All language subtitles for ill.be.gone.in.the.dark.s01e06.1080p.web.h264-btx

af Afrikaans
ak Akan
sq Albanian
am Amharic
ar Arabic
hy Armenian
az Azerbaijani
eu Basque
be Belarusian
bem Bemba
bn Bengali
bh Bihari
bs Bosnian
br Breton
bg Bulgarian
km Cambodian
ca Catalan
chr Cherokee
ny Chichewa
zh-CN Chinese (Simplified)
zh-TW Chinese (Traditional)
co Corsican
hr Croatian
cs Czech
da Danish
en English
eo Esperanto
et Estonian
ee Ewe
fo Faroese
tl Filipino
fi Finnish
fr French
fy Frisian
gaa Ga
gl Galician
ka Georgian
de German
el Greek
gn Guarani
gu Gujarati
ht Haitian Creole
ha Hausa
haw Hawaiian
iw Hebrew
hi Hindi
hu Hungarian
is Icelandic
ig Igbo
id Indonesian
ia Interlingua
ga Irish
it Italian
ja Japanese
jw Javanese
kn Kannada
kk Kazakh
rw Kinyarwanda
rn Kirundi
kg Kongo
ko Korean
kri Krio (Sierra Leone)
ku Kurdish
ckb Kurdish (Soranî)
ky Kyrgyz
lo Laothian
la Latin
lv Latvian
ln Lingala
lt Lithuanian
loz Lozi
lg Luganda
ach Luo
mk Macedonian
mg Malagasy
ms Malay
ml Malayalam
mt Maltese
mi Maori
mr Marathi
mfe Mauritian Creole
mo Moldavian
mn Mongolian
sr-ME Montenegrin
ne Nepali
pcm Nigerian Pidgin
nso Northern Sotho
no Norwegian
nn Norwegian (Nynorsk)
oc Occitan
or Oriya
om Oromo
ps Pashto
fa Persian
pl Polish
pt-BR Portuguese (Brazil)
pt-PT Portuguese (Portugal)
pa Punjabi
qu Quechua
ro Romanian
rm Romansh
nyn Runyakitara
ru Russian
gd Scots Gaelic
sr Serbian
sh Serbo-Croatian
st Sesotho
tn Setswana
crs Seychellois Creole
sn Shona
sd Sindhi
si Sinhalese
sk Slovak
sl Slovenian
so Somali
es Spanish
es-419 Spanish (Latin American)
su Sundanese
sw Swahili
sv Swedish
tg Tajik
ta Tamil
tt Tatar
te Telugu
th Thai
ti Tigrinya
to Tonga
lua Tshiluba
tum Tumbuka
tr Turkish
tk Turkmen
tw Twi
ug Uighur
uk Ukrainian
ur Urdu
uz Uzbek
vi Vietnamese
cy Welsh
wo Wolof
xh Xhosa
yi Yiddish
yo Yoruba
zu Zulu
Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:01,065 --> 00:00:02,124 In the true crime community, 2 00:00:02,148 --> 00:00:04,232 Michelle's death was unbelievable. 3 00:00:04,565 --> 00:00:06,232 One of the first things I thought was, 4 00:00:06,315 --> 00:00:07,857 "That book has to get finished." 5 00:00:09,565 --> 00:00:11,440 I wanted to take care of this person, 6 00:00:11,524 --> 00:00:12,524 for her whole life. 7 00:00:12,607 --> 00:00:15,065 This book, was my last opportunity 8 00:00:15,148 --> 00:00:16,857 to take care of something for her. 9 00:00:17,190 --> 00:00:19,107 And then, there was the case. 10 00:00:19,440 --> 00:00:22,691 There was momentum within agencies recognizing, 11 00:00:22,899 --> 00:00:24,273 "We need to get this done." 12 00:00:24,524 --> 00:00:26,357 I reached out to this genetic genealogist. 13 00:00:26,732 --> 00:00:28,375 We got over a thousand matches. 14 00:00:28,399 --> 00:00:30,023 Things snowballed from there. 15 00:00:30,107 --> 00:00:32,541 I remember thinking, this guy looks awfully good. 16 00:00:32,565 --> 00:00:34,816 After four decades of searching for this guy, 17 00:00:34,899 --> 00:00:37,190 we got a one hundred percent match, 18 00:00:37,273 --> 00:00:39,148 to the Golden State Killer's DNA. 19 00:00:44,232 --> 00:00:45,691 I wish you were pointing that camera 20 00:00:45,774 --> 00:00:47,023 at Michelle right now. 21 00:01:34,857 --> 00:01:36,607 I was 18. 22 00:01:36,691 --> 00:01:39,482 The good girl, the rule follower. 23 00:01:41,107 --> 00:01:42,482 Straight-A student. 24 00:01:43,857 --> 00:01:45,816 I started dating this guy. 25 00:01:46,941 --> 00:01:50,107 He was studying law enforcement 26 00:01:50,190 --> 00:01:53,023 and I was in nursing. 27 00:01:54,649 --> 00:02:00,440 He was very gregarious, uh, outgoing to all my friends. 28 00:02:00,524 --> 00:02:04,232 We'd been together close to a year. 29 00:02:04,315 --> 00:02:08,023 He gave me a high solitaire engagement ring. 30 00:02:09,857 --> 00:02:13,232 And he told me that we're gonna be married. 31 00:02:17,524 --> 00:02:19,691 The rules were never for him. 32 00:02:23,107 --> 00:02:25,148 He took me hunting... 33 00:02:25,232 --> 00:02:26,399 ...without a license. 34 00:02:26,482 --> 00:02:27,899 Illegal spear fishing. 35 00:02:27,982 --> 00:02:32,941 We crossed into "no trespassing" territory at night. 36 00:02:34,023 --> 00:02:37,691 So many of the things that we did together, 37 00:02:37,774 --> 00:02:40,649 he pushed me toward fear. 38 00:02:42,899 --> 00:02:45,649 One time, I'm on the back of his motorcycle 39 00:02:45,732 --> 00:02:47,273 doing this steep hill climb, 40 00:02:47,357 --> 00:02:50,941 I'm just thinking this is... This is suicide. 41 00:02:51,023 --> 00:02:53,357 He let a German shepherd chase us on the bike... 42 00:02:55,023 --> 00:02:57,482 ...and he kicked the dog underneath the chin 43 00:02:57,565 --> 00:03:00,399 and he broke its neck. It just dropped dead. 44 00:03:02,899 --> 00:03:07,273 The critical point for us was in college. 45 00:03:07,357 --> 00:03:10,107 He told me that I was going to help him 46 00:03:10,190 --> 00:03:12,023 to cheat on the exam. 47 00:03:12,107 --> 00:03:16,023 I told him, "I won't let you cheat from my paper." 48 00:03:16,107 --> 00:03:19,190 And that began the escalation of, "But you have to. 49 00:03:19,273 --> 00:03:22,315 We're engaged. You have to, you have to. 50 00:03:22,399 --> 00:03:23,732 You owe me this." 51 00:03:25,691 --> 00:03:28,023 As he continued to put on pressure, 52 00:03:28,107 --> 00:03:31,273 I gave him back the engagement ring. 53 00:03:34,273 --> 00:03:35,482 Two weeks later, 54 00:03:35,565 --> 00:03:37,899 probably two or three o'clock in the morning, 55 00:03:37,982 --> 00:03:40,899 there was a tapping on the glass of my window. 56 00:03:43,023 --> 00:03:46,857 I pulled the curtain back, and he was pointing a gun at me 57 00:03:46,941 --> 00:03:49,816 and said, "Get dressed, we're going to Reno tonight. 58 00:03:49,899 --> 00:03:51,190 We're gonna be married." 59 00:03:53,816 --> 00:03:54,899 At that time, 60 00:03:54,982 --> 00:03:57,565 I still lived in my parents' home, 61 00:03:57,649 --> 00:04:03,232 and I ran to go wake up my father to ask him to help me. 62 00:04:03,315 --> 00:04:06,607 He put me in the bathroom and said, 63 00:04:06,691 --> 00:04:10,023 "Don't you come out until I come and get you." 64 00:04:10,107 --> 00:04:13,232 And it was about two hours of time. 65 00:04:13,315 --> 00:04:16,565 My father came back and just told me to go to bed. 66 00:04:16,649 --> 00:04:18,857 No indication of what was said 67 00:04:18,941 --> 00:04:21,190 or what had happened in the porch, 68 00:04:21,273 --> 00:04:23,399 and... and I never knew. 69 00:04:23,482 --> 00:04:26,357 I never got the story from my father. 70 00:04:27,774 --> 00:04:29,982 And I never saw Joe again. 71 00:05:32,065 --> 00:05:34,315 Where do we go? I'll follow you. 72 00:05:34,399 --> 00:05:35,315 One minute. 73 00:05:35,399 --> 00:05:37,315 Um, can we get this to stream, or... 74 00:05:37,399 --> 00:05:39,857 - We'll find it somewhere. - Here we go. 75 00:05:40,732 --> 00:05:41,972 Turn the volume up all the way. 76 00:05:42,023 --> 00:05:44,482 - Yeah, I will. - Yeah, yeah. 77 00:05:44,565 --> 00:05:46,166 Good morning, everybody. 78 00:05:46,190 --> 00:05:47,541 For those of you that don't know, 79 00:05:47,565 --> 00:05:49,249 my name is Anne Marie Schubert, I'm the District Attorney 80 00:05:49,273 --> 00:05:51,190 of Sacramento County. 81 00:05:51,273 --> 00:05:54,941 Over these years, hundreds of individuals 82 00:05:55,023 --> 00:05:58,107 have sought justice for these victims 83 00:05:58,190 --> 00:05:59,732 and their families. 84 00:05:59,816 --> 00:06:04,732 Many have dedicated their virtual entire professions 85 00:06:04,816 --> 00:06:06,691 to seeking this answer. 86 00:06:09,357 --> 00:06:12,065 Joseph James DeAngelo 87 00:06:12,148 --> 00:06:15,190 has been called a lot of things by law enforcement. 88 00:06:15,273 --> 00:06:17,357 He's been called the East Side Rapist, 89 00:06:17,440 --> 00:06:20,357 he's been called the Visalia Ransacker, 90 00:06:20,440 --> 00:06:22,524 the Original Night Stalker, 91 00:06:22,607 --> 00:06:24,148 and the Golden State Killer. 