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Kinski was a movie himself.
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He was a rather peculiar
individual, a very curious person.
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Klaus Kinski was the worst
work experience of my life.
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00:01:58,785 --> 00:02:02,581
I would never do it again,
even under torture.
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I worked on NOSFERATU IN VENICE,
and it's a long story.
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00:31:37,854 --> 00:31:39,856
I was involved in every
step of the production,
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from development to the very end.
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00:31:43,568 --> 00:31:48,323
The story starts around 1984
when I was directing second unit
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and doing the special effects for
Dario Argento's PHENOMENA.
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00:31:54,704 --> 00:32:02,879
NOSFERATU with Klaus Kinski had been released
not too long before and it was a big success.
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00:32:03,088 --> 00:32:10,137
Carlo Alberto Alfieri wanted to do
a sort of ripoff, an unauthorized sequel.
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00:32:10,554 --> 00:32:19,271
He was optimistic because
he'd known Kinski for years.
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00:32:19,312 --> 00:32:25,402
And one day, when Kinski was visiting Rome,
he managed to have him sign a contract
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00:32:25,735 --> 00:32:35,454
to make NOSFERATU IN VENICE,
a sequel to the famous NOSFERATU.
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00:32:42,878 --> 00:32:51,928
Alfieri asked me to work on this movie because
he wanted me to do the special effects,
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since he knew I had
experience in that field.
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So I was involved in the development of
the project from his office.
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At first it was quite an ambitious movie which
was supposed to be directed by Maurizio Lucidi,
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who was a gialli and
western director.
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00:33:15,952 --> 00:33:19,789
Lucidi was going
to direct, initially.
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The movie was supposed to
be shot in 1984/85, I think.
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00:33:24,002 --> 00:33:34,137
There was already a script and the whole
story was set during the carnival in Venice,
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which happens in February. And since
Kinski wasn't coming to Italy
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until summer, because he was shooting another
movie, they had to shoot the carnival in February.
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It would have been impossible
to recreate at a later time.
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00:33:51,238 --> 00:33:57,536
So I was there during
pre-production with Lucidi and Alfieri.
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00:33:57,869 --> 00:34:03,625
They went to Venice in February to
shoot the carnival footage, using some actors,
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not the leads, but
extras and minor characters.
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But, most importantly, they had a perfect body double
for Kinski, looking just like NOSFERATU:
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bald with long nails,
big canine teeth, etc.
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00:34:20,767 --> 00:34:29,234
They shot a lot of footage, at least two hours of
footage, and they edited it to about 20 minutes.
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00:34:29,401 --> 00:34:33,196
It was very expensive
to shoot those scenes.
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00:34:33,196 --> 00:34:39,953
Venice was particularly expensive
during the carnival.
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00:34:40,620 --> 00:34:43,415
It was hard to find hotels and so on.
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00:34:43,748 --> 00:34:49,629
They shot this footage without Kinski, with the plan
to shoot the rest with him in the summer.
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If I remember correctly, it was the summer
of 1985, and Kinski was very busy.
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He always had other movies
to shoot outside Italy,
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00:35:05,520 --> 00:35:09,149
and he kept on postponing
this movie.
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The distributors who were attached
by Carlo Alberto Alfieri gave up on the project,
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00:35:14,696 --> 00:35:17,073
and he ended up without
distribution for NOSFERATU IN VENICE.
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00:35:17,532 --> 00:35:27,042
So he contacted a producer who was
working a lot at that time: Augusto Caminito.
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00:35:27,083 --> 00:35:40,889
The idea behind NOSFERATU IN VENICE was to redo
Herzog's NOSFERATU. We wanted to follow that idea.
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Kinski agreed immediately and there was a script,
which I completely re-wrote, but it was good.
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We had several directors.
At first there was a guy called Lucchetti,
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then Mario Caiano... No wait,
before him there was Pasquale Squitieri,
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who wanted to do a futuristic Nosferatu set in
a future Venice, but he didn't get along with Kinski.
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So we hired Caiano, who was brought on to shoot a
more traditional movie, more his style and as it was written.
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A friend introduced me to a
producer/screenwriter named Augusto Caminito.
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00:36:36,486 --> 00:36:41,366
He was in a
desperate situation.
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He'd sent a director to Africa to shoot an
adventure movie, a kind of INDIANA JONES,
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and this guy did everything in Africa
except shoot the action scenes.
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So he came back with footage
which couldn't be edited, and he told me,
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“Mario, do me a favor. Save this movie for me.”
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00:36:57,716 --> 00:37:03,138
So I shot for 10 days. I was lucky enough to
find a reconstructed mine at De Paolis studios.
