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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:02,000 --> 00:00:08,000 This programme contains some strong language and scenes which some viewers may find upsetting. 2 00:00:26,280 --> 00:00:28,320 INAUDIBLE 3 00:01:14,560 --> 00:01:17,079 After a sensational five-month long trial, 4 00:01:17,080 --> 00:01:20,679 Michael Peterson will soon learn the fate that awaits him. 5 00:01:20,680 --> 00:01:23,279 The 12 members of the jury are now in their fifth day 6 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:24,799 of deliberations. 7 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:26,919 Will they find that Michael Peterson 8 00:01:26,920 --> 00:01:29,999 used a blow poke to brutally murder his wife Kathleen? 9 00:01:30,000 --> 00:01:32,639 Or will they instead believe the defence's theory, that she 10 00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:35,199 fell down the stairs in the couple's Durham mansion? 11 00:01:35,200 --> 00:01:37,680 A verdict is expected in the next few hours. 12 00:01:48,320 --> 00:01:50,319 Has the jury reached a unanimous verdict 13 00:01:50,320 --> 00:01:52,319 on the issue that was submitted to them? 14 00:01:52,320 --> 00:01:55,440 - Yes. - All right. If you will give that sheet to the deputy, please. 15 00:02:02,320 --> 00:02:05,279 Ladies and gentlemen of the jury, you have returned the following verdict - 16 00:02:05,280 --> 00:02:09,399 State of North Carolina versus Michael Iver Peterson. 17 00:02:09,400 --> 00:02:11,479 "We, the twelve members of the jury, 18 00:02:11,480 --> 00:02:14,959 "unanimously find the defendant to be guilty of first degree murder." 19 00:02:14,960 --> 00:02:17,279 This, the 10th day of October, 2003, 20 00:02:17,280 --> 00:02:21,119 signed by foreperson Christian Lion Jones. 21 00:02:21,120 --> 00:02:23,479 Is this your verdict, so say you all? 22 00:02:23,480 --> 00:02:26,879 - ALL: Yes. - Juror number one, Mr Harrison, would you please stand. 23 00:02:26,880 --> 00:02:29,199 Mr Harrison, your foreperson has returned 24 00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:32,519 for your verdict that the defendant is guilty of first-degree murder. 25 00:02:32,520 --> 00:02:35,239 Is this your verdict and do you still assent thereto? 26 00:02:35,240 --> 00:02:39,279 - Yes. - Thank you. Juror number 12, Mr Hall. 27 00:02:39,280 --> 00:02:42,199 Mr Hall, your foreperson has returned for your verdict that 28 00:02:42,200 --> 00:02:44,639 the defendant is guilty of first-degree murder. 29 00:02:44,640 --> 00:02:47,359 Is this your verdict and do you still assent thereto? 30 00:02:47,360 --> 00:02:48,479 - Yes. - Thank you. 31 00:02:48,480 --> 00:02:52,919 Ms Clerk, the defendant is imprisoned in the North Carolina Department of Corrections 32 00:02:52,920 --> 00:02:55,680 for the remainder of his natural life without parole. 33 00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:13,080 When the jury came in, it didn't just disappoint me. 34 00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:18,040 It shook the foundations of my beliefs in the justice system... 35 00:03:19,040 --> 00:03:23,280 ..in human beings, in my own abilities... 36 00:03:25,200 --> 00:03:29,080 ..in, erm, my judgment... 37 00:03:32,440 --> 00:03:34,040 ..in my sense of reality. 38 00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:39,599 I think that what happened today is that an innocent man was 39 00:03:39,600 --> 00:03:47,600 found guilty based on speculation and conjecture and feelings 40 00:03:47,680 --> 00:03:50,080 and that is so incredibly troubling to me. 41 00:03:52,840 --> 00:03:57,240 I didn't do anything. I am innocent. I was wrongly convicted. 42 00:03:58,720 --> 00:04:01,839 I didn't harm Kathleen and I didn't believe, 43 00:04:01,840 --> 00:04:05,560 until the jury clerk read the sentence, that I would be convicted. 44 00:04:07,800 --> 00:04:11,159 My immediate reaction was, "Let's end it." 45 00:04:11,160 --> 00:04:14,199 And I told David that I didn't want an appeal. 46 00:04:14,200 --> 00:04:17,599 I wanted to just end it right now. Forget it. 47 00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:20,320 Enough was enough. We had all suffered enough. 48 00:04:22,240 --> 00:04:26,879 That wonderful - awful - line from Romeo and Juliet, 49 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:28,680 "All are punished." 50 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:33,599 I don't know what we were being punished for. 51 00:04:33,600 --> 00:04:36,919 I don't why my children had to suffer what they did. 52 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:38,639 Why they were being punished. 53 00:04:38,640 --> 00:04:42,640 But I did feel that, "Let this end right now." 54 00:05:00,160 --> 00:05:05,040 I have been here almost 3,000 days, over eight years. 55 00:05:06,120 --> 00:05:09,959 When I first got here, I thought, "I'll be out in a couple of years." 56 00:05:09,960 --> 00:05:15,239 We appealed and we kept appealing and every one of them failed. 57 00:05:15,240 --> 00:05:17,399 And after eight years, I'm still here. 58 00:05:17,400 --> 00:05:22,039 And I began to think I may die in here. 59 00:05:22,040 --> 00:05:25,319 It's been almost ten years since Kathleen died. 60 00:05:25,320 --> 00:05:32,279 But... Well, there's this wonderful photograph in my locker of her. 61 00:05:32,280 --> 00:05:35,919 Every time I open it I see it. And, er... 62 00:05:35,920 --> 00:05:39,239 it's of Kathleen in the Imperial Gardens in Tokyo. 63 00:05:39,240 --> 00:05:43,639 And she's looking for Japanese, because there aren't any... 64 00:05:43,640 --> 00:05:47,879 in downtown Tokyo, because it's not cherry blossom time. 65 00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:50,759 And that's how it always was with her. We were always joking. 66 00:05:50,760 --> 00:05:52,880 And we were always laughing. 67 00:05:53,880 --> 00:06:01,639 So, even though it's been ten years, it's just like yesterday. 68 00:06:01,640 --> 00:06:03,799 She's just as alive to me, 69 00:06:03,800 --> 00:06:09,400 and I love her as much today as I did ten years ago. 70 00:06:14,880 --> 00:06:19,559 - '911, what's your emergency?' - '1810 Cedar Street. Please!' 71 00:06:19,560 --> 00:06:22,519 - 'What's wrong.' - 'My wife had an accident. She's still breathing.' 72 00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:23,759 'What kind of accident?' 73 00:06:23,760 --> 00:06:26,199 'She fell down the stairs. She's still breathing, please!' 74 00:06:26,200 --> 00:06:28,839 - 'Is she conscious?' - 'What?' - 'Is she conscious?' 75 00:06:28,840 --> 00:06:30,839 'No, she's not conscious.' Please!' 76 00:06:30,840 --> 00:06:33,839 - 'How many stairs did she fall down?' - 'What?' - 'How many stairs?' 77 00:06:33,840 --> 00:06:40,559 - 'Stairs!' - 'How many stairs? Calm down, sir. Calm down.' 78 00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:42,759 'No... 15, 20, I don't know. Please! 79 00:06:42,760 --> 00:06:45,119 'Get somebody here right away, please!' 80 00:06:45,120 --> 00:06:49,159 'OK, somebody's dispatching the ambulance while I ask you questions.' 81 00:06:49,160 --> 00:06:52,240 'It's at Forest Hills, OK? Please, please!' 82 00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:03,999 REPORTER: Durham Police, this morning, are investigating 83 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:06,079 the death of a prominent city resident. 84 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:08,759 Officers called this morning to the home of Nortel executive 85 00:07:08,760 --> 00:07:11,719 Kathleen Peterson, who was found dead in her Forest Hills 86 00:07:11,720 --> 00:07:14,999 mansion after apparently falling down the stairs. 87 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:16,839 Kathleen Peterson's husband, Michael Peterson, 88 00:07:16,840 --> 00:07:19,839 is a former columnist for the Durham Herald-Sun newspaper. 89 00:07:19,840 --> 00:07:24,279 He also ran an unsuccessful mayoral bid in 1999 and just last month 90 00:07:24,280 --> 00:07:27,720 failed in a bid for a seat on the Durham city council. 91 00:07:35,640 --> 00:07:42,039 We believe that she was beaten, that she was stunned and was bleeding. 92 00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:44,759 That she probably recovered 93 00:07:44,760 --> 00:07:51,679 and struggled in the doorframe with Mike Peterson, to a degree. 94 00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:56,399 And that he then had to bludgeon her on multiple 95 00:07:56,400 --> 00:07:58,279 occasions after that. 96 00:07:58,280 --> 00:08:00,400 And that she, basically, bled to death. 97 00:08:10,960 --> 00:08:13,879 REPORTER: Michael Peterson's supporters can't believe 98 00:08:13,880 --> 00:08:16,439 he's charged with the murder of his wife Kathleen. 99 00:08:16,440 --> 00:08:19,639 Kathleen Peterson's biological daughter Caitlin Atwater 100 00:08:19,640 --> 00:08:22,959 served as the main spokesperson for the Peterson family. 101 00:08:22,960 --> 00:08:26,199 She stood shoulder to shoulder with Peterson's biological sons 102 00:08:26,200 --> 00:08:29,439 and their sisters, adopted by Kathleen and Mike Peterson. 103 00:08:29,440 --> 00:08:32,999 My mother and Mike had an absolutely loving relationship 104 00:08:33,000 --> 00:08:34,959 and there is no way that either of them 105 00:08:34,960 --> 00:08:37,760 would ever wish any sort of harm on the other one. 106 00:08:38,840 --> 00:08:42,279 In my mind, if Mike finds Kathleen at the bottom of the stairs, 107 00:08:42,280 --> 00:08:46,199 it's a reasonable assumption on his part that she fell down the stairs. 108 00:08:46,200 --> 00:08:49,279 REPORTER: Peterson's attorney, David Rudolf, says the authorities seem to 109 00:08:49,280 --> 00:08:52,479 have jumped to conclusions about Kathleen's death. 110 00:08:52,480 --> 00:08:54,999 Kathleen and I were in here watching a movie. 111 00:08:55,000 --> 00:08:58,759 I'd gone to Blockbusters and rented a video 112 00:08:58,760 --> 00:09:02,559 and we were watching American Sweethearts. 113 00:09:02,560 --> 00:09:06,239 And I think it was probably around about 11 o'clock that 114 00:09:06,240 --> 00:09:12,279 the movie ended and we took our glasses and we came in here. 115 00:09:12,280 --> 00:09:15,199 I think there was... 116 00:09:15,200 --> 00:09:18,639 I'm not sure... we probably had another bottle... 117 00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:21,359 I know we were drinking two bottles that night. 118 00:09:21,360 --> 00:09:24,319 It was a nice night. I guess it was 55, 60 degrees. 119 00:09:24,320 --> 00:09:27,880 Very nice night. And I'd gone outside. 120 00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:40,759 We were just talking and finishing our drinks and then she said, 121 00:09:40,760 --> 00:09:44,239 "I gotta go in because I've got the conference call in the morning." 122 00:09:44,240 --> 00:09:48,079 I stayed right here. Don't think I said anything special to her, 123 00:09:48,080 --> 00:09:52,039 certainly not thinking this was the last time I was going to see her. 124 00:09:52,040 --> 00:09:55,679 And the last I saw her was when I was there 125 00:09:55,680 --> 00:09:59,599 and she was just walking here. 126 00:09:59,600 --> 00:10:02,719 And... that's it. 127 00:10:02,720 --> 00:10:05,759 That was the last time I saw Kathleen alive. 128 00:10:05,760 --> 00:10:10,920 No, she was alive when I found her, but barely. 129 00:10:12,200 --> 00:10:15,599 'OK, is she awake now? Hello?' 130 00:10:15,600 --> 00:10:17,719 (SOBBING) 131 00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:19,200 'Hello?' 132 00:10:31,120 --> 00:10:33,359 It's impossible for me to believe, 133 00:10:33,360 --> 00:10:38,399 if that's the back of her head, that that could be caused from a 134 00:10:38,400 --> 00:10:44,639 series of missteps, or fall, down 15 flights. 135 00:10:44,640 --> 00:10:46,400 I mean 15 different stairs. 136 00:10:47,480 --> 00:10:49,439 I can't see that happening. 137 00:10:49,440 --> 00:10:52,919 The medical examiner doesn't believe that it was possible either. 138 00:10:52,920 --> 00:10:57,520 This had to occur from multiple inflictions of blunt force trauma. 139 00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:01,239 It just never occurred to Michael Peterson that people wouldn't 140 00:11:01,240 --> 00:11:03,919 believe him when he said that she fell down the stairs. 141 00:11:03,920 --> 00:11:06,559 That's really what this is all about. 142 00:11:06,560 --> 00:11:08,399 He thought he'd get away with it. 143 00:11:08,400 --> 00:11:11,319 I remember Dad actually explaining it to us 144 00:11:11,320 --> 00:11:13,559 and he was just like, he was in shock, 145 00:11:13,560 --> 00:11:16,079 and he was just shaking, and he was like, 146 00:11:16,080 --> 00:11:18,599 "I didn't do it. You have to believe me." 147 00:11:18,600 --> 00:11:22,159 And we were like, "Dad, we believe you. This is horrible. 148 00:11:22,160 --> 00:11:24,159 "How can we not believe you?" 149 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:27,359 We didn't even know any details yet and we were just like, 150 00:11:27,360 --> 00:11:29,039 "We believe you, we believe you. 151 00:11:29,040 --> 00:11:32,039 "We know it's not true. This is horrible." 152 00:11:32,040 --> 00:11:36,399 It was just so upsetting. I couldn't believe it. 153 00:11:36,400 --> 00:11:38,559 But it was so hard to think about that 154 00:11:38,560 --> 00:11:41,920 because, at the same time, we were thinking about our mother. 155 00:11:44,000 --> 00:11:46,760 It was like two bombshells, I guess, hitting us. 156 00:11:54,200 --> 00:11:55,559 We had a wonderful life. 157 00:11:55,560 --> 00:12:00,879 There were five children, Kathleen, and myself. 158 00:12:00,880 --> 00:12:04,479 Two of the children were mine from my first wife, Clayton and Todd. 159 00:12:04,480 --> 00:12:07,479 There were two wonderful girls, Margaret and Martha, 160 00:12:07,480 --> 00:12:11,479 who came to me when their father and their mother died. 161 00:12:11,480 --> 00:12:15,559 And then there was Kathleen's child, from her first marriage, Caitlin. 162 00:12:15,560 --> 00:12:18,599 We lived together for 14 years, 163 00:12:18,600 --> 00:12:21,200 and we were happy every one of those years. 164 00:12:22,480 --> 00:12:25,559 I started to have doubts, of course. I mean, how can you not 165 00:12:25,560 --> 00:12:27,759 when you're hearing all these rumours going around 166 00:12:27,760 --> 00:12:28,760 and things like that. 167 00:12:28,761 --> 00:12:30,839 But it was the physical evidence that allowed me 168 00:12:30,840 --> 00:12:33,799 to actually go back and look at the situation as a whole. 169 00:12:33,800 --> 00:12:38,519 Because reading the autopsy report, I think was the point at which 170 00:12:38,520 --> 00:12:41,399 I was convinced that my mother had been murdered. 171 00:12:41,400 --> 00:12:47,439 Obviously the horrific intensity of the wounds and the fact that I just, 172 00:12:47,440 --> 00:12:51,039 to me, could not physically come up with a way that you could get seven 173 00:12:51,040 --> 00:12:55,719 deep lacerations on the back of your head by falling down the stairs. 174 00:12:55,720 --> 00:12:58,959 And she goes, "Margaret, did you look at the autopsy report?" 175 00:12:58,960 --> 00:13:01,799 And I said, "Yes, I looked through them thoroughly." 176 00:13:01,800 --> 00:13:04,199 And she said, "There's no way Mom 177 00:13:04,200 --> 00:13:07,159 "could have just fallen down the stairs. 178 00:13:07,160 --> 00:13:11,120 "There's no way." And I was like, "You're not a doctor, Caitlin." 179 00:13:19,280 --> 00:13:25,079 One of the hardest things to deal with was losing Caitlin. 180 00:13:25,080 --> 00:13:29,600 And so quickly too. Just like that. Just never see her again. 181 00:13:31,040 --> 00:13:32,439 It's never just Caitlin, 182 00:13:32,440 --> 00:13:34,719 it's Margaret, Martha, Caitlin in a picture. 183 00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:36,999 And it never was anything different than that. 184 00:13:37,000 --> 00:13:40,040 We just had just a long history, and she's our sister. 185 00:13:41,160 --> 00:13:43,719 I did consider Martha and Margaret my sisters 186 00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:47,079 and my mother considered them her daughters, 187 00:13:47,080 --> 00:13:52,079 but my goal, my strength in life is completely opposite. 188 00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:55,680 It's in seeking justice for my mother. That's what I'm here for. 189 00:14:14,960 --> 00:14:18,679 - Good morning, to each of you. - ALL: Good morning. 190 00:14:18,680 --> 00:14:23,680 In a very real sense, this case is about pretence and appearances. 