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Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:36,815 --> 00:00:39,776 Hi Cliff. My name is Michelle McNamara. 2 00:00:39,943 --> 00:00:43,988 I'm a crime writer in Los Angeles. I am doing a series on unsolved crimes. 3 00:00:44,155 --> 00:00:47,783 Hi, Kate, this is Michelle McNamara. 4 00:00:47,950 --> 00:00:51,119 - Hey, it's Michelle. - Hi, Michelle. 5 00:00:52,204 --> 00:00:57,000 I write a lot about unsolved cases. One that I am very fascinated with is 6 00:00:57,166 --> 00:01:00,086 the East Area Rapist/Original Night Stalker case. 7 00:01:00,253 --> 00:01:01,712 I think it's very solvable. 8 00:01:01,879 --> 00:01:05,007 There's a good likelihood that he is still alive and he's out there. 9 00:01:06,717 --> 00:01:10,595 I think the narcotic pull for me is what I think of as the powerful absence 10 00:01:10,762 --> 00:01:13,598 that haunts an unsolved crime. 11 00:01:13,765 --> 00:01:17,101 Murderers lose their power the moment we know them. 12 00:01:17,268 --> 00:01:19,353 We see their unkempt shirts, 13 00:01:19,520 --> 00:01:24,024 the uncertain fear tightening their faces as they're led into a courtroom. 14 00:01:24,191 --> 00:01:26,443 When I'm puzzling over the details of an unsolved crime, 15 00:01:26,609 --> 00:01:32,406 I'm like a rat in a maze given a task. I mean that in the best possible way. 16 00:01:32,573 --> 00:01:35,826 The world narrows, the search propels. 17 00:01:35,993 --> 00:01:39,412 I felt in the truest sense of the word, gripped. 18 00:01:39,579 --> 00:01:42,332 I had a murder habit and it was bad. 19 00:01:43,583 --> 00:01:46,168 I would feed it for the rest of my life. 20 00:02:31,918 --> 00:02:38,715 I'LL BE GONE IN THE DARK 21 00:02:56,815 --> 00:02:58,900 So, what's in Herndon, Virginia ? 22 00:02:59,067 --> 00:03:04,363 Herndon, Virginia is where my parents live, so I was back there for a week, 23 00:03:04,530 --> 00:03:08,033 and while my daughter was visiting her grandparents, 24 00:03:08,200 --> 00:03:14,205 I was in the basement struggling to get this afterword done, it was hard going. 25 00:03:14,372 --> 00:03:17,083 'Cause I was also rereading the book. 26 00:03:18,125 --> 00:03:22,338 And there were those moments when I would want to just like run upstairs 27 00:03:22,504 --> 00:03:25,090 and go tell her something 'cause it felt like I was listening to her, 28 00:03:25,257 --> 00:03:27,300 and then I'd be like, "Oh no, she's not here," you know. 29 00:03:27,467 --> 00:03:31,304 So, it was a very, it was a very dark week. 30 00:03:31,471 --> 00:03:33,306 - Yeah. Oh, I know. - For me. 31 00:03:49,570 --> 00:03:54,908 That summer, I hunted the serial killer at night from my daughter's playroom. 32 00:03:56,368 --> 00:03:58,745 I'd retreat to my makeshift workspace 33 00:03:58,912 --> 00:04:03,374 and boot up my laptop in search of a man I'd never met, 34 00:04:03,541 --> 00:04:07,169 who'd raped and murdered people I didn't know. 35 00:04:08,212 --> 00:04:13,258 In 1977, the Golden State Killer, as I'd come to call him, 36 00:04:13,425 --> 00:04:16,219 hadn't yet graduated to murder. 37 00:04:16,386 --> 00:04:19,805 Long before he was known by the acronym "EAR/ONS," 38 00:04:19,972 --> 00:04:23,309 and even before he was known as the "Original Night Stalker," 39 00:04:23,475 --> 00:04:25,811 they called him the "East Area Rapist," 40 00:04:25,978 --> 00:04:28,730 who was attacking women and girls in their bedrooms 41 00:04:28,897 --> 00:04:31,232 throughout Northern California. 42 00:04:31,399 --> 00:04:36,904 This man is considered to have an extremely violent potential. 43 00:04:37,071 --> 00:04:41,742 There isn't much that you can do except comply with his demands. 44 00:04:42,868 --> 00:04:45,704 He always wore a mask. 45 00:04:45,870 --> 00:04:47,997 The victims slept untroubled 46 00:04:48,164 --> 00:04:52,376 until the flashlight's blaze forced open their eyes. 47 00:04:52,543 --> 00:04:56,213 Sleepy minds lumbered, then raced. 48 00:04:56,380 --> 00:04:59,424 A figure they couldn't see wielded the light. 49 00:04:59,591 --> 00:05:02,844 But who ? And why ? 50 00:05:07,807 --> 00:05:10,225 7 YEARS EARLIER 51 00:05:10,392 --> 00:05:13,478 The other thing that's so interesting about this case I think about a lot is, 52 00:05:13,645 --> 00:05:17,482 you know, serial killers are... oh dear. 53 00:05:17,649 --> 00:05:19,776 This is awkward. Hi. 54 00:05:21,569 --> 00:05:23,821 Why are you wearing a skirt as a dress ? 55 00:05:23,988 --> 00:05:27,950 Oh my god. You are so funny. 56 00:05:28,116 --> 00:05:30,911 Let's just start at the very beginning. 57 00:05:31,077 --> 00:05:34,956 How did you first become interested in this particular case ? 58 00:05:35,123 --> 00:05:40,294 So, this particular one, what's interesting is that I remember... 59 00:05:41,378 --> 00:05:44,673 The great tragedy of this case to me is that it's not better known. 60 00:05:44,840 --> 00:05:49,886 I wish Zodiac would get rid of his 15 minutes of fame 61 00:05:50,053 --> 00:05:52,597 so that EAR/ONS could get a little heat, you know. 62 00:05:52,763 --> 00:05:56,725 And so I was very shocked. I think it was just four or five years ago 63 00:05:56,892 --> 00:06:00,937 that I happened to be home one night and one of the E ! shows was on. 64 00:06:01,104 --> 00:06:03,148 And I thought you've got to be kidding me, I've never, what ? 65 00:06:08,944 --> 00:06:10,988 I looked it up... 66 00:06:16,034 --> 00:06:19,287 and Larry Crompton's book kind of got me. 67 00:06:20,747 --> 00:06:24,542 That's been the last year kind of obsession. 68 00:06:24,708 --> 00:06:26,710 Started with that book. 69 00:06:47,103 --> 00:06:52,233 It was a Friday night. It was probably after 1:00, closer to 2:00. 70 00:06:53,484 --> 00:06:58,822 We were awakened by a voice and a bright light in our face. 71 00:06:58,989 --> 00:07:03,785 Then there he is with his ski mask, 72 00:07:03,952 --> 00:07:06,579 and the only thing you can see is his silhouette. 73 00:07:06,746 --> 00:07:11,584 Then he said, "Don't move or I'll kill you." 74 00:07:23,678 --> 00:07:28,223 Welcome to Crime Scene, a podcast that examines real life crimes. 75 00:07:28,390 --> 00:07:32,644 I'm Michelle McNamara of True Crime Diary.com. 76 00:07:34,562 --> 00:07:38,441 The terror began on June 18, 1976, 77 00:07:38,608 --> 00:07:41,360 when a masked man raped a young woman home alone 78 00:07:41,527 --> 00:07:44,488 in middle class Rancho Cordova. 79 00:07:51,035 --> 00:07:53,204 Larry Crompton is a retired lieutenant 80 00:07:53,371 --> 00:07:56,374 of the Contra Costa Sheriff's Department. 81 00:07:56,540 --> 00:07:59,668 He worked on the Rapist Task Force in the '70s. 82 00:07:59,835 --> 00:08:07,008 Okay. All of these were suspects that we worked on and eliminated, 83 00:08:07,175 --> 00:08:11,929 and some of them really, really did look good. 84 00:08:13,097 --> 00:08:16,558 He recently published a book on the case. 85 00:08:16,725 --> 00:08:20,520 "Sudden Terror" draws on police reports, victim interviews, 86 00:08:20,687 --> 00:08:23,815 Crompton's notes, newspaper clippings. 87 00:08:25,399 --> 00:08:28,319 What follows is my conversation with him. 88 00:08:34,950 --> 00:08:38,411 So, to put together your book you mostly went through your files ? 89 00:08:38,578 --> 00:08:40,371 Yeah, I had everything. 90 00:08:40,538 --> 00:08:43,707 And I was there. 91 00:08:48,587 --> 00:08:53,508 Present, Sergeant Larry Crompton, Sheriff's Office. 92 00:08:58,679 --> 00:09:01,432 We're conducting an interview 93 00:09:01,598 --> 00:09:07,353 for case file 7917426 that occurred on 6-11-79. 94 00:09:08,813 --> 00:09:12,316 You talk about it in the book so well, sort of coming in and you felt him. 95 00:09:12,483 --> 00:09:14,777 And I just wondered what that feeling was like. 96 00:09:14,944 --> 00:09:19,072 It's just... It's hard to believe this... 97 00:09:20,115 --> 00:09:23,826 but when I walked into the house, I had a feeling. 98 00:09:27,204 --> 00:09:31,375 The hair on the back of my neck would just feel like it was standing up. 99 00:09:36,213 --> 00:09:39,007 It was just the... 100 00:09:39,174 --> 00:09:43,010 the fear that was in the victims and... 101 00:09:43,177 --> 00:09:50,225 And listening to what they said you had a feeling that this is a mad man. 102 00:09:53,311 --> 00:09:56,647 It wasn't anything that we had dealt with before. 