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1
00:00:02,770 --> 00:00:06,650
{\an8}Good morning, good morning,
2:30 in the morning.
2
00:00:06,730 --> 00:00:08,270
It's tea time.
3
00:00:10,320 --> 00:00:12,900
This is worse than fucking filming.
4
00:00:16,700 --> 00:00:19,830
{\an8}Old comedian's home.
Hello, comedian. How are you?
5
00:00:19,910 --> 00:00:21,000
Yes.
6
00:00:21,330 --> 00:00:23,160
- Hello, hello...
- Hello.
7
00:00:23,250 --> 00:00:24,500
Uncle Weiner.
8
00:00:24,580 --> 00:00:25,920
This is lapsang souchong.
9
00:00:26,500 --> 00:00:28,500
So it's a bit like
a tea and a cigarette.
10
00:00:32,050 --> 00:00:34,260
I'm going to evacuate and have a shower.
11
00:00:34,340 --> 00:00:36,990
Hope I feel a little better,
I'll come out back again.
12
00:00:45,270 --> 00:00:46,980
Still doing a gig in California.
13
00:00:48,270 --> 00:00:49,270
There's Eric.
14
00:00:49,360 --> 00:00:50,400
Hey!
15
00:00:50,480 --> 00:00:52,400
- Good morning.
- Good morning.
16
00:00:53,440 --> 00:00:54,950
{\an8}What time is it?
17
00:00:55,030 --> 00:00:56,506
{\an8}It should be dark there, shouldn't it?
18
00:00:56,530 --> 00:00:57,830
{\an8}It's three in the morning.
19
00:00:59,200 --> 00:01:00,750
{\an8}It's three in the morning, yes.
20
00:01:00,790 --> 00:01:02,440
So that's why you look like that.
21
00:01:03,250 --> 00:01:06,370
This is how I look
at three in the morning.
22
00:01:06,460 --> 00:01:07,726
So which chair am I sitting in?
23
00:01:07,750 --> 00:01:10,540
The only other one
that's not occupied, John.
24
00:01:10,630 --> 00:01:12,420
Work it out, work it out.
25
00:01:12,510 --> 00:01:15,196
What you on, Eric? Are you
having something to drink or not?
26
00:01:15,220 --> 00:01:19,220
I had a lapsang souchong
and now we're on Brendan's breakfast.
27
00:01:19,300 --> 00:01:21,156
Trying to see the books on Eric's shelf.
28
00:01:21,180 --> 00:01:24,060
Can you see that clearly?
I... you're very fuzzy.
29
00:01:24,140 --> 00:01:26,166
- Can you read books entirely?
- No, I can't at all.
30
00:01:26,190 --> 00:01:28,246
I'm just wondering
if any of them are mine.
31
00:01:28,270 --> 00:01:29,440
Really?
32
00:01:30,770 --> 00:01:32,650
There's a Michael Palin section.
33
00:01:32,730 --> 00:01:33,900
Oh, where is it?
34
00:01:33,980 --> 00:01:37,360
I have some very rare,
unsigned Michael Palin books.
35
00:01:37,450 --> 00:01:39,070
Where? Where did you find them?
36
00:01:39,160 --> 00:01:40,966
Eric, where...
I've been trying to find one.
37
00:01:40,990 --> 00:01:42,846
You have to send up for them
from the publisher
38
00:01:42,870 --> 00:01:45,500
because they come
signed from the factory.
39
00:01:45,580 --> 00:01:49,250
Don't worry, Eric, I'll come over
and soil them, personally.
40
00:01:49,330 --> 00:01:53,670
There is a shop in Henley, apparently,
where you can get unsigned copies...
41
00:01:53,750 --> 00:01:56,600
It's called something like Jonkers
or something like that.
42
00:01:57,010 --> 00:01:58,550
I'm gonna vouch for that.
43
00:01:58,630 --> 00:02:00,510
I, Me, Mine by George Harrison.
44
00:02:01,350 --> 00:02:03,366
That's even greater
than the unsigned ones.
45
00:02:03,390 --> 00:02:04,470
On the bottom shelf.
46
00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:05,640
That's actually my...
47
00:02:05,720 --> 00:02:08,820
No, it's not by George Harrison,
it's by somebody very similar.
48
00:02:09,480 --> 00:02:11,610
Uh... John Locke.
49
00:02:11,690 --> 00:02:14,360
- John Locke? Oh.
- John Locke, yeah...
50
00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:16,400
- It's Francis Bacon.
- Francis Bacon?
51
00:02:16,490 --> 00:02:18,240
Francis Bacon, yes.
52
00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:21,796
He actually... No, it was actually
Shakespeare who pretended to be him.
53
00:02:21,820 --> 00:02:26,500
I have a theory that all Francis Bacon's
works were written by Shakespeare.
54
00:02:26,580 --> 00:02:28,370
They were. Oh, clearly, yes.
55
00:02:28,460 --> 00:02:30,790
Do you know he died in my house?
Francis Bacon.
56
00:02:30,880 --> 00:02:32,056
- Francis Bacon?
- It's true.
57
00:02:32,080 --> 00:02:34,340
- What?
- Francis Bacon died in my house.
58
00:02:34,840 --> 00:02:35,986
Not at your mother's...
59
00:02:36,010 --> 00:02:37,696
Thousands of people
died in your house.
60
00:02:37,720 --> 00:02:39,260
By the way, lucky bastard.
61
00:02:39,340 --> 00:02:41,680
Exactly.
62
00:02:43,600 --> 00:02:44,696
He set the tone for it.
63
00:02:44,720 --> 00:02:47,430
He was trying to invent
the TV dinner it appears.
64
00:02:47,930 --> 00:02:53,230
And found a dead chicken,
stuffed it with snow, got a chill.
65
00:02:53,310 --> 00:02:57,740
They put him to bed in the house,
the bed hadn't been heated properly,
66
00:02:57,820 --> 00:02:59,950
he caught pneumonia and he died.
67
00:03:00,030 --> 00:03:01,660
- In your house?
- Which room?
68
00:03:01,740 --> 00:03:03,926
- I don't know. I don't know.
- In the kitchen?
69
00:03:03,950 --> 00:03:06,290
- Francis Bacon the artist?
- No.
70
00:03:10,080 --> 00:03:11,830
Criminal political leader.
71
00:03:11,920 --> 00:03:15,670
The one who's so encouraging, he said,
"We must put nature on the rack...
72
00:03:15,750 --> 00:03:16,880
Oh, you're right.
73
00:03:16,960 --> 00:03:19,380
...and force her
to reveal her secrets."
74
00:03:19,470 --> 00:03:21,550
It's a nice Elizabethan turn of phrase.
75
00:03:21,630 --> 00:03:23,550
That's very good, that's rigorous.
76
00:03:24,470 --> 00:03:26,486
Wasn't the sort who died
on the bed or on the pillow,
77
00:03:26,510 --> 00:03:29,770
one sort of teethes
the secrets out of nature.
78
00:03:32,770 --> 00:03:34,770
Any famous die in your house, Terry?
79
00:03:34,860 --> 00:03:36,230
No, no...
80
00:03:36,320 --> 00:03:38,780
I thought Aristotle
had died in our house,
81
00:03:38,860 --> 00:03:40,530
but it was all bloody rumor.
82
00:03:40,610 --> 00:03:42,450
- He'd never even been there.
- Who?
83
00:03:42,530 --> 00:03:45,450
Aristotle.
84
00:03:45,530 --> 00:03:48,120
Never been anywhere near Kensington.
85
00:03:48,990 --> 00:03:52,330
You know, the estate agents
will tell you anything, won't they?
86
00:03:53,040 --> 00:03:57,000
"Oh, it's very, you'll like this,
Aristotle was here for three years.
87
00:03:57,090 --> 00:03:59,800
Why is it called
"Aristotle Lane" then?
88
00:04:00,460 --> 00:04:02,340
Exactly, exactly.
89
00:04:03,880 --> 00:04:05,010
Absolute cheeks.
90
00:04:05,090 --> 00:04:08,366
I bought it on the basis of Aristotle
Lane, thought it'd be good for me.
91
00:04:08,390 --> 00:04:10,720
It was to toughen me
up a bit intellectually.
92
00:04:10,810 --> 00:04:12,036
He was a bugger for the bottle.
93
00:04:12,060 --> 00:04:14,786
- Bugger for the bottle, yeah.
- He was a bugger for the bottle.
94
00:04:14,810 --> 00:04:17,110
Hobbes was fond of a drum
and René Descartes...
95
00:04:26,160 --> 00:04:27,910
- Wittgenstein?
- Wittgenstein.
96
00:04:27,990 --> 00:04:31,176
It's come up again. The second time
this morning Wittgenstein's come up.
97
00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:33,136
We were talking about
Wittgenstein earlier
98
00:04:33,160 --> 00:04:36,750
and I was asking whether it was
"Wittgenstein" or "Vittgenstein."
99
00:04:36,830 --> 00:04:38,130
What do most people say?
100
00:04:38,210 --> 00:04:41,146
I should imagine it's depends whether
it was in Austria or Cambridge.
101
00:04:41,170 --> 00:04:42,420
Oh, very good answer.
102
00:04:43,170 --> 00:04:46,510
He was the Professor of Philosophy
at Cambridge University in 1940.
103
00:04:46,590 --> 00:04:47,640
Oh, right.
104
00:04:47,720 --> 00:04:51,656
And, also, interesting enough, he went
to school with Hitler in Graz, in Austria,
105
00:04:51,680 --> 00:04:52,730
when a little boy.
106
00:04:52,810 --> 00:04:54,760
There's pictures of him next to Hitler.
107
00:04:56,310 --> 00:04:58,270
That's a bummer for your CV isn't it?
108
00:04:58,360 --> 00:05:00,546
There's some theory that Hitler
developed his anti-Semitism
109
00:05:00,570 --> 00:05:02,820
because he hated Wittgenstein so much.
110
00:05:03,820 --> 00:05:05,926
Just 'cause he liked the boy
next to him, he didn't like.
111
00:05:05,950 --> 00:05:07,926
That's... that's probably
what it's about.
112
00:05:07,950 --> 00:05:12,490
Isn't it sad? Yeah, and Wittgenstein
had a one-handed brother pianist.
113
00:05:13,330 --> 00:05:17,960
He lost his arm in the first World War
and became a concert pianist.
114
00:05:18,040 --> 00:05:19,936
- Oh, great.
- A one-handed concert pianist.
115
00:05:19,960 --> 00:05:23,210
And people like Ravel
wrote special pieces for him.
116
00:05:23,300 --> 00:05:24,380
I love that.
117
00:05:24,470 --> 00:05:28,220
It's like being a one-handed cricketer,
you know, gotta admire their spirit.
118
00:05:29,090 --> 00:05:31,930
I was watching Somerset
playing Glamorgan once
119
00:05:32,010 --> 00:05:36,310
in the pub, Terrace Pub,
Weston-super-Mare,
120
00:05:36,390 --> 00:05:40,020
and the guy next to me was moaning on
about Somerset.
121
00:05:40,730 --> 00:05:43,336
And he was talking about a fellow
who played for his local village team,
122
00:05:43,360 --> 00:05:47,820
he said to me he'd give his right arm
to play for Somerset.
123
00:05:49,740 --> 00:05:55,200
Not that he would've stood out because
they were wooden spoon winners,
124
00:05:55,290 --> 00:05:59,330
you know, bottom of the championship
table, for seven consecutive years.
125
00:06:01,420 --> 00:06:03,170
Why a wooden spoon?
126
00:06:03,250 --> 00:06:06,566
I don't know where that came from.
That's the right expression, isn't it?
127
00:06:06,590 --> 00:06:08,356
- Yes, wooden spoon.
- Yeah, wooden spoon.
128
00:06:08,380 --> 00:06:10,010
From the bottom of a...
129
00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:13,236
Eric, our wooden spoon correspondent.
130
00:06:13,260 --> 00:06:16,060
- It's rhyming slang, Michael.
- What for?
131
00:06:16,140 --> 00:06:18,366
It's cockney rhyming slang
for being fucking bottom.
132
00:06:18,390 --> 00:06:20,490
- Oh. Oh, yes.
- It's not particularly good
133
00:06:20,560 --> 00:06:21,810
cockney rhyming slang.
134
00:06:21,900 --> 00:06:23,246
Fucking bottom wooden spoon.
135
00:06:23,270 --> 00:06:25,360
That's got a certain non-ring to it.
136
00:06:26,150 --> 00:06:27,820
Like Vaticans, remember?
137
00:06:28,280 --> 00:06:29,740
Vatican cities.
138
00:06:29,820 --> 00:06:31,320
- Oh, yes.
- Oh, yes.
139
00:06:34,030 --> 00:06:36,266
They were known as
Bristol cities in the old days.
140
00:06:36,290 --> 00:06:37,540
Yeah, Bristol's.
141
00:06:37,620 --> 00:06:39,516
No, don't worry about the cause of this,
just do it.
142
00:06:39,540 --> 00:06:41,830
And will it. Sorry.
143
00:06:41,920 --> 00:06:43,920
- Who?
- You mean this is not "doing it"?
144
00:06:46,760 --> 00:06:51,260
I think we all have a completely
different feeling about
Meaning of Life.
145
00:06:51,340 --> 00:06:54,260
I think some of it's
the funniest stuff we ever did
146
00:06:54,350 --> 00:06:56,770
and other bits I didn't like at all.
147
00:06:56,850 --> 00:06:59,890
- Yeah.
- And I always felt that the problem was
148
00:06:59,980 --> 00:07:01,850
that we rushed into it.
