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1
00:00:04,081 --> 00:00:06,481
Can you offer
any hope for the unemployed?
2
00:00:06,961 --> 00:00:08,857
I think
it's going to be very difficult
3
00:00:08,881 --> 00:00:11,121
to get it down significantly in 1983.
4
00:00:12,001 --> 00:00:13,921
Drifters who've strayed to London
5
00:00:14,001 --> 00:00:16,961
in the expectation of
streets paved with gold
6
00:00:17,041 --> 00:00:19,961
and beacon lights
that would guide them to prosperity.
7
00:00:20,041 --> 00:00:22,217
You go to the Job Centre.
"Well, where d'you live?"
8
00:00:22,241 --> 00:00:23,321
"No fixed abode".
9
00:00:23,401 --> 00:00:25,361
"Sir, we're sorry, we can't help you
with a job".
10
00:00:26,441 --> 00:00:29,097
There's a growing army
of younger people looking for work
11
00:00:29,121 --> 00:00:30,201
or a new life.
12
00:00:30,281 --> 00:00:31,801
What they need is a secure home
13
00:00:31,881 --> 00:00:33,841
with a job,
but often they're denied either.
14
00:00:34,121 --> 00:00:35,657
The first thing that they find
15
00:00:35,681 --> 00:00:38,641
is that London isn't
what it appears to be on television.
16
00:00:39,441 --> 00:00:42,321
They've often
deliberately cut all links with the past
17
00:00:42,401 --> 00:00:43,961
and this makes them an easy target
18
00:00:44,041 --> 00:00:46,721
for exploitation
by criminals or conmen.
19
00:00:47,201 --> 00:00:48,961
It's an increasingly violent place
20
00:00:49,401 --> 00:00:50,881
particularly for young people.
21
00:01:04,961 --> 00:01:07,641
- Come on, in you go. Come in.
- Thank you.
22
00:01:07,681 --> 00:01:09,241
Love, Tilly's here.
23
00:01:11,081 --> 00:01:12,081
Just through here.
24
00:01:12,082 --> 00:01:13,082
Thanks.
25
00:01:14,961 --> 00:01:17,761
Oh, hey, Peter.
Sorry to come so early.
26
00:01:19,121 --> 00:01:21,121
Just... give me two secs.
27
00:01:37,081 --> 00:01:38,681
There we go.
28
00:01:40,721 --> 00:01:42,921
They said there should be
some cricket pads?
29
00:01:43,801 --> 00:01:44,801
Well, it's February.
30
00:01:46,001 --> 00:01:47,801
The boys won't need 'em
until the summer term.
31
00:01:48,961 --> 00:01:50,801
I'll see them
before then, surely?
32
00:01:53,721 --> 00:01:54,721
Let me get them.
33
00:01:57,241 --> 00:01:58,241
I'm sorry, Peter.
34
00:02:00,841 --> 00:02:01,881
It's not your fault.
35
00:02:03,281 --> 00:02:04,281
Ah...
36
00:02:04,961 --> 00:02:05,961
Thanks.
37
00:02:06,521 --> 00:02:08,201
Sorry again for the intrusion.
38
00:02:15,041 --> 00:02:16,961
Till, hang on a minute.
39
00:02:18,681 --> 00:02:19,761
Look, I...
40
00:02:21,441 --> 00:02:23,401
I know you're trying to be
a good friend to Carol
41
00:02:23,481 --> 00:02:25,681
and... I don't want you
to get in the middle.
42
00:02:27,361 --> 00:02:28,361
But...
43
00:02:28,801 --> 00:02:30,161
it can't keep going on like this.
44
00:02:31,201 --> 00:02:32,201
It's crazy.
45
00:02:33,881 --> 00:02:35,321
Whatever happened
between me and her
46
00:02:35,361 --> 00:02:36,961
the boys have got
nothing to do with it.
47
00:02:39,481 --> 00:02:40,481
Please.
48
00:02:43,321 --> 00:02:44,321
I miss 'em.
49
00:02:49,201 --> 00:02:50,281
I'll speak to her.
50
00:02:52,841 --> 00:02:53,841
Thank you.
51
00:03:01,121 --> 00:03:02,121
Morning.
52
00:03:02,441 --> 00:03:03,561
Anything on the overnight?
53
00:03:03,641 --> 00:03:05,961
Not much.
Another burglary in Wood Green
54
00:03:06,041 --> 00:03:07,041
but that's about it.
55
00:03:07,161 --> 00:03:08,161
Any witnesses?
56
00:03:08,441 --> 00:03:10,241
It was only called in
half an hour ago, Guv.
57
00:03:11,081 --> 00:03:12,801
Can you take a statement
on your way home?
58
00:03:16,681 --> 00:03:17,801
- The boss in?
- Yep.
59
00:03:20,681 --> 00:03:21,681
- Guv?
- Yeah?
60
00:03:21,761 --> 00:03:22,761
Steve called.
61
00:03:23,401 --> 00:03:26,121
They've found suspected human remains
in Muswell Hill
62
00:03:26,201 --> 00:03:27,401
in a... in a drain.
63
00:03:27,881 --> 00:03:29,681
- Remains?
- That's what he said.
64
00:03:33,281 --> 00:03:34,401
Did he give you an address?
65
00:03:34,801 --> 00:03:37,641
Yeah, said "23 Cranley Gardens".
66
00:03:39,601 --> 00:03:42,201
OK, uh, if he calls again,
tell him I'm on my way.
67
00:03:44,081 --> 00:03:45,241
I thought you were giving up?
68
00:03:45,601 --> 00:03:46,601
I am.
69
00:04:09,562 --> 00:04:11,162
Mr Cattran called this in.
70
00:04:12,161 --> 00:04:13,281
- Alright?
- How do you do?
71
00:04:14,121 --> 00:04:17,601
I was telling the officer, I was called here
last night because of a blockage.
72
00:04:17,921 --> 00:04:20,801
There was a lot more, but when I got back
this morning, it had gone.
73
00:04:22,921 --> 00:04:24,921
- Could it have unblocked itself?
- No way.
74
00:04:25,161 --> 00:04:27,041
You'd have to get in there
and clear it by hand.
75
00:04:27,281 --> 00:04:29,001
Plus, one of the ground floor
tenants heard
76
00:04:29,081 --> 00:04:30,801
someone rooting around
here last night.
77
00:04:37,761 --> 00:04:39,361
Do you know how far
the blockage goes up?
78
00:04:39,401 --> 00:04:40,401
About halfway.
79
00:04:40,441 --> 00:04:41,881
But the middle flat's unoccupied
80
00:04:41,961 --> 00:04:43,721
so it must have come
from the top floor flat.
81
00:04:44,001 --> 00:04:46,321
He's the one that reckoned
it was KFC last night.
82
00:04:47,441 --> 00:04:48,721
That has to be human, right?
83
00:04:51,281 --> 00:04:53,281
- Thank you, Mr Cattran.
- That it?
84
00:04:54,641 --> 00:04:57,161
Uh, we'll contact you to come down
the station for a statement.
85
00:04:58,241 --> 00:04:59,241
Right.
86
00:05:02,081 --> 00:05:03,521
Do you think he wanted a medal?
87
00:05:06,081 --> 00:05:07,081
What d'you reckon?
88
00:05:08,041 --> 00:05:09,681
Well, let's get them down
to pathology.
89
00:05:10,081 --> 00:05:11,241
Confirm they're human.
90
00:05:12,801 --> 00:05:13,881
Is he home?
91
00:05:13,961 --> 00:05:15,241
At work, apparently.
92
00:05:15,321 --> 00:05:16,801
The Job Centre, Kentish Town.
93
00:05:18,761 --> 00:05:19,841
What d'you wanna do?
94
00:05:23,041 --> 00:05:24,161
Well, I guess we wait.
95
00:05:24,521 --> 00:05:25,561
Aye.
96
00:05:25,681 --> 00:05:26,961
I knew you were gonna say that.
97
00:06:05,401 --> 00:06:06,401
Dennis Nilsen?
98
00:06:06,761 --> 00:06:07,761
Aye.