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00:37:03,263 --> 00:37:06,015
Then I went to Tor Caldara,
where I recreated Africa.
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00:37:06,516 --> 00:37:11,479
I shot 10 days of action scenes
in order to save this movie.
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00:37:11,563 --> 00:37:15,775
I even used some of Sergio Leone's
ONCE UPON A TIME IN AMERICA locations.
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Well, I did that for 15 days or so and I saved the
movie. They edited it, he liked it, and he was happy.
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He was so grateful that he told me, “You'll be
the director of the next movie I produce.”
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He even had me sigh a contract.
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Around the same time he also promised Kinski that he would
direct his next movie, which was NOSFERATU IN VENICE.
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Neither Kinski or I knew about this conflict.
I thought I was the director and so did he.
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We knew Mario because we had
worked with him before.
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He was a professional and a
good director. He knew his job.
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He also knew that directing Kinski
wouldn't be an easy task.
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He never could've imagined
just how hard it was going to be.
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While we were waiting for Kinski to arrive, Caminito made
a deal with Berlusconi at Mediaset.
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Berlusconi was starting as a producer. Up until that time
Berlusconi would buy movies cheaply,
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but when the producers realized that they'd made
bad deals they started asking for a lot of money.
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Berlusconi then said, “"Well, if I have
to pay so much for a movie,
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it'd make more sense to co-produce
them and own them.”
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So Caminito closed the first deal of that kind
with Berlusconi, and I remember it was a great deal,
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everyone was happy about it.
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So everything changed once again. The movie
had to be expensive and spectacular.
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It had to be an international production
because they actually had money.
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So the script was changed once again. This time
they went big. Caiano was happy about it, because
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when you tell a director he has a bigger
budget than expected, he's happy.
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Then Kinski arrived and he was like a hurricane,
sweeping everything away. He was at the height of his madness.
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There were moments when he was sweet
and adorable, and then all of a sudden
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he would start to yell like a
madman having a nervous breakdown.
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He always had wild mood swings,
which were completely unexplainable.
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When he was in a good mood, he was the most
adorable guy on earth. Nice and kind.
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But when he had his outbursts of anger,
and it happened often, he was totally wild.
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Kinski was grateful to Alfieri because he'd once had
to escape from Italy. It was on the set of a movie
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where he'd had a fight with an assistant director
and he'd hurt him, so he was sentenced by a judge.
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That's the reason Kinski
suddenly stopped making movies in Italy.
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Alfieri took care of his legal woes and
he managed to get his sentence reversed,
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allowing him to go back to Italy
without going to prison.
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Kinski was very grateful to Alfieri. They had
a very good relationship, as he did with Caminito too.
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Here's the first thing Kinski said when he came to the
office of Carlo Alberto Alfieri, in Piazza Verdi, in Rome,
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while Caiano was there.
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They showed him the bald cap he'd have to wear
since he was supposed to be Nosferatu,
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big canines, long nails
and so on. He said,
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"I had to go through hell to make
NOSFERATU.
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There's no way I'm going through
that process again.”
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We were all in shock, and he said,
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“I'll do this movie with my own long hair, my face, my teeth,
my normal hands. I don't care about the previous movie.”
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This scared all of us because, first of all,
all that footage shot with the double,
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bald, with the big canines,
and long nails,
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killing people in Venice,
would be unusable.
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So they actually discarded it,
because the footage couldn't be used.
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And then we were perplexed, because
if he looked like that in the film
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people wouldn't associate him
with Nosferatu.
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Yes, something
like that happened.
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Kinski was a bit bald on the back of the head anyway,
but he didn't want to be shot from behind because of that.
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Kinski didn't want to use the image of Nosferatu
by Herzog, which was very beautiful.
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He wanted something different, but
the difference between him and Herzog
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is like the difference between
Tanio Boccia and Ingmar Bergman.
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During pre-production Kinski
was obsessed with one thing,
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and I remember this
because it was totally crazy.
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Carlo Alberto Alfieri had an old Ferrari which was still in
good condition, and Kinski wanted it as part of his payment.
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They somehow made a deal
and he got this red Ferrari.
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So the movie started, and
it started off with a bang.
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The first day we shot in Tor Caldara, which is
a rocky place by the sea near Rome.
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We had to shoot the scene where they
find Nosferatu's coffin after the shipwreck.
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We had some extras in that scene.
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We shot it. Caiano is very good,
so it was shot on schedule.
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Kinski only had to be in the last
two shots of this first day.
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I remember it was 5 PM
and almost sunset.
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Kinski arrived in the afternoon. I set up a close-up
of his face, but I could see that he was ignoring me.
