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Mary Pascarella
was the lead psychic
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who investigated the house.
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Mary is a professional psychic,
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a time walker who picked up on
some truly terrifying things.
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She said it was the first time
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she had ever
encountered something
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she could only describe
as pure evil.
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People say this is a hoax.
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It's done for money.
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But let me tell you,
you never sign
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a contract with the devil.
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This house chooses victims.
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We just wanted
to get the house fixed
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so we could move back in.
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I began to say my prayers.
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And I was saying the Our Father.
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And as I was saying
the Our Father,
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I looked out at the door,
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and I had the impression
of a young person.
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I hope this is as close to hell
as I'll ever get.
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George and Kathy,
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whatever happened
to them in the house,
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they got the kids,
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they left all their furnishings,
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all their clothing,
everything in the house
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and just ran.
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They went to a motel
for that first night.
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After Kathy
and I left the house,
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we came to the conclusion
that Ronald DeFeo,
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physically, he did the murders,
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but spiritually,
emotionally, no,
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I don't believe that he's,
in a pure sense, responsible.
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There's no doubt in my mind
that he was influenced
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by that house
and that he was controlled,
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at least for a point.
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It would further the tragedy
sitting in jail
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for six consecutive life terms.
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I didn't like William Weber.
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He was writing a book
about the DeFeo murder.
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Through friends of ours,
we met William Weber,
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sat down and spoke with him.
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He wanted George and
Kathy to put their story
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along with his story
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so that it seemed
like Ronald DeFeo
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was into devil worship,
or there was something
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in the house that caused him
to kill his whole family.
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In the 1970s,
the thought that the devil
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could possess somebody
became a very big deal.
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In December of '75, Ronnie DeFeo
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had just been convicted,
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just two, three years
after The Exorcist.
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Mr. Weber says, listen,
these people named
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the Lutzes bought your house.
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And we can use them
and make money.
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I said,
what are you talking about?
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He tells me, look,
we got The Godfather
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and The Exorcist
all in one hand, Ronnie.
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We're gonna make big, big money.
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The devil knocks off the mafia.
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The old box office champ,
The Godfather,
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is being flattened by that movie
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about diabolical possession,
The Exorcist.
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Could you give us your
reaction to the movie, please?
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Could you give us
your reaction to the movie?
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It's something else.
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- All glory to God.
- Great.
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Disgusting.
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It was disgusting in what way?
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It was just morbid.
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Just all the gory,
the blood and all.
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It was a traumatic experience.
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Didn't you like it?
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It was... yeah,
it was very interesting.
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- Why?
- Because it might be real.
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You know, I get to thinking
that, you know,
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something like that
might transpire,
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you know, around here.
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I don't know.
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People who were agnostic,
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people who were atheists
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went into that movie
and came out
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and were sleeping
with the lights on
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and wearing crucifixes,
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whether or not
they were religious or not.
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Everybody went to see this.
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00:08:01,990 --> 00:08:06,559
So here's William Weber,
a defense attorney,
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00:08:06,560 --> 00:08:09,866
coaching the Lutzes
on what they could say and do
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to play up this haunted thing.
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00:08:18,224 --> 00:08:21,356
But when the Lutzes
gave a press conference
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in William Weber's office,
it was more notable,
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that press conference, for
everything they didn't say.
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The Lutzes did not claim
that they saw, heard, or felt
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the ghosts of the dead DeFeos.
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They didn't say
it was something demonic.
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00:08:45,338 --> 00:08:48,949
In fact,
the Lutzes were very ambiguous
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about what happened.
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So the reporters were left
with more questions
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than answers, which might
be a smart marketing strategy.
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Leave them wanting more,
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00:09:00,353 --> 00:09:03,833
and people will leap
to fill the void.
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00:09:07,011 --> 00:09:10,144
He tries to
communicate by psychic force
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with the plant world.
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00:09:12,365 --> 00:09:13,713
The plant in question
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is a rather wan
split philodendron,
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which Vogel has hooked up
to a polygraph machine.
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00:09:19,502 --> 00:09:21,155
Here, Peter Hurkos,
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a psychic investigator,
is attempting to help
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a metropolitan police department
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by looking into the past.
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He does this by receiving
images from the murder weapon,
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hoping to reconstruct the crime.
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00:09:32,994 --> 00:09:35,865
He was hired to help find
the Boston Strangler,
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did police work
on the Charles Manson murders.
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Like a suitcase.
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She was stabbed
to death five times.
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What you have just seen is part
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of an astounding collection
of psychic phenomena,
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demonstrations of the powers of the mind.
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At the time that the Lutzes held
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the joint press conference
with William Weber,
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I had been assigned
to produce a series
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on the supernatural
and paranormal at Channel 5
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00:10:12,033 --> 00:10:15,340
by the news director.
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So I'm seeing this story
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when it was reported in
the Long Island Press Newsday.
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00:10:20,389 --> 00:10:22,564
It was fairly local.
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00:10:29,268 --> 00:10:32,270
Oh, wow,
a real-life haunted house
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00:10:32,271 --> 00:10:34,273
that we could actually visit?
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00:10:36,144 --> 00:10:38,232
There was no way
that this was not going
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00:10:38,233 --> 00:10:42,497
to be a big ratings grabber.
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So at that point, nobody knew
how to reach the Lutzes.
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They were not living
at Ocean Avenue anymore.
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00:10:54,118 --> 00:10:56,250
After they left the house,
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00:10:56,251 --> 00:11:01,255
the Lutzes moved permanently
into Kathy's mother's house.
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00:11:01,256 --> 00:11:04,345
If I hadn't been sitting there
and seeing how different
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George was, I would have
been a little skeptical
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00:11:07,306 --> 00:11:10,046
about what was going on.
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00:11:10,047 --> 00:11:13,093
He wasn't the same happy,
carefree person
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that he was before.
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He seemed really broken,
totally broken.
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00:11:22,582 --> 00:11:25,279
Seeing the way he was,
I knew something happened,
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something had had
to have happened to him
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for him to change like that.
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00:11:34,333 --> 00:11:37,291
The way they got it
out of their system was,
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they made audiotapes
of each day of what happened,
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every little detail.
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They didn't want
to retell it again and again.
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00:11:49,348 --> 00:11:52,524
If they retold it,
it was like reliving it,
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00:11:52,525 --> 00:11:54,439
and they didn't want
that to happen.
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00:11:54,440 --> 00:11:57,138
They just got everything out
by putting it on the audiotapes.
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00:12:02,404 --> 00:12:04,405
We just sat down
and did a series
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of about 26 cassette tapes,
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just talking about what happened
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while we were in the house.
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On those tapes,
nothing was chronological.
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We skipped all around.
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Our language certainly
wasn't the best.
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We were drinking at times
when we were doing
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those recordings.