99
00:06:08,121 --> 00:06:10,321
My name is Detective
Chief Inspector Peter Jay
100
00:06:10,401 --> 00:06:12,401
and this is Detective
Inspector Steve McCusker.
101
00:06:13,201 --> 00:06:14,921
We'd like to talk to you
about your drains.
102
00:06:15,761 --> 00:06:17,681
Since when were the police
interested in drains?
103
00:06:19,841 --> 00:06:21,481
Let's talk about that upstairs,
shall we?
104
00:06:23,201 --> 00:06:24,201
Alright.
105
00:06:26,801 --> 00:06:27,881
What's this about?
106
00:06:28,601 --> 00:06:31,281
Human remains have been
found in the drains outside.
107
00:06:31,721 --> 00:06:32,721
Right.
108
00:06:34,121 --> 00:06:35,121
Come on in.
109
00:06:35,241 --> 00:06:36,481
Good girl, good girl.
110
00:06:37,121 --> 00:06:38,721
Don't worry, she's very friendly.
111
00:06:46,841 --> 00:06:47,961
Right, don't muck me about.
112
00:06:49,401 --> 00:06:50,761
Where's the rest of the body?
113
00:06:53,401 --> 00:06:54,401
In the cupboard.
114
00:07:13,601 --> 00:07:16,001
Dennis Nilsen, I am arresting you
on the suspicion of murder.
115
00:07:16,961 --> 00:07:19,201
You do not have to say anything,
unless you wish to do so
116
00:07:19,281 --> 00:07:21,641
but what you do say
may be given in evidence.
117
00:07:24,361 --> 00:07:27,081
Don't let anyone up there
'til the pathologist gets here.
118
00:07:42,401 --> 00:07:44,241
So, are we talking about
one body or two?
119
00:07:47,921 --> 00:07:50,681
Fifteen or sixteen, I think.
120
00:08:14,801 --> 00:08:16,041
So, what do we know?
121
00:08:16,641 --> 00:08:17,761
At least one victim.
122
00:08:18,161 --> 00:08:20,601
Partial remains found in a bin liner
in his cupboard.
123
00:08:21,081 --> 00:08:22,881
A young male, judging by the torso.
124
00:08:22,961 --> 00:08:25,561
But going by the smell in the flat,
I'd say there were a lot more.
125
00:08:25,641 --> 00:08:28,281
But there's no actual
evidence of 16 bodies, is there?
126
00:08:28,441 --> 00:08:29,641
It's off limits 'til morning.
127
00:08:29,881 --> 00:08:30,881
Too damp.
128
00:08:30,921 --> 00:08:33,361
We've secured the scene,
but apparently, we risk contamination
129
00:08:33,441 --> 00:08:34,481
if we go in too early.
130
00:08:34,681 --> 00:08:37,201
What he was saying in the car
was pretty convincing, Guv.
131
00:08:37,841 --> 00:08:39,521
Why were you talking to him
in the car?
132
00:08:40,281 --> 00:08:41,281
Well, I was just...
133
00:08:41,321 --> 00:08:43,721
What if he says that confession
was given under duress?
134
00:08:45,161 --> 00:08:48,161
If he's telling the truth we're gonna have
the eyes of the world on us.
135
00:08:48,481 --> 00:08:50,761
We have to do this
by the book from now on.
136
00:08:53,721 --> 00:08:56,881
We need him to identify the remains
before we can charge him.
137
00:08:57,721 --> 00:08:58,721
What do you reckon?
138
00:09:00,041 --> 00:09:02,761
I think we're gonna get a lot more bees
with honey than with vinegar.
139
00:09:02,881 --> 00:09:04,001
Thank you.
140
00:09:07,601 --> 00:09:10,081
- Sorry for the late call, Ronnie.
- No, that's OK.
141
00:09:10,761 --> 00:09:12,921
I'd like a few minutes with my client
if it's possible?
142
00:09:14,281 --> 00:09:16,017
- We're doing it in there, are we?
- Yeah, I thought it'd be
143
00:09:16,041 --> 00:09:17,721
a bit more comfortable
for everyone.
144
00:09:24,761 --> 00:09:26,001
I'm Ronald Moss...
145
00:09:29,321 --> 00:09:31,921
This evening,
two police officers entered your flat.
146
00:09:32,721 --> 00:09:34,401
There they found the remains of a man.
147
00:09:35,401 --> 00:09:36,641
Do you want to explain that?
148
00:09:39,201 --> 00:09:40,681
In what context?
149
00:09:43,241 --> 00:09:44,401
How did it get there?
150
00:09:44,961 --> 00:09:46,617
Have you searched
the rest of the flat yet?
151
00:09:46,641 --> 00:09:48,801
We're in the process of that, as we speak.
152
00:09:48,881 --> 00:09:53,321
You'll find more in the, uh, tea chest
in my bedroom
153
00:09:53,401 --> 00:09:57,001
and in the turned-up drawer
in my bathroom.
154
00:09:57,041 --> 00:09:58,681
All in all,
the remains of three people.
155
00:10:00,281 --> 00:10:02,041
In the car, you said that
there was more.
156
00:10:02,121 --> 00:10:03,481
I must advise my client...
157
00:10:03,561 --> 00:10:05,681
195 Melrose Avenue, N2.
158
00:10:05,761 --> 00:10:08,521
There, you'll find the remains
of 12 or 13 people
159
00:10:08,601 --> 00:10:10,441
dating back to 1978.
160
00:10:12,761 --> 00:10:14,681
It's actually a relief
to get this off my chest.
161
00:10:22,521 --> 00:10:23,521
Thank you.
162
00:10:35,601 --> 00:10:37,361
Who do all these remains belong to?
163
00:10:37,441 --> 00:10:39,257
- I need a moment with my client.
- No, it's OK.
164
00:10:39,281 --> 00:10:40,281
Uh...
165
00:10:41,281 --> 00:10:43,321
I'm afraid I don't...
remember their names.
166
00:10:45,201 --> 00:10:46,201
None of them?
167
00:10:46,721 --> 00:10:48,761
Well, at the time,
I'd only just met them, you know?
168
00:10:49,121 --> 00:10:50,441
Where did you meet them?
169
00:10:50,521 --> 00:10:52,441
All over.
Bars, or on the street.
170
00:10:52,561 --> 00:10:54,241
Some, I just wanted to give a meal.
171
00:10:54,881 --> 00:10:56,841
London can be a lonely place
sometimes.
172
00:10:57,681 --> 00:10:59,121
A friendly face goes a long way.
173
00:10:59,561 --> 00:11:00,641
So, they were homeless?
174
00:11:01,761 --> 00:11:04,521
Uh, some,
because of the drugs, usually.
175
00:11:05,241 --> 00:11:06,681
It really is a disease.
176
00:11:06,761 --> 00:11:07,921
It's very sad.
177
00:11:09,161 --> 00:11:11,401
And this bloody government
does nothing for them.
178
00:11:12,201 --> 00:11:13,401
Were they all male?
179
00:11:14,121 --> 00:11:15,041
Aye.
180
00:11:15,042 --> 00:11:16,362
How old were they?
181
00:11:16,441 --> 00:11:18,361
Well, some looked younger
than others.
182
00:11:18,441 --> 00:11:20,721
Um, sorry, I'm not being
very helpful.
183
00:11:20,801 --> 00:11:22,121
No, you're doing fine.
184
00:11:23,441 --> 00:11:24,441
How did you kill them?
185
00:11:24,641 --> 00:11:25,641
I strangled them.
186
00:11:26,481 --> 00:11:28,281
Where did these murders take place?
187
00:11:28,441 --> 00:11:29,441
In my house.
188
00:11:29,881 --> 00:11:31,561
Mostly in my bed, to be specific.
189
00:11:31,641 --> 00:11:33,241
So, they came home
with you willingly?
190
00:11:33,321 --> 00:11:34,321
Yeah.
191
00:11:36,881 --> 00:11:38,081
Were they all homosexual?
192
00:11:38,641 --> 00:11:39,801
I don't remember asking them.
