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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:07,240 --> 00:00:09,240 When my son was murdered, 2 00:00:09,240 --> 00:00:12,160 the police thought, "Just another Black boy stabbed." 3 00:00:12,160 --> 00:00:14,240 You're telling me that there's nothing you can do, 4 00:00:14,240 --> 00:00:15,560 and I don't accept that. 5 00:00:15,560 --> 00:00:20,720 What the hell is Operation Fishpool? This is all one case. 6 00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:23,840 I'd like to take on the Stephen Lawrence murder. 7 00:00:23,840 --> 00:00:25,680 This is not a whodunnit. We know who done it, 8 00:00:25,680 --> 00:00:28,440 and yet no-one has been held to account for young Stephen's murder. 9 00:00:28,440 --> 00:00:31,640 His body was covered in bruises and abrasions 10 00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:33,120 from being kicked and punched. 11 00:00:33,120 --> 00:00:36,560 There were two stab wounds. No, overarm, like you're bowling. 12 00:00:36,560 --> 00:00:37,920 Well, there's a pattern. 13 00:00:37,920 --> 00:00:39,160 He's a decent witness, 14 00:00:39,160 --> 00:00:41,360 delays in following 'em up, and changes of heart. 15 00:00:41,360 --> 00:00:43,120 What kind of evidence? 16 00:00:43,120 --> 00:00:47,720 These were found on Dobson's jacket, and these on Norris' trousers. 17 00:00:47,720 --> 00:00:50,960 Microscopically indistinguishable from Stephen's polo shirt. 18 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:52,960 You realise this is the first physical evidence 19 00:00:52,960 --> 00:00:54,720 linking any of the suspects with Stephen? 20 00:00:54,720 --> 00:00:58,200 Mistakes were made, but this is my case now, so will you trust me? 21 00:00:58,200 --> 00:01:00,200 Trust has to be earned. 22 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:04,720 He told me not to tell nobody, but it's all here. 23 00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:07,520 What? Same old Met. 24 00:01:26,520 --> 00:01:29,640 DOREEN: A dream has come true here today. 25 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:32,000 This building will be a nurturing space, 26 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:35,600 but it will also be a space of high expectation. 27 00:01:36,800 --> 00:01:40,640 We still have an uphill battle against the low expectations 28 00:01:40,640 --> 00:01:43,040 society has for Black children. 29 00:01:43,040 --> 00:01:48,440 So this will be a space where we see your gifts and expect excellence. 30 00:01:48,440 --> 00:01:53,160 And when I see the work you young people are already achieving, 31 00:01:53,160 --> 00:01:57,480 your creativity and ambition, that, to me, 32 00:01:57,480 --> 00:02:03,560 is the best way we can remember and celebrate Stephen. 33 00:02:03,560 --> 00:02:05,160 APPLAUSE 34 00:02:10,600 --> 00:02:12,680 Thank you for coming. 35 00:02:18,880 --> 00:02:21,320 SHOUTING OUTSIDE, GLASS SMASHING 36 00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:29,600 Come on! 37 00:02:33,920 --> 00:02:36,800 I've called the insurance company already. 38 00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:40,600 Mr Driscoll. 39 00:02:40,600 --> 00:02:44,000 I take it you're not here about the broken glass. 40 00:02:44,000 --> 00:02:47,440 What happened? This is not the first time. 41 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:51,200 Some people don't like what we're trying to do. So? 42 00:02:52,960 --> 00:02:55,000 Er, I wanted to straighten things out. 43 00:02:55,000 --> 00:02:56,880 The business with the newspapers. 44 00:02:56,880 --> 00:02:59,360 I'm confident the leak didn't come from my team. 45 00:03:01,000 --> 00:03:04,960 Oh, I got some doughnuts. Thought maybe... 46 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:09,040 I'm glad you're confident, but I'm not, 47 00:03:09,040 --> 00:03:11,960 because to me, this is the same old Met, 48 00:03:11,960 --> 00:03:14,720 so concerned with publicity that you'll jeopardise 49 00:03:14,720 --> 00:03:16,360 the investigation for a good headline. 50 00:03:16,360 --> 00:03:19,400 Mrs Lawrence, I was as furious as you were when I read the headlines, 51 00:03:19,400 --> 00:03:20,920 the story... 52 00:03:22,040 --> 00:03:24,960 Do something for me. Read these. 53 00:03:26,920 --> 00:03:28,960 Out loud. 54 00:03:31,320 --> 00:03:34,160 "If you don't like this country, get in your canoe 55 00:03:34,160 --> 00:03:36,520 "and go back to where you came from." 56 00:03:36,520 --> 00:03:38,800 I mean... No, go on. 57 00:03:38,800 --> 00:03:42,080 "You ungrateful Black bitch." Look, this is a hate crime. 58 00:03:42,080 --> 00:03:45,400 I get this rubbish every time Stephen's in the paper. 59 00:03:45,400 --> 00:03:47,040 I made the choice to fight for my son, 60 00:03:47,040 --> 00:03:50,840 rather than keeping my mouth shut, and I pay a price for that, 61 00:03:50,840 --> 00:03:54,080 but I resent paying for the Met's publicity stunts. 62 00:03:55,480 --> 00:03:58,040 I know we haven't done much to inspire your confidence 63 00:03:58,040 --> 00:04:00,840 over the years, but this is my case now. 64 00:04:00,840 --> 00:04:04,680 We've got a real chance here. The forensics are promising. 65 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:08,680 But if there are people in the Met working against you, 66 00:04:08,680 --> 00:04:09,880 you have a problem. 67 00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:15,320 You need to ask yourself why there are people in your organisation 68 00:04:15,320 --> 00:04:17,120 who don't want you to succeed. 69 00:04:26,280 --> 00:04:30,600 Birdy. Did we, er, get the statement from the witnesses? 70 00:04:31,920 --> 00:04:33,400 SLAMS DOOR 71 00:04:35,760 --> 00:04:38,600 This is one of the most sensitive investigations 72 00:04:38,600 --> 00:04:42,920 on the Met's books, and we can't even get a door that closes. 73 00:04:42,920 --> 00:04:45,000 I've been on to estates. 74 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:47,120 We wanna nail this case, don't we? 75 00:04:47,120 --> 00:04:50,040 Right, well, there are people out there who don't want us to nail it, 76 00:04:50,040 --> 00:04:52,880 people out there who don't want us to succeed where they failed, 77 00:04:52,880 --> 00:04:56,160 people who want to make excuses, blame the victims. 78 00:04:56,160 --> 00:04:58,760 Well, I can't do anything about those people, but I tell you, 79 00:04:58,760 --> 00:05:02,120 if I find out anyone in this office has been leaking stuff to the press, 80 00:05:02,120 --> 00:05:04,880 I will deal with them... thoroughly. 81 00:05:06,480 --> 00:05:09,280 From now on, no paperwork left lying around. 82 00:05:10,280 --> 00:05:11,480 We're all accountable. 83 00:05:13,600 --> 00:05:15,360 DOOR SLAMS 84 00:05:32,720 --> 00:05:35,200 They were all as gutted as we were, Clive. 85 00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:39,240 Incoming forensic reports, you and me only. Keep 'em in the safe. 86 00:05:39,240 --> 00:05:41,840 Anyone else, as and when required. 87 00:05:48,360 --> 00:05:51,360 They closed Rolan's school, 88 00:05:51,360 --> 00:05:54,800 and asked if we wanted the memorial plaque before they knocked it down. 89 00:05:57,960 --> 00:06:00,080 How you keep going? 90 00:06:01,360 --> 00:06:03,200 It's a life sentence, Neville. 