All language subtitles for The.Core.S01E03.WEBRip.x264-ION10

Mickey: This week on "The Core,"
Simon Barrett,

writer of "You're Next"
and "The Guest"

is here to tell us how he turns
the screws on his audience.

Then a criminologist tells us

why we should fear
our own family.

And effects master Jim Ojala

spills the secrets
of spilling acid on my face.

From "You're Next" to
"The Guest" and "Blair Witch,"

there are few filmmakers
that can capture the anxiety

of a Simon Barrett film.

They start off simple --
a dinner-party,

a heartwarming homecoming,

but something tastes off.

You feel it rotting
in your stomach,

and just when you can't
bear it any longer,

bam! Crossbow bolt to the head.

He fills his movies
with ominous unease,

and he has a damn
good time doing it.

Simon's here today
to talk about tension

with a thrilling game
of Russian Roulette

with blenders.

Sir, thank you so much
for joining me today.

-I'm so sorry. I'm being rude.
-Oh, not at all. Not at all.

Great to see you.
Since you're the guest,

you go ahead and choose yours
and choose one for me.

I'm going to go straight ahead,
and why don't you

grab that one on the end there,
'cause I like

-a little bit of space.
-So, here's how it works.

Seven questions,
eight blender.

We stick our hand
into our chosen blenders.

After each question, we pick
a plug from the tangled cords

and plug her right in.
The blender spins,

and if we both still have
our digits by the end of it,

that blender's removed.

And on we go until
one of us feels very sorry

that we ever agreed
to this stupid game.

-All right.
-All right.

So let's just talk about
how you specifically,

as a writer, build tension
into your scripts.

You know, there's, I guess,
a few things that you can do

to create tension in a film.

Character investment
is important.

You have to care
about the character.

We don't have
character likability.

That's partly my fault,
and I'm sorry,

but we have other things
contributing

to kind of the suspense
of this scenario.

You have to establish
fairly quickly

that either the film
will surprise you

or that bad things
are possible in this world.

You have to set up
the stakes.

And then, you know, score,

obviously, that ominous
kind of tones

and stuff that can
cue the audience

into not feeling that
they're in a safe space.

Blocking, you know, there's a
lot of kind of cinematic tricks,

but also surprises. You know,
any kind of escalation

in pacing.
If the viewers feel

like the film is moving
in a certain rhythm

and they can predict it,
it's like,

"Oh, you know, like this
amount of time happens,

and then there's
a jump scare,"

they'll get used to that
in a lot of subtle ways.

So any kind of unexpected
ramping up of tension

or, you know,
surprise in that regard.

Like how I'm going
to plug this in right now.

Jesus Christ.

-Well, uh...
-Okay.

We lucked out on that one,
I guess.

Okay. So, next question
that I've got for you

on this idea
of misdirection,

the thing that comes
to my mind first and foremost

is the dinner scene
at "You're Next"

where, you know, you get
to know all these characters

but they're fighting
with one another.

Is that very intentional
from the beginning?

Do you try to save
the cat immediately,

or are you more interested
in just kind of real visceral

kind of character
natural human acts?

You know, that's
a great question,

'cause there's tension
between characters

and tension
between relationships,

and then there's tension
of, like,

a crossbow could kill you
at any time,

or you have your hand
in a blender.

I find a combination
of the two

tends to be
fairly interesting.

I can watch gore
all day long,

but show me
a scene in a movie

where a character's made
socially uncomfortable

or embarrassed, and I'll be
squirming and closing my eyes.

-Right.
-I can't take it.

So with that scene
in particular,

I was trying to get a
combination of those two things.

It's like, let's show
a family dynamic

that's engaging
in these different ways.

Let's not waste the audience's
time with them.

Let's try to get them across
in a funny, quick way,

and then
from that point on,

when the crossbows are flying
through the windows,

we'll kind of know who's who
and what they stand for.

I have a bit of comedic
license, you know,

when you're trying
to do something that's funny.

So I utilized it,
and I was like,

"These characters
are ridiculous,

and you'll know who they are
in a few sentences."

Right. I want to expand
on comedic license,

but I feel like we have
to do one of these,

so get rocking and rolling.

-That's the game.
-Okay.

Comedy and horror
are interesting,

and they're both
about timing.

And so what draws you
to this idea

of making something
really terrifying or violent

but also kind of funny
and awkward at the same time?

I think if a film
is relentlessly

just trying to be scary,
it actually becomes,

-in a certain way, oppressive.
-Mm-hmm.

And I, myself,
am not a funny person.

