Would you like to inspect the original subtitles? These are the user uploaded subtitles that are being translated:
1
00:00:08,466 --> 00:00:10,006
Now, when the search warrants
were effected in your case,
2
00:00:10,051 --> 00:00:12,761
they did find an awful lot
in the crawl space of your home.
3
00:00:12,804 --> 00:00:14,264
Did they not?
4
00:00:14,305 --> 00:00:15,885
Well, yeah. I had offered
to sell them the house
5
00:00:15,932 --> 00:00:17,562
because I thought there was
nothing down in the crawl space.
6
00:00:17,600 --> 00:00:18,730
Yeah.
7
00:00:18,768 --> 00:00:20,518
I had never had any qualms
about them
8
00:00:20,562 --> 00:00:22,442
going down in the crawl space.
They were going to go ...
9
00:00:22,480 --> 00:00:24,070
Well, how many bodies
were actually located
10
00:00:24,107 --> 00:00:25,777
on the property and where?
11
00:00:25,817 --> 00:00:30,277
To my understanding,
there was a total of 29 bodies
12
00:00:30,321 --> 00:00:33,411
or 28 bodies
were found on the property,
13
00:00:33,450 --> 00:00:35,790
26,
27 of them under the house.
14
00:00:35,827 --> 00:00:38,117
And the rest?
One was under the driveway.
15
00:00:38,163 --> 00:00:41,673
One was under the garage.
So that makes a total of 29.
16
00:00:41,708 --> 00:00:44,418
Okay. Now, from
the standpoint of the arrest,
17
00:00:44,461 --> 00:00:47,261
when you were arrested
in this matter, this was ...
18
00:00:47,297 --> 00:00:50,007
It snowballed.
It snowballed, okay.
19
00:00:50,050 --> 00:00:52,930
What was the date
of that arrest, do you recall?
20
00:00:52,969 --> 00:00:55,759
December 22nd, 1978
is when I was arrested.
21
00:01:43,228 --> 00:01:45,398
I was driving home
from college
22
00:01:45,438 --> 00:01:47,938
for Christmas break,
23
00:01:47,982 --> 00:01:51,152
and I just kept hearing
about all this on the news.
24
00:01:51,194 --> 00:01:53,864
I never ever thought
of my brother.
25
00:01:54,531 --> 00:01:57,161
They found two more bodies
today in Des Plaines,
26
00:01:57,200 --> 00:01:59,790
Illinois in the house
of a 36-year-old
27
00:01:59,828 --> 00:02:01,328
convicted sex offender,
28
00:02:01,871 --> 00:02:04,291
and this miserable search
will go on.
29
00:02:05,834 --> 00:02:07,594
It never even came
into my head
30
00:02:07,627 --> 00:02:09,747
that my brother
would be a part of that.
31
00:02:10,839 --> 00:02:16,299
When I got home, and I walked
in the door, my mom says,
32
00:02:16,344 --> 00:02:18,684
"I have something to tell you,"
and then I knew.
33
00:02:18,722 --> 00:02:21,812
That’s all she had to say.
I knew that she was
34
00:02:21,850 --> 00:02:25,770
going to tell me
he is somehow connected to this.
35
00:02:34,487 --> 00:02:41,327
We grew up in Chicago.
We moved in 1973 to Des Plaines.
36
00:02:43,705 --> 00:02:47,245
I was the fourth child
out of five of us.
37
00:02:47,292 --> 00:02:49,002
I had all brothers.
38
00:02:49,919 --> 00:02:52,709
My brother John
was 3 years older than me.
39
00:02:54,049 --> 00:02:55,469
To me, he was adventurous.
40
00:02:55,508 --> 00:03:00,508
He was older and driving,
and I was a young kid.
41
00:03:01,514 --> 00:03:03,394
He was 19 years old.
42
00:03:04,976 --> 00:03:09,646
What I remember
about his disappearance is,
43
00:03:09,689 --> 00:03:12,939
he didn’t show up for work
on Friday, and it was payday.
44
00:03:13,443 --> 00:03:15,863
The people he worked
with got concerned.
45
00:03:15,904 --> 00:03:18,244
So they went over
to his apartment
46
00:03:18,990 --> 00:03:22,490
and had to call the police
in order to let them in,
47
00:03:23,620 --> 00:03:25,710
at which time
they called my mom.
48
00:03:26,623 --> 00:03:29,503
His place was not ransacked
or anything.
49
00:03:29,542 --> 00:03:33,302
And it was like,
"Oh, well, he’s not here."
50
00:03:35,298 --> 00:03:41,298
I remember them basically
saying that he left town.
51
00:03:42,597 --> 00:03:46,177
When my brother disappeared,
his car disappeared.
52
00:03:46,893 --> 00:03:49,353
The police convinced
my mom that,
53
00:03:49,396 --> 00:03:51,726
"Oh, he just went away
for the weekend.
54
00:03:51,773 --> 00:03:55,323
He’s 19 years old.
You got to let your child go."
55
00:03:57,654 --> 00:04:01,624
As time went on,
you pray that he’s still alive
56
00:04:01,658 --> 00:04:03,988
and he’s happy somewhere.
57
00:04:05,829 --> 00:04:10,169
It was the September
after he had first disappeared.
58
00:04:10,959 --> 00:04:14,169
My brother’s 1971
Plymouth Satellite
59
00:04:14,212 --> 00:04:18,682
was seen stealing gas.
It had my brother’s plates.
60
00:04:19,509 --> 00:04:23,809
It gave you hope again that,
"Oh, well,
61
00:04:23,847 --> 00:04:27,347
maybe he is out there,"
that he is alive.
62
00:04:30,020 --> 00:04:32,980
My mom knew enough
about the Chicago police
63
00:04:33,023 --> 00:04:34,323
and how they worked.
64
00:04:34,357 --> 00:04:36,437
She would call them
all the time,
65
00:04:36,484 --> 00:04:40,114
but it just was a kid
that disappeared,
66
00:04:41,114 --> 00:04:44,784
and that was the attitude
of the police.
67
00:04:47,746 --> 00:04:51,366
What made this whole case
blow up
68
00:04:51,875 --> 00:04:54,915
is Rob Piest disappeared
from Des Plaines.
69
00:04:58,006 --> 00:05:00,176
Friends and relatives of
missing teenage boys
70
00:05:00,216 --> 00:05:02,006
have been calling
from all over the country
71
00:05:02,052 --> 00:05:04,392
to learn more
about this bizarre crime.
72
00:05:05,055 --> 00:05:08,055
It was Robert Piest’s
disappearance on December 11th
73
00:05:08,099 --> 00:05:11,139
that led police to the home
of the suburban contractor.
74
00:05:12,312 --> 00:05:16,902
At that point, the only name
we knew was Rob Piest.
75
00:05:17,817 --> 00:05:21,277
We only had one name,
but I also had information
76
00:05:21,321 --> 00:05:25,411
that this was just the latest
of many, many victims.
77
00:05:26,993 --> 00:05:30,873
Officially, the word came out
that night
78
00:05:30,914 --> 00:05:33,424
that there was one body
buried in the basement.
79
00:05:34,292 --> 00:05:36,922
Days later, the number grew
and grew and grew.
80
00:05:38,088 --> 00:05:41,128
The key was,
where’s the suspect?
81
00:05:45,428 --> 00:05:47,138
Once we found the bones,
82
00:05:47,639 --> 00:05:50,019
Gacy was charged
with one homicide,
83
00:05:50,058 --> 00:05:51,848
one count of homicide.
84
00:05:51,893 --> 00:05:53,603
He’s actually smiling
in his mugshot.
85
00:05:53,645 --> 00:05:56,265
That was strange to me.
86
00:05:56,981 --> 00:05:59,031
And so he was detained
from then on.
87
00:06:00,652 --> 00:06:04,202
We bring Gacy
into the interview room.
88
00:06:04,656 --> 00:06:07,116
Gacy says,
"I’m going to give it all up.
89
00:06:07,784 --> 00:06:10,454
I’m ready to give you
a detailed confession."
90
00:06:13,540 --> 00:06:15,290
I had read him
his Miranda Rights,
91
00:06:15,792 --> 00:06:18,752
and I started asking Gacy
some questions then,
92
00:06:19,295 --> 00:06:21,755
and I got into more
of a monologue by Gacy.
93
00:06:21,798 --> 00:06:24,548
It wasn’t a interrogation
so much.
94
00:06:25,343 --> 00:06:29,313
He just started telling us
things and rambling on about it.
95
00:06:30,432 --> 00:06:34,892
He told us that he had buried
27 young men in his crawl space.
96
00:06:34,936 --> 00:06:37,726
He did bury a couple of the kids
in his backyard,
97
00:06:38,314 --> 00:06:41,154
and then he threw the remaining
in the Des Plaines River.
98
00:06:45,655 --> 00:06:47,985
It was just a tough thing
to listen to,
99
00:06:48,867 --> 00:06:51,617
the way he talked about
how he killed everybody.
100
00:06:56,332 --> 00:06:59,252
He started out with Rob Piest,
what happened with Rob,
101
00:07:00,503 --> 00:07:04,133
and he said he was just getting
ready to leave the pharmacy
102
00:07:04,174 --> 00:07:06,974
when Rob Piest
came out to his car and said,
103
00:07:07,010 --> 00:07:10,350
"Hey, I understand that you
might be looking for some help,"
104
00:07:11,181 --> 00:07:14,431
and Gacy says, "Yeah, actually,
why don’t you hop in
105
00:07:14,476 --> 00:07:16,056
and fill out
a quick application?
106
00:07:16,102 --> 00:07:19,562
And I’ll give you a call."
