All language subtitles for The.Murders.at.Starved.Rock.S01E03.1080p.WEB.h264-OPUS_track4_eng

(crowd chatting)

Craig Findley:
Cooper, is everybody inside?

We're gonna have
a new boardroom,

and we should be able
to accommodate more people.

We had no anticipation that
so many would be here today,

so I apologize for the,
for the inconvenience.

Diane Oetting:
Hi, everybody.
(clears throat)

Two years ago,

the board was concerned
by the continued refusal

on the part of Mr. Weger

to accept any responsibility
or express any remorse.

The board felt that
a release at that time

could jeopardize public safety.

This was two years ago.

If you let him go today,

does that mean that
the crime wasn't brutal?

Does that mean
he is expressing remorse?

No.

We've been fighting this
for 40 years.

Our family has been accused
of being part of the mob.

My grandfather was accused
of setting up a hit,

and my grandmother
and her friends

were going out
to look at birds.

Thank you.

-Yes, ma'am.
-I'm Chester's sister.

He is two years older
than what I am.

He was my closest sibling,

and he has always
maintained his innocence.

He has lost his life
as you all know.

I just hope my brother
does not die in prison.

Thank you.

If there's nothing further,
I'll ask Janet to take the roll.

If he receives eight votes,
he will be paroled.

If he does not, he will not.

-Miss Martinez.
-Yes.

-Mr. Fisher.
-Pete Fisher: No.

-Janet Crane: Mr. Ruggiero.
-Joseph Ruggiero: No.

Mary Pruett:
My family has always
been involved in this.

It's not that we put him
on a back-burner and forgot him.

We have lived this.

Not like my brother's
had to live it,

but we have lived this
by trying to help him.

Mr. James.

Oreal James:
Yes.

-Janet: Mr. Brink.
-Daniel Brink: Yes.

-Ms. Crigler.
-Edith Crigler: Yes.

-Ms. Daniels.
-Yes.

-Chairman Findley.
-Findley: Yes.

(Mary sobbing)

(Findley speaking)

You betcha. I will.

(pensive music playing)

♪ ♪

♪ ♪

(car approaching)

(bell tolling)

Kathy Etz:
I don't know if members
of the parole board

felt that, perhaps,
he was innocent,

but it was
extremely traumatizing,

and reopened
the wounds of the tragedy.

The idea that he gets
to be out of prison

while my grandmother is dead,

and I-I'm all for
criminal justice reform,

but that does not mean letting
a murderer out of prison.

So, yeah,
I think that they messed up.

The day that he
was granted parole,

my sister, she just
started sobbing,

and, and said,
"I'm so sorry, Mom," like...

and, um...

you know, I, you know,
my mom was...

you know, just, it was,

it was incredibly
upsetting for all of us.

(sobbing)

Mary:
You couldn't believe
it was happening

after all we have been
through, you know?

You just thought, uh,
"We must be dreaming."

You know, it's been 60 years.

His life is gonna start.

This is your sister.

We just got through
with the parole board,

and it was-- Guess what?

Chester Weger (on phone):
I won.

-(friends cheering)
-Andy Hale:
We're so excited for you.

I can't wait
to see ya in person,

and I know your family
can't wait to see you.

Start living your life,
get out and enjoy freedom.

-We love you.
-Andy: We'll, we'll talk
to you soon.

When I got involved
with Chester's case in 2016,

I had never heard
of the Starved Rock murders.

I wasn't born in 1960,
but I read--

It was a front-page article
in The Chicago Tribune
about Chester Weger,

"Starved Rock Killer
Denied Parole Again," right?

So, I was really intrigued.

This guy's
maintained his innocence
over decades and decades.

So, I decided
to write Chester Weger a letter.

You know, when you look
at false confessions,

and there are certain factors
that lead to wrongful
confessions,

the primary one
is the threat of death.

Here you have uncontested
evidence that Chester

was threatened multiple times
with the death penalty.

The second thing
is all the surveillance.

The thing's
to break somebody's will,

and the coercion
and the techniques,

it has all the hallmarks
of a false confession.

Our first goal was just let's,
let's get him out of prison.

But I think
the more important step

is trying to show people
that he's actually innocent.

Reporter 1:
24 times Chester Weger
was up for parole.

On the 24th try,
parole was granted.

Reporter 2:
The longest-serving prisoner

in Illinois is
about to go free.

DJ (on radio):
Classic Hits 103.9, WLPO

talking about, uh,
Chester Weger's parole.

I wonder if any of this
had to do with the fact

that there's no Tony Raccuglia
to fight to keep him in.

Tom Collins:
I really think
that was part of it,

Tony was such
a vociferous advocate.

DJ:
And credible 'cause
he prosecuted him.

Tom:
Yeah, I really think
that Tony's passing

was not a minor factor
in today's decision.

DJ:
Tom Collins
of The News Tribune,

thank you very much.

Tony Raccuglia died May 2019,

and then,
at the next parole hearing,

Weger is, indeed, paroled,

and can't help but think,

maybe, Tony Raccuglia's
pressure had something
to do with it.