193
00:11:40,201 --> 00:11:41,841
Are you homosexual, Mr Nilsen?
194
00:11:44,761 --> 00:11:46,441
Well, uh...
195
00:11:47,001 --> 00:11:48,161
for the sake of convenience
196
00:11:48,241 --> 00:11:50,201
you should probably class me
as a homosexual.
197
00:11:50,281 --> 00:11:52,401
If that's, uh, actually true,
I'm not so sure.
198
00:11:52,721 --> 00:11:54,201
The three in Cranley Gardens.
199
00:11:54,361 --> 00:11:56,121
When did these murders take place?
200
00:11:56,601 --> 00:11:58,921
The most recent was three weeks ago.
201
00:11:59,721 --> 00:12:00,761
Um...
202
00:12:01,441 --> 00:12:03,201
the others, last year sometime.
203
00:12:05,641 --> 00:12:06,801
You kept them for a year?
204
00:12:08,081 --> 00:12:09,081
Aye.
205
00:12:09,601 --> 00:12:10,601
In pieces?
206
00:12:11,081 --> 00:12:13,681
No, no. The dissection is
merely for disposal.
207
00:12:14,761 --> 00:12:17,561
It's the dirty platter
after the feast, if you like.
208
00:12:18,361 --> 00:12:20,401
Now, in Melrose, it was simple
because it was, uh...
209
00:12:20,481 --> 00:12:22,961
a ground floor flat,
with space under the floorboards
210
00:12:23,041 --> 00:12:26,081
for storage and, uh,
sole access to a garden
211
00:12:26,441 --> 00:12:27,801
when a clearance was called for.
212
00:12:28,241 --> 00:12:32,081
Yeah, no, I remember it, Melrose,
when the bodies began to accumulate
213
00:12:32,161 --> 00:12:34,001
I knew there'd be a smell problem, so...
214
00:12:34,601 --> 00:12:38,281
uh, at the weekend,
I'd take up the floorboards...
215
00:12:39,161 --> 00:12:41,601
and I'd get blinding drunk,
so I could face it...
216
00:12:42,081 --> 00:12:44,641
and... put down sort of...
217
00:12:45,241 --> 00:12:47,641
black plastic, like a bin liner...
218
00:12:48,841 --> 00:12:51,321
for the mess,
and then I'd start dissection...
219
00:12:52,001 --> 00:12:53,121
on the kitchen floor.
220
00:12:53,801 --> 00:12:55,681
I learnt if you make an incision
221
00:12:56,321 --> 00:12:59,201
just below the navel,
you can pretty much get to everything
222
00:12:59,281 --> 00:13:01,281
without having
to deal with the rib cage and such.
223
00:13:02,721 --> 00:13:04,601
But it was all, you know, trial and error.
224
00:13:05,241 --> 00:13:06,481
You buried them in the garden?
225
00:13:07,401 --> 00:13:08,601
No, I burnt them, um...
226
00:13:09,561 --> 00:13:11,441
I'd wrap them
in an old piece of carpet
227
00:13:11,961 --> 00:13:14,241
and throw a tyre on top
to hide the smell.
228
00:13:16,401 --> 00:13:19,801
I took no pleasure
in cutting up people
229
00:13:19,881 --> 00:13:21,801
or boiling heads, or...
230
00:13:22,361 --> 00:13:24,081
you know, burning bodies.
231
00:13:24,161 --> 00:13:26,401
I did it because I had to.
There was no more space.
232
00:13:26,481 --> 00:13:28,801
How many bodies did you have
in the house at any one time?
233
00:13:30,841 --> 00:13:32,321
Well, I never did a stock check.
234
00:13:33,841 --> 00:13:35,521
Or ask their names, it seems.
235
00:13:36,561 --> 00:13:37,521
No...
236
00:13:37,522 --> 00:13:39,482
No, that I do regret, yeah.
237
00:13:39,641 --> 00:13:42,521
I wish I could remember their names
to tell you now. I really do.
238
00:13:44,121 --> 00:13:45,961
I have to ask...
239
00:13:47,001 --> 00:13:48,241
why did you do this?
240
00:13:52,201 --> 00:13:53,961
Well, I don't really know, um...
241
00:13:56,721 --> 00:13:58,441
I was rather hoping
you could tell me that.
242
00:14:11,401 --> 00:14:13,401
Take us through them all,
one by one.
243
00:14:14,521 --> 00:14:17,241
With Number 3...
he was a young-looking man
244
00:14:17,321 --> 00:14:19,841
I picked up at Euston Station.
I was out on the piss that night
245
00:14:19,961 --> 00:14:20,961
drinking heavily.
246
00:14:21,241 --> 00:14:23,041
Next morning, he was dead
on the floor.
247
00:14:23,241 --> 00:14:25,561
I remember... bits and pieces.
248
00:14:25,641 --> 00:14:27,361
I don't remember
any violence at all...
249
00:14:27,601 --> 00:14:30,401
Whilst drinking in Soho,
I got into a...
250
00:14:30,521 --> 00:14:32,481
a conversation with this Scottish guy...
251
00:14:32,561 --> 00:14:35,321
Number 11 was a skinhead type
he had "Cut here"
252
00:14:35,401 --> 00:14:36,601
tattooed on his neck.
253
00:14:37,361 --> 00:14:39,681
He was boasting about his toughness,
about his hardness...
254
00:14:39,761 --> 00:14:41,321
After killing him I just went to bed.
255
00:14:41,841 --> 00:14:44,201
End of day, end of drinking,
end of person...
256
00:14:44,561 --> 00:14:45,961
The twelfth was a...
257
00:14:46,041 --> 00:14:48,521
I remember being sat
on him, strangling him...
258
00:14:48,561 --> 00:14:49,737
...and he said "my legs,
I can't move my legs".
259
00:14:49,761 --> 00:14:50,817
I called him an ambulance...
260
00:14:50,841 --> 00:14:52,241
Number 14,
I made him an omelette
261
00:14:52,321 --> 00:14:53,801
as he said he wanted
something to eat.
262
00:14:53,961 --> 00:14:56,521
If it was the omelette
that killed him or me, I'm not so sure
263
00:14:56,601 --> 00:15:00,121
but I don't suppose omelettes leave
red marks on a neck, do they?
264
00:15:10,481 --> 00:15:11,481
What d'you think, Guv?
265
00:15:12,281 --> 00:15:14,641
I'm thinking there's a lot
of words on those pages
266
00:15:14,721 --> 00:15:16,641
but not a lot of concrete evidence.
267
00:15:17,201 --> 00:15:18,321
You think he's lying?
268
00:15:20,041 --> 00:15:21,201
About the amount?
269
00:15:22,041 --> 00:15:23,041
Possibly.
270
00:15:23,641 --> 00:15:25,081
I dunno, Guv.
There's something...
271
00:15:28,281 --> 00:15:29,281
I believe him.
272
00:15:29,961 --> 00:15:32,481
Well, let's get a victims' name
and charge him.
273
00:15:34,401 --> 00:15:36,321
Right.
I'd better update the yard.
274
00:16:04,681 --> 00:16:06,681
That's it, look surprised.
275
00:16:06,801 --> 00:16:08,921
That's it, sure.
276
00:16:10,121 --> 00:16:11,201
Bring that up a bit.
277
00:16:11,801 --> 00:16:12,801
What's this?
278
00:16:14,001 --> 00:16:16,561
Uh, this is the detective.
Jay, right?
279
00:16:16,641 --> 00:16:17,641
Charlotte Proctor.
280
00:16:19,361 --> 00:16:20,401
You went to the press?
281
00:16:20,721 --> 00:16:22,377
Well, you seemed like
you didn't believe me
282
00:16:22,401 --> 00:16:23,561
so I had to tell someone.
283
00:16:23,641 --> 00:16:25,841
Can you confirm the remains
you found were human?
284
00:16:28,041 --> 00:16:30,401
Detective, have you
arrested Mr Nilsen yet?
285
00:17:24,601 --> 00:17:27,721
Guv, I wouldn't... if I were you.
286
00:17:35,321 --> 00:17:36,481
How didn't we know?
