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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:05,214 --> 00:00:08,050 [mellow rock music playing over radio] 2 00:00:08,209 --> 00:00:09,885 ♪ ♪ 3 00:00:09,969 --> 00:00:12,220 - On the only 24-hour radio news center in Kansas, 4 00:00:12,379 --> 00:00:15,390 I'm Gordon Basham with the 2:00 report. 5 00:00:15,549 --> 00:00:17,559 30 years have gone by since the serial killer 6 00:00:17,718 --> 00:00:21,563 calling himself BTK took the life of his first victim. 7 00:00:21,722 --> 00:00:23,648 Now Wichita police say they've solved the case 8 00:00:23,733 --> 00:00:26,985 with the arrest of a 59-year-old Park City man. 9 00:00:27,144 --> 00:00:30,489 - Today is a very historic day. 10 00:00:30,648 --> 00:00:34,826 The bottom line, BTK is arrested. 11 00:00:34,911 --> 00:00:37,987 [cheers and applause] 12 00:00:38,081 --> 00:00:40,657 [dramatic music] 13 00:00:40,741 --> 00:00:42,417 ♪ ♪ 14 00:00:42,576 --> 00:00:46,004 - People in Wichita had been terrorized 15 00:00:46,089 --> 00:00:50,509 by the concept of this bind, torture, kill individual 16 00:00:50,668 --> 00:00:54,554 for 30 years, from '74 to 2005. 17 00:00:59,009 --> 00:01:00,936 - I thought, "This is a-- This is a master criminal." 18 00:01:01,020 --> 00:01:05,181 I mean, he's eluded hundreds of investigators over the years. 19 00:01:05,274 --> 00:01:07,851 - The man accused of being the BTK serial killer 20 00:01:07,935 --> 00:01:10,937 returns to a Kansas courtroom this morning. 21 00:01:11,021 --> 00:01:13,698 - Everybody wanted to know what this guy was about, 22 00:01:13,783 --> 00:01:16,701 who this guy was, and, more important, 23 00:01:16,786 --> 00:01:20,697 how he could kill ten people, including two children. 24 00:01:20,781 --> 00:01:23,116 - The hope is, some of the burning questions 25 00:01:23,200 --> 00:01:24,534 people here are asking 26 00:01:24,627 --> 00:01:28,463 may be answered soon by Rader himself. 27 00:01:28,548 --> 00:01:32,125 - Mr. Rader, I need to find out more information. 28 00:01:32,209 --> 00:01:33,960 ♪ ♪ 29 00:01:34,044 --> 00:01:37,639 - Well, I mean, I strangled Mrs. Otero, 30 00:01:37,798 --> 00:01:40,300 and she went out-- Or passed out. 31 00:01:40,384 --> 00:01:42,302 I thought she was dead. She passed out. 32 00:01:42,386 --> 00:01:45,388 Then I strangled Josephine. 33 00:01:45,472 --> 00:01:47,307 - It was so quiet in that courtroom, 34 00:01:47,391 --> 00:01:49,401 you could hear a fly landing 35 00:01:49,485 --> 00:01:52,312 on a piece of paper a mile away in there. 36 00:01:52,405 --> 00:01:55,148 Dennis Rader was in the center ring 37 00:01:55,232 --> 00:01:56,575 of a three-ring circus, 38 00:01:56,659 --> 00:01:58,568 and the spotlight was on him. 39 00:01:58,652 --> 00:01:59,986 ♪ ♪ 40 00:02:00,079 --> 00:02:02,238 Because of his ego, he loved that, 41 00:02:02,331 --> 00:02:03,999 absolutely loved that. 42 00:02:04,158 --> 00:02:06,993 - At that point in time, strangled her 43 00:02:07,086 --> 00:02:08,411 for a death strangle at that time. 44 00:02:08,495 --> 00:02:09,495 - With your hands? 45 00:02:09,580 --> 00:02:11,423 - There was no regret. 46 00:02:11,582 --> 00:02:15,585 There was no, you know, "I feel bad for doing this." 47 00:02:15,669 --> 00:02:17,012 - What happened then? 48 00:02:17,171 --> 00:02:18,671 - Oh, tried to find a place to hide her, 49 00:02:18,756 --> 00:02:20,506 hide the body. 50 00:02:20,591 --> 00:02:23,009 - Did you find a place? - Yes. Yes, I did. 51 00:02:23,093 --> 00:02:25,187 - You gotta be kidding me. 52 00:02:25,271 --> 00:02:27,689 I looked at this, and I thought, 53 00:02:27,848 --> 00:02:30,525 "That is what killed all these women?" 54 00:02:30,684 --> 00:02:32,527 - Got her to the car, put her in the trunk of the car. 55 00:02:32,686 --> 00:02:36,615 ♪ ♪ 56 00:02:36,774 --> 00:02:39,692 - When people watched the televised courtroom confession 57 00:02:39,777 --> 00:02:41,203 of Dennis Rader, 58 00:02:41,362 --> 00:02:43,363 they basically thought they knew the whole story. 59 00:02:43,447 --> 00:02:45,531 [phone buzzing] 60 00:02:45,625 --> 00:02:48,376 But for me, that was just the start. 61 00:02:58,629 --> 00:03:00,380 [touch tone beeps] Or say-- 62 00:03:00,464 --> 00:03:03,808 - When you went before Judge Waller and he asked you 63 00:03:03,893 --> 00:03:06,552 to talk about the details of all the crimes, 64 00:03:06,646 --> 00:03:07,979 what was--what were you thinking? 65 00:03:08,138 --> 00:03:09,648 What was that like for you? 66 00:03:18,824 --> 00:03:20,825 - Were you feeling anything when that was happening? 67 00:03:20,910 --> 00:03:21,910 Was-- 68 00:03:26,407 --> 00:03:27,991 - Okay. 69 00:03:28,075 --> 00:03:29,334 ♪ ♪ 70 00:03:29,418 --> 00:03:31,419 I'm Dr. Katherine Ramsland, 71 00:03:31,578 --> 00:03:34,422 professor of forensic psychology. 72 00:03:34,581 --> 00:03:36,332 I've been corresponding with Dennis Rader 73 00:03:36,417 --> 00:03:38,001 for over ten years 74 00:03:38,094 --> 00:03:41,680 to try to understand what led him to become 75 00:03:41,764 --> 00:03:45,341 one of the most notorious serial killers in America. 76 00:03:45,434 --> 00:03:48,436 - He really controlled Wichita during that time period. 77 00:03:48,521 --> 00:03:51,356 - Rader wanted you to know he was watching you, 78 00:03:51,515 --> 00:03:52,774 he was aware of you. 79 00:03:52,858 --> 00:03:55,351 He wants you to feel his eyes on you. 80 00:03:55,444 --> 00:03:57,946 - That's so frightening. 81 00:03:58,105 --> 00:04:00,782 - I think it's very important to understand 82 00:04:00,866 --> 00:04:05,287 how any given individual could become an extreme offender. 83 00:04:05,446 --> 00:04:06,955 ♪ ♪ 84 00:04:07,039 --> 00:04:09,198 Why do they make these life choices? 85 00:04:09,292 --> 00:04:14,370 What kinds of mental states do we see in these people? 86 00:04:14,455 --> 00:04:17,206 - The story isn't over, because at this point, 87 00:04:17,291 --> 00:04:20,385 we still don't know-- Or at least I don't know-- 88 00:04:20,544 --> 00:04:23,888 What caused Dennis Rader to become the monster that he did. 89 00:04:24,048 --> 00:04:25,056 I don't know. I'm not sure. 90 00:04:25,215 --> 00:04:26,808 Do you know? - I think I know. 91 00:04:26,967 --> 00:04:29,436 ♪ ♪ 92 00:04:32,556 --> 00:04:33,723 ♪ ♪ 93 00:04:33,816 --> 00:04:35,650 - Dennis Rader is a monster. 94 00:04:35,809 --> 00:04:39,645 Dennis Rader is the worst of humanity. 95 00:04:39,739 --> 00:04:41,406 I don't want the story to go away 96 00:04:41,490 --> 00:04:43,816 until we find out why. 97 00:04:43,901 --> 00:04:46,161 Why did he decide that his life 98 00:04:46,320 --> 00:04:47,570 was going to be that of a killer? 99 00:04:47,654 --> 00:04:48,997 ♪ ♪ 100 00:04:49,156 --> 00:04:51,657 - This is the first time that Rader has explored 101 00:04:51,751 --> 00:04:54,919 these topics in depth with anyone. 102 00:04:55,004 --> 00:04:58,506 Why did you want to put your story out there? 