
had abused him
1725
01:42:19,583 --> 01:42:22,208
from age seven to 14.
1726
01:42:26,375 --> 01:42:30,041
Uh... It was like
being hit by a truck.
1727
01:42:30,875 --> 01:42:33,417
I really didn't know.
1728
01:42:37,208 --> 01:42:39,458
I remember her just...
1729
01:42:39,542 --> 01:42:40,917
I mean, just...
1730
01:42:41,000 --> 01:42:43,458
tears streaming down
her face instantly,
1731
01:42:43,542 --> 01:42:44,917
and this kind of
1732
01:42:45,000 --> 01:42:47,917
collapse in her body,
and then she just...
1733
01:42:48,000 --> 01:42:50,583
kind of reached out
to grab me and she...
1734
01:42:50,667 --> 01:42:52,625
The first thing she said was,
"How could you not...
1735
01:42:52,709 --> 01:42:54,792
"How could you not have told me?
1736
01:42:54,875 --> 01:42:57,083
How could you not have told me?"
1737
01:43:01,458 --> 01:43:03,542
That's a real
complicated question.
1738
01:43:03,625 --> 01:43:05,208
You know, I couldn't...
1739
01:43:05,291 --> 01:43:06,750
I couldn't answer that question.
1740
01:43:06,834 --> 01:43:10,917
I held him and held him.
We sobbed together.
1741
01:43:12,834 --> 01:43:16,083
And I said, "Well,
I have to take some...
1742
01:43:17,250 --> 01:43:18,583
"of the blame for this.
1743
01:43:18,667 --> 01:43:21,834
I am your mother,
and I didn't protect you."
1744
01:43:21,917 --> 01:43:24,792
And that's what he wanted
to hear, apparently.
1745
01:43:29,000 --> 01:43:30,709
I couldn't really...
I don't know,
1746
01:43:30,792 --> 01:43:32,959
I couldn't really hug her yet.
1747
01:43:34,083 --> 01:43:35,750
I mean, I just...
1748
01:43:36,500 --> 01:43:40,291
Very beginning for me
and very confused about, uh...
1749
01:43:41,208 --> 01:43:44,792
just my relationship
with, with Mom.
1750
01:43:49,083 --> 01:43:53,709
I was angry... at my mom.
1751
01:43:53,792 --> 01:43:55,625
I was angry at my mom
before that.
1752
01:43:55,709 --> 01:43:59,792
I was angry for her breaking up the family,
to start with, for this whole...
1753
01:44:01,291 --> 01:44:03,208
Michael Jackson nonsense.
1754
01:44:03,291 --> 01:44:06,208
Like, I don't care
who some guy is,
1755
01:44:06,291 --> 01:44:11,291
how do you leave your seven-year-old
or eight-year-old kid
1756
01:44:11,375 --> 01:44:14,083
to have sleepovers
at their house?
1757
01:44:14,166 --> 01:44:17,083
I mean, that's
just fucking crazy.
1758
01:44:17,166 --> 01:44:19,417
Like, as a parent,
I don't understand
1759
01:44:19,500 --> 01:44:21,625
how that is even possible.
1760
01:44:21,709 --> 01:44:23,667
For five months after that,
1761
01:44:23,750 --> 01:44:26,625
Amanda wouldn't allow me
into their home.
1762
01:44:29,625 --> 01:44:32,166
Wade and I would meet
so that I could see Koa.
1763
01:44:32,250 --> 01:44:34,250
We'd have to meet in a park.
1764
01:44:34,333 --> 01:44:36,500
I was so hurt. I was so...
1765
01:44:36,583 --> 01:44:40,083
I'd always had such a great relationship
with Amanda and all my family.
1766
01:44:40,166 --> 01:44:41,917
I've never had
anything like this happen.
1767
01:44:42,000 --> 01:44:46,125
That was the hardest
thing for me to deal with.
1768
01:44:47,875 --> 01:44:51,000
And I thought she blamed me.
1769
01:44:51,083 --> 01:44:55,667
Now, I'm hearing stories about
what was done to his young body,
1770
01:44:55,750 --> 01:44:57,834
with his mom...
1771
01:44:59,375 --> 01:45:02,959
close by, in-in another room.
