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See? See?
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You want it?
You want eggs?
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No, you can't reach for it.
4
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I got some Lego sets
that I've built,
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like, this is like really cool.
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These are some dinosaurs.
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It double clicks.
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And my favorite part.
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No one knows about it,
I only tell my bestest friends.
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Virtually all I remember
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is sleeping on the couch
next to a gray church.
12
00:02:01,742 --> 00:02:06,781
Just going over to this place
with a bunch of people
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00:02:06,885 --> 00:02:08,818
like terrorists or something.
14
00:02:08,921 --> 00:02:13,788
So, like, and there is one
particular thing I do remember,
15
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not I didn't, like,
on my birthday
16
00:02:16,722 --> 00:02:18,345
when I turned 6
they didn't celebrate,
17
00:02:18,448 --> 00:02:23,867
but the only toy I pretty much
had was a little buildable,
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00:02:23,971 --> 00:02:25,973
Megalosaurus the dinosaur.
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00:02:36,466 --> 00:02:39,814
Terrorism is essentially
mostly a media operation.
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The act of violence
is to get your view across
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because otherwise no one else
would listen to it.
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Reporter:
A second American woman has
now surfaced in connection
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with a terror investigation
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00:02:51,826 --> 00:02:55,244
that stretches from Colorado
to Ireland.
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00:02:55,347 --> 00:02:59,317
First Jihad Jane, now
the woman dubbed Jihad Jamie.
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00:02:59,420 --> 00:03:02,147
And so as we watch
the mainstream press cover it,
27
00:03:02,251 --> 00:03:04,218
it's almost like you applaud
yourself on the back
28
00:03:04,322 --> 00:03:06,186
because you know full well
29
00:03:06,289 --> 00:03:10,845
that the ramifications of that
are going to be.
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00:03:10,949 --> 00:03:12,927
Reporter: You really cannot
judge a book by its cover.
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You can't tell
what your neighbor's doing.
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Reporter #2: We've got two women
that went online,
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which now they're both
under arrest.
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00:03:20,200 --> 00:03:22,650
Reporter #3:
An American woman waging jihad.
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00:03:22,754 --> 00:03:24,234
Have you ever seen
anything like this?
36
00:03:24,307 --> 00:03:25,757
Are these women
a complete anomaly
37
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or is this a whole new profile?
38
00:04:27,715 --> 00:04:30,097
Hi, baby.
39
00:04:32,272 --> 00:04:37,346
Sometimes my sister could carry
it to the far, far corners.
40
00:04:37,449 --> 00:04:41,246
Like join the Muslims
and becoming a terrorist.
41
00:04:41,350 --> 00:04:42,972
First American woman
to be arrested
42
00:04:43,075 --> 00:04:47,321
for terroristic acts
in America was my sister.
43
00:04:47,425 --> 00:04:49,126
Colleen would pretend, like,
to make a phone call,
44
00:04:49,150 --> 00:04:52,499
and I took this picture of her
to do something funny.
45
00:04:52,602 --> 00:04:55,191
So she can pretend like she's on
the phone with a business call
46
00:04:55,295 --> 00:04:58,298
or whatever she was doing
was singing.
47
00:05:00,714 --> 00:05:04,338
There's Colleen
when I was at her apartment.
48
00:05:04,442 --> 00:05:10,724
There's Colleen enjoying
herself, in, um, Amsterdam.
49
00:05:12,622 --> 00:05:17,006
And this is what some girl
in prison made, Colleen.
50
00:05:17,109 --> 00:05:19,284
Uh, says,
"Jihad Jane to the rescue,"
51
00:05:19,388 --> 00:05:22,322
and made a picture
of Colleen's mean face.
52
00:05:32,884 --> 00:05:39,546
I was so into my jihad
in my mission that that's all
53
00:05:39,649 --> 00:05:42,514
that meant something to me
54
00:05:42,618 --> 00:05:46,104
and I just wanted
to accomplish this.
55
00:05:50,280 --> 00:05:52,904
Being in prison,
I reflected over my past
56
00:05:53,007 --> 00:05:57,564
and I realized that I used
to be a pretty selfish person.
57
00:05:57,667 --> 00:06:00,083
And I didn't show
my appreciation to Kurt
58
00:06:00,187 --> 00:06:05,295
like I should have because,
I mean, he did nothing wrong.
59
00:06:05,399 --> 00:06:06,780
That's the one regret I have,
60
00:06:06,883 --> 00:06:09,438
is that he didn't deserve
what I did to him.
61
00:06:21,070 --> 00:06:22,658
Ferris is the name of the town
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00:06:22,761 --> 00:06:24,729
there where
the radio station is,
63
00:06:24,832 --> 00:06:26,489
and they were living
right in front
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00:06:26,593 --> 00:06:30,942
of the actual transmitter site
for the radio station.
65
00:06:33,462 --> 00:06:34,773
We were putting in new equipment
66
00:06:34,877 --> 00:06:37,224
for the station,
so we worked for,
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00:06:37,327 --> 00:06:39,433
you know,
three to four months there.
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00:06:57,486 --> 00:07:00,005
She liked to talk.
She liked to, y'know, hang out.
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00:07:00,109 --> 00:07:04,424
Basically just seemed like
a normal country girl.
70
00:07:09,705 --> 00:07:15,469
And then Colleen eventually
came up and moved in with me.
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00:07:17,747 --> 00:07:19,956
We were very happy and
spending time with each other,
72
00:07:20,060 --> 00:07:24,444
so I think we were
both happy at that point, yeah.
73
00:07:28,827 --> 00:07:32,279
That time period,
she remembers fairly fondly
74
00:07:32,382 --> 00:07:35,351
until his, his father,
75
00:07:35,455 --> 00:07:38,837
Kurt's father and her mother
had to move into...
76
00:07:38,941 --> 00:07:43,463
They were in an apartment,
they both needed care.
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00:07:43,566 --> 00:07:45,292
Colleen's a fairly social being,
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00:07:45,395 --> 00:07:47,501
but she was tied
to that apartment
79
00:07:47,605 --> 00:07:50,504
and she started to spend
a lot of time on the computer.
80
00:08:04,414 --> 00:08:06,520
As I understand it,
Kurt recognized
81
00:08:06,624 --> 00:08:08,705
that there was an issue
for them in their relationship,
82
00:08:08,729 --> 00:08:11,214
and so he decided
to take her to Europe.
83
00:08:11,318 --> 00:08:15,356
And it was actually
while she was in Europe
84
00:08:15,460 --> 00:08:18,636
that she had started
to be intrigued in Islam.
85
00:08:20,396 --> 00:08:22,778
I went to Amsterdam.
86
00:08:22,881 --> 00:08:25,125
My boyfriend and I
had some words or whatever,
87
00:08:25,228 --> 00:08:28,473
and we were drinking
and he went to bed
88
00:08:28,577 --> 00:08:33,340
and I went downstairs to the bar
and I was drinking some more.
89
00:08:33,443 --> 00:08:34,962
And then I got on the elevator
90
00:08:35,066 --> 00:08:38,518
and there was a Middle Eastern
guy on the elevator.
91
00:08:38,621 --> 00:08:42,487
And me and him, we decided
to go get our own room.
92
00:08:44,247 --> 00:08:47,216
And we stayed together
for a few, couple, few hours
93
00:08:47,319 --> 00:08:50,081
and then I went upstairs
to my boyfriend.
94
00:08:50,184 --> 00:08:53,394
He went upstairs
to his girlfriend.
95
00:08:53,498 --> 00:08:55,086
After I come back to America,
96
00:08:55,189 --> 00:08:57,329
decided I was going to find
another Middle Eastern man
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00:08:57,433 --> 00:09:00,263
because I liked him.
98
00:09:00,367 --> 00:09:02,507
I joined different sites for
Muslim,
99
00:09:02,611 --> 00:09:05,959
for, well, for Arab lounge,
100
00:09:06,062 --> 00:09:10,550
Arab, something
and then mezima.com.
101
00:09:10,653 --> 00:09:13,553
I joined, like, a couple
other sites for Muslims.
102
00:09:16,763 --> 00:09:19,938
I started meeting different
brothers and sisters online
103
00:09:20,042 --> 00:09:22,389
in different Muslim sites,
104
00:09:22,492 --> 00:09:24,564
and they was teaching me
more about Islam,
105
00:09:24,667 --> 00:09:26,980
and I made a lot of brothers
and sisters
106
00:09:27,083 --> 00:09:28,706
I made a lot of and brothers
and sisters,
107
00:09:28,809 --> 00:09:34,228
and we was always talking
online, mostly through YouTube.
108
00:09:34,332 --> 00:09:37,059
I was watching videos
on YouTube.
109
00:09:37,162 --> 00:09:38,647
The thing that had
an effect on me
110
00:09:38,750 --> 00:09:45,343
was the brutality I seen
against the Muslims.
111
00:09:45,446 --> 00:09:50,313
It would, like, make me mad.
112
00:09:50,417 --> 00:09:51,428
I was seeing... I mean,
I would get,
113
00:09:51,452 --> 00:09:53,385
I would get upset.
114
00:09:53,489 --> 00:09:56,526
The blood and the bodies
and the children.
115
00:09:56,630 --> 00:09:59,875
And I mean,
it was just so much shit.
116
00:09:59,978 --> 00:10:01,842
They just kept bombing them.
117
00:10:03,879 --> 00:10:06,709
The day that I was watching
the Zionists bombing
118
00:10:06,813 --> 00:10:09,436
the Palestinians and you hear
the children
119
00:10:09,539 --> 00:10:11,127
screaming and crying
and in the people,
120
00:10:11,231 --> 00:10:13,854
all the women and the brothers.
121
00:10:13,958 --> 00:10:17,513
And at the same time, I was
watching this on the Internet,
122
00:10:17,617 --> 00:10:19,688
outside my window
in the streets,
123
00:10:19,791 --> 00:10:23,036
little kids were playing
and having fun and laughing.
124
00:10:23,139 --> 00:10:24,520
And I was thinking to myself,
125
00:10:24,624 --> 00:10:26,902
"You know,
nobody knows what's going on."
126
00:10:31,113 --> 00:10:34,668
I was hurt by what was happening
then I got real angry
127
00:10:34,772 --> 00:10:37,844
and I decided
that I hate I hated Zionists
128
00:10:37,947 --> 00:10:39,880
and I wanted
something done to them.
129
00:10:39,984 --> 00:10:43,297
And I started talking to other
brothers and sisters
130
00:10:43,401 --> 00:10:44,851
who thought, like me.
131
00:10:44,954 --> 00:10:47,439
And then I went further
and found another brother
132
00:10:47,543 --> 00:10:49,718
who was into jihad.
133
00:11:04,733 --> 00:11:07,597
When I first met
Jihad Jane online,
134
00:11:07,701 --> 00:11:10,566
I was about 15 or 16 years old.
135
00:11:13,673 --> 00:11:18,678
When I first came to America,
I was in 2007.
136
00:11:18,781 --> 00:11:20,300
High school was very different
137
00:11:20,403 --> 00:11:24,822
from what I was acquainted
with in Pakistan.
138
00:11:24,925 --> 00:11:31,276
And I didn't really know how to
interact properly with people.
139
00:11:31,380 --> 00:11:34,072
Having Aspergers, you know,
I would just kind of
140
00:11:34,176 --> 00:11:37,524
stay to myself and, you know,
be in my own world.
141
00:11:41,148 --> 00:11:42,494
I did become a social recluse.
142
00:11:42,598 --> 00:11:45,843
I did actually try to avoid
people.
143
00:11:45,946 --> 00:11:48,880
Unfortunately, that led me
to just turn to the Internet.
144
00:11:51,469 --> 00:11:53,574
This is in 20th century Europe.
145
00:11:55,611 --> 00:11:57,302
All that's needed is one...
146
00:11:57,406 --> 00:11:58,590
The first videos that I watched
147
00:11:58,614 --> 00:12:00,616
was just innocuous
religious videos,
148
00:12:00,720 --> 00:12:02,240
so I would just try
to get to know more
149
00:12:02,342 --> 00:12:05,552
about the religious aspect
of my life.
150
00:12:10,143 --> 00:12:11,420
But then they became, you know,
151
00:12:11,523 --> 00:12:13,122
videos about wars
in different countries,
152
00:12:13,146 --> 00:12:16,459
about bombings and, you know,
attacks by extremists.
153
00:12:21,948 --> 00:12:25,330
I would just blame the West
for the entire problems
154
00:12:25,434 --> 00:12:27,919
that
the Muslim world was facing.
155
00:12:28,023 --> 00:12:31,958
Everything that was wrong
with the world as I imagined,
156
00:12:32,061 --> 00:12:36,169
I, you know, I was angry about
that, you know, and I wanted to,
157
00:12:36,272 --> 00:12:37,964
I wanted to know more.
158
00:12:46,006 --> 00:12:48,698
So I would be online for
as many hours
159
00:12:48,802 --> 00:12:50,459
that someone
would work full time.
160
00:12:50,562 --> 00:12:54,290
So about 40 to 50 hours a week,
I would just be online.
161
00:12:54,394 --> 00:12:56,948
You know, just watching
multiple videos.
162
00:12:57,052 --> 00:12:59,537
I would say probably
hundreds of videos.
163
00:13:02,402 --> 00:13:04,991
I met Colleen LaRose
through YouTube.
164
00:13:05,094 --> 00:13:10,168
She was a very avid commentator
on different YouTube videos.
165
00:13:10,272 --> 00:13:12,826
It was very apparent that she
was spending a lot of time,
166
00:13:12,930 --> 00:13:14,517
just as much as me.
167
00:13:21,939 --> 00:13:23,423
When she was
at the house there,
168
00:13:23,526 --> 00:13:25,321
she was doing a very good job,
169
00:13:25,425 --> 00:13:27,323
not only taking care
of her mother,
170
00:13:27,427 --> 00:13:29,291
but, you know,
trying to make sure
171
00:13:29,394 --> 00:13:33,191
that my dad took his medicine.
