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This photo
is taken in the studio,
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and you can see
Michelangelo sitting
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here through this gray glass.
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And this is me.
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It's really funny
because it looks
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as though I'm directing him.
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He was doing his
first film in English.
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His English was not
amazing, and he needed
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somebody to be his ears...
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00:02:13,020 --> 00:02:14,490
his ears with the actors...
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to be able to tell him the
effect of what they would do.
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In '66 I was 27.
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My first movie.
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It's an American movie,
MGM, American budget.
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But the artistic mind behind
it was this particularly
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European mind of.
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We were talking French usually,
and he would explain to me
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often what it was that
he wanted actors to do,
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but sometimes what he
wanted the crew to do.
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00:02:49,490 --> 00:02:52,430
He explained to me once why
he was shooting in London.
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He said, OK, I had this
story I wanted to do.
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The story happens to
concern a photographer.
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So he had to analyze where
would it be interesting to make
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a film about a photographer.
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00:03:03,870 --> 00:03:05,170
He said, well, you
could make it in Rome,
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00:03:05,240 --> 00:03:07,940
but it's been done...
much of it has been done.
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00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:10,410
Seriously considered New York,
but the attraction of London
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was obviously that it
was Swinging London.
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There was a scene, there
was a climate of excitement,
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and interest, and
change, and new work.
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I got a phone call
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from someone who said they were
at Harper's Bazaar in England.
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And Mr. Antonioni
was in town and he'd
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like to watch me take pictures.
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And I thought this is a joke.
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I had seen all his
movies, and at that time,
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Antonioni was god.
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And he came down and he
stood right over here.
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00:04:21,480 --> 00:04:24,250
In 1965 I started
a book shop and art gallery
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00:04:24,320 --> 00:04:28,420
with two friends of mine, Peter
Asher who was part of Peter
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00:04:28,490 --> 00:04:30,360
and Gordon, a rock
and roll group,
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00:04:30,460 --> 00:04:32,600
and my friend John
Dunbar who was the art
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critic for "The Scotsman."
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We found premises
in Mason's Yard
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for the gallery and bookshop.
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00:04:50,340 --> 00:04:56,210
Mason's Yard is a small
piazza just off of Piccadilly.
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That was where the
Scotch of St. James
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was located, which
was at that point
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00:05:00,150 --> 00:05:04,050
the sort of cool rock and
roll aristocracy nightclub
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00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:07,360
where The Stones, and
The Beatles, and The Who,
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00:05:07,460 --> 00:05:11,560
and everybody used to meet.
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00:05:11,670 --> 00:05:13,410
Nothing
like modern discos.
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00:05:13,500 --> 00:05:15,640
It only held 150 people.
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00:05:15,700 --> 00:05:18,040
It was the size of a
VIP bar in modern disco,
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00:05:18,140 --> 00:05:19,880
and it was just a VIP bar.
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00:05:19,970 --> 00:05:21,870
You were looked at
through a keyhole.
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00:05:21,980 --> 00:05:24,580
You had to be well-known,
you had to be known to them.
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00:05:24,680 --> 00:05:26,550
But I was in there
one night and there
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00:05:26,650 --> 00:05:30,650
was a little slim Italian man
getting a lot of attention,
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00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:31,990
and I didn't recognize him.
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I wondered who he was.
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He didn't look like a rock star.
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00:05:34,420 --> 00:05:36,420
And Kit Lambert said,
well, that's Antonioni,
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00:05:36,520 --> 00:05:37,590
the famous director.
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00:05:37,690 --> 00:05:39,260
He's come to make
a film in London,
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and he wants The Who to perform
in it and smash their guitars.
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00:05:43,000 --> 00:05:45,440
And I was very jealous,
and I wanted my group,
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00:05:45,530 --> 00:05:46,430
The Others to be in it.
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00:05:46,530 --> 00:05:48,400
But I couldn't tell Kit that.
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00:05:48,500 --> 00:05:50,600
So I wanted to go up and talk
to him, and said Kit, Kit...
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00:05:50,700 --> 00:05:51,770
no, no, no.
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00:05:51,870 --> 00:05:53,240
He's... I'm... My
group's doing the part.
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00:05:53,340 --> 00:05:56,440
I'm going to see him
tomorrow at the Savoy Hotel.
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00:05:56,540 --> 00:05:58,580
So I told Kit don't
be a pushover.
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00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:00,720
I said demand
5,000 pounds or say
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00:06:00,780 --> 00:06:02,450
you want control of the edit.
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00:06:02,550 --> 00:06:04,790
And I knew Antonioni
would throw him out.
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00:06:09,260 --> 00:06:12,900
One of the people
who Antonioni knew in Britain
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00:06:12,960 --> 00:06:16,860
when he came over here was
Robert Fraser who brought over
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00:06:16,930 --> 00:06:20,130
a lot of pop art from America...
that Andy Warhol he showed,
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00:06:20,230 --> 00:06:24,870
for instance, and British
pop artists like Peter Blake,
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and Hamilton, and
all of those people.
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00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:31,080
At Fraser's place he first met
Paul McCartney, for instance,
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00:06:31,150 --> 00:06:33,650
who was a good friend
of Robert's, as were
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00:06:33,750 --> 00:06:36,950
the other Beatles and Stones.
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00:06:37,050 --> 00:06:41,260
Antonioni and McCartney
got on extremely well,
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00:06:41,320 --> 00:06:44,990
and Paul invited Antonioni
over to his house
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00:06:45,090 --> 00:06:46,290
and showed him his home movies.
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Antonioni was the
most exciting person to meet,
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00:06:53,770 --> 00:06:57,170
because he had
made "L'Avventura,"
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00:06:57,270 --> 00:07:02,680
and "L'Avventura" was the film
that changed my mind complete,
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00:07:02,780 --> 00:07:06,420
or actually introduced
me to cinema.
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00:07:06,480 --> 00:07:10,280
I remember him coming
to my family house
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in Belgravia in London,
which was a very sort
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00:07:13,950 --> 00:07:17,650
of dead, dull place.
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00:07:17,760 --> 00:07:21,760
I think he must have been
brought there with
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probably because
we were the only
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Bohemian family in Belgravia.
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00:07:29,600 --> 00:07:32,500
So when he came, we
were all very excited.
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00:07:32,610 --> 00:07:36,480
We spoke Italian, and then
became a friend of his...
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00:07:36,540 --> 00:07:40,850
so did my brother... and we
went about in London with him.
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00:07:45,620 --> 00:07:51,130
I think he was very, very
much taken by the excitement
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00:07:51,190 --> 00:07:53,390
about London... that
there was about London,
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00:07:53,490 --> 00:07:55,230
and that was going on in London.
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00:07:55,330 --> 00:08:01,740
And he's interested in fashion,
in the clothes, in the customs,
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00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:07,310
in the everything that was
considered to be liberating.
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00:08:12,350 --> 00:08:14,750
This was the first
time that young people had
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00:08:14,850 --> 00:08:17,550
any money, and they didn't have
enough money, obviously, to buy
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00:08:17,650 --> 00:08:21,020
cars or to buy houses or
a mortgage or something,
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00:08:21,090 --> 00:08:26,760
but they had enough money
to buy records and clothes.
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00:08:26,860 --> 00:08:28,930
And there were
young people doing...
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starting little boutiques.
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00:08:30,900 --> 00:08:34,270
And the two key ones for
the London Underground, one
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00:08:34,370 --> 00:08:37,110
was Michael Rainey's
"Hung On You."