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I said, “Action!” And he did
more or less what he had to do.
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It was a silent close up.
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I said, “"Cut!” But he kept on making
weird faces. “Hey, I said CUT!”
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Caiano told Kinski what he was supposed
to do in the scene, and Kinski responded
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in a very impolite way and he threw
his small mirror at him.
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He always had that mirror in his pocket
to check his hair and make-up
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before every scene. He insulted
him very badly, without any reason whatsoever.
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It was a very normal scene,
nothing peculiar was happening.
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Caminito came up to me and said, “Please, he asked us not to
say 'Cut' because he might do something after that.”
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“No way. When I say 'Cut' he has to stop.
He has to do the things I ask him to do.”
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“But you know, it's a different situation...”
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“Yes, sure, whatever, I got it. Goodbye.”
So I left and I sued him. And I won.
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00:44:58,946 --> 00:45:04,952
The movie stopped. The movie stopped
at the very first scene with Klaus Kinski.
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They kept on shooting the movie between
bottles of champagne and snorts of cocaine,
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and they ended up with that unwatchable
mess called NOSFERATU IN VENICE.
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The first day on the set, in order to welcome
the crew, I brought a bottle of champagne.
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They told me, "We had to move Kinski's
trailer so it's in the shade.”
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"The Spanish extras will arrive soon.
And the director left the set.”
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They used a certain tone of voice.
“He left?”
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“Yes, because Kinski slapped him.”
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Caiano touched his arm to instruct him where
to go and Kinski said, “You don't touch me.”
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And he touched his arm like this.
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So I was with the whole crew, the Spanish
dancers, and everyone ready to shoot.
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00:45:59,006 --> 00:46:03,135
I went to Kinski thinking: “This is the
last time I'll see him. This time I'll slap him.”
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When he saw me he was all happy and said, “This is great,
we got rid of Caiano! You should be the director!”
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That night I shot the scenes, somehow thinking
I would find another director the following day.
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But it was August 25th, and no one was available.
Only one said yes, I think it was Giovanni Soldati,
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but he asked me to postpone the shoot for
3 weeks so that he could prepare.
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Three weeks later Kinski's contract would have
ended, so that couldn't happen.
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My acting career, how did it start?
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Well, it started with Kinski.
At that time I was already 18.
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I want to say this because many
people have said that I was underage.
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No, I was already 18, and since I was “legal,”
I was able to participate in a beauty contest
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called “A New Face For Cinema,” which was a
side event of the Venice Film Festival.
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I won that contest and I was celebrating this success
with my friends in a famous restaurant in Venice.
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By chance, Kinski was sitting at the next table because
at that time he was shooting NOSFERATU IN VENICE.
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He was there with
the crew and the director.
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I didn't even know who he was because I was just 18
and I didn't have that kind of cinematic knowledge.
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Back then I only knew Italian movies like
CHRISTMAS HOLIDAYS, and those kind of movies.
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I didn't know important artists and actors.
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Anyway, long story short,
I didn't know who he was.
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He had a peculiar face, though, and I was attracted
to that kind of "mask” that was in front of me.
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I couldn't help looking at him
because he was very peculiar, very strange.
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It was like he was wearing a mask.
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He was shooting NOSFERATU IN VENICE and
he had long hair with a particular color.
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Well, I was very attracted by his figure, which
was certainly very, very charismatic.
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The same thing with him,
for different reasons, of course,
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so the owner of the
restaurant - who was his friend -
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introduced me to him and
everything started there.
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The following day he invited me to the set of NOSFERATU
IN VENICE because he thought that a young girl like me,
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who had never been on a movie set before,
would be happy to be there,
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and after that he invited me to dinner.
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Being on that set was a real epiphany,
since I had never visited one before.
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For the first few months it was more like
a friendship before he left for the States,
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where he lived, in San Francisco,
and so we talked over the phone.
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Then, little by little, it became a real
relationship which lasted 3 and a half years.
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My acting career began with him.
I can say this honestly.
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It started that day in that Venetian restaurant when we met,
and it was he who brought me into the world of cinema.
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While shooting this movie I met two actors who
I already knew, and I was happy to see them again.
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Firstly Donald Pleasence, whom I'd met
on the set of Argento's PHENOMENA.
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Then there was Christopher Plummer,
who acted in my movie STARCRASH,
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so my relationship with him
was even better.
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We reunited on this movie
and we were happy about it.
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It was nice to have them there because
the movie was utter chaos.
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Every time Kinski was walking to set we
would hear him screaming from the canal,
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then from the stairs, and
finally when he arrived on the set.