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By the time I left the house,
I was drinking pretty heavily,
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without a doubt.
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00:12:44,446 --> 00:12:47,361
Nobody could find George,
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00:12:47,362 --> 00:12:49,798
so I called
George's surveying company.
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And I said,
"Hi, my name is Laura DiDio,
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"and I work for Channel 5 News,
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"and I have worked
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"with reputable
paranormal investigators
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00:12:59,722 --> 00:13:04,073
like Hans Holzer,
Ed and Lorraine Warren."
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00:13:04,074 --> 00:13:06,728
And I said, "I'd really like
to help them."
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00:13:09,253 --> 00:13:12,081
George wanted
the parapsychologists
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to have seances in the house
to validate
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what happened in the house,
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that there really
were spirits there,
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that there really
was evil there.
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The Warrens
have devoted 37 years
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to study of the supernatural.
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The School of Demonology
behind their Connecticut home
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houses a collection of what
Ed Warren calls unholy things
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of historic value.
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Laura DiDio convinced
the Warrens to come down
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and go through the house.
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Our special guests tonight
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are Ed and Lorraine Warren,
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who, in their 32 years
as ghost hunters,
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have investigated over 3,000
cases of haunted houses
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00:14:01,480 --> 00:14:04,307
and demonic possession
and have been involved
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in numerous exorcisms.
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Now obviously,
you believe in ghosts.
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I don't think
it's a case of belief.
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I think it's a case
of the evidence.
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So I called them up.
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We set the date for March 6th
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to go into the house
and investigate.
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They were giving Channel 5
and myself the exclusive.
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00:14:29,812 --> 00:14:32,466
George had asked me
to go to the airport
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and pick up
the parapsychologists
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00:14:33,729 --> 00:14:35,687
that were flying in from Duke
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00:14:35,688 --> 00:14:37,429
and take them
to the Amityville house.
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00:14:39,779 --> 00:14:44,696
There was a noted psychic
with the team.
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00:14:44,697 --> 00:14:47,916
I felt while we were driving
that this psychic
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00:14:47,917 --> 00:14:52,094
was trying to find out
from me mentally
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00:14:52,095 --> 00:14:54,967
what had happened in the house.
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00:14:54,968 --> 00:14:56,577
It was
a very strange experience.
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I'm sitting riding in a car.
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There's this man sitting
here not talking to me,
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00:15:00,495 --> 00:15:06,718
wanting me to think
about the Lutzes.
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00:15:06,719 --> 00:15:10,635
Finally, I got so fed up
with the whole feeling
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00:15:10,636 --> 00:15:13,725
that, in my head,
I said, "Stop it."
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00:15:13,726 --> 00:15:16,510
Like, I shouted it in my head.
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00:15:16,511 --> 00:15:19,992
Right after that, this psychic
turned to me and said,
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00:15:19,993 --> 00:15:22,560
"I'm sorry," out loud.
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00:15:22,561 --> 00:15:25,301
And then I was convinced
that it was him.
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00:15:25,302 --> 00:15:26,868
He was probing.
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00:15:26,869 --> 00:15:30,611
He was trying to find out
what I knew about it,
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00:15:30,612 --> 00:15:32,353
which he wasn't supposed
to know.
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00:15:36,618 --> 00:15:40,709
When we went into the house,
it was jarring.
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00:15:42,668 --> 00:15:46,671
So it looked like a nice
middle-class house,
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00:15:46,672 --> 00:15:50,589
just that the people
were out for the day.
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00:15:54,157 --> 00:15:56,158
Kathy had made...
And I'll never forget this...
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00:15:56,159 --> 00:15:57,986
She had made a gingerbread house
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for the kids for Christmas.
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00:15:59,815 --> 00:16:02,817
And that was still
on the dining room table.
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00:16:02,818 --> 00:16:06,995
All of the food was spoiling.
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00:16:32,718 --> 00:16:34,588
Laura DiDio and the crew and I,
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00:16:34,589 --> 00:16:36,504
we arrived around midnight.
226
00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:44,685
Parapsychologists from
Duke University were there.
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00:16:44,686 --> 00:16:46,600
They had cameras set up
and different equipment
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00:16:46,601 --> 00:16:50,082
to sense any paranormal
activity in the house.
229
00:17:27,294 --> 00:17:30,426
There was a crucifix
and a blessed candle
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00:17:30,427 --> 00:17:33,647
to provoke whatever beings
were in that house.
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00:18:12,165 --> 00:18:13,818
Looks like a...
232
00:18:13,819 --> 00:18:17,822
A black shadow
that forms a hood.
233
00:18:17,823 --> 00:18:20,694
And it moves.
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00:18:20,695 --> 00:18:22,914
And as it moves, it kind of...
235
00:18:22,915 --> 00:18:26,700
It says, "I feel
personally threatened."
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00:18:37,756 --> 00:18:40,932
It's... I think it's...
Whatever's here.
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00:18:43,936 --> 00:18:45,850
Whatever is here is...
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00:18:45,851 --> 00:18:48,591
Is it trying to harm them?
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00:18:48,592 --> 00:18:51,594
Yes. And it's something
that comes at you
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00:18:51,595 --> 00:18:53,858
and makes your heart speed up,
that kind of thing.
241
00:19:02,737 --> 00:19:04,782
Then Lorraine Warren
said, "Come on, Marvin.
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00:19:04,783 --> 00:19:05,957
"We're going upstairs
to the sewing room,"
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00:19:05,958 --> 00:19:07,567
which was the area which had
244
00:19:07,568 --> 00:19:10,309
the strongest
paranormal sense."
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00:19:19,014 --> 00:19:23,017
Lorraine said to me,
"Marvin, this is the deepest,
246
00:19:23,018 --> 00:19:26,847
the closest to hell
I ever want to get."
247
00:19:26,848 --> 00:19:30,764
And she was quite serious
248
00:19:30,765 --> 00:19:34,028
and seemed quite concerned
in that moment.
249
00:19:37,990 --> 00:19:40,514
We went room to room.
250
00:19:43,865 --> 00:19:47,346
But when we went upstairs
to the third floor...
251
00:19:53,788 --> 00:19:56,834
It was like
she walked into a wall.
252
00:19:56,835 --> 00:19:58,792
And she stepped right back.
253
00:19:58,793 --> 00:20:00,969
She said, "I can't go in here.
I can't go in here."
254
00:20:03,929 --> 00:20:09,717
I just feel an overwhelming
sense of oppression, dread.
255
00:20:11,458 --> 00:20:13,939
And that was Ronnie's bedroom.
256
00:20:18,073 --> 00:20:20,422
Lorraine sat down,
257
00:20:20,423 --> 00:20:22,076
and she had a headache
after that
258
00:20:22,077 --> 00:20:26,037
that stayed with her.