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00:08:37,200 --> 00:08:40,440
"Granny Takes a Trip,"
which of course is
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00:08:40,540 --> 00:08:42,340
famously
in the book address,
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which was used in "Blow-Up."
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Because they didn't just make
clothes for young people.
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00:08:48,280 --> 00:08:50,420
They also specialized
in vintage clothes.
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00:08:53,550 --> 00:08:56,050
It was
color, bringing color,
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00:08:56,120 --> 00:08:59,590
color to this foggy nation.
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00:08:59,690 --> 00:09:05,560
The fashion photographers
were doing that in a sense,
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00:09:05,630 --> 00:09:08,130
and so it wasn't
just superficial,
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00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:11,940
it was also quite
revolutionary in a way.
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00:09:16,780 --> 00:09:19,880
As a specialist
in the history of photography,
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00:09:19,950 --> 00:09:24,150
as somebody who's passionately
curious about the whole story
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00:09:24,250 --> 00:09:31,160
of the London scene in the '60s,
photography is the dominant
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00:09:31,260 --> 00:09:34,260
thread for me, and has been
a dominant thread through
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00:09:34,330 --> 00:09:36,970
my investigation of "Blow-Up."
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00:09:37,060 --> 00:09:41,800
I've always wanted
to find out more...
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00:09:41,900 --> 00:09:43,670
who were the
influences, who made
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00:09:43,770 --> 00:09:45,470
the pictures used in the film.
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00:09:45,570 --> 00:09:49,740
And I was thrilled to know
that the photographer who one
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00:09:49,810 --> 00:09:53,350
sees in the opening
credits from behind,
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00:09:53,450 --> 00:09:55,290
it was David Montgomery.
136
00:10:02,860 --> 00:10:05,700
Some
people called me up and said,
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00:10:05,790 --> 00:10:11,200
Mr. Antonioni would like you
to come down and photograph
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00:10:11,300 --> 00:10:13,970
while the film's going on.
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00:10:14,030 --> 00:10:17,700
Comes the big day and
I take my assistant,
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00:10:17,800 --> 00:10:21,700
and we go to Brixton Market.
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00:10:21,810 --> 00:10:24,610
And all these big
movie cameras around,
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00:10:24,680 --> 00:10:29,820
and hustling, and facing
this way, that way.
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00:10:29,880 --> 00:10:34,990
One of the men says, OK,
you set up your camera here,
144
00:10:35,060 --> 00:10:40,470
and Donyale Luna, who was
the beautiful black model,
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00:10:40,530 --> 00:10:43,570
was standing on top
of a little hut.
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00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:48,740
So I'm shooting
and I'm shooting,
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and I stop because
I've run out of film.
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We open up the camera and
we're taking the film out,
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and all of a sudden
they come running over
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and say, what are you doing?
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00:11:00,410 --> 00:11:01,980
What are you doing?
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00:11:02,050 --> 00:11:04,750
I said, I'm changing film.
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00:11:04,850 --> 00:11:06,890
I've run out of film.
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00:11:06,990 --> 00:11:09,090
And they said, you
don't need film.
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00:11:09,190 --> 00:11:10,320
This is a movie.
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It's make believe.
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00:11:12,030 --> 00:11:14,230
I said, not make believe to me.
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I'm a photographer.
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I'm not an actor.
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I can't make believe
I'm taking pictures.
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00:11:34,210 --> 00:11:35,340
Actually, I don't
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know how I got in
because I didn't
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00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:38,120
phone the production company.
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00:11:38,220 --> 00:11:39,860
I just called the Savoy
and somehow got through
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00:11:39,920 --> 00:11:41,460
to his suite and said
I was the manager
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00:11:41,560 --> 00:11:43,560
of The Yardbirds, who
were the second biggest
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00:11:43,620 --> 00:11:46,220
group in the world.
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00:11:46,290 --> 00:11:48,460
And I went very prepared
with lots of reviews
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00:11:48,560 --> 00:11:50,530
and photographs and things.
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00:11:50,600 --> 00:11:52,740
And I told him I'd
heard from Kit Lambert
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00:11:52,800 --> 00:11:54,740
that they hadn't
got on very well.
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00:11:54,800 --> 00:11:57,700
And I said to him that actually
this smashing equipment, which
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00:11:57,770 --> 00:12:01,970
he was very keen to see, really
wasn't The Who that started it.
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00:12:02,080 --> 00:12:03,550
I said it was the
Yardbirds who started it
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and The Who copied them.
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00:12:10,250 --> 00:12:12,320
And I said Jeff Beck
always smashes...
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00:12:12,420 --> 00:12:14,090
or he used to smash his guitar.
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00:12:14,150 --> 00:12:15,650
He's marvelous at it.
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00:12:15,760 --> 00:12:19,100
And anyway, I don't how I think
Antonioni just got on with me.
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00:12:19,160 --> 00:12:20,830
We clicked quite well.
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I think he probably
knew I was lying,
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but I think he liked that too.
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00:12:24,730 --> 00:12:27,070
And so he said, OK,
they can come and do it.
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00:12:32,410 --> 00:12:35,980
"We had to play a film to
change the sets at The Hampstead
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00:12:36,080 --> 00:12:38,520
Theatre between
the various scenes
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00:12:38,610 --> 00:12:41,650
in "Adventures in
the Skin Trade."
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00:12:41,750 --> 00:12:44,120
The shooting had to be
done for next to nothing,
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00:12:44,180 --> 00:12:48,250
but I was happy to do it in
a surrealist or irrealist
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00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:51,520
mode in the old black and
white and silent manner.
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00:12:51,630 --> 00:12:55,700
So there I was when a mysterious
and beautiful woman I knew
191
00:12:55,800 --> 00:13:00,970
called Clare came in with a
handsome elder Italian saying
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00:13:01,030 --> 00:13:04,200
that they were
looking for locations.
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00:13:04,300 --> 00:13:07,840
And then I went upstairs to
discover that Clare was with
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00:13:07,940 --> 00:13:13,280
Michelangelo Antonioni who
was about to film "Blow-Up,"
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00:13:13,350 --> 00:13:15,950
which would turn out
to be the definitive
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00:13:16,020 --> 00:13:19,560
statement of how
young life in London
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00:13:19,650 --> 00:13:21,150
appeared to be right then."
198
00:13:27,660 --> 00:13:31,330
David Hemmings at the
time was absolutely broke,
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00:13:31,400 --> 00:13:33,040
and we hired him.
200
00:13:33,130 --> 00:13:35,300
We first wanted to
hire Terence Stamp,
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00:13:35,370 --> 00:13:39,470
but Terence Stamp didn't
like the play too much,
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00:13:39,540 --> 00:13:42,710
and he knew he
was actually being
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00:13:42,810 --> 00:13:44,650
thought of to do.
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00:13:44,710 --> 00:13:49,250
But Hemmings was number
two to Stamp at the time.
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00:13:49,350 --> 00:13:53,720
He had a spotty acting
career, but he was
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00:13:53,820 --> 00:13:56,320
available and absolutely broke.
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00:13:56,390 --> 00:14:01,760
So he came to stay with me in
my river house in Limehouse,
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00:14:01,860 --> 00:14:03,360
and he had nothing.
209
00:14:03,430 --> 00:14:07,400
So we negotiated for 20 pounds
a week was all he was getting.
210
00:14:11,540 --> 00:14:15,040
I took him to
Limehouse in the East end
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00:14:15,110 --> 00:14:20,020
on the docks... that part in
London which was still a port,
212
00:14:20,080 --> 00:14:24,920
still functioning as port, where
writer Andrew Sinclair lived,
213
00:14:25,020 --> 00:14:28,120
and he was working
with David Hemmings,
214
00:14:28,220 --> 00:14:31,290
and I went to the
play with Antonioni.