Tony Raccuglia was one
of the most forceful guys I know
when it comes to cases.

Even at his advanced age,
when it came time for
the parole board hearings,

he'd make sure
that those board members

knew how Tony Raccuglia
felt about this case.

Anthony Raccuglia:
You know, Harland Warren
just passed on.

I'm the only living person
that had anything to do

with the prosecution
of that case.

The Sheriff's Office,
they're all dead.

The judge is dead.
The court reporter is dead.

The defense lawyer is dead.

There's just me and Chester.

We're the only two left.

David Raccuglia:
Of course,
I was happy for his family,

that Chester Weger was paroled,

but I was still mourning
the loss of my father,

and they were,
kind of, wrapped up together,

so it was a strange,
emotional time.

The state's attorney
had suggested...

David:
It was my father's death
that made me wanna go back

to a lot of the footage,
and look at it and see him.

It was a, a good
cathartic experience
for me to see him again.

This guy got caught...

David:
But now, there's a potential

wrongful conviction in the air,

and I still--
I had a lot of questions.

I decided it was time for me
to get to the bottom of this.

♪ ♪

And so, I went back to 1960,
and I studied it all.

You know, I, I feel like
I've worked on this case
for so long,

there might not be anything new,
but there was.

(clapping and cheering)

Officer:
If you can get out,
and just go ahead,

and turn the car off, sir.

Chester:
I got a seatbelt.

(Chester speaking)

Person:
He's gonna-- Yeah.

(Man speaking)

Reporter:
Well, is it a good day?

-Reporter: Are you scared?
-No, I'm not.

After all this time,

you've maintained,
your, uh, innocence,

and how does it feel
looking back, 60 years are gone?

(Chester speaking)

Reporter:
How do you feel?
Are you excited?

Yes, I am.

Person 1:
Okay, Dad, start the car up.

-Person 2: Thank you.
-Chester: Thank you.

-Person 2: All right.
-Person 3: Thank you very much.

That don't make sense.

Person:
I know.

DJ:
Old Chester Weger.

After 60 years,

60, 60 trips around the sun,

a man who's never admitted
any wrongdoing,

he's gonna spend
his, uh, remaining years
trying to prove his innocence.

(Johnny Weger speaking)

(Chester speaking)

Get up, old man, get up.

Mwah!

-How are ya?
-I'm all right.

Good, good, looking good.

Ooh, a little skinny.
We need to fatten you up.

Chester:
I'll be all right.

Person:
We just thank you, dear Lord,

that Chester can get out
of imprisonment, Lord,

and just pray that you'll
continue to be with him
and strengthen him, Lord,

and get him back
into, into today's life,
and just watch over him.

In Christ's name
we pray these things, amen.

Amen.

Johnny Weger:
You can't help but think,
"What if?"

What if my dad wasn't in prison?

What if my mom hadn't remarried?
What if, you know?

Oh, Dad.

Son.

You're all right,
come on.

We'll be all right,
we'll be okay.

-I'll be able to see you,
and write to you and everything.
-I know, yeah.

No, I'm just so happy.

I, I know, I'm happy
to see you, too,

and Becky.

Johnny:
He was convicted
of Starved Rock murders,

I was four months old.

I didn't like nobody,
I didn't like myself,

grew hair down to my ass,

put a chip on my shoulder,

and I kept it there
for many years.

For my first burglary,
we did four months together.

That's the most time
I ever spent with my father

was behind bars.

Brian Towne:
This is a horrible crime.

There are families
that have been affected

on both the victims' side
and the defense side.

I mean, Chester Weger's son
has gone to prison,

several times.

A lot of his behavior
has been as a sexual deviant.

It's hard to say if it's
because of him being the son

of the Starved Rock murderer,

or if he's just made
these choices on his own.

Johnny:
All I ever heard
from the courts,

from the people I've met was,
"You're just like your father."

It's gonna affect ya.

61 years old,

the drugs and alcohol
I put in my body,

and the mess
I put my body through.

I'm here.

They say I don't have a brain,

well, let me tell ya this one.

This is called "Woe is Me."

"Again the shadow's loneliness

"have begun to transverse
the passageways of my heart.

"I'm just a lonely prisoner
caged in a man-made hell,

"and this pain and anguish
I suffer is more than
I can tell.

"Memories, without them
I couldn't live,

"for in my mind's eye,
I can see you clearly,

so if there'd be no memories,
then there'd be no you."

I went through 30 years
of prison,

and totally lost my mind.

In prison, that's
all you have is memories.

My father, he taught me

how to love and to care
about somebody besides myself.

They say he's supposed to have
another chance in court,

but they couldn't pay him enough
for 60 years of heartache,

his parents dying,
his wife dying,

his kids suffering.

They couldn't give him enough.

Andy:
I've never been here before.

I can't believe
how scenic it is.

Now that I see this,

you know, the story that
is set forth in the confession

makes zero sense.

And how high it is.