259
00:20:26,038 --> 00:20:29,215
There was a hush that came over.
260
00:20:43,359 --> 00:20:47,667
We had gotten to the point
where the house
261
00:20:47,668 --> 00:20:49,712
had began to affect me.
262
00:20:49,713 --> 00:20:51,192
And I had gotten up
on the stairs,
263
00:20:51,193 --> 00:20:53,064
and I called down to Ed,
and I said,
264
00:20:53,065 --> 00:20:55,066
"Ed, I'm as sick as a dog."
265
00:20:55,067 --> 00:20:56,545
So I said to Ed,
"I'm gonna lay down
266
00:20:56,546 --> 00:20:58,766
in the bed
for a little while."
267
00:21:01,595 --> 00:21:04,727
And as I was saying
the Our Father,
268
00:21:04,728 --> 00:21:06,860
I looked out of the door.
269
00:21:06,861 --> 00:21:09,428
There was a group
of figures standing
270
00:21:09,429 --> 00:21:12,736
outside of the door saying
the Our Father backward.
271
00:21:15,914 --> 00:21:18,872
The energy
in that house remains.
272
00:21:18,873 --> 00:21:22,876
It may take a hundred years
of our time,
273
00:21:22,877 --> 00:21:25,226
but it will implode again.
274
00:21:28,578 --> 00:21:30,972
That house is purely evil.
275
00:21:36,151 --> 00:21:38,239
We went back to the station.
276
00:21:38,240 --> 00:21:42,243
We cut the piece.
And it ran on the 10:00 news.
277
00:21:46,161 --> 00:21:48,467
The response was overwhelming.
278
00:21:48,468 --> 00:21:51,470
People just went wild over this.
279
00:21:55,127 --> 00:21:57,389
We had great ratings that night.
280
00:21:57,390 --> 00:22:00,087
Often, I'm asked if I was scared
281
00:22:00,088 --> 00:22:02,742
during that night in the house
at 112 Ocean Avenue.
282
00:22:02,743 --> 00:22:03,962
No, I was not.
283
00:22:06,138 --> 00:22:08,966
When the investigators
were asked to come in,
284
00:22:08,967 --> 00:22:13,971
we hadn't told them
what we experienced.
285
00:22:13,972 --> 00:22:16,799
But they had no intention
of ever going back
286
00:22:16,800 --> 00:22:19,977
and investigating further.
287
00:22:19,978 --> 00:22:23,197
Their only suggestion was
to have the house exorcised.
288
00:22:39,475 --> 00:22:42,173
George lost a lot
of money with the house.
289
00:22:42,174 --> 00:22:45,177
So I think financially, they
were not doing well at all.
290
00:22:49,007 --> 00:22:52,009
Weber, the DeFeos'
attorney, had asked us
291
00:22:52,010 --> 00:22:53,662
to sign a book contract
with him,
292
00:22:53,663 --> 00:22:56,013
and we refused
because he was gonna
293
00:22:56,014 --> 00:22:59,147
pay DeFeo 5% of proceeds
for murdering his family.
294
00:23:02,498 --> 00:23:05,413
Plus, he was gonna get
to say what we did
295
00:23:05,414 --> 00:23:07,589
with the rest of our lives
with regard to the story,
296
00:23:07,590 --> 00:23:10,245
and it was just beyond belief.
297
00:23:12,073 --> 00:23:13,682
Our story was ours,
298
00:23:13,683 --> 00:23:15,206
and we were not gonna
do a contract with him,
299
00:23:15,207 --> 00:23:16,990
and we didn't want anything
more to do with that.
300
00:23:16,991 --> 00:23:18,992
We weren't interested
in dealing with him.
301
00:23:18,993 --> 00:23:22,039
And that was it.
302
00:23:25,217 --> 00:23:27,000
I told them
that it was their story,
303
00:23:27,001 --> 00:23:30,699
and I felt that they shouldn't
have to go with William Weber,
304
00:23:30,700 --> 00:23:34,007
that the whole haunting
or whatever happened
305
00:23:34,008 --> 00:23:39,447
to them in the house was
not part of the murder story.
306
00:23:39,448 --> 00:23:43,234
And I happened to find the name
of a publisher in a book
307
00:23:43,235 --> 00:23:45,279
that I was reading
about supernatural
308
00:23:45,280 --> 00:23:47,499
because then was
interested in it.
309
00:23:47,500 --> 00:23:51,024
And I called up this publisher
in New York, Prentice Hall.
310
00:23:51,025 --> 00:23:55,246
And because of the publicity
that was going on at the time,
311
00:23:55,247 --> 00:23:57,640
they agreed
to talk with the Lutzes.
312
00:23:59,338 --> 00:24:03,080
So to George,
this looked like a good way
313
00:24:03,081 --> 00:24:08,650
of getting some money,
which I agreed with him.
314
00:24:08,651 --> 00:24:13,090
If it was being publicized now,
just keep going with it.
315
00:24:13,091 --> 00:24:16,484
If this is what happened,
you know the story.
316
00:24:16,485 --> 00:24:20,619
Then, the publisher got
the writer, Jay Anson.
317
00:24:20,620 --> 00:24:24,275
And they took the audiotapes.
318
00:24:24,276 --> 00:24:27,148
And that's where
The Amityville Horror came from.
319
00:24:33,372 --> 00:24:35,416
We met with Jay Anson.
We spoke with him.
320
00:24:35,417 --> 00:24:37,288
We gave him
the research materials
321
00:24:37,289 --> 00:24:40,247
we had done on the house
and some tapes
322
00:24:40,248 --> 00:24:43,076
that Kathy and I had done
over the weeks
323
00:24:43,077 --> 00:24:45,774
after we had left the house.
324
00:24:45,775 --> 00:24:48,299
And said, "Look,
we're not gonna sit down
325
00:24:48,300 --> 00:24:50,083
"to be interviewed about this.
326
00:24:50,084 --> 00:24:51,345
"You can do what you can
from the tapes.
327
00:24:51,346 --> 00:24:53,086
"But we're just not
gonna relive this.
328
00:24:53,087 --> 00:24:54,870
"We've done it once,
and we're not doing it again.
329
00:24:54,871 --> 00:24:56,917
We did it for the tapes."
330
00:24:58,397 --> 00:25:00,180
Then I spoke to the priest,
331
00:25:00,181 --> 00:25:02,313
and I heard his story.
332
00:25:02,314 --> 00:25:05,359
I was able to put together
a chronology of the events
333
00:25:05,360 --> 00:25:09,102
that took place within
that framework of 28 days.
334
00:25:09,103 --> 00:25:12,192
I was convinced
there are things out there
335
00:25:12,193 --> 00:25:15,935
that many people cannot explain.
336
00:25:15,936 --> 00:25:19,156
I sincerely believe
they took place.