149
00:07:01,940 --> 00:07:05,456
We really shoulda just stepped back from
Life of Brian for a couple of years,
150
00:07:05,480 --> 00:07:09,376
and then I think something would've come
together that would be more integrated.
151
00:07:09,400 --> 00:07:12,410
We were trying to find a form,
a narrative, weren't we, like,
152
00:07:13,030 --> 00:07:15,136
the holy search
for the grail was a narrative,
153
00:07:15,160 --> 00:07:17,450
Life of Brian was a narrative.
154
00:07:17,540 --> 00:07:21,290
The trouble was it was almost on the
last day in Jamaica
155
00:07:21,370 --> 00:07:22,726
that we came up with the title.
156
00:07:22,750 --> 00:07:25,590
And then it was, "That's it, that's it,
this goes here,"
157
00:07:25,670 --> 00:07:28,066
- because everything then fitted.
- Three days in, actually.
158
00:07:28,090 --> 00:07:33,140
It was three days in
and I came down to breakfast
159
00:07:33,220 --> 00:07:36,100
and everybody was
looking glum and thinking,
160
00:07:36,180 --> 00:07:40,520
and Mike suggested we should
turn it into a TV series.
161
00:07:43,900 --> 00:07:49,990
I thought, "What if I only got,
I've got the script timings, which..."
162
00:07:51,150 --> 00:07:53,110
One of the script girls did.
163
00:07:53,200 --> 00:07:55,370
And I thought,
"What are we worrying about?
164
00:07:55,450 --> 00:08:00,950
We've got 70 minutes
of really great material,
165
00:08:01,040 --> 00:08:04,250
and we only need to write
20 minutes more."
166
00:08:04,630 --> 00:08:09,170
And then that turned around. And Eric
came up with
The Meaning of Life.
167
00:08:09,250 --> 00:08:12,220
And we could say, "the life of man,"
168
00:08:12,300 --> 00:08:15,510
and that was the third,
Wednesday, three days in.
169
00:08:16,010 --> 00:08:19,640
And I know when Terry said that,
Eric looked very surprised,
170
00:08:19,720 --> 00:08:21,850
but I have to say
that's how I remember it,
171
00:08:21,930 --> 00:08:24,350
because I believe
that after a couple of days,
172
00:08:24,440 --> 00:08:28,440
we read this material out, we didn't see
any way of integrating it,
173
00:08:28,520 --> 00:08:31,030
and I'm almost sure that I said,
174
00:08:31,110 --> 00:08:33,490
"Look, guys,
why don't we just forget this,
175
00:08:33,570 --> 00:08:35,780
- Yeah.
- and have a lovely two week holiday,
176
00:08:35,860 --> 00:08:41,250
and then go back to London and say
'We worked our brains to death
177
00:08:41,330 --> 00:08:44,960
and it just didn't work. It's a failure
and we're not gonna make it.'"
178
00:08:45,040 --> 00:08:46,920
And the next morning you came down
179
00:08:47,000 --> 00:08:50,630
because I think you'd been working on it
that night or in the morning...
180
00:08:50,710 --> 00:08:53,920
Well, I just thought, "What have I got
that nobody else has got?"
181
00:08:54,010 --> 00:08:59,430
And I thought, I got the timings
the script girl had done in the thing.
182
00:08:59,510 --> 00:09:02,640
So, I didn't, just came...
183
00:09:02,720 --> 00:09:05,286
I remember sitting out at the table,
do you remember?
184
00:09:05,310 --> 00:09:10,070
Outside the place in Jamaica and all
these guys walking out of the beach
185
00:09:10,150 --> 00:09:11,980
offering to sell us weed.
186
00:09:12,690 --> 00:09:15,256
"No, no, we're writing comedy.
Writing comedy, please."
187
00:09:15,280 --> 00:09:16,820
We should've just taken it.
188
00:09:16,910 --> 00:09:20,080
And the film would've probably made
much better.
189
00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:21,580
But I do remember them.
190
00:09:21,660 --> 00:09:24,346
-I still love the idea,
-Couldn't believe the court case though.
191
00:09:24,370 --> 00:09:26,580
- What?
- Remember the idea of a court case?
192
00:09:26,670 --> 00:09:29,380
The whole thing was being,
taking place within a court.
193
00:09:29,460 --> 00:09:32,880
And, because it was a con
that we had made this film
194
00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:36,220
and we needed to do
Hamlet on an island
out somewhere in Jamaica,
195
00:09:36,300 --> 00:09:38,616
the whole thing was a lie and, ultimately,
we all then,
196
00:09:38,640 --> 00:09:40,236
we're going to be killed at the end.
197
00:09:40,260 --> 00:09:42,036
We were going to be found guilty.
Don't you remember this?
198
00:09:42,060 --> 00:09:43,360
No! I don't remember this.
199
00:09:43,390 --> 00:09:46,060
- Do you remember it, Eric?
- Nope, not at all.
200
00:09:46,140 --> 00:09:48,916
I remember it being more
of a tax deductible, a tax dodge.
201
00:09:48,940 --> 00:09:51,400
- But that was the idea.
- Big tax dodge.
202
00:09:51,480 --> 00:09:54,610
It was a tax dodge,
and we were in court having to justify
203
00:09:54,690 --> 00:09:57,820
why we were playing
Hamlet in Jamaica.
204
00:09:58,450 --> 00:10:00,136
Don't remember that happening
but it's really good.
205
00:10:00,160 --> 00:10:01,830
Do you remember we once?
206
00:10:01,910 --> 00:10:04,620
Do you remember we were once
having a writing meeting
207
00:10:04,700 --> 00:10:06,460
- and somebody came in...
- Yeah.
208
00:10:06,540 --> 00:10:08,290
...from outside and said,
209
00:10:08,370 --> 00:10:13,420
"Guys, they're setting up a corporation
which is going to help with tax,
210
00:10:13,500 --> 00:10:15,210
and they just want a name for it."
211
00:10:15,300 --> 00:10:18,840
And we said, "Call it, 'Evader Tax Inc.'"
212
00:10:20,050 --> 00:10:22,890
And they went back and told
the accountants in New York
213
00:10:22,970 --> 00:10:25,180
- and several of them fainted.
- Yeah.
214
00:10:25,270 --> 00:10:28,390
The fear that adjourned us.
215
00:10:30,100 --> 00:10:32,360
- It was our own company, wasn't it?
- Was it?
216
00:10:35,320 --> 00:10:36,940
- KGB.
- So you remember it
217
00:10:37,030 --> 00:10:39,296
- as being a court case?
- No, it was what Eric was talking about,
218
00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:40,910
in fact, it was a tax dodge.
219
00:10:40,990 --> 00:10:44,590
It was when you could get lots of money
from the government and da da da.
220
00:10:45,370 --> 00:10:47,346
Then we were putting it in a court room,
221
00:10:47,370 --> 00:10:50,870
and we'd the sketches, and each one would
be thrown up as evidence
222
00:10:50,960 --> 00:10:54,460
of why it wasn't a tax dodge
when it obviously was,
223
00:10:54,540 --> 00:10:57,550
and that's why the executions,
224
00:10:57,630 --> 00:11:01,106
we were talking, at one point,
about how each person would be executed,
225
00:11:01,130 --> 00:11:03,576
- how... what you would choose for it.
- Oh, right.
226
00:11:03,600 --> 00:11:08,230
And that ended up with the scene with
Graham being chased by the topless girls.
227
00:11:08,310 --> 00:11:10,060
That was a product of that.
228
00:11:10,140 --> 00:11:12,340
It was also World War Three,
was the other...
229
00:11:12,690 --> 00:11:14,060
I remember that bit.
230
00:11:14,150 --> 00:11:15,746
- Yeah.
- Huh? What do you remember?
231
00:11:15,770 --> 00:11:17,836
World War Three,
I remember we had World War Three,
232
00:11:17,860 --> 00:11:21,740
and it was going to be
sponsored by various corporations.
233
00:11:21,820 --> 00:11:26,240
So people were going into battle carrying,
you know, Nike on their backs,
234
00:11:26,330 --> 00:11:29,790
and huge slogans, "Coca-Cola, bombs."
235
00:11:29,870 --> 00:11:34,170
And that ended up with a very nice
World War Three sketch which Mike wrote,
236
00:11:34,250 --> 00:11:38,630
which is about the prime minister going
into the bunker, the alarm's gone off,
237
00:11:38,710 --> 00:11:40,196
and he comes down,
he's in the bunker, he says,
238
00:11:40,220 --> 00:11:42,156
"Good morning, sir."
"Good morning, I am the Prime Minister"
239
00:11:42,180 --> 00:11:43,930
"Yes, could I just see your pass?"
240
00:11:44,010 --> 00:11:47,720
"Uh, yeah, no, unfortunately,
I left my pass on my desk."
241
00:11:47,810 --> 00:11:50,406
He said, "Well, that's perfectly all
right, sir, I just can't let you in."
242
00:11:50,430 --> 00:11:51,916
"Well, I am the Prime Minister."
243
00:11:51,940 --> 00:11:54,416
"Well, anybody could say that
at this point, couldn't they,
244
00:11:54,440 --> 00:11:56,270
at this particular juncture?"
245
00:11:56,770 --> 00:12:00,990
It's a very funny end, that the Prime
Minister couldn't get into the bunker.
246
00:12:01,070 --> 00:12:03,450
Cause there's a lot
of very good stuff called,
247
00:12:03,530 --> 00:12:05,740
when it was called
Monty Python's Fish Film.
248
00:12:05,820 --> 00:12:07,756
- Yeah.
- And I actually have a script of that.
249
00:12:07,780 --> 00:12:08,880
Have you ever read it?
250
00:12:08,910 --> 00:12:12,516
It was a brilliant, another brilliant
script by Michael and Terry, I think,
251
00:12:12,540 --> 00:12:15,170
where they're on a plane
and they're bombing Dresden.
252
00:12:16,790 --> 00:12:20,130
"Sir, have you seen the rear gunner?"
253
00:12:21,380 --> 00:12:24,680
- Bit of a peach, isn't he?
- Oh, yeah.
254
00:12:25,390 --> 00:12:27,800
"I mean, no seriously,
he's startling beautiful.
255
00:12:27,890 --> 00:12:30,720
I mean, he's got a sort of
otherworldly quality to him.
256
00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:33,416
I don't know,
it's just makes me feel better
257
00:12:33,440 --> 00:12:36,770
in a whole moral and spiritual way,"
he says.
258
00:12:36,860 --> 00:12:39,876
"No, I don't think that's proper in the
RAF, you shouldn't, you know,
259
00:12:39,900 --> 00:12:41,716
this is not really...
we're on a bomber mission.
260
00:12:41,740 --> 00:12:44,336
Alright, of course, I don't mean we should
touch him or anything, I just think,
261
00:12:44,360 --> 00:12:48,780
Isn't it nice to have someone who's such a
peach at the back of the aircraft today?"
262
00:12:50,200 --> 00:12:53,410
And it turns out he's an angel.
They've got an angel in the back.
263
00:12:54,250 --> 00:12:57,016
And then they say, "Wait a minute,
if there's an angel in the back,
264
00:12:57,040 --> 00:12:58,380
did we just die?"
265
00:12:58,460 --> 00:13:00,550
That's clever.
266
00:13:00,630 --> 00:13:02,760
Very clever, we should put that in a film.
267
00:13:03,720 --> 00:13:05,486
There's some smashing stuff in that thing.
268
00:13:05,510 --> 00:13:12,520
We also had an idea at one point that
a spacecraft was going to arrive,
269
00:13:12,600 --> 00:13:17,850
and everyone surrounded the spacecraft
to see what was coming in
270
00:13:17,940 --> 00:13:19,536
because they were people
from another planet.
271
00:13:19,560 --> 00:13:23,506
And they came out and they explained that
they were much more evolved than we were.
272
00:13:23,530 --> 00:13:27,820
They were going to teach us how to live
peacefully together,
273
00:13:27,910 --> 00:13:30,740
and we were all very, very excited,
the crowd outside,
274
00:13:30,830 --> 00:13:36,460
and then the turn around and the door
of their spacecraft had closed on them.
275
00:13:37,620 --> 00:13:42,960
And they couldn't get back in
and they started to bitch at each other.
276
00:13:46,470 --> 00:13:48,390
- Do you remember that?
- No.
277
00:13:48,470 --> 00:13:50,156
- I do remember.
- You do remember?
278
00:13:50,180 --> 00:13:53,600
Yeah, yeah. There must be box files
a mile high with all this stuff.
279
00:13:53,680 --> 00:13:57,690
But we also, Graham and I wrote some
stuff about a mad ayatollah.
280
00:13:57,770 --> 00:13:59,620
- Do you remember any of this?
- Yeah.
281
00:13:59,650 --> 00:14:01,036
And I just remember two things:
282
00:14:01,060 --> 00:14:03,900
First, was he was
going into constant rants
283
00:14:03,980 --> 00:14:08,490
about these disgusting
and decadent Western devices,
284
00:14:08,570 --> 00:14:10,240
like toilet paper, you know.
285
00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:14,450
And the other thing was,
I remember there were British troops
286
00:14:14,540 --> 00:14:16,016
that were caught at some point,
287
00:14:16,040 --> 00:14:18,226
and I remember they were all
going to be tortured to death.
288
00:14:18,250 --> 00:14:22,630
And I remember the regiments
and sergeant major come out of the offices
289
00:14:22,710 --> 00:14:25,356
and saluting, and they said,
"Yes, regimental sergeant major.
290
00:14:25,380 --> 00:14:27,590
Permission to panic, sir?"
291
00:14:30,890 --> 00:14:32,350
That's a very good memory.
292
00:14:32,430 --> 00:14:35,826
No, but we all remember different things.
If anything, extraordinary.