191 00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:28,400 It's about things not being as they seem. 192 00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:33,319 The defendant says that Kathleen Peterson's death was 193 00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:37,440 caused by a tragic accidental fall down stairs in their home. 194 00:14:38,680 --> 00:14:42,399 And we say, on the other hand, that she died a horrible, 195 00:14:42,400 --> 00:14:46,319 painful death at the hands of her husband, Michael Peterson. 196 00:14:46,320 --> 00:14:50,359 This is one of the first photographs taken of her 197 00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:56,319 as she's lying on a steel gurney in the Medical Examiner's office 198 00:14:56,320 --> 00:14:58,399 after they've shaved her head 199 00:14:58,400 --> 00:15:01,800 so that they can determine where the wounds are. 200 00:15:05,000 --> 00:15:08,799 This is where the rubber meets the road, ladies and gentlemen. 201 00:15:08,800 --> 00:15:13,599 They say it's an accident that was caused by a couple of falls 202 00:15:13,600 --> 00:15:17,399 in that stairway and we say it's not. 203 00:15:17,400 --> 00:15:19,359 We say it's murder. 204 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:22,639 Agent Duane Deaver is the blood spatter expert who's going to 205 00:15:22,640 --> 00:15:30,640 talk about how he contends Kathleen was impacted in this area. 206 00:15:30,880 --> 00:15:36,639 Duane Deaver finds what he will call are several points of origin. 207 00:15:36,640 --> 00:15:42,119 And what he will also say is that, from his perspective, this was 208 00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:46,439 very, very important because it was above the floor. 209 00:15:46,440 --> 00:15:48,079 It was above the step area. 210 00:15:48,080 --> 00:15:50,479 He will say that it's positioned in such 211 00:15:50,480 --> 00:15:56,439 a manner that these can't be due to an accidental impact on the stairs. 212 00:15:56,440 --> 00:16:02,199 Can you imagine somebody beating somebody over the head, 213 00:16:02,200 --> 00:16:05,439 whacking them as hard as they can - because you don't whack 214 00:16:05,440 --> 00:16:09,119 somebody like this when you're trying to kill them. 215 00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:12,280 Imagine that there's no skull fracture. 216 00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:16,079 There's no brain contusions. 217 00:16:16,080 --> 00:16:18,359 There's no swelling of the brain. 218 00:16:18,360 --> 00:16:21,279 There's none of the internal haemorrhages, subdurals, 219 00:16:21,280 --> 00:16:24,879 things like that, that you would see from that kind of injury. 220 00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:27,279 No, none of them. 221 00:16:27,280 --> 00:16:31,479 Because the truth is not that Michael Peterson decided to 222 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:35,239 beat Kathleen Peterson to death with a blow poker 223 00:16:35,240 --> 00:16:39,759 in the stairway of his home after spending a quiet evening. 224 00:16:39,760 --> 00:16:41,559 That's not the truth of what happened. 225 00:16:41,560 --> 00:16:45,759 The truth is that Kathleen Peterson, after drinking some wine 226 00:16:45,760 --> 00:16:51,599 and some champagne and taking some Valium, tried to walk up a narrow, 227 00:16:51,600 --> 00:16:57,839 poorly lit stairway in flip flops and she fell and she bled to death. 228 00:16:57,840 --> 00:17:01,199 Everyone who really knew that relationship... 229 00:17:01,200 --> 00:17:06,959 Everyone... knew that they loved each other. 230 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:13,399 Everyone who knew them knows that Michael Peterson had nothing 231 00:17:13,400 --> 00:17:17,520 to do with the death of Kathleen Peterson. 232 00:17:59,760 --> 00:18:03,679 One of the most awful things that could ever befall somebody is 233 00:18:03,680 --> 00:18:05,839 to think to yourself, 234 00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:09,680 "The only way I'm ever going to get out of here is in a coffin." 235 00:18:11,240 --> 00:18:14,279 And that thought - I won't say it occurred to me often - 236 00:18:14,280 --> 00:18:19,999 but every so often it would flit across my mind. 237 00:18:20,000 --> 00:18:27,240 And I would think to myself, "Boy, he's there until he dies." 238 00:18:28,880 --> 00:18:35,439 And it was only when all this publicity started coming out about 239 00:18:35,440 --> 00:18:43,120 Deaver that I started feeling like maybe, maybe there was a chance. 240 00:18:52,920 --> 00:18:58,559 The decision... Judge Calvin E Murphy rules that Gregory F Taylor 241 00:18:58,560 --> 00:19:01,999 has proved by clear and convincing evidence 242 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:05,519 that Gregory F Taylor is innocent of the charge of first degree murder 243 00:19:05,520 --> 00:19:08,600 of Jacquetta Thomas on September 26, 1991. 244 00:19:10,240 --> 00:19:13,359 A Wake County man, who spent 17 years in prison, has been 245 00:19:13,360 --> 00:19:16,999 exonerated by the North Carolina Innocence Commission in Raleigh. 246 00:19:17,000 --> 00:19:20,799 Greg Taylor, who had been condemned to life in prison in 1993, 247 00:19:20,800 --> 00:19:22,240 is now a free man. 248 00:19:23,600 --> 00:19:26,839 The commission's three-judge panel centred around the testimony 249 00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:30,119 of one SBI agent - Duane Deaver. 250 00:19:30,120 --> 00:19:32,559 Deaver admits to having misrepresented blood test 251 00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:34,719 results in the Taylor case. 252 00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:38,359 The SBI has announced plans for an internal investigation. 253 00:19:38,360 --> 00:19:40,959 Deaver is a major character in the emerging story 254 00:19:40,960 --> 00:19:42,599 of the SBI's troubles. 255 00:19:42,600 --> 00:19:46,759 At the bureau's crime labs, where Deaver had been a key agent 256 00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:50,999 and trainer, analysts charged with using science to solve crimes 257 00:19:51,000 --> 00:19:55,159 have hidden test results or concocted bizarre experiments 258 00:19:55,160 --> 00:19:57,040 to shore up a prosecutor's case. 259 00:20:03,560 --> 00:20:05,279 I interviewed Tonya Rogers, 260 00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:09,079 who was one of jurors in the Michael Peterson trial. 261 00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:15,159 She said that Deaver's testimony was the most important evidence 262 00:20:15,160 --> 00:20:17,399 presented at the trial. 263 00:20:17,400 --> 00:20:21,159 Ms Rogers said that, during the jury's deliberations, 264 00:20:21,160 --> 00:20:27,999 they started off split, 6-6 or 8-4, but as they talked the most 265 00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:32,839 powerful evidence that moved the jury to come 12-0 for a conviction 266 00:20:32,840 --> 00:20:37,479 was that bloodstain on the inside of Michael Peterson's shorts. 267 00:20:37,480 --> 00:20:41,319 The jury was convinced by Deaver's testimony that the only way 268 00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:44,800 the bloodstain could have arrived there was through an assault. 269 00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:52,759 When I heard what Deaver had done in the Greg Taylor case, 270 00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:57,559 it became clear to me that I might be able to finally prove that 271 00:20:57,560 --> 00:21:02,159 what he had done in Michael's case was the same sort of thing. 272 00:21:02,160 --> 00:21:09,599 In other words, ignore the facts, ignore the science, 273 00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:14,319 and do what you need to do to get a conviction. 274 00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:17,119 Ten years ago next Friday, Kathleen Peterson was found 275 00:21:17,120 --> 00:21:19,639 dead at the bottom of a staircase in their home. 276 00:21:19,640 --> 00:21:23,039 Almost two years after that, her husband Mike Peterson was 277 00:21:23,040 --> 00:21:26,559 found guilty of murder and sentenced to life in prison. 278 00:21:26,560 --> 00:21:29,679 Now Mike Peterson hopes a hearing that could begin next week 279 00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:31,440 will give him a new chance at freedom. 280 00:21:32,960 --> 00:21:35,679 The district attorney's office has seen some turnover 281 00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:38,959 since Peterson's murder trial in 2003. 282 00:21:38,960 --> 00:21:43,359 The original DA, Jim Hardin, is now a superior court judge. 283 00:21:43,360 --> 00:21:45,799 Freda Black, the assistant DA at the time, 284 00:21:45,800 --> 00:21:49,159 is no longer with the district attorney's office. 285 00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:53,559 Tracey Cline, who is Durham's current DA, will represent the State. 286 00:21:53,560 --> 00:21:56,079 Some of the key players have remained the same - 287 00:21:56,080 --> 00:21:59,399 Orlando Hudson, Durham County's Superior Court Judge, and 288 00:21:59,400 --> 00:22:03,400 David Rudolf, who is taking on the case pro bono, are back on the case. 289 00:22:05,160 --> 00:22:08,279 Oh, wow, it's Ron Guerette! 290 00:22:08,280 --> 00:22:11,199 Martha, Ron Guerette just walked in. 291 00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:13,039 - Oh my God. Hi! - Hey, girl. 292 00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:14,559 I'm going to get up and hug you. 293 00:22:14,560 --> 00:22:16,719 I'm on the phone with Martha, with my sister. 294 00:22:16,720 --> 00:22:19,199 - You're not a kid any more. - Good to see you. I know! 295 00:22:19,200 --> 00:22:23,999 - What have you been up to? - Just working in this crazy world. 296 00:22:24,000 --> 00:22:25,519 Yeah, I know what you mean. 297 00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:27,919 He's trying to come back from his near-bankruptcy 298 00:22:27,920 --> 00:22:31,040 in 2003 as a result of working on your father's case. 299 00:22:32,840 --> 00:22:36,279 - Still working on it. - Wow, it's been eight years. 300 00:22:36,280 --> 00:22:37,799 I can't believe it. 301 00:22:37,800 --> 00:22:40,999 - You've gone from a little kid to a young lady. - Little kid? 302 00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:44,199 - I was, like, 20! - You were still a little kid. 303 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:47,159 - Yeah, I'm turning 30 on Saturday. - Is that right? 304 00:22:47,160 --> 00:22:50,719 - Yeah, it's been ten years. - Wow! - Yeah. 305 00:22:50,720 --> 00:22:53,959 Yeah, because Mom died on the 9th and I turned 20 on the 10th 306 00:22:53,960 --> 00:22:55,559 - and... - Oh, that's right! 307 00:22:55,560 --> 00:23:02,039 - Crazy. - That is crazy. - Yeah, I'm married now. - Are you? 308 00:23:02,040 --> 00:23:04,279 Well, congratulations. 309 00:23:04,280 --> 00:23:06,599 'Well, one thing about Radisch, Deaver 310 00:23:06,600 --> 00:23:10,279 'and Butts is they have been in this very courtroom before. 311 00:23:10,280 --> 00:23:13,079 'They have. They've testified in front of people just like you. 312 00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:18,919 'Agent Deaver, Doctor Radisch, they are tried and true. Tried and true. 313 00:23:18,920 --> 00:23:20,839 'Because they work for us. 314 00:23:20,840 --> 00:23:23,559 'Now to hear them tell it, that scene was altered. 315 00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:26,319 'if you believe that, you're just going to have to believe 316 00:23:26,320 --> 00:23:29,079 - 'that Duane Deaver is just a liar.' - Pleasant memories? 317 00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:31,839 'He has no reason in the world to come up here and lie to you.' 318 00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:35,199 - Wow, that one... - Where she says you have... - Where she says they'll 319 00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:37,359 be back in the courtroom again - it just gave me chills. 320 00:23:37,360 --> 00:23:41,159 And you have to believe that Deaver's a liar. Guess what? 321 00:23:41,160 --> 00:23:44,279 And he tried to get himself vindicated by blaming it 322 00:23:44,280 --> 00:23:47,519 on the SBI in general and that got him fired. 323 00:23:47,520 --> 00:23:50,279 Well, after editing that stuff for you for the Deaver clips, 324 00:23:50,280 --> 00:23:53,679 my husband watched it too and he goes, "This guy's an idiot." 325 00:23:53,680 --> 00:23:57,879 - Yeah. I know. - Greg Taylor was let out. 326 00:23:57,880 --> 00:24:01,639 - How long was he in prison? - 17 years. 327 00:24:01,640 --> 00:24:04,400 - Yeah, he was in there for quite a while. - Oh, my God. 328 00:24:05,800 --> 00:24:07,200 That's terrible. 329 00:24:09,240 --> 00:24:11,679 Like, it's just a little lie that 330 00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:13,880 put someone away for 17 years. 331 00:24:16,280 --> 00:24:19,240 That's devastating. God. 332 00:24:20,880 --> 00:24:24,559 Greg Taylor. I live in Durham, North Carolina. 333 00:24:24,560 --> 00:24:26,119 49 years old. 334 00:24:26,120 --> 00:24:30,959 When I was 29 years old, I was arrested for first-degree 335 00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:38,240 murder and tried and convicted April 1993. 336 00:24:40,440 --> 00:24:45,759 I was 31 years old at the time and I was married, had 337 00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:53,760 a nine-year-old daughter and after that things just kind of fell apart. 338 00:25:01,200 --> 00:25:05,799 In the beginning you think that the next appeal you'll be free or 339 00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:10,039 the next motion filed in court and then when those things let you 340 00:25:10,040 --> 00:25:14,039 down, you come to realise that if you've been let down so many times 341 00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:18,119 so far, there's nothing to stop you from being let down in the future. 342 00:25:18,120 --> 00:25:25,359 And it just went on interminably until finally when I had exhausted 343 00:25:25,360 --> 00:25:32,959 all my appeals and I realised that the chances were very good that 344 00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:36,640 I was going to die in prison and I had to learn how to deal with that. 345 00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:02,639 I don't have faith in the system like 346 00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:07,199 I used to have, but I still believe - I hope - 347 00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:12,039 that justice will finally prevail after eight years. 348 00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:14,639 And I'll get out of here. 349 00:26:14,640 --> 00:26:18,840 I want people to see what Duane Deaver did. 350 00:26:20,040 --> 00:26:21,759 I want all of it to come out. 351 00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:25,639 I want people to see what that man did not just to me, 352 00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:27,559 but to other people. 353 00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:33,119 He'd say these ridiculous things and I just would not pay any attention. 354 00:26:33,120 --> 00:26:36,119 I wouldn't even listen anymore, thinking that nobody could believe 355 00:26:36,120 --> 00:26:41,959 this nonsense of hitting Kathleen 42 times or whatever it was. 356 00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:47,599 This re-enactment that he did. It was just all a lie. 357 00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:52,959 So, at the time, I just thought, well, this is just stupid, 358 00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:56,560 nobody's going to believe this. But they did. 359 00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:09,399 I do think that it's Michael's last chance. 360 00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:11,039 It's been eight years. 361 00:27:11,040 --> 00:27:16,839 He is now 68 years old and all of his appeals have been denied 362 00:27:16,840 --> 00:27:20,959 and this is really the best opportunity that we're going 363 00:27:20,960 --> 00:27:23,919 to have to prove that he should never have been convicted. 364 00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:25,080 19, please. 365 00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:29,839 All right, Mike. They're saying that they took your clothes 366 00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:31,760 over yesterday to have them prepared. 367 00:27:34,360 --> 00:27:35,680 Come on with me, please. 368 00:27:43,040 --> 00:27:47,879 I remember just a couple of nights ago, I dreamed I was there, 369 00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:51,640 old man, lying on a gurney at the end of a corridor. 