337
00:25:25,380 --> 00:25:27,990
George told me that he felt that
338
00:25:27,991 --> 00:25:29,122
by staying in Long Island,
339
00:25:29,123 --> 00:25:31,298
they were too close
to Amityville,
340
00:25:31,299 --> 00:25:34,127
and he felt
that the further away he went,
341
00:25:34,128 --> 00:25:38,654
the evil,
it couldn't come with him.
342
00:25:40,265 --> 00:25:44,355
So they moved as far away from
the East Coast as they could.
343
00:25:54,540 --> 00:25:59,545
On Mother's Day of
1976, we landed in San Diego.
344
00:26:01,242 --> 00:26:03,374
I sold my business.
345
00:26:03,375 --> 00:26:05,289
We gave the house
back to the bank.
346
00:26:05,290 --> 00:26:09,423
I couldn't stomach the idea of
selling it to another family.
347
00:26:09,424 --> 00:26:11,730
I think I want my
family and my children
348
00:26:11,731 --> 00:26:14,863
much more
than I want a structure.
349
00:26:14,864 --> 00:26:18,432
And if you view it
in that perspective,
350
00:26:18,433 --> 00:26:20,869
it's easy to walk away from.
351
00:26:25,179 --> 00:26:28,225
The book known as
The Amityville Horror
352
00:26:28,226 --> 00:26:30,052
sold millions in hardcover,
353
00:26:30,053 --> 00:26:32,359
and it's doing likewise
in paperback.
354
00:26:32,360 --> 00:26:35,188
When the book came out,
the whole family
355
00:26:35,189 --> 00:26:38,191
was just living
off the proceeds of the book.
356
00:26:38,192 --> 00:26:40,193
They were very happy about it.
357
00:26:40,194 --> 00:26:42,369
George especially
was very happy about it
358
00:26:42,370 --> 00:26:44,415
because this was...
359
00:26:44,416 --> 00:26:48,245
Helped financially for him,
which he needed it
360
00:26:48,246 --> 00:26:50,857
to take care of his family.
361
00:26:52,075 --> 00:26:53,206
Of course, like a lot of people,
362
00:26:53,207 --> 00:26:55,426
I went out and bought the book.
363
00:26:55,427 --> 00:26:58,342
I remember reading pigs
flying outside of windows
364
00:26:58,343 --> 00:27:02,781
and swarms of flies coming in
and walls bleeding
365
00:27:02,782 --> 00:27:06,219
and weird sounds coming
out of the ground
366
00:27:06,220 --> 00:27:07,612
in the backyard and stuff.
367
00:27:07,613 --> 00:27:10,267
And I was like, this is so...
This is ridiculous.
368
00:27:10,268 --> 00:27:14,445
After I read the book, I
never talked to George again.
369
00:27:14,446 --> 00:27:16,360
I read it.
I put it down.
370
00:27:16,361 --> 00:27:18,362
I couldn't finish it.
371
00:27:18,363 --> 00:27:22,844
Oozing door locks,
levitation of his wife,
372
00:27:22,845 --> 00:27:27,327
stuff that I never saw
or heard in that house.
373
00:27:27,328 --> 00:27:29,286
Why did you come by tonight
to look at this house?
374
00:27:29,287 --> 00:27:31,070
To see what that book
was all about
375
00:27:31,071 --> 00:27:32,899
and everything about the house.
376
00:27:34,161 --> 00:27:37,119
It's a joke.
It's a joke, a complete joke.
377
00:27:37,120 --> 00:27:42,124
I mean, pigs flying around,
all these stupid stories.
378
00:27:42,125 --> 00:27:44,518
Someone's trying
to cash in here.
379
00:27:52,353 --> 00:27:55,486
I truly believe that
they believe all these things.
380
00:27:55,487 --> 00:27:58,315
I was not there obviously.
381
00:27:58,316 --> 00:28:01,100
They told me their story.
The priest told me his story.
382
00:28:01,101 --> 00:28:03,407
And I put it together
in repertory style.
383
00:28:03,408 --> 00:28:06,323
And I leave it up to you.
384
00:28:06,324 --> 00:28:10,065
It was being sold
and promoted as a true story.
385
00:28:10,066 --> 00:28:13,895
I saw nothing to substantiate
that word "true."
386
00:28:13,896 --> 00:28:17,508
But it was a good story,
and it was a big moneymaker.
387
00:28:19,293 --> 00:28:21,295
Get out!
388
00:28:26,866 --> 00:28:29,477
Anson sold the movie rights.
389
00:28:31,349 --> 00:28:33,393
Cut!
390
00:28:33,394 --> 00:28:35,134
He didn't ask us
391
00:28:35,135 --> 00:28:38,529
whether we wanted that
to happen or not.
392
00:28:38,530 --> 00:28:40,227
He just went ahead and did it.
393
00:28:42,577 --> 00:28:44,883
Then they came to us
and sent us contracts
394
00:28:44,884 --> 00:28:48,366
and said,
"We're gonna do your movie."
395
00:28:55,329 --> 00:28:58,462
The Amityville
Horror is one of the first
396
00:28:58,463 --> 00:29:01,116
motion pictures filmed
almost entirely in New Jersey.
397
00:29:05,339 --> 00:29:08,428
George went to the set a lot.
398
00:29:08,429 --> 00:29:12,389
I don't think they really
wanted him there on set.
399
00:29:12,390 --> 00:29:16,828
But he just loved the fact
that there were notable actors
400
00:29:16,829 --> 00:29:19,396
playing him and his wife.
401
00:29:19,397 --> 00:29:20,571
He really enjoyed that.
402
00:29:20,572 --> 00:29:22,442
It was like a big deal,
403
00:29:22,443 --> 00:29:24,966
something totally
out of the ordinary
404
00:29:24,967 --> 00:29:27,360
that ever happened to him.
405
00:29:27,361 --> 00:29:29,580
Kathy, I felt at this time,
406
00:29:29,581 --> 00:29:31,582
was just concerned about George.
407
00:29:31,583 --> 00:29:33,627
And if this was gonna
make him feel better...
408
00:29:33,628 --> 00:29:35,803
Because he was changing back.
409
00:29:35,804 --> 00:29:39,590
He was becoming
more self-confident.
410
00:29:39,591 --> 00:29:43,376
He was happy with the fame,
to be part of it.
411
00:29:43,377 --> 00:29:45,596
So that's what he did.
412
00:29:51,951 --> 00:29:53,647
Well, the first
thing I've got to ask you is,
413
00:29:53,648 --> 00:29:55,823
do you believe in demonic force?
414
00:29:55,824 --> 00:29:59,045
Um, hmm, good question.
415
00:30:00,525 --> 00:30:02,395
Uh...
