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- The first Kurosawa
film I think I ever saw
2
00:00:27,288 --> 00:00:30,987
was "Throne of Blood" on
the Z Channel.
3
00:00:31,031 --> 00:00:33,076
- A Fellini film, "I Vitelloni."
4
00:00:33,120 --> 00:00:35,165
- There was a picture
called "Spider's Stratagem."
5
00:00:35,209 --> 00:00:37,559
- Sam Peckinpah, "Wild Bunch."
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00:00:37,602 --> 00:00:40,953
- The "Straw Dogs," "Bring Me
the Head of Alfredo Garcia."
7
00:00:40,997 --> 00:00:42,738
- "The Story of Adele H."
8
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[upbeat music]
9
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- "Sunlights."
10
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- "Rear Window."
11
00:00:48,831 --> 00:00:49,832
- "Midnight Cowboy."
12
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- "Ikiru."
13
00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:52,008
- "Song Remains the Same."
14
00:00:52,052 --> 00:00:53,488
- "Johnny Guitar."
15
00:00:53,531 --> 00:00:54,271
- "The Onion Field."
16
00:00:54,315 --> 00:00:55,098
- "Los Olvidados."
17
00:00:55,142 --> 00:00:56,360
- "Man Who Fell to Earth."
18
00:00:56,404 --> 00:00:59,146
- Every film that Marlon
Brando was ever in.
19
00:00:59,189 --> 00:01:01,670
[upbeat music]
20
00:01:06,414 --> 00:01:07,154
- Z Channel.
21
00:01:07,197 --> 00:01:07,980
- Z Channel.
22
00:01:08,024 --> 00:01:08,764
- Z Channel.
23
00:01:08,807 --> 00:01:09,808
- Our salvation.
24
00:01:09,852 --> 00:01:10,896
- Uncharted territory.
25
00:01:10,940 --> 00:01:12,768
- Like tom toms in the jungle.
26
00:01:12,811 --> 00:01:16,119
[upbeat music]
27
00:01:16,163 --> 00:01:16,902
- Jerry Harvey.
28
00:01:16,946 --> 00:01:17,642
- Jerry Harvey.
29
00:01:17,686 --> 00:01:18,687
- Programmer.
30
00:01:18,730 --> 00:01:19,470
- Obsessive programmer.
31
00:01:19,514 --> 00:01:20,384
- Dark negative.
32
00:01:20,428 --> 00:01:21,168
- Maverick.
33
00:01:21,211 --> 00:01:22,560
- Nurturing.
34
00:01:22,604 --> 00:01:25,476
- Skating that line between
insanity and genius.
35
00:01:26,347 --> 00:01:27,522
- [Interviewer] What
do you think
36
00:01:27,565 --> 00:01:31,308
the secret of the Z
Channel success is?
37
00:01:31,352 --> 00:01:32,440
- I don't know.
38
00:01:33,963 --> 00:01:37,619
If I told you, then it
wouldn't be a secret.
39
00:01:37,662 --> 00:01:41,231
- My father says there's
only right and wrong,
40
00:01:41,275 --> 00:01:44,104
good and evil,
nothing in between.
41
00:01:47,107 --> 00:01:48,673
It isn't that simple, is it?
42
00:01:48,717 --> 00:01:52,242
- No, it isn't, it
should be, but it isn't.
43
00:01:55,463 --> 00:01:57,682
[theme song]
44
00:01:59,249 --> 00:02:01,077
- [Narrator] Panic's
Newstime 606,
45
00:02:01,121 --> 00:02:03,558
a Hollywood story with a
tragic ending this morning.
46
00:02:03,601 --> 00:02:06,082
The bodies of Z Channel
programmer, Jerry Harvey,
47
00:02:06,126 --> 00:02:07,605
and his wife, Deri Rudulph,
48
00:02:07,649 --> 00:02:09,651
were discovered Saturday
night in their Westwood home.
49
00:02:09,694 --> 00:02:11,870
Police report Harvey
shot and killed Rudulph,
50
00:02:11,914 --> 00:02:13,089
his wife of two years,
51
00:02:13,133 --> 00:02:14,699
before turning the
gun on himself.
52
00:02:14,743 --> 00:02:16,136
The motive is unknown.
53
00:02:16,179 --> 00:02:18,312
Harvey had been chief
programmer at Z Channel
54
00:02:18,355 --> 00:02:19,574
which is known
throughout Los Angeles
55
00:02:19,617 --> 00:02:21,924
for its eclectic and
innovative programming.
56
00:02:21,967 --> 00:02:25,362
Both Harvey and Rudulph
were 39 years old.
57
00:02:26,494 --> 00:02:29,018
[upbeat music]
58
00:03:03,270 --> 00:03:05,489
- So it was back in 1974
59
00:03:05,533 --> 00:03:08,231
and I just started
selling cable television
60
00:03:08,275 --> 00:03:10,364
and the Z Channel had
just started
61
00:03:10,407 --> 00:03:12,496
so we came up here to the
Hollywood Hills
62
00:03:12,540 --> 00:03:13,758
and it was really great
63
00:03:13,802 --> 00:03:16,196
because these people
had terrible reception,
64
00:03:16,239 --> 00:03:18,023
they couldn't see anything
on their television,
65
00:03:18,067 --> 00:03:20,374
and not only were we
offering the good reception,
66
00:03:20,417 --> 00:03:23,464
we gave the movies
uncut and no commercials
67
00:03:23,507 --> 00:03:24,943
in their bedroom, in
their living room,
68
00:03:24,987 --> 00:03:26,423
wherever they wanted it.
69
00:03:26,467 --> 00:03:28,947
They ate it up, it was
very, very successful.
70
00:03:28,991 --> 00:03:31,211
- It was amazing.
71
00:03:31,254 --> 00:03:32,821
I had friends over all the time
72
00:03:32,864 --> 00:03:36,825
because they showed two
movies a night as I recall,
73
00:03:36,868 --> 00:03:39,349
and they were uncut,
uninterrupted.
74
00:03:39,393 --> 00:03:41,830
It was this phenomenon
no one had ever seen it.
75
00:03:41,873 --> 00:03:42,961
- Theta and the Z Channel
76
00:03:43,005 --> 00:03:44,833
was the only one in
the major cities
77
00:03:44,876 --> 00:03:47,009
as New York did not have
it at the time,
78
00:03:47,052 --> 00:03:49,403
Los Angeles was the first
one to do that.
79
00:03:49,446 --> 00:03:53,581
- That this actually existed,
you could see this stuff
80
00:03:53,624 --> 00:03:56,366
was incredible so I was
like, we've got to get this.
81
00:03:56,410 --> 00:03:58,238
So I was living in El
Segundo at the time
82
00:03:58,281 --> 00:04:03,068
and my mom called up and no,
Z Channel wasn't in our area.
83
00:04:03,895 --> 00:04:07,812
- Not only was Theta in that
area along the foothills,
84
00:04:07,856 --> 00:04:10,293
but it was who was in the
homes along the foothills
85
00:04:10,337 --> 00:04:14,210
and those were the folks
that ran the movie industry.
86
00:04:14,254 --> 00:04:16,995
- They were filmed for
the whole family,
87
00:04:17,039 --> 00:04:19,998
but I thought slanted
to adults a little bit
88
00:04:20,042 --> 00:04:22,392
and those are the films
I tried to get.
89
00:04:22,436 --> 00:04:24,264
- "Chinatown" was on a
lot in those days,
90
00:04:24,307 --> 00:04:26,483
they used to run it a lot.
91
00:04:26,527 --> 00:04:27,789
And it was one of my
favorite movies
92
00:04:27,832 --> 00:04:29,225
and I ended up seeing it
93
00:04:29,269 --> 00:04:31,793
like three or four times
a week at certain points.
94
00:04:31,836 --> 00:04:34,230
- I publicized the
shows that we were doing
95
00:04:34,274 --> 00:04:37,015
in Hollywood trade papers,
"Variety" and "Reporter,"
96
00:04:37,059 --> 00:04:40,410
and gradually word
began to spread.
97
00:04:40,454 --> 00:04:43,065
- I think it's interesting
too to note that in that time,
98
00:04:43,108 --> 00:04:44,414
it's hard to remember this,
99
00:04:44,458 --> 00:04:45,981
I tell my kids about it
and they don't believe me,
100
00:04:46,024 --> 00:04:49,680
but there was a time when there
was no Blockbuster stores,
101
00:04:49,724 --> 00:04:54,598
there was no video cassettes,
none of that existed.
102
00:04:54,642 --> 00:04:56,426
- You have to understand
this just before HBO,
103
00:04:56,470 --> 00:04:58,428
before Showtime,
before any of that,
104
00:04:58,472 --> 00:05:00,212
and it was really really
groundbreaking.
105
00:05:00,256 --> 00:05:02,693
[upbeat music]
106
00:05:09,396 --> 00:05:13,356
- When I left, Hal
Kaufman, he took my place.
107
00:05:13,400 --> 00:05:15,402
I remember he had an
assistant who we hired,
108
00:05:15,445 --> 00:05:16,838
the Jerry Harvey,
109
00:05:16,881 --> 00:05:20,145
and that was my first
contact with Jerry Harvey.
110
00:05:20,189 --> 00:05:22,887
- The Z Channel hired a person
111
00:05:22,931 --> 00:05:24,541
that really made the Z Channel,
112
00:05:24,585 --> 00:05:26,151
probably put the Z
Channel on the map
113
00:05:26,195 --> 00:05:27,979
and that's Jerry Harvey.
114
00:05:30,504 --> 00:05:32,288
- Jerry probably is one
of those students
115
00:05:32,332 --> 00:05:37,380
that a teacher encounters
every so often and thinks,
116
00:05:37,424 --> 00:05:40,688
I think the students
probably smarter than I am.
117
00:05:40,731 --> 00:05:42,472
- I had just broken up
with my girlfriend
118
00:05:42,516 --> 00:05:45,127
and so I was standing
at the Dixon Art Center
119
00:05:45,170 --> 00:05:46,694
looking rather
forlorn apparently,
120
00:05:46,737 --> 00:05:48,391
and he kind of
recognized the look
121
00:05:48,435 --> 00:05:51,351
and walk up to me and
said, I recognize the look.
122
00:05:51,394 --> 00:05:52,656
And so we started talking
123
00:05:52,700 --> 00:05:55,485
and we spent the entire day
124
00:05:55,529 --> 00:05:59,184
having lunch and talking about
movies and that's how we met.
125
00:05:59,228 --> 00:06:01,491
- So many of my students,
126
00:06:01,535 --> 00:06:02,884
when they're
interested in movies
127
00:06:02,927 --> 00:06:06,670
are only interested in the
art movies, the Indies,
128
00:06:09,586 --> 00:06:13,503
Jerry loved 'em all and hated
them all when they were bad.
129
00:06:13,547 --> 00:06:17,377
- With Jerry, you always
talked about movies,
130
00:06:17,420 --> 00:06:19,335
his entire frame of
reference was films.
131
00:06:19,379 --> 00:06:23,165
- I started getting these
weekly telephone calls
132
00:06:23,208 --> 00:06:25,210
towards the end of each week
133
00:06:25,254 --> 00:06:29,127
from this obviously very
young, intense young man
134
00:06:30,564 --> 00:06:32,522
asking me for a rundown
135
00:06:33,697 --> 00:06:37,222
of what the good pictures
were going to be
136
00:06:37,266 --> 00:06:38,136
that particular week.
137
00:06:38,441 --> 00:06:40,530
- I think the first contact
138
00:06:41,836 --> 00:06:44,360
or a memory I have of
Jerry Harvey
139
00:06:44,404 --> 00:06:47,711
was when he was booking
the Beverly Cannon.
140
00:06:51,106 --> 00:06:53,238
- I heard about Jerry's work
long before I heard about Jerry
141
00:06:53,282 --> 00:06:55,197
because I heard about his
work for the Beverly Cannon.
142
00:06:55,240 --> 00:06:56,633
I was going to Cal Arts,
143
00:06:56,677 --> 00:06:58,418
an art school 30 miles
north of Los Angeles
144
00:06:58,461 --> 00:07:00,158
and everybody was talking
about the Beverly Cannon,
145
00:07:00,202 --> 00:07:02,596
especially when he ran
the uncut "Wild Bunch,"
146
00:07:02,639 --> 00:07:05,381
I mean, that was like
missile blast,
147
00:07:05,425 --> 00:07:07,731
everybody who loved film
knew about this.
148
00:07:07,775 --> 00:07:11,648
- And on a rainy day in
Beverly Cannon theater,
149
00:07:12,997 --> 00:07:14,564
2000 people
150
00:07:14,608 --> 00:07:17,611
or however many people
showed up for the screening.
151
00:07:17,654 --> 00:07:19,177
- I think a great coup
in his life happened
152
00:07:19,221 --> 00:07:21,615
because Peckinpah arrived
with the print.
153
00:07:21,658 --> 00:07:23,181
And it certainly was momentous
154
00:07:23,225 --> 00:07:27,577
because his bond with Peckinpah
just extended from there.
155
00:07:28,839 --> 00:07:30,624
- Jerry certainly was
one of the people
156
00:07:30,667 --> 00:07:35,193
that looked up to Sam as I
guess kind of a father figure.
157
00:07:35,237 --> 00:07:38,893
Jerry felt that way about
a number of creative people
158
00:07:38,936 --> 00:07:41,504
that he admired and appreciated.
159
00:07:44,159 --> 00:07:46,030
- He was always surprising me,
160
00:07:46,074 --> 00:07:49,991
it was Sam this and
Bob that and I thought,
161
00:07:50,034 --> 00:07:53,211
whoa, how did you get
to meet these people?
162
00:07:53,255 --> 00:07:54,996
- That he arranged a screening
163
00:07:55,039 --> 00:07:57,433
for "Some Call It Loving" there.
164
00:07:57,477 --> 00:07:59,130
You can't help but
respect someone
165
00:07:59,174 --> 00:08:03,657
who has taken all the time
and effort to educate himself,
166
00:08:03,700 --> 00:08:06,137
become familiar with not
only my films,
167
00:08:06,181 --> 00:08:09,619
which ones I did with Kubrick
of course weren't obscure
168
00:08:09,663 --> 00:08:12,883
but "Some Call It Loving"
was kind of an obscure film.
169
00:08:12,927 --> 00:08:16,017
- I met Jerry Harvey in
my mother's living room.
170
00:08:16,060 --> 00:08:19,847
She worked with Jim Harris at
the time and they were friends
171
00:08:19,890 --> 00:08:22,458
and I came bounding
into her house
172
00:08:22,502 --> 00:08:24,895
and he was standing there,
173
00:08:24,939 --> 00:08:27,289
it was kind of love at
first sight, I think.
174
00:08:27,332 --> 00:08:28,725
We stayed on the phone
175
00:08:28,769 --> 00:08:31,511
that night after he left
my house for 11 hours.
176
00:08:31,554 --> 00:08:33,904
He came over the next
night after that
177
00:08:33,948 --> 00:08:37,952
and I don't think he ever
left for three years.
178
00:08:37,995 --> 00:08:41,085
- He had aspirations to
be a filmmaker,
179
00:08:42,347 --> 00:08:46,438
or at least to start
out as a screenwriter.
180
00:08:46,482 --> 00:08:47,918
- We wrote a script together
181
00:08:47,962 --> 00:08:51,748
about two college kids who
were witness to a murder
182
00:08:55,099 --> 00:08:58,842
and that's how we really
started writing together
183
00:08:58,886 --> 00:09:03,064
and we ended up getting
the agency off of that,
184
00:09:03,107 --> 00:09:04,674
meeting Monte Hellman.
185
00:09:04,718 --> 00:09:08,504
- Jerry was also involved
in the making of a film,
186
00:09:08,548 --> 00:09:11,594
a Western that he had
written I believe
187
00:09:11,638 --> 00:09:13,640
and that he was able
to raise the financing
188
00:09:13,683 --> 00:09:15,337
and went over to Italy to do it.
189
00:09:15,380 --> 00:09:17,469
[upbeat music]
190
00:09:17,513 --> 00:09:19,689
[gunshot]
191
00:09:28,568 --> 00:09:30,700
- Are you satisfied now?
192
00:09:30,744 --> 00:09:34,704
- You ain't going to last long,
son.
193
00:09:34,748 --> 00:09:37,098
There ain't no
softhearted gunfighters.
194
00:09:37,141 --> 00:09:39,622
- "China 9" was
really great fun.
195
00:09:39,666 --> 00:09:43,147
I can always remember we flew
into Rome, landed in Rome,
196
00:09:43,191 --> 00:09:46,542
was picked up by the limo
at the airport
197
00:09:46,586 --> 00:09:51,112
and then went to hell Maria,
had a great group of people.
198
00:09:51,155 --> 00:09:53,941
Warren Oates was there,
Fabio Testi,
199
00:09:53,984 --> 00:09:57,640
Jenny Agutter, Sam
Peckinpah, and Monte Hellman.
200
00:09:57,684 --> 00:10:02,471
We just had the best time, one
of the best times of my life.
201
00:10:02,993 --> 00:10:05,430
[upbeat music]
202
00:10:06,780 --> 00:10:10,784
- There was of course a
tremendous black period
203
00:10:10,827 --> 00:10:14,135
when his sister, Ann,
committed suicide.
204
00:10:18,530 --> 00:10:20,271
- Jerry spoke to his
sister all the time,
205
00:10:20,315 --> 00:10:25,102
they were very, very close,
great friends and he adored her.
206
00:10:26,364 --> 00:10:31,282
- Ann checked herself into a
hospital when Jerry was gone
207
00:10:31,326 --> 00:10:36,113
and I believe that she was
waiting for him to come back.
208
00:10:36,548 --> 00:10:38,507
She had left a suicide tape
209
00:10:38,550 --> 00:10:40,988
that was her talking
to Jerry while she died
210
00:10:41,031 --> 00:10:44,600
explaining everything that
had transpired in her life
211
00:10:44,644 --> 00:10:46,602
that led to this decision.
212
00:10:47,429 --> 00:10:49,387
She was really his anchor
213
00:10:49,431 --> 00:10:52,216
and not only did she go
mad, but now she was gone.
214
00:10:52,260 --> 00:10:55,176
And he came back to
have this happen,
215
00:10:56,438 --> 00:10:59,571
and by the time I saw him,
he was crazy.
216
00:10:59,615 --> 00:11:01,791
I'd never seen him so crazy.
217
00:11:03,706 --> 00:11:05,055
- We got married pretty
quickly after that,
218
00:11:05,099 --> 00:11:07,710
we got married in February 1978.
219
00:11:10,582 --> 00:11:13,194
Part of what was really
attractive about it at the time
220
00:11:13,237 --> 00:11:15,109
was we'd already been
having this affair,
221
00:11:15,152 --> 00:11:17,677
but then he was just so
vulnerable and reaching out
222
00:11:17,720 --> 00:11:20,418
and so I blamed the
things that I saw
223
00:11:20,462 --> 00:11:22,420
that seemed dark and
scary to me,
224
00:11:22,464 --> 00:11:25,685
I blamed on the fact that he
was in mourning over his sister
225
00:11:25,728 --> 00:11:28,035
and assumed that my loving him
226
00:11:28,078 --> 00:11:30,733
would make those things
go away and be better.
227
00:11:30,777 --> 00:11:32,039
- We were still very
close friends,
228
00:11:32,082 --> 00:11:35,346
but we weren't really
partners in activity,
229
00:11:35,390 --> 00:11:37,827
we didn't write anything
together after that,
230
00:11:37,871 --> 00:11:40,047
we never did.
231
00:11:44,312 --> 00:11:48,795
- At the time, there was
only Select TV and ON TV
232
00:11:48,838 --> 00:11:52,233
as cable sources in the
area that I lived,
233
00:11:52,276 --> 00:11:54,017
we had gotten Select TV.
234
00:11:55,627 --> 00:11:56,933
And in the middle of the night,
235
00:11:56,977 --> 00:11:59,109
he would wake me up
yelling at the television
236
00:11:59,153 --> 00:12:00,894
because the programming sucked.
237
00:12:00,937 --> 00:12:02,765
And at some point in time,
238
00:12:02,809 --> 00:12:04,375
I just said, if you
hate it so much,
239
00:12:04,419 --> 00:12:06,029
they don't watch it or
write a letter.
240
00:12:06,073 --> 00:12:08,162
And so he wrote a letter to them
241
00:12:08,205 --> 00:12:10,512
telling them what was
wrong with the programming.
242
00:12:10,555 --> 00:12:12,079
And they called him and said,
243
00:12:12,122 --> 00:12:13,297
how do you know so much
244
00:12:13,341 --> 00:12:15,909
and who are you and we
wanna talk to you.
245
00:12:15,952 --> 00:12:19,260
- And Jerry had said he
had found these movies
246
00:12:19,303 --> 00:12:23,481
that since we were
playing eclectic things,
247
00:12:23,525 --> 00:12:24,787
you wanna show me something.
248
00:12:24,831 --> 00:12:26,746
- [Narrator] Greece
withdraws from NATO.
249
00:12:26,789 --> 00:12:28,835
The third guarantor power,
Britain,
250
00:12:28,878 --> 00:12:31,011
with Air Force and
troops on the spot
251
00:12:31,054 --> 00:12:34,057
sticks to her policy of
strict non-involvement.
252
00:12:34,101 --> 00:12:35,319
- It was a documentary
253
00:12:35,363 --> 00:12:38,105
about the invasion of
Greece by the Turks
254
00:12:38,148 --> 00:12:39,846
and political content.
255
00:12:39,889 --> 00:12:41,543
It was interesting movie,
256
00:12:41,586 --> 00:12:43,893
it had just been this guy
had written in this letter,
257
00:12:43,937 --> 00:12:46,504
I was reading the
reaction and was like,
258
00:12:46,548 --> 00:12:50,160
okay, well, that didn't get
them so let me try one more
259
00:12:50,552 --> 00:12:53,555
and I think it was like
a Laura Antonelli film
260
00:12:53,598 --> 00:12:58,386
how I'd never seen before and
it was staggeringly gorgeous.
261
00:12:59,169 --> 00:13:03,043
And I thought anybody who
could go to the kind of,
262
00:13:03,086 --> 00:13:07,177
those poles to the utter
peer documentary,
263
00:13:07,221 --> 00:13:12,182
political documentary to sex
is worth having so I hired him.
264
00:13:12,226 --> 00:13:14,924
- And so that sort of
set Jerry on his path
265
00:13:14,968 --> 00:13:16,186
which seemed really hopeful
266
00:13:16,230 --> 00:13:17,361
because then there was something
267
00:13:17,405 --> 00:13:20,800
that really was about
his passion,
268
00:13:20,843 --> 00:13:23,977
something that he could
do that was positive
269
00:13:24,020 --> 00:13:25,848
and that would give him
something to focus on
270
00:13:25,892 --> 00:13:28,938
besides his own
struggle with himself.
271
00:13:31,593 --> 00:13:35,815
- Hal Kaufman, the guy
running Z at the time,
272
00:13:35,858 --> 00:13:38,948
called Jerry and approach
him about a job.
273
00:13:42,256 --> 00:13:46,129
- [Jerry] I left Select
and weeks after I got to Z,
274
00:13:46,564 --> 00:13:47,914
the head of programming
275
00:13:47,957 --> 00:13:50,917
fell ill and left and
never came back.
276
00:13:54,398 --> 00:13:58,272
- Everything that predated Z
and his own eminence over Z
277
00:13:58,315 --> 00:14:01,710
was merely the prep, it was
the years in the desert.
278
00:14:01,753 --> 00:14:04,017
Boom, suddenly Jerry
arrives in the early 80s
279
00:14:04,060 --> 00:14:05,801
and he's known all through town.
280
00:14:05,845 --> 00:14:08,282
[upbeat music]
281
00:14:10,153 --> 00:14:13,330
- He got me on the phone
and he said, Jerry, he said,
282
00:14:13,374 --> 00:14:14,592
I've been hired
283
00:14:14,636 --> 00:14:17,160
and I wanna do a new spin
284
00:14:17,204 --> 00:14:19,206
on the pictures that
we're showing.
285
00:14:19,249 --> 00:14:21,425
- I think I got a call
from somebody once,
286
00:14:21,469 --> 00:14:23,601
picked up the phone and somebody
on the phone said to me,
287
00:14:23,645 --> 00:14:27,214
this is Jerry Harvey, I buy
movies, do you have so and so.
