All language subtitles for the.war.you.dont.see.ws.pdtv.xvid-barge-eng

I am here because...

I recognize...

in my life there has been
a major imbalance,

mainly caused by...

what I have done in a criminal way.

I want to promise myself

that this is going to be
the most honest...

confession of my life,

and in doing that,

I need to make
the long journey backwards

to understand what I did,

to acknowledge that,

in some way to make
reparation for it,

and to let those
whom I have offended

know that, if possible.

Basically what I want
to say to them is, you know,

it should not have happened.

It should not have happened.

When I saw him the first time,

oh, I think it was
love at first sight.

- I agree.
- I really do.

It was easy to talk to her.

It must be. We've been
together 41 years now.

But he wasn't really
practicing Buddhism.

He used to go with me to church.

Yeah. Before I even met you,

I think I used to go to the chapel,

just for peace and quiet,
you know, so...

But then I still had to go to Ireland

and talk to Maria's dad
and ask for her hand.

- By then you were baptized.
- Yeah.

- I think that was a big
concern for my family. - Yeah.

We got married
December 26, 1964.

I told Maria, I said,
"Would you like to go to the States?"

It was a big step,

but, you know, I was willing
to go anywhere Bob was going.

Yeah.

Ann was born May 9, 1966.

Yeah, a bundle of joy, really.

- She really was.
- Yeah.

'Cause Bob was working
12 hours a day.

We'd get dressed up,
and we'd go outside

and wait for Bob
when he was coming home.

Oh, she'd say, "Hi, Daddy",

and give me a hug
and kiss, you know.

She was a perfect
little lady, you know.

You could take her anyplace.

In her own little way,
she was taking care of me.

So then I went to work
one day a week,

and then we decided
we'd buy a house... this one.

This one here.

The one and only house we got.

I was raised a really
strict Catholic in Ireland.

I mean, that was our life.

Yeah, and...

There is no other religion.

I thought she was a shining
example of a good Catholic

who had faith in her religion

whether I accepted all the beliefs
of the Catholic Church or not.

But I believed something...

And, you know, you raise
your kids that way, you know.

That was part of our life.

- It was our life, actually.
- It was.

I found peace there,

and, you know, comfort, I guess.

Some people are born
to be leaders,

some people are born to
follow, et cetera, you know.

I like helping people,

and, as one of my priest
friends said to me once,

he said, "You're
a people person".

And I think that helped a lot to say,

"Hey, I finally reached what...
or I'd like to do.

"I think this is
what I want to do.

I think this is what
I'm called to do."

I like to be with people.

I felt I was good with people.

I felt I was good with children.

I've often asked myself,

Why did I...

Why do I like children so much?

What do I want to do for them?

I feel compassionate to children
that I see sort of cornered and...

who image what I was
when I was their age

and did not have

somebody to turn to.

I tend to want to reach out
to people like that.

First time we met him was in 1971.

I was so excited to meet
somebody from home.

And I'd only been here,

like, five years at that time.

He would come and spend
his days off here.

He had a really strong Irish accent
at that time,

so we used to help him
with his sermons,

and Ann would go places with him.

Ann Jyono.

Little Ann... Ann was one of
the first people I met there,

or at least her parents.

Her mother was Irish,
father was Japanese...

of Japanese extraction, I think...

and was very welcome
at their home

for many, many years
of my time in Lodi.

I could, and was often
invited, to sleep over there.

Perhaps that's where
some of the problems began

in that... in Ann's situation.

There are two types
of people in the Church:

the hierarchy in the sacred
pastures, as they call them,

who are picked out by God to lead,

and the vast throng
who are the lay people,

and their duty is to be docile,
obedient followers.

It says that.

The system, it's a monarchy.

All power rests in individuals,

and so the system
protects those individuals

because it believes
that that is the will

of the higher power,
of the Almighty:

that He wants those individuals

to be powerful in order to control

this portion of reality called Earth.

And that's, I think, is...

It may sound simplistic
and like science fiction,

but that, in fact, is what it is.

I was...

a student for eight
years at Holy Spirit,

which is in the Sacramento Diocese,

and they had some kind of
advertisement to Camp Pendola,

and it was my first time
ever going away to camp.

None of my friends
went to school there.

I didn't know
anybody else there,

and I actually wrote
a letter to my mom

that she had...

On the back of the envelope,

I said I met a new friend, and
his name was Father O'Grady.

I remember him coming on a
sleep-over with the other girls,

and a couple of days later,

the other girls breaking out
with poison oak,

and them telling me that
I didn't have poison oak

'cause I slept with Father.

And I think the thing that
I'm going to regret most

is that I allowed myself to...

just to cuddling alongside her
in bed one night

when she was visiting with me.

I would...

label it love and concern...

hugging, embracing.

That tended to...

satisfy me and...

in a way that took care of my need

to reach out to somebody, you know.

From there, I don't know
how the relationship started,

that he got my address,

that he got in contact
with my parents.

He...

came over to the house
a couple of times.

My mother's from Argentina,

so she has more
of a trusting attitude.

She had told him, I think,

that I was pulling away
from the family a little bit.

She thought it was a good idea
for me to spend time with him.

If somebody asked me,
"Where was", you know,

"What...

What kicks the bucket for you?"

Whatever the thing is.

"What triggers things off for you?"

You know, "What areas would be?"

And, if given a variety
of areas to consider,

you know, I'd have to say
certainly on the younger level.

That's where a lot of that surfaced.

And if they said to me,

"Well, do you feel aroused
when you see women?"

I'd probably say no.

"Do you feel aroused
when you see men?" No.

"Do you feel aroused
if you've seen children?"

I'd say, "Well, maybe".

"How about children who are...

in swimsuits?"

I'd say, "Yeah".

"How about children in underwear?"

I'd say, "Yeah", you know?

How about... "If you thought
you saw children naked?"

And I'd say, "Mmm, yeah".

My last memory...

of Oliver...

is severe...

pain...

before I black out.

Years ago, Case was
Pastor of St. Anne's,

and the parents called Case,

and said to him,

"You know, when we
picked up our daughter,

"she was not herself at all.

"She was very nervous
and looked very jumpy

and looked extremely anxious."

I mean, he took me out of the house.

I said, you know, "Sometimes
I get carsick on the road".

He said, "Put your
head on my lap",

and, boom, the abuse started.

I mean, I was on Highway 12,

you know, two minutes away
from my house, and it started.

And for 96 hours, that abuse was
happening until my parents came

and said, "Did you
have fun with Father?"

And I'm, like, "He
tickled me too much".

How do you tell your parents
what you just went through?

They finally got it out of her that,

during the night,

Ollie had come into her room
and had molested her.

I think I tried to be
affectionate with her

by kissing her on the mouth.

And I know that my
hand went down,

and I think I brought
up her night dress

and tried to...

not tried to, I did touch
her in the genital area,

perhaps outside
her clothing at first

and maybe, although
I can't be specific,

I think I probably tried to put
my hand inside her underwear,

and I think that's about
the time I realized that...

it was not correct to continue,

and, although I'm not...

paraphrasing exactly
what I remember I did,

but I think I want to say that
I stopped shortly afterwards

and...

left the bed,

left the room,
and went back to my own bed.

Case said, "Have you
ever done this before?"

And, "No".

And... So he told him.

