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These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated: 1 00:00:10,281 --> 00:00:18,281 HIGH PITCHED NOTE 2 00:00:30,200 --> 00:00:34,720 MUSIC 3 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:38,240 The Abu Grahib pictures raised the question, 4 00:00:38,640 --> 00:00:41,519 where were the doctors while this was going on? 5 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:44,480 Either they directly witnessed the abuse 6 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:47,880 or they witnessed the consequences of it. 7 00:00:48,160 --> 00:00:50,320 Why hadn't they protested? 8 00:00:50,920 --> 00:00:58,920 MUSIC 9 00:01:00,080 --> 00:01:02,400 Here doctors weren't complicit. 10 00:01:02,600 --> 00:01:05,440 They were a centrepiece of torture. 11 00:01:05,640 --> 00:01:09,039 They were enablers, they were facilitators, 12 00:01:09,040 --> 00:01:10,840 they were authorizers. 13 00:01:11,320 --> 00:01:19,320 MUSIC 14 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:32,919 From Hippocrates to now, the standard for 15 00:01:32,920 --> 00:01:35,199 the healing professions has been simple. 16 00:01:35,200 --> 00:01:38,759 That the obligation is first and foremost 17 00:01:38,760 --> 00:01:41,519 to the patient's interest and well being. 18 00:01:41,520 --> 00:01:44,120 Torture shatters that covenant. 19 00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:52,999 How have American physicians and 20 00:01:53,000 --> 00:01:55,919 psychologists come to sanction and implement 21 00:01:55,920 --> 00:01:58,399 torture in our military prisons? 22 00:01:58,400 --> 00:02:00,159 And why haven't they been held accountable 23 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:01,640 for their actions? 24 00:02:26,720 --> 00:02:30,120 FILM REEL ROLLING 25 00:02:30,360 --> 00:02:32,279 On behalf of the Army of the United States, 26 00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:34,280 I accept your surrender. 27 00:02:38,600 --> 00:02:42,159 You, your officers, and men will 28 00:02:42,160 --> 00:02:45,079 be given treatment in accordance with the principles 29 00:02:45,080 --> 00:02:47,120 of the Geneva Convention. 30 00:02:47,640 --> 00:02:52,440 PIANO 31 00:02:58,480 --> 00:03:00,879 Sickened by the atrocities of World War Two, 32 00:03:00,880 --> 00:03:03,319 the United States and its allies held trials in 33 00:03:03,320 --> 00:03:05,239 Nuremberg, Germany to determine who is 34 00:03:05,240 --> 00:03:09,400 responsible for the heinous acts that had occurred. 35 00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:14,479 Doctors were among the first to be convicted 36 00:03:14,480 --> 00:03:16,599 and executed for their war crimes. 37 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:21,440 Which included lethal medical experiments on prisoners. 38 00:03:22,040 --> 00:03:24,599 The trial of the doctors lead to more rigorous codes 39 00:03:24,600 --> 00:03:27,040 for medical care of captives. 40 00:03:28,320 --> 00:03:31,919 In 1949, the Geneva Convention also strengthened 41 00:03:31,920 --> 00:03:33,839 the prohibitions against using torture to 42 00:03:33,840 --> 00:03:37,040 get information from prisoners of war. 43 00:03:38,920 --> 00:03:41,159 Despite these efforts, many countries continued 44 00:03:41,160 --> 00:03:45,160 to torture prisoners of war for information and propaganda. 45 00:03:48,200 --> 00:03:50,399 I was in a room that was so small and I could 46 00:03:50,400 --> 00:03:52,000 not lie down. 47 00:03:52,560 --> 00:03:57,839 I was not familiar to stand up to close my eyes, 48 00:03:57,840 --> 00:03:59,360 I like to recline. 49 00:04:01,040 --> 00:04:03,039 The experience of American POW's 50 00:04:03,040 --> 00:04:06,439 in Korea lead the United States to develop a program 51 00:04:06,440 --> 00:04:10,000 to train soldiers how to survive torture if captured. 52 00:04:13,280 --> 00:04:15,560 The program was called SERE. 53 00:04:29,320 --> 00:04:32,559 At the same time, the CIA supported secret research 54 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:36,079 on how experimental drugs induced comas 55 00:04:36,080 --> 00:04:39,560 and methods like sensory deprivation alter the mind. 56 00:04:41,320 --> 00:04:49,200 MUSIC 57 00:04:49,360 --> 00:04:56,920 ELECTRICAL BUZZING 58 00:04:57,800 --> 00:05:04,640 THUMPING 59 00:05:05,840 --> 00:05:12,480 TELEPHONE RINGING 60 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:14,439 SCREAMING 61 00:05:14,440 --> 00:05:18,640 TELEPHONE RINGING 62 00:05:18,840 --> 00:05:21,719 The CIA learned from mind control experiments 63 00:05:21,720 --> 00:05:24,559 and tortures used by totalitarian regimes 64 00:05:24,560 --> 00:05:27,119 that several days of sleep deprivation is 65 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:29,880 a powerful way to break a prisoner down. 66 00:05:30,080 --> 00:05:33,320 TELEPHONE RINGING 67 00:05:33,440 --> 00:05:35,759 My reading is for most people who've been 68 00:05:35,760 --> 00:05:40,119 subjected to that, they will have psychotic like thinking, 69 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:43,639 will be very disorganized, and I think very unreliable 70 00:05:43,640 --> 00:05:45,280 in terms of what they say. 71 00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:49,479 And it really is kind of very harsh and 72 00:05:49,480 --> 00:05:52,800 very cruel to try and keep people awake. 73 00:05:54,840 --> 00:05:59,319 In 1975, a secret CIA manual of abusive 74 00:05:59,320 --> 00:06:02,720 interrogation techniques was discovered and banned. 75 00:06:03,360 --> 00:06:06,479 But in 1999, some of these methods surfaced 76 00:06:06,480 --> 00:06:08,399 during an espionage case led by the 77 00:06:08,400 --> 00:06:12,240 Naval Criminal Investigative Service, or NCIS. 78 00:06:12,840 --> 00:06:15,679 A psychologist played a key role in the interrogation 79 00:06:15,680 --> 00:06:17,999 of a US Naval Officer. 80 00:06:18,000 --> 00:06:21,919 - Petty Officer King was a, he's a cryptologist 81 00:06:21,920 --> 00:06:25,800 who was stationed in Guam in fall of 1999. 82 00:06:27,400 --> 00:06:33,040 He had been given a new duty assignment in the states. 83 00:06:33,640 --> 00:06:35,919 And before he could take that new job, 84 00:06:35,920 --> 00:06:38,839 he had to have a polygraph. 85 00:06:38,840 --> 00:06:44,319 He took his polygraph and came up with 86 00:06:44,320 --> 00:06:45,799 an indeterminate result. 87 00:06:45,800 --> 00:06:49,359 - Well after they told me I had failed the polygraph test, 88 00:06:49,360 --> 00:06:51,359 I heard somebody say spy. 89 00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:54,439 And from that time on, my life became a living nightmare. 90 00:06:54,440 --> 00:06:57,639 - They launched into a full scale interrogation 91 00:06:57,640 --> 00:07:00,000 of him in Guam. 92 00:07:00,520 --> 00:07:04,360 That involved several days of 93 00:07:06,160 --> 00:07:09,040 sleep deprivation essentially. 94 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:12,359 Excessive interrogation and threats, it was almost 95 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:15,080 a full day without sleep. 96 00:07:15,240 --> 00:07:17,839 Then they let him sleep, hour or two hours, 97 00:07:17,840 --> 00:07:21,079 but they would have the phone ringing constantly. 98 00:07:21,080 --> 00:07:25,440 So he would never get any decent amount of sleep. 99 00:07:28,280 --> 00:07:31,479 I got to the point where I just gave them 100 00:07:31,480 --> 00:07:33,559 everything they wanted, just to try and get 101 00:07:33,560 --> 00:07:34,799 out of there sir. 102 00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:36,880 I was an emotional wreck. 103 00:07:39,640 --> 00:07:41,159 I'm not proud of it. 104 00:07:41,160 --> 00:07:44,239 - There was tapes of him, audio tapes, 105 00:07:44,240 --> 00:07:46,479 that we eventually got where he's sobbing saying, 106 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:47,840 I don't know what you from me, 107 00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:49,519 just tell me what you want me to say 108 00:07:49,520 --> 00:07:51,640 so we can stop this. 109 00:07:51,800 --> 00:07:54,999 He would say, I don't understand this. 110 00:07:55,000 --> 00:07:58,159 I can't take this anymore. 111 00:07:58,160 --> 00:08:01,799 And he had made suicidal statements. 112 00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:05,319 By the time he got back into the Washington DC area, 113 00:08:05,320 --> 00:08:09,320 he pleaded for help from a psychologist or psychiatrist. 114 00:08:09,560 --> 00:08:12,439 They brought in NCIS psychologist 115 00:08:12,440 --> 00:08:15,279 Dr. Michael Gelles to, 116 00:08:15,280 --> 00:08:18,880 as far as Petty Officer King knew, to help him. 117 00:08:18,945 --> 00:08:21,799 - I want to be able to recall stuff, 118 00:08:21,826 --> 00:08:24,092 That, according to the polygraph... 119 00:08:24,117 --> 00:08:27,655 I have inside me. 120 00:08:27,680 --> 00:08:33,519 - When a enlisted man is told by NCIS, who are essentially 121 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:39,479 acting as his command, that the polygraph is infallible, 122 00:08:39,480 --> 00:08:40,760 he starts to believe it. 123 00:08:41,754 --> 00:08:48,082 When I look, when I try to think on this, I can't see it 124 00:08:48,168 --> 00:08:51,657 and I was wondering if maybe hypnosis or drugs could help me 125 00:08:51,681 --> 00:08:54,695 if it's a suppressed memory or something like that. 126 00:08:54,720 --> 00:08:58,079 - We saw on the tape when they finally gave it to us, 127 00:08:58,080 --> 00:09:01,599 that Dr. Gelles kept saying, "well you gotta 128 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:02,839 give 'em something. 129 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:06,280 Otherwise we can't, there's nothing I can do for you." 130 00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:10,199 This was Mike Gelles acting in the role of a mental 131 00:09:10,200 --> 00:09:13,199 health professional, but in fact, acting as 132 00:09:13,200 --> 00:09:16,999 an interrogator or with an interrogation team, 133 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:20,160 against a person who was medically debilitated. 134 00:09:20,560 --> 00:09:23,119 Against all medical, psychological ethics, 135 00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:25,840 working for his client, the NCIS. 136 00:09:27,640 --> 00:09:29,439 Dr. Gelles characterized himself as, 137 00:09:29,440 --> 00:09:32,839 I'm not here interrogating you, I'm just the doctor here. 138 00:09:32,840 --> 00:09:34,239 I'm just here to help you. 139 00:09:34,240 --> 00:09:36,840 I'm not one of the interrogators. 140 00:09:37,320 --> 00:09:39,279 We later find out that they actually had evidence 141 00:09:39,280 --> 00:09:42,239 that showed what he said could not have happened. 142 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:44,040 And they knew it by the time that the, 143 00:09:44,280 --> 00:09:45,880 Dr. Gelles was there. 144 00:09:46,560 --> 00:09:50,799 Within a couple days, he grabbed a knife and went to 145 00:09:50,800 --> 00:09:55,000 stab himself with it when an NCIS officer intervened. 146 00:09:56,680 --> 00:09:58,919 The positive thing that came out of it 147 00:09:58,920 --> 00:10:01,519 was they finally got representation. 148 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:04,080 We were finally able to get involved in the case. 149 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:07,359 The case against Petty Officer Daniel King 150 00:10:07,360 --> 00:10:10,519 was dismissed and he was honourably discharged 151 00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:13,280 after almost two years in prison. 152 00:10:14,240 --> 00:10:16,679 I love my country, I love my baby. 153 00:10:16,680 --> 00:10:19,560 I've never betrayed it and I would never betray it. 154 00:10:21,880 --> 00:10:23,759 The King case was a forerunner 155 00:10:23,760 --> 00:10:26,039 of the indefinite detention and psychological 156 00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:28,279 tortures that would be used extensively 157 00:10:28,280 --> 00:10:31,120 on detainees after 9.11. 