All language subtitles for The.Man.Who.Knew.Too.Much.2020.WEBRip.x264-ION10

af Afrikaans
sq Albanian
am Amharic
ar Arabic
hy Armenian
az Azerbaijani
eu Basque
be Belarusian
bn Bengali
bs Bosnian
bg Bulgarian
ca Catalan
ceb Cebuano
ny Chichewa
zh-CN Chinese (Simplified)
zh-TW Chinese (Traditional)
co Corsican
hr Croatian
cs Czech
da Danish
nl Dutch
en English
eo Esperanto
et Estonian
tl Filipino
fi Finnish
fr French
fy Frisian
gl Galician
ka Georgian
de German
el Greek
gu Gujarati
ht Haitian Creole
ha Hausa
haw Hawaiian
iw Hebrew
hi Hindi
hmn Hmong
hu Hungarian
is Icelandic
ig Igbo
id Indonesian
ga Irish
it Italian
ja Japanese
jw Javanese
kn Kannada
kk Kazakh
km Khmer
ko Korean
ku Kurdish (Kurmanji)
ky Kyrgyz
lo Lao
la Latin
lv Latvian
lt Lithuanian
lb Luxembourgish
mk Macedonian
mg Malagasy
ms Malay
ml Malayalam
mt Maltese
mi Maori
mr Marathi
mn Mongolian
my Myanmar (Burmese)
ne Nepali
no Norwegian
ps Pashto
fa Persian
pl Polish
pt Portuguese
pa Punjabi
ro Romanian
ru Russian
sm Samoan
gd Scots Gaelic
sr Serbian
st Sesotho
sn Shona
sd Sindhi
si Sinhala
sk Slovak
sl Slovenian
so Somali
es Spanish
su Sundanese
sw Swahili
sv Swedish
tg Tajik
ta Tamil
te Telugu
th Thai
tr Turkish
uk Ukrainian
ur Urdu
uz Uzbek
vi Vietnamese
cy Welsh
xh Xhosa
yi Yiddish
yo Yoruba
zu Zulu
or Odia (Oriya)
rw Kinyarwanda
tk Turkmen
tt Tatar
ug Uyghur
Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:01,240 --> 00:00:08,240 "The role of the press is to hold power to account." 2 00:00:12,440 --> 00:00:16,496 Mr. Wallace who is presently serving 10 years for manslaughter in an English jail 3 00:00:16,520 --> 00:00:19,160 was known to have links with British Intelligence. 4 00:00:22,080 --> 00:00:24,520 Wallace claimed he was an Intelligence Officer. 5 00:00:24,800 --> 00:00:29,760 Wallace alleges he became involved in a black propaganda campaign by the security services. 6 00:00:30,680 --> 00:00:34,040 There was no evidence to support the claims of Mr. Colin Wallace. 7 00:00:34,120 --> 00:00:39,360 Until anybody can produce proper evidence there is no need to have an inquiry. 8 00:00:43,240 --> 00:00:47,776 Colin Wallace had fractured Mr. Lewis’ skull with a karate style blow 9 00:00:47,800 --> 00:00:51,200 after he was accused of having an affair with Mr. Lewis’ wife. 10 00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:54,376 He hid his friend’s body in the boot of his car 11 00:00:54,400 --> 00:00:56,400 and later dumped it in the river Arun. 12 00:00:56,720 --> 00:01:00,280 He says he was the victim of an MI5 dirty tricks campaign. 13 00:01:06,320 --> 00:01:10,960 The Man Who Knew Too Much 14 00:01:15,640 --> 00:01:21,600 Northern Ireland 1969: Violence erupts between Protestants loyal to the British Crown and Catholics. 15 00:01:21,980 --> 00:01:26,176 Information Policy: An information warfare department is established inside the 16 00:01:26,200 --> 00:01:31,756 British Army’s Northern Ireland headquarters at Lisburn, comprising Army psychological warfare and 17 00:01:31,780 --> 00:01:36,976 the Information Research Department (IRD), a clandestine department in the British Foreign Office. 18 00:01:37,000 --> 00:01:43,696 The IRD as a Foreign Office department had to justify their position 19 00:01:43,720 --> 00:01:47,816 in Northern Ireland and they justified it by emphasizing 20 00:01:47,840 --> 00:01:53,120 the international links of the IRA. By saying this is to do with Ireland, this is to do with the Communists 21 00:01:53,360 --> 00:01:58,000 and oddly this is to do with the Vatican City as well, playing up the Catholic angle. 22 00:01:58,560 --> 00:02:02,056 The IRD tended to work through newspapers. 23 00:02:02,080 --> 00:02:06,960 They would draft articles in London and then 24 00:02:07,200 --> 00:02:11,936 distribute them through friendly journalists to slip into foreign newspapers. 25 00:02:11,960 --> 00:02:14,056 They worked with publishing houses, 26 00:02:14,080 --> 00:02:17,976 where they would write some book about communism 27 00:02:18,000 --> 00:02:23,600 and then it would be distributed or published through a private commercial company. 28 00:02:23,880 --> 00:02:28,960 Hugh Mooney of the IRD was sent as an adviser to Information Policy. 29 00:02:29,280 --> 00:02:33,240 Northern Ireland was the most surveyed country in the world. 30 00:02:33,720 --> 00:02:36,320 Every citizen probably had a file, 31 00:02:37,080 --> 00:02:41,280 every household was under surveillance. Down to minute things, like, 32 00:02:42,080 --> 00:02:43,320 extra pint of milk, 33 00:02:44,760 --> 00:02:47,720 just bought a new TV where has the money come from, like that. 34 00:02:48,360 --> 00:02:55,120 Colin Wallace, a 27-year-old press officer was asked to assist the psychological warfare unit. 35 00:02:56,200 --> 00:03:02,136 Because I grew up in Northern Ireland, because I knew a lot of the background, I was then asked to 36 00:03:02,160 --> 00:03:08,480 explain some of the significance in terms of emblems, in terms of labels and so on so forth. 37 00:03:09,000 --> 00:03:11,640 I was really bringing into the PsyOps team 38 00:03:12,240 --> 00:03:16,920 the Irish dimension as it were, in terms of history, emotion, symbols, sounds. 39 00:03:17,640 --> 00:03:21,136 Maurice Tugwell the head of the Army’s psychological warfare school 40 00:03:21,160 --> 00:03:24,856 and a veteran of Britain’s colonial counter-insurgency campaigns 41 00:03:24,880 --> 00:03:27,040 commanded the PsyOps unit. 42 00:03:27,600 --> 00:03:31,736 Maurice Tugwell believed that, "all information agencies in Northern Ireland 43 00:03:31,760 --> 00:03:33,440 should speak with one voice:" 44 00:03:33,720 --> 00:03:37,960 any organization critical of British policy was an IRA front. 45 00:03:40,120 --> 00:03:44,240 Information Policy, PsyOps was a highly sensitive activity 46 00:03:44,760 --> 00:03:52,560 and it really needed some form of cover, that gave its officers access to the public and the press. 47 00:03:53,120 --> 00:03:58,440 Information Policy was in the same building, on the same corridor, as the press office. 48 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:03,440 So, a visiting journalist going down the corridor to the press office 49 00:04:03,960 --> 00:04:09,600 would almost see the whole corridor as part of army public relations. 50 00:04:09,960 --> 00:04:15,480 Where as a key part of that had no bearing on public relations per se. 51 00:04:16,640 --> 00:04:23,640 On the 9th of August 1971 the British government approved the internment of dissidents without trial. 52 00:04:24,000 --> 00:04:30,200 Many of those imprisoned were not terrorists, but civil rights activists and Irish nationalists. 53 00:04:31,440 --> 00:04:34,880 The perception at that stage was a bad one globally. 54 00:04:35,240 --> 00:04:36,240 And of course, 55 00:04:36,280 --> 00:04:42,280 the IRA were very good from PsyOps point of view, they used that to make Britain look bad. 56 00:04:44,160 --> 00:04:47,240 Reports of torture surfaced in the Irish press. 57 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:50,600 Where there were allegations of brutality, 58 00:04:51,120 --> 00:04:56,680 the Information Policy unit planted with selected journalists 59 00:04:57,080 --> 00:05:02,960 the fact that the techniques used by the security forces 60 00:05:03,160 --> 00:05:06,816 in questioning detainees were actually less 61 00:05:06,840 --> 00:05:10,496 demanding than the techniques we used on our own soldiers 62 00:05:10,520 --> 00:05:13,736 when we were teaching them how to avoid 63 00:05:13,760 --> 00:05:16,960 or deal with interrogation if they were captured by the enemy. 64 00:05:18,280 --> 00:05:24,280 Stories of torture and arbitrary imprisonment without trial fanned feelings of historical injustice 65 00:05:25,120 --> 00:05:28,560 and with that the popularity of the IRA increased. 66 00:05:29,000 --> 00:05:31,640 The violence from all sides escalated. 67 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:38,800 In 1972, 479 people were killed and almost 5000 injured. 68 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:44,680 Each day the psychological operations team would look at 69 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:47,720 the violence of the past 24 hours. 70 00:05:48,040 --> 00:05:52,816 Some activities would require a quick response, we needed to do something that day. 71 00:05:52,840 --> 00:05:57,120 But sometimes there were themes developing, that 72 00:05:57,400 --> 00:06:02,840 for example some type of terrorist activity was creating a problem 73 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:07,000 and therefore we would have to take a more strategic look at that. 74 00:06:07,880 --> 00:06:12,640 A theme was a broad issue that Information Policy identified as a concern. 75 00:06:13,160 --> 00:06:18,040 Major themes included community support for paramilitary organizations, 76 00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:20,896 who were portrayed as organized criminal groups 77 00:06:20,920 --> 00:06:24,020 that intimidated and exploited local communities. 78 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:30,760 Information Policy attempted to spread uncertainty and conflict in target groups. 79 00:06:31,320 --> 00:06:35,240 The international perception of the conflict was another major theme. 80 00:06:35,680 --> 00:06:38,456 Themes were used to color events with a message 81 00:06:38,480 --> 00:06:42,880 that supported Information Policy’s long term PsyOps campaigns. 82 00:06:46,600 --> 00:06:50,096 When journalists visited or phoned the Army Press Office, 83 00:06:50,120 --> 00:06:53,760 they would be passed through to Colin Wallace and his colleagues. 84 00:06:54,320 --> 00:06:58,720 We then from a PsyOps point of view either had an agreed 85 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:04,840 position which we would take on this, feeding in the various themes that we wanted to put across. 86 00:07:05,240 --> 00:07:11,960 Or in certain cases we had a number of journalists who were much more 87 00:07:12,080 --> 00:07:19,080 pro the role of the armed forces in Northern Ireland and we would then call them direct 88 00:07:19,320 --> 00:07:22,840 and explain the background that we wanted to put across. 89 00:07:25,160 --> 00:07:29,296 The propaganda was deliberately designed to create conflict, 90 00:07:29,320 --> 00:07:35,936 to disorientate the IRA to unnerve them and to again to separate them 91 00:07:35,960 --> 00:07:43,160 from the community whose support they needed in order to remain a viable organization. 92 00:07:44,680 --> 00:07:47,240 We discovered at one stage they were using 93 00:07:48,680 --> 00:07:53,920 nitrobenzene to mix with fertilizer to make their bombs more effective. 94 00:07:54,680 --> 00:07:59,480 We discovered that nitrobenzene had a carcinogenic quality 95 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:02,376 and therefore there was a real danger 96 00:08:02,400 --> 00:08:06,400 that people mixing these explosives unless they were protected properly 97 00:08:06,920 --> 00:08:10,480 were likely to develop cancer at a later stage. 98 00:08:10,800 --> 00:08:12,880 This was a scientific fact. But 99 00:08:13,400 --> 00:08:17,040 exactly how much exposure etcetera we had no idea. 100 00:08:17,520 --> 00:08:21,400 But because there were sufficient scientific hooks with that, 101 00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:25,040 we circulated that information to the press. 