416
00:30:02,396 --> 00:30:05,267
Yeah... uh, no, yes.
417
00:30:11,231 --> 00:30:12,753
I sat with George,
418
00:30:12,754 --> 00:30:16,757
and I watched his eyes
as I talked to him
419
00:30:16,758 --> 00:30:18,629
and asked him
a specific question,
420
00:30:18,630 --> 00:30:21,022
looking for the liar
who would stare right at me,
421
00:30:21,023 --> 00:30:23,024
look right at me,
and tell me a direct lie.
422
00:30:23,025 --> 00:30:25,636
And as he'd answer a question,
I'd watch him think about it.
423
00:30:25,637 --> 00:30:28,029
And as he'd tell me
about some of the things,
424
00:30:28,030 --> 00:30:29,422
his voice would begin
to quaver a little.
425
00:30:29,423 --> 00:30:31,642
Then he'd try
to regain composure.
426
00:30:31,643 --> 00:30:34,253
And I walked away saying,
this man believes
427
00:30:34,254 --> 00:30:36,952
that something went wrong
back there, you know.
428
00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:42,304
Twenty-eight states
in America accept the results
429
00:30:42,305 --> 00:30:44,437
of polygraph tests
as legal evidence,
430
00:30:44,438 --> 00:30:46,613
and the polygraph is now used
as a matter of course
431
00:30:46,614 --> 00:30:49,486
by the FBI and other
government agencies.
432
00:30:49,487 --> 00:30:52,053
Basically,
it monitors three things:
433
00:30:52,054 --> 00:30:56,014
cardiac activity,
breathing, and sweat.
434
00:31:07,635 --> 00:31:08,506
The movie company
was getting ready
435
00:31:08,507 --> 00:31:10,681
to release the movie,
436
00:31:10,682 --> 00:31:14,685
and they wanted to give each
of us a polygraph test.
437
00:31:27,002 --> 00:31:28,481
And these are expensive tests.
438
00:31:28,482 --> 00:31:30,614
They were willing to pay for it.
439
00:31:30,615 --> 00:31:32,485
And we said, "Get us the best
there is, and we'll do it.
440
00:31:32,486 --> 00:31:34,531
"Otherwise, we're not
interested in doing it
441
00:31:34,532 --> 00:31:36,837
with someone
that just got out of school."
442
00:31:36,838 --> 00:31:39,927
We were so very pleased
to have Chris Gugas come along
443
00:31:39,928 --> 00:31:42,321
and give us a polygraph test
444
00:31:42,322 --> 00:31:44,932
in his office with Michael Rice.
445
00:31:48,328 --> 00:31:50,285
Chris Gugas, he was
considered number two man
446
00:31:50,286 --> 00:31:53,724
in the world at the time.
447
00:31:53,725 --> 00:31:55,769
He had taught
the use of the polygraph
448
00:31:55,770 --> 00:31:57,641
throughout the world
for the armed forces
449
00:31:57,642 --> 00:32:00,121
and for their
intelligence people.
450
00:32:00,122 --> 00:32:01,775
He had been
instructed personally
451
00:32:01,776 --> 00:32:05,126
by the head guy at the FBI.
452
00:32:05,127 --> 00:32:07,564
Among other things, he was
accepted in California courts
453
00:32:07,565 --> 00:32:09,001
as a witness.
454
00:32:10,263 --> 00:32:12,003
It was a long process.
455
00:32:12,004 --> 00:32:14,745
It's not like you walk in,
strap on the machine, and go.
456
00:32:14,746 --> 00:32:17,356
You have to agree
to the questions.
457
00:32:17,357 --> 00:32:20,098
He had five questions.
They have to be yes or no.
458
00:32:20,099 --> 00:32:22,622
And, you know, you get one shot
459
00:32:22,623 --> 00:32:24,798
at doing this thing right.
460
00:32:24,799 --> 00:32:27,498
One of the questions was,
did you levitate?
461
00:32:29,587 --> 00:32:32,938
One of the questions was, did
Kathy turn into an old woman?
462
00:32:35,854 --> 00:32:38,333
And you answered
them all and went sailing
463
00:32:38,334 --> 00:32:39,726
past the polygraph.
464
00:32:39,727 --> 00:32:43,209
Absolutely.
We passed the test.
465
00:32:44,297 --> 00:32:46,124
Later, those findings
were published
466
00:32:46,125 --> 00:32:49,562
in the National Star
of all things.
467
00:32:49,563 --> 00:32:52,130
Well, George, you
know, people who are lying
468
00:32:52,131 --> 00:32:54,567
usually don't agree
to a polygraph.
469
00:32:54,568 --> 00:32:56,264
That's for damn sure.
470
00:33:17,069 --> 00:33:19,636
Many of the people attending
this invitation-only showing
471
00:33:19,637 --> 00:33:21,942
of The Amityville Horror
gave it rave reviews.
472
00:33:21,943 --> 00:33:24,815
And you can judge
for yourself this weekend.
473
00:33:24,816 --> 00:33:26,643
Last night, there was
474
00:33:26,644 --> 00:33:29,167
a gala sneak preview showing.
475
00:33:29,168 --> 00:33:30,821
This was a private screening
476
00:33:30,822 --> 00:33:32,431
of The Amityville Horror,
477
00:33:32,432 --> 00:33:34,825
based on the best-selling
book by Jay Anson.
478
00:33:34,826 --> 00:33:36,609
Anson attended
the screening accompanied
479
00:33:36,610 --> 00:33:38,829
by the film's producer
and one of the stars
480
00:33:38,830 --> 00:33:40,831
of the picture, James Brolin.
481
00:33:40,832 --> 00:33:43,094
Twenty-eight days
after the Lutz family
482
00:33:43,095 --> 00:33:44,661
moved into their dream house,
483
00:33:44,662 --> 00:33:46,793
they were running
for their lives.
484
00:33:46,794 --> 00:33:50,667
What happened to them
is an experience in terror
485
00:33:50,668 --> 00:33:53,495
you will never forget.
486
00:33:53,496 --> 00:33:56,847
The Amityville Horror, rated R.
487
00:33:56,848 --> 00:33:58,065
Is The Amityville
Horror for real?
488
00:33:58,066 --> 00:33:59,197
I don't know,
and I'm not planning to go
489
00:33:59,198 --> 00:34:00,677
to Amityville and find out.
490
00:34:00,678 --> 00:34:02,417
What I can say, though,
is that the movie
491
00:34:02,418 --> 00:34:03,680
is not very much fun.
492
00:34:03,681 --> 00:34:05,116
Maybe it wasn't meant to be.
493
00:34:05,117 --> 00:34:07,771
Oozing slime is hardly
ever entertaining.