103 00:10:09,117 --> 00:10:13,329 He always wore a mask. Always wore gloves. 104 00:10:13,496 --> 00:10:15,498 Talked through clenched teeth. 105 00:10:16,999 --> 00:10:20,627 Set the houses up prior to the victim's arriving. 106 00:10:20,794 --> 00:10:24,214 Unlocked doors and windows. Opened gates. 107 00:10:25,381 --> 00:10:31,387 Okay. This is our backyard. This was the window right here. 108 00:10:32,429 --> 00:10:34,723 It's on the far side of the house. 109 00:10:36,016 --> 00:10:38,143 I came out here, I walked down here, 110 00:10:38,310 --> 00:10:41,938 and then went this way to the front of the street. 111 00:10:42,105 --> 00:10:45,191 And that's how I got out, right there. 112 00:10:45,358 --> 00:10:49,444 And this is the back fence to get over. 113 00:10:50,654 --> 00:10:54,824 If there was a man in the house, he would throw shoelaces on the bed, 114 00:10:54,991 --> 00:10:57,452 and tell the woman to tie him up. 115 00:10:57,618 --> 00:11:01,205 He would rummage and then he would come back with dishes. 116 00:11:01,372 --> 00:11:03,749 He'd put dishes on the man's back and tell him, 117 00:11:03,916 --> 00:11:07,752 "If I hear these dishes rattle, I'm gonna kill your wife." 118 00:11:07,919 --> 00:11:11,214 And that was what he was putting into their minds... 119 00:11:11,381 --> 00:11:14,133 that they were going to die 120 00:11:14,300 --> 00:11:18,053 and that's what he did over and over and over. 121 00:11:18,220 --> 00:11:20,055 2/2/78. 122 00:11:23,141 --> 00:11:24,517 Twenty-three. 123 00:11:27,478 --> 00:11:32,441 The attack happened on May 14th, 1977. 124 00:11:32,608 --> 00:11:35,819 So, this was my first birthday after the attack. 125 00:11:38,405 --> 00:11:42,700 That's the room it was in. There's my kitchen. 126 00:11:44,285 --> 00:11:48,038 Boy, I have not looked at these pictures in a long time. 127 00:11:49,790 --> 00:11:54,002 My job is to catch him and I didn't do that and... 128 00:11:54,169 --> 00:11:55,795 I can't let it go. 129 00:11:57,797 --> 00:12:00,508 Were normally the victims so relieved that they were alive that they... 130 00:12:00,675 --> 00:12:03,219 Oh yes. Definitely. 131 00:12:03,385 --> 00:12:06,138 Yeah, I wondered. I tried to put myself in that situation. 132 00:12:06,305 --> 00:12:11,059 And to go into someone's home is screwing with them mentally, too. 133 00:12:11,226 --> 00:12:14,854 - Yeah. That's scary. - Yeah. 134 00:12:33,871 --> 00:12:39,918 I think the story of the victims, it has to be told. 135 00:12:42,796 --> 00:12:46,507 I remember Michelle ultimately wanted to serve 136 00:12:46,674 --> 00:12:49,218 helping to get this guy caught. 137 00:12:49,385 --> 00:12:54,973 She looked at it from the hopeful optimistic humans 138 00:12:55,140 --> 00:12:57,892 putting puzzles together, trying to get closure, 139 00:12:58,059 --> 00:13:01,646 trying to make sense of violence and despair. 140 00:13:03,356 --> 00:13:08,402 I mean, what drives me is the need to put a face 141 00:13:08,569 --> 00:13:10,737 on an unknown killer. 142 00:13:10,904 --> 00:13:17,201 And what I love is this intersection of sort of technology and crime solving 143 00:13:17,368 --> 00:13:20,162 in that people can get sort of wheeled out of their house 144 00:13:20,329 --> 00:13:24,791 for something they did in 1957 because of the internet, because of DNA. 145 00:13:24,958 --> 00:13:29,170 I really get off on that. That is so amazing to me. 146 00:13:29,337 --> 00:13:31,172 And I want to be a part of that. 147 00:13:31,339 --> 00:13:35,301 Everyone has their cause, and this just feels like what I was born to do. 148 00:13:35,467 --> 00:13:38,637 Pacific Northwest murders 149 00:13:40,055 --> 00:13:43,058 I love digging for clues, I love putting things together. 150 00:13:43,224 --> 00:13:45,977 I love the puzzling part of it. I love being wrong 151 00:13:46,144 --> 00:13:47,520 because sometimes it proves 152 00:13:47,687 --> 00:13:49,814 that you didn't know enough, and you learn new techniques. 153 00:13:49,980 --> 00:13:52,399 I love every single aspect of it. 154 00:13:55,402 --> 00:13:58,363 What led you to starting this blog ? 155 00:13:58,530 --> 00:14:02,617 I always followed crime stories and that I was always a writer. 156 00:14:02,784 --> 00:14:06,412 So, I really just, I started it on a lark really. 157 00:14:07,663 --> 00:14:11,041 I started reading Michelle's blog, True Crime Diary, 158 00:14:11,208 --> 00:14:13,668 basically on a recommendation. 159 00:14:13,835 --> 00:14:18,089 And I was obsessed with it. Like she couldn't post enough. 160 00:14:18,256 --> 00:14:22,593 And her stories and the way she told them made them so memorable. 161 00:14:22,760 --> 00:14:24,720 You know, they all stuck with you. 162 00:14:25,762 --> 00:14:28,807 Whatever light existed was blotted out. 163 00:14:28,974 --> 00:14:32,268 The sound of hurried footsteps faded away. 164 00:14:32,435 --> 00:14:36,355 It had that feeling of under the blanket with a flashlight at night. 165 00:14:36,522 --> 00:14:41,151 I was kind of amazed at how quickly it caught on. 166 00:14:41,318 --> 00:14:44,446 When people talk to me about finding that blog, 167 00:14:44,612 --> 00:14:48,574 there's a real excitement, people were like, "I've read every single post." 168 00:14:48,741 --> 00:14:50,993 It was like they were drug addicts or something. 169 00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:54,621 About a year in, I started to realize I wasn't really in an echo chamber, 170 00:14:54,788 --> 00:14:57,582 that people were kind of starting to read it and respond to it. 171 00:14:57,749 --> 00:15:02,211 Most of the TV shows that would cover these stories were very cold 172 00:15:02,378 --> 00:15:04,589 or really kind of exploitive. 173 00:15:04,755 --> 00:15:07,591 You spent a bunch of time watching 174 00:15:07,758 --> 00:15:10,761 a reenactment of a beautiful young actress 175 00:15:10,928 --> 00:15:14,514 being attacked over and over while wearing lingerie. 176 00:15:14,681 --> 00:15:18,935 Michelle's blog kind of changed, I think, the focus. 177 00:15:19,102 --> 00:15:20,686 She personalized those people. 178 00:15:20,853 --> 00:15:26,525 If you can remind people about the humanity at the other end of that gun, 179 00:15:26,692 --> 00:15:29,903 this was a person with hopes and dreams, with family, 180 00:15:30,070 --> 00:15:31,821 that could have done this, this, or this. 181 00:15:31,988 --> 00:15:33,489 That's what Michelle did in her writing. 182 00:15:33,656 --> 00:15:36,117 All right, here we go, folks. We've got Michelle McNamara. 183 00:15:36,284 --> 00:15:38,202 She's a writer and a web sleuth. 184 00:15:38,369 --> 00:15:42,289 She has taught college writing, worked as an editor, sold TV pilots, 185 00:15:42,456 --> 00:15:43,999 and also consulted for Dateline. 186 00:15:44,166 --> 00:15:46,918 She is a truth seeker is what she is. 187 00:15:47,085 --> 00:15:49,379 Let's face it, you have a career. You have a life 188 00:15:49,545 --> 00:15:51,756 because people are always gonna get murdered. 189 00:15:51,922 --> 00:15:54,133 - You deal in the devil. - The murder biz. 190 00:15:54,300 --> 00:15:59,179 She was a pioneer. She was somebody who was creating something new. 191 00:15:59,346 --> 00:16:01,765 Yeah, nothing was like that in 2007. 192 00:16:03,474 --> 00:16:06,852 Hi, Los Angeles. Patton Oswalt on Jonesy's Jukebox. 193 00:16:07,019 --> 00:16:09,188 That was Ceremony by New Order. 194 00:16:09,355 --> 00:16:13,608 I am sitting here with the lovely and intelligent Michelle McNamara, my wife, 195 00:16:13,775 --> 00:16:17,654 who is the writer and creator of True Crime Diary.com. 196 00:16:17,821 --> 00:16:21,782 I think this is one of the best written and creepiest crime blogs on the web... 197 00:16:21,949 --> 00:16:24,285 - You're such a good husband. - It is. No, it's a good... 198 00:16:24,451 --> 00:16:28,914 If this site was awful, I'd have to be lying all the time, 199 00:16:29,081 --> 00:16:31,291 so... Michelle ? 