102 00:08:25,560 --> 00:08:31,040 And the good thing about it was lots of experts from the scientific world 103 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:37,920 agreed with the conclusion, that nitrobenzene was a carcinogenic. 104 00:08:38,560 --> 00:08:43,456 Newspapers picked up the story and quoted an anonymous army spokesperson, 105 00:08:43,480 --> 00:08:45,776 who was none other than Colin Wallace, 106 00:08:45,800 --> 00:08:50,336 who claimed that "symptoms of nitro poisoning are difficult to spot. 107 00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:54,136 By the time they are visible it is too late to treat the victim. 108 00:08:54,160 --> 00:08:58,920 Vomiting and a coma follow and later the glands and liver break down." 109 00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:04,736 The Guardian reported: "Children finding it stored in a derelict house 110 00:09:04,760 --> 00:09:09,600 or people forced to store it by the Provisionals could suffer from the poisoning." 111 00:09:11,560 --> 00:09:15,216 On occasion bombs would go off prematurely 112 00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:19,000 and quite often the people transporting the bomb would be killed. 113 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:24,680 And where we got a bomb going off prematurely, although we knew the reason 114 00:09:25,720 --> 00:09:28,440 from the subsequent examination of the device 115 00:09:28,800 --> 00:09:31,016 why it had gone off prematurely, 116 00:09:31,040 --> 00:09:36,160 we would quite often try to shift the reason for that onto something else. 117 00:09:38,680 --> 00:09:44,920 In campaigns of a political nature army PsyOps worked with Hugh Mooney of the IRD. 118 00:09:45,280 --> 00:09:53,280 One of the themes the IRD used in its propaganda was trying to link the IRA to the Soviet Union 119 00:09:53,540 --> 00:09:55,560 and the broader communist 120 00:09:56,900 --> 00:09:58,400 threat. 121 00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:05,440 And so one of their plans involved telling journalists or leaking a story 122 00:10:05,560 --> 00:10:08,056 that Soviet submarines 123 00:10:08,080 --> 00:10:14,560 were dropping subversives, who had been trained by the KGB, off the coast of Ireland. 124 00:10:15,240 --> 00:10:20,936 IRD acquired at one stage some photographs that the Royal Air Force had taken 125 00:10:20,960 --> 00:10:24,640 of a Soviet submarine off the coast of Scotland. 126 00:10:24,840 --> 00:10:31,840 A dossier was then built up by IRD, creating a credible story that 127 00:10:32,560 --> 00:10:35,056 this submarine which then 128 00:10:35,080 --> 00:10:40,120 had moved off the coast of Donegal rather than Scotland, from the story point of view, 129 00:10:40,520 --> 00:10:41,577 that this was 130 00:10:41,601 --> 00:10:46,240 clear evidence that the Soviets were directly involved in the violence in Northern Ireland. 131 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:52,016 So IRD set up a meeting with the News of the World in London. 132 00:10:52,040 --> 00:10:55,216 We took across photographs, various other documents 133 00:10:55,240 --> 00:10:58,600 and material to substantiate the story. 134 00:10:58,920 --> 00:11:04,000 This was given to the News of the World, who ran it as a front page lead. 135 00:11:05,040 --> 00:11:10,960 It was a huge story and it got wide circulation again around the world. 136 00:11:12,960 --> 00:11:17,440 Hugh Mooney identified himself to the journalist as a member of the Foreign Office. 137 00:11:17,720 --> 00:11:21,816 The Foreign Office was a cover for the activities of IRD 138 00:11:21,840 --> 00:11:26,056 and therefore he was listed as a senior member of the Foreign Office 139 00:11:26,080 --> 00:11:32,080 and that is how they knew that he was a genuine official. 140 00:11:35,920 --> 00:11:41,240 We would try to manipulate the terrorist organization simply by information. 141 00:11:41,440 --> 00:11:46,256 Just to delay and get them to lose faith in what they were doing. 142 00:11:46,280 --> 00:11:50,680 But at the other end of the scale there may be a technical intervention, where 143 00:11:50,960 --> 00:11:54,616 again one would try to get 144 00:11:54,640 --> 00:12:00,000 for example a weapon to misfire or to explode or something of that nature. 145 00:12:00,240 --> 00:12:07,240 On one occasion the IRA was struggling with using heavier weapons such as bazookas. 146 00:12:07,440 --> 00:12:11,976 And it turned out that they were using them with the safety cap still on. 147 00:12:12,000 --> 00:12:17,080 The IRD decided to conceal this explanation and instead 148 00:12:18,320 --> 00:12:25,320 issue a dummy army order suggesting that the shells be tested electronically. 149 00:12:26,000 --> 00:12:27,697 The IRD hoped 150 00:12:27,721 --> 00:12:33,360 that this would result in explosions going off in the hands of IRA members. 151 00:12:33,760 --> 00:12:39,816 In Northern Ireland, a clandestine unit, the Military Reaction Force, dressed up as civilians 152 00:12:39,840 --> 00:12:43,680 and injured and killed numerous Catholics in drive by shootings. 153 00:12:44,680 --> 00:12:47,736 Information Policy would point out to journalists 154 00:12:47,760 --> 00:12:51,616 that the weapons used were those that the paramilitary groups carried. 155 00:12:51,640 --> 00:12:56,280 As a result, the press attributed the attacks to the paramilitary groups. 156 00:12:56,920 --> 00:12:59,356 In one incident the police discovered 157 00:12:59,380 --> 00:13:02,380 that an undercover army unit had injured a group of people 158 00:13:02,460 --> 00:13:06,356 at a bus stop in a drive by shooting on the Glen Road in Belfast. 159 00:13:06,680 --> 00:13:09,160 The police wanted to press charges. 160 00:13:09,560 --> 00:13:13,816 PsyOps dissuaded the police by threatening to reveal that the ammunition used 161 00:13:13,840 --> 00:13:16,520 had been given to the army by the police. 162 00:13:20,120 --> 00:13:24,096 Information Policy established close relationships with journalists 163 00:13:24,120 --> 00:13:25,817 and their publications. 164 00:13:25,841 --> 00:13:28,166 The whole thing is about knowing the target audience 165 00:13:28,190 --> 00:13:30,316 but also knowing the journalists as well. 166 00:13:30,340 --> 00:13:32,876 Sometimes you know the relationship was 167 00:13:33,500 --> 00:13:36,640 very good and it was almost at a humorous level. 168 00:13:36,740 --> 00:13:41,556 And journalists might ring me up, say "look Colin I'm quoting you as saying this," 169 00:13:41,880 --> 00:13:43,137 and I would say: "but I didn't say that," 170 00:13:43,161 --> 00:13:45,576 and they said "I know but we knew you would say that." 171 00:13:45,600 --> 00:13:47,537 And it was at that level, and unless 172 00:13:47,561 --> 00:13:51,720 that quote was really way off mark, I would be quite happy with that. 173 00:13:53,040 --> 00:13:56,816 99% of the work I was doing was un-attributable, 174 00:13:56,840 --> 00:13:59,776 and then you also have off-the-record information, which 175 00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:02,616 you know, journalists would know but couldn't actually 176 00:14:02,640 --> 00:14:08,176 report on. So literally that would just be built into their story 177 00:14:08,200 --> 00:14:10,976 without any reference to where it came from. 178 00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:14,377 Professional journalists are very good, because they realized 179 00:14:14,401 --> 00:14:19,016 that if they didn't actually stick by what was a journalistic agreement after all, 180 00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:23,080 then probably we would not cooperate with them in the same way in the future. 181 00:14:23,760 --> 00:14:27,720 How important was it for PsyOps to be believable? 182 00:14:28,760 --> 00:14:34,640 The press quite often said that PsyOps was largely about propaganda and 183 00:14:34,960 --> 00:14:36,377 using disinformation. 184 00:14:36,401 --> 00:14:40,976 But in the vast majority of cases we were working on real intelligence. 185 00:14:41,000 --> 00:14:45,160 See, real intelligence is much more powerful, because 186 00:14:45,360 --> 00:14:48,016 when the terrorists check out their own sources 187 00:14:48,040 --> 00:14:51,280 it has to be credible. They have to be able to stand it out. 188 00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:54,736 If they can show it is false, then of course it is a waste of time 189 00:14:54,760 --> 00:14:56,776 and really does not go anywhere. 190 00:14:56,800 --> 00:15:00,520 So most of the material that we used, the most effective stuff, 191 00:15:00,880 --> 00:15:03,640 was genuine intelligence, 192 00:15:03,760 --> 00:15:05,200 and had to be credible 193 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:10,800 not just from a journalist point of view, but it had to also be credible from a terrorist point of view. 194 00:15:17,000 --> 00:15:19,800 On the 5th of August 1973, 195 00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:23,300 an article in the Belfast Sunday News reported 196 00:15:23,500 --> 00:15:26,400 that sheep had been sacrificed in a black magic ritual 197 00:15:26,500 --> 00:15:29,680 on Copeland Island Beach North East of Belfast. 198 00:15:30,160 --> 00:15:33,720 It was a front-page headline in the Sunday News, which lots of people read. 199 00:15:33,920 --> 00:15:38,680 The story was that sheep had been ritually killed and mutilated, that was the story, 200 00:15:39,160 --> 00:15:43,120 and that it was Satanists who had done this. 201 00:15:43,400 --> 00:15:46,616 As a would-be anthropologist, an undergraduate at the time, 202 00:15:46,640 --> 00:15:49,680 it tweaked my interests and I 203 00:15:50,080 --> 00:15:54,120 began to pay attention as other news stories appeared in other the local papers. 204 00:15:54,880 --> 00:15:58,260 The more I looked the more I found and I began to be really surprised 205 00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:03,600 at the degree to which this had been a local news paper story in Northern Ireland. 206 00:16:06,640 --> 00:16:08,720 From August 1973, 207 00:16:09,120 --> 00:16:11,256 stories of witchcraft and black magic 208 00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:14,400 began to surface in many local newspapers. 209 00:16:14,800 --> 00:16:17,920 The first thing that I had to do was try and understand 210 00:16:18,320 --> 00:16:21,616 what witchcraft would look like. 211 00:16:21,640 --> 00:16:26,496 We had no idea so I bought a book on the subject. 212 00:16:26,520 --> 00:16:28,177 Then the whole idea 213 00:16:28,201 --> 00:16:31,480 of the sacrifice of animals or whatever it might have been, 214 00:16:31,720 --> 00:16:36,360 we got blood from the cook house from the army cook house 215 00:16:36,640 --> 00:16:38,760 and we would scatter that over the 216 00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:41,720 makeshift altars that were there. 217 00:16:42,040 --> 00:16:44,736 Some of that material then we left 218 00:16:44,760 --> 00:16:49,720 and it would be discovered by local people and then eventually 219 00:16:50,420 --> 00:16:52,456 they would talk about it to the press and 220 00:16:52,480 --> 00:16:56,800 gradually the story built up and build up over a period of months. 