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00:14:39,300 --> 00:14:42,770
I saw that he had this
energy, and what a capacity
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00:14:42,870 --> 00:14:46,110
to sort of follow
Antonioni rules,
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00:14:46,210 --> 00:14:48,450
which was saying very little.
218
00:14:48,540 --> 00:14:51,580
And being used in a way,
you're used as a tool.
219
00:14:51,650 --> 00:14:55,420
And at the same time
he had this quickness
220
00:14:55,480 --> 00:14:59,250
and sharpness which was very...
221
00:14:59,320 --> 00:15:00,760
right for the part.
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00:15:00,820 --> 00:15:02,320
Hemmings is marvelous.
223
00:15:02,420 --> 00:15:05,090
It's probably his greatest
performance as the young Dylan
224
00:15:05,160 --> 00:15:07,330
Thomas... quite extraordinary.
225
00:15:07,430 --> 00:15:09,900
Energetic, reckless
and ,
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00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:12,130
he was perfect for "Blow-Up."
227
00:15:12,230 --> 00:15:15,270
So instead of 20
pounds a week, he
228
00:15:15,340 --> 00:15:18,980
left us for the set of
"Blow-Up"... of course,
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00:15:19,070 --> 00:15:20,770
Stamp had been fired.
230
00:15:20,840 --> 00:15:25,010
He had taken the
role on 7,500 a week
231
00:15:25,110 --> 00:15:28,150
in a Rolls Royce white coupe.
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00:15:28,250 --> 00:15:31,820
It was the biggest translation
of fortunes I've ever seen.
233
00:15:36,490 --> 00:15:38,690
He was called Thomas
in the "Blow-Up,"
234
00:15:38,790 --> 00:15:41,990
the great photographer
hero David Hemmings.
235
00:15:42,100 --> 00:15:46,040
Because, of course, that is
how Antonioni.
236
00:15:46,130 --> 00:15:48,370
From "Adventures
in the Skin Trade,"
237
00:15:48,470 --> 00:15:50,770
he took out Dylan Thomas.
238
00:15:59,480 --> 00:16:02,880
The photographer
studio was, at that time
239
00:16:02,980 --> 00:16:09,020
in '66, a very sort of
emblematic place because
240
00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:13,390
of Bailey, and your fashion
scene, and King's Road,
241
00:16:13,490 --> 00:16:15,790
and miniskirts.
242
00:16:15,860 --> 00:16:18,800
It was somehow
culturally central.
243
00:16:23,570 --> 00:16:26,970
Antonioni
was meticulous in researching
244
00:16:27,040 --> 00:16:32,350
to create a real authenticity
around his character,
245
00:16:32,410 --> 00:16:36,910
around the details of how
he lived, how a shoot works.
246
00:16:37,020 --> 00:16:43,860
It's underpinned with a lot
of accurate, minute detailing.
247
00:16:47,160 --> 00:16:50,760
Antonioni
asked Frances Windham,
248
00:16:50,860 --> 00:16:54,900
who was an extremely talented
writer of "The Sunday Times,"
249
00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:58,940
he wanted to compose a
kind of questionnaire.
250
00:16:59,040 --> 00:17:03,940
And so what he had was
data about the behavior,
251
00:17:04,040 --> 00:17:06,740
the choices made
by photographers,
252
00:17:06,850 --> 00:17:09,520
their lifestyle, their
attitudes to women,
253
00:17:09,580 --> 00:17:11,280
and to sex, and so on.
254
00:17:16,560 --> 00:17:18,130
Among
the various photographers
255
00:17:18,220 --> 00:17:21,290
that he visited, of course
was David Montgomery.
256
00:17:21,390 --> 00:17:25,630
So what I learnt in that moment
was that the actor who had
257
00:17:25,730 --> 00:17:29,300
played the part of David
Hemmings' assistant actually
258
00:17:29,400 --> 00:17:30,640
wasn't an actor at all.
259
00:17:36,380 --> 00:17:41,390
Reg was David
Montgomery's assistant.
260
00:17:41,450 --> 00:17:44,590
And Antonioni felt no
need to change his name.
261
00:17:52,230 --> 00:17:53,400
This is good.
262
00:17:53,460 --> 00:17:54,960
This is the Hendrix nudes.
263
00:17:59,600 --> 00:18:08,440
This was 1966... a long time ago.
264
00:18:08,510 --> 00:18:11,780
I was doing a shooting
for Harper's Bazaar,
265
00:18:11,850 --> 00:18:15,350
and Mr. Antonioni came down.
266
00:18:15,450 --> 00:18:19,860
I did a photograph of these
girls wrapped in plastic.
267
00:18:19,950 --> 00:18:24,520
We didn't talk much,
and he ended up using...
268
00:18:24,620 --> 00:18:27,290
I think all the girls
that were in the shooting,
269
00:18:27,360 --> 00:18:29,100
they were in the movie as well.
270
00:18:32,930 --> 00:18:37,370
There were three models, one
called Melanie Hampshire,
271
00:18:37,470 --> 00:18:40,340
and another one
called Peggy Moffitt,
272
00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:44,640
and she was the
first Rudi Gernreich
273
00:18:44,710 --> 00:18:49,280
model for the topless
bikini for women.
274
00:18:49,350 --> 00:18:52,850
And then another one
called Jill Kennington
275
00:18:52,950 --> 00:18:57,520
was just one of those
people that could move.
276
00:18:57,620 --> 00:18:59,490
She had natural grace.
277
00:19:06,730 --> 00:19:07,960
The curious thing
278
00:19:08,030 --> 00:19:10,830
was that we weren't
going to be filming
279
00:19:10,900 --> 00:19:12,170
in Shepperton or anything else.
280
00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:17,050
It was actually taking
place in this studio,
281
00:19:17,140 --> 00:19:19,380
which was John Khan's studio.
282
00:19:19,480 --> 00:19:22,250
And I lived here
for a few years.
283
00:19:26,350 --> 00:19:28,250
The
studio, John Kahn's studio,
284
00:19:28,350 --> 00:19:32,490
is in a part of London which
was then quite shabby, quite
285
00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:34,700
scruffy, an area
where you could rent
286
00:19:34,760 --> 00:19:37,900
a big space, not crazy money.
287
00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:44,370
Today it's become so grand
and so expensive, that area.
288
00:19:44,440 --> 00:19:48,410
The studio is at
39 Prince's Place.
289
00:19:48,510 --> 00:19:51,110
If you go to 39
Prince's Place today,
290
00:19:51,210 --> 00:19:55,450
you will be confused because
the facade will not correspond
291
00:19:55,550 --> 00:19:58,290
to what you know from the film.
292
00:19:58,380 --> 00:20:01,750
You have to go around the
corner to Pottery Lane
293
00:20:01,850 --> 00:20:06,620
to find the facade, so
the exterior shots were
294
00:20:06,730 --> 00:20:09,030
made in this nearby street.
295
00:20:16,740 --> 00:20:19,140
When John agreed to
rent the studio out
296
00:20:19,240 --> 00:20:23,810
to Antonioni as the principal
set, he lived in a caravan
297
00:20:23,910 --> 00:20:25,310
in the street outside.
298
00:20:25,410 --> 00:20:27,650
And I gather that
Antonioni would
299
00:20:27,750 --> 00:20:29,890
probably have
preferred that he'd
300
00:20:29,950 --> 00:20:31,820
moved a little further away.