288
00:14:27,257 --> 00:14:30,957
I think so and so was
probably "Black Orpheus."
289
00:14:35,483 --> 00:14:38,268
- When you first met him I
think he was cold and distant.
290
00:14:38,312 --> 00:14:42,055
We had to generate a mutual
respect which came quickly
291
00:14:42,098 --> 00:14:44,405
because we found out
that each of us
292
00:14:44,448 --> 00:14:48,757
had an interest in old
movies, different movies,
293
00:14:48,800 --> 00:14:51,412
movies that were unloved,
movies that had been unscreened.
294
00:14:51,455 --> 00:14:52,630
- Telephone, Miss Gray.
295
00:14:52,674 --> 00:14:54,415
- Thank you, excuse.
296
00:14:54,458 --> 00:14:56,025
- You should take it here.
297
00:14:56,069 --> 00:14:58,810
- No, nevermind, ask them to
call me at home later, please.
298
00:14:58,854 --> 00:15:00,290
- Bring the phone.
299
00:15:00,334 --> 00:15:01,639
- What was so brilliant
about Jerry was doing
300
00:15:01,683 --> 00:15:05,121
was mixing the art film
with commercial fair.
301
00:15:10,518 --> 00:15:12,520
- I had to see everything
on this crash course,
302
00:15:12,563 --> 00:15:14,957
it was like the Schick
center for movie addiction,
303
00:15:15,001 --> 00:15:19,483
and then I had to hear him
recite to me "Dr. Strangelove,"
304
00:15:19,527 --> 00:15:22,443
there was a month when I heard
scenes from "Dr. Strangelove"
305
00:15:22,486 --> 00:15:24,358
from the moment I woke up to
the moment I went to sleep.
306
00:15:25,315 --> 00:15:29,493
- I agree with you, it's
great to be fine.
307
00:15:29,537 --> 00:15:31,713
Now then, Dimitri,
308
00:15:31,756 --> 00:15:36,152
you know how we've always
talked about the possibility
309
00:15:37,501 --> 00:15:39,982
of something going wrong
with the bomb.
310
00:15:40,026 --> 00:15:42,071
- Z was great for him.
311
00:15:42,115 --> 00:15:44,030
Jerry sort of found
his place there
312
00:15:44,073 --> 00:15:45,248
because he could come in.
313
00:15:45,292 --> 00:15:47,468
I mean, Jerry's favorite
way of dressing
314
00:15:47,511 --> 00:15:51,211
was a business shirt
not tucked in,
315
00:15:51,254 --> 00:15:55,563
a nice jacket, baggy dirty
jeans, and Frye boots,
316
00:15:55,606 --> 00:15:58,479
and he couldn't do that working
in a corporate situation.
317
00:15:58,522 --> 00:16:01,047
So at Z Channel, he could
do what he liked to do best
318
00:16:01,090 --> 00:16:02,787
which is sit cross
legged on the floor
319
00:16:02,831 --> 00:16:05,965
and make his phone calls
that way smoking.
320
00:16:07,444 --> 00:16:10,317
- [Interviewer] When did
you start looking at films?
321
00:16:10,360 --> 00:16:12,493
- [Jerry] To be honest
with you, when I was four.
322
00:16:12,536 --> 00:16:13,885
- [Interviewer] Yes.
323
00:16:13,929 --> 00:16:15,757
- [Jerry] I remember
vividly a film I saw at four
324
00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:17,933
and the impact it had on me.
325
00:16:17,977 --> 00:16:19,717
For a great period of my life,
326
00:16:19,761 --> 00:16:21,110
it had meant more to
me than anything else,
327
00:16:21,154 --> 00:16:23,983
movies, the history
of the movies.
328
00:16:26,202 --> 00:16:29,597
- This man, Jerry Harvey,
this very sweet, very odd man,
329
00:16:29,640 --> 00:16:32,774
called me up and very
tentatively asked me,
330
00:16:32,817 --> 00:16:36,038
would I like "A Safe
Place," my first film,
331
00:16:36,082 --> 00:16:37,474
to be on television.
332
00:16:37,518 --> 00:16:39,128
I was sure he made a mistake
because it was a film
333
00:16:39,172 --> 00:16:41,783
that was so trashed by all
the critics when it opened
334
00:16:41,826 --> 00:16:43,219
that nobody wanted to play it.
335
00:16:47,093 --> 00:16:51,140
- Yes, yes, I have missed
you, do you wanna know why?
336
00:16:52,881 --> 00:16:54,143
- [Actress] Yeah.
337
00:16:58,104 --> 00:17:00,932
- Because you're very
simple-minded.
338
00:17:00,976 --> 00:17:02,325
- [Actress] Screw you.
339
00:17:02,369 --> 00:17:03,805
- I had a film called "Images"
340
00:17:03,848 --> 00:17:07,243
that I had done and shot
in Ireland in '72
341
00:17:09,419 --> 00:17:12,335
and he was particularly,
Jerry liked that film a lot.
342
00:17:14,120 --> 00:17:16,383
He said, lets run that on
the Z Channel.
343
00:17:16,426 --> 00:17:19,864
What we couldn't find who
owned the title,
344
00:17:21,649 --> 00:17:23,346
he said, well, I'll run
it if you don't run it.
345
00:17:23,390 --> 00:17:24,956
I said, well, I'll run
it if you don't run it
346
00:17:25,000 --> 00:17:26,436
so here's the print.
347
00:17:27,437 --> 00:17:28,656
- Katherine.
348
00:17:28,699 --> 00:17:30,962
- What are you talking about,
Katherine.
349
00:17:31,006 --> 00:17:32,007
I love you.
350
00:17:33,835 --> 00:17:35,358
- Don't, you don't.
351
00:17:38,492 --> 00:17:42,800
- These films get lost in a
hurry and I would get calls,
352
00:17:42,844 --> 00:17:46,413
hey, they just played
your movie on Z Channel.
353
00:17:47,675 --> 00:17:48,893
- I'm naked now.
354
00:17:52,071 --> 00:17:55,422
- I mean, that was like
a big release for me.
355
00:17:55,465 --> 00:17:58,033
- If you couldn't get a studio
to release your picture,
356
00:17:58,077 --> 00:18:00,644
your picture did not get seen.
357
00:18:00,688 --> 00:18:03,995
One of the big thing that
changed that was the Z Channel.
358
00:18:04,039 --> 00:18:05,475
- The Z Channel to me
359
00:18:05,519 --> 00:18:08,087
was the first time I could
speak French, Z Channel.
360
00:18:09,566 --> 00:18:11,655
It was the first time you
could turn on your television
361
00:18:11,699 --> 00:18:13,266
and see something
362
00:18:13,309 --> 00:18:16,704
that you would have to
go to the cinema for.
363
00:18:18,227 --> 00:18:19,924
- What he was doing was
coming up with films
364
00:18:19,968 --> 00:18:22,666
that I had never heard of
or didn't know existed.
365
00:18:22,710 --> 00:18:25,060
[soft music]
366
00:18:29,064 --> 00:18:30,500
- People saw movies
367
00:18:30,544 --> 00:18:32,720
that they wouldn't have
gone to see in a theater
368
00:18:32,763 --> 00:18:34,635
if they were free.
369
00:18:34,678 --> 00:18:36,071
And consequently,
370
00:18:36,115 --> 00:18:39,335
I think it was both a
pleasurable experience
371
00:18:39,379 --> 00:18:41,468
and an educational experience,
372
00:18:41,511 --> 00:18:44,253
and I think it widened
everybody's horizons.
373
00:18:44,297 --> 00:18:46,951
- It made I think even
the powers that be
374
00:18:46,995 --> 00:18:49,302
realize that there was
this ultimate audience
375
00:18:49,345 --> 00:18:51,173
that was much larger
than anybody know.
376
00:18:51,217 --> 00:18:52,479
- Jerry found all these films
377
00:18:52,522 --> 00:18:55,090
and was able to program
them on the Z Channel
378
00:18:55,134 --> 00:18:58,702
and it's sort of built a
big following.
379
00:18:58,746 --> 00:19:02,663
- I just think that he in
a sense had blinders on
380
00:19:03,751 --> 00:19:08,277
in which all he could see
through his blinders was film.
381
00:19:11,237 --> 00:19:13,108
- [Interviewer] And you
grew up where?
382
00:19:13,152 --> 00:19:14,718
- [Jerry] I grew up
in Bakersfield.
383
00:19:14,762 --> 00:19:18,113
- [Interviewer] How would
you describe Bakersfield?
384
00:19:18,157 --> 00:19:20,507
- [Jerry] In how many words?
385
00:19:20,550 --> 00:19:22,770
Kind of cross between
"American Graffiti"
386
00:19:22,813 --> 00:19:24,163
and "Two-Lane Blacktop."
387
00:19:25,033 --> 00:19:26,121
- [Interviewer] And was it easy
388
00:19:26,165 --> 00:19:27,688
having an enjoyable childhood?
389
00:19:27,731 --> 00:19:28,602
- [Jerry] No.
390
00:19:36,958 --> 00:19:37,915
- When Jerry came aboard,
391
00:19:37,959 --> 00:19:39,221
it was also the moment
392
00:19:39,265 --> 00:19:40,788
when HBO, Showtime and
the Movie channel
393
00:19:40,831 --> 00:19:41,963
all showed up in LA.
394
00:19:42,006 --> 00:19:43,747
- He was a formidable competitor
395
00:19:43,791 --> 00:19:46,489
and he didn't say nice things
396
00:19:46,533 --> 00:19:47,925
about people he was
competing against
397
00:19:47,969 --> 00:19:51,233
because he lived and
slept at his job.
398
00:19:51,277 --> 00:19:52,713
- They thought they were
gonna carve up
399
00:19:52,756 --> 00:19:56,369
the territory that
belonged to Z Channel.
400
00:19:56,412 --> 00:19:58,980
Z Channel was the only
one in town at that time.
401
00:19:59,023 --> 00:20:00,329
Well, the others thought,
402
00:20:00,373 --> 00:20:01,896
well, we're gonna roll
over this guy.
403
00:20:01,939 --> 00:20:05,726
And in fact, a lot of people
had told Jerry to his face,
404
00:20:05,769 --> 00:20:08,163
you run a nice little
channel, it's too bad.
405
00:20:08,207 --> 00:20:09,338
And he said, well, we'll see.
406
00:20:09,382 --> 00:20:10,426
And what happened was,
407
00:20:10,470 --> 00:20:12,254
of course that HBO
and those guys
408
00:20:12,298 --> 00:20:13,560
really couldn't get a toehold,
409
00:20:13,603 --> 00:20:15,779
Z Channel had what was
called a zero churn rate
410
00:20:15,823 --> 00:20:18,347
which means that nobody
would cancel the service.
411
00:20:20,219 --> 00:20:22,438
- Jerry loved Z Channel, he
loved everything it was about,
412
00:20:22,482 --> 00:20:24,527
but he felt a lot of
pressure to perform.
413
00:20:24,571 --> 00:20:26,181
- He would call you in
the middle of the night,
414
00:20:26,225 --> 00:20:27,574
on a Saturday night,
415
00:20:27,617 --> 00:20:29,532
on a Sunday morning at seven
o'clock in the morning,
416
00:20:29,576 --> 00:20:34,145
he would call you and say,
you got to get me this,
417
00:20:34,189 --> 00:20:35,712
the channel will go under,
418
00:20:35,756 --> 00:20:36,974
it was always the sky is falling
if you don't get me this,
419
00:20:37,018 --> 00:20:38,193
I got to get this.
420
00:20:38,237 --> 00:20:39,412
- So he tried to take it all on
421
00:20:39,455 --> 00:20:41,805
and what he would always
do to compensate
422
00:20:41,849 --> 00:20:46,027
in those kinds of situations
is that he would self medicate.
423
00:20:46,070 --> 00:20:48,421
So he would go around with,
424
00:20:49,683 --> 00:20:53,208
he'd drink and then he'd
have no dose in his pocket.
425
00:20:53,252 --> 00:20:56,255
- He was manic, but he was
an obsessive programmer.
426
00:20:56,298 --> 00:20:58,213
I wanna say that that's not
a bad thing, by the way.
427
00:20:58,257 --> 00:21:02,304
- Basically, he would come
back from work at Z Channel
428
00:21:02,348 --> 00:21:06,482
and order pizza and
fall asleep on the floor
429
00:21:06,526 --> 00:21:08,397
because he was taking a
lot of medication.
430
00:21:08,441 --> 00:21:10,094
So he wasn't really
functioning at home
431
00:21:10,138 --> 00:21:11,574
but nobody knew it at work
432
00:21:11,618 --> 00:21:13,620
because he would function
in the morning.
433
00:21:15,448 --> 00:21:16,797
- I met Jerry on the telephone.
434
00:21:16,840 --> 00:21:17,841
He called me in London,
435
00:21:17,885 --> 00:21:19,016
woke me up at 2:30
in the morning
436
00:21:19,060 --> 00:21:20,627
'cause he got all the
times wrong.
437
00:21:20,670 --> 00:21:23,673
His first words to me were,
how come I don't know you?
438
00:21:23,717 --> 00:21:26,328
So I get this lunatic on the
phone at 2:30 in the morning
439
00:21:26,372 --> 00:21:28,591
giving me this long monologue
440
00:21:28,635 --> 00:21:30,376
about what other
films have I made,
441
00:21:30,419 --> 00:21:31,464
he wants to see everything,
442
00:21:31,507 --> 00:21:33,248
can I send everything
over to him,
443
00:21:33,292 --> 00:21:35,163
what documentaries have
I made and all that?
444
00:21:35,511 --> 00:21:38,732
- Will you have a dance with me,
please.
445
00:21:38,775 --> 00:21:41,212
- I don't mind if I do.
446
00:21:41,256 --> 00:21:42,388
- Come on then.
447
00:21:48,698 --> 00:21:50,047
- In the case of "Overlord,"
448
00:21:50,091 --> 00:21:51,658
you have a World War Two film
449
00:21:51,701 --> 00:21:54,443
which actually incorporates
footage from World War Two,
450
00:21:54,487 --> 00:21:56,271
but incorporates it so artfully
451
00:21:56,315 --> 00:21:58,447
that you can't tell the
stage footage
452
00:21:58,491 --> 00:22:00,884
from the actual footage.
453
00:22:00,928 --> 00:22:03,844
- There began a process
of developing a screenplay
454
00:22:03,887 --> 00:22:08,892
based on real material of
documented material and footage,
455
00:22:09,371 --> 00:22:12,635
and I began to construct
a dramatized documentary
456
00:22:12,679 --> 00:22:15,116
about a young English soldier.
457
00:22:31,045 --> 00:22:33,569
He said we'll start by having
a month of Stuart Cooper,
458
00:22:34,353 --> 00:22:36,006
we'll show all the features,
459
00:22:36,050 --> 00:22:37,312
we'll do the
documentaries later,
460
00:22:37,356 --> 00:22:39,358
we'll show all your feature work
461
00:22:39,401 --> 00:22:41,403
during the month,
different times,
462
00:22:41,447 --> 00:22:44,885
but the deal is you have
to come a month ahead
463
00:22:44,928 --> 00:22:46,582
and do one on one screenings
464
00:22:46,626 --> 00:22:49,019
with the four or
five key critics
465
00:22:49,063 --> 00:22:52,109
and have lunch with them or
dinner and talk about the work.
466
00:22:52,153 --> 00:22:53,546
- Gary Prebula called me up,
467
00:22:53,589 --> 00:22:55,591
said they're showing two
films by Stuart Cooper
468
00:22:55,635 --> 00:22:56,723
who I'd never heard of.
469
00:22:56,766 --> 00:22:57,767
He said, nobody's ever
heard of him,
470
00:22:57,811 --> 00:22:59,508
Z Channel is gonna
premiere them.
471
00:22:59,552 --> 00:23:00,466
I said, there's still
a Z Channel.
472
00:23:00,509 --> 00:23:01,728
He said, oh, yeah.
473
00:23:01,771 --> 00:23:03,425
I was debating whether
or not to go.
474
00:23:03,469 --> 00:23:04,818
When I got there, I was
glad I showed up
475
00:23:04,861 --> 00:23:06,907
because I was the only
one there that I knew of.
476
00:23:06,950 --> 00:23:08,474
There was this other
guy named Jerry Harvey
477
00:23:08,517 --> 00:23:11,564
who I didn't know who I thought
might be a fellow critic.
478
00:23:11,607 --> 00:23:13,348
I was fascinated by
this guy, Stuart Cooper,
479
00:23:13,392 --> 00:23:15,306
'cause I had just seen
"Overlord" for the first time,
480
00:23:15,350 --> 00:23:17,178
I was blown away by it.
481
00:23:17,221 --> 00:23:18,440
But I'm sitting there with Jerry
482
00:23:18,484 --> 00:23:20,747
and Jerry is the one
who's like talking to me
483
00:23:20,790 --> 00:23:22,705
in this mild way
484
00:23:22,749 --> 00:23:24,141
and I'm getting along with him
485
00:23:24,185 --> 00:23:26,230
and I mean, we were laughing
at each other's jokes.
486
00:23:26,274 --> 00:23:29,712
- It was really a great
kismet moment
487
00:23:29,756 --> 00:23:32,759
because then he started
doing some reviews
488
00:23:32,802 --> 00:23:34,978
for Z Channel for Jerry.
489
00:23:35,022 --> 00:23:37,720
- It coincided with the period
that my mother was dying.
490
00:23:37,764 --> 00:23:39,374
I got the news of my
mother's death
491
00:23:39,418 --> 00:23:40,984
and within a half an hour,
492
00:23:41,028 --> 00:23:42,551
the phone rings and
it's Jerry Harvey,
493
00:23:42,595 --> 00:23:44,335
he's like the first
call I'm getting.
494
00:23:44,379 --> 00:23:46,599
I don't know how he found out,
495
00:23:46,642 --> 00:23:48,949
but he called me and he
was consoling me,
496
00:23:48,992 --> 00:23:51,560
he said, look, I've been through
several deaths in my family
497
00:23:51,604 --> 00:23:55,346
and you can make it, it
doesn't have to kill you.
498
00:23:55,390 --> 00:23:57,436
And I said, it won't kill me,
499
00:23:57,479 --> 00:23:58,741
I was like feeling super strong,
500
00:23:58,785 --> 00:24:00,395
I was not hearing what
he was saying.
501
00:24:00,439 --> 00:24:02,571
Now, it's like
unbearably poignant.
502
00:24:02,615 --> 00:24:04,791
- And that was the beginning
of their relationship.
503
00:24:04,834 --> 00:24:06,009
And to the day Jerry died,
504
00:24:06,053 --> 00:24:07,968
I mean, F. X. and he
were very close.
505
00:24:10,013 --> 00:24:11,406
- When Jerry brought me aboard,
506
00:24:11,450 --> 00:24:12,581
my concern was as a critic,
507
00:24:12,625 --> 00:24:14,627
I didn't wanna be paid
508
00:24:14,670 --> 00:24:18,631
to say good things about
a movie I hated.
509
00:24:18,674 --> 00:24:21,198
And Jerry liked my
style of reviewing
510
00:24:21,242 --> 00:24:22,809
because I wouldn't so
much punish the movie
511
00:24:22,852 --> 00:24:24,375
for not succeeding,
512
00:24:24,419 --> 00:24:27,683
I would come from a place
of, well, I tried to like it.
513
00:24:27,727 --> 00:24:29,816
- If I read Z
Magazine religiously,
514
00:24:29,859 --> 00:24:32,645
I used to write nasty
letters to F. X. Feeney.
515
00:24:32,688 --> 00:24:34,777
- I used to get the
angriest letters,
516
00:24:34,821 --> 00:24:36,344
the angriest letters of my life
517
00:24:36,387 --> 00:24:38,825
I got from Z Channel
subscribers.
518
00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:42,002
- Yes, I think I did
write letters to the Z mag
519
00:24:42,045 --> 00:24:43,438
which I'd forgotten
520
00:24:43,482 --> 00:24:47,529
until contacted to participate
in this documentary.
521
00:24:47,573 --> 00:24:52,012
I wrote I think complaining
about the letter boxing bars
522
00:24:54,884 --> 00:24:57,017
weren't big enough for
cortisol was high and low,
523
00:24:57,060 --> 00:24:58,453
and that's how I got
this t-shirt.
524
00:24:58,497 --> 00:25:00,237
- I remember I couldn't wait
525
00:25:00,281 --> 00:25:03,066
when my Z Channel
magazine would every month
526
00:25:03,110 --> 00:25:05,242
because I wanted to read
all the reviews
527
00:25:05,286 --> 00:25:06,853
which weren't always good.
528
00:25:06,896 --> 00:25:08,158
- The people that wrote it
529
00:25:08,202 --> 00:25:11,292
knew that their audience
was keenly interested
530
00:25:11,335 --> 00:25:13,163
in what they had to say.
531
00:25:13,207 --> 00:25:18,386
And what they had to say was
a whole series of original
532
00:25:18,429 --> 00:25:20,649
and highly
controversial observations
533
00:25:20,693 --> 00:25:22,956
about the films that
were being shown.
534
00:25:22,999 --> 00:25:27,134
It wasn't the usual pap that
you get in fan magazines.
535
00:25:28,265 --> 00:25:30,703
- My belief, and I know that
this is Jerry's belief too,
536
00:25:30,746 --> 00:25:32,052
is that if you appeal
537
00:25:32,095 --> 00:25:33,880
to the most intelligent
member of the audience,
538
00:25:33,923 --> 00:25:35,664
everybody else follows along.
539
00:25:35,708 --> 00:25:37,057
There's this feeling
540
00:25:37,100 --> 00:25:39,973
that you have to appeal
to the common denominator.
541
00:25:40,016 --> 00:25:43,063
Jerry and I hit on the phrase,
the uncommon denominator,
542
00:25:43,106 --> 00:25:44,281
that's what we want
543
00:25:44,325 --> 00:25:47,502
because we wanna go for
the smart folks
544
00:25:47,546 --> 00:25:49,286
because everybody is smart.
545
00:25:51,462 --> 00:25:54,335
- Shit, that's my man,
that's my man.
546
00:25:57,120 --> 00:25:58,382
I don't think we'll make
it past the cop.
547
00:25:58,426 --> 00:25:59,688
- We'll make it past the cops,
548
00:25:59,732 --> 00:26:01,342
I just hope we don't
see no Muslims.
549
00:26:03,126 --> 00:26:05,781
- Listen, you owe Ben
Angelelli $4,000.
550
00:26:05,825 --> 00:26:08,610
- You tell Ben Angelelli
to suck my cock.
551
00:26:08,654 --> 00:26:09,872
- Now, wait a minute, you
lost that money,
552
00:26:09,916 --> 00:26:11,657
you should pay your debts.
553
00:26:11,700 --> 00:26:12,875
- A double suck.
554
00:26:22,232 --> 00:26:24,017
- The first couple of years
of Jerry's stewardship of Z
555
00:26:24,060 --> 00:26:28,587
are marked by just the
ability to do the unexpected.
556
00:26:28,630 --> 00:26:30,980
So he was able to make simple
557
00:26:31,024 --> 00:26:33,113
but effective use of his
position there,
558
00:26:33,156 --> 00:26:35,594
and suddenly his reputation
started to take care of itself.
559
00:26:42,383 --> 00:26:43,645
I have this fantasy
560
00:26:43,689 --> 00:26:46,605
that in the year 2050 or
the year 2075,
561
00:26:46,648 --> 00:26:49,129
they're going to read
about the fear
562
00:26:49,172 --> 00:26:51,566
that attacked "Heaven's Gate,"
563
00:26:51,610 --> 00:26:54,003
the fear of that came
down upon "Heaven's Gate,"
564
00:26:54,047 --> 00:26:55,135
and they're not
gonna believe it,
565
00:26:55,178 --> 00:26:56,571
it's gonna seem like
science fiction.
566
00:27:02,577 --> 00:27:05,493
- Stockbird's Association
567
00:27:05,536 --> 00:27:08,844
has the names of some of
you people on the list.
568
00:27:12,195 --> 00:27:14,154
125 names.