370 00:27:54,280 --> 00:27:57,399 You go to central prison and you die. 371 00:27:57,400 --> 00:28:00,679 And you die alone, no family, no-one. 372 00:28:00,680 --> 00:28:03,679 And you die on a gurney. 373 00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:06,799 And I remember having that dream and waking up 374 00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:10,680 thinking, "No!" But it was a pretty scary dream. 375 00:28:36,480 --> 00:28:40,639 Mike, is this going to be good enough for you today? 376 00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:42,839 Is it what you want to wear? 377 00:28:42,840 --> 00:28:46,840 OK. That sports coat? That shirt? Belt? OK. 378 00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:02,119 INAUDIBLE EXCHANGE 379 00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:04,879 - Sorry. - MICHAEL LAUGHS 380 00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:07,959 Judge, Mrs Zamperini wants to be heard. And she is a victim, Judge, 381 00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:11,439 because I believe that Mr Peterson was convicted of first degree murder. 382 00:29:11,440 --> 00:29:13,639 Her sister was murdered, according to a jury. 383 00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:15,519 So Mrs Zamperini would like to be heard 384 00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:18,319 if the court is inclined just to give her a few minutes. 385 00:29:18,320 --> 00:29:20,799 - All right. - Thank you, Your Honour. 386 00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:22,999 Yes, sir. 387 00:29:23,000 --> 00:29:25,479 Good morning, um, Judge Orlando. 388 00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:29,479 I think you're aware that I am Kathleen's sister. 389 00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:32,439 In this court, that is very rarely heard. 390 00:29:32,440 --> 00:29:37,959 KATHLEEN is a victim of murder. We have rights in this state. 391 00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:40,519 That is why there's a judge in this courtroom 392 00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:42,839 to make sure victims' rights are heard. 393 00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:46,479 That is, in my opinion, the judge's sole responsibility, 394 00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:51,799 to make sure that there is clear, fair, quality representation 395 00:29:51,800 --> 00:29:54,439 for the victim, dead or alive. 396 00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:58,959 My sister has lied in her grave for ten years. 397 00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:02,479 This Friday, ten years, she was murdered. 398 00:30:02,480 --> 00:30:05,199 SHE BANGS THE TABLE Ten years, I've been without my sister. 399 00:30:05,200 --> 00:30:07,999 Ten years, her daughter hasn't had her. 400 00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:10,919 And, ten years, the rest of us have been alive and had our freedom. 401 00:30:10,920 --> 00:30:12,999 But not Kathleen. Not Kathleen. 402 00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:15,919 She wanted to live and she deserves 403 00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:19,599 and should get the best, best legal representation. 404 00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:22,079 And there is no way I feel, sir, 405 00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:26,279 that you can have this district attorney represent my sister's rights 406 00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:30,039 and feel you are doing the best job by the citizens of this state 407 00:30:30,040 --> 00:30:33,599 in having her represent and not the Attorney General's office step in. 408 00:30:33,600 --> 00:30:36,319 She is not prepared. It is clear she is not prepared. 409 00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:38,839 The office is not prepared. 410 00:30:38,840 --> 00:30:40,920 Thank you very much, sir. 411 00:30:46,120 --> 00:30:48,639 All right. The court, in its discretion, 412 00:30:48,640 --> 00:30:52,359 will deny the motion to continue. 413 00:30:52,360 --> 00:30:55,479 The court is ready to proceed. 414 00:30:55,480 --> 00:31:00,719 Your Honour, the key issue during Mr Peterson's trial 415 00:31:00,720 --> 00:31:04,039 was what happened in the stairway. 416 00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:06,839 There was only one witness called by the state 417 00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:12,639 who claimed to be able to say what happened in the stairway. 418 00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:16,559 And that was SBI agent Duane Deaver. 419 00:31:16,560 --> 00:31:20,959 He testified that the bloodstain patterns in the stairway 420 00:31:20,960 --> 00:31:23,799 proved that there had been a beating. 421 00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:27,959 He testified that the bloodstains on Michael Peterson's shorts - 422 00:31:27,960 --> 00:31:31,199 and, in particular, there was a stain inside the shorts - 423 00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:36,119 and on his shoes proved that he inflicted this alleged beating, 424 00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:39,999 because he claimed he could tell that the wearer of those items 425 00:31:40,000 --> 00:31:45,079 was in close proximity to Kathleen Peterson when her head was impacted. 426 00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:46,959 But we don't have to take my word 427 00:31:46,960 --> 00:31:49,599 for whether Mr Deaver was a critical witness. 428 00:31:49,600 --> 00:31:52,960 We can listen to district attorney Jim Hardin. 429 00:31:54,560 --> 00:31:56,359 'Now what does Duane Deaver find?' 430 00:31:56,360 --> 00:31:58,799 This is the first area that he contends 431 00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:01,079 is the first point of impact. 432 00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:04,279 This is above the 15th step. 433 00:32:04,280 --> 00:32:09,079 It's off the wall. It's off the riser and it's out in space. 434 00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:11,959 Impact spatter in the crotch area of these pants, 435 00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:13,879 in the back side of this right leg. 436 00:32:13,880 --> 00:32:18,079 Duane Deaver said the only way that can happen is if he's standing 437 00:32:18,080 --> 00:32:22,519 over her with his leg above her striking her. 438 00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:25,119 'Now why do we know there was a second assault?' 439 00:32:25,120 --> 00:32:28,879 Because Duane Deaver says, and this is absolutely critical, 440 00:32:28,880 --> 00:32:34,839 Duane Deaver sees blood spatter on top of the clean-up. 441 00:32:34,840 --> 00:32:37,079 There's only one way that can happen. 442 00:32:37,080 --> 00:32:39,279 If there's a second assault. 443 00:32:39,280 --> 00:32:41,839 'He assaulted her, 444 00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:43,679 'she went down, 445 00:32:43,680 --> 00:32:46,239 'he continued to assault her, ' 446 00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:50,119 and that's when the premeditation formulated. 447 00:32:50,120 --> 00:32:54,279 And, of course, the only thing Mr Peterson was charged with was first degree, 448 00:32:54,280 --> 00:32:57,879 so, without premeditation, the state's case failed. 449 00:32:57,880 --> 00:33:01,199 And the state relied upon Duane Deaver during the trial. 450 00:33:01,200 --> 00:33:03,239 'There's been no evidence in this case' 451 00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:07,239 that anything that was done to that scene altered the walls. 452 00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:09,159 Nobody was walking on the walls. 453 00:33:09,160 --> 00:33:12,159 'There's been no evidence, no credible evidence, 454 00:33:12,160 --> 00:33:15,079 'that anybody did anything to the stairwell.' 455 00:33:15,080 --> 00:33:16,479 Well, if you believe that, 456 00:33:16,480 --> 00:33:20,239 you're just going to have to believe that Duane Deaver is just a liar... 457 00:33:20,240 --> 00:33:23,479 and he has no reason in the world to come here and lie to you. 458 00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:25,719 'Agent Deaver, Dr Radisch, ' 459 00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:28,599 they are tried and true, 460 00:33:28,600 --> 00:33:31,479 tried and true, cos they work for us. 461 00:33:31,480 --> 00:33:34,999 What we didn't know then about Duane Deaver, 462 00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:38,559 but we do know now, is that Duane Deaver had 463 00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:44,039 a pattern and practice of preparing misleading expert reports, 464 00:33:44,040 --> 00:33:49,119 of doing shoddy and scientifically invalid work, 465 00:33:49,120 --> 00:33:53,599 of presenting misleading testimony under oath. 466 00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:55,879 He did it in 2010 467 00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:59,959 at the Innocence Commission Hearing, State vs Greg Taylor. 468 00:33:59,960 --> 00:34:04,919 We never asked for a perfect trial. We hoped to get a fair trial 469 00:34:04,920 --> 00:34:07,039 and I know that this court did its best... 470 00:34:07,040 --> 00:34:10,559 - ALARM WAILS - ..to give us a fair trial. 471 00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:12,639 ALARM CONTINUES 472 00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:15,440 Thank you very much. I think that's my cue. 473 00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:21,439 - It's Candace. - Yeah, I'm sure that's right. 474 00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:24,080 ALARM CONTINUES 475 00:34:26,680 --> 00:34:29,640 WOMAN: Yeah, leave the building. 476 00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:34,239 VOICES ON RADIOS 477 00:34:34,240 --> 00:34:37,799 PEOPLE CHATTER MAN: Everybody, move back. 478 00:34:37,800 --> 00:34:41,199 - Back of the lot! - Move back, move back! - Man, let's move. 479 00:34:41,200 --> 00:34:42,639 Let's go, man. 480 00:34:42,640 --> 00:34:45,399 - It's a bomb threat. - Are you serious? - It's a bomb threat. 481 00:34:45,400 --> 00:34:48,999 - It's a bomb threat? - Yeah. - Oh... Oh, my God. 482 00:34:49,000 --> 00:34:50,879 It was surprising to see that > 483 00:34:50,880 --> 00:34:56,239 40% of Hardin's closing statement was about Duane Deaver. 484 00:34:56,240 --> 00:34:58,239 It was about his research, 485 00:34:58,240 --> 00:35:00,559 - his testimony, and... - That was pretty shocking. 486 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:03,679 I don't think they had anything else that made it first degree 487 00:35:03,680 --> 00:35:06,080 - and that was all Deaver. - That was it. Exactly. 488 00:35:08,080 --> 00:35:10,399 - Made me feel sick to my stomach. - I know. 489 00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:12,840 - Ten years a-wasted. - Yeah. - Nine years a-wasted. 490 00:35:14,160 --> 00:35:16,519 - Mike, there you go. - OK, thank you. 491 00:35:16,520 --> 00:35:19,520 - Don't drop the plate. - No, I got it, I got it. 492 00:35:21,120 --> 00:35:24,959 My God, I'm wearing this ten-pound boot on my foot! 493 00:35:24,960 --> 00:35:27,599 - HE LAUGHS - I can barely move! 494 00:35:27,600 --> 00:35:33,159 What was so nice was to see everybody and my children there. 495 00:35:33,160 --> 00:35:36,439 I can't really talk to them. That's not allowed. 496 00:35:36,440 --> 00:35:39,439 I certainly can't touch them or interact with them, 497 00:35:39,440 --> 00:35:40,919 so that's very hard, 498 00:35:40,920 --> 00:35:43,920 but it's wonderful to know that they're there. 499 00:36:27,480 --> 00:36:29,319 Should be in one of these here. 500 00:36:29,320 --> 00:36:33,479 - Dad, we're here! We're here! Oh, my God! - I know! 501 00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:35,799 - Dad, we love you! - Oh, my God! 502 00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:39,359 - Oh, my God! - I have never been so tired in my life. 503 00:36:39,360 --> 00:36:43,239 - BILL: - I can relate! - Oh, God! 504 00:36:43,240 --> 00:36:47,639 - But everything's OK? - Yeah. - You like LA? - Yeah, I love LA. 505 00:36:47,640 --> 00:36:52,159 - And you love Boulder? - I don't love it, but it's good. - You look great. 506 00:36:52,160 --> 00:36:56,679 - Thank you. - You look... - Margaret's helping me with fashion tips. 507 00:36:56,680 --> 00:36:59,079 LAUGHTER 508 00:36:59,080 --> 00:37:01,879 - Well, what did you think of Candace? - HE LAUGHS 509 00:37:01,880 --> 00:37:04,439 - Wow, how was that? - Dad, are you safe? 510 00:37:04,440 --> 00:37:06,719 I'm afraid she's going to hunt you down! 511 00:37:06,720 --> 00:37:09,839 And I told you that from the beginning - don't hate. 512 00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:13,999 - Don't get caught up in it. And you could see that in her face... - Yeah. 513 00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:16,119 - ..and her eyes... - And her hands. 514 00:37:16,120 --> 00:37:19,399 - Just CONSUMED by hatred. - Yeah. 515 00:37:19,400 --> 00:37:22,279 And yes, you know, I understand it. 516 00:37:22,280 --> 00:37:25,319 But she can't be the only victim, you see. 517 00:37:25,320 --> 00:37:27,799 You guys are victims. I'm a victim. 518 00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:31,399 Um... You don't have to be there all day, every day. 519 00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:35,919 I want to, it's fascinating! I'm so angry at Deaver! 520 00:37:35,920 --> 00:37:38,959 I just want to see all the crap that's talked about him. 521 00:37:38,960 --> 00:37:41,079 - SHE LAUGHS - You know, sometimes I wonder, 522 00:37:41,080 --> 00:37:44,639 - "Where was I during some of that trial?" - I know! - Yeah! 523 00:37:44,640 --> 00:37:48,279 - I don't remember some of that stuff. - Yeah. - He was so... - He was so boring! 524 00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:50,479 - Yeah, he was gross. - He was just boring and gross. 525 00:37:50,480 --> 00:37:54,679 - Supercilious, a know-it-all... - Yeah! - He was really terrible. 526 00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:57,159 Oh, I... Yeah, I hated him so much. 527 00:37:57,160 --> 00:37:59,440 Oh, God, lord! 528 00:38:00,960 --> 00:38:05,479 - OK. No more crying. - Whatever! That's going to make us cry more. 529 00:38:05,480 --> 00:38:07,879 THEY LAUGH 530 00:38:07,880 --> 00:38:10,679 We'll see you tomorrow! 531 00:38:10,680 --> 00:38:14,359 - I love you, Dad! - Bye-bye. - Bye! 532 00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:17,600 - He does look very tired. - Yeah, I know. 533 00:38:20,680 --> 00:38:23,400 - I don't remember how we got in. - What's the...? 534 00:38:24,760 --> 00:38:28,159 You know, we don't know really what happened, 535 00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:32,239 and so we have to live with the mystery of her death 536 00:38:32,240 --> 00:38:36,199 and trust that our dad didn't kill her at the same time. 537 00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:41,959 So it's kind of a hard position to be in... I think... or it's a position 538 00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:46,559 that would, you know, bring up a lot of stuff, so, um... 539 00:38:46,560 --> 00:38:50,999 So I've never doubted my dad's innocence, but... 540 00:38:51,000 --> 00:38:57,320 it's just, it's... just kind of... I don't know, a hard place to be. 541 00:38:58,640 --> 00:39:00,280 Um... 542 00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:16,119 I was looking at here - photographs that were taken from his computer 543 00:39:16,120 --> 00:39:19,039 and most of them are of homosexual military men 544 00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:21,799 and they're all different types of things that they're doing, 545 00:39:21,800 --> 00:39:25,439 you know, multiple partners, but they're all portrayed as being 546 00:39:25,440 --> 00:39:30,240 gay military men, um, performing sexual acts on each other. 547 00:39:32,040 --> 00:39:36,879 It's not the type of thing your typical, average citizen would want to access. 548 00:39:36,880 --> 00:39:39,559 Not if they want to portray themselves 549 00:39:39,560 --> 00:39:42,719 as someone that has this perfect marriage 550 00:39:42,720 --> 00:39:48,599 or however he wants to make his life seem so perfect, um, with his wife. 551 00:39:48,600 --> 00:39:52,359 I loved Kathleen. Kathleen loved me. 552 00:39:52,360 --> 00:39:54,319 I could not love anybody else. 553 00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:57,119 She could not love anybody else. 554 00:39:57,120 --> 00:40:04,999 That's the faithfulness that we... meant to one another. 