301
00:20:50,470 --> 00:20:51,740
As
far as I remember,
302
00:20:51,800 --> 00:20:54,640
the actual shoot
took about a week.
303
00:20:54,740 --> 00:20:57,180
And it was so out
of character for me
304
00:20:57,280 --> 00:21:02,850
to be what ended up by
being the role of us five
305
00:21:02,950 --> 00:21:07,790
girls being completely
dumb, and stupid,
306
00:21:07,850 --> 00:21:11,090
and very immobile as well.
307
00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:15,460
You know, rather than the usual
animation that I was used to.
308
00:21:18,330 --> 00:21:21,270
He obviously knew exactly
what he wanted from us,
309
00:21:21,330 --> 00:21:27,140
and that was like a tableau,
and he wanted the David Hemmings
310
00:21:27,210 --> 00:21:30,350
character to be
very sort of alive,
311
00:21:30,440 --> 00:21:33,210
and for some reason quite rude.
312
00:21:33,310 --> 00:21:35,780
But he wanted us to
be quite inanimate,
313
00:21:35,850 --> 00:21:38,020
so I couldn't move very much.
314
00:21:38,120 --> 00:21:41,660
I remember feeling
quite restricted.
315
00:21:49,060 --> 00:21:51,230
Jill was one
of the absolute top London
316
00:21:51,330 --> 00:21:53,530
models of the '60s.
317
00:21:53,630 --> 00:21:57,370
John Cowan, with whom she
had that close relationship,
318
00:21:57,470 --> 00:22:01,570
was absolutely at
the top of the game.
319
00:22:01,670 --> 00:22:05,670
He was one of the key
photographers defining what
320
00:22:05,750 --> 00:22:07,750
we know as Swinging London.
321
00:22:07,850 --> 00:22:10,690
But setting that new mood...
322
00:22:10,750 --> 00:22:14,890
energetic, dynamic,
youthful... he was intensely
323
00:22:14,990 --> 00:22:17,260
creative in the early '60s.
324
00:22:17,360 --> 00:22:21,030
They were a golden
couple of a golden moment
325
00:22:21,090 --> 00:22:24,560
in British cultural history.
326
00:22:24,660 --> 00:22:27,100
But for different
reasons they didn't
327
00:22:27,200 --> 00:22:29,170
stay in the
spotlight in the way,
328
00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:33,580
for instance, David Bailey
and Jean Shrimpton stayed
329
00:22:33,670 --> 00:22:36,540
in the spotlight and have
maintained that that presence
330
00:22:36,610 --> 00:22:38,010
as reputations ever since.
331
00:22:41,050 --> 00:22:43,450
We have to remember,
a lot of his great,
332
00:22:43,550 --> 00:22:47,250
great photographs were
made for newsprint,
333
00:22:47,350 --> 00:22:49,420
as opposed to magazines.
334
00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:53,920
He was working for the Sunday
papers and the daily papers,
335
00:22:54,030 --> 00:22:58,470
and one realizes that he made
some of his finest pictures,
336
00:22:58,560 --> 00:23:01,400
destined to have a
life span of one day.
337
00:23:01,470 --> 00:23:02,740
The
interesting thing
338
00:23:02,800 --> 00:23:08,470
is that he kept the
essence of this studio
339
00:23:08,570 --> 00:23:11,470
as it was when John
had it, because he
340
00:23:11,580 --> 00:23:16,390
had such huge great blow ups,
particularly of me, many of me.
341
00:23:16,450 --> 00:23:17,820
So it was interesting.
342
00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:20,820
He did want to show the
energy in those photographs
343
00:23:20,920 --> 00:23:22,560
and have it in the set as well.
344
00:23:22,620 --> 00:23:24,320
So that was good.
345
00:23:24,420 --> 00:23:25,490
I liked that.
346
00:23:28,830 --> 00:23:32,230
Bailey's work was not
what the film was about,
347
00:23:32,300 --> 00:23:37,440
but his character, as in what
David Hemmings was inspired by,
348
00:23:37,500 --> 00:23:41,000
I think possibly came
a lot from Bailey.
349
00:23:41,110 --> 00:23:46,450
But the energy came from
John Cowan, for sure.
350
00:23:46,510 --> 00:23:52,920
The shooting with Veruschka
and David was pure John Cowan.
351
00:23:52,990 --> 00:23:55,260
I mean I'd worked
with him like that.
352
00:23:55,320 --> 00:23:59,020
Sadly, it wasn't when
Antonioni was watching us.
353
00:23:59,130 --> 00:24:00,870
But that didn't matter.
354
00:24:00,960 --> 00:24:06,030
Veruschka was perfect for that
role, and I think completely...
355
00:24:06,130 --> 00:24:08,800
John used to often get up
a step ladder, for example,
356
00:24:08,870 --> 00:24:12,110
and film from the floor,
or the other way up.
357
00:24:12,170 --> 00:24:13,310
You're lying on glass.
358
00:24:13,370 --> 00:24:15,770
I mean he was just
very innovative.
359
00:24:57,650 --> 00:25:00,890
It's changed dimension.
360
00:25:00,990 --> 00:25:02,560
I think it used
to be a lot wider.
361
00:25:07,260 --> 00:25:10,030
The things that
used to happen here,
362
00:25:10,100 --> 00:25:13,600
and I used to live
here for a while.
363
00:25:13,700 --> 00:25:14,400
It's great.
364
00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:28,750
Oh, I feel as if I know
every bit of the floor
365
00:25:28,850 --> 00:25:33,790
as well, where we did
photographs and the filming,
366
00:25:33,890 --> 00:25:34,560
of course.
367
00:25:45,900 --> 00:25:47,770
This used to be
a fabulous space,
368
00:25:47,870 --> 00:25:50,370
and I think when Antonioni
found here, he just
369
00:25:50,440 --> 00:25:54,880
thought it was the bee's
knees, because you could get
370
00:25:54,940 --> 00:25:59,980
a whole film crew in here, and
you could shoot from the top,
371
00:26:00,080 --> 00:26:03,050
which made it very interesting.
372
00:26:03,120 --> 00:26:04,820
And I guess the
Veruschka picture
373
00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:05,890
must have been from here.
374
00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:18,800
I wonder what's
going to happen next.
375
00:26:18,900 --> 00:26:22,340
It's a piece of history, though,
this film being made here.
376
00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:26,180
I didn't realize at
the time that film
377
00:26:26,270 --> 00:26:27,940
would be so significant...
378
00:26:28,010 --> 00:26:32,510
you know, sort of bird's
eye view into London life.
379
00:26:32,610 --> 00:26:34,780
Some of it was
exaggerated, of course.
380
00:26:34,850 --> 00:26:38,920
Well, that's a
director's privilege.
381
00:26:38,990 --> 00:26:42,830
And I never knew what
was in Antonioni head.
382
00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:46,520
He was quite a sort
of philosophical man,
383
00:26:46,630 --> 00:26:47,330
and very quiet.
384
00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:19,460
The most
composed secrets of all
385
00:27:19,530 --> 00:27:23,130
is the models in the
reflective glass,
386
00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:26,040
because it's a key
sequence that embodies
387
00:27:26,130 --> 00:27:30,870
the meaning of the film of
just a man with a camera who's
388
00:27:30,970 --> 00:27:33,870
playing with images, visions.
389
00:27:33,970 --> 00:27:36,410
These are visions that
he's able to control.
390
00:27:36,510 --> 00:27:38,350
And of course, what happens
then is that's something
391
00:27:38,410 --> 00:27:40,350
that he can't control.
392
00:27:40,410 --> 00:27:46,850
The fastidiousness of his vision
was very clear in the studio.