158 00:10:31,560 --> 00:10:34,879 It also foreshadowed programs established by the CIA 159 00:10:34,880 --> 00:10:36,519 and Department of Defense. 160 00:10:36,520 --> 00:10:40,399 In which doctors crossed over from clinical services 161 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:42,640 to detainee interrogations. 162 00:10:44,480 --> 00:10:47,639 Dr. Michael Gelles continued as Chief Psychologist 163 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:50,439 of the Naval Criminal Investigative Service. 164 00:10:50,440 --> 00:10:54,839 After 9.11 he was assigned to a special Pentagon Task Force 165 00:10:54,840 --> 00:10:57,239 and consulted on detainee interrogations 166 00:10:57,240 --> 00:11:00,480 in Afghanistan, Guantanamo, and Iraq. 167 00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:11,320 Tonight we are a country awakened to danger 168 00:11:11,880 --> 00:11:14,039 and called to defend freedom. 169 00:11:14,040 --> 00:11:17,320 Whether we bring our enemies to justice 170 00:11:17,680 --> 00:11:21,800 or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done. 171 00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:28,599 APPLAUSE 172 00:11:28,600 --> 00:11:30,560 EXPLOSION 173 00:11:31,560 --> 00:11:33,239 Less than three weeks later, 174 00:11:33,240 --> 00:11:36,519 US forces invaded Afghanistan in retaliation 175 00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:38,719 for the September 11th terrorist attacks 176 00:11:38,720 --> 00:11:40,160 on the United States. 177 00:11:41,560 --> 00:11:44,360 MUSIC 178 00:11:45,560 --> 00:11:48,639 In a radical new policy, the Bush administration 179 00:11:48,640 --> 00:11:52,079 declared Afghan prisoners enemy combatants. 180 00:11:52,080 --> 00:11:54,880 No longer protected by the Geneva Convention. 181 00:11:57,600 --> 00:12:00,559 Before 9.11, prisoners of war were interrogated 182 00:12:00,560 --> 00:12:02,759 according to the army field manual 183 00:12:02,760 --> 00:12:05,400 that followed the Geneva Convention. 184 00:12:05,520 --> 00:12:08,880 The new interrogation methods involved torture. 185 00:12:10,880 --> 00:12:13,519 We have no alternative, but to meet the enemy 186 00:12:13,520 --> 00:12:14,839 where he dwells. 187 00:12:14,840 --> 00:12:18,639 We must and we will use every means 188 00:12:18,640 --> 00:12:21,479 at our disposal to ensure the freedom 189 00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:23,440 and security of the American people. 190 00:12:25,000 --> 00:12:28,799 In 2001, the CIA had few agents who were expert 191 00:12:28,800 --> 00:12:31,800 in legal methods of interrogating detainees. 192 00:12:32,720 --> 00:12:34,719 We had no interrogators. 193 00:12:34,720 --> 00:12:37,039 The closest we came were security officers who would 194 00:12:37,040 --> 00:12:40,239 quiz you if your lie detector test, 195 00:12:40,240 --> 00:12:42,279 they didn't turn out quite right, you know? 196 00:12:42,280 --> 00:12:44,319 Or people would interview people who wanted to 197 00:12:44,320 --> 00:12:46,159 come on board. 198 00:12:46,160 --> 00:12:49,280 - Two psychologists, contracted by the CIA, 199 00:12:49,800 --> 00:12:52,879 were among the first to introduce abusive interrogation 200 00:12:52,880 --> 00:12:56,519 techniques, doctors James Mitchell and Bruce Jessen 201 00:12:56,520 --> 00:12:59,519 were experts in SERE survival training. 202 00:12:59,520 --> 00:13:03,400 They adapted the SERE torture regimen for use on detainees. 203 00:13:04,160 --> 00:13:07,039 - Dr. Bruce Jessen was the Chief of Psychology 204 00:13:07,040 --> 00:13:08,839 of the Air Force's survival school. 205 00:13:08,840 --> 00:13:11,439 The psychologists were there so that if someone 206 00:13:11,440 --> 00:13:13,799 actually was having a difficulty, some kind of 207 00:13:13,800 --> 00:13:17,359 psychological breakdown, that then we could stop, 208 00:13:17,360 --> 00:13:20,159 do a timeout, and actually bring in the psychologist 209 00:13:20,160 --> 00:13:21,919 so they could talk people through. 210 00:13:21,920 --> 00:13:23,399 What we were doing, 211 00:13:23,400 --> 00:13:25,079 in resistance to interrogation training, 212 00:13:25,080 --> 00:13:28,040 it was for the benefit of our own forces. 213 00:13:29,160 --> 00:13:31,759 Seeing that these people actually were the architects 214 00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:34,559 behind the torture program just 215 00:13:34,560 --> 00:13:36,720 it made me physically ill. 216 00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:43,560 DOGS BARKING 217 00:13:43,720 --> 00:13:46,039 The brutal methods organized by 218 00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:49,639 psychologists Mitchell and Jessen for CIA interrogators 219 00:13:49,640 --> 00:13:53,320 came to be called enhanced interrogation techniques. 220 00:13:54,160 --> 00:13:57,079 These techniques were soon adopted by army interrogators 221 00:13:57,080 --> 00:13:59,919 at Guantanamo with the help of a psychiatrist 222 00:13:59,920 --> 00:14:02,039 and a psychologist. 223 00:14:02,040 --> 00:14:04,319 From there, they were exported to Afghanistan 224 00:14:04,320 --> 00:14:06,479 and Iraqi detention sites. 225 00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:08,919 The program became so widespread it was only 226 00:14:08,920 --> 00:14:11,239 a matter of time before the world knew that the 227 00:14:11,240 --> 00:14:14,439 United States was torturing detainees. 228 00:14:14,440 --> 00:14:17,439 - As torture became more and more controversial, 229 00:14:17,440 --> 00:14:21,919 and the lawyers were more and more under pressure 230 00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:25,679 to find a justification for these methods. 231 00:14:25,680 --> 00:14:28,879 They turned to the doctors for an opinion 232 00:14:28,880 --> 00:14:31,399 on whether they impose severe pain, 233 00:14:31,400 --> 00:14:33,679 mental or physical pain or suffering. 234 00:14:33,680 --> 00:14:35,800 Which is the legal definition of torture. 235 00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:41,679 In 2009, the special review of the 236 00:14:41,680 --> 00:14:44,639 enhanced interrogation program by the CIA 237 00:14:44,640 --> 00:14:47,639 Office of Inspector General was declassified 238 00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:51,120 over the fierce objections of the intelligence agency. 239 00:14:51,520 --> 00:14:55,119 Special guidelines from the CIA Office of Medical Services 240 00:14:55,120 --> 00:14:57,120 were also declassified. 241 00:14:57,440 --> 00:14:59,799 The critical role of doctors in the enhanced 242 00:14:59,800 --> 00:15:03,159 interrogation program can be traced through these documents, 243 00:15:03,160 --> 00:15:05,680 and the memos of the office of legal counsel. 244 00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:09,439 The CIA doctors and the legal counsel lawyers 245 00:15:09,440 --> 00:15:12,679 described the enhanced techniques in such detail 246 00:15:12,680 --> 00:15:14,919 that their instructions could be the script 247 00:15:14,920 --> 00:15:17,319 for a training video for doctors assigned 248 00:15:17,320 --> 00:15:19,560 to detainee interrogations. 249 00:15:20,880 --> 00:15:23,400 ELEVATOR 250 00:15:23,920 --> 00:15:26,079 Captured terrorists may be subjected 251 00:15:26,080 --> 00:15:29,119 to a wide range of legally sanctioned techniques 252 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:32,319 designed to psychologically dislocate the detainee, 253 00:15:32,320 --> 00:15:36,159 maximize his feelings of vulnerability and helplessness. 254 00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:39,479 And reduce or eliminate his will to resist our efforts 255 00:15:39,480 --> 00:15:42,240 to obtain critical intelligence. 256 00:15:45,240 --> 00:15:48,920 CHAINS RATTLING 257 00:15:50,200 --> 00:15:55,400 FOOTSTEPS 258 00:15:56,000 --> 00:15:58,600 STAMP 259 00:15:58,760 --> 00:16:06,080 HEAVY BREATHING 260 00:16:10,200 --> 00:16:12,159 They turned to the doctors. 261 00:16:12,160 --> 00:16:15,599 They basically said, we determine that severe pain 262 00:16:15,600 --> 00:16:17,479 means it's very intense. 263 00:16:17,480 --> 00:16:20,359 And of long duration. 264 00:16:20,360 --> 00:16:22,479 And sometimes are violent. 265 00:16:22,480 --> 00:16:25,599 Could you tell us doc, does this method 266 00:16:25,600 --> 00:16:27,319 meet that threshold? 267 00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:31,879 And not once, according to either the legal documents 268 00:16:31,880 --> 00:16:36,519 or the medical memos, not once did the doctors 269 00:16:36,520 --> 00:16:39,280 ever say, "no you can't do this." 270 00:16:45,480 --> 00:16:47,399 Appropriate medical and psychological 271 00:16:47,400 --> 00:16:50,079 personnel must be on site during all detainee 272 00:16:50,080 --> 00:16:52,880 interrogations employing enhanced techniques. 273 00:16:55,680 --> 00:16:58,359 The use of each specific enhanced technique 274 00:16:58,360 --> 00:17:01,200 must be approved by headquarters in advance. 275 00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:15,559 In the government memos, 276 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:17,799 enhanced interrogation techniques fall roughly 277 00:17:17,800 --> 00:17:19,920 into three groups. 278 00:17:20,640 --> 00:17:23,120 Methods that involve physical assault. 279 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:32,320 Those that can induce dangerous levels of physical stress. 280 00:17:36,160 --> 00:17:38,359 And those that can psychologically debilitate 281 00:17:38,360 --> 00:17:39,360 the prisoner. 282 00:17:43,360 --> 00:17:46,360 Methods are combined to increase the pressure. 283 00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:49,720 This also increases the severity of the abuse. 284 00:17:50,920 --> 00:17:54,599 And one of the most monstrous aspects 285 00:17:54,600 --> 00:17:58,599 of the office of medical services memos, 286 00:17:58,600 --> 00:18:01,439 was the reference to the Hippocratic Oath. 287 00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:06,319 It says, remember you must abide by your 288 00:18:06,320 --> 00:18:09,239 obligation to do no harm, it says that. 289 00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:12,559 - The doctor is responsible for keeping the detainee alive, 290 00:18:12,560 --> 00:18:14,599 he checks that the blood pressure and heart rate 291 00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:16,079 are not dangerously high. 292 00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:17,799 And measures the blood oxygen level with 293 00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:19,680 this pulse oximeter. 294 00:18:20,560 --> 00:18:22,999 After prolonged exposure to cold water, 295 00:18:23,000 --> 00:18:24,719 he may check the body temperature 296 00:18:24,720 --> 00:18:26,240 in case of hypothermia. 297 00:18:26,880 --> 00:18:29,199 When there are more than 15 applications 298 00:18:29,200 --> 00:18:31,679 of the waterboard in a 24 hour period, 299 00:18:31,680 --> 00:18:34,039 he has to do careful medical assessments 300 00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:35,839 after the later applications. 301 00:18:35,840 --> 00:18:38,679 In the rare cases, when a prisoner is difficult 302 00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:41,199 to resuscitate, the doctor has to perform 303 00:18:41,200 --> 00:18:43,280 an emergency tracheotomy. 304 00:18:45,600 --> 00:18:48,519 Physicians for Human Rights believes that 305 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:52,799 the safety officer fallacy takes 306 00:18:52,800 --> 00:18:57,079 physicians from being healers to being 307 00:18:57,080 --> 00:18:58,560 calibrators of harm. 308 00:18:58,720 --> 00:19:04,119 They serve as a sort of gasoline on the fire. 309 00:19:04,120 --> 00:19:07,799 Because interrogators think that they can go harder 310 00:19:07,800 --> 00:19:10,319 because there's a health professional there. 