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I thought what was interesting
about him
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00:00:11,395 --> 00:00:16,455
was the strength he had as a leader,
combined with what was obviously
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00:00:16,555 --> 00:00:20,195
a very reflective self-analysis.
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00:00:23,595 --> 00:00:26,975
He could be the father confessor,
the motivational speaker,
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00:00:27,075 --> 00:00:31,175
the priest, the judge, the jury,
the Lord High Executioner,
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00:00:31,275 --> 00:00:36,175
the puppet master
and the inspirational figure
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00:00:36,275 --> 00:00:38,435
all in the course of one day.
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You saw where particular individuals
were starting to become
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far too important
in their own right
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and he showed and demonstrated
that he could do without them.
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His relentless need for success
and have that desire
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to do better and to make sure
that we don't stand still.
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You just trusted him.
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That was the big thing,
because he'd won so much,
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you'd just think,
I'm going to go with it.
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What does it take to be
a great leader?
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That's what people flock here
to the London Business School
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from all over the world to find out
and a lucky few today
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are going to hear
from one of the greats.
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No, he's not a billionaire
from Silicon Valley,
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he's not a general
who's led his troops into battle.
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He's certainly not a politician.
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He is, though, a man who, for more
than a quarter of a century,
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masterminded one of this country's
greatest brands.
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I have studied and analysed leaders
all my life
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but I never saw one quite
as successful as Sir Alex Ferguson.
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It's my very great pleasure
to welcome Sir Alex Ferguson.
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What is the secret of his success?
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Professor Anita Elberse
of the Harvard Business School
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has studied it.
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Together, they take classes,
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addressing the next generation
of business leaders.
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Today in London,
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these students are getting
a crash course in leadership -
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the Ferguson way.
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So what we're going to be doing
is a case study
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like we do those at Harvard
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00:02:30,794 --> 00:02:32,294
and this is a good test to see
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whether you guys are as smart
as the people at Harvard.
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Many regard him
as the best coach in all of sports.
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Why is he such a great coach?
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He's sat next to me!
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Um, I would say...
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LAUGHTER
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I would say he's won everything
there is to win many times.
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Er, Helena?
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00:02:54,794 --> 00:02:57,534
He's got a really strong vision.
He wants to win.
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And he's ruthlessly executing
against that, every single time.
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'It's still Ryan Giggs.
He's past Keown, past Dixon...
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00:03:05,434 --> 00:03:07,973
'and has scored
a sensational goal!'
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Winning was what Sir Alex
did again and again and again.
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When he retired, he'd won
an amazing 49 trophies in his career.
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'Ronaldo!
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'Right-footed,
it's a clear header...
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'and it's into the net!'
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CHEERING
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And I just needed a miracle.
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And of course, we got one.
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'He tries to spread himself
as wide as he can.
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'He makes the save
for Manchester United!
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'Van der Sar!'
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No-one is likely to
ever match his record
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of winning 13 Premier League titles
and two Champions League trophies.
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I think no doubt
he's one of the best coaches ever.
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Not just because I was...
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He was my leader,
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so in history, no question,
probably the best one.
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What does all this have to do
with business?
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Why is this worthy of study
at a business school?
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00:04:02,233 --> 00:04:05,293
One person who knows the answer
to that question
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00:04:05,393 --> 00:04:08,733
is former Manchester United
Chief Executive David Gill.
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00:04:08,833 --> 00:04:11,853
He understood that in order to have
a successful football team,
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and get what he wanted on the pitch,
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the business of Manchester United
had to be very successful.
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His leadership skills meant
that he could understand
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what we were trying to do as a club.
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I think the fact that the club
was champions for so many years
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and has got such a reputation
across the world,
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that you have to put that down
to his great management
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and that had the knock-on effect
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of creating great financial revenues
for the organisations.
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It's about time
I turned over to the man himself.
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Please, again, join me
in welcoming Sir Alex Ferguson.
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Thank you.
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Tomorrow, at Haydock Park,
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I've a horse running
called Hairdryer.
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LAUGHTER
True!
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Sir Alex's record attracted
the attention of one of the world's
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most successful investors - writer
and billionaire Michael Moritz
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who made his money backing Apple
and PayPal and Google.
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Moritz has been a student
of leadership for decades.
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I started looking around
for the people in organisations
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who had been able to steer
an organisation to perform
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at a very high level of excellence,
consistently, for a very long time.
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And that's what piqued my curiosity
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about Sir Alex
and Manchester United.
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Sir Alex is the first person to
say that his world is football
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but the elements and rudiments
of leadership are universal skills
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that are as applicable to
a multi-national corporation,
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a boy scout troop,
a church organization
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as they are to a football club.
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A club made in his image, shaped by
his values, forged by his character.
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Sir Alex Ferguson has
legendary status at Old Trafford.
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As a lifelong United fan myself,
I don't claim to be impartial.
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Ah, welcome. Great to see you.
Professor Ferguson.
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'But I've always wanted to understand
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'the ingredients of
the Fergie Formula for success.'
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As I was watching you
at London Business School,
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I was sitting next to a Chinese,
a Russian, a Uruguayan, an Italian.
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Did you ever think
you would find yourself
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lecturing on leadership to the young
entrepreneurs from around the world?
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The thing about it,
the challenge is it's young people
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and I've always enjoyed
my interaction with young people.
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I've always enjoyed my time as
a manager producing young players,
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because with young people, you know,
it's amazing how they surprise you
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when you give them
an opportunity.
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Now, back at the business school,
you had on the whiteboard,
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all those people that can
crowd in on a football manager...
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Yeah. ..who think they've
got a right to have a say. Yeah.
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And you wiped a whole series
of them off.
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This is a great bit.
Where's that duster?
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Get rid of all these.
They don't mean a thing.
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They don't mean anything.
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Oh, sorry, fans should be there,
sorry.
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LAUGHTER AND APPLAUSE
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What was the essence left behind?
Well, there's a core.
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Look at the core because
you can get trapped
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in the periphery of things
that are happening.
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Your players and your staff,
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they're the important issues
of the whole thing.
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And, of course,
you hope that, then, that transfers
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your results into keeping fans
happy because that's my job.
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Fans just want their team to win
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but Ferguson insists that his job
involves a lot more than that.
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Most managers go to a football club
because it's a result industry.
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They're there to turn
the fortunes of the first team.
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That's why they get the job.
I never thought that way.
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My philosophy was to build
a football club.
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Sir Alex made Man United, as a club,
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to think in a certain way.
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I think he modelled the club
around his view,
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around his personality.
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I think Man United
will be always influenced
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by what he did
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as a manager in the club.
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The club was made at his image.
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I think the strength of United
is this great family spirit
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we always created. And people who
thrive and be recognised.
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You don't mean the star players?
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You're talking about the people
round the club.
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Yeah, they're no problem.
I mean, the players,
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you're with them all the time.
That's the difference.
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As a manager at Manchester United,
you could easily walk by someone.
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A girl came out of the office
and not recognise them.
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I wouldn't do that.
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I would say "hello",
"good morning", whatever.
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And I think it's that recognition
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that gives you
that strength of a family.
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There's a dinner lady called Carol.
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She hammers him. "What you
got on today? What is that?"
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And he'd laugh and he'd go back
at her and he'd start talking about
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her hair or something
or whatever.
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That's the way he is. People don't
see that side of him a lot,
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but he was really, really good
like that.
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He had this unbelievable ability
of remembering everyone's name.
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Obviously, he knows Cath on reception
and the laundry girls
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and the chefs and the cleaners.
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You've got 65, 70 players.
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You've got to remember
all their names.
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Plus the schoolboys,
that's another 30 or 40.
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He knew all the names
because he took an interest in what
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they were doing
and how they were progressing.
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He was the top man
and if he's doing it,
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then everyone else
should be doing it as well.
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Everyone loves him there
in the club.
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He'd invite everyone
to come for lunch, uh...
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for a cup of tea.
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English cup of tea.
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So it is... It was a family.
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It was a family with him.
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And leaders often forget that,
right?
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That it's just as much about
the ladies doing the laundry,
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and making sure that they're happy
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as it is about making sure
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that Cristiano Ronaldo
is having a great day.
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The family Ferguson created at United
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was inculcated with the values
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he'd learnt from his family,
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growing up in Glasgow
in the '40s and '50s
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in the shadow of the Govan shipyards.
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I want to get you to look at an image
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of the place you grew up.
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Govan. Govan. That's the shipyards.
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00:10:38,269 --> 00:10:39,809
Of course, two cranes there.
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I lived only a mile and a half
from there.
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Sometimes I used to go and wait
on my dad coming out the gates
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at around about five o'clock.
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00:10:48,749 --> 00:10:50,728
You know,
even though the temperatures
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and the wind that came down
that Clyde,
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it never stopped them from working,
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never stopped them from
building ships.
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So toughness against the odds?
Absolutely.
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They would never bow, these people.
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I was proud to be brought up
in that kind of environment.
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00:11:03,988 --> 00:11:06,248
Let's take a look at your parents.
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00:11:06,348 --> 00:11:09,168
There we are, there's the Fergusons.
Yeah.
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00:11:09,268 --> 00:11:13,008
And you see the ties?
There were footballs on them.
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00:11:13,108 --> 00:11:17,008
There were... Even at that age?
Yeah, yeah. Oh, yeah, my dad was...
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My dad played for Glentoran
in Northern Ireland.
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00:11:19,428 --> 00:11:21,968
He worked in Harland and Wolff
in Northern Ireland for a spell.
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00:11:22,068 --> 00:11:24,128
And you didn't want to get
on the wrong side of him?
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00:11:24,228 --> 00:11:26,048
Oh, no way. No, he was...
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00:11:26,148 --> 00:11:28,328
He wasn't the type
who would punish you,
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00:11:28,428 --> 00:11:30,008
but his voice was enough.
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00:11:30,108 --> 00:11:32,688
He was a quiet man. But when he...
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00:11:32,788 --> 00:11:36,408
he wasn't happy with you, he raised
the voice and that was enough.
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00:11:36,508 --> 00:11:38,808
So you didn't want to be
on the wrong side of him,
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00:11:38,908 --> 00:11:41,728
he was a stickler for keeping time..
Yeah, yeah.
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00:11:41,828 --> 00:11:45,248
Does it sound a bit familiar?
Stayed with me all my life.
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00:11:45,348 --> 00:11:47,848
I love to be early.
You know, I'm always early.
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00:11:47,948 --> 00:11:49,368
But there must have been clashes.
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00:11:49,468 --> 00:11:52,048
Were there moments where you
thought...? Well, my dad...
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00:11:52,148 --> 00:11:54,328
..cos any teenager with their dad...
Oh, yeah.
226
00:11:54,428 --> 00:11:56,128
..would fall out quite badly...
227
00:11:56,228 --> 00:11:59,568
We never spoke for about
seven or eight months for a while,
228
00:11:59,668 --> 00:12:02,208
because he wanted me to go
to junior football...
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00:12:02,308 --> 00:12:05,208
You didn't speak
for seven or eight months? Yeah.
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00:12:05,308 --> 00:12:08,408
He wanted me to go to
junior football to protect me,
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00:12:08,508 --> 00:12:10,408
if I didn't make it
in senior football.
232
00:12:10,508 --> 00:12:14,328
Did you learn that sometimes
keeping quiet
233
00:12:14,428 --> 00:12:17,568
can be just as worrying
for someone...?
234
00:12:17,668 --> 00:12:20,288
Absolutely, yeah.
Just as good for a leader to do.
235
00:12:20,388 --> 00:12:23,247
Yeah, absolutely. Quieter moments.
I remember we were down 3-0
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00:12:23,347 --> 00:12:26,967
at half-time at Tottenham Hotspurs,
I never says a word.
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00:12:27,067 --> 00:12:30,207
They were ready to go out, I says,
"The next goal's a winner.
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00:12:30,307 --> 00:12:34,127
"Let's score the first goal
and see where it takes us,"
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00:12:34,227 --> 00:12:36,227
and we scored within a minute.
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00:12:40,147 --> 00:12:43,087
You scored within a minute,
you went on to score five! 5-3, yeah.
241
00:12:43,187 --> 00:12:44,207
You once said something
242
00:12:44,307 --> 00:12:46,567
that I think a lot of people
would find surprising -
243
00:12:46,667 --> 00:12:48,647
that when you're looking
at a footballer,
244
00:12:48,747 --> 00:12:51,607
one of the first things you wanted
to do is look at their mum and dad.