I don't enjoy humor.

My main claim to fame is,
I've never laughed or smiled.

But I do find that there's
a certain degree of absurdism

inherent in a lot
of horror scenarios,

where if the characters don't
take a moment and acknowledge

that it almost
feels unreal.

Like, I'm not saying if I was
being chased through a house

by a maniac with an ax,
I'd stop and just be like,

-"This is just so weird."
-Right.

But I would probably
have that micro-thought

at a certain moment
of just like,

"Oh, this is, just, like,
so perfect that I would die

in this, like,
absurd horror movie way."

Showing the audience
that element,

even if it's not totally real
to the real-life experience

of being terrorized,

gives the audience
their reality on screen,

and it makes them like and root
for the characters more.

Right.

Liquidated, all right.

That was a little close.

I don't want
to fan-boy out too much

about the way
that you write,

but I think that you have
this incredible ability

of your movies
really ratchet up,

and they don't blow
their loads too early.

A lot of big movies
you're sitting there watching,

the best scene happens
45 minutes into the film.

You know, and so what's
your kind of, like, process

of finding that new way
to just keep on

ratcheting everything up?

If your biggest scare
is a half hour in,

people are going to leave
the movie feeling deflated.

So one of the things I do

is I always write
my last scene first.

I don't tend to outline
or do treatments,

but I know what
I'm building to,

and I can think about
kind of

what that escalation is
throughout every scene.

And if a scene isn't kind of
getting me closer to that,

then I know I should
cut it out of the movie.

Are there any particular
techniques that you would use

to build to something like
the big fun house finale

-at the end of "The Guest"?
-For "The Guest,"

it's a tricky thing. People are
very into the family dynamic,

and then once he actually
starts killing people,

we lose some viewers,
'cause they want Dan

-to kind of be the hero.
-Right.

But we knew that wasn't
the trajectory of the film,

and so it's just about kind of
earning that in a character way.

And then once
I kind of realized

what the tone of those
scenes was going to be,

I was able to kind of
be like, "Okay.

This is going to be the tone
of the final third of this film.

Some people might not like it,
but I'm into it.

Let's figure out the right kind
of 90 degree turn into this."

Mm-hmm.

You're up.

We should look at some clips
or something that kind of

illustrate the stuff we've been
talking about, right? Like --

But you were right there.

All right.
Let's check it out.

You're sheltering enemies
of the state, are you not?

Yes.

You're sheltering them
underneath your floorboards,

aren't you?

Yes.

Why don't you tell me about
the tension in this scene?

Tarantino is so remarkably good
at these interminable scenes

that should not work
and only do in his films.

Only he can pull off just
this endless scene of dialogue

that's so inherently
fascinating.

We know what
the stakes are here.

He establishes them beautifully
with this camera move.

It's like he's literally
referencing that Truffaut,

Hitchcock conversation
about suspense.

-Right. Yeah.
-It's like he's literally

showing you the bomb
under the table.

-The bomb under the table.
-I just find this kind

of dialogue-driven suspense
really fascinating.

I, myself, don't know
that I have the talent

to to achieve it,

but that's why I like
going to see Tarantino.

-May I approach?
-No!

No. I'm going to throw it.

Careful.
It was a gift.

-They're killing us.
-Keep the gun!

-No!
-All right.

So this next clip, obviously,
is "Green Room."

And so tell me why you think
that this one is, like,

a perfect sense of tension.

"Green Room" is probably
the only film in years

that's made me
yell out loud in a theater.

Once you've seen what's happened
to Anton Yelchin's arm...

Yeah....and you've seen Imogen Poots,

like, slit a guy's belly open...Right.

...you just completely
have no idea

what the movie's
going to do next.

You know, it's not playing
by normal horror movie

or thriller rules.
And of course, he's a musician,

and so, you know,
that's, like, extra awful.

He'll never play,
I don't know, the bass

or whatever he plays again.

Catherine, I'm going
to get you out of there,

but right now,
you listen to me.

I've got to leave this room.
I'll be right back.

Catherine:
No! Don't you leave me here,
you fucking bitch! No!

The classic
"Silence of the Lambs."

Tell me about this one,
why this one resonates.

So I imagine you probably
share my affinity

for, like, A-list
kind of high-art cinema,

and it's this shot right here
that references low

or, you know,
so-called B movie cinema.

You know, Jonathan Demme said
that Roger Corman told him

at some point that
the scariest shot in cinema

is a hand-held shot
approaching a closed door.

-Right.
-So when he set out

to make this thriller,
he put that shot in there.