287
00:18:22,761 --> 00:18:25,721
When I got there this morning,
there was a journo
288
00:18:25,801 --> 00:18:27,521
a few doors down
from Cranley Gardens
289
00:18:27,601 --> 00:18:29,081
with the drain guy from yesterday.
290
00:18:29,441 --> 00:18:30,921
That didn't take him long, did it?
291
00:18:31,321 --> 00:18:34,001
Right, media blackout
from now on, boys.
292
00:18:34,481 --> 00:18:37,121
They get nothing from us, understood?
293
00:18:38,321 --> 00:18:40,881
Last thing we need
is an early siege before we charge him.
294
00:18:41,001 --> 00:18:43,001
Uh, where are we at
with everything else?
295
00:18:43,081 --> 00:18:44,481
Chris, did you search his office?
296
00:18:45,481 --> 00:18:46,681
We weren't allowed to.
297
00:18:47,201 --> 00:18:48,201
What do you mean?
298
00:18:48,202 --> 00:18:51,162
His colleagues said they couldn't believe
he would do anything like this
299
00:18:51,281 --> 00:18:53,881
and if we wanted to search the office,
we'd need to get a warrant.
300
00:18:53,921 --> 00:18:54,921
You're kidding me.
301
00:18:54,961 --> 00:18:57,041
Take down one of the bags
we found in his flat.
302
00:18:57,121 --> 00:18:58,801
Maybe that would act
as a warrant.
303
00:18:58,881 --> 00:19:01,841
- Anything else from the lab?
- Bowen's confirmed strangulation
304
00:19:01,921 --> 00:19:03,577
- as the cause of death.
- Well, that was quick.
305
00:19:03,601 --> 00:19:06,521
Yeah, well one of the pieces
we took down had a ligature mark on it.
306
00:19:06,601 --> 00:19:08,841
Has he been able to identify anyone?
307
00:19:09,001 --> 00:19:11,481
No, not yet. So, all of this is irrelevant...
308
00:19:11,641 --> 00:19:12,961
until he gives us a name.
309
00:19:14,881 --> 00:19:15,961
He used to be a policeman.
310
00:19:16,681 --> 00:19:17,761
- What?
- Where?
311
00:19:17,921 --> 00:19:20,801
In the Met. Willesden.
Left in '73.
312
00:19:20,961 --> 00:19:22,001
Why did he leave?
313
00:19:22,161 --> 00:19:24,481
Nothing on file.
He just left.
314
00:19:25,801 --> 00:19:26,841
Shit.
315
00:19:27,161 --> 00:19:28,201
Are you fucking with us?
316
00:19:28,401 --> 00:19:30,601
- Mr Chambers...
- You're ex-police.
317
00:19:31,121 --> 00:19:32,601
You left that out last night.
318
00:19:32,801 --> 00:19:34,641
I didn't mention it
because it's not relevant.
319
00:19:35,161 --> 00:19:36,161
Not relevant?
320
00:19:36,561 --> 00:19:38,657
No, I wasn't doing this
while I was there, so it's not relevant.
321
00:19:38,681 --> 00:19:40,361
Not at the present time,
anyhow.
322
00:19:42,081 --> 00:19:44,121
It's in nobody's interest
for me to lie.
323
00:19:44,481 --> 00:19:45,481
Why did you leave?
324
00:19:45,961 --> 00:19:46,961
Homophobia.
325
00:19:48,041 --> 00:19:49,761
A name. Right now.
326
00:19:49,921 --> 00:19:51,641
Mr Nilsen,
you don't have to say anything.
327
00:19:51,721 --> 00:19:53,081
Like I said to you last night...
328
00:19:53,841 --> 00:19:56,881
The last one was Scottish. He was saying
how shite Scotland is in the winter.
329
00:19:57,321 --> 00:19:58,601
Scottish name...
330
00:20:00,601 --> 00:20:01,601
Stephen.
331
00:20:01,641 --> 00:20:02,641
It was Stephen.
332
00:20:03,001 --> 00:20:04,001
Stephen what?
333
00:20:07,401 --> 00:20:09,121
Oh, I'm sorry.
I really don't remember.
334
00:20:11,641 --> 00:20:14,201
I think now would be a good time
to pause the interview, anyway.
335
00:20:14,681 --> 00:20:15,881
No, let's keep going.
336
00:20:17,121 --> 00:20:18,161
- Steve?
- Yeah?
337
00:20:18,241 --> 00:20:21,161
Get me a list of all Stephens
reported missing from Scotland.
338
00:20:21,321 --> 00:20:22,961
That's gonna be a pretty long list, Guv.
339
00:20:23,081 --> 00:20:24,721
That's all we got.
Do it.
340
00:20:27,841 --> 00:20:31,441
I want to help the officers
and the men caught up in my mess.
341
00:20:31,681 --> 00:20:33,721
Mr Chambers, may I have a minute
with my client?
342
00:20:34,161 --> 00:20:39,001
As I see it, a solicitor is here
to advise and facilitate my legal rights.
343
00:20:39,081 --> 00:20:40,961
Am I correct? Huh?
344
00:20:41,041 --> 00:20:43,961
Then your advice should've been
to tell the detectives everything.
345
00:20:44,601 --> 00:20:46,881
There's still a process, Mr Nilson.
346
00:20:49,521 --> 00:20:51,321
Mr Moss, I won't be needing you
any longer.
347
00:20:51,961 --> 00:20:53,161
I don't advise this.
348
00:20:53,241 --> 00:20:55,577
No, it's my final decision. It's the only way
we're gonna get to the bottom
349
00:20:55,601 --> 00:20:57,001
of this mess, once and for all.
350
00:20:59,961 --> 00:21:00,961
If you could.
351
00:21:03,121 --> 00:21:04,121
Please.
352
00:21:06,041 --> 00:21:08,641
- Mr Chambers.
- Ronnie.
353
00:21:16,761 --> 00:21:17,761
Shall we carry on?
354
00:21:20,801 --> 00:21:24,201
I was at McDonald's on the way
to Oxford Street station...
355
00:21:25,241 --> 00:21:28,201
he said he hadn't eaten all day.
I mean, what was I meant to say to that?
356
00:21:28,721 --> 00:21:30,361
Um, he had blond hair.
357
00:21:32,321 --> 00:21:33,401
Well...
358
00:21:34,161 --> 00:21:35,281
so did some of the others.
359
00:21:36,321 --> 00:21:38,281
Stephen, blond hair, Scottish...
360
00:21:42,361 --> 00:21:43,961
I can't remember his second name.
361
00:21:45,161 --> 00:21:46,481
Just take your time.
362
00:21:47,481 --> 00:21:48,841
Take us through it again.
363
00:21:49,681 --> 00:21:50,721
You went home.
364
00:21:51,081 --> 00:21:52,121
What happened then?
365
00:21:52,401 --> 00:21:53,841
We drank, we laughed.
366
00:21:54,521 --> 00:21:57,041
I poured two large glasses of rum
and coke.
367
00:21:57,281 --> 00:21:58,761
He said he didn't like rum.
368
00:21:58,841 --> 00:22:01,122
I said, "Well you didn't bloody well
pay for it, did you?"
369
00:22:01,961 --> 00:22:03,521
Yeah. He had a nice laugh.
370
00:22:05,001 --> 00:22:07,361
I mentioned "Tommy",
y'know, the album "Tommy"?
371
00:22:07,441 --> 00:22:09,681
He said he had never heard it,
so I put it on...
372
00:22:11,561 --> 00:22:14,161
and watched as he closed his eyes
and listened to it.
373
00:22:14,601 --> 00:22:17,761
I thought to myself, "You lucky bugger.
Experiencing that for the first time".
374
00:22:19,081 --> 00:22:20,081
Yeah...
375
00:22:22,281 --> 00:22:24,041
I entertained no thoughts of...
376
00:22:25,161 --> 00:22:26,801
harming him.
Well, you know...
377
00:22:27,041 --> 00:22:32,201
I had nothing but concern and affection
for his future and the pain of his life.
378
00:22:33,881 --> 00:22:35,081
But you did strangle him.