1772
01:45:03,041 --> 01:45:06,500
Me being a young mom,
you know, and my just,
1773
01:45:06,583 --> 01:45:08,792
you know, how could you ever
1774
01:45:08,875 --> 01:45:12,375
let your young child sleep
in the bed of a stranger?
1775
01:45:12,458 --> 01:45:14,500
You know, I just
couldn't comprehend it.
1776
01:45:14,583 --> 01:45:16,500
Wade and I met...
1777
01:45:17,750 --> 01:45:19,083
and...
1778
01:45:20,834 --> 01:45:23,959
he said there's things
that he needed to say to me.
1779
01:45:24,041 --> 01:45:26,500
He told me...
1780
01:45:27,667 --> 01:45:31,208
that he felt no emotion for me.
1781
01:45:35,583 --> 01:45:37,792
As a mother, that's like,
1782
01:45:37,875 --> 01:45:41,208
the last thing you wanna
hear from your child.
1783
01:45:43,750 --> 01:45:48,250
He said he had no...
had no feelings for me.
1784
01:45:49,333 --> 01:45:51,333
You know, I remember
asking her, like,
1785
01:45:51,417 --> 01:45:53,625
"How did you not know?"
1786
01:45:53,709 --> 01:45:55,875
You know, and she just
kept saying, "I don't know.
1787
01:45:55,959 --> 01:45:58,291
"I don't know. I don't know
how I didn't know.
1788
01:45:58,375 --> 01:46:00,500
"You don't think...
1789
01:46:00,583 --> 01:46:03,667
"that I wish I knew?
You know, that I...
1790
01:46:03,750 --> 01:46:06,041
that I wish I didn't
see this?" You know.
1791
01:46:06,959 --> 01:46:10,792
But it's changed,
it affected everyone's lives.
1792
01:46:10,875 --> 01:46:15,250
My family's life,
the anger from my family in Australia, and...
1793
01:46:16,709 --> 01:46:19,959
the anger from my family
towards my mother, like...
1794
01:46:20,917 --> 01:46:23,792
it goes so deep.
1795
01:46:23,875 --> 01:46:25,375
She did everything she could.
1796
01:46:25,458 --> 01:46:29,875
She turned her life upside down...
even her marriage.
1797
01:46:29,959 --> 01:46:34,542
She had turned everything
upside down because of Michael.
1798
01:46:34,625 --> 01:46:38,208
It's not easy to accept,
1799
01:46:38,291 --> 01:46:40,959
even at this stage.
1800
01:46:42,083 --> 01:46:46,375
The... The abuse...
was a bomb
1801
01:46:46,458 --> 01:46:50,834
that dropped in our life
and exploded,
1802
01:46:50,917 --> 01:46:54,542
like, you know, and ripped apart
1803
01:46:54,625 --> 01:46:56,709
everything that we found sound
1804
01:46:56,792 --> 01:46:59,834
and secure and safe.
1805
01:47:08,000 --> 01:47:10,667
Of course,
I want James to be happy and feel better,
1806
01:47:10,750 --> 01:47:13,709
but I don't always know
how to get him there.
1807
01:47:13,792 --> 01:47:16,291
A few things had happened, um,
1808
01:47:16,375 --> 01:47:19,709
that just, sort of,
sent him on a spiral.
1809
01:47:21,000 --> 01:47:25,750
His father got sick,
work got very challenging.
1810
01:47:25,834 --> 01:47:29,667
All these things were coming together,
and, um,
1811
01:47:29,750 --> 01:47:31,458
he just...
1812
01:47:31,542 --> 01:47:34,250
he went some place else.
He went to a dark place.
1813
01:47:36,208 --> 01:47:39,250
He started drinking a lot.
He started going out at night.
1814
01:47:39,333 --> 01:47:41,417
Um, he wouldn't come home.
1815
01:47:41,500 --> 01:47:46,166
During that time was the first
time we were really fighting.
1816
01:47:46,250 --> 01:47:48,542
I didn't understand
what was going on at all.
1817
01:47:49,166 --> 01:47:51,750
That was the first time
we ever talked about,
1818
01:47:51,834 --> 01:47:54,709
you know, this isn't
a relationship right now.