92 00:06:25,482 --> 00:06:30,482 Today, it's our pleasure to call him defendant. 93 00:06:32,107 --> 00:06:35,482 His 12-year reign of terror lasted from 1974 94 00:06:35,565 --> 00:06:38,524 through May 4th of 1986. 95 00:06:38,607 --> 00:06:41,399 He started with ransacking, sexual assaults, rape. 96 00:06:41,482 --> 00:06:42,565 Wow. 97 00:06:42,649 --> 00:06:44,565 He moved down the state from Sacramento County 98 00:06:44,649 --> 00:06:46,065 and ending in Orange County. 99 00:06:46,148 --> 00:06:48,065 They just confirmed that he's the Ransacker. 100 00:06:48,148 --> 00:06:50,482 - Wow. - 1980 to 1986. 101 00:06:50,899 --> 00:06:52,190 Oh my God. 102 00:06:53,816 --> 00:06:55,792 There's something about these detectives, 103 00:06:55,816 --> 00:06:57,541 like, I end up, like, falling a little in love 104 00:06:57,565 --> 00:06:59,291 with each of them. Just there... there's something 105 00:06:59,315 --> 00:07:01,458 about the drive that they have and what they're doing, 106 00:07:01,482 --> 00:07:04,732 that I just... I don't know, I get, like, almost, like, teary 107 00:07:04,816 --> 00:07:07,065 when I go to all these different jurisdictions 108 00:07:07,148 --> 00:07:09,649 and they're just digging through old paperwork 109 00:07:09,732 --> 00:07:12,065 and they're not giving up. 110 00:07:12,148 --> 00:07:14,065 I have such respect for it. 111 00:07:14,148 --> 00:07:15,315 It was disbelief. 112 00:07:15,399 --> 00:07:18,899 And then, um, a flood of emotions came through 113 00:07:18,982 --> 00:07:20,440 that over 40 years, 114 00:07:20,524 --> 00:07:22,273 I didn't realize were still there. 115 00:07:22,357 --> 00:07:23,691 Uh, it's absolutely huge. 116 00:07:23,774 --> 00:07:25,565 After nearly a quarter of a century 117 00:07:25,649 --> 00:07:28,816 trying to find this guy, to actually see him, 118 00:07:28,899 --> 00:07:31,732 after all these years of wondering who he was, 119 00:07:31,816 --> 00:07:33,315 it's an amazing moment. 120 00:07:34,816 --> 00:07:37,107 "We found the needle in the haystack." 121 00:07:37,190 --> 00:07:39,107 Those are the words of authorities in California 122 00:07:39,190 --> 00:07:42,148 following the arrest of a former police officer. 123 00:07:42,232 --> 00:07:43,708 Joseph DeAngelo, now 72, 124 00:07:43,732 --> 00:07:46,107 arrested outside his home. They surprised him. 125 00:07:46,190 --> 00:07:49,607 No incident. He didn't say, "It wasn't me," 126 00:07:49,691 --> 00:07:50,941 or anything like that? 127 00:07:51,023 --> 00:07:54,607 No, uh, really no... Really no conversation at all. 128 00:07:54,691 --> 00:07:57,649 Uh, just the, uh, the only thing he really said was, 129 00:07:57,732 --> 00:07:59,899 uh, they had arrested him. 130 00:07:59,982 --> 00:08:03,816 So, I can tell you that over the last few days, 131 00:08:03,899 --> 00:08:08,023 as information started to point towards this individual, 132 00:08:08,732 --> 00:08:10,774 we started some surveillance. 133 00:08:10,857 --> 00:08:13,774 We were able to get some discarded DNA, 134 00:08:13,857 --> 00:08:15,982 and we were able to confirm 135 00:08:16,065 --> 00:08:17,649 what we thought we already knew. 136 00:08:17,732 --> 00:08:19,899 - What does he mean, "discarded DNA"? - We had our man. 137 00:08:19,982 --> 00:08:21,774 - They went through his trash. - Oh. 138 00:08:21,857 --> 00:08:24,982 I can't underscore enough the absolute human factor. 139 00:08:25,065 --> 00:08:30,065 This was a true convergence of emerging technology 140 00:08:30,148 --> 00:08:32,482 and dogged determination by detectives. 141 00:08:32,565 --> 00:08:33,649 Yes. 142 00:08:33,732 --> 00:08:36,065 So I want to thank not only the crime lab, 143 00:08:36,148 --> 00:08:38,065 the DNA that helped us get here, 144 00:08:38,148 --> 00:08:39,399 but my own detectives... 145 00:08:39,482 --> 00:08:41,583 The amazing thing about this DNA technology 146 00:08:41,607 --> 00:08:43,857 is it's like every three months, it gets better. 147 00:08:43,941 --> 00:08:45,232 Within a year I can... 148 00:08:45,315 --> 00:08:47,607 We probably will have the family tree. 149 00:08:47,691 --> 00:08:49,524 What I love is this intersection 150 00:08:49,607 --> 00:08:51,857 of sort of technology and crime solving, 151 00:08:51,941 --> 00:08:55,023 in that people can get sort of wheeled out of their house 152 00:08:55,107 --> 00:08:56,816 for something they did in 1957 153 00:08:56,899 --> 00:08:59,732 because of the internet, because of DNA. 154 00:08:59,816 --> 00:09:01,607 She's an incredible writer, 155 00:09:01,691 --> 00:09:03,941 and a lot of people I saw on social media today 156 00:09:04,023 --> 00:09:05,190 were, you know, tweeting out 157 00:09:05,273 --> 00:09:06,857 this... this last bit that she wrote 158 00:09:06,941 --> 00:09:08,781 - which seems really fitting. - Oh, yeah, yeah. 159 00:09:10,190 --> 00:09:14,107 "One day soon, you'll hear a car pull up to your curb, 160 00:09:15,774 --> 00:09:17,440 an engine cut out. 161 00:09:17,524 --> 00:09:20,724 You'll hear footsteps coming up your front walk. 162 00:09:21,732 --> 00:09:23,315 The doorbell rings." 163 00:09:24,440 --> 00:09:26,732 No side gates are left open. 164 00:09:26,816 --> 00:09:30,607 You're long past leaping over a fence. 165 00:09:30,691 --> 00:09:33,649 Take one of your hyper gulping breaths, 166 00:09:33,732 --> 00:09:35,315 clench your teeth, 167 00:09:35,399 --> 00:09:38,357 inch timidly toward the insistent bell. 168 00:09:49,982 --> 00:09:51,440 Open the door. 169 00:09:52,482 --> 00:09:54,357 Show us your face. 170 00:09:55,440 --> 00:09:57,315 Walk into the light. 171 00:10:05,857 --> 00:10:07,357 Michelle McNamara. 172 00:10:19,190 --> 00:10:20,416 Good morning to you. 173 00:10:20,440 --> 00:10:22,400 We are outside the Sacramento County Courthouse, 174 00:10:22,482 --> 00:10:24,816 where later today, 72-year-old Joseph DeAngelo 175 00:10:24,899 --> 00:10:26,982 will make his first court appearance. 176 00:10:27,065 --> 00:10:28,899 Investigators now telling us 177 00:10:28,982 --> 00:10:31,399 they used discarded DNA to help track him down... 178 00:10:31,482 --> 00:10:33,857 Wow, is that huge. 179 00:10:33,941 --> 00:10:35,816 I was living in Citrus Heights 180 00:10:35,899 --> 00:10:39,899 and he was living in Citrus Heights for 30 years. 181 00:10:40,816 --> 00:10:42,232 Same city. 182 00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:45,816 And the fact that he was a police officer 183 00:10:45,899 --> 00:10:47,649 just makes me sick. 184 00:10:48,440 --> 00:10:49,524 And we're off. 185 00:10:50,691 --> 00:10:52,732 Gonna have positive vibes. 186 00:10:55,565 --> 00:10:58,357 It's interesting because I am getting nervous. 187 00:10:59,482 --> 00:11:01,023 I mean, I'm not afraid of him now, 188 00:11:01,107 --> 00:11:02,816 he's just... he's an old man, 189 00:11:02,899 --> 00:11:06,691 but, um... you know, evil's evil. 190 00:11:10,982 --> 00:11:13,315 On the first day of the arraignment, 191 00:11:13,399 --> 00:11:15,774 I was just like, "Can this be happening? 192 00:11:15,857 --> 00:11:17,399 This cannot be happening." 193 00:11:18,816 --> 00:11:22,774 The victims were all kind of gathered in the DA's office, 194 00:11:22,857 --> 00:11:27,440 and Dr. Offerman's son and his wife were there. 195 00:11:31,065 --> 00:11:33,649 For the longest time, when I found out 196 00:11:33,732 --> 00:11:36,065 that the murders were associated with the rapes, 197 00:11:36,148 --> 00:11:38,357 I really wanted to meet these women. 198 00:11:38,440 --> 00:11:41,065 They were, like, the only people maybe on the planet 199 00:11:41,148 --> 00:11:44,107 who got my story, who understood. 200 00:11:44,190 --> 00:11:46,399 And I thought, "They know." 201 00:11:46,482 --> 00:11:49,399 They know, but they know what happened to Charlene. 202 00:11:51,065 --> 00:11:54,190 But they lived through it, and they got to live through it, 203 00:11:54,273 --> 00:11:56,774 and they're strong. 204 00:11:58,315 --> 00:12:01,023 Forty-two years. 