393
00:27:49,760 --> 00:27:51,660
When we came to do
set up, everybody
394
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:55,560
had to leave the studio,
and Michelangelo would be
395
00:27:55,660 --> 00:27:57,430
in there with the viewfinder.
396
00:27:57,530 --> 00:28:00,870
And he would be working
out what would happen next,
397
00:28:00,930 --> 00:28:02,500
and then he would call
DePalma,
398
00:28:02,570 --> 00:28:04,170
their cameraman, called
the first assistant,
399
00:28:04,240 --> 00:28:07,340
and then he'd call for
the actors, and me,
400
00:28:07,410 --> 00:28:10,610
and they would then
work it out, because he
401
00:28:10,710 --> 00:28:16,580
would design the set up very
slowly, with great care.
402
00:28:24,290 --> 00:28:28,690
The scene with the girls and
the paper, the nude scene,
403
00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:32,400
was, of course, different
again, because there was
404
00:28:32,470 --> 00:28:34,270
the fact that they were naked...
405
00:28:34,370 --> 00:28:36,740
that's difficult, and you have
to close the set and so on.
406
00:28:36,800 --> 00:28:40,700
And the fact also that it
was completely unrehearsed.
407
00:28:40,770 --> 00:28:43,470
You couldn't possibly
rehearse that scene.
408
00:28:43,580 --> 00:28:46,080
So it was just a romp in paper.
409
00:28:50,750 --> 00:28:52,790
I loved that sequence
because that he's
410
00:28:52,890 --> 00:28:56,230
using the paper, which is
part of the photographer's
411
00:28:56,290 --> 00:28:59,730
tool of a photographer that you
see him pulling down the paper,
412
00:28:59,790 --> 00:29:02,160
you know, when he's working
he's changing the sheets.
413
00:29:02,260 --> 00:29:06,560
And here it's used
with wit and style.
414
00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:27,680
My husband
Pierre Rouve was, indeed,
415
00:29:27,790 --> 00:29:30,290
the executive
producer on "Blow-Up,"
416
00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:34,960
working for Bridge Films, which
is, of course, the English
417
00:29:35,030 --> 00:29:39,030
version of Ponti, Carlo Ponti.
418
00:29:39,130 --> 00:29:42,200
One evening... I think I
was drawing the blinds here
419
00:29:42,300 --> 00:29:45,540
in the sitting room, and noticed
that Antonioni in his car
420
00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:49,040
was parked outside on the
other side of the road.
421
00:29:49,140 --> 00:29:53,010
I imagined that Pierre had
invited to come for supper,
422
00:29:53,110 --> 00:29:55,480
but had forgotten
to tell me, and had
423
00:29:55,550 --> 00:29:57,720
forgotten to come back home.
424
00:29:57,820 --> 00:30:02,220
And so I telephoned him and
I said, as far as I can see,
425
00:30:02,320 --> 00:30:06,220
Antonioni's actually sitting
in his car outside the house,
426
00:30:06,330 --> 00:30:10,070
but he doesn't seem to want
to come into the house.
427
00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:12,330
He said, don't do anything.
428
00:30:12,400 --> 00:30:15,800
He's actually a
very, very shy person
429
00:30:15,870 --> 00:30:20,540
and would find it very difficult
to make casual conversation.
430
00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:25,810
So I waited, he waited, and
finally Pierre came home.
431
00:30:28,350 --> 00:30:30,920
He was also working
as a lecturer,
432
00:30:31,020 --> 00:30:36,430
and that meant that he had the
opportunity to invite Antonioni
433
00:30:36,520 --> 00:30:39,090
to visit the Chelsea
School of Art
434
00:30:39,190 --> 00:30:44,530
where Antonioni would have been
introduced to Ian Stephenson
435
00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:46,900
and seen his work, originally.
436
00:30:51,540 --> 00:30:53,180
And over
here, of course, this
437
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:58,610
is the painting which appears in
the film, and is talked about.
438
00:30:58,710 --> 00:31:02,880
This motif is based on a
Greek classical sculpture.
439
00:31:02,950 --> 00:31:05,050
When described by
David Hemmings,
440
00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:07,360
the artist turned into
a leg in the film,
441
00:31:07,420 --> 00:31:09,020
but it doesn't make
any difference.
442
00:31:09,090 --> 00:31:11,430
In fact, that's more
magical than if they
443
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:12,520
actually described it.
444
00:31:15,790 --> 00:31:17,760
He didn't fit in anywhere.
445
00:31:17,860 --> 00:31:19,960
He wasn't a pot
painter, he wasn't
446
00:31:20,070 --> 00:31:22,440
an American style colorist.
447
00:31:22,530 --> 00:31:25,470
He was just making these
extraordinary artworks of
448
00:31:25,570 --> 00:31:28,070
all different colored paints.
449
00:31:28,140 --> 00:31:30,910
In a way he suffered for
that, because he's never
450
00:31:30,980 --> 00:31:33,120
in big exhibitions
very often because they
451
00:31:33,210 --> 00:31:34,610
don't know where to put him.
452
00:31:39,590 --> 00:31:42,730
Antonioni could
have been introduced to a range
453
00:31:42,790 --> 00:31:46,560
of artists who,
it might be felt,
454
00:31:46,630 --> 00:31:53,070
represented the spirit of London
at that point in the mid-'60s.
455
00:31:53,130 --> 00:31:55,900
Stephenson is an
interesting choice.
456
00:31:55,970 --> 00:32:00,640
He's somebody who deconstructs
the process of vision
457
00:32:00,740 --> 00:32:03,780
and representation itself.
458
00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:06,280
When
Antonioni came to the studio,
459
00:32:06,350 --> 00:32:11,690
Ian had on his perfectly clean
white t-shirt, beautiful jeans,
460
00:32:11,780 --> 00:32:15,750
hair all combed, and had the
conversations with Antonioni,
461
00:32:15,820 --> 00:32:17,360
and then they went away.
462
00:32:17,460 --> 00:32:22,030
And eventually when Ian was
on the set at some point,
463
00:32:22,130 --> 00:32:26,030
the artist in the film appeared
in a pair of blue jeans
464
00:32:26,130 --> 00:32:28,600
and a very white t-shirt
and his hair all combed,
465
00:32:28,670 --> 00:32:31,140
and Ian must have said to
them, well, I don't look
466
00:32:31,200 --> 00:32:32,540
like that when I'm painting.
467
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:38,710
And someone must
have just taken a paint brush
468
00:32:38,810 --> 00:32:42,180
and made three or four marks on
the white t-shirt, completely
469
00:32:42,280 --> 00:32:45,550
arbitrary, nothing to do with
anything like Ian's dots.
470
00:32:50,820 --> 00:32:52,720
Assheton Gorton, the
production designer,
471
00:32:52,830 --> 00:32:55,570
came to Ian in the studio
to select some things
472
00:32:55,660 --> 00:32:58,400
to be on the set,
and took virtually
473
00:32:58,500 --> 00:33:00,400
everything out of the studio.
474
00:33:00,500 --> 00:33:06,240
The plaster cast, all the
pots of paints, some easels,
475
00:33:06,340 --> 00:33:08,240
I think there was a
chair, actually... just
476
00:33:08,340 --> 00:33:13,180
sort of in-studio contents
disappeared into a van
477
00:33:13,250 --> 00:33:15,250
and were away for
quite a long time.
478
00:33:15,350 --> 00:33:18,250
So he couldn't actually get
on with what he was doing.