He said, "Ollie, this is outrageous.

"This is the very type of thing

"that people can go to prison for.

I want you to sit down and
write a letter of apology."

I took, you know, the occasion

to write my letter to the victim,

and to say,
"Hey, I'm sorry".

"May I say first of all

"that this is a difficult
letter for me to write.

"I have come to
like Nancy very much

"and wanted to express my
friendship and love for her

"by having her come stay with me.

"I also must admit

"that I feel very
affectionate towards Nancy,

"as I am sure I have
displayed many times,

"even in your presence.

"Now comes the difficult part.

"Did I touch Nancy in areas
which I shouldn't have?

"I have to admit that I
did on a few occasions.

"I guess I became
overly affectionate,

"and took advantage
of the situation

"and went a little too far.

"I have already written for an
appointment with my bishop.

"I realize the big responsibility
I have as a priest,

"and the high ideals
which I must uphold.

"But I am also painfully
aware of my own weakness,

"and how hard it is at times

"to keep the
ideals of priesthood

"in front of me...

"when temptations to
satisfy one's own ego

present themselves."

He said, "You need to know

I've already called
Bishop Guilfoyle",

who was the
bishop at the time,

and...

"As soon as our
talk is finished here,

you're getting
right in the car."

I mean, my mother says

that when she was having
the meeting with Guilfoyle,

he was completely saying,

"Oh, I'm sure Nancy just
misunderstood his actions.

"I'm sure she...

what she says happened
really didn't happen."

Even though Oliver had
already made an appointment,

Guilfoyle had already talked
to Case DeGroot about it.

My mom's having this meeting,

and he's saying, "Oh, I'm sure
nothing really happened",

blah, blah, blah.

My mom pulls out this letter, and
she said his face went beet-red.

He was furious
because of the letter.

Why was he angry about that?

For legal reasons, I'm sure.

Of the, you know...
I think he was anxious

that the letter be destroyed

or in some way...

disappear.

Case wanted to make sure

that Ollie was going to be
getting counseling for this,

but when he inquired,

the bishop felt that...

he had done his part,
he had brought him down,

and, in essence,
his part was over,

and he should not continue
to be a part of this.

I remember saying
one time to Case...

we were driving somewhere,

and Ollie's name came up
for one or another reason:

what he does on his
day off, you know,

and...

when I said, "Well, you know,

he sleeps over
at Maria's house",

and I could see he
got so, like, nervous,

but he didn't say
anything to me.

The reasons we asked him
to stay overnight sometimes

is because the
church can be hectic,

and, like, a priest
can be on 24-hour duty

because parishioners
may need help,

and it was kind of like a relief
to get away from work.

The duties that a
priest has to perform

shouldn't take up all his time.

And I do remember
one time, I think...

And that was his answer
to non-married priests.

- In other religions they're married.
- Yeah.

It would be so much
easier to help people

in the Catholic religion...

'Cause you know
what a family's like.

...if they had a family of their own,

and he used to say
he couldn't do that.

He couldn't do both.

Yeah, 'cause of the work
with the church

that, you know,

what he says is dedication
to the Church, you know.

You have to have celibacy
because you can't give...

But I says, "How do you know
how a family functions?"

And he would say,
"Well, by education, school".

You know, looking back
at it now in reflection,

it's more like a power trip
that he would have us robe him,

like he was a deity, you know?

Like he was the king
or something, you know?

He would call us
out of class, you know.

He had total control of us

'cause he was at our school,

he was at our home,
he was at church.

In a Catholic lifestyle,
what else is left after that?

What part of my
life wasn't he at?

I... Absolutely, you know.

I mean, there's an
awful lot of my areas

that I was ill-equipped
to handle, you know.

Counseling would be one of them.

If I were back in, I'd
never counsel people,

unless I took training
in it, you know.

Because apparently I wasn't
able to spot the differences,

spot the elements that...

There were danger signals

That a therapist, you
know, would know to say,

"Oh, there's transference
here", you know.

This person is not alone,
coming to me once a week.

This person is calling me
on the phone twice a day.

This person is calling
me on the phone

about things that are
insignificant right now.

"My God, what do
I have for dinner?"

Whatever you like.
Why are you calling me?

You've had dinner before.
You'll have dinner again.

But, you know, what
was there about me

that kind of said
"You can call me",

you know?

This was somebody that
we knew for 23 years,

totally trusted.

We trusted him because...

And now, you know,
I hear, you know,

things he did with other families,

and...

I just feel...

I never saw that side of him.

You know, we were
supporting him

up to the very, very end,

'cause he was...
he was the perfect...

example of what you would
think a priest would be

when he was here in our house.

I mean, he was
always respectful.

He was... Anything that I
saw with him with the kids,

he was fine.

He would stay here.

I mean, you'd see him
in here in the morning

reading his Bible.

He was everything that I...

I'd go to work and...

He was the closest thing
to God that we knew.

Being Catholic is...

not like being a Lutheran
or a Presbyterian.

The thing that,
for a lot of non-Catholics

is hard to understand is,

the Church teaches that
the only way to salvation,

if you're Catholic, is
through the Church,

and if you're not in
communion with the Church,

you're damned to hell.

And it's not just kind
of like without-God hell.

It's fire and brimstone
hell for eternity.

Well, the Eucharist, as we
call it in Catholic theology,

the Holy Communion is the
sharing of the bread and wine

that for some is the
body and blood of Christ,

for others represents the
body and blood of Christ.

No matter what you call...
what words you use,

it's essential to Catholicism.

The power of the Eucharist

is what the Church
has held over people,

that "I, as an ordained
person with an indelible mark,

"can make Holy Communion

"is what separates
you from me,

"what separates me

from the average person
going down the street."

And if you think of, you know,

the earliest church communities,

it wasn't controlled
by the clergy.

It was breaking of bread

and passed around
to believing people

as a symbol of
Christ's presence...

spiritual presence among us.

But then it has become
controlled in many ways,

and politicized.

So, for instance, if you're
married and divorced

and remarried but
not by a priest,

you can't go to Communion.

If you're gay and you're not
absolutely chaste and celibate,

you can't go to Communion.

If you vote for somebody
who approves of abortion,

you can't go to Communion,
according to some.

So it's become a kind
of a politicized reward

for thinking the right way,

when, in effect, it's
none of the above.

I can't think of anything more
evil than a priest using his office,

what the Catholics
would call alter Christus,

when the priest raises
that host at Mass

and consecrates that host,

the priest becomes one with Christ.

The Catholics believe,

and we're all taught as little kids,

that it's truly Jesus Christ.

To take that hand,

within moments before or after that,

and place them on a child's
genitals and abuse him...

And I think that was part of the
terrible destruction to the child

that in addition to all the other...

consequences...
long-term consequences

of being sexually abused,

the spiritual abuse...

of being abused by embodiment

of the divine, if you will,

was just devastating.

I asked for a meeting
with Oliver O'Grady in '86,

and they told me, you know,
"Vengeance is wrong.

"He's a virtue
of priesthood now.

"He's in counseling.
Check your motives.

"God will delve out punishments.

You don't need to."

When Nancy Sloan
came to you in the '80s,

she was distressed, correct?

1986, was it?

Was she distressed?

No, she wasn't.

Was she just doing just fine?

She... The first
time I saw her

was that day.

I hadn't known
anything about her.