91 00:06:04,520 --> 00:06:06,080 I've accepted that. 92 00:06:07,960 --> 00:06:13,960 All I can do is try to make my anger... productive, 93 00:06:13,960 --> 00:06:16,440 use it to bring about change. 94 00:06:16,440 --> 00:06:19,720 But it changed me, you know? That's the problem. 95 00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:24,160 It's stolen my memories. I... 96 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:29,840 I can't see Stephen's smile, I can't hear his laugh 97 00:06:29,840 --> 00:06:35,000 without thinking about the killers and feeling so much hatred. 98 00:06:36,560 --> 00:06:41,520 I pray so hard for the strength to forgive. 99 00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:44,760 Forgiveness? Huh! 100 00:06:44,760 --> 00:06:48,760 I mean... have they shown any remorse? 101 00:06:48,760 --> 00:06:53,120 No. No. That's the problem. 102 00:06:53,120 --> 00:06:55,200 Then it's not your problem. 103 00:06:55,200 --> 00:06:59,600 Forgiveness... is not yours to give. 104 00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:04,960 They have to ask. They have to atone. 105 00:07:04,960 --> 00:07:06,720 Without that... HE CLICKS HIS TONGUE 106 00:07:08,480 --> 00:07:10,480 ..dangerous, man. 107 00:07:13,160 --> 00:07:16,480 How you mean? Lets the country off the hook, man. 108 00:07:16,480 --> 00:07:21,160 Lets people think that, that we can do without justice, 109 00:07:21,160 --> 00:07:22,600 without accountability. 110 00:07:25,360 --> 00:07:27,160 When Rolan was killed... 111 00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:36,920 ..the BNP called his murderers "heroes of the white race". 112 00:07:36,920 --> 00:07:39,040 I remember that. Right. 113 00:07:40,280 --> 00:07:45,400 But when we protested, it was us they called extremists. 114 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:52,280 It was our children that the police harassed, and not the racists. 115 00:07:52,280 --> 00:07:55,480 And now, now they want us to forgive and move on, 116 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:58,640 so that they can carry on and pretend that all is well in England. 117 00:07:58,640 --> 00:08:00,600 No. Uh-uh. 118 00:08:02,520 --> 00:08:06,000 When England finally gets angry 119 00:08:06,000 --> 00:08:10,760 about Black children being lynched in the streets, 120 00:08:10,760 --> 00:08:14,760 when the police and the government say enough is enough, 121 00:08:14,760 --> 00:08:17,120 maybe then I will let go my anger. 122 00:08:19,880 --> 00:08:22,120 But until we have real change... 123 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:28,640 ..I'm not gonna cheapen my son's life... 124 00:08:32,000 --> 00:08:33,920 ..with forgiveness. 125 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:38,520 Uh-uh. 126 00:08:42,280 --> 00:08:45,480 I've made contact with most of the coppers from the scene that night, 127 00:08:45,480 --> 00:08:49,800 mostly retired now, and mostly none too thrilled to hear from me. 128 00:08:49,800 --> 00:08:53,560 What about Duwayne Brooks? He wants nothing to do with us. 129 00:08:53,560 --> 00:08:55,600 But I was sort of thinking, do we really need him? 130 00:08:55,600 --> 00:08:58,240 I mean, this case is gonna rest on the forensics, yeah? 131 00:08:58,240 --> 00:09:00,160 Forensics are slippery eels. 132 00:09:00,160 --> 00:09:02,560 Get a scientist on the stand, half the jury will glaze over. 133 00:09:02,560 --> 00:09:04,320 We need them to hear Duwayne's story, 134 00:09:04,320 --> 00:09:07,000 along with any other witnesses we can persuade to come forward. 135 00:09:07,000 --> 00:09:09,600 Give me the files from the kids on the estate again. 136 00:09:09,600 --> 00:09:11,240 They're our best hope at the minute. 137 00:09:43,120 --> 00:09:45,720 Louise? Clive Driscoll. 138 00:09:45,720 --> 00:09:48,880 I'm a detective investigating the murder of Stephen Lawrence. 139 00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:51,480 I don't wanna talk to you. You did wanna talk, though. 140 00:09:51,480 --> 00:09:55,960 You responded to the witness appeal in 1993. That took real guts. 141 00:09:57,440 --> 00:09:59,560 No. Sorry. 142 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:03,400 Five minutes. Just a chat. 143 00:10:06,280 --> 00:10:09,760 All right. But you're not coming in my flat. 144 00:10:12,360 --> 00:10:13,640 I wasn't from the area. 145 00:10:13,640 --> 00:10:15,800 I just used to see a boy off the estate. 146 00:10:15,800 --> 00:10:17,720 That's how you knew the Acourts? Yeah. 147 00:10:17,720 --> 00:10:22,200 Knowing they've killed a boy, having a secret like that, it was horrible. 148 00:10:22,200 --> 00:10:24,600 When I did tell the police, they didn't seem interested, 149 00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:25,760 so after that... 150 00:10:25,760 --> 00:10:28,160 Yeah, well, after that, you didn't trust us. 151 00:10:28,160 --> 00:10:29,800 Exactly. 152 00:10:29,800 --> 00:10:32,560 And meantime, I was hearing things about David's dad. 153 00:10:32,560 --> 00:10:33,880 Clifford Norris. Yeah. 154 00:10:33,880 --> 00:10:36,080 People getting threatened, and worse. 155 00:10:36,080 --> 00:10:39,280 I was 15. I was clueless, petrified. 156 00:10:39,280 --> 00:10:42,800 Look, Louise, this isn't 1993. 157 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:46,320 If you do the right thing, there won't be any repercussions, 158 00:10:46,320 --> 00:10:49,360 and we can protect you from the likes of Clifford Norris. 159 00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:52,280 I'm not being rude, but if you haven't managed to catch those boys 160 00:10:52,280 --> 00:10:55,280 after all these years, why should I believe you can protect me? 161 00:11:13,680 --> 00:11:14,720 DOOR CLOSES 162 00:11:15,880 --> 00:11:17,560 ENGINE STARTS 163 00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:22,640 RADIO: 'Financial report about the Olympics. I mean, just bizarre. 164 00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:26,840 'I mean, I think Boris is hoping one day to be leader of the Tory Party 165 00:11:26,840 --> 00:11:29,760 'and Prime Minister, and his party's never gonna let him do that, 166 00:11:29,760 --> 00:11:33,160 'any more than the Labour Party would let me do it. Too big a risk. 167 00:11:33,160 --> 00:11:35,840 'So this is the best job he's ever gonna have in politics, 168 00:11:35,840 --> 00:11:37,840 'and my advice would be, "Do it..." ' 169 00:11:37,840 --> 00:11:39,720 CAR BEHIND ACCELERATES, BUMPS 170 00:11:39,720 --> 00:11:42,080 SHE GASPS For goodness sake! 171 00:11:43,720 --> 00:11:44,880 Goodness. 172 00:11:46,280 --> 00:11:50,400 Excuse me, you've just hit my car. Excuse me. 173 00:11:50,400 --> 00:11:52,320 KNOCKS ON WINDOW Excuse me. 174 00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:56,400 Hey! No! No, no! 175 00:11:56,400 --> 00:11:57,560 TYRES SCREECH 176 00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:06,160 SHE PANTS 177 00:12:10,040 --> 00:12:13,040 COMPUTER KEYBOARD CLACKING 178 00:12:16,760 --> 00:12:20,000 How much longer am I going to have to wait? 179 00:12:20,000 --> 00:12:22,680 Someone will be with you in due course, madam. 180 00:12:22,680 --> 00:12:24,560 Can you not check it out? 181 00:12:24,560 --> 00:12:27,600 Your colleague said 20 minutes an hour ago. 182 00:12:27,600 --> 00:12:31,160 HE SIGHS Name? 183 00:12:31,160 --> 00:12:34,240 I don't know, they didn't... No, your name. What's your name? 184 00:12:35,560 --> 00:12:37,720 Doreen Lawrence. 