569
00:27:17,984 --> 00:27:19,812
[speaking in foreign language]
570
00:27:20,508 --> 00:27:23,076
- The then current UA management
571
00:27:23,119 --> 00:27:27,515
decided to make the film
at a budget of 12 million.
572
00:27:27,558 --> 00:27:30,823
The 12 million turned out to
be 40 before they were through,
573
00:27:30,866 --> 00:27:33,216
the picture was a
commercial disaster.
574
00:27:42,008 --> 00:27:43,313
- Jerry would get very angry
575
00:27:43,357 --> 00:27:44,837
about what had
happened to a movie,
576
00:27:44,880 --> 00:27:47,013
what had happened to a director,
577
00:27:47,056 --> 00:27:48,971
or how a film had kind
of gotten off track,
578
00:27:49,015 --> 00:27:50,146
or how somebody's been slighted
579
00:27:50,190 --> 00:27:52,018
when they shouldn't
have been slighted
580
00:27:52,061 --> 00:27:53,889
or beaten up when they
shouldn't have been beaten up.
581
00:28:00,809 --> 00:28:02,637
- "Heaven's Gate" was not
only clobbered,
582
00:28:02,681 --> 00:28:04,421
it was basically burned
at the stake.
583
00:28:04,465 --> 00:28:06,075
I mean, the critics
ganged up on it,
584
00:28:06,119 --> 00:28:08,425
it became this huge set
of headlines,
585
00:28:08,469 --> 00:28:10,340
it was in every paper,
586
00:28:10,384 --> 00:28:12,865
the "Herald Examiner" ran
a story about it
587
00:28:12,908 --> 00:28:15,911
every day for three months,
every day.
588
00:28:17,130 --> 00:28:20,655
- I was depressed for a
year after that movie.
589
00:28:20,699 --> 00:28:22,004
I was depressed about it.
590
00:28:22,048 --> 00:28:25,007
I mean, really, it was just,
591
00:28:25,051 --> 00:28:28,271
I mean, you do your work
and you think it's good
592
00:28:28,315 --> 00:28:32,014
and then nobody likes it, no
critics like and it goes down
593
00:28:32,058 --> 00:28:33,450
and then after two weeks,
594
00:28:33,494 --> 00:28:37,498
they pull it off of the
theaters and it disappears.
595
00:28:37,541 --> 00:28:38,891
I mean, it was just.
596
00:28:40,283 --> 00:28:42,764
- It was cut immediately
597
00:28:42,808 --> 00:28:47,290
and lay there until such time
as Jerry approached Cimino
598
00:28:47,334 --> 00:28:50,641
and talked about reconstructing
his long version.
599
00:28:50,685 --> 00:28:52,252
Without Jerry's prompting,
600
00:28:52,295 --> 00:28:53,688
it would never have
occurred to me
601
00:28:53,732 --> 00:28:55,559
to try to find an intact print
602
00:28:55,603 --> 00:28:57,474
of the original "Heaven's Gate."
603
00:28:57,518 --> 00:29:02,305
It was his question that set
the whole process in motion.
604
00:29:02,610 --> 00:29:05,308
- It became a four hour special.
605
00:29:05,352 --> 00:29:08,268
We had the first screening
of "Heaven's Gate,"
606
00:29:08,311 --> 00:29:09,660
I mean, which was
really an event
607
00:29:09,704 --> 00:29:11,750
and everybody tuned into it,
608
00:29:11,793 --> 00:29:14,274
they wanted to know what
all the fuss was about.
609
00:29:14,317 --> 00:29:16,624
- And in a different atmosphere,
610
00:29:16,667 --> 00:29:19,322
a different cultural climate,
611
00:29:19,366 --> 00:29:22,804
the reassembled "Heaven's
Gate" got marvelous reviews.
612
00:29:22,848 --> 00:29:25,328
[upbeat music]
613
00:29:33,423 --> 00:29:34,816
- It was a big event,
614
00:29:34,860 --> 00:29:36,470
and it was the beginning
of sort of big events
615
00:29:36,513 --> 00:29:38,080
happening on cable.
616
00:29:38,124 --> 00:29:38,994
It was really the first time
617
00:29:39,038 --> 00:29:41,040
anything like that had happened.
618
00:29:41,083 --> 00:29:43,520
- You got to see the director's
vision of what the movie was
619
00:29:43,564 --> 00:29:46,436
even after the fact it
was very hard to get out
620
00:29:46,480 --> 00:29:49,918
but in some ways, that put him
20 years ahead of his time.
621
00:29:49,962 --> 00:29:52,529
[violin music]
622
00:30:03,584 --> 00:30:05,368
- I mean, he had a great
relationship with Michael Cimino
623
00:30:05,412 --> 00:30:06,500
because of that,
624
00:30:06,543 --> 00:30:08,154
because he really gave
life to a film
625
00:30:08,197 --> 00:30:10,417
that had been so unfairly,
626
00:30:10,460 --> 00:30:12,201
whether in the end you
liked the movie or not,
627
00:30:12,245 --> 00:30:14,943
it had been so unfairly treated.
628
00:30:21,907 --> 00:30:23,125
- The effort to do
something like that
629
00:30:23,169 --> 00:30:24,431
was a gargantuan effort,
630
00:30:24,474 --> 00:30:27,173
it'd be like saving a
great edifice
631
00:30:29,218 --> 00:30:31,960
that was designed by Frank
Lloyd Wright or something.
632
00:30:32,004 --> 00:30:36,138
- Jerry took great risks
in the films that he bought
633
00:30:36,182 --> 00:30:38,445
and that's why he was
so respected.
634
00:30:38,837 --> 00:30:40,012
- Suddenly had this position
635
00:30:40,055 --> 00:30:42,362
where he was being
interviewed and quoted
636
00:30:42,405 --> 00:30:45,191
and it was nice 'cause he
had this moment
637
00:30:45,234 --> 00:30:47,976
of feeling like people
were acknowledging him
638
00:30:48,020 --> 00:30:50,587
for what he wanted to be
acknowledged for.
639
00:30:50,631 --> 00:30:52,589
- He would have liked to
I think be making movies,
640
00:30:52,633 --> 00:30:56,376
instead, he had such great
respect for great filmmakers
641
00:30:56,419 --> 00:31:00,380
that he provided a place
to showcase their work.
642
00:31:00,423 --> 00:31:02,773
- I remember walking
behind him one day
643
00:31:02,817 --> 00:31:03,949
as we were just taking a break,
644
00:31:03,992 --> 00:31:05,254
I'd turned in a bunch of stuff
645
00:31:05,298 --> 00:31:07,169
and he just made a bunch of buys
646
00:31:07,213 --> 00:31:08,997
and just done a
bunch of business
647
00:31:09,041 --> 00:31:10,651
and he wanted to go
and get some ice cream.
648
00:31:10,694 --> 00:31:14,046
So, we file out of this
little garden spot office
649
00:31:14,089 --> 00:31:15,003
that we had,
650
00:31:15,308 --> 00:31:16,178
which is the first
office that I knew,
651
00:31:16,222 --> 00:31:18,180
and we're hiking up along Bundy,
652
00:31:18,224 --> 00:31:19,268
and I'm walking behind him,
653
00:31:19,312 --> 00:31:21,053
it's just very hot
California day,
654
00:31:21,096 --> 00:31:22,402
he's wearing a tweed jacket,
655
00:31:22,445 --> 00:31:24,491
he's got that cigarette
lighter around his neck,
656
00:31:24,534 --> 00:31:25,884
and he's just bopping along.
657
00:31:25,927 --> 00:31:27,581
And I'm looking at him
and I'm walking behind him
658
00:31:27,624 --> 00:31:29,148
and I'm thinking,
659
00:31:30,323 --> 00:31:32,020
we've just come off several
months of really happy work
660
00:31:32,064 --> 00:31:32,978
and I'm thinking,
661
00:31:33,630 --> 00:31:34,544
this is actually one of the
happiest times of my life.
662
00:31:38,287 --> 00:31:40,028
- [Interviewer] What were
your mother and father doing
663
00:31:40,072 --> 00:31:41,290
when you were growing up.
664
00:31:41,334 --> 00:31:43,423
- [Jerry] My father was a judge,
665
00:31:43,466 --> 00:31:47,079
my mother was a personnel
director for a hospital.
666
00:31:47,122 --> 00:31:48,689
- [Interviewer] Were you able
to see your parents very often,
667
00:31:48,732 --> 00:31:51,213
they sound as though they
were very busy people.
668
00:31:51,257 --> 00:31:55,087
- [Jerry] Yeah, they were
around, maybe too much.
669
00:31:56,697 --> 00:31:59,874
- I was at Select TV
and Jerry called
670
00:31:59,918 --> 00:32:03,312
and said that he would
like to talk to me,
671
00:32:03,356 --> 00:32:04,531
would I be interested
672
00:32:04,574 --> 00:32:07,664
and what I meet him for dinner
673
00:32:07,708 --> 00:32:11,320
to discuss working at
the Z Channel.
674
00:32:11,364 --> 00:32:15,107
We talked about what
the duties would entail
675
00:32:15,150 --> 00:32:18,893
and most of all, he talked
about his personality.
676
00:32:18,937 --> 00:32:21,940
And he said to me, I'm crazy,
you know?
677
00:32:23,289 --> 00:32:25,117
And I said, oh, yeah, sure.
678
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:28,685
- Jerry would be very honest
with you about his own needs.
679
00:32:28,729 --> 00:32:30,949
He'd say, I gotta go
to my shrink.
680
00:32:30,992 --> 00:32:32,776
And he would just say it
in that plain way
681
00:32:32,820 --> 00:32:35,736
like gotta go see my doctor,
got a doctor's appointment,
682
00:32:35,779 --> 00:32:37,694
but it would happen to be
a shrink's appointment.
683
00:32:37,738 --> 00:32:40,045
And he would go often,
684
00:32:40,088 --> 00:32:41,611
I mean, you knew that
he was devoting
685
00:32:41,655 --> 00:32:44,005
maybe a couple of afternoons
a week to go on over there.
686
00:32:44,049 --> 00:32:45,964
- One day, everything
would be fine,
687
00:32:46,007 --> 00:32:48,009
we'd be having a conversation,
688
00:32:48,053 --> 00:32:50,707
maybe he'd go to the bathroom
or go get a glass of water
689
00:32:50,751 --> 00:32:53,275
and he'd come back and he
would be incredibly depressed
690
00:32:53,319 --> 00:32:55,930
because he looked at
the corner of the room
691
00:32:55,974 --> 00:32:58,498
and realize that the
workmanship was shoddy
692
00:32:58,541 --> 00:32:59,934
and start getting depressed
693
00:32:59,978 --> 00:33:02,763
about how people don't care
about anything anymore.
694
00:33:02,806 --> 00:33:04,330
And somehow in those moments
695
00:33:04,373 --> 00:33:06,941
that he would have had
that revelation,
696
00:33:06,985 --> 00:33:08,377
it would sink him into
this depression
697
00:33:08,421 --> 00:33:09,726
about how the planet was doomed
698
00:33:09,770 --> 00:33:11,598
and nobody gave a shit
about anything anymore.
699
00:33:11,641 --> 00:33:16,037
- And he said, in a very
serious, intense way,
700
00:33:16,081 --> 00:33:18,518
I'm really crazy, I'm paranoid.
701
00:33:19,780 --> 00:33:22,261
- He wrote letters to
me at the time
702
00:33:22,304 --> 00:33:25,960
talking about what eventually
would happen to him,
703
00:33:26,004 --> 00:33:28,310
that one day he would
lose the struggle,
704
00:33:28,354 --> 00:33:29,746
not in a threatening way,
not in a,
705
00:33:29,790 --> 00:33:31,313
but he talked about it.
706
00:33:31,357 --> 00:33:32,836
In rare moments of lucidity,
707
00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:35,404
what frightened him was
something inside of him
708
00:33:35,448 --> 00:33:38,929
that he didn't know how
to deal with.
709
00:33:38,973 --> 00:33:41,106
- I don't know how I got around
710
00:33:41,149 --> 00:33:44,109
the I'm crazy or and
I'm paranoid line
711
00:33:45,806 --> 00:33:50,550
but I went to work there and
found that to be pretty true.
712
00:33:50,593 --> 00:33:51,507
- It's Black Flag.
713
00:33:51,551 --> 00:33:54,162
[punk music]
714
00:34:03,389 --> 00:34:05,260
- I made the movie,
715
00:34:05,304 --> 00:34:07,610
the guys that paid for it
716
00:34:07,654 --> 00:34:12,006
were a couple of independent
businessmen from the Valley
717
00:34:13,051 --> 00:34:14,791
who wanted to make a
porno movie.
718
00:34:14,835 --> 00:34:17,055
And I went in to talk to them
719
00:34:17,925 --> 00:34:19,274
and they didn't know
720
00:34:19,318 --> 00:34:21,407
I was gonna come in and
pitch a punk rock movie,
721
00:34:21,450 --> 00:34:23,017
but I told them that punk rock
722
00:34:23,061 --> 00:34:26,542
was the next best thing to porno
so hey, let's sign a check,
723
00:34:26,586 --> 00:34:27,804
and they did.
724
00:34:27,848 --> 00:34:30,155
[punk music]
725
00:34:36,117 --> 00:34:39,033
We showed the film one
night midnight,
726
00:34:39,077 --> 00:34:41,035
they had to shut down
Hollywood Boulevard
727
00:34:41,079 --> 00:34:43,690
and 300 motorcycle cops came.
728
00:34:43,733 --> 00:34:46,606
We had a letter afterwards
from Daryl Gates,
729
00:34:46,649 --> 00:34:48,173
the chief of police saying,
730
00:34:48,216 --> 00:34:50,610
please don't ever show that
movie in Los Angeles again.
731
00:34:50,653 --> 00:34:51,915
- When I go to concerts,
732
00:34:51,959 --> 00:34:56,181
it's like my friends get
beat up on my friends.
733
00:34:56,224 --> 00:34:58,661
Then it's like fucked.
734
00:34:58,705 --> 00:35:00,315
It's 'cause like they're not
beating up the right people,
735
00:35:00,359 --> 00:35:03,101
they're not beating up the
fucking posers,
736
00:35:03,144 --> 00:35:07,844
they're beating up just my
friends, it's fucked, you know.
737
00:35:07,888 --> 00:35:12,197
- The cops recognized Eugene
from having been in the decline
738
00:35:12,240 --> 00:35:13,502
and arrested him.
739
00:35:15,156 --> 00:35:16,462
- [Interviewer] Because
they saw on Z.
740
00:35:16,505 --> 00:35:18,464
- Yeah, because they saw
it on Z Channel, yeah.
741
00:35:28,300 --> 00:35:29,562
- Took you a little longer
than I thought.
742
00:35:31,607 --> 00:35:33,218
- I'm afraid it's gonna take
a little longer than that,
743
00:35:33,261 --> 00:35:34,436
I'm leaving now.
744
00:35:37,526 --> 00:35:38,440
- Road's wet.
745
00:35:39,528 --> 00:35:42,227
- It wasn't raining
when I got here.
746
00:35:42,270 --> 00:35:43,097
- No?
747
00:35:46,709 --> 00:35:47,971
Too bad.
748
00:35:48,015 --> 00:35:50,496
- People really did not
understand that film,
749
00:35:50,539 --> 00:35:54,064
they didn't get it, and
the critics didn't get it.
750
00:35:54,500 --> 00:35:56,980
- You could have a fucker,
I hate you.
751
00:35:57,024 --> 00:36:00,245
[speaking in foreign language]
752
00:36:00,288 --> 00:36:01,333
- Stop that.
753
00:36:03,030 --> 00:36:04,684
- Fuck you, fuck you.
754
00:36:04,727 --> 00:36:09,776
- I was up for an audition to
go do Star Wars of all things
755
00:36:10,385 --> 00:36:13,475
and so I was reading Star
Wars and my agent was like,
756
00:36:13,519 --> 00:36:16,739
push pressuring me like
go read for Star Wars,
757
00:36:16,783 --> 00:36:17,784
this is gonna be this thing.
758
00:36:17,827 --> 00:36:20,221
And I'm going, I don't know,
man,
759
00:36:20,265 --> 00:36:22,789
I'd always said as my
little actress prayer,
760
00:36:22,832 --> 00:36:25,313
if anybody just gave me the
chance, I could just show 'em,
761
00:36:25,357 --> 00:36:27,968
I know it, I could please,
God, give me this chance.
762
00:36:28,011 --> 00:36:31,928
And then bad timing fell
on my lap and I was like,
763
00:36:31,972 --> 00:36:33,843
holy shit, can I do this.
764
00:36:37,282 --> 00:36:38,848
- Alex, you want me?
765
00:36:42,461 --> 00:36:46,204
Come on, come on, do it
now, Alex, do it now.
766
00:36:48,249 --> 00:36:50,512
Here it is, Alex, here
it is, look at it, Alex.
767
00:36:50,556 --> 00:36:53,298
That's what you wanted,
there it is, Alex.
768
00:36:53,341 --> 00:36:55,735
Come here, come here,
769
00:36:55,778 --> 00:36:58,041
come here, take it,
that's what you want.
770
00:36:58,085 --> 00:36:59,739
Here it is, come on.
771
00:36:59,782 --> 00:37:02,959
- In terms of the Z
Channel showing it so much,
772
00:37:03,003 --> 00:37:07,399
I mean, because it had such
a small release theatrically,
773
00:37:08,574 --> 00:37:10,184
I mean, especially in
this country,
774
00:37:10,228 --> 00:37:13,361
that was really where everybody
had a chance to see it.
775
00:37:13,405 --> 00:37:15,755
And I mean, I swear,
even to this day,
776
00:37:15,798 --> 00:37:17,539
I'll have people come up to me
777
00:37:17,583 --> 00:37:21,587
and tell me how much did
that movie affected them.
778
00:37:23,806 --> 00:37:25,634
- [Interviewer] How did you
go about finding those films
779
00:37:25,678 --> 00:37:27,157
because I mean, obviously
it took some effort
780
00:37:27,201 --> 00:37:29,290
and no one else was doing it.
781
00:37:29,334 --> 00:37:31,074
- [Jerry] You look at a
lot of things
782
00:37:31,118 --> 00:37:33,990
that you think might be
interesting based on somebody,
783
00:37:34,034 --> 00:37:36,341
not everybody that
was involved in
784
00:37:36,384 --> 00:37:38,560
or what it's about or
what it's based on
785
00:37:38,604 --> 00:37:42,085
or where it was filmed or
there's a million reasons.
786
00:37:42,129 --> 00:37:43,261
Just like anything like,
787
00:37:43,304 --> 00:37:46,002
you say, gee, that
sounds interesting.
788
00:37:46,046 --> 00:37:48,222
- HBO, Showtime, the
Movie channel,
789
00:37:48,266 --> 00:37:50,833
all of us are at this big
convention in some hotel,
790
00:37:50,877 --> 00:37:54,228
big table desk, pitchers
of water, nameplates.
791
00:37:54,272 --> 00:37:55,447
Jerry's down at the other end.
792
00:37:55,490 --> 00:37:56,883
And everybody's like
going down the list
793
00:37:57,144 --> 00:37:59,494
talking about how many
committees they've got,
794
00:37:59,538 --> 00:38:00,713
how many market research,
795
00:38:00,756 --> 00:38:02,410
we hire this firm from New York,
796
00:38:02,454 --> 00:38:05,457
we've got this firm from
Chicago, bah, bah, bah, bah.
797
00:38:05,500 --> 00:38:07,372
Jerry, how many firms
do you draw on
798
00:38:07,415 --> 00:38:09,243
to choose your programs?
799
00:38:09,287 --> 00:38:12,638
He says, I don't consult
anybody, I just see movies,
800
00:38:12,681 --> 00:38:14,379
I just show good movies.
801
00:38:14,422 --> 00:38:15,989
Yeah, but your decision
making process,
802
00:38:16,032 --> 00:38:17,817
who's your committee?
803
00:38:17,860 --> 00:38:19,819
I don't have a committee,
just me,
804
00:38:19,862 --> 00:38:22,517
I mean, we have people in the
office we talk, we like movies
805
00:38:22,561 --> 00:38:26,173
but basically it's just
whatever we wanna see.
806
00:38:28,088 --> 00:38:31,700
[speaking in foreign language]
807
00:38:36,401 --> 00:38:39,534
- Jerry was an early
and passionate admirer
808
00:38:39,578 --> 00:38:42,320
of a film called "The
Important Thing is to Love"
809
00:38:42,363 --> 00:38:44,844
directed by Andrezej Zulawski.
810
00:38:44,887 --> 00:38:47,977
That film had a huge cult
in Europe in the mid 70s.
811
00:38:48,021 --> 00:38:52,068
I would sometimes seeing
European films see clips from it
812
00:38:52,112 --> 00:38:53,461
because other European directors
813
00:38:53,505 --> 00:38:55,768
were so in awe of "The
Important Thing is to Love"
814
00:38:55,811 --> 00:38:58,466
that they would run little
clips in their movies,
815
00:38:58,510 --> 00:39:01,469
lovers in French films
would often be going to see
816
00:39:01,513 --> 00:39:02,644
"The Important Thing
is to Love."
817
00:39:02,688 --> 00:39:04,733
It became this
immediate touchstone
818
00:39:04,777 --> 00:39:07,649
that automatically was
being quoted in other films.
819
00:39:07,693 --> 00:39:10,826
[speaking in foreign language]
820
00:39:10,870 --> 00:39:13,351
But it only opened briefly,
it only opened for a week
821
00:39:13,394 --> 00:39:14,787
and it just was misunderstood
822
00:39:14,830 --> 00:39:17,442
by the first critics who
dealt with it.
823
00:39:17,485 --> 00:39:19,922
And so it didn't go anywhere,
824
00:39:19,966 --> 00:39:21,446
it didn't form the cult
that it could have
825
00:39:21,489 --> 00:39:24,405
here in the United States.
826
00:39:24,449 --> 00:39:28,148
[speaking in foreign language]
827
00:39:56,219 --> 00:39:57,830
- I mean, the thing
about the Z Channel
828
00:39:57,873 --> 00:40:02,182
is that the sensibility was
offbeat and a little bit,
829
00:40:04,402 --> 00:40:05,968
I don't know, I mean,
they showed everything.
830
00:40:06,012 --> 00:40:08,971
- It was really appropriate
that it was in LA in a way
831
00:40:09,015 --> 00:40:13,019
because in New York, we did
have a lot of like venues
832
00:40:14,107 --> 00:40:15,848
to find those kind of movies.
833
00:40:15,891 --> 00:40:18,198
- When I started working
at this video store
834
00:40:18,241 --> 00:40:20,069
in Manhattan Beach Club
video archives,
835
00:40:20,113 --> 00:40:23,290
and the guy who owned
the store, Lance Lawson,
836
00:40:23,333 --> 00:40:24,770
I would ask, hey, do you
have this movie,
837
00:40:24,813 --> 00:40:26,728
do you have that movie,
and he'd pull 'em out.
838
00:40:26,772 --> 00:40:28,208
And as I'd watch 'em,
839
00:40:28,251 --> 00:40:30,297
I'd realize that these were
the old Z Channel tapes.
840
00:40:30,340 --> 00:40:33,561
- And I still have
probably hundreds of hours
841
00:40:33,605 --> 00:40:36,738
of films that I recorded
off the Z Channel.
842
00:40:36,782 --> 00:40:38,566
- I saw "Dead Pigeon on
Beethoven Street"
843
00:40:38,610 --> 00:40:39,567
from Z Channel,
844
00:40:39,611 --> 00:40:40,960
I had a whole,
845
00:40:41,003 --> 00:40:43,179
and he just lent me the film
846
00:40:43,223 --> 00:40:45,965
and then I watch it and then
it just makes me go like this
847
00:40:46,008 --> 00:40:47,096
'cause the beginning of it,
848
00:40:47,140 --> 00:40:49,490
our tribute to Sam Fuller,
all right?
849
00:40:49,534 --> 00:40:52,798
And you see all the other
movies that like they also show
850
00:40:52,841 --> 00:40:54,495
but Lance only taped
"Dead Pigeon," all right?
851
00:40:54,539 --> 00:40:58,456
Like damn, I wanna see
"Fixed Bayonets," "Park Row,"
852
00:41:01,197 --> 00:41:02,242
God damn it.