293
00:14:35,850 --> 00:14:39,020
But, I mean, it's interesting,
'cause you were saying
294
00:14:39,100 --> 00:14:41,800
we perhaps rushed into it,
writing
The Meaning of Life,
295
00:14:41,860 --> 00:14:45,690
yet I remember we wrote an awful lot
of stuff over a very long period.
296
00:14:45,780 --> 00:14:47,216
- Very long period.
- But maybe you're right.
297
00:14:47,240 --> 00:14:50,070
Maybe we did start it too early
after
Life of Brian.
298
00:14:50,160 --> 00:14:53,450
Well, we didn't have a theme.
We didn't have an idea.
299
00:14:53,530 --> 00:14:55,766
I mean, we didn't have a theme,
that was the problem.
300
00:14:55,790 --> 00:14:58,636
- We were writing to find a theme.
- We were just writing sketches.
301
00:14:58,660 --> 00:15:01,000
- Yeah.
- And then trying to find the subject
302
00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:05,380
for reading out the sketches,
'cause there was that long expedition
303
00:15:05,460 --> 00:15:09,220
to the Himalayas in search
of the meaning of life.
304
00:15:09,300 --> 00:15:13,680
In search of the meaning of life, and that
was sponsored by Benson and Hedges...
305
00:15:14,100 --> 00:15:16,640
...cigarettes.
306
00:15:18,770 --> 00:15:22,810
This was an idea ahead of its time,
where you get, literally,
307
00:15:22,900 --> 00:15:25,900
people to sponsor things.
Not just product placement.
308
00:15:25,980 --> 00:15:28,440
Smoking a Benson and Hedges.
309
00:15:29,030 --> 00:15:30,966
That's what I thought
was absolutely brilliant,
310
00:15:30,990 --> 00:15:34,410
we could've just paid for the whole film
with all these sponsorships.
311
00:15:34,490 --> 00:15:35,870
Just do it blatantly.
312
00:15:35,950 --> 00:15:38,500
Don't lie, don't be clever about it,
just do it.
313
00:15:38,580 --> 00:15:41,266
But we had that,
remember we wrote a thing ages before,
314
00:15:41,290 --> 00:15:42,806
- I think based on that.
- Yeah, yeah.
315
00:15:42,830 --> 00:15:46,840
It was a BBC Comedy Hour,
or something like that,
316
00:15:46,920 --> 00:15:50,170
all based on the idea there was
sponsorship everywhere in the UK,
317
00:15:50,260 --> 00:15:53,430
including the monarchy;
became the Sony Royal Family.
318
00:15:53,510 --> 00:15:56,720
And every year, one member of the public
319
00:15:56,810 --> 00:16:00,366
would become a member of the Royal Family
if they sort of tick the right boxes
320
00:16:00,390 --> 00:16:03,376
and became the Sony Princess
or something like that, just for a year,
321
00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:05,456
and then they go back
to being ordinary again.
322
00:16:05,480 --> 00:16:09,440
You know, it's an idea ahead of its time.
And now, of course,
323
00:16:09,530 --> 00:16:14,410
Back to
The Meaning of Life, I remember
reading the script we'd written
324
00:16:14,490 --> 00:16:18,200
on the plane, going over, and we,
I think it was based on Buñuel's...
325
00:16:19,450 --> 00:16:21,150
Discreet Charm of the Bourgeoisie.
326
00:16:21,370 --> 00:16:25,540
And it was repeated,
it kept on repeating, and I just thought,
327
00:16:25,630 --> 00:16:27,230
"No, this is not going to work."
328
00:16:29,840 --> 00:16:35,050
It was Henry Jaglom at Cannes who,
when
Meaning of Life played in Cannes,
329
00:16:35,140 --> 00:16:37,930
I remember Henry Jaglom,
remember Henry Jaglom?
330
00:16:38,010 --> 00:16:40,310
- Vaguely.
- He made several films,
331
00:16:40,390 --> 00:16:44,270
he was also sort of the amanuensis
of Orson Wells in his latter days.
332
00:16:44,350 --> 00:16:47,810
And Henry came out saying it was
the finest work Python had done,
333
00:16:47,900 --> 00:16:49,746
the best work.
I remember sitting in the car,
334
00:16:49,770 --> 00:16:52,240
I think a couple of others
were in there, arguing,
335
00:16:52,320 --> 00:16:53,836
"What are you talking about, Henry?"
336
00:16:53,860 --> 00:16:58,490
But he was so convinced
that the bad bits worked brilliantly
337
00:16:58,580 --> 00:17:01,750
because they amplified the great moments.
338
00:17:02,000 --> 00:17:03,436
And he thought it was just
a perfect balance.
339
00:17:03,460 --> 00:17:06,556
And it was the only film of ours that
ever won anything at Cannes, wasn't it?
340
00:17:06,580 --> 00:17:10,590
Grand Prix du Jury.
341
00:17:10,670 --> 00:17:14,590
Well, actually, I remember that very well
because I went to Cannes
342
00:17:14,670 --> 00:17:18,010
I think with you, Terry,
and John Goldstone,
343
00:17:18,090 --> 00:17:21,770
you got up on stage
and you announced that, right there,
344
00:17:21,850 --> 00:17:25,246
right at the opening conference, that you
were confident we were going to win
345
00:17:25,270 --> 00:17:27,060
because we bribed the jurors.
346
00:17:28,690 --> 00:17:31,070
And this was in all the French papers.
347
00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:35,490
It would be announced, it would get
the payoffs just as soon as we won.
348
00:17:35,570 --> 00:17:39,280
Well, the chairman of the jury was
the person who was releasing our film.
349
00:17:39,370 --> 00:17:41,240
Oh, no, seriously?
350
00:17:41,330 --> 00:17:44,410
- Yes.
- Oh, how wonderful.
351
00:17:44,950 --> 00:17:46,410
All right, enough of that.
352
00:17:46,620 --> 00:17:50,566
And at the end, no, but at the end when we
won, Terry got on stage to thank the jury
353
00:17:50,590 --> 00:17:54,640
and told them that their money was taped
behind the pipes in the gentleman's room.
354
00:17:57,430 --> 00:18:00,930
And John and I had "Eat more pork,"
on our...
355
00:18:02,890 --> 00:18:04,930
A stained shirt, brown coats, yeah.
356
00:18:06,180 --> 00:18:07,366
There still is that great,
357
00:18:07,390 --> 00:18:09,456
Isn't that the picture
of all of us on the beach,
358
00:18:09,480 --> 00:18:11,416
- with our breasts...?
- Oh, right, yes.
359
00:18:11,440 --> 00:18:13,940
- That was a previous year, I think.
- Was it?
360
00:18:14,030 --> 00:18:15,680
That's when I had my big breasts.
361
00:18:15,740 --> 00:18:18,240
- Was Graham there?
- Yeah, Graham was there.
362
00:18:18,490 --> 00:18:20,426
With a knotted handkerchief
I seem to remember.
363
00:18:20,450 --> 00:18:23,080
- That's right, yeah.
- Quite small breasts.
364
00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:26,830
I do remember that, really,
A Fish Called Wanda came out of it
365
00:18:26,910 --> 00:18:31,210
because I felt that some of the stuff,
like the liver donor,
366
00:18:31,290 --> 00:18:33,140
you know, which is wonderfully funny.
367
00:18:33,210 --> 00:18:35,066
I mean, just as good as anything we did.
368
00:18:35,090 --> 00:18:36,380
It was fantastic, yeah.
369
00:18:36,460 --> 00:18:39,356
And some of it was great, but I felt there
was a whole lot of it that wasn't good,
370
00:18:39,380 --> 00:18:41,986
and I thought there was better material
that had not got in the film,
371
00:18:42,010 --> 00:18:43,076
and I remember thinking,
372
00:18:43,100 --> 00:18:48,310
"Well, I now want to do a film where
I have at least 40 percent of the say
373
00:18:48,390 --> 00:18:51,940
and not a sixth of the say."
Do you see what I mean?
374
00:18:52,020 --> 00:18:54,940
That's when I sat down
with Charlie Crichton,
375
00:18:55,020 --> 00:18:58,466
who I met many years before,
and we started to knock together the plot,
376
00:18:58,490 --> 00:19:00,360
but it came out of that feeling of,
377
00:19:00,450 --> 00:19:03,160
that I didn't want
to be out-voted anymore from...
378
00:19:04,580 --> 00:19:08,580
I do think that
Meaning of Life had,
really had some of our very best things.
379
00:19:08,660 --> 00:19:10,396
- Oh, absolutely.
- Just what we didn't have
380
00:19:10,420 --> 00:19:14,880
was that kid of narrative which kind,
of the knights chasing, or...
381
00:19:14,960 --> 00:19:18,606
Brian being chased, which kind of held it
all together during the quieter bits.
382
00:19:18,630 --> 00:19:23,390
I think I figured out at one point that
we were short of at least one rewrite,
383
00:19:23,470 --> 00:19:26,180
and if we had taken the idea
of the meaning of life
384
00:19:26,260 --> 00:19:32,440
and put on it the seven ages of man,
we could've gone from birth to death
385
00:19:32,520 --> 00:19:36,690
using the same character, even though
we'd gone backwards in time, in and out.
386
00:19:36,770 --> 00:19:38,820
We could've told the story
of one person
387
00:19:38,900 --> 00:19:42,030
and there was a possibility
of some kind of plot.
388
00:19:42,110 --> 00:19:45,950
If you don't have some sort of a story
or narrative holding it together,
389
00:19:46,030 --> 00:19:52,170
it sort of rises or falls
on the quality of every single scene.
390
00:19:52,250 --> 00:19:54,170
- Yeah.
- So that the bad stuff
391
00:19:54,250 --> 00:19:56,090
sticks out much more.
392
00:19:57,590 --> 00:19:59,380
What do you call the bad stuff?
393
00:20:00,010 --> 00:20:03,220
I never thought we did the World War I,
394
00:20:04,300 --> 00:20:07,986
presenting the clocks and watches,
I never thought that was very well done.
395
00:20:08,010 --> 00:20:09,996
I didn't think it was a very strong idea.
396
00:20:10,020 --> 00:20:12,940
- Oh, yeah.
- And then that strange fishy thing
397
00:20:13,020 --> 00:20:15,610
I thought was weird without being funny.
398
00:20:15,690 --> 00:20:20,150
- But that's an icon.
- That's an image, that's iconic.
399
00:20:20,240 --> 00:20:23,176
It turns up on YouTube and everything,
and on the web, always.
400
00:20:23,200 --> 00:20:24,796
- It's huge.
- There's something about that
401
00:20:24,820 --> 00:20:27,450
that is just so surreal,
so inexplicable.
402
00:20:27,530 --> 00:20:30,700
People just find it wonderful,
it's interesting that one.
403
00:20:30,790 --> 00:20:32,306
That basic thing about
The Meaning of Life,
404
00:20:32,330 --> 00:20:34,930
as opposed to all our other films,
is it's a musical.
405
00:20:35,040 --> 00:20:36,840
It actually has eight numbers in it,
406
00:20:36,920 --> 00:20:40,420
which is already more that any usual
picture would normally have.
407
00:20:40,510 --> 00:20:42,946
There's nothing better than,
"Every Sperm is Sacred."
408
00:20:42,970 --> 00:20:44,880
Just the way it's shot and filmed
409
00:20:44,970 --> 00:20:46,446
- with song and dance.
- Yeah, that's true.
410
00:20:46,470 --> 00:20:48,600
It's just an extraordinary moment.
411
00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:52,980
It was voted
the best film musical number...
412
00:20:53,060 --> 00:20:56,100
- Really?
- ...by Rotten Tomatoes, I think it was.
413
00:20:57,650 --> 00:21:02,650
It was nominated for, we rarely got
nominated for anything at BAFTA,
414
00:21:02,740 --> 00:21:05,450
but it was nominated
for best song at BAFTA,
415
00:21:05,530 --> 00:21:08,450
and they played
the three songs that were winners.
416
00:21:08,530 --> 00:21:12,540
And when "Every Sperm is Sacred,"
little clip came on,
417
00:21:12,620 --> 00:21:14,660
the place just erupted,
it was wonderful,
418
00:21:14,750 --> 00:21:18,540
and then, "The winner is,
'Up Where We Belong,'
419
00:21:18,630 --> 00:21:19,976
from
Officer and a Gentleman."
420
00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:25,430
So the same theme, but you could hear
the sort of total groan in the audience.
421
00:21:25,510 --> 00:21:27,360
It was just, you know, it was just...
422
00:21:27,760 --> 00:21:30,470
Well, maybe we should do
The Meaning of Life, Part Two,
423
00:21:30,970 --> 00:21:34,680
with all the stuff that wasn't good enough
to put in the other shows.
424
00:21:34,770 --> 00:21:38,940
I think we made a big mistake,
I think we tried to write in Jamaica.
425
00:21:39,020 --> 00:21:41,970
I think we should just
sit on the beach and film in Jamaica.
426
00:21:42,280 --> 00:21:45,450
Or maybe read the sketches
in the situation where they were.
427
00:21:45,530 --> 00:21:49,240
A little bit of deck chairs. You know,
little cocktails with umbrellas on.
428
00:21:49,320 --> 00:21:51,346
I think that could be
a very nice location.
429
00:21:51,370 --> 00:21:53,820
You would go back to St. Ann's Bay,
remember then?
430
00:21:54,040 --> 00:21:56,806
And all those carved phalluses
they used to bring around. You remember?
431
00:21:56,830 --> 00:21:58,580
- The what?
- Weren't they real?
432
00:21:58,670 --> 00:22:01,750
Uh, sorry, that was just mine.
433
00:22:01,840 --> 00:22:03,226
-Also, along with the weed,
-What?