205 00:12:01,107 --> 00:12:03,524 Forty-two years I've waited for this. 206 00:12:03,607 --> 00:12:07,816 But, hey, he's behind bars and justice is being served. 207 00:12:07,899 --> 00:12:11,774 "Now we, dot, dot, dot, have the power 208 00:12:11,857 --> 00:12:13,357 and the control." 209 00:12:13,440 --> 00:12:15,524 Rape is all about power and control, 210 00:12:15,607 --> 00:12:18,399 but, you know, now we're in charge, buddy. 211 00:12:18,482 --> 00:12:19,732 We're in charge. 212 00:12:22,315 --> 00:12:24,232 Joseph DeAngelo of Citrus Heights 213 00:12:24,315 --> 00:12:27,148 is now facing 13 counts of murder 214 00:12:27,232 --> 00:12:29,482 and 13 counts of kidnapping. 215 00:12:30,607 --> 00:12:33,899 Deb Domingo asked if I could sit in for her, 216 00:12:33,982 --> 00:12:36,148 to be there in spirit for her mother 217 00:12:36,232 --> 00:12:39,399 and her mother's boyfriend that were so brutally murdered. 218 00:13:01,107 --> 00:13:03,458 All right, Your Honor, on the 130 calendar, page two, 219 00:13:03,482 --> 00:13:05,774 in custody, DeAngelo. 220 00:13:05,857 --> 00:13:10,482 Is, uh, Joseph James DeAngelo your true correct legal name? 221 00:13:12,023 --> 00:13:13,524 - I'm sorry? - Yes. 222 00:13:13,607 --> 00:13:15,357 Yes. You are. 223 00:13:16,065 --> 00:13:18,524 This old man? 224 00:13:20,023 --> 00:13:24,148 This pathetic old man is the monster? 225 00:13:24,232 --> 00:13:27,232 ...circumstance. Count one alleges 226 00:13:27,315 --> 00:13:31,232 on or about February 2, 1978, 227 00:13:31,315 --> 00:13:33,107 in the county of Sacramento, 228 00:13:33,190 --> 00:13:37,565 you did willfully, unlawfully, and with malice aforethought 229 00:13:37,649 --> 00:13:40,941 murder Katie Maggiore, a human being, 230 00:13:41,023 --> 00:13:45,107 in violation of Penal Code section 187, subdivision A. 231 00:13:45,190 --> 00:13:47,482 It is a felony. It's further alleged... 232 00:13:47,565 --> 00:13:50,691 I was not happy when I heard he was caught 233 00:13:51,315 --> 00:13:53,482 because I wanted him dead. 234 00:13:53,565 --> 00:13:56,816 But I was happy that he was being brought to justice. 235 00:13:56,899 --> 00:13:58,816 Like, all the conflicting feelings, 236 00:13:58,899 --> 00:14:01,982 I was angry, scared, happy, mad. 237 00:14:02,065 --> 00:14:04,732 I really experienced every emotion. 238 00:14:06,732 --> 00:14:14,065 I feel that I did a great job for 42 years of... 239 00:14:14,148 --> 00:14:20,273 living and trying to be as normal as possible. 240 00:14:20,357 --> 00:14:22,607 You know, it was now real. 241 00:14:22,691 --> 00:14:25,565 And unfortunately... 242 00:14:26,941 --> 00:14:29,565 our brains hold onto a lot of memories 243 00:14:30,774 --> 00:14:32,565 that now were starting to flood. 244 00:14:32,649 --> 00:14:35,565 ...sixty-one, Mr. DeAngelo. 245 00:14:35,649 --> 00:14:37,440 All right. Why don't we take a recess... 246 00:14:43,691 --> 00:14:47,023 To get through that initial time, 247 00:14:47,107 --> 00:14:50,816 I can't stress how... 248 00:14:53,816 --> 00:14:58,607 how unsettling it is to live every minute being afraid 249 00:14:58,691 --> 00:15:01,440 when you never thought that would happen to you 250 00:15:01,524 --> 00:15:02,816 or could happen. 251 00:15:05,816 --> 00:15:09,774 I scribbled over his face 'cause I hated it. 252 00:15:09,857 --> 00:15:13,232 Maybe we shouldn't use that one. 253 00:15:13,315 --> 00:15:17,440 Here's a good one. "How DNA was collected." 254 00:15:21,023 --> 00:15:25,691 Feelings are very complicated in these situations. 255 00:15:27,065 --> 00:15:30,190 I cannot remember after the rape 256 00:15:30,273 --> 00:15:34,607 the first time that I might have broken down in tears. 257 00:15:34,691 --> 00:15:40,357 I don't know that I ever did in front of any of the officers. 258 00:15:49,607 --> 00:15:53,565 The one time I do remember crying 259 00:15:53,649 --> 00:15:55,440 was two and a half months later 260 00:15:55,524 --> 00:16:00,357 on August 16, 1977, when... when Elvis Presley died. 261 00:16:01,273 --> 00:16:02,315 Bye. 262 00:16:06,357 --> 00:16:08,816 I cried for Elvis and I cried for myself 263 00:16:08,899 --> 00:16:12,148 and my family and all we'd been through that year. 264 00:16:12,232 --> 00:16:16,649 And strangely, after DeAngelo's arrest, 265 00:16:16,732 --> 00:16:18,941 I found myself crying a lot. 266 00:16:19,023 --> 00:16:24,023 And this is the thing about these emotions, you... 267 00:16:25,065 --> 00:16:29,357 you... you couldn't even, uh... 268 00:16:29,440 --> 00:16:32,691 intelligently explain why you're crying. 269 00:16:32,774 --> 00:16:36,816 It's... it's just perhaps maybe all the emotional stress 270 00:16:36,899 --> 00:16:42,565 of so much over so long a time. 271 00:16:58,524 --> 00:17:02,982 And then, when they started showing his house 272 00:17:03,065 --> 00:17:06,273 out in Citrus Heights, his nice... 273 00:17:06,357 --> 00:17:10,774 comfy suburban three-car garage house with the toys, 274 00:17:12,107 --> 00:17:14,774 I thought, "You're kidding me." 275 00:17:14,857 --> 00:17:17,857 Citrus Heights? Under our nose? 276 00:17:17,941 --> 00:17:21,107 And he's living the comfy suburban life 277 00:17:21,190 --> 00:17:26,357 that he wrecked for so many other people? 278 00:17:42,732 --> 00:17:44,917 Crazy thought, but what if we actually do 279 00:17:44,941 --> 00:17:48,440 catch this guy and you get the satisfaction 280 00:17:48,524 --> 00:17:51,065 of knowing all the work that we did 281 00:17:51,148 --> 00:17:52,982 helps land this dude? 282 00:17:53,065 --> 00:17:56,649 What's gonna happen to the kid and all these people 283 00:17:56,732 --> 00:18:00,232 that have spent 4,000 hours looking at this stuff? 284 00:18:00,315 --> 00:18:04,232 Uh, what will happen if this case gets solved? 285 00:18:04,315 --> 00:18:07,399 Um, because this does seem to fulfill something 286 00:18:07,482 --> 00:18:08,649 for a lot of people. 287 00:18:10,982 --> 00:18:13,148 This house right here. There it is. 288 00:18:15,065 --> 00:18:17,023 - Seriously? - That's it. 289 00:18:17,482 --> 00:18:19,148 That is it. 290 00:18:44,691 --> 00:18:46,190 Since DeAngelo's arrest, 291 00:18:46,273 --> 00:18:48,440 I spent that time trying to reconcile 292 00:18:48,524 --> 00:18:53,065 Joseph James DeAngelo with the abstract image 293 00:18:53,148 --> 00:18:56,565 of the East Area Rapist that I had developed. 294 00:18:56,649 --> 00:19:00,565 It's like this person's a stranger all over again. 295 00:19:02,440 --> 00:19:03,667 Much in the way that, you know, 296 00:19:03,691 --> 00:19:07,273 I'd struggled to reconcile Michelle's substance abuse 297 00:19:07,357 --> 00:19:09,037 and the things that I didn't know about her 298 00:19:09,107 --> 00:19:10,440 with the person that I knew. 299 00:19:12,273 --> 00:19:14,899 I've struggled to fuse those two people. 300 00:19:28,440 --> 00:19:30,732 You know, all of my work 301 00:19:30,816 --> 00:19:34,524 is interest in, uh, the human psyche. 302 00:19:36,399 --> 00:19:39,524 What makes people suffer, 303 00:19:39,607 --> 00:19:43,565 what makes, uh, people turn out the way they are. 304 00:19:45,774 --> 00:19:49,065 I'm really interested in what made Joe DeAngelo 305 00:19:49,148 --> 00:19:52,107 become the East Area Rapist. 306 00:19:54,774 --> 00:19:58,816 What in his life created that monster? 307 00:20:06,941 --> 00:20:09,482 Was he born like that? 308 00:20:09,565 --> 00:20:10,941 I don't think so. 309 00:20:12,774 --> 00:20:14,190 He may have had something missing 310 00:20:14,273 --> 00:20:15,541 and it culminated in other things 311 00:20:15,565 --> 00:20:18,857 that happened to him in his childhood. 312 00:20:18,941 --> 00:20:22,399 I don't know, but I really want to know. 313 00:20:29,023 --> 00:20:30,232 All right. 314 00:20:35,649 --> 00:20:37,857 The first thing I wanted to do 315 00:20:37,941 --> 00:20:41,774 was do a search for his name in Michelle's hard drive. 316 00:20:43,273 --> 00:20:45,649 She knew more about this case than anyone... 