Original subtitles

NOTES FOR A FILM ON INDIA

India Gate.

The seat of the Indian parliament.

The flag of the Republic of India.

The temple of Rishikesh.

Divine Life Society.

This is the Ganges, near its source at the border with China.

Maybe one day, these people will visit the temple of Rishikesh.

I'm not here to make a documentary or a report on India.

I'm making a film about a film about India.

The film deals with two subjects fundamental to the Third World.

It's about religion and hunger.

I've asked this young boy who works in the temple of Rishikesh

if one of the monks of the temple were to find, in a deserted region,

some tigers starving to death,

if he'd be prepared to feed his own body to them.

He replied that he would.

I went to the Ganges.

It's the ashram of one of the most famous mahatmas of the area.

I asked him the same question.

He didn't want to answer. He wouldn't grant an interview.

He left. He retired to his cave.

Maybe it was a good thing he didnt talk to us.

This was worthy of the ancient saints who are his role models.

Walking around the temple of Rishikesh,

I looked for a monk who would be willing to feed his body to starving tigers.

One of these sadhus must be willing to feed his own body to starving tigers.

So far, no such situation has occurred.

However, should it occur, I think that is what should happen.

That is how I, too, should behave.

If there were some tigers nearby who were starving to death,

how many people do you think would be willing to sacrifice themselves?

There are millions of people in India.

How can I say if they'd be willing to do that?

Would your leader, the mahatma, be willing to feed his body to tigers?

I wont say.

I'm making a film, or rather a documentary for a film

which begins with a story about a maharaja.

This maharaja, before Indian independence,

was travelling through his lands, with his elephants and entourage.

He arrived in a desolate region that was covered in snow

and saw some tigers and their cubs who were starving to death.

He was overcome with pity and fed his own body to the tigers.

Would someone in India be willing to do that now?

Every human being has got two aspects,

the divine aspect and the demonic aspect.

They feel this divine aspect towards all men and even all animals.

This feeling is natural for a human being.

In his heart there is a love for men and for animals, for all living beings.

If he finds any one of them in danger or in difficulty,

he won't hesitate to give his life, to give comfort or help to that being in distress.

That was the feeling of that maharaja when he gave his own life to save the tigers.

But if there were some starving tigers around this temple today,

would any of these monks be prepared to commit the sublime act of donating his own body?

That is the actual meaning of the story.

But dont take it too literally. Theres nothing literal about it.

Everything has got a philosophical meaning. That is the meaning you should look for.

The meaning of this story is that you should be compassionate.

This story teaches us how to have compassion.

Then I went to Bombay, to a wealthy residential area,

where I visited a maharaja and his wife.

I asked him if a maharaja would be willing to feed his body to a starving tiger

to check if my film could start with this story or not.

He would probably take the tigers into his home and feed them.

But if this maharaja were deeply religious?

Yes. He might do it because of religious feelings.

Would a modern-day maharaja do this?

In modern India, I dont think so.

Madam, if your husband fell into poverty...

or rather, if you were the actress in a film,

playing the wife of a maharaja who had fallen into poverty,

how would you behave among all the poor people?

Would you feel inhibited by the caste system?

No, I wouldn't feel different.

You would feel all right amongst the poor people?

Would you touch the untouchables?

Certainly.

Here he is. This is the young Indian I would select to play the maharaja.

He says he would feed his body to a starving tiger.

Where does this maharaja live?

Probably in a palace like this one.

A palace in udaipur where, even today, a maharaja lives.

He still has quite far-reaching military powers, as if he were the queen mother.

Or in this lake palace?

Perhaps its a little too exotic.

No. The palace he would choose is this one in Jaipur.

So, the maharaja dies and leaves his family in great poverty.

India is free.

The British left, and the period of independence begins,

with some terrible problems to solve,

above all, the population problem.

This means the caste system and sterilisation issues.

This is where Gandhi addressed his people.

Regarding the first problem related to overpopulation,

the relationship between the castes,

I did some research in Bombay, by the Gateway of India, overlooking the sea.

I asked someone with experience in this area

if they thought that, for the wife of a maharaja living in poverty,

it would be a difficult thing for her to touch the untouchables.

Certainly. It would be very difficult for her.

LILY PANDYA BOMBAY TOWN COUNCILLOR

In those conditions, the person is helpless.

They would be willing to accept bread, even if it were offered by an untouchable.