434
00:22:03,250 --> 00:22:05,670
- They brought great carved...
- Lemon...
435
00:22:06,130 --> 00:22:09,050
...carved phalluses.
"You want one of these?" Remember?
436
00:22:09,140 --> 00:22:10,190
- Want a dick?
- Card?
437
00:22:10,260 --> 00:22:12,890
- No, "carved" phalluses.
- Oh, carved.
438
00:22:12,970 --> 00:22:14,496
- I thought you said "card."
- Oh, sorry.
439
00:22:14,520 --> 00:22:16,156
- I thought he said "card."
- Teeth.
440
00:22:16,180 --> 00:22:18,416
- Carved phalluses. Do you remember now?
- No.
441
00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:20,940
Because you bought one.
You bought that huge shape.
442
00:22:21,940 --> 00:22:24,900
'Cause I remember you could get
BBC 2 and BBC 1.
443
00:22:25,860 --> 00:22:27,010
No, I do remember them.
444
00:22:28,200 --> 00:22:30,070
I still got mine at home.
445
00:22:30,950 --> 00:22:32,240
Watch, I'm sitting on it.
446
00:22:32,410 --> 00:22:33,660
My wife won't give it up.
447
00:22:37,460 --> 00:22:39,936
They didn't vibrate in those days though,
did they?
448
00:22:39,960 --> 00:22:42,766
They should unpack all the boxes
of all that old material.
449
00:22:42,790 --> 00:22:44,976
I mean, because it's obviously
some good stuff.
450
00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:47,986
Some of the stuff Eric was remembering
I'd completely forgotten.
451
00:22:48,010 --> 00:22:50,616
Well, the fish film is very good,
John Goldstone gave that to me.
452
00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:52,366
If you read that,
you'll have a lot of laughs.
453
00:22:52,390 --> 00:22:55,470
And some of it was in the movie
and some of it wasn't.
454
00:22:55,560 --> 00:22:57,906
And I guess it was our first draft
called, it was called
455
00:22:57,930 --> 00:23:00,190
Monty Python's Fish Film.
456
00:23:00,520 --> 00:23:03,626
Because there's much, much more material
written for
Meaning of Life
457
00:23:03,650 --> 00:23:05,900
-and not used,
-Oh, absolutely.
458
00:23:05,980 --> 00:23:08,570
Probably about three times
as much as we put in.
459
00:23:08,650 --> 00:23:10,256
I found a wonderful cricket sketch.
460
00:23:10,280 --> 00:23:13,180
I think it might've been the last,
he must have written it.
461
00:23:14,740 --> 00:23:18,040
- Someone nudges him, "Oh, sorry."
- That's right.
462
00:23:18,120 --> 00:23:21,460
It's, and Eric's doing
Peter West, I think.
463
00:23:22,080 --> 00:23:24,590
Graham and I wrote "A Fish Song."
464
00:23:24,670 --> 00:23:26,316
"I'd really rather care for fish,
465
00:23:26,340 --> 00:23:28,460
in fact they are my favorite dish.
466
00:23:29,090 --> 00:23:32,390
I lunch on tench and I dine on cod,
467
00:23:32,470 --> 00:23:35,640
and I break my fast on a gastropod."
468
00:23:37,720 --> 00:23:39,560
There you are, that's good.
469
00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:41,826
So do you think
we should do another film together?
470
00:23:41,850 --> 00:23:45,270
I think we should sit on the beach
at St. Ann's Bay together.
471
00:23:45,360 --> 00:23:46,910
I think we may agree with that.
472
00:23:46,980 --> 00:23:49,490
We'll ask for a studio
that will give us...
473
00:23:51,110 --> 00:23:54,490
a month on the beach
somewhere nice next February,
474
00:23:54,570 --> 00:23:58,290
and if a movie comes out of it,
the studio can have it.
475
00:23:58,370 --> 00:24:01,710
I'd need to pay off my mortgage,
so I'd love to do another film.
476
00:24:02,500 --> 00:24:04,556
I think we should get Graham,
somehow or other.
477
00:24:04,580 --> 00:24:06,856
This should be the challenge
for the scientific community.
478
00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:08,986
- To recreate Graham.
- We could get someone to channel him.
479
00:24:09,010 --> 00:24:10,276
- That'd be wonderful.
- No, but that's...
480
00:24:10,300 --> 00:24:12,356
Or we take it with you.
Take a medium with us.
481
00:24:12,380 --> 00:24:16,470
The remake of
Holy Grail
with the holy relics.
482
00:24:16,550 --> 00:24:18,010
Let's take the great idea.
483
00:24:18,310 --> 00:24:20,156
Because there's enough
recorded material of Graham
484
00:24:20,180 --> 00:24:22,230
that he could always be there speaking.
485
00:24:22,310 --> 00:24:24,100
I like the idea of having a medium
486
00:24:24,190 --> 00:24:26,810
who just has no sense
of comic timing at all.
487
00:24:27,520 --> 00:24:29,900
It's got Graham's voice,
"Oh, hello."
488
00:24:31,070 --> 00:24:33,860
But not able to do anything funny.
489
00:24:35,450 --> 00:24:36,660
Poor Graham.
490
00:24:36,740 --> 00:24:39,490
If it's Graham's sense of timing,
he won't show up.
491
00:24:39,580 --> 00:24:41,910
No, no,
492
00:24:43,080 --> 00:24:46,630
That's right, that's very funny.
He'd be late for meetings, wouldn't he?
493
00:24:47,540 --> 00:24:50,960
"No, he's coming in a minute.
All right, he'll be down shortly."
494
00:24:51,050 --> 00:24:52,106
"He'll be here in a minute."
495
00:24:52,130 --> 00:24:54,236
And when the medium
started to go like this,
496
00:24:54,260 --> 00:24:57,680
you would know it was
finally channeling Graham.
497
00:25:00,140 --> 00:25:03,600
And the medium,
"Oh, I've got Norman Wisdom by mistake."
498
00:25:05,310 --> 00:25:08,036
If we did anything,
I think it would have to be about death.
499
00:25:08,060 --> 00:25:10,046
Because I spent three years writing
"Death: The Musical,"
500
00:25:10,070 --> 00:25:12,220
and had to stop it
because nobody wanted it.
501
00:25:12,280 --> 00:25:14,200
It's really a Python subject, death.
502
00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:16,610
- It's a very big one, you know.
- Yeah.
503
00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:20,790
As a tax write-off, too,
you know, obviously.
504
00:25:21,620 --> 00:25:25,370
I like this idea. I think a month on
the beach writing a movie would be fun.
505
00:25:25,540 --> 00:25:27,226
Or in prison or something like that.
506
00:25:27,250 --> 00:25:29,960
Somewhere where we can be secure.
507
00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:33,300
We have to be there, no one could leave.
508
00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:36,776
Because people always
leave meetings early.
509
00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:38,680
It should be a short prison sentence.
510
00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:41,696
I'm always surprised at how much
good material there is around,
511
00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:44,180
that you suddenly remember
that it was not done.
512
00:25:44,270 --> 00:25:49,020
I mean, I remember Graham
and I wrote a sketch
513
00:25:49,650 --> 00:25:54,690
which was originally intended
to be in
The Holy Grail.
514
00:25:55,440 --> 00:26:00,990
And if I remember correctly, ten percent
of the first draft of
The Holy Grail
515
00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:03,540
actually made it into the final movie.
516
00:26:04,450 --> 00:26:08,330
And this sketch was done in
the final six programs that I wasn't in.
517
00:26:09,330 --> 00:26:10,580
- Oh, yes.
- Yeah, yeah.
518
00:26:10,670 --> 00:26:13,000
- Buying an ant.
- Buying an ant, yes.
519
00:26:14,550 --> 00:26:17,930
So it's extraordinary
what material is lying around.
520
00:26:23,890 --> 00:26:24,890
Next question.
521
00:26:28,060 --> 00:26:29,770
That was a wonderful pause.
522
00:26:30,350 --> 00:26:32,360
Right there we'd run out, hadn't we?
523
00:26:32,980 --> 00:26:36,150
"Yes, now the other thing,"
524
00:26:40,110 --> 00:26:42,870
Our growing years were dreadful,
we had rationing,
525
00:26:42,950 --> 00:26:45,176
you know, it was freezing,
there wasn't enough food,
526
00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:46,910
and, you know, it was cold.
527
00:26:47,000 --> 00:26:49,960
But then, it gradually, bit by bit...
528
00:26:50,040 --> 00:26:54,920
I remember having ice on the walls,
inside walls, in my bedroom.
529
00:26:55,000 --> 00:26:58,510
Not just on the window pane, but ice.
530
00:26:58,590 --> 00:27:00,590
You were lucky, we never had ice at all.
531
00:27:02,350 --> 00:27:04,500
- We had ice right up our legs.
- Literally.
532
00:27:05,680 --> 00:27:07,786
We lived in a fridge
in the middle of the road.
533
00:27:07,810 --> 00:27:11,980
And to think after every major war there's
a time when there's sort of a, you know,
534
00:27:12,060 --> 00:27:15,440
a renaissance, if you like.
People come in and change things.
535
00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:18,900
You know, it happened in the 20s
after the first World War.
536
00:27:18,990 --> 00:27:22,346
There was people... dance and there's
people going, "Have a good time."
537
00:27:22,370 --> 00:27:26,240
They want to throw off warfare and being
in the army and all the dullness.
538
00:27:26,330 --> 00:27:28,290
We were a very fortunate generation
539
00:27:28,370 --> 00:27:30,660
and we just came along
from all over England,
540
00:27:30,750 --> 00:27:33,226
and people were doing various things
we didn't know,
541
00:27:33,250 --> 00:27:36,250
but all our contemporaries like,
Floyd and the Stones,
542
00:27:36,340 --> 00:27:37,550
and, you know, Beatles.
543
00:27:37,630 --> 00:27:40,776
That was all going on at the same time
as we were doing our thing,
544
00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:42,260
which was being comedy.
545
00:27:42,340 --> 00:27:44,800
But there was an enormous amount
of great comedy,
546
00:27:44,890 --> 00:27:47,390
and a lot of it came out
of those concert groups,
547
00:27:47,470 --> 00:27:49,600
- what were they called? ENSA.
- ENSA.
548
00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:53,400
Well, a lot of the great comedians
of the 50s, 60s, 70s
549
00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:55,730
had actually been
traveling around the world
550
00:27:55,820 --> 00:27:59,240
entertaining British troops,
and we all had an enormous affection
551
00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:01,570
for musical,
as it was called in those days.
552
00:28:01,650 --> 00:28:05,950
You know, the Frankie Howerd's
and the Morecambe and Wise's.
553
00:28:06,030 --> 00:28:09,330
The Goon Shows came out of the
second World War.
554
00:28:09,410 --> 00:28:12,870
They all sort of, well, Milligan, Secombe,
I think fought together.
555
00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:18,880
So in the middle of all this awfulness,
humor was sort of really important.
556
00:28:18,960 --> 00:28:22,630
There was a kind of resentment,
wasn't there, of the governing class,
557
00:28:22,720 --> 00:28:26,010
feeling that they were idiots
and scheming idiots?
558
00:28:26,100 --> 00:28:28,060
And that came out
in The Goon Show.
559
00:28:29,010 --> 00:28:34,100
It was a time, and that was just a time,
when
Beyond the Fringe happened.
560
00:28:34,190 --> 00:28:37,480
So that you had the great old
musical tradition,
561
00:28:37,570 --> 00:28:41,190
and the best people there, Max Wall,
you know, it was wonderful.
562
00:28:41,280 --> 00:28:43,336
Tommy Cooper,
the funniest man they'll ever be.
563
00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:47,320
You had that, and you suddenly had
Peter Cook and Dudley Moore
564
00:28:47,410 --> 00:28:52,000
and Alan Bennett and Jonathan Miller
and John Bird and John Fortune
565
00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:54,556
and Eleanor Bron,
so they're all coming in at the same time,
566
00:28:54,580 --> 00:28:58,000
- so it was an extraordinary...
- They came about 15 years
567
00:28:58,090 --> 00:28:59,226
after the war ended, wasn't it?
568
00:28:59,250 --> 00:29:02,800
Forty-five, and
Beyond the Fringe
was 1960, something like that?
569
00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:04,906
- Sixty-two, I think.
- 'Cause after the first World War
570
00:29:04,930 --> 00:29:08,076
everything suddenly went wild,
you know, immediately afterward.
571
00:29:08,100 --> 00:29:12,310
It was almost as though, I think
our generation, my parent's generation,
572
00:29:12,390 --> 00:29:16,440
was so bruised by two World Wars
and a major depression
573
00:29:16,520 --> 00:29:17,916
that they just didn't, you know,
574
00:29:17,940 --> 00:29:19,876
didn't know what to do
after the second World War.
575
00:29:19,900 --> 00:29:24,200
Very nervous of any sort
of expression of how you were feeling,
576
00:29:24,280 --> 00:29:27,620
anything like that was dug in,
austerity, keep quiet,
577
00:29:27,700 --> 00:29:29,800
you know, let's hope
nothing awful happens.
578
00:29:31,330 --> 00:29:34,096
The biggest change is, of course,
the arrival of television,
579
00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:35,960
which made an enormous difference.
580
00:29:36,040 --> 00:29:39,420
I mean, it meant that the Vaudeville
people couldn't carry on.
581
00:29:39,500 --> 00:29:42,526
You could do your acts in Vaudeville
for the rest of your life.
582
00:29:42,550 --> 00:29:45,646
But one night on television they say,
"What you doing next week?"
583
00:29:45,670 --> 00:29:48,590
So there was a whole change over
of types of comedian,
584
00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:52,140
and it made it possible
for people like us to get in there.