245
00:12:51,707 --> 00:12:53,127
Yeah, absolutely. Definitely.
246
00:12:53,227 --> 00:12:55,407
Try and find out what
kind of parents they've got.
247
00:12:55,507 --> 00:12:57,007
And particularly the mother.
248
00:12:57,107 --> 00:13:01,047
We used to say to all the scouts,
"Get the mother...
249
00:13:01,147 --> 00:13:02,647
"Get the mother on your side,
250
00:13:02,747 --> 00:13:04,527
"because she makes
all the decisions."
251
00:13:04,627 --> 00:13:09,087
The father, a lot of the time, can
be entranced by his son's progress
252
00:13:09,187 --> 00:13:12,247
and sort of living in their boots
a little bit, you know?
253
00:13:12,347 --> 00:13:14,127
They live in the glory of the kid.
254
00:13:14,227 --> 00:13:16,767
The mother wants to do the best
for her son.
255
00:13:16,867 --> 00:13:18,407
No question about that.
256
00:13:18,507 --> 00:13:21,807
So, in terms of
dealing with parents,
257
00:13:21,907 --> 00:13:24,127
the mother's
the most important person.
258
00:13:24,227 --> 00:13:25,727
He's great with people's mums.
259
00:13:25,827 --> 00:13:28,407
My mum was there
and my wife was there.
260
00:13:28,507 --> 00:13:30,047
My girlfriend at the time, she was.
261
00:13:30,147 --> 00:13:32,407
And he just made them
feel comfortable
262
00:13:32,507 --> 00:13:35,647
and I remember them coming out
of the room, when we finished,
263
00:13:35,747 --> 00:13:37,047
and went to the hotel after
264
00:13:37,147 --> 00:13:39,187
and they were saying,
"He was such a nice guy."
265
00:13:40,707 --> 00:13:43,607
It was Ferguson's reputation
as a disciplinarian
266
00:13:43,707 --> 00:13:45,687
that appealed to Manchester United.
267
00:13:45,787 --> 00:13:48,327
That and his record at Aberdeen.
268
00:13:48,427 --> 00:13:50,807
His team beat
the mighty Real Madrid
269
00:13:50,907 --> 00:13:53,887
to lift the
European Cup Winners' Cup.
270
00:13:53,987 --> 00:13:56,646
He arrived at
Old Trafford in 1986,
271
00:13:56,746 --> 00:13:59,726
and before he could revive
a once great club,
272
00:13:59,826 --> 00:14:03,966
he had first to tackle
a pernicious drinking culture.
273
00:14:04,066 --> 00:14:06,846
I was a bit impulsive, I think.
274
00:14:06,946 --> 00:14:10,326
I called everyone into the
gymnasium, all the young players,
275
00:14:10,426 --> 00:14:12,526
all the staff, all the players.
276
00:14:12,626 --> 00:14:15,526
So I said to them,
"Look, I've read all these stories.
277
00:14:15,626 --> 00:14:18,046
"I've heard all these stories
about the drinking culture.
278
00:14:18,146 --> 00:14:20,726
"Well, I have to tell you,
I won't change.
279
00:14:20,826 --> 00:14:24,166
"You're all going to
have to change. That's a fact."
280
00:14:24,266 --> 00:14:25,646
I mean, how big a problem was it?
281
00:14:25,746 --> 00:14:29,086
Well, I think there was
a genuinely bad element
282
00:14:29,186 --> 00:14:31,406
of drinking in the afternoons.
283
00:14:31,506 --> 00:14:37,206
Going away from the training ground
to spend all afternoon drinking.
284
00:14:37,306 --> 00:14:39,966
People tell stories.
People phone the manager
285
00:14:40,066 --> 00:14:42,926
of Manchester United or Arsenal
or Liverpool, tell them,
286
00:14:43,026 --> 00:14:45,486
"I seen your pair in the pub."
It happens. It happens.
287
00:14:45,586 --> 00:14:48,326
That's the great networking system
you have,
288
00:14:48,426 --> 00:14:50,406
being the manager of
Manchester United.
289
00:14:50,506 --> 00:14:53,086
It's a nice word, "network".
It's spies, isn't it?!
290
00:14:53,186 --> 00:14:55,166
Yeah, well, you need it, you know?
291
00:14:55,266 --> 00:14:57,006
And I then realised to myself,
292
00:14:57,106 --> 00:14:59,966
we're not going to win the league
with this team.
293
00:15:00,066 --> 00:15:01,566
So we did a fire sale.
294
00:15:01,666 --> 00:15:05,486
Got rid of about nine players
and brought five young players in,
295
00:15:05,586 --> 00:15:08,646
people who were hungry enough
to accept challenge
296
00:15:08,746 --> 00:15:11,526
and send the club in
a different direction.
297
00:15:11,626 --> 00:15:14,326
'The new leader of another
failing organisation
298
00:15:14,426 --> 00:15:17,166
'faced similar problems
just a few years later.
299
00:15:17,266 --> 00:15:20,926
'Tony Blair's Labour Party
had lost four elections in a row.'
300
00:15:21,026 --> 00:15:24,086
In a sense,
you both did the same thing -
301
00:15:24,186 --> 00:15:26,366
you took over losing teams
302
00:15:26,466 --> 00:15:30,725
and you had to try and change
the culture of those teams.
303
00:15:30,825 --> 00:15:33,605
Is that vital for someone
who's a leader?
304
00:15:33,705 --> 00:15:36,565
To be prepared to challenge
the existing culture,
305
00:15:36,665 --> 00:15:38,285
not live with it as it is?
306
00:15:38,385 --> 00:15:41,725
Yeah, always the greatest problem
when you're leading an organisation
307
00:15:41,825 --> 00:15:46,805
that is failing is that you
take the system as it is
308
00:15:46,905 --> 00:15:48,765
and you just try to make it work,
309
00:15:48,865 --> 00:15:51,485
when it may be the system itself
that is at fault.
310
00:15:51,585 --> 00:15:53,525
So, in other words, you know,
311
00:15:53,625 --> 00:15:57,765
it may be that you can't get
a political party back to power
312
00:15:57,865 --> 00:16:00,525
just by amending the same message.
313
00:16:00,625 --> 00:16:02,565
You may have to change it
completely.
314
00:16:02,665 --> 00:16:04,885
You know, you may have to redraw
the whole boundaries
315
00:16:04,985 --> 00:16:06,365
of your organisation.
316
00:16:06,465 --> 00:16:08,765
You may have to, as we had
to do with the Labour Party,
317
00:16:08,865 --> 00:16:10,085
fundamentally shift it.
318
00:16:10,185 --> 00:16:14,125
He asks and demands
discipline and respect.
319
00:16:14,225 --> 00:16:15,485
It's a balanced approach.
320
00:16:15,585 --> 00:16:19,525
It's not just showing everyone that
he is the guy who has the power.
321
00:16:19,625 --> 00:16:22,485
Step one in the
Fergie Leadership Manual -
322
00:16:22,585 --> 00:16:26,245
assert control and impose discipline.
323
00:16:26,345 --> 00:16:29,045
The 180-degree opposite to
discipline is anarchy.
324
00:16:29,145 --> 00:16:30,645
Well, anarchy won't achieve a thing,
325
00:16:30,745 --> 00:16:33,965
because people will just shove off
in different directions,
326
00:16:34,065 --> 00:16:38,325
and so discipline is essential
327
00:16:38,425 --> 00:16:42,845
for any team to achieve
the common objective.
328
00:16:42,945 --> 00:16:46,125
And I think that's true of soccer
as it's true of the army.
329
00:16:46,225 --> 00:16:48,685
Sir Alex knew that if you
didn't have discipline
330
00:16:48,785 --> 00:16:51,525
within the organisation,
anarchy would break out
331
00:16:51,625 --> 00:16:54,965
and it would become unwieldy and
impossible to manage or to lead.
332
00:16:55,065 --> 00:16:58,205
I would get into the training
ground... Be there about seven.
333
00:16:58,305 --> 00:17:01,284
I would be there
till God knows what time.
334
00:17:01,384 --> 00:17:04,804
I would stay to watch the academy,
whatever, and I was...
335
00:17:04,904 --> 00:17:06,884
'He arrived very, very early.
336
00:17:06,984 --> 00:17:10,044
'All the time, he was there
in his office to check,'
337
00:17:10,144 --> 00:17:12,644
to make the training.
338
00:17:12,744 --> 00:17:15,844
And always the first one in
339
00:17:15,944 --> 00:17:18,564
and always the last one to go home.
340
00:17:18,664 --> 00:17:21,764
So I learned this
kind of stuff with him.
341
00:17:21,864 --> 00:17:24,324
And that's something
that wasn't lost on the players,
342
00:17:24,424 --> 00:17:26,924
so if he's in early,
why are you not?
343
00:17:27,024 --> 00:17:30,004
He's been doing it 25, 30 years.
Why are you not in before him
344
00:17:30,104 --> 00:17:34,124
or at least near the same time
as him and putting the work in?
345
00:17:34,224 --> 00:17:36,404
Turning up on time
and training hard
346
00:17:36,504 --> 00:17:40,244
were only the beginning of what
the boss demanded from his team.
347
00:17:40,344 --> 00:17:43,964
I wanted them to be
Manchester United in terms of dress,
348
00:17:44,064 --> 00:17:47,404
made sure they wore their blazer
and flannels wherever they went,
349
00:17:47,504 --> 00:17:50,324
in terms of away from home,
in particular.
350
00:17:50,424 --> 00:17:53,564
And why does it matter, though? For a
leader thinking, "Well, who cares?"
351
00:17:53,664 --> 00:17:55,964
Well, I think you're representing
the club that way.
352
00:17:56,064 --> 00:17:58,964
You walk through an airport and you
see the blazer, you see that badge.
353
00:17:59,064 --> 00:18:02,164
There's Manchester United.
They're dressed right, you know?
354
00:18:02,264 --> 00:18:04,324
So the first time I witnessed that
355
00:18:04,424 --> 00:18:08,044
was going to Switzerland in a
tournament for the youth team.
356
00:18:08,144 --> 00:18:10,524
And we're all in our blazers
and we all got told,
357
00:18:10,624 --> 00:18:14,324
in no uncertain terms, that, "You're
representing Manchester United,
358
00:18:14,424 --> 00:18:15,684
"both on and off the pitch.
359
00:18:15,784 --> 00:18:18,844
"So I want you to make sure that you
behave yourself around the hotel
360
00:18:18,944 --> 00:18:20,604
"cos people'll be watching you."
361
00:18:20,704 --> 00:18:22,764
Your lesson, if you were back
in that classroom,
362
00:18:22,864 --> 00:18:25,004
is those little things matter...
Yeah, details.
363
00:18:25,104 --> 00:18:28,204
..just as much as the big things.
Yeah, absolutely. Details. Yeah.
364
00:18:28,304 --> 00:18:30,924
All points to the top
of the mountain, yeah.
365
00:18:31,024 --> 00:18:33,963
"Points to the top of the mountain."
Everything can contribute.
366
00:18:34,063 --> 00:18:36,523
Yeah, absolutely. Just like talking
to the laundry girls
367
00:18:36,623 --> 00:18:38,043
or the canteen staff. Yeah.
368
00:18:38,143 --> 00:18:40,723
Everything makes a difference.
They all matter.
369
00:18:40,823 --> 00:18:43,603
They all matter. A club like United,
they seriously matter.
370
00:18:43,703 --> 00:18:47,123
I want to show you a photograph
which might give you a thought
371
00:18:47,223 --> 00:18:49,083
about some of these issues, as well.
372
00:18:49,183 --> 00:18:52,003
Let's have a quick look.
See if you remember this photo.
373
00:18:52,103 --> 00:18:54,443
Remember those? God almighty...
374
00:18:54,543 --> 00:18:56,403
Why did they do that?
375
00:18:56,503 --> 00:19:01,243
When was that? That was
the '96 Cup Final at Wembley.
376
00:19:01,343 --> 00:19:03,963
I said to Brian Kidd, "1-0."
377
00:19:04,063 --> 00:19:06,523
Those aren't your players, of course,
those are Liverpool.