221 00:16:57,360 --> 00:17:00,320 This was a way of really 222 00:17:00,800 --> 00:17:04,640 getting the interest of the press, getting rumors going around and therefore 223 00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:07,760 doing the things that we really wanted to happen. 224 00:17:10,360 --> 00:17:15,440 The ritual sites were often located in old graveyards and abandoned properties. 225 00:17:15,720 --> 00:17:16,920 You have to remember 226 00:17:17,520 --> 00:17:22,520 that this was a time in Northern Ireland when all kinds of unusual things were happening. 227 00:17:23,120 --> 00:17:27,976 Assassinations were a very regular thing, some of them were particularly bloody and brutal. 228 00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:33,560 Torture, mutilation, using knives and blades and things like that. 229 00:17:33,800 --> 00:17:38,560 People were talking about ritual murders and all kinds of things. So, 230 00:17:39,200 --> 00:17:41,736 all of a sudden all of the moral certainties 231 00:17:41,760 --> 00:17:43,960 no longer seemed to be quite just as certain. 232 00:17:45,360 --> 00:17:49,160 Information Policy sent fake Readers’ Letters to the local press 233 00:17:49,360 --> 00:17:50,960 to help fan the rumours. 234 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:58,920 Quite often on different subjects we would write to local newspapers 235 00:18:00,600 --> 00:18:03,560 drawing attention to something or criticizing something 236 00:18:03,640 --> 00:18:07,360 and then the newspaper would publish that. It would 237 00:18:07,440 --> 00:18:11,240 usually be about a local issue and it was very much done at that local Level. 238 00:18:11,520 --> 00:18:14,656 But then we would pick up the publication of those letters and 239 00:18:14,680 --> 00:18:18,280 we would then circulate those letters more to the national press, 240 00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:23,400 to reflect what would be portrayed as local views. 241 00:18:26,960 --> 00:18:28,240 Don't forget that 242 00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:33,240 we were not just influencing the press. The press is only one way of influencing the public. 243 00:18:33,360 --> 00:18:36,920 We had to be able to influence all sorts of other people who were 244 00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:43,360 you know communicating with the public. 245 00:18:43,920 --> 00:18:45,280 The churches then 246 00:18:45,560 --> 00:18:49,200 in the 70s had much more influence of course than they have today 247 00:18:49,760 --> 00:18:53,960 and therefore this involvement of witchcraft was quite important. 248 00:18:54,360 --> 00:18:57,000 The key thing we wanted the Protestant, 249 00:18:57,160 --> 00:19:00,320 sorry we wanted the clergy to do, I think was just 250 00:19:00,960 --> 00:19:07,960 to try and go back to reject all types of violence 251 00:19:08,680 --> 00:19:13,640 and questionable behavior. And whether that was drugs or witchcraft or terrorism, 252 00:19:14,920 --> 00:19:18,440 it was to say that these activities really have no 253 00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:22,040 place in the society that we were trying to create. 254 00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:23,480 And because 255 00:19:24,120 --> 00:19:28,280 at that stage people's world was dominated by the fear of terrorism, 256 00:19:28,840 --> 00:19:34,776 we were directly linking a lot of these things together. It was important to look at 257 00:19:34,800 --> 00:19:38,360 evil bad and terrorism all within one package. 258 00:19:39,280 --> 00:19:42,040 They were particularly interested in 259 00:19:42,720 --> 00:19:48,680 getting at the Protestant population and getting them to believe in this stuff. 260 00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:52,330 They were trying to scare the bejesus out of the local population 261 00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:59,400 and to attach that fright to the terrible things that going on ergo the paramilitaries. 262 00:20:00,560 --> 00:20:06,896 That is I think what the core job of what they were doing was. 263 00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:10,676 They were trying to discredit the paramilitaries. They were trying to associate them with 264 00:20:11,300 --> 00:20:17,880 bad things, drug dealing, dodgy financial dealings, etc. Etc. 265 00:20:18,280 --> 00:20:20,240 We were just saying, look, the 266 00:20:20,480 --> 00:20:25,920 fact that the community has now sort of dissolved into this violence, 267 00:20:26,120 --> 00:20:31,280 which is becoming more and more sadistic in terms of sectarian assassinations, 268 00:20:31,840 --> 00:20:35,376 you know, where do you draw a halt as a community. 269 00:20:35,400 --> 00:20:38,680 I think it helped to bring home to people, that 270 00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:43,040 there was something going on in their community that really 271 00:20:43,600 --> 00:20:46,120 was not good for them as a whole. 272 00:20:48,720 --> 00:20:50,280 That is a strange way thinking, 273 00:20:50,760 --> 00:20:56,520 because you know you are part of the army and the idea is that you are fighting a war. 274 00:20:57,120 --> 00:21:00,456 But you are saying the witchcraft campaign was about 275 00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:03,160 bringing a sense of morality back to the community, 276 00:21:03,680 --> 00:21:08,360 you wouldn't really have thought that the army would think about that? 277 00:21:08,880 --> 00:21:15,216 Probably not but I think you see it is a war but it is not a conventional war. 278 00:21:15,240 --> 00:21:22,240 Terrorism is fundamentally a propaganda war that is backed up by armed conflict. 279 00:21:22,440 --> 00:21:27,000 So, it was just I think going back to 280 00:21:27,720 --> 00:21:33,656 say to people "you know you have grown up as I did in Northern Ireland with a very strong belief 281 00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:38,760 in the community and in our own church, whatever that religion was, 282 00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:42,080 and surely we have drifted a long way from that 283 00:21:42,200 --> 00:21:45,000 as a result of the violence of the last five six years." 284 00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:57,480 On the 8th of September 1973 285 00:21:57,760 --> 00:22:01,480 the burnt and mutilated body of 10-year-old Brian McDermott 286 00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:04,320 was discovered by the river Lagan in Belfast. 287 00:22:07,120 --> 00:22:10,136 People began to speculate: "was this a black magic killing" and 288 00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:15,760 it certainly contributed towards one of the threads and the rumors and fears 289 00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:20,480 that autumn, which was that Satanists were looking for children to abduct. 290 00:22:21,280 --> 00:22:26,840 Newspapers reported rumours that "a boy or girl under seven would be sacrificed." 291 00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:30,360 The police actually issued 292 00:22:30,760 --> 00:22:35,640 a statement saying they believed that the murder may have involved witchcraft, 293 00:22:35,960 --> 00:22:40,880 that was a concern for us at that stage because bearing in mind that we were creating this concept. 294 00:22:41,600 --> 00:22:46,776 At that point we stopped using witchcraft as a concept. 295 00:22:46,800 --> 00:22:49,880 But that was in September 296 00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:55,720 and according to Richard Jenkins the witchcraft scare continued 297 00:22:56,320 --> 00:23:00,120 all the way to the beginning of 1974? 298 00:23:00,440 --> 00:23:05,360 I think that's right, and one of the points we were making is that when you create a story 299 00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:12,096 it gathers momentum over a period of time and I think although we stop doing things, 300 00:23:12,120 --> 00:23:16,880 there were lots of other stories and rumors going around. There may also have been people, 301 00:23:17,000 --> 00:23:20,760 you know, creating these things for fun really. 302 00:23:20,960 --> 00:23:25,496 But we certainly stopped after Brian McDermott’s death. There's no doubt of that. 303 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:29,576 I’m absolutely clear. But it may well be that the aftermath of that was still going on 304 00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:33,700 for a period of sometime, even to the beginning of the following year. 305 00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:43,320 From early September to December 1973, 306 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:47,560 there were more than 70 articles referring to black magic and witchcraft. 307 00:23:48,040 --> 00:23:53,380 By the beginning of the following year the topic had almost completely vanished from the press. 308 00:23:57,280 --> 00:24:03,440 When the British Prime Minister Harold Wilson visited Northern Ireland, he was briefed by Colin Wallace. 309 00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:08,880 Would the Prime Minister have been aware 310 00:24:09,120 --> 00:24:13,000 that you were in fact in military intelligence? 311 00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:20,600 Oh, I don't believe they would have been. I’m sure he saw me simply as an army press officer. 312 00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:25,160 Did you yourself have a brief for when you interacted with him? 313 00:24:25,520 --> 00:24:31,480 Yes, what happened was that there were certain key things that we felt 314 00:24:32,560 --> 00:24:35,560 the Prime Minister should know. So, the idea is that 315 00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:40,000 you don't want him to be wrong-footed by not being able to answer 316 00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:43,920 the basic questions about security in Northern Ireland. 317 00:24:45,800 --> 00:24:49,616 Influencing the press, the clergy and key decision makers 318 00:24:49,640 --> 00:24:56,440 was one aspect of psychological warfare, another was influencing persons of interest directly. 319 00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:02,360 Quite often we were trying to influence people where we had no direct access to them. 320 00:25:03,040 --> 00:25:08,040 And so when you are trying to move somebody or change somebody's thinking, 321 00:25:08,560 --> 00:25:15,120 sometimes you had to target them through one or more sort of relays of other people. So, 322 00:25:15,140 --> 00:25:17,576 it is never straight communication. 323 00:25:17,700 --> 00:25:21,276 A lot of information we were disseminating was not through the media, 324 00:25:21,900 --> 00:25:23,417 it was also through people, 325 00:25:23,441 --> 00:25:29,400 and therefore it had to be cut out so that the person handling it quite often 326 00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:32,016 didn't realize who the originator was. 327 00:25:32,040 --> 00:25:36,136 And that made it all the more credible, when that person who was known to the target 328 00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:38,160 was passing this information on to him. 329 00:25:38,800 --> 00:25:45,120 Information Policy created profiles of persons of interest and people in their social networks. 