379
00:22:36,801 --> 00:22:40,121
Afterwards, I noticed that his jeans
were soaked with urine.
380
00:22:41,521 --> 00:22:42,521
So...
381
00:22:42,601 --> 00:22:44,801
I wanted to wash him clean,
so I took his clothes off...
382
00:22:45,321 --> 00:22:46,321
and, er...
383
00:22:47,161 --> 00:22:50,441
I remember I had difficulty
with his tight wet jeans
384
00:22:50,561 --> 00:22:53,081
but, soon, he was sat there,
naked in my armchair.
385
00:22:54,441 --> 00:22:55,681
And he'd only urinated.
386
00:22:56,801 --> 00:22:58,921
He obviously hadn't had a square meal
in a few days.
387
00:23:00,241 --> 00:23:04,641
He had deep cuts on both his wrists,
you know, still open.
388
00:23:06,161 --> 00:23:08,241
So, he must have recently tried
to commit suicide...
389
00:23:09,561 --> 00:23:10,681
and I...
390
00:23:11,841 --> 00:23:15,841
I very gently carried him through
to the bathroom and put talc on him
391
00:23:15,921 --> 00:23:18,361
to make him look cleaner.
He looked magnificent.
392
00:23:18,441 --> 00:23:20,361
It was like one of those
Michelangelo sculptures.
393
00:23:25,161 --> 00:23:26,161
We need names.
394
00:23:26,162 --> 00:23:28,002
Mmm. I know you do
and I am trying
395
00:23:28,081 --> 00:23:29,561
but some were a long time ago.
396
00:23:30,481 --> 00:23:32,081
Then stay with the last one.
397
00:23:32,481 --> 00:23:33,681
I said. Stephen.
398
00:23:33,761 --> 00:23:35,081
It's not enough, you know that.
399
00:23:35,521 --> 00:23:39,281
I mean, you remember so many details,
there must've been a time in the evening
400
00:23:39,361 --> 00:23:40,881
he told you his full name.
401
00:23:43,801 --> 00:23:44,841
Look...
402
00:23:45,561 --> 00:23:47,441
all we want to do
is corroborate your claims.
403
00:23:50,681 --> 00:23:52,601
It was definitely a Scottish name.
404
00:23:52,881 --> 00:23:54,441
We joked about that, it was...
405
00:23:57,161 --> 00:23:58,281
Like Fraser, or...
406
00:24:01,841 --> 00:24:03,561
Stephen... Sinclair, it was.
407
00:24:04,401 --> 00:24:05,441
Sinclair.
408
00:24:07,761 --> 00:24:08,801
You're sure?
409
00:24:09,561 --> 00:24:11,001
Aye. Stephen Sinclair.
410
00:24:13,281 --> 00:24:16,641
If this Stephen Sinclair was a drug addict,
chances are he has a record.
411
00:24:17,081 --> 00:24:18,801
Record will have a photo and fingerprints.
412
00:24:18,881 --> 00:24:20,801
We can match those
to what we found at the flat.
413
00:24:21,001 --> 00:24:24,721
He has given us the name,
not to mention the torso in his flat.
414
00:24:24,801 --> 00:24:27,601
- Well, can't we just charge him, Guv?
- And what if he's got it wrong?
415
00:24:27,881 --> 00:24:29,121
Or he's playing with us?
416
00:24:29,601 --> 00:24:32,841
Sinclair walks into our courtroom alive
and well, and there goes the credibility.
417
00:24:32,921 --> 00:24:33,921
You know that.
418
00:24:34,761 --> 00:24:36,881
No mistakes, no shortcuts.
419
00:24:36,961 --> 00:24:38,441
We need to be good police.
420
00:24:38,801 --> 00:24:41,641
Peter, it doesn't feel right giving him
the blue-ribbon treatment here.
421
00:24:43,521 --> 00:24:45,681
Whilst he's talking,
we carry on treating him well.
422
00:24:46,641 --> 00:24:47,681
Understood?
423
00:24:47,801 --> 00:24:49,321
Yes, Guv.
424
00:25:02,441 --> 00:25:05,201
Is it necessary to still have
Bleep here? It's been two days.
425
00:25:05,441 --> 00:25:07,121
Well, there's nothing we can do
about that.
426
00:25:07,161 --> 00:25:09,481
She's an old dog.
Sounds like she's in a lot of distress.
427
00:25:09,561 --> 00:25:11,857
Please. She's done nothing wrong.
She doesn't deserve this.
428
00:25:11,881 --> 00:25:16,201
I'll see what I can do. We won't be starting
until a bit later this morning, Mr Nilsen
429
00:25:16,281 --> 00:25:18,281
but Mr Jay thought you might be hungry.
430
00:25:20,161 --> 00:25:21,481
That's kind of him, thank you.
431
00:25:22,641 --> 00:25:25,121
Another thing. Have there been
any newspaper reports about me?
432
00:25:26,881 --> 00:25:28,041
There was one, yes.
433
00:25:29,041 --> 00:25:30,161
Well, may I have a copy?
434
00:25:32,081 --> 00:25:33,081
I'll ask.
435
00:25:37,601 --> 00:25:38,881
Sinclair was young.
436
00:25:39,201 --> 00:25:40,481
He'd just turned twenty.
437
00:25:42,321 --> 00:25:45,841
Severe personality problems.
Drug abuse.
438
00:25:48,361 --> 00:25:50,001
He really didn't stand a chance,
did he?
439
00:25:52,121 --> 00:25:53,201
Gentlemen.
440
00:25:55,121 --> 00:25:57,001
Pretty grim viewing, I'm afraid.
441
00:25:58,001 --> 00:26:02,641
Well, as you can see, the dissection
has been done to a high level of skill.
442
00:26:03,601 --> 00:26:07,161
It was actually quite simple to decipher
which parts go with which.
443
00:26:07,601 --> 00:26:10,641
Uh, these are from the last victim.
444
00:26:12,961 --> 00:26:16,441
But his head has been boiled
beyond all recognition.
445
00:26:21,401 --> 00:26:22,601
Can we fingerprint him?
446
00:26:23,601 --> 00:26:27,241
This last one, absolutely.
The others, probably not.
447
00:26:27,601 --> 00:26:28,721
Too much decay.
448
00:26:29,521 --> 00:26:31,241
Would you care to know
the cause of death?
449
00:26:31,761 --> 00:26:32,761
Strangulation.
450
00:26:33,201 --> 00:26:36,041
Well, he was strangled, that's true.
451
00:26:37,321 --> 00:26:41,401
But in the autopsy, we discovered
his lungs were filled with water
452
00:26:41,481 --> 00:26:43,801
so, death was due to drowning.
453
00:26:44,721 --> 00:26:45,881
Why did he leave that out?
454
00:26:46,681 --> 00:26:48,721
Uh, there's something else.
455
00:26:49,561 --> 00:26:51,841
Tests show he had Hepatitis B.
456
00:26:52,601 --> 00:26:55,161
Quite a common disease
with needle-using heroin addicts
457
00:26:55,321 --> 00:26:59,081
but if any police officer has been
in its vicinity...
458
00:27:00,121 --> 00:27:02,001
they'll have to have a vaccination,
I'm afraid.
459
00:27:02,401 --> 00:27:04,081
Oh, for fuck's sake!
460
00:27:07,681 --> 00:27:08,761
Thank you, David.
461
00:27:50,001 --> 00:27:51,001
It's Sinclair.
462
00:28:06,401 --> 00:28:10,961
Dennis Nilsen, I am charging you with
the murder of Stephen Sinclair by drowning.
463
00:28:12,081 --> 00:28:15,481
You will now be taken to Melrose Avenue
where you will identify the burn site
464
00:28:15,561 --> 00:28:17,961
of the other victims. Do you understand?
465
00:28:18,561 --> 00:28:19,561
Yeah.
466
00:28:20,001 --> 00:28:21,161
Come on.
467
00:28:26,321 --> 00:28:27,761
The press are outside.
468
00:28:29,841 --> 00:28:31,401
- Who?
- Everyone, I think.
469
00:28:31,681 --> 00:28:32,801
I'll see what's happening.