103 00:05:14,264 --> 00:05:17,350 - Each serial killer has a unique set of factors 104 00:05:17,434 --> 00:05:20,445 that turns him or her into monsters. 105 00:05:20,604 --> 00:05:23,198 The more information we have, 106 00:05:23,357 --> 00:05:26,034 the more we understand what makes them tick, 107 00:05:26,193 --> 00:05:29,704 the easier it will be to prevent them. 108 00:05:29,863 --> 00:05:36,711 ♪ ♪ 109 00:05:38,881 --> 00:05:41,716 [insects chirring] 110 00:05:45,963 --> 00:05:49,808 Serial killers have interested me for about 30 years 111 00:05:49,892 --> 00:05:52,635 and in part because when I was a kid, 112 00:05:52,728 --> 00:05:56,055 there was a serial killer operating in my neighborhood 113 00:05:56,140 --> 00:06:00,476 before anyone even used the phrase "serial killer." 114 00:06:00,561 --> 00:06:03,396 And my brother's friends 115 00:06:03,489 --> 00:06:06,566 found the first body on their farm. 116 00:06:06,650 --> 00:06:08,067 - An Eastern Michigan University student 117 00:06:08,152 --> 00:06:09,244 was charged today 118 00:06:09,403 --> 00:06:11,154 with one of the seven co-ed murders 119 00:06:11,238 --> 00:06:13,406 in the Ann Arbor, Michigan, area. 120 00:06:13,499 --> 00:06:15,500 John Collins, 22-year-old student 121 00:06:15,584 --> 00:06:17,326 at the university's school of education... 122 00:06:17,411 --> 00:06:19,162 - John Norman Collins is also known 123 00:06:19,255 --> 00:06:21,005 as the Co-ed Killer 124 00:06:21,090 --> 00:06:24,592 because co-eds from two different university campuses 125 00:06:24,677 --> 00:06:29,338 in the area were being picked up and murdered. 126 00:06:29,423 --> 00:06:31,507 It fascinated me to watch 127 00:06:31,600 --> 00:06:34,510 the development of this case in the newspapers, 128 00:06:34,595 --> 00:06:40,183 and I wanted to find out more about serial killers. 129 00:06:40,276 --> 00:06:41,684 Later in life 130 00:06:41,768 --> 00:06:45,113 as I became a professor of forensic psychology, 131 00:06:45,272 --> 00:06:47,282 extreme offenders 132 00:06:47,441 --> 00:06:49,942 were something we knew very little about, 133 00:06:50,035 --> 00:06:53,112 and I wanted to contribute to that. 134 00:06:53,197 --> 00:06:54,706 ♪ ♪ 135 00:06:54,865 --> 00:06:58,201 I've published 68 books and have 4 more in the works. 136 00:06:58,285 --> 00:06:59,702 ♪ ♪ 137 00:06:59,795 --> 00:07:02,538 Not only do I write about serial killers. 138 00:07:02,623 --> 00:07:06,292 I'm constantly teaching. I do police trainings. 139 00:07:06,385 --> 00:07:09,888 I do a broad variety of activities, 140 00:07:09,972 --> 00:07:13,475 all surrounding my knowledge of extreme offenders. 141 00:07:13,634 --> 00:07:14,800 ♪ ♪ 142 00:07:14,894 --> 00:07:16,561 A lot of myths have cropped up 143 00:07:16,720 --> 00:07:19,138 about serial killers, 144 00:07:19,231 --> 00:07:22,308 so I especially want to study cases 145 00:07:22,392 --> 00:07:26,821 that show that these myths just don't work. 146 00:07:26,906 --> 00:07:30,066 And law enforcement needs to understand this 147 00:07:30,150 --> 00:07:34,487 so that they don't dismiss a potential suspect too soon. 148 00:07:34,571 --> 00:07:35,738 ♪ ♪ 149 00:07:35,822 --> 00:07:37,665 - Dr. Katherine Ramsland 150 00:07:37,824 --> 00:07:41,410 is one of the leading serial killer experts. 151 00:07:41,504 --> 00:07:46,174 She's helped us understand how we might notice 152 00:07:46,333 --> 00:07:48,501 certain behaviors at a early age, 153 00:07:48,585 --> 00:07:50,178 pick up on those behaviors, 154 00:07:50,337 --> 00:07:53,264 and get help for those behaviors 155 00:07:53,423 --> 00:07:54,924 before it's too late. 156 00:07:55,008 --> 00:07:58,019 ♪ ♪ 157 00:07:58,178 --> 00:08:01,689 - When Dennis Rader was finally caught 158 00:08:01,848 --> 00:08:05,935 and revealed to be this older guy, 159 00:08:06,028 --> 00:08:08,696 paunchy balding guy, 160 00:08:08,855 --> 00:08:12,617 I was interested in the media response to him. 161 00:08:12,776 --> 00:08:14,786 - This is a man--a family man 162 00:08:14,945 --> 00:08:17,446 who went home to his wife and two children every night. 163 00:08:17,531 --> 00:08:18,614 - Doctor, why were there no red flags? 164 00:08:18,699 --> 00:08:19,865 Why did nobody see this? 165 00:08:19,959 --> 00:08:21,709 He was a church leader, a family man 166 00:08:21,868 --> 00:08:23,035 right there in the middle of the community. 167 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:24,379 - You know, I'm amazed by that as well, 168 00:08:24,463 --> 00:08:25,871 that nobody was able to figure out 169 00:08:25,956 --> 00:08:27,882 that this guy had this-- 170 00:08:27,967 --> 00:08:29,717 This secret life that he was hiding. 171 00:08:29,876 --> 00:08:33,388 - The media wanted a specific type of person 172 00:08:33,547 --> 00:08:37,559 to fit the mold of serial killer. 173 00:08:37,643 --> 00:08:40,553 But he'd been a family man, a churchgoer. 174 00:08:40,637 --> 00:08:42,146 He had a job. 175 00:08:42,306 --> 00:08:45,474 You know, he basically blasted all the FBI stereotypes 176 00:08:45,559 --> 00:08:47,560 out of the water. 177 00:08:47,644 --> 00:08:51,072 ♪ ♪ 178 00:08:51,231 --> 00:08:54,650 One of the reasons I wanted to work with him 179 00:08:54,743 --> 00:08:59,155 was to look at someone who appears to be an outlier 180 00:08:59,248 --> 00:09:02,417 and see what he teaches us. 181 00:09:02,576 --> 00:09:04,243 ♪ ♪ 182 00:09:04,328 --> 00:09:08,164 Because he's not unique. 183 00:09:08,248 --> 00:09:11,342 There are others who have been family men, 184 00:09:11,427 --> 00:09:13,094 churchgoers, 185 00:09:13,253 --> 00:09:17,757 seemingly normal people who have these thoughts 186 00:09:17,841 --> 00:09:21,177 and sometimes act on these thoughts. 187 00:09:21,261 --> 00:09:22,520 And so I think it's important for us 188 00:09:22,605 --> 00:09:25,514 to not just understand them 189 00:09:25,608 --> 00:09:30,186 but also treat them before they become serial killers. 190 00:09:30,270 --> 00:09:33,689 ♪ ♪ 191 00:09:33,774 --> 00:09:36,200 My initial communications with Dennis Rader 192 00:09:36,360 --> 00:09:38,027 were kind of interesting. 193 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:42,457 He liked the fact that I came in with credentials, 194 00:09:42,616 --> 00:09:45,793 because it meant he was being taken seriously. 195 00:09:45,952 --> 00:09:50,131 But at the same time, he wanted to test me. 196 00:09:50,290 --> 00:09:53,459 He said he wanted me to solve some codes, 197 00:09:53,543 --> 00:09:56,638 and he liked working with codes. 198 00:09:56,797 --> 00:09:58,297 ♪ ♪ 199 00:09:58,382 --> 00:10:02,143 He began to send me cut-out pages from magazines 200 00:10:02,302 --> 00:10:04,553 and newspapers where he'd circle things, 201 00:10:04,647 --> 00:10:06,972 and he'd make odd comments. 