200 00:16:31,458 --> 00:16:34,502 You were telling me about something going on in the Northwest right now. 201 00:16:36,838 --> 00:16:41,508 Yeah, I have a theory there is a serial killer operating in the Northwest 202 00:16:41,675 --> 00:16:47,889 who is killing couples out camping. There's been about four or five cases 203 00:16:48,056 --> 00:16:52,685 where there seems to be no motive, and they are both shot in the head. 204 00:16:53,686 --> 00:16:55,646 I remember the Jenner case so clearly. 205 00:16:55,813 --> 00:16:59,274 That was such a turning point for her because... 206 00:16:59,441 --> 00:17:04,028 she became very fascinated with how crimes are investigated. 207 00:17:04,195 --> 00:17:06,447 It's not easy to get to this beach. 208 00:17:06,614 --> 00:17:10,659 You have to negotiate a tricky path down a rocky cliff. 209 00:17:14,538 --> 00:17:16,414 On Wednesday, August 18, 210 00:17:16,581 --> 00:17:21,669 a Sheriff's helicopter noticed two sleeping bags on Fish Head Beach. 211 00:17:21,836 --> 00:17:24,922 Despite the noise and nearness of the helicopter, 212 00:17:25,089 --> 00:17:28,133 the figures in the sleeping bags didn't move. 213 00:17:29,092 --> 00:17:32,637 Lindsay and Jason had each been shot in the head at close range 214 00:17:32,804 --> 00:17:36,307 with a .45 caliber Marlin rifle. 215 00:17:36,474 --> 00:17:37,850 That is a creepy beach. 216 00:17:38,017 --> 00:17:41,437 I showed you all that evidence, or all that footage. It's a very creepy beach. 217 00:17:41,604 --> 00:17:45,691 The act of actually going to the crime scene and walking the case 218 00:17:45,857 --> 00:17:48,777 made her go, "Oh, yeah, I can't just be clicking on the internet." 219 00:17:48,943 --> 00:17:51,988 I have to go visit places and look at places. 220 00:17:53,364 --> 00:17:55,074 It changed the way she wrote about it. 221 00:17:56,117 --> 00:18:01,705 When did you make the shift, Michelle, from reading stuff and absorbing it 222 00:18:01,872 --> 00:18:03,873 to thinking I can do something here, 223 00:18:04,040 --> 00:18:08,878 I can start trying to connect dots that I might see that others have missed ? 224 00:18:09,045 --> 00:18:11,255 There was this kind of national news 225 00:18:11,422 --> 00:18:13,465 about a kidnapping that took place in Missouri. 226 00:18:13,632 --> 00:18:16,343 This boy had been kidnapped from a bus stop. 227 00:18:16,510 --> 00:18:19,888 And it immediately reminded me of a lesser known case that had happened 228 00:18:20,055 --> 00:18:22,181 five years before that no one else was talking about, 229 00:18:22,348 --> 00:18:24,725 but there were things that were interesting to me. 230 00:18:24,892 --> 00:18:28,312 So, I posted that I think whoever took this boy, Ben Ownby, 231 00:18:28,479 --> 00:18:30,772 probably also took this kid, Shawn Hornbeck. 232 00:18:30,939 --> 00:18:32,607 And I posted it on a Wednesday. 233 00:18:32,774 --> 00:18:36,194 That Friday, the police in St. Louis went to investigate a tip about 234 00:18:36,361 --> 00:18:39,489 where Ben Ownby might be, and they knocked on the door, 235 00:18:39,655 --> 00:18:41,741 and Shawn Hornbeck opened the door. 236 00:18:41,907 --> 00:18:44,910 You mean a kid who'd been kidnapped years earlier answered the door ? 237 00:18:45,077 --> 00:18:48,163 Right. And again, this was three days after I had posted 238 00:18:48,330 --> 00:18:51,708 I think they're probably taken by the same person. 239 00:18:51,875 --> 00:18:53,501 That was a big moment for me. 240 00:18:53,668 --> 00:18:56,670 I could start to see where my head full of facts and details 241 00:18:56,837 --> 00:18:59,923 could intersect with technology. 242 00:19:00,090 --> 00:19:03,468 I had started to kind of use internet tools 243 00:19:03,635 --> 00:19:07,764 to figure out that they seemed similar and that they might be connected. 244 00:19:07,931 --> 00:19:10,474 It's got to be amazing when you find a new sort of clue. 245 00:19:10,641 --> 00:19:14,061 When people describe like porn addiction or something. 246 00:19:14,228 --> 00:19:19,441 - This is really weird. - I can't stop myself. Time disappears. 247 00:19:19,608 --> 00:19:22,986 - All those things happen. - So, it's a genuine addiction. 248 00:19:23,152 --> 00:19:24,570 - You are on board. - Yeah. 249 00:19:24,737 --> 00:19:28,699 - Are you doing this now ? Currently ? - Every night. Until 2 in the morning. 250 00:19:30,367 --> 00:19:34,704 I cannot remember the specific time we started talking about EAR/ONS 251 00:19:34,871 --> 00:19:38,416 because every day, there was so many cases she was following up. 252 00:19:38,583 --> 00:19:45,047 And then just organically, that became the thing that got narrowed down. 253 00:19:47,216 --> 00:19:50,177 I looked at Michelle's blog, True Crime Diary.com, 254 00:19:50,343 --> 00:19:51,928 and I was really intrigued. 255 00:19:52,095 --> 00:19:56,557 So, she and I first met in 2011 to talk about some story ideas, 256 00:19:56,724 --> 00:20:02,479 and she was so smart and so cool 257 00:20:02,646 --> 00:20:05,607 and down to earth, and her shit was together. 258 00:20:05,774 --> 00:20:08,818 Not only that, I really liked how she was unpretentious 259 00:20:08,985 --> 00:20:12,655 in an obviously pretty pretentious city and business. 260 00:20:12,822 --> 00:20:14,782 I remember she wore these clogs. 261 00:20:14,949 --> 00:20:18,202 She had a backpack that she bought at Target. 262 00:20:18,368 --> 00:20:23,623 And she just showed up in a flannel shirt and as like low key as possible. 263 00:20:23,790 --> 00:20:28,544 So, we meet up, we go to this café. I think we met there like at 11 264 00:20:28,711 --> 00:20:32,631 and probably didn't leave until about three o'clock in the afternoon. 265 00:20:32,798 --> 00:20:37,761 Because she started telling me this story about this guy. 266 00:20:39,846 --> 00:20:43,808 The case that is sort of the biggest case that I'm most obsessed with is, 267 00:20:43,974 --> 00:20:48,687 the short version is basically he's the worst serial offender in modern history 268 00:20:48,854 --> 00:20:50,605 that no one really knows about. 269 00:20:50,772 --> 00:20:54,984 He raped over 50 women in California and killed 10 people. 270 00:20:56,110 --> 00:20:58,529 And he's never been caught. 271 00:20:58,696 --> 00:21:01,865 There's no one like him out there. There hasn't been before. 272 00:21:02,032 --> 00:21:06,328 He is such a unique offender. 273 00:21:06,495 --> 00:21:12,291 This guy was one of the most prolific, violent, brutal serial rapists, 274 00:21:12,458 --> 00:21:16,253 and eventually a murderer, and I had never heard of him. 275 00:21:16,420 --> 00:21:18,630 Like you'd heard of Zodiac Killer, you heard Son of Sam, 276 00:21:18,797 --> 00:21:22,300 you hear of all these big, especially in the '70s and '80s, which seem to be 277 00:21:22,467 --> 00:21:26,054 the most fertile period for these serial killer stories, 278 00:21:26,220 --> 00:21:28,723 and I had never heard of him. 279 00:21:28,890 --> 00:21:30,599 He would eat in the people's kitchens, 280 00:21:30,766 --> 00:21:33,936 he would hide ligatures under cushions so that when he was attacking, 281 00:21:34,103 --> 00:21:37,022 you suddenly would watch this man take a ligature under your cushion 282 00:21:37,189 --> 00:21:39,274 that you didn't even know he had been in your house. 283 00:21:39,441 --> 00:21:43,986 I'm drinking this Arnold Palmer that's 36 thousand ounces and I'm like 284 00:21:44,153 --> 00:21:47,489 sipping on it and drinking it as she's telling me this story. 285 00:21:47,656 --> 00:21:52,786 I needed to go to the bathroom badly because my bladder was about to burst, 286 00:21:52,953 --> 00:21:57,165 but I couldn't. I couldn't. I just kept listening and listening and listening. 287 00:21:57,332 --> 00:21:58,958 And that's how I knew it was a great story. 288 00:21:59,125 --> 00:22:03,337 The challenge for any magazine editor, any reporter and writer is 289 00:22:03,504 --> 00:22:06,632 sure, you have a person or you have a topic, 290 00:22:06,798 --> 00:22:09,426 really interesting guy from a long time ago, 291 00:22:09,592 --> 00:22:12,053 but there was nothing new to say yet. 292 00:22:15,598 --> 00:22:18,100 What's fascinating to me about this case is that 293 00:22:18,267 --> 00:22:23,105 it's rich with so many clues, and it really seems to me that it's just 294 00:22:23,271 --> 00:22:27,192 time, energy, and curiosity. And that... 295 00:22:27,358 --> 00:22:30,861 And frankly, it should be solved. It just should be. 296 00:22:33,822 --> 00:22:37,409 When I was so gripped by Crompton's book, 297 00:22:37,576 --> 00:22:41,454 I googled East Area Rapist, Original Night Stalker, 298 00:22:41,621 --> 00:22:46,250 and this came up, this link to the A&E Cold Case Files message board. 