378
00:19:06,623 --> 00:19:07,803
Yeah, it's Liverpool, yeah.
379
00:19:07,903 --> 00:19:09,963
You turned to Brian Kidd,
your assistant...
380
00:19:10,063 --> 00:19:13,163
1-0. 1-0.
What, just because of this?
381
00:19:13,263 --> 00:19:14,363
Yeah.
382
00:19:14,463 --> 00:19:16,123
Because of that.
383
00:19:16,223 --> 00:19:17,843
I think that's...
384
00:19:17,943 --> 00:19:21,163
I don't know,
what would you call it?
385
00:19:21,263 --> 00:19:24,883
Arrogance or overconfidence or...
386
00:19:24,983 --> 00:19:26,563
I don't know. It was ridiculous.
387
00:19:26,663 --> 00:19:28,883
I think it was
absolutely ridiculous.
388
00:19:28,983 --> 00:19:33,043
Blue shirt, red and white tie
and a white suit and a blue flower.
389
00:19:33,143 --> 00:19:34,803
Who designed that?
390
00:19:34,903 --> 00:19:37,483
And they say it was Armani! Yeah?
391
00:19:37,583 --> 00:19:39,583
I bet you his sales went down.
392
00:19:40,703 --> 00:19:42,203
But I'm still working out
what it was.
393
00:19:42,303 --> 00:19:44,483
Was it cos they're not taking
the game seriously?
394
00:19:44,583 --> 00:19:46,003
Well...
395
00:19:46,103 --> 00:19:49,483
I mean, Jamie Redknapp's
got sunglasses on...
396
00:19:49,583 --> 00:19:52,963
But, you know,
the most telling part of it is
397
00:19:53,063 --> 00:19:56,763
Roy Evans and Ron Moran
had black suits on.
398
00:19:56,863 --> 00:19:58,603
I think they were embarrassed.
399
00:19:58,703 --> 00:20:01,923
Liverpool Football Club's
a great club with history.
400
00:20:02,023 --> 00:20:04,882
They've won the European Cup
more times than Manchester United.
401
00:20:04,982 --> 00:20:06,922
Between Manchester United
and Liverpool,
402
00:20:07,022 --> 00:20:09,282
they've won more trophies
than any club in Britain.
403
00:20:09,382 --> 00:20:11,442
That didn't represent Liverpool.
404
00:20:11,542 --> 00:20:13,722
James gets there just first.
405
00:20:13,822 --> 00:20:15,722
Cantona!
406
00:20:15,822 --> 00:20:20,442
There is to be a memorable end
to a poor cup final.
407
00:20:20,542 --> 00:20:22,002
The Liverpool episode at Wembley,
408
00:20:22,102 --> 00:20:25,002
where they were wearing the white
suits, he would use stuff like that.
409
00:20:25,102 --> 00:20:27,402
"Have you seen these lot?
You seen what they're wearing?
410
00:20:27,502 --> 00:20:29,042
"They think they've won it already."
411
00:20:29,142 --> 00:20:32,042
Stuff like that would get
into your heads that,
412
00:20:32,142 --> 00:20:34,322
"What do you mean they think
they've won it already?"
413
00:20:34,422 --> 00:20:37,762
Sir Alex had other ways of getting
into his players' heads,
414
00:20:37,862 --> 00:20:40,282
including what became known
as "the hairdryer",
415
00:20:40,382 --> 00:20:44,202
a term first coined by
United striker Mark Hughes.
416
00:20:44,302 --> 00:20:45,762
The hairdryer...
417
00:20:45,862 --> 00:20:48,442
LAUGHTER
418
00:20:48,542 --> 00:20:51,282
Erm, the hairdryer
obviously is a myth.
419
00:20:51,382 --> 00:20:53,682
LAUGHTER
420
00:20:53,782 --> 00:20:55,562
Let me just put that out there.
421
00:20:55,662 --> 00:20:58,282
But that apparently
was the treatment
422
00:20:58,382 --> 00:21:01,162
that underperforming players
received from Sir Alex.
423
00:21:01,262 --> 00:21:03,202
And basically he's standing
in close proximity
424
00:21:03,302 --> 00:21:05,602
and he's shouting so hard
that your hair goes like this.
425
00:21:05,702 --> 00:21:09,202
..and shout at you and
physically blow you out the room.
426
00:21:09,302 --> 00:21:11,362
LAUGHTER
427
00:21:11,462 --> 00:21:13,042
Can I show you a little video?
428
00:21:13,142 --> 00:21:17,022
Oh, dearie me.
Do you know what's coming? No.
429
00:21:22,742 --> 00:21:24,742
We're not lip reading.
430
00:21:26,662 --> 00:21:29,302
I wasn't well that day.
NICK LAUGHS
431
00:21:31,662 --> 00:21:33,322
If you were like that
on the touchline,
432
00:21:33,422 --> 00:21:35,442
I wonder what you were like
in the changing room?
433
00:21:35,542 --> 00:21:38,921
I always want to get it off
my chest, out of my system
434
00:21:39,021 --> 00:21:40,201
and kick on from there.
435
00:21:40,301 --> 00:21:43,081
What I said to them remained
in the dressing room.
436
00:21:43,181 --> 00:21:47,921
I could be really angry,
I could be volatile, I could be...
437
00:21:48,021 --> 00:21:49,641
But it was over.
438
00:21:49,741 --> 00:21:53,721
And the players knew that. They knew
that. I never brought it up again.
439
00:21:53,821 --> 00:21:56,401
I never held a grudge ever
in my life.
440
00:21:56,501 --> 00:21:59,321
And when you heard it was called
the hairdryer, did you think...?
441
00:21:59,421 --> 00:22:02,281
Honestly, I didn't like it
at the time. Honestly.
442
00:22:02,381 --> 00:22:05,161
I was a bit annoyed, you know?
But now...
443
00:22:05,261 --> 00:22:08,121
You have to... You have to...
You can smile.
444
00:22:08,221 --> 00:22:10,841
Put it in the comedy part, you know?
445
00:22:10,941 --> 00:22:12,961
We played Benfica away and got beat.
446
00:22:13,061 --> 00:22:15,961
We didn't play well and he was...
447
00:22:16,061 --> 00:22:18,201
he was shouting at me...
448
00:22:18,301 --> 00:22:20,721
and I thought I was one of our
best players on the day.
449
00:22:20,821 --> 00:22:22,961
And I was thinking,
"What are you shouting at?"
450
00:22:23,061 --> 00:22:25,401
So I started going back at him,
shouting back,
451
00:22:25,501 --> 00:22:28,001
and the problem is,
which I failed to learn quickly,
452
00:22:28,101 --> 00:22:29,641
is that the more you shout at him,
453
00:22:29,741 --> 00:22:32,001
the louder he gets
and the more aggressive he gets
454
00:22:32,101 --> 00:22:33,481
and the closer he gets to you.
455
00:22:33,581 --> 00:22:38,281
He had that skill of have you
got to put your arm around someone
456
00:22:38,381 --> 00:22:42,041
or have you got to lose your temper
to get the best out of them?
457
00:22:42,141 --> 00:22:44,361
I remember him having a go
at me at at half-time
458
00:22:44,461 --> 00:22:47,641
and I had the sort of attitude,
"Right, OK, I'll show him."
459
00:22:47,741 --> 00:22:49,881
And played well the second half.
460
00:22:49,981 --> 00:22:56,081
So then he quickly knew how I would
respond to him losing his temper.
461
00:22:56,181 --> 00:22:58,361
That followed me for
the next 20 years,
462
00:22:58,461 --> 00:22:59,881
so it was a big mistake early on.
463
00:22:59,981 --> 00:23:02,481
Giggsy sometimes would have
to do one thing wrong in a half.
464
00:23:02,581 --> 00:23:06,041
Half-time comes, he hammered...
He would hammer Giggsy.
465
00:23:06,141 --> 00:23:08,401
But that was to show
the other players
466
00:23:08,501 --> 00:23:10,640
no-one's exempt
from getting hammered
467
00:23:10,740 --> 00:23:12,000
and you better all fix up,
468
00:23:12,100 --> 00:23:13,920
cos I'll be coming for you
at full-time
469
00:23:14,020 --> 00:23:15,200
if you don't sort this out.
470
00:23:15,300 --> 00:23:22,520
I remember sometimes when we do
something bad or we lost some games,
471
00:23:22,620 --> 00:23:26,480
he'd kick the chairs and he'd kick
the boots, he'd kick everything,
472
00:23:26,580 --> 00:23:30,160
the waters, the drinks,
and he's so red
473
00:23:30,260 --> 00:23:33,040
and, "BLEEP! You should
pass the ball, you..."
474
00:23:33,140 --> 00:23:36,960
It's unbelievable, but it was good,
because we learn.
475
00:23:37,060 --> 00:23:39,040
The great thing
about the boss was that,
476
00:23:39,140 --> 00:23:40,720
the next day, it was forgotten.
477
00:23:40,820 --> 00:23:43,840
And you'd be walking towards him,
approaching him,
478
00:23:43,940 --> 00:23:46,560
the next day thinking,
"Is he going to have a go at me?"
479
00:23:46,660 --> 00:23:50,240
And he would just crack a joke or
he would talk about the next game.
480
00:23:50,340 --> 00:23:52,760
And how often was it
you were just generally furious,
481
00:23:52,860 --> 00:23:56,320
you got to tell people, and how often
was there a bit of calculation?
482
00:23:56,420 --> 00:23:57,440
A little bit of...
483
00:23:57,540 --> 00:24:00,600
Sometimes I would lose my temper
when we would win.
484
00:24:00,700 --> 00:24:06,680
Now, the real reason for losing your
temper is because of expectation.
485
00:24:06,780 --> 00:24:09,760
I could never visualise us
losing a game.
486
00:24:09,860 --> 00:24:12,880
You know, by the time
I picked my team,
487
00:24:12,980 --> 00:24:15,680
done the tactics, had my team talk,
488
00:24:15,780 --> 00:24:18,000
I was confident
we'd always win the game.
489
00:24:18,100 --> 00:24:21,400
But of course you don't
win every game, that's a fact.
490
00:24:21,500 --> 00:24:24,280
But when they drop
below their expectation,
491
00:24:24,380 --> 00:24:26,760
that annoyed me the most, you know?
492
00:24:26,860 --> 00:24:30,280
No player was too big to be
spared the hairdryer -
493
00:24:30,380 --> 00:24:32,600
Ince, van Nistelrooy, Beckham,
494
00:24:32,700 --> 00:24:35,560
following that famous bust-up
with a flying boot.
495
00:24:35,660 --> 00:24:39,040
No player,
except perhaps Eric Cantona,
496
00:24:39,140 --> 00:24:43,119
United's iconic French superstar,
who got very different treatment,
497
00:24:43,219 --> 00:24:47,039
even after a spectacular lapse
in discipline.
498
00:24:47,139 --> 00:24:50,359
I want you to take you back a moment,
I suspect, is hard for you,
499
00:24:50,459 --> 00:24:53,259
let alone anybody else, to forget.
Let's just take a look.
500
00:24:55,099 --> 00:24:57,119
Oh, yeah.
501
00:24:57,219 --> 00:24:58,439
Did you see that?
502
00:24:58,539 --> 00:25:00,079
I didn't see it at all.
503
00:25:00,179 --> 00:25:02,039
I was looking at the pitch.
504
00:25:02,139 --> 00:25:04,919
But, Jesus, you know,
when you see what he's done.
505
00:25:05,019 --> 00:25:08,639
It was a problem for the club,
because it got such headlines,
506
00:25:08,739 --> 00:25:10,279
it was front page,
507
00:25:10,379 --> 00:25:15,159
and we decided to have a meeting
at Alderley Edge the next night.
508
00:25:15,259 --> 00:25:18,199
On our way, I get a phone call
from Ritchie Greenbury,
509
00:25:18,299 --> 00:25:21,759
the chairman of Marks & Spencer
at the time, Richard.
510
00:25:21,859 --> 00:25:24,279
And a big United fan?
Big United fan.
511
00:25:24,379 --> 00:25:27,719
He says,
"Well, don't let Cantona go.
512
00:25:27,819 --> 00:25:30,479
"He'll give you
great moments of joy."
513
00:25:30,579 --> 00:25:31,759
And I said, "I know that."