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00:50:29,068 --> 00:50:37,701
There was always a lot of confusion. But the funny thing
about Pleasence was that he couldn't care less.
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00:50:38,244 --> 00:50:47,002
The set was a mess. Kinski argued with everybody
from the still photographer to the camera guy,
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the cinematographer... But Pleasence was
always sitting on the sofa reading a book,
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waiting to be called to shoot.
He couldn't care less.
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“Donald, are you ready?”
“"Ready!”
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He came to the set, he shot his scene, and then
he went back to the sofa to read his book.
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He was completely indifferent
to the chaos on the set.
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Plummer had a different attitude.
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At first he put a lot of effort into the
movie since he's a huge professional.
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His first scenes were the ones of the duel
against Kinski, when Plummer shoots
199
00:51:34,008 --> 00:51:38,637
and puts a hole in Kinski's stomach.
That was a blue screen effect I did.
200
00:51:38,679 --> 00:51:41,307
I directly worked on that scene.
201
00:51:42,308 --> 00:51:49,064
The surreal thing was that when
we did rehearsal for that scene,
202
00:51:49,982 --> 00:51:53,777
Plummer started saying
his lines in front of Kinski.
203
00:51:54,236 --> 00:52:04,872
Kinski looked at him in an indifferent way because,
as I said, he didn't want to rehearse.
204
00:52:05,247 --> 00:52:12,713
Without saying anything, he took his mirror from his pocket,
the one he used every day to check his make-up,
205
00:52:12,963 --> 00:52:21,055
took a comb, and started combing his hair while
Plummer was saying his lines in front of him.
206
00:52:22,556 --> 00:52:27,770
And then he answered him while he was still
combing his hair, with the same indifferent look.
207
00:52:27,811 --> 00:52:32,941
Plummer was flabbergasted
and then he burst into laughter.
208
00:52:33,317 --> 00:52:39,114
From that moment on he treated the
set like a joke. He no longer cared.
209
00:52:39,490 --> 00:52:45,829
One day I asked him, "How is it to
act with Kinski?” He said,
210
00:52:45,871 --> 00:52:49,750
“"Well, they're paying me so
much money that I don't care."
211
00:52:49,917 --> 00:52:53,712
Talking about Christopher Plummer,
I can quote Kinski.
212
00:52:53,796 --> 00:52:58,342
I asked him, “What do you think of
Christopher Plummer? Is he a good actor?”
213
00:52:58,509 --> 00:53:01,136
Kinski said, “"He's a great actor,
but he doesn't know it.”
214
00:53:01,261 --> 00:53:05,224
But Plummer was a great
professional and great actor.
215
00:53:05,349 --> 00:53:09,812
There was a scene with Barbara De Rossi
in which he raised hell.
216
00:53:10,104 --> 00:53:17,611
Barbara De Rossi was to be in her bed sleeping,
and Kinski had to arrive at night and grab her.
217
00:53:17,903 --> 00:53:23,450
The scene was to just be
close ups of the actors.
218
00:53:23,951 --> 00:53:32,501
I was there to record sound.
219
00:53:33,085 --> 00:53:40,175
The rest of the crew couldn't see the bodies
of the actors because I was in front of them,
220
00:53:40,217 --> 00:53:43,679
and the camera was by my side.
221
00:53:43,971 --> 00:53:56,066
While we were shooting this scene, I saw him pull away
the blanket and put his hands “in her nature.”
222
00:53:56,525 --> 00:53:59,069
Let's call it that.
223
00:54:00,612 --> 00:54:09,538
I was like, "What the hell is he doing?”
Because what he was doing was off-screen.
224
00:54:10,539 --> 00:54:17,963
She didn't say anything,
poor girl, she was petrified.
225
00:54:18,881 --> 00:54:24,011
When the director said,
“Cut!” She ran away crying.
226
00:54:24,595 --> 00:54:30,309
Barbara De Rossi left the set crying and
Caminito and Alfieri tried to calm her down.
227
00:54:30,851 --> 00:54:35,731
They finally agreed that Kinski
was not allowed to touch her anymore.
228
00:54:35,773 --> 00:54:43,822
He couldn't do what he did
earlier when they'd shot the scene.
229
00:54:43,989 --> 00:54:49,119
She was in bed and he had to caress her,
and maybe he was a little inappropriate
230
00:54:49,161 --> 00:54:51,705
and she didn't like it, but nothing
more than that happened.
231
00:54:51,789 --> 00:54:57,878
Since the others didn't see what happened,
because my body was covering it,
232
00:54:58,170 --> 00:55:03,592
everyone asked, “What happened?”