So he jumps in the car with Gacy
107
00:07:19,606 --> 00:07:21,686
while his mom is out front
waiting for him,
108
00:07:21,733 --> 00:07:24,743
and Gacy fumbles around
with the paperwork, and he says,
109
00:07:24,778 --> 00:07:27,698
"Jeez, doggone it, I must’ve
left the stuff at home."
110
00:07:27,739 --> 00:07:29,909
He says, "I just live down
the block here.
111
00:07:29,949 --> 00:07:31,579
If you want, come on with me,"
112
00:07:31,618 --> 00:07:33,698
and Piest says,
"Well, my ma is out front."
113
00:07:33,745 --> 00:07:35,575
He says,
"I’ll get you back right away.
114
00:07:35,622 --> 00:07:37,002
Don’t worry about it."
115
00:07:37,040 --> 00:07:38,710
So kind of reluctantly,
Piest says,
116
00:07:38,750 --> 00:07:41,340
"Okay, let’s go do
a quick application."
117
00:07:42,045 --> 00:07:45,085
So Gacy drives from Nisson
Pharmacy with Rob Piest,
118
00:07:45,131 --> 00:07:50,301
willingly, to his house
and go in his house,
119
00:07:50,345 --> 00:07:54,925
and Gacy starts talking to him
about entertaining kids
120
00:07:54,974 --> 00:07:56,314
as a clown and stuff like that.
121
00:07:56,351 --> 00:07:57,981
He says, "Yeah,
I got all these cool tricks."
122
00:07:58,019 --> 00:07:59,689
He says, "I’ll show you,"
123
00:08:00,271 --> 00:08:03,481
and he puts a pair of handcuffs
on himself, Gacy does,
124
00:08:04,025 --> 00:08:06,855
and struggles with
the handcuffs a little bit,
125
00:08:06,903 --> 00:08:08,783
and then he turns around,
126
00:08:08,822 --> 00:08:10,662
and he’s got
the handcuffs dangling,
127
00:08:11,408 --> 00:08:13,328
and Piest says, "Wow.
That’s cool. How’d you do that?"
128
00:08:13,368 --> 00:08:17,538
And he says, "Easy. Put them on.
I’ll show you how to do it."
129
00:08:17,580 --> 00:08:19,870
So Piest actually
handcuffed himself,
130
00:08:21,418 --> 00:08:24,168
so Piest struggles
and struggles and struggles,
131
00:08:24,212 --> 00:08:27,382
and he says, "I don’t know
how to get out of these things.
132
00:08:27,424 --> 00:08:28,884
What’s the trick?"
133
00:08:28,925 --> 00:08:30,335
And he says,
"I reached in my pocket,
134
00:08:30,385 --> 00:08:32,795
and I pulled out the key,"
and I said,
135
00:08:32,846 --> 00:08:34,886
’The trick is,
you got to have the key,’"
136
00:08:34,931 --> 00:08:38,231
and he says,
"Once I got Piest shackled,
137
00:08:38,852 --> 00:08:41,022
he was pretty much mine
at that point."
138
00:08:43,314 --> 00:08:46,864
Gacy just talked
so matter-of-factly
139
00:08:46,901 --> 00:08:48,571
about what he did to Rob Piest,
140
00:08:49,320 --> 00:08:53,950
got into great graphic detail
of the handcuff trick
141
00:08:54,576 --> 00:09:00,286
and a rope trick, disrobing him
and performing oral sex on him.
142
00:09:03,960 --> 00:09:05,590
He was pretty proud
of that rope trick.
143
00:09:05,628 --> 00:09:08,628
He thought it was
kind of ingenious.
144
00:09:09,299 --> 00:09:11,259
He’d put a rope
around their neck,
145
00:09:11,968 --> 00:09:13,508
tie a little knot
right at the neck,
146
00:09:13,553 --> 00:09:16,433
and then a little bit later,
he would put another knot,
147
00:09:16,473 --> 00:09:19,603
and he’d have a stick,
maybe 8, 10 inches long,
148
00:09:20,435 --> 00:09:23,805
and he would wedge the stick
between the front shoulder
149
00:09:24,314 --> 00:09:27,114
and the back of the head,
and he would start twisting it,
150
00:09:27,150 --> 00:09:31,110
and, of course, twisting,
and it would just get tight
151
00:09:31,154 --> 00:09:33,824
and eventually strangle them.
152
00:09:34,491 --> 00:09:35,781
The rope trick is ...
153
00:09:35,825 --> 00:09:37,445
The way I describe
the rope trick is,
154
00:09:37,494 --> 00:09:39,084
it’s nothing more
than a tourniquet.
155
00:09:39,120 --> 00:09:40,080
Mm-hmm.
156
00:09:40,121 --> 00:09:41,621
And I had explained it
to them.
157
00:09:41,664 --> 00:09:44,334
I even demonstrated it to them.
It would cut off the air.
158
00:09:45,085 --> 00:09:46,535
So if you’re going
to kill somebody,
159
00:09:46,586 --> 00:09:48,956
you just put it on their neck
and twist it three times
160
00:09:49,005 --> 00:09:52,085
or four times or whatever
until the person stopped moving.
161
00:09:53,301 --> 00:09:55,801
So he was doing this
to Rob Piest
162
00:09:55,845 --> 00:09:57,675
and twisting and twisting it,
163
00:09:58,348 --> 00:10:00,228
and he did it maybe three
or four times,
164
00:10:00,266 --> 00:10:01,886
and he got a phone call.
165
00:10:01,935 --> 00:10:03,845
And he went to answer the phone,
and when he came back,
166
00:10:03,895 --> 00:10:07,855
Rob Piest was dead,
fallen onto the ground.
167
00:10:11,194 --> 00:10:12,954
The family was driving
around the neighborhoods
168
00:10:12,987 --> 00:10:14,607
and so forth that evening after
169
00:10:14,656 --> 00:10:17,116
when his mother came
and couldn’t find him,
170
00:10:17,158 --> 00:10:22,288
and I think Rob was already done
by that time.
171
00:10:22,330 --> 00:10:24,000
He was already dead.
172
00:10:26,501 --> 00:10:27,751
Throughout the confession,
173
00:10:27,794 --> 00:10:31,384
Gacy pretty much showed
no emotion at all.
174
00:10:32,382 --> 00:10:33,882
At the conclusion
of the interview,
175
00:10:33,925 --> 00:10:36,885
we stepped out and his attorney,
176
00:10:36,928 --> 00:10:39,058
Sam Amirante was waiting
in the lobby.
177
00:10:40,223 --> 00:10:42,733
So we briefed him
on the confession
178
00:10:43,435 --> 00:10:48,565
and both Gacy and his attorneys
agreed to have Gacy
179
00:10:49,232 --> 00:10:52,032
do a second confession
with the state’s attorneys
180
00:10:52,068 --> 00:10:55,408
there, the police officers
and his attorneys.
181
00:10:56,322 --> 00:10:58,662
Well, there had to be
15 people crammed
182
00:10:58,700 --> 00:11:00,620
into a little interview room,
183
00:11:00,660 --> 00:11:04,500
so I’m just watching everyone
else with their jaws open.
184
00:11:06,458 --> 00:11:08,838
He had all of us
on the edge of our seats,
185
00:11:09,294 --> 00:11:13,304
and John knew it, and this was
going to be his last hurrah.
186
00:11:13,340 --> 00:11:16,510
We’re his last audience.
He’s lost everyone else,
187
00:11:16,551 --> 00:11:20,261
so he’s going to try to impress
us with his horrific acts.
188
00:11:28,438 --> 00:11:32,148
It was a nightmare.
189
00:11:33,026 --> 00:11:36,066
Sam Amirante,
his criminal attorney,
190
00:11:36,863 --> 00:11:40,203
called me,
and he told me
191
00:11:40,241 --> 00:11:45,291
that John had been arrested
for suspicion of murder.
192
00:11:47,165 --> 00:11:49,495
Of course, 2 o’clock
in the morning,
193
00:11:49,542 --> 00:11:52,752
you’re not even awake,
and you’re hearing this,
194
00:11:53,380 --> 00:11:57,590
and I said to Sam, I said,
"Can I talk to him?"
195
00:11:57,634 --> 00:12:01,224
He said, "For just a minute,"
and so he put him on the phone.
196
00:12:01,262 --> 00:12:03,602
I said, "John, did you
kill somebody?"
197
00:12:04,391 --> 00:12:09,151
And he uttered, "Uh-huh."
He didn’t say, "Yes,"
198
00:12:09,187 --> 00:12:11,727
but that’s exactly
how he uttered it.
199
00:12:12,774 --> 00:12:17,204
And, of course, at this point,
we thought it was a person.
200
00:12:18,863 --> 00:12:20,873
We didn’t learn
until everybody else
201
00:12:20,907 --> 00:12:25,077
did about the numerous amounts
of bodies
202
00:12:25,120 --> 00:12:27,080
that were under the house.
203
00:12:27,122 --> 00:12:30,382
When I watched the news,
I just cried.
204
00:12:30,917 --> 00:12:32,457
This afternoon,
Gacy was charged
205
00:12:32,502 --> 00:12:35,092
with murdering Robert Piest.
At the hearing, police said
206
00:12:35,130 --> 00:12:37,260
Gacy has confessed
to the Piest murder.
207
00:12:37,799 --> 00:12:39,549
Meanwhile, investigators
have started
208
00:12:39,592 --> 00:12:41,092
to dismantle Gacy’s house
209
00:12:41,136 --> 00:12:43,886
and garage as they continue
to search for other bodies
210
00:12:43,930 --> 00:12:45,970
in this quiet
suburban neighborhood.