311 00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:15,079 That they can push the detainee closer to the edge 312 00:19:15,080 --> 00:19:16,919 because there's a safety net there 313 00:19:16,920 --> 00:19:19,239 in the form of a health professional to catch them. 314 00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:22,199 - The CIA Office of Medical Services instructs the 315 00:19:22,200 --> 00:19:26,000 doctor to keep thorough systematic records. 316 00:19:27,080 --> 00:19:29,679 In order to best inform future medical judgements 317 00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:32,519 and recommendations, it is important that every 318 00:19:32,520 --> 00:19:36,319 application of the waterboard be thoroughly documented. 319 00:19:36,320 --> 00:19:40,320 How long each application and the entire procedure lasted. 320 00:19:41,040 --> 00:19:42,639 How much water was used. 321 00:19:42,640 --> 00:19:45,440 Realizing that much splashes off. 322 00:19:45,720 --> 00:19:48,719 If the naso or oropharynx was filled, 323 00:19:48,720 --> 00:19:51,719 what sort of volume was expelled and how the 324 00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:54,159 subject looked between each treatment. 325 00:19:54,160 --> 00:19:56,919 - So to warp a person, to warp a professional, 326 00:19:56,920 --> 00:19:59,679 a doctor for example, into doing this kind of thing 327 00:19:59,680 --> 00:20:01,879 really is quite a trick. 328 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:05,919 The sad part about it is it's so easy 329 00:20:05,920 --> 00:20:08,599 with these group mentalities and all the kinds of things 330 00:20:08,600 --> 00:20:11,799 that you can manipulate people into doing 331 00:20:11,800 --> 00:20:13,440 against their better instincts. 332 00:20:17,080 --> 00:20:18,719 For walling, a flexible false 333 00:20:18,720 --> 00:20:20,800 wall will be constructed. 334 00:20:24,800 --> 00:20:25,839 SLAMMING 335 00:20:25,840 --> 00:20:27,719 The idea is to create a sound that will make 336 00:20:27,720 --> 00:20:30,319 the impact seem far worse than any injury that might 337 00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:32,240 result from the action. 338 00:20:34,240 --> 00:20:37,119 The CIA had special equipment built 339 00:20:37,120 --> 00:20:38,999 for the enhanced techniques. 340 00:20:39,000 --> 00:20:41,399 The water board was built so that the interrogators 341 00:20:41,400 --> 00:20:44,920 could swing the detainee upright in an emergency. 342 00:20:46,520 --> 00:20:50,520 Cramped confinement boxes came in small and large sizes. 343 00:20:52,520 --> 00:20:54,279 You have informed us that you would spend 344 00:20:54,280 --> 00:20:56,120 at most two hours in this box. 345 00:20:56,560 --> 00:20:59,039 You have informed us of the purpose of using this box. 346 00:20:59,040 --> 00:21:01,679 It's not to interfere with his senses or his personality, 347 00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:03,839 but to cause him physical discomfort that will 348 00:21:03,840 --> 00:21:06,880 encourage him to disclose critical information. 349 00:21:18,800 --> 00:21:19,800 SLAMS 350 00:21:25,000 --> 00:21:26,000 SLAMS 351 00:21:54,360 --> 00:21:56,399 We've had a lot of debate about torture in this 352 00:21:56,400 --> 00:21:58,519 country and whether its ever justified, 353 00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:00,199 I think it's never justified. 354 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:02,719 In part, because as we've seen, that once you start 355 00:22:02,720 --> 00:22:05,399 down the road of torture, it never stops 356 00:22:05,400 --> 00:22:07,760 and it gets worse and worse and worse. 357 00:22:08,240 --> 00:22:14,240 PULSE BEEPING 358 00:22:15,400 --> 00:22:16,840 Keep going. 359 00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:26,439 Most seriously, for reasons of physical 360 00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:28,599 fatigue or psychological resignation, 361 00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:30,639 the subject may simply give up. 362 00:22:30,640 --> 00:22:32,759 Allowing excessive filling of the airways 363 00:22:32,760 --> 00:22:34,919 and loss of consciousness. 364 00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:37,800 An unresponsive subject should be righted immediately. 365 00:22:42,280 --> 00:22:50,280 GROANING 366 00:22:57,000 --> 00:22:58,680 Doctor! 367 00:23:07,480 --> 00:23:12,360 Today, doctors are essential to torturing regimes. 368 00:23:13,760 --> 00:23:18,639 Half of all torture survivors report seeing a doc 369 00:23:18,640 --> 00:23:20,520 supervising their torture. 370 00:23:21,360 --> 00:23:23,759 The doc keeps alive the ones who are supposed 371 00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:25,359 to be kept alive. 372 00:23:25,360 --> 00:23:29,279 The doc devises methods of torture, such as shock, 373 00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:34,880 such as cold, such as isolation or psychological stress, 374 00:23:35,400 --> 00:23:38,679 that does not leave wounds that can be interpreted 375 00:23:38,680 --> 00:23:40,519 as evidence. 376 00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:44,919 And the doc uses the bureaucracy of the modern state 377 00:23:44,920 --> 00:23:48,599 to conceal the medical records, to falsify 378 00:23:48,600 --> 00:23:52,160 medical records, and to falsify death certificates. 379 00:24:01,520 --> 00:24:04,719 It was clear that the abuse had been quite extensive 380 00:24:04,720 --> 00:24:07,439 and involved very large numbers of prisoners. 381 00:24:07,440 --> 00:24:11,759 And also involved really extraordinary levels 382 00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:13,680 of gratuitous violence. 383 00:24:16,040 --> 00:24:19,519 I decided, given the gravity of the issues, 384 00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:24,000 to be extremely conservative in my approach. 385 00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:28,839 I wouldn't use witness accounts. 386 00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:31,160 I wouldn't use lawyer statements. 387 00:24:31,600 --> 00:24:33,319 I wouldn't use press accounts. 388 00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:36,200 I would only use first source government documents. 389 00:24:38,480 --> 00:24:42,839 As it happened, the ACLU was conducting a gigantic 390 00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:46,599 set of lawsuits under the Freedom of Information Act 391 00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:49,040 to obtain government records. 392 00:24:52,880 --> 00:24:56,320 They put these documents up on a website. 393 00:24:57,880 --> 00:24:59,519 I read somewhere in the neighbourhood of 394 00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:01,120 60 to 80,000 pages. 395 00:25:02,560 --> 00:25:05,239 Once you start getting that many documents, 396 00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:08,480 it's possible to cross link events. 397 00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:16,240 The story of the ice man, for example. 398 00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:21,040 That story resides in about 15 different documents. 399 00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:24,279 And until you put them all together, 400 00:25:24,280 --> 00:25:26,799 you can't see the extraordinary narrative. 401 00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:29,759 Because this guy was picked up at his home 402 00:25:29,760 --> 00:25:33,920 by Navy Seals, there was a huge fight at his home. 403 00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:38,640 They took him to a Navy Seals base, he was naked. 404 00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:41,039 It was November. 405 00:25:41,040 --> 00:25:43,999 He said, "I feel like I'm gonna die." 406 00:25:44,000 --> 00:25:46,199 And the interrogator said to him, "You're gonna 407 00:25:46,200 --> 00:25:47,919 wish you were dead." 408 00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:49,759 A medic watched as they worked him over 409 00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:52,400 in something called the Romper Room. 410 00:25:53,320 --> 00:25:55,839 Then they took him to Abu Ghraib. 411 00:25:55,840 --> 00:25:59,359 He said, "I can't breathe" to the entry people. 412 00:25:59,360 --> 00:26:02,200 But was not given a physical exam. 413 00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:06,359 The Seals turned him over to the CIA. 414 00:26:06,360 --> 00:26:09,559 The CIA took him into a shower room 415 00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:12,999 and they had the guards tie his hands behind his back 416 00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:15,000 and they hoisted him up. 417 00:26:16,120 --> 00:26:18,999 When you hang somebody backwards by their wrists, 418 00:26:19,000 --> 00:26:21,799 it prevents the lungs from expanding. 419 00:26:21,800 --> 00:26:24,679 And when you add to that, broke ribs 420 00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:27,639 and a sandbag over his head, it makes breathing 421 00:26:27,640 --> 00:26:29,680 even more difficult. 422 00:26:30,080 --> 00:26:33,800 The final cause of death was asphyxiation. 423 00:26:35,920 --> 00:26:38,279 Then they called the guards back in. 424 00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:41,639 And the guards, the CIA guy told the guards, 425 00:26:41,640 --> 00:26:44,679 "Look, he's faking it. 426 00:26:44,680 --> 00:26:47,919 He won't talk and he keeps slumping down." 427 00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:51,119 Well the guards tried to lift him up, he was dead weight. 428 00:26:51,120 --> 00:26:52,840 In fact, he was dead. 429 00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:04,680 The CIA freaked out at this guy being dead. 430 00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:08,240 They called intelligence commander Apus, 431 00:27:08,800 --> 00:27:11,679 who came in and said, "I'm not going down for this, 432 00:27:11,680 --> 00:27:13,920 what'd you do to this guy?" 433 00:27:14,320 --> 00:27:16,519 So they sent one of their lieutenants off 434 00:27:16,520 --> 00:27:18,079 to grab some ice. 435 00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:20,719 And packed him in the body bag. 436 00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:24,240 And then the guards had their photo shoot. 437 00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:29,759 The next thing that happened was in the morning, 438 00:27:29,760 --> 00:27:32,320 they had to get him out of the shower room 439 00:27:32,440 --> 00:27:35,480 and they had to take him through the prison cell blocks. 440 00:27:41,080 --> 00:27:45,039 So they called in a medic, who put an IV in his arm, 441 00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:48,279 and wheeled him out saying he was sick. 442 00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:51,319 The narrative of where his autopsy was done, 443 00:27:51,320 --> 00:27:54,399 who did it, and why the death certificate 444 00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:57,840 was suppressed is still classified. 445 00:27:59,640 --> 00:28:01,719 Although the United States was obligated 446 00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:04,919 to return his body to the al Jamadi family, 447 00:28:04,920 --> 00:28:07,599 he was buried in an unmarked grave. 448 00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:09,439 His family learned what happened to him 449 00:28:09,440 --> 00:28:11,920 through the Abu Ghraib photos. 450 00:28:14,360 --> 00:28:17,119 The world knows Mr. Jamadi as the body defiled 451 00:28:17,120 --> 00:28:18,840 by Abu Ghraib guards. 