330 00:25:45,800 --> 00:25:47,297 The key thing was that 331 00:25:47,321 --> 00:25:51,500 when you knew a lot about a person and the people they worked with, 332 00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:53,977 like any other part of society, 333 00:25:54,001 --> 00:25:56,196 there were people who didn't like each other, 334 00:25:56,220 --> 00:25:58,076 there were people who were jealous of each other. 335 00:25:58,100 --> 00:26:01,060 Because we had the relevant intelligence, 336 00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:04,760 if we could plant it the right way, 337 00:26:05,000 --> 00:26:10,760 you could for example if one person was suspicious of another for some reason, 338 00:26:10,960 --> 00:26:12,920 you could increase that suspicion, 339 00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:17,820 by feeding information in that would tend to reinforce their own views of that individual. 340 00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:20,560 So, it was that type of activity. 341 00:26:21,600 --> 00:26:23,177 Could you explain more about 342 00:26:23,201 --> 00:26:27,200 the kind of techniques you used to create psychological conflict? 343 00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:30,840 I have to be careful with that because 344 00:26:31,520 --> 00:26:36,640 what I don't want to do is actually share techniques that are still having impact. 345 00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:39,800 And so there is a Grey area there. 346 00:26:40,000 --> 00:26:44,960 But it is basically along the lines that we are saying, first of all is to identify 347 00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:51,720 relationships, look at how toxic those relationships may or may not be, 348 00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:57,660 and then try to maneuver them by planting information in, to have that effect. 349 00:27:00,120 --> 00:27:02,880 You build up quite a comprehensive profile 350 00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:06,120 of that person and their associates. 351 00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:09,680 Now it may be that some of those associates 352 00:27:09,700 --> 00:27:13,136 are totally innocent of any involvement in terrorism whatsoever. 353 00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:16,800 They just happen to be good friends from school days and so on and so forth. 354 00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:19,200 It is really creating a picture 355 00:27:19,400 --> 00:27:22,640 of that person so you almost know 356 00:27:22,800 --> 00:27:25,840 what their response will be to something that you do. 357 00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:29,200 This is a very different use of psychology 358 00:27:29,760 --> 00:27:35,380 and I think a lot of people wouldn't be aware that this knowledge exists 359 00:27:35,640 --> 00:27:40,440 and that people study psychology for these kinds of purposes? 360 00:27:42,600 --> 00:27:48,720 I think that's true, but you have to be careful because we did do lots of things 361 00:27:49,000 --> 00:27:52,160 that had a positive psychological effect. 362 00:27:52,520 --> 00:27:56,360 Like for example we ran youth clubs, we ran community relations. 363 00:27:56,680 --> 00:28:01,240 I was the Army's Father Christmas going around schools and hospitals at Christmas. 364 00:28:01,520 --> 00:28:05,480 We actually provided funds for projects. We took kids away from 365 00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:08,000 the really bad areas of Northern Ireland, 366 00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:10,017 from opposite sides of the fence, 367 00:28:10,041 --> 00:28:13,760 Catholic and Protestant together, we took them away to the mountains camping. 368 00:28:16,720 --> 00:28:21,320 Colin Wallace was refused clearance to target high-ranking protestant paramilitaries 369 00:28:21,480 --> 00:28:23,240 in psychological operations. 370 00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:29,120 These individuals who at times colluded with the British army were on an excluded list. 371 00:28:29,560 --> 00:28:34,680 A number of protestant clergy and politicians on the other hand were legitimate targets. 372 00:28:36,120 --> 00:28:40,680 Psyops targeted individuals who were not members of terrorist organizations, 373 00:28:40,960 --> 00:28:44,440 but who had influence in communities of interest to PsyOps. 374 00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:48,417 In the Catholic community, 375 00:28:48,441 --> 00:28:52,960 personal conflicts were the most common reason for a person to become an informant. 376 00:28:53,760 --> 00:28:58,500 We couldn't admit to what we were doing, the army didn't admit to what we were doing and so on so forth. 377 00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:04,720 A senior figure political or military might ask us to do something 378 00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:08,640 and then for political reasons usually 379 00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:13,640 they would say it would be a really good idea if X happened 380 00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:15,880 but then they would quite often say but 381 00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:20,960 I don't want you to tell me how you go about it because I may have to deny it, 382 00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:27,080 and that was a classic example so in other words the person doesn't want to lie that they were involved. 383 00:29:28,280 --> 00:29:33,040 Senior figures were deliberately kept in the dark about the specifics of campaigns, 384 00:29:33,320 --> 00:29:37,520 so that they could deny involvement should they be called upon to answer questions. 385 00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:45,400 At the age of 29 Colin Wallace was the youngest Senior Information Officer in the MOD. 386 00:29:45,980 --> 00:29:48,300 During his time in Information Policy 387 00:29:48,680 --> 00:29:52,840 he was put forward for New Year’s Honors 3 times by his superiors. 388 00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:03,840 In 1973, the IRD was withdrawn from Northern Ireland. 389 00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:10,000 The IRD focused on framing conflicts both at home and abroad as part of a clash of ideologies, 390 00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:12,120 between Communism and the West. 391 00:30:12,300 --> 00:30:17,696 Army Intelligence saw the IRD as involved in political propaganda of limited relevance 392 00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:21,420 to their anti-terror and counter-insurgency campaign. 393 00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:24,400 The military feared that 394 00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:29,560 having the IRD in Northern Ireland was undermining the credibility 395 00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:33,320 of their own PR campaigns 396 00:30:33,480 --> 00:30:39,020 and Lisburn and the army headquarters was becoming known as the Lisburn lie machine. 397 00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:44,240 Not long after the departure of Hugh Mooney and the IRD, 398 00:30:44,440 --> 00:30:49,400 a meeting was convened at Stormont Castle, the HQ of MI5 in Northern Ireland. 399 00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:54,000 At this meeting a campaign code-named Clockwork Orange was launched. 400 00:30:54,280 --> 00:30:58,920 Colin Wallace was asked to liaise with an operative by the cover-name, John Shaw. 401 00:30:59,680 --> 00:31:04,320 He never came to army headquarters at any time when I was there. 402 00:31:04,440 --> 00:31:08,400 All the meetings I had with him were at the White Gables Hotel. 403 00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:13,776 I think the idea with that was that there would be no direct link, 404 00:31:13,800 --> 00:31:19,360 particularly with some of the information that we were using, between him and the army. 405 00:31:20,120 --> 00:31:24,776 Colin Wallace alleges John Shaw supplied him with material that included smears 406 00:31:24,800 --> 00:31:28,760 on politicians from the three main political parties in Britain. 407 00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:34,680 Why were you given that information, considering the sensitivity of it? 408 00:31:35,160 --> 00:31:38,880 As I say, this was background, because if we are looking 409 00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:41,816 for example at the increase in violence, 410 00:31:41,840 --> 00:31:43,417 that has to be put in context, 411 00:31:43,441 --> 00:31:47,416 particularly if you are briefing journalists in depth or foreign journalists. 412 00:31:47,440 --> 00:31:52,120 You have to explain at that stage what led up to the violence. 413 00:31:52,160 --> 00:31:55,696 So, in other words, the violence was really the activity, 414 00:31:55,720 --> 00:31:59,680 but the background was coming from the briefing papers that I was given. 415 00:32:00,260 --> 00:32:03,976 Some of the forgeries that Information Policy and MI5 and IRD 416 00:32:04,200 --> 00:32:06,776 concocted in Northern Ireland came into my possession. 417 00:32:07,000 --> 00:32:10,000 To Merlyn Rees, who at one point was the Minister for Northern Ireland. 418 00:32:10,200 --> 00:32:13,736 This is apparently from the American Congress for Irish freedom, 1971. 419 00:32:13,760 --> 00:32:19,320 This was an IRA front in America. This is a letter apparently thanking Merlyn Rees for his support, 420 00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:22,880 which of course Merlyn Rees didn’t support it, but there you go. 421 00:32:23,920 --> 00:32:25,777 According to Stephen Dorril 422 00:32:25,801 --> 00:32:29,360 some of the smears Colin Wallace received from John Shaw 423 00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:32,040 were already in circulation in Britain. 424 00:32:32,840 --> 00:32:37,440 Britain had a very sophisticated system 425 00:32:37,760 --> 00:32:41,776 whereby there were scores of people around the country 426 00:32:41,800 --> 00:32:45,360 whose job it was just to sit in bars, coffee bars, 427 00:32:46,080 --> 00:32:51,200 talk to people, go to clubs and spread rumors 428 00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:57,120 and gradually kind of build up this idea about someone or some operation. 429 00:32:57,600 --> 00:33:01,080 It was smears about sex, 430 00:33:01,720 --> 00:33:05,640 accusations that Wilson had affairs. 431 00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:08,416 The British Prime Minister, Harold Wilson, 432 00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:11,560 had been sexually compromised on a trip to Moscow. 