514
00:25:31,859 --> 00:25:34,279
But, you know,
there was the mood of the board,
515
00:25:34,379 --> 00:25:37,959
so I had to fight the case,
"Look, we must keep him.
516
00:25:38,059 --> 00:25:42,719
"We can't let him go.
We can't give in to the mob."
517
00:25:42,819 --> 00:25:47,839
And we decided to suspend him
for four months.
518
00:25:47,939 --> 00:25:51,799
And the FA were, at the time,
were happy with it,
519
00:25:51,899 --> 00:25:54,439
but somehow they added to it.
520
00:25:54,539 --> 00:25:57,159
NEWSREEL: Ahead of Cantona, then,
seven months of training.
521
00:25:57,259 --> 00:25:59,279
Dull, laborious, unfulfilling.
522
00:25:59,379 --> 00:26:03,919
Expediency may yet mean that with
regret club and player part company.
523
00:26:04,019 --> 00:26:06,079
But, as the great disciplinarian,
524
00:26:06,179 --> 00:26:10,759
wasn't your first instinct to think,
"He's blown it. He's a great player.
525
00:26:10,859 --> 00:26:13,619
"I get on with him,
but that's too much"? Yeah.
526
00:26:15,259 --> 00:26:16,278
Well, he had never...
527
00:26:16,378 --> 00:26:20,518
He had never given us any indication
that explosion was there.
528
00:26:20,618 --> 00:26:24,318
But I decided to approach it
this way -
529
00:26:24,418 --> 00:26:26,518
I would speak to him every day.
530
00:26:26,618 --> 00:26:29,158
And I would talk to him
about football all the time
531
00:26:29,258 --> 00:26:31,278
and he loved it, you know?
532
00:26:31,378 --> 00:26:35,298
And that's why all the players
say he was my prodigal son.
533
00:26:36,978 --> 00:26:39,198
But I think he needed
different attention.
534
00:26:39,298 --> 00:26:42,198
He needed different ways
of dealing with him.
535
00:26:42,298 --> 00:26:44,758
He was a different guy
from everyone else.
536
00:26:44,858 --> 00:26:46,278
He's an amazing human being.
537
00:26:46,378 --> 00:26:48,998
But when you saw that image of him
kicking a spectator,
538
00:26:49,098 --> 00:26:51,078
wasn't there a bit of you
that thought,
539
00:26:51,178 --> 00:26:53,918
"That's exactly the ill discipline
that has to stop at this club.
540
00:26:54,018 --> 00:26:55,878
"I've got to get rid"?
541
00:26:55,978 --> 00:26:58,158
No, there was
something in me that said,
542
00:26:58,258 --> 00:27:01,878
"I need to do something about him.
I need to stand by him."
543
00:27:01,978 --> 00:27:05,898
Because the world was after him
and it was a bit like...
544
00:27:07,338 --> 00:27:09,638
..no-one was there to help him.
545
00:27:09,738 --> 00:27:12,998
And I said, "Well, it'll have
to be me, cos I'm his manager."
546
00:27:13,098 --> 00:27:16,798
I think the thing that amazed me,
and used to frustrate me at times,
547
00:27:16,898 --> 00:27:18,358
was his man management.
548
00:27:18,458 --> 00:27:21,078
I'd never seen him have a go
at Eric Cantona, for example.
549
00:27:21,178 --> 00:27:22,798
Some of the players
would resent that,
550
00:27:22,898 --> 00:27:25,358
"Why's he not having a go at
Cantona? He's missed a penalty."
551
00:27:25,458 --> 00:27:28,038
Or "Why's he not having a go at
Cantona? He had an awful game."
552
00:27:28,138 --> 00:27:30,518
The manager knew, in the long run,
that he would come good,
553
00:27:30,618 --> 00:27:33,078
that he would produce the goods
at the right time.
554
00:27:33,178 --> 00:27:35,798
Yeah, his man management
was second to none.
555
00:27:35,898 --> 00:27:37,718
To have all his honesty
556
00:27:37,818 --> 00:27:42,438
that allows him
to be father, friend,
557
00:27:42,538 --> 00:27:44,998
brother of a player.
558
00:27:45,098 --> 00:27:49,917
Enemy of a player. But enemy...
559
00:27:50,017 --> 00:27:52,557
for a few...a few seconds.
560
00:27:52,657 --> 00:27:55,757
But then the brother comes again
or the old brother or the father.
561
00:27:55,857 --> 00:27:57,797
These human qualities...
562
00:27:57,897 --> 00:28:00,797
are absolutely crucial
to be a great leader.
563
00:28:00,897 --> 00:28:06,117
The fabulous leader
is a very rare individual
564
00:28:06,217 --> 00:28:10,357
and that person is capable of
565
00:28:10,457 --> 00:28:15,517
making an organisation do things,
making the people,
566
00:28:15,617 --> 00:28:17,997
persuading, cajoling, nudging,
567
00:28:18,097 --> 00:28:21,837
caressing, sometimes,
the people inside an organisation
568
00:28:21,937 --> 00:28:25,837
to do something that they weren't,
didn't think they were capable of.
569
00:28:25,937 --> 00:28:27,877
What we have here essentially
is a case
570
00:28:27,977 --> 00:28:31,677
that is about how one person is
very effective at managing teams.
571
00:28:31,777 --> 00:28:34,317
That's not enough, though,
for a leader.
572
00:28:34,417 --> 00:28:37,117
They also need to know
how to cull their teams,
573
00:28:37,217 --> 00:28:39,077
how to be ruthless.
574
00:28:39,177 --> 00:28:40,677
Yes, over here.
575
00:28:40,777 --> 00:28:43,997
When they had big players and they
had the youth team coming through,
576
00:28:44,097 --> 00:28:46,957
the confidence to effect the change,
sell the big players
577
00:28:47,057 --> 00:28:49,477
and go with the youth players.
578
00:28:49,577 --> 00:28:51,837
A good leader has to
make tough decisions,
579
00:28:51,937 --> 00:28:54,757
that's why he or she is a leader.
580
00:28:54,857 --> 00:28:58,037
And sometimes there are things
which are not very nice.
581
00:28:58,137 --> 00:29:03,357
Erm, you have to lay off a whole
group of people, for example.
582
00:29:03,457 --> 00:29:06,717
200, 300 people,
close down a factory.
583
00:29:06,817 --> 00:29:08,077
In some cases,
584
00:29:08,177 --> 00:29:12,237
you may have to release
a very highly paid individual,
585
00:29:12,337 --> 00:29:16,717
but you have to do it. It's part
and parcel of being a leader.
586
00:29:16,817 --> 00:29:20,037
As you go through your career,
you've got to rebuild the team.
587
00:29:20,137 --> 00:29:21,476
You have to be ruthless.
588
00:29:21,576 --> 00:29:24,916
It's the hard part for you,
because they do become like family,
589
00:29:25,016 --> 00:29:28,676
you know,
and the great squad of '94,
590
00:29:28,776 --> 00:29:32,196
the Cantonas and the Inces
and Robson
591
00:29:32,296 --> 00:29:35,756
and these players,
Bruce, they get older.
592
00:29:35,856 --> 00:29:40,036
And the horrible thing is the
evidence is on the football field,
593
00:29:40,136 --> 00:29:41,356
and you can't avoid that.
594
00:29:41,456 --> 00:29:43,636
Some of these issues
were played out in the press,
595
00:29:43,736 --> 00:29:47,116
but he wasn't afraid to make
the decision which he thought
596
00:29:47,216 --> 00:29:50,276
was for the long-term or
medium-term benefit of the team.
597
00:29:50,376 --> 00:29:53,836
And I think that ability to be
ruthless is no bad thing,
598
00:29:53,936 --> 00:29:56,436
but, at the same time,
I think he did have compassion
599
00:29:56,536 --> 00:29:59,356
and I don't think he necessarily
found all these decisions easy.
600
00:29:59,456 --> 00:30:02,996
And it wasn't just players
past their peak who were shown
601
00:30:03,096 --> 00:30:05,276
the red card by Ferguson.
602
00:30:05,376 --> 00:30:07,236
The scenario with Roy Keane -
603
00:30:07,336 --> 00:30:09,996
there was a video
that he'd done for MUTV
604
00:30:10,096 --> 00:30:11,556
that the club didn't want to go out.
605
00:30:11,656 --> 00:30:13,436
The manager thought
that it wasn't right,
606
00:30:13,536 --> 00:30:15,516
it was disrespectful, et cetera,
to the team.
607
00:30:15,616 --> 00:30:18,796
The next day, he told the players
that Roy Keane would never come
608
00:30:18,896 --> 00:30:20,596
back to Man United again.
609
00:30:20,696 --> 00:30:22,716
He was captain of Man United.
610
00:30:22,816 --> 00:30:26,996
'Roy Keane lifts the trophy
for Manchester United.'
611
00:30:27,096 --> 00:30:30,476
Best player probably Man United
had for a long period of time.
612
00:30:30,576 --> 00:30:32,036
That was for the next generation.
613
00:30:32,136 --> 00:30:34,756
"Don't think you're ever bigger
than this club, cos you're not.
614
00:30:34,856 --> 00:30:35,876
"Cos you'll go.
615
00:30:35,976 --> 00:30:38,476
"I've just told the captain
he's never coming back again.
616
00:30:38,576 --> 00:30:40,156
"What are you going to do now?"
617
00:30:40,256 --> 00:30:42,556
Hey, this is ridiculous!
618
00:30:42,656 --> 00:30:44,356
LAUGHTER
619
00:30:44,456 --> 00:30:47,836
How do you handle a particularly
difficult member of the team?
620
00:30:47,936 --> 00:30:50,996
That was a question
which haunted a new Prime Minister
621
00:30:51,096 --> 00:30:53,415
who turned to Sir Alex for advice.
622
00:30:54,455 --> 00:30:56,115
We would talk about man management
623
00:30:56,215 --> 00:30:59,475
and I would say, "Look, such and
such an individual is, you know...
624
00:30:59,575 --> 00:31:02,315
"He might be really brilliant
but he's very, very tough.
625
00:31:02,415 --> 00:31:05,275
"I don't know quite
what to do about it."
626
00:31:05,375 --> 00:31:07,875
Of course, Alex, cos this is
how he would run his soccer teams,
627
00:31:07,975 --> 00:31:09,515
said "Get rid of him".
628
00:31:09,615 --> 00:31:11,875
And I'd say,
"Well, it's all very well, Alex,
629
00:31:11,975 --> 00:31:14,275
"but how would you be
if you got rid of a player
630
00:31:14,375 --> 00:31:16,755
"but still found them in the
dressing room every day?"
631
00:31:16,855 --> 00:31:19,115
And he said, "Now that would
be a problem," he said.
632
00:31:19,215 --> 00:31:20,755
"That would definitely be
a problem."
633
00:31:20,855 --> 00:31:22,715
I said to him,
"You have to keep your control."
634
00:31:22,815 --> 00:31:24,715
I don't know who he
was talking about at the time
635
00:31:24,815 --> 00:31:26,315
but you have to keep control.
636
00:31:26,415 --> 00:31:28,795
"You're the Prime Minister.
You have to have control."
637
00:31:28,895 --> 00:31:31,195
You must have guessed
he was talking about Gordon Brown.
638
00:31:31,295 --> 00:31:33,195
I didn't know, actually.
639
00:31:33,295 --> 00:31:36,555
And I don't think anyone knew
till later on
640
00:31:36,655 --> 00:31:40,475
that there was some sort of...there
was some feeling between the two.
641
00:31:40,575 --> 00:31:41,635
He said to you,
642
00:31:41,735 --> 00:31:44,995
"What do you do with a player
who won't accept the discipline?"
643
00:31:45,095 --> 00:31:46,875
And you said, "Get him out".
644
00:31:46,975 --> 00:31:51,155
If they are affecting the control
of you or they're disrupting
645
00:31:51,255 --> 00:31:54,395
the dressing room, you have to
make the decision - is it worth it?
646
00:31:54,495 --> 00:31:56,835
We weren't actually talking
about an individual
647
00:31:56,935 --> 00:31:58,715
but a hypothetical case, as it were.
648
00:31:58,815 --> 00:32:01,715
But, yeah,
his attitude was it doesn't matter
649
00:32:01,815 --> 00:32:05,675
if he's your best player, if he's
difficult, put him out of the room.