452 00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:22,119 The press focused on who tortured him 453 00:28:22,120 --> 00:28:25,120 and whether officers would be prosecuted for his murder. 454 00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:27,679 One fact is rarely noted. 455 00:28:27,680 --> 00:28:31,200 Mr. Jamadi's fate was sealed by two medics, a doctor, 456 00:28:31,360 --> 00:28:34,399 and the medical command responsible for his healthcare, 457 00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:36,919 according to the third Geneva Convention, 458 00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:39,440 ratified by the United States. 459 00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:45,640 The number of doctors involved in detainee abuse is unknown. 460 00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:48,319 But in declassified government documents, 461 00:28:48,320 --> 00:28:50,919 the al Jamadi case is just one among many 462 00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:54,240 involving medical complicity and cover up of torture. 463 00:28:58,040 --> 00:29:00,119 The pathologist working for the 464 00:29:00,120 --> 00:29:04,799 Armed Forces Institute of Pathology collectively 465 00:29:04,800 --> 00:29:08,919 and systematically and uniformly suppressed 466 00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:14,759 death reports in US prisons 467 00:29:14,760 --> 00:29:17,160 in Afghanistan and Iraq. 468 00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:20,759 To the extent that they ever became aware of them 469 00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:23,720 in the CIA rendition presence as well. 470 00:29:24,097 --> 00:29:27,041 There have been detainees here since last July. 471 00:29:27,108 --> 00:29:29,375 Nobody knows what cave they are in. 472 00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:31,400 Nobody can reach the detainees. 473 00:29:31,431 --> 00:29:33,831 The Americans dominate the detainees. 474 00:29:34,982 --> 00:29:38,262 They dragged them out of bed naked. 475 00:29:38,820 --> 00:29:40,695 Three of them were released. 476 00:29:40,739 --> 00:29:42,043 Two were kept. 477 00:29:42,121 --> 00:29:43,801 One was taken to Basra. 478 00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:51,120 Secret deaths in prisons alienate populations profoundly. 479 00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:55,839 And in fact, when you look in Iraq and what happened 480 00:29:55,840 --> 00:29:58,599 after the Abu Ghraib experience, 481 00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:02,079 including the death of Jamadi came out, 482 00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:04,199 what happened was that support for our 483 00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:06,759 presence in Iraq dropped from around 70 percent 484 00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:08,200 to around 20 percent. 485 00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:12,319 We lost the moral authority that we had at Iraq. 486 00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:17,199 We lost the Iraq people in a way that radically 487 00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:22,200 transformed the Iraq military and political landscape. 488 00:30:23,480 --> 00:30:26,319 And then of course, the ultimate folly of all this was 489 00:30:26,320 --> 00:30:29,759 that according to military intelligence, 490 00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:32,159 85 percent of the prisoners at Abu Ghraib were 491 00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:36,119 entirely innocent or ignorant of any insurgency 492 00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:37,880 activity whatsoever. 493 00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:52,680 MUSIC 494 00:30:57,800 --> 00:31:01,559 As a doctor who's been evaluating in caring 495 00:31:01,560 --> 00:31:04,159 for torture victims from all over the world, 496 00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:07,759 for over 15 years, individuals that I examine who've been 497 00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:11,199 detained at Abu Ghraib or Guantanamo are among 498 00:31:11,200 --> 00:31:16,399 the most traumatized, scarred both 499 00:31:16,400 --> 00:31:19,999 physically and psychologically and for lack of a better 500 00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:22,239 way at putting it, most damaged individuals 501 00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:23,800 that I've examined. 502 00:31:24,440 --> 00:31:27,199 - Under pressure to obtain useful intelligence, 503 00:31:27,200 --> 00:31:29,719 the Department of Defense established behavioural 504 00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:31,799 science consultation teams. 505 00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:34,679 Made up of both psychiatrists and psychologists 506 00:31:34,680 --> 00:31:37,279 to advice interrogators on strategy 507 00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:41,440 after observing interrogations on TV monitors like this. 508 00:31:42,541 --> 00:31:45,655 (indistinct speech) 509 00:31:47,030 --> 00:31:49,734 - He said it's healthy. I can't move my arm. 510 00:31:49,741 --> 00:31:52,128 - I requested medical for a long time. 511 00:31:52,162 --> 00:31:54,107 They don't do anything about it. 512 00:31:54,132 --> 00:31:56,864 - No, I mean they look like they're healing well to me. 513 00:31:56,889 --> 00:31:58,557 You know I'm not a doctor but I think... 514 00:31:58,582 --> 00:32:00,270 you're getting good medical care. 515 00:32:00,295 --> 00:32:02,835 - No I'm not. You're not here. 516 00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:09,759 The Behavioral Science Consultation Teams, 517 00:32:09,760 --> 00:32:12,279 or BSCTS, helped interrogators 518 00:32:12,280 --> 00:32:13,999 exploit the physical and emotional 519 00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:16,719 vulnerabilities of the detainees. 520 00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:19,159 These doctors were pulled out of clinical services 521 00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:22,079 and thrust into the role of consultants 522 00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:24,639 without any experience with interrogation. 523 00:32:24,640 --> 00:32:27,119 - We like to think of torture as mainly this 524 00:32:27,120 --> 00:32:29,919 physical phenomenon, that it's only torture 525 00:32:29,920 --> 00:32:32,039 if you're beating someone or hanging them 526 00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:33,239 from their thumbs. 527 00:32:33,240 --> 00:32:35,519 It's really important to recognize and understand 528 00:32:35,520 --> 00:32:39,919 that most, if not all torture, has both physical 529 00:32:39,920 --> 00:32:42,400 and psychological components. 530 00:32:46,920 --> 00:32:48,879 According to the Guantanamo standard 531 00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:52,559 operating procedures, on arrival each detainee 532 00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:55,399 is isolated for four weeks and allowed contact 533 00:32:55,400 --> 00:32:57,119 only with interrogators and the 534 00:32:57,120 --> 00:32:59,680 behavioral science consultants. 535 00:33:01,520 --> 00:33:02,920 Step up. 536 00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:08,080 Turn around. 537 00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:25,519 Human beings are social, we're creatures that 538 00:33:25,520 --> 00:33:28,919 thrive on communication with others, connection with others. 539 00:33:28,920 --> 00:33:31,879 So when you deprive someone of that, you automatically 540 00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:36,239 start raising risk factors for the kinds of reactions, 541 00:33:36,240 --> 00:33:38,279 for reactions such as depression, 542 00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:41,279 anxiety, panic attacks, 543 00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:44,639 suicidality, in sort of more extreme cases 544 00:33:44,640 --> 00:33:47,360 and psychosis even in more extreme cases. 545 00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:01,920 SCREAMING 546 00:34:17,720 --> 00:34:20,640 SLAMMING 547 00:34:23,720 --> 00:34:29,360 SLAMMING 548 00:34:29,720 --> 00:34:31,479 Isolation is often combined with 549 00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:34,879 sleep deprivation to further disorient the detainee. 550 00:34:34,880 --> 00:34:36,159 - Soccer? 551 00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:38,520 TEASING AND TAUNTING 552 00:34:38,760 --> 00:34:39,920 SLAM 553 00:34:43,640 --> 00:34:47,239 Stay the fuck awake, no sleeping, no sleeping. 554 00:34:47,240 --> 00:34:48,359 None, none. 555 00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:50,600 SLAMMING 556 00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:54,719 Investigative journalists were among 557 00:34:54,720 --> 00:34:56,999 the first to expose some of the techniques 558 00:34:57,000 --> 00:35:00,200 recommended by the behavioral science consultants. 559 00:35:01,520 --> 00:35:04,919 There was one plan in particular that a detainee's 560 00:35:04,920 --> 00:35:07,319 lawyer described to me in which the 561 00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:10,479 detainee was told that a psychiatrist had monitored 562 00:35:10,480 --> 00:35:12,319 the amount of toilet paper he was allowed, 563 00:35:12,320 --> 00:35:14,439 he was only allowed seven squares a day. 564 00:35:14,440 --> 00:35:16,639 And that was actually an improvement over earlier 565 00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:19,199 when the psychiatrist, according to these sources, 566 00:35:19,200 --> 00:35:22,279 had taken away all of his toilet paper. 567 00:35:22,280 --> 00:35:25,359 Each detainees had kind of a psychological assessment 568 00:35:25,360 --> 00:35:29,399 and a plan kind of created for interrogating 569 00:35:29,400 --> 00:35:32,280 him depending on his weaknesses and vulnerabilities. 570 00:35:33,600 --> 00:35:36,839 Another common form of abuse that I heard 571 00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:40,519 from almost every former Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo 572 00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:44,239 detainee was these horrific recountings 573 00:35:44,240 --> 00:35:46,479 of sexual humiliations. 574 00:35:46,480 --> 00:35:48,079 There was one individual, for example, 575 00:35:48,080 --> 00:35:51,759 who told me how he was forced to be naked 576 00:35:51,760 --> 00:35:54,879 in a room where it was made very hot and very cold. 577 00:35:54,880 --> 00:35:56,759 He was forced to stand in uncomfortable 578 00:35:56,760 --> 00:35:58,159 and painful positions. 579 00:35:58,160 --> 00:36:01,679 But what was most devastating to him about that experience, 580 00:36:01,680 --> 00:36:06,759 was when he said, a woman who was naked 581 00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:09,719 came into the interrogation room 582 00:36:09,720 --> 00:36:12,599 and touched herself and then touched him 583 00:36:12,600 --> 00:36:15,039 with what he believed was menstrual blood. 584 00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:17,119 It was this moment when he was utterly 585 00:36:17,120 --> 00:36:20,799 and completely helpless and humiliated. 586 00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:23,039 That was most traumatizing to him. 587 00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:26,360 That was when he hung his head in shame. 588 00:36:32,120 --> 00:36:35,479 Probably overwhelmingly, most of the individuals 589 00:36:35,480 --> 00:36:39,079 who were detained at Abu Ghraib or Guantanamo 590 00:36:39,080 --> 00:36:40,279 were not terrorists. 