185 00:12:38,920 --> 00:12:41,200 I'm afraid at the moment all of our officers 186 00:12:41,200 --> 00:12:43,320 are currently busy on high-priority calls. 187 00:12:43,320 --> 00:12:46,000 This was a car-jacking. Surely that's high priority? 188 00:12:46,000 --> 00:12:47,880 If you wouldn't mind waiting, 189 00:12:47,880 --> 00:12:51,120 I'm sure someone will be with you in due course. 190 00:13:09,920 --> 00:13:14,160 On him, now, there! You do it every time! 191 00:13:14,160 --> 00:13:16,000 MOBILE RINGS 192 00:13:18,280 --> 00:13:19,680 Hello? 193 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:23,080 Wh... 194 00:13:23,080 --> 00:13:24,560 I've got to go. 195 00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:29,280 I'm sorry. 196 00:13:29,280 --> 00:13:32,400 I wanna speak to the officer in charge of Mrs Lawrence's case. 197 00:13:32,400 --> 00:13:35,280 Sorry, who are you? DCI Driscoll, Specialist Crime Directorate. 198 00:13:35,280 --> 00:13:36,520 Oh, sorry, guv. 199 00:13:36,520 --> 00:13:38,320 Quick as you like, son. Yeah, of course. 200 00:13:38,320 --> 00:13:40,840 Are you hurt? I can take you to A&E. Oh, no, I'm fine. 201 00:13:40,840 --> 00:13:43,600 They didn't touch me. But I left everything in the car, 202 00:13:43,600 --> 00:13:46,000 my wallet, I'll have to cancel all my cards... 203 00:13:46,000 --> 00:13:47,520 We'll sort it all out. Don't worry. 204 00:13:48,800 --> 00:13:51,120 Right, the duty inspector will be here in a moment. 205 00:13:51,120 --> 00:13:53,920 Can I get you a cup of tea in the meantime? I'm fine. 206 00:13:53,920 --> 00:13:55,080 Yes, please, Sergeant. 207 00:13:55,080 --> 00:13:59,120 Two teas, and, er, some biccies if you can rustle 'em up. Sugar, Mrs L? 208 00:13:59,120 --> 00:14:00,840 I'll just take milk, thank you. 209 00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:08,000 As a peace offering it was appreciated, 210 00:14:08,000 --> 00:14:09,200 but as a cup of tea... 211 00:14:09,200 --> 00:14:12,080 Shocking. He'll never make inspector like that. 212 00:14:12,080 --> 00:14:14,840 Did he put the milk in the mug with the teabag still in it? Ugh. 213 00:14:15,880 --> 00:14:17,320 I'll make us a proper cuppa. 214 00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:19,120 Here, I'll do that. You've had a shock. 215 00:14:19,120 --> 00:14:22,320 I'm not a damsel in distress, Mr Driscoll. 216 00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:24,360 Mr Driscoll is what my teachers called me at school 217 00:14:24,360 --> 00:14:25,920 before they gave me six of the best. 218 00:14:25,920 --> 00:14:27,040 Clive will do, I think. 219 00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:30,160 OK. Thank you, Clive, but I'll manage. 220 00:14:50,880 --> 00:14:54,320 We've had to turn this house into a fortress. 221 00:14:54,320 --> 00:14:58,160 There's a cost to speaking out. Yeah, I can see that. 222 00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:04,000 I have to say, though, you ain't half good at it, speaking out. 223 00:15:05,200 --> 00:15:08,120 I reckon there must be a lot of powerful people who have nightmares 224 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:11,440 about getting the hairdryer treatment from Doreen Lawrence. 225 00:15:11,440 --> 00:15:13,160 I didn't plan for it. 226 00:15:13,160 --> 00:15:16,280 I thought the killers would just be arrested. 227 00:15:16,280 --> 00:15:19,000 Never expected getting justice to be my job. 228 00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:21,280 No, well, it shouldn't have been. 229 00:15:21,280 --> 00:15:24,560 But here we are, 15 years later. Mm. 230 00:15:27,840 --> 00:15:32,000 Do you have children? Yeah, five. Four boys and one girl. 231 00:15:32,000 --> 00:15:35,560 The eldest is in Afghanistan, as it happens, yeah. Marine. 232 00:15:35,560 --> 00:15:39,880 Mm, you must worry about him. Sick to my stomach. 233 00:15:39,880 --> 00:15:44,640 It's funny, when I was away at Hendon for basic training, 234 00:15:44,640 --> 00:15:48,480 he'd, er, he'd come up and he'd cling onto my leg, 235 00:15:48,480 --> 00:15:50,360 "Don't go, Daddy." 236 00:15:50,360 --> 00:15:52,560 And now the shoe's on the other foot. 237 00:15:52,560 --> 00:15:57,120 I have to stop myself clinging onto him every time he ships out. 238 00:16:04,400 --> 00:16:08,520 You know, erm, I, er... HE CLEARS HIS THROAT 239 00:16:08,520 --> 00:16:13,560 I can't even begin to imagine the strength 240 00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:17,200 it must take to keep fighting all these years. 241 00:16:17,200 --> 00:16:21,280 Yeah, sometimes, I really do feel like giving up. 242 00:16:21,280 --> 00:16:25,360 But then I sleep, and I dream of him, and, you know, 243 00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:30,080 he's so sad and angry at not being alive. 244 00:16:31,400 --> 00:16:34,240 It's horrible. So I keep going. 245 00:16:35,720 --> 00:16:40,080 It's not about feeling strong. I don't feel strong. 246 00:16:40,080 --> 00:16:42,600 I just don't have a choice. 247 00:16:45,600 --> 00:16:47,640 RADIO: 'From London's newsroom at seven o'clock. 248 00:16:47,640 --> 00:16:51,440 'Helping you breathe more easily, London gets a new low-emission zone. 249 00:16:51,440 --> 00:16:53,840 'How immigrants should be taught how to queue in shops, 250 00:16:53,840 --> 00:16:57,640 'and why Cameron's losing ground in the power stakes. 251 00:16:57,640 --> 00:16:58,760 'Good morning, I'm...' 252 00:16:58,760 --> 00:17:00,760 Birdy, I need you to get one of your DCs 253 00:17:00,760 --> 00:17:02,480 to track down Clifford Norris. 254 00:17:02,480 --> 00:17:04,880 Old man Norris? Why? 255 00:17:04,880 --> 00:17:06,520 A witness, Birdy, what else? 256 00:17:06,520 --> 00:17:10,760 These were found on Norris' trousers. Two hairs. 257 00:17:10,760 --> 00:17:13,880 The mitochondrial DNA is a thousand-to-one match with Stephen. 258 00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:17,160 His hair? That's a significant find, surely. 259 00:17:17,160 --> 00:17:19,760 Well, a thousand-to-one isn't as strong as the fibres, 260 00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:21,160 but it's corroborative. 261 00:17:21,160 --> 00:17:23,640 It adds detail to the picture. Good. 262 00:17:23,640 --> 00:17:25,880 Let's hope there's more where that came from. 263 00:17:25,880 --> 00:17:28,200 It is good, but we need to prove how it got there. 264 00:17:30,800 --> 00:17:33,560 We've had a couple of breakthroughs on the case. 265 00:17:33,560 --> 00:17:37,400 But we're looking at a 15-year game of pass-the-parcel 266 00:17:37,400 --> 00:17:38,800 when it comes to exhibits. 267 00:17:38,800 --> 00:17:42,360 We've had internal reviews, external reviews, private prosecution. 268 00:17:42,360 --> 00:17:44,840 The defence are gonna be looking for any opportunity 269 00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:46,160 to cry contamination. 270 00:17:46,160 --> 00:17:49,800 I need to know every time anyone touched, moved, 271 00:17:49,800 --> 00:17:51,840 opened, or even glanced at an exhibit. 272 00:17:51,840 --> 00:17:54,800 So, hang on, you're talking about forensic evidence. 273 00:17:54,800 --> 00:17:57,800 New and compelling forensic evidence. 274 00:17:57,800 --> 00:18:00,160 But for it to be worth anything, we need to prove 275 00:18:00,160 --> 00:18:03,320 there was absolutely no opportunity for Stephen's clothing 276 00:18:03,320 --> 00:18:06,600 to have contact with the suspects' clothing after the fact. 277 00:18:08,520 --> 00:18:11,960 I need someone I can rely on to do that, and that's you. 278 00:18:11,960 --> 00:18:13,600 All right. 