494
00:34:07,772 --> 00:34:09,990
But the way the Lutzes
are relentlessly persecuted
495
00:34:09,991 --> 00:34:12,427
by their haunted house
is finally just repetitive,
496
00:34:12,428 --> 00:34:14,647
boring, gruesome,
more than a little depressing.
497
00:34:14,648 --> 00:34:17,258
I was going to say, who
would want to see this movie?
498
00:34:17,259 --> 00:34:20,000
But millions of people
already have gone to see it.
499
00:34:20,001 --> 00:34:23,656
It's a big hit
at the box office.
500
00:34:23,657 --> 00:34:26,703
Horror doesn't have to be good.
501
00:34:26,704 --> 00:34:28,792
Even horror
which is critically panned
502
00:34:28,793 --> 00:34:31,098
can be really powerful.
503
00:34:31,099 --> 00:34:33,100
The Amityville Horror
sticks in the mind.
504
00:34:33,101 --> 00:34:35,886
And I think that's what's
given it its longevity,
505
00:34:35,887 --> 00:34:37,714
not any kind of conception
of quality,
506
00:34:37,715 --> 00:34:41,935
but its ability for moments
or ideas to kind of resonate
507
00:34:41,936 --> 00:34:45,766
and stick with people
for decades.
508
00:34:47,028 --> 00:34:49,029
The great moment where one
of the Lutzes' children
509
00:34:49,030 --> 00:34:52,380
ends up with a hand smashed
by the sash window,
510
00:34:52,381 --> 00:34:54,687
and they're desperately trying
to pull it back in,
511
00:34:54,688 --> 00:34:56,863
but the two men
can't lift the window.
512
00:34:56,864 --> 00:34:59,910
The glowing eyes
that appear outside the window
513
00:34:59,911 --> 00:35:01,738
on the second floor.
514
00:35:01,739 --> 00:35:03,740
Lots of people mention that
as something that they see,
515
00:35:03,741 --> 00:35:05,742
watching the film
for the first time,
516
00:35:05,743 --> 00:35:08,179
as being something that really
sort of stays with them,
517
00:35:08,180 --> 00:35:10,485
and I think because it speaks
to a very deep-seated fear
518
00:35:10,486 --> 00:35:11,965
of, like, you see something
out of the corner
519
00:35:11,966 --> 00:35:13,793
of your eye at night.
520
00:35:13,794 --> 00:35:16,840
The oozing staircase
and the bleeding wall,
521
00:35:16,841 --> 00:35:19,146
where suddenly it seems
like the entire environment
522
00:35:19,147 --> 00:35:21,932
is coming apart at the seams.
523
00:35:21,933 --> 00:35:24,325
Green slime, what was that
on the wall in the movie?
524
00:35:24,326 --> 00:35:25,936
George, did that happen?
525
00:35:25,937 --> 00:35:28,590
As the movie did it,
not exactly, no.
526
00:35:28,591 --> 00:35:31,332
- Do you believe them?
- Do I?
527
00:35:31,333 --> 00:35:33,552
Yeah, when I'm sitting here
with them, yes, I do.
528
00:35:33,553 --> 00:35:35,902
It's hard to deny
a lot of the facts.
529
00:35:52,224 --> 00:35:54,355
Watching the Lutzes
on Good Morning America
530
00:35:54,356 --> 00:35:58,011
really drives home
the importance of saying,
531
00:35:58,012 --> 00:36:00,100
"This is based
on a true story."
532
00:36:00,101 --> 00:36:02,363
Somebody tells you a scary
story about a haunted house,
533
00:36:02,364 --> 00:36:03,451
you go, eh, that's fine.
534
00:36:03,452 --> 00:36:04,931
That's just a scary story.
535
00:36:04,932 --> 00:36:08,979
But someone tells you
about it on the morning news,
536
00:36:08,980 --> 00:36:11,851
and the people are right there,
and the actor is right there,
537
00:36:11,852 --> 00:36:14,245
you see this collapse
of the distinction
538
00:36:14,246 --> 00:36:17,162
between the truth
and entertainment.
539
00:36:19,817 --> 00:36:22,209
Rosemary's Baby,
540
00:36:22,210 --> 00:36:25,604
The Exorcist and The Omen
541
00:36:25,605 --> 00:36:27,911
are referred to
as the unholy trinity.
542
00:36:27,912 --> 00:36:30,783
All three of these films
involving Satanism
543
00:36:30,784 --> 00:36:33,830
and the supernatural
and the occult present
544
00:36:33,831 --> 00:36:36,790
an attack
on the American family.
545
00:36:39,010 --> 00:36:42,012
In Rosemary's Baby,
she's pregnant.
546
00:36:42,013 --> 00:36:43,143
It's a nice, young couple.
547
00:36:43,144 --> 00:36:45,276
They move into a new apartment.
548
00:36:45,277 --> 00:36:47,844
And then they realize
that she has no control
549
00:36:47,845 --> 00:36:49,802
over the antichrist spawn
550
00:36:49,803 --> 00:36:51,936
that she is now
bringing to bear.
551
00:36:53,851 --> 00:36:57,592
And so this represents
the dread of what it means
552
00:36:57,593 --> 00:37:01,292
to be a woman in society,
of the loss of control
553
00:37:01,293 --> 00:37:03,598
over your own body
and what eventually becomes
554
00:37:03,599 --> 00:37:05,426
of your child.
555
00:37:05,427 --> 00:37:08,908
In The Exorcist, where it's
a single-parent household,
556
00:37:08,909 --> 00:37:10,823
and it is an adolescent child,
557
00:37:10,824 --> 00:37:13,695
an adolescent daughter,
Regan MacNeil,
558
00:37:13,696 --> 00:37:16,089
going through puberty,
559
00:37:16,090 --> 00:37:18,091
new experiences
happening with her body
560
00:37:18,092 --> 00:37:21,007
that is going
to rebel against her mother.
561
00:37:21,008 --> 00:37:25,882
At the same time,
The Omen that comes out in 1976
562
00:37:25,883 --> 00:37:30,843
is about a young couple that,
due to pregnancy mishaps,
563
00:37:30,844 --> 00:37:32,889
have to adopt a child.
564
00:37:32,890 --> 00:37:36,066
Little do they know that it
is also the spawn of Satan.
565
00:37:36,067 --> 00:37:38,459
Thus, not only do you need
the transcendental authority
566
00:37:38,460 --> 00:37:40,897
of the church,
you need some male force,
567
00:37:40,898 --> 00:37:42,899
represented
by Catholic patriarchy,
568
00:37:42,900 --> 00:37:45,727
to come in and save the day.
569
00:37:53,606 --> 00:37:55,085
Do you plan
to show the movie here?
570
00:37:55,086 --> 00:37:56,956
No, we don't.