299 00:22:47,877 --> 00:22:54,007 For someone like me, again, it's like oh wow, look at all these... 300 00:22:54,174 --> 00:22:59,512 Wow. Wait, who would spend, you know, all this time ? 301 00:22:59,679 --> 00:23:04,225 Well, me I guess because it's a week later and I've read 20 thousand posts. 302 00:23:07,019 --> 00:23:10,689 You know, certainly in this case, there was this community of people, 303 00:23:10,855 --> 00:23:12,565 they all had different reasons for being involved in it. 304 00:23:12,732 --> 00:23:15,526 Some of them were from Sacramento and remembered 305 00:23:15,693 --> 00:23:19,113 and were still fearful and wanted to see it closed. 306 00:23:22,616 --> 00:23:28,705 Others were more kind of just data mining, sleuth kind of people. 307 00:23:31,499 --> 00:23:34,418 This was unique to me because I've never actually been part of this 308 00:23:34,585 --> 00:23:36,879 sort of message board community before. 309 00:23:37,045 --> 00:23:42,675 They throw around clues, you go down the rabbit hole gleefully 310 00:23:42,842 --> 00:23:48,305 like oh there's just this unending thread of information that I can find. 311 00:23:48,472 --> 00:23:53,727 EAR/ONS is an acronym for the East Area Rapist slash Original Night Stalker. 312 00:23:53,894 --> 00:23:57,188 It's an awkward name befitting a man who crossed jurisdictions 313 00:23:57,355 --> 00:24:00,358 and flummoxed law enforcement for decades. 314 00:24:00,525 --> 00:24:02,860 What kind of man was he ? 315 00:24:08,490 --> 00:24:13,244 My favourite true-crime blogger just wrote about the EAR. 316 00:24:13,411 --> 00:24:17,206 I've been aware of Michelle for probably a few years, 317 00:24:17,373 --> 00:24:19,583 as I was a fan of her True Crime Diary. 318 00:24:21,043 --> 00:24:23,795 I'd read True Crime Diary in its entirety. 319 00:24:23,962 --> 00:24:29,217 So, when she finally wrote about East Area Rapist, it was exciting. 320 00:24:29,384 --> 00:24:34,597 I'm obsessed. It's not healthy. I know the strangest details about him. 321 00:24:34,764 --> 00:24:39,017 I know his blood type. I know his penis size. 322 00:24:39,184 --> 00:24:42,395 He vaulted fences. He escaped foot chases. 323 00:24:42,562 --> 00:24:46,232 But I believe it's the rare moments when he was human 324 00:24:46,399 --> 00:24:49,068 that will be his downfall in the end. 325 00:24:49,235 --> 00:24:53,781 Her writing evoked the central hook for me, which was the mystery, 326 00:24:53,947 --> 00:24:56,825 the question of who is behind this crime ? 327 00:24:56,992 --> 00:24:59,577 She wasn't a ghoulish gore hound. 328 00:24:59,744 --> 00:25:03,372 There was nothing tasteless about her writing. It struck just the right tone. 329 00:25:03,539 --> 00:25:05,958 An impressive community of people has come together 330 00:25:06,125 --> 00:25:10,879 at an A&E sponsored website. Unlike other unsolved mystery communities, 331 00:25:11,046 --> 00:25:16,134 the EAR/ONS community's desire for justice feels strong and sincere. 332 00:25:16,301 --> 00:25:19,095 She reached out to me privately, and we started corresponding, 333 00:25:19,262 --> 00:25:23,807 and it was evident she was entrenched in this case. As was I. 334 00:25:23,974 --> 00:25:27,978 I saw who seemed to be some of the kind of leaders on the board, 335 00:25:28,144 --> 00:25:30,396 and I just began kind of personal messaging. 336 00:25:30,563 --> 00:25:36,652 We started exchanging notes and developed a rapport pretty quickly. 337 00:25:36,819 --> 00:25:38,529 We just built mutual trust 338 00:25:38,696 --> 00:25:42,491 until we were just openly sharing our work with each other. 339 00:25:42,657 --> 00:25:46,536 And that's when we discovered that a lot of it had intersected. 340 00:25:47,578 --> 00:25:50,956 We kind of started exchanging ideas and theories and things like that, 341 00:25:51,123 --> 00:25:53,292 and we just kind of forged a friendship, 342 00:25:53,459 --> 00:25:58,046 a strange friendship over this strange 30-year-old case. 343 00:25:58,213 --> 00:25:59,798 You're the best, Paul Haynes ! 344 00:26:01,633 --> 00:26:07,179 Hi, my name is Michelle. I'm a long-time lurker on the EAR/ONS board. 345 00:26:07,346 --> 00:26:09,390 The case is of interest to me and you seem 346 00:26:09,556 --> 00:26:12,601 really measured and thoughtful in your responses. 347 00:26:12,768 --> 00:26:15,729 I wanted to know if you have any thoughts on something. 348 00:26:15,895 --> 00:26:17,647 I spent an afternoon doing some research, 349 00:26:17,814 --> 00:26:22,068 and I feel like I've stumbled upon a compelling suspect. 350 00:26:22,234 --> 00:26:25,404 Hi Michelle, thanks for trusting me with this information. 351 00:26:25,571 --> 00:26:29,699 I'm a Sacramento native and have been investigating this case for years. 352 00:26:29,866 --> 00:26:32,202 Let's talk. 353 00:26:32,368 --> 00:26:36,831 I traveled to Sacramento to meet a woman about whom I know very little, 354 00:26:36,998 --> 00:26:40,584 including the spelling of her last name. 355 00:26:43,503 --> 00:26:46,548 The social worker operates as a kind of gate keeper 356 00:26:46,715 --> 00:26:49,467 between investigators and the board community. 357 00:26:49,634 --> 00:26:54,680 This irks some posters who accuse her of hinting at confidential information 358 00:26:54,847 --> 00:26:57,599 but then shutting down when asked to share. 359 00:26:57,766 --> 00:27:03,813 She greeted me in the parking lot by waving her arms wildly overhead. 360 00:27:03,980 --> 00:27:05,690 I liked her right away. 361 00:27:06,691 --> 00:27:10,486 Well, we had been in communication. I knew she was flying into Sacramento. 362 00:27:10,653 --> 00:27:14,781 And she was another civilian that was interested in the movement. 363 00:27:14,948 --> 00:27:17,283 And we would drive around to the crime scenes. 364 00:27:17,450 --> 00:27:22,288 I would take her to the areas. And so, we drove around for hours. 365 00:27:22,455 --> 00:27:25,165 We're gonna go about five miles from here. 366 00:27:25,332 --> 00:27:28,585 And I'm going to take you to the first crime scenes first. 367 00:27:28,752 --> 00:27:33,673 Our language just immediately became about the case facts 368 00:27:33,840 --> 00:27:36,592 and about what we knew and what this and what do you think of that. 369 00:27:36,759 --> 00:27:40,679 It was a language that nobody else could've understood what we talke about 370 00:27:40,846 --> 00:27:44,558 unless you had that experience or you were aware of the case. 371 00:27:44,725 --> 00:27:47,686 I just don't think it's gonna be somebody that everybody thought, 372 00:27:47,852 --> 00:27:49,812 oh, that's the East Area Rapist. 373 00:27:49,979 --> 00:27:52,940 I think you're right because he wasn't caught. 374 00:27:53,107 --> 00:27:56,068 I think it's gonna be somebody that they go, "Really ?" 375 00:27:56,235 --> 00:27:59,780 Right. Right. Obviously, he didn't stand out at the time. 376 00:27:59,946 --> 00:28:01,865 There's something about two women getting together 377 00:28:02,032 --> 00:28:05,785 that have a common cause and a common goal, and, you know, we're crusaders, 378 00:28:05,952 --> 00:28:08,162 we're warriors, we're on the path. 379 00:28:08,329 --> 00:28:12,166 That was the beginning of a relationship. 380 00:28:12,333 --> 00:28:15,419 We'll remain lifelong friends forever. 381 00:28:22,675 --> 00:28:25,302 First, we're gonna head into Rancho Cordova 382 00:28:25,469 --> 00:28:31,808 to his very early attacks, number one and number three. 383 00:28:32,851 --> 00:28:36,646 Sacramento... When you were growing up, 384 00:28:36,813 --> 00:28:38,189 did it seem to be a lot of people who worked... 385 00:28:38,356 --> 00:28:40,941 - It was a cow town. - Oh, okay. 386 00:28:41,108 --> 00:28:44,027 When you say a cow town, you mean that there was the out-outlying farms ? 