555 00:40:05,000 --> 00:40:07,959 It transcended body. 556 00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:10,199 It was much deeper than that. 557 00:40:10,200 --> 00:40:14,199 - I loved her spiritually... - HE TAPS HIS CHEST 558 00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:21,679 ..as well as physically, so I saw no, nor did she see, any problem. 559 00:40:21,680 --> 00:40:24,759 She would've been infuriated by learning that her husband, 560 00:40:24,760 --> 00:40:28,519 who she truly loved, was bisexual. 561 00:40:28,520 --> 00:40:31,999 We believe that, once she learned this information, 562 00:40:32,000 --> 00:40:35,480 that an argument ensued and a homicide occurred. 563 00:40:39,480 --> 00:40:42,279 - State your name, please. - Brent Wolgamott. 564 00:40:42,280 --> 00:40:44,959 - How old are you, sir? - I'm 28 years old, ma'am. 565 00:40:44,960 --> 00:40:47,919 Do you remember when you were contacted by a person 566 00:40:47,920 --> 00:40:50,759 - with the name "mpwriter"? - Yes, ma'am. 567 00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:54,799 Did you all actually discuss what you were going to do 568 00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:57,719 when you were to get together on September 5, 2001? 569 00:40:57,720 --> 00:41:01,519 - Yes, ma'am. - And what we're y'all planning on doing? - Er, having sex. 570 00:41:01,520 --> 00:41:04,399 - What type of sex, sir? - Um... - Do you know? 571 00:41:04,400 --> 00:41:06,959 - Can I say it? I guess, anal sex. - OK. 572 00:41:06,960 --> 00:41:10,719 - Did you get together with him on September 5, 2001? - No, ma'am. 573 00:41:10,720 --> 00:41:12,679 - Well, what happened? - I had a very long day 574 00:41:12,680 --> 00:41:14,399 and, when I got up there that night, 575 00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:17,279 I just said, you know what, I'll talk to him when I come back. 576 00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:20,199 I'm just tired and I want to go to Palm Springs, so I didn't go. 577 00:41:20,200 --> 00:41:24,999 We found out he's bisexual. We found out that he'd had correspondence 578 00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:28,919 with a male, military prostitute kind of guy. 579 00:41:28,920 --> 00:41:33,999 We found out crazy stuff. I mean, lots of crazy, crazy stuff, 580 00:41:34,000 --> 00:41:39,279 but none of it really shocked me at all. I mean, it was more like, 581 00:41:39,280 --> 00:41:42,519 "Oh, great, this is going to be terrible for the case," 582 00:41:42,520 --> 00:41:47,839 you know, "jurors hate this stuff, especially in Durham," um, but... 583 00:41:47,840 --> 00:41:51,239 Yeah, it wasn't like, um... 584 00:41:51,240 --> 00:41:54,959 I was never presented with anything that made me 585 00:41:54,960 --> 00:41:56,999 think twice about my dad. 586 00:41:57,000 --> 00:42:01,199 Did Michael Peterson ever do or say anything, 587 00:42:01,200 --> 00:42:03,999 either on the phone or in an e-mail, 588 00:42:04,000 --> 00:42:07,719 that indicated that he was not in love with Kathleen Peterson? 589 00:42:07,720 --> 00:42:09,639 To the contrary, unlike most of my clients, 590 00:42:09,640 --> 00:42:12,639 he indicated that he had a great relationship. Most clients don't 591 00:42:12,640 --> 00:42:15,719 want to say anything about their relationship. He indicated he had 592 00:42:15,720 --> 00:42:19,319 a warm relationship with his wife and nothing would ever destroy that. 593 00:42:19,320 --> 00:42:22,919 To think that he had this secret life going on is baffling 594 00:42:22,920 --> 00:42:25,879 and it makes me think there are so many things I didn't know about him 595 00:42:25,880 --> 00:42:28,160 and it cancels out all trust I have in him. 596 00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:33,439 Parent figures have always been difficult for us. 597 00:42:33,440 --> 00:42:37,679 Just having such a tumultuous experience of... 598 00:42:37,680 --> 00:42:40,959 losing our birth parents. 599 00:42:40,960 --> 00:42:46,919 Living with Patty and our dad was really tumultuous. 600 00:42:46,920 --> 00:42:49,159 We were kind of tossed around a lot 601 00:42:49,160 --> 00:42:51,599 and then we moved in with Kathleen and Dad 602 00:42:51,600 --> 00:42:54,239 and Kathleen had a daughter, Caitlin. 603 00:42:54,240 --> 00:42:57,639 And, you know, we weren't anybody's natural children, 604 00:42:57,640 --> 00:43:00,839 so we kind of... 605 00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:06,519 had... parent issues most of our lives, I guess. 606 00:43:06,520 --> 00:43:08,199 THEY LAUGH 607 00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:10,839 - Um... - I think, yeah, 608 00:43:10,840 --> 00:43:15,839 the thing that makes me so sad is that our two constants, really... 609 00:43:15,840 --> 00:43:20,399 I mean, Dad was the only continuity we've had in our lives for parents. 610 00:43:20,400 --> 00:43:21,960 Um... 611 00:43:23,480 --> 00:43:27,039 And so I feel like that's why we have such a strong bond with him, 612 00:43:27,040 --> 00:43:33,119 um, and with each other, but also Mom, Kathleen, it's.. 613 00:43:33,120 --> 00:43:37,840 She really was the first person who took us in and combed our hair. 614 00:43:49,760 --> 00:43:55,959 I just know that, um, my mom died in '85 from a brain haemorrhage. 615 00:43:55,960 --> 00:43:58,439 She had been having many headaches before. 616 00:43:58,440 --> 00:44:00,839 I mean, there's... Many people have said this. 617 00:44:00,840 --> 00:44:04,119 That, um, she called her mother complaining of headaches. 618 00:44:04,120 --> 00:44:07,999 She hated doctors, like I don't like doctors either! 619 00:44:08,000 --> 00:44:10,879 Neither does Martha, um... 620 00:44:10,880 --> 00:44:15,079 So she didn't want to go see one no matter how much, you know, Dad... 621 00:44:15,080 --> 00:44:19,359 Um, Mike and Patty, I guess, um, told her to go 622 00:44:19,360 --> 00:44:25,799 and she basically died before she even hit the bottom of the stairs. 623 00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:27,959 NEWS ON TV 624 00:44:27,960 --> 00:44:31,359 'The murder case against Michael Peterson doesn't just involve 625 00:44:31,360 --> 00:44:35,519 'his wife any more - it involves a friend who died 18 years ago.' 626 00:44:35,520 --> 00:44:38,039 'Elizabeth Ratliff was a friend of Michael Peterson. 627 00:44:38,040 --> 00:44:39,759 'In fact, Peterson was with Ratliff 628 00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:42,199 'the night before she was found dead in Germany. 629 00:44:42,200 --> 00:44:45,799 'Ratliff's body was discovered at the bottom of the staircase in 1985 630 00:44:45,800 --> 00:44:49,239 'and prosecutors have implied that the circumstances of her death 631 00:44:49,240 --> 00:44:52,159 'mirror those of Michael Peterson's wife Kathleen.' 632 00:44:52,160 --> 00:44:55,439 The two daughters that were adopted by Michael Peterson 633 00:44:55,440 --> 00:44:57,959 were the daughters of Elizabeth Ratliff, 634 00:44:57,960 --> 00:45:00,399 that woman that died 18 years ago in Germany. 635 00:45:00,400 --> 00:45:04,199 They were raised by Michael Person, raised as his own daughters, 636 00:45:04,200 --> 00:45:07,199 and they refer to him as Dad and, as I told you before, 637 00:45:07,200 --> 00:45:10,679 those two girls, who are now grown up and in their twenties, 638 00:45:10,680 --> 00:45:12,359 are supporting Michael Peterson. 639 00:45:12,360 --> 00:45:15,639 So while prosecutors, on the one hand, say Michael Peterson 640 00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:18,519 is responsible for killing their biological mother 641 00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:21,839 and for killing their step-mother who was helping to raise them, 642 00:45:21,840 --> 00:45:23,319 they are saying no. 643 00:45:23,320 --> 00:45:28,639 There's an autopsy report that says, "Cause of death - natural causes." 644 00:45:28,640 --> 00:45:32,959 - "The stairway killer." Is that the idea? - That's what they'll try... 645 00:45:32,960 --> 00:45:37,360 - He found a way to kill women 17 years apart. - Right. 646 00:45:39,080 --> 00:45:42,559 Once it became clear to us that the prosecution was going 647 00:45:42,560 --> 00:45:45,399 to try and use this evidence in Germany, 648 00:45:45,400 --> 00:45:47,999 we went to Germany ourselves. 649 00:45:48,000 --> 00:45:50,919 'We spoke with Patty Peterson, 650 00:45:50,920 --> 00:45:55,879 'who had been there with Liz the night before she died and who was 651 00:45:55,880 --> 00:46:00,239 'at her house with Michael that morning that her body was found.' 652 00:46:00,240 --> 00:46:04,039 There was nothing out of place, except she was no longer living. 653 00:46:04,040 --> 00:46:07,759 Everything was as if one would've walked into a normal home. 654 00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:12,039 - You know, there was no pool of blood, there were no... - Spatters? 655 00:46:12,040 --> 00:46:15,279 I mean, there could have been a few spatters here, 656 00:46:15,280 --> 00:46:18,559 but so small that they did not register with me. 657 00:46:18,560 --> 00:46:20,119 She was turned sideways. 658 00:46:20,120 --> 00:46:23,439 - She was turned on her side facing upwards. - Facing that way? 659 00:46:23,440 --> 00:46:25,479 Yes, like that. 660 00:46:25,480 --> 00:46:28,199 In the very beginning, I was surprised 661 00:46:28,200 --> 00:46:32,559 when people made a connection between Liz and Kathleen, 662 00:46:32,560 --> 00:46:34,239 because there was no connection. 663 00:46:34,240 --> 00:46:38,079 Liz had had a stroke. She was found at the bottom of the stairs. 664 00:46:38,080 --> 00:46:42,239 Kathleen fell down the stairs, I firmly believe. 665 00:46:42,240 --> 00:46:44,879 I saw no connection between those, 666 00:46:44,880 --> 00:46:49,159 but now, of course, knowing how it was presented. 667 00:46:49,160 --> 00:46:51,679 "This person murdered, found at the bottom of the steps. 668 00:46:51,680 --> 00:46:54,999 "This person murdered, found at the bottom of the steps." 669 00:46:55,000 --> 00:46:59,240 Anybody would understandably come to that conclusion. 670 00:47:09,880 --> 00:47:12,999 Three, two, one. 671 00:47:13,000 --> 00:47:16,879 The DA thinks that there's enough similarity between the two deaths 672 00:47:16,880 --> 00:47:19,959 that they've had Ratliff's body exhumed from a cemetery here in Texas 673 00:47:19,960 --> 00:47:23,879 and brought to the medical examiner's office in Chapel Hill. 674 00:47:23,880 --> 00:47:27,039 It was, like, my worst nightmare when I was little. 675 00:47:27,040 --> 00:47:29,959 You know, you'd have nightmares of, like... 676 00:47:29,960 --> 00:47:32,559 your mother, your parents coming back alive 677 00:47:32,560 --> 00:47:35,319 and, like, what they would look like, you know, 678 00:47:35,320 --> 00:47:39,520 just typical childhood nightmares and it was like it was coming true. 679 00:47:44,280 --> 00:47:46,839 They spent thousands of dollars 680 00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:51,799 transporting her body 1,200 miles from Bay City, Texas, to Chapel Hill 681 00:47:51,800 --> 00:47:55,519 in order to allow the very same medical examiner, who had already 682 00:47:55,520 --> 00:47:59,479 concluded that Kathleen Peterson's death was not accidental, 683 00:47:59,480 --> 00:48:03,840 to perform that autopsy in the hopes of coming to the same conclusion. 684 00:48:05,840 --> 00:48:08,119 I expect him to be found guilty 685 00:48:08,120 --> 00:48:13,879 of killing his wife and I think, after the autopsy tomorrow, 686 00:48:13,880 --> 00:48:19,959 people will have... issues, I think, with the result of that, 687 00:48:19,960 --> 00:48:23,440 as far as his involvement with the death of Elizabeth Ratliff. 688 00:48:26,280 --> 00:48:30,359 'They didn't prove that Elizabeth Ratliff had been murdered, 689 00:48:30,360 --> 00:48:35,999 'but just the jury hearing about all this created this impression' 690 00:48:36,000 --> 00:48:40,319 that Michael Peterson must've been responsible in some way. 691 00:48:40,320 --> 00:48:43,639 'This is just too big a coincidence.' 692 00:48:43,640 --> 00:48:46,319 In my opinion, the cause of death of Mrs Ratliff 693 00:48:46,320 --> 00:48:47,960 was blunt trauma of the head. 694 00:48:49,560 --> 00:48:54,239 - JIM HARDIN: - Do you also have an opinion as to the manner of Mrs Ratliff's death? 695 00:48:54,240 --> 00:48:56,879 - In my opinion... - Objection. - Overruled. 696 00:48:56,880 --> 00:49:01,279 In my opinion, the manner of death in Mrs Ratliff's case was homicide. 697 00:49:01,280 --> 00:49:04,160 Court is now in recess for ten minutes. 698 00:49:06,760 --> 00:49:10,119 'When I found out the evidence of Liz Ratliff's death' 699 00:49:10,120 --> 00:49:13,199 'and that it was very similar to my mother's death, ' 700 00:49:13,200 --> 00:49:18,279 there was a possibility that I had been living with a man for 13 years 701 00:49:18,280 --> 00:49:23,799 who had possibly committed murder 18 years ago and, all this time, 702 00:49:23,800 --> 00:49:26,879 there was this big secret, something I didn't know about him, 703 00:49:26,880 --> 00:49:29,400 and that's very scary. 704 00:49:30,640 --> 00:49:33,200 DOOR RATTLES LOUDLY 705 00:49:43,760 --> 00:49:45,880 Step right over here. 706 00:49:52,800 --> 00:49:55,360 DOOR BANGS AND SQUEAKS 707 00:50:07,840 --> 00:50:09,959 So what do you have? 708 00:50:09,960 --> 00:50:14,519 You have two women murdered on or pushed down, whatever... 709 00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:17,879 - Oh! - ..two staircases, two different countries... - Take it easy. 710 00:50:17,880 --> 00:50:21,439 ..and one man present with them each time. Both ruled a homicide. 711 00:50:21,440 --> 00:50:25,479 The second thing is the blood wiping on the walls. 712 00:50:25,480 --> 00:50:28,159 The medical examiner testified, and I read last night, 713 00:50:28,160 --> 00:50:32,599 that Kathleen Peterson laid there and was bleeding for a time - 714 00:50:32,600 --> 00:50:37,359 she couldn't say how long - for a period of time before she died. 715 00:50:37,360 --> 00:50:41,479 But it's clear evidence that somebody was wiping the blood off the walls. 716 00:50:41,480 --> 00:50:46,599 And then, how do you get past the blood spatter on his shoes? 717 00:50:46,600 --> 00:50:50,919 And then, the bloody footprint on the back of her leg. 718 00:50:50,920 --> 00:50:54,799 And judge, I went back and I looked at the photographs in this case. 719 00:50:54,800 --> 00:50:57,679 I don't know how high that ceiling is in that home, 720 00:50:57,680 --> 00:51:03,039 but anybody with common sense would know that the blood on that ceiling 721 00:51:03,040 --> 00:51:06,119 and on the wall did not come from falling down the steps. 722 00:51:06,120 --> 00:51:08,759 I grew up in a house that had steps. I've fallen down the steps. 723 00:51:08,760 --> 00:51:10,360 My mother's fallen down the steps. 724 00:51:11,600 --> 00:51:16,239 Separate and apart from anything Mr Deaver did, 725 00:51:16,240 --> 00:51:19,679 Mr Labor and Mr Epstein indicate in their report 726 00:51:19,680 --> 00:51:22,959 that this was clearly not a fall down the steps 727 00:51:22,960 --> 00:51:25,279 and furthermore, Judge Hudson, 728 00:51:25,280 --> 00:51:29,559 they indicated from wearing the pants of Michael Peterson 729 00:51:29,560 --> 00:51:34,279 that the spatter inside of those pants came in an upward direction, 730 00:51:34,280 --> 00:51:37,119 and found that, in their opinion, 731 00:51:37,120 --> 00:51:40,839 - Mr Peterson was standing over the body of this young lady... - Not true. 732 00:51:40,840 --> 00:51:44,079 - That's just not true. - ..when that spatter went inside of his pants. 733 00:51:44,080 --> 00:51:45,359 Your Honour, at this time, 734 00:51:45,360 --> 00:51:48,000 the defendant would call Mike Klinkosum to the stand. 735 00:51:54,480 --> 00:52:01,959 In 1991, Greg, um, and his acquaintance Johnny Beck 736 00:52:01,960 --> 00:52:04,639 had been out in Raleigh that evening 737 00:52:04,640 --> 00:52:07,999 and had been seeking drugs and drinking. 738 00:52:08,000 --> 00:52:11,559 They had been together, because Johnny knew where to get drugs 739 00:52:11,560 --> 00:52:16,519 and Greg had the money and so they were doing drugs together 740 00:52:16,520 --> 00:52:18,999 and they ended up driving down 741 00:52:19,000 --> 00:52:22,599 into a cul-de-sac on Blunt Street, here in Raleigh, 742 00:52:22,600 --> 00:52:26,079 and they sat there for a while and smoked some more crack 743 00:52:26,080 --> 00:52:28,999 and, then, at one point, when they were getting ready to leave, 744 00:52:29,000 --> 00:52:32,439 Greg decided, because he had a four-wheel drive vehicle, 745 00:52:32,440 --> 00:52:36,119 that he would go down this dirt path out into this field. 