211
00:12:47,142 --> 00:12:50,022
By the next day,
the 22nd of December,
212
00:12:50,812 --> 00:12:52,312
it was a feeding frenzy.
213
00:12:52,814 --> 00:12:57,284
Reporters every step of the way,
cameras all over the street,
214
00:12:57,318 --> 00:13:00,028
authorities going in
and out of the house.
215
00:13:00,488 --> 00:13:01,988
It was a mob scene.
216
00:13:02,615 --> 00:13:05,825
It was one of the biggest
stories Chicago had ever seen.
217
00:13:07,245 --> 00:13:09,995
People were glued to their
screens watching our coverage.
218
00:13:10,040 --> 00:13:12,960
Here’s what it looked like
last night when we were here
219
00:13:13,001 --> 00:13:16,341
starting at about 11 o’clock
as the search was beginning.
220
00:13:16,379 --> 00:13:18,299
Why were you here?
No comment.
221
00:13:18,340 --> 00:13:19,800
We can’t say anything.
222
00:13:19,841 --> 00:13:21,381
You can’t say anything
about why you were here
223
00:13:21,426 --> 00:13:23,296
for a couple hours tonight?
No, we can’t.
224
00:13:23,345 --> 00:13:24,925
State’s attorney’s office
advised us not to say anything.
225
00:13:24,971 --> 00:13:26,971
State attorney’s office
advised you not to say anything.
226
00:13:27,015 --> 00:13:28,265
You’ve been here
for a couple hours,
227
00:13:28,308 --> 00:13:29,728
and they say
you can’t say anything?
228
00:13:29,768 --> 00:13:32,648
I got to go now.
We blocked off the street
229
00:13:33,146 --> 00:13:35,016
around the sides of the house,
230
00:13:35,065 --> 00:13:37,105
and there was people
there every morning.
231
00:13:37,650 --> 00:13:40,320
It was cold, and there was
people just standing around,
232
00:13:40,362 --> 00:13:43,282
three, four,
five deep, couple hundred people
233
00:13:43,323 --> 00:13:45,283
that were just
watching the house.
234
00:13:46,493 --> 00:13:49,413
I pretty much stayed
at the house over there digging.
235
00:13:52,207 --> 00:13:53,877
It was my job to do so.
236
00:13:54,334 --> 00:13:57,464
You just go on, and you
keep digging, keep going.
237
00:14:00,507 --> 00:14:03,047
Those poor guys down there,
are using, literally,
238
00:14:03,093 --> 00:14:06,603
their 10 fingers, literally,
using their 10 fingers,
239
00:14:06,638 --> 00:14:09,638
and trying to exhume the body
because there’s always
240
00:14:09,683 --> 00:14:12,563
a possibility of loss
of trace evidence.
241
00:14:12,602 --> 00:14:15,402
So you can’t use a shovel
or something like that.
242
00:14:15,855 --> 00:14:18,015
And with that, the medical
examiner disappeared
243
00:14:18,066 --> 00:14:20,646
into what he called
the incredible maze
244
00:14:20,694 --> 00:14:23,284
that was a crawl space
and, more recently,
245
00:14:23,321 --> 00:14:26,161
has been a mass grave
under John Gacy’s home.
246
00:15:10,660 --> 00:15:13,200
Every day, we’d probably
come up with a couple,
247
00:15:13,246 --> 00:15:14,406
two or three bodies,
248
00:15:14,456 --> 00:15:16,456
and then on a good day
maybe four.
249
00:15:17,125 --> 00:15:19,915
Once you got your body
completely dug out,
250
00:15:19,961 --> 00:15:21,591
we’d video-tape it.
251
00:15:21,629 --> 00:15:24,419
Recording at the north wall
at the front door, upper level,
252
00:15:25,800 --> 00:15:28,470
the remains
of body number five are found.
253
00:15:29,721 --> 00:15:31,641
Say this was body such
and such,
254
00:15:31,681 --> 00:15:33,391
dug up by such and such,
255
00:15:33,433 --> 00:15:35,773
and then he’d be put in
a body bag and taken out,
256
00:15:35,810 --> 00:15:38,360
and then you’d keep going
for your next one.
257
00:15:39,647 --> 00:15:42,227
We’d go in there
do the same thing every day.
258
00:15:43,026 --> 00:15:44,316
About 4:30 in the afternoon
259
00:15:44,361 --> 00:15:47,451
when we started
bringing the body bags out,
260
00:15:47,489 --> 00:15:49,529
the cameras would roll
at that point,
261
00:15:49,574 --> 00:15:51,704
and that’s when
the local news went on,
262
00:15:52,619 --> 00:15:54,539
and they could lead
the story with it.
263
00:15:54,579 --> 00:15:57,169
Everybody got their shots?
Everything got quiet,
264
00:15:57,791 --> 00:16:01,291
and you could hear people say,
"Okay, today, three more.
265
00:16:01,336 --> 00:16:03,336
That’s" ...
They were counting them.
266
00:16:04,923 --> 00:16:06,683
People were out there
in the snow,
267
00:16:07,175 --> 00:16:08,795
chanting like
at a football game,
268
00:16:08,843 --> 00:16:12,813
the number of body bags being
carried into a squad roller
269
00:16:12,847 --> 00:16:14,517
to be driven to the morgue,
270
00:16:15,225 --> 00:16:17,685
like they were counting points
in the end zone.
271
00:16:20,397 --> 00:16:22,187
It had turned into a circus,
272
00:16:22,232 --> 00:16:24,532
an amazing spectacle
to this reporter,
273
00:16:24,567 --> 00:16:26,987
people bringing brown
bag lunches,
274
00:16:27,028 --> 00:16:28,778
mothers lifting up
small children,
275
00:16:28,822 --> 00:16:30,662
so they could see
the sheriff’s officers
276
00:16:30,699 --> 00:16:33,329
dumping loads of mud
on the driveway,
277
00:16:33,368 --> 00:16:35,328
mud that had been
part of a grave,
278
00:16:36,079 --> 00:16:38,499
and when the people got tired
of looking at the house
279
00:16:38,540 --> 00:16:40,330
they could take pictures
of each other.
280
00:16:40,375 --> 00:16:43,455
"See? I was there,
where they found the bodies."
281
00:16:45,505 --> 00:16:48,545
During the time that we’re
recovering bodies,
282
00:16:49,134 --> 00:16:50,804
we don’t find Rob Piest there.
283
00:16:51,428 --> 00:16:54,558
So his parents,
his sister and brother,
284
00:16:55,056 --> 00:16:56,766
they still didn’t have his body.
285
00:16:58,435 --> 00:17:02,395
Since Robert Piest’s
only been gone for 10 days,
286
00:17:03,106 --> 00:17:05,896
this can’t be him
because these are bones already.
287
00:17:06,359 --> 00:17:10,779
And so at that particular point,
go back to Gacy.
288
00:17:13,908 --> 00:17:17,198
I certainly never handled
anybody else like John Gacy
289
00:17:17,245 --> 00:17:18,785
or that magnitude of a case,
290
00:17:18,830 --> 00:17:21,830
but I went back to
the conversation of Rob Piest,
291
00:17:21,875 --> 00:17:25,455
and we didn’t have a body,
and it was around Christmas,
292
00:17:26,046 --> 00:17:28,166
and we had been told Gacy
was in an Iowa prison
293
00:17:28,214 --> 00:17:30,594
when his father died.
That upset him a lot.
294
00:17:31,426 --> 00:17:33,176
So I brought that up to Gacy.
295
00:17:33,219 --> 00:17:34,719
I said, "Remember
when your father died?
296
00:17:34,763 --> 00:17:36,433
Well, we’ve got a family
now in Des Plaines
297
00:17:36,473 --> 00:17:38,733
who would like to be
able to spend
298
00:17:38,767 --> 00:17:41,897
Christmas having closure
on where their boy is
299
00:17:41,936 --> 00:17:43,646
and where the body is."
300
00:17:44,230 --> 00:17:46,480
And he kind of hemmed
a little bit, and I said,
301
00:17:46,524 --> 00:17:49,614
"Well, is he aboveground?
Where’s he at?"
302
00:17:50,487 --> 00:17:52,317
He said, "Well, it’s neither."
303
00:17:52,364 --> 00:17:56,244
And you took him where?
Out on the I-55 bridge.
304
00:17:56,284 --> 00:17:59,414
And that’s where ...
How was he then taken
305
00:17:59,454 --> 00:18:02,044
from the car
and placed into the river?
306
00:18:03,083 --> 00:18:05,633
Just opened up the trunk
and dumped him in
307
00:18:05,669 --> 00:18:06,799
Uh-huh.
308
00:18:06,836 --> 00:18:08,166
There was no big special deal
out of it.
309
00:18:08,213 --> 00:18:10,133
Okay. Yeah.
310
00:18:10,173 --> 00:18:13,763
We asked John, "Why?
Why the river?
311
00:18:13,802 --> 00:18:15,682
You had a perfect thing
going on here."
312
00:18:15,720 --> 00:18:19,220
He said, "Well, there was no
room left in the crawl space,"
313
00:18:19,265 --> 00:18:21,175
so he drove to the river.
314
00:18:22,727 --> 00:18:25,437
The bridge from which
he threw the body
315
00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:30,240
was pretty high,
and the current got pretty fast.
316
00:18:30,276 --> 00:18:32,566
It just kept moving
and moving and moving.
317
00:18:32,612 --> 00:18:35,122
And so I didn’t really have
great confidence
318
00:18:35,156 --> 00:18:38,156
that we would be able
to find Rob Piest’s body.