This entire sequence just has
such a great dynamic.

It'll be a lot easier with that.

Simon: This is a somewhat
different kind of suspense

from some of the previous stuff,
where, like, in "Green Room"

you're legitimately very
concerned for the characters.

Same in "Inglourious Basterds"
and "Silence of the Lambs."

This, I'm not
so much concerned.

-I'm just very interested.
-Yeah.

It's almost the inverse
of the "Inglourious Basterds"

in certain ways, where
there's almost no dialogue.

Right.It's just them
staring at each other

while this amazing
Ennio Morricone score plays,

which is, of course, some of
the best music of all time.

These three guys
have been building up

to a confrontation
now for 2 1/2 hours.

Right.Their characters are so iconic
and interesting,

and the actors are
doing such incredible,

career-defining
performances

that you just end up
being glued to the screen.

Fuck!

It's not even hot,
you dumb bitch!

Mickey:
So, yeah. Tell me a little bit
about this and the tension.

Simon: When I was writing
the script, you know, I --

This really bothered some people
on the IMDb message boards,

as you can imagine, but it was
a creative choice for them

to not ever have any guns.

But it was also trying to find,
like, creative weapons.

Right.You know, stuff that people
wouldn't necessarily think of,

do the kind of
"Home Alone" thing.

I mean, obviously, this one was
very influenced by "Home Alone."

I don't just want to see
someone get chased with, like,

a gun or an ax or something
that I've seen before.

I need to find, like, a creative
thing to do with those things.Yeah.

And here's the blender gag,

that, you know, that when
I wrote it in the script,

I was just like, this seems
achievable on a budget.

In any scenario, it's like,
"Okay. That could be goofy."

But it is actually pretty brutal
and hard core of a blender gag.

Well, I mean,
the movie has a tone

that allows you to accept
something like this.

I think this would be
a pretty inefficient way

to actually kill someone.

You guys pretty much
nailed the originality.

It's so awesome.

All right.
Well...

This game's
getting close.

So, I want to ask about
Simon Barrett pre-success.

How do you do that? How do you
find ways to make movies

when no one will return
your phone calls?

I feel like as person who
graduated from film school,

it's very hypocritical for me
to say what I want to say,

which is don'tgo to film school.
Right. Don't.

It's a complete waste
of time and money.

The first film I got made

was because a gentleman who had
acted in my student films,

and I'd acted
in a couple of his,

ended up working
in some capacity

for the head of a company
that was making movies for Sony.

And that's how I got
"Dead Birds" made.

So if I hadn't gone
to film school,

-none of that would've happened.
-Sure. Totally.

Would I still be
making movies?

Would I have an even
awesomer career?

Would I, you know, be, like,
wielding an Oscar in each hand

right now
instead of a blender in one?

I don't know.
But I suspect not.

Well, film school,
unfortunately,

cannot save you now.
So, you're up.

Four.

Those odds --

-That was another --
-Well,

you know what,
let's just ratchet this up,

because there's nothing I love
more than a big, juicy climax.

But why don't we talk
about your philosophy

for the climax of a film?

Well, I mean, again, it really
depends on the type of film

you're trying to make.

But I do feel like
the good climax

to a movie both
simultaneously delivers

on everything the audience would
want from that type of film.

So if you're making
a horror movie,

then it's, like,
the scariest series

of sequences,

you know, the most
perilous set pieces.

And if you're making comedy,
it's the funniest.

But it also should subvert
the viewers' expectations.

I think a good ending
almost always contains

an element of surprise,
'cause what you want

is that ending that
gives you what you want,

but in a way that you
couldn't have ever expected.

Totally, and, you know,
to be honest,

I did not expect it
to get to this point,

so...why don't you
just do it?

All right.
This is it.

Aah! My writing hand!

Oh, why?!

I'm going to be honest with you.
My face didn't actually melt,

all thanks
to effects master Jim Ojala.

Why don't you tell us how you
did these insane gore effects?

Well, for your effect,

we started out with
simple antacid tablets.

-Mm-hmm.
-You can actually crush

antacid tablets
into a powder

and we went ahead did, like,
sore makeup on you.

Mm-hmm.So you looked kind of, like,
bruised and irritated.

And then we powder the antacid
tablets into your face,

and then you
spritz it with water,

and boom, your face
starts bubbling.

-Right.
-So that's stage one.

And then stage two,
we go into gelatin, basically.

You tint it up
with the cream makeup,

so it's like a skin tone,

and then you can put
that on your face

and start doing a buildup so it
looks like all bubbly and gross.