470
00:28:32,881 --> 00:28:35,161
I'll go and speak to them,
whilst you head out the back.
471
00:28:35,241 --> 00:28:37,041
No, they're out there, as well.
472
00:28:37,321 --> 00:28:38,521
Geoff, get the hood.
473
00:28:39,201 --> 00:28:40,961
No. I've got nothing to hide.
474
00:28:45,921 --> 00:28:47,121
Nilsen, over here!
475
00:28:48,041 --> 00:28:49,681
Nilsen! Nilson, look over here!
476
00:28:49,761 --> 00:28:51,617
What sentence are
we looking at Detective?
477
00:28:51,641 --> 00:28:52,641
Give us a quote!
478
00:28:54,001 --> 00:28:56,801
On Wednesday morning,
officers were called to an address
479
00:28:56,961 --> 00:29:00,001
to investigate suspicious fragments
found in a drain.
480
00:29:00,561 --> 00:29:04,441
Upon analysis, they were proved to be human,
and an investigation was opened.
481
00:29:05,161 --> 00:29:09,001
We have now charged a man
by the name of Dennis Nilsen with murder.
482
00:29:10,921 --> 00:29:13,761
How many people
do you suspect him to have murdered?
483
00:29:13,841 --> 00:29:16,241
We won't be revealing
the number at this time.
484
00:29:16,321 --> 00:29:19,241
Can you at least say what
gender he is suspected of killing?
485
00:29:20,121 --> 00:29:21,121
Men.
486
00:29:21,161 --> 00:29:23,921
When did Nilsen start this...
unusual habit?
487
00:29:23,961 --> 00:29:27,921
Five years, but can you make sure
you attribute the term "unusual habit"
488
00:29:28,001 --> 00:29:30,201
to Mr Wells and not myself, please?
489
00:29:30,281 --> 00:29:33,921
Inspector, how can somebody kill
for five years without the police knowing?
490
00:29:34,401 --> 00:29:37,241
We will be investigating that
at the relevant time.
491
00:29:37,361 --> 00:29:38,601
That's all, thank you.
492
00:29:38,681 --> 00:29:41,681
Inspector, do you feel
you let the people of Muswell Hill down?
493
00:30:03,601 --> 00:30:05,321
Ah, it's strange being back here.
494
00:30:09,441 --> 00:30:11,001
I remember summers here.
495
00:30:13,721 --> 00:30:15,761
Bleep as a little puppy,
running around.
496
00:30:18,601 --> 00:30:21,561
- We even had a vegetable patch there...
- Where did you have the bonfires?
497
00:30:43,081 --> 00:30:44,641
I'd start here, if I were you.
498
00:30:50,001 --> 00:30:51,081
OK, Dennis.
499
00:30:52,721 --> 00:30:56,041
You're now gonna be taken to Herne Hill
where you will stay whilst you're on remand.
500
00:30:56,641 --> 00:30:58,001
Not back to the station?
501
00:30:59,161 --> 00:31:00,321
No, I'm afraid not.
502
00:31:01,801 --> 00:31:02,841
OK, let's go.
503
00:31:10,281 --> 00:31:12,321
I just spoke to some of the boys
from Willesden.
504
00:31:12,961 --> 00:31:15,521
So, they say, rumour has it,
Nilsen left the Police
505
00:31:15,601 --> 00:31:18,121
because he was caught masturbating
in the morgue.
506
00:31:18,521 --> 00:31:19,521
No.
507
00:31:20,641 --> 00:31:21,841
Makes you uneasy, don't it?
508
00:31:22,481 --> 00:31:24,561
How much we're relying on him
to tell us the truth.
509
00:31:26,001 --> 00:31:28,841
It was here, outside Hornsea Police Station
510
00:31:28,921 --> 00:31:31,801
that Police confirmed
that Dennis Andrew Nilsen...
511
00:31:32,521 --> 00:31:36,481
has been charged with the first of,
what is said to be, multiple murders.
512
00:31:37,001 --> 00:31:40,001
On Wednesday morning,
officers were called to an address...
513
00:31:40,081 --> 00:31:41,441
Can you help me with this?
514
00:31:41,521 --> 00:31:43,137
...to investigate suspicious fragments
found in a drain.
515
00:31:43,161 --> 00:31:44,161
Brian?
516
00:31:45,161 --> 00:31:46,521
Oh, sorry.
517
00:31:46,601 --> 00:31:48,777
On analysis
there were proved to be human
518
00:31:48,801 --> 00:31:50,561
and an investigation was opened.
519
00:31:51,281 --> 00:31:52,241
What's happened?
520
00:31:52,242 --> 00:31:54,642
Oh, it's a multiple killer in London.
521
00:31:54,801 --> 00:31:56,881
...by the name of Dennis Nilsen
with murder.
522
00:31:57,241 --> 00:32:00,601
It's being reported that he was caught
by the discovery of blocked drains
523
00:32:00,681 --> 00:32:03,361
that were filled with the remains
of human flesh
524
00:32:03,441 --> 00:32:06,057
- that Nilsen had flushed down the lavatory.
- I have to go to work.
525
00:32:06,081 --> 00:32:08,561
It is also being reported
that his victims were men
526
00:32:08,641 --> 00:32:12,601
that Nilsen has lured back to his flat
on the sense of promised frivolity.
527
00:33:08,281 --> 00:33:10,201
- Mr Sinclair.
- Yes.
528
00:33:10,281 --> 00:33:12,361
My name is Detective Chief Inspector
Peter Jay.
529
00:33:13,121 --> 00:33:15,481
Are you the parent of Stephen Sinclair?
530
00:33:16,001 --> 00:33:19,801
Before you say any more Officer,
Stephen doesn't live here anymore.
531
00:33:19,881 --> 00:33:22,801
He hasn't done since he started stealing
from us to fund his habit.
532
00:33:23,721 --> 00:33:25,217
We don't even know where he is,
at the moment.
533
00:33:25,241 --> 00:33:26,401
Mr Sinclair, can we come in?
534
00:33:32,681 --> 00:33:33,841
Elizabeth?
535
00:33:35,561 --> 00:33:37,281
A few days ago, a body was found.
536
00:33:38,841 --> 00:33:42,641
That body, I'm... sorry to say,
has now been confirmed as Stephen.
537
00:33:45,081 --> 00:33:47,761
A man has been charged
in connection with his murder.
538
00:33:51,001 --> 00:33:52,081
His murder?
539
00:33:52,161 --> 00:33:55,961
I'm sorry to say, we can't give you much
information at present
540
00:33:56,041 --> 00:33:57,641
but we will as soon as we can.
541
00:33:58,441 --> 00:34:01,161
In the meantime,
if there's anything that you need... um...
542
00:34:01,241 --> 00:34:02,521
Can I see him?
543
00:34:04,481 --> 00:34:06,401
I'm afraid that's not possible,
Mrs Sinclair.
544
00:34:07,001 --> 00:34:09,281
But surely we need to identify him.
545
00:34:10,801 --> 00:34:12,161
He's already been identified.
546
00:34:12,681 --> 00:34:13,801
But how?
547
00:34:14,761 --> 00:34:16,081
Has somebody come in to see him?
548
00:34:18,281 --> 00:34:19,641
I want to see him.
549
00:34:21,121 --> 00:34:22,801
Maybe somebody's made a mistake.
550
00:34:22,881 --> 00:34:24,561
Mrs Sinclair. It's Stephen.
551
00:34:27,881 --> 00:34:30,441
I can't tell you how sorry I am
to be sure of that.
552
00:34:33,041 --> 00:34:34,361
But you don't want to see him.
553
00:34:36,241 --> 00:34:37,321
Not like this.
554
00:34:40,841 --> 00:34:42,641
I told him something like this
would happen.
555
00:34:43,721 --> 00:34:44,921
But that drug...
556
00:34:45,721 --> 00:34:46,721
it changed him.
557
00:34:47,121 --> 00:34:49,321
There was nothing we could do,
was there, love?
558
00:34:49,761 --> 00:34:50,761
No.