279 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:16,200 But I was working at Woolwich when Stephen was killed. 280 00:18:17,440 --> 00:18:20,360 I remember the atmosphere. Let's be honest, Del, back in '93, 281 00:18:20,360 --> 00:18:23,360 the Acourt gang would have fitted in better with the Metropolitan Police 282 00:18:23,360 --> 00:18:24,920 than young Stephen. 283 00:18:24,920 --> 00:18:29,040 I guess what I'm asking is, is this real? 284 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:31,720 Does the brass actually want us to solve this murder? 285 00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:34,920 We're not doing this to please the Metropolitan Police. 286 00:18:34,920 --> 00:18:36,680 The Lawrence family have lost a son. 287 00:18:36,680 --> 00:18:39,000 We're murder police, we work for them. 288 00:18:51,560 --> 00:18:54,080 Makes a change to have the police call a meeting, 289 00:18:54,080 --> 00:18:55,600 instead of us demanding one. 290 00:18:58,720 --> 00:19:02,120 Jocelyn. Are we the first here? I think so. 291 00:19:06,200 --> 00:19:08,000 Jocelyn Cockburn? Yes. 292 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:11,160 And Neville Lawrence? Yes, that's correct. 293 00:19:11,160 --> 00:19:12,400 Thank you. 294 00:19:13,560 --> 00:19:15,000 DOOR OPENS 295 00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:20,640 Neville. 296 00:19:22,160 --> 00:19:24,400 Doreen. Imran. 297 00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:31,000 The forensic review is on-going, and we've made another significant find. 298 00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:34,000 Human hair strands have been identified 299 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:36,640 on two of the suspects' clothing. 300 00:19:36,640 --> 00:19:38,400 Stephen's hair? 301 00:19:38,400 --> 00:19:42,040 We think so. It's a thousand-to-one DNA match. 302 00:19:42,040 --> 00:19:45,480 Is that enough? Are we talking about bringing charges? 303 00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:48,920 Not yet. We wanna build the strongest case possible, 304 00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:50,200 and to achieve that, 305 00:19:50,200 --> 00:19:53,480 we need solid witnesses as well as forensic evidence. 306 00:19:53,480 --> 00:19:57,600 Previous investigations have treated some crucial people badly. 307 00:19:57,600 --> 00:19:59,360 Duwayne Brooks being an example. 308 00:19:59,360 --> 00:20:01,720 They treated that boy like a prime suspect. 309 00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:03,920 Yes. We let him down. 310 00:20:03,920 --> 00:20:06,720 But when it comes to trial, we'll need him. 311 00:20:06,720 --> 00:20:08,280 So you think there will be a trial? 312 00:20:08,280 --> 00:20:11,360 We're increasingly confident, but as it's a double jeopardy case, 313 00:20:11,360 --> 00:20:14,480 the CPS will want to consult the family on re-prosecution. 314 00:20:14,480 --> 00:20:17,560 As in, do we want a prosecution? 315 00:20:17,560 --> 00:20:20,600 I know it sounds like a daft question. There's no question. 316 00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:23,480 There's never been any question about our commitment. 317 00:20:23,480 --> 00:20:26,240 The question is whether the Metropolitan Police 318 00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:29,960 are actually going to support the prosecution this time around. 319 00:20:29,960 --> 00:20:32,160 We've been here twice before, you know. 320 00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:34,480 We don't want to go through that disappointment again. 321 00:20:34,480 --> 00:20:37,760 I know. You have my word. 322 00:20:37,760 --> 00:20:39,880 It's not your word I'm worried about. 323 00:20:39,880 --> 00:20:41,680 I mean, let's not beat around the bush. 324 00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:43,840 I'm still worried about corruption. 325 00:20:45,520 --> 00:20:48,920 Look, when it comes to previous investigations, 326 00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:51,600 I'd like answers to a lot of questions. 327 00:20:51,600 --> 00:20:54,240 Will I get those answers? Probably not. 328 00:20:55,280 --> 00:20:59,040 All I can say is I'm the SIO now... 329 00:20:59,040 --> 00:21:02,000 and I have no intention of letting anyone interfere 330 00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:03,840 with my investigation. 331 00:21:03,840 --> 00:21:05,240 'DC Derek Reid calling. 332 00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:08,120 'We're trying to establish the chain of custody 333 00:21:08,120 --> 00:21:10,040 'for exhibits in the Stephen Lawrence case, 334 00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:13,360 'and I have some questions regarding his clothing.' 335 00:21:13,360 --> 00:21:14,760 On the night of the murder, 336 00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:17,960 you brought Stephen's clothing back to the station unsealed, to Eltham? 337 00:21:17,960 --> 00:21:19,280 Er, no, not to Eltham. 338 00:21:19,280 --> 00:21:23,160 I mean, it was drenched with blood, so I took 'em to Southwark. 339 00:21:23,160 --> 00:21:26,360 They had a drying room there. They were sealed once they were dry. 340 00:21:26,360 --> 00:21:29,400 So, during that process, there's a lot of wet blood, 341 00:21:29,400 --> 00:21:31,080 the bags aren't sealed. 342 00:21:31,080 --> 00:21:34,840 Could you have transferred blood to the outside of the evidence bag? 343 00:21:34,840 --> 00:21:37,400 I mean, I wore gloves, but it's possible. 344 00:21:38,560 --> 00:21:43,800 You seized Dobson's jacket on 7th of May. 345 00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:47,040 Was it bagged at the scene? Yes. 346 00:21:47,040 --> 00:21:48,160 Right. 347 00:21:48,160 --> 00:21:53,040 Erm... only, in your notebook, 348 00:21:53,040 --> 00:21:55,640 you made an entry about sealing exhibits 349 00:21:55,640 --> 00:21:57,760 back at Plumstead nick later that day. 350 00:22:07,920 --> 00:22:10,920 Well, I mean, I would have followed best practice. 351 00:22:12,960 --> 00:22:16,280 We're just trying to fill any gaps. If you can help us, great. 352 00:22:16,280 --> 00:22:19,280 If you can't remember, understandable. 353 00:22:20,320 --> 00:22:22,200 We're on the same side here. 354 00:22:23,840 --> 00:22:26,200 So when Stephen's clothes arrived from Southwark, 355 00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:28,200 did they go into a secure evidence store? 356 00:22:28,200 --> 00:22:32,560 Er, no, it wasn't an evidence store, really. It was just an unused cell. 357 00:22:32,560 --> 00:22:36,440 What, so there was some kind of shelving, partitioning? 358 00:22:36,440 --> 00:22:38,520 Unfortunately not, no. 359 00:22:38,520 --> 00:22:42,000 As I remember it, Stephen's clothing was stored on the bed. 360 00:22:42,000 --> 00:22:43,240 The bed? 361 00:22:43,240 --> 00:22:46,080 Well, yes. I mean, like I said, it was a cell. 362 00:22:49,440 --> 00:22:51,760 MOBILE RINGS 363 00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:54,600 Shaun. 'Clive.' 364 00:22:54,600 --> 00:22:56,880 'Birdy's found a witness.' 