172
00:13:33,295 --> 00:13:37,782
But she did spend a lot of time
on the computer.
173
00:13:37,886 --> 00:13:40,026
I knew she'd like to play
a lot of the games
174
00:13:40,129 --> 00:13:42,166
on the computer there.
175
00:13:50,450 --> 00:13:52,832
Felt like I was
living a double life
176
00:13:52,935 --> 00:13:55,696
and I wanted to commit
to one of them.
177
00:13:58,423 --> 00:14:00,943
And I've committed to jihad.
178
00:14:41,501 --> 00:14:42,985
Thought that he was like me,
179
00:14:43,089 --> 00:14:45,332
that he wanted to do something,
make a difference.
180
00:14:51,062 --> 00:14:53,720
I thought that he was a brother
181
00:14:53,823 --> 00:14:56,930
that was into jihad like I was,
182
00:14:57,034 --> 00:15:01,072
and he was somebody
who had already tried
183
00:15:01,176 --> 00:15:05,801
to do a couple of things
to further the cause of jihad.
184
00:15:12,256 --> 00:15:17,019
And then he was in some sort of
an army of sorts or whatever,
185
00:15:17,123 --> 00:15:21,713
who, according to him and that
he had fought for the Muslim.
186
00:15:25,890 --> 00:15:28,548
But he did say that there was
a house work ready for me
187
00:15:28,651 --> 00:15:30,611
and brothers and sisters
were there waiting for me
188
00:15:30,688 --> 00:15:33,794
and all I need to do
is just to come there.
189
00:15:43,114 --> 00:15:45,841
I met Black Flag
on Islam guiding English forums,
190
00:15:45,945 --> 00:15:48,706
and these are like
actual jihadist forums.
191
00:15:48,809 --> 00:15:51,916
He was one of the very
active users on there.
192
00:15:53,849 --> 00:15:56,921
The Black-Flag came across
as someone who knew basically
193
00:15:57,025 --> 00:15:59,185
what he was doing, you know,
he was very authoritative,
194
00:15:59,234 --> 00:16:02,616
he was very influential
in the forum itself.
195
00:16:02,720 --> 00:16:04,825
I mean, he had a certain level
of eloquence,
196
00:16:04,929 --> 00:16:06,689
you know, in his words.
197
00:16:16,734 --> 00:16:18,908
The remarkable thing to me
when I first got involved
198
00:16:19,012 --> 00:16:21,981
in this case was that.
199
00:16:22,084 --> 00:16:27,952
Just, just all open, there was
there was no coded language,
200
00:16:28,056 --> 00:16:29,216
there was no attempt to hide.
201
00:16:54,703 --> 00:16:57,947
Colleen LaRose had come
to the attention of the FBI
202
00:16:58,051 --> 00:17:02,504
because she was on social media
talking about, uh,
203
00:17:02,607 --> 00:17:05,852
certain types of desires
and intents relative
204
00:17:05,955 --> 00:17:08,648
to what was happening
in the Muslim world
205
00:17:08,751 --> 00:17:11,720
and wanting to do something
to rectify
206
00:17:11,823 --> 00:17:16,069
what she perceived
as wrongs against Muslims.
207
00:17:16,173 --> 00:17:18,313
And so you definitely
would have been paying
208
00:17:18,416 --> 00:17:20,556
quite a bit of attention
to not only her,
209
00:17:20,660 --> 00:17:22,938
but to others in her network.
210
00:17:24,940 --> 00:17:27,736
Well, Eli was...
211
00:17:27,839 --> 00:17:31,809
identified as somebody
who was in Pakistan.
212
00:17:31,912 --> 00:17:35,985
In her mind,
he was the technical expert,
213
00:17:36,089 --> 00:17:38,919
I met the brother Eagle Eye.
214
00:17:39,023 --> 00:17:41,646
He was an al-Qaeda operative.
215
00:17:41,750 --> 00:17:45,788
He had a page on YouTube
and I saw some of his videos
216
00:17:45,892 --> 00:17:48,757
and I liked his videos
because they were about jihad.
217
00:17:51,242 --> 00:17:54,003
There's also an interesting...
218
00:17:54,107 --> 00:17:55,867
there's a movie called
"Eagle Eye,"
219
00:17:55,971 --> 00:18:00,113
an American movie that's about
a fictional terrorist
220
00:18:00,217 --> 00:18:02,150
who's known as Eagle Eye.
221
00:18:02,253 --> 00:18:06,844
For what it's worth, that she
didn't know about that movie.
222
00:18:06,947 --> 00:18:10,503
I'm not convinced
he's a real individual,
223
00:18:10,606 --> 00:18:11,997
as opposed to somebody
who was pretending
224
00:18:12,021 --> 00:18:13,851
to be a terrorist
or a government agent.
225
00:18:19,546 --> 00:18:22,618
He told me,
do I want to know about somebody
226
00:18:22,722 --> 00:18:26,105
who needs to be dealt with?
227
00:18:26,208 --> 00:18:29,591
And I said, well, he said that
Lars Vilks needs to be killed
228
00:18:29,694 --> 00:18:31,179
and that what he's done,
229
00:18:31,282 --> 00:18:33,284
that nobody's ever slapped him
for what he's done
230
00:18:33,388 --> 00:18:35,148
and he needs to be killed
231
00:18:35,252 --> 00:18:37,022
because you want to know
the crime that he did.
232
00:18:37,046 --> 00:18:38,807
And I said, "Yeah."
233
00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:50,957
You've got the invitation
to a smaller exhibition
234
00:18:51,060 --> 00:18:52,786
in the middle of Sweden.
235
00:18:55,548 --> 00:18:59,828
They had a project
called The Dog in Art,
236
00:18:59,931 --> 00:19:03,280
so they asked me
for a contribution to that.
237
00:19:05,213 --> 00:19:06,904
My drawing you want my drawing,
238
00:19:07,007 --> 00:19:11,115
was the head of the prophet
on, on a dog.
239
00:19:21,884 --> 00:19:25,647
Some Muslims started
to make demonstration.
240
00:19:32,378 --> 00:19:36,485
There was demonstrations
in Pakistan, Bangladesh.
241
00:19:39,385 --> 00:19:41,283
I had a phone call
and they told me
242
00:19:41,387 --> 00:19:43,320
"We had bad news,
we had bad news."
243
00:19:49,049 --> 00:19:51,776
I was informed by the police
saying that
244
00:19:51,880 --> 00:19:54,331
"al-Qaeda had put a price on
your head."
245
00:20:08,379 --> 00:20:11,900
I didn't know what was
actually a fatwa meant.
246
00:20:12,003 --> 00:20:15,593
It's just a very, very,
very dangerous.
247
00:20:17,768 --> 00:20:20,149
How does these things work?
248
00:20:20,253 --> 00:20:22,876
Will there be people
coming after me?
249
00:20:22,980 --> 00:20:25,189
Who?
250
00:20:25,293 --> 00:20:29,400
Will it take 10 minutes?
Will it take one hour?
251
00:20:29,504 --> 00:20:33,266
Take a couple of days
or what will happen?
252
00:20:40,204 --> 00:20:44,415
I'm just a sister, and he's had
that much confidence in me
253
00:20:44,519 --> 00:20:46,590
and he thought
that I was that strong,
254
00:20:46,693 --> 00:20:48,971
that I could go do that,
and it made me feel good
255
00:20:49,075 --> 00:20:52,389
that he had
that much confidence in me.
256
00:21:00,535 --> 00:21:03,575
There was a lot of talk
about killing this cartoonist.
257
00:21:03,676 --> 00:21:06,920
I mean, we would chat about it
almost every day.
258
00:21:07,024 --> 00:21:08,898
Me and LaRose would
definitely talk a lot about it,
259
00:21:08,922 --> 00:21:11,718
and she was very excited
to partake in it.
260
00:21:11,822 --> 00:21:13,996
She was very passionate about
and I was very passionate
261
00:21:14,100 --> 00:21:15,550
about it,
and we kind of, you know,
262
00:21:15,653 --> 00:21:17,621
just look towards the Black Flag
as the person,
263
00:21:17,724 --> 00:21:21,280
you know, who would just kind of
bring this whole thing together.
264
00:21:21,383 --> 00:21:24,559
And then he told me that the
brothers can't get close to him
265
00:21:24,662 --> 00:21:26,768
because he's got bodyguards
all around him
266
00:21:26,871 --> 00:21:31,462
and that I could probably
get close to him.
267
00:21:31,566 --> 00:21:33,222
I told him,
I said, "Yes, I'll do it."
268
00:21:38,814 --> 00:21:41,206
Oh, that would have accelerated
the investigation
269
00:21:41,230 --> 00:21:46,615
because now you have her being
directed to travel overseas
270
00:21:46,719 --> 00:21:48,341
in support of terrorism,
271
00:21:48,445 --> 00:21:54,968
to actually plot to kill an
individual in a foreign country.
272
00:21:55,072 --> 00:21:57,385
I was talking to my brother
online all the time,
273
00:21:57,488 --> 00:22:01,975
and the Black Flag told me that
he had everything ready for me
274
00:22:02,079 --> 00:22:03,701
and he told my brother
in Pakistan
275
00:22:03,805 --> 00:22:05,531
that everything was ready
for me.
276
00:22:05,634 --> 00:22:08,465
So I was all, "You need to get
out of America."
277
00:22:51,956 --> 00:22:55,132
There's a lot more
families in this country now,
278
00:22:55,235 --> 00:22:59,688
that have got kids
that are pulling the same stuff,
279
00:22:59,792 --> 00:23:01,103
and I'm sure they're probably
280
00:23:01,207 --> 00:23:04,935
asking themselves
the same question, why.
281
00:23:05,038 --> 00:23:09,733
You know, what are these people
282
00:23:09,836 --> 00:23:13,737
saying to these kids
that getting them
283
00:23:13,840 --> 00:23:19,674
turned their back
on their country...
284
00:23:19,777 --> 00:23:25,404
and going and fighting
for something that is not real?
285
00:23:29,442 --> 00:23:32,928
And, and what, what?
286
00:23:33,032 --> 00:23:40,522
These people came into my home,
through the computer,
287
00:23:40,626 --> 00:23:47,495
and invaded my, my domain
and stole my daughter from me.
288
00:24:34,058 --> 00:24:37,372
- Okay.
- We good, guys?
289
00:24:37,476 --> 00:24:39,926
What did you think of
when you were in prison?
290
00:24:40,030 --> 00:24:43,551
What I think about
when I was in prison?
291
00:24:43,654 --> 00:24:46,243
Why in the hell did I ever
get on that plane?
292
00:24:49,591 --> 00:24:51,282
So.
293
00:24:54,285 --> 00:24:55,563
But I can't change the past.
294
00:24:55,666 --> 00:24:58,048
I mean, in Islam
we're not allowed to say,
295
00:24:58,151 --> 00:25:00,429
"Well, if I were to did this,
this would'a happened,
296
00:25:00,533 --> 00:25:01,773
you're not allowed to say that.
297
00:25:01,810 --> 00:25:03,132
So, I mean, you just got
to accept it.
298
00:25:03,156 --> 00:25:04,606
It's the will of Allah,
subhanAllah.
299
00:25:14,098 --> 00:25:15,859
People laughed at me
my entire life,
300
00:25:15,962 --> 00:25:18,620
so why am I going to worry
about it now?
301
00:25:28,665 --> 00:25:32,047
I was made fun of in school
where I've grown up.
302
00:25:33,911 --> 00:25:34,912
Sometimes it'd be lonely.
303
00:25:35,016 --> 00:25:37,432
I wish I had friends, but...
304
00:25:37,536 --> 00:25:40,262
it was, like, it was this is
something I was always used to.
305
00:25:40,366 --> 00:25:41,919
I grew up like that.
306
00:25:45,613 --> 00:25:46,993
I've always had
a low self-esteem,
307
00:25:47,097 --> 00:25:51,998
but I have a hard time
saying no to people.
308
00:25:52,102 --> 00:25:55,726
I always want to please people
make people happy.
309
00:25:55,830 --> 00:25:59,385
And why do you think you want
to please people so much?
310
00:25:59,488 --> 00:26:01,318
Because no one
wanted to be my friend,
311
00:26:01,421 --> 00:26:02,975
I wanted to have friends.
312
00:26:11,984 --> 00:26:15,090
I got married when I was 18.
313
00:26:15,194 --> 00:26:16,678
What age was he?
314
00:26:16,782 --> 00:26:18,784
Uh, 33.
315
00:26:20,648 --> 00:26:23,720
He used to beat me up
all the time.
316
00:26:23,823 --> 00:26:25,687
It was physical,
he would hit me,
317
00:26:25,791 --> 00:26:28,794
give me black eyes, fat lips.
318
00:26:30,727 --> 00:26:35,421
One morning, I woke up and I
found my gun next to my head
319
00:26:35,524 --> 00:26:37,457
and he wasn't in the room.
320
00:26:40,115 --> 00:26:43,498
He beat me up and so I ran out
on the house
321
00:26:43,602 --> 00:26:46,674
and ran straight
to the police department
322
00:26:46,777 --> 00:26:49,608
and got a restraining order
put against him.
323
00:26:51,230 --> 00:26:54,405
And after the divorce,
I never heard from him again.
324
00:26:56,373 --> 00:26:59,169
I had a couple boyfriends
after that.
325
00:26:59,272 --> 00:27:05,624
Um, nothing serious, but, um,
and then I met my son's father.
326
00:27:11,975 --> 00:27:16,496
His name was Alejandro.
He was from Mexico.
327
00:27:19,707 --> 00:27:24,919
I got pregnant with my son
down in Mexico.