All the struggle to get
the bodies up here,

which, how long's
that gonna take you?

And risk having somebody else
walk into the canyon?

That to me is the bigger risk,
not a plane in the sky.

There's hikers,
there's people here.

To drag three grown women
up into that cave,

it strikes me so much more
as being a two-man job.

If you go back and look
at all the newspaper articles,

you see
the complete focus being,

this is a crime
committed by two people

because of the hairs.

There was all kinds
of hair evidence
collected at the scene,

and there was
no hair evidence introduced
against Chester at trial.

There were 18 hairs
found in Ms. Oetting's hand,

and there were seven hairs
found on Ms. Murphy's glove.

It clearly looks like the hairs
of the attackers,

and there's
this 1960 lab report that says

it's not Chester's hair
on the glove.

That to me, for sure, would've
been reasonable doubt

back in the day,

and it wasn't even
introduced at the trial.

(suspenseful music playing)

I wanna test those for DNA.

The argument being used
against us is,

"Oh, well, it's all been
commingled and contaminated."

Oh, well, that's great.

So, the guys that we're claiming
caused this guilty verdict

can contaminate
all the evidence,

and prevent Chester
from even looking at it?

Oh, isn't that convenient?

I retained an expert.

He has a lab called Microtrace.

His name is Skip Palenik,

and his son Chris
works there as well.

Skip Palenik is world-renowned.

I mean, he's worked
with Scotland Yard.

He's worked on the, you know,
the Green River Murders,

the JonBenét Ramsey case.

I mean, I could go
on and on and on.

Chris Palenik:
Back in 1960, somebody
took a glass microscope slide,

put the materials down,
added a mounting medium,

it hardened,
and a cover slip on top.

And so, that evidence
is embedded in
the microscope slide.

You can pick it up,
you can hand it around,
you can pass it around.

-You could lick it.
-You could lick it.

And everything that's
in there is preserved.

Even since 2004, DNA technology
has advanced in great strides,

so it's, most likely, still
material with evidential value.

Andy:
One of the crucial things to
remember about Chester's case

is the trial took
place in 1961,

prior to Supreme Court case
Brady v. Maryland,

which said, "The state
has to turn over

any exculpatory information
to the defense."

So, this report, that the hairs
did not match Chester Weger,

they were under no obligation,
legally, to turn it over.

David:
That's not his job.

This was pre-Brady.

Let's be honest,
is it my father's job

to fight for what evidence
was brought into the trial?

That's McNamara's job,
the job of the defense.

However, I'm sure hoping
Andy Hale and his team

have that opportunity.
I hope that happens.

Reporter:
New at 10:00,
Chester Weger,

the so-called
Starved Rock Killer,

pulling into
his new home tonight.

That's after almost
60 years behind bars.

Reporter 2:
Welcome to Chicago.

Can I speak with you
for a moment?

Reporter 3:
How do you feel, Chester?

Reporter 4:
The convicted murderer
tonight

steps into
St. Leonard's
halfway House,

his nieces by his side,

like his family has been
for the past six decades.

(Reporter speaking)

-It's wonderful.
-Yeah.

It's, it's almost
hard to describe.

I mean, it's been, it's been

-our whole lifetime.
-It's surreal, yeah.

(Reporter speaking)

-Carrie Clancy: No.
-Nita Freeman: No.

Carrie:
He's exhausted, sorry.

Nita:
He can't, he can't. Thank you.

-David:
I'm David. Do you remember me?
-Chester: I remember you, David.

-You look great.
-You look great, too.

You look healthy.
You look fantastic.

-You look good.
-Well, what a place to see you.

I'm, I'm happy to see you.

Don't you find it
hard to believe

that somebody from
a normal working class family,

raised in this area,

what, what would have
caused him

to all of a sudden
bludgeon three women to death?

Anthony:
The true story is
with Chester Weger himself,

and he'll never
tell the truth in this case.

Chester was
a different type of person,

and those were things that,

evidence that the public
doesn't know about.

Past history, past experiences
that he had,

and, and it just fit.

David:
My father never said this to me
until I was making this film,

but he believed there was
more to the scenario

than what was in the confession.

He thought there might have been
a sexual motivation.

Looking at a story
over 60 years,

you, you have to go back
to those tidbits,

those little things
that answer questions.

A lot of my communication
with Chester

after I filmed him
was through letters.

They were not only personal,

but they were very revealing
about his true feelings.

He told me about himself
as a boy

witnessing one of his sisters,
Elveta,

being raped
by two neighbor boys.

Chester:
I was eight years old

when much older boys,
they raped my sister.

They forced me to watch.

The attack was, uh,
in my dad's chicken house.

Yes, I was mistreated

by one of my neighbor boys,

and I could not
explain to my folks

because I did not want Chester

to be blamed
for something, you know?

Chester:
It was my job
to protect my sisters.

What would have happened
when I got older?

I don't know
what I would have done.

But I would try to kill 'em.
I know that.

I wouldn't hesitate.