479
00:33:25,360 --> 00:33:26,930
I heard
a lot about Pierre
480
00:33:27,030 --> 00:33:30,000
needing to get up terribly
early in the morning
481
00:33:30,060 --> 00:33:33,030
and having to go down to
Stockwell to make sure
482
00:33:33,100 --> 00:33:35,700
that the right amount
of houses were painted
483
00:33:35,770 --> 00:33:38,710
the right color of red,
because Antonioni would
484
00:33:38,770 --> 00:33:41,440
never have had the wrong red.
485
00:33:41,540 --> 00:33:44,540
It had to be the right
thing, the perfect thing.
486
00:33:48,380 --> 00:33:51,780
Antonioni was
very fortunate in having
487
00:33:51,880 --> 00:33:54,280
an excellent
production designer,
488
00:33:54,390 --> 00:33:56,790
a man called
Assheton Gorton, who
489
00:33:56,890 --> 00:34:02,030
was very sensitive to
locations in London.
490
00:34:02,090 --> 00:34:05,960
So we begin with the Economist
Building, an extremely
491
00:34:06,070 --> 00:34:08,770
modern architecture in London.
492
00:34:32,390 --> 00:34:36,460
What Assheton Gorton did was
to find a shop, and stuff that
493
00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:40,230
full of this kind of debris.
494
00:34:40,300 --> 00:34:46,240
So that we see, if you like,
the relics of an imperial past.
495
00:34:46,310 --> 00:34:47,950
We know that they're
not sympathetic
496
00:34:48,010 --> 00:34:49,980
to the young photographer.
497
00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:53,650
On the other hand, he
seizes upon the propeller.
498
00:34:56,120 --> 00:35:01,790
It's true of Antonioni's
spirit, an ambivalent object.
499
00:35:01,850 --> 00:35:04,850
It's a relic, it's antiquated.
500
00:35:04,960 --> 00:35:08,360
On the other hand, it's
about the era of modernity.
501
00:35:13,970 --> 00:35:18,470
But the main thing he
did was to find the park,
502
00:35:18,540 --> 00:35:20,980
and the park was like a little...
503
00:35:21,040 --> 00:35:23,710
a little theatre.
504
00:35:23,810 --> 00:35:26,710
He wanted a stage set.
505
00:35:26,810 --> 00:35:31,620
It was a park, a London park,
but it felt a compacted space.
506
00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:44,230
When we
arrived outside the park,
507
00:35:44,330 --> 00:35:47,500
by this antique shop, one
could see that the road
508
00:35:47,570 --> 00:35:49,540
was sort of a particular color.
509
00:35:49,640 --> 00:35:53,910
And I learned that they had,
in fact, painted the road.
510
00:35:54,010 --> 00:35:56,850
And this was the
first experience
511
00:35:56,910 --> 00:36:00,050
of the degree of
control of color
512
00:36:00,150 --> 00:36:02,990
that Michelangelo had
developed, from this
513
00:36:03,050 --> 00:36:07,420
where he's so
particular about the color.
514
00:36:07,520 --> 00:36:08,520
It's an art.
515
00:36:08,590 --> 00:36:09,720
It's like painting with color.
516
00:36:44,390 --> 00:36:47,460
As very young and not
experienced in cinema,
517
00:36:47,560 --> 00:36:50,930
I didn't quite understand
why the sun was shining
518
00:36:51,030 --> 00:36:52,570
and we didn't shoot.
519
00:36:52,630 --> 00:36:55,770
And he explained to me
that I need the cloud.
520
00:36:55,870 --> 00:36:58,940
It has to be very English,
it has to be gloomy.
521
00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:01,980
This was another aspect
of the precision, the
522
00:37:02,070 --> 00:37:05,440
artistic precision of his eye.
523
00:38:16,320 --> 00:38:19,120
It
was in '94 or '95
524
00:38:19,180 --> 00:38:23,220
I think that I had the
extreme good fortune
525
00:38:23,320 --> 00:38:28,890
to find the original blow-ups
that feature in the film,
526
00:38:28,990 --> 00:38:30,390
or at least a number of them.
527
00:38:30,500 --> 00:38:33,870
Just over 20 of the original
blow-ups with the drawing
528
00:38:33,970 --> 00:38:36,740
pin holes, where Hemmings
pinned them to the beam
529
00:38:36,840 --> 00:38:37,540
or to the wall.
530
00:38:46,080 --> 00:38:53,420
20 of these photographs made in
the park showing the couple...
531
00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:56,320
is it a gun in the
bushes, is it a body?
532
00:38:56,390 --> 00:39:01,060
That picture story where Thomas,
the photographer, thinks he's
533
00:39:01,160 --> 00:39:02,560
stumbled on a murder.
534
00:39:02,660 --> 00:39:05,160
The evidence, the
evidential pictures.
535
00:39:12,570 --> 00:39:15,740
At first it was a mystery as
to who had actually taken them.
536
00:39:15,840 --> 00:39:18,910
Somehow... I forget how
the connection was made...
537
00:39:19,010 --> 00:39:21,350
I learnt that it
was Don McCullin.
538
00:39:21,410 --> 00:39:25,180
Don McCullin who is such
an illustrious reputation
539
00:39:25,250 --> 00:39:31,790
in the history, known for his
really powerful war reportage.
540
00:39:31,890 --> 00:39:36,130
He was a great photojournalist
covering the great conflicts
541
00:39:36,230 --> 00:39:38,870
of his time.
542
00:39:38,930 --> 00:39:41,400
Antonioni had
asked Arthur Evans,
543
00:39:41,470 --> 00:39:43,810
the onset photographer
for "Blow-Up,"
544
00:39:43,900 --> 00:39:50,870
to take some pictures in a
park, which he did, but Arthur
545
00:39:50,940 --> 00:39:54,310
Evans didn't get them right.
546
00:39:54,410 --> 00:39:57,280
They were too clear, too crisp...
547
00:39:57,380 --> 00:39:59,950
... too
professional in a sense.
548
00:40:00,050 --> 00:40:03,950
And Antonioni realized he
needed something more gritty,
549
00:40:04,060 --> 00:40:07,130
some... when you blew
it up would soon
550
00:40:07,230 --> 00:40:09,730
become this pattern of green.
551
00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:12,000
And through
connections, possibly
552
00:40:12,100 --> 00:40:15,670
through Frances Wyndham, because
both Frances Wyndham and Don
553
00:40:15,770 --> 00:40:18,240
McCullin were working
on "The Sunday Times,"
554
00:40:18,300 --> 00:40:20,470
he was introduced
to Don McCullin
555
00:40:20,570 --> 00:40:24,070
and saw the gritty
style of photography
556
00:40:24,140 --> 00:40:28,750
that he was associated with, and
he became the man for the job.
557
00:40:42,360 --> 00:40:45,460
Most crucial, there is a
body at the end of the line.
558
00:40:47,970 --> 00:40:51,440
Now, McCullin had been,
earlier in the 1960s,
559
00:40:51,500 --> 00:40:55,770
in Cyprus, in other
theaters of conflict
560
00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:58,680
where he had
photographed bodies.
561
00:41:05,020 --> 00:41:07,560
Ian
was invited onto the set
562
00:41:07,650 --> 00:41:12,560
to actually drop some paint
on some of the blank canvases.
563
00:41:12,660 --> 00:41:15,900
And there was a bit of floom
with his hand doing it.
564
00:41:15,990 --> 00:41:19,560
It did show that was how it
was put onto the canvas...
565
00:41:19,660 --> 00:41:23,130
dropped and moved
around and counted.