585
00:29:52,220 --> 00:29:55,366
It's very strange because in England,
unlike the rest of Europe,
586
00:29:55,390 --> 00:29:57,490
television is what people wanted to be in.
587
00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:00,770
If you were Italian or if you were Spanish
or if you were French,
588
00:30:00,860 --> 00:30:02,460
then you wanted to be in movies.
589
00:30:02,690 --> 00:30:07,240
And the television
was considered rather second rate,
590
00:30:07,320 --> 00:30:11,280
and sort of people, politicians got
their friends into easy sinecures there.
591
00:30:11,370 --> 00:30:16,040
Right? So television in this country
was always that heart of our arch.
592
00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:18,476
But the style of humor changed,
and I think that had to do with education,
593
00:30:18,500 --> 00:30:21,210
university.
People suddenly going to university.
594
00:30:21,290 --> 00:30:24,960
So there was one kind of comedy,
it was like the musical comedy.
595
00:30:25,050 --> 00:30:28,526
And suddenly this wave after the war,
it happened in America the same thing,
596
00:30:28,550 --> 00:30:29,970
suddenly, after the war,
597
00:30:30,050 --> 00:30:35,220
You know, suddenly there's Mort Sahl,
Lenny Bruce, intellectual comedians,
598
00:30:35,310 --> 00:30:37,456
and that's where, you know,
Beyond the Fridge came out of.
599
00:30:37,480 --> 00:30:40,600
But oddly always
with this great respect for the old.
600
00:30:40,690 --> 00:30:41,770
Oh, totally.
601
00:30:41,860 --> 00:30:46,150
And Python was so lucky,
I hadn't realized that we were
602
00:30:46,240 --> 00:30:53,240
on the first, the first week
that BBC went into color.
603
00:30:53,330 --> 00:30:54,910
Yeah, we were very fortunate.
604
00:30:54,990 --> 00:30:56,976
- And we would...
- Is that so? I never realized that.
605
00:30:57,000 --> 00:30:58,250
It's absolutely true.
606
00:30:58,330 --> 00:30:59,580
Yeah, the first,
607
00:30:59,670 --> 00:31:04,960
so we would've been made in black and
white if, you know, for BBC 1.
608
00:31:05,300 --> 00:31:08,550
Someone said to me the other day
about Silly Walks.
609
00:31:08,630 --> 00:31:10,446
How could we write something like that?
610
00:31:10,470 --> 00:31:14,180
And their point was,
that it now would seem very offensive
611
00:31:14,260 --> 00:31:17,770
- to people with disabilities.
- That's right.
612
00:31:17,850 --> 00:31:21,900
My point was that the way you did it
was just, it was a wonderfully,
613
00:31:21,980 --> 00:31:25,820
it wasn't, it wasn't sort of awkward,
it was incredibly smooth.
614
00:31:25,900 --> 00:31:28,250
So you're absolutely,
actually, rather athletic.
615
00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:30,676
Wonderful, the bottom half
of the body only moving.
616
00:31:30,700 --> 00:31:34,740
When other people came in,
like the lady who served the tea,
617
00:31:34,830 --> 00:31:37,466
and the tray all shook, then it did
look like you were sort of
618
00:31:37,490 --> 00:31:40,096
- making a joke about disability.
- I remember John and Graham
619
00:31:40,120 --> 00:31:44,040
ringing us up and,
we were writing together,
620
00:31:44,130 --> 00:31:46,960
and John and Graham rang us up and said,
621
00:31:47,050 --> 00:31:50,630
"We're having this problem
with this sketch,
622
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:54,800
'The Ministry of Silly Walks,'
would you like to write it?"
623
00:31:54,970 --> 00:31:56,510
- Really?
- Yes.
624
00:31:56,600 --> 00:31:58,746
And so we wrote them
"Ministry of Silly Walks."
625
00:31:58,770 --> 00:31:59,930
I know you did.
626
00:32:00,270 --> 00:32:05,610
I think you knew that you were
going to do such a grotesque walk,
627
00:32:05,690 --> 00:32:10,110
that everybody would laugh at it
and nobody would listen to the script.
628
00:32:11,610 --> 00:32:13,756
It's extraordinary how
we remember things differently.
629
00:32:13,780 --> 00:32:17,160
I always assumed that you two
had written that sketch,
630
00:32:17,240 --> 00:32:21,210
and I remember practicing
the movements in the corridor
631
00:32:21,290 --> 00:32:23,870
of my little flat which,
believe it or not,
632
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:26,130
was in Basil Street, extraordinary fact.
633
00:32:26,210 --> 00:32:29,420
And I remember, you know,
figuring out the movements.
634
00:32:29,510 --> 00:32:32,630
And I also remember,
vis a vis,
what Mike just said,
635
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:36,760
that the week after it went out
and everyone thought it was so funny,
636
00:32:36,850 --> 00:32:40,350
I was walking along Oxford Street
and I bumped into a guy called
637
00:32:40,430 --> 00:32:45,230
Con Mahoney, who was the head
of BBC Radio Light Entertainment,
638
00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:49,230
and he talked about the sketch
and was I not worried...
639
00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:51,490
- Ah.
- ...that we were making fun of people
640
00:32:51,570 --> 00:32:54,450
with physical disabilities, seriously?
641
00:32:54,530 --> 00:32:59,200
And I suddenly thought,
"This is so weird to have this objection."
642
00:32:59,280 --> 00:33:02,346
But Mike's saying that people
would be more concerned about it now.
643
00:33:02,370 --> 00:33:05,960
I think that's the problem,
it's so easy to cause offense now.
644
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:08,646
At least it was a bit more difficult
when we were doing Python.
645
00:33:08,670 --> 00:33:11,720
The thing is you could get away
with what's going on in Syria,
646
00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:12,800
we can't stop that.
647
00:33:12,880 --> 00:33:17,800
But we can stop people using certain words
like I read when I got back recently,
648
00:33:17,890 --> 00:33:22,140
I read a piece in
The Spectator,
and he was talking about the fact
649
00:33:22,220 --> 00:33:25,690
that someone had got into trouble
by talking about a transsexual
650
00:33:25,770 --> 00:33:30,230
because transsexual persons like to be
called transsexual persons,
651
00:33:30,320 --> 00:33:32,966
and not being called transsexuals.
Do you see what I mean?
652
00:33:32,990 --> 00:33:38,660
There's an extraordinary sensitivity
to a single word or phrase,
653
00:33:38,740 --> 00:33:43,000
meanwhile, the most appalling things
are going on all over the world
654
00:33:43,080 --> 00:33:45,886
- that nobody can stop.
- Yes, well they can't really help that.
655
00:33:45,910 --> 00:33:47,936
At least we can stop people
saying the N-word.
656
00:33:47,960 --> 00:33:50,130
That's something, you know,
657
00:33:50,210 --> 00:33:54,340
but what would we do about serious,
rather, indefinite at the moment.
658
00:33:54,420 --> 00:33:57,920
- We're hoping for developments.
- Would comedy help in that situation?
659
00:33:59,260 --> 00:34:01,260
Sorry,
660
00:34:01,350 --> 00:34:03,930
That was like what we did
in
Life of Brian,
661
00:34:04,020 --> 00:34:07,480
when Brian says,
"I'm not a Roman, I'm a Jew,
662
00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:11,820
kike, sheeny, Red,"
we used every word you could use.
663
00:34:11,900 --> 00:34:14,666
And said, "And I'm proud of it."
I mean, I thought that was really great.
664
00:34:14,690 --> 00:34:18,450
And that's the problem
with what goes on now with language,
665
00:34:18,530 --> 00:34:22,330
it's people are so uncertain of which
words cause offense and which don't,
666
00:34:22,410 --> 00:34:25,120
so people tiptoe around
language all the time.
667
00:34:25,200 --> 00:34:27,516
Am I right in thinking
that the word "homosexual"
668
00:34:27,540 --> 00:34:30,250
is now thought of
as being vaguely unpleasant?
669
00:34:31,460 --> 00:34:32,670
It's rather serious.
670
00:34:32,750 --> 00:34:35,510
I think, I think just the act, John.
671
00:34:37,970 --> 00:34:40,340
I think the word itself
is perfectly innocuous.
672
00:34:43,100 --> 00:34:44,560
You could be on television.
673
00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:46,060
Oh, he is on television.
674
00:34:46,140 --> 00:34:47,810
He is on television.
675
00:34:48,730 --> 00:34:51,650
Satirizing the modern world
is really complex, I think.
676
00:34:51,730 --> 00:34:53,150
Because it's so diffused.
677
00:34:53,230 --> 00:34:55,690
It's so unfocused, everything, you know,
678
00:34:55,780 --> 00:34:56,876
where there's a class system.
679
00:34:56,900 --> 00:34:59,046
There's no class system
in the way there was before
680
00:34:59,070 --> 00:35:01,910
where you could actually aim
very clearly at things.
681
00:35:01,990 --> 00:35:05,160
It's so undefined,
and that's what I think is interesting.
682
00:35:05,790 --> 00:35:07,426
A year ago I was talking to Stoppard.
683
00:35:07,450 --> 00:35:10,226
We were talking about, "Oh, is there
a way of doing another
Brazil?"
684
00:35:10,250 --> 00:35:13,670
Because
Brazil is the now-now,
even though it was done in '84.
685
00:35:13,750 --> 00:35:16,686
And it's like, he said, "I don't know
how to get to grips with it.
686
00:35:16,710 --> 00:35:19,010
What is it you actually start
dealing with it?"
687
00:35:19,090 --> 00:35:22,510
And I think that's one
of the big problems,
688
00:35:22,590 --> 00:35:25,010
it was easier when
the class system was clearer,
689
00:35:25,100 --> 00:35:27,616
when everything was in its place.
Then you can pull it apart.
690
00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:31,626
That's why I've always thought, you know,
a medieval film, like
Brian, is very good.
691
00:35:31,650 --> 00:35:33,336
You've got a king,
you've got a knight, you know,
692
00:35:33,360 --> 00:35:35,416
- You know where you are.
- There's archetypes, stereotypes,
693
00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:36,756
and you can deal with them.
694
00:35:36,780 --> 00:35:40,360
- Now it's really hard and it's...
- But don't you think that's to do
695
00:35:40,450 --> 00:35:41,506
with us being younger?
696
00:35:41,530 --> 00:35:43,796
I mean, when you're young, you do
write sketches.
697
00:35:43,820 --> 00:35:46,006
You have a very simple
black and white view. That things...
698
00:35:46,030 --> 00:35:48,556
Whereas when you get older
everything becomes grayer,
699
00:35:48,580 --> 00:35:52,186
because you can't really, you have to be
nice about other people, their viewpoints.
700
00:35:52,210 --> 00:35:53,606
Whereas when you're young,
you're really,
701
00:35:53,630 --> 00:35:56,460
you know, really know good people
and bad people.
702
00:35:56,550 --> 00:35:58,526
You're on the side of good things
and anti bad things.
703
00:35:58,550 --> 00:35:59,550
Yeah, yeah.
704
00:35:59,630 --> 00:36:03,340
And as you get older, it all becomes
a bit more mixed up, you know.
705
00:36:03,430 --> 00:36:04,656
- You like people.
- The question is,
706
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:07,720
what do you make fun of?
Because when we grew up in,
707
00:36:07,810 --> 00:36:12,230
let's say the 50s, all right,
we were at school, right.
708
00:36:12,310 --> 00:36:17,820
And it seemed at that time that we lived
in a relatively stable society,
709
00:36:17,900 --> 00:36:20,320
but a lot of it was obviously stupid.
710
00:36:20,400 --> 00:36:24,030
And it was great, great fun
making fun of the stupid bits
711
00:36:24,110 --> 00:36:26,886
because you thought, "Well, eventually,
people will see how stupid they are,
712
00:36:26,910 --> 00:36:28,096
and they'll sort things out."
713
00:36:28,120 --> 00:36:30,540
Now we have a very fractured society.
714
00:36:30,620 --> 00:36:33,120
I don't think anyone understands
what's going on.
715
00:36:33,210 --> 00:36:36,250
I had dinner with somebody
who was in the world of marketing
716
00:36:36,340 --> 00:36:39,380
a few months ago, and I said,
"Explain it to me,"
717
00:36:39,460 --> 00:36:43,760
and he said, "You know, the present
developments, they make no sense.
718
00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:48,430
There's no logic to them. It's very hard
for anyone to understand what's going on."
719
00:36:48,510 --> 00:36:51,930
And, you know,
comedy's about knocking things down
720
00:36:52,020 --> 00:36:55,150
because they're ridiculous
and need to be improved.
721
00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:57,610
What do you start with now?
722
00:36:57,690 --> 00:37:00,190
I mean, we know that the BBC is a mess,
723
00:37:00,280 --> 00:37:02,950
we know the national
health service is a mess,
724
00:37:03,030 --> 00:37:06,046
that politicians have never been held
in such low regard. I mean...
725
00:37:06,070 --> 00:37:09,530
You know, the invasion of Iraq was a con.
726
00:37:09,620 --> 00:37:12,016
I mean, what about
Family Guy,
do you ever watch
Family Guy
727
00:37:12,040 --> 00:37:14,160
or
South Park at all these days?
728
00:37:14,250 --> 00:37:17,000
- No.
- 'Cause
Family Guy is funny.
729
00:37:17,080 --> 00:37:21,050
Family Guy does some very funny stuff,
and as indeed,
South Park.
730
00:37:21,130 --> 00:37:23,066
But I think what you were saying earlier
731
00:37:23,090 --> 00:37:25,446
is it's very hard to get any kind of grip
on a thing
732
00:37:25,470 --> 00:37:29,026
because it all seems to be falling apart
and nobody seems to have any solutions,
733
00:37:29,050 --> 00:37:30,196
so what can you make fun of?