650
00:32:05,775 --> 00:32:09,895
But even Sir Alex sometimes lived to
regret his decisions about players.
651
00:32:10,975 --> 00:32:14,035
I always thought I was brave
enough to make decisions,
652
00:32:14,135 --> 00:32:15,675
maybe sometimes wrong.
653
00:32:15,775 --> 00:32:19,575
I made a wrong decision with
Jaap Stam. That was a mistake.
654
00:32:20,735 --> 00:32:23,435
One decision we've talked
about quite a bit is the decision
655
00:32:23,535 --> 00:32:26,554
to let Jaap Stam
go to an Italian club
656
00:32:26,654 --> 00:32:31,114
and I think it was based
on his belief
657
00:32:31,214 --> 00:32:33,674
that maybe Jaap Stam would
not come back from his injury.
658
00:32:33,774 --> 00:32:36,274
It's a decision he regrets,
because Jaap Stam went on to
659
00:32:36,374 --> 00:32:38,994
play for six seasons
at a very, very high level.
660
00:32:39,094 --> 00:32:42,274
He played two European cup finals.
It was a good decision, wasn't it?
661
00:32:42,374 --> 00:32:44,374
LAUGHTER
662
00:32:45,534 --> 00:32:47,674
Changing the team only works,
of course,
663
00:32:47,774 --> 00:32:52,354
if the people who replace those
who are let go, the next generation,
664
00:32:52,454 --> 00:32:53,754
prove to be better.
665
00:32:53,854 --> 00:32:55,434
You're mentioning youth players.
666
00:32:55,534 --> 00:32:57,634
What is characteristic
of the Ferguson brand
667
00:32:57,734 --> 00:32:58,914
when it comes to youth? Yes?
668
00:32:59,014 --> 00:33:00,954
I think it's kind
of giving them a lot of,
669
00:33:01,054 --> 00:33:05,074
a lot of chance to kind of shine
and grow as a team. Right.
670
00:33:05,174 --> 00:33:09,074
MORITZ: 'No structure is going
to remain standing
671
00:33:09,174 --> 00:33:11,234
'unless it's built
on a firm foundation,
672
00:33:11,334 --> 00:33:13,234
'so, for United,
673
00:33:13,334 --> 00:33:16,834
'this meant above all developing'
674
00:33:16,934 --> 00:33:20,794
a pipeline of young players,
675
00:33:20,894 --> 00:33:25,234
um, who, when they were signed,
weren't very well-known,
676
00:33:25,334 --> 00:33:30,114
or when they were purchased,
were, in many instances,
677
00:33:30,214 --> 00:33:33,394
affordable and cheap purchases.
678
00:33:33,494 --> 00:33:36,714
Building a team around
a new generation of talented kids
679
00:33:36,814 --> 00:33:41,354
may look a safe bet now.
At the time, it was a risky gamble.
680
00:33:41,454 --> 00:33:46,434
So let's take a look at what became
known as the Class of '92.
681
00:33:46,534 --> 00:33:50,954
OK. Look at Scholesy. You'd think
he's just out of nursery!
682
00:33:51,054 --> 00:33:54,554
Well, they weren't.
What ages were they there?
683
00:33:54,654 --> 00:33:57,954
They would be 17.
Giggs would be maybe 18.
684
00:33:58,054 --> 00:34:01,753
And some people look at that group
and say, "It was a one-off".
685
00:34:01,853 --> 00:34:03,313
You were a very lucky man.
686
00:34:03,413 --> 00:34:06,993
It is not unreasonable to say that
but I have to say this.
687
00:34:07,093 --> 00:34:11,033
We were scouting and trialling and
coaching the best in the country.
688
00:34:11,133 --> 00:34:12,633
I'm sure of that.
689
00:34:12,733 --> 00:34:16,993
We were obviously characters and we
were in the mind-set that once
690
00:34:17,093 --> 00:34:20,353
we get in this team,
we're not going out of it.
691
00:34:20,453 --> 00:34:23,393
We were lucky in the fact that
we had a manager who was willing
692
00:34:23,493 --> 00:34:28,013
to give us a chance and was willing
to gamble, really, on youth.
693
00:34:29,173 --> 00:34:33,013
And remember this,
some thought it wouldn't pay off.
694
00:34:34,413 --> 00:34:35,713
Brilliantly done!
695
00:34:35,813 --> 00:34:39,553
The trick is always buy when you're
strong. So he needs to buy players.
696
00:34:39,653 --> 00:34:41,073
You can't win anything with kids.
697
00:34:41,173 --> 00:34:44,513
Alan Hansen, of course,
told you you'd win nothing with kids.
698
00:34:44,613 --> 00:34:47,673
Well, you can't win anything
without them.
699
00:34:47,773 --> 00:34:52,193
The secret was the development of
the character that feared nothing,
700
00:34:52,293 --> 00:34:55,753
so coming to the first team with me,
it was a cakewalk for them.
701
00:34:55,853 --> 00:34:59,353
They just sailed through it,
absolutely no problem.
702
00:34:59,453 --> 00:35:02,473
These young lads were old heads
on young shoulders.
703
00:35:02,573 --> 00:35:04,473
We worked hard to get there.
704
00:35:04,573 --> 00:35:07,793
We worked hard, but, yeah,
with the right material...
705
00:35:07,893 --> 00:35:10,713
The first time I played,
I came on as a substitute and, yeah,
706
00:35:10,813 --> 00:35:12,833
I can remember
the manager's last words -
707
00:35:12,933 --> 00:35:14,513
"Just go out and enjoy yourself."
708
00:35:14,613 --> 00:35:18,273
Um, you're thinking,
"What do you mean, enjoy myself?
709
00:35:18,373 --> 00:35:20,313
"Um, I'm going out to play...
710
00:35:20,413 --> 00:35:23,393
"You know, I'm going out to play
in front of 40-odd thousand
711
00:35:23,493 --> 00:35:25,473
"and I'm 17
712
00:35:25,573 --> 00:35:28,153
"and um, I'll try and enjoy it
but I don't think I will!"
713
00:35:28,253 --> 00:35:33,352
But, um, he always said that
and, um, like I say, instantly,
714
00:35:33,452 --> 00:35:34,832
you just felt relaxed.
715
00:35:34,932 --> 00:35:38,912
That's part of man management and
not putting too much pressure on me.
716
00:35:39,012 --> 00:35:41,672
But also knowing
what I was capable of.
717
00:35:41,772 --> 00:35:45,552
And did you think of yourself,
almost as a father figure to them?
718
00:35:45,652 --> 00:35:48,712
That you were teaching them
how to grow up,
719
00:35:48,812 --> 00:35:51,272
how to behave in the way
that your father taught you?
720
00:35:51,372 --> 00:35:55,872
I think that the character-building
does apply itself that way.
721
00:35:55,972 --> 00:35:59,432
And there are some instances
where players would come to me
722
00:35:59,532 --> 00:36:02,432
with personal problems, knowing
it would never go out the door,
723
00:36:02,532 --> 00:36:04,872
knowing they could trust me
to help them
724
00:36:04,972 --> 00:36:07,832
and I was proud that the players
would trust me in that way.
725
00:36:07,932 --> 00:36:12,472
It was when my daddy
was sick in London.
726
00:36:12,572 --> 00:36:14,992
And he was in hospital, very bad.
727
00:36:15,092 --> 00:36:16,832
HE SPEAKS OWN LANGUAGE
728
00:36:16,932 --> 00:36:18,032
INTERPRETER: Coma.
729
00:36:18,132 --> 00:36:20,032
In coma. In a coma?
730
00:36:20,132 --> 00:36:22,432
And I had a conversation with him,
731
00:36:22,532 --> 00:36:25,872
and I say, "Boss, I want to...
I don't feel good."
732
00:36:25,972 --> 00:36:28,912
And we had...we are in a...
733
00:36:29,012 --> 00:36:32,432
a key moment in the league,
in the Champions League, but I said,
734
00:36:32,532 --> 00:36:34,632
"I don't feel good,
I want to see my dad."
735
00:36:34,732 --> 00:36:36,632
"Cristiano,
if you want to go one day,
736
00:36:36,732 --> 00:36:39,552
"two days, one week, you can go.
I'm going to miss you.
737
00:36:39,652 --> 00:36:42,632
"I'll miss you here, because
you know that you are important,
738
00:36:42,732 --> 00:36:45,432
"but your daddy
is in the first place."
739
00:36:45,532 --> 00:36:49,112
When he told me that, I feel like
"This guy is unbelievable."
740
00:36:49,212 --> 00:36:51,112
He was the father of football
for me.
741
00:36:51,212 --> 00:36:55,152
'Cristiano Ronaldo with a shot and
Ronaldo finds the back of the net.
742
00:36:55,252 --> 00:36:56,832
'It's a stunning goal.'
743
00:36:56,932 --> 00:36:59,352
He knew what he had under his bonnet
with Cristiano as well.
744
00:36:59,452 --> 00:37:01,352
He knew he had the potential
to be a world star,
745
00:37:01,452 --> 00:37:02,552
best player on the planet.
746
00:37:02,652 --> 00:37:04,951
And he knew there were
certain aspects of his life
747
00:37:05,051 --> 00:37:07,071
that he needed to take care of
and help him with,
748
00:37:07,171 --> 00:37:09,111
and I think you see that
in the way Cristiano
749
00:37:09,211 --> 00:37:13,231
speaks about the manager now, even
after all these years have gone by.
750
00:37:13,331 --> 00:37:17,071
He refers to him as his father
in football, which is testament,
751
00:37:17,171 --> 00:37:20,831
really, to the way
the manager dealt with him.
752
00:37:20,931 --> 00:37:22,311
Is that power?
753
00:37:22,411 --> 00:37:25,151
Yes, you have all the power. Yeah.
754
00:37:25,251 --> 00:37:26,471
Right, a bit of advice.
755
00:37:26,571 --> 00:37:29,671
I don't think power is
very important. I really don't.
756
00:37:29,771 --> 00:37:32,711
I think the thing I was always after
was to make sure I kept my...
757
00:37:32,811 --> 00:37:33,911
My control.
758
00:37:34,011 --> 00:37:38,191
Ferguson imposed that control, not
just on the pitch, but off it too.
759
00:37:38,291 --> 00:37:39,871
When I first signed for United,
760
00:37:39,971 --> 00:37:42,071
I twisted my ankle
in my first-ever game,
761
00:37:42,171 --> 00:37:43,831
so I was out for about six weeks.
762
00:37:43,931 --> 00:37:45,871
So I got to know the city
a little bit better than
763
00:37:45,971 --> 00:37:47,791
I probably should have.
764
00:37:47,891 --> 00:37:50,591
And just as I got back to fitness,
I went out on the training pitch
765
00:37:50,691 --> 00:37:53,111
and I saw the manager was
just waiting there for the players
766
00:37:53,211 --> 00:37:55,431
to come out, and he said,
"Rio, let me talk to you, son,"
767
00:37:55,531 --> 00:37:58,271
I said, "All right, boss?" He said,
"How are you enjoying the city?
768
00:37:58,371 --> 00:38:00,711
"Is it all right? Have you
been out anywhere or anything?"
769
00:38:00,811 --> 00:38:03,071
I said, "Yeah, not been out,
to be honest with you, Boss,
770
00:38:03,171 --> 00:38:06,551
"I've just been to a couple of
restaurants and just taking it easy,
771
00:38:06,651 --> 00:38:09,071
"just chilling out, really."
He said, "Oh, good."
772
00:38:09,171 --> 00:38:11,671
He said, "Um, just make sure
we get off on the right foot.
773
00:38:11,771 --> 00:38:14,671
"Um, I know you've been
overindulging in the nightclubs,
774
00:38:14,771 --> 00:38:17,351
"going out here and there
and people tell me these things.
775
00:38:17,451 --> 00:38:19,911
"You can't hide none of this
from me. Just to make sure now
776
00:38:20,011 --> 00:38:22,551
"you know that I know
and it doesn't happen any more,
777
00:38:22,651 --> 00:38:25,031
"if you want to stay at this club
for a long time.
778
00:38:25,131 --> 00:38:26,231
"Go on. Go to train."
779
00:38:26,331 --> 00:38:27,991
I was like, "Oh, my God!"