566
00:41:23,200 --> 00:41:25,840
Antonioni did ask
Ian about trying
567
00:41:25,900 --> 00:41:31,070
to relate the image on the
canvas to the photographs.
568
00:41:31,180 --> 00:41:32,520
And Ian didn't copy them.
569
00:41:32,580 --> 00:41:34,080
He couldn't have copied them.
570
00:41:34,180 --> 00:41:38,320
But he did make some movement
on the surface of the paintings
571
00:41:38,380 --> 00:41:41,180
which represented
the more abstracted
572
00:41:41,250 --> 00:41:46,760
forms on the blow-up
version of the photograph.
573
00:41:46,860 --> 00:41:51,770
Antonioni wanted
to double back on his own film
574
00:41:51,860 --> 00:41:56,430
by having it mirrored in
a painting by Stephenson.
575
00:41:56,540 --> 00:42:01,410
And so he requests that a
painting be made from one
576
00:42:01,510 --> 00:42:06,220
of the stills that Don
McCullin had provided... these,
577
00:42:06,280 --> 00:42:08,950
which have such
extraordinarily highly
578
00:42:09,050 --> 00:42:11,120
charged atmospheres to them.
579
00:42:11,220 --> 00:42:14,790
Because they show the
disappearance of form
580
00:42:14,890 --> 00:42:18,960
in foliage and undergrowth,
then for Stephenson
581
00:42:19,060 --> 00:42:24,400
to then step up to that
and show forms disappearing
582
00:42:24,460 --> 00:42:26,800
in paint as painted marks.
583
00:42:39,240 --> 00:42:41,740
Don McCullin
was the name attached
584
00:42:41,810 --> 00:42:44,280
to the blow-ups
made in the park,
585
00:42:44,380 --> 00:42:50,120
but Don McCullin is the name
attached to the pictures which
586
00:42:50,220 --> 00:42:53,090
Thomas, the photographer,
shows to his agent in the scene
587
00:42:53,160 --> 00:42:56,000
in the restaurant
where they're looking
588
00:42:56,090 --> 00:43:00,130
at the maquette of a book
which he hopes to publish.
589
00:43:00,230 --> 00:43:02,070
And these pictures
are the... they're
590
00:43:02,130 --> 00:43:07,000
the absolute opposite of his
his high fashion pictures.
591
00:43:07,110 --> 00:43:10,250
They're his photographs
of tramps, down and outs,
592
00:43:10,310 --> 00:43:11,580
people in the east
end of London,
593
00:43:11,640 --> 00:43:14,280
the poor, the underbelly
of the dark side,
594
00:43:14,350 --> 00:43:18,620
this glamorous city that people
talk about as Swinging London.
595
00:43:26,290 --> 00:43:28,190
Peter Bowles
had quite an important part
596
00:43:28,290 --> 00:43:30,690
as the agent of Hemmings.
597
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:34,040
And unfortunately,
on one key day
598
00:43:34,130 --> 00:43:37,700
was very upset because
Michelangelo had cut
599
00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:43,170
quite a long speech, which
is central to the meaning
600
00:43:43,270 --> 00:43:44,310
of the film, really.
601
00:43:44,380 --> 00:43:46,650
And so he was
saying to the peers,
602
00:43:46,710 --> 00:43:48,810
surely this is very important.
603
00:43:48,880 --> 00:43:50,950
You know, surely
I should say this.
604
00:43:51,020 --> 00:43:55,060
And Peter has written very
interestingly about how
605
00:43:55,150 --> 00:43:59,690
Michelangelo said, I'll tell
you why we have to cut it,
606
00:43:59,790 --> 00:44:02,960
that's because it says
what the film's about,
607
00:44:03,030 --> 00:44:06,830
and I prefer people not to be
told what the film's about.
608
00:44:09,500 --> 00:44:13,370
The technique of getting
the actors to do what it was
609
00:44:13,470 --> 00:44:17,710
that he wanted was slightly
different with different actors
610
00:44:17,810 --> 00:44:18,840
in different sequences.
611
00:44:26,150 --> 00:44:28,390
The arrival of Vanessa
Redgrave was very interesting
612
00:44:28,490 --> 00:44:32,160
because she hadn't been part
of the film up till that time,
613
00:44:32,220 --> 00:44:38,190
and she was very intelligent
in working on Antinuromy.
614
00:44:38,260 --> 00:44:42,760
She was proactive
in talking to him
615
00:44:42,870 --> 00:44:48,910
and tried to suck out from him
what it was that he wanted.
616
00:44:49,010 --> 00:44:51,880
And you could see the
intensity of her concentration,
617
00:44:51,940 --> 00:44:55,210
because on the page the
character is nothing.
618
00:44:55,280 --> 00:44:57,720
So she couldn't
prepare this character.
619
00:45:02,790 --> 00:45:05,230
She's a Shakespearean
actress, and she
620
00:45:05,290 --> 00:45:07,190
withdrew all of her
Shakespearean technique
621
00:45:07,260 --> 00:45:13,200
out, and simply existed in front
of the camera in the situation
622
00:45:13,260 --> 00:45:18,030
intensely, vividly, and
had this close relationship
623
00:45:18,100 --> 00:45:20,970
with Antonioni.
624
00:45:21,070 --> 00:45:24,570
Sarah Miles had a...
not a very big part.
625
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:30,110
And I think maybe that was
a bit of a issue for her.
626
00:45:30,220 --> 00:45:32,220
I think also she
didn't get on well
627
00:45:32,280 --> 00:45:33,750
with Michelangelo Antonioni.
628
00:45:33,820 --> 00:45:38,790
So things didn't go very well,
and then she got annoyed.
629
00:45:38,890 --> 00:45:40,830
I think she got angry.
630
00:45:40,930 --> 00:45:43,230
The relationship with
Sarah was an example
631
00:45:43,290 --> 00:45:44,490
of one that did not work.
632
00:45:44,600 --> 00:45:46,770
The relationship with
Vanessa did work.
633
00:45:50,100 --> 00:45:52,470
With David, it was different.
634
00:45:52,570 --> 00:45:53,970
He was not technical.
635
00:45:54,070 --> 00:45:56,470
He would kind of,
I think, give him
636
00:45:56,570 --> 00:45:59,110
guidelines and get
him to improvise,
637
00:45:59,180 --> 00:46:01,350
to feel free and be natural.
638
00:46:05,020 --> 00:46:07,360
One of the most interesting
things about the film for me
639
00:46:07,450 --> 00:46:13,460
was working with David Hemmings,
because he was enormous fun.
640
00:46:13,530 --> 00:46:17,870
And he had a Jeep.
641
00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:20,160
I think that he had
bought the Jeep in order
642
00:46:20,270 --> 00:46:23,510
to hire it to the film.
643
00:46:23,600 --> 00:46:25,040
I don't know how much
they paid him per week,
644
00:46:25,140 --> 00:46:30,610
but it was a very
clever idea on his part.
645
00:46:30,680 --> 00:46:34,550
We borrowed the Jeep one
night and went camping, David
646
00:46:34,650 --> 00:46:38,550
and his girlfriend and I. We
found a tent, took the Jeep,
647
00:46:38,650 --> 00:46:41,850
drove out of London,
slept in the forest,
648
00:46:41,950 --> 00:46:44,120
and drove back in for
filming the next day.
649
00:46:44,190 --> 00:46:46,360
He shouldn't have been allowed
to take the Jeep because it's
650
00:46:46,460 --> 00:46:48,500
a prop on the film.
651
00:46:48,560 --> 00:46:51,830
He also occasionally
borrowed the Rolls Royce.