853
00:41:03,635 --> 00:41:06,115
Tape park fucking row.
854
00:41:06,159 --> 00:41:09,467
- In those days, that was
the only game in town.
855
00:41:09,510 --> 00:41:11,120
I mean, there's only
cable channel
856
00:41:11,164 --> 00:41:13,035
that you can watch
real good movies
857
00:41:13,079 --> 00:41:16,474
which totally disappeared
from the screen.
858
00:41:17,692 --> 00:41:19,912
And some of them
viewed my movies
859
00:41:19,955 --> 00:41:22,610
and of course, I always
like to see my movie
860
00:41:22,654 --> 00:41:25,091
just to see what's
on television.
861
00:41:30,052 --> 00:41:34,796
♪ Stay alive until the
night is over ♪
862
00:41:38,060 --> 00:41:42,238
♪ And just the station
on your way ♪
863
00:41:43,849 --> 00:41:47,635
- When "McCabe & Mrs. Miller"
first came out, it was a flop.
864
00:41:47,679 --> 00:41:51,030
It made less money, grossed
less money, I think,
865
00:41:51,073 --> 00:41:52,858
than "O.C. and Stiggs"
866
00:41:52,901 --> 00:41:55,861
or some of these films in
mind that were really flops.
867
00:41:55,904 --> 00:41:59,647
And it's become a little
kind of a mini classic.
868
00:42:01,649 --> 00:42:03,651
You do a film and it's so,
869
00:42:06,698 --> 00:42:10,049
it's just different from
what the standard thing is.
870
00:42:10,092 --> 00:42:12,094
They just don't succeed
871
00:42:12,138 --> 00:42:14,662
until the audiences have time
872
00:42:14,706 --> 00:42:17,665
to let themselves
catch up with it.
873
00:42:18,927 --> 00:42:21,060
It's hard to keep the
audience's attention
874
00:42:21,103 --> 00:42:23,932
when you show them everything.
875
00:42:23,976 --> 00:42:27,457
And the problem with most
films is that you hear it,
876
00:42:27,501 --> 00:42:29,503
you see exactly what it is.
877
00:42:29,547 --> 00:42:32,767
If you're talking, there's
a big close up of your face
878
00:42:32,811 --> 00:42:37,293
so we know that you're
talking and we hear it.
879
00:42:37,337 --> 00:42:41,384
So I think the mandate in
the film is to hide that,
880
00:42:42,603 --> 00:42:45,563
to make the audience,
well, what's going on,
881
00:42:45,606 --> 00:42:48,870
I don't quite see that,
and oh, you think that,
882
00:42:48,914 --> 00:42:51,656
so that the goosebumps
can come out.
883
00:42:53,788 --> 00:42:57,575
Otherwise, you're sitting
there drinking Coca Cola
884
00:42:57,618 --> 00:42:59,359
and eating a hot dog.
885
00:43:00,534 --> 00:43:03,145
♪ You chose your journey
886
00:43:03,189 --> 00:43:07,672
♪ Long before you came
upon this highway ♪
887
00:43:09,761 --> 00:43:12,720
- I knew Jerry
personally so well.
888
00:43:12,764 --> 00:43:16,332
He would say, hey, I wanna
sneak your film on my channel.
889
00:43:16,376 --> 00:43:18,334
I said, oh, that's good
890
00:43:18,378 --> 00:43:20,946
'cause otherwise they
didn't play anywhere.
891
00:43:20,989 --> 00:43:22,556
They just didn't play anywhere.
892
00:43:22,600 --> 00:43:25,124
[upbeat music]
893
00:43:33,175 --> 00:43:35,656
- The Z Channel did great
film festivals,
894
00:43:35,700 --> 00:43:38,746
we'd put on Truffaut
film festivals
895
00:43:38,790 --> 00:43:42,837
and Curacao film festivals
and Australian film festivals,
896
00:43:42,881 --> 00:43:44,709
French film festivals,
English film festivals,
897
00:43:44,752 --> 00:43:47,799
anything that we can
sort of highlight
898
00:43:47,842 --> 00:43:50,497
maybe a lesser known
movie around.
899
00:43:50,540 --> 00:43:53,021
- Yeah, I mean, the cool
thing about Z Channel
900
00:43:53,065 --> 00:43:56,198
was like investigating
somebody's work.
901
00:43:57,722 --> 00:44:01,595
Jacqueline Bisset seemed
like a fetish in a way,
902
00:44:01,639 --> 00:44:03,379
which I thought was pretty cool.
903
00:44:03,423 --> 00:44:06,644
- Jacqueline Bisset is so
much a figure of Z Channel
904
00:44:06,687 --> 00:44:09,168
I think because her
great beauty,
905
00:44:10,604 --> 00:44:13,781
her great beauty led itself to
"Day for Night" by Truffaut,
906
00:44:13,825 --> 00:44:16,436
it lent itself to a wonderful
film called "Le Magnifique"
907
00:44:16,479 --> 00:44:18,612
which was the
quintessential Z movie,
908
00:44:18,656 --> 00:44:20,222
that is to say,
909
00:44:20,266 --> 00:44:24,052
a European movie that few
people knew about stateside,
910
00:44:24,096 --> 00:44:26,402
but which had a great deal
911
00:44:26,446 --> 00:44:29,144
of American style entertainment
value built into it.
912
00:44:29,188 --> 00:44:31,886
[upbeat music]
913
00:44:38,458 --> 00:44:42,201
[speaking in foreign language]
914
00:44:46,248 --> 00:44:50,035
- You got Jean-Paul
Belmondo as a poor writer
915
00:44:50,078 --> 00:44:51,819
who's fantasizing himself
916
00:44:51,863 --> 00:44:55,431
the superhero of his
own pulp novel,
917
00:44:55,475 --> 00:44:58,260
and the girl downstairs,
Jackie Bisset,
918
00:44:58,304 --> 00:45:01,002
is like the the iconic
star of this pulp novel
919
00:45:01,046 --> 00:45:02,787
in this guy's head.
920
00:45:02,830 --> 00:45:06,094
[soft music]
921
00:45:06,138 --> 00:45:09,837
[speaking in foreign language]
922
00:45:15,843 --> 00:45:17,758
- When I did "Le Magnifique,"
923
00:45:17,802 --> 00:45:21,240
Philippe de Broca asked
me to play this part
924
00:45:21,283 --> 00:45:23,068
which was one part was a student
925
00:45:23,111 --> 00:45:26,854
and one part was this sort
of Bond type character.
926
00:45:28,638 --> 00:45:32,251
[singing in foreign language]
927
00:45:38,300 --> 00:45:41,913
[speaking in foreign language]
928
00:45:53,098 --> 00:45:54,882
Doing "Le Magnifique"
was interesting,
929
00:45:54,926 --> 00:45:58,843
but interesting for me was
to watch Jean-Paul Belmondo
930
00:45:58,886 --> 00:46:02,107
because he was the most
coordinated actor
931
00:46:02,150 --> 00:46:03,935
I've ever worked with
932
00:46:03,978 --> 00:46:05,719
and he could do three
or four things,
933
00:46:05,763 --> 00:46:08,026
comb his hair, machine
gun somebody,
934
00:46:08,069 --> 00:46:12,073
jump from rock to rock
like a light footed leper,
935
00:46:12,117 --> 00:46:13,901
not a leper, leopard,
936
00:46:17,775 --> 00:46:20,952
like an animal, like a
beautiful animal.
937
00:46:25,304 --> 00:46:27,393
♪ Hallelujah
938
00:46:27,436 --> 00:46:29,525
♪ Hallelujah
939
00:46:29,569 --> 00:46:34,139
♪ Hallelujah, Hallelujah,
Hallelujah ♪
940
00:46:34,182 --> 00:46:38,230
♪ Hallelujah, Hallelujah
941
00:46:38,273 --> 00:46:40,362
- It was like having a
film festival in your house
942
00:46:40,406 --> 00:46:42,974
every single night, a
film festival,
943
00:46:43,496 --> 00:46:45,324
but you wouldn't have to
go to Rotterdam
944
00:46:45,367 --> 00:46:46,586
and you wouldn't have
to go to Berlin
945
00:46:46,629 --> 00:46:47,848
and you wouldn't have
to go to Cannes
946
00:46:47,892 --> 00:46:49,328
and you wouldn't have
to go to Venice.
947
00:46:49,371 --> 00:46:52,157
It was just like your own
private film festival.
948
00:46:52,200 --> 00:46:56,161
And the programming was
eccentric and odd and mixed.
949
00:46:57,597 --> 00:46:58,903
I was angry at it many times,
950
00:46:58,946 --> 00:47:01,122
I thought, why are you
playing that?
951
00:47:01,166 --> 00:47:03,864
You're the only voice
on television,
952
00:47:03,908 --> 00:47:07,259
play only the kind of
art films that I like,
953
00:47:07,302 --> 00:47:10,871
but it was very good enough
and not catering just to me,
954
00:47:10,915 --> 00:47:13,569
it really gave you a kind
of smorgasbord,
955
00:47:13,613 --> 00:47:17,660
it gave you a kind of open ended
view of all kinds of cinema
956
00:47:17,704 --> 00:47:18,966
and it gave you a sense
957
00:47:19,010 --> 00:47:21,621
of the size and scope
that cinema has.
958
00:47:36,897 --> 00:47:38,812
- Antonioni is not necessarily
959
00:47:38,856 --> 00:47:43,382
about the logical structure
of a dramatic story,
960
00:47:43,425 --> 00:47:45,863
but about atmosphere and nuance
961
00:47:47,647 --> 00:47:50,780
and the kind of
emotional tension
962
00:47:50,824 --> 00:47:53,174
that exists more like weather.
963
00:47:54,915 --> 00:47:57,396
One of the most striking
things for me in my memory
964
00:47:57,439 --> 00:48:00,660
is Monica Vitti walking
across a piazza.
965
00:48:02,531 --> 00:48:04,403
And then you see above
966
00:48:04,446 --> 00:48:07,885
like about 25 guys just
watching her move,
967
00:48:10,191 --> 00:48:13,629
and it says so much about
Italian culture,
968
00:48:13,673 --> 00:48:17,851
about visual imagery, about
femininity, about sex,
969
00:48:17,895 --> 00:48:20,071
about the just being a human
970
00:48:22,377 --> 00:48:27,165
and then being in a place in a
like kind of classical piazza
971
00:48:28,035 --> 00:48:31,691
somewhere very, very
Italian and Mediterranean.
972
00:48:31,734 --> 00:48:35,042
I don't know, it's just
kind of haunting.
973
00:48:41,919 --> 00:48:44,399
- Jeanne Moreau walking down
the street in "La Notte"
974
00:48:44,443 --> 00:48:45,444
did it for me,
975
00:48:45,487 --> 00:48:46,706
I said, this is a woman,
976
00:48:46,749 --> 00:48:48,012
this is a job, whatever
this woman is doing,
977
00:48:48,055 --> 00:48:50,449
I've no idea why she's
so depressed.
978
00:48:50,492 --> 00:48:51,885
She is obviously
totally depressed
979
00:48:51,929 --> 00:48:54,148
and this man is not
treating her well.
980
00:48:54,192 --> 00:48:57,195
I don't care about him,
she is fascinating.
981
00:48:57,238 --> 00:48:58,674
I don't know what that
all that means,
982
00:48:58,718 --> 00:49:00,938
it's just unknown material.
983
00:49:00,981 --> 00:49:02,330
- For someone to sit and think,
984
00:49:02,374 --> 00:49:06,465
okay, I wanna show the final
break in a relationship,
985
00:49:09,381 --> 00:49:12,079
I wanna see that actual,
the crack.
986
00:49:13,124 --> 00:49:13,951
Now, how?
987
00:49:15,561 --> 00:49:18,912
What about they attend an
all night party
988
00:49:21,523 --> 00:49:25,049
and somehow it's the
attending of that party
989
00:49:25,092 --> 00:49:28,487
that makes them finally realize
990
00:49:28,530 --> 00:49:31,055
that their relationship is dead,
991
00:49:31,098 --> 00:49:33,057
and that's the film you
set out to write.
992
00:49:33,100 --> 00:49:36,974
[speaking in foreign language]
993
00:49:48,550 --> 00:49:50,074
- [Interviewer] Have
you been married?
994
00:49:50,117 --> 00:49:52,206
- [Jerry] Yeah, I think so.
995
00:49:59,779 --> 00:50:01,302
- By the fall of 1983,
996
00:50:02,564 --> 00:50:03,913
it was really clear to me
997
00:50:03,957 --> 00:50:05,785
that I couldn't stay in
this relationship anymore,
998
00:50:05,828 --> 00:50:08,962
the psychiatry that I'd
had so much hope for
999
00:50:09,006 --> 00:50:10,790
wasn't gonna solve the problem,
1000
00:50:10,833 --> 00:50:12,966
Jerry wasn't ready to
solve the problem,
1001
00:50:13,010 --> 00:50:16,013
or perhaps capable, but
I didn't care anymore.
1002
00:50:16,056 --> 00:50:18,406
- I went into work one
day and Jerry wasn't there
1003
00:50:18,450 --> 00:50:22,367
and he was gone as it would
prove for three weeks.
1004
00:50:22,410 --> 00:50:23,977
I had understood that it
was a contract dispute
1005
00:50:24,021 --> 00:50:25,761
and he was holding a firm line.
1006
00:50:25,805 --> 00:50:28,329
Well, he served for
three weeks later
1007
00:50:28,373 --> 00:50:32,333
and then in that time,
he had divorced Vera.
1008
00:50:32,377 --> 00:50:35,336
- He continued to be in
touch with me,
1009
00:50:35,380 --> 00:50:37,991
we saw one another a few times.
1010
00:50:39,123 --> 00:50:42,387
A couple of times when
they were really ill fated
1011
00:50:42,430 --> 00:50:45,346
because we sort of had
a little moment together
1012
00:50:45,390 --> 00:50:46,695
and then that would
just make it worse
1013
00:50:46,739 --> 00:50:48,001
because it would give him hope.
1014
00:50:48,045 --> 00:50:51,831
- Jerry spoke bitterly
of that period.
1015
00:50:51,874 --> 00:50:53,180
Not bitterly of Vera
1016
00:50:53,224 --> 00:50:56,618
but just of being married
and being in that zone
1017
00:50:56,662 --> 00:50:59,186
and it was just somehow that
was something we didn't discuss
1018
00:50:59,230 --> 00:51:02,581
except to acknowledge
that love was hell.
1019
00:51:04,713 --> 00:51:06,193
In that three weeks
1020
00:51:06,237 --> 00:51:08,021
in which he had disappeared
from the face of the earth,
1021
00:51:08,065 --> 00:51:09,849
he had dissolved his
marriage to Vera
1022
00:51:09,892 --> 00:51:13,766
and started dating the
landlady at his new apartment,
1023
00:51:13,809 --> 00:51:15,420
it was Deri Rudulph,
1024
00:51:15,463 --> 00:51:18,684
who I eventually met
a couple months later.
1025
00:51:21,687 --> 00:51:24,037
- Jerry Harvey loved the movie
1026
00:51:24,081 --> 00:51:27,693
that Henry Fonda did with his
ex wife, Margaret Sullavan,
1027
00:51:27,736 --> 00:51:29,608
it was called "The
Moon's Our Home,"
1028
00:51:29,651 --> 00:51:31,218
and it's basically the
New Year's Eve picture
1029
00:51:31,262 --> 00:51:32,611
and Jerry wanted to play it
1030
00:51:32,654 --> 00:51:35,048
as his New Year's Eve
movie one year.
1031
00:51:35,092 --> 00:51:36,093
Very hard to get ahold of.
1032
00:51:36,658 --> 00:51:38,138
- Do you Sera Brown--
1033
00:51:38,182 --> 00:51:39,618
- I suppose you'd want me
to wait around doing nothing
1034
00:51:39,661 --> 00:51:40,880
while you're making
up your mind?
1035
00:51:40,923 --> 00:51:42,142
- I certainly do.
1036
00:51:42,186 --> 00:51:44,057
- To have and to hold
from this day forward--
1037
00:51:44,101 --> 00:51:45,450
- If that's what you
feel about it,
1038
00:51:45,493 --> 00:51:46,407
you might have called the
whole thing off.
1039
00:51:46,451 --> 00:51:48,670
- I certainly do.
1040
00:51:48,714 --> 00:51:50,672
- Do you promise to love,
honor and obey him--
1041
00:51:50,716 --> 00:51:51,456
- You really mean that?
1042
00:51:51,499 --> 00:51:53,284
- I most certainly do.
1043
00:51:54,589 --> 00:51:56,765
I'm sick of being made
a fool, I'm through.
1044
00:51:57,331 --> 00:51:58,854
I never wanna see you
again as long as I live,
1045
00:51:58,898 --> 00:52:00,508
I wouldn't marry you...
1046
00:52:01,944 --> 00:52:04,425
- Now all you got to do is
kiss the bride and it's $3.
1047
00:52:06,471 --> 00:52:08,168
- It was a favorite
picture of his
1048
00:52:08,212 --> 00:52:10,692
and the audience got to see it.
1049
00:52:14,305 --> 00:52:15,523
- [Interviewer] I can see
1050
00:52:15,567 --> 00:52:17,917
that you're definitely in
love with films,
1051
00:52:17,960 --> 00:52:20,485
I mean, suddenly it's your life,
1052
00:52:20,528 --> 00:52:22,269
but it seems to be
totally your life,
1053
00:52:22,313 --> 00:52:26,578
do you do anything outside
of film, for instance.
1054
00:52:26,621 --> 00:52:28,710
- [Jerry] What do you mean?
1055
00:52:29,929 --> 00:52:31,191
- Jerry was a creature of habit
1056
00:52:31,235 --> 00:52:33,193
and he had his watering holes
1057
00:52:33,237 --> 00:52:36,065
and I think the favorite
of all his watering holes
1058
00:52:36,109 --> 00:52:37,110
was Guido's.
1059
00:52:38,416 --> 00:52:42,115
And he very often went
there with Michael Cimino.
1060
00:52:42,159 --> 00:52:43,725
When I was introduced to
Cimino for the first time,
1061
00:52:43,769 --> 00:52:45,466
it was at Guido's.
1062
00:52:45,510 --> 00:52:48,252
Jerry knew all the waiters,
they all knew Jerry,
1063
00:52:48,295 --> 00:52:49,514
the waiters all knew Cimino.
1064
00:52:49,557 --> 00:52:52,647
In fact, when Cimino
walked through the door,
1065
00:52:52,691 --> 00:52:55,955
two waiters at once reached
out with cigarette lighters.
1066
00:52:55,998 --> 00:52:58,697
- I remember going to
Guido's one afternoon for,
1067
00:52:58,740 --> 00:53:01,395
it's kind of a late, late,
late lunch.
1068
00:53:01,439 --> 00:53:04,311
And Jerry was there and
pretty wound up.
1069
00:53:04,355 --> 00:53:06,922
And the thing I remember
the most about it
1070
00:53:06,966 --> 00:53:11,536
is he was perspiring kind of
profusely in the restaurant.
1071
00:53:11,579 --> 00:53:13,320
And I can remember exactly
what he was wound up about,
1072
00:53:13,364 --> 00:53:15,496
but he's wound up
about something,
1073
00:53:15,540 --> 00:53:16,497
it was something was going on
1074
00:53:16,541 --> 00:53:17,716
or something was bothering him,
1075
00:53:17,759 --> 00:53:20,327
but we had a few drinks
1076
00:53:20,371 --> 00:53:23,156
and I remember the waiter or
one of the guys came around
1077
00:53:23,200 --> 00:53:25,724
and adjusted his neck for him
right there at the restaurant,
1078
00:53:25,767 --> 00:53:27,552
kind of got behind him and said,
1079
00:53:27,595 --> 00:53:30,163
Jerry you're way
overstressed here,
1080
00:53:30,207 --> 00:53:34,733
and kind of cracked his neck
and I was like, oh, my God.
1081
00:53:34,776 --> 00:53:36,561
- He's really moody guy,
1082
00:53:36,604 --> 00:53:40,565
the days that he would
walk into his office,
1083
00:53:40,608 --> 00:53:43,220
sort of skulk into his
office and shut the door,
1084
00:53:43,263 --> 00:53:44,743
we knew not to approach him.
1085
00:53:44,786 --> 00:53:46,962
- I know he fought with
his demons an awful lot.
1086
00:53:47,006 --> 00:53:48,442
At the same time,
1087
00:53:48,486 --> 00:53:50,531
those demons were kind
of which drove him on
1088
00:53:50,575 --> 00:53:52,533
because he was insistent
and persistent
1089
00:53:52,577 --> 00:53:55,536
and he refused to take
no for an answer
1090
00:53:55,580 --> 00:53:59,105
and he was constantly
trying to make things right.
1091
00:53:59,453 --> 00:54:04,458
- I remember when Jerry brought
"1900," Bertolucci's film
1092
00:54:04,980 --> 00:54:09,637
and played the entire film not
cut, and it was so exciting.
1093
00:54:10,812 --> 00:54:14,468
- I got the six hour
"1900" all right from Lance
1094
00:54:14,512 --> 00:54:17,036
when he taped it off
of Z Channel.
1095
00:54:17,341 --> 00:54:21,040
- I still have 'cause it
took me two 120 tapes,
1096
00:54:22,171 --> 00:54:25,827
I still have the full
"1900" recorded off of Z.
1097
00:54:30,310 --> 00:54:34,009
[speaking in foreign language]
1098
00:54:41,843 --> 00:54:44,411
- "1900" was very jinxed film
1099
00:54:44,455 --> 00:54:47,719
in the sense that Bertolucci
had spent too much money on it,
1100
00:54:47,762 --> 00:54:49,242
the Grimaldis were
unhappy with him
1101
00:54:49,286 --> 00:54:50,896
for spending too
much money on it
1102
00:54:50,939 --> 00:54:53,594
and so his version was under
lock and key for many years,
1103
00:54:53,638 --> 00:54:55,683
almost in a fit of peak.
1104
00:54:55,727 --> 00:54:58,207
- Jerry insisted to the
Grimaldis for five years
1105
00:54:58,251 --> 00:55:01,515
that they had an uncut "1900,"
1106
00:55:01,559 --> 00:55:03,343
a five hour version of "1900."
1107
00:55:03,387 --> 00:55:04,866
They said, no, no, it no
longer exists,
1108
00:55:04,910 --> 00:55:07,478
maybe it existed once,
but it no longer exists.
1109
00:55:07,521 --> 00:55:08,827
And he pressed them
and pressed them
1110
00:55:08,870 --> 00:55:11,395
and eventually he managed
to get it released
1111
00:55:11,438 --> 00:55:13,048
and so we showed it
on Z Channel.
1112
00:55:13,092 --> 00:55:15,224
And there you could
see in all its splendor
1113
00:55:15,268 --> 00:55:17,488
what Bertolucci had intended.
1114
00:55:23,102 --> 00:55:25,452
- So another amazing thing
about the Z Channel to me,
1115
00:55:25,496 --> 00:55:26,888
like I don't even know
1116
00:55:26,932 --> 00:55:30,501
how you could get the
rights to show these things
1117
00:55:31,371 --> 00:55:33,373
with all those
politics involved,
1118
00:55:33,417 --> 00:55:38,030
but to just have access to
the the vision of the director
1119
00:55:38,073 --> 00:55:40,859
is amazing, invaluable.
1120
00:55:40,902 --> 00:55:43,427
- You just never know when
you're living in a golden age.
1121
00:55:43,470 --> 00:55:45,864
- I saw Berlin Alexanderplatz.
1122
00:55:48,736 --> 00:55:51,565
Now, that was the most
extraordinary revelation,
1123
00:55:51,609 --> 00:55:54,307
where else are you gonna
see this 12 or 14 hours
1124
00:55:54,351 --> 00:55:56,178
of his magnificent novel
1125
00:55:56,222 --> 00:55:59,486
turned into this
extraordinarily brilliant film
1126
00:55:59,530 --> 00:56:02,010
which nobody in commercial
filmmaking to this day
1127
00:56:02,054 --> 00:56:03,795
will ever put on television.
1128
00:56:03,838 --> 00:56:07,712
It was like some enormous
meal that kept coming
1129
00:56:07,755 --> 00:56:10,889
and you saw the whole
thing, it was breathtaking.
