All language subtitles for Unsolved.Mysteries.S04E23.480p.WEB-DL.AAC2.0.H.264-PLAYREADY_track3_[und]

ANNOUNCER: This program is
about unsolved mysteries.

Whenever possible, the
actual family members

and police officials
have participated

in recreating the events.

What you are about to see
is not a news broadcast.

ROBERT STACK: Tonight,
a special edition

of "Unsolved Mysteries"--

in the summer of 1991,
31-year-old Jeffrey Dahmer

confessed to the unprovoked
murders of 17 young men.

Neighbors and
coworkers, who described

Dahmer as a quiet loner, were
shocked by the revelations.

In the 1980s, banking
executives siphoned billions

from the nation's S&Ls.

Savings were diverted
to fraudulent land

schemes, luxury cars
and yachts, prostitutes

and political slush funds.

The rest of us will
be repaying the debt

well into the next century.

Iraqi president Saddam
Hussein murdered thousands

of rivals in his rise to power.

Though soundly defeated
by Operation Desert Storm,

he has re-emerged to
threaten world stability.

The central characters in these
seemingly unrelated events

share one disturbing
trait, a cunning mind

unrestrained by conscience.

Some call them psychopaths.

Others call the sociopaths.

We call them diabolical minds.

Motherhood is above suspicion,
unquestioned, sacred.

So no one was surprised
when Marie Hilley resolutely

nursed her family
through a series

of debilitating illnesses.

Nobody had any idea
that Marie Hilley

was poisoning her own family.

From his prison cell,
convicted murderer G. Daniel

Walker terrorized
a deputy district

attorney who prosecuted him.

Our exclusive
interview with Walker

paints a chilling portrait
of the diabolical mind.

In June 1989, a mother
and her two daughters

were sexually
assaulted then dumped,

still alive, into Tampa Bay.

Perhaps you can help
identify the killer,

who authorities believe will
continue to rape and murder.

Tonight in this
special presentation,

we'll explore the mysteries
of a frightening phenomenon--

the mysteries of
the diabolical mind.

Join me.

[music playing]

The words diabolical
and psychopath

bring to mind the lurid
villains from horror movies,

out of control, glassy
eyed, unkempt maniacs.

Real life psychopaths
bear little resemblance

to these movie madmen.

They hold jobs,
shop for groceries,

and appear no different
than the rest of us--

most of the time.

Only the minority
of psychopaths

are actually violent.

There are people who are vice
presidents of corporations, who

step over the competition,
whose backstabbing

is only figurative.

One of the social dangers
that psychopathic individuals

perpetuate is that oftentimes,
especially if they're

brighter than average or
perhaps very intelligent,

that they can fool
individuals into believing

that they are quite sincere
and are being quite honest.

ROBERT STACK: Even
psychopaths who

murder, such a serial
killer John Wayne Gacy,

might stand next to you
in line at the post office

without drawing your attention.

John Wayne Gacy is an
interesting case in Chicago.

A respectable,
responsible figure,

he was a clown at
children's parties

and active in the political
party of his time,

photographed with the president
and the president's wife.

But all the while
this was going on,

he was systematically
luring into his house

and then hideously torturing
and killing young men

and then burying
them under his home.

ROBERT STACK: Ted
Bundy also appeared

to be a pillar of society.

At various times before
his arrest and execution,

he was a counselor on
a rape crisis hotline,

a campaign aide to Washington
Governor Dan Evans,

and in 1972, Ted Bundy was named
Mr. Up and Coming Republican.

Two very well-known
journalists describe Ted Bundy,

for example, as a
kind of alien life

form mimicking the behavior
of real human beings.

A lot of psychopaths don't
just kill individuals.

They're not content with that.

A lot of psychopaths
run countries.

I see no fundamental difference
between someone like Ted Bundy

and someone like
Adolph Hitler, who

simply used very
different techniques

for very similar ends.

All that mattered to them
was control and domination,

in the one case of a
single isolated individual,

in another of an entire nation.

And the ruthless annihilation
of millions meant nothing.

The most destructive
psychopaths

are those very few
who achieve and hold

onto absolute political power.

The force of authority combined
with a diabolical mind almost

inevitably leads to an epic
and horrifying rampage.

In these rare home
movies, Adolf Hitler

appears no more threatening than
a prosperous Bavarian country

gentleman, a friend of
dogs and small children.

And yet, Hitler was
certainly the most

heinous psychopath of all time.

What drove Hitler
to systematically

murder six million Jews and
decimate most of Europe?

One of the more common
prevalent theories today

is that there's a lack of
bonding between the parent

and the child in the
very early years.

The sociopath grows up feeling
unloved, out of control.

And when he grows up,
he has intense need

for control over other people.