387 00:28:44,194 --> 00:28:45,946 Yeah, it was outlying farms and... 388 00:28:46,113 --> 00:28:48,156 - There's still a lot of like... - It's still outlying. 389 00:28:48,323 --> 00:28:50,492 It's interesting 'cause coming from LA, 390 00:28:50,658 --> 00:28:53,369 you almost never see sort of big open empty spaces. 391 00:28:53,536 --> 00:28:55,538 Driving around, it's like wow. 392 00:28:55,705 --> 00:28:58,248 We're entering the Rancho Cordova realm. 393 00:28:58,415 --> 00:29:03,336 And I'm gonna take you right into the heart of it all. 394 00:29:03,503 --> 00:29:06,256 This is where the first crime occurs. 395 00:29:08,132 --> 00:29:13,762 When you first are learning about the case, 396 00:29:13,929 --> 00:29:19,851 you just want to get a feel for where did these things happen, 397 00:29:20,018 --> 00:29:23,396 who were the players in this, and... 398 00:29:23,563 --> 00:29:26,023 Can you tell anything more about this offender 399 00:29:26,190 --> 00:29:28,859 by going into the places he was in ? 400 00:29:29,026 --> 00:29:31,403 A few houses down on the right is number three. 401 00:29:31,570 --> 00:29:33,655 Yeah, so these houses are close together. Yeah. 402 00:29:33,822 --> 00:29:37,325 And I'll actually show you number one's house. 403 00:29:37,492 --> 00:29:41,620 For Michelle, it's like I want to get in this guy's mind, 404 00:29:41,787 --> 00:29:45,833 I want to go to these places, I want to try to understand 405 00:29:46,917 --> 00:29:50,253 why this area and why so close together. 406 00:29:50,420 --> 00:29:54,841 Was he from here ? This is his hot spot. 407 00:29:56,384 --> 00:29:58,385 This is the house right here. 408 00:29:58,552 --> 00:30:02,848 He cut the phone lines, and 409 00:30:04,307 --> 00:30:07,769 raped her and left the scene. 410 00:30:07,936 --> 00:30:13,107 This was in June, June 18th, 1976 was this attack. 411 00:30:13,274 --> 00:30:18,070 And the attack we're going to was in August, August 29th, '76. 412 00:30:19,279 --> 00:30:22,198 So, we're pulling up to attack number three right now. 413 00:30:22,365 --> 00:30:26,619 - That's how close he was. -He had to be from around here. 414 00:30:26,786 --> 00:30:30,372 A 12-year-old saw a masked man outside the window, 415 00:30:30,539 --> 00:30:32,332 ran, and woke her mother up. 416 00:30:32,499 --> 00:30:36,127 The mother ran to the kitchen and dialed the operator. 417 00:30:36,294 --> 00:30:40,089 Moments later, EAR was standing in the doorway with a club and a gun, 418 00:30:40,256 --> 00:30:45,094 naked from the waist down. He told the mother, "Freeze or I'll kill you." 419 00:30:45,261 --> 00:30:48,805 The mother grabbed the gun band as he approached her. 420 00:30:48,972 --> 00:30:51,558 He clubbed her until she lay on the floor. 421 00:30:51,725 --> 00:30:55,019 A neighbor had seen EAR walking away with no pants on 422 00:30:55,186 --> 00:30:57,313 but could not describe his face. 423 00:30:57,480 --> 00:31:01,108 This is the second house in, and if we drive to the corner house 424 00:31:01,275 --> 00:31:05,362 and if you just look on the fence line right here through, 425 00:31:05,529 --> 00:31:12,577 this goes straight through to the number one attack in June of '76. 426 00:31:12,743 --> 00:31:17,956 The neighbor also said that he was hearing for a couple months prior 427 00:31:18,123 --> 00:31:20,333 people jumping over his fence. 428 00:31:20,500 --> 00:31:25,380 It's my guess he was actually 429 00:31:25,546 --> 00:31:29,133 looking at these houses long before he attacked. 430 00:31:30,384 --> 00:31:36,139 It's amazing to me that any one person could get away with this many crimes. 431 00:31:36,306 --> 00:31:41,811 And you can just see how they're just a stone's throw away from each other. 432 00:31:41,978 --> 00:31:44,105 And right down the fence line. 433 00:31:44,271 --> 00:31:47,024 But he wasn't walking on those kind of fences, was he ? 434 00:31:47,191 --> 00:31:50,402 - He's said to have been walking them. - Oh, wow. 435 00:31:57,784 --> 00:32:02,955 As Michelle was going up, doing drive arounds of Sacramento, 436 00:32:03,122 --> 00:32:05,207 I saw her confidence growing. 437 00:32:05,374 --> 00:32:08,627 It was really exciting to have someone who was... 438 00:32:08,793 --> 00:32:11,337 you're in love with someone and they're doing something 439 00:32:11,504 --> 00:32:14,674 and you can see how excited and energized they are about it, 440 00:32:14,840 --> 00:32:16,634 and that makes you excited and energized. 441 00:32:18,802 --> 00:32:24,849 I'm amazed I'm still funny. I'm amazed I'm still funny. Because I'm in love. 442 00:32:25,016 --> 00:32:29,770 I'm in love. I'm in love. Yes, I am. 443 00:32:29,937 --> 00:32:33,607 And there is nothing, nothing ends a comedian's career quicker 444 00:32:33,774 --> 00:32:38,361 than regular sex and being in love. It's the worst thing on the planet. 445 00:32:38,528 --> 00:32:41,072 My girlfriend is obsessed with true crime and serial killers too. 446 00:32:41,239 --> 00:32:45,284 All she does all day, watches FBI Files, Forensics Files on TV. 447 00:32:45,451 --> 00:32:48,537 The most graphic, disturbing, depressing shows. 448 00:32:48,704 --> 00:32:50,080 I walk in the house every single day, 449 00:32:50,247 --> 00:32:53,041 "The amount of semen found in the chest cavity led investigators..." 450 00:32:53,208 --> 00:32:55,502 Oh my God ! 451 00:32:56,669 --> 00:33:00,798 She's like, "Shh, it's the semen cavity killer. I want see what's..." 452 00:33:04,551 --> 00:33:07,596 When I met Michelle was on... 453 00:33:09,014 --> 00:33:13,059 It was a show at the Largo. I think it was May 20th. 454 00:33:14,227 --> 00:33:17,229 I had been doing "The King of Queens" for five years, 455 00:33:17,396 --> 00:33:20,023 and I'd had a couple specials at that point. 456 00:33:20,190 --> 00:33:22,818 But she wasn't that steeped in the comedy scene, 457 00:33:22,984 --> 00:33:24,861 so she didn't know who I was. 458 00:33:25,028 --> 00:33:28,781 This guy was funny. More than funny. 459 00:33:28,948 --> 00:33:33,118 He was moody and startling, but hilarious. 460 00:33:33,285 --> 00:33:36,455 He could move the crowd with the tiniest of expressions. 461 00:33:36,622 --> 00:33:40,959 "Irish girls," he said, he knocked the microphone against his forehead, 462 00:33:41,126 --> 00:33:43,169 "Irish girls are my kryptonite." 463 00:33:43,336 --> 00:33:46,380 And then I was just sitting at the bar afterwards, and she was leaving, 464 00:33:46,547 --> 00:33:49,717 and she literally tapped me and just went, "Irish women, nice." 465 00:33:49,883 --> 00:33:53,095 And she was so fucking like steam roller gorgeous 466 00:33:53,261 --> 00:33:57,849 that I was just stunned, and I ran, I literally ran down the street 467 00:33:58,016 --> 00:34:01,018 and went like, "Hey !" And then the first word I ever said to her was, 468 00:34:01,185 --> 00:34:05,230 "Hey !," screaming. And then she turned around, and I went, 469 00:34:05,397 --> 00:34:07,316 "I'm not going to play any fucking games. I want your name and number 470 00:34:07,482 --> 00:34:09,526 so I can take you on a date this weekend. Are you free ?" 471 00:34:09,693 --> 00:34:13,696 And she went, "Yeah." I went, "Good, give me your number." 472 00:34:13,863 --> 00:34:16,699 It was just the most awkward, 473 00:34:16,866 --> 00:34:21,370 non-James Bond moment I could have had. 474 00:34:27,834 --> 00:34:29,460 Take off my mask. 475 00:34:29,627 --> 00:34:34,090 Our first date in LA they show movies at the Hollywood Forever Cemetery. 476 00:34:34,256 --> 00:34:37,759 So, we went and watched an Italian film called "The Tenth Victim". 477 00:34:41,972 --> 00:34:45,350 Really goofy Italian science fiction film. 478 00:34:45,516 --> 00:34:47,685 I was too nervous to really do a lot of talking that night. 479 00:34:47,852 --> 00:34:50,437 She did way more of the talking 'cause she just was... 480 00:34:50,604 --> 00:34:53,398 And the more we talked I'm like, "Oh my God, she's so smart and so cool. 481 00:34:53,565 --> 00:34:54,941 I'm gonna screw this up." 482 00:34:59,612 --> 00:35:01,697 I remember I called her late at night 'cause I was up and I'm like, 483 00:35:01,864 --> 00:35:03,241 "The Creature From the Black Lagoon is on." 484 00:35:03,407 --> 00:35:05,701 She goes, "I'm watching it. It's one of my favorite movies." 