And I told them what I saw.
233
00:55:03,717 --> 00:55:08,931
So everyone went to Barbara
in order to console her.
234
00:55:09,264 --> 00:55:16,438
A man, an actor who does something
like that... You can call it what you like...
235
00:55:16,688 --> 00:55:22,277
He always had a passionate relationship
with women. Sometimes he was aggressive,
236
00:55:22,402 --> 00:55:24,196
but he could also be nice and sweet.
237
00:55:24,488 --> 00:55:28,951
There were no problems with
Barbara De Rossi. Everything went well.
238
00:55:37,960 --> 00:55:41,839
We sold it pretty well all over the world.
239
00:55:41,964 --> 00:55:44,883
I think the movie was released 3 years later.
240
00:55:45,133 --> 00:55:51,098
The relationship with Berlusconi
was excellent in the beginning,
241
00:55:51,223 --> 00:55:53,559
but then it turned into a living hell
because he didn't like the movie.
242
00:55:54,101 --> 00:56:04,903
While shooting the movie they were so thrilled
that they signed a contract with Kinski
243
00:56:05,279 --> 00:56:11,827
to shoot his PAGANINI movie, then another
contract to shoot a movie in America.
244
00:56:12,035 --> 00:56:22,170
They had big projects planned with Kinski, but everything
turned into dust because of NOSFERATU IN VENICE
245
00:56:22,170 --> 00:56:31,138
and the beginning of the shoot of PAGANINI,
when Kinski's madness was uncontrollable.
246
00:56:44,776 --> 00:56:48,113
Kinski said that he was
the reincarnation of Paganini,
247
00:56:48,280 --> 00:56:51,033
because it was a movie he'd
wanted to do for many years.
248
00:56:51,116 --> 00:56:53,327
He had that idea because
one day he was in Paris
249
00:56:53,368 --> 00:56:59,750
and he saw a picture of Paganini
in a shop and it caught his attention.
250
00:56:59,875 --> 00:57:03,378
From that moment on he started to study
his life in detail because,
251
00:57:03,587 --> 00:57:09,092
I say it again, he was an incredible
perfectionist in this way.
252
00:57:09,343 --> 00:57:14,389
And so he developed this movie
for years, especially his character.
253
00:57:14,473 --> 00:57:17,059
He identified with Paganini.
254
00:57:17,309 --> 00:57:20,228
He said he was his reincarnation.
The movie was to be called KINSKI PAGANINI,
255
00:57:20,228 --> 00:57:22,981
because he did a sort of transfer with him.
256
00:57:23,106 --> 00:57:27,611
Paganini too had quite a
debauched personal life,
257
00:57:27,694 --> 00:57:32,616
and so, just like him,
he was “genius and disorder,”
258
00:57:32,699 --> 00:57:38,997
and because of this they
were one and the same.
259
00:57:39,081 --> 00:57:42,960
There are two kinds of scripts: the very
technical ones and the very descriptive ones.
260
00:57:43,335 --> 00:57:53,261
When you read a very technical one
you can “see” the movie,
261
00:57:53,303 --> 00:57:56,598
because you imagine the
camera movements and everything.
262
00:57:56,974 --> 00:57:59,893
When they are descriptive
it's like reading a story.
263
00:58:00,435 --> 00:58:02,354
This script was neither
one nor the other.
264
00:58:02,437 --> 00:58:05,232
It wasn't technical.
There were no descriptions like,
265
00:58:05,315 --> 00:58:10,445
“the camera goes here and there, then
the editing will show a detail of an eye...”
266
00:58:10,654 --> 00:58:18,537
It was nothing like that. There were just
sentences giving some impressions or ideas.
267
00:58:18,745 --> 00:58:21,498
It was like looking at a detail
of an Impressionist painting.
268
00:58:21,748 --> 00:58:25,460
You can see the whole picture
only by looking at it in its entirety.
269
00:58:25,585 --> 00:58:27,421
You can like it or not.
270
00:58:27,587 --> 00:58:32,259
But if you just look ata 5 cm x 5 cm bit,
you only see some color blobs.
271
00:58:32,592 --> 00:58:38,932
What was written in the script, in my very
humble opinion, was just color blobs, that's all.
272
00:58:39,182 --> 00:58:43,395
He loved Rome a lot, and he especially
loved a villa on the Appia Antica street,
273
00:58:43,437 --> 00:58:46,314
which he rented every time
he came to Rome.
274
00:58:46,440 --> 00:58:51,236
We lived in that villa when
we were a couple.
275
00:58:51,403 --> 00:58:54,031
It was a peculiar villa,
almost ghost-like.