David:
That started the string
of several letters

that got a little darker,
a little stranger.

"For several years afterwards,

"I had a bad dream
about the 1947 rape.

"In each dream I reheard
my sister's 1947 screams.

"So, I married a girl
who was not a virgin.

"It saved me from having
to sexually hurt her

by taking her virginity."

I'm not a therapist,

but there's, there's definitely
a childhood trauma.

When we were in person,
he was very kind.

I don't hate your father.

And he said,
"You know, David,
he just did his job."

Well, I then got a letter
that said,

"Anthony Raccuglia
told sexual lies about me.

"He claimed I raped
an eight-year-old girl

"when I was 12.

"He also said I performed

"some sort of degenerate,

"perverted sexual act

"that left my wife
permanently maimed.

"But the thing that
your father forgot to report,

"if my murderous,
perverted sex weapon

"was my tongue or my penis,

they were the only two Joann had
ever taken sexually from me."

He knew my dad played
professional baseball,

and so, he asked me
if Mickey Mantle and Nellie Fox

stuck baseball bats
up my dad's ass.

Maybe he was just trying
to make me understand

how it felt to have an attack
on someone's sexuality,

whatever it was.

At the end of that
perverted stuff, he wrote,

"David, have a Merry Christmas,
Chester Weger."

I felt like Chester was
working at trying to get me

to understand him as a person.

But for me, the letters painted
a picture of darkness,

and it completely changed
my perspective on Chester Weger.

Chester Weger was a suspect
right from the beginning

because of that juvenile rape
of an eight-year-old girl

when he was 12 years old.

He denied it.
He said he didn't do it.

Chester:
The girl was raped
and I helped her dress.

I carried her home.

This girl's father,
he made the police release me.

David:
So, I dug deep

into the 12-year-old
Chester Weger rape.

I, ultimately, did find
the report,

many, many years after
I interviewed Chester Weger.

It was very detailed.

This young girl,
who was eight years old,

was walking home from school
with Mary Weger,

Chester Weger's sister.

Mary Weger said goodbye to her,
went off on her trail.

Chester Weger grabbed the girl,
raped her.

There was sign
of penetration, blood,

and his parents noticed that he
had blood all over his pants.

And Chester said,
"I killed a snake."

And the police questioned him,
he confessed.

It was a very dark picture
of a sexual troubling.

All of this character analysis

with these priors
was disturbing,

but does that make him
a murderer?

Person:
You can take off your mask now.

Andy:
Poor Chester, I mean,
he gets released from prison

after 60 years,

and the next month,
COVID-19 hits.

Locks him down at his facility.

Family can't come see him,

he can't travel,
can't go anywhere.

When you've been locked up
for 60 years for something
that you didn't do,

and then you finally
get out, and now we have
the pandemic comes.

Once again you're locked up.

(Person on phone speaking)

(Chester speaking)

(Person on phone speaking)

Andy:
The clock's ticking.
Every day matters, every day.

I feel like every
waking moment,

I should be
working on Chester's case.

I always think forensics
is the way to start

if you can do it.

But, at the same time,
I will always ask people,

"Well, what was
word on the street?"

I'm open to anything.

(on phone)
Okay, uh...

Sandra Bland (on phone):
Yes.

Andy:
Do I have your permission
to tape this call?

Sandra:
All right.

Andy: What was it
that Stanley had told you?

Sandra:
That Chester Weger was
not involved in the murder.

It was him and George Spiros.

Andy:
He admitted that to you?

Sandra:
Yes, sir.

Andy:
Wow.

Sandra:
I remember him saying
that the police,

the day they stopped him
in his car,

if they would have searched
the trunk,

they would have found
all the evidence in his trunk.

Andy:
When I heard that,

it sounded too crazy
or good to be true,

but the part that struck me
when I listened to it again

was that it didn't really
seem like

she was trying
to embellish things,

she was telling it
kinda matter of fact.

It sounded credible in terms
of how she told the story.

Sandra (on phone):
He just said it went--
Something went wrong.

Let's go back
to the physical evidence.

The devil's in the details,

and, a lot of times, there's
something insignificant
at first blush

that you later come back to,
and you have, kind of,
an aha moment,

and I had,
kind of, that aha moment
recently in this case.

"No explanation
for end of finger missing,

hole in glove."

Ms. Murphy had

the tip of her left index finger
cut postmortem.

Who does that?

And I think if you look
at how they're laid out,

I mean, it's
a very kinda graphic display.

To me, it's like
a serial killer kinda thing

who wants to collect something
from the crime scene.

That is a very deliberate act,

and that is not Chester Weger.
Give me a break.

(Person speaking)

Well, I think there's somebody
else who was out at the lodge,

and worked there that...

that was involved and, um,

is a more, a much more
logical suspect.

Sandra:
George Spiros.
I know he was involved in that.

Stanley Tucker was like
a instigator.

He would dare George Spiros
to do something,

and George Spiros
didn't have all his marbles,

and he would do it.

It wouldn't surprise me

if Stanley didn't tell
George Spiros,

"Go get those cameras
from them ladies."