She seemed very composed.

He just went on and on,

lashing out all this guilt on me,

when I told him, you know,

I just want him to
understand the depth

of the pain that I suffer
on a regular basis,

that how, when I
see a Dodge Duster,

which was the car
that he drove at the time,

how I still pull
over and dry heave.

What did she want?

She wanted to know

whether Father O'Grady

was continuing in therapy.

What did you tell her?

I told that I would...
I thought he was,

but I would check
on it for sure.

- Was he?
- Yes.

I told him, "You knew
that I was being abused.

"You knew that the
abuse was happening.

How could you not
have done something?"

So Bishop Montrose knew
O'Grady was an abuser?

He knew that O'Grady
had been accused

of inappropriate touching in '76.

Just like every other
bishop after '76.

- Right?
- Yes.

And he said...

"We knew that you
were being abused,

"but you were a girl,

"so we thought it
was normal curiosity.

"Had you been a boy,

"we would have thought
something was wrong with it.

"That would have been obscene

for him to have abused
a boy, like homosexual."

The situation is, I'm
alone with the boy.

There wasn't anybody else
in the rectory at the time.

I brought him in.

I had been affectionate
with him before,

so being affectionate
again with him

wasn't that difficult a
thing to do, which I was.

And I remember...

just holding him
and hugging him

and probably saying
some nice things to him,

and he was responding
as well, you know.

And the thought that had
gone through my mind, actually,

was to...

take off all his clothes

and to molest him that way.

And I think I may have
taken off his T-shirt,

and then I was going
to unbuckle his pants,

and there was a feeling...

I didn't know if
I wanted to go...

There was a conflict
in my mind about,

"Do I really want to do this?

"Here's somebody that I like.

"Here's somebody that I respect,

"a family I respect.

What would he feel
like at the end of this?"

Yet, at the other side,

there was urges within
me to be sexual with him,

and this is an opportunity
to be sexual with him,

because I wouldn't have
this opportunity again

God knows when.

And so I decided not to
be affectionate with him,

and yet later, I brought him
back into my bedroom again,

and I did unbutton his pants,

take out his penis,

and I began to masturbate
him at that time.

And...

I think what I...
In doing that,

I'm not too sure what
he was feeling with all...

I think, looking at his face

kind of told me that he was...

a little uneasy about this.

I thought at one point he
was going to cry, you know.

One of the few times it
had ever happened to me,

I had an orgasm myself...

without him touching me,

and I think that ended
it right there and then.

So I just tidied him up, and...

perhaps I took care of myself,
too, in the bathroom alone,

but I tidied him up
and put on his T-shirt,

and then I made a decision
right there and then.

I was not going to do
that again to this boy.

There's Ireland.

Yeah.

He went with us.

Yeah.

There he is with
Grandma and Grandpa.

- That's right. That's you.
- Yep.

- You're standing there.
- Behind the car.

Yeah.

- That's your Communion picture.
- Yep.

With Mahony.

I'm angry at Mahony

for claiming that he had absolutely
no knowledge of this pedophile

who had a file, a sub-secret file,

that had pieces of evidence,
that had, you know,

a father who had...

the Howard father
who had come forward

with his concerns
about the amount of time

that his children were alone
on Oliver O'Grady's days off.

'76 to '84,

that's, I think, when a lot of the
Howards' situation took place,

and, you know, if I
was involved with them,

I was a danger to them,

but I would have been a
danger to others as well.

Were you concerned about
Father O'Grady's conduct

with regard to the
Howard family in 1980?

I called him in and told him

that he was to
cease and desist

any more conduct... contact

with Mrs. Howard or
the Howard family.

He promised to do so,

and I never had another report

about him and the Howards.

I visited with the bishop,
and we had a conference,

and I had mentioned that perhaps
I should need some counseling

to get an
understanding of this,

and the bishop kind of at that time
said, "Okay, go ahead and do that".

You know, I'd say, "Bless me,
Father, for I have sinned. I..."

Sometimes it's good
to give them a time limit

as to when your last
confession was,

and say, "Well, I'd been with
some friends of mine yesterday,

"and some of them
are young children,

"and I had the opportunity
to be alone with one of them,

"and I did some things such
as to touch his private parts,

"and took occasion
to do that a few times

"when he was alone with me,

"and...

"I want to confess that right now,

ask forgiveness and absolution."

If it had come to your attention

that Father O'Grady told
your vicar-general

that he had sexual urges
towards a 9-year-old

or 10-year-old or an 11-year old,

is that cause to remove
him from ministry?

No.

And the Church just moved him

to another place
where they have kids.

Why didn't they just take him out?

Why didn't they admit it?

There was no action taken

that would remove
him from children,

and so when you transfer him
from one place to another,

it's...

just a tragedy waiting to happen.

Like again, the '84 situation,
what brought it up

was, you know, I'm not
feeling right inside.

There's something not right.

I need to take care of this.

When I had mentioned it
to my counselor,

this time a professional counselor...

he was a layman...

He was very helpful, you know?

And he about pulled
the whole tablecloth

out from under me, you know?

And all of a sudden,

I saw this massive...

problem, you know,

that I had,

these tendencies that I had,

and this vale of destruction

that I had created
as a result of that.

And that was very frightening,

very difficult to comprehend,

and even to want to comprehend

at that particular time

that that was going on.

But that's what he did
when he confronted me,

and said, "I need
to report this",

and he meant report it
to the authorities...

police department...

and that really scared me, you know?

That really woke me up.

My counselor suggested

that I now talk
to the bishop's office.

Well, I'm aware right now

that a personnel file
is kept on each person,

so I would tend to think that,

knowing Mahony as he is,

that he would have
gone through all those

and would have seen any references

that would have been in the file

regarding the 1973
and 1976 issues,

and that, I think,
should have told him

that there was, you know,
not just a one-shot deal,

but there was at least
two prior situations

that needed to be dealt with.

I should have been removed...

and attended to,

and he should also,
then, have followed up

by attending to the
people that I harmed.

I'd like if he had done that.

I'd like if all of the
bishops had done that.

Now, I didn't talk to
Mahony right away.

I think I talked to the other monsignor
that was there, Monsignor Cain.

Did you think it
was important in 1984

that the Stockton
Police Department

be advised not only
of the information

concerning young Mr. Howard,

but also that there had been

a prior allegation by
Nancy Sloan's family

of inappropriate touching?

No.

Well, how would they uncover

what happened to Nancy Sloan,

unless someone from
the diocese told them?

They wouldn't,

and at the time,

the two just were not related.

They just didn't coordinate.

What do you mean when you
say they weren't related,

they didn't coordinate?

Well, at the time of...

that he came in in '84

to talk about this incident,

certainly...

I knew the one in '76 took place,

but I didn't put
the two together.

One was a girl.

It was inappropriate touching.

The other was a boy, he said,

so I just didn't hook
them up in my own mind.

Monsignor Cain then suggested

I talk to the diocesan attorney.

Oh, it was very difficult, yeah,

because I was,
you know, kind of...

you know that kind
of unknowing thing?

I could be arrested.

Where could I end up, you know?

This could be...

What will my family think?

What will anybody think

when this happens, you know?

Mahony did call me. He was
out of town with some meeting.

I can't remember where.

But when he did get
back, he did talk to me.