317 00:20:47,899 --> 00:20:49,357 but I didn't find it. 318 00:20:50,399 --> 00:20:52,399 And I was like, "Let's build a timeline." 319 00:20:52,482 --> 00:20:54,607 We need to build a timeline of where he's been. 320 00:20:57,065 --> 00:20:59,899 Joe is one of four, born in 1945 321 00:20:59,982 --> 00:21:01,565 in upstate New York. 322 00:21:01,649 --> 00:21:03,732 As a boy, he moves with his family 323 00:21:03,816 --> 00:21:06,691 to an army base in Germany where his father's stationed. 324 00:21:06,774 --> 00:21:09,524 My gut has always been like it's a troubled child 325 00:21:09,607 --> 00:21:11,607 of someone who had a big family connection 326 00:21:11,691 --> 00:21:13,315 to the military. Yeah. 327 00:21:14,565 --> 00:21:16,315 Then he moves to Rancho Cordova 328 00:21:16,399 --> 00:21:19,065 in Sacramento County for high school. 329 00:21:19,148 --> 00:21:22,691 They struggle financially and move frequently. 330 00:21:22,774 --> 00:21:27,482 In 1964, his parents divorce and Joe joins the Navy, 331 00:21:27,565 --> 00:21:31,315 serving as a warship repairman in Vietnam. 332 00:21:31,399 --> 00:21:33,625 Another part of me thinks, "Well, was it Vietnam?" 333 00:21:33,649 --> 00:21:35,107 I mean, look at the timing of it. 334 00:21:35,190 --> 00:21:37,273 So, you know, I'm not sure it wasn't that 335 00:21:37,357 --> 00:21:38,691 or something like that. 336 00:21:38,774 --> 00:21:40,232 Right. Wow. 337 00:21:40,315 --> 00:21:42,440 When he returns in 1968, 338 00:21:42,524 --> 00:21:45,023 Joe goes to school for criminal justice. 339 00:21:45,107 --> 00:21:47,440 That's when he's engaged to Bonnie Colwell, 340 00:21:47,524 --> 00:21:49,857 which ends badly. 341 00:21:49,941 --> 00:21:52,482 After graduation, he follows his family 342 00:21:52,565 --> 00:21:54,273 south to Exeter, California, 343 00:21:54,357 --> 00:21:57,065 and marries twenty-year-old Sharon Huddle. 344 00:21:58,357 --> 00:22:01,607 In 1973, he becomes a police officer, 345 00:22:01,691 --> 00:22:03,899 assigned to the anti-burglary unit 346 00:22:03,982 --> 00:22:05,607 one town over from Visalia, 347 00:22:05,691 --> 00:22:08,107 the same year the ransackings begin. 348 00:22:10,399 --> 00:22:12,982 Three years later, the ransacking ceases 349 00:22:13,065 --> 00:22:15,315 and Joe moves with Sharon to Auburn, 350 00:22:15,399 --> 00:22:17,440 where he joins the police force. 351 00:22:17,524 --> 00:22:20,941 The East Area Rapist attacks begin that summer, 352 00:22:21,023 --> 00:22:24,065 just 30 miles southwest in Rancho Cordova. 353 00:22:25,857 --> 00:22:27,496 No, he definitely was living in Sacramento. 354 00:22:27,520 --> 00:22:28,041 Okay. 355 00:22:28,065 --> 00:22:30,083 I mean, he definitely knew Sacramento very well. 356 00:22:30,107 --> 00:22:32,148 But he keeps coming back to this very small... 357 00:22:32,232 --> 00:22:33,750 I mean, you can walk to those crime scenes. 358 00:22:33,774 --> 00:22:34,384 Yeah. 359 00:22:34,409 --> 00:22:36,238 They're within a mile of each other. 360 00:22:37,232 --> 00:22:40,023 The EAR terrorizes Sacramento and beyond 361 00:22:40,107 --> 00:22:42,857 until 1979, when Joe was arrested 362 00:22:42,941 --> 00:22:45,190 for stealing dog repellent and a hammer 363 00:22:45,273 --> 00:22:47,524 and fired from the force. 364 00:22:47,607 --> 00:22:49,941 He wasn't super athletic. 365 00:22:50,023 --> 00:22:53,065 He had a nickname, which was Junk Food Joey. 366 00:22:53,148 --> 00:22:56,565 He would, you know, have a bag of potato chips, 367 00:22:56,649 --> 00:23:01,399 a candy bar, or a soft drink in his hand all the time. 368 00:23:01,482 --> 00:23:03,357 The Original Night Stalker murders 369 00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:06,649 in Southern California start in 1979. 370 00:23:06,732 --> 00:23:09,148 The murder spree stops in 1981, 371 00:23:09,232 --> 00:23:12,440 the same year the first of his three daughters is born. 372 00:23:13,148 --> 00:23:14,899 I mean, God. 373 00:23:16,357 --> 00:23:19,023 No murders occur for the next five years 374 00:23:19,107 --> 00:23:22,482 until his last known victim, Janelle Cruz, 375 00:23:22,565 --> 00:23:24,774 is killed in 1986. 376 00:23:24,857 --> 00:23:28,315 Joe's second daughter is born six months later. 377 00:23:29,941 --> 00:23:32,357 In the early '90s, his wife moves out 378 00:23:32,440 --> 00:23:33,982 with their three daughters. 379 00:23:34,065 --> 00:23:35,982 Though Sharon is a divorce lawyer, 380 00:23:36,065 --> 00:23:38,148 the pair never legally splits. 381 00:23:41,607 --> 00:23:44,982 I think he's a middle-class guy 382 00:23:45,065 --> 00:23:48,148 who... who has a respectable job that you would just be... 383 00:23:48,232 --> 00:23:51,482 Your jaw would drop if you found out that this was him. 384 00:23:52,732 --> 00:23:55,107 Joe spends most of his time fishing 385 00:23:55,190 --> 00:23:57,065 and working the night shift as a mechanic 386 00:23:57,148 --> 00:23:59,524 at a supermarket distribution center. 387 00:23:59,607 --> 00:24:02,273 In March 2018, he retires, 388 00:24:02,357 --> 00:24:04,816 and the following month, he is arrested. 389 00:24:08,857 --> 00:24:11,565 Um, the inside of the house was cluttered, 390 00:24:11,649 --> 00:24:13,691 but an organized clutter. Uh... 391 00:24:13,774 --> 00:24:15,148 Do we have any sense 392 00:24:15,232 --> 00:24:16,941 that he knew the book came out? Or... 393 00:24:17,023 --> 00:24:19,917 No. In fact, I was half expecting to see Michelle's book inside the house. 394 00:24:19,941 --> 00:24:21,166 Yeah. 395 00:24:21,190 --> 00:24:24,273 Uh, I did think about Michelle, thinking, 396 00:24:24,357 --> 00:24:26,732 "I wish you were here to be able to see this," 397 00:24:26,816 --> 00:24:29,273 because we had so many conversations 398 00:24:29,357 --> 00:24:31,816 about who this guy actually could be. 399 00:24:39,607 --> 00:24:42,065 You know, having three daughters 400 00:24:42,148 --> 00:24:45,899 and a granddaughter, um... 401 00:24:45,982 --> 00:24:48,148 you know, knowing that he committed crimes 402 00:24:48,232 --> 00:24:49,691 against women like that. 403 00:24:51,565 --> 00:24:53,691 What must that be like in his soul 404 00:24:53,774 --> 00:24:55,607 and in his conscience? 405 00:24:57,774 --> 00:25:01,148 My first alliance is with all the survivors, 406 00:25:01,232 --> 00:25:05,732 but I also feel compassion towards his family. 407 00:25:05,816 --> 00:25:08,273 I mean, their lives are changed forever. 408 00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:20,565 This is Uncle Joe. 409 00:25:20,649 --> 00:25:23,899 This is at his house, uh, in Citrus Heights. 410 00:25:27,273 --> 00:25:29,399 Here's Uncle Joe again. 411 00:25:29,482 --> 00:25:31,232 It's when he was younger. 412 00:25:31,315 --> 00:25:35,148 And this looks like it was taken at my parents' place. 413 00:25:35,232 --> 00:25:37,273 Um, yeah. 414 00:25:40,190 --> 00:25:41,232 Yeah. 415 00:25:44,982 --> 00:25:48,399 My mom, as she's dying, 416 00:25:48,482 --> 00:25:52,357 she says, "This family... 417 00:25:52,440 --> 00:25:55,399 is so full of secrets. 418 00:25:57,065 --> 00:25:59,732 Everyone has a secret." 419 00:26:02,232 --> 00:26:06,315 It's Becky, Joe, and Constance. 420 00:26:07,774 --> 00:26:09,524 So, Constance is my mother. 421 00:26:11,315 --> 00:26:14,399 She told me stories where they would be eating... 422 00:26:14,482 --> 00:26:16,941 peas off of the kitchen floor 423 00:26:17,023 --> 00:26:18,607 and they would be looking in cabinets 424 00:26:18,691 --> 00:26:19,982 to try to find something to eat. 425 00:26:20,065 --> 00:26:21,440 They were just little kids. 426 00:26:21,524 --> 00:26:23,691 Yeah, they, you know, because they were always... 427 00:26:23,774 --> 00:26:25,899 They were hungry, you know, and no one was home 428 00:26:25,982 --> 00:26:27,190 to feed them. 429 00:26:27,273 --> 00:26:30,649 Um, she said that they would be locked up in a closet. 