328
00:27:25,022 --> 00:27:28,232
I was so excited
I had finally had a baby.
329
00:27:37,690 --> 00:27:39,968
He had had
a warrant or something.
330
00:27:40,072 --> 00:27:41,532
George Mott: They sent him
back to Mexico.
331
00:27:41,556 --> 00:27:44,766
Yeah, they deported him
back to Mexico.
332
00:27:44,870 --> 00:27:50,392
And so Christian doesn't know
who his dad is.
333
00:27:54,742 --> 00:27:58,746
Who was your third husband? Jamie
Pauline Ramirez: Some guy I worked with,
334
00:27:58,849 --> 00:28:04,130
he ended up getting arrested
and eventually got deported.
335
00:28:07,064 --> 00:28:08,697
Well, I wasn't going to
get married again,
336
00:28:08,721 --> 00:28:10,205
I was through.
337
00:28:10,309 --> 00:28:12,242
Yes, we got married
and divorced,
338
00:28:12,345 --> 00:28:13,933
marry, divorce, marry, divorce,
339
00:28:14,037 --> 00:28:15,348
and I just got tired of it.
340
00:28:15,452 --> 00:28:17,626
Why, what for?
341
00:28:19,525 --> 00:28:21,044
I didn't want to
deal with it anymore.
342
00:28:21,147 --> 00:28:24,599
I was happy I had my little job,
I was going to college.
343
00:28:26,670 --> 00:28:31,502
I had my own place, had my own
little car, had my son.
344
00:28:31,606 --> 00:28:34,471
So I was making it.
345
00:28:44,239 --> 00:28:48,761
It was in 2009,
I noticed on her computer screen
346
00:28:48,865 --> 00:28:52,213
that she had this Lawrence
of Arabia type,
347
00:28:52,316 --> 00:28:58,806
you know, screensaver
on her computer.
348
00:28:58,909 --> 00:29:01,532
I didn't think of anything
of it at first,
349
00:29:01,636 --> 00:29:05,191
but then during
Easter week of 2009
350
00:29:05,295 --> 00:29:06,710
is when she made
the announcement
351
00:29:06,814 --> 00:29:12,578
that she was going
to convert to Islam.
352
00:29:12,681 --> 00:29:16,340
I remember being in the bedroom
and she just walked in
353
00:29:16,444 --> 00:29:19,343
and just blurted it out.
354
00:29:19,447 --> 00:29:22,070
I reacted poorly.
355
00:29:22,174 --> 00:29:24,555
I just, you know, I was angry.
356
00:29:33,150 --> 00:29:35,532
Jamie Pauline Ramirez: I like
the idea of the Brotherhood.
357
00:29:35,635 --> 00:29:38,224
Every Muslim is the brother
of another Muslim.
358
00:29:38,328 --> 00:29:40,330
I like that idea.
359
00:29:41,849 --> 00:29:45,128
I will talk
to people online about Islam
360
00:29:45,231 --> 00:29:47,406
and ask them questions
and everything.
361
00:29:52,066 --> 00:29:56,415
She worked long hours
at the doctor's office
362
00:29:56,518 --> 00:29:58,762
and she got home
at 7:00 at night
363
00:29:58,866 --> 00:30:01,903
and head straight back
to her room,
364
00:30:02,007 --> 00:30:05,665
get on the computer
talking to these people
365
00:30:05,769 --> 00:30:10,429
until, you know, 1:00, 2:00,
3:00 in the morning.
366
00:30:10,532 --> 00:30:14,467
I will read and comment on
like Newcomer's to Islam
367
00:30:14,571 --> 00:30:17,988
and watch videos
about newcomers to Islam.
368
00:30:18,092 --> 00:30:22,717
And eventually I ran
into my codefendant,
369
00:30:22,821 --> 00:30:25,547
his screen name
with the Black Flag.
370
00:30:27,239 --> 00:30:32,037
He sent me an e-mail
through YouTube.
371
00:30:32,140 --> 00:30:36,110
Originally,
he always talked about
372
00:30:36,213 --> 00:30:39,527
living in a non-Muslim country.
373
00:30:39,630 --> 00:30:42,530
Then he would send
me jihad videos,
374
00:30:42,633 --> 00:30:47,846
and then about a week or a week
or so around there,
375
00:30:47,949 --> 00:30:49,848
he asked me to marry him.
376
00:30:56,820 --> 00:31:00,548
One day I walked in the kitchen
and I heard Arabic playing
377
00:31:00,651 --> 00:31:03,413
and I'm like,
it just caught my ear.
378
00:31:03,516 --> 00:31:06,071
And it was like,
"And the infidels"
379
00:31:06,174 --> 00:31:08,004
and I was like,
the fuck are you doing?
380
00:31:08,107 --> 00:31:12,042
And I looked at her computer
and it's got all the bodies,
381
00:31:12,146 --> 00:31:14,873
all the blow ups, you know,
and America's doing this,
382
00:31:14,976 --> 00:31:16,978
and this is happening
with Israel.
383
00:31:17,082 --> 00:31:19,947
And I said, Jamie, I said,
is this something for school?
384
00:31:20,050 --> 00:31:22,742
She goes, "They're hurting
our people."
385
00:31:22,846 --> 00:31:24,641
I said, "Jamie, that ain't even
your fight."
386
00:31:26,850 --> 00:31:31,441
He sent me an e-mail...
387
00:31:31,544 --> 00:31:34,858
telling me
that she needs to contact me.
388
00:31:38,931 --> 00:31:44,799
Colleen and him had been
communicating previously and,
389
00:31:44,903 --> 00:31:48,423
and me and Colleen
communicated together.
390
00:32:19,006 --> 00:32:21,940
The fact that she was able
to make that connection
391
00:32:22,043 --> 00:32:24,666
with Jamie
in these online forums,
392
00:32:24,770 --> 00:32:28,463
Colleen, is actually engaging
in online recruitment.
393
00:32:28,567 --> 00:32:30,569
You know, obviously Jamie
fell into line with that
394
00:32:30,672 --> 00:32:33,606
and actually took
her own direct steps.
395
00:32:46,965 --> 00:32:51,590
The decision was not finalized
until about three days before.
396
00:32:51,693 --> 00:32:53,350
I wanted to go by,
I didn't want to go,
397
00:32:53,454 --> 00:32:57,768
I wanted to finish school too,
so but my mom wouldn't let up.
398
00:32:59,529 --> 00:33:01,048
What the hell?
399
00:33:01,151 --> 00:33:03,740
This lady is never going to
let me be a Muslim woman.
400
00:33:03,843 --> 00:33:06,363
I might as well just leave.
401
00:33:06,467 --> 00:33:08,400
I got tired
of getting yelled at.
402
00:33:17,064 --> 00:33:21,861
Well, I had one of our police
officers knocking at my door,
403
00:33:21,965 --> 00:33:23,691
wanting to know
where she was at.
404
00:33:23,794 --> 00:33:27,798
She hadn't been
at work in a week.
405
00:33:27,902 --> 00:33:30,284
And I said, "What?"
406
00:33:35,392 --> 00:33:41,088
I called her on the phone,
I said, "What are you doing?"
407
00:33:41,191 --> 00:33:43,193
And she told me that she was
going to go stay
408
00:33:43,297 --> 00:33:44,988
with a friend down in Denver.
409
00:33:50,304 --> 00:33:53,686
I had come home in the
afternoon or evening there
410
00:33:53,790 --> 00:33:57,069
and she was gone.
411
00:33:57,173 --> 00:34:00,900
And I didn't know where she was
or what had happened there,
412
00:34:01,004 --> 00:34:02,533
but, yeah, I just got home
and her mother
413
00:34:02,557 --> 00:34:06,354
was there by herself
and she was gone.
414
00:34:08,667 --> 00:34:10,738
The only thing that I know
of that was missing,
415
00:34:10,841 --> 00:34:13,154
I mean,
was she had taken my passport.
416
00:34:13,258 --> 00:34:18,608
She didn't take any money or
anything else that I'm aware of.
417
00:34:18,711 --> 00:34:22,543
It was like
she just picked up and left.
418
00:34:22,646 --> 00:34:24,648
So you have the purchase
of the the tickets.
419
00:34:24,752 --> 00:34:28,859
You have Colleen
stealing the passport.
420
00:34:28,963 --> 00:34:32,863
You have her making contact
with the Swedish embassy saying,
421
00:34:32,967 --> 00:34:36,522
I want to become a citizen
and she's gone well beyond
422
00:34:36,626 --> 00:34:41,286
just espousing
what she would like to do.
423
00:34:41,389 --> 00:34:45,738
So now this case is full on.
424
00:34:45,842 --> 00:34:48,362
He told me
that Colleen had ran off.
425
00:34:48,465 --> 00:34:51,399
He said, "And I'm sending
your mom back to Texas.
426
00:34:51,503 --> 00:34:52,652
He says,
"I can't take care of her.
427
00:34:52,676 --> 00:34:56,680
My dad just died recently."
428
00:34:56,784 --> 00:35:01,547
What the hell is she doing?
I had no idea.
429
00:35:04,136 --> 00:35:06,069
It's your worst nightmare
because now you have
430
00:35:06,173 --> 00:35:07,622
two American citizens
431
00:35:07,726 --> 00:35:10,936
who they've been having
these conversations,
432
00:35:11,039 --> 00:35:14,146
they've been engaging
in these planning activities,
433
00:35:14,250 --> 00:35:17,770
and now they've actually taken
that next step to travel abroad.
434
00:35:30,749 --> 00:35:32,658
Do you ever think of
your sister as a terrorist?
435
00:35:32,682 --> 00:35:34,201
No.
436
00:35:34,304 --> 00:35:39,792
I mean, I'm glad
she is so important now.
437
00:35:39,896 --> 00:35:42,070
But I don't see how.
438
00:35:42,174 --> 00:35:44,728
To me she's still
my little sister.
439
00:35:44,832 --> 00:35:48,767
You know, same mom,
same father, same blood.
440
00:35:48,870 --> 00:35:50,113
Everything.
441
00:35:50,217 --> 00:35:51,873
Except she's short.
442
00:36:00,296 --> 00:36:03,368
I felt pride,
I felt more strong,
443
00:36:03,471 --> 00:36:06,681
that I had a mission,
I had a goal.
444
00:36:08,511 --> 00:36:10,720
Something that was important,
that needed to be done
445
00:36:10,823 --> 00:36:13,101
and I was going
to be the one to do it.
446
00:36:14,827 --> 00:36:17,520
Colleen, in your life,
is there any other times
447
00:36:17,623 --> 00:36:19,384
where you felt important?
448
00:36:19,487 --> 00:36:21,040
Not like that, no.
449
00:36:26,149 --> 00:36:29,773
Her parents were
both alcoholics.
450
00:36:29,877 --> 00:36:33,605
Her father was abusive
when drunk,
451
00:36:33,708 --> 00:36:36,539
her mother was drunk frequently.
452
00:36:36,642 --> 00:36:38,782
They were for a while
still together.
453
00:36:38,886 --> 00:36:43,580
Then they separated,
her father remarried,
454
00:36:43,684 --> 00:36:45,927
and it was then
she would bounce back and forth
455
00:36:46,031 --> 00:36:50,415
between her father's household
and their mother's household.
456
00:36:50,518 --> 00:36:53,038
Neither was
a very good place for her.
457
00:36:56,662 --> 00:36:59,389
Colleen: The first time I ran
away, I was like 13,
458
00:36:59,493 --> 00:37:02,565
it was moved
from Michigan to Texas.
459
00:37:02,668 --> 00:37:05,947
So I just kept running away.
460
00:37:06,051 --> 00:37:09,986
I can't calculate the amount of
times Colleen has run away.
461
00:37:10,089 --> 00:37:12,333
She just had a lot of anger
also.
462
00:37:12,437 --> 00:37:17,856
You know, a lot of hurt a lot of
confusion, a lot of pain.
463
00:37:17,959 --> 00:37:20,479
I think I was, like, um
464
00:37:20,583 --> 00:37:27,797
about 13, I've met this guy
that had a restaurant.
465
00:37:27,900 --> 00:37:30,696
He knew a pimp and the pimp
came in there one day and saw me
466
00:37:30,800 --> 00:37:32,491
and me and him
just started talking
467
00:37:32,595 --> 00:37:36,150
and I just ended up
going home with him
468
00:37:36,254 --> 00:37:40,085
and then he started me
doing all kinds of stuff.
469
00:37:40,188 --> 00:37:43,709
That's what I started doing,
drugs. I mean, everything.
470
00:37:45,677 --> 00:37:48,162
I wanted to make a lot of money
so that my pimp
471
00:37:48,266 --> 00:37:50,198
would be happy with me
472
00:37:50,302 --> 00:37:53,892
and I felt like these men
when they came to see me,
473
00:37:53,995 --> 00:37:57,827
I felt like I was desirable.
474
00:37:57,930 --> 00:38:02,383
At that time, I didn't click
to me that this is terrible.
475
00:38:05,179 --> 00:38:10,771
At some point after
she wandered into prostitution,
476
00:38:10,874 --> 00:38:14,153
yes, her first husband
was one of her customers.
477
00:38:14,257 --> 00:38:17,743
Well, he was like 33
and I was like 15
478
00:38:17,847 --> 00:38:20,574
and he liked getting high
and I like getting high.
479
00:38:20,677 --> 00:38:21,989
He was crazy.
480
00:38:22,092 --> 00:38:23,932
I don't know who our witnesses
was or if we had
481
00:38:24,025 --> 00:38:26,407
witnesses or what,
but we ended up getting married.
482
00:38:26,511 --> 00:38:28,444
And I got married to him
by using a fake I.D.,
483
00:38:28,547 --> 00:38:30,066
a fake birth certificate.
484
00:38:30,169 --> 00:38:31,826
That he had gotten and I had...