And George Spiros
murdered those women.

And I think Stanley
participated in the murder,

so that there was no witnesses.

Karen Norris:
I don't really like
to use the word "psychic,"

because there's a lot
of negative connotation

that comes with those words,
so I use "energy sensitive."

Person:
What did your grandfather
think of your--

He didn't believe in it.

He'd be like, "Oh,
there's nobody here, you know."

"Y-You're crazy,
you're just seeing things."

That's how my grandfather was.

Is Chester Weger responsible

for the murder
of these three women?

I have a male entity
stepping forward saying "no."

I don't know
if that's my grandfather,

but this does not feel
like my grandfather.

Ooh...

A really aggressive...

a really aggressive
male energy, um, ooh...

A really aggressive
male energy telling me

that I don't wanna go down
this path, that I need
to stop where I am

because I'm not going to like
the answers that I get.

Um, I think
this is George Spiros.

I think, I think
this is George Spiros, oh...

I feel really threatened.

Whew!

Um...

He's telling me
to stay out of it.

(exhales sharply)

David:
You know, to say this story

has become more colorful

is a very large understatement.

Dave Marsh:
Well, George
would take the opportunity

to go to the crime scene,
and do whatever
was on his mind,

pretty freaky things.

That would be consistent
with the women...

David:
As a filmmaker, I went in deep.

I found myself at night
on these blogs

reading all of this incredibly
crazy information,

things that I--
were hard to believe,

but, you know,
I tend to be a believer.

But I started to realize
that there was a couple
of people in town

that were not very credible.

Dave:
There's a wound,
there's a wound,

and there's a wound.

This is a torture technique.

When the cut is made,

the, uh, ligaments
in the arm snap back.

The Chinese Triads call it
"death by a thousand cuts."

The person that would,
specifically, know
this technique

would be George Spiros
because he's been trained

for the CIA and other
clandestine operations.

If you look back in history,

an operation that was
going on around the world,

uh, was called Operation Gladio,

which was, basically,
just mayhem and terrorism
everywhere.

The first Operation Gladio event

was probably
the Starved Rock murders.

Excuse me.

If you study the history
of these pedophile rings,

you always find judges,
governors.

"I'm gonna go have a sex orgy at
the Starved Rock Lodge, honey.
Y-Ya got a problem with that?"

Nobody wants to talk about it,
there's a fear.

You gotta be careful
what you say.

And I don't really know
anything about the senator,

but, uh, give me some liquor
and I'll speculate.

(laughs)

David:
David Marsh is

unapologetically inappropriate.

I mean, the things that he
comes up with, the theories,

and they don't help the case.

Dan Churney:
There's this hardcore group
of people who believe Weger

is framed, and they're just,
you know, one-track mind.

It's hard to have a conversation
with them about it.

Steve Stout:
I know David Marsh, yes.

We've had some... discussions.

He enrages me.

I'd rather not be talking
about him, personally.

I mean, he's,
I think, dangerous.

Dave (on phone):
This is David Marsh.

You hung up on me
'cause I yelled at you.

You are the biggest pussy
I've ever talked to in my life

if you thought
that was yelling.

Th-That's just his nature.

And he came in several times
to the newspaper,

and the authorities
were called in.

David:
The Free Chester Weger group

went from being,
sort of, rumors and innuendo

to lunatic fringe.

Mary:
Everybody that sticks
their nose in this

that don't know him--

I have nothing to do
with Free Chester Weger.

As a matter of fact,

we call them
"The Three Stooges."

I try to say,
"Stay out of it.
Leave him alone."

It-- All it does is
it hurts the case.

It does-- It hurts my brother.

(cat meows)

Deedra Fox:
We started out
with the best intentions.

We were led down a dark road.

Dave Marsh destroyed me.

He destroyed Bob Petre.

And we were led to believe,
the end of our movie,

we're gonna film Chester
coming through the gates,

and him grabbing
your guys' hands and crying.

And I wish that's
the way it had happened.

But it didn't.

(peaceful guitar playing)

Person:
We have one more topic here,
the documentary.

David Raccuglia,
I believe, whose father,

Tony Raccuglia, coincidentally,

I'm sure they had
some fun Thanksgiving dinners.

I mean, we're going back
almost 60 years now.

How do you begin...?

Anthony:
Why are you doing this?

What motivation do you have?

I wonder about what this
is gonna really do for you.

Through grade school,
through high school,

didn't I tell you the same
things I'm telling you now?

There just isn't any doubt
that the man was guilty.

David:
I don't have
the confidence my father had

that Chester Weger was guilty.

I also don't believe
he's a hundred percent innocent.

(on computer)
So, let's start
with the beating.

I went back to the interview
that I did with Chester Weger.

Sher-Sheriff Eutsey

started out by jabbing me
in the stomach

with a, a nightstick.

David:
The first time
I interviewed Chester,

I was infuriated, you know?

It sounded like the confession

was completely
coerced out of him.
I got a little angry.