734
00:37:30,220 --> 00:37:32,616
I mean, they sort of just deal
with very small things,
735
00:37:32,640 --> 00:37:35,270
- you know, relationships, all that.
- Yeah. Yeah.
736
00:37:35,350 --> 00:37:38,730
I think you can do daily life
and the way people act together,
737
00:37:38,810 --> 00:37:41,296
the way people are just in ordinary,
everyday life.
738
00:37:41,320 --> 00:37:43,240
That's still good ground for comedy.
739
00:37:43,820 --> 00:37:45,770
It's not really what Python did though.
740
00:37:45,820 --> 00:37:48,450
No, we never did anything
that approached sitcom
741
00:37:48,530 --> 00:37:50,990
or anything about domestic life at all.
742
00:37:51,080 --> 00:37:55,080
It was always on the level of absurdity
if we went into it, you know.
743
00:37:55,160 --> 00:37:59,000
I think that's one of the great
appeals of Python, it's ideas lead.
744
00:37:59,080 --> 00:38:02,880
You know, if you're doing a sitcom,
then it has to be Attila the Hun
745
00:38:02,960 --> 00:38:06,300
coming home, saying,
"Honey, I'm home," you know,
746
00:38:06,380 --> 00:38:09,890
it's always had a very bright,
you know,
747
00:38:09,970 --> 00:38:13,220
encyclopedic sense of ideas
coming from it.
748
00:38:13,310 --> 00:38:16,496
I think people felt a little bit
more intelligent when they watched it,
749
00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:18,730
even though we were being banal at times.
750
00:38:18,810 --> 00:38:19,810
Yes, absolutely.
751
00:38:19,900 --> 00:38:22,456
Somebody said 20 years ago,
and I thought it was true,
752
00:38:22,480 --> 00:38:24,586
that the world seemed to be getting
madder and madder,
753
00:38:24,610 --> 00:38:27,700
and trying to exaggerate the madness,
or make fun of it now,
754
00:38:27,780 --> 00:38:29,320
the world was ahead of us.
755
00:38:29,410 --> 00:38:31,846
And I read something in the papers
about two weeks ago,
756
00:38:31,870 --> 00:38:35,176
and it was a guy in England
who was a burglar who'd been imprisoned.
757
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:38,540
And he went to the European Court
of Human Rights
758
00:38:38,620 --> 00:38:41,590
to say that this imprisonment
759
00:38:41,670 --> 00:38:48,550
was depriving him of his human right
to have a family life.
760
00:38:49,590 --> 00:38:50,680
And he got out.
761
00:38:52,140 --> 00:38:53,510
I mean...
762
00:38:54,060 --> 00:39:00,100
There's a woman PC
that's just suing this garage owner
763
00:39:00,190 --> 00:39:03,110
because she was called
to the site of this robbery,
764
00:39:03,190 --> 00:39:06,490
and it was at night,
and she tripped over the curb.
765
00:39:06,570 --> 00:39:11,110
And she's now suing the victim
for not lighting that curb properly.
766
00:39:12,070 --> 00:39:15,790
Now what's interesting
is her head constable is saying,
767
00:39:15,870 --> 00:39:17,976
"We're not actually
agreeing with this woman,"
768
00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:21,040
but the organization above that
769
00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:23,750
that looks after police people
all over the country,
770
00:39:23,840 --> 00:39:27,130
they're backing her.
I mean, unbelievable.
771
00:39:27,210 --> 00:39:30,210
- So you got a world where the victim...
- The Python sketch.
772
00:39:30,260 --> 00:39:35,350
...is, is, actually, Victimization
is what the modern world is about.
773
00:39:35,430 --> 00:39:39,480
And if you can be a victim,
you got a halfway decent chance, I think.
774
00:39:39,560 --> 00:39:40,960
Works in marriages, as well.
775
00:39:45,730 --> 00:39:49,570
I think if we can show
that John is a victim of a predatory woman
776
00:39:50,070 --> 00:39:52,030
who has destroyed his...
777
00:39:52,320 --> 00:39:55,240
- He is a serial victim.
- Exactly.
778
00:39:55,620 --> 00:39:59,500
We can take a class action against,
how many is it, three or four?
779
00:39:59,580 --> 00:40:00,910
He's a marital recidivist.
780
00:40:04,380 --> 00:40:07,340
Very good. Very good.
781
00:40:11,170 --> 00:40:13,680
It's what I hear
from all the young comedians now,
782
00:40:13,760 --> 00:40:15,510
is that there's an executive class
783
00:40:15,600 --> 00:40:19,390
that has never written,
performed, or directed comedy,
784
00:40:19,680 --> 00:40:23,850
that thinks that by some mystical process
785
00:40:23,940 --> 00:40:27,730
they know what is funny and what is
not funny, and they've never done it.
786
00:40:27,820 --> 00:40:30,586
Never done it in their life.
If somebody who'd never flown a plane
787
00:40:30,610 --> 00:40:32,950
started telling pilots
how to fly planes...
788
00:40:33,030 --> 00:40:35,740
- It's like so obvious.
- It's insane.
789
00:40:35,820 --> 00:40:40,750
Where as in the old days, the good people,
they'd come through floor managers,
790
00:40:40,830 --> 00:40:44,880
you know, directors.
They worked on comedy for years,
791
00:40:44,960 --> 00:40:50,880
and they kind of absorbed this strange
thing that we do to make people laugh.
792
00:40:50,960 --> 00:40:55,760
It infuriates me now to hear young people
say that they don't want to go to the BBC
793
00:40:55,840 --> 00:40:59,760
in particular because they're gonna want,
not just the pilot script,
794
00:40:59,850 --> 00:41:02,906
they're gonna want detailed outlines
for all the other episodes.
795
00:41:02,930 --> 00:41:04,416
And I just want to say to them,
796
00:41:04,440 --> 00:41:09,730
"When Michael Mills trusted us to produce
something because he thought we had talent
797
00:41:09,820 --> 00:41:12,190
we were able to do that."
Sometimes you won't.
798
00:41:12,650 --> 00:41:16,910
But there's no fall, fail safe program.
799
00:41:16,990 --> 00:41:19,596
There's no way you can be absolutely sure
you're going to produce something.
800
00:41:19,620 --> 00:41:22,016
No, no, you have to take the risk
that it's not going to be very good,
801
00:41:22,040 --> 00:41:23,556
but you have to take that risk.
802
00:41:23,580 --> 00:41:27,356
He was good. There were a lot of other
people at the BBC in executive positions,
803
00:41:27,380 --> 00:41:28,936
we said earlier, who didn't like it.
804
00:41:28,960 --> 00:41:30,606
I thought, "Why are we doing this?"
805
00:41:30,630 --> 00:41:32,630
There was a confidence, wasn't there?
806
00:41:32,710 --> 00:41:36,316
They knew things would flop, but there was
a confidence that they were worth trying.
807
00:41:36,340 --> 00:41:39,260
The executive class
didn't exist as it does now.
808
00:41:39,350 --> 00:41:42,826
That's simply what's happened everywhere.
Not just the BBC, but everywhere.
809
00:41:42,850 --> 00:41:45,350
Television, cinema, everything.
810
00:41:45,440 --> 00:41:48,916
It's all risen up, so you've got this
layer of people that sit on the top
811
00:41:48,940 --> 00:41:50,230
who are the gatekeepers,
812
00:41:50,690 --> 00:41:53,990
that are the ones who decide
what the public will or will not like.
813
00:41:54,070 --> 00:41:57,216
And as you say, none of them
have any particular talent or skill.
814
00:41:57,240 --> 00:41:58,966
But why is it that so much good stuff
815
00:41:58,990 --> 00:42:01,340
is coming out of America now
in the comedy line?
816
00:42:01,990 --> 00:42:03,870
- Why is that...
- Yeah.
817
00:42:03,950 --> 00:42:06,266
- ...did you say?
- Do you agree with the statement?
818
00:42:06,290 --> 00:42:08,960
Yeah, I think there's
a lot of great comedy here.
819
00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:11,340
I think television's in
a very good state here.
820
00:42:11,420 --> 00:42:13,800
I don't see a lot of it
coming in the movies,
821
00:42:13,880 --> 00:42:16,316
I think television,
things are funnier by and large.
822
00:42:16,340 --> 00:42:19,316
But I think there's so much of it,
I think there's plenty of room
823
00:42:19,340 --> 00:42:22,310
for people, now, to get in on a low level
and get good.
824
00:42:22,390 --> 00:42:24,930
I don't find network television
very funny.
825
00:42:25,020 --> 00:42:28,520
But I would say this, I would say that
I don't think any network
826
00:42:28,600 --> 00:42:30,000
could still put on Python...
827
00:42:31,440 --> 00:42:32,876
- ...after all these years.
- Yeah, yeah.
828
00:42:32,900 --> 00:42:35,150
I think we'd have to do it in Salford.
829
00:42:36,780 --> 00:42:39,410
We're still cable, you know.
We are still cable.
830
00:42:40,120 --> 00:42:43,426
But that's what happened in America,
was cable TV came in, HBO and all,
831
00:42:43,450 --> 00:42:46,136
and suddenly there were subscribers,
and the money was in a pot,
832
00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:49,226
and that's when things started happening,
'cause
Simpsons, South Park,
833
00:42:49,250 --> 00:42:53,840
all of it came out of, basically,
a new system that suddenly appeared.
834
00:42:53,920 --> 00:42:55,276
The networks couldn't do it.
835
00:42:55,300 --> 00:42:58,760
And they're, HBO, Showtime
are still doing the best work.
836
00:42:58,840 --> 00:43:00,776
- Yes.
- Because there's real freedom with it,
837
00:43:00,800 --> 00:43:01,800
and is much freer,
838
00:43:01,890 --> 00:43:05,930
television is much, much freer
than the Hollywood studio system now.
839
00:43:06,020 --> 00:43:07,326
- Yeah.
- I mean, to get films through
840
00:43:07,350 --> 00:43:11,560
is really difficult, but more
and more people are going on to HBO.
841
00:43:11,650 --> 00:43:16,150
My ex-son-in-law, Ed Solomon,
who wrote
Men in Black,
842
00:43:16,230 --> 00:43:21,110
he said that writers are much more
respected in American television then
843
00:43:21,200 --> 00:43:24,620
if they're working in television
than if they're working in film.
844
00:43:24,990 --> 00:43:27,266
And that's why
they've gravitated to television,
845
00:43:27,290 --> 00:43:30,500
and now a lot of ex-writers are producers,
846
00:43:30,580 --> 00:43:33,380
and they are working with writers
and guiding them.
847
00:43:33,460 --> 00:43:35,420
Not perhaps writing themselves anymore,
848
00:43:35,500 --> 00:43:38,550
and that that's why the programs
are so much better.
849
00:43:38,970 --> 00:43:42,510
But it seems to me that breaking
television up in this country
850
00:43:42,590 --> 00:43:47,810
into all these very small audiences
has done nothing for the quality of it.
851
00:43:48,180 --> 00:43:49,180
What do you think?
852
00:43:50,770 --> 00:43:53,810
Yeah, maybe right.
I sort of agree.
853
00:43:53,900 --> 00:43:56,820
- I don't watch a lot of comedy anymore.
- No.
854
00:43:56,900 --> 00:43:58,990
But I think that Python was,
855
00:43:59,070 --> 00:44:02,530
I mean, at the time we didn't think
it was a ground breaker.
856
00:44:02,610 --> 00:44:05,260
We didn't even know
it was going to last another year.
857
00:44:05,330 --> 00:44:08,290
You know, shows weren't repeated much.
858
00:44:08,370 --> 00:44:10,516
And that was it.
Then we'd go on to the next thing.
859
00:44:10,540 --> 00:44:12,830
But it just was,
and we look back at it now,
860
00:44:12,920 --> 00:44:16,170
we were dealing with things,
and, you know,
861
00:44:16,250 --> 00:44:19,396
churning out material that people
wouldn't be able to do nowadays
862
00:44:19,420 --> 00:44:23,090
with the kind of exuberance that lasted
for two-and-a-half series.
863
00:44:23,180 --> 00:44:25,080
It was six people making the decision.
864
00:44:25,140 --> 00:44:27,850
It was within us, there was nobody else.
865
00:44:27,930 --> 00:44:31,560
There was no outside influence.
If it'd make us laugh, it went in.
866
00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:34,536
And, you know, sometimes we were right
and sometimes we were wrong.
867
00:44:34,560 --> 00:44:36,496
That's what always intrigued me,
some of the stuff
868
00:44:36,520 --> 00:44:39,956
that we thought was really funny,
in the end, we look back, it was not.
869
00:44:39,980 --> 00:44:43,980
And I think the great thing in those days
were, there were always a lot of people
870
00:44:44,030 --> 00:44:45,546
- who didn't know what they were doing.
- Yeah.
871
00:44:45,570 --> 00:44:48,660
But there was this
extraordinary number of people at BBC
872
00:44:48,740 --> 00:44:50,596
at that time who did know
what they were doing,
873
00:44:50,620 --> 00:44:52,960
and they did not want to be stars.
874
00:44:53,040 --> 00:44:55,630
It's all changed now,
it's all so individualistic.
875
00:44:55,710 --> 00:44:56,540
Do you remember?
876
00:44:56,630 --> 00:45:02,050
People in the old days, it was quite
something to get a byline in a newspaper.
877
00:45:02,130 --> 00:45:04,880
Now you have a photograph
of the journalist.
878
00:45:04,970 --> 00:45:06,736
- Right, yeah.
- Do you see what I mean?