365 00:22:56,880 --> 00:22:59,040 Follow-up from a canvas a few years back. 366 00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:01,560 I think you might want some face time with this one. 367 00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:04,560 I'll see you back there. OK. Keep him comfortable. 368 00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:06,080 I'll be there in about half an hour. 369 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:11,520 I'd had a drink in Woolwich, and then I was walking home 370 00:23:11,520 --> 00:23:15,120 to where I was lodging, and I was almost at the Well Hall roundabout, 371 00:23:15,120 --> 00:23:18,720 and that's where I saw, you know, the... the bother. 372 00:23:21,800 --> 00:23:23,280 What did you see, exactly? 373 00:23:23,280 --> 00:23:26,720 I saw David Norris, Gary Dobson and the two Acourts 374 00:23:26,720 --> 00:23:29,520 laying into the Black kid, Lawrence. 375 00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:31,160 How many drinks had you had? 376 00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:36,480 I don't know, six, seven pints, few chasers. 377 00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:39,280 So you were drunk. I was pissed. I weren't blind. 378 00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:45,240 You weren't local, so how did you know who they were? 379 00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:49,040 A bloke I worked with pointed them out to me a few weeks before, 380 00:23:49,040 --> 00:23:52,040 told me to watch out for 'em, said they were aggy, 381 00:23:52,040 --> 00:23:53,720 carried knives and that, you know. 382 00:23:53,720 --> 00:23:56,840 Can you give us his details, the bloke that pointed them out to you? 383 00:23:56,840 --> 00:23:59,320 I can do. I don't know if he'll talk to you. 384 00:23:59,320 --> 00:24:01,360 I ain't spoke to him in ten years. 385 00:24:03,160 --> 00:24:06,120 Why didn't you come forward at the time? 386 00:24:06,120 --> 00:24:08,120 Well, no-one asked me, did they? So... 387 00:24:08,120 --> 00:24:11,360 Well, we were on the radio, on Crimewatch, in the papers. 388 00:24:11,360 --> 00:24:13,440 We were begging for witnesses. 389 00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:15,800 Well, if you want the truth, I'm a racist, 390 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:17,920 so I won't lose any sleep over him. 391 00:24:21,720 --> 00:24:23,880 So why talk now? 392 00:24:23,880 --> 00:24:27,040 They came and asked me, I told them what I knew. 393 00:24:27,040 --> 00:24:28,720 I ain't afraid of the Acourts. 394 00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:32,280 He was drunk. 395 00:24:32,280 --> 00:24:36,840 On the other hand, he's a fully paid-up racist, which is helpful. 396 00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:39,920 No reason to lie. If we can find the other workmate, 397 00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:43,920 get him to confirm he pointed out the gang, firm up the ID, 398 00:24:43,920 --> 00:24:46,280 we might finally have a useable witness. 399 00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:51,680 My anxiety is that some of this forensic evidence, 400 00:24:51,680 --> 00:24:54,880 though compelling, is not exactly new. 401 00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:57,800 What do you mean? 402 00:24:57,800 --> 00:25:00,800 Advice we've had from legal counsel is that it isn't good enough 403 00:25:00,800 --> 00:25:03,680 to call evidence new because we've just found it, 404 00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:06,480 if we really should have found it before. 405 00:25:06,480 --> 00:25:08,960 Even though your tests have found traces of Stephen 406 00:25:08,960 --> 00:25:12,480 on the suspects' clothing, it was more difficult, 407 00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:16,520 but not impossible, to conduct this kind of analysis in '93. 408 00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:20,400 The Met can't afford another Stephen Lawrence trial to collapse. 409 00:25:22,120 --> 00:25:24,200 What are you saying? What I've always said. 410 00:25:24,200 --> 00:25:25,640 That I doubt this review 411 00:25:25,640 --> 00:25:28,680 will produce anything strong enough for a retrial. 412 00:25:28,680 --> 00:25:31,240 You don't even have a decent witness. We're working on that. 413 00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:34,200 It isn't enough. 414 00:25:35,520 --> 00:25:39,960 I am sorry, Clive, but we need more than this for the CPS. 415 00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:42,040 All right, then. 416 00:25:42,040 --> 00:25:44,160 We'll just have to find more, won't we? 417 00:25:50,280 --> 00:25:52,280 I've got some more bad news, I'm afraid. 418 00:25:52,280 --> 00:25:54,520 Tracked down our racist's workmate. Don't tell me. 419 00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:57,240 Denies all knowledge. 420 00:25:57,240 --> 00:25:59,520 Says he didn't know the suspects. 421 00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:03,280 Everyone in Eltham knew the Acourt gang. Exactly. 422 00:26:03,280 --> 00:26:06,000 But he's not playing ball. LIFT BELL DINGS 423 00:26:08,560 --> 00:26:13,320 Hello. Hello. Ooh. Does your nose do that? 424 00:26:15,360 --> 00:26:18,080 Heh-heh. BABY COOS 425 00:26:21,200 --> 00:26:24,000 As you can see, Clifford Norris is no threat to you, 426 00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:25,760 or anyone else, for that matter. 427 00:26:26,760 --> 00:26:31,000 He's living in a bedsit, pickling his liver on the dole. 428 00:26:31,000 --> 00:26:34,400 He won't be buying many coppers with his giro, I promise you that. 429 00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:45,440 I'm sorry. 430 00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:48,200 I thought it over, but I've got her to think about, you know? 431 00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:51,120 Louise, he's not a player any more. He can't hurt you, 432 00:26:51,120 --> 00:26:54,280 but you could make a difference to the Lawrence family. 433 00:26:54,280 --> 00:26:56,800 You could give them justice. But why me? 434 00:26:56,800 --> 00:26:58,240 Everyone knows who done it. 435 00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:02,680 I wanna help, but I can't. I'm sorry. 436 00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:14,200 I was so sure she was gonna do the right thing. 437 00:27:15,680 --> 00:27:18,800 I must be losing my touch. 438 00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:23,560 It's the Eltham Omerta, isn't it? Here, got this in today. 439 00:27:23,560 --> 00:27:26,080 Serious Organised Crime Agency. 440 00:27:26,080 --> 00:27:28,240 Jamie Acourt's apparently a regular guest 441 00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:30,360 in a drug wiretap they're running. 442 00:27:30,360 --> 00:27:32,600 They're classing him as a high flight risk. 443 00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:35,720 Bags packed, ready to go, they reckon. Christ. 444 00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:37,920 Can we request surveillance? 445 00:27:37,920 --> 00:27:39,800 They won't even pay for a bolt for the door. 446 00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:43,000 If they're as connected as SOCA reckons, 447 00:27:43,000 --> 00:27:45,920 it isn't just the flight risk. They could intimidate witnesses. 