485
00:38:31,930 --> 00:38:33,839
He gave me the birth certificate
to carry around in my pocket
486
00:38:33,863 --> 00:38:37,107
so it looked like it's worn out.
487
00:38:37,211 --> 00:38:38,764
We went to Buddy's house,
488
00:38:38,868 --> 00:38:41,733
which was Colleen's husband
at the time,
489
00:38:41,836 --> 00:38:45,323
and he said she was gone,
she was out prostituting.
490
00:38:45,426 --> 00:38:48,567
And so we couldn't
find her nowhere.
491
00:38:52,813 --> 00:38:55,056
I was a truck
driver at that time.
492
00:38:55,160 --> 00:38:57,404
He was one of my customers.
493
00:38:57,507 --> 00:38:59,716
Well, he met me at the
what they call it,
494
00:38:59,820 --> 00:39:01,235
a "hose stroll"
it's where I was,
495
00:39:01,339 --> 00:39:03,306
the street I was working on.
496
00:39:06,861 --> 00:39:08,501
And he told me
he was going to leave Texas
497
00:39:08,587 --> 00:39:09,761
and he's going to Tennessee
498
00:39:09,864 --> 00:39:11,901
and he asked me
if I wanted to go.
499
00:39:12,004 --> 00:39:14,213
I just wanted to get away.
500
00:39:14,317 --> 00:39:16,699
And that was my perfect way
to get out.
501
00:39:16,802 --> 00:39:18,494
So I came b... I went with him.
502
00:39:22,256 --> 00:39:24,258
And while I was with him,
I was going,
503
00:39:24,362 --> 00:39:26,674
I was going to truck stops
with him.
504
00:39:26,778 --> 00:39:29,574
And he was prostituting me
'cause the truck driver's there.
505
00:39:32,162 --> 00:39:35,752
And I would just go
from one truck to another.
506
00:39:38,962 --> 00:39:41,965
And then we got to Tennessee
and I was real sick
507
00:39:42,069 --> 00:39:43,311
and I couldn't go out with him.
508
00:39:48,455 --> 00:39:51,112
I was sick, and so I guess
I was more sick then, I know,
509
00:39:51,216 --> 00:39:53,632
because there's all kinds
of things wrong with me.
510
00:39:53,736 --> 00:39:55,151
So I was not able to go out
511
00:39:55,254 --> 00:39:57,153
to work
with the truck driver no more.
512
00:39:57,256 --> 00:39:59,569
And they never came back for me.
513
00:40:01,882 --> 00:40:04,229
'Cause I was sick and I didn't
have nowhere to go,
514
00:40:04,332 --> 00:40:07,163
and I went to this restaurant
and this one lady
515
00:40:07,266 --> 00:40:11,443
came up to me and she asked me,
"Are you okay?"
516
00:40:11,547 --> 00:40:14,204
When I encountered
Colleen LaRose,
517
00:40:14,308 --> 00:40:19,106
I was a counselor at the runaway
house in Memphis, Tennessee.
518
00:40:19,209 --> 00:40:22,420
She had told me that she had
started prostituting
519
00:40:22,523 --> 00:40:24,042
around 14 years of age
520
00:40:24,145 --> 00:40:29,323
and had basically been
on the streets since age 13.
521
00:40:29,427 --> 00:40:31,843
And one thing that had
contributed to that
522
00:40:31,946 --> 00:40:36,813
was the dysfunction
within her family unit.
523
00:40:36,917 --> 00:40:42,025
So I did call Richard LaRose,
Colleen's father.
524
00:40:42,129 --> 00:40:45,960
One reason this case
stuck out in my mind so much
525
00:40:46,064 --> 00:40:50,517
was when I on the phone told him
about the allegations
526
00:40:50,620 --> 00:40:53,520
that she had made
towards him of sexual abuse.
527
00:40:53,623 --> 00:40:55,625
He admitted it to me.
528
00:40:55,729 --> 00:40:57,972
Matter of fact,
he used the words that,
529
00:40:58,076 --> 00:41:00,250
"Yes, I did rape my daughters."
530
00:41:12,021 --> 00:41:15,645
In my eyes, Richard it was
nothing but a lousy, drunk,
531
00:41:15,749 --> 00:41:21,582
lazy, abusive to my mother,
abusive to us children,
532
00:41:21,686 --> 00:41:25,068
but he never physically
would hit us,
533
00:41:25,172 --> 00:41:28,865
but he would do other sexual
stuff to my sister and I.
534
00:41:31,385 --> 00:41:33,214
It started when I was nine,
535
00:41:33,318 --> 00:41:37,425
and I think Colleen was six
or seven when it started.
536
00:41:37,529 --> 00:41:42,016
I think she was seven when he
started messing with her.
537
00:41:42,120 --> 00:41:43,477
I remember one
time when I was seven,
538
00:41:43,501 --> 00:41:45,226
he came to my bed and I guess
539
00:41:45,330 --> 00:41:47,953
he was
he was touching me or whatever,
540
00:41:48,057 --> 00:41:50,335
and he asked me
if I ever been fucked.
541
00:41:50,438 --> 00:41:52,061
And I told him, "No."
542
00:41:52,164 --> 00:41:54,270
I don't remember
what happened after that.
543
00:41:54,373 --> 00:41:57,549
It just, I blocked it out.
544
00:41:57,653 --> 00:42:01,898
I always got real nauseous
at my stomach.
545
00:42:02,002 --> 00:42:07,041
Him just doing stuff to me,
nasty stuff.
546
00:42:07,145 --> 00:42:11,598
Just about every...
about twice a week.
547
00:42:11,701 --> 00:42:14,601
I remember one time when my,
my mother and my step dad
548
00:42:14,704 --> 00:42:16,050
was driving me and my sister,
549
00:42:16,154 --> 00:42:19,226
my brother back to my real dad
and his wife
550
00:42:19,329 --> 00:42:20,848
and I was in
the back seat of the car.
551
00:42:20,952 --> 00:42:22,470
I just started to cry
because I knew
552
00:42:22,574 --> 00:42:25,232
what was going to be
waiting for me when I got there.
553
00:42:27,683 --> 00:42:30,996
Olive Mannino: So he confirmed
to me that her allegations
554
00:42:31,100 --> 00:42:34,413
were true about
the incestuous relationship
555
00:42:34,517 --> 00:42:37,140
that he had with his children.
556
00:42:37,244 --> 00:42:40,765
I did hand her the phone
and Colleen confronted
557
00:42:40,868 --> 00:42:45,045
her father and she was very
angry and she was very tearful
558
00:42:45,148 --> 00:42:49,083
and I just remember
that conversation so vividly.
559
00:42:49,187 --> 00:42:51,085
And I remember her screaming
into the phone
560
00:42:51,189 --> 00:42:54,537
while I stood there beside her
and she was yelling at him,
561
00:42:54,641 --> 00:42:56,159
"Why did you do this to me?
562
00:42:56,263 --> 00:42:58,299
Why did you mess me up like
this?
563
00:42:58,403 --> 00:43:00,888
Don't you see
what you've done to me?"
564
00:43:00,992 --> 00:43:04,892
And she was so angry and so full
of rage towards him.
565
00:43:04,996 --> 00:43:08,102
And I remember her
slamming down the phone
566
00:43:08,206 --> 00:43:10,346
and then just embracing me
567
00:43:10,449 --> 00:43:13,556
and crying
and crying and sobbing.
568
00:43:13,660 --> 00:43:16,386
And it was just like years
of abuse
569
00:43:16,490 --> 00:43:18,734
she was trying to let out.
570
00:43:18,837 --> 00:43:24,015
♪♪
571
00:43:24,118 --> 00:43:27,225
It was just a part of my...
I consider everything in my life
572
00:43:27,328 --> 00:43:29,399
is been a big adventure.
573
00:43:31,125 --> 00:43:33,334
And so it was just part of me
growing up,
574
00:43:33,438 --> 00:43:35,405
it's what I had to go through.
575
00:44:04,607 --> 00:44:08,128
May I speak to Mark, please?
576
00:44:08,231 --> 00:44:09,785
This is
577
00:44:09,888 --> 00:44:11,269
This is Fatima.
578
00:44:16,446 --> 00:44:18,414
Okay, I'll wait.
579
00:44:25,870 --> 00:44:27,181
Hello, Mark?
580
00:44:27,285 --> 00:44:29,149
Hey, it's me.
581
00:44:29,252 --> 00:44:30,875
I'm free.
582
00:44:32,393 --> 00:44:34,119
I'm coming home.
583
00:45:03,562 --> 00:45:07,049
This is Muslimah.
584
00:45:07,152 --> 00:45:08,740
This is Abdullah, he's pink
585
00:45:08,844 --> 00:45:12,054
because he's in touch
with his feminine side.
586
00:45:12,157 --> 00:45:14,504
And this is Frenchie,
he's deformed.
587
00:45:14,608 --> 00:45:18,750
So Frenchie is the gay dog.
588
00:45:19,613 --> 00:45:21,166
I tell you,
I'd say y'all can't imagine
589
00:45:21,270 --> 00:45:23,859
that a terrorist sleeping
with stuffed animals.
590
00:45:28,967 --> 00:45:32,591
Yeah, everybody should.
It keeps you calm at night.
591
00:45:32,695 --> 00:45:34,259
And when I was in the shoe,
I didn't have them,
592
00:45:34,283 --> 00:45:36,112
I would get a towel
and I would bundle it up
593
00:45:36,216 --> 00:45:39,046
and I would hold the towel
like I held my cat
594
00:45:39,150 --> 00:45:42,360
and sleep with that.
595
00:45:42,463 --> 00:45:45,501
Guess it's like
a security thing.
596
00:45:51,507 --> 00:45:55,649
This is my bucket list
for when I get out.
597
00:45:55,753 --> 00:45:59,929
Find my baby Daw Savage,
go to Zim's Facebook page,
598
00:46:00,033 --> 00:46:03,968
copy pics for her.
Keep in touch with my babies.
599
00:46:04,071 --> 00:46:09,387
It'll be Breezy, Jalin, Max,
Tatiana, Meeco,
600
00:46:09,490 --> 00:46:13,253
and of course, most important,
my sweet baby Zimmy.
601
00:46:13,356 --> 00:46:15,324
Oh, there is a new disease.
602
00:46:15,427 --> 00:46:17,705
I heard about a lot of girls
heard about it.
603
00:46:17,809 --> 00:46:19,707
It's called blue waffle,
women get it.
604
00:46:19,811 --> 00:46:23,539
It's like it's a sexually
transmitted disease.
605
00:46:23,781 --> 00:46:25,265
That's what they said.
606
00:46:25,368 --> 00:46:27,819
And we all don't know
if that's a real thing
607
00:46:27,923 --> 00:46:29,787
or if people are just
making it up.
608
00:46:29,890 --> 00:46:31,719
Yeah, we just we never
heard of it.
609
00:46:31,823 --> 00:46:33,031
We want to see what it is
610
00:46:33,135 --> 00:46:34,595
and how you get it
and how to get rid of it
611
00:46:34,619 --> 00:46:37,001
and what it what
does it do to you?
612
00:46:37,104 --> 00:46:40,625
Research in minute detail
the situation in Palestine,
613
00:46:40,728 --> 00:46:43,973
how it used to be
before the Zionists invaded
614
00:46:44,077 --> 00:46:46,493
and the situation
they are in now.
615
00:47:03,027 --> 00:47:05,443
When you were in prison,
what did you think about
616
00:47:05,546 --> 00:47:07,306
the event at Waterford
and what had happened?
617
00:47:07,341 --> 00:47:10,206
I was proud of myself
because I told my brother
618
00:47:10,310 --> 00:47:13,382
that I was willing to do
what he asked me to do.
619
00:47:13,485 --> 00:47:15,867
I knew he was proud of me.
620
00:47:15,971 --> 00:47:23,971
♪♪
621
00:47:24,738 --> 00:47:26,602
When I wrote him
Waterford he came
622
00:47:26,705 --> 00:47:29,329
to get me at the airport,
he told me, he says,
623
00:47:29,432 --> 00:47:32,573
"I feel that you went
from YouTube to Ireland."
624
00:47:32,677 --> 00:47:34,092
I go,
"I can't believe I'm here."
625
00:47:40,133 --> 00:47:41,928
I got into the back seat
because, oh, sister,
626
00:47:42,031 --> 00:47:43,431
don't sit beside brother
on the car,
627
00:47:43,481 --> 00:47:45,345
we sit behind and I sat behind,
628
00:47:45,448 --> 00:47:47,761
he didn't talk to me.
629
00:47:47,865 --> 00:47:51,454
But he didn't
and he was very quiet.
630
00:47:51,558 --> 00:47:53,836
I could tell that
there was something
631
00:47:53,940 --> 00:47:55,286
that was bothering him,
632
00:47:55,389 --> 00:47:57,529
but he wouldn't tell me
what it was.
633
00:48:03,190 --> 00:48:07,988
His real name was Ali,
and he was from Algeria
634
00:48:08,092 --> 00:48:13,752
and he's lived in France awhile,
and he...
635
00:48:13,856 --> 00:48:16,963
sort of, like,
came out of nowhere.
636
00:48:17,066 --> 00:48:22,106
Ali Charaf Damache was living
in a one-bedroom apartment,
637
00:48:22,209 --> 00:48:24,004
a rather rundown street.
638
00:48:24,108 --> 00:48:26,731
I did ask him about Black Flag.
639
00:48:26,834 --> 00:48:31,874
And he acknowledged
that it was him.
640
00:48:31,978 --> 00:48:34,497
He was a loner,
641
00:48:34,601 --> 00:48:38,985
he had excellent English,
intelligent, literate,
642
00:48:39,088 --> 00:48:42,298
he had been in the auctioneering
business in Cork.
643
00:48:42,402 --> 00:48:44,887
And now, he was unemployed.