746 00:52:36,120 --> 00:52:40,919 And when he did, he got his car stuck in a ravine out in the field. 747 00:52:40,920 --> 00:52:44,599 As so, as they walked back into the cul-de-sac on Blunt Street, 748 00:52:44,600 --> 00:52:47,479 they noticed... And this was in the early hours. 749 00:52:47,480 --> 00:52:52,159 They noticed, um, what Greg at first thought was a roll of carpet 750 00:52:52,160 --> 00:52:54,999 lying in the road in the cul-de-sac 751 00:52:55,000 --> 00:52:58,679 and it was really Johnny who determined that it was a body. 752 00:52:58,680 --> 00:53:01,559 And because they had been out using drugs 753 00:53:01,560 --> 00:53:03,799 and Greg still had some marijuana on him 754 00:53:03,800 --> 00:53:08,119 and didn't have a driver's licence, they just decided to leave it be. 755 00:53:08,120 --> 00:53:10,919 And later that morning, he went back to the cul-de-sac 756 00:53:10,920 --> 00:53:12,439 and he walked up to the police 757 00:53:12,440 --> 00:53:15,159 and told them that that was his truck in the field. 758 00:53:15,160 --> 00:53:20,519 And they asked him to come down to be questioned and he agreed to do that 759 00:53:20,520 --> 00:53:24,960 and, at that point, um, things started rolling against him. 760 00:53:30,000 --> 00:53:34,679 They had found stains on the fender and the fender liner 761 00:53:34,680 --> 00:53:37,839 that law enforcement thought might be blood. 762 00:53:37,840 --> 00:53:40,199 So they sent these stains 763 00:53:40,200 --> 00:53:44,039 to the SBI lab for testing in the serology section. 764 00:53:44,040 --> 00:53:46,239 The report that was generated 765 00:53:46,240 --> 00:53:50,439 and signed by Agent Deaver from the SBI lab said that 766 00:53:50,440 --> 00:53:53,439 there were chemical indications for the presence of blood. 767 00:53:53,440 --> 00:53:55,279 That's what was written in the lab report. 768 00:53:55,280 --> 00:53:59,879 What was not turned over or disclosed was the fact that Agent Deaver 769 00:53:59,880 --> 00:54:04,479 had gotten a negative result on the Takayama test, which indicated 770 00:54:04,480 --> 00:54:09,159 that he could not confirm that those two stains were in fact blood. 771 00:54:09,160 --> 00:54:14,279 And the lab report that was given to defence counsel, 772 00:54:14,280 --> 00:54:18,439 given to the prosecutor and introduced into evidence, 773 00:54:18,440 --> 00:54:24,599 Duane Deaver's lab report, did it say anything about the fact 774 00:54:24,600 --> 00:54:27,399 - that an additional test had been done? - No. 775 00:54:27,400 --> 00:54:29,239 What was the result of that trial? 776 00:54:29,240 --> 00:54:31,799 Um, Mr Taylor was convicted of first degree murder. 777 00:54:31,800 --> 00:54:35,959 - And what was his sentence? - Er, he was... Life in prison. 778 00:54:35,960 --> 00:54:39,279 Did you see in the report where Agent Deaver stated, 779 00:54:39,280 --> 00:54:41,879 in his opinion, there is nothing scientifically wrong 780 00:54:41,880 --> 00:54:46,639 with what they reported and they did not hurt anybody 781 00:54:46,640 --> 00:54:50,679 by not reporting negative results. Do you see that? 782 00:54:50,680 --> 00:54:53,599 Greg Taylor is the prime example. 783 00:54:53,600 --> 00:54:57,719 He spent 17 years in prison for a murder he didn't commit 784 00:54:57,720 --> 00:55:00,159 and if the results of the confirmatory test, 785 00:55:00,160 --> 00:55:02,399 the Takayama test, had been turned over, 786 00:55:02,400 --> 00:55:05,519 I think that would have made a large impact on the jury, 787 00:55:05,520 --> 00:55:08,959 because, at his trial, the prosecutor, 788 00:55:08,960 --> 00:55:11,519 um, in his closing argument, 789 00:55:11,520 --> 00:55:14,599 several times referred to the blood on the truck. 790 00:55:14,600 --> 00:55:17,919 I think, even later, some jurors gave their opinion 791 00:55:17,920 --> 00:55:22,959 that the blood on the truck was a major factor, um, in their decision. 792 00:55:22,960 --> 00:55:25,519 It never occurred to anybody. 793 00:55:25,520 --> 00:55:29,559 We thought they hadn't done all the testing they should've done. 794 00:55:29,560 --> 00:55:32,999 Er, we thought the testing was probably not accurate, 795 00:55:33,000 --> 00:55:37,239 but it never occurred to anybody that they had done the testing 796 00:55:37,240 --> 00:55:43,199 and just hidden the results. Um... they're scientists 797 00:55:43,200 --> 00:55:46,719 and scientists are supposed to be about the facts. 798 00:55:46,720 --> 00:55:49,759 They're not supposed to take sides. They're supposed to 799 00:55:49,760 --> 00:55:53,199 reveal everything they find and not have bias, 800 00:55:53,200 --> 00:55:57,839 but the fact that they held back these confirmatory tests was... 801 00:55:57,840 --> 00:56:02,039 was absolutely biased in favour of the prosecution 802 00:56:02,040 --> 00:56:06,199 in the way they conducted, er, they prepared that final report. 803 00:56:06,200 --> 00:56:09,119 So I was shocked, really. 804 00:56:09,120 --> 00:56:11,559 We were all shocked. 805 00:56:11,560 --> 00:56:13,719 You know, how could a lab do that? You'd expect... 806 00:56:13,720 --> 00:56:18,439 I'd expect it from a prosecutor or a policeman or an attorney, 807 00:56:18,440 --> 00:56:22,160 maybe a judge or whatever, but from a lab, you know? 808 00:56:24,520 --> 00:56:29,799 You know, where's the... the sense of fairness? 809 00:56:29,800 --> 00:56:35,279 Why do they feel like they have to do something like that? 810 00:56:35,280 --> 00:56:41,039 Um, you know, when I think about, you know, all the years that I lost, 811 00:56:41,040 --> 00:56:45,319 because of this, what I missed of my daughter growing up, you know. 812 00:56:45,320 --> 00:56:49,719 I missed her tenth birthday. I missed her high school graduation. 813 00:56:49,720 --> 00:56:51,640 I missed her college graduation. 814 00:56:53,240 --> 00:56:54,960 I missed her getting married. 815 00:56:56,600 --> 00:56:59,479 I missed the birth of my grandson. 816 00:56:59,480 --> 00:57:03,519 You know, she was 26 years old when I was released 817 00:57:03,520 --> 00:57:07,479 and I missed all that. I look at her today like she's a stranger, 818 00:57:07,480 --> 00:57:10,520 cos I don't know how she came to be about herself. 819 00:57:36,920 --> 00:57:40,200 - Do you know which direction to go? - Um... 820 00:57:47,800 --> 00:57:50,399 HE GASPS 821 00:57:50,400 --> 00:57:54,760 - Say hi? - How are you doing? - Say hi? Hi, Grandpa! 822 00:57:57,400 --> 00:57:59,919 How you doing? 823 00:57:59,920 --> 00:58:02,959 HE CHATTERS TO THE BABY, BECKY LAUGHS 824 00:58:02,960 --> 00:58:07,799 - His first visit to jail. - But he's been to prison twice already! 825 00:58:07,800 --> 00:58:13,359 - Dada! - He's seen you twice at Nash. - In prison! That's right. Right! 826 00:58:13,360 --> 00:58:15,399 His first time to jail, though. 827 00:58:15,400 --> 00:58:18,119 The first through-the-glass conversation! All those 828 00:58:18,120 --> 00:58:21,439 little memories that you write down in the baby scrapbook, you know! 829 00:58:21,440 --> 00:58:23,799 - In his baby book! - SHE LAUGHS 830 00:58:23,800 --> 00:58:26,159 Oh, for God's sake! 831 00:58:26,160 --> 00:58:29,079 - Oh, it's good to see you! God! - You too, Dad. 832 00:58:29,080 --> 00:58:30,999 THEY LAUGH 833 00:58:31,000 --> 00:58:34,359 Oh, Christ! Now your ears go back beautifully! 834 00:58:34,360 --> 00:58:36,159 Yeah, everything's great. 835 00:58:36,160 --> 00:58:41,119 - Work's going well, all this is good. - He's a darling. 836 00:58:41,120 --> 00:58:44,839 You know, down here with family, it's stressful but, you know, 837 00:58:44,840 --> 00:58:46,719 - it's nice to see everybody. - Oh, yeah! 838 00:58:46,720 --> 00:58:49,719 So do you think he looks like anyone yet? 839 00:58:49,720 --> 00:58:53,279 - I think his ears are a little like mine. - They are! 840 00:58:53,280 --> 00:58:57,719 I said that to Margaret the other day, 841 00:58:57,720 --> 00:59:00,719 because we were looking at you in court from the back and I look at him 842 00:59:00,720 --> 00:59:03,199 from the back and your ears look the same from the back. 843 00:59:03,200 --> 00:59:05,719 I had gorgeous small ears when I was young. 844 00:59:05,720 --> 00:59:08,039 - Is he going to have hair or not? - I don't know. 845 00:59:08,040 --> 00:59:12,439 - One of these days. - Some day! Some day! 846 00:59:12,440 --> 00:59:17,440 When you see Margaret, would you please wish her a happy birthday? 847 00:59:18,520 --> 00:59:21,759 - That poor child. - I know. 848 00:59:21,760 --> 00:59:25,719 You know, I wrote about this day with her. 849 00:59:25,720 --> 00:59:28,279 I was there when she was born. 850 00:59:28,280 --> 00:59:30,879 Well, I wasn't in the room, but I took her to the hospital 851 00:59:30,880 --> 00:59:36,999 in 1981, drove her in a snowstorm to go to, 852 00:59:37,000 --> 00:59:39,999 you know, Wiesbaden hospital. 853 00:59:40,000 --> 00:59:44,599 And then, I was there every birthday after that. 854 00:59:44,600 --> 00:59:47,399 Every single birthday she ever had, 855 00:59:47,400 --> 00:59:50,559 I was there until, I guess it was about the 18th birthday. 856 00:59:50,560 --> 00:59:56,599 Then she went to college. And then there was the 20th birthday. 857 00:59:56,600 --> 00:59:59,400 - Yeah, that one kind of sucked. - Kind of sucked?(!) 858 01:00:00,560 --> 01:00:05,919 Yeah, you remember that? Watching the grid search of the house. 859 01:00:05,920 --> 01:00:11,559 And then here it is, her 30th birthday. Oh my god. 860 01:00:11,560 --> 01:00:14,479 So maybe this is the last I'm going to see of Dorian 861 01:00:14,480 --> 01:00:20,559 until you bring him down for our ice cream and tattoo outing. 862 01:00:20,560 --> 01:00:22,239 Well, we'll see. 863 01:00:22,240 --> 01:00:24,959 - So I'll see you Tuesday morning. - Yup. 864 01:00:24,960 --> 01:00:27,920 You're going to watch me hobble down the stairs, OK? 865 01:00:29,440 --> 01:00:34,559 God almighty! Christ. Don't let them film me going down the stairs! 866 01:00:34,560 --> 01:00:35,719 THEY CHUCKLE 867 01:00:35,720 --> 01:00:39,840 Jesus. No filming going down the stairs! 868 01:00:41,520 --> 01:00:42,679 I love you. 869 01:00:42,680 --> 01:00:46,040 - Love you, Dad. - Bye bye. 870 01:00:47,320 --> 01:00:48,919 Come on, wave. 871 01:00:48,920 --> 01:00:51,679 Bye bye! 872 01:00:51,680 --> 01:00:54,600 - Bye, Dad. Love you. - Oh, shit. 873 01:01:05,600 --> 01:01:07,719 ♪ Happy birthday to you 874 01:01:07,720 --> 01:01:12,519 ♪ Happy birthday to you 875 01:01:12,520 --> 01:01:18,079 ♪ Happy birthday dear Margaret 876 01:01:18,080 --> 01:01:24,439 ♪ Happy birthday to you. ♪ 877 01:01:24,440 --> 01:01:28,160 APPLAUSE AND CHEERING 878 01:01:32,760 --> 01:01:35,599 APPLAUSE AND CHEERING 879 01:01:35,600 --> 01:01:40,599 It was snowing, gently falling everywhere and after many, 880 01:01:40,600 --> 01:01:45,559 many hours of intensive labour, I was at your birth mother's side. 881 01:01:45,560 --> 01:01:48,879 Margaret at long last emerged. 882 01:01:48,880 --> 01:01:53,879 She was exquisitely beautiful and she looked exactly the same. 883 01:01:53,880 --> 01:01:58,599 Lovely red strawberry blonde hair. To Margaret, much love. 884 01:01:58,600 --> 01:02:01,839 May the future bring you much happiness and continued fulfilment. 885 01:02:01,840 --> 01:02:04,599 We love you, dearest Margaret. 886 01:02:04,600 --> 01:02:07,800 APPLAUSE 887 01:02:08,960 --> 01:02:10,879 Thanks for coming, guys. 888 01:02:10,880 --> 01:02:13,359 I hope your thirties are freaking awesome! > 889 01:02:13,360 --> 01:02:15,920 APPLAUSE 890 01:02:17,680 --> 01:02:22,479 My 20th birthday sucked so hardcore and my 30th birthday 891 01:02:22,480 --> 01:02:25,799 is so much better, so thank you guys for coming. 892 01:02:25,800 --> 01:02:29,400 It's gonna just be a lot better from now on. I hope. 893 01:02:32,960 --> 01:02:35,640 So to all of you guys and to Dad, too. 894 01:02:45,200 --> 01:02:48,879 Place your left arm on the Bible, raise your right arm and swear 895 01:02:48,880 --> 01:02:51,319 the testimony you're about to give the court and the jury 896 01:02:51,320 --> 01:02:54,199 in the case now being heard to be the truth and nothing but the truth, 897 01:02:54,200 --> 01:02:56,559 - so help you God. - I do. - Please be seated. 898 01:02:56,560 --> 01:02:57,839 Did there come a time 899 01:02:57,840 --> 01:03:01,919 when you were asked to conduct a review 900 01:03:01,920 --> 01:03:04,080 of the SBI laboratory? 901 01:03:05,320 --> 01:03:06,959 Yes, 902 01:03:06,960 --> 01:03:12,879 in early March of 2010 we agreed to conduct a review 903 01:03:12,880 --> 01:03:17,599 of all serology files with similar reporting sequences 904 01:03:17,600 --> 01:03:20,159 as had appeared in the Taylor case. 905 01:03:20,160 --> 01:03:22,839 The purpose of the report was to see 906 01:03:22,840 --> 01:03:25,519 if there had been any cases of injustice. 907 01:03:25,520 --> 01:03:29,279 Did you find that there were at least a number of agents, 908 01:03:29,280 --> 01:03:33,919 not just agent Deaver, who were producing lab reports 909 01:03:33,920 --> 01:03:37,839 that didn't have all of the tests that they had actually run? 910 01:03:37,840 --> 01:03:42,919 We identified 230 cases where not all the tests were reported 911 01:03:42,920 --> 01:03:45,759 in the final report that was issued by the lab. 912 01:03:45,760 --> 01:03:49,639 You would see a presumptive positive and a negative Takayama 913 01:03:49,640 --> 01:03:51,959 shown in the notes and then you would see a final report 914 01:03:51,960 --> 01:03:54,519 that simply reported the presumptive positive. 915 01:03:54,520 --> 01:03:58,199 And of the five cases that were categorised by you all 916 01:03:58,200 --> 01:04:01,799 as the most serious of all the cases you looked at, 917 01:04:01,800 --> 01:04:05,719 who was the agent on each of those cases? 918 01:04:05,720 --> 01:04:07,159 Special Agent Deaver. 919 01:04:07,160 --> 01:04:10,559 Were those the only instances where you found that agent Deaver 920 01:04:10,560 --> 01:04:15,679 had failed to put down what his lab notes reflected? 921 01:04:15,680 --> 01:04:21,199 - No, I believe the final total was 34. - 34 cases? - That's correct. 922 01:04:21,200 --> 01:04:25,159 Thank you very much. Please answer whatever questions the DA may have. 923 01:04:25,160 --> 01:04:26,200 I appreciate it. 924 01:04:34,240 --> 01:04:37,239 I got this group of French people who are following me 925 01:04:37,240 --> 01:04:38,640 around with a camera. 926 01:04:40,680 --> 01:04:43,839 I think they want to film inside there. 927 01:04:43,840 --> 01:04:47,239 - I don't know if you're... - If it's OK with you it's OK with me. 928 01:04:47,240 --> 01:04:50,239 - It's OK with me. - Oh, you've come to share lunch with me! 929 01:04:50,240 --> 01:04:52,359 - No! - You were going to bring your own. 930 01:04:52,360 --> 01:04:54,359 No, no, I'm not sharing anything with you. 931 01:04:54,360 --> 01:04:57,719 Why are you hobbling around like you're 80 years old? 932 01:04:57,720 --> 01:05:00,279 - Jeez, 80?! - 90. - How about 200? 933 01:05:00,280 --> 01:05:03,280 - Ask them what I looked like yesterday. - Why, what's going on? 934 01:05:04,400 --> 01:05:07,879 Well, I'm hardly the Princess and the Pea here. 935 01:05:07,880 --> 01:05:10,479 - You know, the story of the Princess and the Pea? - Yes. 936 01:05:10,480 --> 01:05:13,039 I've been in prison for eight years. 937 01:05:13,040 --> 01:05:16,439 We don't have orthopaedic mattresses or anything. 938 01:05:16,440 --> 01:05:20,559 - They don't have the foam? - No, it's pretty terrible. 939 01:05:20,560 --> 01:05:24,559 I'm so used to prison luxury conditions, you see, 940 01:05:24,560 --> 01:05:29,119 that coming to the jail, sleeping on cold concrete - maybe that's it. 941 01:05:29,120 --> 01:05:30,399 Maybe that's it. 942 01:05:30,400 --> 01:05:35,679 It's sort of like going from the Westin with their Heavenly beds 943 01:05:35,680 --> 01:05:37,040 to Motel 6. 944 01:05:39,480 --> 01:05:45,119 So, she is not calling Deaver. She is not calling any experts. 945 01:05:45,120 --> 01:05:47,919 Uh, she's going to call a couple of witnesses. 946 01:05:47,920 --> 01:05:51,719 I think she's going to try to get into evidence that Deborah Radisch 947 01:05:51,720 --> 01:05:54,519 thought it was a homicide, but neither of those things 948 01:05:54,520 --> 01:05:57,559 has any bearing on it. 949 01:05:57,560 --> 01:06:00,439 - As you say, that's for a retrial. - Right, right. 950 01:06:00,440 --> 01:06:02,919 I don't want to get too far out ahead of ourselves here, 951 01:06:02,920 --> 01:06:06,559 but if we get a new trial, then the question becomes, 952 01:06:06,560 --> 01:06:08,359 can they even retry you, 953 01:06:08,360 --> 01:06:12,319 given the fact that Deaver was all over that scene? 