879
00:45:06,760 --> 00:45:08,510
And what you have now is executives
880
00:45:08,600 --> 00:45:11,720
who want to be thought
of as famous executives.
881
00:45:11,810 --> 00:45:14,660
This was unheard of.
Michael Mills is completely forgotten
882
00:45:14,730 --> 00:45:17,280
except when we thank him
for making Python possible.
883
00:45:17,360 --> 00:45:21,230
But they want to be stars now, and that's
why they want to control everything,
884
00:45:21,320 --> 00:45:25,530
so it has their name on it
rather than the name of the talent.
885
00:45:28,620 --> 00:45:32,290
How did we do with the BAFTA awards?
886
00:45:32,370 --> 00:45:36,170
I mean, the strange thing about Python
was that, from the very beginning,
887
00:45:36,250 --> 00:45:39,130
a lot of the most important people
just didn't like it.
888
00:45:39,210 --> 00:45:43,720
Tom Sloan accosted Ian MacNaughton
in the lift and said,
889
00:45:43,800 --> 00:45:46,010
- "What the hell are you doing?"
- Yeah.
890
00:45:46,090 --> 00:45:49,550
And then
The Independent newspaper,
under this Freedom of Information
891
00:45:49,640 --> 00:45:51,890
got some minutes out about four years ago,
892
00:45:51,970 --> 00:45:55,916
and all the heads of department, I think
there were about eight heads of department
893
00:45:55,940 --> 00:45:59,940
and six of them condemned Python,
894
00:46:00,020 --> 00:46:04,900
and these were not cosmonauts
or matadors or plumbers.
895
00:46:04,990 --> 00:46:09,280
These were people whose job it was
to understand what was good television,
896
00:46:09,370 --> 00:46:11,966
and six out of eight of them
couldn't see they had something
897
00:46:11,990 --> 00:46:14,636
under their noses that was
actually rather interesting.
898
00:46:14,660 --> 00:46:17,330
- And I think that kind of...
- Yeah.
899
00:46:17,420 --> 00:46:21,500
- But thank God they put it on, you know.
- Oh, well, that's Michael Mills.
900
00:46:21,590 --> 00:46:24,356
But then when it came to film,
I remember Alexander Walker,
901
00:46:24,380 --> 00:46:26,196
who was the leading critic at that point,
902
00:46:26,220 --> 00:46:29,930
he did a book on British films
of the, I don't know, 60s, 70s,
903
00:46:30,010 --> 00:46:32,260
and Python was a footnote,
that's all it was.
904
00:46:32,350 --> 00:46:34,770
Where you went,
I remember going to Brussels
905
00:46:34,850 --> 00:46:37,440
and all they talked about
was Python films.
906
00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:39,286
- And yet, we didn't exist.
- But, Terry, Terry,
907
00:46:39,310 --> 00:46:41,810
- Yeah?
- We had lampooned the piss out of him
908
00:46:41,900 --> 00:46:44,416
- in one of the episodes, if you remember.
- There was that.
909
00:46:44,440 --> 00:46:47,490
We did Alexander Walker,
and he had this hair which was funny,
910
00:46:47,530 --> 00:46:50,430
and as I talked, his hair got bigger
and bigger and bigger,
911
00:46:50,490 --> 00:46:52,700
- and bigger and bigger!
- Yeah, I know.
912
00:46:52,780 --> 00:46:56,096
Normally, he would like that,
any attention Alexander would love it.
913
00:46:56,120 --> 00:46:57,210
He was Canadian.
914
00:46:57,290 --> 00:47:01,790
But it was interesting if you
actually read books on cinema of the 70s,
915
00:47:01,880 --> 00:47:06,380
we're not... or 80s, whenever it was
we were, we don't really exist there.
916
00:47:06,460 --> 00:47:09,986
It's very strange, it's as though the
British film industry thought of us
917
00:47:10,010 --> 00:47:13,720
as a kind of a separate unit that
didn't really count as a British film.
918
00:47:13,810 --> 00:47:16,930
My recollection,
and I ought to check this,
919
00:47:17,020 --> 00:47:22,020
is that
Life of Brian
got one nomination...
920
00:47:22,110 --> 00:47:25,530
- Did it?
- And that was for costume design.
921
00:47:25,610 --> 00:47:27,240
- What, for BAFTA?
- Yeah.
922
00:47:28,570 --> 00:47:29,860
Sheets.
923
00:47:31,610 --> 00:47:35,030
Did Python, did Python ever get
an Academy Award for anything?
924
00:47:35,120 --> 00:47:36,120
- No.
- No.
925
00:47:36,200 --> 00:47:38,080
- No.
- No Emmys.
926
00:47:38,160 --> 00:47:39,710
No.
927
00:47:39,790 --> 00:47:42,630
- No Grammys.
- No. Not that we're bitter.
928
00:47:44,130 --> 00:47:46,050
We're at... Badge of courage.
929
00:47:46,130 --> 00:47:48,106
It was puzzling, actually,
I think that's the main thing.
930
00:47:48,130 --> 00:47:51,090
I don't feel angry by that,
I'm just kind of puzzled.
931
00:47:51,180 --> 00:47:56,260
I remember being frustrated that the
summary of when we made
The Holy Grail
932
00:47:56,350 --> 00:48:00,520
and
The Life of Brian, the summary
of that year of film didn't include,
933
00:48:00,600 --> 00:48:07,110
in the papers, didn't include anything.
No mention of the, of the...
934
00:48:07,190 --> 00:48:09,466
We always thought
we were doing something right.
935
00:48:09,490 --> 00:48:10,820
It was supposed to be...
936
00:48:10,900 --> 00:48:12,636
I'm happy in our attitude because, I mean,
937
00:48:12,660 --> 00:48:17,240
we were very,
dismissive of awards.
938
00:48:17,330 --> 00:48:18,556
- Do you remember?
- Yeah.
939
00:48:18,580 --> 00:48:21,540
We did actually do a send up, didn't we?
Of BAFTA.
940
00:48:21,620 --> 00:48:23,630
Oh, yes.
Crying, the onions.
941
00:48:23,710 --> 00:48:25,566
You did Dickie Attenborough, didn't you?
942
00:48:25,590 --> 00:48:30,170
Yes. We did Dickie Attenborough
and we brought on David Niven's fridge,
943
00:48:30,260 --> 00:48:31,630
- Yes.
- That's right, yeah.
944
00:48:31,720 --> 00:48:33,510
To accept the award.
945
00:48:33,590 --> 00:48:36,486
'Cause David couldn't be here tonight
so he sent his fridge.
946
00:48:36,510 --> 00:48:41,140
And this is the fridge in which David
keeps all his cheese, his vegetables.
947
00:48:41,230 --> 00:48:44,060
It was his second best fridge,
or was it the best?
948
00:48:45,360 --> 00:48:48,110
Yeah, we did show
a certain amount of contempt for them.
949
00:48:48,150 --> 00:48:49,900
- Yeah.
- I think it's fair.
950
00:48:50,070 --> 00:48:53,240
It was returned in, in spades.
951
00:48:53,320 --> 00:48:56,990
It's funny because, you know,
sometimes people were a little bit upset,
952
00:48:57,080 --> 00:48:58,466
even when it was quite affectionate.
953
00:48:58,490 --> 00:49:01,250
For example, every time that
I ever met Alan Whicker,
954
00:49:01,330 --> 00:49:05,420
he always talked about Whickerida,
which was actually an affectionate parody.
955
00:49:05,500 --> 00:49:09,960
It was as though it somehow
got under his skin. And people...
956
00:49:10,050 --> 00:49:12,090
So, it... it got under his skin?
957
00:49:12,170 --> 00:49:14,120
- Yeah.
- It was an affectionate parody.
958
00:49:14,180 --> 00:49:16,340
Exactly. People are very...
959
00:49:16,430 --> 00:49:20,680
We did another film critic,
we made fun of.
960
00:49:22,390 --> 00:49:23,940
-Philip,
-Oh, Gavin Millar.
961
00:49:24,020 --> 00:49:25,600
- Yes.
- Gavin Millar.
962
00:49:26,600 --> 00:49:29,610
- You made fun of him.
- Yes, I... and I wrote that.
963
00:49:29,690 --> 00:49:35,700
I think the fact was that we were so
obviously not kowtowing,
964
00:49:35,780 --> 00:49:39,740
not obviously wanting to belong
to any particular group,
965
00:49:39,830 --> 00:49:45,670
and that without quite realizing it
we got the natural response to that.
966
00:49:45,750 --> 00:49:47,766
Which is that we're not
bothering about you,
967
00:49:47,790 --> 00:49:49,936
but we're not saying
it's really at a conscious level.
968
00:49:49,960 --> 00:49:53,146
You'd think that film critics were rather
pleased to be in Python.
969
00:49:53,170 --> 00:49:54,770
I mean, they're usually ignored.
970
00:49:55,930 --> 00:49:58,640
I remember once, I mean,
this is absolutely true,
971
00:49:58,720 --> 00:50:02,180
when we did
Fish Called Wanda,
972
00:50:02,270 --> 00:50:04,600
and I was in LA
973
00:50:04,680 --> 00:50:08,190
and they wanted to link
974
00:50:08,270 --> 00:50:12,230
so that I would appear
in the BAFTA awards.
975
00:50:12,320 --> 00:50:15,610
And I wasn't particularly keen
976
00:50:15,700 --> 00:50:18,700
because none of us had ever been
that crazy about awards.
977
00:50:18,780 --> 00:50:21,530
And I remember they said,
"You have won something,"
978
00:50:21,620 --> 00:50:23,766
and I thought, "Oh, really.
Well, that's nice, I suppose,"
979
00:50:23,790 --> 00:50:28,960
then I go to appear and I assumed
that I'd won the writing prize.
980
00:50:29,040 --> 00:50:34,090
And when they announced the writing prize
and said somebody else's name,
981
00:50:34,170 --> 00:50:37,470
My face went, "What?"
982
00:50:37,550 --> 00:50:40,180
Because I realized
that I'd won Best Actor.
983
00:50:40,260 --> 00:50:45,770
And to get Best Actor for that role
of Archie is ridiculous.
984
00:50:45,850 --> 00:50:49,350
It's a good comedy performance
but it's hardly up there with
Gandhi.
985
00:50:51,520 --> 00:50:53,270
Though, were you up against
Gandhi?
986
00:50:53,360 --> 00:50:54,756
No, no, we weren't up against,
987
00:50:54,780 --> 00:50:58,070
But I remember the film
that got the Best Script,
988
00:50:58,150 --> 00:50:59,586
nobody's ever heard of it again.
989
00:50:59,610 --> 00:51:02,950
It's never been mentioned
since that evening.
990
00:51:06,000 --> 00:51:07,210
Why are fish funny?
991
00:51:07,290 --> 00:51:09,870
Very good question.
Because they are.
992
00:51:09,960 --> 00:51:11,000
Are they?
993
00:51:11,080 --> 00:51:13,800
Well, they are.
We did a lot of fish stuff.
994
00:51:14,670 --> 00:51:17,550
The fish license,
"License my pet fish, Harry."
995
00:51:17,630 --> 00:51:18,816
"How do you know my name is Harry?"
996
00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:21,680
That's right. Very good.
997
00:51:21,760 --> 00:51:23,866
I think animals were always
a theme with us.
998
00:51:23,890 --> 00:51:28,230
There's something funny about animals,
and there's something funny about eating.
999
00:51:28,310 --> 00:51:33,270
An awful lot of our sketches had something
to do with one or the other of those.
1000
00:51:33,360 --> 00:51:34,440
Do you agree?
1001
00:51:34,860 --> 00:51:36,070
- No.
- No.
1002
00:51:36,150 --> 00:51:37,966
- That's just a quick thought.
- Next.
1003
00:51:37,990 --> 00:51:42,110
I mean, "Fish Slapping Dance," would not
be any better with cats, would it really?
1004
00:51:42,200 --> 00:51:44,030
Well,
1005
00:51:44,120 --> 00:51:45,990
I think we got the thing right there.
1006
00:51:46,080 --> 00:51:47,870
Big cat,
1007
00:51:48,830 --> 00:51:51,210
The cat was in
Holy Grail
with the old woman.
1008
00:51:51,290 --> 00:51:53,920
- Oh, yes.
- Beating the cat on the wall.
1009
00:51:54,460 --> 00:51:55,816
Sort of thrown away, that was.
1010
00:51:55,840 --> 00:51:57,670
I don't even remember it.
1011
00:52:02,970 --> 00:52:05,350
Beating the...
1012
00:52:06,510 --> 00:52:07,866
- It was very funny.
- Come on, now. Sorry.
1013
00:52:07,890 --> 00:52:08,956
We got chatting there.
What have you got to say?
1014
00:52:08,980 --> 00:52:11,440
No, I, what? About the what?
1015
00:52:11,520 --> 00:52:13,916
Amuse us. You're a very
funny man, and we love you.
1016
00:52:13,940 --> 00:52:17,506
No, no, I'm, Look, I may be funny,
but it's four in the morning, you know.
1017
00:52:17,530 --> 00:52:19,570
I don't really play this late.
1018
00:52:20,570 --> 00:52:22,660
This is the latest gig I've done.
1019
00:52:25,870 --> 00:52:29,556
Professor Brian Cox, I had a dinner
with him, a couple of dinners with him,
1020
00:52:29,580 --> 00:52:31,806
and when I dined with him
about a month later, I said,
1021
00:52:31,830 --> 00:52:35,840
"So has the universe expanded enormously
since our last dinner?"
1022
00:52:35,920 --> 00:52:39,420
And he said, "Actually,
the surprising thing is it's quite small
1023
00:52:39,510 --> 00:52:43,180
because it's so big
the expansion is may be fast,
1024
00:52:43,260 --> 00:52:45,430
but the percentage in which it expanded
1025
00:52:45,510 --> 00:52:48,560
during a very small
period of time, is very, very small.