591 00:36:40,280 --> 00:36:42,719 They were individuals who were picked up and sweeped, 592 00:36:42,720 --> 00:36:45,479 who were in the wrong place at the wrong time, 593 00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:51,079 got arrested, put through this hell like no other, 594 00:36:51,080 --> 00:36:55,319 that they or I could describe, and then were released. 595 00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:58,240 But really shells of who they were. 596 00:37:00,360 --> 00:37:03,399 Mohammed Jawad was one of these detainees. 597 00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:06,599 In 2002, he was arrested in a crowded marketplace 598 00:37:06,600 --> 00:37:09,479 in Kabul after a grenade exploded injuring 599 00:37:09,480 --> 00:37:11,639 three US servicemen. 600 00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:13,999 Jawad did not have a birth certificate and his 601 00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:15,719 age at the time is uncertain. 602 00:37:15,720 --> 00:37:19,920 But he was estimated to be between 14 and 16. 603 00:37:20,280 --> 00:37:22,919 After a short detention in Afghanistan, 604 00:37:22,920 --> 00:37:25,399 he was moved to Guantanamo Bay. 605 00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:27,719 - Guantanamo Bay is sort of supposed to be you know, 606 00:37:27,720 --> 00:37:31,239 where you keep the worst of the worst, you know, 607 00:37:31,240 --> 00:37:33,559 the really bad people. 608 00:37:33,560 --> 00:37:36,119 And you have a child who's being accused of 609 00:37:36,120 --> 00:37:38,519 throwing a hand grenade at US soldiers being called 610 00:37:38,520 --> 00:37:42,040 a war criminal, it just didn't make sense. 611 00:37:42,920 --> 00:37:45,719 During an interrogation of Mohammed Jawad, 612 00:37:45,720 --> 00:37:47,919 the interrogator became alarmed when the youth 613 00:37:47,920 --> 00:37:50,319 began talking to a wall. 614 00:37:50,320 --> 00:37:53,279 He asked a psychologist assigned to detainee 615 00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:55,639 interrogations to observe Jawad and check 616 00:37:55,640 --> 00:37:57,039 his mental state. 617 00:37:57,040 --> 00:37:59,319 Her response was reported by another officer 618 00:37:59,320 --> 00:38:01,640 in a sworn deposition. 619 00:38:05,840 --> 00:38:08,319 He appears to be rather frightened and it looks 620 00:38:08,320 --> 00:38:09,919 as if he could break easily if he were 621 00:38:09,920 --> 00:38:12,279 isolated from his support network and made 622 00:38:12,280 --> 00:38:15,600 to rely solely on the interrogator. 623 00:38:15,920 --> 00:38:18,799 Make him as uncomfortable as possible, 624 00:38:18,800 --> 00:38:21,240 work him as hard as possible. 625 00:38:25,560 --> 00:38:27,919 The psychologist concluded that Jawad 626 00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:30,479 was faking homesickness and depression. 627 00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:32,799 And recommended more severe isolation to 628 00:38:32,800 --> 00:38:34,720 induce his cooperation. 629 00:38:41,240 --> 00:38:45,039 After a period in this extreme isolation, Mohammed Jawad 630 00:38:45,040 --> 00:38:47,519 attempted to kill himself by banging his head 631 00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:50,240 off metal structures in his cell. 632 00:38:55,320 --> 00:38:57,919 He survived and was kept relatively isolated 633 00:38:57,920 --> 00:38:59,719 for five more years, 634 00:38:59,720 --> 00:39:01,919 when Dr. Katherine Porterfield examined 635 00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:04,520 him at the request of Jawad's defense team. 636 00:39:16,320 --> 00:39:19,159 Over the course of my evaluation with Mr. Jawad, 637 00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:23,239 it was clear he was suffering with major depression. 638 00:39:23,240 --> 00:39:26,160 He had intense sadness and despair. 639 00:39:26,360 --> 00:39:30,119 Difficulty sleeping, he had severe sleep problems. 640 00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:34,319 Appetite had been basically profoundly impaired. 641 00:39:34,320 --> 00:39:36,639 You know, he barely ate very much and he had 642 00:39:36,640 --> 00:39:38,759 almost, he said, no taste for food anymore. 643 00:39:38,760 --> 00:39:41,479 He was a very, very depressed young man. 644 00:39:41,480 --> 00:39:45,639 - When I went into Jawad, I wanted to take 645 00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:48,079 the initiative and you know, get to the point 646 00:39:48,080 --> 00:39:49,439 as quickly as possible. 647 00:39:49,440 --> 00:39:51,599 And he basically stopped me. 648 00:39:51,600 --> 00:39:54,119 And I was with an interpreter, he doesn't speak English 649 00:39:54,120 --> 00:39:55,839 or didn't at that time. 650 00:39:55,840 --> 00:39:59,799 And he said, "I don't wanna talk about who you are 651 00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:01,399 or why you're doing what you're doing 652 00:40:01,400 --> 00:40:03,479 or anything, all I wanna do is find out when 653 00:40:03,480 --> 00:40:04,879 I can go see my mom." 654 00:40:04,880 --> 00:40:07,279 All of a sudden, the curtain got pulled back 655 00:40:07,280 --> 00:40:09,799 and you know, there was this boy sitting in a chair 656 00:40:09,800 --> 00:40:11,319 asking for his mom. 657 00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:15,039 And it really changed the way that I approached that case. 658 00:40:15,040 --> 00:40:17,559 - When I would ask him to recount anything 659 00:40:17,560 --> 00:40:19,719 about his time at Guantanamo, he would become 660 00:40:19,720 --> 00:40:22,439 very distressed, put his head in his hands, 661 00:40:22,440 --> 00:40:25,359 and just say, "I can't, it's too hard." 662 00:40:25,360 --> 00:40:28,839 I wrote a declaration stating that I felt that 663 00:40:28,840 --> 00:40:30,639 the conditions he was in were not appropriate 664 00:40:30,640 --> 00:40:31,919 or harming him. 665 00:40:31,920 --> 00:40:34,639 And his lawyers basically then argued, 666 00:40:34,640 --> 00:40:36,399 to the authorities, that he should be moved 667 00:40:36,400 --> 00:40:38,520 out of a situation of isolation. 668 00:40:39,120 --> 00:40:42,440 And that response did not come for many months. 669 00:40:42,840 --> 00:40:46,079 - He was never viewed as an innocent person, you know, 670 00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:47,479 within the system. 671 00:40:47,480 --> 00:40:49,679 It was always, he's guilty, so how do we get 672 00:40:49,680 --> 00:40:51,760 to the conviction as fast as possible? 673 00:40:52,360 --> 00:40:54,919 Jawad's lawyer, Eric Montalvo, 674 00:40:54,920 --> 00:40:57,879 went to extraordinary lengths for his client. 675 00:40:57,880 --> 00:41:00,039 To get missing records and depositions, 676 00:41:00,040 --> 00:41:01,399 he travelled to Kabul. 677 00:41:01,400 --> 00:41:04,119 An unarmed marine without the protection 678 00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:07,399 of US forces, he returned with messages of support 679 00:41:07,400 --> 00:41:10,559 from Jawad's family and powerful evidence 680 00:41:10,560 --> 00:41:13,320 that Mohammed Jawad was innocent. 681 00:41:14,680 --> 00:41:16,279 And I think that at the end of the day, 682 00:41:16,280 --> 00:41:19,239 it was such a mess of a case. 683 00:41:19,240 --> 00:41:21,679 And it was so emblematic of all the things wrong 684 00:41:21,680 --> 00:41:26,159 with Guantanamo, that they just got him out of there. 685 00:41:26,160 --> 00:41:28,560 And tried to make it go away. 686 00:41:30,600 --> 00:41:32,399 After seven years in prison, 687 00:41:32,400 --> 00:41:35,040 Mohammaed Jawad was finally released. 688 00:41:35,480 --> 00:41:38,519 Eric Montalvo kept his promise to be in Kabul 689 00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:40,760 when the young man arrived. 690 00:41:41,520 --> 00:41:43,519 His mother couldn't even recognize him 691 00:41:43,520 --> 00:41:46,119 because he had physically changed so much, 692 00:41:46,120 --> 00:41:47,439 because he was just a boy. 693 00:41:47,440 --> 00:41:50,199 And he apparently had a certain shape to the back of his 694 00:41:50,200 --> 00:41:53,559 head from either a fall or what have you, 695 00:41:53,560 --> 00:41:56,719 and she was in total disbelief until she 696 00:41:56,720 --> 00:41:59,719 felt the shape of his head. 697 00:41:59,720 --> 00:42:03,200 And then at that point she knew and collapsed on the floor. 698 00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:21,719 In the case of involvement of health professionals, 699 00:42:21,720 --> 00:42:25,000 when does it rise to the level of national scandal? 700 00:42:30,120 --> 00:42:33,479 How many more revelations about physician involvement, 701 00:42:33,480 --> 00:42:38,159 about research, about approval of interrogations 702 00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:41,880 for people who are clearly injured, to be injured again. 703 00:42:43,400 --> 00:42:45,080 How much more? 704 00:42:45,400 --> 00:42:46,919 The American public does not hear much 705 00:42:46,920 --> 00:42:49,800 about doctor involvement in detainee abuse. 706 00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:53,159 Since the Abu Ghraib scandal, both administrations 707 00:42:53,160 --> 00:42:55,479 have gone to great lengths to present detainee 708 00:42:55,480 --> 00:42:57,040 treatment as humane. 709 00:42:58,040 --> 00:43:00,920 We are going to treat them exactly right. 710 00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:06,239 We're gonna treat them humanely and 711 00:43:06,240 --> 00:43:09,160 it will be appropriate to their circumstance. 712 00:43:10,040 --> 00:43:11,719 The press is given tours of modern 713 00:43:11,720 --> 00:43:13,880 medical facilities in Guantanamo. 714 00:43:14,320 --> 00:43:16,879 And army psychologists who report on the condition 715 00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:20,160 of detainees, make no mention of symptoms of trauma. 716 00:43:21,200 --> 00:43:22,919 The diagnosis we see, are the same ones we've 717 00:43:22,920 --> 00:43:24,199 seen in the states. 718 00:43:24,200 --> 00:43:27,519 The main or most prevalent diagnosis here 719 00:43:27,520 --> 00:43:29,120 are personality disorders. 720 00:43:30,320 --> 00:43:32,479 Do you see any signs of desperation 721 00:43:32,480 --> 00:43:33,920 by some detainees? 722 00:43:36,040 --> 00:43:37,520 Uhh... 723 00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:40,279 not really. 724 00:43:40,280 --> 00:43:41,560 Well... 725 00:43:43,280 --> 00:43:47,600 A few of 'em have maybe well... 726 00:43:49,080 --> 00:43:51,479 Maybe a few of 'em. 727 00:43:51,480 --> 00:43:54,039 I can't... I don't know really any specific details though 728 00:43:54,040 --> 00:43:57,320 where they have done anything 729 00:43:57,920 --> 00:43:59,520 out of desperation. 730 00:44:00,880 --> 00:44:02,679 Doctors at detention sites are divided 731 00:44:02,680 --> 00:44:06,079 between those who work in treatment services 732 00:44:06,080 --> 00:44:09,279 and those who work under the intelligence command. 733 00:44:09,280 --> 00:44:11,639 Although the two are officially separate, 734 00:44:11,640 --> 00:44:15,079 there are many reports of doctors in the medical services 735 00:44:15,080 --> 00:44:18,560 supporting the programs of the intelligence command. 736 00:44:24,080 --> 00:44:26,640 Released detainee Adel al Gazzar. 737 00:44:27,440 --> 00:44:30,720 One day I remember I was crying terrible from the pain. 738 00:44:30,880 --> 00:44:33,639 A doctor turned up with pain killers but he said, 739 00:44:33,640 --> 00:44:35,799 "I will give you the medication, but first you need 740 00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:38,680 to sign a confession that you're a member of al Qaeda." 741 00:44:39,520 --> 00:44:41,919 I told him I'm not a member of al Qaeda 742 00:44:41,920 --> 00:44:43,800 and cannot confess to a lie. 743 00:44:44,040 --> 00:44:47,080 He put the medication in his pocket and walked off. 744 00:44:47,800 --> 00:44:51,159 What's interesting is that the medical personnel 745 00:44:51,160 --> 00:44:54,880 at Guantanamo never go by their real names. 