1819
01:47:54,792 --> 01:47:56,917
Is this heading towards
divorce? I mean,
1820
01:47:57,000 --> 01:48:00,458
that was the first time we ever
talked about things like that.
1821
01:48:00,542 --> 01:48:04,125
I had, like,
a lot of self-hatred,
1822
01:48:04,208 --> 01:48:06,208
and I didn't know why.
1823
01:48:07,291 --> 01:48:08,959
And you're not
putting it on him.
1824
01:48:09,041 --> 01:48:11,208
You're putting it on yourself.
1825
01:48:11,291 --> 01:48:14,458
You think it's your doing.
1826
01:48:14,542 --> 01:48:17,417
That's part of
the manipulation.
1827
01:48:18,625 --> 01:48:21,375
People, they might look
at me and see a grownup,
1828
01:48:22,083 --> 01:48:25,625
but you... need to see
1829
01:48:25,709 --> 01:48:29,333
we're mentally little kids.
1830
01:48:29,417 --> 01:48:32,417
We've just gotten...
just gotten older.
1831
01:48:39,208 --> 01:48:40,750
Good morning.
Good to see you.
1832
01:48:40,834 --> 01:48:43,000
You know that the things you're
gonna say here this morning,
1833
01:48:43,083 --> 01:48:44,792
and perhaps
in a court of law,
1834
01:48:44,875 --> 01:48:47,625
are gonna get a lot of attention,
make a lot of headlines.
1835
01:48:47,709 --> 01:48:49,083
So, before I ask you specifics,
1836
01:48:49,166 --> 01:48:51,667
what's your
mindset right now?
1837
01:48:51,750 --> 01:48:53,875
What's my mindset. Um...
1838
01:48:53,959 --> 01:48:56,291
I feel strong. I feel...
1839
01:48:57,333 --> 01:48:59,000
like this is
the right thing to do,
1840
01:48:59,083 --> 01:49:01,291
- 'cause this is my truth.
- Despite what some people
1841
01:49:01,375 --> 01:49:03,583
- may say after you say these things?
- Yes.
1842
01:49:03,667 --> 01:49:06,333
I had to defend the lie,
1843
01:49:06,417 --> 01:49:08,417
you know, for so many years.
1844
01:49:09,792 --> 01:49:11,542
And I didn't wanna do
that anymore.
1845
01:49:11,625 --> 01:49:14,000
You know, I was just
trying to declare this
1846
01:49:14,083 --> 01:49:17,583
whole new life for myself,
1847
01:49:17,667 --> 01:49:19,834
based on the truth.
1848
01:49:19,917 --> 01:49:22,125
Let me take you back
to 2005, Wade, all right,
1849
01:49:22,208 --> 01:49:24,959
the child molestation trial
of Michael Jackson.
1850
01:49:25,041 --> 01:49:27,333
You were the first witness
called by the defense,
1851
01:49:27,417 --> 01:49:30,667
and the attorney for Michael
Jackson said he called you first
1852
01:49:30,750 --> 01:49:33,667
because you were so
convincing and powerful,
1853
01:49:33,750 --> 01:49:36,375
asserting the innocence
of Michael Jackson.
1854
01:49:36,458 --> 01:49:39,458
And here we are these years
later, and you're going to say
1855
01:49:39,542 --> 01:49:41,208
- just the opposite.
Right.
1856
01:49:41,291 --> 01:49:43,417
What happened?
1857
01:49:44,125 --> 01:49:45,917
First of all, one thing
I wanna clear up is that
1858
01:49:46,000 --> 01:49:48,959
this is not a case
of repressed memory.
1859
01:49:49,041 --> 01:49:50,750
- Which has been reported in the press.
- Yeah.
1860
01:49:50,834 --> 01:49:54,500
I never forgot one moment
of what Michael did to me.
1861
01:49:55,208 --> 01:49:58,250
But I was psychologically
and emotionally
1862
01:49:58,333 --> 01:50:01,417
completely unable
and unwilling
1863
01:50:01,500 --> 01:50:03,917
to understand that
it was sexual abuse.
1864
01:50:04,000 --> 01:50:06,625
So, what are you alleging
that he actually did?
1865
01:50:06,709 --> 01:50:10,667
He sexually abused me
from seven years old until 14.
1866
01:50:10,750 --> 01:50:13,417
And even though
there's lots of...