ROBERT STACK:
Hitler's father was 52

years old when Hitler was born.

Many believe his physical
and emotional abuse virtually

destroyed his son's self-esteem.

As an adult, Adolf
Hitler felt compelled

to subjugate millions to
avenge his own deep feelings

of inferiority.

Psychopaths kill because
that is the ultimate act

of humiliation
and dominance that

shows their total
power and control

over another human being.

It's the ultimate achievement
of their psychopathic dreams.

[speaking german]

ROBERT STACK: Amidst
the wreckage and misery

that he unleashed
on Europe, Hitler

displayed the psychopath's most
chilling trait, a total absence

of empathy for his victims.

For the psychopath,
the world is

a smorgasbord from
which he can select

whatever food he wants to eat.

There is no reciprocity.

There's no empathy
for who he victimizes.

It is something that
he intentionally does.

And it's choices
that he makes day in

and day out as to who
he will manipulate.

[crowd cheering]

ROBERT STACK: More recently,
Iraqi president Saddam Hussein

ordered the invasion
of Kuwait, the latest

episode in a political
career marked

by bloodletting and treachery.

Saddam has an extremely
dangerous personality.

But he is not crazy
in the sense of being

committable to a
mental institution.

This is the kind of
person, in a court

of law, who would
not be considered not

guilty by reason of insanity.

But the recommendation of
the examining psychiatrist

would undoubtedly be
to throw away the key.

ROBERT STACK: Saddam
Hussein grew up

in an impoverished almost
medieval village that lacked

electricity and running water.

He was frequently beaten by his
stepfather, kept out of school,

and forced to help
support his family

by stealing chickens and sheep.

Like Hitler, Hussein exploited
a turbulent political climate

to legitimize his personal need
to dominate and control others.

Along the way, what he
learned and what was reinforced

regularly was that violence
is the key to power.

[gunshots]

ROBERT STACK: During
the 1960s and '70s,

Hussein methodically eliminated
political rivals, torturing

and murdering thousands.

By July of 1979,
Hussein inspired

so much fear that he was able
to gain the presidency simply

by asking for it.

Within days, Hussein summoned
his leading supporters

to a meeting, where he charged
a number of potential rivals

with treason.

This crude video footage
was smuggled out of Iraq

and shows several of the accused
being led from the meeting.

After that meeting, Hussein
forced those not identified

as conspirators to execute
their former colleagues.

A striking example of the
dangers of criticizing Saddam

occurred in 1982.

The war with Iran that
Saddam had initiated

was going very badly.

And Saddam decided
they had to stop it.

But by now Khomeini was
obsessed with Saddam said

there would be no
peace until Saddam

was deposed or stepped down.

Saddam called a cabinet meeting,
asked his cabinet, what shall

we do?

Khomeini insists I step down.

To a man, of course, the
cabinet said you must stay on,

we need your leadership.

Saddam then said, no, no, no,
I want your frank, candid,

and creative suggestions.

His Oxford-educated minister
of health, a Dr. Ibrahim,

took him seriously and made
a rather shrewd suggestion.

Why, he suggested,
don't we have you

step down temporarily, Saddam,
until our goal of peace

is established?

And then you can
resume the presidency.

As the story is told, Saddam
thanked him for his candor

and then had him arrested.

The minister's wife
pled with Saddam

to return her husband to her.

He promised her that he would.

As best as I can tell, the
only promise he ever kept.

The next day, he
returned her husband

to her in a black canvas
bag chopped into pieces.

ROBERT STACK: With his
critics effectively silenced,

Hussein launched his
ill-fated invasion of Kuwait.

When he ultimately
surrendered, Hussein

promised to terminate
production of all chemical

and nuclear weapons.

Subsequent United Nations
inspections confirmed

that Hussein was lying.

If one were to strip world
leaders and politicians

of narcissistic
characters, the ranks

would be perilously thinned.

We must always be
alert to that fusion

between that personal
drive for power,

unconstrained by
conscience, when

it meets a wounded population.

That has repetitively
over history

led to some of the
most violent episodes

that have scarred our planet.

History has shown that
political psychopaths

will not mellow into wise
and magnanimous leaders.

Most, like Adolf Hitler, perish
in the flames they help ignite.

Some, like Idi Amin,
are deposed and live

a quiet retirement in exile.

A few, such as Joseph
Stalin and the Soviet Union,

die of old age with their
iron grip still strong.

The ultimate fate of Saddam
Hussein remains a question.

When we return, a case
study of a different kind--

the female diabolical mind.

[music playing]

It may not surprise you that
95% of all serial killers

and mass murderers are men.

As one expert has
said, if you're

looking for a diabolical
gender, it is the male.

There are, however, a
few diabolical women.