448 00:27:47,120 --> 00:27:49,480 We limit case conferences. 449 00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:51,600 Think about who actually needs to be there. 450 00:27:51,600 --> 00:27:53,120 We can't afford another leak. 451 00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:28,040 DOREEN: 'I look around here today 452 00:28:28,040 --> 00:28:32,520 'and see the Prime Minister, the Home Secretary, 453 00:28:32,520 --> 00:28:35,200 'the Archbishop of Canterbury. 454 00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:39,640 'It's an honour to see you all here, of course it is, 455 00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:42,400 'but I wish you weren't here.' 456 00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:47,240 I wish we didn't need to be here. But we do. 457 00:28:47,240 --> 00:28:50,920 We have to keep Stephen's memory alive 458 00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:52,640 because we still don't have justice. 459 00:28:54,320 --> 00:28:58,040 For me, for my family, 460 00:28:58,040 --> 00:29:03,480 the pain of our loss remains undiminished after 15 years. 461 00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:09,000 The campaign for justice for Stephen continues, 462 00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:14,360 as must the wider fight to combat racism, discrimination, 463 00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:16,560 and prejudice. 464 00:29:16,560 --> 00:29:18,080 APPLAUSE 465 00:29:25,840 --> 00:29:28,320 Stephen was my benchmark. 466 00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:33,280 I was always trying to reach his level and, annoying as it was, 467 00:29:33,280 --> 00:29:35,600 I was never quite as good. 468 00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:40,200 He's made me aspire to be the best person I can be, 469 00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:42,680 and I can't thank him enough for that. 470 00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:45,440 I loved my big brother. 471 00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:50,560 He was killed by hate, but I believe that love is stronger than hate, 472 00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:55,040 that, in the end, love will conquer hate. 473 00:29:56,880 --> 00:29:59,880 PHONE RINGS DS Birdsall speaking. 474 00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:05,280 OK. Yeah, I'll get him to call you. 475 00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:12,240 DIAL TONE 476 00:30:12,240 --> 00:30:14,680 MOBILE RINGS 477 00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:17,680 Excuse me, I'll just get rid of this, if you don't mind. 478 00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:20,880 Can't speak right now. You need to call forensics, ASAP. 479 00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:30,760 It's Clive Driscoll. We've found Stephen's blood. 480 00:30:30,760 --> 00:30:32,120 What? 481 00:30:33,360 --> 00:30:34,600 You found it where? 482 00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:38,200 We've found Stephen's blood on Gary Dobson's jacket. 483 00:30:39,920 --> 00:30:41,280 Dear God. 484 00:30:44,400 --> 00:30:46,880 Hello, Clive. Oh, Mrs L. 485 00:30:46,880 --> 00:30:49,680 You look very smart. Well, I do try. 486 00:30:49,680 --> 00:30:53,760 I, er, I have to say, it's an honour. 487 00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:55,160 That was a beautiful service. 488 00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:58,160 And the case? How's everything going? 489 00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:02,680 Well, I mean, it's going well. Good. 490 00:31:22,120 --> 00:31:25,200 There. You see that? 491 00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:29,000 That discolouration there is the blood of Stephen Lawrence. 492 00:31:29,000 --> 00:31:30,920 It's on the back of the collar, which fits. 493 00:31:30,920 --> 00:31:33,880 When you stab someone, as you pull the knife back, 494 00:31:33,880 --> 00:31:37,160 there's a little judder as you reach the end of the trajectory, 495 00:31:37,160 --> 00:31:40,640 so any droplets of wet blood often hit the back of the clothing. 496 00:31:40,640 --> 00:31:43,400 And the key thing here is that that isn't a flake. 497 00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:46,120 It's saturated, stained into the fabric, 498 00:31:46,120 --> 00:31:48,760 which means the blood was still wet when it landed there 499 00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:53,440 during the attack. So this is A1, Rolls-Royce evidence? 500 00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:55,800 Indeed. With a cherry on top. 501 00:31:56,760 --> 00:32:00,040 Is it too good? How can evidence be too good? 502 00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:02,840 As in, is it so good it should have been found a long time ago? 503 00:32:02,840 --> 00:32:05,680 Amplified fragment length polymorphism forms of analysis 504 00:32:05,680 --> 00:32:07,920 weren't available during earlier investigations. 505 00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:10,800 We couldn't have confidently confirmed this was Stephen's blood. 506 00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:14,120 Right, well, the only thing I understood there was 507 00:32:14,120 --> 00:32:17,400 "We couldn't have done this before", and that's all I need. 508 00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:19,360 This is new and compelling evidence. 509 00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:23,720 This is getting serious now, isn't it? 510 00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:25,880 If we rely on forensics, we'd better be confident... 511 00:32:25,880 --> 00:32:27,920 MOBILE RINGS ..about the chain of custody. 512 00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:29,960 Hello? 'DCI Driscoll?' Who's this? 513 00:32:29,960 --> 00:32:32,200 'We're running a piece on the developments 514 00:32:32,200 --> 00:32:35,280 'of the Stephen Lawrence case. Wondered if you wanted to comment. 515 00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:37,760 'On or off, your call.' 516 00:32:41,800 --> 00:32:45,280 I need to know your source. Course you do. 517 00:32:45,280 --> 00:32:49,360 So, is it gonna be enough, then, this new DNA evidence? 518 00:32:49,360 --> 00:32:52,880 You cannot run this story. We're dealing with flight risks. 519 00:32:53,920 --> 00:32:56,400 HE SCOFFS You're serious? 520 00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:01,120 Look, we got off on the wrong foot here. 521 00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:02,920 You give me an angle that works for you. 522 00:33:02,920 --> 00:33:08,680 All right, I've tried to appeal to your sense of civic duty. 523 00:33:08,680 --> 00:33:10,960 How about this? 524 00:33:10,960 --> 00:33:15,040 If you run this story, I'll hold a lovely big press conference, 525 00:33:15,040 --> 00:33:19,200 with refreshments and everything, and I will name you personally 526 00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:22,560 as having sabotaged the Stephen Lawrence murder investigation. 527 00:33:31,640 --> 00:33:33,160 Afternoon. 528 00:33:34,280 --> 00:33:37,200 Sorry to keep you waiting. Mark Ellison QC. 529 00:33:37,200 --> 00:33:40,120 Is everyone here? Do we have our forensic people? 