559
00:34:53,161 --> 00:34:56,241
He wouldn't listen to us,
no matter how hard we tried.
560
00:34:58,641 --> 00:35:01,601
He just thought of us as a hotel,
or a bank...
561
00:35:02,601 --> 00:35:04,321
or a prison.
562
00:35:04,481 --> 00:35:05,641
Not now, Neil.
563
00:35:14,521 --> 00:35:15,561
I'm sorry.
564
00:35:23,721 --> 00:35:25,121
Brian?
565
00:35:25,681 --> 00:35:26,681
Yeah.
566
00:35:31,561 --> 00:35:32,641
Oh, thank you.
567
00:35:34,401 --> 00:35:36,081
- Anything good?
- Oh no, not really.
568
00:35:36,161 --> 00:35:38,481
It's just all so salacious...
569
00:35:38,881 --> 00:35:40,401
He just looks so ordinary.
570
00:35:40,641 --> 00:35:43,841
Like someone you'd walk past in the street,
or meet in a bank.
571
00:35:44,841 --> 00:35:47,281
You see, that's what makes
the whole thing so intriguing.
572
00:35:47,721 --> 00:35:51,961
This dichotomy between this seemingly normal,
unobtrusive civil servant
573
00:35:52,321 --> 00:35:54,881
and the nature of his crimes.
574
00:35:54,961 --> 00:35:56,881
It just seems so hard to fathom.
575
00:35:57,441 --> 00:35:58,761
What's there to fathom?
576
00:35:58,921 --> 00:36:02,841
Well, what makes most of us go one way
with our lives, and others, like Nilsen
577
00:36:03,281 --> 00:36:05,681
go so far in the opposite direction?
578
00:36:06,921 --> 00:36:08,241
Probably because he's evil.
579
00:36:10,321 --> 00:36:11,361
I'm going to be late.
580
00:36:12,241 --> 00:36:13,641
See you tonight.
581
00:36:17,201 --> 00:36:19,801
The man currently being questioned by police
582
00:36:19,881 --> 00:36:23,281
is a 37-year-old civil servant,
Andrew Nilsen
583
00:36:23,561 --> 00:36:26,041
known to his colleagues at work as "Des".
584
00:36:26,601 --> 00:36:30,001
For the past six months, he's been working
here at the Manpower Services Commission
585
00:36:30,201 --> 00:36:31,881
in London's Kentish Town.
586
00:36:32,401 --> 00:36:34,961
I understand that he is also
a former policeman
587
00:36:35,121 --> 00:36:38,201
having been in the force
for about a year in the early seventies.
588
00:36:39,121 --> 00:36:41,657
- Really surprised.
- Where did they get the photo from?
589
00:36:41,681 --> 00:36:43,521
- Not us.
- Probably robbed it.
590
00:36:43,601 --> 00:36:47,481
If I find out any of you tipped them off
about him being ex-police
591
00:36:47,561 --> 00:36:50,361
I'll personally drag you
to the fucking committee myself!
592
00:36:51,361 --> 00:36:52,441
D'you hear me?
593
00:36:53,401 --> 00:36:54,921
We are in blackout.
594
00:36:55,001 --> 00:36:57,681
That means you don't mention his name
outside this station.
595
00:36:57,761 --> 00:37:00,881
Not to your wives, your mistresses,
your friends down the pub...
596
00:37:01,081 --> 00:37:02,081
you understand?
597
00:37:04,241 --> 00:37:07,481
This man killed on our patch
for four years.
598
00:37:08,961 --> 00:37:11,561
We find every name,
and we charge and convict him
599
00:37:11,641 --> 00:37:13,441
with every single fucking one.
600
00:37:14,921 --> 00:37:16,441
He gets away with nothing.
601
00:37:24,841 --> 00:37:25,841
Get rid.
602
00:37:40,081 --> 00:37:41,441
Come in.
603
00:37:43,121 --> 00:37:44,841
This gentleman is here
about Nilsen.
604
00:37:45,401 --> 00:37:46,761
He wants to talk to you, Guv.
605
00:37:48,761 --> 00:37:49,801
What can I do for ya?
606
00:37:51,161 --> 00:37:52,841
Dennis Nilsen tried to kill me.
607
00:37:55,881 --> 00:37:56,881
Where did you meet him?
608
00:37:57,241 --> 00:37:59,241
A pub. The Golden Lion.
609
00:38:00,081 --> 00:38:01,601
Dean Street, Soho.
610
00:38:02,081 --> 00:38:03,321
But, I'm not gay.
611
00:38:03,961 --> 00:38:04,961
No, of course.
612
00:38:06,121 --> 00:38:10,761
He was with a group of people,
who I assume were his friends.
613
00:38:12,281 --> 00:38:15,481
After last orders, he said we should go back
to his for a drink.
614
00:38:16,641 --> 00:38:18,241
I thought he meant all of us...
615
00:38:18,801 --> 00:38:21,081
but it was only the two of us that went.
616
00:38:22,241 --> 00:38:26,641
I must have passed out,
because when I came to...
617
00:38:27,121 --> 00:38:31,241
he'd tied my ankles together
with his tie, and...
618
00:38:32,361 --> 00:38:34,961
he was strangling me with mine.
619
00:38:36,841 --> 00:38:41,001
I managed to... fight him off
and get him to the ground.
620
00:38:42,161 --> 00:38:45,761
He then started screaming "Take my money!"
621
00:38:45,921 --> 00:38:47,321
"Take my money!"
622
00:38:47,401 --> 00:38:49,321
Like I was the one attacking him!
623
00:38:50,001 --> 00:38:52,321
Sorry, uh... when was this?
624
00:38:53,841 --> 00:38:54,921
Three years ago.
625
00:38:56,041 --> 00:38:57,841
I'd put it to the back of my mind.
626
00:38:58,601 --> 00:38:59,601
Moved on.
627
00:39:00,401 --> 00:39:02,801
But when I saw his face in the newspaper,
it all came back.
628
00:39:04,601 --> 00:39:06,361
Why didn't you go to the police
at the time?
629
00:39:07,121 --> 00:39:08,161
I did.
630
00:39:08,721 --> 00:39:09,721
Straight away.
631
00:39:10,841 --> 00:39:13,081
They took me back there.
They were there for...
632
00:39:13,721 --> 00:39:14,881
five minutes...
633
00:39:16,161 --> 00:39:19,801
spoke to Nilsen, and bought his story
that it was a "lovers' tiff".
634
00:39:20,721 --> 00:39:22,601
It wasn't something they wanted
to be around.
635
00:39:24,081 --> 00:39:27,161
They even apologised to him
for wasting his time, and sent me on my way.
636
00:39:32,241 --> 00:39:33,481
OK, um...
637
00:39:35,081 --> 00:39:37,041
You're just gonna have to go
from the beginning.
638
00:39:38,321 --> 00:39:39,441
Leave nothing out.
639
00:40:00,721 --> 00:40:02,801
So, how many of these
has he written to you?
640
00:40:02,881 --> 00:40:05,281
Well, the fourth came today...
641
00:40:05,361 --> 00:40:07,881
and, uh, there's a...
there's a poem in the last one.
642
00:40:12,081 --> 00:40:15,601
"Lives of sorrow,
Bones of the dead
643
00:40:15,681 --> 00:40:18,401
Given by the sea,
To Fitful Head".
644
00:40:19,321 --> 00:40:20,761
It's so... sensitive.
645
00:40:20,881 --> 00:40:23,641
Well, quite.
Uh, you wouldn't think by reading that
646
00:40:23,801 --> 00:40:25,201
that this man strangled young men
647
00:40:25,281 --> 00:40:27,521
and then disposed of them
down the lavatory, would you?
648
00:40:27,601 --> 00:40:29,321
How is the prison allowing you
to meet him?
649
00:40:29,841 --> 00:40:32,001
Uh, he said he'd put me
on the visitors list.
650
00:40:32,081 --> 00:40:34,401
Although, they're probably not aware
that I'm a writer.
651
00:40:35,121 --> 00:40:36,241
Well, aren't you frightened?
652
00:40:36,561 --> 00:40:37,841
No, no, he's...