485 00:35:05,868 --> 00:35:09,746 That was one of the things we bonded over really early. We loved that. 486 00:35:09,913 --> 00:35:12,082 We loved many of the same things. 487 00:35:12,249 --> 00:35:16,461 Like "Creature From the Black Lagoon," tales of the grim and offbeat, 488 00:35:16,627 --> 00:35:19,463 and good food. 489 00:35:19,630 --> 00:35:22,716 I didn't like the way his comedian friends, including him, 490 00:35:22,883 --> 00:35:25,886 seemed to tell jokes but never listen. 491 00:35:26,053 --> 00:35:33,351 He thought I was thin skinned. For a while, it seemed it might not work. 492 00:35:33,517 --> 00:35:35,603 But one night, he was saying goodbye to me, 493 00:35:35,770 --> 00:35:41,108 and he won me over with an adorable Edward G. Robinson impression. 494 00:35:41,274 --> 00:35:45,361 And I was doing that, "Meh, see. Look at the getaway sticks on that tomato." 495 00:35:45,528 --> 00:35:47,697 Like chatting her up 496 00:35:47,864 --> 00:35:51,617 but in that old kind of slang and she thought that was so hilarious. 497 00:35:51,784 --> 00:35:54,703 I laughed and grabbed him. 498 00:35:54,870 --> 00:35:56,747 "More," I said. 499 00:35:56,913 --> 00:35:59,874 "Look at the keister on that hot number." 500 00:36:00,041 --> 00:36:04,128 Couples have in-jokes with each other, and that became one of my... 501 00:36:04,295 --> 00:36:07,798 It was just all that '30's gangster slang. 502 00:36:07,965 --> 00:36:11,468 However you wanna say it. I can't, oh God. 503 00:36:12,677 --> 00:36:19,267 I wouldn't let him go. After a while, we gave up and moved in together. 504 00:36:19,433 --> 00:36:24,563 I made this custom desk for her that was in this kind of half-moon shape. 505 00:36:24,730 --> 00:36:28,108 Like I wanted her to have like this command center. 506 00:36:28,275 --> 00:36:31,027 I've never tired of the Robinson impression. 507 00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:34,238 I've never tired of Patton. 508 00:36:36,741 --> 00:36:39,827 Michelle knew that she was marrying a famous person, 509 00:36:39,993 --> 00:36:45,206 and as much as lived a life that a lot of people might fantasize about, 510 00:36:45,373 --> 00:36:48,543 none of that mattered to her. And I mean really. 511 00:36:50,211 --> 00:36:55,799 She was a regular salt of the earth Midwestern gal. 512 00:36:55,966 --> 00:36:58,301 And she didn't want to be anything else. 513 00:36:58,468 --> 00:37:01,971 The whole being photographed and going to premieres and stuff. 514 00:37:02,138 --> 00:37:05,224 That meant nothing to her. 515 00:37:05,391 --> 00:37:07,101 Especially if you're someone who's thinking, 516 00:37:07,268 --> 00:37:09,937 "I want to go home and write later, I want to get up tomorrow and write." 517 00:37:10,104 --> 00:37:14,232 One of her favorite things in the world was to be in her room 518 00:37:14,399 --> 00:37:17,986 under the covers with a fan reading. 519 00:37:18,152 --> 00:37:20,113 - Do you want Patton alone ? - Do you want to leave ? 520 00:37:20,279 --> 00:37:22,114 Yes, I do. 521 00:37:22,281 --> 00:37:23,741 She went to the Oscars. She went to the Grammys. 522 00:37:23,908 --> 00:37:28,328 We just always giggled about it. It was so different from how we grew up. 523 00:37:28,495 --> 00:37:30,247 She usually would wear black and she would joke 524 00:37:30,413 --> 00:37:33,583 that they would think she was like a PR person. 525 00:37:33,750 --> 00:37:35,543 She was just an introvert, that's all. 526 00:37:35,710 --> 00:37:40,714 She was really good at making herself a fly on the wall and inconspicuous. 527 00:37:40,881 --> 00:37:43,091 I think it's one of the reasons she had incredible insight into people. 528 00:37:43,258 --> 00:37:46,803 She listened, she watched, she didn't need to be the center of attention. 529 00:37:46,970 --> 00:37:48,680 She didn't want to be. 530 00:37:48,846 --> 00:37:51,557 I think she'd always been sort of singled out as 531 00:37:51,724 --> 00:37:55,561 you're a terrific writer, and then she got to LA where 532 00:37:55,728 --> 00:37:58,897 there's a gazillion people trying to do the same thing 533 00:37:59,064 --> 00:38:01,566 and that was hard for her. She hadn't experienced 534 00:38:01,733 --> 00:38:06,487 that degree of consistent rejection and failure and disappointment. 535 00:38:06,654 --> 00:38:10,908 Her ultimate dream was always to write books or for the New Yorker. 536 00:38:11,075 --> 00:38:15,328 She also really, really wanted a child. 537 00:38:18,414 --> 00:38:21,375 Four years after we got married, our daughter was born. 538 00:38:21,542 --> 00:38:23,294 Alice. Hi. 539 00:38:24,879 --> 00:38:26,255 Hi. 540 00:38:26,422 --> 00:38:28,048 It was so amazing. 541 00:38:28,215 --> 00:38:30,217 Look at her... 542 00:38:33,887 --> 00:38:35,471 Oh, Alice. 543 00:38:37,765 --> 00:38:40,935 I think Alice was about two or three 544 00:38:41,101 --> 00:38:47,065 when Michelle was meticulously, due diligence researching about EAR/ONS. 545 00:38:47,232 --> 00:38:51,611 In Sacramento, the air is immediately better. 546 00:38:51,778 --> 00:38:55,531 Struck by the big open spaces. 547 00:38:55,698 --> 00:38:58,617 A little over half a million, or about half a million people, 548 00:38:58,784 --> 00:39:03,038 but it feels, coming from Los Angeles, it feels so much smaller. 549 00:39:08,501 --> 00:39:11,712 - How are you doing in here ? - I'm good. 550 00:39:12,963 --> 00:39:15,549 I might have... okay, this is crazy, can I have one more latte ? 551 00:39:15,716 --> 00:39:18,927 Of course. You got it. 552 00:39:19,094 --> 00:39:23,264 - But this was really yummy. - Good. 553 00:39:24,307 --> 00:39:26,600 When Michelle interviewed me, 554 00:39:26,767 --> 00:39:33,898 we met for breakfast down at the Citizen Hotel in downtown Sacramento. 555 00:39:34,065 --> 00:39:36,442 Talking about the attack is difficult, 556 00:39:36,609 --> 00:39:41,947 but Michelle, she was so serious about the case. 557 00:39:42,114 --> 00:39:45,409 She was just the easiest person to talk to. 558 00:39:45,576 --> 00:39:50,413 So, I'm from suburban Chicago, so all of this is so foreign to me. 559 00:39:50,580 --> 00:39:54,542 But I'm trying to get back into sort of the mindset. 560 00:39:54,709 --> 00:39:58,254 A lot of people will say that 561 00:39:59,421 --> 00:40:04,884 the E-A-R crimes, crime period, 562 00:40:05,051 --> 00:40:08,930 was kind of the end of innocence for Sacramento. 563 00:40:16,895 --> 00:40:21,357 We have the confluence of the American and Sacramento rivers. 564 00:40:21,524 --> 00:40:24,402 It was built up being a commerce center, 565 00:40:24,569 --> 00:40:26,529 and it became the state capital. 566 00:40:26,696 --> 00:40:31,491 We had both Mather Field and McClellan Air Base. 567 00:40:31,658 --> 00:40:37,622 So, military was a big aspect of the economy and the people who lived here. 568 00:40:37,789 --> 00:40:40,666 Back in those days, you did know more of your neighbors, 569 00:40:40,833 --> 00:40:46,421 people didn't lock all their doors or their cars necessarily all the time. 570 00:40:46,588 --> 00:40:51,009 And terrible crime was just 571 00:40:51,176 --> 00:40:53,386 not that common. 572 00:40:56,555 --> 00:41:01,435 '70's Sacramento, being a cop was like a cop anywhere else. 573 00:41:01,602 --> 00:41:05,438 It was pretty slow. And then June comes along, 574 00:41:05,605 --> 00:41:10,526 and you got this pervert later known as the East Area Rapist. 575 00:41:10,693 --> 00:41:15,739 I responded to a home invasion, a rape, in 1976, October 5th. 576 00:41:15,906 --> 00:41:18,700 Jane Carson on Wood Parkway. 577 00:41:18,867 --> 00:41:23,037 At the time, the East Area rape cases started, I was working Homicide. 578 00:41:23,204 --> 00:41:26,249 And I think it was the fifth case I was called to the scene on, 579 00:41:26,415 --> 00:41:28,751 which was Jane Carson. 580 00:41:28,918 --> 00:41:32,421 I understand the feelings that you're going through and wondering 581 00:41:32,588 --> 00:41:35,757 whether you did the right thing or whether you did the wrong thing, 582 00:41:35,924 --> 00:41:38,343 and could you have done anything any differently ? 