Typically these
sociopaths conceal

their true nature behind a
veil of tenderness and warmth.

Frank and Marie Hilley were
high school sweethearts.

They were married in 1950.

And the life they
built together was

the envy of friends and
neighbors in Anniston, Alabama.

Here we go.

ROBERT STACK: By
1971, Frank had worked

his way up from shipping
clerk to supervisor

at the local foundry.

The Hilleys had two children,
Carol, 11, and Mike, 18.

Aside from her
tendency to overspend,

Marie was a cheerful
and supportive partner,

by all appearances the
perfect wife and mother.

Well, let's eat.

ROBERT STACK: But
appearances deceive.

MICHAEL HILLEY: I first
started getting sick when I was

18, a lot of stomach problems.

And I started having those
problems about two or three

months after an
insurance policy was

taken out on me for $25,000.

Sweetheart, you're not
feeling any better, are you?

Oh.

Oh, honey, you are
still just burning up.

My stomach hurts.

Does it still?

ROBERT STACK: Mike's doctors
are unable to diagnose or cure

his persistent stomach ailments.

Don't know what
could be wrong.

ROBERT STACK: Curiously, once
Mike left home for college,

the symptoms disappeared.

And curiously, with
Mike away from home,

his father developed a
mysterious stomach ailment.

Once again, doctors are
unable to find a cause

or provide a cure.

At the same time, Frank
and Marie's marriage

was falling apart.

MICHAEL HILLEY: My
father called me one day

and had something he
wanted to talk to me about.

He had come home from
work early one day

and had found my mother in
bed with one of her employers.

[dogs barking]

I think my father was
going to divorce her.

Pop, whatever you do--

MICHAEL HILLEY: And I think that
was one circumstance that she

just wouldn't allow to happen.

I love you too, Pop.

She placed a high value on
prominence and reputation.

And to go through a divorce
would have destroyed that.

ROBERT STACK: Within two
weeks of confiding in Mike,

Frank Hilley's mysterious
disorder suddenly worsened.

Frank was admitted to
the local hospital.

Marie rarely left
his side, tenderly

feeding and caring for him.

No more.

I'm so sick and poorly.

You've got to eat, Frank.

MICHAEL HILLEY: I remember
thinking to myself,

maybe this is the catalyst that
will put them back together.

Don't you talk that way.

MICHAEL HILLEY: Maybe
his illness will

bring them closer together.

Frank, I am here for you.

And together we are
going to make it.

ROBERT STACK: Frank Hilley
died on May 25, 1975.

The official cause of
death was hepatitis.

Nobody suspected the truth.

What's important
to understand is

that these people, who seem so
loving, love in a very odd way.

The sociopath will
love you for what

you do for them not for who
you are and what you are.

Whenever you become no longer
necessary to their lives,

they will throw you away.

And if It has to be
through murder, so be it.

ROBERT STACK: Marie spent little
time mourning for her husband.

The proceeds from
Frank's life insurance

total more than $30,000.

Marie quickly refurnished
her house, bought a new car,

and draped herself in
expensive jewels and fashions.

When the money ran out,
Marie kept spending.

We became aware that Marie
was having financial problems.

There were various businesses
filing complaints on her

for insufficient checks
that she had written

to cover various purchases.

There were some deals
with automobiles

that she had made that fell
through and weren't paid for.

Just a lot of little
things that began to add

up to flag our attention.

She owed more than she had.

She couldn't pay her bills.

My mother's finances
were in terrible shape.

I began to receive phone
calls from creditors

wanting the money.

So she was getting all of
these things with the promise

to her creditors that
I would pay for them.

ROBERT STACK: Four years
after her father's death,

18-year-old Carol Hilley
suddenly became sick.

Nobody thought to
connect her illness

to Marie's financial problems.

But nobody knew that
Marie had insured

Carol's life for $25,000.

MICHAEL HILLEY: During the time
that everyone was getting sick,

I think the time
between those illnesses

was sufficient enough
not to cause anybody

to question what was going on.

However, in each
individual case,

I think someone, a
relative in the family

suspected that
something was going on.

And like me later on,
something is, but what?

For you to try to tell me--

ROBERT STACK: Shortly
after Carol became ill,

Mike returned to
Anniston to confront

Maria about her overspending.

No.

We are going to the bank
and cash in Daddy's stocks

so that you can pay me
the money that you owe me.

I won't do anything like that.

That is all the money
I have in the world,

and I will not spend it.

Momma, the creditors are
calling me three times a day.

ROBERT STACK: Mike was
now living in Florida.

He had a wife and
young baby of his own.

And Marie's appetite for
expensive possessions

threatened his family.

Mother--

MICHAEL HILLEY: I said,
if I have to pick you up

and physically put you in the
car, we're going to the bank.