954 01:06:12,320 --> 01:06:16,039 I mean, ALL over the scene, and remember the photo glitches 955 01:06:16,040 --> 01:06:20,679 and him smelling the wine and... 956 01:06:20,680 --> 01:06:22,199 Yes, he's the one that did that! 957 01:06:22,200 --> 01:06:25,279 - All of it. He did all of it! - Such bullshit. 958 01:06:25,280 --> 01:06:29,479 He did all of it. Get a good close-up of him. 959 01:06:29,480 --> 01:06:32,039 THEY CHUCKLE 960 01:06:32,040 --> 01:06:34,119 Oh, another close-up right there. 961 01:06:34,120 --> 01:06:38,719 How the man got away with it, for as long as he did, 962 01:06:38,720 --> 01:06:44,359 that's really a crime, because you wonder how many other cases 963 01:06:44,360 --> 01:06:46,839 there are - not high-profile cases - 964 01:06:46,840 --> 01:06:51,479 but other cases in which the man probably testified. 965 01:06:51,480 --> 01:06:54,599 He made the difference of sending them either to prison 966 01:06:54,600 --> 01:06:57,799 or getting them much more time. 967 01:06:57,800 --> 01:07:02,999 And I just cannot even imagine that anybody would do that, 968 01:07:03,000 --> 01:07:08,599 but he's done it for, gosh, over 20 years. 969 01:07:08,600 --> 01:07:14,719 In September 2007, Dr Turner killed his wife Jennifer Turner 970 01:07:14,720 --> 01:07:17,239 and several months after the killing, 971 01:07:17,240 --> 01:07:20,159 Dr Turner was indicted by the Davie County Grand Jury 972 01:07:20,160 --> 01:07:21,599 for first-degree murder. 973 01:07:21,600 --> 01:07:26,079 What does Dr Turner say had happened between him and his wife? 974 01:07:26,080 --> 01:07:30,879 Well, the killing occurred in an outbuilding of the property 975 01:07:30,880 --> 01:07:35,039 that Dr Turner and his wife had shared until they became separated 976 01:07:35,040 --> 01:07:37,839 about 18 months before the killing. 977 01:07:37,840 --> 01:07:43,079 Inside the building, there were tons of stuff just lying all around. 978 01:07:43,080 --> 01:07:46,639 One of the things that was lying around was a large seven-foot - 979 01:07:46,640 --> 01:07:50,039 I mean, for lack of a better term - Viking spear 980 01:07:50,040 --> 01:07:53,719 that had about a 16-inch blade on the end of it 981 01:07:53,720 --> 01:07:56,319 and Mrs Turner picked up the spear 982 01:07:56,320 --> 01:08:00,039 and attacked him with it, driving it through his leg near his groin, 983 01:08:00,040 --> 01:08:03,279 through and through twice and stabbing it on his arm. 984 01:08:03,280 --> 01:08:05,439 At that point in time, he went into his pocket. 985 01:08:05,440 --> 01:08:08,799 He had a pocket knife with him and he used the pocket knife 986 01:08:08,800 --> 01:08:10,959 to defend himself and in doing so, 987 01:08:10,960 --> 01:08:12,680 inflicted the wounds that killed her. 988 01:08:27,400 --> 01:08:31,239 Did he in fact have wounds on his leg that were consistent 989 01:08:31,240 --> 01:08:33,679 with what he had said happened? 990 01:08:33,680 --> 01:08:36,399 Yes, he lost about a quarter of his blood volume 991 01:08:36,400 --> 01:08:39,719 and one of those wounds was about 1.5 centimetres 992 01:08:39,720 --> 01:08:43,599 from his femoral artery, which they also concluded would have killed him 993 01:08:43,600 --> 01:08:44,879 if it had hit him. 994 01:08:44,880 --> 01:08:49,799 I'm going to show you what has been marked as exhibit 27. 995 01:08:49,800 --> 01:08:53,559 What was the initial opinion that Agent Thomas had 996 01:08:53,560 --> 01:08:58,319 with regard to the shirt that Dr Turner had been wearing? 997 01:08:58,320 --> 01:09:01,599 Uh, this transfer bloodstain pattern was consistent with a bloody hand 998 01:09:01,600 --> 01:09:03,880 being wiped on the surface of the shirt. 999 01:09:11,520 --> 01:09:13,799 What does the second report say? 1000 01:09:13,800 --> 01:09:16,799 It says, "it is consistent with a pointed object, 1001 01:09:16,800 --> 01:09:20,399 "consistent with a knife being wiped on the surface of the shirt." 1002 01:09:20,400 --> 01:09:23,679 Was there any indication in that second report 1003 01:09:23,680 --> 01:09:27,120 that there had been a significant change? 1004 01:09:28,200 --> 01:09:29,439 No, there wasn't. 1005 01:09:29,440 --> 01:09:32,879 What special agent Thomas testified about is that the SBI 1006 01:09:32,880 --> 01:09:35,079 and Special Agent Deaver, who was working with him, 1007 01:09:35,080 --> 01:09:38,639 had been presented with a new scenario. 1008 01:09:38,640 --> 01:09:42,399 That, in essence, he had inflicted those wounds on himself 1009 01:09:42,400 --> 01:09:44,879 and entirely staged the scene. 1010 01:09:44,880 --> 01:09:48,919 Following that, they, when looking at the shirt, could it possibly 1011 01:09:48,920 --> 01:09:51,759 have been because someone was wiping a knife off on the shirt? 1012 01:09:51,760 --> 01:09:55,879 Was that what he got out of that meeting that Agent Deaver attended? 1013 01:09:55,880 --> 01:09:56,919 Yes. 1014 01:09:56,920 --> 01:10:00,279 Then it says, "I'm going to meet with Duane 1015 01:10:00,280 --> 01:10:02,760 - "to do the actual reconstruction." - Yes. 1016 01:10:08,760 --> 01:10:12,559 - Who's filming this? - Special Agent Deaver. - He's present there? 1017 01:10:12,560 --> 01:10:13,920 He's filming it, yes. 1018 01:10:17,440 --> 01:10:21,039 I think what they were trying to do is put blood 1019 01:10:21,040 --> 01:10:25,359 on just the outside layers of the knife in the hopes 1020 01:10:25,360 --> 01:10:29,479 that it would somehow duplicate the initial stain, even though 1021 01:10:29,480 --> 01:10:32,439 he didn't know a scenario where that would occur in actual real life, 1022 01:10:32,440 --> 01:10:35,400 where you only have blood on the absolute edges of a knife. 1023 01:10:37,080 --> 01:10:42,919 Nice good curve. Turn your wrist in. Even better, yeah. 1024 01:10:42,920 --> 01:10:47,999 'All right then, you might get some just lightly on the fingers' 1025 01:10:48,000 --> 01:10:52,960 and just kinda... up, up. 1026 01:10:54,080 --> 01:10:58,319 'Beautiful. That's a wrap, baby.' 1027 01:10:58,320 --> 01:11:01,879 Not in any effort to recreate any scenario 1028 01:11:01,880 --> 01:11:07,599 of what actually happened that night, but just to create a stain 1029 01:11:07,600 --> 01:11:11,879 that might look like another stain, that might refute 1030 01:11:11,880 --> 01:11:15,119 what our experts said about what that stain was. 1031 01:11:15,120 --> 01:11:17,279 'There's a bloodstain expert, Stewart James.' 1032 01:11:17,280 --> 01:11:22,319 He's universally regarded as one of the handful of top two or three 1033 01:11:22,320 --> 01:11:24,279 experts in this field. 1034 01:11:24,280 --> 01:11:29,399 He takes the video of the Kirk Turner blood experiments 1035 01:11:29,400 --> 01:11:33,799 where Gerald Thomas wipes the shirt and Duane Deaver is filming it 1036 01:11:33,800 --> 01:11:38,719 and he shows this video at professional conferences, 1037 01:11:38,720 --> 01:11:41,239 both in the United States and abroad. 1038 01:11:41,240 --> 01:11:46,599 The reaction in the community of bloodstain pattern analysis, 1039 01:11:46,600 --> 01:11:50,439 he says, is shock, that everyone just looks at these experiments 1040 01:11:50,440 --> 01:11:53,119 and says, "That is a bunch of malarkey." 1041 01:11:53,120 --> 01:11:56,999 It's sort of what's happening in Mike Peterson's motion 1042 01:11:57,000 --> 01:12:00,199 for appropriate relief right now. You can sort of know 1043 01:12:00,200 --> 01:12:04,639 all of these anecdotal things and you can experience individual cases 1044 01:12:04,640 --> 01:12:08,599 like we did with Dr Turner and other cases, but once you see 1045 01:12:08,600 --> 01:12:13,519 all of those things synthesised and brought together 1046 01:12:13,520 --> 01:12:18,799 and woven into the same tapestry, it's pretty devastating 1047 01:12:18,800 --> 01:12:25,040 to see what can pass for science and justice in a courtroom. 1048 01:12:27,320 --> 01:12:29,920 Thanks, I appreciate it. 1049 01:12:31,160 --> 01:12:34,319 Am I going to get a lunch today, deputy? 1050 01:12:34,320 --> 01:12:35,839 We're working on it. 1051 01:12:35,840 --> 01:12:40,639 This woman stabbed him with a spear and then he cut her throat. 1052 01:12:40,640 --> 01:12:46,079 You know, this is not a good marriage here, but anyway... 1053 01:12:46,080 --> 01:12:50,039 But then when I read that Duane Deaver believed that the man 1054 01:12:50,040 --> 01:12:54,079 had taken a spear and put it through his leg, 1055 01:12:54,080 --> 01:12:58,879 I mean, it just boggles the mind, 1056 01:12:58,880 --> 01:13:00,880 that anybody would come up with that. 1057 01:13:05,000 --> 01:13:06,120 I got an orange. Oh! 1058 01:13:15,400 --> 01:13:19,119 You ought to feel how cool this sandwich is. 1059 01:13:19,120 --> 01:13:21,400 Just feel how cold that is. 1060 01:13:38,040 --> 01:13:41,679 Mrs Sutton, have you been qualified as an expert witness 1061 01:13:41,680 --> 01:13:44,439 in the field of bloodstain pattern analysis? 1062 01:13:44,440 --> 01:13:45,759 Yes sir, I have. 1063 01:13:45,760 --> 01:13:49,399 I want to show you what Mr Deaver testified to 1064 01:13:49,400 --> 01:13:50,999 at Mr Peterson's trial. 1065 01:13:51,000 --> 01:13:56,359 I'm gonna ask of you to describe the types of experiments that you used 1066 01:13:56,360 --> 01:14:00,079 and what the results were, generally. 1067 01:14:00,080 --> 01:14:06,119 Test 1 was to place a source of blood a certain distance above 1068 01:14:06,120 --> 01:14:11,119 a horizontal or above the ground and impact it with test shoes on 1069 01:14:11,120 --> 01:14:13,359 and to take a look at those spatters 1070 01:14:13,360 --> 01:14:17,400 to determine if they were comparable to what I found on the real shoes. 1071 01:14:42,920 --> 01:14:44,479 The wearer of these shoes - 1072 01:14:44,480 --> 01:14:49,919 these shoes were actually directly below the source of blood, 1073 01:14:49,920 --> 01:14:52,599 which in my opinion is the back of the head of the victim 1074 01:14:52,600 --> 01:14:54,999 when it was impacted. 1075 01:14:55,000 --> 01:14:58,439 Is there anything about these experiments that you saw 1076 01:14:58,440 --> 01:15:02,719 that in any way supports Mr Deaver's opinion? 1077 01:15:02,720 --> 01:15:07,479 No. The experiment won't show that at all. 1078 01:15:07,480 --> 01:15:12,399 What the experiment shows is that if you impact a sponge, 1079 01:15:12,400 --> 01:15:13,720 it'll create spatter. 1080 01:15:15,160 --> 01:15:19,359 That's a given in my field. That's a recreation. 1081 01:15:19,360 --> 01:15:22,919 That's trying to make a set of circumstances 1082 01:15:22,920 --> 01:15:26,039 and get a desired outcome. 1083 01:15:26,040 --> 01:15:30,000 It's not what I would classify as an experiment. 1084 01:16:17,200 --> 01:16:21,679 'The opinion is that these pants are consistent with impact spatters 1085 01:16:21,680 --> 01:16:23,799 'that result from a forceful impact' 1086 01:16:23,800 --> 01:16:25,119 and that the individual 1087 01:16:25,120 --> 01:16:27,639 wearing these pants at the time of that impact 1088 01:16:27,640 --> 01:16:32,119 was in close proximity to the source of blood when it was impacted. 1089 01:16:32,120 --> 01:16:36,879 Was that experiment that you just saw acceptable within 1090 01:16:36,880 --> 01:16:40,679 the bounds of bloodstain pattern analysis? 1091 01:16:40,680 --> 01:16:43,879 No. The first thing that really struck me was 1092 01:16:43,880 --> 01:16:47,119 as soon as he stepped into the stairway 1093 01:16:47,120 --> 01:16:50,639 he pulled the short leg open. That's not fair. 1094 01:16:50,640 --> 01:16:54,319 If the question is, can I take a step into the stairwell, 1095 01:16:54,320 --> 01:16:58,319 hit somebody, and get spatter back into my shorts, 1096 01:16:58,320 --> 01:17:02,599 then I have to do it with as natural a motion as possible. 1097 01:17:02,600 --> 01:17:04,359 One thing I did notice, 1098 01:17:04,360 --> 01:17:09,319 the target was placed more towards the centre of the landing 1099 01:17:09,320 --> 01:17:14,399 as opposed to back where the area of origin was actually calculated. 1100 01:17:14,400 --> 01:17:18,079 And of course, that's so that you can have one leg up. 1101 01:17:18,080 --> 01:17:20,799 That certainly could be one explanation, sure. 1102 01:17:20,800 --> 01:17:24,079 If it was back further, somebody would be standing on the landing. 1103 01:17:24,080 --> 01:17:26,359 They wouldn't have their leg up, would they? 1104 01:17:26,360 --> 01:17:29,719 I agree with that and it would also be difficult to hit that sponge. 1105 01:17:29,720 --> 01:17:34,679 Are the experiments that you used consistent with what others 1106 01:17:34,680 --> 01:17:38,959 in the field use to conduct analysis of bloodstain patterns? 1107 01:17:38,960 --> 01:17:40,839 Yes, they are. 1108 01:17:40,840 --> 01:17:44,999 Is it consistent with the methodology that you learned 1109 01:17:45,000 --> 01:17:47,160 - 15, 16 years ago? - Yes, it is. 1110 01:17:48,840 --> 01:17:51,199 - Is that true? - No, sir. 1111 01:17:51,200 --> 01:17:54,239 Is his methodology, as you saw in these experiments, 1112 01:17:54,240 --> 01:17:58,239 what others who are competent in the field of bloodstain analysis 1113 01:17:58,240 --> 01:18:00,839 use to analyse crime scenes? 1114 01:18:00,840 --> 01:18:01,880 No, sir. 1115 01:18:10,480 --> 01:18:14,640 Happy birthday. 1116 01:18:30,480 --> 01:18:32,600 I'm glad you were able to finally get here. 1117 01:18:43,280 --> 01:18:44,320 Can't shake hands. 1118 01:18:55,280 --> 01:18:57,800 Remain seated, come to order, court is back in session. 1119 01:19:03,680 --> 01:19:05,319 Could you please state your name 1120 01:19:05,320 --> 01:19:08,239 and spell your last name for the court reporter, please? 1121 01:19:08,240 --> 01:19:12,319 Ronald Thomas Guerette. G-U-E-R-E-T-T-E. 1122 01:19:12,320 --> 01:19:14,359 Before becoming a private investigator, 1123 01:19:14,360 --> 01:19:16,839 what was your profession? 1124 01:19:16,840 --> 01:19:21,039 I was a police officer in Colorado for a couple years. 1125 01:19:21,040 --> 01:19:25,359 Then I was a police officer in Charlotte for about ten years. 1126 01:19:25,360 --> 01:19:27,799 When did you first get involved in the case 1127 01:19:27,800 --> 01:19:29,799 State vs Michael Peterson? 1128 01:19:29,800 --> 01:19:32,759 About a week after December the 9th. 1129 01:19:32,760 --> 01:19:34,719 Of what year? 1130 01:19:34,720 --> 01:19:38,719 - Umm, ten years ago. - 2001? - 2001. 1131 01:19:38,720 --> 01:19:42,359 In connection with this hearing, did you review 1132 01:19:42,360 --> 01:19:44,799 all of the discovery that was provided 1133 01:19:44,800 --> 01:19:48,279 by the state of North Carolina in response to the orders 1134 01:19:48,280 --> 01:19:50,759 - that were issued by Judge Hudson? - I did. 1135 01:19:50,760 --> 01:19:54,479 Well over 100,000 pages, many, many CDs, and disks, and... 1136 01:19:54,480 --> 01:19:57,239 - And you reviewed all of that? - Unfortunately. 1137 01:19:57,240 --> 01:20:03,639 All right. Did you review some reports that Duane Deaver 1138 01:20:03,640 --> 01:20:06,960 - either authored or was mentioned in? - Yes, sir. 1139 01:20:10,720 --> 01:20:15,599 On how many cases of bloodstain pattern analysis or evaluations 1140 01:20:15,600 --> 01:20:17,759 have you actually worked? 1141 01:20:17,760 --> 01:20:20,999 I don't know for sure, but it would be somewhere around 200 1142 01:20:21,000 --> 01:20:24,519 that I have written reports on myself. Now, that doesn't include 1143 01:20:24,520 --> 01:20:28,239 the number of cases that I have looked at as part of my training. 1144 01:20:28,240 --> 01:20:31,519 And I continue to provide help to others who are in training. 1145 01:20:31,520 --> 01:20:33,359 I help them with their cases 1146 01:20:33,360 --> 01:20:35,799 and I wouldn't necessarily write a report on that. 1147 01:20:35,800 --> 01:20:40,439 Were you able to compare the results of your analysis 1148 01:20:40,440 --> 01:20:44,799 of the reports that he wrote with his testimony? 1149 01:20:44,800 --> 01:20:45,960 Yes, I was. 1150 01:20:47,920 --> 01:20:53,719 How many cases were there in total in which Agent Deaver just 1151 01:20:53,720 --> 01:21:00,039 observed bloodstains, either at the scene, at the SBI laboratory, 1152 01:21:00,040 --> 01:21:03,679 - or by looking at photos? - Only 54. 1153 01:21:03,680 --> 01:21:06,359 In how many of those cases did Agent Deaver provide 1154 01:21:06,360 --> 01:21:10,319 - a bloodstain pattern analysis opinion? - 36. 1155 01:21:10,320 --> 01:21:15,999 In how many of those cases did Agent Deaver actually go to the scene 1156 01:21:16,000 --> 01:21:19,279 - of an event? - Well, he went to 17 different scenes 1157 01:21:19,280 --> 01:21:22,639 between 1987 and 2003. 1158 01:21:22,640 --> 01:21:28,799 How many cases were there in which Agent Deaver performed tests 1159 01:21:28,800 --> 01:21:32,239 or experiments before the Peterson case? 1160 01:21:32,240 --> 01:21:34,599 Three. Only three. 