202 00:10:07,066 --> 00:10:09,975 Like, at one point, he said, 203 00:10:10,060 --> 00:10:11,811 "I understand you're interested 204 00:10:11,895 --> 00:10:14,822 in recipes of the three-layer kind." 205 00:10:14,981 --> 00:10:16,658 ♪ ♪ 206 00:10:16,742 --> 00:10:20,653 I thought that was strange, because I actually don't cook 207 00:10:20,746 --> 00:10:23,489 and especially three-layer recipes. 208 00:10:23,573 --> 00:10:27,576 So I didn't really quite get what he meant. 209 00:10:27,670 --> 00:10:30,830 I put the whole alphabet down, A, B, C, D, E, F. 210 00:10:30,914 --> 00:10:34,250 And then I looked at each of the pieces of paper 211 00:10:34,334 --> 00:10:37,845 that had things circled or items in his letter 212 00:10:38,004 --> 00:10:41,683 that corresponded to the A, B, C, D letters 213 00:10:41,767 --> 00:10:44,602 and wrote everything I could down. 214 00:10:44,761 --> 00:10:48,931 But then I began to see the things that he had circled, 215 00:10:49,024 --> 00:10:51,192 like "beef," 216 00:10:51,351 --> 00:10:53,102 "tangy," 217 00:10:53,186 --> 00:10:54,112 "king." 218 00:10:54,271 --> 00:10:56,614 So there's K. 219 00:10:56,773 --> 00:11:01,452 And then it dawned on me what the three-layer recipes were: 220 00:11:01,537 --> 00:11:03,529 BTK, 221 00:11:03,613 --> 00:11:07,366 for bind them, torture them, kill them. 222 00:11:07,451 --> 00:11:10,795 And so once I returned the code to him 223 00:11:10,879 --> 00:11:13,622 and said, "Okay, what's next?" 224 00:11:13,707 --> 00:11:16,467 He recognized not that I had solved the code 225 00:11:16,626 --> 00:11:19,044 but that I would play the game. 226 00:11:19,129 --> 00:11:20,388 ♪ ♪ 227 00:11:20,547 --> 00:11:23,474 So your fantasy life was more important to you 228 00:11:23,633 --> 00:11:25,518 than your real life, it sounds like. 229 00:11:38,741 --> 00:11:42,818 - There's a great value in understanding Dennis Rader 230 00:11:42,903 --> 00:11:44,412 and his motivations, 231 00:11:44,571 --> 00:11:47,915 the things that made him do what he did. 232 00:11:48,074 --> 00:11:50,659 If we have more people who are skilled 233 00:11:50,744 --> 00:11:53,838 at recognizing those aspects of a person 234 00:11:53,997 --> 00:11:58,092 that might lead them in a path of some criminal behavior, 235 00:11:58,251 --> 00:12:01,012 whether it be a serial killer or whatever, 236 00:12:01,096 --> 00:12:02,597 if they can intervene, 237 00:12:02,756 --> 00:12:04,932 I mean, think of the lives that they'll save. 238 00:12:05,091 --> 00:12:07,092 - I would love it that you could just 239 00:12:07,186 --> 00:12:09,595 get some of this stuff off your chest. 240 00:12:09,679 --> 00:12:11,439 Your health is declining, 241 00:12:11,598 --> 00:12:13,599 and I think it'd be really great for you 242 00:12:13,683 --> 00:12:16,852 to be able to just say what you need to say. 243 00:12:16,945 --> 00:12:18,529 Is that okay with you? 244 00:12:25,788 --> 00:12:28,531 [dramatic music] 245 00:12:28,624 --> 00:12:32,043 - People refer to Wichita as a big little small town. 246 00:12:32,202 --> 00:12:34,796 And a lot of people don't realize how big Wichita is. 247 00:12:34,955 --> 00:12:38,466 It's the biggest city, you know, in Kansas. 248 00:12:38,550 --> 00:12:41,460 And Wichita is just this very livable place 249 00:12:41,545 --> 00:12:44,296 with very friendly people. 250 00:12:44,381 --> 00:12:45,807 ♪ ♪ 251 00:12:45,891 --> 00:12:48,976 - It's a small town with small-town values, 252 00:12:49,061 --> 00:12:54,148 neighborly people right in the middle of the country. 253 00:12:54,307 --> 00:12:58,736 ♪ ♪ 254 00:12:58,821 --> 00:13:02,648 - Dennis Rader was raised primarily in Wichita 255 00:13:02,732 --> 00:13:06,986 and moved to the suburb of Park City when he got married. 256 00:13:07,070 --> 00:13:08,913 ♪ ♪ 257 00:13:09,072 --> 00:13:11,991 When I'm writing about any person, 258 00:13:12,084 --> 00:13:14,577 I want to see what they saw, 259 00:13:14,661 --> 00:13:16,921 smell what they smelled, 260 00:13:17,080 --> 00:13:19,340 feel the air. 261 00:13:19,499 --> 00:13:21,175 Where did he work? 262 00:13:21,260 --> 00:13:24,587 Kinds of travel routes did he use? 263 00:13:24,671 --> 00:13:28,516 It's almost as if I'm putting myself in their headspace. 264 00:13:28,675 --> 00:13:29,842 ♪ ♪ 265 00:13:29,935 --> 00:13:32,687 There's a psychology in it. 266 00:13:35,691 --> 00:13:37,182 - I'm in Wichita. 267 00:13:37,276 --> 00:13:39,527 Haven't been here since 2016. 268 00:13:40,696 --> 00:13:41,988 - Are you ready to go? 269 00:13:43,189 --> 00:13:44,031 - Okay. 270 00:13:44,190 --> 00:13:45,783 ♪ ♪ 271 00:13:45,868 --> 00:13:49,203 Dennis Rader is in El Dorado Correctional Facility 272 00:13:49,362 --> 00:13:51,289 in Kansas. 273 00:13:51,448 --> 00:13:53,457 He's in a cell by himself, 274 00:13:53,617 --> 00:13:56,878 apart from the general population in the prison. 275 00:13:57,037 --> 00:14:00,047 But he does have a phone that he can use. 276 00:14:01,875 --> 00:14:03,009 - Okay. 277 00:14:06,546 --> 00:14:08,797 [laughs] - Okay. 278 00:14:08,891 --> 00:14:11,634 In order to produce the kind of book I wanted, 279 00:14:11,727 --> 00:14:15,721 I needed to get permission from family members 280 00:14:15,814 --> 00:14:19,391 of the victims who had formed a trust. 281 00:14:19,476 --> 00:14:23,404 Dennis Rader had signed over his life rights 282 00:14:23,488 --> 00:14:28,651 to the victims' family trust as part of a settlement. 283 00:14:28,735 --> 00:14:31,996 So Dennis Rader gets absolutely no profit 284 00:14:32,080 --> 00:14:34,332 from any of the work I do with him. 285 00:14:34,491 --> 00:14:37,043 So what's your cell like? 286 00:14:42,174 --> 00:14:45,584 - The way to approach really any offender 287 00:14:45,669 --> 00:14:48,012 is to be nonjudgmental. 288 00:14:48,096 --> 00:14:50,339 That's the first rule. 289 00:14:50,432 --> 00:14:53,267 You have to be able to listen to what they have to say, 290 00:14:53,352 --> 00:14:55,436 no matter what they have to say. 291 00:15:09,192 --> 00:15:12,954 ♪ ♪ 292 00:15:16,032 --> 00:15:17,449 - But at the same time, 293 00:15:17,542 --> 00:15:20,619 you also must keep your goals in mind. 294 00:15:20,704 --> 00:15:22,454 You must set parameters 295 00:15:22,547 --> 00:15:25,132 and keep some respect in the process. 296 00:15:25,217 --> 00:15:28,094 Is that why you call yourself a cave monster? 297 00:15:36,886 --> 00:15:39,555 - Rader loves to manipulate people. 298 00:15:39,639 --> 00:15:45,152 And I know, despite a long involvement with Dennis Rader, 299 00:15:45,311 --> 00:15:48,731 I could easily be used and exploited in some way. 300 00:15:48,815 --> 00:15:51,316 So yeah, I have to keep my guard up really all the time. 301 00:15:51,401 --> 00:15:57,081 ♪ ♪ 302 00:15:57,240 --> 00:15:59,750 Dennis Rader was 28 years old 303 00:15:59,835 --> 00:16:04,079 when he murdered four members of the Otero family. 