1130
00:56:10,932 --> 00:56:14,675
[speaking in foreign language]
1131
00:56:39,526 --> 00:56:43,225
- One day he walked into
the office and said,
1132
00:56:45,227 --> 00:56:46,838
come into my office, please.
1133
00:56:46,881 --> 00:56:49,928
And I went into his
office and he said,
1134
00:56:51,408 --> 00:56:53,410
he sat back in his
chair and he said,
1135
00:56:53,453 --> 00:56:55,716
I don't like the air
that you breathe,
1136
00:56:55,760 --> 00:56:57,979
I don't like the ground
that you walk on,
1137
00:56:58,023 --> 00:57:01,418
I can't stand to be in
the same room as you are,
1138
00:57:01,461 --> 00:57:03,768
you are a horse unrestrained.
1139
00:57:04,812 --> 00:57:06,118
And I looked at him
1140
00:57:06,161 --> 00:57:09,077
and I was completely
flabbergasted and shocked.
1141
00:57:09,121 --> 00:57:10,557
I mean, I think I even laughed
1142
00:57:10,601 --> 00:57:13,386
because it was so
out of nowhere.
1143
00:57:14,909 --> 00:57:17,085
And I remember laughing,
1144
00:57:17,129 --> 00:57:19,218
I remember at one point
laughing and saying,
1145
00:57:19,261 --> 00:57:21,481
well, I guess there's no room
1146
00:57:21,525 --> 00:57:24,310
for me to grow in this
organization.
1147
00:57:25,398 --> 00:57:26,573
And he told me
1148
00:57:28,445 --> 00:57:30,403
he'd write a letter of
recommendation or something.
1149
00:57:35,887 --> 00:57:39,978
- The day Peckinpah died,
Jerry had to leave work early.
1150
00:57:40,021 --> 00:57:42,023
Jerry got the phone call
that Peckinpah had died
1151
00:57:42,067 --> 00:57:43,764
and as someone who
knew Jerry well,
1152
00:57:43,808 --> 00:57:45,462
just came over to the office
1153
00:57:45,505 --> 00:57:47,333
and took him out for the
rest of the day.
1154
00:57:47,376 --> 00:57:49,596
It was just understood
that that was just gonna be
1155
00:57:49,640 --> 00:57:51,598
something Jerry couldn't
work past for a bit.
1156
00:57:52,077 --> 00:57:54,819
- He was like family,
Sam and Jerry,
1157
00:57:54,862 --> 00:57:58,213
and Jerry had a very
strong sense of family
1158
00:58:00,694 --> 00:58:04,481
and that you don't see
that much anymore.
1159
00:58:04,524 --> 00:58:06,439
Really if you felt
1160
00:58:06,483 --> 00:58:10,835
that you were part of this
undefinable idea of a family,
1161
00:58:17,755 --> 00:58:21,019
you could turn your
back and he'd cover it.
1162
00:58:21,062 --> 00:58:24,239
We were all quite
devastated over Sam passing
1163
00:58:24,283 --> 00:58:27,547
and the fact that he
wasn't able to get work.
1164
00:58:27,591 --> 00:58:29,854
There was nobody in this town
1165
00:58:29,897 --> 00:58:33,379
that would finance him
at all for anything,
1166
00:58:33,422 --> 00:58:37,470
I think the last thing you
did was a Julian Lennon video.
1167
00:58:37,514 --> 00:58:40,255
- Well, Peckinpah's recent
years had been so difficult
1168
00:58:40,299 --> 00:58:42,867
that one could see,
one could sense
1169
00:58:42,910 --> 00:58:47,219
that he was moving toward
that one way or another.
1170
00:58:47,262 --> 00:58:48,829
Yeah, yeah.
1171
00:58:48,873 --> 00:58:51,092
[soft music]
1172
00:59:25,692 --> 00:59:27,085
- As a receptionist,
1173
00:59:27,128 --> 00:59:29,653
I was literally sitting
right outside Jerry's door,
1174
00:59:29,696 --> 00:59:32,003
so quietly sat there
1175
00:59:32,046 --> 00:59:36,747
and occasionally would bring
up some film talk with him
1176
00:59:36,790 --> 00:59:41,534
and he began to realize that I
knew a little bit about film.
1177
00:59:42,317 --> 00:59:45,930
Then he brought me into
the programming department.
1178
00:59:45,973 --> 00:59:47,496
- And he usually had
Tim Ryerson in with him
1179
00:59:47,540 --> 00:59:49,368
and they'd be like two guys
1180
00:59:49,411 --> 00:59:51,326
baling hay on an
intellectual level.
1181
00:59:51,370 --> 00:59:53,894
They'd just be, why don't we
do this, why don't we do that,
1182
00:59:53,938 --> 00:59:55,983
and they'd be moving
their way down the board
1183
00:59:56,027 --> 00:59:57,681
trying ideas out on each other.
1184
00:59:57,724 --> 00:59:58,899
- We stood at that board
1185
00:59:58,943 --> 01:00:02,599
and move those magnetic
stripes around
1186
01:00:02,642 --> 01:00:06,124
that represented the
different films.
1187
01:00:06,167 --> 01:00:08,387
I can remember many times
1188
01:00:08,430 --> 01:00:11,129
just it was like standing
there and looking at it
1189
01:00:11,172 --> 01:00:12,609
and it's just dreaming
1190
01:00:12,652 --> 01:00:16,743
about all the wonderful
possibilities that you could do.
1191
01:00:27,624 --> 01:00:29,147
- Claude Chabrol,
1192
01:00:29,190 --> 01:00:31,149
in fact, that was one of the
other directors, all right,
1193
01:00:31,192 --> 01:00:32,454
that Lance gave me.
1194
01:00:32,498 --> 01:00:34,195
I'd never seen "This Man
Must Die," all right,
1195
01:00:34,239 --> 01:00:35,980
and they showed it on Z
Channel and I got it from him,
1196
01:00:36,023 --> 01:00:37,764
you still can't see that
goddamn movie.
1197
01:00:37,808 --> 01:00:40,158
- It was the great thing
about Z right from the get go
1198
01:00:40,201 --> 01:00:41,725
that they were running
European films.
1199
01:00:41,768 --> 01:00:43,596
That was how they got
the reputation
1200
01:00:43,640 --> 01:00:44,989
that they programmed them well
1201
01:00:45,032 --> 01:00:46,773
and they were making a
hit with it, who knew?
1202
01:00:46,817 --> 01:00:49,384
[upbeat music]
1203
01:01:05,879 --> 01:01:07,838
One interesting aspect
of "Das Boot,"
1204
01:01:07,881 --> 01:01:10,667
it had a career as a
film in theaters
1205
01:01:10,710 --> 01:01:12,973
where it really wowed
audiences around the country.
1206
01:01:13,017 --> 01:01:14,801
But then, we discovered
1207
01:01:14,845 --> 01:01:17,412
that it had been a mini
series in Germany,
1208
01:01:17,456 --> 01:01:18,805
that it was actually
six hours long
1209
01:01:18,849 --> 01:01:21,634
and that there were
six hour long episodes.
1210
01:01:21,678 --> 01:01:22,853
Makes sense, we showed it.
1211
01:01:22,896 --> 01:01:26,073
[speaking indistinctly]
1212
01:01:34,473 --> 01:01:36,693
There's this tragic irony
under "Das Boot"
1213
01:01:36,736 --> 01:01:39,260
that these guys who are
just hard working guys
1214
01:01:39,304 --> 01:01:41,480
who don't think politically
1215
01:01:41,523 --> 01:01:44,526
who just love the sea and
are under it and in it
1216
01:01:44,570 --> 01:01:46,050
and involved with their work
1217
01:01:46,093 --> 01:01:49,053
and whose reality is
one another,
1218
01:01:49,096 --> 01:01:50,532
they have no idea
1219
01:01:50,576 --> 01:01:52,665
that there in a sense like
the Monty Python character
1220
01:01:52,709 --> 01:01:55,102
is about to be crushed by
a big foot from the sky.
1221
01:01:55,146 --> 01:01:58,062
And in a way, it's because
it's played in slow motion,
1222
01:01:58,105 --> 01:02:01,369
we can feel the tragic
melancholy behind that.
1223
01:02:01,413 --> 01:02:03,894
[upbeat music]
1224
01:02:11,292 --> 01:02:12,467
- HBO was a thorn in the side
1225
01:02:12,511 --> 01:02:14,295
of everyone that
worked at Z Channel
1226
01:02:14,339 --> 01:02:18,256
'cause they feared that HBO
would muscle them off the dial.
1227
01:02:18,299 --> 01:02:21,825
HBO had buying power so they
could give monies to studios
1228
01:02:21,868 --> 01:02:23,087
which were very alluring.
1229
01:02:23,130 --> 01:02:26,264
- The Z Channel had
budgets that restricted
1230
01:02:26,307 --> 01:02:28,832
and you couldn't just pay
for everything
1231
01:02:28,875 --> 01:02:30,529
that you really wanted to do.
1232
01:02:30,572 --> 01:02:32,487
- There was always
somebody saying to him,
1233
01:02:32,531 --> 01:02:35,099
do we have to spend money
on this program guide?
1234
01:02:35,142 --> 01:02:37,666
Gee, if we didn't have
the program guide,
1235
01:02:37,710 --> 01:02:39,712
then we could be
more profitable.
1236
01:02:39,756 --> 01:02:42,715
Do you have to spend so
much money on the movies?
1237
01:02:42,759 --> 01:02:46,501
Do we have to spend so much
in marketing the Z Channel?
1238
01:02:46,545 --> 01:02:48,112
There were all these
pressures on him.
1239
01:02:48,155 --> 01:02:49,722
Sometimes they would
take money away from him
1240
01:02:49,766 --> 01:02:51,376
that he couldn't spend
the next year.
1241
01:02:51,419 --> 01:02:54,031
- He had to figure out
what his limitations were.
1242
01:02:54,074 --> 01:02:55,641
And Jerry was very good
about doing that,
1243
01:02:55,684 --> 01:02:57,164
he had a very strong
business sense
1244
01:02:57,208 --> 01:03:00,080
so he knew what he could
do and what he couldn't do.
1245
01:03:00,124 --> 01:03:02,909
But he realized that what
he could do was a lot
1246
01:03:02,953 --> 01:03:05,346
based on simply his own
knowledge of movies.
1247
01:03:05,390 --> 01:03:07,740
[soft music]
1248
01:03:35,159 --> 01:03:37,901
- Not only did Jerry champion
1249
01:03:37,944 --> 01:03:40,164
the full version of
"Heaven's Gate,"
1250
01:03:40,207 --> 01:03:42,340
but he also felt the same way
1251
01:03:42,383 --> 01:03:46,344
about Leone's "Once
Upon a Time in America."
1252
01:03:46,387 --> 01:03:47,475
- Because you still think
1253
01:03:47,519 --> 01:03:48,563
like some schmuck
from the streets.
1254
01:03:48,607 --> 01:03:49,826
Now, if we'd listened to you,
1255
01:03:49,869 --> 01:03:51,566
we'd still be rolling
drunks for a living.
1256
01:03:51,610 --> 01:03:52,741
- It was a famous day,
you broke?
1257
01:03:52,785 --> 01:03:53,742
- Don't bust my balls, Noodles,
1258
01:03:53,786 --> 01:03:56,180
I am talking about real money.
1259
01:03:57,790 --> 01:03:59,400
- This is real money to me.
1260
01:04:00,053 --> 01:04:02,055
It's a lot of money, you
want any of it?
1261
01:04:03,840 --> 01:04:05,145
- You'll carry that stink
of the streets with you
1262
01:04:05,189 --> 01:04:06,581
the rest of your life.
1263
01:04:06,625 --> 01:04:08,192
- Well, when we did "Once
Upon a Time in America,"
1264
01:04:08,235 --> 01:04:11,151
it was clearly from a
personal point of view,
1265
01:04:11,195 --> 01:04:12,718
an extraordinary opportunity.
1266
01:04:12,761 --> 01:04:16,983
I think this is potentially
one of the greatest movies,
1267
01:04:20,857 --> 01:04:22,510
one of the great
epics ever made.
1268
01:04:22,554 --> 01:04:26,210
I mean, it was, Bob De Niro was
at the height of his career,
1269
01:04:26,253 --> 01:04:28,168
I mean, he still is,
he's always great,
1270
01:04:28,212 --> 01:04:31,868
but I mean, he had just
come off "Raging Bull."
1271
01:04:34,653 --> 01:04:36,655
Sergio Leone was a genius.
1272
01:04:39,527 --> 01:04:41,747
It was a 12 year
project for him.
1273
01:04:41,790 --> 01:04:44,184
We shot for 11 months,
1274
01:04:44,228 --> 01:04:47,013
and because of one
test screening,
1275
01:04:48,493 --> 01:04:50,060
Warner Brothers and
The Lead Company
1276
01:04:50,103 --> 01:04:52,758
decided to take the three
hour and 43 minute version
1277
01:04:52,801 --> 01:04:54,020
of "Once Upon a Time in America"
1278
01:04:54,064 --> 01:04:56,762
and cut it down to two
hours and something,
1279
01:04:56,805 --> 01:04:58,242
and they used the
assistant editor
1280
01:04:58,285 --> 01:05:01,288
of "Police Academy 2"
or something to cut it.
1281
01:05:01,332 --> 01:05:02,899
- It broke the director's heart.
1282
01:05:02,942 --> 01:05:04,422
He was cut by a group of people
1283
01:05:04,465 --> 01:05:07,425
who should never have been
allowed in the cutting room
1284
01:05:07,468 --> 01:05:09,035
and they massacred it,
they ruined it.
1285
01:05:09,079 --> 01:05:10,819
They made a test showing of
it in Chicago or Illinois,
1286
01:05:10,863 --> 01:05:11,995
something on a cold night,
1287
01:05:12,038 --> 01:05:14,432
they didn't get the
results they wanted.
1288
01:05:14,475 --> 01:05:15,650
- Any problem.
1289
01:05:15,694 --> 01:05:17,522
- No trouble, good stuff.
1290
01:05:23,136 --> 01:05:27,271
- It was a really grueling,
miserable experience,
1291
01:05:27,314 --> 01:05:30,013
it was hugely frustrating and
disappointing, discouraging.
1292
01:05:30,056 --> 01:05:32,232
- The full version was
a masterpiece
1293
01:05:32,276 --> 01:05:34,321
as compared to like a
routine film
1294
01:05:34,365 --> 01:05:37,107
in a butchered
shortened version.
1295
01:05:39,761 --> 01:05:42,677
- Come here, look at this,
come here.
1296
01:05:44,201 --> 01:05:46,594
Sudden death, fucking tragedy.
1297
01:05:49,206 --> 01:05:50,076
26 years old.
1298
01:05:51,121 --> 01:05:51,948
- 26?
1299
01:05:54,515 --> 01:05:55,690
What a shame.
1300
01:05:55,734 --> 01:05:58,911
- Great stiff, she died
of an overdose.
1301
01:05:58,955 --> 01:06:00,782
- And I'm ready for another.
1302
01:06:00,826 --> 01:06:03,524
- Jerry actually showed
both versions side by side
1303
01:06:03,568 --> 01:06:04,961
on the Z Channel.
1304
01:06:05,004 --> 01:06:07,572
And I mean, there was no doubt,
1305
01:06:07,615 --> 01:06:09,748
no doubt how stunning it is
1306
01:06:12,577 --> 01:06:16,537
to allow your creation
when you're an artist
1307
01:06:16,581 --> 01:06:21,151
to be manhandled by other people
who are maybe not as adept
1308
01:06:22,369 --> 01:06:25,329
at understanding the vision
as you the filmmaker is.
1309
01:06:25,372 --> 01:06:27,722
[soft music]
1310
01:06:30,595 --> 01:06:31,683
- Your brother's a real friend.
1311
01:06:31,726 --> 01:06:33,728
- He's a romantic.
1312
01:06:33,772 --> 01:06:36,775
- When it came out in
it's aborted version,
1313
01:06:36,818 --> 01:06:40,953
Sheila Benson, who was then
also a critic for "The Times,"
1314
01:06:40,997 --> 01:06:42,520
called it the worst
movie of the year,
1315
01:06:42,563 --> 01:06:44,609
and then it was restored
to the director's cut
1316
01:06:44,652 --> 01:06:45,697
which was also shown,
1317
01:06:45,740 --> 01:06:46,828
and eight years later,
1318
01:06:46,872 --> 01:06:48,613
she picked it as either the best
1319
01:06:48,656 --> 01:06:52,965
or one of the five or 10
best pictures of the decade,
1320
01:06:53,009 --> 01:06:55,098
which goes to show you what
a little editing can do.
1321
01:06:55,141 --> 01:06:57,448
[soft music]
1322
01:07:08,415 --> 01:07:11,592
- In a way, what Z Channel
was and what Jerry did
1323
01:07:11,636 --> 01:07:14,378
is it became an
alternative voice,
1324
01:07:14,421 --> 01:07:16,989
a voice which said, not
only you're wrong,
1325
01:07:17,033 --> 01:07:19,296
but here's why you're wrong,
1326
01:07:19,339 --> 01:07:23,822
here's how it should play and
here's how they played it.
1327
01:07:23,865 --> 01:07:25,563
And then they shut up
1328
01:07:25,606 --> 01:07:29,045
because a picture's worth
a million words.
1329
01:07:33,875 --> 01:07:36,965
- [Interviewer] And do you feel
you've arrived where you are
1330
01:07:37,009 --> 01:07:39,359
by accident or by design.
1331
01:07:39,403 --> 01:07:41,883
- [Jerry] Initially by accident
1332
01:07:41,927 --> 01:07:44,495
and then subsequently by design.
1333
01:07:45,931 --> 01:07:48,890
- Deri was so warm, she
was so bright,
1334
01:07:48,934 --> 01:07:51,893
and I met her at her house,
1335
01:07:51,937 --> 01:07:54,418
she had a party for
Jerry at her house.
1336
01:07:54,461 --> 01:07:58,030
And that in itself was a
very welcoming gesture.
1337
01:07:58,074 --> 01:08:01,599
It was a birthday party
at the end of 1985.
1338
01:08:01,642 --> 01:08:03,688
- She was a lovely woman,
1339
01:08:03,731 --> 01:08:07,170
both in spirit and
physical beauty actually.
1340
01:08:07,213 --> 01:08:09,128
- And I immediately felt glad
1341
01:08:09,172 --> 01:08:12,044
that if Jerry had to
leave Vera for anybody,
1342
01:08:12,088 --> 01:08:14,351
that at least he'd found
his way to Deri
1343
01:08:14,394 --> 01:08:17,658
because she seemed to be
such a positive spirit.
1344
01:08:17,702 --> 01:08:22,141
- Deri grew up with a mother
who had been an iron lung
1345
01:08:22,185 --> 01:08:25,579
and needed an awful
lot from Deri.
1346
01:08:25,623 --> 01:08:28,191
As I recall her mother
been in a wheelchair a lot.
1347
01:08:28,234 --> 01:08:31,194
So Deri grew up taking
care of people.
1348
01:08:35,459 --> 01:08:38,070
That's what she tried to
do with Jerry.
1349
01:08:38,114 --> 01:08:40,203
- To know her was to
just have a crush on her,
1350
01:08:40,246 --> 01:08:41,856
she was just so amazing.
1351
01:08:41,900 --> 01:08:44,207
And she was becoming a
stand up comedian,
1352
01:08:44,250 --> 01:08:46,948
she was starting a
newspaper in Westwood,
1353
01:08:46,992 --> 01:08:48,167
she owned a lot of
property in Westwood,
1354
01:08:48,211 --> 01:08:49,647
she'd inherited a lot
of property.
1355
01:08:49,690 --> 01:08:52,084
And she felt a great
loyalty to the community.
1356
01:08:52,128 --> 01:08:55,696
- She's very optimistic,
open, outgoing person
1357
01:08:57,698 --> 01:09:00,527
and wanted sincerely to
support Jerry
1358
01:09:02,703 --> 01:09:05,880
and give him what he
needed emotionally.
1359
01:09:11,538 --> 01:09:12,887
- [Interviewer] Are there
any points in your life
1360
01:09:12,931 --> 01:09:14,193
where you can look back and see
1361
01:09:14,237 --> 01:09:15,673
that you might have done
something else
1362
01:09:15,716 --> 01:09:17,588
at that particular point?
1363
01:09:19,285 --> 01:09:20,373
- [Jerry] Many, many times.
1364
01:09:20,417 --> 01:09:21,200
- [Interviewer] Really?
1365
01:09:21,244 --> 01:09:22,723
- [Jerry] Yeah.
1366
01:09:22,767 --> 01:09:25,509
I think there are myriads
of crossroads in one's life
1367
01:09:25,552 --> 01:09:30,296
where one stops, says, do I go
this way or do I go that way?
1368
01:09:30,644 --> 01:09:33,517
- I was very happy when I'd
heard that he had remarried.
1369
01:09:33,560 --> 01:09:34,779
I thought, well,
1370
01:09:34,822 --> 01:09:37,695
since it finally
didn't work out with Vera
1371
01:09:37,738 --> 01:09:41,177
after a substantial
number of years together,
1372
01:09:41,220 --> 01:09:45,485
I thought, well, this is nice
that he's met somebody else.
1373
01:09:45,529 --> 01:09:47,139
- Their marriage was
a very colorful affair
1374
01:09:47,183 --> 01:09:48,749
held at the Westwood Marquis,
1375
01:09:48,793 --> 01:09:52,405
and Jerry, in his
contribution to the ceremony
1376
01:09:52,449 --> 01:09:55,669
was to add lines from
"Ride the High Country."
1377
01:09:55,713 --> 01:09:59,325
He had the the minister say,
I am not a man of a cloth.
1378
01:09:59,369 --> 01:10:02,154
- And this is not a
religious ceremony,
1379
01:10:02,198 --> 01:10:03,938
it's a civil marriage
1380
01:10:05,113 --> 01:10:08,334
which is not to be
entered into unadvisedly
1381
01:10:09,596 --> 01:10:11,729
with reverence and soberly.
1382
01:10:13,034 --> 01:10:17,735
A good marriage is a kind
of simple glory of mind,
1383
01:10:17,778 --> 01:10:22,783
a good marriage is like a rare
animal, it's hard to find,
1384
01:10:22,827 --> 01:10:25,351
it's almost impossible to keep.
1385
01:10:26,352 --> 01:10:28,963
You see people change
1386
01:10:29,007 --> 01:10:32,663
and that's important for you
to know at the beginning,
1387
01:10:32,706 --> 01:10:34,186
people change.
1388
01:10:34,230 --> 01:10:38,582
- It was a occasion at which
Jerry's circle of friends
1389
01:10:38,625 --> 01:10:41,193
was small but very
potent and in attendance.
1390
01:10:41,237 --> 01:10:44,979
There was me, Michael Cimino
was best man at the wedding,
1391
01:10:45,023 --> 01:10:47,765
and let's see, there was
James B. Harris.
1392
01:10:47,808 --> 01:10:50,768
There were a whole group of
really terrific people there.
1393
01:10:50,811 --> 01:10:53,597
And Deri's very large family,
1394
01:10:53,640 --> 01:10:57,296
they all were in love with
Deri, and who wouldn't be,
1395
01:10:57,340 --> 01:11:00,168
I mean, it was just a
really terrific gathering.
1396
01:11:00,212 --> 01:11:02,780
[upbeat music]
1397
01:11:10,831 --> 01:11:13,051
The market had been created
after "Heaven's Gate"
1398
01:11:13,094 --> 01:11:15,009
for director's cuts,
1399
01:11:15,053 --> 01:11:18,404
and "The Leopard" had
been in a botched cut,
1400
01:11:18,448 --> 01:11:21,059
and even the studio knew
to be a botched cut.
1401
01:11:21,102 --> 01:11:24,367
And so "The Leopard" was
restored to its full strength
1402
01:11:24,410 --> 01:11:26,369
when I toured the video market.
1403
01:11:26,412 --> 01:11:28,022
And Jerry was there
1404
01:11:28,066 --> 01:11:29,850
the night they screened
it for the first time
1405
01:11:29,894 --> 01:11:31,809
and he made sure there
was an offer on the table
1406
01:11:31,852 --> 01:11:35,595
and that when we showed it on
Z Channel, we highlighted it.