And then you create
the dimension.

Then put in your sores
and all that stuff.

And what is all this?
Are these your tests?

Yeah. And then these are
Pros-Aide Transfers.

These are basically, like,
sculptures of boils

that we put on you, as well,
to kind of give extra dimension,

and then we sculpted
the gelatin on top of that,

just so you have different
textures and stuff like that.

And then loose hair is
always just really gross.

-Right.
-So we figure if you're melting

from sulfuric acid, your hair's
coming out, everything.

So we mat your hair down

so you've got, like, bald spots
showing up,

and then this is, like, just is
stringing down in the gelatin.

So that's why I'm going to find,
like, loose hair in places

for the next month or so, right?Yeah. Exactly.

-Every nook and cranny. Yes.
-Every nook and cranny.

And then for the final,
to just really go extreme,

and to be able to do it
fairly quickly,

we made a silicone
burn mask.

And so is this a custom-made
mask? You made it --

Yes. It's kind of like the same
technique as gelatin...

-Cool.
-...where you stretch, like,

a sock, over a head form

and then just start
gooping on silicone,

and as it sets, you stretch it
and make it look nasty.

And then you put on
all the burn

and the teeth
and all that stuff.

-Yeah. Yeah.
-Okay. And three.

Two. One.

How about the hand
in the blender,

which, you know,
is both disgusting

and also very splattery?

For that, we had Simon
put his hand in,

and you got all
the great lead-up,

and then, so we can actually
see, like, a close-up

of something
physically happening

-to the skin...
-Right.

...we made a nice
gelatin hand

where from here
all the way to here,

is filled with blood.
And then it's sealed off

so it can't leak out
until you puncture it.

So then you put that in,
and then once those blades

start tearing
at these fingers,

-it just rips everything apart.
-Wow.

So you can get that quick second
of something really badass

happening on camera.

Then you cut to the wide
or medium of Simon,

which, he's got tubes,

one tube with a little bit of
foam, connected to each finger.

And then we made this little,
like, custom silicone piece

for the top of his knuckles.

And then once it's blended and
painted to look like his skin,

it looks like --
Well, when it's spraying blood,

it looks like his damn fingers
are cut off, you know?

And if you want the crazy amount
of pressure

that we had coming out
of your hand...

Yeah....you can get, like,
fire extinguishers

that are specifically
made for water,

and then you can pressurize
them up to 100 psi.

-Right.
-And, boom,

you go as hard
as you want with it.

And so wherever you spray the
blood, that's up to the actor.

-Exactly.
-You really went for it.

-You had great direction.
-Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah.
I regret it tremendously.

Eagle-eyed viewers will note
the continuity error.

I lost my left hand.
That's a right hand.

-Oh, that's an alternative.
-Oh, yeah. Okay.

You know, the funny thing is,
you know,

the whole blender gag
in "You're Next"

that we're riffing on where
that person gets a blender

shoved into their head,

you know, the only reason
I even wrote that

is 'cause it was a special
effect that I felt like no one

could tell me
it was impossible to do,

because I knew a little bit
about blood tubing...

-Right.
-...and fake smoke and stuff.

And I was like, this is
something we can achieve.

-Yeah. Totally.
-That will work.

That will work,
and it will look good,

and it won't ruin
our shooting day.

-Right. Absolutely.
-Yeah, and it was --

Blender stuff is, you know,
it's horrifying...

-Yeah.
-...but achievable.

It gives you a lot of room
to wire stuff.

Well, it's smart, 'cause
you're in a confined space,

so it's not just like
it's all over the place.

Well, thank you, Simon,
for giving us an awesome lesson

on tension. Thank you, Jim,
for making us look so fucked up.

And come with me.
I got something to show you.

Simon's movies are fun.
They're suspenseful.

They're scary as hell partly
because they're also not real,

but they play on
real-world fears,

and that's why they hook us.

Who better to tell us exactly
what we need to be afraid of

than a renowned criminologist,
Dr. Bill Sanders?

-How are you, sir?
-Very well, thank you.

So, I watch a lot
of horror movies

which basically makes me afraid
of pretty much everything.

And so what is the thing that
I should be the most afraid of?

The person you should
be most afraid of

is the one sitting right next
to you watching that film.

Horror movies depict
a deranged killer,

a lunatic, often.

It's much more mundane
in real life.

It's someone you know,
particularly if you're married

or have a boyfriend,
girlfriend.

That's usually the number-one
suspect in all homicides.

If not that, a friend,
a family member.