433 00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:15,456 There were accusations about, which is again kind of 434 00:33:15,480 --> 00:33:20,720 interesting in retrospect, about him being too close to Jewish people. 435 00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:24,360 So, there were kind of anti-semitic smears. 436 00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:29,000 That Wilson was corrupt that he had secret bank accounts … 437 00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:33,040 A few years ago the son of a MI6 officer 438 00:33:33,680 --> 00:33:35,000 contacted me and said 439 00:33:36,080 --> 00:33:40,320 "You've written about my father, but did you know that 440 00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:46,320 when he retired in 1970 he went into the City of London and he started a newsletter 441 00:33:46,480 --> 00:33:51,040 and spread rumors through this newsletter and smears about Wilson." 442 00:33:51,760 --> 00:33:55,580 Here's another fake - A Swiss account supposedly held by 443 00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:58,216 Edward Short, who was the 444 00:33:58,240 --> 00:34:01,656 leader of the House of Commons at the time I think, another Labour MP, 445 00:34:01,680 --> 00:34:04,360 a fake bank account showing he had 30,000 pounds. 446 00:34:04,600 --> 00:34:10,560 A journalist who trusts somebody like Colin can easily be manipulated. 447 00:34:10,760 --> 00:34:15,216 He would say to somebody: "okay, yeah, I think I know so-and-so, 448 00:34:15,240 --> 00:34:19,256 talk to that person or I can supply you with this bit of information 449 00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:22,376 or I have this document I will allow you to look at 450 00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:27,320 which will back up what I am saying or what this person has told you." 451 00:34:29,840 --> 00:34:32,640 It is a very sophisticated kind of system. 452 00:34:32,800 --> 00:34:37,920 This is thought out about what it is you want to achieve with this particular story. 453 00:34:39,160 --> 00:34:44,760 This might be part of a chain. It might be part of an operation that is ongoing, 454 00:34:44,960 --> 00:34:48,520 with the idea that you kind of sway the argument or you 455 00:34:48,920 --> 00:34:53,040 change the view of something, smear somebody. 456 00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:58,376 In October 1974 at a meeting with John Shaw, 457 00:34:58,400 --> 00:35:02,680 Colin Wallace demanded proof of political clearance for Clockwork Orange. 458 00:35:03,000 --> 00:35:06,040 He never saw or heard from John Shaw again. 459 00:35:12,000 --> 00:35:13,977 Colin Wallace turned his attention to 460 00:35:14,001 --> 00:35:17,720 undermining the Republican support network in the US and Ireland. 461 00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:21,800 He created a dossier that linked fundraisers and businessmen 462 00:35:22,040 --> 00:35:25,040 supportive of Republicans to weapons smuggling. 463 00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:31,520 Colin Wallace traced the serial numbers of weapons captured in Belfast to arms dealers in the US. 464 00:35:31,960 --> 00:35:35,320 He identified a leading fundraiser and major benefactors. 465 00:35:35,720 --> 00:35:39,680 The story was intended as an exclusive for a major publication. 466 00:35:42,160 --> 00:35:45,080 The Irish Joint Section of MI5 and MI6 467 00:35:45,240 --> 00:35:49,320 reported in a telegram that "The Managing Editor of the Daily Telegraph 468 00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:52,360 was prepared to give the article wide coverage…" 469 00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:56,560 Colin Wallace was asked to supply additional photographs. 470 00:35:57,040 --> 00:36:02,320 Information Policy ran a photography department that gathered images for intelligence purposes. 471 00:36:02,760 --> 00:36:07,280 These images could be used as supporting material in press briefings. 472 00:36:08,160 --> 00:36:13,600 The Daily Telegraph published a special investigation. Reporter Christopher Dobson, wrote: 473 00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:19,376 "I have spent the last two months investigating the way in which the IRA gets its money. 474 00:36:19,400 --> 00:36:22,096 I have traveled to the United States and Ireland 475 00:36:22,120 --> 00:36:25,896 in tracking back the serial numbers of arms captured in Belfast, 476 00:36:25,920 --> 00:36:29,960 and I have looked into the lives of the paymasters of terror." 477 00:36:34,680 --> 00:36:39,256 The press helped Information Policy to target individuals and organisations 478 00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:44,120 to which PsyOps had no direct access due to their geographic location. 479 00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:48,360 The article provided no evidence of the funding or smuggling of arms, 480 00:36:48,720 --> 00:36:52,330 however the reader was left with the distinct impression 481 00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:56,440 that the individuals and organization highlighted were responsible. 482 00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:08,560 William McGrath was a prominent individual in loyalist politics, the Church and the Orange Order, 483 00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:11,640 and the head of an organization called Tara. 484 00:37:12,240 --> 00:37:17,376 I was asked to encourage the press to look at what Tara and McGrath were all about. 485 00:37:17,400 --> 00:37:21,480 Tara was an organization 486 00:37:21,840 --> 00:37:28,040 that was really designed to prepare for a doomsday situation by loyalists. 487 00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:32,400 If there was an IRA Campaign, 488 00:37:32,680 --> 00:37:38,160 or in fact as McGrath said the Irish Army might even invade the North. 489 00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:41,840 Attending the meetings of Tara 490 00:37:42,000 --> 00:37:44,536 there were members of the Ulster Volunteer Force, 491 00:37:44,560 --> 00:37:47,720 which was then a proscribed loyalist paramilitary group. 492 00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:51,020 There were also police officers attending it. 493 00:37:52,080 --> 00:37:55,760 In 1973 McGrath issued a proclamation, 494 00:37:56,040 --> 00:37:59,080 that was designed to make the Roman Catholic Church illegal. 495 00:37:59,920 --> 00:38:03,080 William McGrath was also the housemaster of Kincora, 496 00:38:03,320 --> 00:38:07,880 a home for boys from troubled backgrounds between the ages of 11 to 18. 497 00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:15,120 Colin Wallace issued 3 separate briefings on McGrath, the press did not follow up the story. 498 00:38:15,680 --> 00:38:17,980 The Army was informed by Special Branch that 499 00:38:18,160 --> 00:38:22,616 if they moved against McGrath it would be a great propaganda coup for the IRA 500 00:38:22,640 --> 00:38:27,060 and significantly damage the political structure in Northern Ireland. 501 00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:37,760 In December 1974, Colin Wallace was summoned to the Ministry of Defence in London. 502 00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:42,520 Everything as far as I was concerned, in terms of my job, 503 00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:49,160 how I was regarded by annual performance reports, all those things were perfect. 504 00:38:49,640 --> 00:38:53,440 And so I was a bit surprised to be told then by 505 00:38:54,560 --> 00:38:58,920 the senior MOD official who saw me that because my life was in danger 506 00:38:59,640 --> 00:39:01,920 I had to be moved out of the province. 507 00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:06,280 A farewell party was organized. 508 00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:10,480 A prominent cartoonist recorded Colin Wallace’s departure. 509 00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:14,120 I moved to my new post and 510 00:39:14,560 --> 00:39:18,680 a day after that a police officer from Northern Ireland arrived 511 00:39:18,880 --> 00:39:21,016 with a Special Branch officer 512 00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:24,560 and said that they were investigating the fact that 513 00:39:25,040 --> 00:39:28,560 I had given a restricted document to a journalist. 514 00:39:28,840 --> 00:39:31,480 For the past six years I had been supplying, 515 00:39:32,560 --> 00:39:36,416 you know, as part of my job description, highly sensitive information 516 00:39:36,740 --> 00:39:39,660 to journalists from different countries around the world. 517 00:39:39,960 --> 00:39:46,400 Unbeknown to Colin Wallace, MI5 had made an assessment that he was disgruntled and a security risk. 518 00:39:47,680 --> 00:39:52,720 The disciplinary hearing that followed concluded that Colin Wallace should be dismissed. 519 00:39:52,960 --> 00:39:56,800 But, that he could keep his pension if he resigned voluntarily. 520 00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:03,560 Peter Broderick, a colleague of Colin Wallace’s in Army Public Relations, tried to support him 521 00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:08,240 and was informed that Colin Wallace was a member of a terrorist organization. 522 00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:12,920 Peter Broderick was then transferred out of the Ministry of Defence. 523 00:40:18,840 --> 00:40:24,160 When my disciplinary hearing was finished and I realized that 524 00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:27,160 clearly it had been rigged, 525 00:40:27,400 --> 00:40:32,576 I then engaged a solicitor purely for personal protection to tell him what had happened to me. 526 00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:34,760 He said that he was involved 527 00:40:35,800 --> 00:40:40,136 in dirty tricks against politicians in Northern Ireland 528 00:40:40,160 --> 00:40:45,080 and he also said that this had now started to move over onto the mainland. 529 00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:48,080 That he was involved in a dirty tricks campaign 530 00:40:48,240 --> 00:40:52,840 against mainland politicians and in particular he mentioned Harold Wilson. 531 00:40:54,600 --> 00:40:57,000 Colin Wallace moved to South-East London 532 00:40:57,360 --> 00:41:00,760 and began to speak out about his work in Information Policy, 533 00:41:01,080 --> 00:41:06,400 he lobbied MPs, supplied information to the press and wrote to the former prime minister. 534 00:41:07,640 --> 00:41:12,856 Harold Wilson already held suspicions that MI5 had undermined him and his government 535 00:41:12,880 --> 00:41:15,680 and had communicated this to two journalists. 536 00:41:16,480 --> 00:41:20,560 He thought they had mounted a campaign of denigrating him personally, 537 00:41:20,800 --> 00:41:27,560 of using official material that had been gathered and then misused by leaking it to newspapers. 538 00:41:28,360 --> 00:41:31,200 They released a book, which was largely ignored. 539 00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:37,096 In 1977 the IRD was quietly closed down. 540 00:41:37,120 --> 00:41:41,840 After an internal investigation into the plot against the former prime minister. 