1407
01:11:35,639 --> 01:11:39,295
- I have seen the uncut
version of it, all right?
1408
01:11:39,338 --> 01:11:40,644
And they restored it
1409
01:11:40,687 --> 01:11:44,300
to more or less it's
IB Technicolor stature.
1410
01:11:44,343 --> 01:11:45,431
It's fantastic.
1411
01:11:46,867 --> 01:11:48,042
- "The Leopard" is
about one night
1412
01:11:48,086 --> 01:11:50,218
in the life of a
Sicilian prince.
1413
01:11:50,262 --> 01:11:51,829
And this prince may be dying,
1414
01:11:51,872 --> 01:11:54,397
there's a feeling of
mortality that's plaguing him,
1415
01:11:54,440 --> 01:11:56,094
he's got a bad heart it seems
1416
01:11:56,137 --> 01:11:57,443
and he's just sort of
1417
01:11:57,487 --> 01:11:58,618
moving through the
chambers of his life
1418
01:11:58,662 --> 01:12:00,054
in a kind of melancholy way.
1419
01:12:00,098 --> 01:12:01,186
But really what's happening
1420
01:12:01,229 --> 01:12:04,668
is that an era is
ending around him.
1421
01:12:04,711 --> 01:12:07,845
Because of the length that
Visconti gave to that story,
1422
01:12:07,888 --> 01:12:11,370
that prince in this
single night of his life,
1423
01:12:11,414 --> 01:12:13,981
we actually feel the world
moving through this man
1424
01:12:14,025 --> 01:12:18,334
and we feel that when he
goes, a world goes with him.
1425
01:12:29,736 --> 01:12:32,086
- I met Jerry in 1986 or '87,
1426
01:12:33,436 --> 01:12:35,263
I was working at a video
store in Westwood
1427
01:12:35,307 --> 01:12:36,569
called Videotec
1428
01:12:36,613 --> 01:12:39,180
and I was going to
college here at UCLA
1429
01:12:39,224 --> 01:12:40,486
and I was a clerk there
1430
01:12:40,530 --> 01:12:42,575
and Jerry was one of the
many industry customers
1431
01:12:42,619 --> 01:12:44,577
who used to come in.
1432
01:12:44,621 --> 01:12:49,365
He made me a bit uncomfortable,
he just seemed very strange,
1433
01:12:50,235 --> 01:12:52,150
he gave off an
uncomfortable vibe.
1434
01:12:52,193 --> 01:12:54,457
His wife on the other hand
was a sweet charming woman
1435
01:12:54,500 --> 01:12:55,719
and she gave off a great vibe.
1436
01:12:55,762 --> 01:12:57,329
- Jerry would go in there
and rent videos
1437
01:12:57,373 --> 01:12:59,200
and they would get into
conversations,
1438
01:12:59,244 --> 01:13:00,593
and Jerry realized,
1439
01:13:00,637 --> 01:13:02,900
hey, this guy knows
what he's talking about.
1440
01:13:02,943 --> 01:13:06,730
- Then he asked me if I'd be
interested in working at Z
1441
01:13:06,773 --> 01:13:08,122
as a programming assistant.
1442
01:13:08,166 --> 01:13:10,908
And at that point, my
attitude changed greatly,
1443
01:13:10,951 --> 01:13:13,432
and I was very happy to see him
1444
01:13:16,957 --> 01:13:21,484
- I think one reason Jerry
was such a great programmer
1445
01:13:21,527 --> 01:13:24,182
was the knowledge and the taste,
1446
01:13:25,226 --> 01:13:27,925
the showmanship, the creativity,
1447
01:13:29,796 --> 01:13:32,712
and then the passion to do it
or the commitment to do it.
1448
01:13:32,756 --> 01:13:35,802
- HBO and Showtime each
launched a second channel
1449
01:13:35,846 --> 01:13:40,546
that was more movie-focused
more film buff-focused.
1450
01:13:40,590 --> 01:13:43,854
Showtime did The Movie
channel, HBO did Cinemax
1451
01:13:43,897 --> 01:13:47,727
and they certainly were
aware of Z Channel
1452
01:13:47,771 --> 01:13:49,599
and tried to steal some
of our thunder,
1453
01:13:49,642 --> 01:13:51,383
we didn't think they were
doing a very good job of it.
1454
01:13:51,427 --> 01:13:53,167
- I mean, if we ran it,
1455
01:13:53,211 --> 01:13:54,734
even certain foreign films
1456
01:13:54,778 --> 01:13:57,215
would end up running on
the other places,
1457
01:13:57,258 --> 01:13:58,782
they would have to
pretty sexy usually,
1458
01:13:58,825 --> 01:14:01,524
our night owl films
tended to show up a lot
1459
01:14:01,567 --> 01:14:04,483
on Movie Channel and
Showtime and HBO
1460
01:14:04,527 --> 01:14:06,180
just because that's
like, well, tits and ass.
1461
01:14:06,224 --> 01:14:10,446
[speaking in foreign language]
1462
01:14:26,157 --> 01:14:28,594
- Much to my surprise
when I asked Jerry
1463
01:14:28,638 --> 01:14:31,118
what was the most successful
aspect of our programming,
1464
01:14:31,162 --> 01:14:33,338
he said, the night owl series.
1465
01:14:33,381 --> 01:14:34,513
I said, you've gotta be kidding.
1466
01:14:34,557 --> 01:14:36,123
He said no, we're
killing night line,
1467
01:14:36,167 --> 01:14:38,256
we're killing the 11
o'clock news.
1468
01:14:38,299 --> 01:14:39,605
- Night owl programs
1469
01:14:39,649 --> 01:14:43,435
where our late night
kind of soft core things,
1470
01:14:43,479 --> 01:14:46,264
movies with sex TNA,
stuff like that.
1471
01:14:47,526 --> 01:14:50,703
- My objectivity breaks
right the fuck down
1472
01:14:50,747 --> 01:14:52,226
when I think of those
night owl films
1473
01:14:52,270 --> 01:14:53,706
because those girls,
1474
01:14:53,750 --> 01:14:56,230
the women in those films
were so pretty.
1475
01:14:56,274 --> 01:14:58,668
I mean, they always found
1476
01:14:58,711 --> 01:15:02,062
even in the lamest of
the night owls,
1477
01:15:02,106 --> 01:15:04,674
even the one that has
like no plot
1478
01:15:04,717 --> 01:15:07,067
or it's just like why am
I watching this?
1479
01:15:07,111 --> 01:15:09,243
I know I'm only watching
this till the next nude scene
1480
01:15:09,287 --> 01:15:11,507
but I'm gonna stay in there.
1481
01:15:14,640 --> 01:15:16,294
"The Lady on the Bus,"
I remember.
1482
01:15:21,647 --> 01:15:23,475
Someone like Laura
Antonelli or Sonia Braga
1483
01:15:23,519 --> 01:15:25,216
would hit a big with a
respectable film,
1484
01:15:25,259 --> 01:15:26,652
but their backlog
1485
01:15:26,696 --> 01:15:29,699
was full of all kinds of
early nudie kind of films
1486
01:15:29,742 --> 01:15:31,178
and we would get them all
1487
01:15:31,222 --> 01:15:34,268
so basically we would have
Laura Antonelli festivals
1488
01:15:34,312 --> 01:15:36,836
that had every last
movie she'd made
1489
01:15:36,880 --> 01:15:38,490
with all the nude scenes.
1490
01:15:38,534 --> 01:15:42,102
- Laura Antonelli, it's like,
whatever happened to her?
1491
01:15:42,146 --> 01:15:44,888
I think she was like
the first actress
1492
01:15:44,931 --> 01:15:48,282
that I ever like fell
in love with in a movie
1493
01:15:48,326 --> 01:15:50,850
that I went into like
see her films
1494
01:15:50,894 --> 01:15:52,896
and they were genuinely sexy.
1495
01:15:52,939 --> 01:15:55,551
I mean, I don't think I knew
what sexy was before then,
1496
01:15:55,594 --> 01:15:57,901
I had crushes on actresses
1497
01:15:57,944 --> 01:16:01,992
and I thought I was in
love with them, all right?
1498
01:16:02,035 --> 01:16:03,733
But I'm watching
"Life Mistress,"
1499
01:16:03,776 --> 01:16:05,561
there's a scene that she's
with this actor
1500
01:16:05,604 --> 01:16:07,214
who's trying to get
into his room
1501
01:16:07,258 --> 01:16:09,869
and they're making out
on the stairs.
1502
01:16:09,913 --> 01:16:13,873
And he reaches out and
grabs her in her crotch.
1503
01:16:13,917 --> 01:16:16,659
And it was really
sexy to see that.
1504
01:16:16,702 --> 01:16:19,400
And when he did it, she went,
oh,
1505
01:16:20,706 --> 01:16:24,101
and she almost like
collapsed in his arm.
1506
01:16:27,800 --> 01:16:30,107
- Please take me to bed, please.
1507
01:16:30,150 --> 01:16:33,719
- And then they didn't go into
the room and I was pissed.
1508
01:16:33,763 --> 01:16:35,634
- The great divergence
between European cinema
1509
01:16:35,678 --> 01:16:37,680
and American cinema
really is about sex.
1510
01:16:37,723 --> 01:16:39,551
- If you want to do
nudity in a movie,
1511
01:16:39,595 --> 01:16:42,336
you have to do it in
a certain way,
1512
01:16:43,860 --> 01:16:45,818
it's interesting because
it's so natural
1513
01:16:45,862 --> 01:16:48,952
because you see things that
people do with each other
1514
01:16:48,995 --> 01:16:51,563
that you were not aware
of that could be done.
1515
01:16:51,607 --> 01:16:55,132
I get many many calls after
"Turkish Delight" say,
1516
01:16:55,175 --> 01:16:58,396
you enriched our sex life so.
1517
01:16:58,439 --> 01:17:02,008
[singing in foreign language]
1518
01:17:30,036 --> 01:17:32,386
"Turkish Delight" was
a great book, you know,
1519
01:17:32,430 --> 01:17:33,300
I loved the book.
1520
01:17:33,344 --> 01:17:35,302
It was like in Holland
1521
01:17:35,346 --> 01:17:39,002
was going with the wind
in the United States,
1522
01:17:39,045 --> 01:17:41,787
everybody was interested
and it was having an opinion
1523
01:17:41,831 --> 01:17:45,835
if it should be Vivian
Lee or not, isn't it,
1524
01:17:45,878 --> 01:17:49,752
and who should be her lover,
Clay Cable or anybody else.
1525
01:17:49,795 --> 01:17:52,319
And this was like,
this is our book,
1526
01:17:52,363 --> 01:17:54,408
it was so phenomenally
important that book
1527
01:17:54,452 --> 01:17:56,497
in Holland at that time.
1528
01:17:59,109 --> 01:18:01,677
[soft music]
1529
01:18:05,376 --> 01:18:07,813
I had worked with Rutger Hauer
1530
01:18:07,857 --> 01:18:10,773
on the television series
was called "Floris."
1531
01:18:10,816 --> 01:18:14,037
Because he was a
television person,
1532
01:18:14,080 --> 01:18:16,430
I didn't even think about
him strangely enough.
1533
01:18:16,474 --> 01:18:18,476
My producer of ours said,
1534
01:18:18,519 --> 01:18:21,827
well, what about this nice
guy that you used in "Floris."
1535
01:18:21,871 --> 01:18:24,612
He's a nice guy and he
seemed sympathetic,
1536
01:18:24,656 --> 01:18:25,613
why don't you test him?
1537
01:18:25,657 --> 01:18:27,224
I said, he's more a farmer.
1538
01:18:27,267 --> 01:18:29,835
He goes like, bum bum,
bum, he was like that.
1539
01:18:29,879 --> 01:18:32,838
And he said, yeah, but you never
know, you have to test him.
1540
01:18:32,882 --> 01:18:34,884
And so I tested everybody
and at the end,
1541
01:18:34,927 --> 01:18:36,842
I tested Rutger Hauer too,
1542
01:18:36,886 --> 01:18:39,802
and then I realized that
Rutger Hauer is phenomenal.
1543
01:18:39,845 --> 01:18:41,673
That there was absolutely,
1544
01:18:41,717 --> 01:18:43,588
that I couldn't have
been more wrong
1545
01:18:43,631 --> 01:18:44,894
in thinking that he
couldn't do it.
1546
01:19:21,104 --> 01:19:23,106
Because that was Rutger Hauer,
1547
01:19:23,149 --> 01:19:25,804
and that was of course for
everybody that knew the book
1548
01:19:25,848 --> 01:19:28,024
was like, are you an idiot,
1549
01:19:28,067 --> 01:19:31,854
how can you do this
wonderful character of Eric
1550
01:19:31,897 --> 01:19:33,551
that is so beautiful
1551
01:19:33,594 --> 01:19:36,293
and has all these
feelings versus woman?
1552
01:19:36,336 --> 01:19:38,904
[soft music]
1553
01:19:53,440 --> 01:19:55,791
So, I was right, I was right.
1554
01:19:56,922 --> 01:19:58,750
I've been right a
couple of times,
1555
01:19:58,794 --> 01:20:00,926
I've been wrong many times.
1556
01:20:04,582 --> 01:20:08,325
The fact that I immigrated
to the United States in '85
1557
01:20:08,368 --> 01:20:12,808
had to do not only with the
fact that I got a job here,
1558
01:20:14,722 --> 01:20:17,769
but with the fact that
people got me the job
1559
01:20:17,813 --> 01:20:19,336
because they knew my work,
1560
01:20:19,379 --> 01:20:21,207
and they knew it
because of Z Channel.
1561
01:20:23,601 --> 01:20:24,820
- [Interviewer] Is
there anything else
1562
01:20:24,863 --> 01:20:27,910
you would like to have
done with your life
1563
01:20:27,953 --> 01:20:30,173
than what you're doing
at the moment?
1564
01:20:30,216 --> 01:20:32,566
- [Jerry] Oh, there's
many things.
1565
01:20:32,610 --> 01:20:35,004
Be president, run a
major studio,
1566
01:20:36,788 --> 01:20:37,833
more than anything though,
1567
01:20:37,876 --> 01:20:40,226
I think I would like to
have been able
1568
01:20:40,270 --> 01:20:42,794
to play professional football.
1569
01:20:44,230 --> 01:20:48,582
Throw passes, be a quarterback,
buy things like that.
1570
01:20:51,455 --> 01:20:54,632
- Jerry felt excited
about what he was doing,
1571
01:20:54,675 --> 01:20:56,416
he'd be excited
about a new deal,
1572
01:20:56,460 --> 01:21:00,377
he'd be excited about being
able to announce a Warner's deal
1573
01:21:00,420 --> 01:21:02,422
or something along those lines,
1574
01:21:02,466 --> 01:21:06,209
but at the same time, I always
felt that Jerry felt beaten.
1575
01:21:06,252 --> 01:21:09,821
I think he felt he was
fighting that uphill battle.
1576
01:21:09,865 --> 01:21:12,258
- [Interviewer] The whole
time or just later though.
1577
01:21:12,302 --> 01:21:16,393
- I think the whole time, I
always felt that way of Jerry.
1578
01:21:16,436 --> 01:21:18,003
- When you were a
friend of Jerry's,
1579
01:21:18,047 --> 01:21:22,616
you were kind of immersed in
his whole being, his whole life
1580
01:21:22,660 --> 01:21:25,402
and that was quite a
lot of stuff.
1581
01:21:25,445 --> 01:21:27,186
- When Deri suggested marriage,
1582
01:21:27,230 --> 01:21:29,797
Jerry said, I have got
to be honest with you,
1583
01:21:29,841 --> 01:21:31,190
I don't want children.
1584
01:21:31,234 --> 01:21:34,019
I mean, if you're okay with
that, then we can talk,
1585
01:21:34,063 --> 01:21:37,196
but you just need to know that
before you get your hopes up.
1586
01:21:37,240 --> 01:21:40,069
- Jerry was so hurt
by his family,
1587
01:21:42,027 --> 01:21:44,856
it was difficult for him
to get married.
1588
01:21:44,900 --> 01:21:47,685
And when he did get married,
1589
01:21:47,728 --> 01:21:50,644
initially inconceivable
to have children,
1590
01:21:50,688 --> 01:21:52,951
so much so that he had
had a vasectomy.
1591
01:21:52,995 --> 01:21:55,649
- He certainly did give
me the outlines
1592
01:21:55,693 --> 01:21:59,044
of a very, very
dysfunctional family life.
1593
01:22:00,176 --> 01:22:01,873
Very tormented.
1594
01:22:01,917 --> 01:22:04,441
- His father was a judge who
at some point in his career
1595
01:22:04,484 --> 01:22:06,399
had sent more people to death
1596
01:22:06,443 --> 01:22:09,228
in the county of whatever
Bakersfield county is
1597
01:22:09,272 --> 01:22:10,795
than any other judge.
1598
01:22:10,838 --> 01:22:12,057
I mean, this was a family
1599
01:22:12,101 --> 01:22:14,712
full of pain and darkness
and strangeness.
1600
01:22:14,755 --> 01:22:17,280
- Jerry's father was a
fundamentalist Catholic,
1601
01:22:17,323 --> 01:22:20,457
someone who was so much a
traditionalist,
1602
01:22:20,500 --> 01:22:24,765
so hidebound that he wasn't
even close to his family.
1603
01:22:26,245 --> 01:22:28,682
When his own daughter was coming
to him in a suicidal state,
1604
01:22:28,726 --> 01:22:30,075
he slammed the door in her face.
1605
01:22:30,119 --> 01:22:33,513
- For what Jerry said,
Jerry's father was a drunk,
1606
01:22:33,557 --> 01:22:35,907
rather sadistic
towards his kids.
1607
01:22:35,951 --> 01:22:38,779
Jerry didn't really have a
lot of nice things to say,
1608
01:22:38,823 --> 01:22:41,782
would tell stories about
his father coming in
1609
01:22:41,826 --> 01:22:44,089
and throwing water on him to
wake him up in the morning
1610
01:22:44,133 --> 01:22:46,962
and there were no
specific references
1611
01:22:51,140 --> 01:22:52,706
to specific abuse or
anything else,
1612
01:22:52,750 --> 01:22:55,492
but it was something he really
didn't talk about that much.
1613
01:22:55,535 --> 01:22:58,364
- He expressed
actually more active,
1614
01:22:58,408 --> 01:23:01,715
active anger toward his mother.
1615
01:23:01,759 --> 01:23:04,718
- She was a extremely
monotone person.
1616
01:23:07,025 --> 01:23:09,723
I never saw her angry,
I never saw her cry,
1617
01:23:09,767 --> 01:23:12,770
I never saw her really
laugh that much.
1618
01:23:12,813 --> 01:23:16,730
It was like she was
almost in a drugged state.
1619
01:23:16,774 --> 01:23:18,384
- Maybe she was shut
off emotionally
1620
01:23:18,428 --> 01:23:20,517
because she had done things
1621
01:23:20,560 --> 01:23:21,953
and not been there for them
1622
01:23:21,997 --> 01:23:23,215
or allowed abuse to
happen to them.
1623
01:23:23,259 --> 01:23:24,564
We'll never know.
1624
01:23:32,137 --> 01:23:35,184
- He told me that he had
another sister
1625
01:23:36,620 --> 01:23:41,146
that the family really did
not know what had happened to,
1626
01:23:41,190 --> 01:23:46,195
but had come to the feeling
that she had committed suicide.
1627
01:23:46,543 --> 01:23:49,328
- Jerry never really made
that big of a point about it,
1628
01:23:49,372 --> 01:23:52,331
except that Mary had
disappeared,
1629
01:23:52,375 --> 01:23:56,205
and he kind of just said
that as a toss away line
1630
01:23:57,815 --> 01:24:00,426
and that's all he
would refer to it,
1631
01:24:00,470 --> 01:24:02,167
it's the only way he
would refer to it.
1632
01:24:11,872 --> 01:24:15,050
- He had told me stories of
struggling with depression
1633
01:24:15,093 --> 01:24:18,792
and what he sort of
identified as evil thoughts
1634
01:24:20,055 --> 01:24:22,144
and dark thoughts when he
was growing up.
1635
01:24:22,187 --> 01:24:24,363
- Jerry was always volatile,
1636
01:24:24,407 --> 01:24:27,801
he always had a very bad temper.
1637
01:24:27,845 --> 01:24:31,675
But he didn't drink until
in the late 70s
1638
01:24:31,718 --> 01:24:33,372
when he started drinking.
1639
01:24:33,416 --> 01:24:36,288
When Jerry drank, he
was dangerous.
1640
01:24:37,942 --> 01:24:40,205
I can remember once in Rome,
1641
01:24:40,249 --> 01:24:42,903
we were all having a great
time, we were drinking,
1642
01:24:42,947 --> 01:24:45,210
and I made the comment,
1643
01:24:45,254 --> 01:24:48,605
God created whiskey to keep the
Irish from ruling the world.
1644
01:24:48,648 --> 01:24:50,128
And Jerry took a cigarette
1645
01:24:50,172 --> 01:24:53,610
and flicked it right at my
face from across the table,
1646
01:24:53,653 --> 01:24:56,091
hit me in the eye,
fortunately I wear glasses.
1647
01:24:56,134 --> 01:24:58,136
- We both looked for him
for therapists
1648
01:24:58,180 --> 01:25:00,834
and found this doctor
that he went to
1649
01:25:00,878 --> 01:25:03,098
that we were really
excited about.
1650
01:25:03,141 --> 01:25:05,187
He was smart, he was as
smart as Jerry,
1651
01:25:05,230 --> 01:25:06,492
he could challenge him,
1652
01:25:06,536 --> 01:25:08,625
and it started out to
be a really good thing
1653
01:25:08,668 --> 01:25:10,235
and Jerry really looked
forward to it
1654
01:25:10,279 --> 01:25:12,368
because he could talk
to somebody,
1655
01:25:12,411 --> 01:25:13,586
he found somebody that
could really challenge him
1656
01:25:13,630 --> 01:25:15,153
and talk to him.
1657
01:25:15,197 --> 01:25:18,374
Unfortunately along the way,
it fell into other traps
1658
01:25:18,417 --> 01:25:23,205
and I don't think in the end,
it was such a good thing.
1659
01:25:23,248 --> 01:25:24,467
I didn't live in fear,
1660
01:25:24,510 --> 01:25:26,904
I mean, the day I was
afraid it was over,
1661
01:25:26,947 --> 01:25:28,210
the day I got afraid
1662
01:25:28,253 --> 01:25:30,125
and something happened to
make me afraid,
1663
01:25:30,168 --> 01:25:32,344
we weren't together anymore.
1664
01:25:34,694 --> 01:25:36,740
I just had this
really bad feeling
1665
01:25:36,783 --> 01:25:38,089
and I tried to call the house
1666
01:25:38,133 --> 01:25:39,351
because he should
have been there,
1667
01:25:39,395 --> 01:25:41,136
and he didn't answer the phone
1668
01:25:41,179 --> 01:25:42,702
and I just had a bad feeling
1669
01:25:42,746 --> 01:25:47,185
so I got in my car and I
drove back to the house.
1670
01:25:47,229 --> 01:25:49,666
And I came in and he
had taken a lot of pills
1671
01:25:49,709 --> 01:25:51,102
and he was waving a gun
1672
01:25:51,146 --> 01:25:53,496
that was the gun that Sam
Peckinpah had given him.
1673
01:25:53,539 --> 01:25:56,063
And I just went to look for
his doctor's phone number
1674
01:25:56,107 --> 01:25:57,587
because I just thought
1675
01:25:57,630 --> 01:25:59,893
this is like something
terrible's happening here.
1676
01:25:59,937 --> 01:26:02,983
And when I came back,
he held the gun on me.
1677
01:26:03,027 --> 01:26:06,378
And basically, in one
form or another
1678
01:26:06,422 --> 01:26:09,642
had the gun at my head
and in my mouth
1679
01:26:09,686 --> 01:26:13,516
and up against my head for
the next three or four hours.
1680
01:26:13,559 --> 01:26:14,908
He had called the doctor before
1681
01:26:14,952 --> 01:26:16,693
and left him a message
that he was in trouble.