Bottom line,
it's someone you know.

Jesus.
Well, that's comforting.

From an experts'
perspective,

what do most
horror films get wrong?

The planning involved
is not so extensive.

Murders just come,

happen in the spur of
the moment out of anger.

The individual just lashes out
and kills someone.

Another thing they get wrong
is how clean the homicides are,

or as if they know exactly
in the body where to hit.

You know, they're going
to slice their neck,

and then they just
bleed out peacefully.

Or they just get shot
in the right place,

and shot only once
or twice.

Real-life homicides are often
characterized by overkill,

whereby they are stabbed
well beyond the necessary --

necessity that
would cause death,

and/or they are killed
in various ways.

So they are shot,
then they are stabbed,

and then they are burned.

So it is, again, within that
emotional overdrive,

base, you know, fear,
tension, righteousness,

the adrenaline
the body produces,

the frenzied attack.

It's far from clean.

What are the major societal
factors that would result

in someone committing a homicide
or something like that?

One of the main predictors
of being both a victim

and a perpetrator of homicide
is being a male.

Another one is age.
It is young people.

So, as we age, you know,
get out of 20s and 30s,

we actually are
less susceptible

at being both a victim
and perpetrator.

But if you want to know
the master variable, like,

this out of all the variables
consistently indicate

to be the strongest,
it would be poverty.

And even amongst poverty, so
amongst poor areas, what's that?

It would be absolute
depravation.

So who, in the poor areas,
is most deprived

or concentrations
of that deprivation,

that is where you'll have

the strongest correlations
with homicide.

So, finally, how do you
get away with murder?

I would like to know that

because of a script
that I'm...writing.

Just go kill someone randomly
you've never seen before

on the street.

And just run
as fast as I can?

Well, as I have
indicated earlier,

homicides are most
likely to occur

amongst people
who know one another.

So the number-one suspect
in the homicide,

the detectives are thinking,
"Someone this guy knows."

The detective is not
going to be thinking,

"Oh, this is some random guy
who just walked by

and happened to stab,
or shoot,

or whatever,
this individual right there."

So by engaging in that
uncommon pattern of behavior,

you are less likely
to get caught

and/or get away with murder.

Well, Dr. Sanders, I can't say
that this helped alleviate

any of my preexisting anxieties,
but it really was fascinating,

and thank you so much
for being on the show.

Thanks for having me.

Dude, we had Simon Barrett on
today,

and it was intense.

I saw.

Already?

Here. Take this.

There are other weird video
stores I can go to, you know?

Take it. Some on.
This whole meta thing's

really fucking with my head.

I'm fucking with you.

All right.
Tension.

Got some crazy
tense movies for you.

You ever think about moving
a little bit closer

-to civilization?
-Nope.

-Want your spine tingled?
-Every day.

First up, we've got
"Willow Creek"

from director
Bobcat Goldthwait.

He makes a movie
about Bigfoot.

At one point, two characters
in one tent and nowhere to look

but directly into
their terrified eyes

wondering what's outside.

No!

Next up, we got "The Reef."

Not dissimilar, except you're
not stuck inside a tent,

you're out in the open sea,
a couple of people,

and sharks all around them.

-Do they get turned into chum?
-I'm not going to tell you.

We got "Take Shelter"
from Jeff Nichols,

starring Michael Shannon.

He's getting premonitions
of the end of the world, right?

The whole time,
he's paranoid.

He's wondering
if he's going insane.

When he has to tell
his entire community,

it's one of the most
uncomfortable sequences

on Shudder.

Does the end
of the world happen?

I'm not going to tell you.

Next up, we have a Shudder
exclusive, "We Go On."

This is one of my favorite
modern haunters.

I'd like to offer $30,000
to the first person

that can show me definitive
proof of life after death.

A man terrified of death
and dying to know

whether there's
an afterlife.

When he finds out
ghosts are real,

it'll upend
your whole night.

That sounds
very unsettling.

One of our favorite contemporary
slashers, "Lake Bodom."

At one point, two of
the characters realize

that the key
they need to a car

is in the pocket of a dead body
at the bottom of said lake.

Is she going to make it back up?Is she?

You're going to have
to watch to find out.

Thank you so much, Sam.
I got some watching to do.

Hey, don't drop
those tapes.

They are on-air masters.

I will be very careful.

-Thank you.
-Until next time.

That'll do it for "The Core."

Thank you so much again to titan
of tension Simon Barrett.

And I don't know
about you, but now,

I'm going to do something
that always relaxes me.