430 00:26:31,857 --> 00:26:34,816 Uh, her father would lock them in a closet 431 00:26:34,899 --> 00:26:36,941 and then bring them out and line them up 432 00:26:37,023 --> 00:26:39,732 and do corporal punishment on them. 433 00:26:39,816 --> 00:26:42,524 And guess who got the worst of the beatings? 434 00:26:43,816 --> 00:26:45,565 It was Uncle Joe. 435 00:26:45,649 --> 00:26:48,315 She says, "My brother, Joe, 436 00:26:48,399 --> 00:26:50,857 got the worst of all of us." 437 00:26:53,148 --> 00:26:55,482 When we started dating each other, 438 00:26:55,565 --> 00:26:57,399 he had a big muscle car. 439 00:26:58,065 --> 00:26:59,899 He taught me how to drive. 440 00:26:59,982 --> 00:27:03,941 And he bought me a small .22 rifle 441 00:27:04,023 --> 00:27:05,774 and taught me how to clean it, 442 00:27:05,857 --> 00:27:08,524 how to load it, how to shoot it 443 00:27:08,607 --> 00:27:11,524 and, um, it was... It was a power thing. 444 00:27:12,649 --> 00:27:15,357 It was all about his dominance. 445 00:27:16,774 --> 00:27:20,399 Joe was my first sexual partner. 446 00:27:20,482 --> 00:27:24,232 When we were together intimately, 447 00:27:24,941 --> 00:27:28,232 he would stop and come back 448 00:27:28,315 --> 00:27:31,148 and stop and come back and stop and come back. 449 00:27:31,232 --> 00:27:35,315 And I didn't really understand that I could say, 450 00:27:35,399 --> 00:27:37,691 "You know, this is not fun for me. 451 00:27:37,774 --> 00:27:40,565 This is practically painful for me." 452 00:27:41,065 --> 00:27:42,941 And, uh... 453 00:27:43,023 --> 00:27:44,315 but I j... I went along. 454 00:27:44,399 --> 00:27:46,816 I didn't... I really didn't know any better. 455 00:27:46,899 --> 00:27:50,232 I just had no reference to say, "This is... 456 00:27:50,315 --> 00:27:53,107 This is going toward abusive." 457 00:27:55,649 --> 00:27:57,357 After the broken engagement 458 00:27:57,440 --> 00:27:59,273 with a gun at my window, 459 00:27:59,357 --> 00:28:02,065 I had so put it away and buried it. 460 00:28:04,565 --> 00:28:06,482 When he was arrested 461 00:28:06,565 --> 00:28:09,315 and I started to tell the story again, 462 00:28:09,399 --> 00:28:11,899 I was sleeping about three hours a night. 463 00:28:13,607 --> 00:28:16,482 I'm waking up with a gun at my head 464 00:28:16,565 --> 00:28:18,399 over and over and over again. 465 00:28:23,941 --> 00:28:26,023 I still today have a hard time 466 00:28:26,107 --> 00:28:27,607 believing that he did it. 467 00:28:28,816 --> 00:28:30,565 I mean, Joe's like... 468 00:28:31,273 --> 00:28:33,107 an amazing person. 469 00:28:34,399 --> 00:28:37,107 He was loving and... 470 00:28:37,982 --> 00:28:39,774 nice and... 471 00:28:42,273 --> 00:28:45,774 just the dad that I always wished that I had had. 472 00:28:48,482 --> 00:28:52,816 I was related to Joe through marriage, 473 00:28:54,399 --> 00:28:57,524 but he was just always known as Uncle Joe to me. 474 00:28:59,816 --> 00:29:02,649 When I was 13, 475 00:29:02,732 --> 00:29:07,148 I had two boys break into my house 476 00:29:07,232 --> 00:29:11,524 through a bathroom window in my parents' room 477 00:29:13,107 --> 00:29:17,148 and put my clo... My sister in a closet, 478 00:29:18,315 --> 00:29:19,857 held a knife to my neck, 479 00:29:21,857 --> 00:29:22,982 and attacked me. 480 00:29:25,065 --> 00:29:27,482 Well, between that and... 481 00:29:29,232 --> 00:29:32,857 the abuse of my dad, I tried to harm myself... 482 00:29:36,649 --> 00:29:38,315 and that's pretty much how I ended up 483 00:29:38,399 --> 00:29:40,023 going to live with Joe. 484 00:29:46,315 --> 00:29:50,190 This was dated on April 30th... 485 00:29:52,607 --> 00:29:54,524 and I said, "Joe... 486 00:29:55,691 --> 00:29:59,023 I don't even know how to begin, other than to say..." 487 00:30:01,982 --> 00:30:05,357 "I cannot believe what I am hearing and seeing. 488 00:30:09,273 --> 00:30:12,273 You taught me to drive, shoot a gun, 489 00:30:12,357 --> 00:30:16,357 always took me to Blockbuster to rent my favorite movies. 490 00:30:22,357 --> 00:30:25,565 Some of my best memories are of you. 491 00:30:25,649 --> 00:30:27,023 You were a good dad, 492 00:30:27,107 --> 00:30:29,565 that is the one thing I know to be true. 493 00:30:31,565 --> 00:30:33,899 I hope you did care about me... 494 00:30:36,816 --> 00:30:39,649 because my heart is forever broken." 495 00:30:52,315 --> 00:30:56,649 In 1975, we lived off of Winchester Way 496 00:30:56,732 --> 00:30:58,273 in Rancho Cordova. 497 00:31:00,524 --> 00:31:01,941 One night, uh, 498 00:31:03,273 --> 00:31:07,232 I was sleeping and I had to turn over. 499 00:31:07,315 --> 00:31:10,232 And I remember opening my eyes, and I saw... 500 00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:14,774 some... a man, or some man, 501 00:31:14,857 --> 00:31:17,607 or something, in a... in a ski mask 502 00:31:17,691 --> 00:31:19,524 and he was staring at me. 503 00:31:19,607 --> 00:31:21,357 This is the house 504 00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:24,023 that me and my family used to live in. 505 00:31:24,107 --> 00:31:27,565 Um, the bedroom to the left 506 00:31:27,649 --> 00:31:30,065 was me and my brother's bedroom. 507 00:31:30,148 --> 00:31:33,524 That's where I saw the man in the ski mask. 508 00:31:33,607 --> 00:31:35,107 I always wondered all these years, 509 00:31:35,190 --> 00:31:37,273 who was that talking to me 510 00:31:37,357 --> 00:31:39,857 through his teeth, who said, 511 00:31:39,941 --> 00:31:45,107 uh, "Don't turn around, go back to sleep"? 512 00:31:47,482 --> 00:31:50,941 I never discussed it with anybody. 513 00:31:51,023 --> 00:31:53,315 I never told a soul. 514 00:31:53,399 --> 00:31:56,524 I sat down with my wife after my uncle got arrested, 515 00:31:56,607 --> 00:32:00,941 and I was in tears and I was telling her these things. 516 00:32:01,565 --> 00:32:04,649 I said, "Wow, 517 00:32:04,732 --> 00:32:10,107 I wonder if he used our house as a safe haven?" 518 00:32:13,107 --> 00:32:15,774 I feel very, very bad 519 00:32:16,607 --> 00:32:18,565 for all these victims 520 00:32:18,649 --> 00:32:20,482 and for their families, 521 00:32:21,816 --> 00:32:23,607 and all these people, 522 00:32:23,691 --> 00:32:27,357 you know, that were murdered by him too and their families. 523 00:32:32,273 --> 00:32:34,273 And then, you wake up one day 524 00:32:34,357 --> 00:32:37,899 and you find out that you're on this side of the spectrum, 525 00:32:38,816 --> 00:32:41,023 where your family member 526 00:32:41,107 --> 00:32:43,899 is the one that did all these heinous crimes. 527 00:32:45,023 --> 00:32:48,565 Can you imagine how we feel as well? 528 00:32:49,774 --> 00:32:54,357 To think that someone who we knew all of our lives 529 00:32:55,607 --> 00:32:57,023 was like this, 530 00:32:58,774 --> 00:33:00,482 and we had no clue. 531 00:33:04,107 --> 00:33:07,148 The only motive that there ever was, 532 00:33:07,232 --> 00:33:09,315 was to completely control a person 533 00:33:09,399 --> 00:33:11,732 that I found physically attractive 534 00:33:11,816 --> 00:33:14,357 and keep them with me as long as possible, 535 00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:18,482 even if it meant just keeping a part of them. 536 00:33:18,565 --> 00:33:20,691 What would motivate somebody to do this? 537 00:33:20,774 --> 00:33:21,899 What was the motive? 538 00:33:21,982 --> 00:33:23,148 What's the motive? 539 00:33:23,232 --> 00:33:24,312 What was the motive? 540 00:33:24,357 --> 00:33:26,077 Motive? Motive? Motive? 541 00:33:35,649 --> 00:33:38,440 Thousands of people flocked to Nashville, Tennessee, 542 00:33:38,524 --> 00:33:39,607 earlier this month. 543 00:33:39,691 --> 00:33:42,565 They were headed to the second annual CrimeCon, 544 00:33:42,649 --> 00:33:44,482 a convention whose mere existence 545 00:33:44,565 --> 00:33:47,357 confirms America's fascination with crime. 546 00:33:47,440 --> 00:33:49,524 To me, it's almost like the Coachella 547 00:33:49,607 --> 00:33:51,107 of people who love true crime. 