644
00:48:47,890 --> 00:48:52,101
Wasn't that big of an apartment
it a restroom at a bedroom
645
00:48:52,205 --> 00:48:57,382
and a front room and kitchenette
type thing all in one space,
646
00:48:57,486 --> 00:49:01,559
and that's where I was sleeping.
647
00:49:01,662 --> 00:49:04,769
When she first got to Europe,
she called me,
648
00:49:04,872 --> 00:49:07,530
she was wearing,
because it was during the time
649
00:49:07,634 --> 00:49:08,876
where Muslims don't eat.
650
00:49:08,980 --> 00:49:10,809
- Ramadan, yeah.
- Ramadan.
651
00:49:10,913 --> 00:49:16,401
And, she says, "I wonder if it'd
be okay with the time changes
652
00:49:16,505 --> 00:49:18,714
and everything she's already
been through,
653
00:49:18,817 --> 00:49:21,579
if she could at least have
banana, you know,
654
00:49:21,682 --> 00:49:23,961
something to eat. She always
loved bananas.
655
00:49:24,064 --> 00:49:25,583
And I thought, I said,
656
00:49:25,686 --> 00:49:28,827
"I would, What are they're going
to put you in jail?"
657
00:49:28,931 --> 00:49:30,805
We talked for a little bit and I
told her what time it was,
658
00:49:30,829 --> 00:49:33,694
it was 5:00 in the morning
in Texas.
659
00:49:33,798 --> 00:49:37,422
And then the phone went out.
660
00:49:39,700 --> 00:49:44,982
The next day, Jamie was there,
you know, Jamie was in Ireland.
661
00:49:45,085 --> 00:49:46,362
I had no idea.
662
00:49:46,466 --> 00:49:47,985
And then I went
and I talked to Jamie
663
00:49:48,088 --> 00:49:49,688
and Jamie told me
she had gotten married.
664
00:49:49,745 --> 00:49:51,574
So I said,
"Who'd you get married to?"
665
00:49:51,678 --> 00:49:53,231
And she said, "Brother Ali."
666
00:49:54,439 --> 00:49:56,994
I arrived in.
667
00:49:57,097 --> 00:50:01,860
Arrived there on Sunday morning.
We got married Monday.
668
00:50:01,964 --> 00:50:04,173
We couldn't have children
without marriage,
669
00:50:04,277 --> 00:50:06,520
so I wanted more kids, so.
670
00:50:08,522 --> 00:50:12,975
Uh, I had to get married
in order to have more kids.
671
00:50:13,079 --> 00:50:14,597
And I said, "Oh."
672
00:50:14,701 --> 00:50:16,334
I didn't understand,
because I was just in the car
673
00:50:16,358 --> 00:50:18,060
with him the day before,
he picked me up at the airport.
674
00:50:18,084 --> 00:50:20,327
He had just gotten married
that morning to her.
675
00:50:20,431 --> 00:50:22,536
He never mentioned that to me.
676
00:50:22,640 --> 00:50:24,676
I said, "Oh,
okay, well, that's great."
677
00:50:24,780 --> 00:50:32,305
♪♪
678
00:50:32,408 --> 00:50:34,662
When she was over there,
you know, intermittently,
679
00:50:34,686 --> 00:50:37,965
she was able to talk with me
through the same chat messengers
680
00:50:38,069 --> 00:50:39,415
that we were using.
681
00:50:39,519 --> 00:50:42,936
LaRose described that she was
a little bit
682
00:50:43,040 --> 00:50:45,490
disaffected
by meeting the Black Flag.
683
00:50:45,594 --> 00:50:49,253
I mean, she had what she
imagined was not really true.
684
00:50:49,356 --> 00:50:51,600
There was was
kind of an illusion.
685
00:50:51,703 --> 00:50:55,500
The Black Flag was not
treating her the right way.
686
00:50:55,604 --> 00:50:57,640
At one point,
I remember asking the Black Flag
687
00:50:57,744 --> 00:51:00,643
if everything was fine if,
you know, things were in order,
688
00:51:00,747 --> 00:51:02,369
and he said that everything
was in order
689
00:51:02,473 --> 00:51:03,750
and he was very busy with stuff
690
00:51:03,853 --> 00:51:06,856
and he was taking
care of everyone.
691
00:51:06,960 --> 00:51:10,826
I didn't think that we had time
for a private life,
692
00:51:10,929 --> 00:51:14,140
for our own life
when we had things to do.
693
00:51:14,243 --> 00:51:15,531
He's moving on with his life
and here
694
00:51:15,555 --> 00:51:17,488
I am holding my life back
695
00:51:17,591 --> 00:51:19,731
so I can do
what I was supposed to do.
696
00:51:19,835 --> 00:51:21,768
And here he is
on getting married.
697
00:51:21,871 --> 00:51:25,289
Like why you're supposed to be
doing this? What are you doing?
698
00:51:51,038 --> 00:51:52,488
That was one of
the last messages
699
00:51:52,592 --> 00:51:54,801
I sent to my brother
in Pakistan.
700
00:51:57,044 --> 00:52:01,980
I was trying to reassure him
that I am strong
701
00:52:02,084 --> 00:52:03,810
and I would not let him down.
702
00:52:03,913 --> 00:52:06,951
♪♪
703
00:52:07,054 --> 00:52:09,781
And I wanted him to know
that I'm not, I'm not afraid.
704
00:52:09,885 --> 00:52:11,438
I would do it.
705
00:52:11,542 --> 00:52:16,788
♪♪
706
00:52:16,892 --> 00:52:21,207
She was she was a comic,
she was comical, she was funny.
707
00:52:22,967 --> 00:52:27,523
But I wouldn't be, I wouldn't be
friends with her.
708
00:52:27,627 --> 00:52:30,699
But I mean, she made me laugh
and she was comical the way
709
00:52:30,802 --> 00:52:32,494
she did things,
the way she spoke.
710
00:52:32,597 --> 00:52:37,844
I mean, she just kept on
running a million miles an hour.
711
00:52:41,710 --> 00:52:45,852
Jamie was not allowed
to leave the apartment
712
00:52:45,955 --> 00:52:48,820
and I did not want to stay
in the house all the time,
713
00:52:48,924 --> 00:52:51,651
so I would go in the daytime
to different stores, whatever,
714
00:52:51,754 --> 00:52:54,964
and when I would come back Jamie
would still be there alone.
715
00:52:55,068 --> 00:52:57,553
And I felt bad for her
because I'm the type of person
716
00:52:57,657 --> 00:53:00,522
that I'll do what my brothers
tell me to do,
717
00:53:00,625 --> 00:53:02,524
but they're going to respect me.
718
00:53:02,627 --> 00:53:04,457
And they're going to
take care of me
719
00:53:04,560 --> 00:53:06,148
like they would take care
of your sister
720
00:53:06,252 --> 00:53:08,633
and take care of your mother,
take care of your aunt.
721
00:53:08,737 --> 00:53:11,291
They're not going to treat me
like I'm a dog.
722
00:53:17,539 --> 00:53:22,958
♪♪
723
00:53:23,061 --> 00:53:28,446
♪♪
724
00:53:28,550 --> 00:53:31,311
They really didn't hang out
together that much.
725
00:53:31,415 --> 00:53:34,314
I mean, he told her
how to get to places,
726
00:53:34,418 --> 00:53:38,663
but he didn't hang out with her.
727
00:53:38,767 --> 00:53:42,253
He told me he didn't like her.
728
00:53:42,357 --> 00:53:46,568
I mean, he just I thought
I thought he was like a leader,
729
00:53:46,671 --> 00:53:47,983
like a leader.
730
00:53:48,086 --> 00:53:49,650
And that he had everything
under control,
731
00:53:49,674 --> 00:53:52,574
he had people under him,
and that he could teach me.
732
00:53:52,677 --> 00:53:54,886
But it turned out
he wasn't that at all.
733
00:53:58,062 --> 00:54:00,029
He was a liar. Period.
734
00:54:00,133 --> 00:54:01,893
He lied to all of us.
735
00:54:05,242 --> 00:54:07,150
And it was like, even, like,
when I talked to my brother
736
00:54:07,174 --> 00:54:08,762
in Pakistan, and I told him,
737
00:54:08,866 --> 00:54:11,144
"What did I Ali tell you
that he was going to do?"
738
00:54:11,248 --> 00:54:12,408
And he said, "Well, he told me
739
00:54:12,490 --> 00:54:14,320
the same thing
that he told you."
740
00:54:14,423 --> 00:54:16,839
So I said, "Well, I mean,
he, he, he didn't do it."
741
00:54:16,943 --> 00:54:21,568
He said,
"Well, what's going on?"
742
00:54:21,672 --> 00:54:23,536
But I didn't back down.
743
00:54:23,639 --> 00:54:26,815
So, I mean, it left him just
standing there looking foolish
744
00:54:26,918 --> 00:54:30,750
because he didn't have anything
ready, and I was ready.
745
00:54:30,853 --> 00:54:37,204
♪♪
746
00:54:37,308 --> 00:54:43,659
♪♪
747
00:54:43,763 --> 00:54:46,904
So I was just waiting
and waiting and waiting,
748
00:54:47,007 --> 00:54:52,116
and it's like, finally I need
to go do something.
749
00:54:52,219 --> 00:54:55,050
So I went to the library,
I got on the Internet
750
00:54:55,153 --> 00:54:58,536
and I went to the FBI website.
751
00:54:58,640 --> 00:55:00,607
And then I wrote to them
and I told them,
752
00:55:00,711 --> 00:55:04,853
I said, "Look,
if you let me come home,
753
00:55:04,956 --> 00:55:07,442
I'll tell you the truth
that you want to know."
754
00:55:07,545 --> 00:55:12,723
♪♪
755
00:55:12,826 --> 00:55:16,520
We didn't Ali just took her
to the airport and she's gone.
756
00:55:16,623 --> 00:55:18,487
Never heard from her again.
757
00:55:18,591 --> 00:55:26,591
♪♪
758
00:55:26,702 --> 00:55:34,702
♪♪
759
00:55:34,952 --> 00:55:36,436
How much trouble I was
gonna get into?
760
00:55:36,540 --> 00:55:38,265
No, I did not know.
761
00:55:38,369 --> 00:55:40,243
It's just, like, you know, the
planning of killing that man,
762
00:55:40,267 --> 00:55:43,236
I didn't think that was illegal
because I didn't do it.
763
00:55:43,340 --> 00:55:44,686
I didn't follow through.
764
00:55:44,789 --> 00:55:46,895
But apparently
that's called conspiracy.
765
00:55:46,998 --> 00:55:48,241
And that's just as bad as
766
00:55:48,345 --> 00:55:50,726
actually carrying it
through almost.
767
00:55:50,830 --> 00:55:58,113
♪♪
768
00:55:58,216 --> 00:56:00,874
For you know what I the
impression I get
769
00:56:00,978 --> 00:56:03,739
for her the minute she came back
to the United States,
770
00:56:03,843 --> 00:56:06,466
that episode was over
in her life.
771
00:56:06,570 --> 00:56:09,814
And so she would talk
to the agents about it
772
00:56:09,918 --> 00:56:11,723
and then they would let her
go home and that was it.
773
00:56:11,747 --> 00:56:13,335
She would go back
and live with Kurt.
774
00:56:13,439 --> 00:56:16,200
I think she really that's,
that's the way she perceived it.
775
00:56:18,547 --> 00:56:20,998
And then when my lawyer told me
that I was looking at life
776
00:56:21,101 --> 00:56:25,451
I was like, "What the heck,
I didn't even do anything."
777
00:56:25,554 --> 00:56:28,902
The FBI told me, "This is
a little bit of trouble,
778
00:56:29,006 --> 00:56:31,871
this is a lot of trouble,
you're right here."
779
00:56:31,974 --> 00:56:39,974
♪♪
780
00:57:00,520 --> 00:57:03,143
Jamie Pauline Ramirez: After,
after we decided to get married,
781
00:57:03,247 --> 00:57:06,768
the jihad aspect
of our conversations
782
00:57:06,871 --> 00:57:10,772
pretty much got put
on the back burner.
783
00:57:10,875 --> 00:57:13,602
Did he discuss jihad with you?
784
00:57:13,706 --> 00:57:15,673
After we decided
to get married, no.
785
00:57:15,777 --> 00:57:19,436
Very little,
I'll say very little.
786
00:57:19,539 --> 00:57:21,886
Was it a loving relationship
that you had?
787
00:57:21,990 --> 00:57:23,750
Loving? No.
788
00:57:25,372 --> 00:57:28,893
Mnh-mnh.
789
00:57:28,997 --> 00:57:30,447
Why not?
790
00:57:30,550 --> 00:57:32,690
I don't know.
791
00:57:32,794 --> 00:57:34,416
He was very quiet
and very distant.
792
00:57:34,520 --> 00:57:36,453
He didn't talk to me.
793
00:57:38,213 --> 00:57:39,939
Maybe 10 sentences.
794
00:57:40,042 --> 00:57:43,460
Maybe I'm exaggerating a little
bit, but it was very little.
795
00:57:45,841 --> 00:57:49,224
He wasn't, he wasn't violent
towards me, he just didn't talk.
796
00:57:49,327 --> 00:57:51,207
I mean, I didn't like
the way he treated my son.
797
00:57:51,295 --> 00:57:54,850
He was mean to my son.
798
00:57:54,954 --> 00:57:57,335
I didn't like that at all.
799
00:57:57,439 --> 00:58:04,550
Basically, it sounds like
that Ali's, uh,
800
00:58:04,653 --> 00:58:09,831
taking control of the child
was the biggest factor
801
00:58:09,934 --> 00:58:11,557
in the life in that apartment.