652
00:46:51,900 --> 00:46:54,070
He took me and a
girlfriend in the Rolls
653
00:46:54,170 --> 00:46:58,580
Royce up and down
the King's Road.
654
00:46:58,670 --> 00:47:01,710
David was always keen
to have a good time.
655
00:47:01,810 --> 00:47:05,810
Jeep, Rolls Royce, girls,
friend, a good time.
656
00:47:13,850 --> 00:47:15,380
The
filming actually took place
657
00:47:15,490 --> 00:47:19,360
in the Elstree MGM Studios,
which was a great big cabin
658
00:47:19,420 --> 00:47:22,160
of studios, and you walk
into this huge studio,
659
00:47:22,230 --> 00:47:24,430
there in one little corner
right over there that
660
00:47:24,530 --> 00:47:27,370
just is a nightclub set up.
661
00:47:27,430 --> 00:47:29,370
Because the whole place is cold.
662
00:47:29,430 --> 00:47:30,730
They don't have
heating in there.
663
00:47:30,840 --> 00:47:33,540
So to create an atmosphere
of warmth and smoke
664
00:47:33,610 --> 00:47:37,180
and all that is really
very, very difficult.
665
00:47:37,240 --> 00:47:40,610
I have recently bought a
second guitar to the group.
666
00:47:40,710 --> 00:47:42,380
The base player had left.
667
00:47:42,450 --> 00:47:46,020
And Jeff was very keen for Jimmy
Page to come in and play base.
668
00:47:46,080 --> 00:47:49,450
And I told Jeff, I don't
mind, but he won't play base.
669
00:47:49,550 --> 00:47:50,920
I promise you.
670
00:47:51,020 --> 00:47:53,790
After one day he'll say no,
I want to play guitar too.
671
00:47:53,890 --> 00:47:56,730
And I explained to Jeff that
he had to smash his guitar.
672
00:47:56,790 --> 00:47:58,630
He just refused at point blank.
673
00:47:58,730 --> 00:48:00,200
Jeff never smashed a guitar.
674
00:48:00,270 --> 00:48:01,100
He loves his guitar.
675
00:48:01,200 --> 00:48:02,100
They're his children.
676
00:48:02,200 --> 00:48:04,140
He nurses them, he strokes them.
677
00:48:04,240 --> 00:48:07,640
He couldn't believe I was
asking him to smash his guitar.
678
00:48:07,740 --> 00:48:09,140
But eventually he did agree.
679
00:48:09,240 --> 00:48:11,980
We bought a second guitar
from a cheap guitar.
680
00:48:12,080 --> 00:48:13,820
And I said, we're not
going to smash the guitar.
681
00:48:13,910 --> 00:48:15,140
You just push it
through the amp.
682
00:48:15,250 --> 00:48:17,650
You break the amp,
but with your guitar.
683
00:48:17,750 --> 00:48:19,320
And he tried a few
times in rehearsal
684
00:48:19,420 --> 00:48:21,890
and it went quite well,
because the amp broke
685
00:48:21,950 --> 00:48:23,950
without the guitar breaking.
686
00:48:24,060 --> 00:48:26,960
And then at the filming,
he really got into it.
687
00:48:27,060 --> 00:48:30,130
He didn't really get into
it, but Antonioni called
688
00:48:30,230 --> 00:48:31,230
him out in front of everybody.
689
00:48:31,300 --> 00:48:32,470
He said, Jeff, come on.
690
00:48:32,560 --> 00:48:33,730
We've got to do it.
691
00:48:33,800 --> 00:48:35,270
There was a crowd there,
the people filming,
692
00:48:35,330 --> 00:48:37,930
and people wanted to go to
lunch and it was Take 38.
693
00:48:38,000 --> 00:48:40,170
So finally, Jeff didn't really
get angry with the guitar,
694
00:48:40,270 --> 00:48:43,110
he got angry at Antonioni,
and he took his anger
695
00:48:43,170 --> 00:48:44,240
and smashes the amp.
696
00:48:44,310 --> 00:48:45,010
Ah, cut.
697
00:48:45,110 --> 00:48:45,780
Lovely.
698
00:48:45,840 --> 00:48:46,740
Off to lunch.
699
00:48:50,480 --> 00:48:51,850
People often talk
as if Yardbirds
700
00:48:51,950 --> 00:48:53,850
was some great influence
from Antonioni,
701
00:48:53,950 --> 00:48:56,950
but it's completely the other
way around, because Antonioni
702
00:48:57,020 --> 00:48:58,490
sort of broke up the Yardbirds.
703
00:48:58,590 --> 00:49:00,590
Therefore, may have been
instrumental in creating
704
00:49:00,660 --> 00:49:01,800
Led Zeppelin.
705
00:49:01,860 --> 00:49:03,860
So we can put Antonioni
into rock history.
706
00:49:23,350 --> 00:49:25,620
I had a contract
for a certain length of time,
707
00:49:25,680 --> 00:49:28,550
and then I had to
leave the film.
708
00:49:28,650 --> 00:49:30,390
And the film overran...
709
00:49:30,490 --> 00:49:32,390
several weeks over.
710
00:49:32,490 --> 00:49:35,560
I didn't know everything,
and the script is not
711
00:49:35,660 --> 00:49:38,000
a complete record of the film.
712
00:49:38,060 --> 00:49:40,800
There's stuff in the film
which is not in the script,
713
00:49:40,870 --> 00:49:44,240
and the ending is absolutely
one of those things.
714
00:49:44,340 --> 00:49:48,910
So when I saw at the
screening, I saw the ending,
715
00:49:49,010 --> 00:49:50,710
I was quite astonished.
716
00:49:53,880 --> 00:49:57,080
I don't personally
think it's the best
717
00:49:57,180 --> 00:49:58,920
possible ending for that film.
718
00:49:59,020 --> 00:50:01,590
Perhaps there could have
been another ending.
719
00:50:01,690 --> 00:50:03,390
But there's wonderful
things in the film,
720
00:50:03,490 --> 00:50:04,990
and it was a
wonderful experience,
721
00:50:05,060 --> 00:50:11,430
and it was also a very vivid
picture of London at that time.
722
00:50:11,530 --> 00:50:13,030
And the fact that
it's by an Italian
723
00:50:13,100 --> 00:50:14,870
makes it even more interesting.
724
00:51:35,510 --> 00:51:37,250
Once
I'd finished the film,
725
00:51:37,320 --> 00:51:39,790
I sort of was onto
the next thing,
726
00:51:39,850 --> 00:51:43,120
and I did have a very
exciting working life.
727
00:51:43,190 --> 00:51:45,190
And I'd sort of put it to bed.
728
00:51:45,290 --> 00:51:47,660
But you know these
things, if they're good,
729
00:51:47,760 --> 00:51:49,360
they don't go away.
730
00:51:49,460 --> 00:51:51,260
And it's still here.
731
00:51:51,330 --> 00:51:52,430
Still here.
732
00:51:52,500 --> 00:51:55,500
Still being seen and
being appreciated.
733
00:51:55,600 --> 00:51:59,200
So I just think back
and think what a lucky...
734
00:51:59,300 --> 00:52:03,100
lucky I didn't say no,
actually, because I nearly did.
735
00:52:03,170 --> 00:52:05,010
Because I thought I'm
not a stupid model.
736
00:52:05,110 --> 00:52:07,480
I don't want to
portray a stupid model.
737
00:52:07,550 --> 00:52:08,680
But there we go.
738
00:52:08,780 --> 00:52:10,980
Look at it.
739
00:52:11,050 --> 00:52:12,390
And yeah, very proud of it.
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