319
00:18:38,827 --> 00:18:40,447
Thirty-six-year-old John Gacy,
320
00:18:40,495 --> 00:18:43,205
a convicted sex offender,
has already been charged
321
00:18:43,248 --> 00:18:45,498
with the murder
of 15-year-old Robert Piest.
322
00:18:46,001 --> 00:18:48,501
Police are searching a river
for his body.
323
00:18:49,629 --> 00:18:53,629
By that point, we now know
that Gacy was talking,
324
00:18:53,675 --> 00:18:57,175
and he’s laying out exactly
where those bodies were buried.
325
00:18:58,596 --> 00:19:01,556
Gacy, for some reason,
took a liking to me.
326
00:19:02,017 --> 00:19:04,807
I had blond hair at the time
and certainly a lot younger,
327
00:19:04,853 --> 00:19:08,773
but we had a good relationship.
And they got a hold of us
328
00:19:08,815 --> 00:19:11,565
and said that Gacy wanted
to talk to Larry and I.
329
00:19:12,485 --> 00:19:15,525
So Albrecht and I walked back
into the cell block
330
00:19:15,572 --> 00:19:17,322
and try
and get more information.
331
00:19:17,949 --> 00:19:21,449
Gacy called the crawl space,
"the burial grounds,"
332
00:19:21,911 --> 00:19:25,961
and I said, "I haven’t been
in your crawl space.
333
00:19:25,999 --> 00:19:28,289
Can you kind of tell me
where things are?"
334
00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:31,460
He said "Well, give me
a piece of paper,"
335
00:19:32,088 --> 00:19:33,508
and the only thing we had
336
00:19:33,548 --> 00:19:37,048
was a pink copy of
his prisoner property receipt,
337
00:19:37,093 --> 00:19:42,893
and he drew a diagram a
rectangular shape of the house,
338
00:19:43,433 --> 00:19:46,023
which was the crawl space,
and inside it,
339
00:19:46,061 --> 00:19:49,861
he put another rectangle
and with an X on it,
340
00:19:49,898 --> 00:19:52,858
and he said, "That’s where
the first one was buried."
341
00:19:54,152 --> 00:19:55,702
Then he put an N on top.
342
00:19:55,737 --> 00:19:57,987
And I said, "What’s that?"
He said, "That’s north."
343
00:19:58,031 --> 00:20:02,541
And then he started
to make smaller rectangles.
344
00:20:02,577 --> 00:20:04,247
Some would have numbers in them.
345
00:20:04,704 --> 00:20:07,464
These numbers denoted
how many people were buried
346
00:20:07,499 --> 00:20:10,089
in a particular grave or trench.
347
00:20:10,960 --> 00:20:12,960
He went all the way around
the perimeter of the house
348
00:20:13,004 --> 00:20:16,094
making these various notations
where bodies were buried,
349
00:20:16,758 --> 00:20:19,508
and as soon as he
got done with it,
350
00:20:19,552 --> 00:20:21,142
I reached in
and grabbed it from him
351
00:20:21,179 --> 00:20:24,349
because I wanted to have that
as evidence, and it was amazing.
352
00:20:24,766 --> 00:20:26,476
His recollection
of where those bodies were
353
00:20:26,518 --> 00:20:27,808
and where they actually
354
00:20:27,852 --> 00:20:30,362
did find the bodies
was right on the money.
355
00:20:38,530 --> 00:20:41,410
Police investigators using
sledgehammers, axes and chain
356
00:20:41,449 --> 00:20:45,249
saws gutted John Gacy’s
suburban Chicago home today.
357
00:20:45,286 --> 00:20:47,996
They have found bodies every
place Gacy told them to look.
358
00:20:48,039 --> 00:20:50,499
The murder suspect
has allegedly told police
359
00:20:50,542 --> 00:20:54,052
they will find the remains of 20
more young men and boys here.
360
00:20:56,840 --> 00:20:59,340
I think everybody was numb
at that time.
361
00:21:00,135 --> 00:21:02,925
It wasn’t that we didn’t expect
to find bones.
362
00:21:03,763 --> 00:21:07,433
It was just in
the number of bones.
363
00:21:08,059 --> 00:21:11,899
There were 29 bodies
that were at the house,
364
00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:17,530
27 in the crawl space
and one under the barbecue pit
365
00:21:17,569 --> 00:21:21,199
and one under the walkway
to the garage.
366
00:21:29,706 --> 00:21:34,036
I can’t tell you how I acted
when I saw
367
00:21:34,085 --> 00:21:37,875
that they were under that house.
I stood there, like, frozen.
368
00:21:39,549 --> 00:21:44,179
I was always on him
about the smell in the house.
369
00:21:44,220 --> 00:21:48,560
I couldn’t stand it.
It smelled like dead rats.
370
00:21:50,477 --> 00:21:52,227
And I used to tell him, I said,
371
00:21:52,270 --> 00:21:55,860
"You really got to get somebody
or do something.
372
00:21:55,899 --> 00:21:59,649
There must be something dead
under the house."
373
00:22:00,528 --> 00:22:03,868
He said there, "There isn’t
anything dead under the" ...
374
00:22:03,907 --> 00:22:06,117
I said, “Yes, there is.
375
00:22:06,159 --> 00:22:08,659
I can smell it,
and I know the smell.
376
00:22:09,162 --> 00:22:11,712
That’s something dead
under there."
377
00:22:13,917 --> 00:22:16,667
I’m like, "I was right,
there were dead things
378
00:22:16,711 --> 00:22:20,591
under that house."
That just freaked me out.
379
00:22:20,632 --> 00:22:25,052
And the youngest girl
had her bedroom
380
00:22:25,095 --> 00:22:27,675
right there
where that crawl space was.
381
00:22:32,102 --> 00:22:34,062
I couldn’t get down in the
crawl space that easy,
382
00:22:34,104 --> 00:22:35,904
and then I had a bum back
to begin with.
383
00:22:35,939 --> 00:22:37,729
You got to crawl on your belly
to move around
384
00:22:37,774 --> 00:22:40,034
in the crawl space.
There is no way
385
00:22:40,068 --> 00:22:43,068
that I could have done
any of the digging down there.
386
00:22:43,113 --> 00:22:45,743
I had enough trouble
just getting down there.
387
00:22:47,534 --> 00:22:50,794
Gacy asked us about whether
two kids that worked for him,
388
00:22:50,829 --> 00:22:53,289
Mike Rossi and David Cram,
were at the station,
389
00:22:53,957 --> 00:22:55,377
and we said, "No."
390
00:22:55,417 --> 00:22:57,917
And he said, "Well, because
they were involved,"
391
00:22:58,461 --> 00:23:00,341
and we said, "Well, what do you
mean they were involved?
392
00:23:00,380 --> 00:23:02,720
They were involved
with the killings?"
393
00:23:02,757 --> 00:23:04,337
And he says,
394
00:23:04,384 --> 00:23:07,304
"No, but they dug the trenches
in the crawl space for me,"
395
00:23:08,471 --> 00:23:11,431
and, "Well, did they know
what the trenches were for?"
396
00:23:11,474 --> 00:23:13,944
And his answer was,
"They never said anything,
397
00:23:13,977 --> 00:23:15,597
but if they didn’t know
what was down there,
398
00:23:15,645 --> 00:23:17,355
they were ... stupid."
399
00:23:19,983 --> 00:23:25,033
Gacy told the boys to go down
and dig some shallow trenches
400
00:23:25,071 --> 00:23:27,451
so that he could take care
of some of the plumbing problems
401
00:23:27,490 --> 00:23:28,950
that were down there.
402
00:23:28,992 --> 00:23:32,582
Later on, he would have them
spread the lime
403
00:23:32,996 --> 00:23:35,206
to get rid of any of the smell,
404
00:23:35,248 --> 00:23:39,038
and that’s really why they claim
that they were digging.
405
00:23:40,211 --> 00:23:44,341
He was paying them enough money
that, in fact,
406
00:23:44,924 --> 00:23:48,514
he was,
shall I say, attractive to them.
407
00:23:48,553 --> 00:23:50,893
That’s kind of why
they stuck with him.
408
00:23:52,432 --> 00:23:56,142
His two loyal workers,
Cram and Rossi,
409
00:23:56,186 --> 00:23:59,146
they were tough guys,
you know, street smart,
410
00:23:59,189 --> 00:24:02,729
and they were getting property
from young kids
411
00:24:02,776 --> 00:24:04,646
who never-appeared again,
412
00:24:04,694 --> 00:24:07,324
property that these
young victims
413
00:24:07,364 --> 00:24:09,704
had that Gacy
was giving to them.
414
00:24:11,576 --> 00:24:12,866
When we were on the scene,
415
00:24:12,911 --> 00:24:16,501
we saw Officer Rafael Tovar
taking Rossi
416
00:24:16,539 --> 00:24:18,289
in and out of the house.
417
00:24:18,750 --> 00:24:20,880
I asked my cameraman
to get a shot of him
418
00:24:20,919 --> 00:24:23,629
because I was curious.
"Who is this kid?"
419
00:24:24,172 --> 00:24:26,302
As the investigation wore on,
420
00:24:26,800 --> 00:24:31,140
the name Rossi went
from Gacy confidante,
421
00:24:31,179 --> 00:24:36,479
friend,
lover to informant by police.
422
00:24:37,727 --> 00:24:41,857
We went to Mike Rossi’s house
423
00:24:41,898 --> 00:24:44,358
because we wanted
to interview him some more,
424
00:24:44,401 --> 00:24:45,441
and we got there.