I remember saying to him,

I said, "You know, Bishop,

this whole thing has been
going on for the past"...

and I'd been keeping
a record of the days...

"40 days."

It was, like, actually 40 days.

I said, "It's"...

I said, "It's been a real
desert experience for me",

using an analogy
from the Scripture

and, you know, the whole "40
years in the desert" type of thing.

I said, "It's been a real Lenten
experience for me, I guess",

I said, "even outside of Lent".

And he was very
supportive, you know.

He was very compassionate.

I felt at the time...

I think he was merely calling

to check how I was doing,

because he obviously knew

I had been very stressed
out over the situation,

and I told him that, you know.

And he got back to me.
He said, "This is where we are:

"No charge is being filed,
but we are moving you on,

and here's a couple of other
parts to the package deal."

The bishop, the attorneys,
and the police department

decided that maybe it was best

to move me on to another situation
out of the particular county

in which these charges will be filed,

and then to...

they'll let me take care
of the business there.

And Mahony's people
promised the police

that he would never
have another parish,

that he wouldn't be around kids,

and they'd take care of it.

In the Vatican Ecclesiastical system,

there's this term that's used.

It's called bella figura.

It's an Italian word

which means good
impression, good image.

One of the aspects,
one of the factors

in a man being successful
in the Church

is that he create a good image,

and that's what Roger was
very much concerned about,

that there be this image

of a very upright, loyal,
orthodox bishop,

soon to become
archbishop hopefully,

because he would be the
only choice for the pope

to be the archbishop of Los Angeles.

And the thing he had to do, then,

was to take O'Grady,
to avoid scandal,

and any scrutiny
on him in particular,

was to move him
to an outlying parish

far away from where the police
would have jurisdiction,

which was in Stockton at the time,

and move him out to San Andreas...

St. Andrew's in San Andreas...

way out there in the hinterland,

and put him out there

in a very quiet
little bucolic setting,

where there was no other supervisor,
just O'Grady,

and nobody would know,

and the police wouldn't know,

the public wouldn't know,

the parishioners and the victims
over there wouldn't know,

and Rome wouldn't know.

I'd taken the depositions

of cardinals, archbishops,
and bishops across this country

for 23 years,

and what I've
encountered is deception,

perjury, denial, and deceit

at the highest levels
of the Catholic Church.

Somebody has represented
to the police,

in the middle of their
active investigation,

that they are going to transfer
O'Grady out of the parish...

That he will be working
only with adults

and away from children,

and Monsignor Cain has denied

that he was possessed
of that knowledge.

Under oath.

You were the captain of the ship,

the bishop of the diocese,

the ordinary in charge.

Who else, if you weren't
possessed of this knowledge

and Monsignor Cain wasn't
possessed of this knowledge,

do you think could have been,

knowing the way
the diocese works

or at least worked in 1984?

I just have no idea of knowing.

I don't know.

I know that Monsignor Cain
knew that last sentence existed,

he certainly would
have said something.

He would not have
just let us go ahead

and move him to San Andreas.

I know that.

So I don't know who...

When they say
"This unit was advised",

I don't know who
they're referring to.

I have no idea.

To quote the cardinal's
appointment letter, he put him in

"full care of the souls of
that parish in California."

This... it would have
been the first time

that I had the total
responsibility for a parish.

Up to that time,
I was an associate.

It was again working out
in a nice, nice way for him

that another situation had
been smoothly handled.

Do you remember receiving this
letter from Father O'Grady?

I don't remember it, but I recall...

You know, you showed it to
me. I presume I received it.

Okay. Next sentence states,

"I would like to write to you
as one of the first persons

to whom I owe a great
deal of gratitude."

Period.

"I sincerely thank you

"for all that you have done for me

in the past few months."

What did you think he
was referring to there

when he made that statement?

Nothing in particular. I thought
this was a overly effusive letter.

I didn't really have
that much relations...

personal
relationship with him.

He was not a priest
that I would golf with

or have dinner with
or anything else,

so he was, I think,

quite flowery and
effusive, basically.

I honestly don't know.

As I say, when I first...

when I saw this again,

and I suspect the
time when I got it,

it's just an overly
effusive letter

that...

Next paragraph states, quote,

"I am particularly grateful to you

for your sensitivity to me
and my needs at this time."

What did you think
he referred to there?

I don't remember.

Really, as I say,

I just found the whole
letter terribly overstated,

and I imagine at the time

I read it cursorily
and filed it after...

It probably would have then...

I didn't answer
it for some time.

I didn't feel it was...

it was important or...

I have no idea.

At this point, looking
back at this 12 years ago,

I can't remember what I
thought when I read this letter.

When I read this,
I was just very puzzled.

I couldn't imagine what
he was referring to.

I just didn't...

I personally didn't pay
that much attention to it.

You'll notice I didn't answer it
till almost three weeks later.

What Cardinal Mahony did is,
he picked his own career,

and he picked power and
glory over the children.

It's like the scene in the Gospel

where it says that
Satan took Christ

to the top of a mountain,

and showed Him all
the cities of the world

and all the glory
over the world,

and said, "This
all can be yours

if you'll just sit and bow
down and worship me".

I think that's what
Cardinal Mahony did.

It was the only thing he
could do to keep his status,

and ultimately be exalted
to cardinal as he was,

not two years later.

To be married in the Church,
the Catholic Church,

you go through a
series of classes

with the priest that
you're dealing with.

In our case, it
was Oliver O'Grady.

Those classes,

from what I've heard now,

run between six
and seven weeks,

or six or seven sessions.

My wife and I went
in for our classes.

We met with the...
with O'Grady one time.

He found out that I
was in law enforcement,

and determined
that we did not need

any more further
marital training,

and signed us off,

and we were able to get
married in the Catholic Church

with Oliver O'Grady
presiding at our wedding.

And he was the priest

for one of the churches that
encompassed half the county,

so he played a major role
in a lot of people's lives,

a lot of families in
Calaveras County.

He's admitted that he spent
as much time grooming victims

as he did being a priest,

and he was a priest
for over 30 years,

spending every waking hour
planning abuse, executing abuse,

thinking about abuse.

So 365 days a year times 30.

He has so many victims,

I don't think he can keep track,

and I think it's in the hundreds.

How young are
the molested kids?

One's what, three
months, nine months?

That was his youngest victim.

Right.

You know, nine months.

nine months.

To abuse an infant,

I mean, you really...

Part of what people have to do

when they're talking about this...

and it's so hard,

and no one wants to do it...

is to really try to walk through

and picture a grown man

inserting... forcing his penis
into the vagina of a baby.

Oliver, have you
ever been diagnosed

with a disassociative disorder?

I'm sure I fit the category

of a lot of disorders.

Whatever they are,

you name that, I'll jump.

I'm not trying to be flippant here.

And I am. I'm sorry.

That's okay, but what
I'm trying to say is,

has anybody ever told you

you may disassociate
from events?

I'm sure they have.

Okay.

Is it...

I mean, to me, as a lay person,

when you molest somebody,

it's sort of black and white:

either you do or you don't.

What I get from you, Oliver, is,

in some instances,

you're not sure if
you molested people.

Correct.

Do you think that's
because it didn't happen,

or do you think that's because,

either to deal with
the trauma yourself,

or to justify it or deal with guilt,

whatever the
malady you had was,

do you maybe be disassociating

from the reality of
what actually occurred?