583 00:41:38,510 --> 00:41:41,971 And I think you handled the situation very well. 584 00:41:42,138 --> 00:41:45,975 Well, I had thought of kicking him, but it would have been useless 585 00:41:46,141 --> 00:41:49,936 as my hands were tied and I was blindfolded and my child was with me. 586 00:41:51,688 --> 00:41:56,609 When the husband left for work, the rapist was in their house and on her. 587 00:41:56,776 --> 00:42:00,821 He knew down to the minute what was going on in Jane's house 588 00:42:00,988 --> 00:42:02,865 and the neighborhood. 589 00:42:03,031 --> 00:42:06,660 When I left there, I was convinced this probably wasn't just a routine rape. 590 00:42:06,826 --> 00:42:10,955 In fact, I know it wasn't. And then I started digging in deeper. 591 00:42:11,122 --> 00:42:13,541 In the meantime, we have a couple more rapes and at that point, 592 00:42:13,708 --> 00:42:18,253 there's no question we had a serial rapist. He had a definite pattern. 593 00:42:18,420 --> 00:42:21,506 When we realized that we first had a series going, 594 00:42:21,673 --> 00:42:24,425 the sheriff did not want the media to be aware of it. 595 00:42:24,592 --> 00:42:26,677 Because we didn't have anything. 596 00:42:26,844 --> 00:42:29,513 Because of what was happening within the rapes, 597 00:42:29,680 --> 00:42:33,267 he didn't want the word to get out to make fear in the community. 598 00:42:33,434 --> 00:42:35,811 We just weren't ready to handle anything coming in 599 00:42:35,977 --> 00:42:38,772 and we didn't have that many people working it. 600 00:42:40,064 --> 00:42:41,691 This is attack number eight 601 00:42:41,858 --> 00:42:44,860 and this victim was accosted outside of her house, 602 00:42:45,027 --> 00:42:48,030 as she drove her car into the driveway. 603 00:42:48,197 --> 00:42:52,325 She was taken into the backyard of her neighbor's house 604 00:42:52,492 --> 00:42:57,246 and there were strips of cloth already laid out for ligatures. 605 00:42:57,413 --> 00:43:01,750 Her ankles were tied with cord. She was blindfolded, gagged. 606 00:43:01,917 --> 00:43:05,796 Jingling her car keys, the EAR said he'd be back in five minutes. 607 00:43:05,963 --> 00:43:10,967 Car was reportedly found in the area with the dog locked in the trunk. 608 00:43:11,134 --> 00:43:13,678 The media became aware of it. The Sheriff said, 609 00:43:13,845 --> 00:43:16,764 "Please don't print anything, we're gonna catch this guy." 610 00:43:16,931 --> 00:43:21,143 And then as time went on and we didn't catch the guy, the media said, 611 00:43:21,310 --> 00:43:23,562 "Okay, we're gonna start printing." 612 00:43:23,728 --> 00:43:27,273 That was when the whole community was brought in. 613 00:43:27,440 --> 00:43:31,610 What happened right after number eight on 11/3/76, 614 00:43:31,777 --> 00:43:36,156 the rape series came to light during this meeting on crime prevention. 615 00:43:36,323 --> 00:43:38,617 There were 500 people in attendance. 616 00:43:38,783 --> 00:43:40,326 You can use a simple alarm system. 617 00:43:40,493 --> 00:43:43,371 Mount a bell device on the outside of your home. 618 00:43:43,538 --> 00:43:49,084 String some wires to a power source, and then string the other set of wires 619 00:43:49,251 --> 00:43:52,295 right to a nightstand and have a toggle switch there. 620 00:43:52,462 --> 00:43:56,091 If you ever hear the glass breaking, reach over on your nightstand, 621 00:43:56,257 --> 00:43:59,969 and flip the switch, the bell goes off on the outside. 622 00:44:00,136 --> 00:44:01,679 Other than by word of mouth 623 00:44:01,846 --> 00:44:05,015 where people might be talking about a neighbor that had been raped, 624 00:44:05,182 --> 00:44:08,768 there wasn't a lot of information until this time. 625 00:44:08,935 --> 00:44:11,146 On 11/4/76, 626 00:44:11,312 --> 00:44:16,442 the first newspaper article on the EAR appears in the Sacramento Bee. 627 00:44:16,609 --> 00:44:18,194 Warren Holloway was a reporter. 628 00:44:18,360 --> 00:44:20,946 I put a little one paragraph note out to the detectives, 629 00:44:21,113 --> 00:44:23,740 "Got a rape series going in the East Area." 630 00:44:23,907 --> 00:44:26,034 And he walked out, he saw that. The next day on the newspaper 631 00:44:26,201 --> 00:44:27,869 "East Area Rapist." 632 00:44:28,036 --> 00:44:30,705 It just got picked up and there it was, "East Area Rapist." 633 00:44:30,872 --> 00:44:33,249 Three weeks after attack number eight, 634 00:44:33,415 --> 00:44:37,044 where it was announced there was a town hall meeting in Rancho Cordova, 635 00:44:37,211 --> 00:44:41,798 of the 35 that attended, only one of those was a male. 636 00:44:43,007 --> 00:44:46,802 Following two weeks later, "Publicity May Have Curtailed Rapist," 637 00:44:46,969 --> 00:44:51,932 is written in the Sacramento Bee. Then he has his tenth attack. 638 00:44:54,059 --> 00:44:56,436 A lot of people don't realize this, 639 00:44:56,603 --> 00:45:01,065 but six rapes in Sacramento out of the first ten, 640 00:45:02,525 --> 00:45:07,488 six of them were teenagers. And two of them were 15 years old. 641 00:45:22,292 --> 00:45:26,463 This one here is probably Christmas day. 642 00:45:26,630 --> 00:45:29,299 So, it would be a week after it happened. 643 00:45:37,097 --> 00:45:42,602 It was December 18th. There was a high school dance and I had a cold, 644 00:45:42,769 --> 00:45:46,481 so at the last minute, I decided to stay at home. 645 00:45:46,647 --> 00:45:51,277 My parents were going to a Christmas party, and my sister was at work. 646 00:45:52,653 --> 00:45:55,322 My parents left probably around 6:30ish. 647 00:45:55,489 --> 00:45:58,116 And I think I put a pizza in the oven. 648 00:45:58,283 --> 00:46:03,329 I remember having my slippers on, and I decided to go play the piano. 649 00:46:10,002 --> 00:46:12,754 I heard a noise, 650 00:46:12,921 --> 00:46:16,507 but at 15 years old, you always hear noises in your house 651 00:46:16,674 --> 00:46:19,885 when your parents aren't home. So, I didn't think much of it. 652 00:46:20,052 --> 00:46:25,015 I stopped. I do remember stopping and listening and... 653 00:46:27,767 --> 00:46:31,771 I didn't hear anything else, so I continued to play. 654 00:46:34,732 --> 00:46:39,153 It wasn't very much longer, maybe a couple minutes, that I felt 655 00:46:41,196 --> 00:46:44,783 a presence next to me, 656 00:46:44,949 --> 00:46:47,660 and I looked up, and 657 00:46:48,744 --> 00:46:51,122 then I felt a knife at my throat. 658 00:46:57,961 --> 00:47:00,380 And then he told me in my ear, 659 00:47:00,547 --> 00:47:05,301 "If you scream or move, I will put this knife through your throat. 660 00:47:05,468 --> 00:47:07,094 And I'll be gone in the dark." 661 00:47:11,973 --> 00:47:16,853 He moved me down the hallway, through the garage, and into the backyard. 662 00:47:21,524 --> 00:47:24,360 Where I was left out in a... 663 00:47:25,444 --> 00:47:29,030 on a picnic bench while he went back into the house, 664 00:47:29,197 --> 00:47:33,368 and he told me he'd be watching me every 10 seconds. 665 00:47:36,954 --> 00:47:42,459 He came back outside, and that is where he cut my clothes off. 666 00:47:47,839 --> 00:47:50,049 He would bring me inside 667 00:47:50,216 --> 00:47:53,594 and he would rape me, take me back outside, 668 00:47:53,761 --> 00:47:57,180 inside, rape me again, back outside, 669 00:47:57,347 --> 00:47:59,683 and then another time. 670 00:48:01,059 --> 00:48:07,273 Yeah. So that was my first memory of that. 671 00:48:18,074 --> 00:48:23,287 I think during that time though there wasn't a lot of feeling going on. 672 00:48:23,454 --> 00:48:27,583 I was pretty numb and... 673 00:48:27,749 --> 00:48:30,877 But what I do remember is he had moved the couch 674 00:48:32,379 --> 00:48:34,380 very close to our fireplace. 675 00:48:34,547 --> 00:48:38,592 But because I was blindfolded and couldn't see, 676 00:48:38,759 --> 00:48:42,888 I thought he had caught our couch on fire. 677 00:48:44,222 --> 00:48:47,142 And I think that was probably... 678 00:48:48,309 --> 00:48:52,605 That was really scary, because I thought I was going to die. 679 00:48:55,774 --> 00:48:57,818 And then he was gone. 680 00:49:03,615 --> 00:49:07,535 I stopped playing the piano shortly after the attack. 