802
00:58:11,660 --> 00:58:14,767
He, you know,
he fashions some gun
803
00:58:14,870 --> 00:58:17,114
for the, for the young child,
804
00:58:17,217 --> 00:58:18,771
and he was, he was essentially
805
00:58:18,874 --> 00:58:20,566
like starting
to totally inculcate him,
806
00:58:20,669 --> 00:58:23,465
taking him places,
leaving him behind.
807
00:58:29,022 --> 00:58:31,956
A lot of times he would take
my son to the park
808
00:58:32,060 --> 00:58:34,545
and I would be left at home.
809
00:58:34,649 --> 00:58:40,068
Cook and then clean and then
look on the Internet.
810
00:58:42,726 --> 00:58:44,635
Christian:
I have no clue if my mom
was happy there.
811
00:58:44,659 --> 00:58:46,212
Pretty much I never
really saw her
812
00:58:46,315 --> 00:58:52,770
except like sitting down
and reading the newsprint or...
813
00:58:52,874 --> 00:58:55,221
You didn't really see her?
814
00:58:55,324 --> 00:59:00,122
No, I saw her a lot, but,
like, not really doing anything.
815
00:59:03,988 --> 00:59:07,095
Sometimes were you not
allowed outside?
816
00:59:07,198 --> 00:59:09,245
Not that I wasn't allowed,
I just didn't get to wha...
817
00:59:09,269 --> 00:59:14,412
Not that I was... he didn't say,
"No, you can't go outside,"
818
00:59:14,516 --> 00:59:16,622
but he just didn't
take me anywhere.
819
00:59:16,725 --> 00:59:23,801
♪♪
820
00:59:23,905 --> 00:59:28,495
Jamie said she only went out
once or twice.
821
00:59:28,599 --> 00:59:31,913
So it was just total isolation.
822
00:59:34,571 --> 00:59:36,997
Jeremy Ibrahim Gonzalez:
It seemed to me like
he kept her isolated
823
00:59:37,021 --> 00:59:39,817
and would not let her
leave the house,
824
00:59:39,921 --> 00:59:43,269
so she was very much
a prisoner in that home
825
00:59:43,372 --> 00:59:45,547
and she allowed that to happen.
826
00:59:45,651 --> 00:59:50,379
You know, she very well
could have picked up and left.
827
00:59:50,483 --> 00:59:52,105
But when you look at her history
828
00:59:52,209 --> 00:59:54,452
from her previous marriages
and the domestic abuse
829
00:59:54,556 --> 00:59:57,421
she suffered
and a dysfunctional childhood,
830
00:59:57,524 --> 00:59:59,181
it is, you know, very much akin
831
00:59:59,285 --> 01:00:01,736
to battered woman syndrome
where she's not going,
832
01:00:01,839 --> 01:00:06,395
even though it would make
eminent sense for her to leave.
833
01:00:06,499 --> 01:00:08,363
And, you know,
what compounds it is,
834
01:00:08,466 --> 01:00:12,505
she's in a foreign country,
so where does she go?
835
01:00:12,609 --> 01:00:20,547
♪♪
836
01:00:20,651 --> 01:00:24,966
I got pregnant
around February-ish.
837
01:00:25,069 --> 01:00:26,864
And was that a shocker?
838
01:00:29,660 --> 01:00:33,215
I don't know. No.
839
01:00:33,319 --> 01:00:35,424
A fact of life.
840
01:00:35,528 --> 01:00:38,186
It happens.
841
01:00:38,289 --> 01:00:40,326
Were you happy with the news?
842
01:00:40,429 --> 01:00:41,845
Was I happy with the pregnancy?
843
01:00:41,948 --> 01:00:44,917
Yeah, I wanted,
I wanted more kids.
844
01:00:45,020 --> 01:00:47,057
So, it's not like I was going to
reject the baby.
845
01:00:47,160 --> 01:00:50,577
What does have
anything to do with anything?
846
01:01:03,487 --> 01:01:05,385
I'm working on my garden thing,
847
01:01:05,489 --> 01:01:08,009
you want to talk to Christian?
848
01:01:08,112 --> 01:01:10,425
Yes.
Okay.
849
01:01:10,528 --> 01:01:12,703
Christian, it's your mom.
850
01:01:12,807 --> 01:01:15,154
Hi, baby, what are you doing?
851
01:01:15,257 --> 01:01:17,915
Nothing, just watching TV.
852
01:01:18,019 --> 01:01:23,127
What you watching? Uh, "River Monsters."
853
01:01:23,231 --> 01:01:24,473
What is it?
854
01:01:24,577 --> 01:01:27,407
"River Monsters."
855
01:01:27,511 --> 01:01:30,376
Oh, yeah.
So what'd you do today?
856
01:01:30,479 --> 01:01:34,311
Huh?
So what'd you do today?
857
01:01:34,414 --> 01:01:38,591
Fed the chickens.
858
01:01:38,695 --> 01:01:41,767
Woke up.
859
01:01:41,870 --> 01:01:43,561
That's about it.
860
01:01:47,738 --> 01:01:49,326
Is this
your last week of school?
861
01:01:49,429 --> 01:01:52,018
Huh?
Is this
your last week of school?
862
01:01:52,122 --> 01:01:53,606
Yeah.
863
01:01:55,953 --> 01:01:58,266
That's good.
864
01:02:02,442 --> 01:02:05,273
Yep.
865
01:02:06,308 --> 01:02:10,243
Well, I'm gonna try to have
them mail that thing
866
01:02:10,347 --> 01:02:14,213
So you can
come out here this summer.
867
01:02:14,316 --> 01:02:17,630
I hope I, hope I can.
868
01:02:17,734 --> 01:02:19,287
Yeah, I hope you do, too.
869
01:02:19,977 --> 01:02:21,461
Can't wait to see you.
870
01:02:21,565 --> 01:02:23,153
Can't wait to see you.
871
01:02:25,880 --> 01:02:28,917
So I'll try to make some money
and send it to Grandma,
872
01:02:29,021 --> 01:02:31,126
and bring you out here.
873
01:02:33,266 --> 01:02:35,717
Hopefully,
I'll have a bigger apartment.
874
01:02:38,271 --> 01:02:40,618
Mm.
875
01:02:51,664 --> 01:02:54,046
You getting bored?
876
01:02:54,149 --> 01:02:55,633
A little.
877
01:02:59,189 --> 01:03:02,433
Are you getting bored? No.
878
01:03:06,990 --> 01:03:09,371
Ah.
879
01:03:13,755 --> 01:03:15,446
You good?
880
01:03:15,550 --> 01:03:16,827
Huh?
881
01:03:16,931 --> 01:03:18,933
You good?
882
01:03:19,036 --> 01:03:20,555
I am.
883
01:03:31,186 --> 01:03:32,809
So what you been up to?
884
01:03:32,912 --> 01:03:38,504
♪♪
885
01:03:38,607 --> 01:03:42,128
Christian: One day, they came
busting through the door
886
01:03:42,232 --> 01:03:47,444
and then they took me
and it was a cloud from there.
887
01:03:47,547 --> 01:03:49,411
♪♪
888
01:03:49,515 --> 01:03:52,725
I can't remember anything
from there on.
889
01:03:52,829 --> 01:03:54,520
There was a bang at the door
and then
890
01:03:54,623 --> 01:03:57,592
Ali goes, "Omalee,
it's the police."
891
01:03:57,695 --> 01:03:59,501
And he jumps over me
and by the time he made it
892
01:03:59,525 --> 01:04:01,883
to the other side of the floor,
the police were in the room.
893
01:04:01,907 --> 01:04:07,774
♪♪
894
01:04:07,878 --> 01:04:13,919
♪♪
895
01:04:14,022 --> 01:04:16,783
Ali Charafe Damache:
You're stupid.
You really are stupid men.
896
01:04:16,887 --> 01:04:18,164
You don't have, you don't have
897
01:04:18,268 --> 01:04:19,925
people in America,
living in America.
898
01:04:20,028 --> 01:04:23,307
Believe me, when we get you,
you will pay.
899
01:04:23,411 --> 01:04:26,379
It's expensive.
900
01:04:26,483 --> 01:04:29,106
What's the purpose of this call?
Why are you calling?
901
01:04:32,834 --> 01:04:37,701
And this is the, this is the
consequences of a hypocrite.
902
01:04:37,804 --> 01:04:39,703
You show me these photos,
and I will shoot you.
903
01:04:39,806 --> 01:04:41,774
I will put a bullet
in your head.
904
01:04:45,191 --> 01:04:48,401
Christian, my son,
905
01:04:48,505 --> 01:04:51,439
they took him to
this little play area
906
01:04:51,542 --> 01:04:52,761
and then they took me
to the side
907
01:04:52,785 --> 01:04:55,684
and told me
what I was arrested for.
908
01:04:55,788 --> 01:04:58,618
Conspiracy to provide material
support to al-Qaeda.
909
01:04:58,722 --> 01:05:03,037
♪♪
910
01:05:03,140 --> 01:05:04,797
They let me say goodbye to him.
911
01:05:04,901 --> 01:05:07,524
♪♪
912
01:05:07,627 --> 01:05:09,767
What did you say to him?
913
01:05:09,871 --> 01:05:13,012
Then I was gonna, I was gonna
go away for a while.
914
01:05:13,116 --> 01:05:21,116
♪♪
915
01:05:21,227 --> 01:05:29,227
♪♪
916
01:05:43,525 --> 01:05:46,597
I was in my room
in solitary confinement
917
01:05:46,701 --> 01:05:48,530
and just another regular day,
918
01:05:48,634 --> 01:05:50,543
and this girl started yelling
at me, "Fatima, Fatima!"
919
01:05:50,567 --> 01:05:52,534
I said, "What?"
She said, "They say that
920
01:05:52,638 --> 01:05:54,398
you're all over on the TV."
I said, "What?"
921
01:05:54,502 --> 01:05:56,883
She said, "Yeah, they said
something about 'Jihad Jane.'"
922
01:05:56,987 --> 01:05:58,644
I said, "Really?
What are they saying?"
923
01:05:58,747 --> 01:06:00,208
"They said something about you
was going to kill somebody
924
01:06:00,232 --> 01:06:01,647
or something like that."
925
01:06:01,750 --> 01:06:03,960
And, um, they're saying
"it's all over the news."
926
01:06:04,063 --> 01:06:06,445
We have got
a "Fox News Alert."
927
01:06:06,548 --> 01:06:08,895
Tonight, the Jihadist Next Door.
928
01:06:08,999 --> 01:06:11,726
Susan, what do we know?
929
01:06:11,829 --> 01:06:15,419
Take a look at this woman.
Her name is Colleen LaRose.
930
01:06:15,523 --> 01:06:18,112
She's been in here,
at the federal prison
931
01:06:18,215 --> 01:06:20,700
in Philadelphia since October.
932
01:06:20,804 --> 01:06:23,151
♪♪
933
01:06:23,255 --> 01:06:26,189
One of the COs was standing
in front of my door
934
01:06:26,292 --> 01:06:27,852
and she was freaking out
because I guess
935
01:06:27,949 --> 01:06:30,883
that the news people were all in
front of the prison, too.
936
01:06:30,987 --> 01:06:32,954
Wanting to film the prison
or whatever,
937
01:06:33,058 --> 01:06:34,852
and she'd go, "LaRose!"
I said, "What?"
938
01:06:34,956 --> 01:06:38,649
She goes, "What did you do?"
"Nothing."
939
01:06:38,753 --> 01:06:42,999
And I realized that, you know,
people had known about me.
940
01:06:43,102 --> 01:06:46,657
I had no idea it was going to be
as widespread.
941
01:06:46,761 --> 01:06:49,626
I don't know.
It's just, it was crazy.
942
01:06:49,729 --> 01:06:52,663
Good evening, everyone.
She calls herself "Jihad Jane,"
943
01:06:52,767 --> 01:06:55,390
a petite blond
from the Philadelphia suburbs.
944
01:06:55,494 --> 01:06:57,151
Tonight, a fascinating story.
945
01:06:57,254 --> 01:06:59,670
A woman who lived on Main Street
in Pennsburg, Pennsylvania,
946
01:06:59,774 --> 01:07:01,569
stands accused of trying
to recruit others
947
01:07:01,672 --> 01:07:04,054
to wage a holy war
in Asia and Europe.
948
01:07:04,158 --> 01:07:06,781
An assistant attorney general
said this case demonstrates
949
01:07:06,884 --> 01:07:10,129
that terrorists are actively
looking for Americans
950
01:07:10,233 --> 01:07:11,958
to join their ranks.
951
01:07:12,062 --> 01:07:15,617
♪♪
952
01:07:15,721 --> 01:07:17,516
Colleen's indictment
was a big deal.
953
01:07:17,619 --> 01:07:20,001
I got inundated with calls
from the press that day.
954
01:07:20,105 --> 01:07:21,830
And this was a shocker.
955
01:07:21,934 --> 01:07:24,764
She calls herself "Jihad Jane."
956
01:07:24,868 --> 01:07:26,283
That's the name
she gave herself.
957
01:07:26,387 --> 01:07:29,873
I think the whole thing
was fueled by the fact
958
01:07:29,976 --> 01:07:32,117
that she called herself
Jihad Jane.
959
01:07:32,220 --> 01:07:33,577
I mean, that wasn't
what the press called her,
960
01:07:33,601 --> 01:07:34,912
she called herself that.
961
01:07:35,016 --> 01:07:36,576
WoNew tonight,
a Pennsylvania woman
962
01:07:36,638 --> 01:07:38,409
who calls herself Jihad Jane,
has been charged...
963
01:07:38,433 --> 01:07:40,228
And because of that,
it mushroomed
964
01:07:40,332 --> 01:07:41,919
much more than it was.
965
01:07:42,023 --> 01:07:44,646
Our big story this morning,
Jihad Jane.
966
01:07:44,750 --> 01:07:46,855
She called herself Jihad Jane.
967
01:07:46,959 --> 01:07:48,581
Jihad Jane.