276
00:58:54,281 --> 00:59:01,997
It was haunted by ghosts and they sat well with
Kinski. It was a nice domestic partnership.
277
00:59:02,372 --> 00:59:08,462
He loved that place a lot and we lived
there when he was preparing PAGANINI.
278
00:59:08,462 --> 00:59:13,925
It was very funny because he would dress
like Paganini, even when he wasn't on set.
279
00:59:14,217 --> 00:59:20,223
He asked me to do the same. He wanted
me to wear the 1800's period costumes,
280
00:59:20,348 --> 00:59:24,352
because I'd never worn them before
and he wanted me to get used to them.
281
00:59:24,561 --> 00:59:30,650
It was a very precise
and detailed method.
282
00:59:30,817 --> 00:59:38,617
He was dressed in black with
his smoking jacket - or was it a waistcoat?
283
00:59:38,742 --> 00:59:45,749
I don't remember - with his black hair, and he wandered
the villa with candles all around. It was striking.
284
00:59:45,957 --> 00:59:51,213
Kinski was left handed, though, and
so he played the violin backwards.
285
00:59:51,421 --> 00:59:54,341
I don't know how to say it,
I'm not an expert.
286
00:59:54,466 --> 00:59:59,679
Anyway, in the movie the violin was
played by the great Salvatore Accardo,
287
00:59:59,846 --> 01:00:02,808
who used his hands on the instrument.
288
01:00:02,933 --> 01:00:06,269
When they had to edit the
movie they had problems,
289
01:00:06,394 --> 01:00:09,064
because in one scene the violin was on the
right and in another one it was on the left.
290
01:00:09,189 --> 01:00:15,070
In order to explain this he'd say,
“"Damn! Paganini was diabolical,
291
01:00:15,112 --> 01:00:16,822
he could play with both hands!”
292
01:00:16,988 --> 01:00:19,074
Okay then, perfect, problem solved.
293
01:00:31,336 --> 01:00:35,966
That movie was a
reflection of life for him.
294
01:00:36,133 --> 01:00:42,556
It was his redemption as a director,
since he'd always hated his directors.
295
01:00:42,681 --> 01:00:48,353
He always had a difficult relationship with them
because he didn't like being directed,
296
01:00:49,020 --> 01:00:51,148
so he had many conflicts.
297
01:00:51,189 --> 01:00:56,236
This movie was his payback,
because he was the director
298
01:00:56,319 --> 01:00:58,488
and no one could tell him what to do.
299
01:00:58,530 --> 01:01:03,368
It was him who told us what to
do, because it was his movie.
300
01:01:03,535 --> 01:01:07,706
It was him who brought
the money into the movie,
301
01:01:07,873 --> 01:01:11,334
at least that's what he
believed, and how he behaved.
302
01:01:11,626 --> 01:01:16,298
So he was the “owner”
of these movies.
303
01:01:16,882 --> 01:01:22,095
And so everything he said, even the
stupidest things, had to be respected.
304
01:01:22,137 --> 01:01:25,599
My first meeting with Kinski was
when he ended up in jail.
305
01:01:25,974 --> 01:01:36,026
I started the job and they told me, “Tomorrow Kinski
has to inspect the location at Villa Pamphili."”
306
01:01:36,735 --> 01:01:42,532
"The meeting is already scheduled,
be there and see what happens.”
307
01:01:43,033 --> 01:01:45,785
I talked to the person who had
given us permission to go there,
308
01:01:45,827 --> 01:01:48,246
and he talked to the office
of Villa Pamphili.
309
01:01:48,330 --> 01:01:53,501
And they prepared a minivan
to visit the garden.
310
01:01:54,294 --> 01:02:02,385
They provided it because, even in the 80s, it was
absolutely forbidden to drive your own car there.
311
01:02:02,802 --> 01:02:09,809
Then I saw a Ferrari Testarossa
coming from Gianicolo,
312
01:02:09,893 --> 01:02:12,270
heading full speed towards
Porta San Pancrazio.
313
01:02:12,354 --> 01:02:14,439
It stopped in front
of the entrance.
314
01:02:14,522 --> 01:02:19,444
The Ferrari had mirrored glass
so I couldn't see inside.
315
01:02:19,611 --> 01:02:23,323
It was Klaus Kinski
and Debora Caprioglio.
316
01:02:23,907 --> 01:02:27,911
He lowered the window
and I saw him with his white hair.
317
01:02:28,203 --> 01:02:32,874
So I said, "Good morning, Mr. Kinski.
I'm Stefano Spadoni, unit manager of the movie."