If others hadn't been there,
I, I think he, actually,
would have killed me

'cause Eutsey, Eutsey went nuts.

Chester was not
physically abused at all.

And you have to remember
he had the opportunity

to challenge the confessions
at a separate hearing.

If he was going to claim someone
beat the confession out of him,

that's when it should
have been made, and it wasn't.

He never at any time

said anybody beat
the statement out of him

in order to get him
to admit to the killing.

I thought, yeah, you know,
that's, that's interesting.

I got all the transcripts,

everything I could get
on the trial,
and I started reading.

There's not one mention
of beatings
and physical abuse in 1960.

To deem that confession
admissible,
they had a long hearing.

Anthony:
We put on about
a dozen witnesses to testify

to show the confession
was a voluntary statement.

David:
And Herschel Weger
said to all of that,

"My son seemed like
he was fine."

And Chester was asked
the same questions.

"I was not beaten."

I was given cigarettes
and sandwiches.
I was treated well."

I saw no intimidation
or anything.

He seemed very willing,

very friendly with them,
I would say.

Especially with Dummett,
he seemed to be very friendly.

David:
It wasn't just
Dummett and Hess,

court reporters, psychologists.

His confession of this crime
was given to many.

There was a photo of Chester
with his shirt off.

There was a doctor's report,
and it said

Chester was not beaten
the night of the confession.

Chester's own words,

his side of the story,

is completely different
than public record.

These other people,
it's really hard to believe

that they would be part of
a conspiracy to frame Chester.

The conspiracy
has to keep getting bigger
and bigger and bigger.

Sheriff Eutsey bragged
about what he done to me,
everybody knew about it.

I told McNamara, and he told me

that the police were gonna deny
that they done it, that--

and I just went
by what McNamara told me.

McNamara told me
to forget about it.

Impossible.

McNamara was very adamant

at the corruptness
of the law enforcement

on this case.

Very adamant.

He would have had that
tattooed on his arm

that Chester was beaten.

To keep that fact out
makes no sense.

I don't believe he was beaten.

Andy:
He says he was beaten.

I believe that.

But whether there
was or wasn't,

I think the threats of death,

and all the coercive techniques
that have gone on
since September,

their game plan worked.

Chester, I believe,

added color to the story
after years in prison.

So, we're entering Oglesby.

This is where Chester Weger's
family home was.

According to
the clemency petition,
on the day of the murder,

Chester would have visited
Franklin's Barber Shop,

which is right here.

Chester:
The time this crime happened,

Stanley Tucker
had taken me to Oglesby,

and I got a haircut
at Ben Franklin's Barber Shop.

I told the police
when they first questioned me.

David:
That's the new alibi
that came out in 2003.

Chester claims he told that
to law enforcement

right from the beginning,

so I started digging
for more documents,

and I came across
the original police file.

This was the first time
the police ever interviewed him.

"I finished work
about 2:45 or 3 PM,

and went down to the basement,
and wrote a letter to a girl."

The jury heard one alibi
in 1960,

and it was the same one
he told the police.

There's no mention
of Stanley Tucker.

He never mentioned
anything about haircuts,

and things like that.

I believe Chester might have
not been telling me the truth.

Donna Kelly was very adamant
he was getting a haircut.

She had a man who was quite
elderly sign an affidavit.

I, I don't know, I don't know
why he never come in, you know?

I was told he had died,
and, and, and, uh,

I-- my father
thought he had died, too.

Brian:
Chester Weger
had many, many years

to try to think of,

uh, "Okay, well, maybe this
was this or that was that."

"Oh, check with so-and-so
because I was there."

An alternate reality

can suddenly become reality
in some people's minds.

(Chester speaking)

It's an interesting ride
when you interview him

because he changes the story.

(Chester speaking on phone)

I don't even wanna say lies,
but the truth is,

they're looking like lies
at this point.

Every shoot,
Chester had a whole new story.

David:
He told me this whole story

that is nowhere
to be found in 1960.

DJ:
I'm still a little
uncomfortable about it,

but there it is
on the front page.

You know, the Facebook
meatheads are like,
"Oh, he didn't do it.

He didn't do it.
He's innocent."

The same Facebook meatheads
are now like...

(slaps desk)
"I can't believe
he's living next door!"

(laughs)
815-223-30--

Nita:
So, he's finally home,

and we weren't even

at the new house
for 15 minutes,

and The News Tribune
knocked on our front door,

and he said,
"LaSalle County needs
to know that he's here."

That's when the fiasco
started with the city
and the police department.

-They were harassing him.
-Carrie: Yeah.

The harassment's
gonna continue,
and has continued,

and no matter where
he moves, it's gonna,
it's gonna continue.

-Carrie: Yeah.
-Nita: And now,
they're adding

the sexual offender registry
on him now, too.

Johnny is labeled
as a sex offender as well,

so they are not allowed
to see each other.

And, and Johnny's crushed
just like he is.

(Chester speaking)

Nita:
We always ask him,
"What do you want us to do?"