304 00:16:04,172 --> 00:16:06,007 By all appearances, 305 00:16:06,166 --> 00:16:08,333 Dennis Rader was an average joe, 306 00:16:08,418 --> 00:16:10,177 and he lived in Wichita his whole life 307 00:16:10,262 --> 00:16:15,016 except for the years from 1966 to 1970, 308 00:16:15,100 --> 00:16:16,842 when he served in the air force. 309 00:16:16,926 --> 00:16:20,095 ♪ ♪ 310 00:16:20,180 --> 00:16:23,524 - I met the Rader family before Dennis. 311 00:16:23,608 --> 00:16:26,435 We went to church together at Christ Lutheran. 312 00:16:26,519 --> 00:16:28,103 ♪ ♪ 313 00:16:28,188 --> 00:16:30,448 I remember Dennis coming back in '70 314 00:16:30,607 --> 00:16:32,274 from the service. 315 00:16:32,358 --> 00:16:33,784 It was a big deal. 316 00:16:33,869 --> 00:16:35,611 All the people of the church who had been there 317 00:16:35,695 --> 00:16:38,197 for years knew him. 318 00:16:38,281 --> 00:16:40,532 So they were welcoming him home 319 00:16:40,625 --> 00:16:42,126 and, you know, "How are you doing?" 320 00:16:42,285 --> 00:16:43,544 And, "Where you going to work?" 321 00:16:43,703 --> 00:16:44,962 ♪ ♪ 322 00:16:45,121 --> 00:16:48,373 We had an old basketball goal. 323 00:16:48,467 --> 00:16:50,709 Dennis and his brothers would play. 324 00:16:50,802 --> 00:16:53,128 Dennis didn't like to lose. 325 00:16:53,221 --> 00:16:56,799 He was a little bit of a bully, arrogant, 326 00:16:56,883 --> 00:16:58,809 older, better, whatever-- 327 00:16:58,968 --> 00:17:01,303 You know, those kind of things. 328 00:17:01,387 --> 00:17:03,138 ♪ ♪ 329 00:17:03,231 --> 00:17:07,726 - In 1970, Dennis Rader returned from the air force, 330 00:17:07,811 --> 00:17:10,479 and he's 25 years old. 331 00:17:10,572 --> 00:17:14,992 The world that Dennis Rader's coming back to, the Midwest, 332 00:17:15,077 --> 00:17:17,995 puts a big emphasis on family values, 333 00:17:18,080 --> 00:17:22,074 where what matters is going to church, 334 00:17:22,158 --> 00:17:24,418 getting a job, 335 00:17:24,577 --> 00:17:28,422 getting married, and raising a family. 336 00:17:28,581 --> 00:17:30,674 His parents wanted to introduce him 337 00:17:30,834 --> 00:17:33,511 to a girl at their church. 338 00:17:33,595 --> 00:17:38,265 He met her and got married pretty quickly. 339 00:17:38,350 --> 00:17:40,434 What were you anticipating 340 00:17:40,593 --> 00:17:42,770 when you thought about getting married? 341 00:17:42,854 --> 00:17:45,272 What were you anticipating being as a husband? 342 00:18:05,544 --> 00:18:07,878 - The question is commonly raised, 343 00:18:07,963 --> 00:18:10,455 can serial killers-- 344 00:18:10,549 --> 00:18:13,467 Can they ever really love someone? 345 00:18:13,626 --> 00:18:17,388 If a serial killer has what we call 346 00:18:17,547 --> 00:18:19,464 the brain of a psychopath, 347 00:18:19,558 --> 00:18:22,467 their emotions tend to be shallow, 348 00:18:22,552 --> 00:18:28,473 and their ability to process moral information is distorted. 349 00:18:28,558 --> 00:18:32,644 If Dennis Rader talks about loving someone, 350 00:18:32,737 --> 00:18:34,730 it could be that he really doesn't 351 00:18:34,814 --> 00:18:36,732 experience that very deeply. 352 00:18:36,816 --> 00:18:38,567 ♪ ♪ 353 00:18:38,660 --> 00:18:41,236 Rader got his dream job, as he would call it, 354 00:18:41,321 --> 00:18:44,156 at Cessna, building aircraft. 355 00:18:44,249 --> 00:18:46,500 But then a short time later, he lost the job. 356 00:18:46,659 --> 00:18:48,160 ♪ ♪ 357 00:18:48,253 --> 00:18:50,838 And this was a big failure for him. 358 00:18:50,997 --> 00:18:53,924 He couldn't figure out why he'd been laid off. 359 00:18:54,083 --> 00:18:58,345 And he also had the pressure of how he'd support his wife. 360 00:18:58,504 --> 00:19:01,682 You got a job at Cessna which you loved, right? 361 00:19:01,841 --> 00:19:03,100 - Oh, yeah, yeah. 362 00:19:03,259 --> 00:19:05,603 - And then you were laid off. 363 00:19:05,687 --> 00:19:07,605 - Mm-hmm. - What was that like for you? 364 00:19:18,191 --> 00:19:20,442 - But why would that-- Why would getting laid off 365 00:19:20,526 --> 00:19:22,027 get you to the point 366 00:19:22,111 --> 00:19:23,829 where you want to break in someone's house? 367 00:19:37,377 --> 00:19:38,794 ♪ ♪ 368 00:19:38,878 --> 00:19:40,304 - When you talk about your organized offender, 369 00:19:40,388 --> 00:19:42,473 which if you look from Dennis Rader's perspective, 370 00:19:42,557 --> 00:19:44,549 most of what he did would fall 371 00:19:44,643 --> 00:19:47,886 into what we call an organized-offender style... 372 00:19:47,971 --> 00:19:49,480 ♪ ♪ 373 00:19:49,639 --> 00:19:52,057 They plan, and he actually 374 00:19:52,141 --> 00:19:54,476 would execute practice sessions 375 00:19:54,560 --> 00:19:56,979 to see what it was like to break glass, 376 00:19:57,063 --> 00:19:58,656 go through a house he wasn't familiar with 377 00:19:58,815 --> 00:20:00,241 until he thought he was ready. 378 00:20:00,325 --> 00:20:01,400 He would try to get the timing down 379 00:20:01,484 --> 00:20:03,994 of his potential suspects, 380 00:20:04,079 --> 00:20:05,988 then use that to have a successful event. 381 00:20:06,072 --> 00:20:07,748 ♪ ♪ 382 00:20:07,907 --> 00:20:11,252 - That person wasn't involved in your layoff. 383 00:20:11,411 --> 00:20:12,911 Why would you pick someone like that 384 00:20:12,996 --> 00:20:15,756 to take out your frustration on? 385 00:20:23,265 --> 00:20:24,390 - Did it work? 386 00:20:26,342 --> 00:20:27,592 ♪ ♪ 387 00:20:27,686 --> 00:20:31,596 - When he got fired, he was so angry 388 00:20:31,690 --> 00:20:35,017 that he wanted to do something destructive, 389 00:20:35,110 --> 00:20:38,020 to act out against society. 390 00:20:38,104 --> 00:20:42,449 And that meant breaking laws, and that made him feel better. 391 00:20:42,608 --> 00:20:45,610 It just gave him a sense of being powerful again, 392 00:20:45,704 --> 00:20:48,780 and he was ready to move forward 393 00:20:48,873 --> 00:20:51,709 with something far more serious and lethal. 394 00:20:59,709 --> 00:21:02,594 ♪ ♪ 395 00:21:06,808 --> 00:21:09,643 [dramatic music] 396 00:21:09,728 --> 00:21:14,982 - In 1974, Wichita was just a large Midwestern city. 397 00:21:15,141 --> 00:21:18,477 About 250,000 people lived here. 398 00:21:18,561 --> 00:21:21,897 The main jobs here were agriculture and aviation. 399 00:21:21,981 --> 00:21:24,408 ♪ ♪ 400 00:21:24,492 --> 00:21:28,153 What we didn't have here is crime. 401 00:21:28,237 --> 00:21:30,914 We had the occasional burglaries and robberies, 402 00:21:30,999 --> 00:21:34,835 but the bad stuff happened on the East or West Coast. 403 00:21:34,919 --> 00:21:37,079 It didn't happen in Wichita, Kansas. 404 00:21:37,163 --> 00:21:39,915 ♪ ♪ 405 00:21:39,999 --> 00:21:42,176 - We ended up in Wichita after my father 406 00:21:42,335 --> 00:21:43,835 had gotten out of the air force. 407 00:21:43,920 --> 00:21:47,181 He found a job here in Wichita at Cook Airfield. 408 00:21:47,340 --> 00:21:51,018 There were five of us kids in the family. 409 00:21:51,102 --> 00:21:53,512 I was the oldest. 