- I think that would be accurate, yes.
- Okay.

He's a very dangerous man,

and an aggressive,
assaultive person,

who apparently would do anything

to get to his victims,

including having sex
with their parents.

When I was little, I was
always talking to everybody.

And I feel like I had a lot of...

more hope in me than doubt.

I'm sure you could ask all
my teachers, and they'd go,

"Yeah. Smart guy. I don't
know what happened to him."

O'Grady saw an easy mark in us

because we're brought up...

I was brought up Catholic,

so automatically you see
a guy with a collar on,

you automatically trust him.

So he moved right in,

and Becky fell
hook, line and sinker.

You know, he was the wolf,

and I was the gatekeeper,

and I let the wolf
through the gate.

That's what it's always
felt like to me, you know?

And to know that
you could be...

that I could be so wrong.

I mean, how wrong
could I have been?

I mean, to be so
horribly wrong...

was absolutely devastating.

His whole thing,
he would get into the family

more than just with
the children, you know,

so my mom had been
involved with him,

and I think that was the...

that was the killer
one there, you know?

And early on I...

I realized early on that
there was something wrong,

but my upbringing told me,
nah, that can't happen.

I talk with a lot of, like,
female survivors,

and they talk about,
like, little games

to sort of... segue toward it,

but with... it wasn't
like that with me.

He just started in.

He started right in:

grabbing me, touching me,
making me touch him...

telling me that... why would
my folks have brought me here

if they didn't think it was okay?

Why would they even
have thought that?

Those are the things that he said.

I failed them once,
and it was huge,

and I'll never do it again.

That will never happen again.

I will not ever...

I will never fail them again.

I was trimming those
bushes, right there,

those little bushes,

the first time it happened.

I went into the house to eat lunch,

and then he just came
in and closed the door,

and he just held me down,
held my head down,

and he fucking sodomized
me right in there.

Right there.

That's not easy
to say, you know.

Fuck, for years I
never even spoke of it,

and every time I'd
get close to a girl,

or every time I'd...

feel like something
was done wrong to me,

I'd go right there.

It would just go in
the bin with it, you know?

That's the kind of...
That's what this shit does.

It doesn't just hurt you.

In July of 1993, we had a family

that contacted the Calaveras County
Sheriff's Department

to report that a priest in San
Andreas in Calaveras County

was molesting members of the family,

specifically two young boys
in the family.

So the next day he called me,

and he said he was having a problem

and he was away from the parish.

And I knew, just talking to him,
that there was something wrong.

Then we told him
we would help him.

I said, "If you didn't do any
of these things to children,

"you have no problem.

There's no way anybody
can accuse you of..."

Even the word molestation
never even entered my mind.

It was just touching.

I said, "If you didn't
touch these kids

"in an inappropriate way
or touched them sexually,

"you don't have anything
to worry about.

You don't have a record."

Then he said, Well, I had
a problem nine years ago."

When we started
our investigation,

we found out that this had
not been the first incident

that he had been involved in.

Going back as far as the mid-'70s

he had been involved
with molesting children.

It appeared that...

to us that there was a lot
of knowledge about that

outside of our community

but none of that
information had reached us.

At that point we
were supporting him.

Yeah.

Then he was concerned
about his family and stuff.

So I talked to his
family in Ireland,

and told them that
we would support him

and make sure he got represented
and everything like that.

At that point we obtained
arrest warrants for Oliver O'Grady

for multiple counts of lewd
and lascivious acts with minors.

We served search warrants at
the parish here in San Andreas,

the rectory here in San Andreas,

the diocese in Stockton,

and in law offices...
Not law offices,

but the offices of Cardinal
Mahony in Los Angeles.

Then when he asked for the
bail money, Bob went and got it.

I went to work Monday morning...

And I did.

And everybody at work
knew who he was.

They knew he was my friend.

The newspapers had...

It was kind of quiet.

I remember saying,
"What's the matter with you guys?

How come you're all acting
this way this morning?"

They said,
"Did you read the paper?"

I said, "No, I haven't had
time to read the paper yet.

Yeah.

It was exploded all over the
front page of the newspaper.

I said, "There's no way
Ollie would touch our kids".

We didn't suspect.
We didn't see anything.

Just no way.

Then I called Bob at work

and told him what I saw
in the paper and everything.

I said... And he said
the same thing to me.

He said, "No way.

There's no way he
would touch our kids."

Then it was almost like
the fear of God got in me.

I told... He said, "Well,
we have to ask them".

But then we went...

I called her and I said,

"Ann, did you see the paper?

Did you read about
Father Ollie in the paper?"

She said she didn't
watch the news or something.

I said, "There's all these
allegations against him".

The boys from...
It was the Howard kids at that time.

And...

I was... When I said it to her

I was expecting a response
like "Who's doing this?"

And it was nothing.
It was just absolute silence.

Then I said to her... I said,

"Ann, I have to ask you."

I said, "Did he ever touch you
when you were a little girl?"

And she... "I got to go, Mom.

I got to take care of the dog."

I just knew right then.

I just felt it.

She still wouldn't answer.

I said, "Bob, you
have to call her".

I knew she wouldn't lie to Bob.

So I asked her.

She called him.

You called her.

I asked her if he had molested you.

You said,
"Did he ever touch you?"

Yeah.
"Did he ever touch..."

And she said yes.

And the whole world collapsed.

I could hear him crying.

I could hear Ann crying
on the other side...

I gave her back the phone, and...

She came over, and
Case DeGroot came over.

At that point, it
destroyed our lives.

From that day on it just...

Destroyed our family.

Everything.

Then it's like you
have flashbacks.

Why didn't I see this?

Why didn't I see that?

Right.

It was like...

It was terrible.

I kind of handed Ann
over to this bastard

on a silver platter, just about.

How did he do it?

He just destroyed...

How did we get fooled
by him so much?

I used to go to work
and he'd be here

saying his morning prayers.

Had the Bible in his hand,

and he's saying morning prayers.

I said, "Good morning, Ollie".

Then he'd be in there at
nighttime molesting Ann.

And during the night he's
molesting my daughter.

Raping her!

Not molesting her!
Raping her!

At five years old!

God's sakes!

How could that happen?

But that's what he did.

It's futile to ask the question,
"How can this be?

Why does this happen?"

The system, the monarchical,

hierarchical
governmental system

that the people in charge
of the Roman Catholic Church

from the Pope on down firmly
believe was willed by almighty God

is the reason why Roger
Mahony is believed to be

substantially more
important and better

than the children who were
ravished by Oliver O'Grady.

My father won't walk
me down the aisle

because he can't
step in the church.

He's taken my wedding
away from me,

everything in the future.

I constantly am battling
to regain my life back.

Constantly.

I have never
conceived a child.

I'm not married.

I'm 40 years old, almost.

I'm 39.

I'm approaching 40 and...

it's still not over.

When did it stop?
When she was 13?

- 12.
- 12, okay.

And I asked her, "Why didn't
you tell us earlier? Why?"

And her answer was to me

that I used to say that
anybody who tried to hurt you,

I would kill him!

And...

I shouldn't have
made that statement.

She told me that...

She wouldn't say anything!

She asked a little girl
what would happen

if your Dad killed somebody,

and they said that he would
go to jail forever and ever

and never come out.