There no questions.

Right after breakfast,
which she cooked,

I got about as sick as
I'd ever been in my life.

I'm so sorry.

Momma, I don't want
to stay here anymore.

I know darling.
I--

ROBERT STACK: Mike
recovered quickly

and returned to
Florida, but Carol's

condition steadily worsened.

Well, last night I
talked to my friend Ellen,

who's the registered nurse.

And she said they have this
new medicine at her clinic

that she thinks might help you.

Can you get me some?

Well I--

ROBERT STACK: Carol
was in and out

of the hospital for six
months and finally became

paralyzed from the waist down.

The only thing is--

ROBERT STACK:
Still, doctors were

unable to diagnose her illness.

You promise you
won't tell a soul?

I promise I
won't tell anybody.

All right then, baby,
I'll give you some.

Now let's see here.

You need to turn over for me
because I'm going to have to do

like an injection in your hip.

MICHAEL HILLEY: Carol became
increasingly sicker and weaker.

Although I didn't
see her at that time,

I only heard from my
mother and my aunt.

OK, sweetie, this is
going to sting a little bit.

MICHAEL HILLEY: I
remember my aunt

telling me that my mother
had Carol in seclusion,

would not let anybody
see her, would

not let anyone talk to her.

And if something didn't
happen, Carol was going to die.

All right now,
sweetheart, I really

think that will help you.

I do.

When we find a woman
who is a sociopath,

we find an individual
who leads a double life,

who fools and manipulates
family and friends.

No one suspects.

In fact, she's often the last
person you'd suspect at all.

Well, how can I
help you, detective?

ROBERT STACK: On
September 20, 1979,

Marie's facade of innocence
began to fracture.

--checks that you've written--

ROBERT STACK: While at the
hospital tending Carol,

Marie was arrested for
passing bad checks.

There's one for
$5,000 that you

ROBERT STACK: Anniston police
didn't realize that the arrest

probably saved Carol's life.

There's another for $1,000
that you wrote for a used car.

One of Carol's
friends at that time

told me that she had
visited Carol that day,

and Carol had mentioned
something about injections

that my mother had given her.

Now just look
straight ahead for me.

Would you?

Um hm, That's good.

ROBERT STACK: Mike
demanded that the hospital

staff re-examine Carol.

DOCTOR: How did you
sleep last night?

OK.

ROBERT STACK: Doctors
checked for a telltale sign

of arsenic poisoning,
unmistakable white lines

across the fingernails.

DOCTOR: Did you eat breakfast?

CAROL HILLEY: Yeah.

The world as I knew it at
that point just fell apart.

Everything that I had
been taught to rely on

was totally in question.

Everything that my
mother had taught me--

right from wrong--

I had to go back and re-examine.

ROBERT STACK: Mike
Hilley was forced

to confront the unspeakable.

His mother probably
murdered his father.

[music playing]

In October of 1979,
at Mike's request,

and surprisingly with
Marie's permission,

Frank Hilley's body was
exhumed for a second autopsy.

Marie quietly
slipped out of town

three weeks before the
autopsy results were released.

The revised cause of
death, arsenic poisoning.

On January 11, 1980,
an arrest warrant

was issued, charging Marie
with the murder of her husband.

But by then, Marie
Hilley had disappeared.

At about the same time,
700 miles from Anniston,

a romance blossomed in
Fort Lauderdale, Florida.

Marie Hilley had resurfaced,
flaunting a new identity--

Robbi Hannon.

John, could I have a light?

Oh, sure.

ROBERT STACK: John
Holman, recently

arrived from New Hampshire,
was pleased to meet her.

So, Robbi, right?

Um hm.

What brings you
to sunny Florida?

Oh, just wanted to
take a little vacation,

get away from the past.

JOHN HOLMAN: Yeah,
I understand that.

Where are you from?

Oh, just a little
town in Texas.

JOHN HOLMAN: Texas?

ROBERT STACK: Robbi told
John she was a widow

and was soon to
inherit a vast estate.

JOHN HOLMAN: Married?

ROBERT STACK: She also revealed
she had a life-threatening

brain cancer.
JOHN HOLMAN: Oh, I'm sorry.

But, hey, enough about me.

Well, how about you?

There's not much
to tell, I'm afraid.

Sociopaths tend to
be very good actors.

They know how to play
the script of life.

And they know how to
capitalize upon the needs

and vulnerabilities of others.

New Hampshire, all that snow.

ROBERT STACK: The Robbi Hannon
character was skillfully

and deliberately created.

She was attractive.

She was available.

She was going to be rich.

And she might die
sometime in the future.

The possibilities
seemed endless.

Robbi and John were
married in May of 1981.