410 00:21:53,596 --> 00:21:56,765 Josie was very artistic, creative. 411 00:21:56,849 --> 00:22:00,018 She wrote poetry, drew a lot of pictures. 412 00:22:00,103 --> 00:22:02,687 Joey was just like a little man. 413 00:22:02,772 --> 00:22:04,523 I mean, he was already a lady-killer, 414 00:22:04,607 --> 00:22:08,026 good-looking, totally athletic. 415 00:22:08,111 --> 00:22:10,278 My mom and dad had this relationship 416 00:22:10,363 --> 00:22:12,280 of unbelievable love. 417 00:22:12,365 --> 00:22:14,375 ♪ ♪ 418 00:22:14,459 --> 00:22:17,119 You know, he adored her. 419 00:22:17,203 --> 00:22:19,121 ♪ ♪ 420 00:22:19,205 --> 00:22:21,623 It's the kind of love you wish you could find. 421 00:22:21,716 --> 00:22:23,634 They lived together, and they died together. 422 00:22:23,718 --> 00:22:26,545 They basically died looking in each other's eyes. 423 00:22:26,629 --> 00:22:29,631 ♪ ♪ 424 00:22:29,715 --> 00:22:32,717 In January of 1974, I was 15 years old. 425 00:22:32,802 --> 00:22:34,136 ♪ ♪ 426 00:22:34,229 --> 00:22:36,397 It had been snowing. 427 00:22:36,556 --> 00:22:38,890 It was the day of testing for school. 428 00:22:38,975 --> 00:22:41,309 I asked my dad to take me to school early that day 429 00:22:41,394 --> 00:22:43,812 so that I could get to that early study hall. 430 00:22:43,896 --> 00:22:47,232 And Danny and Carmen had to go with me 431 00:22:47,316 --> 00:22:49,901 because they were riding with him also. 432 00:22:49,986 --> 00:22:53,155 Took my tests, aced everything. 433 00:22:53,248 --> 00:22:54,164 ♪ ♪ 434 00:22:54,323 --> 00:22:56,575 I was walking home. 435 00:22:56,659 --> 00:22:59,920 Walked over to the back gate, opened it up, 436 00:23:00,079 --> 00:23:01,997 and my dog, Lucky, was outside. 437 00:23:02,090 --> 00:23:04,258 ♪ ♪ 438 00:23:04,342 --> 00:23:07,085 And that was totally not normal. 439 00:23:07,170 --> 00:23:08,345 So I said, "Hey, Lucky, 440 00:23:08,430 --> 00:23:09,421 what are you doing out here, buddy?" 441 00:23:09,505 --> 00:23:10,931 ♪ ♪ 442 00:23:11,090 --> 00:23:14,342 I went to the back door, opened it up... 443 00:23:14,427 --> 00:23:15,760 ♪ ♪ 444 00:23:15,854 --> 00:23:17,855 And I noticed that my mom's purse 445 00:23:18,014 --> 00:23:20,015 was on the stove, flipped up. 446 00:23:20,099 --> 00:23:21,766 ♪ ♪ 447 00:23:21,860 --> 00:23:23,935 So I yelled out, "Is anybody home?" 448 00:23:24,020 --> 00:23:25,279 ♪ ♪ 449 00:23:25,438 --> 00:23:26,605 One of my siblings yelled out, 450 00:23:26,698 --> 00:23:28,023 "Charlie, come back here. 451 00:23:28,116 --> 00:23:30,609 Mom and dad are playing a bad trick on us." 452 00:23:30,702 --> 00:23:32,861 So I ran back down the hall. 453 00:23:32,945 --> 00:23:34,613 ♪ ♪ 454 00:23:34,697 --> 00:23:37,282 I looked and saw my mom laying on the bed. 455 00:23:37,366 --> 00:23:39,626 She was beat up. 456 00:23:39,785 --> 00:23:41,536 My dad had a belt around his neck. 457 00:23:41,621 --> 00:23:42,880 ♪ ♪ 458 00:23:43,039 --> 00:23:44,798 You could smell the death. 459 00:23:44,883 --> 00:23:46,550 You could smell the fear. You could smell all-- 460 00:23:46,634 --> 00:23:49,377 I could--to this day, I can smell fear. 461 00:23:49,471 --> 00:23:50,545 ♪ ♪ 462 00:23:50,638 --> 00:23:53,298 My heart just broke. 463 00:23:53,382 --> 00:23:55,967 It felt like somebody had ripped my chest wide open 464 00:23:56,052 --> 00:23:58,053 and taken--and pulled my heart out. 465 00:23:58,137 --> 00:23:59,980 ♪ ♪ 466 00:24:00,139 --> 00:24:01,815 I told Danny to get on the phone 467 00:24:01,900 --> 00:24:03,225 and call the police. 468 00:24:03,309 --> 00:24:04,651 ♪ ♪ 469 00:24:04,810 --> 00:24:06,228 He yelled that the phone was dead. 470 00:24:06,321 --> 00:24:08,146 ♪ ♪ 471 00:24:08,231 --> 00:24:10,398 So I told Danny to go next door and call the police. 472 00:24:10,483 --> 00:24:12,817 ♪ ♪ 473 00:24:12,911 --> 00:24:14,486 - Crime scene investigators 474 00:24:14,570 --> 00:24:17,915 and detectives from Wichita police showed up. 475 00:24:17,999 --> 00:24:21,001 And the three older Otero children 476 00:24:21,085 --> 00:24:23,921 didn't know where their 11-year-old sister was 477 00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:25,330 and 9-year-old brother. 478 00:24:25,414 --> 00:24:27,341 ♪ ♪ 479 00:24:27,500 --> 00:24:29,927 - When police went through the house, 480 00:24:30,011 --> 00:24:32,921 they also found Joey Jr. 481 00:24:33,005 --> 00:24:35,924 Dead in his bedroom 482 00:24:36,017 --> 00:24:39,761 and Josephine hanged from a pipe in the basement. 483 00:24:39,845 --> 00:24:43,181 ♪ ♪ 484 00:24:43,266 --> 00:24:45,767 - They took us to the police department. 485 00:24:45,851 --> 00:24:48,862 I asked for Joey and Josie. 486 00:24:48,947 --> 00:24:52,699 And finally, a police captain and a chaplain came up to me 487 00:24:52,858 --> 00:24:54,776 and said, "Charlie, we gotta tell you 488 00:24:54,860 --> 00:24:57,621 "that Joey and Josie... 489 00:24:57,780 --> 00:24:59,623 were in the house." 490 00:24:59,707 --> 00:25:02,459 And once again, it felt like they'd ripped my heart out 491 00:25:02,544 --> 00:25:04,119 all over again. 492 00:25:04,203 --> 00:25:06,621 [sobs] 493 00:25:06,706 --> 00:25:09,124 [sighs] 494 00:25:09,208 --> 00:25:10,792 Sorry. 495 00:25:10,876 --> 00:25:16,223 ♪ ♪ 496 00:25:16,307 --> 00:25:19,309 The crime scene investigators noted 497 00:25:19,394 --> 00:25:22,729 that the thermostat had been turned extremely high. 498 00:25:31,314 --> 00:25:32,564 ♪ ♪ 499 00:25:32,657 --> 00:25:34,316 - Rader would often take his ideas 500 00:25:34,400 --> 00:25:39,830 from true-detective magazines or fiction about crimes. 501 00:25:39,914 --> 00:25:44,743 And so he had read if you turn up the thermostat, 502 00:25:44,836 --> 00:25:47,504 it makes bodies decompose faster 503 00:25:47,589 --> 00:25:49,506 and foils the ability 504 00:25:49,665 --> 00:25:53,844 to determine the time of death. 505 00:25:54,003 --> 00:25:57,764 - The lack of items stolen would give you the indication 506 00:25:57,923 --> 00:26:00,601 that the motive behind these killings 507 00:26:00,685 --> 00:26:02,427 was not a home invasion. 508 00:26:02,511 --> 00:26:05,430 It was more for the sexual gratification. 509 00:26:05,514 --> 00:26:07,441 ♪ ♪ 510 00:26:07,525 --> 00:26:11,194 - The police, when they found 11-year-old Josephine 511 00:26:11,354 --> 00:26:12,779 partially clothed, 512 00:26:12,938 --> 00:26:16,524 there was semen on her and around her body. 513 00:26:16,609 --> 00:26:18,360 ♪ ♪ 514 00:26:18,444 --> 00:26:22,864 - DNA was not even on law enforcement radar in the '70s. 515 00:26:22,948 --> 00:26:24,541 And that's one of the remarkable things 516 00:26:24,700 --> 00:26:27,118 about this case is the way the Wichita Police Department 517 00:26:27,203 --> 00:26:29,537 original crime scene folks 518 00:26:29,622 --> 00:26:31,465 collected that evidence and maintained it 519 00:26:31,549 --> 00:26:33,300 so that it was not contaminated 520 00:26:33,384 --> 00:26:35,710 so that it was available for DNA 521 00:26:35,795 --> 00:26:39,381 when DNA came along years later. 