548 00:33:55,732 --> 00:33:58,357 I've spent a lot of time thinking about why. 549 00:33:58,440 --> 00:34:01,440 For many reasons, the fascination makes no sense. 550 00:34:02,232 --> 00:34:04,190 I'm extraordinarily squeamish 551 00:34:04,273 --> 00:34:06,399 about visual depictions of violence 552 00:34:06,482 --> 00:34:08,273 and frequently have to leave the room 553 00:34:08,357 --> 00:34:10,691 at what many would consider mild episodes 554 00:34:10,774 --> 00:34:13,232 of physical roughness on TV. 555 00:34:13,315 --> 00:34:16,107 No one in my family has murdered or been murdered. 556 00:34:17,941 --> 00:34:20,691 I don't know. I just don't know. 557 00:34:27,816 --> 00:34:29,291 So glad to meet you! 558 00:34:29,315 --> 00:34:31,816 It's a fear a lot of women hold 559 00:34:31,899 --> 00:34:33,649 that something's gonna happen to them, 560 00:34:33,732 --> 00:34:35,691 they might get attacked, um, 561 00:34:35,774 --> 00:34:38,023 you know, whatever it might be. 562 00:34:38,107 --> 00:34:40,023 Uh, they might get raped. 563 00:34:40,107 --> 00:34:43,273 Because in the world, they are vulnerable, 564 00:34:43,357 --> 00:34:46,899 and their worst fear happened to somebody else. 565 00:34:46,982 --> 00:34:51,107 And there's empathy, it's fear-driven... 566 00:34:52,607 --> 00:34:56,357 and when you're transferred into these alternate worlds 567 00:34:56,440 --> 00:34:57,607 through true crime, 568 00:34:57,691 --> 00:35:00,774 where the worst things possible are happening, 569 00:35:00,857 --> 00:35:02,148 it's both a relief, 570 00:35:02,232 --> 00:35:05,440 because it takes your mind off all your darkness inside... 571 00:35:07,315 --> 00:35:09,732 and at the same time, it's filling a fantasy 572 00:35:09,816 --> 00:35:11,524 of your worst fears. 573 00:35:15,357 --> 00:35:16,607 It was awesome. 574 00:35:16,691 --> 00:35:17,891 - Thank you, guys. - Thank you. 575 00:35:17,941 --> 00:35:19,333 - Appreciate it. - Can we have a picture? 576 00:35:19,357 --> 00:35:20,691 - Sure. - I'm sorry. 577 00:35:23,273 --> 00:35:24,649 Big fan. 578 00:35:26,524 --> 00:35:28,982 Initially, I was just a little, 579 00:35:29,065 --> 00:35:30,732 um, uneasy about the fact 580 00:35:30,816 --> 00:35:32,857 that I had no direct relationship to the case. 581 00:35:32,941 --> 00:35:34,381 It's the sort of thing that's like, 582 00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:35,667 "Well, why are you doing this?" 583 00:35:35,691 --> 00:35:36,833 Like, "Do you know someone who was... 584 00:35:36,857 --> 00:35:38,565 Who was attacked by this offender?" No. 585 00:35:39,816 --> 00:35:42,732 But it was just, I don't know, why do people collect, 586 00:35:42,816 --> 00:35:46,065 uh, baseball cards or model trains, you know? 587 00:35:46,148 --> 00:35:48,190 It's just something that captured my interest. 588 00:35:53,691 --> 00:35:58,565 This case gave me a direction and a focus. 589 00:36:00,065 --> 00:36:03,065 Connecting with Michelle was validating. 590 00:36:04,315 --> 00:36:07,065 I was spending ten to 15 hours a day 591 00:36:07,148 --> 00:36:09,107 developing persons of interest. 592 00:36:10,565 --> 00:36:12,148 Had this case not been solved, 593 00:36:12,232 --> 00:36:13,583 I could have continued doing that 594 00:36:13,607 --> 00:36:15,190 for the next 20 years. 595 00:36:17,982 --> 00:36:20,232 Now that the person has a face and a name, 596 00:36:21,607 --> 00:36:24,023 I guess I'm... I'm... I'm just kind of waiting for a certain, 597 00:36:24,107 --> 00:36:26,565 uh, feeling to materialize. 598 00:36:31,148 --> 00:36:34,691 Sort of overwhelming waves of feeling emotion. 599 00:36:34,774 --> 00:36:37,857 Uh, and it never really happens. 600 00:36:50,399 --> 00:36:52,774 Who is Joseph James DeAngelo? 601 00:36:52,857 --> 00:36:55,482 The wife of the suspected East Area Rapist 602 00:36:55,565 --> 00:36:58,357 returned home only briefly this afternoon, 603 00:36:58,440 --> 00:37:00,315 driving off when she saw us approach. 604 00:37:00,399 --> 00:37:03,023 It would be living hell to be related to this person. 605 00:37:03,107 --> 00:37:05,524 Tonight, investigators revealing new details 606 00:37:05,607 --> 00:37:07,232 about what may have fueled the rage 607 00:37:07,315 --> 00:37:10,023 of accused Golden State Killer Joseph DeAngelo. 608 00:37:10,107 --> 00:37:12,774 One rape victim in 1978 describing 609 00:37:12,857 --> 00:37:15,190 how her attacker sobbed while saying, 610 00:37:15,273 --> 00:37:17,649 "I hate you, Bonnie. I hate you." 611 00:37:23,315 --> 00:37:25,148 I had no idea 612 00:37:26,273 --> 00:37:28,107 how much I would be involved. 613 00:37:29,774 --> 00:37:31,315 The street in front of my home 614 00:37:31,399 --> 00:37:33,083 was full of satellite trucks and reporters 615 00:37:33,107 --> 00:37:34,565 just waiting for me. 616 00:37:34,649 --> 00:37:38,190 I had, uh, 143 phone messages 617 00:37:38,273 --> 00:37:39,399 waiting on my phone. 618 00:37:39,482 --> 00:37:43,482 People calling repeatedly from NBC, ABC, CBS. 619 00:37:43,565 --> 00:37:46,941 A producer from The Today Show came day after day after day 620 00:37:47,023 --> 00:37:48,857 and left notes and cards, 621 00:37:48,941 --> 00:37:51,732 and "We want to interview you." 622 00:37:51,816 --> 00:37:55,607 My Facebook profile photograph wasn't protected, 623 00:37:55,691 --> 00:37:59,315 so that's the photograph that was used all over the place. 624 00:38:00,190 --> 00:38:03,190 It was total invasion of my privacy. 625 00:38:04,357 --> 00:38:06,941 But I refuse to wear 626 00:38:07,023 --> 00:38:09,023 the blame for a crazy man, 627 00:38:09,107 --> 00:38:13,107 so I... I don't... I don't carry the guilt for that. 628 00:38:13,190 --> 00:38:17,941 But the empathy with the women that were attacked, 629 00:38:18,023 --> 00:38:21,524 and I can't... I can't turn that off. 630 00:38:24,565 --> 00:38:25,792 Applause broke out 631 00:38:25,816 --> 00:38:27,399 in this Sacramento County courtroom 632 00:38:27,482 --> 00:38:29,023 after a judge ruled to begin 633 00:38:29,107 --> 00:38:31,357 Joseph DeAngelo's preliminary trial 634 00:38:31,440 --> 00:38:32,482 in four months, 635 00:38:32,565 --> 00:38:35,732 despite defense requests to delay another year. 636 00:38:46,982 --> 00:38:48,982 I was told by the detectives 637 00:38:49,065 --> 00:38:54,023 that came to interview me that he didn't kill from '82... 638 00:38:54,107 --> 00:38:57,691 And then he killed again in '86. 639 00:39:00,023 --> 00:39:04,065 And so, during that period, I lived with him, 640 00:39:04,148 --> 00:39:07,232 and then I got married in '86 and moved away. 641 00:39:08,107 --> 00:39:09,107 So... 642 00:39:10,565 --> 00:39:13,565 that's the golden question, is everybody wants to know 643 00:39:13,649 --> 00:39:15,399 why he stopped. 644 00:39:20,607 --> 00:39:22,107 And there's my mother. 645 00:39:29,357 --> 00:39:31,273 My mother was, uh... 646 00:39:33,774 --> 00:39:34,982 she was raped... 647 00:39:40,774 --> 00:39:43,941 in Germany when she was seven years old... 648 00:39:47,190 --> 00:39:48,440 by two... 649 00:39:49,941 --> 00:39:51,148 military... 650 00:39:52,482 --> 00:39:53,982 officers or men... 651 00:39:55,482 --> 00:39:57,107 in an airplane hangar. 652 00:40:02,148 --> 00:40:03,816 Guess who was watching. 653 00:40:07,107 --> 00:40:08,357 Uncle Joe. 654 00:40:11,273 --> 00:40:14,607 He watched her getting raped. 655 00:40:23,232 --> 00:40:24,816 The very thing... 656 00:40:26,148 --> 00:40:27,691 that happened to my mother 657 00:40:29,107 --> 00:40:31,065 is the very thing that my uncle went 658 00:40:31,148 --> 00:40:32,607 and did to other women. 659 00:40:36,857 --> 00:40:38,315 I don't understand that. 660 00:40:40,816 --> 00:40:42,524 How sickening is that? 661 00:40:43,899 --> 00:40:50,107 Wouldn't you want to be, like, an advocate to do good 662 00:40:50,190 --> 00:40:53,399 when you see something like that happen to your own sister? 663 00:40:57,857 --> 00:40:59,315 It's just sickening. 