She said that day I decided
I could never tell anybody

because she said,
"I knew Dad would kill him".

It guess her love for me
kept her from telling me.

And my love for her...

I feel guilty about that,

but I feel betrayed
by the Church.

The Church had betrayed
me and my family!

They destroyed it.

By golly, I'm not going
to let it destroy me now.

My name is Tom Doyle.

I've been a Catholic
priest for 35 years.

I've been fired from
two major positions

and sidetracked from two
careers as a priest in the Church

because I've openly
advocated for the victims

of clergy sexual abuse,

and according to some,

been much too critical
and much too vocal

about the source
of the cover-up:

the manipulation,
the dishonesty

that comes from the top.

When we were serving
the search warrants,

the members of the Church
that were responsible

for keeping those records
threw up a lot of roadblocks

in having to contact
their attorneys

to find out what
they had to give to us.

Your duties as chancellor encompass
the entire diocese, correct?

Yes.

If a child had
been sexually abused

during those years,

is it fair to say that that would
have come to your attention

as chancellor and/or vicar-general
and/or auxiliary bishop?

Calls for speculation.

During which years?

When you were an officer
of the Diocese of Fresno

in any of those three offices.

Object to the term
"officer of the diocese".

Go ahead.

I imagine I would have become
aware of that during that time.

Your testimony is that
no such event occurred?

No, my testimony is
I cannot recall

something like that
occurring during that time.

Do you think if a child were raped
during your tenure at Fresno

that that would be something
that you would forget?

Object. Argumentative.
Harassing.

Instruct the witness
not to answer.

Do you think if a child molestation
allegation had been levied, Your Eminence,

while you were there acting
as an official of the diocese

and it came to your attention,

that would be something
you would forget?

I'm going to object.

Harassing. Argumentative.

Asked and answered.

Instruct the witness
not to answer.

He hasn't answered
that question.

Yes, he has.

When the diocese was
relating to the police,

and they didn't
disclose the fact

that O'Grady had been
previously accused,

do you think they were
telling the whole truth?

Repeat that please.

In '84, when the diocese was
talking to the police, okay?

The diocese did not talk
to the police in '84.

The diocese attorney did.

I didn't know that at the time.

Okay.

Do you think that somebody
should have told the cops, Father...

Or Monsignor, forgive me...

that O'Grady had been
previously accused?

It was in the hands of our attorney.

Now, what should be done
or what should not be done

would be his decision.

So basically you left it
to your lawyer to decide

whether or not to tell the truth.

We left it to our lawyer
to work in the investigation.

At that time, besides the
police investigation that we had,

there was one guy that
could speak the truth

and blow the whistle
on Roger Mahony

having known about
Olive O'Grady for years,

and that was Oliver O'Grady.

The night before he was
scheduled to testify in that trial,

the attorneys for Roger
Mahony went to his jail cell,

cut a deal with him,

a very dark deal that said,

"Oliver, you take
the contempt citation

"and refuse to testify, even
though you've been ordered to,

and we'll take care of you."

And they did.

Does the diocese of Stockton

or any of its representatives

provide for any economic
support for you right now?

Not at the moment.

Have they in the past?

Not since I left the priesthood.

They didn't buy you an annuity?

I believe they did.

Do you get a check
from that annuity?

No, that will not come into effect
until I'm 65.

Who holds that annuity?

I believe the diocese holds it.

Are you at all concerned, Oliver,

that if you give testimony
that hurts the diocese

that they might revoke that?

I have a lot of concerns
about a lot of things,

and I guess that would
be one of them.

My parents don't get
a pension from the Church.

They lost their whole
financial stability from this.

Yeah.

They will never ever be the same.

My mother is forced into retirement.

My dad has to quit his job
to take care of her.

Because of what?

Because of some jackass
that was running around

juggling 50 kids at a time,

and some raping mothers.

He abused my parents, too.

The Church abused my parents, too.

They took our tithes,
they took our tuition money,

and they haven't returned
any of that back to my family.

They deserve all of that back.

There is no excuse that you'd
paid to send your kid to school

to get raped, you know,

and to be molested in the basement

where you're supposed
to be getting an education

or being called in his office

where he has full reign to do

whatever he wants to you
and send you back to class.

This case, from the start to
finish, was less than two months.

It was strange at the speed
in which that operated.

We just felt that there was
a lot of things

that were left hanging
in this investigation,

but because of the speed
with which it went,

we just weren't able to do our jobs
as effectively as we could have.

But they were afraid that, through
the powers of civil discovery,

the civil attorneys
were going to find out

that the Church knew
prior to Oliver's ordination

that he probably offended.

He got to serve seven years,

and I testified in the case
that convicted him,

and he's over there
living the life of Reilly.

He's having tea and living
like a normal person.

He doesn't even have to report
like people here do.

Seeing Oliver walk around loose
with kids is one thing,

but knowing that
he was set up to do that,

and he's allowed to do that,

and he's going to be paid
to do that by the Church

makes me furious.

I have to agree with Frank Keating.

He was the former
governor of Oklahoma.

He compared this diocese
and the cardinal

to La Cosa Nostra.

In 2002, the U.S. Conference
of Catholic Bishops

asked former Oklahoma
governor Frank Keating

to head a national review board

to scrutinize the Catholic Church,

hold bishops accountable,

and guide the Church in
how to prevent, report,

and disclose sexual abuse.

Keating resigned after
making critical comments

about how some diocese,
including Los Angeles,

were and continue to be
less than open with the public

and less than honest
with themselves.

If you take the position that you won't get
anything out of me without a subpoena,

the suggestion is you
have something to hide.

For a faith institution,
that's a terrible suggestion.

In Los Angeles, when ordered
to produce the documentation,

the records...

Where you find the truth,
or most of the truth...

by the District Attorney
of Los Angeles County,

Cardinal Mahony's lawyers
cooked up this myth

called "formation privilege"

which has no basis in canon law,
civil law, history, or theology,

that every communication between
a bishop and one of his priests

is equal to confessional as far
as confidentiality is concerned.

There are a lot of
privileged communications

in the state of California.

One of them is reporters
in news media of sources.

That's a very highly protected
protection that you have.

There are between a husband and
wife testifying against each other.

There are a whole list of them.

Those are protected
communications,

and so a priest
talking to his bishop

is a protected communication.

As Christian adults,

Catholic, non-Catholic,

Jewish, whatever,

we should always be in the
business of protecting children.

The one thing that
always stuck with me

that Mahony didn't...

The children...

- He didn't protect them.
- Yeah.

He didn't come clean.

He has presided over...

the wholesale sexual abuse...

of dozens and dozens and
dozens of children in his dioceses.

Let me put it this way.

Cardinal Mahony's argument
about the documents

is an argument David
Koresh would love.

Basically, if doctrine
lets you rape kids,

I guess that makes the
Archdiocese of Los Angeles

an official cult.

The last place
we found O'Grady

was living with a
family in Thurles

in the shadow of the
seminary he'd attended

with the full knowledge
of the bishop,

with the full knowledge of
the rector of the seminary,

and the family he was
living with didn't know.

And the Garda, the police
in Ireland, didn't know.

I could say that my
life has been a failure.

I'd like to think that I can
still make some good decisions

and even bright future
for myself as a result.

So, don't always
do the right things.