I also asked if she thought that, at first sight, just by looking at someones face,

their physical appearance, she would be able to recognise an untouchable.

It is very difficult.

They dont come here, because no one is supposed to touch them.

They remain segregated from the rest of the communities.

So theyre a little shy.

They're ashamed of coming outside, and have to hide away.

Social conventions stop them from associating with other people.

Subconsciously, they feel fear.

Fear of being found amongst other people.

They're afraid someone might object because they allowed themselves to be touched.

Could you show us one?

That is what Im looking for.

They mainly work as refuse collectors.

They remain completely outside of other communities.

They're called Harijans.

Over there, you can see a lady

who is from what is called the untouchable community of India.

This poor woman is telling us which village she comes from.

We looked for another untouchable who was willing to talk to us,

but it was very difficult.

Difficult due to discretion on our part more than unwillingness on theirs.

Here he is.

Do you think you could ever be Prime Minister of India?

Anyone of us could.

Advancing little by little, we could all achieve that.

If you work hard, you can become great.

Regarding the second problem related to overpopulation and hunger,

that is, the problem of sterilisation,

we spoke to a high-ranking official from the Communist Party in New Delhi.

We asked if the Communist Party supported this sterilisation bill.

Mr M. FARooQI SECRETARY, DELHI COMMUNIST PARTY

The Communists think the people can't be forced to do this.

We have to do it democratically.

We have to take the people with us.

Otherwise, they would never learn anything.

After all, removing the prejudices of thousands of years is not so easy.

Just outside the Communist Party headquarters,

we stopped a group of people who looked like factory workers.

We asked them if they were for or against this bill.

- Yes, I'm for it. - I'm for it.

I'm for it.

The workers support it, at least those we questioned did.

We also spoke to intellectuals outside of a book show in the city centre.

Are you for or against?

Yes, I agree with this method.

I agree with it.

- Yes, I do. - Yes, I agree.

Yes, I agree with it.

Yes. It's a good idea.

I'm not in favour of it.

Why?

Everyone must get a chance of living.

But were trying to control that.

This is not the way of doing things. We should increase production.

There are many ways of solving the problem, other than this method.

So most workers and intellectuals agree with the sterilisation bill.

The main problem is the countryside, the villages,

where the majority of Indians live.

Hello.

Hello. Whats this village called?

- Bhavali. - Thank you.

This is the village of Bhavali.

We entered it almost clandestinely, afraid of breaking some kind of spell.

The village was basking in a peaceful noon sun.

A prehistoric peace

that is not without a certain elegiac sweetness.

The inhabitants welcomed us with smiles.

With a graciousness and hospitality which was quite moving,

they welcomed us and smiled.

They showed us how they worked.

The techniques they used are the same as those used 2,000 to 3,000 years ago.

When we asked them to talk about sterilisation, they refused.

We cant discuss it.

Theyre unaffected by this problem.

The maharaja dies.

His family is left in an India teeming with problems that seem irresolvable.

Who makes up the poor family of this maharaja?

A mother. It could be this woman,

or this one,

or even this one.

No, this one, this kind of motherhood.

The eldest son could be this one.

Or this smiling boy.

Or one of these two.

No. This is the one. This could be the first-born of the maharaja.

This is the youngest.

The daughter could be this one.

Or this one.

It has to be this one. This sweet little lamb.

So the maharajas family is dispersed amongst the people.

The first part of the film, the sacrifice of the maharaja to the tigers,

represents not only India before independence but all of Indian prehistory.

The second part of the film, the family in poverty,

represents not only Indias liberation but the entire story of modern-day India.

These problems can be summarised in one word, industrialisation.

The passage from an underdeveloped nation

to a lifestyle that we consider civilised, or at least modern.

In the cities, the population of India comprises mainly an urban underclass

that has the characteristics of the underclass of the world.

Regarding industrialisation and its related problems,

we went out to do some interviews and research.

We spoke to journalists,

to The Times of India

and, in the suburbs, to the workers in the factories.

Bombay is quite heavily industrialised.

There are around 4,000 businesses.

Of these, 3,000 have only about 50 employees.

But there are some large ones. Around 16 have over 15,000 employees.

The statue of Shiva, next to the hammer and sickle.

Lastly, the inhabitants of a village located between Bombay and Poona,

on the road linking two of the most modern, developed cities of India.