318
01:02:32,999 --> 01:02:38,129
"You can park your car here, the mini-van is
ready, and we can take you to see the location.”
319
01:02:38,421 --> 01:02:46,888
Kinski said, "I won't go anywhere
in a shitty mini-van. I'll go in my car.”
320
01:02:47,055 --> 01:02:51,893
He rolled up the window and took off
towards Villa Pamphili at 100 km/h.
321
01:02:52,560 --> 01:02:57,482
I looked at the permits guy
and said, "I haven't seen you today.”
322
01:02:57,565 --> 01:03:01,820
And he said, “I haven't seen
you either. Goodbye.”
323
01:03:01,987 --> 01:03:04,990
Kinski was then arrested and
taken to the police station.
324
01:03:05,282 --> 01:03:09,786
I came back to the production office and after
a while we were told he was arrested
325
01:03:09,911 --> 01:03:13,290
for entering Villa Pamphili
at 100 km/h in his Ferrari Testarossa.
326
01:03:13,456 --> 01:03:21,214
Altovito and Caminito asked me
what happened and I told them.
327
01:03:21,298 --> 01:03:26,886
Their faces turned pale because they
started to realize who they were dealing with.
328
01:03:27,262 --> 01:03:38,023
I remember a scene with the chariot and the
four horses. They had to turn in a small square.
329
01:03:38,189 --> 01:03:43,611
He said, “"Shoot! Shoot!”
And then, of course, we told him,
330
01:03:43,695 --> 01:03:49,367
“This is not a car, it has no steering wheel!
Four horses can't turn here!”
331
01:03:49,868 --> 01:03:55,457
And so they had to remove two horses
in order to shoot that scene.
332
01:03:56,082 --> 01:04:01,087
The whole movie was shot like this.
It was like a bet.
333
01:04:01,504 --> 01:04:05,258
On the set Kinski had a very protective attitude
towards me because it was my first time on set.
334
01:04:05,467 --> 01:04:13,475
So I probably had a different perspective
than that of a normal movie set.
335
01:04:13,683 --> 01:04:21,608
He was very demanding with me as well,
and he didn't treat me differently.
336
01:04:30,325 --> 01:04:38,541
When it was released I thought that
PAGANINI was a masterpiece.
337
01:04:38,792 --> 01:04:44,297
The film that would shock
the international movie business.
338
01:04:44,547 --> 01:04:54,516
Years later I consider it a very difficult movie,
not least from the point of view of its making.
339
01:04:54,682 --> 01:05:01,356
It's almost a visionary movie, certainly not a
traditional movie, but it was very particular.
340
01:05:01,523 --> 01:05:06,986
We arrived at the Cannes Festival
out of competition,
341
01:05:07,153 --> 01:05:11,408
because the movie was rejected by the official
selection and Kinski was angry about that.
342
01:05:11,449 --> 01:05:17,205
The movie was screened in
a different section of the festival.
343
01:05:17,372 --> 01:05:22,127
We arrived in Cannes and he
called a press conference,
344
01:05:22,127 --> 01:05:26,673
in which he said the worst things about
the organizers of the festival,
345
01:05:26,673 --> 01:05:30,343
especially about the ones
who did not select his movie.
346
01:05:31,511 --> 01:05:36,516
A very important and well-known journalist
told him that his movie was bad.
347
01:05:36,683 --> 01:05:42,772
Of course she did it in a provocative way,
but Kinski lost it,
348
01:05:42,772 --> 01:05:51,990
and he started insulting her,
and throwing things at her.
349
01:05:52,073 --> 01:05:59,789
The photographers were incredibly happy
about it, because I remember
350
01:05:59,831 --> 01:06:07,088
that they followed us across the Croisette
and we almost ended up in the water.
351
01:06:07,130 --> 01:06:12,010
Everyone talked about it. I didn't realize anything
because I was 19, I was having fun.
352
01:06:12,093 --> 01:06:17,140
I felt like laughing. I wasn't
aware of the media buzz.
353
01:06:17,223 --> 01:06:22,061
He was very good at that, he was a
communicator. It was natural for him.
354
01:06:22,687 --> 01:06:27,734
Anyway, this press conference created a
lot of hype. There are pictures and videos.
355
01:06:27,775 --> 01:06:32,572
It was very funny. Well, it's funny to talk
about now, but maybe back then it wasn't.
356
01:06:39,746 --> 01:06:43,082
The “private” Kinski wasn't very
different from the “public” one.