541 00:41:42,520 --> 00:41:45,456 I corresponded with Lord Hunt. 542 00:41:45,480 --> 00:41:50,720 He was asked to carry out the investigation into the alleged plot against Harold Wilson 543 00:41:51,560 --> 00:41:55,960 and he spoke to a number of people including the heads of MI5 and MI6. 544 00:41:56,560 --> 00:42:00,520 He said that there was a plot, 545 00:42:01,680 --> 00:42:06,960 that there were dissident elements within both organizations. 546 00:42:07,640 --> 00:42:13,080 He wrote that report which went to the new Prime Minister 547 00:42:13,640 --> 00:42:19,000 and a copy of it was supposed to have been deposited in the Cabinet Office. 548 00:42:19,920 --> 00:42:25,040 I asked the Cabinet Office where was the copy and they said they could not find one. 549 00:42:28,960 --> 00:42:34,220 Colin Wallace unaware of the demise of the IRD began a new life in West Sussex. 550 00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:39,800 In January 1980 551 00:42:39,840 --> 00:42:45,440 the Irish Independent published an article on the abuse of boys at the Belfast boys home Kincora. 552 00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:49,576 The Housefathers William McGrath, Joseph Mains and Raymond Semple 553 00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:52,360 had been sexually abusing the boys in their care. 554 00:42:53,120 --> 00:42:56,200 Politicians in Northern Ireland demanded a full inquiry. 555 00:42:57,640 --> 00:43:02,440 Did you see this man in Arundel between 6:15pm – 11:30pm on Tuesday 5th August 1980? 556 00:43:08,640 --> 00:43:12,320 The body which was found last Friday in the river 557 00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:14,640 had head injuries. 558 00:43:15,480 --> 00:43:19,320 This is a matter for the pathologist who is making his examination, 559 00:43:19,680 --> 00:43:24,780 to find out whether in fact the person died as a result of drowning or as a result of the head injuries. 560 00:43:25,560 --> 00:43:30,240 Colin Wallace had fractured Mr. Lewis’ skull with a karate style blow 561 00:43:30,440 --> 00:43:35,656 during a meeting at his house after he was accused of having an affair with Mr. Lewis’ wife. 562 00:43:35,680 --> 00:43:40,440 He hid his friend’s body in the boot of his car and later dumped it in the river Arun. 563 00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:44,176 Colin Wallace was charged with the murder. 564 00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:48,920 The prosecution alleged he was infatuated with Jane Lewis the deceased’s wife. 565 00:43:49,880 --> 00:43:55,680 He was found guilty of manslaughter and sentenced to ten years on the 20th of March 1981. 566 00:44:04,760 --> 00:44:08,960 65-year-old William McGrath seen here in the foreground. 567 00:44:09,400 --> 00:44:13,160 He ran two bible study centres in Belfast in the 50s and 60s. 568 00:44:13,400 --> 00:44:17,360 McGrath was also a founding member of the protestant paramilitary group Tara. 569 00:44:17,640 --> 00:44:20,240 This man was one of McGraths victims. 570 00:44:20,840 --> 00:44:23,296 He would come up when you were getting dressed and 571 00:44:23,320 --> 00:44:26,960 then he would start doing things you don’t like. 572 00:44:27,560 --> 00:44:32,216 There was one time I was bleeding. I told him to stop. It was unpleasant. 573 00:44:33,040 --> 00:44:35,620 You couldn’t turn to no-one you know. 574 00:44:35,640 --> 00:44:40,005 One of the Army’s former press officers at Thiepval Barracks in Lisburn, Colin Wallace, 575 00:44:40,040 --> 00:44:42,680 is now a key figure in the Kincora investigation. 576 00:44:43,040 --> 00:44:47,240 Mr. Wallace who is presently serving 10 years for manslaughter in an English jail 577 00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:50,120 was also known to have links with British intelligence. 578 00:44:51,400 --> 00:44:55,920 Kevin Dowling, exactly what did Colin Wallace tell you in 1973? 579 00:44:56,840 --> 00:45:00,136 He certainly said that McGrath was a homosexual. 580 00:45:00,160 --> 00:45:04,480 You must remember that the conversation I had with him was in 1973. 581 00:45:05,400 --> 00:45:07,976 I don’t remember the conversation entirely clearly. 582 00:45:08,000 --> 00:45:12,856 It has been suggested to me that McGrath was in fact some kind of an army informer 583 00:45:12,880 --> 00:45:15,976 and that the police felt obliged to protect him in order 584 00:45:16,000 --> 00:45:18,536 to bring to book greater criminals than he. 585 00:45:18,560 --> 00:45:21,180 Exactly what part did British intelligence play 586 00:45:21,260 --> 00:45:24,700 and were they aware that William McGrath was employed at Kincora. 587 00:45:26,200 --> 00:45:31,160 British Army files relating to the Kincora Boys’ Home disappeared from army headquarters. 588 00:45:33,720 --> 00:45:37,280 It was rumoured that William McGrath was an MI5 informant. 589 00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:43,336 McGrath, Mains and Semple, who ran the Kincora Boys’ Home, 590 00:45:43,360 --> 00:45:45,360 were sentenced in December 1981. 591 00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:48,640 All were released in under 2 years. 592 00:45:48,880 --> 00:45:53,120 Meanwhile, Colin Wallace was still only at the beginning of his 10-year sentence. 593 00:45:54,920 --> 00:45:57,880 When I first got to know him, 594 00:45:58,280 --> 00:45:59,320 he was in prison 595 00:46:00,680 --> 00:46:02,720 and it was bizarre. 596 00:46:03,720 --> 00:46:05,680 He was actually protected in prison. 597 00:46:06,760 --> 00:46:09,240 Other prisoners believed him. 598 00:46:10,600 --> 00:46:13,280 He actually had kind of bodyguards, 599 00:46:13,680 --> 00:46:17,320 because they thought probably correctly that he might be 600 00:46:18,480 --> 00:46:20,080 killed, assassinated in prison. 601 00:46:22,160 --> 00:46:27,000 Clive Ponting was head of the legal department at the Ministry of Defence in 1983 602 00:46:27,400 --> 00:46:31,760 and remembers a meeting with MI5 where Colin Wallace was discussed. 603 00:46:32,520 --> 00:46:34,297 There was never any suspicion that 604 00:46:34,321 --> 00:46:38,280 Wallace was making these stories up and that it was all totally unfounded and 605 00:46:38,840 --> 00:46:40,200 very easy to rubbish. 606 00:46:40,520 --> 00:46:44,736 It was very much a matter that the story was being contained at the moment 607 00:46:44,760 --> 00:46:46,480 because he was in jail. But that 608 00:46:46,880 --> 00:46:49,376 in a few years time, he would be back out again and 609 00:46:49,400 --> 00:46:52,500 could be expected to start making the allegations again. 610 00:46:53,040 --> 00:46:57,416 One evening in prison, Colin Wallace read an article about Fred Holroyd, 611 00:46:57,440 --> 00:47:00,640 a former Military Intelligence Officer in Northern Ireland, 612 00:47:01,120 --> 00:47:04,000 whose experience bore some resemblance to his own. 613 00:47:04,880 --> 00:47:08,000 Colin wrote a letter to Fred asking for help. 614 00:47:08,240 --> 00:47:09,600 When I got to the prison 615 00:47:09,760 --> 00:47:11,680 I realized this was the same man 616 00:47:11,960 --> 00:47:16,520 that I met in the secret corridor, who had an office in army headquarters. 617 00:47:17,440 --> 00:47:21,760 The MOD repeatedly were refuting that he was anything more 618 00:47:22,000 --> 00:47:26,880 than a civilian clerk with a Walter Mitty complex. And yet here he is with an office 619 00:47:27,000 --> 00:47:31,320 in this secret corridor with the political officer MI5, MI6, all of the people 620 00:47:31,680 --> 00:47:34,160 who were running the army were in that office. 621 00:47:36,080 --> 00:47:39,456 I went on the same day that the murder was committed, at the same time. 622 00:47:39,480 --> 00:47:42,816 You know you have got every man and his dog walking along that path. 623 00:47:42,840 --> 00:47:46,656 You have fishermen overlooking at about a hundred yards away on a bridge. 624 00:47:46,680 --> 00:47:49,476 You have all sorts of courting couples walking along and 625 00:47:49,500 --> 00:47:51,896 the river boats going up and down the river. 626 00:47:51,920 --> 00:47:55,000 The thing was, you know, it's Trafalgar Square on a Saturday. 627 00:47:55,480 --> 00:47:58,160 The story that the police had put out was a lie. 628 00:47:58,800 --> 00:48:02,560 I also discovered a witness who had seen the dead man 629 00:48:03,040 --> 00:48:08,440 after he had allegedly been killed by Colin and the police persuaded her not to give evidence. 630 00:48:08,640 --> 00:48:12,960 He was sitting by the window with the gentleman he was with. 631 00:48:13,220 --> 00:48:17,616 A man approximately in his 50s with thinning grey hair combed back over the top of his head. 632 00:48:17,640 --> 00:48:20,200 And as far as I remember, I think he was in a grey suite. 633 00:48:20,240 --> 00:48:25,720 Whatever exchange came from Jonathan Lewis it was sharp and back to fiddling with his glass on his knee. 634 00:48:26,200 --> 00:48:27,600 He looked far from happy. 635 00:48:28,600 --> 00:48:32,200 She was frightened of the police. She thought the police were in on it. 636 00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:36,760 Fred Holroyd door-stepped the boatman who had found the body. 637 00:48:37,000 --> 00:48:40,296 And he didn't know who I was. They all get very frightened when I arrive 638 00:48:40,320 --> 00:48:44,476 and start asking questions about things that they are worried about themselves. 639 00:48:44,500 --> 00:48:48,936 And he said: "I can tell you that the buggers wouldn't let me give the evidence I wanted to give, 640 00:48:48,960 --> 00:48:51,256 which was you know that I had reversed back and 641 00:48:51,280 --> 00:48:53,320 my propeller had hit the guy in the face 642 00:48:53,480 --> 00:48:55,420 and that is what caused the wound." 643 00:48:55,720 --> 00:48:57,776 And I said: "Yyou are kidding," and he said: "No." 644 00:48:57,800 --> 00:49:00,976 So I said: "Are you prepared to put that down in writing?" He said: 645 00:49:01,000 --> 00:49:05,736 "Well if I have to, but the best thing would be to get me in a court and ask me questions and then 646 00:49:05,760 --> 00:49:09,120 I have to answer in a courtroom and the police can't do me any harm." 647 00:49:11,800 --> 00:49:15,880 When Colin was still in prison he was via his solicitor, he was sending 648 00:49:16,120 --> 00:49:18,300 out various documents that he had written. 649 00:49:18,640 --> 00:49:20,800 I was unemployed, and in those days in Hull, 650 00:49:21,240 --> 00:49:25,150 in Mrs. Thatcher's Britain in a place like Hull with unemployment at 10 percent, 651 00:49:25,360 --> 00:49:26,840 if you had something to do 652 00:49:27,000 --> 00:49:30,336 and I did, the people on the dole would ignore you for years. 653 00:49:30,360 --> 00:49:33,080 So, I carried on doing this journalism stuff. 654 00:49:33,920 --> 00:49:39,336 Lobster, an obscure magazine made on a photocopier, with a circulation of 150, 655 00:49:39,360 --> 00:49:42,120 co-founded and co-edited by Ramsay and Dorril, 656 00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:45,576 may at the time have been the only publication in Britain 657 00:49:45,600 --> 00:49:48,600 to take Colin Wallace’s allegations seriously. 