We asked these villagers if they feel very different

to the workers in the factories which are encroaching upon their villages.

- Life is good now. - Life is good now.

Is there no difference between the villagers who work in the fields

and the workers in the factories?

Of course. Definitely. These people only know agriculture.

And theyre not perfect at this task.

They are farmers simply because they live in the country and plough the fields.

But they dont know exactly how to produce, how to use fertilizers and all that.

Sometimes, teachers and government officials come to teach them these things.

But its beyond their capabilities, because this is a poor country.

Do you feel very different to the workers?

- Yes. Different. - Different.

Different.

Different.

Would you prefer to be a farmer or a factory worker?

Farmer.

Farmer.

Farmer.

Farmer.

We put the same question to some factory workers

who had been working in a factory for a long time.

Would you prefer to work in the fields, or here?

I like the country, working the land.

Do you think theres much difference between a farmer and a factory worker?

Yes, there is a big difference.

We can work with foreign machinery, study how it works and its applications.

Regarding religion and politics, we are quite different.

When we discuss religion with villagers,

their religion is quite different, though its the same religion.

I mean, they believe in something different, a different god.

When India is full to the brim of factories, do you think you will change?

Will you become westernised or will you remain Indian?

Indian.

Indian.

We will always feel Indian.

Indias progress depends on us.

There are two problems related to industrialisation.

The first is that the white man, Western man,

has a stupid and shameful concept of Third World nations.

He believes that a country must be westernised in order to modernise, to industrialise.

Is this correct or inevitable?

Mr MATHEW EDIToR, TIMES oF INDIA

If westernise means to assimilate new technologies,

then we are most definitely becoming westernised.

But if this means losing the personality

or the distinctive characteristics of this country, then we will try to resist.

This is the essence of the conflict.

There is no question of resisting it openly.

Mr GUPTA VICE PRESIDENT, TIMES OF INDIA

We recognise we have our own culture. We won't let another culture be forced on us.

We try to merge our culture with what we can take from others.

Second problem.

Recently in India, there have been the first instances of civil disorder.

Are these signs of the first influences of industrialisation on the Indian spirit?

In some ways, these are signs of industrialisation

Mr SHAM LAL PRESIDENT, TIMES oF INDIA

because peoples expectations have increased greatly since independence.

'Im surprised at how little violence there is

in a country like India, with so many problems and passions.

We are still a non-violent people,

even if the newspapers always talk about violence.

But they dont mention that we have many shortages,

or that theres a cow protection movement.

I would also like to clarify that, in part, the very tradition of Gandhi leads to violence.

Gandhi taught us non-violence, but also to resist authority.

I think that today people regard it as their right to resist authority.

Lets return to the film.

We left the maharajas family in poverty, wandering around India.

But why are they in poverty? And where are they going?

To answer these two questions, I asked two Indian intellectuals from Bombay

to have a discussion together on the subject, and to help me with the script.

Mr M.K.A. ABBAS DIRECToR AND SCRIPTWRITER

The maharajas family becomes poor,

because the maharaja probably was poor himself.

Many reasons could have led to the maharajas family

travelling around India.

One reason could have been to transport his ashes.

In fact, when the maharaja dies, he is cremated.

The ashes must be collected and placed in sacred waters.

So the ashes are transported to Benares.

Mr RAJENDAR SINGH BEDI NoVELIST

I would say that the children behave as their father did.

After independence, they decide they have no right to own their property.

It belongs to the people.

So they give up their property, and try their best to earn their living.

Ultimately, pitted against the reality of our country today,

they find theyre not able to fend for themselves.

In they end, one after the other, they all die.

The film moves to Benares, where the last member of the family is cremated.

This is idealism pitted against reality.

Mr JAG MoHAN SCRIPTWRITER

We have a famous story about King Shibi

who gave away part of his own flesh to a hungry eagle.

This story was also told during the Buddhist period, as The Jataka Tales.

So this is perfect for Indian folklore.

Why is the maharajas family travelling? I would explain it as follows.

When a Hindu dies, they think not only of the Ganges,

but also Nasik, Kanyakumari, the southernmost point of India, and Prayag.

So these people could die in four different places.

So, one by one, the wife and children of the maharaja die of hunger.

A Westerner who goes to India has everything, but gives nothing.

However, India has nothing, but gives everything.

Amazing.