425
00:24:45,485 --> 00:24:48,235
His wife told us
he was still at work,
426
00:24:49,072 --> 00:24:52,122
and she invited us to wait
for him, and I asked her,
427
00:24:52,158 --> 00:24:54,868
"What kind of car does he drive?
I’ll look out the window",
428
00:24:54,911 --> 00:24:57,831
and she told us
it’s a white Plymouth.
429
00:24:57,872 --> 00:25:00,672
I says, "Okay, fine."
And a little bit later
430
00:25:00,709 --> 00:25:03,339
while looking through some of
the missing persons reports,
431
00:25:03,378 --> 00:25:08,428
I noticed that John Szyc’s car
was a white Plymouth Satellite.
432
00:25:08,466 --> 00:25:12,296
It was one of the lights
in the cartoons that go on,
433
00:25:12,345 --> 00:25:14,755
I said,
"Darn, that was the same color."
434
00:25:15,473 --> 00:25:17,143
Then talking to Mike Rossi,
435
00:25:17,183 --> 00:25:20,153
we found out that he’d gotten
the car from John Gacy,
436
00:25:20,186 --> 00:25:25,976
so we were able to tie John Szyc
to Gacy in that manner.
437
00:25:28,445 --> 00:25:31,485
John Szyc was not a runaway.
He was a working kid
438
00:25:31,531 --> 00:25:35,411
and somehow or other wound
up on the bad side of Gacy.
439
00:25:36,619 --> 00:25:39,789
I spoke to members
of John Szyc’s family.
440
00:25:40,331 --> 00:25:42,421
They’d been pleading
with Chicago Police
441
00:25:42,459 --> 00:25:44,749
to help them
find their missing son.
442
00:25:45,462 --> 00:25:47,342
Police had come back
to the family and said,
443
00:25:47,380 --> 00:25:49,720
"We have evidence
that he’s alive
444
00:25:49,758 --> 00:25:51,218
and just simply gone."
445
00:25:51,801 --> 00:25:55,351
So for 2 years, that’s all
the family had to go on.
446
00:25:59,309 --> 00:26:00,979
They worked
the John Szyc case,
447
00:26:01,019 --> 00:26:04,149
but they took an easy way out
in closing the case.
448
00:26:04,189 --> 00:26:07,149
Mike Rossi apparently went up
to get gas one day
449
00:26:07,192 --> 00:26:11,282
and did the fill-and-run,
took off without paying.
450
00:26:11,321 --> 00:26:12,741
They had the license
plate number,
451
00:26:12,781 --> 00:26:14,451
so when the report was written,
452
00:26:14,908 --> 00:26:17,988
it got channeled over
to the investigator
453
00:26:18,036 --> 00:26:20,826
that was doing the John Szyc
missing persons report.
454
00:26:21,623 --> 00:26:23,583
Authorities started
to question that.
455
00:26:23,625 --> 00:26:25,625
Gacy assured them,
"Oh, no, no, no, no.
456
00:26:25,669 --> 00:26:29,959
Szyc needed money. I had the car
because he sold it to me,
457
00:26:30,006 --> 00:26:32,126
so he could get money
to leave town."
458
00:26:33,510 --> 00:26:37,350
Gacy tells them,
"John’s not around here.
459
00:26:37,389 --> 00:26:41,269
I haven’t seen him in months.
He ran away."
460
00:26:42,060 --> 00:26:45,150
The police believed
Gacy’s story.
461
00:26:45,188 --> 00:26:49,028
In fact, John Gacy himself
was the one who determined
462
00:26:49,067 --> 00:26:51,187
that John Szyc was a runaway.
463
00:26:52,570 --> 00:26:55,700
The Szyc family provided me
with a letter
464
00:26:55,740 --> 00:26:57,660
from the Chicago
police department
465
00:26:58,034 --> 00:27:00,204
which I quoted
in one of my stories.
466
00:27:00,245 --> 00:27:04,165
"Dear Mr. and Mrs. Szyc,
I was unable to locate your son,
467
00:27:04,207 --> 00:27:07,877
but I did learn that he sold
his auto in February of 1977
468
00:27:07,919 --> 00:27:11,299
and told the buyer that he
needed the money to leave town."
469
00:27:15,010 --> 00:27:18,050
The investigator told
the Szyc family,
470
00:27:18,096 --> 00:27:19,556
"Well, he must be alive.
471
00:27:19,597 --> 00:27:22,847
Maybe he’s just mad at you
or whatever."
472
00:27:22,892 --> 00:27:25,022
So that was how
he closed the case.
473
00:27:30,233 --> 00:27:33,193
I used to have dreams
that I would see him,
474
00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:37,490
and either he would run
the opposite way
475
00:27:37,532 --> 00:27:41,202
or would just ignore me.
476
00:27:42,454 --> 00:27:46,504
So in your head, you’re thinking
that he disappeared because,
477
00:27:47,167 --> 00:27:50,917
for whatever reason, he didn’t
want to be a part of the family.
478
00:27:54,841 --> 00:28:00,681
I didn’t see my brother’s car
again until on the news
479
00:28:00,722 --> 00:28:03,062
when they were at Gacy’s house.
480
00:28:05,352 --> 00:28:10,272
At that point, we’re watching
the news every day.
481
00:28:11,107 --> 00:28:12,437
You see the car,
482
00:28:12,484 --> 00:28:14,944
and then you notice
they mentioned a ring.
483
00:28:15,945 --> 00:28:18,065
With the initials
that were in it,
484
00:28:18,114 --> 00:28:21,164
I already knew that it was his.
485
00:28:21,201 --> 00:28:23,621
So it all started to add up
a little bit.
486
00:28:24,412 --> 00:28:28,672
There were just things
that definitely put him there.
487
00:28:28,708 --> 00:28:30,458
It was just a matter of time.
488
00:28:39,302 --> 00:28:42,852
When the police officer ...
Sorry.
489
00:28:43,556 --> 00:28:46,516
When the police officers
come to tell you
490
00:28:46,559 --> 00:28:50,189
that he was
positively identified,
491
00:28:50,230 --> 00:28:55,780
it sort of, you know,
changes everything in your life
492
00:28:55,819 --> 00:28:58,949
because then you know
he’s not coming home.
493
00:28:58,988 --> 00:29:03,448
You get closure by knowing
it had nothing to do with us.
494
00:29:03,493 --> 00:29:06,713
He got in with the wrong guy
at the wrong time,
495
00:29:06,746 --> 00:29:09,116
and this is what happened.
496
00:29:13,878 --> 00:29:19,468
You never become numb to
the scene of a stretcher carried
497
00:29:19,509 --> 00:29:23,429
by four men
with a white shrouded body
498
00:29:23,471 --> 00:29:29,141
lying on top of it.
I think the one common thread
499
00:29:29,185 --> 00:29:31,555
that runs through
all the interviews
500
00:29:31,604 --> 00:29:33,984
with the families
of the victims is,
501
00:29:34,024 --> 00:29:35,864
"We tried to tell the police.
502
00:29:35,900 --> 00:29:39,280
We tried to tell them,
but they weren’t listening."
503
00:29:52,500 --> 00:29:57,130
As I continue my research,
I’m getting angrier and angrier
504
00:29:57,172 --> 00:30:00,432
as to why somebody
didn’t stop this man
505
00:30:00,467 --> 00:30:04,467
before he started killing
young men and boys in Chicago.
506
00:30:07,140 --> 00:30:08,480
Gacy’s name came up
507
00:30:08,516 --> 00:30:11,476
in some missing person
reports in Chicago,
508
00:30:11,519 --> 00:30:15,609
and Gacy had some kind of
contact with the victims,
509
00:30:15,648 --> 00:30:17,358
whether they were
working for him,
510
00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:18,990
or they went to talk to him
about a job
511
00:30:19,027 --> 00:30:20,527
or whatever it may be.
512
00:30:20,570 --> 00:30:25,620
Gregory Godzik, let’s see,
number four.
513
00:30:28,661 --> 00:30:34,581
Gregory Godzik had come
to work for me in,
514
00:30:36,961 --> 00:30:38,551
according to this, 1976.
515
00:30:39,047 --> 00:30:42,177
He came to us through Taft
High School through a program.
516
00:30:42,217 --> 00:30:43,927
He had worked
for Republic Lumber Company,
517
00:30:43,968 --> 00:30:45,638
and then he came to work for us.
518
00:30:47,389 --> 00:30:51,769
My brother Gregory
was 17 in 1976,
519
00:30:52,227 --> 00:30:54,597
and he was a senior
at Taft High School.
520
00:30:55,230 --> 00:30:57,360
We had a very simple family.
521
00:30:57,399 --> 00:30:59,359
We had dinner together
every night.
522
00:30:59,901 --> 00:31:03,321
Those times were very simple,
very simple life.
523
00:31:05,740 --> 00:31:12,410
Senior year, you had an option
to have a part-time job
524
00:31:12,997 --> 00:31:14,707
but still getting school credit,
525
00:31:14,749 --> 00:31:20,049
and he decided to get a job
at this Republic Lumber making,
526
00:31:20,422 --> 00:31:26,222
I think, $2.25 an hour.
I remember him coming home,
527
00:31:26,261 --> 00:31:28,301
and he said
there was a man that came in.
528
00:31:28,346 --> 00:31:31,596
"His name was Gacy,
and he wants to give me a job,"
529
00:31:31,641 --> 00:31:33,561
making $5 an hour.
530
00:31:34,269 --> 00:31:39,729
If somebody’s dangling $5
an hour cash versus $2.25,
531
00:31:40,442 --> 00:31:42,072
a kid at 17 is going to say,
532
00:31:42,110 --> 00:31:44,990
"Well, I’m going to go
this route versus that route."