1867
01:50:13,500 --> 01:50:16,125
parts of it that are still...
1868
01:50:16,208 --> 01:50:19,125
scary and uncomfortable, um,
1869
01:50:19,208 --> 01:50:21,083
to talk about
these sort of things,
1870
01:50:21,166 --> 01:50:23,917
and talk about these
sexual details and this...
1871
01:50:24,000 --> 01:50:26,917
crazy stuff that happened
1872
01:50:27,000 --> 01:50:29,333
between Michael and I...
1873
01:50:31,667 --> 01:50:35,000
it still feels
a whole lot better than...
1874
01:50:36,625 --> 01:50:38,542
than the lie did.
1875
01:50:39,417 --> 01:50:41,125
You have these symptoms,
1876
01:50:41,208 --> 01:50:44,792
and then you find out that
somebody else has them and...
1877
01:50:44,875 --> 01:50:48,041
and then they went through
something that you went through.
1878
01:50:48,709 --> 01:50:52,250
I really just wanted to talk
to Wade 'cause...
1879
01:50:53,083 --> 01:50:54,625
you feel so alone.
1880
01:50:56,625 --> 01:50:59,875
I think I told my wife
after Wade...
1881
01:51:00,959 --> 01:51:03,709
came out,
maybe a few weeks after.
1882
01:51:04,375 --> 01:51:06,834
Telling her was...
1883
01:51:13,625 --> 01:51:16,125
like, no going back.
1884
01:51:16,208 --> 01:51:18,500
At that point in time, we had
a computer in our bedroom,
1885
01:51:18,583 --> 01:51:20,250
and I was working late at night.
1886
01:51:20,333 --> 01:51:21,750
And he was sitting
at the edge of the bed,
1887
01:51:21,834 --> 01:51:24,250
just waiting for me to finish,
which was not like him.
1888
01:51:24,333 --> 01:51:27,000
And I, you know, was working,
working, working. He's like,
1889
01:51:27,083 --> 01:51:30,667
"Can you please just stop?" And
he sounded so irritated with me.
1890
01:51:30,750 --> 01:51:32,667
I was like, you know,
what the heck?
1891
01:51:32,750 --> 01:51:34,417
I turn off the computer,
and I turned around,
1892
01:51:34,500 --> 01:51:38,333
and that's when I saw how
serious and sad his face was.
1893
01:51:38,417 --> 01:51:41,500
And he said, "Laura,
I have to tell you something."
1894
01:51:41,583 --> 01:51:44,125
And he just said,
"Bad things have happened.
1895
01:51:44,208 --> 01:51:48,250
You know, Michael wasn't...
he wasn't a good guy." And...
1896
01:51:48,875 --> 01:51:52,208
he just clearly was
a ball of emotions,
1897
01:51:52,291 --> 01:51:54,250
and, um, and I was scared.
1898
01:51:54,333 --> 01:51:56,792
It was just like
a punch in the chest.
1899
01:51:56,875 --> 01:52:00,083
You're not positive
it's the right decision...
1900
01:52:00,959 --> 01:52:03,000
and then thinking that
1901
01:52:03,083 --> 01:52:05,792
that action's gonna ruin
your life...
1902
01:52:08,792 --> 01:52:11,250
is... I can... I don't know.
1903
01:52:11,333 --> 01:52:15,709
I can't even, I can't describe
how scary it is.
1904
01:52:15,792 --> 01:52:19,291
It wasn't a heavy,
long conversation.
1905
01:52:19,375 --> 01:52:21,208
It was a cry.
1906
01:52:21,291 --> 01:52:24,041
He sort of just...
we gave each other a hug,
1907
01:52:24,125 --> 01:52:28,917
and he showed me
Wade's interview,
1908
01:52:29,000 --> 01:52:33,041
and he just sort
of cried and...
1909
01:52:33,125 --> 01:52:34,959
He didn't go into
much detail then.
1910
01:52:35,041 --> 01:52:37,083
It was just more
of this like...
1911
01:52:37,166 --> 01:52:40,125
Oh, wow. Our life
just got heavy.
1912
01:52:41,917 --> 01:52:44,917
It still feels shameful.
1913
01:52:45,000 --> 01:52:46,709
I still have...