1682
01:26:16,736 --> 01:26:18,912
So he had reached out already,
1683
01:26:18,956 --> 01:26:20,523
the doctor had arranged
1684
01:26:20,566 --> 01:26:23,221
to come and take him to
the hospital.
1685
01:26:23,265 --> 01:26:24,918
And it was basically
from that moment,
1686
01:26:24,962 --> 01:26:26,572
we were never together.
1687
01:26:28,792 --> 01:26:30,968
- I didn't see Jerry
for seven years
1688
01:26:31,011 --> 01:26:33,623
while he was married to Vera.
1689
01:26:33,666 --> 01:26:36,843
When Vera and Jerry
started to break up,
1690
01:26:38,976 --> 01:26:41,196
I guess I was the
first phone call.
1691
01:26:41,239 --> 01:26:44,721
And Jerry showed back
up in my life
1692
01:26:44,764 --> 01:26:48,768
and it was like the thing
I had dreamed of
1693
01:26:48,812 --> 01:26:50,509
for all of those years.
1694
01:26:52,076 --> 01:26:55,732
One night, we were having
dinner somewhere in Westwood
1695
01:26:55,775 --> 01:27:00,563
and I remember Jerry starting
to get angry for no reason.
1696
01:27:01,564 --> 01:27:05,829
I mean, we were having a
very pedestrian conversation
1697
01:27:05,872 --> 01:27:07,961
about something and
out of nowhere,
1698
01:27:08,005 --> 01:27:11,051
he started to become infuriated.
1699
01:27:11,095 --> 01:27:14,838
So he got to the point
where he stood up
1700
01:27:14,881 --> 01:27:16,709
and he walked out of
the restaurant.
1701
01:27:16,753 --> 01:27:20,365
So I went trailing after him
and when I got up behind him,
1702
01:27:20,409 --> 01:27:22,541
I remember grabbing
him by the shirt going,
1703
01:27:22,585 --> 01:27:24,543
what's a matter, what
did I say, what happened,
1704
01:27:24,587 --> 01:27:26,371
and he turned around and
all of a sudden
1705
01:27:26,415 --> 01:27:28,199
I found like his fist
was in the air
1706
01:27:28,243 --> 01:27:31,724
and he was about to
pull me with it.
1707
01:27:31,768 --> 01:27:34,988
And he looked up at his hand
and he looked down at me
1708
01:27:35,032 --> 01:27:36,555
and he looked up at his hand
1709
01:27:36,599 --> 01:27:39,254
and he kind of caught it and
he pulled it back to himself
1710
01:27:39,297 --> 01:27:42,779
and it was as if it was
somebody else's hand.
1711
01:27:49,612 --> 01:27:51,004
Jerry and I
1712
01:27:51,048 --> 01:27:54,051
changed the nature of our
relationship after that.
1713
01:27:54,094 --> 01:27:57,402
I think on some level,
he was trying to back off
1714
01:27:57,446 --> 01:28:00,840
and protect me from
being subjected to that.
1715
01:28:02,842 --> 01:28:04,801
But the subtext to
all of that also
1716
01:28:04,844 --> 01:28:07,499
is that he had moved out
from his place with Vera
1717
01:28:07,543 --> 01:28:09,196
into another apartment
1718
01:28:09,240 --> 01:28:11,416
and the landlady was Deri.
1719
01:28:14,071 --> 01:28:15,725
- What the fuck is this?
1720
01:28:15,768 --> 01:28:16,639
- Maize.
1721
01:28:16,682 --> 01:28:17,857
- Maize for what?
1722
01:28:17,901 --> 01:28:19,119
- Wild dogs.
1723
01:28:19,163 --> 01:28:21,426
- Yeah, wild dogs, that's
bullshit, Boyle,
1724
01:28:21,470 --> 01:28:23,167
you've lied to me
straight through.
1725
01:28:23,210 --> 01:28:24,386
- You want me to be
honest with you?
1726
01:28:24,429 --> 01:28:25,996
- No.
1727
01:28:26,039 --> 01:28:27,519
- "Salvador" was not the kind
of picture you would expect,
1728
01:28:27,563 --> 01:28:28,912
it wasn't a studio picture,
1729
01:28:28,955 --> 01:28:31,306
it didn't have any studio
juggernaut behind it,
1730
01:28:31,349 --> 01:28:32,655
there was no money
to promote it,
1731
01:28:32,698 --> 01:28:34,657
it show for two weeks as
I said in two theaters
1732
01:28:34,700 --> 01:28:37,529
in February 10 months
ago so it was forgotten.
1733
01:28:37,573 --> 01:28:41,490
[speaking in foreign language]
1734
01:28:51,891 --> 01:28:56,113
- Holy shit, they're gonna
fucking kill us now, Boyle,
1735
01:28:56,156 --> 01:28:58,681
God damn it, I thought you knew
your way around here, Boyle,
1736
01:28:58,724 --> 01:29:02,859
they're gonna fucking kill
us, Boyle, God damn it.
1737
01:29:02,902 --> 01:29:05,557
- Stop it, shut the fuck up,
just be cool.
1738
01:29:05,601 --> 01:29:08,299
- It was clear that both
Jerry and Chuck Champlin
1739
01:29:08,343 --> 01:29:10,040
thought it was just a
terrific picture
1740
01:29:10,083 --> 01:29:11,563
and the kind of picture
1741
01:29:11,607 --> 01:29:13,696
that should have gotten
attention, but didn't.
1742
01:29:13,739 --> 01:29:16,263
Charles Champlin wrote a front
page article in the LA Times,
1743
01:29:16,307 --> 01:29:17,482
it was a two page article
1744
01:29:17,526 --> 01:29:19,919
about this great
forgotten classic.
1745
01:29:19,963 --> 01:29:21,486
And then Jerry Harvey
called up and said,
1746
01:29:21,530 --> 01:29:23,488
hey, that was great that
Chuck did that.
1747
01:29:23,532 --> 01:29:26,709
He said, I really
believe in this film,
1748
01:29:26,752 --> 01:29:27,797
and he said,
1749
01:29:29,059 --> 01:29:31,583
I believe Z Channel can have
a little bit of influence.
1750
01:29:34,934 --> 01:29:38,677
[speaking in foreign language]
1751
01:29:43,508 --> 01:29:45,118
He said I'm gonna give
this film a shot,
1752
01:29:45,162 --> 01:29:47,164
he said I'm gonna show it
during December.
1753
01:29:47,207 --> 01:29:49,732
So he said while all the studios
are screening their movies
1754
01:29:49,775 --> 01:29:51,603
at every private screening
room on the ballot,
1755
01:29:51,647 --> 01:29:53,866
what's called the Bel Air
of Beverly Hills circuit,
1756
01:29:53,910 --> 01:29:55,433
and while they're showing
them at theaters and so on,
1757
01:29:55,477 --> 01:29:56,826
this film, which is not
being shown anywhere
1758
01:29:56,869 --> 01:29:59,742
is gonna be shown on
the Z Channel.
1759
01:29:59,785 --> 01:30:01,134
So there was the
cover of Z Channel
1760
01:30:01,178 --> 01:30:02,614
which everybody in
the business got
1761
01:30:02,658 --> 01:30:06,313
and everybody's now saw
"Salvador" this month, right?
1762
01:30:06,357 --> 01:30:07,489
And the next thing you know.
1763
01:30:07,532 --> 01:30:09,969
- Paul Newman in "The
Color of Money,"
1764
01:30:10,013 --> 01:30:12,058
James Woods in "Salvador."
1765
01:30:12,102 --> 01:30:13,973
- I get nominated for an
Academy Award for Best Actor
1766
01:30:14,017 --> 01:30:16,976
and Oliver and Richard Boyle
who co-wrote the screenplay
1767
01:30:17,020 --> 01:30:18,717
got nominated for
Best Screenplay.
1768
01:30:18,761 --> 01:30:20,502
- [Interviewer] What's
the most exciting thing
1769
01:30:20,545 --> 01:30:22,721
for you about movie making?
1770
01:30:22,765 --> 01:30:25,289
- Tonight, tonight is
the most exciting thing
1771
01:30:25,332 --> 01:30:27,160
about movie making, believe me.
1772
01:30:27,204 --> 01:30:28,335
It was an amazing year
1773
01:30:28,379 --> 01:30:31,817
and had Jerry not sort of pushed
1774
01:30:31,861 --> 01:30:34,298
to have Chuck do the
interview at the right time,
1775
01:30:34,341 --> 01:30:38,084
put Z Channel magazine out
with the "Salvador" picture
1776
01:30:38,128 --> 01:30:39,956
on the cover with the
whole cover,
1777
01:30:39,999 --> 01:30:41,348
shown it during that month,
1778
01:30:41,392 --> 01:30:43,176
that picture would have
been completely forgotten
1779
01:30:43,220 --> 01:30:45,962
and the kind of work that I'm
most proud of just personally
1780
01:30:46,005 --> 01:30:48,181
would never have been seen.
1781
01:30:53,404 --> 01:30:55,624
[speaking in foreign language]
1782
01:30:55,667 --> 01:30:56,755
- Are you kidding.
1783
01:30:56,799 --> 01:30:59,584
- So I think personally,
1784
01:30:59,628 --> 01:31:01,325
I've always felt at that
particular day
1785
01:31:01,368 --> 01:31:02,805
with Chuck Champlin and
with Jerry Harvey
1786
01:31:02,848 --> 01:31:04,459
and what came of it
1787
01:31:04,502 --> 01:31:07,766
was really the turning point
in my career without a doubt.
1788
01:31:07,810 --> 01:31:10,203
[soft music]
1789
01:31:15,470 --> 01:31:19,691
- HBO and the other competitors,
they had been wanting,
1790
01:31:21,171 --> 01:31:24,000
they had been wanting Z
Channel gone for a long time,
1791
01:31:24,043 --> 01:31:25,436
many people were taking bets
1792
01:31:25,480 --> 01:31:28,221
on when Z Channel would
finally slide off the cliff.
1793
01:31:28,265 --> 01:31:30,615
And it was Jerry's tenacity
1794
01:31:30,659 --> 01:31:33,226
and the stubborn
reputation of Z Channel,
1795
01:31:33,270 --> 01:31:36,447
the fact that it was really
beloved in the community,
1796
01:31:36,491 --> 01:31:38,667
those things work
together to keep Z
1797
01:31:38,710 --> 01:31:40,407
kind of like floating
like a castle in the air
1798
01:31:40,451 --> 01:31:42,932
beyond its normal mortality.
1799
01:31:42,975 --> 01:31:44,803
- Z Channel had at its peak
1800
01:31:44,847 --> 01:31:47,850
I think about 100,000
paying subscribers,
1801
01:31:47,893 --> 01:31:50,505
there were others who I
think were stealing it.
1802
01:31:50,548 --> 01:31:52,028
- We had people
calling up to say,
1803
01:31:52,071 --> 01:31:53,725
would it be possible to
subscribe to the magazine
1804
01:31:53,769 --> 01:31:55,292
without subscribing
to the channel.
1805
01:31:55,335 --> 01:31:57,033
And I was like why would
you like to do that?
1806
01:31:57,076 --> 01:32:00,863
- I remember we had
some new owners come in,
1807
01:32:00,906 --> 01:32:04,040
the CEO ordered Z
Channel for his home.
1808
01:32:05,345 --> 01:32:08,479
The cable man drove
up to the home
1809
01:32:08,523 --> 01:32:12,483
and said to the CEO's wife
not knowing who she was,
1810
01:32:12,527 --> 01:32:15,660
give me 20 bucks or whatever
1811
01:32:15,704 --> 01:32:18,271
and I'll give you Z
Channel for free.
1812
01:32:18,315 --> 01:32:20,056
- Jerry was very
stressed at that time
1813
01:32:20,099 --> 01:32:21,884
and unhappy at that time
1814
01:32:23,581 --> 01:32:24,843
and I guess that
somewhere in there
1815
01:32:24,887 --> 01:32:26,628
is where the salute to Z
1816
01:32:27,716 --> 01:32:30,675
became something we
intended to do.
1817
01:32:31,850 --> 01:32:35,288
- The AFI tribute in January
of 1987 was a real highlight
1818
01:32:35,332 --> 01:32:36,855
in I think Jerry's life
1819
01:32:36,899 --> 01:32:38,683
and I think in the life
of Z Channel.
1820
01:32:38,727 --> 01:32:40,293
We were about to be sold,
1821
01:32:40,337 --> 01:32:41,860
this was a moment of
marshaling the troops.
1822
01:32:41,904 --> 01:32:43,993
Everybody who had benefited
1823
01:32:44,036 --> 01:32:45,995
because of Z Channel's
existence was invited
1824
01:32:46,038 --> 01:32:50,086
to come take part in a
day long series of panels.
1825
01:32:50,129 --> 01:32:52,001
One person that Jerry
became very close to
1826
01:32:52,044 --> 01:32:53,524
in the last couple of
months of his life
1827
01:32:53,568 --> 01:32:55,961
was film director
Richard Brooks,
1828
01:32:56,005 --> 01:32:58,660
who directed "Elmer
Gantry," "In Cold Blood,"
1829
01:32:58,703 --> 01:33:00,749
"Looking for Mr. Goodbar."
1830
01:33:00,792 --> 01:33:03,534
Jerry located certain
films of Richard Brooks
1831
01:33:03,578 --> 01:33:05,362
that had been forgotten
1832
01:33:05,405 --> 01:33:06,929
such as "Something of Value"
1833
01:33:06,972 --> 01:33:09,105
with Rock Hudson and
Sidney Poitier.
1834
01:33:09,148 --> 01:33:10,585
- When it comes time to
kill the lion,
1835
01:33:10,628 --> 01:33:13,152
I want to shoot the gun too.
1836
01:33:13,196 --> 01:33:17,243
- It's just Shaw and how he
feels about Africans and guns.
1837
01:33:17,287 --> 01:33:18,941
- I want to shoot the gun too.
1838
01:33:18,984 --> 01:33:21,117
- I'm sorry, Mathyla.
1839
01:33:21,160 --> 01:33:23,119
- Always when we
hunted is the same,
1840
01:33:23,162 --> 01:33:26,731
you have all the fun, I
do all the work.
1841
01:33:26,775 --> 01:33:28,733
- But when we were little
and played together.
1842
01:33:28,777 --> 01:33:32,563
- But we're big now and
things are not the same.
1843
01:33:33,564 --> 01:33:34,391
- Hit him.
1844
01:33:39,439 --> 01:33:41,006
Hit him, hit him hard.
1845
01:33:49,972 --> 01:33:52,844
Do what he says now and
better hurry.
1846
01:33:58,633 --> 01:34:00,722
- "Something of Value" is
a movie from the early 50s
1847
01:34:00,765 --> 01:34:02,637
which deals with apartheid,
1848
01:34:02,680 --> 01:34:06,031
it deals with the Mau Mau
uprisings of the 1950s in Africa
1849
01:34:06,075 --> 01:34:10,166
which is a topic so relevant
to contemporary history,
1850
01:34:11,471 --> 01:34:13,299
it was painfully relevant
1851
01:34:13,343 --> 01:34:18,304
to the situation that was in
South Africa in the late 1980s.
1852
01:34:18,348 --> 01:34:20,611
Nelson Mandela was
still in prison
1853
01:34:20,655 --> 01:34:24,484
when we played "Something
of Value" on Z Channel.
1854
01:34:27,183 --> 01:34:28,445
- Remember me?
1855
01:34:33,668 --> 01:34:34,494
- Kimani.
1856
01:34:36,671 --> 01:34:37,976
What do you want?
1857
01:34:38,020 --> 01:34:39,412
- I've come home.
1858
01:34:53,600 --> 01:34:55,037
- When Richard Brooks
did "Something of Value,"
1859
01:34:55,080 --> 01:34:56,516
he managed to get
Winston Churchill
1860
01:34:56,560 --> 01:34:58,649
to do a short prologue.
1861
01:34:58,693 --> 01:35:01,434
Winston Churchill said, the
situation in South Africa
1862
01:35:01,478 --> 01:35:04,568
is the most important thing in
the world today, blah, blah,
1863
01:35:04,611 --> 01:35:07,658
turning a globe or
something very important.
1864
01:35:07,702 --> 01:35:12,445
- The problem of East Africa
are the problems of the world.
1865
01:35:13,185 --> 01:35:16,711
This was true in 1907
and it is true today.
1866
01:35:20,497 --> 01:35:23,065
- But the studio had said,
1867
01:35:23,108 --> 01:35:25,371
get rid of the old fat guy,
right?
1868
01:35:25,415 --> 01:35:27,373
It's like get really old fat
guy, it's Winston Churchill.
1869
01:35:27,417 --> 01:35:31,334
So Winston Churchill got cut
out of the picture, right?
1870
01:35:31,377 --> 01:35:34,946
It's a small bit but Churchill
had done them a huge favor.
1871
01:35:34,990 --> 01:35:37,862
So it did Richard Brooks's
heart a lot of good
1872
01:35:37,906 --> 01:35:40,909
to see that put back
in the picture.
1873
01:35:42,171 --> 01:35:45,087
- There was a cause for
hope in about September 1987
1874
01:35:45,130 --> 01:35:47,045
when the Rock Group
bought the Z Channel,
1875
01:35:47,089 --> 01:35:48,873
and it had very ambitious plans,
1876
01:35:48,917 --> 01:35:50,875
they came to all the
studios and said,
1877
01:35:50,919 --> 01:35:53,878
we're gonna take it national,
we need your support,
1878
01:35:53,922 --> 01:35:56,489
we're going to really
grow the subscriber base.
1879
01:35:56,533 --> 01:36:00,929
- The vision was to do a sort
of national satellite channel
1880
01:36:00,972 --> 01:36:05,063
that would compete with
HBO and Showtime.
1881
01:36:05,107 --> 01:36:06,586
- Jerry was happy,
1882
01:36:06,630 --> 01:36:08,937
he felt like he'd found the
right kind of wildcatters,
1883
01:36:08,980 --> 01:36:10,286
the right kind of cowboys
1884
01:36:10,329 --> 01:36:11,853
that would understand
his temperament
1885
01:36:11,896 --> 01:36:13,942
and just the future
looked golden.
1886
01:36:13,985 --> 01:36:15,813
- What do they call this place?
1887
01:36:15,857 --> 01:36:19,382
- Just over the rise be a
big town called Tombstone.
1888
01:36:19,425 --> 01:36:20,470
Fine town.
1889
01:36:20,513 --> 01:36:22,385
- Tombstone?
1890
01:36:22,428 --> 01:36:23,778
Yeah, I heard of it.
1891
01:36:25,605 --> 01:36:30,306
Well, me and your brothers
might ride in there tonight,
1892
01:36:30,349 --> 01:36:33,135
get ourselves a shave
maybe, a glass of beer.
1893
01:36:33,178 --> 01:36:35,137
- Yeah, you would
enjoy yourself.
1894
01:36:35,180 --> 01:36:37,400
Wide awake, wide open
town Tombstone,
1895
01:36:37,443 --> 01:36:39,489
get anything you want there.
1896
01:36:39,532 --> 01:36:40,533
- Thank you.
1897
01:36:52,850 --> 01:36:54,330
- [Interviewer] You want
to get any children?
1898
01:36:54,373 --> 01:36:55,244
- [Jerry] No.
1899
01:36:56,985 --> 01:36:58,334
- They had agreed not
to have kids,
1900
01:36:58,377 --> 01:36:59,944
they were both content with it.
1901
01:36:59,988 --> 01:37:01,293
And there was a point
1902
01:37:01,337 --> 01:37:03,382
when Jerry made an ironic
remark late in '87,
1903
01:37:03,426 --> 01:37:06,995
he said, well, I could have
predicted this would happen.
1904
01:37:07,038 --> 01:37:08,170
And I said, what do you mean?
1905
01:37:08,213 --> 01:37:09,867
He said, well, I'm
gonna have to go in
1906
01:37:09,911 --> 01:37:11,216
and have my vasectomy undone.
1907
01:37:11,260 --> 01:37:12,870
I said, really, what's up?
1908
01:37:12,914 --> 01:37:14,872
And well, Deri wants kids?
1909
01:37:14,916 --> 01:37:18,267
- And reverse vasectomies
usually don't work
1910
01:37:22,662 --> 01:37:25,448
and so there was some
frustration going on there
1911
01:37:25,491 --> 01:37:27,189
between Deri and Jerry.
1912
01:37:27,232 --> 01:37:30,583
- Jerry had told the doctors,
look, I have a problem,
1913
01:37:30,627 --> 01:37:31,671
I used to have a
drinking problem,
1914
01:37:31,715 --> 01:37:33,195
please don't give me
any painkillers
1915
01:37:33,238 --> 01:37:35,023
after the surgery is over,
1916
01:37:35,066 --> 01:37:37,199
that way I can recover faster.
1917
01:37:37,242 --> 01:37:39,810
And they agreed, he had
the topical anesthetic,
1918
01:37:39,854 --> 01:37:41,986
but after that, he
was cold turkey
1919
01:37:42,030 --> 01:37:43,814
just surviving it with
gritted teeth,
1920
01:37:43,858 --> 01:37:44,989
the pain of what followed,
1921
01:37:45,033 --> 01:37:47,818
unfortunately, an
infection followed.
1922
01:37:47,862 --> 01:37:49,994
And this time, the
doctors told him,
1923
01:37:50,038 --> 01:37:51,561
look, we have to perform
the entire operation
1924
01:37:51,604 --> 01:37:52,867
all over again.
1925
01:37:53,868 --> 01:37:55,304
And he said,
1926
01:37:55,347 --> 01:37:57,741
all right, this time you
use painkillers though.
1927
01:37:57,784 --> 01:38:00,222
He had the bins that
he predicted,
1928
01:38:00,265 --> 01:38:02,441
but he was able to manage
it 'cause he saw it coming
1929
01:38:02,485 --> 01:38:04,139
and he and Deri went
off to Bora Bora
1930
01:38:04,182 --> 01:38:08,056
and within a week and a
half, he was back up on top
1931
01:38:08,099 --> 01:38:10,841
and he arrived from Bora Bora
1932
01:38:10,885 --> 01:38:13,061
pretty much in time for
the stock market crash.
1933
01:38:14,801 --> 01:38:18,240
- Sadly, just after the Rock
Group bought the Z Channel,
1934
01:38:18,283 --> 01:38:22,244
the stock market went south
in a big way in October 1987.
1935
01:38:22,287 --> 01:38:25,334
And all those ambitious
plans were backburnered
1936
01:38:25,377 --> 01:38:28,990
and unfortunately, they were
ultimately never realized.
1937
01:38:29,033 --> 01:38:32,645
- I could see the stress
but he really did,
1938
01:38:34,473 --> 01:38:37,302
he was more concerned
about his staff
1939
01:38:40,566 --> 01:38:43,482
and that they not be worried
or afraid or what have you
1940
01:38:43,526 --> 01:38:46,224
than he seemed to be
about himself.
1941
01:38:48,270 --> 01:38:50,663
- One night in October of '87,
1942
01:38:51,969 --> 01:38:54,929
I go to the movies with
Jerry and Deri
1943
01:38:54,972 --> 01:38:58,236
and we watch "The Sicilian"
directed by Michael Cimino.
1944
01:38:58,280 --> 01:38:59,759
It's about to come out
the next week,
1945
01:38:59,803 --> 01:39:01,065
it's a preview screening.
1946
01:39:02,937 --> 01:39:05,548
We're watching this film,
it's got very witty dialogue,
1947
01:39:05,591 --> 01:39:07,245
it's got tremendous
energy to it,
1948
01:39:07,289 --> 01:39:10,683
but the official
opinion on Cimino
1949
01:39:10,727 --> 01:39:13,469
was he's a downer or something.
1950
01:39:13,512 --> 01:39:17,038
And Jerry said, the two
hour 25 minute cut
1951
01:39:17,081 --> 01:39:19,475
is actually opening next
week in Paris.
1952
01:39:19,518 --> 01:39:20,998
I said, it is?
1953
01:39:21,042 --> 01:39:23,261
He said, yeah, Deri and I
just made plans to go over.
1954
01:39:23,305 --> 01:39:24,959
And I said, oh, well,
I'm there too.
1955
01:39:26,221 --> 01:39:28,266
Oh, it was such a wonderful
time that we spent there
1956
01:39:28,310 --> 01:39:30,051
in terms of getting to
know them both.