She found work as
a secretary and was

welcomed into the
quiet social fabric

of Marlow, New Hampshire.

Hi, Esther, how are you?

John Holman, good
to see you again.

Thank you.

And who do we have here?

Pastor, I'd like for you to
meet my wife, Robbi Holman.

Very pleased to
meet you, Robbi.

Well, the pleasure
is all mine, Pastor.

ROBERT STACK: By all accounts,
John and Robbi shared

a quiet and contented marriage.

Then in September of 1982, Robbi
informed John that her brain

cancer had worsened.

She flew alone to Texas
for special medical tests.

John Holman never
saw Robbi again.

He got a call sometime
later from an individual

who identified herself
as Robbi Hannon's

twin sister Teri Martin.

She also advised Mr.
Holman that Robbi had died,

and the body had been
donated to science.

And all the arrangements
had been made so there

was nothing for him to do.

ROBERT STACK: Several weeks
later, Teri Martin, Robbi's

sister, came to New Hampshire.

She brought an emotional
farewell letter

Robbi had written to John
just before she died.

Teri?

You must be John.

I'm Teri Martin, Robbi's sister.

Oh, I'm sorry, John, I thought
you knew we were twins.

I guess I knew,
but I had no idea--

--identical twins.

Why, if it weren't
for the hair--

ROBERT STACK: Marie Hilley had
lost 20 pounds, dyed her hair

blonde, and boldly
returned to New Hampshire

as her own twin sister.

I'm so sorry
we're having to meet

under circumstances like this.

ROBERT STACK: John Holman
accepted Teri at face value.

She moved in with him, and they
lived together for two months.

However, some of
John's neighbors

were suspicious and attempted
to verify Teri's story.

Nothing checked out.

[thunder rumbles]

Marie Hilley was
ultimately trapped

by an unlikely coincidence.

Her age and description
just happened

to match one of the FBI's
most wanted fugitives.

On January 18, 1983,
Teri Martin was taken

into custody for questioning.

After she was picked
up, they had no idea

that she was
actually Marie Hilley

and that she was wanted
in Alabama for murder

and attempting to
poison her daughter.

Once she was picked up, then
they've learned who, in fact,

she really was.

ROBERT STACK: Marie
Hilley was sentenced

to life plus 20 years.

In the winter of 1987,
she escaped from prison

only to die seven days
later from prolonged

exposure to the cold.

Marie Hilley was 53 years old.

[music playing]

MICHAEL HILLEY: My mother had
a lot of charisma and charm,

and she knew how to use that.

She had the ability
to make you believe

what she was saying,
even if you knew

that it was an outright lie.

She had the ability to make you
believe that you were the most

important thing in her life.

And that could have been the
furthest thing from the truth.

ROBERT STACK: What
inner forces polluted

Marie Hilley's natural bonds
with her husband and children?

How could a wife and mother
regard her own family

members as little more
than economic resources

to be exploited?

Like so many diabolical
personalities,

Marie Hilley remains a mystery.

When we return, a disturbing
face-to-face confrontation

with a diabolical mind, an
interview with convicted

murderer G. Daniel Walker.

INTERVIEWER: How long
is your rap sheet?

I would think the
current one would probably

be about 29 to 30 pages.

INTERVIEWER: 29 to 30 pages?

Yeah.

INTERVIEWER: Charles
Manson's is only five.

Well, he was just a killer.

[music playing]

ROBERT STACK: Words,
collections of letters,

some bearing an
emotional charge,

others as neutralizer
as air, perhaps

providing a window
to the inner workings

of the diabolical mind.

How you doing, Steve?

Eh, fairly good.

OK, remember the
instructions now.

Each time you see--

ROBERT STACK: Based
on test responses

to emotional and
non-emotional words,

Dr. Robert Hare
in Canada believes

that this normal subject
can be distinguished

from a psychopath.

Sensitive electronic instruments
show that a normal person

responds faster to
emotionally charged words

than to words that are neutral.

But psychopaths do not
make this distinction.

Dr. Hare believes this may
help explain why psychopaths

don't have a conscience.

Most people talk about
conscience in terms

of something like an inner
voice talking to oneself,

well I shouldn't do that.

You know, mommy said
I shouldn't do it.

I shouldn't do it.

And after awhile, it
becomes sort of automatic.

We do that.

We refer to that as conscience.

I would say that the
psychopath probably

doesn't have the same
sort of inner voice

that most people have.

It may be that the language
processes or the ability

of language to actually
control behavior

is different in the psychopath
than it is in other people.

ROBERT STACK: Dr. Hare's
experiment is just one

attempt to unravel the
most vexing mystery

of the diabolical mind--

are certain people
born as psychopaths

or do they become psychopaths?