Obviously not, but...

I think what I'm doing
right now is not alone

the best thing,
but I think the only thing.

I'm thinking of writing a letter

to each person that I have
offended sexually in the past.

I do want to apologize to them.

I am... But I don't want that
to be a simple statement.

I think they...

Basically what I
want to say to them:

It should not have happened.

It should not have happened.

If I could invite these people

to come and meet
with me one-on-one

and give them the opportunity
to, again, talk to me,

tell me what I did to them.

I need to hear that, and I
think they need to say that.

I can't say it's hard to do this.

I'm kind of happy
that I am doing it,

but it's going to be a
very interesting reunion.

And I really, really,

really, really hope they come.

"I'm writing this letter to you

"to invite you to meet with me.

"I would like to
apologize to you again

"for the wrong I did to you.

"It is my hope that this
opportunity will allow you

"the freedom to continue
with your life

"knowing that I have acknowledged
my actions of the past,

"and hopefully enabling you

to continue your life in a
better way from now on."

"I need to acknowledge
to you face-to-face

that I have molested you sexually
for many years many years ago."

"In this way I will be able
to respond and apologize

to all those I have
offended in a sexual way."

He's a piece of crap, man.

He remembered
all of our names.

I get so angry to even
think that that guy's alive.

I would kill his mother.

I won't be quoting Scripture.

It won't open with a prayer,

except if anybody wants
to, be they need a...

It might not even close
with a prayer.

I don't expect people to
hug me when they leave.

I don't expect people...

I hope they might
shake hands with me,

and say, "Hey, yeah,
it's over right now".

And I let them get
on with their lives,

and I'm sure they'll be happy
to let me get on with mine.

Come on down, you know?

We'll have a barbe...
It's stupid.

What the fuck is he thinking
writing these letters?

Yeah, that's what we all need.

To see him?
Are you kidding me?

We don't need anything from him.

I want to know
what his motivation is.

I do not want to go over there
so he can get his jollies off

collecting his little family
of abuse victims.

Yeah, his little whatever.

My motivation of
going over there...

If I thought that he had
a heart at all to touch,

it would be different.

But I think he's so far gone...

But it would be to disclose
as much as you can

about what you did
while you were here

and putting the nail
in Mahony's coffin

to get the truth
about what he knew.

Those are the people.

Those are the letters,

and all I can say is Godspeed.

I hope to see
all of you real soon.

I think the little girl
that's five years old

that's scared and afraid
of him is still afraid to go.

And then I think,
I'm a big girl now...

and what I didn't have the
courage as a child to tell him...

it might be nice to
tell him something.

Healing myself wasn't going to...

It was never pending
on what happened to him.

That's... It's within
me to get better,

not based on anything that...

I felt like if I was relying on...

his punishment to heal myself,

it seems like that would
be giving too much clout

to the pain that I'd
gone through, you know?

To say that's what I am
and that's who I am...

That's not who I am, so...

When you were a little boy,

were you ever touched
sexually by a priest?

Yes.

And what was that
priest's name?

I can't remember.

Do you know where it happened?

When I was an altar boy
at St. Michael's Church,

the event happened there.

How many times
did it happen, Oliver?

Not many. I'd say
two or three times.

I think we all go through
an exploratory stage of that,

but my older brother
did abuse me.

Again, I find it hard
to say the word "abuse"

because I did not consider
that to be abuse at the time.

I think my older brother
initiated it with me.

I remember in the early stages

being uncomfortable with that.

But later when I found out

that he was also...

being sexual with my sister,

I became curious and
probably got involved that way.

So the incidents with your
brother at a younger age,

the incidents with your brother
at an older age when you were 15?

Yes.

Multiple incidents with your sister

when she was approximately nine.

Correct.

Then you had at least
the two incidents

with the visiting priests

when you were 10 or 11.

Yes.

Have you ever thought, Oliver,

that some of your problems
that you encountered as a priest

that led to your incarceration

may be related to that?

I have thought about it,

but I can't seem
to make a link.

I'm never going to get
what I want out of this.

Not from Mahony.

I'm never going to
see them all in jail.

So who gives a shit
what they think?

You just do what you want
to do to take care of yourself.

To hell with them.

That's what you got to do.

We're trying to
uncover the truth.

We're here to support you

and we're here to support
all of the other kids,

because this is big
business to the Church.

This is money to the Church.

It's like a big corporation.

We have to ask ourselves

who's paying for this
nightmare, for this crisis?

Who is obliged to get involved?

I think we all are.

One of the things
that I've seen

in my time with
people like yourselves

has been a change in the
understanding of what church is.

Many of us, when I ask you,

"When you hear
the word 'church,'

what comes to your mind?"

Most of us will think
of bishops, the Vatican,

the hierarchy,
church buildings.

That will be changing,
it is changing,

because church is us.

It's right here in this room.

25 years ago,

Tom Doyle called
the bishops to action

and put a plan before the U.S.
Catholic Conference of Bishops,

a comprehensive plan
to address the crisis

of pedophilia in the priesthood.

Basically, they wrote a report

and said this is going
to be a massive crisis

that's going to cost the Church a
billion dollars unless you do something.

They found that there
was a national crisis

of children being sexually
abused by priests

on a massive scale.

I didn't know what
they were doing.

I thought that they would
take it and do something

because they were...

the Catholic Bishops
Conference in the United States

were forever giving
pronouncements on everything

from nuclear war to the Boy Scouts
to animal husbandry to chewing gum.

You name it, they were
giving pronouncements

on the morality of
just about everything.

But on this, they stonewalled.

Cardinal Ratzinger,
now Pope Benedict,

was head of what's called
the Office of the Congregation

for the Doctrine of the Faith.

The head of my church,
the successor to Peter,

the Holy Father,

was the person in
charge of making sure

that priests didn't
hurt children.

He was in charge of that
office from 1978 until 2005.

He did a very poor job,

and basically was the one
person besides the Pope

who could have stopped it,
and he didn't.

What the bishops did is
they squelched the report...

they went back
to their dioceses,

and they carried on as normal.

They knew children
were being victimized,

and they did
absolutely nothing

except insure that law
enforcement and the public

and the faithful
would not find out.

The bishops have known that
bishops, priests, and deacons

have been sexually abusing
children since the fourth century,

and it's been a severe
major, major problem,

and they've never really
been able to curb it.

Basically, you have a
sexualized priesthood.

It's been sexualized for years,

that looks at child sexual abuse

no different than it does if
you're having sex with a woman

because it's all a violation
of clerical celibacy.

If all sex by
definition was bad sex

because you weren't
supposed to be having it,

then pedophilia is just
another kind of bad sex.

There is no basis in the scriptures
for mandatory celibacy.

It's not mandated by Christ.

It's not justified
anywhere in the gospels

or in the life and times
and sayings of Christ.

All 12 apostles were married,

with probably the exception of John.

The first several dozen popes

were married and had children.

It's something that the
institutional Church leaders

began to think about
and tried to impose

at least from the
fourth century.

Married priests,
when they died,

their inheritance
went to their oldest son.

So the institutionalized
Church leaders,

desiring to stop this practice,
began to mandate celibacy

so that when a priest's property
had to pass after he died

it would go to the
bishop or to the Church.

What we have to remember
is a lot of the priests

who have been reported
as offenders

went into the seminary
at a minor seminary

at ages 14, 15, 16.