1914
01:52:47,625 --> 01:52:50,333
feelings that it was...
1915
01:52:52,500 --> 01:52:54,542
like, my fault.
1916
01:52:58,792 --> 01:53:00,750
And now, TMZ breaks the news
1917
01:53:00,834 --> 01:53:03,291
to pop star Omarion
that Wade Robson
1918
01:53:03,375 --> 01:53:06,792
is suing Michael Jackson
for child sex abuse!
1919
01:53:06,875 --> 01:53:08,667
- What?
Yes.
1920
01:53:08,750 --> 01:53:10,083
He's suing Mike?
1921
01:53:10,166 --> 01:53:12,291
- Yes.
- MJ? The person that's dead?
1922
01:53:12,375 --> 01:53:14,041
All of the above, actually!
1923
01:53:14,125 --> 01:53:16,583
He said Michael never touched me,
but, yes, I slept in his bed,
1924
01:53:16,667 --> 01:53:20,458
by myself with him,
and he was in his 30s, I was seven.
1925
01:53:20,542 --> 01:53:22,917
He should sue his mom
for letting him go sleep
1926
01:53:23,000 --> 01:53:25,458
with Michael Jackson
when he's seven years old.
1927
01:53:25,542 --> 01:53:27,625
Wade Robson, I put
him on as my witness
1928
01:53:27,709 --> 01:53:30,166
and he was subjected to
a withering cross-examination
1929
01:53:30,250 --> 01:53:33,667
by prosecutor Ron Zonen from the Santa
Barbara District Attorney's Office.
1930
01:53:33,750 --> 01:53:36,875
I mean, Ron went after him,
and Ron's a good prosecutor.
1931
01:53:36,959 --> 01:53:40,333
He would not waver. He was
adamant he was never touched.
1932
01:53:40,417 --> 01:53:43,917
And my understanding was Safechuck
repeatedly said the same thing.
1933
01:53:44,000 --> 01:53:45,959
So, to suddenly come
back years later,
1934
01:53:46,041 --> 01:53:48,041
and say we want
millions of dollars,
1935
01:53:48,125 --> 01:53:50,875
we were brainwashed,
we had repressed memory,
1936
01:53:50,959 --> 01:53:53,458
we didn't face the facts,
we didn't deal with reality...
1937
01:53:53,542 --> 01:53:55,458
I just find very,
very suspicious.
1938
01:53:55,542 --> 01:53:57,709
The story just keeps changing.
1939
01:53:58,792 --> 01:54:00,375
His story
1940
01:54:00,458 --> 01:54:02,583
keeps changing.
1941
01:54:06,417 --> 01:54:10,041
I have really fucking
had it with you, dude.
1942
01:54:10,125 --> 01:54:11,542
Fuck you.
1943
01:54:11,625 --> 01:54:13,834
Fuck you to fucking hell.
1944
01:54:13,917 --> 01:54:15,667
Fuck you, Wade!
1945
01:54:15,750 --> 01:54:18,375
Fuck, I hate you so much!
1946
01:54:25,000 --> 01:54:26,959
The die-hard Michael fans,
1947
01:54:27,041 --> 01:54:29,083
some of them are...
1948
01:54:30,125 --> 01:54:34,458
very, um... hateful.
1949
01:54:34,542 --> 01:54:37,000
It's been scary for me,
1950
01:54:37,083 --> 01:54:39,709
as a mom, with our child.
1951
01:54:39,792 --> 01:54:44,959
You know, in regard to the,
the threats that come from...
1952
01:54:45,041 --> 01:54:46,625
that Wade receives.
1953
01:54:46,709 --> 01:54:50,166
I'm not gonna lie
and say that that's not hard...
1954
01:54:50,250 --> 01:54:54,041
to see and to hear and to feel,
1955
01:54:54,125 --> 01:54:57,375
um, people not believing me,
and people thinking
1956
01:54:57,458 --> 01:55:00,250
that it's all about the money,
about nothing but the money.
1957
01:55:00,333 --> 01:55:03,000
Newsreader 1:
A judge has dismissed a choreographer's claim
1958
01:55:03,083 --> 01:55:05,917
that Michael Jackson
molested him as a child.