If I were to cast my vote
in one direction or the other,

I would probably say
that it's more likely

that they're born, not made.

I think that there are fairly
strong genetic contributions

to all personality
traits, including

the personality traits
that make up psychopathy.

I think it's pretty clear
that while people may have

an inherited susceptibility
to certain kinds

of violent crimes,
that individuals

who go on to produce these
kinds of abominable crimes

are created.

They're shaped by
their families.

They're shaped by
their societies.

They model the culture
heroes in their civilization.

And they go on to commit
these abominable acts.

Experts are still years
away from understanding

the mind of the psychopath.

For a close-up look at the
baffling enigma of such

a personality,
"Unsolved Mysteries"

traveled to Northern California
to interview convicted murderer

G. Daniel Walker.

While he is not a serial killer,
Walker is, without doubt,

a diabolical mind.

At the time of the
interview, G. Daniel Walker

was probably the only
prisoner in California

with his own
courthouse workspace,

including a computer,
privileges resulting

from a lawsuit against
the state prison system.

Over a three-year period,
Walker was driven several times

a week to the Alameda County
Courthouse, where he prepared

still more lawsuits
against judges,

district attorneys, journalists,
and corrections officials.

He is almost as much trouble
inside prison as out.

Good morning, all.

A funny thing happened to me
on the way to this interview.

I got arrested, put
in chains, and I'm

not the defendant in this case.

ROBERT STACK: Walker projects
a buoyant confident manner.

This amiable posture belies
the fraud, armed robberies,

and murder, which have
kept him institutionalized

for most of the past 35 years.

G. Daniel Walker served
time in the late 1960s

for armed robbery and
the attempted murder

of an Illinois policeman.

In 1972, he escaped.

Three months later
he was arrested

in California for the
murder of advertising

executive William Ashlock.

After the killing,
Walker allegedly

raped Ashlock's
fiance, all the while

proclaiming his love for her.

He then terrorized her into
helping him cover up the crime.

Walker defended
himself in court,

claiming Ashlock was the
victim of a mafia hit squad.

Walker insisted that he had only
helped to cover up the murder

to protect Ashlock's fiance.

He lost his case and received
a sentence of 17 years

to life in prison.

While Walker insists he is
innocent of the murder charge,

he openly boasts
of having committed

more than 300 other crimes
for which he has neither

being charged nor tried.

Do you feel that you are
pretty much by the system

where you belong, from
the standpoint of--

Yes, yes.

I am convicted of murder.

I've always denied
that I was the one that

did the actual shooting
in that peculiar case,

but I've taken
the witness stand.

ROBERT STACK: Walker
was interviewed

by former FBI criminal
profiler Robert Ressler.

--in concealing the crime.

And given the same set of
facts, I would do it again.

How long is your rap sheet?

I would think the
current one would probably

be about 29 to 30 pages.

ROBERT RESSLER: 29 to 30 pages?

Yeah.

ROBERT RESSLER: Charles
Manson's is only five.

Well, he was just a killer.

But yeah, at the
same time, I've

heard you say that your
criminal record, your rap sheet,

your FBI record, whatever,
does not certainly

hold all that you have done.

Definitely not.

No, the body of work of, you
know, the criminal enterprise

has been much greater.

And let's hope that I've
been successful in something.

See, you're meeting a
failed criminal right now.

And you're very happy to
be meeting me as a failed

criminal, because if
you were meeting me

as a successful criminal,
that means that I'd

have the gun pointed at you.

And you would suddenly
have this fecal matter--

ROBERT RESSLER: A person like
him can be extremely dangerous.

He doesn't buy our system.

He does not buy our society's
rules as we establish them.

And again, that's the
mark of a psychopath

or a sociopath is that they
make their own rules in life.

You have had so
many opportunities

to stay out of jail.

And yet, you keep
coming back in.

Well then again, you see
prison as not been successful.

And just because
you're in prison

doesn't mean you
can't be successful.

I think Solzhenitsyn said the
greatest freedom that a man

enjoys is being in
prison because they feed

your breakfast in the morning.

You can go out and kill
one of your cellmates,

and they'll still feed you
lunch and give you sheets

for your bed in the evening.

The psychopathic
individual will

use several different defenses.

One of those is rationalization.

He will come up with very
elaborate explanations

that when thought about very
carefully make no sense.

Institutions are
not that unsatisfying.

You've got to
remember, I don't have

to go out and kill any cows.

They're going to
do all that for me.

I don't half go out
and cook any meals.

I don't have to wash any dishes.

They're going to do all
those things for me.

So, the institution
becomes a wife by nature.

They're going to wash
my dirty socks for me.

They're going to do
all of the things

that I don't
necessarily like to do.

So, if that's becoming
institutionalized,

I'm happily married.