681 00:49:09,286 --> 00:49:12,289 It was difficult for me to play 682 00:49:12,456 --> 00:49:18,628 because I always felt like there was somebody behind me. 683 00:49:21,631 --> 00:49:23,674 It was just a few hours. 684 00:49:24,800 --> 00:49:26,969 But it changed everything. 685 00:49:28,178 --> 00:49:31,598 It had been a month since he last struck, but he has struck again. 686 00:49:31,765 --> 00:49:34,267 This time it was a 15-year-old girl. 687 00:49:34,434 --> 00:49:37,103 Again, it was in a Northeast Sacramento neighborhood. 688 00:49:37,270 --> 00:49:39,105 Again, he knew she was alone, 689 00:49:39,271 --> 00:49:41,732 forced his way in using a knife to threaten her, 690 00:49:41,899 --> 00:49:44,193 and raped her repeatedly for several hours 691 00:49:44,359 --> 00:49:46,862 and forced her to perform perverted sex acts. 692 00:49:47,028 --> 00:49:49,155 The latest victim was younger than the others, 693 00:49:49,322 --> 00:49:51,282 and the attack took place early in the evening 694 00:49:51,449 --> 00:49:54,577 where the others took place between 11 at night and dawn. 695 00:49:54,744 --> 00:49:59,915 But it definitely was the same rapist who eluded authorities for over a year. 696 00:50:04,586 --> 00:50:06,754 When Michelle and I talked about this story, 697 00:50:06,921 --> 00:50:10,591 it was one of those things you keep thinking about and keep thinking about. 698 00:50:10,758 --> 00:50:13,969 Michelle had already done an incredible amount of research. 699 00:50:14,136 --> 00:50:18,056 And I remember thinking, "Okay, we've got a few hurdles." 700 00:50:18,223 --> 00:50:20,391 I have to pitch this to my editor-in-chief. 701 00:50:20,558 --> 00:50:24,353 Everyone loves a story about a killer, but in order to get her interested, 702 00:50:24,520 --> 00:50:28,023 I had to convince her that this story was relevant now 703 00:50:28,190 --> 00:50:32,069 and that it was like a Los Angeles and a California story. 704 00:50:32,235 --> 00:50:34,612 Michelle was an incredible, intrepid reporter. 705 00:50:34,779 --> 00:50:36,864 And so, as we were sort of trying to put the pitch together, 706 00:50:37,031 --> 00:50:39,742 she would go on her own and just research things. 707 00:50:39,909 --> 00:50:42,203 You could be completely confident that she was going to come back 708 00:50:42,369 --> 00:50:44,204 with something, something good, 709 00:50:44,371 --> 00:50:46,623 and not just get the facts right but also be able 710 00:50:46,790 --> 00:50:50,126 to have that relationship with that person she would need 711 00:50:50,293 --> 00:50:52,879 that no one else could get to. 712 00:50:56,716 --> 00:50:59,718 I pitched L.A. Magazine the EAR story, 713 00:50:59,885 --> 00:51:03,180 and they're interested in doing it possibly, which would be amazing. 714 00:51:03,346 --> 00:51:07,141 That would be, like, the kind of publicity that you can't buy. 715 00:51:07,308 --> 00:51:10,061 I just think this story is so important to be told. 716 00:51:10,228 --> 00:51:14,815 I just feel like he's smirking somewhere going, like, 717 00:51:14,982 --> 00:51:17,359 "I don't have to pay for this ever." 718 00:51:17,526 --> 00:51:22,447 If there's any way I could look at whatever you have 719 00:51:22,614 --> 00:51:25,324 and I won't copy anything, I just look at it and take notes 720 00:51:25,491 --> 00:51:27,118 and then give it back to you tomorrow, 721 00:51:27,284 --> 00:51:30,162 at least then I can say I saw case files. 722 00:51:30,329 --> 00:51:35,375 Can I let you while you're here look at some stuff ? 723 00:51:37,544 --> 00:51:40,338 Because I've sworn confidentiality 724 00:51:40,505 --> 00:51:44,633 that I would never release it out of my possession. 725 00:51:44,800 --> 00:51:48,470 Right. So I can sit there... 726 00:51:48,637 --> 00:51:52,432 You can sit there and go through them. I just can't let them leave my home. 727 00:51:52,599 --> 00:51:55,726 How many pages are there all together like ? 728 00:51:55,893 --> 00:51:57,937 - Probably four or five thousand. - Oh my god. 729 00:51:58,104 --> 00:51:59,480 - Yeah, it's big. - Yeah. 730 00:51:59,647 --> 00:52:03,400 It's all the rapes. It's all 50 rapes. 731 00:52:05,569 --> 00:52:07,195 I should make a trade with you today. 732 00:52:07,362 --> 00:52:11,324 You let me take this today and I'll let you take the cases today. 733 00:52:11,491 --> 00:52:13,117 -And then we give them back. -And then we give them back. 734 00:52:13,284 --> 00:52:15,911 I would do that, but we have to give them back. 735 00:52:16,078 --> 00:52:18,455 I can't believe I'm doing this. 736 00:52:18,622 --> 00:52:19,998 These underground trades, 737 00:52:20,165 --> 00:52:23,376 the result of furtive alliances forged from a shared obsession 738 00:52:23,543 --> 00:52:26,546 with a faceless serial killer were common. 739 00:52:26,712 --> 00:52:31,008 Online sleuths, retired detectives, and active detectives, 740 00:52:31,175 --> 00:52:33,177 everyone participated. 741 00:52:37,138 --> 00:52:40,808 DUDE. I got my hands on 4,000 pages of police reports. 742 00:52:40,975 --> 00:52:44,186 Case files of rapes 1-50. DYING. 743 00:52:50,233 --> 00:52:51,943 The grandiose seeker in me 744 00:52:52,110 --> 00:52:56,072 couldn't wait to insert the flash drive into my laptop back at my hotel. 745 00:52:57,907 --> 00:53:01,619 At every stoplight I touched the top pocket in my backpack 746 00:53:01,785 --> 00:53:04,705 to make sure the tiny rectangle was still there. 747 00:53:09,375 --> 00:53:14,672 Once in my room, I immediately changed into the crisp white hotel bathrobe. 748 00:53:14,839 --> 00:53:18,092 I lowered the shades and turned off my phone. 749 00:53:19,760 --> 00:53:22,179 I dumped a bag of mini-bar gummy bears into a glass 750 00:53:22,345 --> 00:53:27,391 and set it next to me on the bed where I sat cross legged in front of my laptop. 751 00:53:29,685 --> 00:53:35,357 Ahead of me was a rare 24-hour stretch without interference or distraction. 752 00:53:36,400 --> 00:53:40,487 No tiny hands, slicked with paint, asking to be washed. 753 00:53:40,653 --> 00:53:44,573 No preoccupied hungry husband to inquire about dinner. 754 00:53:45,991 --> 00:53:48,327 I inserted the flash drive. 755 00:53:48,494 --> 00:53:50,996 My mind in mail sorter mode, 756 00:53:51,163 --> 00:53:54,332 my index finger on the down arrow key. 757 00:53:54,499 --> 00:53:57,877 I began to not so much read as devour. 758 00:54:02,214 --> 00:54:04,925 Drainage ditches and cement lined canals 759 00:54:05,092 --> 00:54:08,595 come up frequently in the police reports. 760 00:54:10,013 --> 00:54:11,556 It's clear from the start, 761 00:54:11,723 --> 00:54:15,059 from footprints, evidence, suspicious sightings, 762 00:54:15,226 --> 00:54:18,020 and even bringing one victim down there, 763 00:54:18,187 --> 00:54:23,942 that the East Area Rapist traveled this way, like a subterranean creature. 764 00:54:24,985 --> 00:54:26,736 He was doing reconnaissance. 765 00:54:26,903 --> 00:54:29,489 He was studying people. 766 00:54:29,655 --> 00:54:31,741 Learning when they were home. 767 00:54:32,992 --> 00:54:35,452 That means that women exist who, 768 00:54:35,619 --> 00:54:40,415 because of change of schedule or luck, were never victims. 769 00:54:40,582 --> 00:54:45,044 But they felt something terrifying brush against them. 770 00:54:49,840 --> 00:54:53,718 Hours vanished, the gummy bears were gone. 771 00:54:54,928 --> 00:54:57,764 I was jittery from sugar, hunger, 772 00:54:57,931 --> 00:55:00,641 and spending too much time alone in the dark 773 00:55:00,808 --> 00:55:03,561 absorbing a 50-chapter horror story. 774 00:55:09,274 --> 00:55:11,359 Part of the thrill of the game for him I believe 775 00:55:11,526 --> 00:55:16,447 was a kind of connect the dots puzzle he played with people. 776 00:55:16,614 --> 00:55:21,285 You may not think you have something in common with your neighbor, 777 00:55:21,452 --> 00:55:23,620 but you do. 778 00:55:23,787 --> 00:55:25,538 Me. 779 00:55:28,291 --> 00:55:30,960 Hi Michelle, just spoke with the LA Mag editor. 780 00:55:31,127 --> 00:55:33,045 It's official. It's a green light. 70239

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