1959
01:55:06,000 --> 01:55:08,625
Los Angeles Superior Court
Judge Mitchel Becklov
1960
01:55:08,709 --> 01:55:12,041
dismissed Wade Robson's
claim on Tuesday,
1961
01:55:12,125 --> 01:55:15,875
after determining he waited
too long to file it in court.
1962
01:55:15,959 --> 01:55:17,875
Newsreader 2:
He did not rule on the credibility
1963
01:55:17,959 --> 01:55:20,375
of Robson's
allegations themselves.
1964
01:55:20,458 --> 01:55:23,583
This is where they
officially threw out his case.
1965
01:55:28,083 --> 01:55:30,417
These people don't
even know Michael.
1966
01:55:30,500 --> 01:55:32,583
They know Michael Jackson,
1967
01:55:32,667 --> 01:55:34,750
the amazing musician,
1968
01:55:34,834 --> 01:55:36,917
and the amazing superstar.
1969
01:55:37,000 --> 01:55:40,667
I'm not taking anything away from
Michael's talent as a superstar.
1970
01:55:41,834 --> 01:55:46,125
But as a man,
as a human being,
1971
01:55:46,208 --> 01:55:48,375
he's hurt people.
1972
01:55:49,250 --> 01:55:51,333
And those people that he's hurt
1973
01:55:51,417 --> 01:55:53,417
should have a chance
to talk about it,
1974
01:55:53,500 --> 01:55:56,291
and they should be
allowed to be okay.
1975
01:55:56,375 --> 01:55:58,417
The way that I understand it,
it's very common
1976
01:55:58,500 --> 01:56:02,250
for this type of abuse to be
registered later in life.
1977
01:56:02,333 --> 01:56:04,375
That when you're that
small and that hurt,
1978
01:56:04,458 --> 01:56:07,333
you don't even understand
what's happened to you.
1979
01:56:07,417 --> 01:56:10,417
So, I mean, we can't change it.
1980
01:56:10,500 --> 01:56:12,458
Michael's gone,
but it doesn't change the fact
1981
01:56:12,542 --> 01:56:14,125
that he destroyed these people,
1982
01:56:14,208 --> 01:56:16,417
and that the world still
goes on loving him.
1983
01:56:21,208 --> 01:56:24,375
He had so many good parts about him.
1984
01:56:24,458 --> 01:56:27,959
People think his music's
great, so he's great.
1985
01:56:28,041 --> 01:56:29,792
And people grew
up with him, too,
1986
01:56:29,875 --> 01:56:33,083
'cause he was a star
since he was a little kid.
1987
01:56:33,166 --> 01:56:35,500
So, to think that that person
1988
01:56:35,583 --> 01:56:39,208
is doing the worst
possible things to kids...
1989
01:56:41,667 --> 01:56:46,667
you know, that's tough,
I think, for people to...
1990
01:56:47,917 --> 01:56:50,208
wrap their heads around.
1991
01:56:50,291 --> 01:56:53,917
I didn't protect my son.
1992
01:56:55,834 --> 01:56:59,458
That will always,
always haunt me.
1993
01:56:59,875 --> 01:57:02,333
I had one job. I had one child.
1994
01:57:02,417 --> 01:57:04,208
And I had one job.
1995
01:57:05,000 --> 01:57:07,792
And I fucked up.
1996
01:57:11,542 --> 01:57:14,041
So, I had all these months
1997
01:57:14,792 --> 01:57:16,875
of loving my life with Michael,
1998
01:57:16,959 --> 01:57:21,709
and traveling, and living
the good life, so to speak,
1999
01:57:21,792 --> 01:57:24,959
all those wonderful memories...
2000
01:57:25,583 --> 01:57:30,959
it was all based on, um,
the suffering of my son.
2001
01:57:31,041 --> 01:57:34,375
My son had to suffer
for me to have this life.
2002
01:57:35,917 --> 01:57:40,625
My son is messed up today
because of it.
2003
01:57:40,709 --> 01:57:43,458
And I'm messed up
today because of it.
2004
01:57:44,750 --> 01:57:48,625
So you keep secrets and secrets,
and secrets kill you.
2005
01:57:48,709 --> 01:57:50,959
And everything's been
a secret...
2006
01:57:51,834 --> 01:57:54,166
and finally, can say something.