ROBERT RESSLER: If you had
the option, would you leave?

I've had the option to escape.

I have escaped, as you know.

Juries have tried me and never
found me guilty of escape.

I've always represented
myself in those cases.

There is a certain excitement,
when you have escaped

from a major penitentiary and
you know that the red lights

are right behind you.

You know the sirens are going.

There is a certain
excitement that you

just-- it's better than sex.

So yes, there is that
possibility that there

may be the 14th escape.

ROBERT RESSLER: You
know, I've heard

that before from other people.
- Oh, it's exciting.

ROBERT RESSLER: Yeah,
yeah, the excitement

is a high factor in maintaining
a life the way you have.

And oftentimes, you'll
find that the people that

are pursuing you
will lose the scent,

so you have to go
back and show them,

no, no, you've got to
turn this way, fellows,

you know, to keep
the chase going.

And I've done that.

They will draw the
interview into what

we call a narcissistic
twinship, where they will try

to do things to
show in what ways

they are similar
to the interviewer.

And oftentimes the
interviewer is both

flattered and caught off guard.

You know, the minute you
have taken down a perpetrator,

and you've taken him
down, that you guys

get together and
give the high fives

and say "good job we did today.

Oh, that was a great job."

Well, the criminals
do the same thing.

The minute that
you've outwitted them,

you get together and
give the high fives.

You go, oh, we got over on them.

ROBERT RESSLER: Are you saying
there's just a fine line

between you and I then?

Very fine line,
and you know it.

ROBERT RESSLER: Do you have
any true feelings of remorse?

Well, I would
have to say, take

a different tangent on that.

Do I have remorse for the
things that put me there?

We have to remember that the
crime that I'm in prison for I

defended myself.

So I'm the one that
lost that case.

So I have remorse that I
didn't handle that case

in a little different way.

As far as helping--

REID MELOY: The psychopathic
individual will engage

in a psychology of reversals.

Pain originates in other people.

Problems originate
in other people.

And responsibility
for our behavior

is really other
people's responsibility.

ROBERT RESSLER: Do
you feel that you

are a truly dangerous
person from the standpoint

of committing violent acts?

Only if you've done
something wrong to me.

I think what you're
referring to is

the fact that I imported two--

ROBERT STACK: From prison,
Walker somehow managed

to have a highly
toxic poison imported

into the United States.

A deputy district attorney
who had once prosecuted Walker

became terrified that he
might be Walker's target.

--system, where
it can't be traced.

So when suddenly the
system discovered

that I had 2.2 pounds of
poison in the United States,

they went crazy.

Like what does G. Daniel
Walker want with this poison?

Well, the little lady that
lives in Dubuque, Iowa that

has an antique collection that
has never heard of the name G.

Daniel Walker knew that I
didn't have that poison for her,

so she had no concern.

There were a lot of
deputy attorney generals,

a lot of United States--

assistant United States
attorneys, that suddenly

became very uncomfortable.

And there were a lot of judges
that became uncomfortable.

And they started a
major investigation.

They indicted me, a
two count indictment

for importing this poison.

They spent about $1,300,000
working up a prosecution.

And then they folded their
tent because they found out

that I hadn't broken the law.

Did you use the poison?

They've never found any
sufficient evidence to charge

me with having used it.

But it certainly cause one
deputy attorney general

in the state of California
to go through his cabinets

and take all
ingestible items out--

toothpaste and liquor.

And finally his wife
said, well gee, it

could be in the carpets.

So they recarpeted their home.

And finally they sold
the home and moved.

ROBERT RESSLER:
So in other words,

creating paranoia
in a person can

be oftentimes even more
insidious than just

making verbal threats.

It's a better gamesmanship
than doing physical violence,

because fear lives with
you 24 hours a day.

Fear never goes away.

If you kill somebody,
that's over.

ROBERT RESSLER: --or
attempt to kill somebody.

Yes.

If you've hurt them,
you know, and as long

as the pain is there, that's--

but fear is a pain that
lives with you forever.

Since 1977, G.
Daniel Walker has

been denied parole seven times.

If the state does grant him
parole on the murder charge,

Walker still faces
a 50-year term

on federal charges stemming
from credit card frauds he

committed from inside prison.

When we return, FBI and
Florida investigators track

an elusive diabolical killer.

[music playing]

On May 26, 1989, Joan
Rogers and her daughters

Michelle, 17, and Christe,
14, left their farm

in Willshire, Ohio for a
long-anticipated vacation

in Florida.

They visited the
zoo in Jacksonville

then drove to Kennedy
Space Center, Disney World,

and the Epcot Center
before arriving

in Tampa on June 1, a Thursday.

Boy, long trip.