746 00:44:55,320 --> 00:44:59,039 So they always rely on pseudonyms. 747 00:44:59,040 --> 00:45:03,520 You know, Doctor Scarlet, you know, Doctor Geneva. 748 00:45:03,640 --> 00:45:07,716 So it's very hard to identify medical personnel. 749 00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:15,920 MUSIC 750 00:45:22,720 --> 00:45:24,439 There were doctors who actually lived up 751 00:45:24,440 --> 00:45:25,999 to their ethical obligations. 752 00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:27,879 And the perception among the prisoners 753 00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:31,479 was that those doctors were very quickly, 754 00:45:31,480 --> 00:45:34,159 you know, shuffled out of Guantanamo. 755 00:45:34,160 --> 00:45:37,000 Or rotated out of their posts. 756 00:45:37,360 --> 00:45:40,280 Were not renewed or maintained in those positions. 757 00:45:42,160 --> 00:45:43,759 Journalists are not allowed to 758 00:45:43,760 --> 00:45:46,799 interview detainees in the detention sites. 759 00:45:46,800 --> 00:45:50,639 Reports of how detainees are force fed at Guantanamo 760 00:45:50,640 --> 00:45:53,760 come from released prisoners and their defense lawyers. 761 00:45:56,680 --> 00:45:58,919 I represented Ahmed Zuhair, who's a Saudi national 762 00:45:58,920 --> 00:46:05,279 who was in US custody from 2002 until 2009. 763 00:46:05,280 --> 00:46:08,479 He was on hunger strike as a form of peaceful protest 764 00:46:08,480 --> 00:46:10,799 at sort of his unlawful and indefinite 765 00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:13,879 imprisonment away from his family, away from his life, 766 00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:18,080 and also in protest of the torture that he had survived. 767 00:46:18,360 --> 00:46:21,559 And he said, you know, he would continue his hunger 768 00:46:21,560 --> 00:46:24,639 strike until the United States stopped referring 769 00:46:24,640 --> 00:46:26,080 to him as an enemy combatant. 770 00:46:31,920 --> 00:46:33,919 You know, over the course of my two years 771 00:46:33,920 --> 00:46:37,559 representing him and meeting with him at Guantanamo, 772 00:46:37,560 --> 00:46:40,399 his health fluctuated sharply. 773 00:46:40,400 --> 00:46:43,079 You know, we had some meetings where he was in a gurney. 774 00:46:43,080 --> 00:46:45,519 There were some meetings where he could not move 775 00:46:45,520 --> 00:46:47,799 and where he was in physical pain. 776 00:46:47,800 --> 00:46:50,600 I saw him vomit repeatedly. 777 00:46:50,880 --> 00:46:53,599 So it was a physically traumatizing experience 778 00:46:53,600 --> 00:46:58,039 for him, but somehow you know, really almost magically 779 00:46:58,040 --> 00:47:00,440 he remained lucid throughout. 780 00:47:02,480 --> 00:47:07,079 You know, initially, force feeding was done on a bed 781 00:47:07,080 --> 00:47:09,719 in a relatively unfettered position. 782 00:47:09,720 --> 00:47:11,559 So the authorities went from a protocol that 783 00:47:11,560 --> 00:47:13,999 accommodated the prisoners and made the 784 00:47:14,000 --> 00:47:15,839 force feeding experience more comfortable 785 00:47:15,840 --> 00:47:18,919 and more tolerable, to another protocol. 786 00:47:18,920 --> 00:47:22,879 Which was designed specifically to inflict 787 00:47:22,880 --> 00:47:25,759 maximum pain and discomfort so as to pressure 788 00:47:25,760 --> 00:47:29,280 the hunger strikers to suspend their hunger strikes. 789 00:47:30,560 --> 00:47:33,000 The subsequent protocol that my client described 790 00:47:33,120 --> 00:47:38,040 involved what he referred to as the Torture Chair. 791 00:47:38,360 --> 00:47:41,239 Which was a chair, which was a six point restraint 792 00:47:41,240 --> 00:47:43,839 chair where prisoners were restrained at the arms, 793 00:47:43,840 --> 00:47:46,200 legs, torso, head, and neck. 794 00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:48,879 They took away lubrication, they took away 795 00:47:48,880 --> 00:47:52,120 local aesthetics, they took away soothing lozenges. 796 00:47:52,640 --> 00:47:56,280 All to make the experience as uncomfortable as possible. 797 00:47:58,600 --> 00:48:06,080 SCREAMING 798 00:48:07,560 --> 00:48:09,839 Some of the men refused to come out. 799 00:48:09,840 --> 00:48:14,039 Because they objected to being force fed. 800 00:48:14,040 --> 00:48:16,239 And in a brutal manner. 801 00:48:16,240 --> 00:48:18,159 And so they wished to remain in their cells. 802 00:48:18,160 --> 00:48:21,519 And so what the medical authorities at Guantanamo 803 00:48:21,520 --> 00:48:25,479 do at that point, was to order basically a riot squad, 804 00:48:25,480 --> 00:48:29,639 six man teams in full riot gear, 805 00:48:29,640 --> 00:48:34,319 with padding, shields, sticks, helmets, visors, mace, 806 00:48:34,320 --> 00:48:37,599 and they would basically march into a cell block 807 00:48:37,600 --> 00:48:40,679 as loudly as possible to intimidate and terrorize 808 00:48:40,680 --> 00:48:41,999 the prisoner population. 809 00:48:42,000 --> 00:48:44,519 And then they would go into the cell. 810 00:48:44,520 --> 00:48:48,520 And drag them out to the restraint chair. 811 00:48:49,560 --> 00:48:53,879 And then one of the US military medical personnel 812 00:48:53,880 --> 00:48:57,319 would insert the force feeding tubes. 813 00:48:57,320 --> 00:49:00,239 And a single feeding session would last, 814 00:49:00,240 --> 00:49:01,479 you know, two to three hours. 815 00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:05,800 Depending on how much nutrition was to be administered. 816 00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:09,039 That experience was so traumatic that a lot of the 817 00:49:09,040 --> 00:49:11,639 prisoners developed inflamed nasal passages. 818 00:49:11,640 --> 00:49:13,759 The medical personnel, they would leave the tubes 819 00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:17,119 in their noses for days on end. 820 00:49:17,120 --> 00:49:19,919 But he was in a position where that was the only 821 00:49:19,920 --> 00:49:24,400 possible gesture of protest that was left to him. 822 00:49:28,080 --> 00:49:29,919 The people in Guantanamo Bay, we have not 823 00:49:29,920 --> 00:49:31,079 forgotten about you. 824 00:49:31,080 --> 00:49:33,799 Even though I've been released for over two years, 825 00:49:33,800 --> 00:49:36,719 the burden of Guantanamo is still there with me. 826 00:49:36,720 --> 00:49:38,239 And until that place is closed down, 827 00:49:38,240 --> 00:49:41,480 I can never forget what happened there. 828 00:49:43,160 --> 00:49:47,519 We were able to get a federal judge to order 829 00:49:47,520 --> 00:49:51,799 the government to either 830 00:49:51,800 --> 00:49:55,799 force feed Mr. Zuhair in humane conditions, on a bed, 831 00:49:55,800 --> 00:49:59,679 in a clinic, and not in the restraint chair. 832 00:49:59,680 --> 00:50:03,879 Or justify to the judge, to the federal court, 833 00:50:03,880 --> 00:50:06,279 why it was necessary to force feed him 834 00:50:06,280 --> 00:50:07,799 in that restraint chair. 835 00:50:07,800 --> 00:50:09,599 But the other hunger strikers who were not 836 00:50:09,600 --> 00:50:11,559 subject to that order, they were still being 837 00:50:11,560 --> 00:50:15,399 force fed pursuant to the old protocol. 838 00:50:15,400 --> 00:50:17,479 And to my knowledge, that force feeding protocol, 839 00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:19,439 that's a protocol that is still alive and that is 840 00:50:19,440 --> 00:50:22,720 still being applied at Guantanamo today in 2010. 841 00:50:24,680 --> 00:50:27,359 Ahmed Zuhair was released from Guantanamo 842 00:50:27,360 --> 00:50:30,320 after being imprisoned for seven years without charge. 843 00:50:32,720 --> 00:50:35,719 But Shaker Amair, a leader of the hunger strikes, 844 00:50:35,720 --> 00:50:37,319 remains in isolation. 845 00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:40,560 The only British resident still detained at Guantanamo. 846 00:50:45,040 --> 00:50:50,159 I'm dying here everyday, mentally and physically. 847 00:50:50,160 --> 00:50:53,680 I have got kidney problems from the filthy yellow water. 848 00:50:54,720 --> 00:50:57,799 I have lung problems from the chemicals they 849 00:50:57,800 --> 00:51:00,159 spread all over the floor. 850 00:51:00,160 --> 00:51:03,719 I'm already arthritic at 40 because I sleep 851 00:51:03,720 --> 00:51:05,559 on a steel bed. 852 00:51:05,560 --> 00:51:07,999 And they use freezing air conditioning as part 853 00:51:08,000 --> 00:51:10,599 of the interrogation process. 854 00:51:10,600 --> 00:51:13,519 I have ruined eyes from the permanent 24 hour 855 00:51:13,520 --> 00:51:15,120 fluorescent lights. 856 00:51:16,240 --> 00:51:19,439 I have been made paranoid so I can trust nobody, 857 00:51:19,440 --> 00:51:20,919 even my lawyer. 858 00:51:20,920 --> 00:51:24,280 Because the Americans play with my mind. 859 00:51:26,120 --> 00:51:29,920 I would just like to die quietly by myself. 860 00:51:30,600 --> 00:51:34,439 I want no feeding, no force tubes. 861 00:51:34,440 --> 00:51:36,159 No help. 862 00:51:36,160 --> 00:51:38,640 No intensive assisted feeding. 863 00:51:53,160 --> 00:51:56,199 From everything we've seen about how this policy 864 00:51:56,200 --> 00:51:57,759 of torture was designed and implemented, 865 00:51:57,760 --> 00:52:00,199 that health professionals were a critical cog in the wheel. 866 00:52:00,200 --> 00:52:02,559 And that if you were to take the health professionals out, 867 00:52:02,560 --> 00:52:06,319 the system as we know it, I believe would've come 868 00:52:06,320 --> 00:52:07,759 to a grinding halt. 869 00:52:07,760 --> 00:52:12,319 - Had the senior physicians come out forcefully 870 00:52:12,320 --> 00:52:19,919 and more or less unified, that clinical practitioners 871 00:52:19,920 --> 00:52:23,079 were not gonna participate or condone 872 00:52:23,080 --> 00:52:27,359 any of these practices, that there could've very likely 873 00:52:27,360 --> 00:52:30,279 been at least a curtailment and a serious 874 00:52:30,280 --> 00:52:32,839 limitation of their happening. 875 00:52:32,840 --> 00:52:34,879 For the army, it would've meant that the army 876 00:52:34,880 --> 00:52:37,919 surgeon general would have said, 877 00:52:37,920 --> 00:52:40,319 absolutely we are not going to comply with this. 878 00:52:40,320 --> 00:52:44,359 It violates all our ethical principles, it is wrong. 879 00:52:44,360 --> 00:52:47,359 And no medical people will be involved 880 00:52:47,360 --> 00:52:48,759 in these practices. 881 00:52:48,760 --> 00:52:51,040 Doctor Kylie, who then was a surgeon general, 882 00:52:51,320 --> 00:52:53,759 had the opposite viewpoint. 883 00:52:53,760 --> 00:52:57,119 That the military mission of getting the 884 00:52:57,120 --> 00:53:00,199 intelligence information superseded what had 885 00:53:00,200 --> 00:53:03,600 been the traditional medical ethics and medical practice. 886 00:53:04,920 --> 00:53:07,199 Some intelligence and military officials 887 00:53:07,200 --> 00:53:09,799 did protest the torture program. 888 00:53:09,800 --> 00:53:12,599 - In simple words, your own soldier's language, 889 00:53:12,600 --> 00:53:14,119 how did this happen? 890 00:53:14,120 --> 00:53:16,119 - Failure in leadership sir from the brigade 891 00:53:16,120 --> 00:53:17,439 commander on down. 892 00:53:17,440 --> 00:53:19,479 Lack of discipline. 893 00:53:19,480 --> 00:53:20,920 No training whatsoever. 894 00:53:22,560 --> 00:53:25,039 General Antonio Taguba was forced 895 00:53:25,040 --> 00:53:27,519 into retirement for his rigorous investigation 896 00:53:27,520 --> 00:53:28,680 of the abuses. 897 00:53:28,920 --> 00:53:30,919 The military command severely punished 898 00:53:30,920 --> 00:53:33,559 Sargent Sam Provance for refusing to retract 899 00:53:33,560 --> 00:53:36,400 his testimony about tortures at Abu Ghraib. 