He wants to be cleared.

That's-- We're gonna
continue to fight until

he is vindicated.

And we know
it's gonna happen.

-Yep.
-We just don't know when.

Photographer:
Let me just take
a few more shots.

(camera shutter clicking)

David:
The span of time,

to me, that's the biggest
hurdle we're gonna have to jump

in order to get to the truth.

There's not
a lot of people left.

My father, Harland Warren,
these people are gone.

I thought the only one left
in this case would have been
Chester Weger

after my father passed away.

It wasn't true.

This was my father's
first case.

He was 26 years old.

You were both very young
and very early in your careers,

and you both had
such an impact on this case.

That's pretty rare.

Bill Jansen:
You learn by experience.

You ran into a lot
of different characters

that could have done it,
you know?

That's all part of,
of a criminal investigation,

but I thought to myself,
this case has to be solved.

It has to be solved.

David:
Back in 1960,

Bill Jansen was handpicked

to give fresh eyes to the case.

I mean, this is a man who,

later in life,
went into the FBI,

became a judge.

He made a lot of sense,
and what he said, for me,

changed everything
about the case.

Bill:
The superintendent of
the Illinois State Police said,

"I'm assigning you to
the Starved Rock murders case

because there
was a standstill."

Few suspects, but really
nothing definite going on.

Complicated case,
very complicated.

It was from the beginning.

Now the details
set out in the confession,
it just didn't make sense.

The women were found
at St. Louis Canyon.

There's quite a distance from
the lodge to the crime scene.

That trail was treacherous.

Ms. Oetting had a bad back,
a slipped disk.

Now to walk that with
a bad back and a slipped disk,
it's almost impossible.

I walked it several times during
good weather and it is tough.

But going in the West entrance,
it's flat,

just walked right in.

I believe someone
gave 'em a ride

to the West entrance
of the canyon.

George Spiros
saw the three women

in front of the--
what they call
the root beer stand,

saw them walk past.

Timewise, there's quite
a distance

from the lodge
to that root beer stand,

and then, to go
all the way back...

and then, down
through the trail...

I, I just don't believe it.

I, I, still to this day,
believe that they
were given a ride

to the West entrance
of St. Louis Canyon.

A little later,
another witness

saw a black car
in the parking lot

at, at St. Louis Canyon,
the West entrance.

Person:
Can you read
that witness statement?

Bill:
Yeah. "One man,
leather fringe jacket,

"the two men standing
behind the trunk,

and he was pouring water
on the other man's hand."

Stanley Tucker has
a black Cadillac.

I'm strongly convinced

that Stanley Tucker
gave 'em a ride

to the West entrance
of the canyon.

That put 'em together.

That's why Chester Weger
and Stanley Tucker

were the two main suspects
in this case.

(Person speaking)

No, no.

But that was
up to Harland Warren.

They didn't have enough,
I guess, to prosecute him on.

Uh... and I, still to this day,

I said, I, I don't see how
he did it by himself,

but he said he did.

Was he by himself?

Stanley Tucker,

whether he went
into the canyon with Chester,

only Chester can answer that.

(Person speaking)

He was a good guy.

Stanley, Stanley wouldn't
bother nobody.

Person:
One of the things, Chester,
that I wanted to ask you about,

you wrote this letter
to your father.

This.

What year is this?
Do you know?

Person:
This is December 13th.
It's 1960.

So this, David, actually,
found in a stack of papers.

David:
This letter...

this letter, you know,

incredibly cryptic
and hard to understand.

Chester wrote this
to his father

while he was awaiting trial
at county jail.

"Dear Dad, I don't know
how to say this,

"but I have to, and I don't
want you saying anything.

"If you do, I'll see myself
that I get the electric chair.

"Any ideas you have
that if I never told the truth,

"you were going
to tell the truth yourself

"who killed these people.

"Only I could tell you,

"and despite of what I never
will tell you the real truth.

"Your life, Mom's life,

"Joann's life,

and the kids'
mean more to me than my own."

I think what he's trying
to say is,

"I'm not the murderer,
but I'm harboring information."

"I've only got
two choices, Dad:
to fight it in court,

"and either burn or see
bloody harm come to you,

"or to stick with the story
and to give life to all.

"But I want you to know
I'm not the one.

"Tell no one this
and I promise you this,

"if you do at any time,

"I'll burn because
I won't see you hurt

for something I can't
and I won't ever tell you."

(Mary speaking)

David:
"I'm young.

"I have read the Bible,
and I believe in the Lord,

"and I'm not afraid.

"So, forgive me.

Your son, Chester."

Andy:
"Your son, Chester O. Weger."

Were you ever protecting
anybody else that, actually,
did the murders?

-No, no.
-Okay.

Protecting somebody else
who may have killed somebody--

and you didn't want
to tattle on them?

Andy:
Can we, maybe, take a break?

David:
That letter made me feel
Chester is hiding something.

If it wasn't him, it was someone
else that he had knowledge

because then he came back
and said, "I am not the one."