571
00:37:56,957 --> 00:38:00,003
We've contemplated
every maneuver possible
572
00:38:00,004 --> 00:38:01,874
in the event that things
get out of hand,
573
00:38:01,875 --> 00:38:04,007
changing the name of the street,
574
00:38:04,008 --> 00:38:05,878
eliminating parking
along the hallway,
575
00:38:05,879 --> 00:38:07,575
making the streets one-way.
576
00:38:07,576 --> 00:38:09,882
We've come up with a plan
just to have extra police
577
00:38:09,883 --> 00:38:11,579
down there on a full-time basis
578
00:38:11,580 --> 00:38:13,408
in unmarked cars
just to keep traffic moving.
579
00:38:16,498 --> 00:38:18,891
It seems local
residents would retitle
580
00:38:18,892 --> 00:38:21,720
The Amityville Horror
The Amityville Nuisance
581
00:38:21,721 --> 00:38:23,156
because all it's done
is brought a lot
582
00:38:23,157 --> 00:38:25,898
of unwelcome tourists, sightseers,
583
00:38:25,899 --> 00:38:28,118
and a lot of extra traffic
to what used
584
00:38:28,119 --> 00:38:29,946
to be a quiet
Long Island village.
585
00:38:41,959 --> 00:38:43,611
Why did you come by tonight
to look at this house?
586
00:38:43,612 --> 00:38:45,178
To see what it was like.
587
00:38:45,179 --> 00:38:48,182
I guess, we just specifically
came from Chicago to see it.
588
00:38:50,228 --> 00:38:52,055
It isn't a
house that we want to sell.
589
00:38:52,056 --> 00:38:54,492
It's a house we feel
we're being forced to sell
590
00:38:54,493 --> 00:38:58,148
because of
The Amityville Horror.
591
00:38:58,149 --> 00:38:59,932
In the two years
the Cromarty family
592
00:38:59,933 --> 00:39:01,803
has lived here,
they tell us they
593
00:39:01,804 --> 00:39:04,197
have never noticed anything
strange or supernatural
594
00:39:04,198 --> 00:39:05,938
taking place.
595
00:39:05,939 --> 00:39:09,159
But we feel now
we have to give up.
596
00:39:09,160 --> 00:39:10,943
We need a night's sleep.
597
00:39:10,944 --> 00:39:12,205
That people have nothing better
598
00:39:12,206 --> 00:39:13,990
in the world to do
599
00:39:13,991 --> 00:39:18,559
than to come and gape
or do stupid things.
600
00:39:38,015 --> 00:39:38,841
When the film first came out,
601
00:39:38,842 --> 00:39:41,234
I was like ten or so.
602
00:39:41,235 --> 00:39:44,803
We went to go see a movie
with the babysitter.
603
00:39:44,804 --> 00:39:48,198
And in a different theater
down the hall,
604
00:39:48,199 --> 00:39:50,809
The Amityville Horror
was showing.
605
00:39:50,810 --> 00:39:53,203
I told the babysitter
I needed to go to the bathroom
606
00:39:53,204 --> 00:39:56,597
and went out
607
00:39:56,598 --> 00:39:59,297
and went
inside the other theater.
608
00:40:01,125 --> 00:40:03,039
This is a movie about my family,
609
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:07,826
and I was seeing
this reaction from a crowd
610
00:40:07,827 --> 00:40:10,350
as they're watching
the Amityville movie.
611
00:40:10,351 --> 00:40:12,439
And it was just, like, surreal.
612
00:40:17,184 --> 00:40:20,273
And it was like,
this is what the world
613
00:40:20,274 --> 00:40:23,450
came to think was my story.
614
00:40:26,367 --> 00:40:29,021
Here I was, a little kid
with a New York accent
615
00:40:29,022 --> 00:40:31,371
in a California public school
with the same name
616
00:40:31,372 --> 00:40:33,025
as in the movie.
617
00:40:33,026 --> 00:40:36,116
It didn't take long for kids
to figure out who I was, so...
618
00:40:40,077 --> 00:40:43,035
I tried to tell them
what happened if they asked.
619
00:40:43,036 --> 00:40:45,124
And then it was like,
"Well, that's not what
620
00:40:45,125 --> 00:40:47,735
was in the movie.
You're a liar."
621
00:40:47,736 --> 00:40:49,041
I was like, what?
622
00:40:54,265 --> 00:40:57,267
And then, at one point,
they went on a world tour
623
00:40:57,268 --> 00:40:58,268
talking about it.
624
00:41:12,196 --> 00:41:14,501
The next one is this.
This is really strange.
625
00:41:14,502 --> 00:41:16,547
Now, if you look closely
at this photograph here,
626
00:41:16,548 --> 00:41:18,114
now, that's... you can't
really see it too well here,
627
00:41:18,115 --> 00:41:20,116
but that's a little boy.
628
00:41:20,117 --> 00:41:22,074
And who is he supposed to be?
629
00:41:22,075 --> 00:41:24,642
We don't know
who he is actually.
630
00:41:24,643 --> 00:41:26,252
But Missy knows him,
our daughter.
631
00:41:26,253 --> 00:41:28,341
When she saw the picture,
which was discovered
632
00:41:28,342 --> 00:41:30,778
now two weeks ago, she said,
"That's the little boy
633
00:41:30,779 --> 00:41:32,738
I used to always talk to."
634
00:41:36,002 --> 00:41:41,093
They even had
put us into a Catholic school.
635
00:41:41,094 --> 00:41:43,096
They dropped us
in The Orphanage.
636
00:41:45,490 --> 00:41:47,360
That was a tough thing, man.
637
00:41:47,361 --> 00:41:50,189
You know, the other kids
in The Orphanage were like,
638
00:41:50,190 --> 00:41:52,104
"Your parents aren't
coming back for you,
639
00:41:52,105 --> 00:41:54,193
just like they left us
here too."
640
00:41:54,194 --> 00:41:59,155
You know, it was definitely...
641
00:41:59,156 --> 00:42:00,374
a hard time.
642
00:42:04,857 --> 00:42:08,164
I asked Kathy a couple
of times about the children,
643
00:42:08,165 --> 00:42:11,254
and she told me
that she was trying
644
00:42:11,255 --> 00:42:14,387
to shelter them from everything
645
00:42:14,388 --> 00:42:16,998
that was going on.
646
00:42:16,999 --> 00:42:22,395
When I look back on it now,
I feel for the children.
647
00:42:22,396 --> 00:42:25,703
I didn't think, at that point,
they were being sheltered.
648
00:42:25,704 --> 00:42:27,619
It was just too public.
649
00:42:31,405 --> 00:42:33,406
I'm Jackie Stone,
650
00:42:33,407 --> 00:42:35,626
and this is supposedly
where it all happened.
651
00:42:35,627 --> 00:42:37,976
The DeFeo, Lutz,
or Cromarty house...