522 00:26:39,474 --> 00:26:44,052 - The Otero murders were the first taste of a maniac 523 00:26:44,145 --> 00:26:46,813 that we knew was loose somewhere in Wichita, 524 00:26:46,898 --> 00:26:47,889 somewhere in Kansas. 525 00:26:47,982 --> 00:26:49,307 ♪ ♪ 526 00:26:49,400 --> 00:26:50,901 We thought it was a one-off, 527 00:26:50,985 --> 00:26:53,228 a one-time deal. 528 00:26:53,321 --> 00:26:55,155 We were wrong. 529 00:26:59,827 --> 00:27:01,236 [dramatic music] 530 00:27:01,329 --> 00:27:07,501 - Now we're on our way to what was once the Otero house 531 00:27:07,585 --> 00:27:11,672 where Dennis Rader committed his first murders, 532 00:27:11,756 --> 00:27:13,832 four people in a single family. 533 00:27:13,916 --> 00:27:16,510 ♪ ♪ 534 00:27:16,669 --> 00:27:18,095 - Hi, Doctor. - Hello. How are you? 535 00:27:18,254 --> 00:27:20,597 - Pleasure to meet you. - You too. 536 00:27:20,756 --> 00:27:23,758 Can you tell me something about when you were here that day... 537 00:27:23,843 --> 00:27:25,519 - Sure. - What it was like? 538 00:27:25,603 --> 00:27:29,097 - We had no idea what was going on here at all. 539 00:27:29,181 --> 00:27:30,515 ♪ ♪ 540 00:27:30,599 --> 00:27:32,267 Detectives were running in and out, 541 00:27:32,360 --> 00:27:34,277 and no one would talk to me. 542 00:27:34,362 --> 00:27:35,687 - But you knew them? - I knew them. 543 00:27:35,771 --> 00:27:37,114 - And they knew you. Okay. - Yeah, I knew them. 544 00:27:37,273 --> 00:27:38,523 And I'd go up to them, 545 00:27:38,607 --> 00:27:42,619 and they'd say, "Can't talk now. Busy." 546 00:27:42,778 --> 00:27:46,698 In 1974, I was the chief photographer for KAKE TV. 547 00:27:46,782 --> 00:27:48,792 ♪ ♪ 548 00:27:48,876 --> 00:27:50,535 All the reporters there were trying to get 549 00:27:50,619 --> 00:27:52,287 the police department to say something. 550 00:27:52,371 --> 00:27:55,290 Finally, they said that four people 551 00:27:55,374 --> 00:27:56,958 had died in the house. 552 00:27:57,042 --> 00:27:58,626 ♪ ♪ 553 00:27:58,720 --> 00:28:02,547 Well, that was huge. 554 00:28:02,631 --> 00:28:04,641 Four people dying in a house in Wichita, Kansas? 555 00:28:04,800 --> 00:28:06,393 That just didn't happen. 556 00:28:06,552 --> 00:28:09,471 - The bodies of Joseph Otero, his wife, Julie, 557 00:28:09,564 --> 00:28:12,056 their daughter Josephine, and their son Joseph II 558 00:28:12,150 --> 00:28:14,484 were discovered in their east Wichita home. 559 00:28:14,569 --> 00:28:16,153 The victims had been bound, 560 00:28:16,237 --> 00:28:18,989 gagged, and strangled with a cord. 561 00:28:19,073 --> 00:28:20,991 - The investigators looked shaken, 562 00:28:21,075 --> 00:28:23,744 and it was basically from the children, 563 00:28:23,903 --> 00:28:27,322 what they saw and what had been done to the children. 564 00:28:27,406 --> 00:28:28,823 That would shake anybody. 565 00:28:28,916 --> 00:28:31,242 [siren wailing] 566 00:28:31,327 --> 00:28:33,545 - Do you remember where you spotted her? 567 00:28:37,666 --> 00:28:39,009 ♪ ♪ 568 00:28:59,021 --> 00:29:01,782 ♪ ♪ 569 00:29:01,866 --> 00:29:03,283 - When I talked to Dennis Rader, 570 00:29:03,367 --> 00:29:06,361 he had targeted the wife, not the children. 571 00:29:06,445 --> 00:29:08,613 The children were just collateral damage. 572 00:29:08,697 --> 00:29:10,198 ♪ ♪ 573 00:29:10,282 --> 00:29:13,460 And he said it in such a matter-of-fact way 574 00:29:13,544 --> 00:29:14,702 that was haunting. 575 00:29:14,787 --> 00:29:15,962 ♪ ♪ 576 00:29:23,554 --> 00:29:25,129 - What was your plan? 577 00:29:25,214 --> 00:29:27,474 What did you think you were going to do that day? 578 00:29:38,394 --> 00:29:40,445 ♪ ♪ 579 00:30:12,094 --> 00:30:14,262 ♪ ♪ 580 00:30:14,346 --> 00:30:17,107 - He didn't know that Joseph Otero Sr. 581 00:30:17,266 --> 00:30:19,017 Was not going to work. 582 00:30:19,110 --> 00:30:22,687 He also did not know they had a dog. 583 00:30:22,771 --> 00:30:25,773 All he's thinking about is, he's picked them, 584 00:30:25,858 --> 00:30:28,785 he has a limited time frame in which to act, 585 00:30:28,870 --> 00:30:31,529 and now he must complete the plan. 586 00:30:31,614 --> 00:30:33,031 ♪ ♪ 587 00:30:33,115 --> 00:30:36,960 What we do know about psychopathic killers 588 00:30:37,044 --> 00:30:40,380 is that they tend to overfocus. 589 00:30:40,539 --> 00:30:42,957 So it's as if they're a train on a track 590 00:30:43,042 --> 00:30:44,626 that is not going to stop 591 00:30:44,710 --> 00:30:47,721 till it gets to its goal, no matter what. 592 00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:49,631 - As you talked to Dennis Rader, 593 00:30:49,715 --> 00:30:51,215 did you feel at any point 594 00:30:51,300 --> 00:30:52,893 that he was trying to manipulate you? 595 00:30:53,052 --> 00:30:54,469 - Always. - Yeah. 596 00:30:54,553 --> 00:30:58,640 - But I always knew that's how he operates. 597 00:30:58,724 --> 00:31:00,901 - You've researched all these serial killers. 598 00:31:01,060 --> 00:31:02,810 Do you have dreams? 599 00:31:02,895 --> 00:31:07,065 - I do not, in part, I think, because I do it clinically. 600 00:31:07,149 --> 00:31:09,400 - Do you compartmentalize? - I probably do. 601 00:31:09,493 --> 00:31:11,912 - That's just what Rader said he did. 602 00:31:11,996 --> 00:31:14,572 - He actually has a better word for it: "cubing." 603 00:31:14,657 --> 00:31:17,992 Rader's idea of cubing is that he's the cube 604 00:31:18,085 --> 00:31:20,587 with multiple sides that he can switch in and out 605 00:31:20,671 --> 00:31:23,423 at any given time for whatever is necessary. 606 00:31:23,582 --> 00:31:25,416 But he's still all these other things. 607 00:31:25,501 --> 00:31:26,927 ♪ ♪ 608 00:31:47,523 --> 00:31:48,782 ♪ ♪ 609 00:31:48,941 --> 00:31:51,109 - After Rader had killed four people, 610 00:31:51,193 --> 00:31:52,869 he went home. 611 00:31:52,954 --> 00:31:56,030 He knew that he had to present himself to his wife 612 00:31:56,115 --> 00:31:58,124 as if everything was normal. 613 00:31:58,209 --> 00:32:02,620 So he pulled it together very quickly and managed to act 614 00:32:02,713 --> 00:32:05,548 as if it was just a regular day 615 00:32:05,708 --> 00:32:07,133 and nothing had happened. 616 00:32:07,218 --> 00:32:09,877 And in retrospect, 617 00:32:09,962 --> 00:32:12,797 she didn't see anything different about him. 618 00:32:12,881 --> 00:32:16,467 So he was able to cube very quickly. 619 00:32:16,552 --> 00:32:18,311 ♪ ♪ 620 00:32:18,396 --> 00:32:19,646 - We've been tracking him down... 621 00:32:19,805 --> 00:32:23,141 - Dennis Rader and other serial killers like him 622 00:32:23,225 --> 00:32:27,237 can present themselves in multiple ways, 623 00:32:27,321 --> 00:32:30,064 whatever works for their purposes, 624 00:32:30,157 --> 00:32:32,400 and have no real concern 625 00:32:32,493 --> 00:32:36,070 about any inconsistencies or contradictions, 626 00:32:36,155 --> 00:32:39,249 including moral judgments. 