533
00:31:45,905 --> 00:31:49,615
He thought Gacy
offered him a future.
534
00:31:54,289 --> 00:31:58,749
It was December 11th,
a Saturday night.
535
00:31:59,336 --> 00:32:05,586
He was supposed to go to Gacy’s
house to pick up a paycheck.
536
00:32:10,347 --> 00:32:13,267
The next morning,
my mother woke up and said,
537
00:32:13,308 --> 00:32:15,438
"Do you know
where your brother is?"
538
00:32:15,477 --> 00:32:18,307
When he’d come home,
he’d give my mother a kiss.
539
00:32:18,772 --> 00:32:23,652
And that night when he did not
come home,
540
00:32:23,693 --> 00:32:25,953
my mother knew
there was something wrong.
541
00:32:26,488 --> 00:32:29,778
My mother felt immediately,
"This isn’t normal.
542
00:32:29,824 --> 00:32:33,414
Your brother’s missing."
She called the Chicago Police.
543
00:32:35,330 --> 00:32:37,920
My mom talked to a couple
of police officers,
544
00:32:37,957 --> 00:32:39,667
and they all said,
545
00:32:39,709 --> 00:32:41,459
"Well, there’s really nothing
we can do.
546
00:32:41,503 --> 00:32:44,133
He has to be gone
at least 72 hours,
547
00:32:44,172 --> 00:32:46,172
but we’ll take the information."
548
00:32:48,426 --> 00:32:52,556
Sunday, they found the car
in a parking lot.
549
00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:57,600
That was his pride
and joy, his car,
550
00:32:57,644 --> 00:33:02,194
and to find it unlocked,
it was so out of character.
551
00:33:03,441 --> 00:33:06,571
My mom told them
where he was working,
552
00:33:06,611 --> 00:33:10,371
but nothing was ever
followed,that we know of.
553
00:33:11,616 --> 00:33:14,286
Gregory Godzik,
who worked for Gacy,
554
00:33:14,953 --> 00:33:17,873
disappeared in December of 1976,
555
00:33:18,415 --> 00:33:22,125
2 years before bodies were
discovered under Gacy’s home.
556
00:33:22,752 --> 00:33:25,212
I talked to Greg Godzik’s
mother, Eugenia,
557
00:33:25,255 --> 00:33:29,335
and she told me she had gone
and confronted Gacy directly.
558
00:33:29,384 --> 00:33:30,844
I talked to him.
559
00:33:30,885 --> 00:33:33,255
I called him up to find out
if my Gregory called,
560
00:33:33,805 --> 00:33:37,845
and he said he did and that
he was going to come to work,
561
00:33:38,351 --> 00:33:39,811
and I says,
"Well, did he ever come?"
562
00:33:39,853 --> 00:33:41,313
and he says, "No."
563
00:33:41,354 --> 00:33:43,364
And I says, "How do you know
it was Gregory?"
564
00:33:43,398 --> 00:33:46,648
And he says because
he had him on his tape,
565
00:33:47,736 --> 00:33:51,106
and I asked him
if he could play it back.
566
00:33:51,156 --> 00:33:52,816
He said, no, he erased it.
567
00:33:53,366 --> 00:33:56,696
My mother had
my brother’s time card.
568
00:33:56,745 --> 00:33:59,205
He says, "Can I have
that time card?"
569
00:33:59,247 --> 00:34:02,247
And my mother said, "No,
I’m going to hold on to this."
570
00:34:03,084 --> 00:34:07,214
I do remember her saying,
"He’s kind of an odd man."
571
00:34:07,255 --> 00:34:11,545
She felt that he probably
could have gave more information
572
00:34:11,593 --> 00:34:13,263
but was too elusive.
573
00:34:13,887 --> 00:34:17,467
He kind of brushed her off.
She felt odd.
574
00:34:18,266 --> 00:34:22,096
Eugenia Godzik told me
that she both confronted Gacy
575
00:34:22,145 --> 00:34:23,395
and went to the police.
576
00:34:23,438 --> 00:34:24,608
Did you ever tell the police
577
00:34:24,647 --> 00:34:26,647
about your conversation
with John Gacy?
578
00:34:26,691 --> 00:34:28,361
Yes, I’m sure I did.
579
00:34:28,943 --> 00:34:31,783
And that was the last
she heard from Gacy,
580
00:34:31,821 --> 00:34:33,991
and she got nowhere
with police either.
581
00:34:36,701 --> 00:34:39,161
Mrs. Godzick was
very convincing
582
00:34:39,204 --> 00:34:40,874
that her son was not a runaway.
583
00:34:41,956 --> 00:34:44,876
But once again, Gacy was able
to convince the police
584
00:34:44,918 --> 00:34:48,418
that he didn’t really have any
further involvement with Godzik.
585
00:34:50,799 --> 00:34:56,139
My father, his mode was:
stay at home, say the rosary,
586
00:34:56,179 --> 00:34:59,219
and my mother kept saying,
"Oh, the hell with that.
587
00:34:59,265 --> 00:35:00,975
I’m going to go
do the footwork."
588
00:35:02,268 --> 00:35:04,688
In the meantime,
I did have at least
589
00:35:04,729 --> 00:35:07,439
two of my girlfriends’ dads
looking into it.
590
00:35:07,857 --> 00:35:10,187
The one that I called
right away,
591
00:35:10,235 --> 00:35:12,485
he was a homicide
police officer.
592
00:35:13,071 --> 00:35:15,741
I remember talking
to my girlfriend, and she said,
593
00:35:15,782 --> 00:35:21,082
"Oh, my dad is always saying
it’s tops on his list."
594
00:35:31,006 --> 00:35:36,466
When the Robert Piest story
broke out 2 years
595
00:35:36,511 --> 00:35:38,681
after my brother
had disappeared,
596
00:35:39,431 --> 00:35:41,061
my mother said, "Oh, my god.
597
00:35:41,850 --> 00:35:45,400
Gacy, that’s the man
that your brother worked for.
598
00:35:45,812 --> 00:35:51,152
This could be it."
Shortly after that,
599
00:35:51,192 --> 00:35:53,902
we got a phone call
from my girlfriend’s dad,
600
00:35:53,945 --> 00:35:56,775
He said,
"There’s a case breaking.
601
00:35:57,365 --> 00:35:59,865
It’s bigger than
you can ever imagine,
602
00:35:59,909 --> 00:36:05,329
and there’s many, many bodies.
Be prepared."
603
00:36:05,999 --> 00:36:09,709
Gregory was 17 years old
when he disappeared 2 years ago.
604
00:36:10,211 --> 00:36:11,801
He had worked part-time for Gacy
605
00:36:11,838 --> 00:36:14,878
and was allegedly last seen with
Gacy the night he disappeared.
606
00:36:14,924 --> 00:36:17,894
Nevertheless, Gregory’s mother
still hopes he’s alive.
607
00:36:18,470 --> 00:36:20,390
I really do want
to believe that.
608
00:36:26,978 --> 00:36:30,318
Gregory said that he was
working around Gacy’s house
609
00:36:30,732 --> 00:36:34,612
digging trenches
around his home,
610
00:36:35,236 --> 00:36:36,816
and eventually it ended up
611
00:36:36,863 --> 00:36:39,073
that they were digging
their own graves.
612
00:36:41,743 --> 00:36:45,713
The 2 years that it took,
there were so many opportunities
613
00:36:45,747 --> 00:36:50,167
for this to end up better
than what it was.
614
00:36:50,210 --> 00:36:52,130
Yes, my brother would’ve
been a victim,
615
00:36:52,170 --> 00:36:55,590
but there would’ve been
so many more young men saved.
616
00:36:55,632 --> 00:36:57,052
I feel sorry for those
other families
617
00:36:57,092 --> 00:36:59,182
that had to go
through the same thing.
618
00:37:00,095 --> 00:37:05,135
Ever family I spoke to said
they were reassured by police
619
00:37:05,183 --> 00:37:06,983
that they were working on it,
620
00:37:07,018 --> 00:37:11,608
but in none of the cases did the
police come up with any answers,
621
00:37:11,648 --> 00:37:13,978
explanations or evidence.
622
00:37:14,567 --> 00:37:17,487
In Chicago,
clout was everything,
623
00:37:18,154 --> 00:37:24,124
and the victims were voiceless
and faceless and cloutless,
624
00:37:24,661 --> 00:37:30,421
young boys and men, hitchhiking,
looking for work,
625
00:37:30,834 --> 00:37:33,924
looking for fun,
being approached
626
00:37:33,962 --> 00:37:39,762
by this roly-poly man
who would promise them money,
627
00:37:39,801 --> 00:37:43,601
promise them jobs
and give them something else.
628
00:37:53,148 --> 00:37:58,068
Gacy never once showed
any type of remorse or regret
629
00:37:58,111 --> 00:38:01,321
in what he did.
He always blamed the kids.
630
00:38:01,364 --> 00:38:02,914
"They did this for money."
631
00:38:02,949 --> 00:38:04,909
Whether it was for a job
or for sex,
632
00:38:04,951 --> 00:38:07,911
whatever,
it was never his fault at all.
633
00:38:07,954 --> 00:38:11,254
I am not the monster image
that’s been portrayed of me,
634
00:38:11,291 --> 00:38:12,921
and the only way you can make
a monster image
635
00:38:12,959 --> 00:38:15,379
is to make it look
like I stalked the streets
636
00:38:15,420 --> 00:38:17,420
and picked up altar boys
off the street.