658 00:49:49,080 --> 00:49:55,440 I wrote this, which was you know 50 pages, an attempt to explain Colin’s story. 659 00:49:55,840 --> 00:49:59,960 We printed quite a lot of these about a thousand copies 660 00:50:01,840 --> 00:50:04,600 I think and we went to London and had a press conference. 661 00:50:04,960 --> 00:50:11,280 So, two hicks from the sticks turn up carrying this big document and saying here's a big story. 662 00:50:11,840 --> 00:50:15,960 The media were not impressed at all, virtually no response to it. 663 00:50:16,360 --> 00:50:20,360 In January 1987 Colin Wallace was released from prison. 664 00:50:22,480 --> 00:50:24,576 A journalist called Julian O' Halloran 665 00:50:24,600 --> 00:50:29,296 went to Lewes Prison and actually filmed Colin Wallace as he stepped out of the prison gate 666 00:50:29,320 --> 00:50:32,676 and interviewed him and it was going to be broadcast on Newsnight. 667 00:50:32,700 --> 00:50:36,696 I was actually watching Newsnight when there was a great kerfuffle in the studio. 668 00:50:36,720 --> 00:50:39,816 Something had happened and bits of paper were being looked at, 669 00:50:39,840 --> 00:50:41,537 headphones were being checked. 670 00:50:41,561 --> 00:50:43,600 What happened was the Wallace segment 671 00:50:43,680 --> 00:50:46,896 had been yanked at the last minute by a man called Alan Prothero, 672 00:50:46,920 --> 00:50:50,200 who at that point was deputy director of the BBC. 673 00:50:50,840 --> 00:50:54,200 Prothero was a part-time army officer in the territorial army 674 00:50:54,360 --> 00:50:58,080 and his speciality was media - military relations. 675 00:51:01,880 --> 00:51:04,077 I went down to visit him and Fred 676 00:51:04,101 --> 00:51:07,476 and it was in the middle of winter. We were sitting in Colin Wallace’s unheated house. 677 00:51:07,600 --> 00:51:10,500 He had come out of prison and he couldn't afford to heat it. 678 00:51:11,000 --> 00:51:14,440 So we were all sitting you know in our coats in Colin’s living room 679 00:51:14,520 --> 00:51:16,500 and I remember saying something like, 680 00:51:17,040 --> 00:51:21,000 "So your plan is that me and you two guys with no money between us 681 00:51:21,120 --> 00:51:23,440 are gonna take on MI5 and the MOD?" 682 00:51:23,640 --> 00:51:25,480 "Yes that's the plan," they said. 683 00:51:26,480 --> 00:51:29,720 Irish broadcaster RTE picked up the story. 684 00:51:30,960 --> 00:51:34,016 The record says that Colin Wallace killed Jonathan Lewis. 685 00:51:34,040 --> 00:51:35,737 - Oh yes, absolutely. - Did you? 686 00:51:35,761 --> 00:51:38,216 No, I didn’t, I had nothing at all to do with his death. 687 00:51:38,240 --> 00:51:40,277 I wasn’t involved in any way. 688 00:51:40,501 --> 00:51:43,976 But I mean if I am not calm about it. If I panic about it. 689 00:51:44,000 --> 00:51:46,036 If I create a fuss. If I get excited about it, 690 00:51:46,160 --> 00:51:48,160 that is not going to change the verdict 691 00:51:48,280 --> 00:51:52,056 any quicker than if I stay calm and deal with it properly through the correct channels. 692 00:51:52,680 --> 00:51:56,040 Eventually I was hired by Channel 4 News. 693 00:51:56,540 --> 00:51:58,320 Colin had these hand written notes 694 00:51:58,720 --> 00:52:03,200 that he claimed he had written down from this MI5 disinformation project 695 00:52:03,360 --> 00:52:06,160 against Labour MPs. 696 00:52:06,400 --> 00:52:10,920 Robert Parker of Channel 4 News went to a forensic scientist called Dr. Julius Grant. 697 00:52:11,600 --> 00:52:16,480 What chances do you think there are that these notes are forgeries? 698 00:52:17,640 --> 00:52:19,360 Well, from what I already said, 699 00:52:20,000 --> 00:52:23,720 the chances that they are forgeries seem to be rather remote. 700 00:52:23,880 --> 00:52:28,600 And thus these documents were in fact written, probably when Wallace said they were written. 701 00:52:28,800 --> 00:52:32,160 While we were working together on bits and pieces about Wallace, 702 00:52:33,400 --> 00:52:37,040 another journalist in ITN, who was one of their crime correspondents, 703 00:52:37,360 --> 00:52:40,656 began feeding information he was getting from the MOD, 704 00:52:40,680 --> 00:52:43,200 the Ministry of Defense, denigrating Wallace. 705 00:52:43,560 --> 00:52:47,136 We were also getting similar stuff from professor Paul Wilkinson, 706 00:52:47,160 --> 00:52:51,680 a terrorism expert, again denigrating Wallace and saying he's a fantasist and a liar. 707 00:52:52,920 --> 00:52:56,800 Investigative journalist Paul Foot wrote a book about Colin Wallace. 708 00:52:57,400 --> 00:53:00,760 Wallace began to appear in the British media more frequently, 709 00:53:00,920 --> 00:53:05,360 including on popular ITV weekly debate show Central Weekend Live. 710 00:53:05,880 --> 00:53:08,360 If you take the case of Mr. Wallace here. 711 00:53:09,080 --> 00:53:12,560 As every body else who is ever convicted of any crime, 712 00:53:12,760 --> 00:53:18,096 poor Mr. Wallace was framed. I don’t believe he was framed, it’s a fact. 713 00:53:18,120 --> 00:53:24,016 Any responsible journalist in Northern Ireland in the early 70s knew what Colin Wallace was up to. 714 00:53:24,040 --> 00:53:25,677 There was this gung-ho character 715 00:53:25,701 --> 00:53:28,036 who was running around in the dead of night 716 00:53:28,060 --> 00:53:31,816 shoving envelopes full of documents into the letter boxes of journalists. 717 00:53:31,840 --> 00:53:34,040 And you would say there is Colin at it again. 718 00:53:34,520 --> 00:53:37,000 I for one I was probably the first person in the CIA 719 00:53:37,040 --> 00:53:40,896 who got into this dirty-tricks business. It wasn’t as dirty as a lot of people think it was. 720 00:53:40,920 --> 00:53:42,717 A lot of people find it very objectionable. 721 00:53:42,741 --> 00:53:46,576 Just a minute. To blacken someone is a hell of a lot better than killing them. 722 00:53:46,600 --> 00:53:48,400 In World War 2 we killed people, 723 00:53:48,880 --> 00:53:50,477 and now we got into the business 724 00:53:50,501 --> 00:53:53,616 where we are simply playing dirty tricks, to prevent having World War 3. 725 00:53:53,640 --> 00:53:55,936 You are the man that sparked all this off. 726 00:53:55,960 --> 00:53:58,337 I did not join the security forces 727 00:53:58,361 --> 00:54:02,180 to discredit the Labour Party, the Conservative Party or the Liberal Party, 728 00:54:02,400 --> 00:54:06,456 and because I was deflected from my main job into doing political disinformation, 729 00:54:06,480 --> 00:54:09,000 I was not actually doing the job I had joined to do. 730 00:54:09,080 --> 00:54:14,716 Good evening, a civil servant sacked after making allegations about an MI5 dirty tricks campaign 731 00:54:14,740 --> 00:54:18,500 has been awarded £30,000 compensation by the government. 732 00:54:18,800 --> 00:54:20,896 Calcutt QC was asked to conduct an inquiry. 733 00:54:21,120 --> 00:54:24,416 In his report he reveals that MOD officials 734 00:54:24,440 --> 00:54:29,200 contacted Mr. Wallace’s disciplinary hearing beforehand, thus influencing the outcome. 735 00:54:29,520 --> 00:54:34,320 The Defence Secretary Tom King asked Mr. Calcutt not to write a full report. 736 00:54:34,680 --> 00:54:38,720 Labour’s Northern Ireland Secretary between 1974 and 76 said 737 00:54:38,880 --> 00:54:41,480 he had been the victim of a dirty tricks campaign. 738 00:54:42,080 --> 00:54:44,960 Who instructed Mr. Wallace 739 00:54:45,200 --> 00:54:48,296 to do the job he and others did. That is what we have to know. 740 00:54:48,320 --> 00:54:53,600 We want to be sure that this sort of thing never happens again. I feel very strongly about it. 741 00:54:54,500 --> 00:54:58,056 Mrs. Thatcher having insisted there was no evidence to back such claims 742 00:54:58,080 --> 00:55:01,056 was forced to admit in the Commons that she had been misled. 743 00:55:01,080 --> 00:55:04,496 This followed the discovery of documents in the Ministry of Defence, 744 00:55:04,520 --> 00:55:08,240 which related to a propaganda campaign code-named Clockwork Orange. 745 00:55:08,720 --> 00:55:11,436 He is calling for the government to launch a full inquiry. 746 00:55:11,560 --> 00:55:13,376 Injustice to me is really a minor matter. 747 00:55:13,400 --> 00:55:18,076 The much more important matters are the allegations that there was an attempt to 748 00:55:18,500 --> 00:55:21,256 influence the general election in 1974 749 00:55:21,280 --> 00:55:24,840 and indeed the assaults on the children in Kincora during the 70s. 750 00:55:25,660 --> 00:55:29,120 My aspect of the story is only a minor one by comparison. 751 00:55:29,300 --> 00:55:31,320 The government specifically ruled out 752 00:55:31,680 --> 00:55:34,376 the re-opening into the investigation of the alleged cover up 753 00:55:34,400 --> 00:55:38,080 of the homosexual abuse of boys at the Kincora home in Belfast. 754 00:55:39,000 --> 00:55:42,536 Information about homosexual behavior at the Kincora Boys’ Home 755 00:55:42,560 --> 00:55:45,400 was used to blackmail prominent figures in Northern Ireland. 756 00:55:46,560 --> 00:55:51,200 After I left Northern Ireland another intelligence officer came in called Brian Gemmell 757 00:55:51,680 --> 00:55:57,440 he was told about the allegation surrounding the abuses at Kincora. 758 00:55:57,760 --> 00:56:00,240 He wrote a report about it and he submitted 759 00:56:00,400 --> 00:56:04,240 that report to a senior MI5 officer, Ian Cameron, 760 00:56:04,480 --> 00:56:07,440 who then told him to stop investigating. 761 00:56:07,600 --> 00:56:10,520 You know on the phone we have got phone calls of generals 762 00:56:10,600 --> 00:56:13,320 who have said, "Yes I knew all about Kincora, I was told and 763 00:56:13,360 --> 00:56:18,040 I took it to MI5 and they said it was none of my business and I left it to them. It was their business," 764 00:56:18,320 --> 00:56:23,200 and all this sort of stuff and you know the realization, like me the light is dawning 765 00:56:23,760 --> 00:56:25,800 that we are not who we say we are. 766 00:56:29,840 --> 00:56:34,936 Journalist David Leigh tracked down Denis Payne, the former head of MI5 in Northern Ireland, 767 00:56:34,960 --> 00:56:37,160 to a sleepy village in the countryside, 768 00:56:37,440 --> 00:56:40,760 and confronted him with the Clockwork Orange allegations. 769 00:56:41,400 --> 00:56:45,776 I am under an obligation to say absolutely nothing. I can’t say anything at all. 770 00:56:45,800 --> 00:56:50,476 I mean you have collected all the information, I can’t believe anybody is in the slightest bit 771 00:56:50,500 --> 00:56:53,000 interested in it, but, I have nothing to add. 772 00:56:55,560 --> 00:57:00,080 In 1996 Colin Wallace appealed his conviction for manslaughter. 773 00:57:01,120 --> 00:57:04,000 Today, 15 years after he was jailed for manslaughter, 774 00:57:04,200 --> 00:57:06,800 Colin Wallace from West Sussex, cleared his name. 775 00:57:07,160 --> 00:57:12,160 He served 6 years in the 1980s after being found guilty of killing an antiques dealer 776 00:57:12,360 --> 00:57:14,120 near his home in West Sussex. 