1957
01:39:30,094 --> 01:39:33,141
It was again to be in
Deri's company.
1958
01:39:33,184 --> 01:39:34,881
I mean, she just loved
being in Paris
1959
01:39:34,925 --> 01:39:36,709
and it was just all positive
1960
01:39:36,753 --> 01:39:38,102
and there was a special
screening for us
1961
01:39:38,146 --> 01:39:39,712
'cause we'd come all this way.
1962
01:39:39,756 --> 01:39:41,366
And my feeling was
1963
01:39:41,410 --> 01:39:43,542
that it was one of the three
best films of the year,
1964
01:39:43,586 --> 01:39:45,805
but films getting clobbered
back in the United States.
1965
01:39:45,849 --> 01:39:47,329
- And when he came back,
1966
01:39:47,372 --> 01:39:49,287
he called me to tell me
that he was back
1967
01:39:49,331 --> 01:39:52,987
and relayed to me how
upset he was.
1968
01:39:53,030 --> 01:39:56,338
I mean, it almost went
beyond like you had to say,
1969
01:39:56,381 --> 01:39:58,949
Jerry, Jerry, relax, calm down,
1970
01:39:59,950 --> 01:40:01,517
you're making yourself sick
1971
01:40:01,560 --> 01:40:05,173
over someone else's
trials and tribulations,
1972
01:40:06,435 --> 01:40:08,219
one has to worry about
themselves a little more,
1973
01:40:08,263 --> 01:40:10,047
stop killing yourself
1974
01:40:10,091 --> 01:40:13,529
worrying about other filmmakers'
problems.
1975
01:40:13,572 --> 01:40:17,228
[speaking in foreign language]
1976
01:40:38,423 --> 01:40:41,383
- Jerry had been receiving
these inquiries from Joe Cohen
1977
01:40:41,426 --> 01:40:44,995
who was an executive with
Spectre Core which owned Prism
1978
01:40:45,039 --> 01:40:46,692
which had had some
success back East
1979
01:40:46,736 --> 01:40:50,653
showing sports and movies,
combining them in one channel.
1980
01:40:50,696 --> 01:40:52,089
And it was Joe's idea
1981
01:40:52,133 --> 01:40:55,266
that the same could be
done for Z Channel.
1982
01:40:55,310 --> 01:40:59,096
Given the conditions of
that month of October,
1983
01:40:59,140 --> 01:41:00,445
it made a lot of sense.
1984
01:41:00,489 --> 01:41:02,360
- The way to salvage all of this
1985
01:41:02,404 --> 01:41:04,971
was to add sports programming.
1986
01:41:05,015 --> 01:41:06,886
And that was it.
1987
01:41:06,930 --> 01:41:09,237
- And thus was born Z Plus,
1988
01:41:10,455 --> 01:41:12,979
which was everything you
love about Z Channel,
1989
01:41:13,023 --> 01:41:15,156
plus the Dodgers and Angels.
1990
01:41:17,071 --> 01:41:19,595
[upbeat music]
1991
01:41:38,266 --> 01:41:39,615
- [Jerry] The movie,
"The Wild Bunch"
1992
01:41:39,658 --> 01:41:42,661
had a pretty profound
effect upon my life.
1993
01:41:42,705 --> 01:41:45,186
It was about men in a
changing world
1994
01:41:45,229 --> 01:41:47,144
where the values were changing
1995
01:41:47,188 --> 01:41:50,582
and they had kind of
outlived a different world.
1996
01:41:50,626 --> 01:41:53,237
[soft music]
1997
01:42:06,337 --> 01:42:09,297
- March 17th of 1988,
we all went to Guido's.
1998
01:42:09,340 --> 01:42:10,646
And that was another
great evening,
1999
01:42:10,689 --> 01:42:12,430
that was like the Parisian
trip all over again.
2000
01:42:12,474 --> 01:42:14,650
This time, Michael
Cimino was there
2001
01:42:14,693 --> 01:42:16,652
and because I had sort of
gone to the war
2002
01:42:16,695 --> 01:42:18,088
for "The Sicilian,"
2003
01:42:18,132 --> 01:42:20,090
he and I are now very
comfortable with each other
2004
01:42:20,134 --> 01:42:22,484
and so we were all of us there
2005
01:42:22,527 --> 01:42:24,094
and there was a cake
2006
01:42:24,138 --> 01:42:27,880
that Deri had ordered from like
this really special bakery.
2007
01:42:27,924 --> 01:42:30,274
I mean, it's the most amazing
chocolate cake I've ever had.
2008
01:42:30,318 --> 01:42:31,884
And Michael had chosen
the inscription
2009
01:42:31,928 --> 01:42:34,365
which comes from John Ford from
"She Wore a Yellow Ribbon,"
2010
01:42:34,409 --> 01:42:36,672
which is lest we forget.
2011
01:42:36,715 --> 01:42:38,239
So that was on the cake.
2012
01:42:38,282 --> 01:42:42,504
And it was Michael's way of
thanking me and Jerry both.
2013
01:42:42,547 --> 01:42:45,985
And boy, it's so amazing
how the fates work
2014
01:42:46,029 --> 01:42:47,683
because this was the last
time we were all together
2015
01:42:47,726 --> 01:42:52,296
and they could not have been
more luminous as a pair,
2016
01:42:52,340 --> 01:42:54,690
we could not have all
been happier.
2017
01:42:54,733 --> 01:42:55,952
I mean, that night
2018
01:42:55,995 --> 01:42:58,737
is now surrounded by a
strange aura for me
2019
01:42:58,781 --> 01:43:02,306
because it was so happy
and we were also together.
2020
01:43:02,350 --> 01:43:04,917
And the cake says,
lest we forget.
2021
01:43:11,750 --> 01:43:14,318
- One of the risks of
taking on a partnership
2022
01:43:14,362 --> 01:43:16,712
with a sports channel
2023
01:43:16,755 --> 01:43:20,281
is that sporting events
often run commercials.
2024
01:43:20,324 --> 01:43:22,108
- Because there was
this precedent
2025
01:43:22,152 --> 01:43:24,546
in premium or paid television
2026
01:43:24,589 --> 01:43:28,506
was defined as not
having commercials,
2027
01:43:28,550 --> 01:43:30,856
we got into a battle with HBO
2028
01:43:34,425 --> 01:43:37,950
which escalated
unfortunately into a lawsuit.
2029
01:43:40,170 --> 01:43:42,738
- Z Channel felt that HBO
2030
01:43:42,781 --> 01:43:45,567
had teamed up with four
other studios
2031
01:43:45,610 --> 01:43:49,788
to prevent Z Channel from
getting access to their films,
2032
01:43:49,832 --> 01:43:51,616
and Z Channel instituted
2033
01:43:52,661 --> 01:43:56,969
a restraint of trade type
lawsuit against them.
2034
01:43:57,013 --> 01:44:02,018
Jerry was going to be the
star witness in this lawsuit
2035
01:44:02,061 --> 01:44:04,368
and was preparing to testify.
2036
01:44:08,242 --> 01:44:10,505
- When I tried to understand
what Jerry's state of mind was
2037
01:44:10,548 --> 01:44:12,071
in the last couple of
weeks of his life,
2038
01:44:12,115 --> 01:44:14,073
I think that it had a
lot to do with the fact
2039
01:44:14,117 --> 01:44:15,814
that he was going up
against his friends
2040
01:44:15,858 --> 01:44:20,210
and old collaborators, old
business partners in court.
2041
01:44:20,254 --> 01:44:22,430
- I was quite worried about
him the last time I saw him
2042
01:44:22,473 --> 01:44:25,781
and express concern
to my partner
2043
01:44:25,824 --> 01:44:28,000
and anyone else that would
listen about it
2044
01:44:28,044 --> 01:44:29,393
and didn't know what to do,
2045
01:44:29,437 --> 01:44:32,266
but he's seem that he
was imploding.
2046
01:44:34,877 --> 01:44:38,402
- The night that we
inaugurated the sports channel,
2047
01:44:38,446 --> 01:44:39,838
I mean, they had all
these baseball players
2048
01:44:39,882 --> 01:44:41,840
up at the building
2049
01:44:41,884 --> 01:44:44,495
and Jerry and I took a
long kind of Socratic walk
2050
01:44:44,539 --> 01:44:47,411
around the block, we circled
the block several times
2051
01:44:47,455 --> 01:44:48,934
just talking it through.
2052
01:44:48,978 --> 01:44:50,806
And I was full of dread
and apprehension
2053
01:44:50,849 --> 01:44:52,024
about how things were gonna work
2054
01:44:52,068 --> 01:44:53,374
and Jerry was being
very positive.
2055
01:44:53,417 --> 01:44:55,941
- Jerry was very at
ease at the party
2056
01:44:55,985 --> 01:44:59,031
and he had to say a few words
2057
01:44:59,075 --> 01:45:02,296
and a lot of us all showed
up in support of Jerry.
2058
01:45:02,339 --> 01:45:06,517
- Up to the end, he was
telling me and other people,
2059
01:45:08,084 --> 01:45:09,607
it's going to be all right,
2060
01:45:09,651 --> 01:45:12,958
I know we're going to prevail,
it's good.
2061
01:45:16,266 --> 01:45:17,702
And he had the flu.
2062
01:45:21,140 --> 01:45:23,317
And basically, that was it.
2063
01:45:23,360 --> 01:45:25,449
He had the flu, he stayed home
2064
01:45:25,493 --> 01:45:28,322
and then we did not
see him again.
2065
01:45:30,759 --> 01:45:32,848
- My college girlfriend,
the day of Jerry's death,
2066
01:45:32,891 --> 01:45:35,024
saw him kind of wandering
through the sculpture gardens
2067
01:45:35,067 --> 01:45:36,199
here at UCLA.
2068
01:45:37,200 --> 01:45:38,244
Didn't talk to him or anything,
2069
01:45:38,288 --> 01:45:39,028
but she knew him
2070
01:45:39,071 --> 01:45:40,029
and she saw him
2071
01:45:40,551 --> 01:45:41,552
just kind of walking through
the sculpture gardens
2072
01:45:41,596 --> 01:45:44,468
in a melancholy way
the day he died.
2073
01:45:47,297 --> 01:45:48,690
I'm sure when she saw him,
2074
01:45:48,733 --> 01:45:52,433
he didn't know it was
gonna be the day he died.
2075
01:45:56,350 --> 01:46:00,484
- We got a call to come
into the office on Sunday.
2076
01:46:00,528 --> 01:46:02,660
- Somebody called me at
home and said,
2077
01:46:02,704 --> 01:46:05,663
you need to come into
the office right now.
2078
01:46:05,707 --> 01:46:09,101
- 10:00am on a Sunday,
yeah, okay, I can be there.
2079
01:46:30,775 --> 01:46:33,909
- Jerry didn't kill
himself for an hour
2080
01:46:35,084 --> 01:46:36,955
after he killed Deri.
2081
01:46:36,999 --> 01:46:39,741
And I know during that time,
2082
01:46:39,784 --> 01:46:43,527
the lucid part of him
probably resurfaced.
2083
01:46:43,571 --> 01:46:45,703
I know he called his
psychiatrist,
2084
01:46:45,747 --> 01:46:49,751
I know in a really sort
of eerily calm way,
2085
01:46:49,794 --> 01:46:53,711
he described what he had
done to his psychiatrist.
2086
01:46:53,755 --> 01:46:56,801
And it's interesting, I
know Jerry so well
2087
01:46:56,845 --> 01:46:59,543
that I didn't even need
to read the police report
2088
01:46:59,587 --> 01:47:03,373
to corroborate the vision
that I had in my head,
2089
01:47:03,417 --> 01:47:05,593
but I knew he would
go to his bed
2090
01:47:05,636 --> 01:47:07,725
and I knew he would sit
down in that spot
2091
01:47:07,769 --> 01:47:10,772
in a sort of slumped
position that he sat in.
2092
01:47:10,815 --> 01:47:12,861
And I know that he must
have spent an hour
2093
01:47:12,904 --> 01:47:15,516
contemplating what it
was that he had done,
2094
01:47:15,559 --> 01:47:17,735
and that he had come to
the conclusion
2095
01:47:17,779 --> 01:47:21,173
that there was just no
way that what he had done
2096
01:47:21,217 --> 01:47:24,438
was acceptable enough
to go on living.
2097
01:47:24,481 --> 01:47:26,440
And he put the gun to his temple
2098
01:47:26,483 --> 01:47:28,790
and he self executed himself.
2099
01:47:32,010 --> 01:47:35,971
- I think one of the more
painful events in my life
2100
01:47:36,014 --> 01:47:39,409
was sitting at the
breakfast table,
2101
01:47:39,453 --> 01:47:43,195
cup of tea in front of me,
picking up the LA Times,
2102
01:47:43,239 --> 01:47:47,199
and that's how I learned
what happened to Jerry.
2103
01:47:47,243 --> 01:47:49,637
- People are always asking why
2104
01:47:49,680 --> 01:47:52,335
when something dreadful happens.
2105
01:47:52,378 --> 01:47:55,512
Truth is, it doesn't
matter why, it happened.
2106
01:47:55,556 --> 01:47:59,995
- I was angry at him, I was
angry at him for doing that,
2107
01:48:01,953 --> 01:48:03,564
and I think many other
people have felt the same way
2108
01:48:03,607 --> 01:48:04,913
and that may be one
of the reasons
2109
01:48:04,956 --> 01:48:07,219
the story hasn't been
told for so many years.
2110
01:48:07,263 --> 01:48:11,267
Maybe people need to go through
a healing process for that.
2111
01:48:11,310 --> 01:48:13,356
But did I see it coming?
2112
01:48:31,679 --> 01:48:33,855
- When Jerry died, his
mother called me that day,
2113
01:48:33,898 --> 01:48:35,160
a few months after that,
2114
01:48:35,204 --> 01:48:38,729
I started to see her on a
regular basis.
2115
01:48:38,773 --> 01:48:40,949
Maybe I just wanted to
know the answer,
2116
01:48:40,992 --> 01:48:45,040
maybe there was a reason why
everyone at a certain age
2117
01:48:45,083 --> 01:48:49,610
came to this realization that
they'd come from a bad seed,
2118
01:48:49,653 --> 01:48:50,654
we don't know.
2119
01:48:52,526 --> 01:48:55,093
And maybe part of my
association with her
2120
01:48:55,137 --> 01:48:59,707
was sort of because I was
really curious to know as well
2121
01:48:59,750 --> 01:49:03,058
because as much as I
pushed Jerry away,
2122
01:49:03,101 --> 01:49:05,756
I wanted to
understand the story.
2123
01:49:14,722 --> 01:49:16,506
- After Jerry died,
2124
01:49:16,550 --> 01:49:19,944
it was right at the time
within a week or two
2125
01:49:21,467 --> 01:49:25,080
of when Z Channel started
broadcasting sports.
2126
01:49:27,386 --> 01:49:31,869
And I guess you could say Z
Channel died when Jerry died,
2127
01:49:33,915 --> 01:49:37,309
Z Channel died when
sports came on.
2128
01:49:37,353 --> 01:49:40,095
- Well, there was a year
between Jerry's death
2129
01:49:40,138 --> 01:49:42,358
and the end of Z Channel.
2130
01:49:42,401 --> 01:49:43,838
So while those events
2131
01:49:43,881 --> 01:49:48,320
were certainly clearly
linked in people's minds,
2132
01:49:48,364 --> 01:49:50,801
they weren't directly
linked perhaps.
2133
01:49:50,845 --> 01:49:54,544
- We were showing "The
Silence" by Ingmar Bergman,
2134
01:49:54,588 --> 01:49:56,546
the end very climactic scene,
2135
01:49:56,590 --> 01:50:00,158
it's all about the
quest for God,
2136
01:50:00,202 --> 01:50:03,814
is there God or is
there just silence.
2137
01:50:03,858 --> 01:50:06,948
And here we reach the
climax of the movie
2138
01:50:09,820 --> 01:50:11,953
then comes on at the
bottom of the frame
2139
01:50:11,996 --> 01:50:13,563
a yellow chiron that says,
2140
01:50:13,607 --> 01:50:17,132
don't miss the Dodgers game
coming up next at seven o'clock
2141
01:50:17,175 --> 01:50:18,133
on Z Channel.
2142
01:50:44,681 --> 01:50:46,161
- The Z Channel was
really about content,
2143
01:50:46,204 --> 01:50:47,553
here's what we love,
we love movies,
2144
01:50:47,597 --> 01:50:48,511
and here's a whole bunch of them
2145
01:50:48,859 --> 01:50:49,643
and here's some really
interesting people
2146
01:50:49,686 --> 01:50:51,122
talking about them.
2147
01:50:51,166 --> 01:50:55,039
- To be included within
all these great filmmakers
2148
01:50:55,083 --> 01:50:59,870
and to hopefully have opened
somebody else's eyes out there,
2149
01:51:01,567 --> 01:51:03,657
I mean, 'cause that's
what Z Channel did do,
2150
01:51:03,700 --> 01:51:06,224
just show the ordinary film goer
2151
01:51:06,268 --> 01:51:08,879
that there was a whole
other world out there.
2152
01:51:08,923 --> 01:51:13,057
And so I feel very privileged
to be a part of that.
2153
01:51:13,101 --> 01:51:15,190
- There's been no place
since in my mind
2154
01:51:15,233 --> 01:51:18,410
that has done quite what
Z Channel's done
2155
01:51:18,454 --> 01:51:22,023
in sort of bringing all
different kinds of film together
2156
01:51:22,066 --> 01:51:26,636
in a way that really brings
out the best in films
2157
01:51:26,680 --> 01:51:31,685
by showing it in a context
of everything that is movies.
2158
01:51:31,728 --> 01:51:33,556
- The Z Channel
being what it was
2159
01:51:33,599 --> 01:51:37,212
and being a
remarkable achievement,
2160
01:51:37,255 --> 01:51:39,649
if you compare that with
what Jerry eventually did
2161
01:51:39,693 --> 01:51:44,219
and how he died and what
he did prior to his death,
2162
01:51:44,262 --> 01:51:47,657
there's this sense of
creating a hero
2163
01:51:47,701 --> 01:51:50,442
where perhaps one is
inappropriate.
2164
01:51:52,618 --> 01:51:54,882
And I had problems with that.
2165
01:51:57,928 --> 01:52:01,105
- Whatever I think sort
of positive feelings
2166
01:52:01,149 --> 01:52:03,934
that were about Jerry
at that point,
2167
01:52:05,762 --> 01:52:08,809
and it's sort of
trumped everything,
2168
01:52:08,852 --> 01:52:10,593
you weren't gonna get
around the fact
2169
01:52:10,636 --> 01:52:12,203
that he murdered his wife.
2170
01:52:12,247 --> 01:52:14,815
- I had a feeling in my mind
that Jerry had other options,
2171
01:52:14,858 --> 01:52:17,556
that there was other
options for him.
2172
01:52:17,600 --> 01:52:18,819
That doesn't make it right,
2173
01:52:18,862 --> 01:52:20,385
I'm not saying anything
2174
01:52:20,429 --> 01:52:24,476
about how you leave this earth
or don't leave this earth,
2175
01:52:24,520 --> 01:52:26,522
I just always had in the
back of my mind and still do
2176
01:52:26,565 --> 01:52:29,046
that he had other options.
2177
01:52:29,090 --> 01:52:31,092
- They can't be diminished
2178
01:52:34,182 --> 01:52:36,532
when we all stand up and
have to say our names
2179
01:52:36,575 --> 01:52:40,101
about who's responsible
for this piece of shit
2180
01:52:41,319 --> 01:52:43,887
or this masterpiece,
who's responsible.
2181
01:52:43,931 --> 01:52:46,760
Everybody wants to take credit,
2182
01:52:46,803 --> 01:52:49,501
but he was an intricate part
2183
01:52:49,545 --> 01:52:52,374
of all of those films
that he touched.
2184
01:52:52,417 --> 01:52:54,071
Even though he had nothing
to do with them
2185
01:52:54,115 --> 01:52:56,073
when they were made,
2186
01:52:56,117 --> 01:52:57,771
there was still a living
2187
01:53:01,426 --> 01:53:05,779
nurturing that brought
those films
2188
01:53:05,822 --> 01:53:09,521
that otherwise I think
would been lost forever.
2189
01:53:12,655 --> 01:53:14,222
I like him.
2190
01:53:14,265 --> 01:53:16,311
- Louise Brooks, one of
Jerry's favorite actresses
2191
01:53:16,354 --> 01:53:19,227
and one of mine, always
like to quote Gerter,
2192
01:53:19,270 --> 01:53:23,361
Gerter would say, a human
life remains of consequence,
2193
01:53:23,405 --> 01:53:26,060
not because of what we
leave behind,
2194
01:53:26,103 --> 01:53:29,933
but because we act and
inspire and rouse others.
2195
01:53:31,369 --> 01:53:32,022
Damn it.
2196
01:53:34,111 --> 01:53:37,898
Sorry, a human life
remains of consequence,
2197
01:53:37,941 --> 01:53:39,813
not because of what we
leave behind,
2198
01:53:39,856 --> 01:53:42,641
but because we act and
inspire and rouse others
2199
01:53:42,685 --> 01:53:45,383
to action and inspiration,
2200
01:53:45,427 --> 01:53:48,560
we act and inspire and rouse
others to action and enjoyment.
2201
01:53:48,604 --> 01:53:51,346
And so, when I think of the
legacy of Jerry Harvey's life,
2202
01:53:51,389 --> 01:53:52,651
I think of it in those terms,
2203
01:53:52,695 --> 01:53:55,437
I think, he's not a guy
who left much behind,
2204
01:53:55,480 --> 01:53:57,961
what he left behind was
in a lot of way wreckage
2205
01:53:58,005 --> 01:54:01,182
and very tragic and
costly wreckage.
2206
01:54:01,225 --> 01:54:05,795
The films that got left
behind that he midwifed
2207
01:54:05,839 --> 01:54:08,798
are part of the action and
inspiration of his life.
2208
01:54:08,842 --> 01:54:10,756
He acted and inspired others
2209
01:54:10,800 --> 01:54:13,411
to value these things of beauty.
2210
01:54:15,196 --> 01:54:16,458
- [John] You're listening
to Castaway's Choice,
2211
01:54:16,501 --> 01:54:17,807
I'm John McNally.
2212
01:54:17,851 --> 01:54:19,853
Our castaway this week
is Jerry Harvey,
2213
01:54:19,896 --> 01:54:23,639
who is the program director
of Group W's Z Channel.
2214
01:54:23,682 --> 01:54:26,207
Why did you choose what letter?
2215
01:54:26,250 --> 01:54:29,253
- [Jerry] For me it's
the greatest love song.
2216
01:54:29,297 --> 01:54:30,167
- [John] It's that simple?
2217
01:54:30,211 --> 01:54:31,299
- [Jerry] Yeah.
2218
01:54:32,387 --> 01:54:34,868
[soft music]
2219
01:54:41,483 --> 01:54:46,270
♪ Gone is the romance that
was so divine ♪
2220
01:54:49,665 --> 01:54:54,452
♪ 'Tis broken and
cannot be mended ♪
2221
01:54:58,717 --> 01:55:03,505
♪ You must go your way
and I must go mine ♪
2222
01:55:07,030 --> 01:55:11,905
♪ But now that our love
dreams have ended ♪
2223
01:55:28,530 --> 01:55:33,317
♪ What'll I do when you are
far away and I am blue ♪
2224
01:55:43,545 --> 01:55:48,463
♪ What'll I do?
2225
01:55:48,506 --> 01:55:53,250
♪ What'll I do when I am
wond'ring who is kissing you ♪
2226
01:56:03,304 --> 01:56:08,265
♪ What'll I do?
2227
01:56:08,309 --> 01:56:10,702
♪ What'll I do
2228
01:56:10,746 --> 01:56:17,492
♪ With just a photograph
to tell my troubles to ♪
2229
01:56:27,937 --> 01:56:30,592
♪ When I'm alone
2230
01:56:30,635 --> 01:56:35,423
♪ With only dreams of you
what won't come true ♪
2231
01:56:45,563 --> 01:56:48,131
♪ What'll I do?
2232
01:57:11,589 --> 01:57:14,027
[upbeat music]
176946
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