1161 01:21:34,600 --> 01:21:37,999 What was the date of the last experiment 1162 01:21:38,000 --> 01:21:43,919 that Agent Deaver conducted on his own before the Peterson case? 1163 01:21:43,920 --> 01:21:47,999 Back in 1991. 11 years before. 1164 01:21:48,000 --> 01:21:50,479 How many cases were there in which Agent Deaver, 1165 01:21:50,480 --> 01:21:55,319 before the Peterson case, found a precise point of impact? 1166 01:21:55,320 --> 01:21:56,599 Zero. 1167 01:21:56,600 --> 01:21:59,359 I think Agent Deaver also gave some testimony about falls 1168 01:21:59,360 --> 01:22:01,599 and investigating falls, correct? 1169 01:22:01,600 --> 01:22:04,959 That is correct... and stairs. 1170 01:22:04,960 --> 01:22:08,999 Have you ever analysed bloodstain evidence from a situation 1171 01:22:09,000 --> 01:22:11,560 that was known to be a fall? 1172 01:22:14,000 --> 01:22:19,279 Well... yes, I have been to, probably, about 15 times 1173 01:22:19,280 --> 01:22:23,120 where it was reported that a fall had occurred. 1174 01:22:24,240 --> 01:22:27,879 Probably five or six of those times I was in agreement 1175 01:22:27,880 --> 01:22:31,959 that a fall was involved. The rest of the those, I was not in agreement 1176 01:22:31,960 --> 01:22:34,919 that a fall was involved or created the spatters, 1177 01:22:34,920 --> 01:22:37,000 the patterns, that were seen there. 1178 01:22:38,880 --> 01:22:43,359 Mr Guerette, how many of Agent Deaver's cases did you find 1179 01:22:43,360 --> 01:22:48,839 in which he had gone to the scene of a fall to analyse it in some way? 1180 01:22:48,840 --> 01:22:52,399 Well, I checked every word on every page in these documents 1181 01:22:52,400 --> 01:22:55,000 and the word "falls" never occurred. 1182 01:22:56,760 --> 01:22:59,920 - That's all I have, your honour. Thank you. - You can come down. 1183 01:23:21,080 --> 01:23:25,759 Hey! Good to see - oh! Look at those teeth! 1184 01:23:25,760 --> 01:23:29,119 So are you alive, or what? Are you alive? 1185 01:23:29,120 --> 01:23:33,640 You've been hobbling around all day. Let's see you move! 1186 01:23:35,800 --> 01:23:39,039 - It looks like it's going well, really well. - It really is. 1187 01:23:39,040 --> 01:23:44,439 Yeah, it really is. I mean, you never know, of course, 1188 01:23:44,440 --> 01:23:48,479 but I would think he'll rule in my favour. 1189 01:23:48,480 --> 01:23:50,439 Freaking... that would be amazing, right? 1190 01:23:50,440 --> 01:23:52,719 No! it's supposed to be the way it's supposed to be. 1191 01:23:52,720 --> 01:23:56,679 - Either way, it's amazing. - Well, here it is! 1192 01:23:56,680 --> 01:24:03,439 So with any kind of luck I'll be out of here, you know... soon. 1193 01:24:03,440 --> 01:24:06,479 Obviously that's what we're all hoping for, 1194 01:24:06,480 --> 01:24:11,479 - but it would be so amazing for that to happen. - I know. I know. 1195 01:24:11,480 --> 01:24:15,679 Yesterday, there were around 217 articles 1196 01:24:15,680 --> 01:24:19,319 - from local papers to the Washington Post. - On what? 1197 01:24:19,320 --> 01:24:22,879 And they're just basically talking about how all the experts 1198 01:24:22,880 --> 01:24:25,199 are discrediting Deaver. 1199 01:24:25,200 --> 01:24:29,799 But he really did convict me with his points of origin 1200 01:24:29,800 --> 01:24:33,879 and "the head had to be right here, and so therefore, 1201 01:24:33,880 --> 01:24:39,399 "if the head's right here, all the blood must have hit out there." 1202 01:24:39,400 --> 01:24:42,599 - And that's just bullshit. - Well, it's so convincing, right? 1203 01:24:42,600 --> 01:24:46,439 For him to get so specific and say that it happened here, there, 1204 01:24:46,440 --> 01:24:49,279 - and there. - Oh yeah, there's no question. 1205 01:24:49,280 --> 01:24:52,399 And the thing with the shorts and the tennis shoes and 1206 01:24:52,400 --> 01:24:56,079 what David picked up and I had missed also the second time 1207 01:24:56,080 --> 01:25:01,159 was the first-degree murder charge premeditation only came 1208 01:25:01,160 --> 01:25:02,560 because of Deaver. 1209 01:25:03,640 --> 01:25:06,879 Enough about me. We've all seen me. I'm sick of me. 1210 01:25:06,880 --> 01:25:08,319 Tell me about you, kid. 1211 01:25:08,320 --> 01:25:10,919 Man, my life has changed night and day. 1212 01:25:10,920 --> 01:25:15,279 I've got this best friend, this girl named Jasmine, 1213 01:25:15,280 --> 01:25:18,759 - and she's lived there for... - I'm going to have to come closer. 1214 01:25:18,760 --> 01:25:23,959 - I can't hear. - Yeah so, you want to stand up? 1215 01:25:23,960 --> 01:25:28,359 - You can stand up. - Sit down. - They're making too much damn noise. 1216 01:25:28,360 --> 01:25:31,479 Can't you hear that shit down there? 1217 01:25:31,480 --> 01:25:34,399 It's buffered, it's buffered. 1218 01:25:34,400 --> 01:25:37,280 It's coming in my ear. What the fuck are they doing? 1219 01:25:39,520 --> 01:25:42,439 Well, when am I going to become a grandfather again? 1220 01:25:42,440 --> 01:25:45,479 I'm working on it - very hard, I'll have you know. 1221 01:25:45,480 --> 01:25:47,279 - I'm working on it, hard. - Good! 1222 01:25:47,280 --> 01:25:49,039 - Yessir. - Time's up, sir. 1223 01:25:49,040 --> 01:25:51,199 OK. I got to go. 1224 01:25:51,200 --> 01:25:56,959 OK. I love you very much, Dad, and put 'er there. 1225 01:25:56,960 --> 01:25:59,719 I love you and I'm so glad to see you again. 1226 01:25:59,720 --> 01:26:01,840 I'll see you, I'll see you, all right. 1227 01:26:45,360 --> 01:26:50,079 Not to jump the gun in any way, but we wanna try to be prepared, 1228 01:26:50,080 --> 01:26:52,519 just in case this goes our way. 1229 01:26:52,520 --> 01:26:57,439 - Which I don't know is going to happen. - I understand. I understand. 1230 01:26:57,440 --> 01:27:01,199 But anyway, so, we've put together about 300,000 worth 1231 01:27:01,200 --> 01:27:05,439 of property - actually a little bit more than that, 1232 01:27:05,440 --> 01:27:09,879 but enough property that will secure a 300,000 bond. 1233 01:27:09,880 --> 01:27:13,239 Kerry has checked into electronic monitoring, 1234 01:27:13,240 --> 01:27:17,639 Joan Miner has agreed to allow you to stay there 1235 01:27:17,640 --> 01:27:20,599 - for as long as you need to. - All right. 1236 01:27:20,600 --> 01:27:23,839 And I need to talk with her to ask her if she's also willing 1237 01:27:23,840 --> 01:27:27,079 to be a third party custodian, which simply means, 1238 01:27:27,080 --> 01:27:33,839 if you don't come home one night, not only would the monitor go off, 1239 01:27:33,840 --> 01:27:38,999 but she would call the sheriff and say, "Hey, he's not here." 1240 01:27:39,000 --> 01:27:41,920 - All right? - What do you think? Seriously? 1241 01:27:43,720 --> 01:27:48,079 I think the same thing I thought before the verdict came in back then. 1242 01:27:48,080 --> 01:27:53,079 - OK. All right. - I mean, what can I say? 1243 01:27:53,080 --> 01:27:56,399 And... We'll finish it today. 1244 01:27:56,400 --> 01:27:59,840 - OK. - All right. Hang in there. 1245 01:28:01,760 --> 01:28:04,280 - Goodbye. - Thank you, David. 1246 01:28:09,440 --> 01:28:14,959 I feel like I'm coming out the other side of a really dark tunnel 1247 01:28:14,960 --> 01:28:19,959 that I've been in with regard to this case, and it's different. 1248 01:28:19,960 --> 01:28:22,160 I don't think anything will ever heal. 1249 01:28:23,320 --> 01:28:29,720 What I felt when that jury came back in October of 2003... 1250 01:28:32,280 --> 01:28:38,519 ..it was as devastating a moment as I've ever had professionally. 1251 01:28:38,520 --> 01:28:40,840 So that won't heal. That won't go away. 1252 01:28:43,000 --> 01:28:50,959 But I do feel like a weight has sort of been lifted a little bit, 1253 01:28:50,960 --> 01:28:53,639 if we get a new trial. 1254 01:28:53,640 --> 01:28:59,320 If we don't get a new trial, I will feel crushed all over again. 1255 01:29:00,760 --> 01:29:04,439 So there's a part of me that's very scared 1256 01:29:04,440 --> 01:29:06,439 about what's going to happen, 1257 01:29:06,440 --> 01:29:09,159 because I don't want to be crushed again. 1258 01:29:09,160 --> 01:29:12,240 The state and this honourable court, please be seated. 1259 01:29:17,080 --> 01:29:21,519 Judge Hudson, what do we know now that we didn't 1260 01:29:21,520 --> 01:29:25,919 and couldn't have known in 2003? 1261 01:29:25,920 --> 01:29:27,999 We know Duane Deaver misled the court 1262 01:29:28,000 --> 01:29:30,799 and the jury about his training and experience. 1263 01:29:30,800 --> 01:29:34,319 That he misled the court and the jury about points of impact, 1264 01:29:34,320 --> 01:29:37,279 that he misled the court and the jury about the experiments. 1265 01:29:37,280 --> 01:29:41,319 That he had a pattern and practice of having a strong bias for the 1266 01:29:41,320 --> 01:29:46,080 state, writing misleading reports and giving misleading testimony. 1267 01:29:47,320 --> 01:29:52,239 You had indicated that you had worked 200 cases 1268 01:29:52,240 --> 01:29:55,880 and that you had been involved in roughly 500 cases. 1269 01:29:57,040 --> 01:29:58,279 Yeah, that was an estimate. 1270 01:29:58,280 --> 01:30:02,919 Let's give Agent Deaver the benefit of the doubt and just put 1271 01:30:02,920 --> 01:30:07,879 aside the 300 he claimed he did, which there's no reports for. 1272 01:30:07,880 --> 01:30:10,600 What about the 200 he claimed he did reports for? 1273 01:30:11,960 --> 01:30:13,160 That was a lie. 1274 01:30:14,240 --> 01:30:16,480 There's no nicer way to say it. 1275 01:30:17,560 --> 01:30:18,919 He lied. 1276 01:30:18,920 --> 01:30:22,919 He only went to 17 scenes total 1277 01:30:22,920 --> 01:30:27,040 and none of those involved a fall. 1278 01:30:28,280 --> 01:30:30,120 Not a single one. 1279 01:30:31,280 --> 01:30:35,199 I have no doubt that a source of blood was out there and that it 1280 01:30:35,200 --> 01:30:39,359 was impacted creating those and that they are not on a surface. 1281 01:30:39,360 --> 01:30:44,239 Mr Deaver brings a sort of new meaning to the phrase "often wrong, 1282 01:30:44,240 --> 01:30:45,320 but never in doubt." 1283 01:30:47,000 --> 01:30:52,759 He testified that way, as the court I'm sure will remember, 1284 01:30:52,760 --> 01:30:54,999 all the way through this trial. 1285 01:30:55,000 --> 01:30:57,159 On and on and on. 1286 01:30:57,160 --> 01:31:01,279 We didn't know at the time that he had left out of all his lab reports 1287 01:31:01,280 --> 01:31:04,919 negative confirmatory results. 1288 01:31:04,920 --> 01:31:08,239 And the reason he didn't put those negative confirmatory tests 1289 01:31:08,240 --> 01:31:11,719 in was because he didn't want the defence to have it, 1290 01:31:11,720 --> 01:31:17,079 because they might "confuse" the jury by pointing out the truth. 1291 01:31:17,080 --> 01:31:19,359 He wasn't just an expert. 1292 01:31:19,360 --> 01:31:24,119 He actually became an advocate for the guilt of the people 1293 01:31:24,120 --> 01:31:26,399 whose cases he worked on. 1294 01:31:26,400 --> 01:31:29,079 He did it in Mr Peterson's case, 1295 01:31:29,080 --> 01:31:34,839 and we know he did it in Greg Taylor's case back in 1991. 1296 01:31:34,840 --> 01:31:36,879 Not only does he do testing that's not 1297 01:31:36,880 --> 01:31:41,839 accepted by anyone in the field, but then with regard to 1298 01:31:41,840 --> 01:31:48,719 one of the critical opinions that he gives, he bases it entirely 1299 01:31:48,720 --> 01:31:51,039 on this testing, 1300 01:31:51,040 --> 01:31:53,959 and testifies to the jury that that's what proves 1301 01:31:53,960 --> 01:31:58,600 Michael Peterson was there in the stairway, hitting Kathleen. 1302 01:32:00,120 --> 01:32:03,959 You relied on these experiments in reaching your opinions, did you not? 1303 01:32:03,960 --> 01:32:05,559 Yes, I did. 1304 01:32:05,560 --> 01:32:08,319 As a matter of fact there were several opinions that you've 1305 01:32:08,320 --> 01:32:11,039 testified to in front of this jury that you wouldn't have 1306 01:32:11,040 --> 01:32:13,400 testified to without those experiments. Correct? 1307 01:32:19,920 --> 01:32:21,239 Uh, yes. 1308 01:32:21,240 --> 01:32:25,599 For example, your opinion about the cause of the spatter inside 1309 01:32:25,600 --> 01:32:27,319 of Mr Peterson's shorts. 1310 01:32:27,320 --> 01:32:28,399 That was an opinion 1311 01:32:28,400 --> 01:32:31,679 you wouldn't have given without the experiments, right? 1312 01:32:31,680 --> 01:32:32,759 Yes. 1313 01:32:32,760 --> 01:32:37,399 It all boils back to his ridiculous experiment, 1314 01:32:37,400 --> 01:32:40,919 and the little victory dance that Susie Barker did 1315 01:32:40,920 --> 01:32:43,520 when he finally was able to get it into his shorts. 1316 01:32:51,280 --> 01:32:56,319 That's the critical testimony that basically says it's a beating 1317 01:32:56,320 --> 01:32:58,839 and Michael Peterson committed it. 1318 01:32:58,840 --> 01:33:01,879 And there is no other evidence in this trial, 1319 01:33:01,880 --> 01:33:05,920 Deborah Radisch included, who could ever say it was Michael Peterson. 1320 01:33:07,720 --> 01:33:10,399 It's not just new evidence, your honour, it violates 1321 01:33:10,400 --> 01:33:13,679 Mr Peterson's constitutional right to due process. 1322 01:33:13,680 --> 01:33:18,559 You have a right not to be tried with fabricated evidence 1323 01:33:18,560 --> 01:33:20,480 and that's what happened in this case. 1324 01:33:21,520 --> 01:33:24,759 I'm therefore going to ask the court at this time, 1325 01:33:24,760 --> 01:33:29,839 as hard as that is, given the length of this trial, 1326 01:33:29,840 --> 01:33:32,399 to grant Michael Peterson a trial 1327 01:33:32,400 --> 01:33:37,079 at which the evidence can be presented in a fair way, 1328 01:33:37,080 --> 01:33:42,480 in an unbiased way, and then let a jury of 12 sort it out. 1329 01:33:43,680 --> 01:33:44,959 Thank you, Your Honour. 1330 01:33:44,960 --> 01:33:47,639 One of the most important things about the criminal justice 1331 01:33:47,640 --> 01:33:50,520 system is the verdict of the jury. 1332 01:33:51,600 --> 01:33:53,879 I would ask the court by looking at the record, 1333 01:33:53,880 --> 01:33:57,039 what is the newly discovered evidence? 1334 01:33:57,040 --> 01:33:59,679 There is no newly discovered evidence. 1335 01:33:59,680 --> 01:34:03,759 The same old, same old, same old thing. 1336 01:34:03,760 --> 01:34:08,079 The defendant must show this court that had they gotten all this 1337 01:34:08,080 --> 01:34:12,239 information, that the jury would have decided differently. 1338 01:34:12,240 --> 01:34:17,039 The blood spatter, the blood patterns, the wiping of the blood 1339 01:34:17,040 --> 01:34:22,559 off the wall, blood drops, spatter on shoes, 1340 01:34:22,560 --> 01:34:25,719 spatter inside of pants. 1341 01:34:25,720 --> 01:34:29,479 When you look at the injuries to her head, 1342 01:34:29,480 --> 01:34:34,799 when you look at how she laid in that stairwell, when you look 1343 01:34:34,800 --> 01:34:41,519 at the sweatpants with a footprint on the back of her leg and when the 1344 01:34:41,520 --> 01:34:45,519 medical examiner testified, based on her training and experience, and now 1345 01:34:45,520 --> 01:34:49,360 she's a chief medical examiner, that this was not an accident. 1346 01:34:50,600 --> 01:34:53,199 How in the world would a jury find it different, 1347 01:34:53,200 --> 01:34:56,239 because Mr Deaver, a reasonable doubt, 1348 01:34:56,240 --> 01:34:59,960 is reason based on common, everyday sense. 1349 01:35:01,560 --> 01:35:06,799 It does not take a rocket scientist to look at Kathleen Peterson, 1350 01:35:06,800 --> 01:35:10,639 the back of her head, the blood every which way, 1351 01:35:10,640 --> 01:35:14,920 way up in the air, on the ceiling and say that that was an accident? 1352 01:35:17,200 --> 01:35:19,079 Judge, I'd ask that you follow the outline 1353 01:35:19,080 --> 01:35:20,519 of North Carolina Supreme Court 1354 01:35:20,520 --> 01:35:23,720 and North Carolina Court of Appeals and uphold this righteous verdict. 1355 01:35:25,360 --> 01:35:26,680 Thank you, Your Honour. 1356 01:35:37,160 --> 01:35:38,759 All right. 1357 01:35:38,760 --> 01:35:44,479 Has Mr Peterson proven that Duane Deaver misled the court 1358 01:35:44,480 --> 01:35:47,839 into allowing him to express certain opinions 1359 01:35:47,840 --> 01:35:49,879 that you put up on the board? 1360 01:35:49,880 --> 01:35:53,000 The answer to that question is yes. 1361 01:35:54,560 --> 01:35:57,999 Has Peterson proven that Duane Deaver misled 1362 01:35:58,000 --> 01:36:02,959 the jury about the validity of certain of his arguments? 1363 01:36:02,960 --> 01:36:05,800 The answer to that question is yes. 1364 01:36:06,800 --> 01:36:11,559 Was Deaver's false and misleading testimony material? 