777 00:57:15,280 --> 00:57:16,817 During the appeal hearing, 778 00:57:16,841 --> 00:57:21,656 the Home Office pathologist admitted that a Secret Service agent had suggested to him 779 00:57:21,680 --> 00:57:27,640 that the injury was caused by a karate chop to the head and not from the propeller of a boat. 780 00:57:29,000 --> 00:57:32,496 The hearing at the Court of Appeal focused largely on new medical evidence 781 00:57:32,520 --> 00:57:34,760 about the injury Jonathan Lewis received. 782 00:57:34,840 --> 00:57:39,616 Jonathan Lewis was most probably attacked at the river bank and not at his house, 783 00:57:39,640 --> 00:57:44,760 and he said there was no evidence that his body had ever been in Colin Wallace’s car. 784 00:57:45,080 --> 00:57:48,880 He says he was the victim of an MI5 dirty tricks campaign. 785 00:57:49,120 --> 00:57:52,760 Now Mr. Wallace is demanding a full investigation into his claims. 786 00:57:55,200 --> 00:58:00,920 Even after Colin Wallace had received compensation his troubles with MI5 were not over. 787 00:58:02,120 --> 00:58:03,657 While I was working at BAA, 788 00:58:03,681 --> 00:58:06,500 MI5 contacted the head of security there 789 00:58:06,700 --> 00:58:10,020 and then I was made redundant after that. 790 00:58:11,400 --> 00:58:14,640 Now I can't say MI5 was responsible, but again 791 00:58:14,760 --> 00:58:18,240 why were they still meddling in my case after all those years. 792 00:58:19,120 --> 00:58:23,400 The media reported Colin Wallace’s appeal and aired his allegations, 793 00:58:23,660 --> 00:58:25,497 but they did not ask themselves 794 00:58:25,521 --> 00:58:28,856 what role they themselves had played in spreading fake news 795 00:58:28,880 --> 00:58:32,200 and what lessons they could learn for their reporting in future. 796 00:58:35,400 --> 00:58:39,440 Colin Wallace repeatedly called for a full investigation into his claims. 797 00:58:40,080 --> 00:58:42,560 But there was to be no full investigation, 798 00:58:43,160 --> 00:58:46,120 only an ever longer list of inquiries and legal disputes 799 00:58:46,320 --> 00:58:50,240 spanning decades, as the allegations faded from public view. 800 00:58:52,240 --> 00:58:53,640 We now look at 801 00:58:53,720 --> 00:58:56,720 probably five inquiries that all failed totally 802 00:58:57,440 --> 00:59:02,400 to do what Parliament assured the public that it would do. 803 00:59:02,480 --> 00:59:05,840 Still to this day Colin is a problem. 804 00:59:06,560 --> 00:59:12,280 There are major efforts to restrict what he says. 805 00:59:12,800 --> 00:59:20,140 Kincora is a prime example, the boys home where it is alleged intelligence people 806 00:59:20,200 --> 00:59:25,036 were involved recruiting people used people etc the inquiries into that 807 00:59:25,160 --> 00:59:27,760 have been incredibly restricted. 808 00:59:28,520 --> 00:59:34,560 And Colin on the one hand will be told: yes come and tell us your story tell us everything. 809 00:59:35,000 --> 00:59:40,096 Then when it gets nearer you get a document from the minister that says 810 00:59:40,120 --> 00:59:45,840 I am sorry you can talk about that area but no way he's going to talk about that 811 00:59:46,240 --> 00:59:53,240 or MI5 … he cannot talk about this area because that gets him into an Official Secrets area. 812 00:59:54,000 --> 01:00:00,320 So even to this day 40 years on they are still trying to shut him up. 813 01:00:00,680 --> 01:00:04,360 The whole system you see is unaccountable and it's insidious 814 01:00:05,520 --> 01:00:08,536 it's easy for MI5 to say no we don't do it 815 01:00:08,560 --> 01:00:11,300 because nobody can prove what they did and they didn’t. 816 01:00:12,800 --> 01:00:16,416 Today, the role the military and intelligence services can play 817 01:00:16,440 --> 01:00:18,840 in manufacturing and manipulating the news 818 01:00:19,040 --> 01:00:21,176 is considered a conspiracy. 819 01:00:21,500 --> 01:00:25,540 Despite extensive press coverage of Colin Wallace’s allegations, 820 01:00:25,600 --> 01:00:30,280 not a single person in a position of authority has been held to account. 821 01:00:33,680 --> 01:00:37,776 When Hugh Mooney of the IRD was asked under oath at a public inquiry 822 01:00:37,800 --> 01:00:39,480 about his PsyOps work, 823 01:00:40,080 --> 01:00:43,080 he lied and claimed he was never involved in PsyOps, 824 01:00:43,480 --> 01:00:45,960 despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary. 825 01:00:46,440 --> 01:00:47,920 Hugh Mooney walked away, 826 01:00:48,080 --> 01:00:51,840 no questions asked and became a successful businessman. 827 01:00:52,520 --> 01:00:55,520 This is a very, very secretive society. 828 01:00:56,520 --> 01:00:58,080 It runs through everything. 829 01:00:58,240 --> 01:01:02,360 Secrecy is the British disease. It's not anything else, it’s secrecy. 830 01:01:02,560 --> 01:01:07,440 If you believe in the democratic process there has to be oversight 831 01:01:08,280 --> 01:01:10,400 and at the moment we don't have oversight. 832 01:01:10,840 --> 01:01:15,200 Because vetting is an important issue for politicians who are looking for 833 01:01:15,520 --> 01:01:17,400 ministerial appointments 834 01:01:17,880 --> 01:01:21,760 and service people or police officers moving into the higher level, 835 01:01:21,960 --> 01:01:24,920 you must have access to classified information. 836 01:01:25,280 --> 01:01:29,816 If MI5 don't agree to you having that clearance, 837 01:01:29,840 --> 01:01:33,520 if they take that clearance away from you, then your career is doomed. 838 01:01:34,120 --> 01:01:39,376 So, you never know about it, it is an invisible threat that is hanging over people all the time 839 01:01:39,400 --> 01:01:42,860 and therefore the danger is that MI5 840 01:01:42,880 --> 01:01:50,080 has almost an invisible degree of influence that really is way outside what it should be. 841 01:01:50,640 --> 01:01:56,080 And it is therefore virtually impossible to challenge MI5 on some of the decisions they make. 842 01:01:56,200 --> 01:02:00,720 Politicians are careerists, most of them they want to go up the ladder, become ministers, 843 01:02:01,000 --> 01:02:06,376 and if you start criticizing or investigating the army or the intelligence services, 844 01:02:06,400 --> 01:02:09,760 this will not do your career any good whatsoever. 845 01:02:10,200 --> 01:02:15,080 And this is also true for journalists, not a good career path. This is sticky stuff. 846 01:02:16,000 --> 01:02:18,276 People are saying well why are you fighting 847 01:02:18,300 --> 01:02:21,040 with the Army and the MOD, surely you are a part of that. 848 01:02:21,560 --> 01:02:25,440 I am only fighting with the MOD because I was given no choice, 849 01:02:26,040 --> 01:02:28,800 because the MOD didn't even talk to me. 850 01:02:28,960 --> 01:02:30,960 If I hadn't fought when I did 851 01:02:31,000 --> 01:02:33,200 I would probably still have a conviction 852 01:02:33,560 --> 01:02:37,800 and I still wouldn’t have got the admissions out of the government that we have now got. 853 01:02:38,320 --> 01:02:44,936 People realize that the full truth hasn't come out and although authorities think they may have been clever 854 01:02:44,960 --> 01:02:49,176 and believable to dodge around the issue the public have a totally different view. 855 01:02:49,200 --> 01:02:54,176 People are pretty aware of when things are not actually truthful 856 01:02:54,400 --> 01:02:57,456 and they know at the moment they haven't had the full truth about 857 01:02:57,480 --> 01:02:59,200 what has happened in Northern Ireland. 858 01:02:59,640 --> 01:03:06,160 So, can you give an example of the areas of the troubles that are still closed? 859 01:03:06,720 --> 01:03:13,240 I can't say precisely, because that would put me in jeopardy. 860 01:03:15,080 --> 01:03:18,520 And it would put Colin in deep jeopardy. 861 01:03:19,400 --> 01:03:21,800 But there are certain areas 862 01:03:22,960 --> 01:03:26,776 of the troubles which have simply not been talked about at all. 863 01:03:27,400 --> 01:03:30,280 There are things about, 864 01:03:32,480 --> 01:03:35,280 there is a suicide in Northern Ireland 865 01:03:35,960 --> 01:03:41,260 of a military intelligence officer, one of the key events. It is an official secret. 866 01:03:41,420 --> 01:03:47,940 A suicide is an official secret and so far no one has written about it. 867 01:03:49,120 --> 01:03:56,000 And some of the events around that are appalling, in that he ran agents, 868 01:03:56,320 --> 01:04:02,640 agents, who were 14 and 15 year old Catholic schoolgirls. 869 01:04:03,840 --> 01:04:08,880 This is how desperate the army at some stage became to get intelligence. 870 01:04:09,200 --> 01:04:13,320 And you kind of say: "How do you run a 14 year old Catholic schoolgirl." 871 01:04:19,200 --> 01:04:20,880 In the story of Colin Wallace 872 01:04:21,320 --> 01:04:25,120 the press helps direct the present by spreading fake news 873 01:04:25,360 --> 01:04:30,120 and the media helps digest the past by creating a discussion about the past. 874 01:04:31,000 --> 01:04:34,936 The role of departments of the state in creating and shaping reality 875 01:04:34,960 --> 01:04:36,457 is not acknowledged. 876 01:04:36,481 --> 01:04:39,480 And even after the media has become aware of this, 877 01:04:39,640 --> 01:04:43,520 it does not inform the public of the implications of that omission. 878 01:04:44,520 --> 01:04:49,480 Power is not held to account, no key decision makers are held to account, 879 01:04:49,760 --> 01:04:53,400 and they and their organizations make no admission of wrong-doing. 880 01:04:54,400 --> 01:04:58,920 The files that would serve as proof of their actions either destroyed or hidden. 881 01:05:00,080 --> 01:05:03,800 In this story the press serves as a complex mechanism 882 01:05:03,880 --> 01:05:06,840 that helps to reinforce and legitimize power. 883 01:05:08,000 --> 01:05:10,456 Allegations of wrong-doing and injustice 884 01:05:10,480 --> 01:05:13,216 become lost in inquiries and legal disputes, 885 01:05:13,240 --> 01:05:15,896 that drag on to this day and that most people 886 01:05:15,920 --> 01:05:18,080 no longer understand or believe. 887 01:05:18,560 --> 01:05:22,680 We are told that a free press will hold power to account. 888 01:05:23,240 --> 01:05:28,216 But what of those individuals and institutions that will never be held to account 889 01:05:28,240 --> 01:05:34,120 and have never been held to account. Should the press include that truth in its reporting? 890 01:05:35,120 --> 01:05:40,120 Or are some truths destined to be nothing more than versions of fake news? 891 01:05:42,680 --> 01:05:49,680 Former residents of the Kincora Boys’ Home are still fighting for justice. 892 01:05:50,320 --> 01:05:54,516 The British Home Office, Foreign Office, MI5 and MI6 continue to engage in PsyOps. 893 01:05:54,540 --> 01:05:58,976 The British Army’s psychological warfare unit is currently called "The 77th Brigade". 894 01:05:59,000 --> 01:06:03,600 Together they target Britain’s perceived enemies, real and imaginary, with impunity. 895 01:06:03,800 --> 01:06:10,496 Colin Wallace continues to participate as a witness in inquiries relating to his time in Northern Ireland. 896 01:06:10,520 --> 01:06:14,176 He lives on the same street, in the same house, in the same village where 897 01:06:14,200 --> 01:06:18,720 the unsolved murder of Jonathan Lewis took place over 40 years ago. 86847

Can't find what you're looking for?
Get subtitles in any language from opensubtitles.com, and translate them here.