They may have been thinking
about a vocation even earlier.

They got stopped.

They got literally arrested in
their psychosexual development.

They're nurtured in an
attitude of negativity

toward relationships,
toward women,

toward marriage,
and toward sexuality,

and they never really
fully understand

what any of these
are all about.

So when these men
became unable to be celibate

or when their sexual
urges overpowered them,

they sought out victims who
they experienced at some level

as psychosexual peers.

The L.A. Times recently reported

that 10% of the seminary
graduates from St. John's Seminary,

where the vast majority
of priests in the western U.S.

went to the seminary,

a full 10%, since 1960, of
their graduates are pedophiles.

Perpetrators of children.

10%.

If Yale was producing
10% of its students

that became to
be perpetrators,

somebody would take action.

In Boston, after the final
settlements were made

for about $85 million
a couple of years ago,

one of the priests said
publicly at an interview,

"Thank God this
clergy crisis is over.

Now we can get
back to normal."

The situation was far worse

than even what the most hardened
cynic thought was going on.

Cardinal Law, who was
the archbishop of Boston,

presided over some of
the worst sexual abusers

in the history of the Church.

It was something that ultimately
caused Cardinal Law to step down.

You would think,
if you presided

over the abuse of
dozens of children,

that that would mean you
would be sent to a punishment.

You know, the Vatican
didn't even make it a secret.

They thought he was
unfairly accused in the media.

They made him the
cardinal archbishop

of this church in Rome,

and he actually presided at
Pope John Paul II's funeral Mass.

What's happening in Los Angeles

does in many ways dwarf
what happened in Boston.

As of June 2002,

we had over 100 criminal
investigations ongoing,

and that encompassed
over 100 individual priests.

What that tells you is how large
the scope of this problem is.

I think the Vatican
is looking for a way

to say "We've solved this",

and they are scapegoating...

because so many of the
victims were male victims,

they're scapegoating
the homosexual priests

and saying "If we get rid
of the homosexual priests,

then we'll be rid
of this problem".

Most men who abuse
children are heterosexual.

The Bishops' Conference, I think,

would like to project that
this problem is now over with.

It's taken care of.
They have solved it,

and it's now under control,

which is a normal
corporate approach

to something of this nature.

I'm sure that the guys in
Enron thought that, too,

when they were discovered.

Every day, every week,

I learn of another
child, young adult,

offended by a cleric

who hasn't been disclosed
before this day,

and my fear is, my belief is,
that there are not hundreds,

but there are
thousands of offenders

yet to be exposed
and disclosed

still roaming the churches
in the landscapes in this U.S.,

and tens of thousands...

tens of thousands worldwide.

What is a good Catholic?

A good Catholic traditionally

is someone who kept
their mouth shut,

their pocketbook open,
you know...

Paid, prayed, and obeyed,

was docile, went to Mass,
obeyed all the Commandments,

went to confession
on a regular basis.

For the most part, was
ritualized, obedient, and quiet.

But a good Catholic
is not that at all.

A good Catholic is a Catholic
in the model of Jesus Christ:

a revolutionary,

someone who's not afraid...

Someone who's not afraid
to get up and speak the truth.

Remember, the only time
Christ ever got angry

was when He went to church.

And as we speak,
Tom Doyle goes to Rome,

not because the Pope's
gonna hear him,

but because he has to do
what they should be doing,

and making those
known offenders,

such as Oliver O'Grady,
who now resides in Ireland,

known to the community
as an offender.

I think a lot of the people
in Rome are in deep denial

about just how
serious this issue is.

Never attempted this
before, honestly.

Pronto.

Mi chiamo* Patrizio Wall.

I'm calling Father Tom Doyle,

who is in America.

Yes, you know Father Thomas?

Yeah. He will be
coming to Rome.

As far as I know, he's in Rome,
trying to help two victims,

one of whom's our
client, Ann Jyono.

They have an appointment
with somebody at the Holy See

to hear their complaint.

I'm doing this for my daughter,

but I said to her,

"if you do it for the other
victims and the children...

"or...

the kids..."

"I'll help."

By golly.

People got to know!

It's not right.

They haven't a clue, you know,

if it hasn't happened to them.

Nobody has a clue.

They have no idea
what it does to people.

And we're not victims...

Destroys you everywhere.

...in that sense,
but Ann was a victim.

She was raped by this priest!

People understand, he's isn't
a pedophile, he's a rapist!

My anger's so hard.

Right now, I'm in Rome,

and I'm waiting to meet
with the Jyonos,

a family whose children

have been sexually
abused by Oliver O'Grady.

I've not met them.
I'm going to meet them,

and my purpose is to
hopefully help them

begin a healing process.

Good morning.
How are you, dear?

Good morning.
I'm glad to see you.

How do you feel?

This is Ann.

And what I'm gonna do is,

if we preface this one
with a short sentence

and say...

"Bishops, archbishops, and cardinals

have consistently lied
to us and to the public

and to law
enforcement agencies

about the cover-up

of sexual abuse by
the clergy, period."

We'll address it to the Pope,

and it'll be from you specifically,

but speaking in the
name of all those

who have been
victimized and molested,

and I'm gonna put it in
language that they will...

direct language they'll understand.

A lot has changed in the
Catholic Church this year,

but it's still having trouble

responding to the victims
of sexual abuse by priests.

Today, two American
women came to the Vatican

hoping to deliver a
letter to the new Pope.

The guards wouldn't let them in.

Since we are survivors
of clergy abuse,

it has been a very
difficult journey,

and we have come
thousands of miles

to try to plead for some sort
of mercy and assistance

with our journey
of pain and healing.

We seek to regain our faith.

And instead of...

embracing them,
reaching out to them,

the institutional church
not only rejected them,

but they revictimized them.

They abused them by
pointing them out to be...

making them out to be
an enemy of the Church.

I got them alone at one point
and expressed a sincere apology,

my profound regrets as to
what had happened to them,

and I apologized to them

in the name of the institution,

the clergy, and the priests,

which I am still legally a part of.

And both of them said,

"No one has ever said
this to us before."

I made up my mind.

There is no God.

I do not believe
in a God, all right?

All of these rules, everything...

they're made up
by man, you know?

I've tried to find...

what it is that...

brought religion
to where it is today,

why, you know,

what differences in them...

the similarities in all of them,

and I think that that's
a big thing for me

is that they all...

share some common theme
or philosophy at some level,

and you can't say
"This one, not that one"

without alienating someone, so...

And that's not...
That wasn't the message

of Jesus or Buddha or
Mohammad or anybody,

so what's...

They're already
off-base at that point,

and that happened
a long time ago,

so... I think it's just all...

all where...

the only place it could have
gone is the wrong direction.

What we need to do as a Church

is to acknowledge our
good days and our bad days,

our good times
and our bad times.

Somehow we always
seem to look back

and say, "Well, there were
dark moments and times

"in our history.

We would rather
not dwell on them."

In a very poetic way, you see?

And that's very nice.

But it's not reality.

What I'd like to hear,
to say, "Hey,

"you know, we had one
heck of an awful time

there in the Middle Ages.

But you know what?
We're still here."

And that's the point,

if the Church could see it.

And I'm here speaking
on behalf of Brandon...

with his parents today

because this offender...

is still in ministry.