627 00:32:39,408 --> 00:32:44,662 And so yes, he can say he feels shame or remorse. 628 00:32:44,755 --> 00:32:47,999 But that can all be erased immediately 629 00:32:48,092 --> 00:32:51,419 if he's trying to present the face of BTK, 630 00:32:51,503 --> 00:32:53,504 the infamous serial killer. 631 00:32:53,589 --> 00:32:54,848 ♪ ♪ 632 00:32:55,007 --> 00:32:56,591 Did you think you would do it again? 633 00:32:56,675 --> 00:32:58,676 Did you think, "That's it. I'm done. 634 00:32:58,761 --> 00:33:01,271 It's out of my system," or did you think-- 635 00:33:06,602 --> 00:33:07,527 - Okay. 636 00:33:19,782 --> 00:33:20,957 [dramatic music] 637 00:33:21,042 --> 00:33:24,544 - It was horrible for people here in Wichita, 638 00:33:24,703 --> 00:33:27,455 which was pretty much a sleepy little town, 639 00:33:27,539 --> 00:33:28,706 to all of a sudden find 640 00:33:28,799 --> 00:33:31,375 that this major massacre of a family 641 00:33:31,460 --> 00:33:33,711 had happened right here 642 00:33:33,796 --> 00:33:35,388 in our--in our community. 643 00:33:35,547 --> 00:33:36,631 ♪ ♪ 644 00:33:36,715 --> 00:33:39,476 - It was a huge story. 645 00:33:39,560 --> 00:33:42,729 Most people at that time thought it was a drug deal, 646 00:33:42,888 --> 00:33:44,981 because no person in their right mind 647 00:33:45,066 --> 00:33:46,983 would kill a family. 648 00:33:47,142 --> 00:33:49,903 That didn't happen at all. 649 00:33:50,062 --> 00:33:51,154 ♪ ♪ 650 00:33:51,238 --> 00:33:53,147 - Quadruple homicides today 651 00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:56,242 are still rare, thankfully, 652 00:33:56,327 --> 00:33:58,486 but you can imagine how rare they were then 653 00:33:58,570 --> 00:34:00,580 and then the kind of attention that 654 00:34:00,739 --> 00:34:03,157 that kind of a homicide garnered 655 00:34:03,250 --> 00:34:05,251 and the public outrage and the public fear 656 00:34:05,336 --> 00:34:08,088 and the demands that those investigators felt 657 00:34:08,247 --> 00:34:11,925 when lead after lead after lead led them nowhere. 658 00:34:12,084 --> 00:34:14,001 ♪ ♪ 659 00:34:14,086 --> 00:34:16,921 - In 1974, no one in law enforcement 660 00:34:17,014 --> 00:34:20,100 was using the phrase "serial killer." 661 00:34:20,184 --> 00:34:23,511 It would really end up being used later that decade 662 00:34:23,595 --> 00:34:25,680 and into the 1980s. 663 00:34:25,773 --> 00:34:29,851 But nobody really understood what serial murder was about, 664 00:34:29,944 --> 00:34:32,278 in particular stranger murder. 665 00:34:32,437 --> 00:34:34,856 - Fear spread quickly in the community. 666 00:34:34,949 --> 00:34:37,441 People began looking over their shoulders. 667 00:34:37,535 --> 00:34:39,527 Doors and windows were locked tight. 668 00:34:39,620 --> 00:34:41,779 Gun sales skyrocketed. 669 00:34:41,864 --> 00:34:44,791 And the prevailing paranoia was not without good reason. 670 00:34:44,950 --> 00:34:46,209 ♪ ♪ 671 00:34:46,293 --> 00:34:49,036 - The Otero murders changed the life, 672 00:34:49,130 --> 00:34:53,550 I would think, of everybody in the city at that time. 673 00:34:53,634 --> 00:34:55,459 It did in our own household. 674 00:34:55,553 --> 00:34:58,713 We did not lock a door in our house 675 00:34:58,806 --> 00:35:01,307 until January of '74. 676 00:35:01,466 --> 00:35:03,309 ♪ ♪ 677 00:35:03,468 --> 00:35:04,894 - When we were talking to the police detectives 678 00:35:05,053 --> 00:35:06,563 over a series of days 679 00:35:06,722 --> 00:35:07,722 and we were starting to find out what's happened, 680 00:35:07,806 --> 00:35:09,899 it reminded me very much 681 00:35:10,058 --> 00:35:11,642 of the "In Cold Blood" murders 682 00:35:11,727 --> 00:35:14,562 in Holcomb, Kansas, in the '50s. 683 00:35:14,646 --> 00:35:16,489 It reminded me of that because I had been 684 00:35:16,648 --> 00:35:19,901 at the hanging of Richard Hickock and Smith. 685 00:35:19,985 --> 00:35:22,495 ♪ ♪ 686 00:35:22,580 --> 00:35:24,497 - The Clutter family was killed 687 00:35:24,656 --> 00:35:28,668 by a couple of recently released prison inmates 688 00:35:28,752 --> 00:35:30,670 that had been falsely told 689 00:35:30,829 --> 00:35:35,091 that they had a safe full of money at this farm. 690 00:35:35,176 --> 00:35:40,087 The prison inmates decided to pull this home invasion. 691 00:35:40,172 --> 00:35:42,015 Showed up, killed the family, 692 00:35:42,099 --> 00:35:45,509 the four that were present, in cold blood 693 00:35:45,603 --> 00:35:47,270 for just a small amount of money and a radio, 694 00:35:47,429 --> 00:35:48,354 a transistor radio. 695 00:35:48,513 --> 00:35:50,014 ♪ ♪ 696 00:35:50,098 --> 00:35:53,601 - When news of the Clutter murders rocked Kansas, 697 00:35:53,685 --> 00:35:55,862 it made a deep impression on Rader. 698 00:35:56,021 --> 00:35:58,364 ♪ ♪ 699 00:35:58,449 --> 00:36:01,492 You did hear that on the radio when it happened? 700 00:36:03,946 --> 00:36:05,371 ♪ ♪ 701 00:36:26,718 --> 00:36:29,145 - Dennis Rader was especially interested in the fact 702 00:36:29,304 --> 00:36:33,224 that they had been bound with rope before being killed, 703 00:36:33,317 --> 00:36:37,153 because he himself loved the feel of ropes 704 00:36:37,312 --> 00:36:38,988 around his waist. 705 00:36:39,147 --> 00:36:42,158 And also, in his fantasies, 706 00:36:42,243 --> 00:36:45,736 he would be using rope to bind his victims. 707 00:36:45,821 --> 00:36:48,906 So the fact that the Clutter family 708 00:36:48,991 --> 00:36:52,168 had been bound with rope appealed to him. 709 00:37:01,845 --> 00:37:05,181 - After Rader murdered the Oteros, 710 00:37:05,340 --> 00:37:07,600 he took a radio 711 00:37:07,759 --> 00:37:11,104 as if to establish some link of solidarity 712 00:37:11,188 --> 00:37:14,932 to the Clutter killers, who also had taken a radio. 713 00:37:15,017 --> 00:37:16,267 ♪ ♪ 714 00:37:16,351 --> 00:37:19,854 Rader aspired to become a serial killer. 715 00:37:19,938 --> 00:37:23,357 So that meant he needed to study them 716 00:37:23,442 --> 00:37:26,360 in order to figure it out. 717 00:37:26,453 --> 00:37:31,032 I think most serial killers are not very creative 718 00:37:31,116 --> 00:37:32,533 or bright about what they're doing. 719 00:37:32,626 --> 00:37:34,368 And they do tend to read 720 00:37:34,453 --> 00:37:38,706 what other killers like themselves have done. 721 00:37:38,790 --> 00:37:42,468 And yet Rader, I think, took that to an extreme, 722 00:37:42,627 --> 00:37:45,796 where most of what he did or thought about 723 00:37:45,889 --> 00:37:48,466 had been done before by someone else. 724 00:37:48,559 --> 00:37:52,136 He really was not that creative. 725 00:37:52,220 --> 00:37:53,888 And in order to become 726 00:37:53,972 --> 00:37:56,816 the serial killer he aspired to be, 727 00:37:56,900 --> 00:38:00,644 after the Oteros, he had to kill again. 