637
00:38:17,881 --> 00:38:20,011
They want to make them look like
innocent babes in the woods,
638
00:38:20,050 --> 00:38:22,050
and I was swatting them
like flies.
639
00:38:22,093 --> 00:38:23,763
Gacy would tell us
that he had other kids
640
00:38:23,803 --> 00:38:25,433
that he had picked up
641
00:38:25,472 --> 00:38:27,812
and had sexual relations with
but didn’t kill them all.
642
00:38:28,266 --> 00:38:31,096
He had this dark Oldsmobile
with a spotlight on it,
643
00:38:31,144 --> 00:38:33,814
and a lot of people
thought it was a squad car.
644
00:38:34,439 --> 00:38:36,359
A young kid 16, 17,
645
00:38:36,399 --> 00:38:40,109
18 years old some guy pulls
next to him with a squad car,
646
00:38:40,153 --> 00:38:41,533
it looks like,
647
00:38:41,571 --> 00:38:43,781
they’re going to do
what this guy tells him to do.
648
00:38:43,823 --> 00:38:45,873
Once he got in the car
back to his house,
649
00:38:46,493 --> 00:38:49,623
Gacy determined whether
they’re going to live or die.
650
00:38:49,662 --> 00:38:51,462
My encounters were always
by happenchance.
651
00:38:51,498 --> 00:38:52,998
If you pull up to a stoplight,
652
00:38:53,041 --> 00:38:54,831
and there’s somebody standing
there waiting for a bus,
653
00:38:54,876 --> 00:38:57,666
if you give them a ride,
and you ask them whether,
654
00:38:58,672 --> 00:38:59,962
"You get into anything,
655
00:39:00,006 --> 00:39:02,716
or you want drugs
or something like that?"
656
00:39:03,301 --> 00:39:06,761
that’s how it happened,
always happenchance encounters.
657
00:39:10,183 --> 00:39:12,233
I talked to a number
of young men
658
00:39:12,268 --> 00:39:15,728
who had been approached
and propositioned by Gacy.
659
00:39:15,772 --> 00:39:20,492
I talked to some young men
who’d escaped, barely,
660
00:39:20,527 --> 00:39:22,897
the fate of most
of his other victims.
661
00:39:24,197 --> 00:39:27,827
One violent attack took place
just 9 months before bodies
662
00:39:27,867 --> 00:39:30,197
were discovered
in his crawl space.
663
00:39:30,870 --> 00:39:33,000
At the time Robert Piest
went missing,
664
00:39:33,039 --> 00:39:38,039
Gacy was actually out on bond
on a charge of battery.
665
00:39:39,004 --> 00:39:42,844
The victim was Jeffrey Rignall.
He came forth.
666
00:39:43,383 --> 00:39:46,803
We got the information
from Rignall himself.
667
00:39:49,180 --> 00:39:51,810
Jeffrey Rignall
was the love of my life.
668
00:39:52,642 --> 00:39:55,312
Jeff and I were together
for 27 years.
669
00:39:56,229 --> 00:39:58,059
It’s very hard
to find somebody special.
670
00:39:58,106 --> 00:40:00,146
You’ll know when you find one.
671
00:40:00,191 --> 00:40:04,571
And that’s exactly
what Jeff was, a special person.
672
00:40:05,447 --> 00:40:11,117
All the problems started when he
got abducted by John Wayne Gacy.
673
00:40:13,079 --> 00:40:19,379
In 1978, right around the 20th
of March, I got a phone call.
674
00:40:19,419 --> 00:40:25,129
Jeff told me that he was
abducted and almost killed.
675
00:40:27,510 --> 00:40:32,140
Jeff said, "The guy rolled down
the window and said,
676
00:40:32,182 --> 00:40:35,522
’You want to smoke a joint?’"
So Jeff got in the car.
677
00:40:36,269 --> 00:40:38,609
The guy lit the joint up
and passed it to him.
678
00:40:38,646 --> 00:40:42,936
He was a clean-cut
looking man,
679
00:40:42,984 --> 00:40:48,034
and I got in the car with him,
680
00:40:48,073 --> 00:40:50,333
and shortly after
I got in the car with him,
681
00:40:50,367 --> 00:40:52,237
he placed a rag over my face,
682
00:40:52,827 --> 00:40:55,287
of which turned out
to be chloroform.
683
00:40:55,872 --> 00:40:57,792
He was unconscious.
684
00:40:58,625 --> 00:41:03,415
Jeff would wake up every now,
and then he would see something,
685
00:41:03,463 --> 00:41:06,133
but he would only be there
for a split second,
686
00:41:06,174 --> 00:41:08,554
and then the rag
would come over his face.
687
00:41:08,593 --> 00:41:14,723
The next thing he knew, he was
strapped down in a torture wood.
688
00:41:15,767 --> 00:41:19,557
There were chains he said that
were suspended from the ceiling
689
00:41:19,604 --> 00:41:21,654
that held him up in the air.
690
00:41:22,857 --> 00:41:29,987
So he was there being beaten,
being raped, being chloroformed,
691
00:41:31,491 --> 00:41:35,791
drugged,
beaten again constantly.
692
00:41:36,329 --> 00:41:42,129
After the attack, the abductor
drove him back down to the area
693
00:41:42,168 --> 00:41:46,338
that he was picked up at
and left him there half-clothed,
694
00:41:47,048 --> 00:41:49,718
only his pants on
and nothing else.
695
00:41:53,263 --> 00:41:57,853
When I first saw Jeff,
he was distraught.
696
00:41:58,393 --> 00:42:02,653
He was beat up, and he had burns
from chloroform,
697
00:42:02,689 --> 00:42:04,109
had a rope burn.
698
00:42:04,149 --> 00:42:06,609
He was still bleeding
from the backside.
699
00:42:07,152 --> 00:42:09,242
Everything that could go wrong
with your body
700
00:42:09,279 --> 00:42:12,489
seemed to go wrong with him
at this moment.
701
00:42:13,825 --> 00:42:17,325
The police come to the
hospital to interview Rignall,
702
00:42:18,663 --> 00:42:21,753
and his story is very vague,
703
00:42:22,375 --> 00:42:25,085
and he did not know
where the house was
704
00:42:25,128 --> 00:42:26,918
or what it looked like
or anything,
705
00:42:27,464 --> 00:42:30,434
and so it was a very minimalist
police report,
706
00:42:30,467 --> 00:42:32,007
and nothing transpired.
707
00:42:32,552 --> 00:42:38,562
The police assumed that
Jeff’s encounter with Gacy
708
00:42:39,059 --> 00:42:41,309
was a consensual arrangement.
709
00:42:41,353 --> 00:42:46,863
They had no clue of how to treat
a gay rape of any sort
710
00:42:47,567 --> 00:42:49,687
and did not even think
that would be possible,
711
00:42:49,736 --> 00:42:52,566
because they would figure
that all sexual arrangements
712
00:42:52,614 --> 00:42:54,414
between gay people
were consensual,
713
00:42:54,908 --> 00:42:56,618
which is definitely
not the case.
714
00:42:57,410 --> 00:42:59,290
Jeffrey Rignall filed
a report,
715
00:42:59,329 --> 00:43:03,459
but much to the shame
of the police at that time,
716
00:43:03,500 --> 00:43:04,710
they pretty much figured,
717
00:43:04,751 --> 00:43:06,671
"Oh, it was one gay guy
on another one,"
718
00:43:06,711 --> 00:43:08,211
they didn’t really care
719
00:43:08,254 --> 00:43:11,304
because they didn’t do very much
of an investigation,
720
00:43:12,092 --> 00:43:15,432
so Jeffrey decided
he’d do his own investigation.
721
00:43:16,304 --> 00:43:19,854
Jeff thought that that man
could kill somebody.
722
00:43:19,891 --> 00:43:22,191
He figured whatever
he did to him,
723
00:43:22,227 --> 00:43:24,597
he was going to do it
to other people.
724
00:43:25,063 --> 00:43:27,023
That’s why he wanted
to catch him.
725
00:43:36,074 --> 00:43:38,204
As soon as Jeff
got out of the hospital,
726
00:43:38,243 --> 00:43:41,413
we started looking for the car
that picked Jeff up.
727
00:43:42,288 --> 00:43:46,208
He noticed the license plate
because he had to walk around it
728
00:43:46,251 --> 00:43:50,051
in order to get to the car,
and he could hear planes.
729
00:43:50,714 --> 00:43:56,304
So he knew he was out somewhere
in the vicinity of the airport.
730
00:43:57,053 --> 00:43:59,933
Since the police took
the matter very, very lightly,
731
00:44:00,390 --> 00:44:03,770
and I felt that you know
it wasn’t a light matter,
732
00:44:03,810 --> 00:44:10,030
I rented a car and sat where
I thought I was approximately,
733
00:44:10,066 --> 00:44:12,146
waiting for his car to come by.
734
00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:20,910
We went out every day
we could, and then ...
735
00:44:21,369 --> 00:44:24,409
This had been
probably 3, 4 weeks?
736
00:44:25,457 --> 00:44:28,457
Jeff looked up and he said,
"That’s it! That’s the car!"
737
00:44:30,462 --> 00:44:34,802
We saw the car go by,
pulled in right in behind him,
738
00:44:35,508 --> 00:44:37,888
kept a couple car lengths
away from him.
739
00:44:37,927 --> 00:44:39,797
You could see the license plate.
740
00:44:41,264 --> 00:44:43,144
We took the license
plate number,
741
00:44:43,183 --> 00:44:46,483
identified the name
and went back to the police.
742
00:44:46,519 --> 00:44:49,479
They got his picture
and did a photo array,
743
00:44:49,522 --> 00:44:52,482
and he identified Gacy
as the one that done it to him.