2007
01:57:56,875 --> 01:58:00,625
I don't wanna know too
much about what went on.
2008
01:58:00,709 --> 01:58:02,875
I don't wanna have
that discussion with him
2009
01:58:02,959 --> 01:58:05,917
because that would give
me nightmares.
2010
01:58:06,625 --> 01:58:10,333
I don't wanna hear that,
so I have not really had
2011
01:58:10,417 --> 01:58:13,041
a discussion about
the sexual side of it.
2012
01:58:13,125 --> 01:58:16,166
I don't know what else
I could've done,
2013
01:58:16,667 --> 01:58:19,125
but whatever it is,
I wish I had.
2014
01:58:20,542 --> 01:58:22,792
I don't know
if I'll ever really
2015
01:58:22,875 --> 01:58:25,625
fully forgive her to what
happened to the family
2016
01:58:25,709 --> 01:58:27,834
and what happened to Wade.
2017
01:58:27,917 --> 01:58:30,583
Um, I still love her and all.
2018
01:58:31,166 --> 01:58:34,291
You know, still support her
as much as I can, but...
2019
01:58:35,375 --> 01:58:38,000
there's some things that
I don't know if you...
2020
01:58:38,917 --> 01:58:41,125
I don't know if I can forgive.
2021
01:58:46,166 --> 01:58:50,333
I don't know how many
there are that Michael abused,
2022
01:58:50,417 --> 01:58:53,792
but you can only imagine
what the power that he had
2023
01:58:53,875 --> 01:58:55,834
and the influence that he had.
2024
01:58:55,917 --> 01:58:58,959
We, like, the public knows
how many children were there.
2025
01:58:59,041 --> 01:59:02,333
And then there's all the children
that we don't know about.
2026
01:59:07,792 --> 01:59:14,125
If my story of abuse with Michael and...
2027
01:59:14,208 --> 01:59:16,667
and all of the ways
that it affected me...
2028
01:59:17,375 --> 01:59:19,959
if speaking that truth,
2029
01:59:20,041 --> 01:59:23,667
other survivors of
child sexual abuse,
2030
01:59:23,750 --> 01:59:25,792
at the hands of anybody,
2031
01:59:25,875 --> 01:59:27,542
could be helped in any way,
shape or form,
2032
01:59:27,625 --> 01:59:30,291
by me coming forward
and speaking it,
2033
01:59:30,375 --> 01:59:32,166
I wanted to be able to do that.
2034
01:59:32,250 --> 01:59:35,417
I wanna be able
to speak the truth...
2035
01:59:36,417 --> 01:59:39,709
as loud as I had to speak
the lie for so long.
2036
01:59:42,917 --> 01:59:45,208
It's just the fame,
the whole thing,
2037
01:59:45,291 --> 01:59:47,458
you do get caught up in it.
2038
01:59:49,417 --> 01:59:52,000
Maybe I can forgive him,
at some point,
2039
01:59:52,083 --> 01:59:55,208
if I tried to understand
that he was sick...
2040
01:59:58,875 --> 02:00:02,000
but forgiving myself
is another thing.
2041
02:00:02,083 --> 02:00:05,417
I don't know if
I will ever do that.
2042
02:00:13,917 --> 02:00:17,625
He took my son's childhood away.
2043
02:00:19,417 --> 02:00:23,250
He took the man
he could've been away.
2044
02:00:23,333 --> 02:00:25,458
He was a pedophile.
2045
02:00:27,291 --> 02:00:31,250
pedophile.
2046
02:00:33,125 --> 02:00:35,208
I think they thought they
were doing the right thing,
2047
02:00:35,291 --> 02:00:37,750
and he's the biggest star,
and he's gonna...
2048
02:00:37,834 --> 02:00:39,917
"I'm gonna help
your son, and...
2049
02:00:40,000 --> 02:00:41,542
"You're son's amazing,
2050
02:00:41,625 --> 02:00:43,500
and I'm gonna be there
for him."
2051
02:00:44,125 --> 02:00:46,291
It's all a big seduction.
2052
02:00:47,166 --> 02:00:49,291
So, do I blame them?
2053
02:00:53,625 --> 02:00:56,291
I'm still working on it.
2054
02:00:57,305 --> 02:01:03,494
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