728 00:38:00,729 --> 00:38:02,989 ♪ ♪ 729 00:38:07,652 --> 00:38:09,329 - After the Oteros, 730 00:38:09,413 --> 00:38:13,333 the Kathryn Bright murder wasn't very long afterward. 731 00:38:13,492 --> 00:38:15,418 Didn't you think that was risky? 732 00:38:47,117 --> 00:38:50,528 - At this point, he was going about his life 733 00:38:50,612 --> 00:38:53,614 as a student at Wichita State University 734 00:38:53,707 --> 00:38:57,785 and a husband and hoping to start a family. 735 00:38:57,878 --> 00:39:00,121 - It takes a different type of mentality 736 00:39:00,205 --> 00:39:03,383 to commit a crime during daylight hours-- 737 00:39:03,467 --> 00:39:07,553 More confidence and the ability to blend in-- 738 00:39:07,638 --> 00:39:09,797 Than it would to work under the cover of darkness. 739 00:39:09,890 --> 00:39:12,383 So that tells you a little bit about the mentality 740 00:39:12,467 --> 00:39:14,969 and the planning that was going into these crimes. 741 00:39:15,053 --> 00:39:18,556 - When you had picked out Kathryn Bright, 742 00:39:18,649 --> 00:39:21,484 how long did--how long did you watch her 743 00:39:21,643 --> 00:39:23,736 before you decided to act? 744 00:39:39,744 --> 00:39:41,829 ♪ ♪ 745 00:39:41,913 --> 00:39:44,748 - Kathryn Bright was a 21-year-old girl 746 00:39:44,833 --> 00:39:47,084 who lived alone. 747 00:39:47,169 --> 00:39:50,004 She had a brother who was 19 who lived in Valley Center. 748 00:39:50,097 --> 00:39:51,589 ♪ ♪ 749 00:39:51,673 --> 00:39:53,841 One night, he spent the night with his sister 750 00:39:53,925 --> 00:39:55,759 so they could go shopping the next morning, 751 00:39:55,844 --> 00:39:57,344 and they got up, and they went shopping. 752 00:39:57,438 --> 00:39:58,512 ♪ ♪ 753 00:39:58,597 --> 00:40:00,514 A normal day at that point. 754 00:40:00,607 --> 00:40:02,349 ♪ ♪ 755 00:40:02,443 --> 00:40:05,769 - BTK prided himself on meticulous planning, 756 00:40:05,863 --> 00:40:06,946 or at least he thought he did. 757 00:40:07,105 --> 00:40:08,355 ♪ ♪ 758 00:40:08,440 --> 00:40:10,116 He knew who Kathryn Bright was. 759 00:40:10,275 --> 00:40:12,952 He had monitored her for a while. 760 00:40:13,111 --> 00:40:15,288 But he was not expecting a brother. 761 00:40:15,447 --> 00:40:16,780 ♪ ♪ 762 00:40:16,874 --> 00:40:18,458 Well, the brother came in, 763 00:40:18,542 --> 00:40:22,286 and BTK had to do something with the brother, 764 00:40:22,370 --> 00:40:25,456 because the brother was immediate threat. 765 00:40:25,540 --> 00:40:28,209 - He tied me up, had me tie my sister up, 766 00:40:28,302 --> 00:40:31,137 and he separated us into separate bedrooms. 767 00:40:31,221 --> 00:40:35,883 And he came back in and was gonna strangle me to death. 768 00:40:35,976 --> 00:40:38,969 And I broke loose the bonds he had me tied up with 769 00:40:39,054 --> 00:40:41,472 and jumped up and fought him for the gun. 770 00:40:41,556 --> 00:40:42,973 ♪ ♪ 771 00:40:43,066 --> 00:40:44,567 He jerked it away from me, 772 00:40:44,651 --> 00:40:47,153 and then he shot me the first time in the head. 773 00:40:47,237 --> 00:40:50,064 And I went down, and then he thought I was dead. 774 00:40:50,157 --> 00:40:51,565 ♪ ♪ 775 00:40:51,650 --> 00:40:54,818 - This was not in BTK's plan at all. 776 00:40:54,903 --> 00:40:57,154 He was there to kill Kathryn Bright 777 00:40:57,247 --> 00:40:59,240 and to do all of the torturous things 778 00:40:59,324 --> 00:41:01,167 that he did to Kathryn Bright. 779 00:41:01,251 --> 00:41:03,077 A brother? That wasn't in the plan. 780 00:41:03,170 --> 00:41:05,079 ♪ ♪ 781 00:41:05,163 --> 00:41:07,081 - So a second fight entails. 782 00:41:07,165 --> 00:41:08,666 He once again shoots him, 783 00:41:08,759 --> 00:41:11,010 thinks he's killed him, and goes back 784 00:41:11,094 --> 00:41:12,836 to attack Kathryn once more time. 785 00:41:12,921 --> 00:41:14,764 And next thing he heard was the front door open, 786 00:41:14,923 --> 00:41:16,349 and Kevin's running away. 787 00:41:16,508 --> 00:41:18,267 So he knew his time was limited. 788 00:41:18,426 --> 00:41:20,770 So he didn't get to do everything he wanted to do. 789 00:41:20,929 --> 00:41:23,689 He said he knew he had to kill her and just move on, 790 00:41:23,774 --> 00:41:24,932 so he stabbed her. 791 00:41:25,025 --> 00:41:26,526 ♪ ♪ 792 00:41:39,289 --> 00:41:41,707 - But as soon as he had stabbed Kathryn Bright, 793 00:41:41,866 --> 00:41:44,535 he realized this was not what he wanted to do. 794 00:41:44,619 --> 00:41:47,296 What he liked was to strangle people, 795 00:41:47,381 --> 00:41:49,632 to bind them and strangle them. 796 00:41:49,716 --> 00:41:51,709 Stabbing was not in the picture, 797 00:41:51,802 --> 00:41:53,886 and never again did he use it. 798 00:41:54,045 --> 00:41:55,388 ♪ ♪ 799 00:42:09,894 --> 00:42:12,488 ♪ ♪ 800 00:42:12,647 --> 00:42:16,576 - When did you first feel like you were a serial killer? 801 00:42:23,500 --> 00:42:26,410 - Now that Rader had murdered people 802 00:42:26,503 --> 00:42:29,079 in two separate incidents 803 00:42:29,164 --> 00:42:31,582 in unrelated locations, 804 00:42:31,666 --> 00:42:34,343 he instinctively knew he was among 805 00:42:34,502 --> 00:42:37,513 the rare group of killers that grabbed headlines. 806 00:42:37,672 --> 00:42:39,757 - Motiveless, random killings, 807 00:42:39,841 --> 00:42:42,009 sometimes thousands of miles apart. 808 00:42:42,102 --> 00:42:43,853 A Justice Department investigator calls it 809 00:42:44,012 --> 00:42:46,188 terrifying, an epidemic. 810 00:42:46,273 --> 00:42:47,848 They're known as serial killers. 811 00:42:47,941 --> 00:42:49,683 And according to law enforcement officials, 812 00:42:49,768 --> 00:42:51,277 there are at least 35 of them 813 00:42:51,436 --> 00:42:54,355 roaming the country now, stalking victims. 814 00:42:54,439 --> 00:42:57,700 - Dennis Rader had aspired to become a serial killer. 815 00:42:57,859 --> 00:42:59,869 And with these murders, 816 00:43:00,028 --> 00:43:02,196 he had become BTK. 817 00:43:02,289 --> 00:43:07,209 ♪ ♪ 818 00:43:07,369 --> 00:43:09,462 He loved murder. 819 00:43:09,621 --> 00:43:13,549 He loved the idea that he was a serial killer. 820 00:43:13,634 --> 00:43:16,218 Why did you like hanging cats? 821 00:43:19,714 --> 00:43:22,049 - Although he looked normal on the outside, 822 00:43:22,142 --> 00:43:24,051 it just gives you a glimpse of the monster 823 00:43:24,135 --> 00:43:25,645 that was living inside him. 824 00:43:28,973 --> 00:43:31,734 - We have no solid leads at all. 825 00:43:31,893 --> 00:43:34,987 - That was like an atomic bomb going off in the city. 826 00:43:35,072 --> 00:43:37,731 "How many people do I have to kill 827 00:43:37,816 --> 00:43:39,650 "before I get my name in the paper? 828 00:43:39,734 --> 00:43:44,246 BTK." 63950

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