664 00:41:13,565 --> 00:41:15,148 Honestly... Oh... Oh, my God. 665 00:41:15,232 --> 00:41:18,440 Thank you, guys, for staying... Coming out so early, 666 00:41:18,524 --> 00:41:19,774 for hanging out. 667 00:41:19,857 --> 00:41:22,315 This was amazing. Thank you, Paul Haynes. 668 00:41:22,399 --> 00:41:23,774 Thank you, Billy Jensen. 669 00:41:26,899 --> 00:41:28,273 And thank you, murderinos! 670 00:41:42,232 --> 00:41:44,732 Um, this is, uh, Kris. 671 00:41:45,565 --> 00:41:47,023 K-R-I-S. 672 00:41:49,565 --> 00:41:52,190 And, um, and I'm the social worker in the book. 673 00:41:52,273 --> 00:41:53,982 - Oh, you are. - Yeah. 674 00:41:54,065 --> 00:41:56,025 Yes. But you're not named. Are you okay with that? 675 00:41:56,107 --> 00:41:57,541 - She used a pseu... - You know what? 676 00:41:57,565 --> 00:41:59,691 - I'm perfect. - Okay. Good. Good. 677 00:41:59,774 --> 00:42:01,065 Are you in the book as well? 678 00:42:01,148 --> 00:42:02,691 - I'm number one. - She's number one. 679 00:42:02,774 --> 00:42:04,816 - Oh, my God. - And Kris is number ten. 680 00:42:04,899 --> 00:42:06,041 - God. - And then... 681 00:42:06,065 --> 00:42:07,291 And you're under pseudonyms? 682 00:42:07,315 --> 00:42:08,375 - Yep. - Yeah. 683 00:42:08,399 --> 00:42:10,899 - Okay. - And Patricia showed up tonight 684 00:42:10,982 --> 00:42:13,732 and just, uh, went to the manager of the store 685 00:42:13,816 --> 00:42:14,941 and said she was a victim. 686 00:42:15,023 --> 00:42:17,357 And this is her first interaction tonight 687 00:42:17,440 --> 00:42:20,315 with even, like, meeting people that... 688 00:42:20,399 --> 00:42:23,816 It's so powerful having all the women together. 689 00:42:23,899 --> 00:42:26,190 Well, this... This has made me feel 690 00:42:26,273 --> 00:42:28,232 - a thousand percent better... - Mm-hmm. 691 00:42:28,315 --> 00:42:29,917 - ...getting to see you... - Us, too. 692 00:42:29,941 --> 00:42:31,482 - Yeah. - ...like, living 693 00:42:31,565 --> 00:42:33,249 and moving around in the world and living your... 694 00:42:33,273 --> 00:42:34,982 - And strong. - Yeah, exactly. 695 00:42:35,065 --> 00:42:35,899 And we're... 696 00:42:35,982 --> 00:42:38,148 I... I just feel like we've very unified 697 00:42:38,232 --> 00:42:40,273 and we do have something in common, 698 00:42:40,357 --> 00:42:42,399 but more than that, like, we just... 699 00:42:42,482 --> 00:42:43,899 - Bonded. - We've bonded. 700 00:42:43,982 --> 00:42:46,524 And so just, uh, if we're gonna find something good 701 00:42:46,607 --> 00:42:48,899 out of the bad, we're gonna find it. 702 00:42:48,982 --> 00:42:50,440 - Yeah. - We will. 703 00:42:50,524 --> 00:42:51,982 - And we are. - Oh, God. 704 00:42:52,065 --> 00:42:53,708 So you did a really great job in finishing... 705 00:42:53,732 --> 00:42:55,625 - Yeah. And we thank you. - Thank you so much. 706 00:42:55,649 --> 00:42:56,941 Thank you. Thank you. 707 00:42:57,023 --> 00:43:00,315 I'm... It means everything to get to meet you guys. 708 00:43:01,273 --> 00:43:03,148 And us to meet you. 709 00:43:03,649 --> 00:43:05,232 It does. I wish... 710 00:43:05,315 --> 00:43:06,357 And I w... you know, I... 711 00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:07,792 I wish Michelle was hugging you guys. 712 00:43:07,816 --> 00:43:11,065 I every day wish Michelle was here to see this. 713 00:43:11,148 --> 00:43:13,816 We... yeah. I wish Michelle was here. 714 00:43:13,899 --> 00:43:15,982 This would have been her glory. 715 00:43:19,232 --> 00:43:21,899 Pick... Pick the Abe Lincoln setting for Billy. 716 00:43:31,774 --> 00:43:35,982 Meeting those women up in Sacramento... 717 00:43:36,065 --> 00:43:39,065 to see them there and they're smiling 718 00:43:39,148 --> 00:43:43,524 and... and... and they were like joking with me, and, um... 719 00:43:46,691 --> 00:43:49,232 They had every right to become horrible monsters 720 00:43:49,315 --> 00:43:51,691 like Joseph DeAngelo, and they didn't. 721 00:43:51,774 --> 00:43:53,857 So, them and the way that they're living 722 00:43:53,941 --> 00:43:56,399 is such a fuck-you to him. 723 00:43:56,482 --> 00:43:59,399 Like, "You tried to bring the same damage to us 724 00:43:59,482 --> 00:44:03,399 that forever warped you, and it didn't work. 725 00:44:03,482 --> 00:44:05,607 And we... we've proved that you could have chosen 726 00:44:05,691 --> 00:44:06,941 to overcome this 727 00:44:07,023 --> 00:44:08,982 and that's why you can't look at us." 728 00:44:10,357 --> 00:44:11,857 Fuck you, Joseph DeAngelo. 729 00:44:11,982 --> 00:44:15,649 Fuck all these fucking loser zilch assholes. 730 00:44:15,732 --> 00:44:16,982 Fuck them. 731 00:44:24,857 --> 00:44:26,524 It's so good to see you. 732 00:44:26,607 --> 00:44:28,732 Of course! He really thinks I don't remember them. 733 00:44:28,816 --> 00:44:30,649 Are you kidding? We're like... 734 00:44:30,732 --> 00:44:33,691 - Hi! Good to see you. - How are you? 735 00:44:33,774 --> 00:44:35,357 - How are you? - Good. 736 00:44:46,482 --> 00:44:49,899 - Hello. How are you? - Hi. 737 00:44:49,982 --> 00:44:51,232 I'm good. 738 00:44:51,315 --> 00:44:54,649 Oh, my gosh, it's so nice to meet you. 739 00:44:54,732 --> 00:44:56,232 This is my husband, Bob. 740 00:44:56,315 --> 00:44:58,999 - Hi, Bob. It's nice to meet you, too. - Nice to meet you. 741 00:44:59,023 --> 00:45:00,440 - This is Kris. - Oh, yeah. 742 00:45:02,399 --> 00:45:04,649 I just wanted to introduce myself. I'm Linda. 743 00:45:04,732 --> 00:45:07,190 - Hi. Courtney. - Hi, Courtney. Nice to meet you. 744 00:45:09,774 --> 00:45:11,166 Hi. My name's... My name's Michelle. 745 00:45:11,190 --> 00:45:13,148 Good to meet you. 746 00:45:13,232 --> 00:45:15,107 And I'm number... I'm number 39. 747 00:45:15,857 --> 00:45:16,774 I'm 31. 748 00:45:16,857 --> 00:45:18,337 And this is my husband, who's also 31. 749 00:45:18,399 --> 00:45:19,774 Were you married then? 750 00:45:19,857 --> 00:45:22,315 Mm-hmm. And I had a three-year-old son. 751 00:45:22,399 --> 00:45:25,023 - Yeah. - And then how long did your marriage last after that? 752 00:45:25,107 --> 00:45:27,607 - Seven months. - Oh, boy. 753 00:45:27,691 --> 00:45:29,857 All parties went for death penalty. 754 00:45:29,941 --> 00:45:33,357 Because I wanted him to rot in jail, you know. 755 00:45:33,440 --> 00:45:35,023 But now... 756 00:45:35,107 --> 00:45:37,267 I don't think he's gonna live that long anyway. 757 00:45:37,315 --> 00:45:38,607 Nah, probably not. 758 00:45:38,691 --> 00:45:39,899 I told Gay, I said, 759 00:45:39,982 --> 00:45:41,607 "I hope he goes to prison for 30 years." 760 00:45:41,691 --> 00:45:42,691 Not... Don't kill him. 761 00:45:42,732 --> 00:45:44,315 - Yeah. - Let him suffer. 762 00:45:44,399 --> 00:45:47,857 - Yeah, absolutely. - Trust me, he will. 763 00:45:47,941 --> 00:45:50,065 He's not gonna have any place to hide. 764 00:45:50,148 --> 00:45:52,065 I would just like for it to be over, 765 00:45:52,148 --> 00:45:54,732 and for all the convictions to be on record, 766 00:45:54,816 --> 00:45:57,899 and for him to be out of the limelight 767 00:45:57,982 --> 00:46:00,732 and where he should remain for the rest of his life. 768 00:46:00,816 --> 00:46:01,816 Yeah. 769 00:46:03,315 --> 00:46:05,023 Um, I've decided to get... 770 00:46:05,107 --> 00:46:08,273 a little bit of therapy to just deal with some of the... 771 00:46:08,357 --> 00:46:12,273 uh, feelings that I've developed over this past year, 772 00:46:13,190 --> 00:46:15,190 uh, things that have been dredged up. 773 00:46:16,399 --> 00:46:18,691 It's been almost a year now, and I'm... 774 00:46:19,691 --> 00:46:22,023 I'm much better in some ways. 775 00:46:22,982 --> 00:46:24,857 In some ways, I'm worse. 