900 00:53:37,200 --> 00:53:41,679 I do know military doctors who 901 00:53:41,680 --> 00:53:46,279 either directly indirectly did resist cooperating, 902 00:53:46,280 --> 00:53:48,799 voiced their dissent. 903 00:53:48,800 --> 00:53:53,440 And they feel and I really 904 00:53:53,840 --> 00:53:56,199 agree with them that their careers one way 905 00:53:56,200 --> 00:53:57,920 or another were hurt. 906 00:53:59,160 --> 00:54:00,839 In contrast, the officers who developed 907 00:54:00,840 --> 00:54:03,439 and conducted the enhanced techniques program 908 00:54:03,440 --> 00:54:05,200 remain well protected. 909 00:54:05,760 --> 00:54:08,519 The CIA has provided doctors James Mitchell 910 00:54:08,520 --> 00:54:11,119 and Bruce Jessen with a five million dollar 911 00:54:11,120 --> 00:54:13,279 legal defense fund in case they are charged 912 00:54:13,280 --> 00:54:15,360 with torturing detainees. 913 00:54:17,280 --> 00:54:20,279 Now if we got professionals who are trained in this 914 00:54:20,280 --> 00:54:23,479 kind of work to get information that'll 915 00:54:23,480 --> 00:54:25,599 protect the American people, and by the way, 916 00:54:25,600 --> 00:54:27,639 we have gotten information from these 917 00:54:27,640 --> 00:54:29,559 high valued detainees, 918 00:54:29,560 --> 00:54:31,559 that have helped protect you. 919 00:54:31,560 --> 00:54:34,119 In 2006, President Bush announced 920 00:54:34,120 --> 00:54:35,759 that the enhanced techniques provided 921 00:54:35,760 --> 00:54:37,439 invaluable intelligence. 922 00:54:37,440 --> 00:54:40,119 But by then, the program was so widely condemned 923 00:54:40,120 --> 00:54:42,079 that a high army official could publicly 924 00:54:42,080 --> 00:54:44,440 refute him without getting punished. 925 00:54:46,000 --> 00:54:48,799 No good intelligence is gonna come from abusive practices. 926 00:54:48,800 --> 00:54:50,719 I think history tells us that. 927 00:54:50,720 --> 00:54:52,519 I think the empirical evidence of the last 928 00:54:52,520 --> 00:54:55,159 five years, hard years, tell us that. 929 00:54:55,160 --> 00:54:58,559 So and moreover, any piece of intelligence 930 00:54:58,560 --> 00:55:02,479 which is obtained under duress, through the use 931 00:55:02,480 --> 00:55:08,479 of abusive techniques, would be of questionable credibility. 932 00:55:08,480 --> 00:55:11,399 And additionally, it would do more harm than good 933 00:55:11,400 --> 00:55:13,679 when it inevitably became known that abusive 934 00:55:13,680 --> 00:55:15,599 practices were used. 935 00:55:15,600 --> 00:55:18,519 - There's a guy speaking truth to power. 936 00:55:18,520 --> 00:55:22,399 Didn't deter Dick Cheney or George Bush 937 00:55:22,400 --> 00:55:23,639 from doing this anyway. 938 00:55:23,640 --> 00:55:26,119 But Kimmons was laying down the law saying look, 939 00:55:26,120 --> 00:55:28,279 my army is not gonna do that. 940 00:55:28,280 --> 00:55:31,919 If it's done that in the past, it's gonna stop doing that. 941 00:55:31,920 --> 00:55:33,920 Because they don't work. 942 00:55:35,040 --> 00:55:38,119 In 2002, FBI and other federal investigators 943 00:55:38,120 --> 00:55:41,159 tried to stop abusive methods that military interrogators 944 00:55:41,160 --> 00:55:43,839 were adopting at Guantanamo. 945 00:55:43,840 --> 00:55:45,639 Dr. Michael Gelles, who had been involved in 946 00:55:45,640 --> 00:55:49,079 the Daniel King espionage case, was among those 947 00:55:49,080 --> 00:55:51,479 who protested the brutality. 948 00:55:51,480 --> 00:55:53,919 The federal investigators, including Dr. Gelles, 949 00:55:53,920 --> 00:55:56,239 proposed an alternative way to interrogate 950 00:55:56,240 --> 00:55:58,519 a high valued detainee. 951 00:55:58,520 --> 00:56:01,399 It was rejected by the military in favour 952 00:56:01,400 --> 00:56:03,319 of more physical coercion. 953 00:56:03,320 --> 00:56:06,920 The alternate plan remained classified until 2009. 954 00:56:08,200 --> 00:56:11,479 Well when we actually read the plan, it was chilling. 955 00:56:11,480 --> 00:56:14,439 It was not a model for an ethical interrogation, 956 00:56:14,440 --> 00:56:18,159 but it was based on instilling complete 957 00:56:18,160 --> 00:56:21,839 dependency and debility over many months. 958 00:56:21,840 --> 00:56:24,119 I think what we're finding out is that what 959 00:56:24,120 --> 00:56:28,039 Colonel Larry James, who claims to have abolished 960 00:56:28,040 --> 00:56:31,679 abuses at Guantanamo in January of 2003, 961 00:56:31,680 --> 00:56:35,279 what Larry James and Michael Gelles felt was abusive 962 00:56:35,280 --> 00:56:38,799 was only the most extreme techniques. 963 00:56:38,800 --> 00:56:40,799 The so called physical techniques. 964 00:56:40,800 --> 00:56:44,799 Slapping or banging against a wall. 965 00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:48,199 Not sleep deprivation and isolation 966 00:56:48,200 --> 00:56:49,760 and sensory deprivation. 967 00:56:51,600 --> 00:56:53,679 Significant but incomplete reform, 968 00:56:53,680 --> 00:56:56,919 banning extreme physical tortures but not some of the 969 00:56:56,920 --> 00:57:00,719 psychological abuses, can also be seen in 2006 970 00:57:00,720 --> 00:57:03,279 revisions of the army field manual. 971 00:57:03,280 --> 00:57:06,159 Endorsed by the Obama administration. 972 00:57:06,160 --> 00:57:08,599 - Any interrogations taking place are gonna 973 00:57:08,600 --> 00:57:11,079 have to abide by the army field manual. 974 00:57:11,080 --> 00:57:14,519 We believe that the army field manual 975 00:57:14,520 --> 00:57:17,999 reflects the best judgement of our military. 976 00:57:18,000 --> 00:57:23,479 That we can abide by a rule 977 00:57:23,480 --> 00:57:25,319 that says we don't torture. 978 00:57:25,320 --> 00:57:27,279 - When President Obama came into office, 979 00:57:27,280 --> 00:57:29,519 he also indicated that the interrogations 980 00:57:29,520 --> 00:57:32,639 by the United States forces, including the CIA, 981 00:57:32,640 --> 00:57:36,039 should follow the parameters laid down in the 982 00:57:36,040 --> 00:57:37,759 current army field manual. 983 00:57:37,760 --> 00:57:40,079 That's the same army field manual that carries 984 00:57:40,080 --> 00:57:44,559 appendix M, with all of its different abusive 985 00:57:44,560 --> 00:57:46,519 forms of interrogation. 986 00:57:46,520 --> 00:57:49,759 It also is the same army field manual that changed 987 00:57:49,760 --> 00:57:52,519 the definition of the use of fear up from the 988 00:57:52,520 --> 00:57:54,479 previous army field manual to allow for the 989 00:57:54,480 --> 00:57:57,999 induction of new phobias, new fears. 990 00:57:58,000 --> 00:58:01,079 It changed the language of the previous army field manual, 991 00:58:01,080 --> 00:58:03,559 which had banned sleep deprivation. 992 00:58:03,560 --> 00:58:05,479 Now there was no such ban. 993 00:58:05,480 --> 00:58:10,759 - My reading of the appendix M of the field manual 994 00:58:10,760 --> 00:58:15,559 was that it did open a door to some of these 995 00:58:15,560 --> 00:58:17,879 techniques that are mostly being used 996 00:58:17,880 --> 00:58:19,440 by the CIA. 997 00:58:27,720 --> 00:58:29,639 The question of detainee abuse 998 00:58:29,640 --> 00:58:31,679 and the role that doctors play in it, 999 00:58:31,680 --> 00:58:34,559 is no longer limited to the military or CIA 1000 00:58:34,560 --> 00:58:36,799 operations oversees. 1001 00:58:36,800 --> 00:58:39,359 Detainees awaiting trial in the United States 1002 00:58:39,360 --> 00:58:42,479 may be subject to special administrative measures, 1003 00:58:42,480 --> 00:58:46,119 or SAM's, that resemble the isolation and deprivation 1004 00:58:46,120 --> 00:58:47,760 found in Guantanamo. 1005 00:58:49,000 --> 00:58:52,479 We're gathered here on a very wet and damp day 1006 00:58:52,480 --> 00:58:55,239 outside of the Metropolitan Correctional Center, 1007 00:58:55,240 --> 00:58:58,719 where for nearly three years, Fahad Hashmi has been held 1008 00:58:58,720 --> 00:59:01,719 in severe solitary confinement. 1009 00:59:01,720 --> 00:59:05,079 - In 2006, Fahad Hashmi, an American citizen, 1010 00:59:05,080 --> 00:59:07,879 was arrested for material support for al Qaeda 1011 00:59:07,880 --> 00:59:10,520 and kept in highly restricted lockdown. 1012 00:59:11,400 --> 00:59:15,400 His treatment raised an issue rarely debated in public. 1013 00:59:15,520 --> 00:59:18,640 Prolonged isolation can jeopardize a prisoner's health. 1014 00:59:19,040 --> 00:59:20,919 Do the special administrative measures supersede 1015 00:59:20,920 --> 00:59:22,879 the orders of a doctor responsible 1016 00:59:22,880 --> 00:59:25,480 for the detainee's care? 1017 00:59:26,320 --> 00:59:29,159 - So we say tonight to Fahad 1018 00:59:29,160 --> 00:59:31,759 and to his family, that we stand with you 1019 00:59:31,760 --> 00:59:34,719 and remain committed to struggle alongside you 1020 00:59:34,720 --> 00:59:38,639 towards a light that surely must come and emerge 1021 00:59:38,640 --> 00:59:40,400 from these dark days. 1022 00:59:40,920 --> 00:59:44,719 As we leave, I'd like everyone to place 1023 00:59:44,720 --> 00:59:46,919 a flower, you're not allowed to stand on the sidewalk 1024 00:59:46,920 --> 00:59:49,639 in front of the MCC, but as you walk by, 1025 00:59:49,640 --> 00:59:51,480 please place a flower. 1026 00:59:53,160 --> 00:59:54,759 The detention practices of the war 1027 00:59:54,760 --> 00:59:57,119 on terror have come home. 1028 00:59:57,120 --> 01:00:00,719 If extreme isolation is harming a detainee, 1029 01:00:00,720 --> 01:00:03,240 can US prison doctors stop it? 1030 01:00:03,880 --> 01:00:05,759 Do doctors have the authority to protect 1031 01:00:05,760 --> 01:00:08,599 the healthcare of the prisoner? 1032 01:00:08,600 --> 01:00:10,919 Although much is classified, there is evidence 1033 01:00:10,920 --> 01:00:14,159 that decisions by doctors treating detainees 1034 01:00:14,160 --> 01:00:16,920 may be countermanded by government officials. 1035 01:00:25,440 --> 01:00:29,039 When I hear about psychologists participating 1036 01:00:29,040 --> 01:00:33,599 in CIA black sites, in the kidnapping of children, 1037 01:00:33,600 --> 01:00:36,559 I know that something is wrong in the state 1038 01:00:36,560 --> 01:00:39,319 of psychology and how psychology is being used. 1039 01:00:39,320 --> 01:00:41,760 APPLAUSE 1040 01:00:42,320 --> 01:00:44,719 Many human rights and healthcare organisations 1041 01:00:44,720 --> 01:00:46,479 have protested the role of doctors 1042 01:00:46,480 --> 01:00:48,759 in the torture program. 1043 01:00:48,760 --> 01:00:51,279 In 2005, Doctor Steven Sharfstein, 1044 01:00:51,280 --> 01:00:52,919 the newly elected president of the 1045 01:00:52,920 --> 01:00:55,559 American Psychiatric Association wrote to 1046 01:00:55,560 --> 01:00:57,799 Secretary of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, 1047 01:00:57,800 --> 01:01:01,039 raising concerns about psychiatrists assisting 1048 01:01:01,040 --> 01:01:03,440 interrogations at Guantanamo. 1049 01:01:05,360 --> 01:01:07,999 Well what happened was I didn't hear a word 1050 01:01:08,000 --> 01:01:09,279 in response to my letter. 1051 01:01:09,280 --> 01:01:11,359 And then in the beginning of October I got a call, 1052 01:01:11,360 --> 01:01:13,039 "Would you like to go next week?" 1053 01:01:13,040 --> 01:01:15,999 I guess that's the way things work in the military. 1054 01:01:16,000 --> 01:01:17,439 And I said absolutely. 1055 01:01:17,440 --> 01:01:20,559 We landed and we went, took a boat trip 1056 01:01:20,560 --> 01:01:23,039 across the bay, to the prison. 1057 01:01:23,040 --> 01:01:27,759 And then we had a briefing on the prison, 1058 01:01:27,760 --> 01:01:29,360 very extensive one. 1059 01:01:31,280 --> 01:01:34,039 What we heard was that there were these 1060 01:01:34,040 --> 01:01:38,159 Behavioral Science Consultation Teams, BSCT teams, 1061 01:01:38,160 --> 01:01:42,799 they were never in the room when interrogations took place. 