780
00:38:28,091 --> 00:38:30,071
The only thing
I ever worried about was
781
00:38:30,171 --> 00:38:32,031
the control of Manchester United.
782
00:38:32,131 --> 00:38:34,831
The control of the players,
the dressing room.
783
00:38:34,931 --> 00:38:37,030
That is paramount to me.
784
00:38:37,130 --> 00:38:40,630
And I only worried
if I ever lost that control.
785
00:38:40,730 --> 00:38:42,830
He controlled everything, I think.
786
00:38:42,930 --> 00:38:46,950
The transfer policy, the decisions,
the players' contracts.
787
00:38:47,050 --> 00:38:51,830
The staff, I think
everything was in his hands.
788
00:38:51,930 --> 00:38:56,350
And I think
it's a fantastic way to do it,
789
00:38:56,450 --> 00:38:59,950
especially if you are surrounded
by good people,
790
00:39:00,050 --> 00:39:03,350
because when you say
you are in control,
791
00:39:03,450 --> 00:39:05,910
it doesn't mean
that you don't share.
792
00:39:06,010 --> 00:39:09,110
I think his belief is that in order
to lead a football team
793
00:39:09,210 --> 00:39:12,190
effectively, you have to be
the biggest personality.
794
00:39:12,290 --> 00:39:15,470
You can't have players
that are the bigger stars,
795
00:39:15,570 --> 00:39:17,630
that are the bigger egos
in the dressing room.
796
00:39:17,730 --> 00:39:20,270
This is probably also
the most controversial lesson
797
00:39:20,370 --> 00:39:21,990
and I am honestly not entirely sure
798
00:39:22,090 --> 00:39:25,150
whether we can translate this to
many other business settings and
799
00:39:25,250 --> 00:39:28,830
I think the business world nowadays,
if you as a manager come in
800
00:39:28,930 --> 00:39:32,190
and say, or as a CEO and say,
"I demand absolute control
801
00:39:32,290 --> 00:39:35,790
"and anyone who steps
out of my control, they're fired",
802
00:39:35,890 --> 00:39:37,470
that's a pretty harsh stance
803
00:39:37,570 --> 00:39:39,950
and it might not work very well
in the business climate
804
00:39:40,050 --> 00:39:41,270
that we have nowadays.
805
00:39:41,370 --> 00:39:45,030
I never thought about these guys as
star players. It never bothered me.
806
00:39:45,130 --> 00:39:48,990
And one thing
I did say to a star player,
807
00:39:49,090 --> 00:39:54,390
"Remember one thing. Your reputation
is always on the line on Saturday.
808
00:39:54,490 --> 00:39:56,630
"So the expectation is
bigger for you.
809
00:39:56,730 --> 00:39:59,750
"You have to show you've worked as
hard as all the rest of the players,
810
00:39:59,850 --> 00:40:02,350
"because that really
is a truly great player."
811
00:40:02,450 --> 00:40:05,270
Motivation,
teaching the value of teamwork,
812
00:40:05,370 --> 00:40:08,190
they were also crucial
to Ferguson's success,
813
00:40:08,290 --> 00:40:11,429
even if his methods
could be a little unusual.
814
00:40:11,529 --> 00:40:15,229
There was one photograph
you had on your office wall.
815
00:40:15,329 --> 00:40:18,089
Let's just take a look at it.
I want to know why you had it.
816
00:40:19,249 --> 00:40:23,749
There you are. Every year, I'd bring
the apprentices in to my office.
817
00:40:23,849 --> 00:40:25,469
One day, I says, "Right, tell me,
818
00:40:25,569 --> 00:40:27,569
"what do you think
of that photograph?"
819
00:40:28,729 --> 00:40:32,269
And they'd look at it and,
of course, they're all twitching,
820
00:40:32,369 --> 00:40:36,589
nervous, that I've set a trap.
And I said, "Well, there's 11 there.
821
00:40:36,689 --> 00:40:38,829
"There's 11 members of the team."
822
00:40:38,929 --> 00:40:45,309
I says, "They built the
Rockefeller Centre back in the '20s
823
00:40:45,409 --> 00:40:47,469
"and they lost lives.
824
00:40:47,569 --> 00:40:49,509
"One or two
would try to save them
825
00:40:49,609 --> 00:40:51,909
"and lost their lives through that."
I says,
826
00:40:52,009 --> 00:40:55,989
"There's no bigger sacrifice than
giving your life for a team."
827
00:40:56,089 --> 00:40:59,989
I remember he had this picture
of 11 guys sitting in the wind
828
00:41:00,089 --> 00:41:04,109
but without, er, how you say?
829
00:41:04,209 --> 00:41:05,629
No ropes for safety. Exactly.
830
00:41:05,729 --> 00:41:08,069
It quite surprised me
when I looked at the frame,
831
00:41:08,169 --> 00:41:10,189
I said,
"Wow! It's unbelievable frame,"
832
00:41:10,289 --> 00:41:13,789
and he say, "Cristiano,
this is what team should do it.
833
00:41:13,889 --> 00:41:17,469
"We should be together, we should
work together, we should do it...
834
00:41:17,569 --> 00:41:20,469
"Everything together,
if you want to win something,"
835
00:41:20,569 --> 00:41:22,549
and he gave the example
all the time
836
00:41:22,649 --> 00:41:27,509
because it was 11 guys
in that picture, so it was...
837
00:41:27,609 --> 00:41:28,829
Fantastic memory.
838
00:41:28,929 --> 00:41:32,309
I remember right now in my eyes,
839
00:41:32,409 --> 00:41:36,509
I remember his office
and this frame.
840
00:41:36,609 --> 00:41:39,869
There was another image you used
to use quite a bit, I think.
841
00:41:39,969 --> 00:41:44,388
Oh, yeah. Geese. Yeah.
842
00:41:44,488 --> 00:41:46,668
It's a fantastic story.
843
00:41:46,768 --> 00:41:52,068
It's how they fly 4,000 miles
from Canada to some warm climate.
844
00:41:52,168 --> 00:41:53,668
They go in two Vs.
845
00:41:53,768 --> 00:41:57,308
And the ones at the front do most of
the flying, then they change over,
846
00:41:57,408 --> 00:42:01,668
and if one goes away,
another two have to look after it.
847
00:42:01,768 --> 00:42:05,308
The birds overhead flying and it
would be in the middle of training.
848
00:42:05,408 --> 00:42:06,708
He'd stop the training, he'd go,
849
00:42:06,808 --> 00:42:08,868
"Right, look. All look.
Have a look up to the sky."
850
00:42:08,968 --> 00:42:11,108
So we'd be all looking up
at the sky, "See them birds."
851
00:42:11,208 --> 00:42:15,108
And they all went like an arrow
formation. "That's teamwork."
852
00:42:15,208 --> 00:42:18,388
You can just imagine 22 players
or 20-odd players just looking
853
00:42:18,488 --> 00:42:21,068
up at the sky, thinking,
"What's he going on about?"
854
00:42:21,168 --> 00:42:28,068
And I'd say to them, "These geese
fly 4,000 miles to get a bit of sun.
855
00:42:28,168 --> 00:42:31,588
"All I'm asking you to do is
play 38 games to win the league.
856
00:42:31,688 --> 00:42:33,708
"I don't think I'm asking too much."
857
00:42:33,808 --> 00:42:38,748
Other teams in other sports wanted
one of Fergie's inspirational talks,
858
00:42:38,848 --> 00:42:42,468
so when Europe was fighting
to retain the Ryder Cup,
859
00:42:42,568 --> 00:42:45,228
the captain called in Sir Alex.
860
00:42:45,328 --> 00:42:46,908
I was never one of the superstars,
861
00:42:47,008 --> 00:42:50,308
so dealing with the likes of
Rory McIlroy and how he was going
862
00:42:50,408 --> 00:42:52,868
to feel in that situation was
something that was alien to me
863
00:42:52,968 --> 00:42:56,268
and he was the one that I thought
could really help me with that,
864
00:42:56,368 --> 00:42:58,308
so, and I looked around,
I thought, you know,
865
00:42:58,408 --> 00:43:01,828
"There's a guy that really got it
right, in terms of success."
866
00:43:01,928 --> 00:43:05,628
Paul had spoke to me
a year before the tournament
867
00:43:05,728 --> 00:43:08,748
and asked if I'd like
to contribute with the team.
868
00:43:08,848 --> 00:43:11,388
So I did it,
had a motivational talk with them.
869
00:43:11,488 --> 00:43:13,787
He spoke to the caddies
before he came up to the players,
870
00:43:13,887 --> 00:43:16,187
which was great, and that was
a lot of fun for the caddies
871
00:43:16,287 --> 00:43:17,827
and it made them very much included,
872
00:43:17,927 --> 00:43:20,027
because the caddies were
a huge part of what we did.
873
00:43:20,127 --> 00:43:23,027
The caddies. Goodness me,
that was fantastic.
874
00:43:23,127 --> 00:43:27,707
There was a caddie called
Billy Forster, big Leeds United fan,
875
00:43:27,807 --> 00:43:29,787
and he gave me stick.
876
00:43:29,887 --> 00:43:33,947
He says,
"You got Cantona for nothing!"
877
00:43:34,047 --> 00:43:36,907
As we were listening to the speech,
I could hear the laughter
878
00:43:37,007 --> 00:43:39,707
coming from the caddies' room
and the players didn't know but
879
00:43:39,807 --> 00:43:43,027
I could hear the laughter, so I knew
things were going well done there.
880
00:43:43,127 --> 00:43:47,507
So when he came in, first of all,
he knew everybody's name
881
00:43:47,607 --> 00:43:50,547
and addressed everybody personally.
882
00:43:50,647 --> 00:43:54,107
Sir Alex told the Ryder Cup team
the story that had worked
883
00:43:54,207 --> 00:43:56,307
so well at Old Trafford.
884
00:43:56,407 --> 00:43:59,867
I did the bit about the geese. And
I think that was an important one.
885
00:43:59,967 --> 00:44:03,307
The Ryder Cup team, although they
were favourites, it wasn't going
886
00:44:03,407 --> 00:44:07,747
to win them the tournament, cos
the work ethic, the concentration.
887
00:44:07,847 --> 00:44:10,387
They've got the talent,
it's the 12 best golfers in Europe
888
00:44:10,487 --> 00:44:12,307
without question.
889
00:44:12,407 --> 00:44:14,227
And they just need to focus
on the things
890
00:44:14,327 --> 00:44:15,987
that are going to matter
in the game.
891
00:44:16,087 --> 00:44:20,667
And that became a kind
of a something that we, as a team,
892
00:44:20,767 --> 00:44:24,707
mentioned a number of times
during the week. And it was...
893
00:44:24,807 --> 00:44:27,227
It was a phrase that we used,
"remember the geese".
894
00:44:27,327 --> 00:44:29,947
And the ironic thing about it is,
when we won
895
00:44:30,047 --> 00:44:33,387
and we were getting our photograph
taken, this perfect V of geese
896
00:44:33,487 --> 00:44:37,067
flew right over their heads and
over the club house right behind.
897
00:44:37,167 --> 00:44:40,627
I never changed as a human being,
as my style of management,
898
00:44:40,727 --> 00:44:44,547
my decision-making, my discipline -
never changed that.
899
00:44:44,647 --> 00:44:48,066
But I was always looking to change
to make things better.
900
00:44:48,166 --> 00:44:51,546
Leadership is actually a balance
of listening, learning and leading.
901
00:44:51,646 --> 00:44:52,986
You know, you have to listen
902
00:44:53,086 --> 00:44:55,346
and absorb what are the lessons
going on out there.
903
00:44:55,446 --> 00:44:58,226
You have to be prepared
to learn those lessons
904
00:44:58,326 --> 00:45:01,186
and look at what the trends are
and what the changes are that
905
00:45:01,286 --> 00:45:04,826
are happening in your country, in
your society, in your profession and
906
00:45:04,926 --> 00:45:09,026
then you have to be prepared at
the end to take control and to lead.
907
00:45:09,126 --> 00:45:12,546
Tony Blair says that leadership
is a balance of listening,
908
00:45:12,646 --> 00:45:14,266
learning and leading.
909
00:45:14,366 --> 00:45:16,426
Is that a good summary?
910
00:45:16,526 --> 00:45:21,106
Yeah, I think these are accurate
statements, no doubt about that.