"The one."

When I was
making the documentary,

the Spiros name kept coming up.

Bill Jansen took
the heat off Spiros,

and started to shine
the light a little bit more
on Stanley Tucker.

I told the police, I said,
"You arrest Stanley Tucker."

I said, "I'm gonna,
I'm gonna testify for him

because I know
the man's innocent.
He was with me."

David:
It's possible that Chester
sticks up for Stanley,

uses Stanley in his alibi

because Chester and Stanley
were together

on the day of the murder.

I, I can't remember
too much about it.

It's been so long ago.

David:
Time has warped the perception,

and I'm not sure
Chester Weger's capable

of answering
the questions anymore.

Andy, I spent a lot of time
interviewing Chester.

Things like his alibi.

That was a very
inconsistent story.

I can't tell you whether
he's telling the truth
when he says he was beaten,

uh, when he says
his alibi was X, Y, and Z.

Uh, those things
may or may not be true.

But there's all the elements
of a false confession.

The crime scene
is not compatible

-with his story
and the confession.
-Right.

That's why I'm sitting
here today.

I think he is not
a reliable storyteller

40, 50, 60 years later.

The damage to a person
after four decades in prison

can be substantial,
especially if you're innocent.

That's why I've looked at,
kind of, the evidence
as opposed to,

you know, whether
he said something that,
that did or didn't make sense.

David:
The ironic thing
about this case

is we've uncovered

an incredible amount
of information,

but I-I-I'm not sure
I can do any more.

It's, kind of, up to Andy Hale
to take it from here.

Andy:
If your dad was here right now,
if I were to say to him,

"Would you be interested
in DNA testing?"
What do you think he would say?

I'm positive
he would be interested
in DNA testing.

That is the only way
conclusion is going to come,

through a DNA match
of either Chester Weger
or another individual.

Andy:
Let's be real,
today is our biggest day.

-We're not asking the court
to declare Chester innocent.
-Right.

We're simply asking,

let us have access
to the physical evidence,

so Microtrace can do analysis.

Carrie:
You know,
we wanna clear his name

before he does pass.
That is my, my biggest fear,

is not being able to do that
for him before he passes--

-Mary: And I think
he'll keep fighting, he will.
-'cause he wants it so bad.

-He wants it so bad.
-Mary: 'Cause that's what
he said all these years.

"I'll fight it 'til
the day I die."

-And I think that's
what has kept him going.
-It's kept him going.

-It really has.
-Mary: Because that's exactly
what he's done.

God is with us.

All the way through.

Andy:
Absolutely, absolutely.

Steve:
Is that why we're here,
looking for justice?

Is it a search for justice,

or is it a search
for a settlement?

Mary:
Everybody thinks
that we're in it for the money.

We're not in it for the money.
I'm not in it for the money.

I want the world,
because this is worldwide,

and I want those people to know
that my brother did not do this.

(Judge speaking)

Andy:
Hallelujah!

-Yeah.
-Mary: Finally, finally.

Oh my gosh.

The judge started talking
about the history of the case.

It sounded like
we were gonna lose again.

But then, when he said,
"You know what?

This isn't fair.
It's not fair."

Can you hear me, young man?

Chester (on phone):
Yes.

So, we took a huge
step forward today.

We'll be able to test
this evidence,

and prove your innocence.
How about that?

We just had to call,
and tell you the good news.

I love you, brother.

All:
Love you, Chester!

(Mary laughs)

Steve:
I'm here to protect the story.

That's the only reason
I'm sitting here.

I stand for the prosecution.

I stand for the truth.

And I know that sounds
pretty noble,

but that's just
what, what I am right now.

And I'll protect this story
until my last breath.

David:
When it comes to true crime,

everyone wants to be
part of solving something.

Decade after decade,

generation after generation,

it snowballed out of control.

(cat meows)

Mary:
I put all these memories away.

Everything just comes
flooding back.

Early this morning,
I, I dreamt about my mom.

She don't have
to go through it no more.

David:
Let's face it, this is
a collateral damage story.

I feel for the families.

They're gonna have
to hear this story again...

be emotionally brought back
to all of this trauma.

I wish my father was alive
to talk to him about this.

You know,
I know deep down he supported
what we were doing .

We're getting everything
out on the table.

What is fact?

What is fiction?

That somebody really looked
into this case.

(pensive music playing)

("Devil or Angel" by
Bobby Vee playing)

♪ Devil or angel ♪

♪ I can't make up my mind ♪

♪ Which one you are ♪

♪ I'd like to wake up
and find ♪

♪ Devil or angel ♪

♪ Dear, whichever you are ♪

♪ I miss you ♪

♪ I miss you ♪

♪ I-I mi-i-i-iss you ♪

♪ Devil or angel ♪

♪ Please say you'll be mine ♪

♪ Love me or leave me ♪

♪ I'll go out of my mind ♪

♪ Devil or angel ♪

♪ Dear, whichever you are ♪

♪ I love you ♪

♪ I love you ♪

♪ I love you ♪