1365 01:36:11,560 --> 01:36:14,440 The answer to that question is yes. 1366 01:36:15,960 --> 01:36:20,839 Is a new trial required for newly discovered evidence, 1367 01:36:20,840 --> 01:36:26,199 due process violations, and for perjured testimony? 1368 01:36:26,200 --> 01:36:29,400 The answer to those questions is yes. 1369 01:36:31,160 --> 01:36:35,320 It will be the court's order that Mr Peterson receive a new trial. 1370 01:36:38,560 --> 01:36:41,160 - About time, ain't it? - It's fine. - Thank you. 1371 01:37:22,680 --> 01:37:24,520 What do you mean "now"? 1372 01:37:29,800 --> 01:37:31,639 It's impossible to say what happened, 1373 01:37:31,640 --> 01:37:34,240 but I know my father didn't kill Kathleen. 1374 01:37:35,360 --> 01:37:38,999 I loved Kathleen more than anything, but he didn't do it. 1375 01:37:39,000 --> 01:37:41,439 He told me and I know it. I believe that in my heart. 1376 01:37:41,440 --> 01:37:42,480 Thanks. 1377 01:37:53,920 --> 01:37:57,080 - Honest to God, thank you so much. - You're welcome. - I appreciate it. 1378 01:37:58,200 --> 01:38:01,800 This was fantastic. I'll be crying a while. 1379 01:38:02,880 --> 01:38:05,960 - Well, Michael. - That was quick. I did not believe that. 1380 01:38:09,760 --> 01:38:12,639 You know I told you when I went to visit you the first time after the 1381 01:38:12,640 --> 01:38:16,320 - verdict how devastated I was by that. - I know. 1382 01:38:17,920 --> 01:38:21,359 You also told me it might be harder on you than me and I told you, "Wait 1383 01:38:21,360 --> 01:38:26,159 a minute, you're leaving in your goddamn BMW and I'm going back..." 1384 01:38:26,160 --> 01:38:28,839 I understand, but having said that, 1385 01:38:28,840 --> 01:38:30,919 this has weighed on me for eight years. 1386 01:38:30,920 --> 01:38:33,879 I know it has. I'm so happy. 1387 01:38:33,880 --> 01:38:36,999 Jesus Christ. Eight years. 1388 01:38:37,000 --> 01:38:39,199 I told your kids, "I'm getting tired of this. 1389 01:38:39,200 --> 01:38:42,559 He gets convicted and you guys cry. 1390 01:38:42,560 --> 01:38:45,079 He gets a new trial and you guys still cry." 1391 01:38:45,080 --> 01:38:47,239 We're a very emotional family. 1392 01:38:47,240 --> 01:38:50,799 Now my goal is to walk you out of this courthouse this afternoon. 1393 01:38:50,800 --> 01:38:53,959 We'll see if we can do that. We'll try. 1394 01:38:53,960 --> 01:38:55,839 Oh god, that would be wonderful. 1395 01:38:55,840 --> 01:38:58,119 We might have to carry you, but we'll do it. 1396 01:38:58,120 --> 01:39:00,319 No, I'm much better now. 1397 01:39:00,320 --> 01:39:03,719 I suspect that some of that was just stress. 1398 01:39:03,720 --> 01:39:05,999 Oh, do you think? 1399 01:39:06,000 --> 01:39:11,239 What, my high blood pressure? Yeah. OK. All right. Thank you. Thank you. 1400 01:39:11,240 --> 01:39:15,000 All right, you can relax now. Enjoy your gourmet lunch. 1401 01:39:16,680 --> 01:39:19,159 - Let's see. - Oh, fuck it. 1402 01:39:19,160 --> 01:39:21,519 All right. We'll see you at 2:30. 1403 01:39:21,520 --> 01:39:25,160 OK? Thank you, David. And you too, Ron. 1404 01:39:37,160 --> 01:39:44,359 I have kept everything inside me for years, and years, and years. 1405 01:39:44,360 --> 01:39:46,160 I think I could go on a roll now. 1406 01:39:47,200 --> 01:39:50,439 And I could cry about Kathleen, and cry about my mother, 1407 01:39:50,440 --> 01:39:52,519 cry about my father. 1408 01:39:52,520 --> 01:39:58,919 I could cry about Margaret and Martha, Clay and Todd. 1409 01:39:58,920 --> 01:40:02,560 Oh, all the things we've all gone through and suffered. 1410 01:40:03,640 --> 01:40:10,880 It was just this ocean of tears inside me, and... oh. 1411 01:40:12,200 --> 01:40:14,759 HE EXHALES 1412 01:40:14,760 --> 01:40:16,840 I don't know, I just want to breathe. 1413 01:40:39,840 --> 01:40:42,759 We went to the gas station today, and Margaret and Martha were 1414 01:40:42,760 --> 01:40:46,720 on the front page of the newspaper, right, but in a good way this time. 1415 01:40:47,720 --> 01:40:51,199 So we had Margaret hold up the newspaper in the middle 1416 01:40:51,200 --> 01:40:52,599 of a public location. 1417 01:40:52,600 --> 01:40:55,479 Like, come on, Margaret, take a photo! 1418 01:40:55,480 --> 01:40:57,439 Something we would have never done before. 1419 01:40:57,440 --> 01:41:00,239 There were a number of people who came up, like the photographer, 1420 01:41:00,240 --> 01:41:01,839 that's like, "I work for a newspaper, 1421 01:41:01,840 --> 01:41:04,679 I'm not allowed to have an opinion, but I'm really happy for you!" 1422 01:41:04,680 --> 01:41:07,199 So many times! 1423 01:41:07,200 --> 01:41:08,559 Just walking around Durham, 1424 01:41:08,560 --> 01:41:11,280 it's like you feel that label of Peterson over your head. 1425 01:41:13,040 --> 01:41:15,599 You're concerned that people look at you a certain way, 1426 01:41:15,600 --> 01:41:18,159 but like for the first time I was like standing up, walking around, 1427 01:41:18,160 --> 01:41:19,919 I was like, "Peterson, yeah!" 1428 01:41:19,920 --> 01:41:21,840 It feels good to be in Durham now. 1429 01:41:23,520 --> 01:41:28,919 We went to the cemetery today. It was beautiful. 1430 01:41:28,920 --> 01:41:32,559 Yeah, it was gorgeous, the beautiful tree, the roses. 1431 01:41:32,560 --> 01:41:34,719 The rose bush, that's great! 1432 01:41:34,720 --> 01:41:36,359 It was really different this time. 1433 01:41:36,360 --> 01:41:39,999 I mean, it was sad, but it was also amazing. 1434 01:41:40,000 --> 01:41:41,120 Yeah, to have that... 1435 01:41:43,280 --> 01:41:46,159 ..because it's so fresh, the memory of her death 1436 01:41:46,160 --> 01:41:48,439 and the funeral, 1437 01:41:48,440 --> 01:41:55,680 but to go there with this new feeling was pretty remarkable. 1438 01:41:56,720 --> 01:41:57,760 Yeah. 1439 01:42:17,840 --> 01:42:18,960 - Nine-86. - Nine-86. 1440 01:43:16,320 --> 01:43:18,359 This one is shut right here. 1441 01:43:18,360 --> 01:43:21,919 - It might be in that bag. - I've got you. 1442 01:43:21,920 --> 01:43:23,719 And a shoe lace for the tennis shoes. 1443 01:43:23,720 --> 01:43:25,960 - Shoe laces are in the bag over there. - OK. 1444 01:45:28,440 --> 01:45:31,479 I've waited over eight years, 1445 01:45:31,480 --> 01:45:34,519 2,988 days, as a matter of fact, 1446 01:45:34,520 --> 01:45:39,159 and I counted, for the opportunity to have a retrial. 1447 01:45:39,160 --> 01:45:44,119 I want to thank Judge Hudson for giving me that opportunity so that 1448 01:45:44,120 --> 01:45:49,400 I can vindicate myself and prove my innocence in a fair trial this time. 1449 01:45:50,480 --> 01:45:53,439 I want to thank all the people who have supported me 1450 01:45:53,440 --> 01:45:55,360 from all over the world. 1451 01:45:58,040 --> 01:46:00,879 It's impossible for me to express my gratitude. 1452 01:46:00,880 --> 01:46:04,559 What I want to do now though is to spend time with my family, 1453 01:46:04,560 --> 01:46:06,719 and with my children, 1454 01:46:06,720 --> 01:46:09,879 and certainly, at a later time, 1455 01:46:09,880 --> 01:46:13,599 I'd be happy to talk with everybody and share more. 1456 01:46:13,600 --> 01:46:15,039 Thank you very, very much. 1457 01:46:15,040 --> 01:46:19,680 Mr Peterson, what's the first thing you plan to do tonight? 1458 01:46:37,840 --> 01:46:40,239 So I'm interested in how much buzzing this, erm...? 1459 01:46:40,240 --> 01:46:42,680 It'll keep you up all night. 1460 01:46:44,440 --> 01:46:46,999 I can honestly say I tried it and the only time it buzzed, 1461 01:46:47,000 --> 01:46:49,239 the transmitter buzzed when I needed to charge it, 1462 01:46:49,240 --> 01:46:50,919 - because I forgot to plug it in. - Oh, OK. 1463 01:46:50,920 --> 01:46:54,199 Mr Peterson, this paperwork pretty much says that this is 1464 01:46:54,200 --> 01:46:57,399 electronic monitoring equipment that belongs to Michael King's company, 1465 01:46:57,400 --> 01:46:58,479 Reliant Monitoring. 1466 01:46:58,480 --> 01:47:00,439 We will make you a copy and make sure... 1467 01:47:00,440 --> 01:47:02,480 - What is today? 12/15? - Today is 12/15. 1468 01:47:09,480 --> 01:47:11,800 I'll be able to finally become a Buddhist! 1469 01:47:16,400 --> 01:47:20,319 - Spoiled already! - Oh, he's a momma's boy. - All right! 1470 01:47:20,320 --> 01:47:22,680 We'll change that. We'll change that. 1471 01:47:27,600 --> 01:47:30,239 You guys both ended up momma's boys too, right? 1472 01:47:30,240 --> 01:47:31,720 Only this guy right here. 1473 01:47:35,440 --> 01:47:37,920 - Well, champagne. - Some champagne. 1474 01:47:44,120 --> 01:47:49,559 I cannot tell you how much I appreciate what you all have done, 1475 01:47:49,560 --> 01:47:54,159 and how long you have fought and stayed by my side. 1476 01:47:54,160 --> 01:47:56,000 So, to you! 1477 01:47:57,960 --> 01:48:03,079 Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, guys. Thank you. 1478 01:48:03,080 --> 01:48:05,839 Thank you, and then a second toast, to the family - 1479 01:48:05,840 --> 01:48:08,799 Margaret, Martha, Clay, everybody else. 1480 01:48:08,800 --> 01:48:10,519 You guys just took this so well. 1481 01:48:10,520 --> 01:48:12,599 You were in there. You were suffering. 1482 01:48:12,600 --> 01:48:14,719 But there's a lot of emotional anguish 1483 01:48:14,720 --> 01:48:16,240 and mental anguish that we had too. 1484 01:48:17,320 --> 01:48:21,639 You guys were just incredible, your emotional spirits never wavered, 1485 01:48:21,640 --> 01:48:23,359 so, cheers to you, guys. 1486 01:48:23,360 --> 01:48:26,559 - La familia! - La familia! 1487 01:48:26,560 --> 01:48:31,040 - Hear, hear! Sante! - Cin cin! - Sante! - Sante! 1488 01:49:03,360 --> 01:49:08,119 I can't share my experience for the last eight years with anybody. 1489 01:49:08,120 --> 01:49:09,679 They wouldn't understand it. 1490 01:49:09,680 --> 01:49:12,399 They have no way of knowing what that means. 1491 01:49:12,400 --> 01:49:15,239 I could say, "Well, I was locked away for eight years 1492 01:49:15,240 --> 01:49:17,239 and I didn't have any privacy or any freedom. 1493 01:49:17,240 --> 01:49:18,959 I was in prison for eight years." 1494 01:49:18,960 --> 01:49:20,679 People could say, "Oh, you were 1495 01:49:20,680 --> 01:49:23,399 in prison for eight years, that must have been terrible!" 1496 01:49:23,400 --> 01:49:25,399 Yeah, it was, 1497 01:49:25,400 --> 01:49:32,839 but you have no real understanding of that, and I can't tell you that. 1498 01:49:32,840 --> 01:49:35,719 No matter what I tell you can make you understand and realize that, 1499 01:49:35,720 --> 01:49:38,279 and so therefore your world 1500 01:49:38,280 --> 01:49:42,760 is very different from everybody else's world. 1501 01:49:44,360 --> 01:49:49,479 I wanted to come back to who I was, but I can't, 1502 01:49:49,480 --> 01:49:56,239 so I'm still working about me in this world out there. 1503 01:49:56,240 --> 01:49:58,639 Then with the realization also, 1504 01:49:58,640 --> 01:50:00,759 "Oh, don't ever forget, Mike, 1505 01:50:00,760 --> 01:50:03,479 they're trying to send you back there." 1506 01:50:03,480 --> 01:50:07,159 "They still think that you're guilty, many of them. 1507 01:50:07,160 --> 01:50:09,519 They want you to go back there for the rest of your life. 1508 01:50:09,520 --> 01:50:11,199 They want you to die in prison." 1509 01:50:11,200 --> 01:50:16,719 So while you're trying to move along, always on your shoulder 1510 01:50:16,720 --> 01:50:20,439 is this heavy burden 1511 01:50:20,440 --> 01:50:23,840 or, in my case, on my foot is a monitoring device. 1512 01:50:25,840 --> 01:50:29,279 - David! - How are you, sir? - Good. Fine, fine, fine. 1513 01:50:29,280 --> 01:50:30,799 Have you shrunk a little? 1514 01:50:30,800 --> 01:50:32,439 I'm still taller than you are, 1515 01:50:32,440 --> 01:50:35,159 I don't care how much I've goddamn shrank! 1516 01:50:35,160 --> 01:50:38,039 - You look better than the last time I saw you. - Well, no kidding. 1517 01:50:38,040 --> 01:50:40,999 If I was any worse, I'd be out there in Maplewood! 1518 01:50:41,000 --> 01:50:43,439 Nothing much is going to happen in your case, no matter 1519 01:50:43,440 --> 01:50:47,639 what, for the rest of this year. 1520 01:50:47,640 --> 01:50:52,839 After that, depending on what the Attorney General's office 1521 01:50:52,840 --> 01:50:55,839 decides, what the Court of Appeals decides, 1522 01:50:55,840 --> 01:51:00,440 we could be back putting it on the docket for trial sometime next year. 1523 01:51:01,920 --> 01:51:06,919 Then of course, the question becomes, do you want to retry this case? 1524 01:51:06,920 --> 01:51:09,479 Or do you want to see 1525 01:51:09,480 --> 01:51:12,479 if some sort of a resolution can be negotiated, 1526 01:51:12,480 --> 01:51:15,479 and there's lot's of different ways to do that. 1527 01:51:15,480 --> 01:51:18,719 There's a no-contest plea, where you simply are saying, 1528 01:51:18,720 --> 01:51:20,599 "I'm not going to contest this". 1529 01:51:20,600 --> 01:51:25,039 There's an Alford plea where you basically say, "I'm pleading 1530 01:51:25,040 --> 01:51:28,399 guilty, but I'm not pleading guilty because I'm guilty, I'm pleading 1531 01:51:28,400 --> 01:51:31,199 guilty because I don't want to go through another trial." 1532 01:51:31,200 --> 01:51:34,239 I know guys in prison who have taken an Alford Plea 1533 01:51:34,240 --> 01:51:38,159 and said, basically, "Fuck it. I don't want to go on any further. 1534 01:51:38,160 --> 01:51:40,479 Let's end this damn thing right now." 1535 01:51:40,480 --> 01:51:43,679 But what that means is, you're guilty. 1536 01:51:43,680 --> 01:51:46,639 - I mean, on the record, you're guilty. - On the record, you're guilty. 1537 01:51:46,640 --> 01:51:48,519 Is there any way to do it, "I'm not guilty, 1538 01:51:48,520 --> 01:51:51,199 I don't care about any money, I don't care about whatever." 1539 01:51:51,200 --> 01:51:53,439 I mean, I'm going to go on with what you say on this. 1540 01:51:53,440 --> 01:51:57,159 Could the DA decide that he's just going to drop it? 1541 01:51:57,160 --> 01:52:00,479 He could, but I don't think he's going to do that. 1542 01:52:00,480 --> 01:52:04,319 So, realistically speaking, the only three options are 1543 01:52:04,320 --> 01:52:08,079 a no-contest plea, Alford plea, or go to trial. 1544 01:52:08,080 --> 01:52:10,279 Even going to trial doesn't guarantee innocence. 1545 01:52:10,280 --> 01:52:11,719 Oh, no, but it gives me an option. 1546 01:52:11,720 --> 01:52:15,439 The other two, there's no option. You're basically guilty. 1547 01:52:15,440 --> 01:52:19,799 You see the whole thing is, I didn't do it, so why would I even do this? 1548 01:52:19,800 --> 01:52:24,480 I think we don't need to discuss that today. 1549 01:52:26,520 --> 01:52:29,799 I mean, this isn't going to be until maybe the middle of next year? 1550 01:52:29,800 --> 01:52:33,759 - At least. - At least? - Nothing's going to happen quickly here. 1551 01:52:33,760 --> 01:52:35,880 Jesus. OK. All right. 1552 01:53:00,560 --> 01:53:03,679 I can remember when I was a very young man, 1553 01:53:03,680 --> 01:53:08,599 I said, "I'm going to live a life with as few regrets as possible." 1554 01:53:08,600 --> 01:53:11,919 And now I'm getting to be a pretty old man. 1555 01:53:11,920 --> 01:53:15,959 And I look back and, oh, Lord, do I have some regrets. 1556 01:53:15,960 --> 01:53:20,239 I wish I'd done that differently. I wish I hadn't done that. 1557 01:53:20,240 --> 01:53:21,760 Yes, it's filled with regrets. 1558 01:53:23,240 --> 01:53:28,840 But in the balance, I've got these wonderful children. 1559 01:53:30,200 --> 01:53:33,719 I had a wonderful relationship with Kathleen. 1560 01:53:33,720 --> 01:53:35,640 I was loved and I loved. 1561 01:53:36,880 --> 01:53:38,639 And I still do. 1562 01:53:38,640 --> 01:53:42,360 And I guess that's about the best you can say about a person. 1563 01:53:44,680 --> 01:53:48,799 Their capacity to love, and mine is infinite. 1564 01:53:48,800 --> 01:53:51,480 Honestly, it gets bigger all the time. 1565 01:53:52,960 --> 01:53:56,800 I can look at my children and think, "Yeah, they love me." 1566 01:53:58,880 --> 01:54:00,240 What else do you want? 1567 01:55:21,920 --> 01:55:24,000 - Did you plant the roses? - No, I didn't. 1568 01:55:30,560 --> 01:55:31,760 - I can get this one. - OK. 1569 01:55:33,400 --> 01:55:34,480 Here. 1570 01:56:10,040 --> 01:56:11,280 Ten years later. 1571 01:56:12,480 --> 01:56:14,080 I know. 1572 01:56:15,080 --> 01:56:16,719 I know. 1573 01:56:16,720 --> 01:56:17,760 Still hurts. 1574 01:56:19,000 --> 01:56:20,079 It'll always hurt. 1575 01:56:20,080 --> 01:56:21,959 It'll never go away, ever. 1576 01:56:21,960 --> 01:56:23,600 No, it never, never goes away. 1577 01:56:26,560 --> 01:56:27,720 You never forget. 1578 01:56:30,520 --> 01:56:32,040 Always pain, always pain. 1579 01:56:39,880 --> 01:56:41,280 Come on, dear, let's go. 1580 01:57:29,040 --> 01:57:31,320 Subtitles by Red Bee Media Ltd 139255

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