911
00:45:21,206 --> 00:45:24,146
And you went
to different places to learn.
912
00:45:24,246 --> 00:45:26,146
You went to the SAS on one occasion.
913
00:45:26,246 --> 00:45:28,426
Years ago,
I took the team down there for a day
914
00:45:28,526 --> 00:45:30,306
and we stayed overnight.
915
00:45:30,406 --> 00:45:34,626
It was fantastic, because
you're speaking to a body of men
916
00:45:34,726 --> 00:45:39,266
where the concentration levels
have to be 100% all the time.
917
00:45:39,366 --> 00:45:42,186
So I was impressed with
what I saw down there.
918
00:45:42,286 --> 00:45:44,746
Did the players identify with them,
or did they just...
919
00:45:44,846 --> 00:45:48,426
Oh, they loved it. ..look at them
as if they were a different world?
They loved it.
920
00:45:48,526 --> 00:45:51,026
I'll always remember,
they took us into the hostage room
921
00:45:51,126 --> 00:45:55,066
and they put four players
with their heads down on the table
922
00:45:55,166 --> 00:45:59,386
and all the rest of the players
were behind the rope, you know.
923
00:45:59,486 --> 00:46:01,706
They just pulled me out.
Me, Paul Ince.
924
00:46:01,806 --> 00:46:05,546
There's cardboard cutouts
and...we're the hostages.
925
00:46:05,646 --> 00:46:10,226
The cardboard cutouts are the people
holding us hostage.
926
00:46:10,326 --> 00:46:13,346
So we were just sat there
at the table - next minute,
927
00:46:13,446 --> 00:46:14,786
the lights just went off.
928
00:46:14,886 --> 00:46:18,186
We heard, "Get down! Get down!"
Which we instantly did.
929
00:46:18,286 --> 00:46:23,105
And all of a sudden,
a smoke bomb comes in.
930
00:46:23,205 --> 00:46:27,985
Everything goes dark and within
seconds, bang! Bang! Bang! Bang!
931
00:46:28,085 --> 00:46:32,465
A couple of bullet sounds and then
the lights come on and right
932
00:46:32,565 --> 00:46:38,065
next to us was four or five
soldiers, SAS gear, night goggles.
933
00:46:38,165 --> 00:46:42,265
I saw one of the soldiers with
a gun against Paul Ince's head
934
00:46:42,365 --> 00:46:44,345
and Incy, I tell you...
HE LAUGHS
935
00:46:44,445 --> 00:46:47,225
What did Incy do?
He went, "Aaaaargh!"
936
00:46:47,325 --> 00:46:51,465
He absolutely, honestly,
he nearly died. It was brilliant.
937
00:46:51,565 --> 00:46:53,025
Yeah, it was a great experience.
938
00:46:53,125 --> 00:46:57,185
Great experience
and one that we never forgot.
939
00:46:57,285 --> 00:46:58,665
GUNFIRE
940
00:46:58,765 --> 00:47:04,225
What I hope Sir Alex and his team
would have seen and appreciated
941
00:47:04,325 --> 00:47:09,825
was a very high degree of
professional skill and ability,
942
00:47:09,925 --> 00:47:13,945
an utter dependence,
one upon another,
943
00:47:14,045 --> 00:47:18,305
in other words, the team actually
brought to a very high pinnacle
944
00:47:18,405 --> 00:47:24,505
of mutual dependence and respect.
945
00:47:24,605 --> 00:47:29,305
The Ferguson formula produced
year after year of success
946
00:47:29,405 --> 00:47:32,705
that one victory, one match,
one extraordinary moment
947
00:47:32,805 --> 00:47:35,705
seemed to capture its essence.
948
00:47:35,805 --> 00:47:38,385
Let's take a look at one night.
949
00:47:38,485 --> 00:47:39,905
One night in Barcelona.
950
00:47:40,005 --> 00:47:41,705
In 1999.
951
00:47:41,805 --> 00:47:43,665
'Beckham crosses from the left.
952
00:47:43,765 --> 00:47:47,025
'Right footed, it's a clear header
and it's in the net!
953
00:47:47,125 --> 00:47:50,125
'Solskjaer has won the European Cup
for Manchester United!'
954
00:47:52,084 --> 00:47:53,784
So United were 1-0 down,
955
00:47:53,884 --> 00:47:56,064
going into injury time.
956
00:47:56,164 --> 00:47:59,184
That gesture - was that disbelief?
957
00:47:59,284 --> 00:48:03,704
I think it was a bit of that,
but when it went to 1-1,
958
00:48:03,804 --> 00:48:05,504
Steve McClaren came to me and says,
959
00:48:05,604 --> 00:48:07,864
"Well, we're back to four-four-two
in extra time."
960
00:48:07,964 --> 00:48:11,264
I says, "No, the game's over.
They'll never recover."
961
00:48:11,364 --> 00:48:13,984
And we scored the second goal.
They were gone.
962
00:48:14,084 --> 00:48:16,304
Bayern were absolutely gone.
963
00:48:16,404 --> 00:48:19,424
Those three minutes, in a sense,
964
00:48:19,524 --> 00:48:23,824
are like the whole Ferguson formula
boiled down, aren't they?
965
00:48:23,924 --> 00:48:30,104
Well, that particular team
was a team that never gave in.
966
00:48:30,204 --> 00:48:31,784
And through that season,
967
00:48:31,884 --> 00:48:35,304
they continually won games
in the last few minutes.
968
00:48:35,404 --> 00:48:38,744
To win the league once
is very difficult.
969
00:48:38,844 --> 00:48:42,904
But to do it over 26 years,
I think, is simply amazing.
970
00:48:43,004 --> 00:48:46,184
I was able to plan
three, four years ahead,
971
00:48:46,284 --> 00:48:48,344
because I was there long enough.
972
00:48:48,444 --> 00:48:50,504
Even having won the coveted treble,
973
00:48:50,604 --> 00:48:55,004
Ferguson set about dismantling
his team and creating another.
974
00:48:56,724 --> 00:48:59,664
I think his greatest legacy
is that he had success over
975
00:48:59,764 --> 00:49:02,064
a quarter of a century
976
00:49:02,164 --> 00:49:03,984
and that he was able to build
977
00:49:04,084 --> 00:49:08,104
and rebuild four or five
truly great teams.
978
00:49:08,204 --> 00:49:11,024
For me, that is something
that no manager has matched.
979
00:49:11,124 --> 00:49:15,904
The rebuilding of the organisation
was consistent
980
00:49:16,004 --> 00:49:19,784
and often people, when
they've built a structure or got
981
00:49:19,884 --> 00:49:24,783
an entity into a winning position,
they forget what took them there
982
00:49:24,883 --> 00:49:27,823
and they stop doing the renovation,
they stop doing the repairs.
983
00:49:27,923 --> 00:49:29,783
Sir Alex didn't stop
984
00:49:29,883 --> 00:49:33,943
and he rebuilt the club
on perpetual four-year cycles.
985
00:49:34,043 --> 00:49:37,343
You smile inside, because he say,
"You're still hungry.
986
00:49:37,443 --> 00:49:41,023
"You still want to win. You're
still motivated to win trophies,
987
00:49:41,123 --> 00:49:46,183
"to go to the trainings
with 62 years old, 63, 64, 65."
988
00:49:46,283 --> 00:49:48,743
He is still hungry.
He still wants one more title.
989
00:49:48,843 --> 00:49:51,503
He still want that team
play good every weekend,
990
00:49:51,603 --> 00:49:54,663
so this is, for me,
it was a surprise.
991
00:49:54,763 --> 00:49:56,983
But the lesson for a leader,
992
00:49:57,083 --> 00:50:01,343
is at the very moment
you reach the top, is what?
993
00:50:01,443 --> 00:50:03,783
When you're at the top...
It's like climbing a mountain.
994
00:50:03,883 --> 00:50:05,823
You go up there
and the view is beautiful.
995
00:50:05,923 --> 00:50:08,423
In normal circumstances,
you have to come down the mountain.
996
00:50:08,523 --> 00:50:09,503
Not in football.
997
00:50:09,603 --> 00:50:12,503
For Manchester United, you have to
stay up there and look at the view.
998
00:50:12,603 --> 00:50:13,783
You can't come down.
999
00:50:13,883 --> 00:50:15,943
Of course,
you don't win every league,
1000
00:50:16,043 --> 00:50:18,943
but the important thing
is to be challenging every time.
1001
00:50:19,043 --> 00:50:21,543
That was a big thing at Man United.
It was never about,
1002
00:50:21,643 --> 00:50:24,543
"Oh, we've won, let's celebrate
for days on end, months on end
1003
00:50:24,643 --> 00:50:26,023
"and really enjoy it."
1004
00:50:26,123 --> 00:50:28,143
You never got the sense
that we really enjoyed it
1005
00:50:28,243 --> 00:50:30,263
as much as we maybe should have,
now I've retired.
1006
00:50:30,363 --> 00:50:31,703
I think if I did enjoy it too much,
1007
00:50:31,803 --> 00:50:35,303
cos I did quite like
enjoying things,
1008
00:50:35,403 --> 00:50:38,063
maybe I wouldn't have been able
to climb the mountain again
1009
00:50:38,163 --> 00:50:40,463
so soon and so consistently.
1010
00:50:40,563 --> 00:50:46,343
You have some managers
that you work hard for
1011
00:50:46,443 --> 00:50:48,983
because you fear them
1012
00:50:49,083 --> 00:50:52,663
and you have other managers
that you work hard for
1013
00:50:52,763 --> 00:50:54,763
because you love them.
1014
00:50:55,603 --> 00:50:57,502
Where on this line is Sir Alex?
1015
00:50:57,602 --> 00:50:59,842
LAUGHTER
1016
00:51:02,842 --> 00:51:04,962
Some people are pointing.
1017
00:51:06,682 --> 00:51:08,742
Where on this line is he?
Yes, over there.
1018
00:51:08,842 --> 00:51:11,302
I think he's more towards
the love side.
1019
00:51:11,402 --> 00:51:12,662
ALL: Aw!
1020
00:51:12,762 --> 00:51:14,062
It's a fact.
1021
00:51:14,162 --> 00:51:16,222
OK, you need to stop talking
right now.
1022
00:51:16,322 --> 00:51:17,422
LAUGHTER
1023
00:51:17,522 --> 00:51:22,182
So, for you, was it more fear
or was it love or maybe both?
1024
00:51:22,282 --> 00:51:24,522
Both. Both.
1025
00:51:26,042 --> 00:51:28,462
In the beginning, it's kind of...
1026
00:51:28,562 --> 00:51:31,342
not scared but it's...
1027
00:51:31,442 --> 00:51:32,982
respectful.
1028
00:51:33,082 --> 00:51:35,662
You respect because you say,
1029
00:51:35,762 --> 00:51:41,222
"He can smile, but he can be angry
too, so let's do the right things."
1030
00:51:41,322 --> 00:51:43,582
Early on in my career,
definitely fear.
1031
00:51:43,682 --> 00:51:47,262
As a 17-year-old
seeing this figure
1032
00:51:47,362 --> 00:51:53,822
who was so intent on
discipline and quality.
1033
00:51:53,922 --> 00:51:56,222
But also fear from me,
fear of failure.
1034
00:51:56,322 --> 00:52:00,302
But then as the career
and the relationship grew,
1035
00:52:00,402 --> 00:52:02,822
more towards the love aspect.
1036
00:52:02,922 --> 00:52:05,382
There can be occasions
where fear came into it
1037
00:52:05,482 --> 00:52:07,502
and occasions with a bit of love.
1038
00:52:07,602 --> 00:52:09,182
But in the case of fear,
1039
00:52:09,282 --> 00:52:11,382
if you look at the way
Manchester United played,
1040
00:52:11,482 --> 00:52:13,422
the players played
and the teams played,
1041
00:52:13,522 --> 00:52:15,622
there was no way that fear
was in that team.
1042
00:52:15,722 --> 00:52:17,742
In terms of my time at United,
1043
00:52:17,842 --> 00:52:22,122
I often wondered whether
it was hate, fear, love.
1044
00:52:23,402 --> 00:52:25,182
I didn't pay great attention to it,
1045
00:52:25,282 --> 00:52:29,501
but I still was always concerned
about the balance of it.