968
01:07:48,685 --> 01:07:53,966
The kind of cases that get
media attention are, are absurd.
969
01:07:54,070 --> 01:07:56,106
I mean, they're absurd.
So this is an absurd case.
970
01:07:56,210 --> 01:07:58,936
But it's "Jihad Jane."
971
01:07:59,040 --> 01:08:00,569
I gave myself that name.
972
01:08:00,593 --> 01:08:02,906
I take pride in my name,
Jihad Jane.
973
01:08:03,009 --> 01:08:06,254
They call me a terrorist.
They call me Jihad Jane.
974
01:08:06,358 --> 01:08:08,981
They call me all kinda thing...
Yeah, that's me. Yeah.
975
01:08:09,085 --> 01:08:10,603
That's fine.
I'm proud of my name.
976
01:08:10,707 --> 01:08:12,157
She wasn't necessarily hiding.
977
01:08:12,260 --> 01:08:15,470
When you're using the name
Jihad Jane, and you're online.
978
01:08:15,574 --> 01:08:18,577
Reporter:
This video you see here,
it shows where LaRose lived.
979
01:08:18,680 --> 01:08:20,613
We also understand
from neighbors
980
01:08:20,717 --> 01:08:22,684
that she had a boyfriend
with whom she lived.
981
01:08:22,788 --> 01:08:24,445
Those initial showed up...
982
01:08:24,548 --> 01:08:26,826
IThose days were terrible.
I got to admit that.
983
01:08:26,930 --> 01:08:29,312
I mean, I don't know
how else to describe it,
984
01:08:29,415 --> 01:08:32,246
but, yeah, it was miserable.
985
01:08:32,349 --> 01:08:35,525
It's hard enough having, you
know, a relationship problem,
986
01:08:35,628 --> 01:08:38,079
but having
a relationship problem
987
01:08:38,183 --> 01:08:42,601
that's, you know,
spread out throughout the world
988
01:08:42,704 --> 01:08:44,982
is really
makes it terrible there.
989
01:08:45,086 --> 01:08:46,812
Alright, Steve Teeley
reporting live
990
01:08:46,915 --> 01:08:48,607
from the Philadelphia area.
991
01:08:48,710 --> 01:08:50,190
Thank you very much.
It's interesting.
992
01:08:50,264 --> 01:08:51,955
Apparently, she lived with a guy
993
01:08:52,058 --> 01:08:55,200
and stole his passport
to give to a terrorist.
994
01:08:55,303 --> 01:08:58,582
IOther than that, I don't know.
I think it's mostly
995
01:08:58,686 --> 01:09:02,931
just caused me more personal
heartache than anything.
996
01:09:09,179 --> 01:09:11,526
Lars Vilks: 'Twas, um,
major news in Sweden,
997
01:09:11,630 --> 01:09:14,219
so when the phones
started to ring.
998
01:09:14,322 --> 01:09:16,117
That was the whole day for that.
999
01:09:16,221 --> 01:09:18,661
Well, you mentioned the artist
she wanted to kill, Lars Vilks.
1000
01:09:18,706 --> 01:09:21,157
He came out with a statement
and I read, quote,
1001
01:09:21,260 --> 01:09:24,194
"I'm glad she didn't kill me."
Well put, Lars.
1002
01:09:24,298 --> 01:09:26,990
It seems very abstract in a way,
to me.
1003
01:09:27,093 --> 01:09:28,854
It's like living in a film.
1004
01:09:28,957 --> 01:09:32,064
And in a way,
it's a perfect work of art
1005
01:09:32,168 --> 01:09:35,895
where you play
the main character for yourself.
1006
01:09:35,999 --> 01:09:39,036
Colleen LaRose, may not look
like a terrorist,
1007
01:09:39,140 --> 01:09:41,315
and that's precisely
what has people worried.
1008
01:09:41,418 --> 01:09:42,947
Then the news people
make a big deal out of me
1009
01:09:42,971 --> 01:09:44,697
because I'm an American woman.
1010
01:09:44,801 --> 01:09:48,114
And I have I mean,
I was planning to kill a man.
1011
01:09:48,218 --> 01:09:50,116
And I guess, I mean,
1012
01:09:50,220 --> 01:09:52,222
that's not something
that you see every day.
1013
01:09:52,326 --> 01:09:53,855
Reporter: We've heard of soccer
moms, right?
1014
01:09:53,879 --> 01:09:55,881
But what do you call
Colleen LaRose?
1015
01:09:55,984 --> 01:09:58,780
My question is, we know
that male suicide bombers,
1016
01:09:58,884 --> 01:10:01,990
I believe they're rewarded
with 72 virgins in heaven.
1017
01:10:02,094 --> 01:10:03,889
But what do the female martyrs
get Pat?
1018
01:10:03,992 --> 01:10:06,271
The Quran's really
not clear about that.
1019
01:10:06,374 --> 01:10:09,688
They get to wash the dishes
for all the others.
1020
01:10:09,791 --> 01:10:11,217
This is exactly
what so many Americans
1021
01:10:11,241 --> 01:10:14,071
have been fearful of.
Is that one of our own
1022
01:10:14,175 --> 01:10:17,247
who doesn't assume
the normal stereotypical
1023
01:10:17,351 --> 01:10:20,146
"jihadist look"
would actually turn.
1024
01:10:20,250 --> 01:10:23,426
First, Jihad Jane, now the woman
dubbed "Jihad Jamie."
1025
01:10:23,529 --> 01:10:26,498
Jeremy Ibrahim Gonzalez:
When Jamie was charged,
I had to correct the media
1026
01:10:26,601 --> 01:10:31,572
because she never described
herself as jihad Jamie.
1027
01:10:31,675 --> 01:10:33,781
And they stopped using the name.
1028
01:10:33,884 --> 01:10:40,201
But, at the same time, you know,
if you're part of a band
1029
01:10:40,305 --> 01:10:44,412
and you're not the player
that anybody remembers,
1030
01:10:44,516 --> 01:10:45,965
you're still part of the band.
1031
01:10:46,069 --> 01:10:49,521
Reporter: taking her
6-year-old son with her.
1032
01:10:49,624 --> 01:10:53,145
A 17 year old when he started
to work with Jihad Jane
1033
01:10:53,249 --> 01:10:54,629
and we have to be concerned
1034
01:10:54,733 --> 01:10:56,453
about this type of individual
in the future.
1035
01:10:56,528 --> 01:10:58,944
Khalid,
a legal immigrant from Pakistan,
1036
01:10:59,047 --> 01:11:00,601
faces 15 years in prison.
1037
01:11:00,704 --> 01:11:02,264
I was keeping tabs
on what was happening
1038
01:11:02,292 --> 01:11:04,260
and I was looking
at news coverage.
1039
01:11:04,363 --> 01:11:06,158
It was mostly about her,
1040
01:11:06,262 --> 01:11:10,645
how she represented an anomaly
in the whole terrorism concept,
1041
01:11:10,749 --> 01:11:11,922
the fact that she was white,
1042
01:11:12,026 --> 01:11:13,717
that she was blonde, blue eyed,
1043
01:11:13,821 --> 01:11:15,281
and that she wasn't,
you know, someone
1044
01:11:15,305 --> 01:11:18,446
whom a typical terrorist
would look like.
1045
01:11:18,550 --> 01:11:23,313
Reporter:
Jihad Jane, is this the new face
of homegrown terrorism?
1046
01:11:23,417 --> 01:11:25,557
Yes, the new face
of the war on terror.
1047
01:11:25,660 --> 01:11:27,490
That came from
the U.S. Attorney's Office.
1048
01:11:27,593 --> 01:11:29,837
Reporter:
According to authorities,
thisis the new face
1049
01:11:29,940 --> 01:11:33,012
of international terrorism.
- Federal authorities say this is
1050
01:11:33,116 --> 01:11:35,774
the potential face of terrorism
in the United States.
1051
01:11:35,877 --> 01:11:39,847
Colleen LaRose represents
the new face of terrorism.
1052
01:11:39,950 --> 01:11:42,263
Alright.
1053
01:11:42,367 --> 01:11:44,714
Yes, the media
plays a role in this.
1054
01:11:44,817 --> 01:11:47,613
But the government,
the process isn't the FBI.
1055
01:11:47,717 --> 01:11:50,444
The prosecutors fashioned her,
1056
01:11:50,547 --> 01:11:55,725
the first white female jihadist
ever arrested.
1057
01:11:55,828 --> 01:11:58,279
And my client was
the youngest jihadist
1058
01:11:58,383 --> 01:11:59,970
ever arrested in U.S. history.
1059
01:12:00,074 --> 01:12:03,249
The Justice Department says this
points to an evolving threat.
1060
01:12:03,353 --> 01:12:05,435
Reporter: The indictment
underscores the evolving nature
1061
01:12:05,459 --> 01:12:06,805
of the threat we face.
1062
01:12:06,908 --> 01:12:10,395
This case underscores
the evolving nature
1063
01:12:10,498 --> 01:12:12,155
of the threat that we face.
1064
01:12:12,258 --> 01:12:14,571
So I think the
message that the government
1065
01:12:14,675 --> 01:12:17,333
intended to get out there was,
1066
01:12:17,436 --> 01:12:21,302
"Oh, now there's terrorists that
are not Arab Muslims.
1067
01:12:21,406 --> 01:12:22,821
That they haven't come from
overseas
1068
01:12:22,924 --> 01:12:25,030
and snuck onto a plane
with a bomb.
1069
01:12:25,133 --> 01:12:28,516
They are living among us, and...
1070
01:12:28,620 --> 01:12:33,072
I think that they were
interested in
1071
01:12:33,176 --> 01:12:34,833
kind of fear mongering.
1072
01:12:34,936 --> 01:12:37,905
That she was a full-fledged
jihad machine, Bill,
1073
01:12:38,008 --> 01:12:41,633
In many ways, she represents
the greatest fear of the FBI,
1074
01:12:41,736 --> 01:12:44,187
a suspected terrorist
who fits no profile,
1075
01:12:44,290 --> 01:12:47,880
a U.S. citizen who can travel
freely and blend right in.
1076
01:12:47,984 --> 01:12:50,676
Jihad Jane is a real threat.
1077
01:12:59,305 --> 01:13:06,105
♪♪
1078
01:13:06,209 --> 01:13:13,009
♪♪
1079
01:13:13,112 --> 01:13:19,981
Last year there came an Opera
at the Opera House in Stockholm.
1080
01:13:20,085 --> 01:13:23,985
On the theme of Jihad Jane.
1081
01:13:24,089 --> 01:13:27,299
We had... With just,
three characters,
1082
01:13:27,403 --> 01:13:31,924
Jihad Jane, the artist,
and a reporter.
1083
01:13:32,028 --> 01:13:35,376
That was a very nasty picture of
the artist actually.
1084
01:13:37,343 --> 01:13:38,724
That's why I thought about
1085
01:13:38,828 --> 01:13:41,865
trying to do something
completely different.
1086
01:13:41,969 --> 01:13:45,835
♪♪
1087
01:13:45,938 --> 01:13:48,458
I want to go deeper, and make,
1088
01:13:48,562 --> 01:13:50,598
to make a long Opera, actually.
1089
01:13:50,702 --> 01:13:58,702
♪♪
1090
01:13:58,882 --> 01:14:06,882
♪♪
1091
01:14:07,235 --> 01:14:11,723
It seemed to be over.
And when it comes to 2010,
1092
01:14:11,826 --> 01:14:15,520
I actually thought
that I forgot.
1093
01:14:15,623 --> 01:14:17,280
But then came this case
and of course,
1094
01:14:17,383 --> 01:14:23,528
this case has
a special fascination
1095
01:14:23,631 --> 01:14:26,945
and it became
kind of world news.
1096
01:14:29,154 --> 01:14:33,779
Everyone seemed to believe
that I had done something again.
1097
01:14:37,576 --> 01:14:41,994
♪♪
1098
01:14:42,098 --> 01:14:48,138
I showed a video about religion
and homosexuality,
1099
01:14:48,242 --> 01:14:51,487
a funny, funny video,
because it was showing
1100
01:14:51,590 --> 01:14:54,420
the prophet
in homosexual situations.
1101
01:14:54,524 --> 01:15:01,186
♪♪
1102
01:15:01,289 --> 01:15:07,986
♪♪
1103
01:15:27,730 --> 01:15:33,943
And at that time, the Muslims
in the room, they they reacted.
1104
01:15:34,046 --> 01:15:38,810
And one man came up to me,
but then the bodyguards acted
1105
01:15:38,913 --> 01:15:44,298
and suddenly there was
a riot in the room.
1106
01:15:44,401 --> 01:15:46,887
Police fighting with
with angry Muslims.
1107
01:15:46,990 --> 01:15:50,269
And I was pulled out of the room
and that was the riot in there.
1108
01:15:50,684 --> 01:15:58,588
♪♪
1109
01:15:58,692 --> 01:16:06,562
♪♪
1110
01:16:06,665 --> 01:16:09,979
And then just two days later,
I mean,
1111
01:16:10,082 --> 01:16:12,637
you had this two Muslim guys
1112
01:16:12,740 --> 01:16:15,294
tried to burn down my house.
1113
01:16:15,398 --> 01:16:17,814
And they were all armatures.
1114
01:16:17,918 --> 01:16:20,161
They tried to burn
down the house,
1115
01:16:20,265 --> 01:16:21,749
but they set fire to themselves
1116
01:16:21,853 --> 01:16:23,889
and they left their driver's
license at the place.
1117
01:16:23,993 --> 01:16:28,963
I mean, that's it's really
on the same amateurish level.
1118
01:16:29,067 --> 01:16:32,622
That's, again, what I call
the amateurish pair.
1119
01:16:32,726 --> 01:16:37,282
Okay, and this has been
inspected before.