776 00:46:24,941 --> 00:46:29,399 But... I am better in my daily life 777 00:46:29,482 --> 00:46:31,357 and my ability to... 778 00:46:32,774 --> 00:46:37,691 um, sleep better at night and, uh, open the window, 779 00:46:37,774 --> 00:46:40,899 wake up, and not be certain that, uh... 780 00:46:40,982 --> 00:46:42,899 death is in my home. 781 00:46:43,857 --> 00:46:45,649 And, um... 782 00:46:45,732 --> 00:46:48,357 it is hard for, I think, people to understand, 783 00:46:48,440 --> 00:46:51,899 although I found people here at this gathering understand 784 00:46:52,691 --> 00:46:54,565 how it doesn't go away. 785 00:46:56,857 --> 00:46:58,857 I'm not gonna change my life 786 00:46:58,982 --> 00:47:01,482 and give him one more ounce of me. 787 00:47:01,565 --> 00:47:05,774 And if I do, he won, and I said I'm not doing that. 788 00:47:05,857 --> 00:47:08,273 I want to be positive, I want to show strength, 789 00:47:08,357 --> 00:47:09,797 and I want to show it to other women. 790 00:47:09,857 --> 00:47:11,148 - Yes. - And young girls. 791 00:47:11,232 --> 00:47:13,023 - Yes. - If it happens to a young girl, 792 00:47:13,107 --> 00:47:14,899 report it, don't be ashamed of it, 793 00:47:14,982 --> 00:47:16,500 - own it, and move on. - That's right. 794 00:47:16,524 --> 00:47:18,148 - If you need help, get help. - Yep. 795 00:47:18,232 --> 00:47:20,190 So, I was telling her, I said... 796 00:47:20,273 --> 00:47:23,899 My younger son did not want me to be a part of these shows. 797 00:47:23,982 --> 00:47:25,649 He said, "I'm in fear of something 798 00:47:25,732 --> 00:47:27,774 happening to my family." 799 00:47:27,857 --> 00:47:30,732 I wrote him a letter and I told him, 800 00:47:30,816 --> 00:47:33,107 "I stayed quiet for over 20 years." 801 00:47:33,982 --> 00:47:35,691 And I said, "Today, I'm happy, 802 00:47:35,774 --> 00:47:38,649 I'm healthy, I'm strong, 803 00:47:38,732 --> 00:47:40,607 I'm part of the 'Me Too, ' 804 00:47:41,524 --> 00:47:43,357 and I have a story to tell." 805 00:47:43,440 --> 00:47:45,524 And when he got the letter, he called up and he said, 806 00:47:45,607 --> 00:47:48,023 "Mom, I love you, and I'm proud of you." 807 00:47:51,607 --> 00:47:54,315 Okay, well, has everyone got their glass? 808 00:47:54,399 --> 00:47:56,691 Yep. 809 00:47:56,774 --> 00:47:59,774 So, it's been four decades since the East Area Rapist 810 00:47:59,857 --> 00:48:01,315 invaded our lives... 811 00:48:04,107 --> 00:48:05,232 and our bodies. 812 00:48:05,816 --> 00:48:06,857 And with that... 813 00:48:06,941 --> 00:48:11,148 he also invaded our sense of security and safety. 814 00:48:11,232 --> 00:48:14,857 And for me, as much as I hate to admit it at times, 815 00:48:14,941 --> 00:48:16,774 it definitely changed me. 816 00:48:17,774 --> 00:48:19,565 And now, it's only been one year 817 00:48:19,649 --> 00:48:22,399 since the East Area Rapist has a face. 818 00:48:22,482 --> 00:48:25,357 He can't hide behind his mask anymore. 819 00:48:25,440 --> 00:48:27,232 And he has a name. 820 00:48:27,315 --> 00:48:29,816 And his name is Inmate DeAngelo. 821 00:48:30,649 --> 00:48:32,691 And Inmate DeAngelo is behind bars 822 00:48:32,774 --> 00:48:34,357 and our safety has been restored. 823 00:48:35,816 --> 00:48:37,941 But something else happened... 824 00:48:38,023 --> 00:48:40,941 during this year, and that is us. 825 00:48:41,023 --> 00:48:43,941 When we've met, we've had no trouble sharing 826 00:48:44,023 --> 00:48:45,649 what we couldn't share with other people 827 00:48:45,732 --> 00:48:47,607 because it comes from here and we get it. 828 00:48:47,691 --> 00:48:49,732 And we know what it means. 829 00:48:49,816 --> 00:48:52,190 We're not just survivor sisters, 830 00:48:52,273 --> 00:48:54,023 we are a survivor family. 831 00:48:55,315 --> 00:48:56,982 - Well, said. - And... 832 00:48:57,649 --> 00:48:59,649 um, on a personal note, 833 00:49:00,816 --> 00:49:02,732 I feel for the very first time 834 00:49:02,816 --> 00:49:07,273 that I'm on the road to becoming myself again. 835 00:49:07,357 --> 00:49:09,190 And you are all to thank for that. 836 00:49:10,148 --> 00:49:11,565 So raise your glass 837 00:49:11,649 --> 00:49:14,273 to our new extended survivor family. 838 00:49:14,357 --> 00:49:16,399 - Cheers. - Cheers. 839 00:49:27,023 --> 00:49:29,023 Great... Great job, Kris. 840 00:49:29,107 --> 00:49:31,747 Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much. Thank you. 841 00:49:39,357 --> 00:49:41,625 - Oh, are you leaving? - We're gonna have to go. 842 00:49:41,649 --> 00:49:43,232 Okay. Yeah. You've got vacation, huh? 843 00:50:10,190 --> 00:50:13,732 The arrest of the suspect and visiting Paris 844 00:50:13,816 --> 00:50:16,440 were two lifelong dreams for me. 845 00:50:16,524 --> 00:50:19,899 And somehow, they occurred simultaneously. 846 00:50:21,232 --> 00:50:24,691 We had this trip planned for a while. 847 00:50:24,774 --> 00:50:28,732 And when he was arrested, I said... 848 00:50:28,816 --> 00:50:31,607 "He's going to prison and I'm going to Paris." 849 00:50:31,691 --> 00:50:34,190 And that's... That's a good thing. 850 00:50:38,232 --> 00:50:41,899 Two days later, I found myself walking through the Louvre 851 00:50:41,982 --> 00:50:44,023 for the first time in my whole life, 852 00:50:44,107 --> 00:50:46,107 which had been a lifelong goal. 853 00:50:46,190 --> 00:50:48,649 And I was just stopped in my tracks 854 00:50:48,732 --> 00:50:50,899 by this one painting. 855 00:50:56,148 --> 00:51:02,190 It is a young woman who has been left to drown 856 00:51:02,273 --> 00:51:03,941 with her hands bound. 857 00:51:05,315 --> 00:51:09,857 And the painting shows her peacefully having... 858 00:51:09,941 --> 00:51:11,691 given up... 859 00:51:11,774 --> 00:51:14,148 just under the surface of the water. 860 00:51:15,232 --> 00:51:19,816 It just summed up how I felt, you know, 861 00:51:19,899 --> 00:51:22,440 during the event and sometimes after. 862 00:51:23,982 --> 00:51:26,232 You know, this is what it feels like 863 00:51:26,315 --> 00:51:30,899 to have everything taken from you. 864 00:51:30,982 --> 00:51:35,107 And yet, you know, you're so close to the surface, 865 00:51:35,190 --> 00:51:37,399 but you can't survive. 866 00:52:22,524 --> 00:52:24,440 I think the narcotic pull for me 867 00:52:24,524 --> 00:52:26,607 is what I think of as the powerful absence 868 00:52:26,691 --> 00:52:28,691 that haunts an unsolved crime. 869 00:52:31,649 --> 00:52:34,524 Murderers lose their power the moment we know them. 870 00:52:35,732 --> 00:52:40,065 But he, whomever he was, was still out there. 871 00:52:40,148 --> 00:52:43,774 The hollow gap of his identity was violently powerful to me. 872 00:52:45,941 --> 00:52:48,774 But if you commit a brutal crime and then vanish, 873 00:52:49,732 --> 00:52:51,899 what you leave behind isn't just pain, 874 00:52:51,982 --> 00:52:53,357 but absence... 875 00:52:54,107 --> 00:52:56,607 a great supreme blankness 876 00:52:56,691 --> 00:53:00,357 that triumphs, obscenely, it seems to me... 877 00:53:01,399 --> 00:53:03,273 over everything else. 878 00:54:24,148 --> 00:54:26,857 You shared so much with us, 879 00:54:26,941 --> 00:54:30,232 so much of her personal writing and thoughts. 880 00:54:30,315 --> 00:54:32,899 Extraordinarily generous. 881 00:54:32,982 --> 00:54:35,440 Is there something that you were looking for in... in there 882 00:54:35,524 --> 00:54:38,232 that you couldn't look at yourself? 883 00:54:38,315 --> 00:54:41,524 There were parts of her that I didn't know about, 884 00:54:41,607 --> 00:54:45,315 and I figured with talking to other friends of hers and... 885 00:54:45,399 --> 00:54:47,649 family members and people that she worked with, 886 00:54:47,732 --> 00:54:49,607 you know, even if you're married to someone, 887 00:54:49,691 --> 00:54:51,440 you don't totally 100 percent know 888 00:54:51,524 --> 00:54:53,399 the other person. 889 00:54:53,482 --> 00:54:54,941 It's not the whole Michelle. 890 00:54:55,023 --> 00:54:56,649 It's parts of her. 891 00:54:58,691 --> 00:55:00,982 I try to tell Alice every single thing I can 892 00:55:01,065 --> 00:55:02,607 about Michelle that I know. 893 00:55:02,691 --> 00:55:04,148 But there's stuff I don't know. 894 00:58:38,631 --> 00:58:41,631 Subtitles Diego Moraes(oakislandtk) www.opensubtitles.org 67198

Can't find what you're looking for?
Get subtitles in any language from opensubtitles.com, and translate them here.