1026
00:52:48,640 --> 00:52:51,270
- There you are.
- So, it has expanded, but...
1027
00:52:51,350 --> 00:52:54,730
Well, it is expanding all the time,
even during this short program.
1028
00:52:54,810 --> 00:52:57,900
- It's just expanding...
- You just can't notice it, can you?
1029
00:52:57,980 --> 00:53:01,086
I mean, stand in the square out there,
it looks like the same size to me.
1030
00:53:01,110 --> 00:53:03,530
Technically
a little bit further away.
1031
00:53:07,070 --> 00:53:09,240
That's a nice thought.
I like that thought.
1032
00:53:12,160 --> 00:53:13,750
You're going away!
1033
00:53:17,040 --> 00:53:18,266
- I'm against it.
- Terrific.
1034
00:53:18,290 --> 00:53:21,550
- I think it's a great idea.
- I'm in favor of it for others,
1035
00:53:21,630 --> 00:53:23,066
but I'm against it, personally.
1036
00:53:23,090 --> 00:53:24,630
What was Woody Allen said?
1037
00:53:24,720 --> 00:53:26,116
It was not that he was frightened of it
1038
00:53:26,140 --> 00:53:28,490
but he didn't want to
be there when it happened.
1039
00:53:29,010 --> 00:53:32,210
What I'm frightened of is an afterlife.
I don't want any of that.
1040
00:53:32,560 --> 00:53:35,786
To think, all those virgins, all those
Muslim virgins, that are all over you,
1041
00:53:35,810 --> 00:53:37,020
you don't want that.
1042
00:53:37,100 --> 00:53:40,900
I wonder if, as you get older,
I'm going to feel, as I get older,
1043
00:53:40,980 --> 00:53:43,150
I get more sort of child-like in a way.
1044
00:53:43,650 --> 00:53:47,386
- That's called senility, Michael.
- I can relate to my grandsons very well.
1045
00:53:47,410 --> 00:53:50,306
'Cause it's a bit like Python, you know,
you can do any silly things with them,
1046
00:53:50,330 --> 00:53:53,910
and all that, why do we get sillier
as we get older, which is some hope.
1047
00:53:54,000 --> 00:53:55,080
Do you think so?
1048
00:53:57,750 --> 00:54:01,186
I read a bit about this stuff and I think
there is something going on,
1049
00:54:01,210 --> 00:54:03,710
but I, you know, after we die.
1050
00:54:03,800 --> 00:54:06,106
I actually think there may be
something going on
1051
00:54:06,130 --> 00:54:08,720
because there's a lot of
interesting books out there
1052
00:54:08,800 --> 00:54:13,270
written by, not loonies or mediums
who may be very strange people,
1053
00:54:13,350 --> 00:54:16,140
but written by academics,
particularly in America.
1054
00:54:16,230 --> 00:54:18,900
And if you look at some of those stories,
1055
00:54:18,980 --> 00:54:21,520
I mean,
I'm most fascinated by these things,
1056
00:54:21,610 --> 00:54:26,820
these out of body experiences, where
people claim to have left their bodies.
1057
00:54:26,900 --> 00:54:32,540
I mean, there was one that was tested
in a psychological laboratory
1058
00:54:32,620 --> 00:54:34,620
by a guy called Charlie Tart,
1059
00:54:35,040 --> 00:54:38,710
Charles Tart, who was a very well known
professor of psychology,
1060
00:54:38,790 --> 00:54:42,316
and he discovered that the person
working for him was a sort of au pair,
1061
00:54:42,340 --> 00:54:44,550
said that she often left her body.
1062
00:54:44,630 --> 00:54:51,180
So, he checked it, and on six occasions
she just lay in the bed in the laboratory
1063
00:54:51,260 --> 00:54:56,100
and they placed a five-digit number
on the ledge above her bed,
1064
00:54:56,640 --> 00:54:58,850
which couldn't be seen except from above,
1065
00:54:58,940 --> 00:55:01,730
and on five occasions
she did not leave her body,
1066
00:55:01,810 --> 00:55:04,110
and on the sixth occasion she did,
1067
00:55:04,190 --> 00:55:06,860
and she was able to report
the correct number.
1068
00:55:06,940 --> 00:55:09,360
She'd gone up, looked it, remembered it,
1069
00:55:09,450 --> 00:55:11,796
and then was able to report
a five-digit number.
1070
00:55:11,820 --> 00:55:15,870
Now, you can say it was a coincidence,
but you kinda think,
1071
00:55:15,950 --> 00:55:20,540
well, if this is possible,
there are these veridical experiences
1072
00:55:20,620 --> 00:55:22,000
by people who've had OBEs.
1073
00:55:22,080 --> 00:55:25,920
In other words, they've seen things
that they could not possibly know
1074
00:55:26,010 --> 00:55:29,430
and report them accurately afterwards
and can be checked.
1075
00:55:29,510 --> 00:55:34,930
If that is going on, if our consciousness
could be separate from our body...
1076
00:55:35,010 --> 00:55:38,206
In other words... if our consciousness
is like a television receiver,
1077
00:55:38,230 --> 00:55:40,770
the programs are not made
in the television set,
1078
00:55:40,850 --> 00:55:45,690
they're made somewhere else, but you have
to watch the television set to see them.
1079
00:55:45,780 --> 00:55:48,586
If one had a, if there was
a kind of consciousness like that
1080
00:55:48,610 --> 00:55:53,280
and the reductionist, materialist,
reductionist people who simply
1081
00:55:53,370 --> 00:55:59,080
find all the research and all
the anecdotal information so absurd
1082
00:55:59,160 --> 00:56:01,976
that they won't even look at it
and they sweep it under the carpet.
1083
00:56:02,000 --> 00:56:04,316
Which is what happens
to every scientific theory
1084
00:56:04,340 --> 00:56:07,630
because people become
so attached, emotionally, to the theory
1085
00:56:07,710 --> 00:56:10,236
that they don't want to think
that it couldn't be right.
1086
00:56:10,260 --> 00:56:11,970
I mean, it's always.
1087
00:56:12,050 --> 00:56:15,510
Your shamans have always believed
in out of body experiences,
1088
00:56:15,600 --> 00:56:18,770
but that's while you're alive.
That's not the afterlife.
1089
00:56:18,850 --> 00:56:22,730
I would rather not even think about it.
I'm not counting on it.
1090
00:56:22,810 --> 00:56:24,440
I'd like to be surprised.
1091
00:56:24,520 --> 00:56:27,506
But the idea of... when you start
talking about the afterlife,
1092
00:56:27,530 --> 00:56:30,530
it's about how do you get the afterlife?
1093
00:56:30,610 --> 00:56:33,570
How do you get where it should be
that you can control it?
1094
00:56:33,660 --> 00:56:36,160
My attitude is don't even count on it.
1095
00:56:36,240 --> 00:56:38,910
If there happens to be something,
hunky-dory.
1096
00:56:38,990 --> 00:56:41,750
- But it's...
- But at least be interested in it
1097
00:56:41,830 --> 00:56:44,920
because what you get from
the Dawkins' and the Dennetts
1098
00:56:45,000 --> 00:56:49,380
and the Christopher Hitchens' is an attack
on the very worst type of religion
1099
00:56:49,460 --> 00:56:54,050
that no one is ever going to try
and really defend anyway.
1100
00:56:54,140 --> 00:56:56,260
You know, there's an enormous amount
1101
00:56:56,350 --> 00:56:58,826
about organized religion
that is absolute nonsense.
1102
00:56:58,850 --> 00:57:02,560
But underneath it all,
I think there is something going on.
1103
00:57:02,640 --> 00:57:04,416
It's just that
the organized church...
1104
00:57:04,440 --> 00:57:07,246
Organized religion was really...
Enlightenment started the whole thing
1105
00:57:07,270 --> 00:57:10,570
that religion has to be reasonable,
has to be scientific.
1106
00:57:10,650 --> 00:57:11,716
You have to explain it.
1107
00:57:11,740 --> 00:57:15,780
In the 19th century, all the biblical
scholars in America were, you know,
1108
00:57:15,870 --> 00:57:18,700
"It's, it's historically true, the Bible."
1109
00:57:18,780 --> 00:57:21,250
The Bible... Religion is about myth.
1110
00:57:21,330 --> 00:57:24,170
Myth is not Logos. It's not real.
1111
00:57:24,250 --> 00:57:26,330
It's not the reason, but it is a form.
1112
00:57:26,420 --> 00:57:30,630
And I think that's the problem,
that people start confusing myth
1113
00:57:30,710 --> 00:57:33,670
with, you know,
the solid reality around us.
1114
00:57:33,760 --> 00:57:36,316
I mean, I learned last night,
one book I was reading,
1115
00:57:36,340 --> 00:57:40,100
that the Crucifixion is not mentioned
in Christian documents
1116
00:57:40,180 --> 00:57:42,560
until 40 years after Christ's death.
1117
00:57:42,640 --> 00:57:45,140
- Which is somewhere around...
- Duh.
1118
00:57:45,230 --> 00:57:48,626
When you think about it, you would've
thought someone should mention it.
1119
00:57:48,650 --> 00:57:50,730
Yeah, I know, no, that's the whole thing.
1120
00:57:50,820 --> 00:57:53,440
And that's been the problem
where, when, you know...
1121
00:57:53,530 --> 00:57:55,070
Except it was commonplace.
1122
00:57:55,150 --> 00:57:57,910
- No, but I think myth is wonderful,
-Yeah, commonplace.
1123
00:57:57,990 --> 00:58:00,990
Because it gives form to things.
And gives shape and gives...
1124
00:58:01,080 --> 00:58:04,040
Explains things a different way
that words and reason can't,
1125
00:58:04,120 --> 00:58:06,670
- but it doesn't mean it really happens.
- No.
1126
00:58:06,750 --> 00:58:09,226
And I think the whole point is...
What is it, meaning of life?
1127
00:58:09,250 --> 00:58:12,486
It's trying to give meaning to life.
Not that there is any meaning to life.
1128
00:58:12,510 --> 00:58:15,670
I just think we should have
an attitude of curiosity towards it.
1129
00:58:15,760 --> 00:58:17,356
- Oh, yeah.
- Instead of sort of condemning it
1130
00:58:17,380 --> 00:58:19,616
as Richard Dawkins.
I know Richard a little bit
1131
00:58:19,640 --> 00:58:22,560
and I like him very much indeed,
but he kind of condemns.
1132
00:58:22,640 --> 00:58:25,406
He's so aggressive about anyone
who thinks anything goes on,
1133
00:58:25,430 --> 00:58:26,810
but be interested.
1134
00:58:26,890 --> 00:58:30,336
I think if you're a comedian, or whatever,
you enjoy humor and comedy.
1135
00:58:30,360 --> 00:58:32,956
- You got to... Everything's up for grabs.
- Exactly.
1136
00:58:32,980 --> 00:58:36,110
And that's what you got to be.
Certainty is our enemy.
1137
00:58:36,530 --> 00:58:38,546
- Yeah, that's right.
- That was very good, Mike.
1138
00:58:38,570 --> 00:58:41,830
- And finally, yes.
- My last words, yeah.
1139
00:58:42,830 --> 00:58:44,926
What are you going to have
on your gravestone then, John?
1140
00:58:44,950 --> 00:58:47,540
Um, "Calls referred to..."
1141
00:58:47,620 --> 00:58:48,830
Yes.
1142
00:58:50,380 --> 00:58:53,340
"Gone to lunch, back soon."
1143
00:58:54,670 --> 00:58:57,470
Mine says, "Say no more."
1144
00:58:57,550 --> 00:58:59,680
Very noble.
1145
00:59:00,800 --> 00:59:03,366
And hopefully when we're all dead
we'll be doing commercials,
1146
00:59:03,390 --> 00:59:06,480
because, you know, they'll be using us
and chopping us up
1147
00:59:06,560 --> 00:59:08,350
to sell vacuum cleaners, I think.
1148
00:59:08,690 --> 00:59:10,400
-And on that note,
-On that note.
1149
00:59:12,020 --> 00:59:14,480
Please send your contributions
to this address.
1150
00:59:14,780 --> 00:59:16,690
It will appear on your screen now.
1151
00:59:16,780 --> 00:59:19,910
Help the old unmarried
and married Pythons.
1152
00:59:22,910 --> 00:59:24,990
- Very good.
- Thank you.
1153
00:59:25,080 --> 00:59:26,160
Thank you, Eric.
1154
00:59:26,540 --> 00:59:28,500
- Well done. Sleep well.
- Be good.
1155
00:59:28,580 --> 00:59:31,040
Thank you very much.
It was great to see you all.
1156
00:59:31,130 --> 00:59:33,356
I miss you.
I mean, we should do this, you know,
1157
00:59:33,380 --> 00:59:36,420
sometime when we can
get together without the cameras.
1158
00:59:37,340 --> 00:59:39,170
And the great...
1159
00:59:39,260 --> 00:59:41,616
That would seem very strange
without the cameras.
1160
00:59:41,640 --> 00:59:44,180
They're talk about death.
1161
00:59:47,100 --> 00:59:49,310
- Good night.
- Good night. Bye-bye.
1162
00:59:49,390 --> 00:59:50,890
Thank you, John.
1163
00:59:54,610 --> 00:59:55,980
Are we still wired up here?
1164
01:00:03,530 --> 01:00:05,120
What is this for again?
1165
01:00:05,830 --> 01:00:06,870
Posterity.
1166
01:00:06,950 --> 01:00:08,620
Austerity?
98549