652
00:42:37,977 --> 00:42:39,499
Depending
on how you look for it...
653
00:42:39,500 --> 00:42:41,240
The site
of the Amityville Horror
654
00:42:41,241 --> 00:42:42,373
or the Amityville Hoax.
655
00:42:43,287 --> 00:42:45,201
Do you believe
it is a horror or hoax?
656
00:42:45,202 --> 00:42:46,593
It's a hoax.
657
00:42:46,594 --> 00:42:48,029
So you don't believe it at all?
658
00:42:48,030 --> 00:42:49,857
- Not at all.
- Definitely a hoax.
659
00:42:49,858 --> 00:42:51,381
Why?
660
00:42:51,382 --> 00:42:53,774
Well, I've been a longtime
resident of Amityville,
661
00:42:53,775 --> 00:42:56,951
and there's never
any incident of this type
662
00:42:56,952 --> 00:42:58,344
at any time in that home.
663
00:42:58,345 --> 00:43:00,651
I think it was just
a moneymaking bracket
664
00:43:00,652 --> 00:43:02,870
that somebody put together
with a lot of brains.
665
00:43:02,871 --> 00:43:05,003
You know, they saw a good chance
to make a lot of money,
666
00:43:05,004 --> 00:43:06,613
so they put a film together,
667
00:43:06,614 --> 00:43:08,267
and now they're making millions.
668
00:43:08,268 --> 00:43:09,529
Do you believe that all that
669
00:43:09,530 --> 00:43:11,792
- really happened here?
- Yeah, I believe it.
670
00:43:11,793 --> 00:43:14,230
I believe. I believe
in the devil.
671
00:43:14,231 --> 00:43:17,233
As far as we're concerned,
the Amityville hoax
672
00:43:17,234 --> 00:43:18,625
is the real horror.
673
00:43:18,626 --> 00:43:20,366
Whether or not
it was a hoax or a horror,
674
00:43:20,367 --> 00:43:22,194
you'll have to decide that
for yourself.
675
00:43:25,677 --> 00:43:27,373
People were coming to think
676
00:43:27,374 --> 00:43:29,942
that it was a hoax.
677
00:43:32,292 --> 00:43:34,250
I knew that Mom
and George had, like,
678
00:43:34,251 --> 00:43:36,208
given the recordings over
to Jay Anson
679
00:43:36,209 --> 00:43:38,211
and that Anson wrote the book.
680
00:43:39,865 --> 00:43:43,041
But I had never heard the tapes.
681
00:43:43,042 --> 00:43:45,261
All I know is that this is what
682
00:43:45,262 --> 00:43:48,655
he went around the world promoting
683
00:43:48,656 --> 00:43:50,745
and thought it was fine.
684
00:43:56,273 --> 00:43:59,840
Like, let me tell you a story
about that photo
685
00:43:59,841 --> 00:44:03,844
taken during
the Warren investigation.
686
00:44:03,845 --> 00:44:07,239
That photo has circulated
all around the world
687
00:44:07,240 --> 00:44:09,720
and all over the internet now.
688
00:44:09,721 --> 00:44:11,591
But here's the thing.
689
00:44:11,592 --> 00:44:14,290
You'll notice that head
that's sticking out
690
00:44:14,291 --> 00:44:17,510
of that doorway...
Attached to that head,
691
00:44:17,511 --> 00:44:19,469
it's a plaid shirt.
692
00:44:19,470 --> 00:44:23,516
And it's consistent with the
same shirt as the photographer
693
00:44:23,517 --> 00:44:25,257
that's taking these photos.
694
00:44:28,957 --> 00:44:32,134
And so it's not some spirit.
695
00:44:34,136 --> 00:44:37,269
It's the picture
of the photographer.
696
00:44:46,801 --> 00:44:50,151
I never liked
that he felt that it was fine
697
00:44:50,152 --> 00:44:53,329
to add fiction to it.
698
00:44:53,330 --> 00:44:56,506
It really pissed me off.
699
00:44:59,771 --> 00:45:03,513
Because there's enough
to the story
700
00:45:03,514 --> 00:45:05,776
that anybody
that has a real sense
701
00:45:05,777 --> 00:45:10,346
of what paranormal activity is,
702
00:45:10,347 --> 00:45:12,565
there's enough here.
703
00:45:12,566 --> 00:45:14,525
There's no need to pepper it
with any bullshit.
704
00:45:17,702 --> 00:45:20,791
Is this fact or fiction?
705
00:45:20,792 --> 00:45:23,576
Fiction, absolutely.
706
00:45:23,577 --> 00:45:25,361
So this story evolved
over dinner with the Lutzes
707
00:45:25,362 --> 00:45:26,623
and a bottle of wine.
708
00:45:26,624 --> 00:45:29,452
I think it was
about three bottles of wine.
709
00:45:29,453 --> 00:45:31,584
Yes, about three bottles
of wine.
710
00:45:31,585 --> 00:45:34,326
So the story grew
with each bottle of wine.
711
00:45:34,327 --> 00:45:35,937
Each bottle
became a better story.
712
00:45:37,548 --> 00:45:40,332
I told them
there were flies found
713
00:45:40,333 --> 00:45:42,378
in the house where the body
of the older sister
714
00:45:42,379 --> 00:45:44,336
was discovered.
715
00:45:44,337 --> 00:45:48,385
From those flies, they created
a complete supernatural scene.
716
00:45:50,822 --> 00:45:54,215
And there was
a greenish-black substance
717
00:45:54,216 --> 00:45:56,609
around many of the doorknobs.
718
00:45:56,610 --> 00:45:59,439
They were the result
of fingerprint powders.
719
00:46:01,615 --> 00:46:03,834
So we took real-life incidences,
720
00:46:03,835 --> 00:46:06,445
and then we transposed them.
721
00:46:06,446 --> 00:46:08,578
Green slime
was actually spaghetti
722
00:46:08,579 --> 00:46:11,929
that had been splashed
on the wall at a time
723
00:46:11,930 --> 00:46:16,063
when Mr. DeFeo supposedly had
hit his wife in the kitchen
724
00:46:16,064 --> 00:46:18,936
while she was carrying
a plate of spaghetti.
725
00:46:18,937 --> 00:46:21,373
There were times
when one of the DeFeo
726
00:46:21,374 --> 00:46:25,377
or a neighbor's kitten
would jump on Dawn's window.
727
00:46:25,378 --> 00:46:27,510
And just taking
that little incident,
728
00:46:27,511 --> 00:46:33,646
we developed it into a pig
appearing at the window.
729
00:46:33,647 --> 00:46:35,648
We could sit here
for three weeks.
730
00:46:35,649 --> 00:46:38,521
And I'll keep telling you
each time, it's a fraud.
731
00:46:40,524 --> 00:46:47,922
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