744
00:44:55,487 --> 00:44:58,447
They called Jeff and told him
that he was arrested.
745
00:44:59,199 --> 00:45:01,279
And he said, "Good, where is he?
Is he in jail?"
746
00:45:01,326 --> 00:45:02,826
Says, "He’s out on bond."
747
00:45:02,869 --> 00:45:06,459
He was released right away
after posting a minor bond.
748
00:45:07,665 --> 00:45:12,625
Now he’s out probably doing the
same thing that he did to Jeff.
749
00:45:13,380 --> 00:45:18,260
So we tried to get the charges
on Gacy bumped up.
750
00:45:19,803 --> 00:45:23,563
And the State’s Attorney said,
"You can’t bump them up."
751
00:45:24,307 --> 00:45:26,427
After all, it’s just
another butt-fuck."
752
00:45:30,772 --> 00:45:32,822
This grim investigation
at John Gacy’s house
753
00:45:32,857 --> 00:45:36,187
is expected to last for weeks,
and when they finish here,
754
00:45:36,236 --> 00:45:38,736
police plan to search
other sites and drag a river
755
00:45:38,780 --> 00:45:42,330
where Gacy allegedly told them
he disposed of other bodies.
756
00:45:42,367 --> 00:45:44,367
When we all saw the bodies
coming out there,
757
00:45:44,411 --> 00:45:50,001
Jeff just totally freaked out.
He was manic, crazy,
758
00:45:50,041 --> 00:45:52,921
yelling, screaming,
throwing things around.
759
00:45:53,378 --> 00:45:56,668
"See, I told you. I told you.
They never believed me.
760
00:45:56,715 --> 00:45:58,925
I told you.
Why didn’t they believe me?"
761
00:45:58,967 --> 00:46:00,587
He was totally upset.
762
00:46:00,635 --> 00:46:03,635
I thought he was going to just
have a total nervous breakdown
763
00:46:03,680 --> 00:46:08,640
and be done, and eventually,
he did calm down,
764
00:46:09,227 --> 00:46:13,227
and then the next news
had more bodies coming out.
765
00:46:16,735 --> 00:46:19,235
And it just continued that way.
766
00:46:24,200 --> 00:46:25,700
There were all kinds
of victims,
767
00:46:25,744 --> 00:46:27,204
and there was a good percentage
768
00:46:27,245 --> 00:46:32,495
that were absolutely straight,
suburban kids,
769
00:46:33,418 --> 00:46:36,208
and there was certainly
a good percentage
770
00:46:36,254 --> 00:46:41,474
that were either homosexuals
or even homosexual prostitutes.
771
00:46:43,053 --> 00:46:46,473
Gacy told us that
most of his victims,
772
00:46:46,514 --> 00:46:48,354
as long as they didn’t pose
a threat to him,
773
00:46:48,391 --> 00:46:51,941
the vast majority of these
people left, and left unharmed.
774
00:46:53,605 --> 00:46:56,975
The victims who he perceived
to be a threat,
775
00:46:58,318 --> 00:47:01,858
either because of remorse
that they showed
776
00:47:01,905 --> 00:47:04,065
or trying to extort more money
777
00:47:04,449 --> 00:47:06,449
or the threat
of telling neighbors,
778
00:47:07,410 --> 00:47:10,620
he said he would deal with them
usually with the rope trick.
779
00:47:14,459 --> 00:47:17,549
The fact that it appeared
that many of the victims
780
00:47:17,587 --> 00:47:21,467
were gay young men
I think created a stigma.
781
00:47:22,634 --> 00:47:26,184
Gay men in Chicago
back in the ’70s
782
00:47:26,971 --> 00:47:28,971
were still
kind of an underclass,
783
00:47:29,933 --> 00:47:32,603
and I think this might have been
part of the reason
784
00:47:32,644 --> 00:47:35,314
why Gacy was able
to get away with what he did.
785
00:47:36,815 --> 00:47:42,145
I think it affected the way
it was reported
786
00:47:42,195 --> 00:47:44,985
and the way it was treated
by law enforcement.
787
00:47:46,658 --> 00:47:50,038
It was a very difficult thing
to report because I didn’t know
788
00:47:50,078 --> 00:47:54,168
what the parents and family
members of these young men knew.
789
00:47:54,541 --> 00:47:56,501
Investigators tonight believe
that many
790
00:47:56,543 --> 00:47:58,633
if not most
of his alleged victims
791
00:47:58,670 --> 00:48:01,840
were either male prostitutes
or other homosexuals.
792
00:48:01,881 --> 00:48:05,141
They came to him either paid
or looking for a good time
793
00:48:05,176 --> 00:48:07,346
and got more
than they bargained for.
794
00:48:09,764 --> 00:48:14,564
The characterization
of the victims was horrible.
795
00:48:15,311 --> 00:48:16,811
They’re young people
who were entitled
796
00:48:16,855 --> 00:48:18,225
to the rest of their lives
797
00:48:18,273 --> 00:48:20,153
to have something
that they could live for,
798
00:48:20,692 --> 00:48:25,412
and Gacy snuffed
that out completely.
799
00:48:26,031 --> 00:48:28,281
They shouldn’t have been
portrayed like that
800
00:48:28,324 --> 00:48:30,044
because there was no proof.
801
00:48:30,827 --> 00:48:35,207
Robert Piest was a healthy,
athletic young man
802
00:48:35,248 --> 00:48:36,668
who never left home.
803
00:48:36,708 --> 00:48:39,498
His mom was waiting for him
around the corner.
804
00:48:40,545 --> 00:48:44,045
The police went by what they
were being told by Gacy.
805
00:48:44,632 --> 00:48:47,012
They didn’t know
who these people even were.
806
00:48:47,886 --> 00:48:53,386
They had no idea if it was the
senator’s kid or a runaway kid.
807
00:48:53,433 --> 00:48:55,603
The reporters are doing
the same thing.
808
00:48:55,643 --> 00:48:59,313
The police told the reporters,
"Nobody cares about them."
809
00:49:00,148 --> 00:49:03,398
Whether it’s runaways,
whether it’s drug ...
810
00:49:03,443 --> 00:49:05,613
Who cares?
They are still people.
811
00:49:06,029 --> 00:49:10,699
And the Chicago police,
who on many occasions could have
812
00:49:10,742 --> 00:49:15,212
prevented the futures
from happening, did nothing.
813
00:49:16,581 --> 00:49:19,001
I recall reporting
at the time
814
00:49:19,042 --> 00:49:23,172
all of Gacy’s contacts with
the Chicago Police Department.
815
00:49:23,213 --> 00:49:25,053
John Gacy came into contact
with authorities
816
00:49:25,090 --> 00:49:28,590
more than half a dozen times,
allegedly involved in crimes
817
00:49:28,635 --> 00:49:31,005
ranging from kidnapping
to rape and assault.
818
00:49:31,429 --> 00:49:33,929
His name came up in connection
with missing persons.
819
00:49:33,973 --> 00:49:35,523
He was even linked to a theft
820
00:49:35,558 --> 00:49:37,848
committed with the car
of one of his victims.
821
00:49:37,894 --> 00:49:41,114
I remember talking to the police
superintendent at the time,
822
00:49:41,147 --> 00:49:44,437
James O’Grady, and asking him,
"What was going on here?
823
00:49:44,484 --> 00:49:46,074
Why didn’t you see these signs?
Why?
824
00:49:46,111 --> 00:49:49,821
Why did you just kind of dismiss
it and release him every time?"
825
00:49:50,323 --> 00:49:52,453
and he was angry.
826
00:49:53,159 --> 00:49:56,369
He thought that the detectives
did not do their work.
827
00:49:57,414 --> 00:49:59,834
He wouldn’t appear on camera
to talk about it,
828
00:49:59,874 --> 00:50:02,214
but the police superintendent
of the time
829
00:50:02,252 --> 00:50:05,802
was furious with the work
of the detectives
830
00:50:05,839 --> 00:50:09,299
who released Gacy time
after time after time.
831
00:50:10,427 --> 00:50:12,927
That’s where
he’s the scariest.
832
00:50:12,971 --> 00:50:16,811
He’s a person who got involved
with charities,
833
00:50:16,850 --> 00:50:19,020
got involved with politics,
834
00:50:19,060 --> 00:50:22,270
did things that
made him believable.
835
00:50:22,313 --> 00:50:26,283
What’s scary about that is,
someone in your neighborhood,
836
00:50:26,693 --> 00:50:28,453
who you think is a good person,
837
00:50:28,987 --> 00:50:31,317
they might just be another
John Wayne Gacy.
838
00:50:31,906 --> 00:50:35,446
John Wayne Gacy was a master
manipulator.
839
00:50:35,493 --> 00:50:39,413
He manipulated his victims.
He manipulated authorities.
840
00:50:39,456 --> 00:50:43,746
He lived to deceive.
And after his arrest,
841
00:50:43,793 --> 00:50:47,263
a whole new chapter
of Gacy’s deception began.
842
00:50:48,048 --> 00:50:51,428
The day that we arrested him,
Gacy was already thinking
843
00:50:51,468 --> 00:50:53,138
what his defense
was going to be.
844
00:50:53,178 --> 00:50:55,598
He looked up at me, and he said,
"It’s never going to happen."
845
00:50:55,638 --> 00:50:57,308
I says,
"Well, what do you mean?"
846
00:50:57,349 --> 00:51:00,479
And he says, "I’m never gonna
spend a day in jail for this."67170
Can't find what you're looking for?
Get subtitles in any language from opensubtitles.com, and translate them here.