530 00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:43,320 Er, yeah, that'll be Ed and Angela. 531 00:33:46,160 --> 00:33:48,280 A lot seems to rest on the fact that this blood stain 532 00:33:48,280 --> 00:33:49,920 was soaked into the fabric. 533 00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:51,200 Well, yes. 534 00:33:51,200 --> 00:33:54,360 The nature of the staining would suggest the blood was uncoagulated, 535 00:33:54,360 --> 00:33:55,560 fresh, when it got there. 536 00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:58,920 These tests that you do to the clothing, 537 00:33:58,920 --> 00:34:00,280 do any of them involve moisture? 538 00:34:01,200 --> 00:34:04,440 Well, we did use the Phadebas Amylase test to detect saliva. 539 00:34:04,440 --> 00:34:06,400 That does involve a dampened paper press test. 540 00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:07,760 So if I was the defence, 541 00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:11,040 I would be saying the blood stain was the result of contamination, 542 00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:13,960 and only soaked into the weave of the fabric when it was dampened. 543 00:34:13,960 --> 00:34:16,000 I think that's a highly improbable hypothesis. 544 00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:18,760 If you say that on the stand, we've lost. 545 00:34:18,760 --> 00:34:21,160 An improbable hypothesis is reasonable doubt. 546 00:34:21,160 --> 00:34:23,520 If I may, with forensic evidence such as this, 547 00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:25,480 we're dealing with degrees of probability. 548 00:34:25,480 --> 00:34:28,120 No, not good enough. I need you to go away 549 00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:31,720 and prove the absolute impossibility of this blood stain 550 00:34:31,720 --> 00:34:33,680 coming from any sequence of events, 551 00:34:33,680 --> 00:34:36,320 other than the jacket being at the fatal attack. 552 00:34:37,360 --> 00:34:39,120 Right. 553 00:34:39,120 --> 00:34:42,080 Well, we'll, er, go back and review. Good. 554 00:34:44,160 --> 00:34:47,520 Del? I thought that was you. Ha-ha! You all right, Jenny? 555 00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:49,360 It's been years. Yeah. 556 00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:52,280 You still with Trident? Er, no. No, I'm... I'm actually on 557 00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:54,520 the Stephen Lawrence case, as it happens. 558 00:34:54,520 --> 00:34:58,640 You? No way. Part of Doreen Lawrence's private police force. 559 00:34:58,640 --> 00:35:00,520 What's that supposed to mean? 560 00:35:00,520 --> 00:35:03,200 Come on, you must be pulling your hair out on that job. 561 00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:05,640 I mean, it's not like anyone wants to face the actual truth 562 00:35:05,640 --> 00:35:07,480 about Saint Stephen. 563 00:35:07,480 --> 00:35:09,360 Which is what? 564 00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:12,400 Well, it was a gang thing, wasn't it? 565 00:35:12,400 --> 00:35:15,880 Stabbed with his own knife after he tried to rip off a dealer. 566 00:35:15,880 --> 00:35:17,480 Everyone knows. 567 00:35:17,480 --> 00:35:19,320 I tell you what, then, Jenny. 568 00:35:19,320 --> 00:35:23,040 You send everyone across to us. We'll happily take their statements. 569 00:35:25,560 --> 00:35:27,440 DC Derek Reid calling again. 570 00:35:27,440 --> 00:35:30,560 I had a question about the tape seals. 571 00:35:30,560 --> 00:35:32,760 You said they were checked every time, right? 572 00:35:34,360 --> 00:35:35,680 So how was that recorded? 573 00:35:35,680 --> 00:35:40,600 In 1998, you resealed a couple of our exhibits. Yeah. 574 00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:43,440 Can you explain the deterioration on the packaging? 575 00:35:43,440 --> 00:35:47,600 Just to clarify, you're saying that when the suspects' clothing 576 00:35:47,600 --> 00:35:49,000 arrived in Eltham, 577 00:35:49,000 --> 00:35:51,560 Stephen's clothing had already been sent off for analysis? 578 00:35:51,560 --> 00:35:54,440 What date was that? 579 00:35:54,440 --> 00:35:58,520 We've tracked every single exhibit since 1993. 580 00:35:58,520 --> 00:36:01,600 We know where every item was at one time. 581 00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:04,760 For example, LH/5, Dobson's jacket, 582 00:36:04,760 --> 00:36:09,160 that was also handed over to Kent Police on 23rd of June 1997. 583 00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:12,360 It remained sealed and in a cupboard with the other clothing exhibits. 584 00:36:12,360 --> 00:36:15,960 Tricky, Tricky, this is all very comprehensive, very impressive, 585 00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:17,520 but for now, what's the headline? 586 00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:19,720 What are we looking at in terms of opportunities 587 00:36:19,720 --> 00:36:22,160 for cross-contamination? The headline is this. 588 00:36:22,160 --> 00:36:25,320 The thing the first investigation took the biggest kicking for, 589 00:36:25,320 --> 00:36:28,000 that two-week delay between the murder and the arrests? 590 00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:31,160 Now it's our saving grace. You've lost me. 591 00:36:31,160 --> 00:36:34,800 None of the suspects' clothing was seized and brought to the station 592 00:36:34,800 --> 00:36:36,760 until 7th of May. 593 00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:39,800 Stephen's exhibits were sent for forensic examination 594 00:36:39,800 --> 00:36:41,360 a week before that. 595 00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:45,040 Stephen's and the suspects' exhibits were never at the same station 596 00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:47,560 at the same time. 597 00:36:47,560 --> 00:36:49,560 So opportunities for cross-contamination 598 00:36:49,560 --> 00:36:51,800 back in '93 were... Vanishingly small. 599 00:36:56,600 --> 00:37:00,920 Clive, Duwayne is in the paper with the man running for mayor. 600 00:37:00,920 --> 00:37:02,160 Boris? 601 00:37:02,160 --> 00:37:05,080 'No, no, no, the other one. The Liberal.' 602 00:37:05,080 --> 00:37:08,560 Ex-police officer. Duwayne campaigning for him. 603 00:37:08,560 --> 00:37:11,960 Yeah, Brian Paddick. I remember him from my Brixton days. 604 00:37:11,960 --> 00:37:14,080 Well, there you go, then. 605 00:37:15,280 --> 00:37:18,280 Maybe he can put in a good word for you. 606 00:37:19,440 --> 00:37:22,560 I really, really appreciate you making time, Mr Brooks. 607 00:37:22,560 --> 00:37:25,080 Brian said you were one of the good guys. 608 00:37:25,080 --> 00:37:26,680 That's the only reason why I'm here. 609 00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:32,480 Thing is, we're making headway with Stephen's case. Really? 610 00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:38,520 15 years of headway, and what do we have to show for it? 611 00:37:39,720 --> 00:37:43,960 I'm sorry. We let you down. No, sorry, you didn't let me down. 612 00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:46,000 You tried to stitch me up. OK? 613 00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:49,000 You arrested me for protesting the murder of my friend 614 00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:50,840 whilst his killers walked free. 615 00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:55,000 I am sorry, Duwayne. 