1062 01:01:42,800 --> 01:01:44,239 They were in another room. 1063 01:01:44,240 --> 01:01:45,799 They were listening in. 1064 01:01:45,800 --> 01:01:48,879 They had direct way to talk to the 1065 01:01:48,880 --> 01:01:52,719 interrogators and to advise them about 1066 01:01:52,720 --> 01:01:57,919 what ways to proceed and their role they 1067 01:01:57,920 --> 01:02:01,439 emphasized was to try to establish rapport with 1068 01:02:01,440 --> 01:02:06,199 these detainees and not really stress them in any way. 1069 01:02:06,200 --> 01:02:10,559 So they were trying definitely to convince us 1070 01:02:10,560 --> 01:02:14,159 that what they were doing was humane, ethical, 1071 01:02:14,160 --> 01:02:17,080 you know, on the up and up. 1072 01:02:18,720 --> 01:02:20,399 Doctor Sharfstein and his colleagues 1073 01:02:20,400 --> 01:02:22,279 were not convinced that psychiatrists should 1074 01:02:22,280 --> 01:02:24,360 assist in interrogations. 1075 01:02:26,360 --> 01:02:27,919 I didn't think that psychiatrists 1076 01:02:27,920 --> 01:02:29,719 had any competency 1077 01:02:29,720 --> 01:02:31,919 to be doing this kind of work. 1078 01:02:31,920 --> 01:02:34,720 We're trained to diagnose, treat. 1079 01:02:36,240 --> 01:02:40,440 Beyond the ethical position of do no harm, 1080 01:02:41,200 --> 01:02:44,039 what training do we have in interrogations 1081 01:02:44,040 --> 01:02:45,679 and police interrogations, or any of those 1082 01:02:45,680 --> 01:02:47,399 kinds of issues? 1083 01:02:47,400 --> 01:02:50,359 - In 2006, after much internal debate, 1084 01:02:50,360 --> 01:02:52,399 the American Psychiatric Association passed 1085 01:02:52,400 --> 01:02:55,119 a resolution stating that it was not appropriate 1086 01:02:55,120 --> 01:02:57,799 for psychiatrists to directly assist 1087 01:02:57,800 --> 01:03:00,720 in the interrogation of detainees. 1088 01:03:01,280 --> 01:03:03,759 The American Psychiatric Association just drew 1089 01:03:03,760 --> 01:03:05,600 the line and said, no. 1090 01:03:06,560 --> 01:03:08,799 And actually many... 1091 01:03:08,800 --> 01:03:11,479 I was contacted by a number of military psychiatrists 1092 01:03:11,480 --> 01:03:15,359 saying thank you, because now we can say to superiors, 1093 01:03:15,360 --> 01:03:18,799 "I don't wanna go against the policy, position, 1094 01:03:18,800 --> 01:03:23,760 and the ethical rules of my association." 1095 01:03:24,200 --> 01:03:26,879 Though the standards of the AMA and the 1096 01:03:26,880 --> 01:03:29,919 American Psychiatric Association are as they should be, 1097 01:03:29,920 --> 01:03:33,119 strong unequivocal prohibitions against direct 1098 01:03:33,120 --> 01:03:37,439 involvement in interrogation, the fact remains 1099 01:03:37,440 --> 01:03:40,479 that neither of those associations have taken 1100 01:03:40,480 --> 01:03:45,279 ethical action against members who allegedly 1101 01:03:45,280 --> 01:03:47,559 were directly involved in the abuse 1102 01:03:47,560 --> 01:03:49,800 of prisoners in US custody. 1103 01:03:50,800 --> 01:03:52,399 Only one professional association 1104 01:03:52,400 --> 01:03:55,319 approved of its doctors assisting interrogations, 1105 01:03:55,320 --> 01:03:59,240 the American Psychological Association or APA. 1106 01:03:59,800 --> 01:04:02,279 In 2005, it followed the recommendations 1107 01:04:02,280 --> 01:04:05,719 of its task force on psychological ethics 1108 01:04:05,720 --> 01:04:08,320 and national security, or PENS. 1109 01:04:10,040 --> 01:04:14,559 So for us, the question is not whether 1110 01:04:14,560 --> 01:04:17,919 psychologists may be involved in these processes, 1111 01:04:17,920 --> 01:04:20,559 it's how psychologists may be involved 1112 01:04:20,560 --> 01:04:24,600 in these activities in an ethical manner. 1113 01:04:25,320 --> 01:04:28,519 We know from records and accounts of what went 1114 01:04:28,520 --> 01:04:32,639 on at the task force that there was never 1115 01:04:32,640 --> 01:04:35,159 a question, a discussion, about whether 1116 01:04:35,160 --> 01:04:37,239 it was ethical for psychologists to participate 1117 01:04:37,240 --> 01:04:38,399 in these interrogations. 1118 01:04:38,400 --> 01:04:41,759 That was assumed from the very first moment. 1119 01:04:41,760 --> 01:04:46,039 The APA has never, except when absolutely forced to 1120 01:04:46,040 --> 01:04:50,759 by the public record, acknowledged that there are 1121 01:04:50,760 --> 01:04:52,400 even problems in the policy. 1122 01:05:02,080 --> 01:05:04,439 Psychology's profession has been intimately 1123 01:05:04,440 --> 01:05:06,719 involved with the military intelligence establishment, 1124 01:05:06,720 --> 01:05:09,119 something that's sort of invisible to a large 1125 01:05:09,120 --> 01:05:12,160 number of practical psychologists. 1126 01:05:13,320 --> 01:05:15,759 APA officials appointed a task force 1127 01:05:15,760 --> 01:05:18,399 guaranteed to approve psychologists involvement 1128 01:05:18,400 --> 01:05:20,640 in detainee interrogations. 1129 01:05:22,720 --> 01:05:25,119 Doctor Morgan Banks helped to write the standard 1130 01:05:25,120 --> 01:05:29,400 operating procedures manual for BSCT interrogation doctors. 1131 01:05:30,160 --> 01:05:32,879 Doctor Scott Shumate attended the launch 1132 01:05:32,880 --> 01:05:36,999 of enhanced interrogation procedures at a CIA black site. 1133 01:05:37,000 --> 01:05:39,719 Doctor Larry James was the first psychologist 1134 01:05:39,720 --> 01:05:43,240 to advise on interrogations at Abu Ghraib. 1135 01:05:49,160 --> 01:05:51,479 Doctor Bryce Lefever, another member of the task force 1136 01:05:51,480 --> 01:05:54,519 majority, asserted that a psychologist assisting 1137 01:05:54,520 --> 01:05:57,399 interrogations has no responsibility 1138 01:05:57,400 --> 01:05:59,199 for detainee welfare. 1139 01:05:59,200 --> 01:06:01,519 Contradicting the most basic ethical principles 1140 01:06:01,520 --> 01:06:03,479 of psychology practice. 1141 01:06:03,480 --> 01:06:05,279 - America happens to be my client. 1142 01:06:05,280 --> 01:06:08,439 Americans are who I care about. 1143 01:06:08,440 --> 01:06:10,479 I have no fondness for the enemy. 1144 01:06:10,480 --> 01:06:12,199 And I don't feel like I need to take care 1145 01:06:12,200 --> 01:06:14,399 of their mental health needs. 1146 01:06:14,400 --> 01:06:17,919 Producing some pain just seems to be, 1147 01:06:17,920 --> 01:06:22,199 you know at first blush, something that would be wrong 1148 01:06:22,200 --> 01:06:25,719 because we do no harm, but if it does the most 1149 01:06:25,720 --> 01:06:28,919 good for the most people, it's entirely ethical. 1150 01:06:28,920 --> 01:06:30,680 And to do otherwise would be unethical. 1151 01:06:31,760 --> 01:06:33,279 Doctor Michael Gelles was the 1152 01:06:33,280 --> 01:06:37,039 psychologist involved in the Daniel King espionage case. 1153 01:06:37,040 --> 01:06:39,919 In 2001, one of King's lawyers found Gelles 1154 01:06:39,920 --> 01:06:42,399 treatment of King so unethical that he submitted 1155 01:06:42,400 --> 01:06:45,559 a complaint to the APA Ethics Committee. 1156 01:06:45,560 --> 01:06:47,880 The complaint was dismissed. 1157 01:06:48,640 --> 01:06:50,919 Four years later, the Ethics Director helped 1158 01:06:50,920 --> 01:06:53,519 appoint psychologists to the PENS task force, 1159 01:06:53,520 --> 01:06:55,640 including Michael Gelles. 1160 01:06:56,600 --> 01:06:59,039 APA officials stressed the organisation's 1161 01:06:59,040 --> 01:07:01,639 strong resolutions against torture. 1162 01:07:01,640 --> 01:07:03,159 And claimed that psychologists keep the 1163 01:07:03,160 --> 01:07:06,559 interrogations safe, ethical, and effective. 1164 01:07:06,560 --> 01:07:09,559 In 2008, thousands of APA members effectively 1165 01:07:09,560 --> 01:07:11,639 rejected this claim and voted down 1166 01:07:11,640 --> 01:07:14,200 the interrogation policy. 1167 01:07:14,760 --> 01:07:17,479 In spite of this referendum, psychologists still 1168 01:07:17,480 --> 01:07:19,759 assist detainee interrogations and their work 1169 01:07:19,760 --> 01:07:22,200 remains highly controversial. 1170 01:07:23,040 --> 01:07:25,439 Today, behavioral science consultants and 1171 01:07:25,440 --> 01:07:28,639 research psychologists have a prominent role 1172 01:07:28,640 --> 01:07:30,839 in the Obama administration program for 1173 01:07:30,840 --> 01:07:33,840 interrogating high valued detainees. 1174 01:07:43,640 --> 01:07:45,839 When people committed these same acts, 1175 01:07:45,840 --> 01:07:49,440 we prosecuted them in the past at places like Nuremberg. 1176 01:07:50,280 --> 01:07:52,479 And places like the International Criminal Tribunal 1177 01:07:52,480 --> 01:07:54,479 for the former Yugoslavia. 1178 01:07:54,480 --> 01:07:55,879 What's different here? 1179 01:07:55,880 --> 01:07:59,279 The difference is, is that we just don't care enough. 1180 01:07:59,280 --> 01:08:01,519 - There's been no accountability at all. 1181 01:08:01,520 --> 01:08:03,799 No investigation that we're aware of. 1182 01:08:03,800 --> 01:08:07,799 No attempt to question the doctors about 1183 01:08:07,800 --> 01:08:11,879 what they did, reveal what they did fully. 1184 01:08:11,880 --> 01:08:14,079 In fact, both the Bush administration, the Obama 1185 01:08:14,080 --> 01:08:18,199 administration have utterly refused and opposed 1186 01:08:18,200 --> 01:08:21,079 any attempt to investigate. 1187 01:08:21,080 --> 01:08:25,279 And the doctors have completely escaped 1188 01:08:25,280 --> 01:08:29,599 any ethical or legal responsibility 1189 01:08:29,600 --> 01:08:30,760 for what they've done. 1190 01:08:31,720 --> 01:08:33,119 The fight for accountability 1191 01:08:33,120 --> 01:08:34,919 is now turning to institutions separate 1192 01:08:34,920 --> 01:08:37,919 from the United States government and military. 1193 01:08:37,920 --> 01:08:41,999 Doctors, including those in the CIA and military, 1194 01:08:42,000 --> 01:08:44,759 must be licensed by their state boards, 1195 01:08:44,760 --> 01:08:46,719 which are responsible for disciplining any 1196 01:08:46,720 --> 01:08:48,720 involved in malpractice. 1197 01:08:50,480 --> 01:08:52,919 To my knowledge, to date, there have been complaints 1198 01:08:52,920 --> 01:08:56,279 filed against health professionals in California, 1199 01:08:56,280 --> 01:09:01,080 New York, Louisiana, Alabama, Guam, and Ohio. 1200 01:09:02,040 --> 01:09:04,439 Before health professional boards, licensing boards 1201 01:09:04,440 --> 01:09:06,720 in all of those states. 1202 01:09:07,440 --> 01:09:11,479 Not one of them to our knowledge has even 1203 01:09:11,480 --> 01:09:14,759 investigated, officially seriously investigated 1204 01:09:14,760 --> 01:09:16,079 any of the allegations. 1205 01:09:16,080 --> 01:09:20,119 Some boards have not bothered to give written answers, 1206 01:09:20,120 --> 01:09:21,919 but over the phone when consulted, 1207 01:09:21,920 --> 01:09:24,039 have said that they don't have jurisdiction. 1208 01:09:24,040 --> 01:09:27,320 We don't believe that that's true in any of the cases. 1209 01:09:27,880 --> 01:09:29,639 The Texas State Board of Examiners 1210 01:09:29,640 --> 01:09:32,359 dismissed a complaint against Doctor James Mitchell, 1211 01:09:32,360 --> 01:09:36,479 the psychologist who according to government documents, 1212 01:09:36,480 --> 01:09:40,520 led the team that waterboarded a detainee 83 times. 1213 01:09:41,800 --> 01:09:45,359 Until congress, until the National Institutes of Health, 1214 01:09:45,360 --> 01:09:48,079 institutes of medicine, realize that this 1215 01:09:48,080 --> 01:09:52,079 is arguably the single greatest scandal 1216 01:09:52,080 --> 01:09:55,560 in the history of American medical ethics, 1217 01:09:56,440 --> 01:10:01,799 and act that way, we will be not even 1218 01:10:01,800 --> 01:10:04,519 knowing what we don't know about. 1219 01:10:04,520 --> 01:10:06,480 Not even knowing the questions to ask. 1220 01:10:10,880 --> 01:10:12,240 Hold it. 1221 01:10:17,920 --> 01:10:19,040 Okay. 1222 01:10:22,920 --> 01:10:29,160 ELECTRICAL BUZZING 1223 01:10:29,520 --> 01:10:31,080 GATE SLAMMING 1224 01:10:33,920 --> 01:10:40,920 PIANO 92510

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