653
00:40:38,481 --> 00:40:41,041
he's hardly going to jump over the desk
and strangle me, is he?
654
00:40:41,121 --> 00:40:42,361
No, but still.
655
00:40:43,001 --> 00:40:44,481
Do you think you'll shake his hand?
656
00:40:44,601 --> 00:40:46,521
No.
No, I-I-I shouldn't think so.
657
00:40:51,081 --> 00:40:54,361
- Name?
- Uh, Brian Masters to see Dennis Nilsen.
658
00:41:08,881 --> 00:41:10,521
You find us OK?
659
00:41:23,081 --> 00:41:24,121
Do you smoke, Brian?
660
00:41:25,761 --> 00:41:26,761
Yes, I do.
661
00:41:28,681 --> 00:41:29,841
Ah...
662
00:41:31,481 --> 00:41:34,001
You can smoke as many real fags
in this room as you like, yeah?
663
00:41:34,241 --> 00:41:35,841
Out there, you're only allowed tobacco.
664
00:41:40,441 --> 00:41:41,561
Yeah.
665
00:41:44,761 --> 00:41:47,201
They say capital punishment's dead,
but Her Majesty manages
666
00:41:47,281 --> 00:41:48,641
to find her little ways, y'know.
667
00:41:49,761 --> 00:41:51,921
Yes.
668
00:41:52,121 --> 00:41:53,841
I read your book, Brian.
669
00:41:54,561 --> 00:41:56,401
"The Dukes...", uh...
670
00:41:57,201 --> 00:42:00,961
"...Origin, ennoblement
and the history of 26 families".
671
00:42:01,401 --> 00:42:02,761
Are you from aristocracy?
672
00:42:02,921 --> 00:42:05,081
No. No, I'm not.
673
00:42:05,881 --> 00:42:07,641
You're from that kind of world,
though, eh?
674
00:42:08,481 --> 00:42:09,721
I bet you're a bloody Tory.
675
00:42:11,361 --> 00:42:13,121
I'm not sure
that's entirely relevant.
676
00:42:13,641 --> 00:42:16,761
I'm suppose I'm just... I'm not entirely sure
of your intentions as of yet.
677
00:42:17,801 --> 00:42:21,161
Yeah? Your letters sounded genuine,
but now we are sat opposite each other...
678
00:42:21,961 --> 00:42:24,561
I worry. I have judged myself
679
00:42:24,761 --> 00:42:28,401
more harshly than any casual observer
or any court ever could.
680
00:42:29,321 --> 00:42:31,921
Aren't you the one judging me,
Mr Nilsen?
681
00:42:33,361 --> 00:42:34,361
How's that?
682
00:42:34,401 --> 00:42:39,161
Well, you hear my accent and you assume
that you know everything about me.
683
00:42:39,241 --> 00:42:41,137
No, I'm simply stating it's obvious
where you come from.
684
00:42:41,161 --> 00:42:42,121
I'm not...
685
00:42:42,122 --> 00:42:43,922
It's no bad thing.
686
00:42:44,001 --> 00:42:46,641
I just like to know where I stand
with the person I am talking to.
687
00:42:47,281 --> 00:42:48,281
Well, I was...
688
00:42:48,681 --> 00:42:50,721
I was brought up on the Old Kent Road.
689
00:42:52,561 --> 00:42:55,001
You don't sound like you were brought up
on the Old Kent Road.
690
00:42:55,161 --> 00:42:57,161
Well, I was lucky.
I got an education.
691
00:42:57,481 --> 00:43:00,481
Ah, is that where the accent comes from then?
It's your education is it?
692
00:43:01,721 --> 00:43:03,601
You know, I was under the impression...
693
00:43:03,681 --> 00:43:08,601
that I was here to discuss
writing a book about you.
694
00:43:08,721 --> 00:43:09,721
Um...
695
00:43:10,121 --> 00:43:11,801
I'm really not that interesting.
696
00:43:12,321 --> 00:43:15,801
Why would you want to write about
a monster like me?
697
00:43:15,881 --> 00:43:17,457
Do you consider yourself
to be a monster?
698
00:43:17,481 --> 00:43:19,521
- Well, have you read the paper?
- Mm, of course.
699
00:43:21,441 --> 00:43:25,361
It truly amazes me,
people's attraction to the macabre
700
00:43:26,321 --> 00:43:29,881
cos all of us have skeletons rattling around
in our cupboards, y'know.
701
00:43:30,081 --> 00:43:34,161
Secrets they would never dare
to tell to anyone.
702
00:43:34,321 --> 00:43:36,481
So, what comes is this...
703
00:43:37,161 --> 00:43:41,121
flood of self-righteous
public condemnation
704
00:43:41,361 --> 00:43:44,601
whilst, simultaneously, everybody's talking
about it over and over and over.
705
00:43:44,961 --> 00:43:47,121
They're consuming it and indulging in it
706
00:43:47,201 --> 00:43:49,657
- but at arm's length, which is all very well.
- I'm not here to do that.
707
00:43:49,681 --> 00:43:55,401
But, meanwhile, I'm left here to rot,
whilst others make profits at my expense.
708
00:43:55,481 --> 00:43:58,881
Well, if-if you want some money from this,
I'm sure we can come to some arrangement.
709
00:43:58,961 --> 00:44:00,681
I don't want a penny
from any of this.
710
00:44:00,841 --> 00:44:03,601
I just don't want
those poor men exploited.
711
00:44:05,201 --> 00:44:09,641
Well, I'm not here to exploit you
or those seventeen young men that you...
712
00:44:10,001 --> 00:44:11,921
Fifteen! It was fifteen.
713
00:44:12,561 --> 00:44:14,201
It wasn't 17, it was 15.
714
00:44:15,521 --> 00:44:17,401
See, now, if you're gonna get
your information
715
00:44:17,481 --> 00:44:21,041
from those red top fuckers
telling lies about me every day
716
00:44:21,321 --> 00:44:22,961
we might as well say
goodbye now, Brian.
717
00:44:24,241 --> 00:44:29,321
I have a responsibility for my story
and theirs to be told correctly.
718
00:44:29,801 --> 00:44:31,681
Well, I also have that responsibility.
719
00:44:33,521 --> 00:44:37,921
You know, I'm... I have no want to write
some two-bit horror novel
720
00:44:38,401 --> 00:44:39,721
with ghoulish adjectives.
721
00:44:40,281 --> 00:44:44,041
I'm not here to elaborate
or expose or all excuse.
722
00:44:44,481 --> 00:44:46,361
I'm here to comprehend
723
00:44:46,441 --> 00:44:48,241
because the law cannot comprehend...
724
00:44:49,121 --> 00:44:51,121
beyond the question of guilty
or innocent.
725
00:44:52,721 --> 00:44:54,201
And how do you propose to do that?
726
00:44:55,841 --> 00:44:56,841
By listening.
727
00:44:57,601 --> 00:45:01,761
I want to know about your upbringing,
your teenage years.
728
00:45:02,121 --> 00:45:03,241
Your time in the army.
729
00:45:04,441 --> 00:45:05,441
All of it.
730
00:45:06,201 --> 00:45:08,201
Because only by doing that...
731
00:45:09,481 --> 00:45:11,281
do we get the whole picture...
732
00:45:12,681 --> 00:45:13,881
Mr Nilsen.
733
00:45:17,881 --> 00:45:19,361
I must warn you, Brian...
734
00:45:20,441 --> 00:45:24,041
you will find a full inquiry
into my life and deeds...
735
00:45:25,361 --> 00:45:26,401
distressing.
736
00:45:27,801 --> 00:45:28,881
I'm aware of that.
737
00:45:29,841 --> 00:45:30,841
Well, then...
738
00:45:31,161 --> 00:45:36,681
I pass the burden of my past and deeds
onto your shoulders.
739
00:45:41,241 --> 00:45:43,681
So, make sure you bring an extra pack of fags
next time, eh?
740
00:45:47,121 --> 00:45:48,121
Oh.
741
00:45:49,401 --> 00:45:50,601
Please call me Des.
56627
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