357
01:06:43,333 --> 01:06:49,297
He acted only when he was shooting
movies, and I think he brought a lot
358
01:06:49,422 --> 01:06:55,178
of his personality to the characters he played,
especially from a physical point of view because,
359
01:06:55,220 --> 01:06:59,849
as I said before, he wore a “mask” and he could
be very beautiful or very ugly,
360
01:06:59,933 --> 01:07:02,393
depending on what
character he was playing.
361
01:07:02,477 --> 01:07:05,396
When he did NOSFERATU IN VENICE
he was Nosferatu,
362
01:07:05,522 --> 01:07:09,025
in his face, it was the same thing
in the previous NOSFERATU movie,
363
01:07:09,275 --> 01:07:14,948
which was more successful and
which is still popular today.
364
01:07:15,073 --> 01:07:19,035
But he could be very beautiful as well,
as he was in many movies he did,
365
01:07:19,452 --> 01:07:24,499
not only with Herzog but,
for example, 'IMPORTANCE D'AIMER.
366
01:07:24,707 --> 01:07:30,630
He had a completely
plastic face.
367
01:07:30,964 --> 01:07:34,592
In his private life he was exactly
how people saw him in public.
368
01:07:34,634 --> 01:07:39,138
He was a very generous man,
very loving, very jealous, even too much.
369
01:07:39,430 --> 01:07:49,816
He alternated moments of extreme
sweetness and calm with moments of rage.
370
01:07:50,024 --> 01:08:00,910
When he saw something he didn't like,
like someone cutting him off in a car,
371
01:08:00,994 --> 01:08:04,122
he became very, very irascible.
372
01:08:04,247 --> 01:08:07,875
And he wasn't afraid of anything,
he never feared consequences.
373
01:08:08,251 --> 01:08:16,342
In his private life, in his relationship with me,
he was very sweet because he wasn't irascible.
374
01:08:16,593 --> 01:08:20,805
You would think that a man like him, with such a
peculiar nature, might have been different,
375
01:08:21,014 --> 01:08:27,395
but he always had the greatest respect for our
relationship, and he was also very protective.
376
01:08:27,562 --> 01:08:34,068
Probably he was way too jealous, and that was
the reason why our relationship ended.
377
01:08:34,235 --> 01:08:41,743
His jealousy was obsessive and made our
relationship end. And other reasons too, of course.
378
01:08:41,868 --> 01:08:47,915
Sometimes relationships end because
people want new experiences in life.
379
01:08:48,333 --> 01:08:51,544
I was very young,
he wasn't, and so...
380
01:08:52,003 --> 01:08:57,634
Anyway, in his private life he could be very
funny as well, because his outbursts of anger
381
01:08:57,759 --> 01:09:04,599
only lasted 5 minutes and everyone knows that, even the
people around him, not only me, his girlfriend.
382
01:09:04,724 --> 01:09:10,355
Even his collaborators knew that. Even his
maid Clara, who became my maid as well,
383
01:09:10,438 --> 01:09:17,111
she knew that they lasted 5 or 10 minutes and then
they ended. But while they lasted they were tough.
384
01:09:17,403 --> 01:09:29,248
He didn't have many friends. He had some friends
in Paris, but they were in the movie business as well.
385
01:09:29,749 --> 01:09:33,920
Yeah, his friends were all more or
less from the movie business.
386
01:09:34,045 --> 01:09:41,552
Kinski didn't like mankind much,
he often talked shit about it.
387
01:09:41,886 --> 01:09:47,600
After many years I think that he was absolutely right
in some ways, but he wasn't a social person.
388
01:09:47,809 --> 01:09:59,737
When he worked he loved to stay
with people, but he didn't have many friends.
389
01:10:00,154 --> 01:10:08,287
He had a couple in Paris, but he had hardly
any friends in the US, if I remember correctly.
390
01:10:12,875 --> 01:10:18,256
The place he loved most was certainly
his chalet in Lagunitas, California.
391
01:10:18,339 --> 01:10:21,676
It was a fantastic place, completely isolated,
in the middle of the woods.
392
01:10:22,301 --> 01:10:28,433
The first time I went there I was like, "Mamma mia!”
Because getting there was quite a trip.
393
01:10:28,599 --> 01:10:36,274
You could only get there by jeep
because the road was so narrow and steep.
394
01:10:36,357 --> 01:10:42,655
You had to pray you arrived home
safe and sound.
395
01:16:12,151 --> 01:16:26,457
It was the place he loved most
and felt the most alive,
396
01:16:26,707 --> 01:16:38,677
because he also had a
close relationship with nature.
397
01:16:38,928 --> 01:16:45,476
This chalet was in the middle of the woods,
and they found him dead there.
398
01:16:45,518 --> 01:16:48,395
At least I think,
because I lost all contact with him.
41507
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