1120
01:16:37,385 --> 01:16:39,802
It's just that
it's not a real gun.
1121
01:17:10,384 --> 01:17:12,041
What happened that day,
yes, I mean,
1122
01:17:12,144 --> 01:17:17,598
I was I had been
at this place in Copenhagen
1123
01:17:17,702 --> 01:17:19,117
several times before.
1124
01:17:19,220 --> 01:17:20,256
Nice and calm.
1125
01:17:23,362 --> 01:17:26,469
This time we had
the French ambassador there.
1126
01:17:26,572 --> 01:17:30,680
He gave a speech
about the Charlie Hebdo case.
1127
01:17:30,784 --> 01:17:35,581
I just started, then,
then the shooting began.
1128
01:17:41,070 --> 01:17:44,004
WoAnd the turning point,
is "but."
1129
01:17:44,107 --> 01:17:47,593
Why do we still say
but when we...
1130
01:18:06,992 --> 01:18:10,547
♪♪
1131
01:18:10,651 --> 01:18:13,309
That is a kind of breaking point
in the whole story,
1132
01:18:13,412 --> 01:18:16,277
when, when you have to face
a reality
1133
01:18:16,381 --> 01:18:21,973
and you lose the idea
of being a part of a comedy.
1134
01:18:22,076 --> 01:18:24,803
I mean, they now know
we have people
1135
01:18:24,907 --> 01:18:26,287
that are acting on such a level
1136
01:18:26,391 --> 01:18:29,428
that the people
actually are killed.
1137
01:18:29,532 --> 01:18:34,571
♪♪
1138
01:18:34,675 --> 01:18:36,194
Because then you understand
1139
01:18:36,297 --> 01:18:39,784
that you can't really talk
about amateurs anymore.
1140
01:18:39,887 --> 01:18:47,826
♪♪
1141
01:18:47,930 --> 01:18:55,903
♪♪
1142
01:18:56,007 --> 01:19:03,946
♪♪
1143
01:19:04,049 --> 01:19:11,954
♪♪
1144
01:19:12,057 --> 01:19:19,996
♪♪
1145
01:19:20,100 --> 01:19:28,073
♪♪
1146
01:19:28,177 --> 01:19:36,150
♪♪
1147
01:19:36,254 --> 01:19:39,740
This place looks
like it's shut down.
1148
01:19:39,844 --> 01:19:44,055
I hear that that the employment
is getting better,
1149
01:19:44,158 --> 01:19:46,057
jobs are coming back to America.
1150
01:19:50,820 --> 01:19:54,513
I like Trump.
1151
01:19:54,617 --> 01:19:58,448
I like him because he don't care
what anybody says.
1152
01:19:58,552 --> 01:20:01,003
And when he got the job
as president or whatever,
1153
01:20:01,106 --> 01:20:03,799
it was a downgrade from where he
was used to or most presidents
1154
01:20:03,902 --> 01:20:07,112
get the job as president
is an upgrade for them.
1155
01:20:07,216 --> 01:20:08,700
I just like the way that Trump
1156
01:20:08,804 --> 01:20:11,358
will say something
and he don't apologize for it.
1157
01:20:13,394 --> 01:20:15,434
When he says he's going
to do something, he does it.
1158
01:20:15,465 --> 01:20:17,605
Or he tries to do it,
whereas most politicians,
1159
01:20:17,709 --> 01:20:19,135
when they say they're going
to do something,
1160
01:20:19,159 --> 01:20:22,783
they just say it because
they want to get elected.
1161
01:20:22,887 --> 01:20:27,512
I would vote for Trump.
1162
01:20:27,615 --> 01:20:29,169
But I do not like him
1163
01:20:29,272 --> 01:20:32,482
what he did with the Israelis
and the Palestinians.
1164
01:20:35,727 --> 01:20:43,727
♪♪
1165
01:20:45,392 --> 01:20:53,392
♪♪
1166
01:20:55,160 --> 01:21:03,160
♪♪
1167
01:21:04,652 --> 01:21:06,827
Okay, you got the other one in?
1168
01:21:08,898 --> 01:21:12,798
We just gotta go up the road,
get some water.
1169
01:21:12,902 --> 01:21:15,456
Water for them, water for us.
1170
01:21:15,560 --> 01:21:17,458
Okay. That's all.
1171
01:21:17,562 --> 01:21:19,633
That's it.
Okay.
1172
01:21:27,710 --> 01:21:29,401
It's not worth the trouble, man.
1173
01:21:29,505 --> 01:21:33,819
I mean, we both sit up wondering
1174
01:21:33,923 --> 01:21:37,754
if we died in the morning,
how safe is he?
1175
01:21:37,858 --> 01:21:41,068
He can't get through by himself,
you know, and that ain't right.
1176
01:21:41,172 --> 01:21:43,657
I worry about his mom
sending somebody
1177
01:21:43,760 --> 01:21:48,317
because she can't
be heard verbally.
1178
01:21:48,420 --> 01:21:50,836
I'm seri... I don't like her.
1179
01:21:50,940 --> 01:21:53,011
I don't like his mom
for what she did to him,
1180
01:21:53,115 --> 01:21:54,979
what she did to you.
1181
01:21:55,082 --> 01:21:56,946
And what she started now.
1182
01:21:57,050 --> 01:21:59,707
I told that bitch
before she got in trouble.
1183
01:21:59,811 --> 01:22:02,469
You going to jail in six months?
Was she there?
1184
01:22:02,572 --> 01:22:04,126
Yes.
1185
01:22:04,229 --> 01:22:06,449
Was she charged with what I said
she could be charged with?
1186
01:22:06,473 --> 01:22:09,683
Okay, so I I'm not
a profitable forecaster,
1187
01:22:09,786 --> 01:22:12,375
but I knew what the fuck
I was talking about.
1188
01:22:12,479 --> 01:22:14,136
She know what I'll do.
1189
01:22:14,239 --> 01:22:17,656
And I've done her
and don't play.
1190
01:22:17,760 --> 01:22:20,038
I'm not the one to play with.
1191
01:22:35,088 --> 01:22:43,088
♪♪
1192
01:22:43,337 --> 01:22:51,337
♪♪
1193
01:22:51,690 --> 01:22:59,690
♪♪
1194
01:23:00,044 --> 01:23:01,493
Thank you.
1195
01:23:01,597 --> 01:23:05,911
You're fortunate
that you don't really remember
1196
01:23:06,015 --> 01:23:07,637
a whole lot of stuff.
1197
01:23:07,741 --> 01:23:09,087
About the only thing you
remember
1198
01:23:09,191 --> 01:23:12,953
is not having a birthday. A couple things.
1199
01:23:13,057 --> 01:23:16,612
And your mom sitting on the pot
reading a magazine.
1200
01:23:16,715 --> 01:23:19,891
Yeah, that was weird, but yeah,
I don't remember anything.
1201
01:23:19,995 --> 01:23:24,171
So honestly, this isn't
a big deal to me anymore.
1202
01:23:24,275 --> 01:23:26,932
It really was never a big deal.
1203
01:23:27,036 --> 01:23:32,662
It's for me, it's something
that I remember every minute.
1204
01:23:32,766 --> 01:23:39,117
♪♪
1205
01:23:39,221 --> 01:23:45,606
♪♪
1206
01:23:45,710 --> 01:23:47,850
I saw, like,
a Wikipedia page on her
1207
01:23:47,953 --> 01:23:50,611
and I was telling her about
how she was telling me
1208
01:23:50,715 --> 01:23:53,062
about how she
a terrorist and all that.
1209
01:24:00,690 --> 01:24:04,867
I didn't really feel that much,
but it just
1210
01:24:04,970 --> 01:24:07,145
nothing really surprised me
'cause I kind of knew
1211
01:24:07,249 --> 01:24:10,321
everything about
what the page said.
1212
01:24:14,428 --> 01:24:16,810
Do you regret
bringing him over there?
1213
01:24:20,227 --> 01:24:22,781
Well, I mean, I regret going
over there, period,
1214
01:24:22,885 --> 01:24:27,027
because I'm... it lost seven
years of my son's life.
1215
01:24:27,131 --> 01:24:29,512
Yeah, I regret that.
1216
01:24:38,038 --> 01:24:39,764
But I accept it.
1217
01:25:02,994 --> 01:25:06,101
When someone calls me Colleen,
it irritates me.
1218
01:25:06,204 --> 01:25:07,930
I can't explain it.
1219
01:25:08,033 --> 01:25:11,554
If somebody did it at prison,
I would jump all over her.
1220
01:25:11,658 --> 01:25:13,458
Don't ever call me
that you ever call me that,
1221
01:25:13,556 --> 01:25:16,870
I will not answer to you.
Don't ever call me that.
1222
01:25:24,015 --> 01:25:25,810
I don't like to be called
Colleen anymore
1223
01:25:25,913 --> 01:25:31,436
because it's a part of my past
that I no longer have.
1224
01:25:34,681 --> 01:25:37,477
As far as I'm concerned,
she's pretty much dead.
1225
01:26:17,517 --> 01:26:21,762
It's going to be...
So these first few weeks
1226
01:26:21,866 --> 01:26:23,488
are going to be a little tough.
Yeah.
1227
01:26:23,592 --> 01:26:26,733
Got to get you a job.
Just be like a temporary job.
1228
01:26:26,836 --> 01:26:29,839
A job doing what? I don't know.
1229
01:26:29,943 --> 01:26:31,979
But you need money.
1230
01:26:32,083 --> 01:26:34,016
Yeah. Yeah.
1231
01:26:34,119 --> 01:26:36,846
It's fascinating
how she was used.
1232
01:26:38,676 --> 01:26:42,231
And yet she wouldn't complain
about being used at all.
1233
01:26:42,335 --> 01:26:46,235
That's that's really one of the
biggest ironies in all of this.
1234
01:26:48,410 --> 01:26:52,276
She just likes that her name,
got out there.
1235
01:26:52,379 --> 01:26:53,899
It's sort of...
And I laugh about that,
1236
01:26:53,967 --> 01:26:58,247
I you know,
I shouldn't 'cause it's sad.
1237
01:26:58,351 --> 01:27:05,185
My old self,
I'm nobody.
1238
01:27:05,289 --> 01:27:08,809
But with what, with what I did,
I'm somebody.
1239
01:27:11,467 --> 01:27:14,436
I'm Jihad Jane.
Yes, I'm somebody.
1240
01:27:14,539 --> 01:27:16,231
That's true. Yes.
1241
01:27:16,334 --> 01:27:19,268
And it sounds vain,
I don't like to sound vain.
1242
01:27:19,372 --> 01:27:21,132
But yeah, I am somebody.
1243
01:27:21,236 --> 01:27:25,619
I am somebody people know and,
yeah, I like it. It feels good.
1244
01:27:38,011 --> 01:27:40,358
Cristine:
I got red, green, white.
1245
01:28:01,655 --> 01:28:03,426
Jamie Pauline Ramirez: You learn
your lesson from the past,
1246
01:28:03,450 --> 01:28:04,969
of course, yes.
1247
01:28:05,072 --> 01:28:06,591
But to dwell on the past
and saying,
1248
01:28:06,695 --> 01:28:09,007
"Well, I wish
I could've done that."
1249
01:28:09,111 --> 01:28:11,216
No, it's not worth the time.
1250
01:28:13,080 --> 01:28:14,979
There was a reason
I went to prison,
1251
01:28:15,082 --> 01:28:16,463
what it is,
I haven't learned yet.
1252
01:28:16,567 --> 01:28:18,879
Well, maybe it's to learn,
to learn something
1253
01:28:18,983 --> 01:28:22,366
about myself, I don't know.
1254
01:28:22,469 --> 01:28:24,506
To protect me from something.
1255
01:28:46,424 --> 01:28:51,153
It's me and the Swedish king,
we are in the same situation.
1256
01:28:51,256 --> 01:28:54,467
He has also to cope
with limitations.
1257
01:29:42,791 --> 01:29:44,137
What happened, happened.
1258
01:29:44,240 --> 01:29:46,553
I mean, there's no turning back
to the, to date.
1259
01:29:46,657 --> 01:29:49,004
I mean that's, uh in this
country at least, you know,
1260
01:29:49,107 --> 01:29:50,592
I've been the youngest person,
1261
01:29:50,695 --> 01:29:52,259
but tomorrow it could be
someone else, you know?
1262
01:29:52,283 --> 01:29:56,529
So it's, it's important
not to let that happen.
1263
01:30:43,127 --> 01:30:46,406
At the end of the day,
there was one person
1264
01:30:46,510 --> 01:30:48,926
who always loved me
through all this,
1265
01:30:49,029 --> 01:30:51,480
and he never, he of course,
he got hurt.
1266
01:30:51,584 --> 01:30:52,861
Of course he got upset.
1267
01:30:52,964 --> 01:30:54,932
But he still loved me
through all this.
1268
01:30:55,035 --> 01:30:57,417
And there's no way
I'll ever be able
1269
01:30:57,521 --> 01:30:59,041
to make up to him
for everything I did.
1270
01:30:59,143 --> 01:31:02,042
I'm going to try as hard
as I can to make him happy.
1271
01:31:05,667 --> 01:31:07,634
He doesn't understand Islam
1272
01:31:07,738 --> 01:31:13,433
because his idea of Islam
is what happened to me.
1273
01:31:13,537 --> 01:31:15,746
Because I reverted to Islam
in 2008
1274
01:31:15,849 --> 01:31:18,265
and then I got
to prison in 2009.
1275
01:31:18,369 --> 01:31:20,769
He told me, "Well, see what a
lot of good Islam did for you."
1276
01:31:20,820 --> 01:31:22,511
But he doesn't understand,
1277
01:31:22,615 --> 01:31:24,247
This is something Idid not
Islam didn't do to me.
1278
01:31:24,271 --> 01:31:25,825
Idid this.
100802
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