616 00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:56,640 You were treated appallingly. 617 00:37:56,640 --> 00:38:02,040 The thing is, I need your evidence to lock up the bastards 618 00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:04,840 that killed your friend. I already gave my evidence. 619 00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:09,760 I was a scared kid. 620 00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:12,040 I knew that the Acourts could come after me... 621 00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:16,600 ..but I still identified Neil Acourt and Luke Knight. 622 00:38:16,600 --> 00:38:19,440 You were brave. You stood up for your friend. 623 00:38:19,440 --> 00:38:23,160 But it didn't matter, though, did it? Because no-one believed me. 624 00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:27,840 I did everything the police asked of me, 625 00:38:27,840 --> 00:38:30,800 and they still acted like I was hiding something. 626 00:38:32,080 --> 00:38:35,560 It was unfathomable to them that a Black man 627 00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:38,160 could just be an innocent victim. 628 00:38:39,360 --> 00:38:43,560 Look, I won't ask you to trust the police. Why should you? 629 00:38:43,560 --> 00:38:47,200 But I am gonna charge these men. And when I do, 630 00:38:47,200 --> 00:38:50,080 it will rest on forensics, cold, hard science. 631 00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:51,720 There'll be a lot less wriggle room 632 00:38:51,720 --> 00:38:54,400 for anyone who doesn't want to see justice for Stephen. 633 00:38:55,880 --> 00:38:58,400 So why do you need me? 634 00:38:58,400 --> 00:39:01,680 Because forensics alone won't be enough. 635 00:39:02,920 --> 00:39:06,360 You were there. You can bring it to life for them. 636 00:39:27,200 --> 00:39:30,760 So, we made 12 attempts to reconstitute blood fragments 637 00:39:30,760 --> 00:39:32,400 using Phadebas substrate. 638 00:39:32,400 --> 00:39:35,400 Sorry, can you imagine that you're trying to explain this 639 00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:37,520 to a five-year-old? Sorry. 640 00:39:37,520 --> 00:39:40,880 We took tiny samples of Stephen's dried blood 641 00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:44,760 and applied different liquids, but the samples became jelly-like. 642 00:39:44,760 --> 00:39:46,600 The blood wouldn't have been able 643 00:39:46,600 --> 00:39:50,440 to soak into the weave of the fabric, even if it was rehydrated. 644 00:39:50,440 --> 00:39:53,760 So? My conclusion is Stephen's blood was fresh 645 00:39:53,760 --> 00:39:55,480 when it soaked into the jacket. 646 00:39:56,840 --> 00:39:59,920 Which means that Dobson's jacket must have been present 647 00:39:59,920 --> 00:40:03,640 at the murder scene. Yes. Well, that's music to my ears. 648 00:40:03,640 --> 00:40:07,080 Let's hope that this is enough to get us over the line with the CPS. 649 00:40:20,560 --> 00:40:22,920 Ah, Clive. 650 00:40:22,920 --> 00:40:26,880 Detective Superintendent Jill Bailey will be joining us for the meeting. 651 00:40:26,880 --> 00:40:28,800 All right? 652 00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:32,120 Given the level of scrutiny the Met can expect going forward, 653 00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:35,200 I thought your team would benefit from Jill's support 654 00:40:35,200 --> 00:40:37,720 as reviewing superintendent. 655 00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:43,480 I've never had a reviewing superintendent before. 656 00:40:43,480 --> 00:40:45,800 Never heard of one, actually. 657 00:40:45,800 --> 00:40:48,960 Yes, well, this is a unique case. 658 00:40:50,040 --> 00:40:53,600 What will you be reviewing, ma'am? Me? 659 00:40:54,960 --> 00:40:58,720 I hope I can provide some guidance when it comes to 660 00:40:58,720 --> 00:41:02,240 the more politically delicate aspects of the case. 661 00:41:22,760 --> 00:41:24,400 Over the past two years, 662 00:41:24,400 --> 00:41:27,160 we have followed a series of significant evidential leads 663 00:41:27,160 --> 00:41:31,600 in the investigation into Stephen's murder. 664 00:41:31,600 --> 00:41:35,640 The Director of Public Prosecutions has now reviewed this evidence 665 00:41:35,640 --> 00:41:37,720 and provided us with an update. 666 00:41:37,720 --> 00:41:42,120 Mr and Mrs Lawrence, Stuart, I won't beat about the bush. 667 00:41:42,120 --> 00:41:45,080 The fact is, we have found Stephen's blood 668 00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:47,200 on the jacket of one of the suspects. 669 00:41:47,200 --> 00:41:48,800 We've also found hair, 670 00:41:48,800 --> 00:41:53,840 clothing fibres belonging to Stephen on the clothing of several suspects. 671 00:41:53,840 --> 00:41:58,720 As a result of this, the DPP has agreed that we can charge 672 00:41:58,720 --> 00:42:02,480 Gary Dobson and David Norris for Stephen's murder. 673 00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:05,560 Hope to execute the arrests within the week. 674 00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:16,040 I'm sorry. 675 00:42:16,040 --> 00:42:19,760 I know this has been a long road for your family. 676 00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:24,120 I know this is good news, but... 677 00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:30,360 Yes... SHE SNIFFS 678 00:42:30,360 --> 00:42:32,800 ..we have waited a long time for this. 679 00:42:38,680 --> 00:42:41,760 But that's two. There were five. 680 00:42:42,720 --> 00:42:45,840 The forensic evidence against Dobson and Norris 681 00:42:45,840 --> 00:42:48,760 is stronger than what we have against the other suspects. 682 00:42:48,760 --> 00:42:52,360 The DPP doesn't want to endanger the stronger cases 683 00:42:52,360 --> 00:42:55,400 in a joint prosecution. So they get away with it again. 684 00:42:55,400 --> 00:42:58,760 No, no. We take down Dobson and Norris first, 685 00:42:58,760 --> 00:43:00,840 but this is an on-going investigation. 686 00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:02,880 I haven't forgotten about the others. 687 00:43:03,960 --> 00:43:06,600 If there's a disparity in the evidence, 688 00:43:06,600 --> 00:43:09,400 then separate prosecutions is sensible. 689 00:43:09,400 --> 00:43:13,880 OK. If that's the best way forward, then I'm OK with that. 690 00:43:19,120 --> 00:43:21,200 You know, when we first met, 691 00:43:21,200 --> 00:43:23,840 you promised me you'd do your best for Stephen. 692 00:43:25,720 --> 00:43:28,760 Thank you for keeping that promise. 693 00:43:30,080 --> 00:43:31,680 Well, thank you, both. 694 00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:32,800 Er... 695 00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:35,160 I don't take the trust you've placed in us lightly. 696 00:43:36,960 --> 00:43:39,720 You understand that following these arrests, 697 00:43:39,720 --> 00:43:44,000 there's likely to be renewed attention on your family. 698 00:43:44,000 --> 00:43:46,000 We can deal with that. 699 00:43:48,000 --> 00:43:49,840 We're ready. 700 00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:55,480 Subtitles by accessibility@itv.com 54776

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