Michelle, would you--

ROBERT STACK: There, the
Rogers' carefree vacation came

to a sudden and horrifying end.

I knew they were supposed
to be back maybe on Saturday,

Sunday, maybe a Monday.

But Tuesday morning, I got
a little concerned about it,

and I called her mom, and
she hadn't even called her.

And I knew something had
happened then because she's

not the type that don't call.

I just figured she
couldn't get a hold of me.

And that's when I think
I reported them missing.

ROBERT STACK: On the same day
Hal Rogers expected his family

to return home, the bodies
of three unidentified women

floated to the
surface of Tampa Bay.

Each had been bound with tape,
weighted with a cinder block,

and dumped into the
Bay still alive.

All three had apparently
been sexually assaulted.

The victims were Joan,
Michelle, and Christe Rogers.

Once again, authorities
were confronted

with a grim harvest of an
unknown psychopathic killer.

Male serial killers are
so difficult to apprehend.

They kill strangers, unknown
motive, no crime scene,

no fingerprints, no
other physical evidence,

usually only a dump site.

And that is the modus operandi
of the male serial killer.

The murders of Joan,
Michelle, and Christe

were classic psychopathic
killings, cunningly conceived

and executed without remorse.

The maddening
scarcity of evidence

has limited authorities to
assumptions and speculation.

Without a name,
face, or fingerprint,

police have attempted
to construct

the profile of a killer.

It is at best a slow,
frustrating process.

Tampa Bay was the final stop
on the Rogers' itinerary

before they returned to Ohio.

Christe, wasn't that
last place we went neat?

Oh, yes, it was.

Did you love it?

ROBERT STACK: Joan,
Michelle, and Christe

checked into their motel
around noon on June 1.

Within hours, fate
and happenstance

brought them into the
range of a lurking killer.

We believe that they were
victims of opportunity.

What that means basically
is he surveilled them.

He knew that they were the ones
that he wanted to approach.

And he had planned this, but
it wasn't that much in advance,

because the circumstances
of their travels

wouldn't lend to that.

ROBERT STACK: Authorities
believe that in order

to bring Joan and her
daughters under his control,

the killer first had to overcome
their natural suspicions.

We feel that the offender
presented himself in a very

non-threatening manner,
something where he made it

enticing or inviting to them,
struck up a conversation,

and that in his
physical appearance,

he was probably pleasing
to look at, someone that

they felt comfortable with.

--appears to be the car.

It's a two-door
Olds, blue in color.

Give me a photograph of
that side of the car there.

ROBERT STACK: On June
the 8th, the Rogers' car

was found at a boat
ramp near their motel.

Inside was a sinister hint that
the women had been entrapped.

Photograph that note
on the front seat.

We found a note in that
vehicle that indicated

directions for the victims
to go to the boat ramp

and to meet someone there
with something that's blue

slash white.

That would lead us to
believe that they went there

to meet a blue and white boat.

ROBERT STACK:
Police are convinced

that Joan Rogers
and the two girls

were lured to their
deaths, probably

by the promise of an
innocent boat ride,

and probably by more
than one assailant.

- All right.
- Hi.

How are you doing today?

Good.

Let me give you a hand.

They got on the boat with
this person or these people.

And at that time, I'm sure
they felt very safe with them.

And that was the killer's plan.

MAN: Sit back.

This is terrific.

This is great, huh?

CINDRA CUMMINGS:
He knew what he was

going to do those victims before
they ever got on his boat.

MAN: We're ready.
- OK.

MAN: Let's go.

We think a person like
this will kill again,

in all probability
has killed again.

However we think
that he was surprised

that the bodies surfaced
as quickly as they did.

And in his killing
subsequent to this,

he will change his
manner and his method

of disposal of any bodies.

The psychological
profile of the killer

has provided investigators
with some insights

into this ugly
crime but has failed

to pinpoint a specific suspect.

Police have only a few
admittedly slim leads

that might result in the capture
of this confident and ruthless

psychopath.

A guest at the motel on the
day of the Rogers' death

reported seeing a young
well-groomed white male

loading a cooler
into a white boat

with dark blue racing stripes.

The boat was towed
by a dark colored

Chevy Blazer or Ford Bronco.

Efforts to locate this person
have so far been unsuccessful.

[music playing]

It is easy to feel overwhelmed
and frightened by the

many faces of the sociopath.

The immediacy of
television makes

us feel as though every
murder, every horror,

is happening right
down the block.

In reality, violent psychopaths
are an extreme rarity.

And fortunately few of us
will ever encounter one.

There is still much to
learn about this disturbing

phenomenon in terms of
identifying it, predicting

it, and preventing it.

Thank you for joining us.

And please join us next
time for another edition

of "Unsolved Mysteries."

[music playing]