1046
00:52:29,601 --> 00:52:32,641
I have to say this,
it's right there - respect.
1047
00:52:34,641 --> 00:52:38,981
'I think love or fear is
an inappropriate statement,
1048
00:52:39,081 --> 00:52:40,621
'quite frankly. It's respect.'
1049
00:52:40,721 --> 00:52:44,861
I think that people
should respect you.
1050
00:52:44,961 --> 00:52:48,341
If they don't respect you,
then you've lost it.
1051
00:52:48,441 --> 00:52:51,021
You've basically lost it.
It's as simple as that.
1052
00:52:51,121 --> 00:52:55,301
Ferguson was to win the respect of
his rivals as well as his own team.
1053
00:52:55,401 --> 00:52:58,421
I played against Man United
with Porto.
1054
00:52:58,521 --> 00:53:03,661
The respect started when in that
Man United-Porto,
1055
00:53:03,761 --> 00:53:09,621
the first time, the opposite manager
knocking my door
1056
00:53:09,721 --> 00:53:11,861
to congratulate my players.
1057
00:53:11,961 --> 00:53:14,101
Sir Alex walks in? Yeah.
1058
00:53:14,201 --> 00:53:17,261
That, in our Portuguese culture,
was...
1059
00:53:17,361 --> 00:53:19,061
It doesn't belong to our culture.
1060
00:53:19,161 --> 00:53:23,181
From that moment, I owe him respect
1061
00:53:23,281 --> 00:53:26,881
and I always gave him
my respect and my admiration.
1062
00:53:28,201 --> 00:53:32,021
Sir Alex retired in 2013
to be with his wife Cathy
1063
00:53:32,121 --> 00:53:33,901
following the death of her sister.
1064
00:53:34,001 --> 00:53:35,101
Champions!
1065
00:53:35,201 --> 00:53:39,261
He went out at the top after winning
his 13th Premier League title.
1066
00:53:39,361 --> 00:53:43,541
We kept it quiet. Nobody knew.
Not even my sons, nobody knew
1067
00:53:43,641 --> 00:53:47,301
until David Gill wanted to see me
on a Sunday afternoon.
1068
00:53:47,401 --> 00:53:50,741
He came along and he says,
"I'm retiring."
1069
00:53:50,841 --> 00:53:53,141
I said, "Phew, so am I."
1070
00:53:53,241 --> 00:53:55,181
LAUGHTER
1071
00:53:55,281 --> 00:53:57,181
I remember being
asked in the late-'90s
1072
00:53:57,281 --> 00:53:59,501
when I was a finance director
going around the City as,
1073
00:53:59,601 --> 00:54:02,780
presenting the results we were
quoting on the stock exchange then -
1074
00:54:02,880 --> 00:54:05,500
what's going to be happen
when Alex Ferguson retires?
1075
00:54:05,600 --> 00:54:06,860
What's going to happen?
1076
00:54:06,960 --> 00:54:10,460
Without doubt, when Alex left,
it was going to be...
1077
00:54:10,560 --> 00:54:12,860
It was a sea change for the club.
1078
00:54:12,960 --> 00:54:17,060
You don't have a person as important
and as influential and successful
1079
00:54:17,160 --> 00:54:19,820
as that for many, many years
without being a sea change.
1080
00:54:19,920 --> 00:54:21,380
With people and what's happened,
1081
00:54:21,480 --> 00:54:23,180
there was always
a bit of uncertainty.
1082
00:54:23,280 --> 00:54:26,940
He went out after a very
successful season and, I think...
1083
00:54:27,040 --> 00:54:29,900
Personally, I think
it was the right decision.
1084
00:54:30,000 --> 00:54:33,340
He told me a huge secret.
1085
00:54:33,440 --> 00:54:36,660
Not many people knew,
1086
00:54:36,760 --> 00:54:42,780
like, one month or two months before
the decision to be made to stop.
1087
00:54:42,880 --> 00:54:46,700
I know that he trusts me, because
if he doesn't, he doesn't tell me.
1088
00:54:46,800 --> 00:54:48,860
But I was... I was scared.
1089
00:54:48,960 --> 00:54:53,020
I was scared, so when finally
he informed the media
1090
00:54:53,120 --> 00:54:56,140
about his decision,
it was a sense of relief.
1091
00:54:56,240 --> 00:55:01,100
The man chosen to replace Ferguson
was no big name, no proven winner.
1092
00:55:01,200 --> 00:55:03,580
David Moyes survived
less than a year.
1093
00:55:03,680 --> 00:55:07,340
Many blamed Sir Alex
for appointing his friend.
1094
00:55:07,440 --> 00:55:12,500
Now one of the biggest issues
for any leader is when to go,
1095
00:55:12,600 --> 00:55:16,120
when to call it a day,
and how to plan the succession.
1096
00:55:17,480 --> 00:55:19,500
Did you get it right?
1097
00:55:19,600 --> 00:55:21,600
On the succession...
1098
00:55:22,720 --> 00:55:26,020
..when I'd announced my retirement,
do you honestly believe
1099
00:55:26,120 --> 00:55:29,540
that one man could decide
the future of Manchester United?
1100
00:55:29,640 --> 00:55:32,660
It's absolute nonsense.
There was a good process.
1101
00:55:32,760 --> 00:55:34,819
They're a professional
football club,
1102
00:55:34,919 --> 00:55:38,139
they know what they're doing,
the Glazers, David Gill.
1103
00:55:38,239 --> 00:55:40,379
Jose was going back to Chelsea,
1104
00:55:40,479 --> 00:55:43,499
Carlos Ancelotti
was going to Real Madrid,
1105
00:55:43,599 --> 00:55:46,939
Jurgen Klopp
had signed a contract at Dortmund,
1106
00:55:47,039 --> 00:55:50,939
Louis van Gaal was staying
with Holland at the World Cup.
1107
00:55:51,039 --> 00:55:57,899
Probably every manager in the world
looks at Man United as a huge club,
1108
00:55:57,999 --> 00:56:00,679
but I wanted to come to Chelsea.
1109
00:56:02,719 --> 00:56:07,019
We didn't bring that into the table,
because we were so open.
1110
00:56:07,119 --> 00:56:11,419
He knows so much about myself
that he knew
1111
00:56:11,519 --> 00:56:15,219
that, for almost a season,
1112
00:56:15,319 --> 00:56:18,659
I wanted to leave Real Madrid
and I wanted to come to Chelsea.
1113
00:56:18,759 --> 00:56:23,019
The other thing was
I took Pep Guardiola for dinner
1114
00:56:23,119 --> 00:56:26,619
in New York on the September
1115
00:56:26,719 --> 00:56:29,779
and had no idea
I was ever going to retire.
1116
00:56:29,879 --> 00:56:33,599
I said to him, "Give me a call,
tell me what you're going to do."
1117
00:56:34,839 --> 00:56:36,619
No answer.
1118
00:56:36,719 --> 00:56:40,259
I don't think
we made a mistake at all.
1119
00:56:40,359 --> 00:56:42,539
I think we chose
a good football man,
1120
00:56:42,639 --> 00:56:46,299
did a great job at Everton,
11 years there.
1121
00:56:46,399 --> 00:56:47,899
We picked the right man.
1122
00:56:47,999 --> 00:56:50,059
Unfortunately,
it didn't work for David.
1123
00:56:50,159 --> 00:56:52,579
Sometimes people say,
don't they, the critics?
1124
00:56:52,679 --> 00:56:54,339
"Well, it was impossible
for David Moyes
1125
00:56:54,439 --> 00:56:57,459
"because he'd inherited this team
and you'd stopped trying."
1126
00:56:57,559 --> 00:57:01,299
There's this continual thing
about we'd left an old team
1127
00:57:01,399 --> 00:57:02,859
and all that nonsense.
1128
00:57:02,959 --> 00:57:05,379
We won the league by 11 points.
1129
00:57:05,479 --> 00:57:06,659
It was unbelievable.
1130
00:57:06,759 --> 00:57:10,578
The average age of my teams
consistently in all the years,
1131
00:57:10,678 --> 00:57:14,138
the 20 years from when we started
winning the championship,
1132
00:57:14,238 --> 00:57:17,218
was 27-28. Every year.
1133
00:57:17,318 --> 00:57:20,658
If Ryan Giggs had retired
say six or seven years ago,
1134
00:57:20,758 --> 00:57:23,298
say he'd retired at 35...
1135
00:57:23,398 --> 00:57:25,818
it's quite likely that
I'd have made him my assistant
1136
00:57:25,918 --> 00:57:29,738
and quite likely he could move right
into the job with the experience of
1137
00:57:29,838 --> 00:57:31,418
being an assistant manager to me,
1138
00:57:31,518 --> 00:57:34,818
as he's doing in helping
Louis van Gaal at the moment.
1139
00:57:34,918 --> 00:57:37,378
But I would never ask
a player to quit.
1140
00:57:37,478 --> 00:57:39,098
He said that?
1141
00:57:39,198 --> 00:57:43,018
I mean...I obviously played
until I was 40.
1142
00:57:43,118 --> 00:57:44,938
It's obviously
a completely different job,
1143
00:57:45,038 --> 00:57:47,698
completely different mind-set
going from playing to coaching,
1144
00:57:47,798 --> 00:57:52,198
so it would have been great for me
personally to work under Sir Alex...
1145
00:57:54,758 --> 00:57:56,818
..to see
how he worked behind the scenes,
1146
00:57:56,918 --> 00:57:58,938
because you don't really see that
as a player.
1147
00:57:59,038 --> 00:58:01,698
We'd like to have spoken
to many managers, believe me,
1148
00:58:01,798 --> 00:58:03,338
because that's the process.
1149
00:58:03,438 --> 00:58:05,738
We'd like to have asked them
what they felt
1150
00:58:05,838 --> 00:58:08,738
about leaving a big club
to go to a bigger club,
1151
00:58:08,838 --> 00:58:10,618
to come to Manchester United.
1152
00:58:10,718 --> 00:58:12,378
But it wasn't there for us.
1153
00:58:12,478 --> 00:58:15,658
I think we did the best under
the circumstances we were in.
1154
00:58:15,758 --> 00:58:17,578
We have come to the end
of the session.
1155
00:58:17,678 --> 00:58:19,258
Let's give it up
for Sir Alex Ferguson.
1156
00:58:19,358 --> 00:58:21,358
APPLAUSE
1157
00:58:26,798 --> 00:58:29,858
Now, we've spent a long time
analysing your leadership
1158
00:58:29,958 --> 00:58:31,418
and the lessons for others.
1159
00:58:31,518 --> 00:58:33,458
How would you sum it up?
1160
00:58:33,558 --> 00:58:36,138
Well, I think consistency is...
1161
00:58:36,238 --> 00:58:38,458
I think it probably sums me up.
1162
00:58:38,558 --> 00:58:43,057
I think that in the
26-and-a-half years I was there,
1163
00:58:43,157 --> 00:58:47,857
I never changed my conviction
or my philosophy or my attitudes.
1164
00:58:47,957 --> 00:58:51,937
That consistency created players
who were consistent,
1165
00:58:52,037 --> 00:58:53,537
the club were consistent,
1166
00:58:53,637 --> 00:58:57,317
and that's what's made them the best
club in the world, without question.
1167
00:59:00,957 --> 00:59:02,857
My day job is in investment banking,
1168
00:59:02,957 --> 00:59:05,897
so I learnt a lot
from how he's dealt
1169
00:59:05,997 --> 00:59:07,997
with very highly-paid individuals.
1170
00:59:10,797 --> 00:59:12,977
What really came
across was his passion.
1171
00:59:13,077 --> 00:59:15,437
You could see how much
he loved what he does.
1172
00:59:18,997 --> 00:59:20,377
The key thing is
how to lead
1173
00:59:20,477 --> 00:59:22,537
very young teams
of very talented people
1174
00:59:22,637 --> 00:59:25,077
and being able to get
them to deliver the most.
1175
00:59:27,117 --> 00:59:30,057
Understanding about how
to manage a talent pipeline,
1176
00:59:30,157 --> 00:59:32,157
bringing players in.
1177
00:59:34,117 --> 00:59:36,537
His ability to constantly
renew himself.
1178
00:59:36,637 --> 00:59:39,277
I think that's a great lesson
in it for all of us.
95024
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